April 14, 2024 • 38 mins
Ever wondered what solo travel in France could teach you? Join host Annie Sargent and guest Joel Joslin in episode 489 of Join Us in France, as they explore the charms and challenges of a 21-day journey from Paris to Nice. What unique flavors will Joel discover? How does solo travel change his perspective on adventure? Tune in to find the answers and be inspired for your own travels!
Table of Contents for this Episode
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Annie Sargent (00:16):
This is Join Us in France episode 489,
quatre cent quatre vingt neuf.
Bonjour, I'm Annie Sargent, and Join Usin France is the podcast where we take
a conversational journey through thebeauty, culture and flavors of France.
Today, I bring you a trip report withJoel Joslin where he showcases his 21 day
(00:38):
solo traveler's journey through France.
And he does it in awonderfully candid manner.
I love that because Ilove to keep it real.
This podcast is supported by donorsand listeners who buy my tours and
services, including my ItineraryConsult Service, my GPS self-guided
tours of Paris on the Voice Map app,or take a day trip with me around the
(01:01):
southwest of France in my electric car.
You can browse all of that at myboutique joinusinfrance.com/boutique.
Patreon supporters get the episodeas soon as it's ready and ads free.
There won't be a magazine today becauseI'm away exploring the beautiful
Aveyron Department for a few days.
(01:21):
I'll be back next week with detailsabout access around the Olympic sites
especially before the opening ceremony.
But I do want to thank allmy patrons who have kept this
podcast going for a long time.
And a shout out this week to newpatrons: Patty Mulkeen, Krista
Critter, Carol Tumey, Rebecca A.
(01:44):
S.
and Kristi R.
And to all of my current patrons,it's wonderful to have you on board
in the community of francophiles.
I'll post some photos of my Aveyronvisit next week, because the new
messaging feature of Patreon worksreally well, so I'm enjoying that.
(02:04):
How do you become a patronand get this podcast ads free?
Go to patreon.com/JoinUs and to supportElyse, go to patreon.com/ElysArt.
And thank you very much.
(02:34):
Bonjour Joel, and welcometo Join Us in France!
Joel Joslin (02:37):
Hi Annie, thank you for having me.
Annie Sargent (02:39):
Lovely to see you, and we have an interesting
conversation laid out today.
You had a rather long trip to France.
You were here for 21 days,and this was a solo trip.
So can you tell us when yourtrip took place and more or less
briefly where you went so thatthen we can dig in more details?
Joel Joslin (03:00):
Yeah, so I went to France last October 2022,
end of September, I guess.
I went to spent about a week inParis, and then five days in Normandy,
three days in Brittany, four days inStrasbourg, and three days in Nice.
Annie Sargent (03:17):
Oh, so you went all over the place.
Did you land into Paris?
Joel Joslin (03:21):
Yes.
Annie Sargent (03:22):
And flew out of Paris as well?
Joel Joslin (03:24):
I flew out of Nice.
Annie Sargent (03:26):
Out of Nice, okay.
And how did you getaround most of that time?
Joel Joslin (03:30):
A lot of it was by train, so I went from Paris to Normandy,
to Brittany by train is pretty easy.
I used a car some inNormandy, which actually...
but if I could change one thingabout my trip, I probably would
have used one less, because I reallydidn't really need it, and I could
have gotten a more central hotel.
It was helpful for the Aigle deMont St-Michel, but I probably
didn't need it for the rest of it.
Annie Sargent (03:51):
Interesting.
Joel Joslin (03:51):
To get from St.
Malo, and Brittany to Strasbourg, Ihad to change trains a couple of times.
It was a day mostly on the train,but I didn't mind it, you know,
like a long train ride is a lot morerelaxing, like a long drive or flight.
Annie Sargent (04:04):
That's true.
Joel Joslin (04:05):
There's a lot of nice scenery, so it was just
a day of rest a little bit.
And then I flew Strasbourgto Nice on Volotea.
It was like two hours.
Annie Sargent (04:13):
Oh yeah, not my favorite airline.
Did everything go well?
Joel Joslin (04:17):
Yeah, well, it was fine.
We have budget lines, super budget lineslike that in the US too, I think they're
generally okay for short trips, I think.
Annie Sargent (04:24):
Yeah, and it's true that in France, if it's like you experienced,
if you go from Brittany all the wayto Strasbourg, you have to go through
Paris, you will have to change trainsin Paris, and if you had tried to
do Strasbourg to Nice, you probablywould have had to go back to Paris
as well and change trains in Paris.
So, you know, it's one of the reasons whythe regional airlines are still needed.
(04:48):
We can't do everything by train, eventhough lots of French people would
like to, but the other issue thatcomes up is that French trains are
not cheap, when you compare them toother countries in Europe, like Spanish
trains, Italian trains, German trains,we're quite expensive by comparison.
And so that's why we still have a lotof people driving and taking airplanes.
(05:10):
Even those not very good Voloteaflights that I don't like,
but you know, such is life.
Joel Joslin (05:15):
Well, it was so.., Volotea it was so cheap, I didn't really mind it.
Annie Sargent (05:19):
Exactly.
It's very cheap.
Yeah, very cheap.
So I'm interested in what you said aboutBrittany, cause I usually recommend that
people take the train into Brittany,but then rent a car, especially if
they're going to do all the landingbeaches and all that by themselves.
Perhaps you had a tour, right?
Joel Joslin (05:36):
You mean Normandy?
Right?
Annie Sargent (05:37):
Normandy.
Sorry.
Sorry.
Yes.
Joel Joslin (05:38):
Yeah, so I, well, okay, so I spent, I was in a
couple locations in Normandy.
I spent the first two days inRouen, which I really liked Rouen.
It's a very nice town, nice city, but,yeah, if I were to live in France, which
I don't think will ever happen, it'sjust hypothetically, I might pick Rouen,
because it's a very, very pretty cityand just the right size city for me.
(05:58):
And it's close to Paris,so it's very good location.
So yeah, I really liked Rouen.
And then I got a car for the, like,more western central Normandy.
I took a tour for the D-Day stuff,which a lot of those roads are
really, really tricky, like the smallcountry roads you have to go through.
So I don't think I couldbail out that car either.
Annie Sargent (06:16):
Where do you normally drive in the US?
Joel Joslin (06:18):
Well, I live in North Carolina.
Annie Sargent (06:20):
Okay.
Okay.
Joel Joslin (06:21):
Central North Carolina, Raleigh Durham.
Annie Sargent (06:24):
So it's interesting because, you know, if you take a
tour, you can see a lot very fast.
Those tour guides, which companydid you do your tour with?
Joel Joslin (06:34):
I don't remember the name.
Annie Sargent (06:35):
Was it perhaps Overlord Tours?
Joel Joslin (06:38):
I don't think so.
Annie Sargent (06:39):
Okay.
Okay.
Yeah, there's a bunch of companies thatdo this, and there are some companies
that will also drive you to the Mont St.
Michel, but from Bayeux.
Where were you staying in Normandy?
Joel Joslin (06:50):
I stayed in like a kind of a countryside hotel.
I kind of, in retrospect, I thinkprobably would have been better if
I just stayed in Bayeux and justgot in a car to get to Mont St.
Michel.
That's the only time I really needed it.
Annie Sargent (07:03):
That makes sense.
That makes sense.
Yeah, you can do a lot in Francewith just tour guides and the train.
But there is no way to getfrom Bayeux to Mont St.
Michel by train as far as I know.
Joel Joslin (07:15):
I think you can go take a train to Rennes and then a shuttle bus,
but that seems like so much trouble.
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (07:21):
Yeah, yeah, so Dol-de-Bretagne is the place, or
Rennes, I think, probably, are placeswhere you could get a train to close,
so you get to Dol-de-Bretagne, andthen from there you can take a bus.
Honestly, that's for people whohave time, and who could, you
know, who don't mind spending awhole day just in transportation.
(07:42):
Most people want to drive to the Mont St.
Michel, spend half a daythere, and leave the next day.
Is that what you did?
Joel Joslin (07:50):
Yeah, pretty much.
I got delayed going to Mont St.
Michel because I got aflat tire on the way.
I'm not really used to European roads,but they fixed it after a couple hours.
And then I had a pleasant drivethere, and yeah, I saw it and
left, mid, late afternoon.
And yeah, then I dropped my car off atSaint Malo and checked into my hotel.
Annie Sargent (08:08):
Aha.
So your flat tire thing, what happened?
Did you just call the assistanceand they took care of you?
Joel Joslin (08:15):
Yeah, it took them a while, but they got to it eventually.
Annie Sargent (08:17):
Yeah, usually assistance in France, I mean, you can get
any assistance anywhere in France.
It's just a question of waiting,and waiting, and waiting.
So they, I assume they towed your carto a repair, to a tire place, and then
you waited while they fixed the car?
Joel Joslin (08:35):
No, they just replaced it there.
Annie Sargent (08:36):
Oh, OK, even better.
Joel Joslin (08:38):
I was there three nights in Saint Malo.
If I'd been in Brittany one or two moredays I would have wanted a car then, but,
you know, I wasn't there that long, so.
I did take the ferry to Dinard though.
Annie Sargent (08:47):
How did you like Mont St.
Michel, the time you spentthere and Saint Malo?
I'd love to hear youropinions about these places.
Joel Joslin (08:53):
I really enjoyed both of them, like, Saint Malo, when there
it was like kind of a cloudy drizzlyday, which isn't the best for photos,
but it's, you know, very atmospheric.
I really enjoyed Mont St.
Michel and Saint Malo, I likeda lot too, I liked walking along
the walls and seeing the sea andI liked the really extreme tides.
Annie Sargent (09:13):
Yeah.
Joel Joslin (09:14):
That at low tide, like there's land bridges to
outer islands and at high tide thewaves are attacking the sea walls.
Annie Sargent (09:21):
Yes.
This weekend, as a matterof fact, is a high tide.
We're recording this in the lateOctober and this weekend is a high tide.
And you can see, I mean, this is normalfor Saint Malo, you can see the water
totally hitting the first row of houses.
It's quite spectacular to see that.
(09:42):
I mean, they must have very good windowsand doors because they get hit really
hard with those windows and doors.
Some of these houses are reallyclose to the wall, aren't they?
Joel Joslin (09:52):
Yeah.
And I like the food.
There are a lot of goodcrepes and seafood.
Annie Sargent (09:55):
Yeah.
Oh yeah.
Yeah.
Crepes, you can...
and it's pretty inexpensive too.
I mean, seafood is more expensive,but crepes are not very expensive.
Joel Joslin (10:03):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I had a lot of crepes and galettes there.
Annie Sargent (10:06):
Did you get tired of eating out all the time?
Joel Joslin (10:08):
Not really, I mean, I tended to, the way I did it, I tended,
like, breakfast, most of the time Iwould just go to a boulangerie and get
a croissant or something with my coffee.
Then for lunch, I'd sit down and getsomething like a cheese plate or maybe
a sandwich or something like that.
And then for dinner, I'd get, somethinga big, like, three or four course
(10:29):
meal, so that way I could kind ofpace myself how much I ate out.
Annie Sargent (10:33):
Yeah.
What sort of budget did youhave for food on this trip?
Do you remember?
More or less?
Joel Joslin (10:39):
I think for breakfast and lunch, I went fairly cheap.
For dinner, I spent a littlemore, but I didn't go to,
like, super high priced places.
I would usually get, for dinner, I'dusually get, like two drinks, starter,
main course and dessert, maybe oneother thing, and I tried to stay under
fifties, maybe sixty euros for it.
(11:00):
Which was, especially once I gotout of Paris, wasn't that difficult.
Annie Sargent (11:04):
Yeah, yeah, Paris is always more expensive for everything.
Anyway.
Okay.
So, was three nights inSaint Malo too long perhaps?
Joel Joslin (11:13):
Not really.
I mean, I was kind of exhausted, soit was nice to take it a little slow.
One more night would have, therewould, and I think, and I could
go, I rode the ferry over tocheck out Dinard a little bit too.
Annie Sargent (11:24):
Uh-huh.
Joel Joslin (11:25):
One more night would have been too much though, but without a car,
but if I stayed any longer, I would havewanted to get a car and drive around.
Annie Sargent (11:33):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
No, it's a really beautifulplace and lots of good weather
at times, at times, not always.
So, late September to October,Do you feel like you lucked out
on the weather or not so much?
Joel Joslin (11:45):
Yeah, I would say so.
It didn't rain that much andthe temperature was good.
Annie Sargent (11:48):
All right, let's get into your favorites.
Like I asked you to rank yourfavorites that you saw on this trip.
So this is where we jumparound a little bit.
But you listed the firstas Chartres Cathedral.
Tell me more.
Joel Joslin (12:01):
I took a day trip there from Paris, and it was, was very beautiful,
and I liked the chateau village too.
I almost wanted to spend a night there,but I ended up going back to Paris.
Yeah, I really enjoyed that.
It was very beautiful.
Annie Sargent (12:15):
And it felt like a village to you.
Joel Joslin (12:17):
Yeah, yeah.
Annie Sargent (12:19):
It's a city, but it's not a huge city.
I mean, when you're out of Paris, itfeels like a very small place, doesn't it?
Joel Joslin (12:26):
Sure.
Yeah, Mont St.
Michel I really liked.
I really enjoyed Strasbourg, and I tooka group tour of the Alsatian countryside.
We went to─ Mittelwihr,Eguisheim, and Colmar.
Annie Sargent (12:38):
Very nice, was this a bus tour or something, or
was it the, like a small vehicle?
Joel Joslin (12:43):
It was a van.
Annie Sargent (12:44):
And was it all English speakers in the van?
Joel Joslin (12:47):
Yeah, I think most of the others were from
Germany, but they spoke English.
Annie Sargent (12:50):
And what about the food in Alsace?
It's very different from therest of the country, isn't it?
Joel Joslin (12:55):
Yeah, yeah, the food was, I liked the food, it was very different.
You know, more German, obviously.
I had some really good sausage andsome really good Black Forest cake.
The last meal I had inStrasbourg wasn't the best.
I think I picked kind of atourist trap place, but besides
that, I enjoyed the food.
Annie Sargent (13:13):
How much time did you spend planning your evening meals?
I mean, at lunchtime, obviouslyyou kept it simple, but for your
evening meals, are you the type ofperson who does a ton of research or
you just like to go with the flow?
Joel Joslin (13:25):
Usually, I mean, I wouldn't pick them out days in advance.
I would usually try to get areservation for where I was going to
eat in the evening by afternoon tomake sure they'd have a spot for me.
But yeah, I would just, I'd go by, like,hotel recommendations a lot of the time,
or think guidebooks in a couple cases,and, or just what seemed good to me.
Annie Sargent (13:46):
Hopefully you listened to the podcast before you went as well?
Joel Joslin (13:49):
Yeah, I listen to some episodes.
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (13:52):
Because there are some good recommendations on the podcast as well.
So that's very cool.
All right.
And then the other things that you listare in the South, St-Paul de Vence.
Joel Joslin (14:01):
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
Well, I was in Nice three days, whichwas a good day, way to end the trip.
Yeah.
And I spent one day, well,morning, I think I went to
the Forum for the same day.
I also went to the Chagall Museum,but anyway, I went, yeah, I took
the bus to Saint Paul de Vence andyes, just spent a few hours there.
It was very nice.
Annie Sargent (14:22):
So that was, yeah, because getting to Saint Paul de Vence
is not the easiest thing in the world.
So probably the tourist office toldyou how to get the bus or something?
Joel Joslin (14:30):
I think I followed a guide I'd read before about it.
Yeah, but the bus drive, I mean,well, once you get out of the
city anyway, it's very scenic.
Annie Sargent (14:38):
Yes.
So what, I forgot to ask atthe beginning, how many times
had you visited France before?
Was this your first time or?
Joel Joslin (14:45):
I had been once before, in like 2015, I think, I went to,
went to Britain, and then I wentto Paris for a few days at the end.
And Paris, that was the bestpart of the trip, so I wanted to
go back and see more of France.
So, yeah, actually, Paris, the trip got,I've told you about before, the trip
got off to a little bit of a rough startbecause I got sick a few days into Paris.
(15:08):
I wasn't like seriouslysick, just a mild cold.
If it had happened like late in thetrip, I just pushed through it, but
it was early, so I decided I just gotto rest this off, so I spent like a
whole day and at least half of twomore days just lying in my hotel room.
Annie Sargent (15:22):
Did you have to see a doctor or no?
Joel Joslin (15:23):
No, no, it was nothing serious.
Annie Sargent (15:25):
Yeah.
That's a bummer when you getsick and you waste, I mean, I
guess you need to get better.
So, you know, you spend some time in bed,I guess that's just how it's going to go.
Joel Joslin (15:36):
Mm hmm.
Annie Sargent (15:36):
In Paris, did you have things you wanted to do or are you
just the type of travel you, you strikeme as the type of traveler who just
shows up somewhere and looks around.
Joel Joslin (15:45):
There have been some museums I wanted to go to.
I did like the Musée Rodin.
I made it there.
Yeah, there were a few differentthings I wanted to do, but
I had to cancel a lot of it.
Annie Sargent (15:54):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So Paris was not the best part ofthe trip, but then things got better.
But you know, this happensto a lot of people.
They make plans and then they can'tfollow the plan as, as well as they
had hoped for because somethinghappens, you know, a family member
gets sick or they get sick or whatever.
Yeah.
Joel Joslin (16:10):
Yeah, yeah, and while I was, like, in my hotel, just sitting in
my hotel in Paris, also ended up justmaking a few other last minute changes
to the itinerary, like, just basicallydropping a couple one or two night
places and just consolidating a littlebit, which I think was for the best.
Annie Sargent (16:27):
Mm hmm.
you did.
I mean, you had a lot of things onyour 21 days, it's not impossible.
It's just, you know, you got arounda lot of different places and always
complicates your life a little bit.
Around Nice, did you see anythingelse besides Saint Paul de Vence?
Joel Joslin (16:44):
I went to the Chagall Museum and I took a walking tour.
Annie Sargent (16:47):
All right.
A walking tour with a group or a VoiceMap?
Joel Joslin (16:50):
Like a, yeah, the group.
We went up to the chateau, and yeah,it was, so yeah, I really enjoyed Nice.
Annie Sargent (16:57):
Yeah.
So did you go up to the château that,whereas there's no chateau, or did you
go to a chateau that actually exists?
Because I don't remember a chateauthat was occupied during the war.
Joel Joslin (17:07):
Well, there's like this, there's a fort, like you have
to take an elevator part of the way.
Annie Sargent (17:12):
Okay, okay.
Joel Joslin (17:13):
There's a big rampart overlooking the sea.
Annie Sargent (17:15):
So the Château Hill is what it is.
Joel Joslin (17:17):
Yeah, and then there's the ruins of an old
chateau a little behind that.
Yeah.
yeah, I really like the food in Nice too.
It's like, nice mix of Mediterraneanfreshness and French complexity, I guess.
Annie Sargent (17:30):
Yeah, no, it's, it's really good.
They serve you the best pizzas in Nice.
I love, I love all the pizzas.
And, if you go to the episodes thatwe've had about Nice, especially the one
with the lady that wrote the VoiceMaptour, I can't remember her name or the
episode number, I'll put it in the shownotes, but she recommended a lot of
really good restaurants in Nice becauseshe's been living there for decades.
(17:53):
And so she's tried them all.
And so she, she had a few that,you know, come out on top.
Joel Joslin (17:58):
I don't remember most of the restaurants now.
I did write, send you one, Femme duBoulangerie, which isn't just a bakery.
Yeah, I enjoyed my dinner there so much.
I had lunch there a couple days later.
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (18:10):
THat's a good sign.
Joel Joslin (18:11):
Yeah, I enjoyed pretty much every meal I had in Nice.
I had one of those, I forget whatit's called, but it's basically
a Niçoise salad sandwich.
with olive oil drizzled all over it.
Annie Sargent (18:20):
Ah, yes, Pam Bagnard, Pam Bagnard, with tuna fish in it, right?
Joel Joslin (18:25):
That was really good.
Yeah, had that for lunch one day.
Annie Sargent (18:28):
Very good.
Oh, all right, and now we yank backto Strasbourg because you liked the
Strasbourg Cathedral and some museums.
I would like to hear what, which ones,and what you recommend people do there.
Joel Joslin (18:40):
Yeah, the cathedral's really nice, it's got a big square around it
with a lot of cool stuff, and there'sa museum about the cathedral nearby.
There's like kind of this triplemuseum of like, I think, fine arts
decorations and ancient stuff.
I only made the fine artsone, but it's really nice.
And then there's the, a fewblocks away, there's the Museum
(19:01):
of the City of Strasbourg,
which, yeah, I really enjoyed that too.
Part of it was closed forrenovations or something.
Annie Sargent (19:08):
It's a very good one.
I think that was my favorite,The History of Strasbourg,
because I just like history.
Joel Joslin (19:16):
Yeah.
I took the boat tour too.
Annie Sargent (19:18):
Yes, the boat tours are fantastic in Strasbourg.
I love that.
I thought that was reallydone better than most cities.
Joel Joslin (19:26):
Yeah, yeah, it was really nice.
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (19:28):
You had mentioned Rouen in the beginning, but you
did a walking tour in Rouen.
Was it again a group tour?
Joel Joslin (19:34):
Where?
Annie Sargent (19:35):
Rouen.
Joel Joslin (19:35):
Oh, Rouen, I don't think I did a walking tour there.
Annie Sargent (19:38):
Okay.
Oh, you said walking around Rouen.
So you just liked the city.
Joel Joslin (19:44):
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (19:44):
Did you find it that different from other cities?
Like, is it very differentfrom Strasbourg or...?
Joel Joslin (19:50):
It's not like, hugely different, I just like the feel of it.
And I went to like the Joan of Arc,the place where they have the trial
reenacted and one or two other spots.
Annie Sargent (19:58):
All right, so, your D-Day beach tour.
Do you remember all theplaces where they took you?
Joel Joslin (20:04):
We went to Pointe du Hoc.
No, I'm butcheringpronunciation there, but.
Yeah, yes.
I think, one of the beaches,maybe Omaha and the cemetery.
It was a half day tour.
Annie Sargent (20:16):
Oh yeah, then, and did you feel that was too much, like some
people really love these historicaltours, did you feel it was too much,
did you feel it was just enough?
Joel Joslin (20:26):
I thought it was just the right amount.
Annie Sargent (20:27):
Uh Huh.
They didn't throw too muchhistory at you all at once?
Joel Joslin (20:30):
No, I mean, it was, it felt just right.
Annie Sargent (20:33):
Are you generally a history, like a history fan, do
you read history books or anything
Joel Joslin (20:38):
like that?
Yeah, yeah, I do.
Annie Sargent (20:39):
Mm-hmm
Joel Joslin (20:40):
I actually have a history degree, undergrad.
Annie Sargent (20:42):
Oh, there you go.
So, did you specialize in anything?
Joel Joslin (20:46):
Not really, no.
Annie Sargent (20:47):
Just a general...
but did you do much Europeanhistory or mostly US history?
Joel Joslin (20:52):
I did more European.
My, actually my senior seminar relevantto this was about the French Revolution,
but now I work in computer science.
Annie Sargent (20:59):
Very good, very good.
Now, you went to a museum inParis that I have not seen,
it's the Gustave Moreau Museum.
Joel Joslin (21:07):
Yeah, yeah, that was, I forgot about that one.
Yeah, it's about the Frenchpainter Gustave Moreau.
It's pretty small, but hasa lot of nice paintings.
Yeah, I did that thefirst day I was there.
Annie Sargent (21:17):
So is that, so did you like it because it's a smaller museum
that you can get through quickly or?
Joel Joslin (21:24):
Yeah, it was a good size, and it had a lot of nice paintings.
Annie Sargent (21:27):
Yeah.
It sounds like you, you like medium sizedcities, perhaps medium sized museums,
you don't love the Louvre, you know,like spend the whole day in the Louvre.
Joel Joslin (21:36):
I actually, I actually do enjoy the Louvre.
I've been there once, I didn't makeit there this time, but someday maybe
I'll go again and see more of it.
Annie Sargent (21:45):
Are there things that you wish you had known about Paris, or about
France in general that you want to sharewith everybody that you just discovered
or you were surprised by or whatever?
Joel Joslin (21:56):
I don't know, like if the biggest thing I would have probably
changed from the final itineraryI ended up with, like I said, was
just staying in Bayeux for like WestCentral Normandy and just getting
a car the day I went to Mont St.
Michel and then Saint Malo.
I was mostly good about avoiding touristtraps, but there were one or two I ended
(22:17):
up in for restaurants, so I just, youknow, you probably don't want to go, at
least for, like, dinner, you probablydon't want to go to places that are,
like, on the squares facing the big sites.
A few blocks back, it'll be.
Annie Sargent (22:34):
Yeah.
so that's always an interesting questionis, you know, touristy, what's touristy?
Well, sometimes, and this is areality in France in minor towns, you
don't really have a lot of choice.
Like tomorrow, Elyse and I are goingto visit some towns in the Gers, so
it's a rural department, where we'regoing is two hour drive from Toulouse
(22:58):
and we're not going to find a lot ofrestaurants, you know, there's not, we
might have a choice between two or three.
So it's in cases like that, youhave to go to the restaurant that's
open on the town square becausethat's what's open, you know.
Otherwise it's going to be a sandwichor a grocery store stop or something,
Joel Joslin (23:19):
Sure, yeah, just mostly medium to large cities.
Annie Sargent (23:22):
Yeah.
Medium large cities, you usuallyget more, a lot more choice and I
don't know, touristy to me doesn't,I mean, obviously you're a visitor
from the US, you're a tourist.
And so there's no shame in goingto touristy places so long as
you get a good experience, agood meal for a decent price.
(23:42):
If the prices are inflated, or if thefood is just not so interesting or
whatever, that's a different matter.
Joel Joslin (23:51):
Yeah, I had a, I ended up, I did have dinner at a couple places
like that, but I enjoyed the vastmajority of the meals I had a lot, so...
Annie Sargent (24:00):
Yeah.
What's your favorite thing toorder when you're in France?
Joel Joslin (24:03):
Let's see, I like, well, this is a really basic answer, the croissants
are really good, I liked escargots, thecheese, I'd usually get some large meat
thing for dinner or occasionally fish.
Annie Sargent (24:15):
So is, like, if they have escargot as an appetizer,
you will always take that?
Joel Joslin (24:20):
Most of the time.
Annie Sargent (24:22):
That's funny to me because that's what tourists do.
French people don't typicallyorder escargot because we can
have it any time and you know...
But visitors, they want to trythe escargot, of course they do.
And it's pretty tasty because all thatbutter and garlic, mmm, it's good.
Joel Joslin (24:39):
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (24:42):
That's good.
Let's see.
Ah, you went, you had a souffléat one of the restaurants
you mentioned in your notes.
Joel Joslin (24:49):
Oh yes, yes.
It was a dessert souffléwith like this caramel sauce.
It was very good.
Annie Sargent (24:54):
Mmm, yes, yes, soufflé is something else.
Joel Joslin (24:59):
Pantruchet.
Yeah, I was one of two restaurantsand I guess it's been a year since
the trip so I can't remember everyrestaurant I ate at, but that was one
of the best restaurants I ate in Paris.
Annie Sargent (25:09):
It's called what?
Le pain ou le Le lapin
Joel Joslin (25:11):
Le Pantruche.
Annie Sargent (25:12):
Okay.
Interesting.
I'll try and find it and put a...
Joel Joslin (25:15):
And yeah, there's also another restaurant in Paris Pony.
I went there a couple times.
It was a good place to go to while I wassick because it was near my hotel and
it's just, it's like a good brasserieslash bar slash burgers, like the kind of
no fuss food you want when you're sick.
It was good.
Annie Sargent (25:34):
One of the questions I ask on the form is what did you
learn about France on this trip?
And your answer is I learned howvaried and diverse the country is.
I'd like you to, you know, tell memore about this because you did get
around to a lot of different regions.
Joel Joslin (25:49):
Right, so, well, first there's just a whole lot of different
landscapes there, there's the coasts inBrittany, and the mountains and hills
around Alsace, and then Nice, which isalso coastal, but a completely different
kind, and then there's lots of differentcultures, Paris is Paris, of course,
and then Alsace is more German, Nice ismore Italian and also a little British.
(26:13):
Kind of funny, it's anItalian-French town that was, lot
of it was built by the British.
Annie Sargent (26:16):
Yeah, there were a lot of, a lot of British move there.
The weather is pleasant.
Joel Joslin (26:21):
The cuisine and food is very different from region to region too.
Annie Sargent (26:24):
Mm hmm.
Very good.
So, the last question we'regoing to get into is, did you
make any mistakes on this trip?
And this is where I want you to takeyour time and just tell me about the
mistakes because other people, we wantthem to avoid mistakes if they can.
Joel Joslin (26:37):
Yeah, I mentioned I didn't really need a car in Normandy
except for getting to Mont St.
Michel, so, I wasn't there long enoughthat I really needed one besides that.
I think my initial itinerary was busierwith more stops than I ended up with,
so I did end up changing it, while Iwas in Paris, so it worked out pretty
(26:58):
well, but I think the one I had plannedwas a little bit more aggressive, and
I think that would have been a mistake
.Annie Sargent: So what did you remove?
Uh, I moved a few, a few things, like, I was originally
gonna, spend a night in Mont St.
Michel, and go to a couple otherplaces in Provence besides Nice.
Strasbourg actually was originallygoing to be a day trip from Paris,
(27:19):
and I ended up changing thataround, I was too sick to go there.
And yeah, so it was actually prettydifferent, but I think the final
itinerary worked out pretty well.
Annie Sargent (27:28):
Uh huh.
So you have to be nimble.
I mean, that's just a fact.
And because you were travelingby yourself, you were able to.
It's harder when you're with you know,your significant other, or with your
parents, or with your friends, orbecause getting everybody to agree
on one thing is pretty difficult.
Joel Joslin (27:47):
Yeah, so the first half of the trip had some ups and
downs, but on the whole, I thinkit all turned out really well.
Annie Sargent (27:53):
Mm hmm.
Mm hmm.
It's funny.
You said, I forgot that I generallydo not enjoy driving in Europe.
Joel Joslin (27:59):
Yeah, yeah,
Annie Sargent (28:00):
Yeah.
The narrow roads, did you rent a bigcar or how big was this car you got?
Joel Joslin (28:05):
It wasn't that big.
I don't know what brand it was, but,yeah, it was medium, it was medium sized,
but I don't know, it's just like theroads in the US, most parts of the US
are a lot wider, so like just gettingused to the European roads is tricky.
Annie Sargent (28:23):
Yeah.
It is, it is,when you arenot used to it it's...
yeah you said you got a flat tirefrom hitting a curb, it happened to me
once as well, it happens to all of us.
Joel Joslin (28:32):
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (28:33):
Yeah, that's just never, never a good thing, but, honestly, there
are places, and in Normandy, if you're notgoing to do a tour, you can't get to those
places without a car, so it just depends.
If your plan is to take a tour,then you don't need a car really,
ever, because if you set yourself,if you're in Bayeux, and you take a
(28:57):
Normandy beach tour, and then you takeanother tour to take you to Mont St.
Michel, which you can do, somecompanies do that, then that's it, you
don't need a car for Normandy at all.
I was talking to somebody just a fewdays ago, who was interested in touring
around Occitanie where I live, and it's,I, you know, like, I don't know how you
(29:18):
do it without, it's either a tour, likeif you want to go to the Dordogne, if
you're in Toulouse and you want to goto the Dordogne, it's either a tour or
a private driver, or you rent a car.
You know, you can't get to those places.
You know, it's just a fact.
And there's so many places whereyou don't need a car, you know, at
all, like, it's fine, it's fine.
Joel Joslin (29:38):
And like, the one nice thing.
Then you get tours, like, sometimes youcan go through places a little faster
than you'd like, like, I didn't, I wasn'table to see as much as Colmar as I ideally
would like on the tour, but the nice thingis, since you don't have to concentrate
on driving, you can just, like, enjoythe scenery as much as you want.
Annie Sargent (29:54):
Yeah.
Joel Joslin (29:55):
And the Alsatian countryside is very beautiful.
Annie Sargent (29:58):
Very nice, isn't it?
And the other way to enjoyit is to just take buses.
They have a good regional bus system.
But it's, again, it'sfor people who have time.
So if you're going to be in Strasbourgfor a few days, you can take a bus to
most of these villages, a public bus,like a city bus, regional bus, I guess.
(30:18):
And that will take you, typically thatbus is going to be full of teenagers
who don't have a driver's license yetand older people who don't want to
drive anymore, and they take the bus.
And you have a bus like pretty muchevery hour to go to these places like
Colmar and Riquevire and all that.
So, you can do it on the bus, butit takes longer, everything takes
(30:38):
longer if you do it that way.
A tour is really the most efficientway to do it, they will just take you.
And sometimes they yank youout a little bit too fast.
It sounds like perhaps in Colmar theysaid, let's move on a little too fast.
Joel Joslin (30:51):
Yeah, yeah, I was, I had actually been hoping to do
the Unterlinden, which I wasn'table to, but maybe someday.
Annie Sargent (30:57):
You mean, did you say Unterlinden?
You didn't get to see the museum?
Joel Joslin (31:01):
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (31:01):
Ah, yeah, yeah.
And it is a big museum.
I mean, you can just go to the retable,to the, you know, the altarpiece, and
just see that, but it is true that if youwant to see the whole museum, it would
take a good two, perhaps three hours.
You know, it's not one of the tinyones, that we have in some places.
And one of the things that you mentionedis that perhaps your itinerary was
(31:25):
overambitious and that's a, that'sgood advice for most people just to...
Joel Joslin (31:29):
I'd say it was, the original one I had planned was too ambitious.
And then the one I revised, like, I was,you know, I was in my hotel room a lot in
Paris, and I realized, yeah, especiallynow that I'm sick, this is just too much.
So I, like, fortunately I wasable to just call the hotels and
get a few things shifted around.
So, yeah, it worked out, itworked out, the itinerary I ended
(31:52):
up with worked out pretty well.
Annie Sargent (31:54):
And what did you do for internet access?
Did you purchase a plan?
What did you do?
Joel Joslin (31:59):
Yeah, I bought an international plan, and also
the hotels had Wi Fi, so, youknow, I could use it there a lot.
Annie Sargent (32:05):
And it sounds like you didn't use apps particularly
to book your hotels or whatever.
Did you mostly call them?
Yeah.
Joel Joslin (32:13):
Yeah, mostly I did it through the hotel's website,
that tends to be the cheapest.
There are a couple apps I used.
I used Omio for trains.
Annie Sargent (32:21):
Omio?
Joel Joslin (32:22):
Yeah, O M I O.
Yeah, it just, it's for booking trainsin Europe, I don't know if they do
other continents, but it just putsmost regional trains together into one
search, and then you can book from there.
Annie Sargent (32:34):
That's pretty good.
I mean, I don't think I'veheard about this one before.
Joel Joslin (32:38):
Yeah, it's pretty handy.
Annie Sargent (32:39):
Sounds good.
Joel Joslin (32:39):
I went to Italy recently and I used it there too.
Annie Sargent (32:41):
Aha, so compare France and Italy now.
Joel Joslin (32:45):
I really, I really enjoyed both, I think I, I think
I liked France a little better,but yeah, I really enjoyed both.
Annie Sargent (32:52):
In what ways?
Is it the food?
Is it the people?
Is it the scenery?
Is it the museums?
The diversity perhaps?
I think France is more diverse.
Joel Joslin (33:01):
Yeah, the food, I think the scenery, both have a lot of
beautiful scenery, but I'd give aslight advantage to France probably.
And yeah, I like, France seems to havemore like different types of food, of
things in the country, more the diversity.
But I really enjoy both of them.
Annie Sargent (33:16):
Yeah, in Italy, it felt like it was one church after another.
So many gorgeous churches in Italy.
It's unbelievable.
Joel Joslin (33:23):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I like gothic churches a little betterthan Baroque, so there's that too.
Annie Sargent (33:28):
Ah, yes.
Yeah.
That's a big, that's a big one, because inItaly, they're mostly baroque, you know,
and in Nice as well, it's a lot of Baroquechurches, they're beautiful, but yeah.
Okay, let's see.
So, overall, you thoughtyour trip was restful.
Joel Joslin (33:44):
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (33:45):
Doesn't sound like you have major regrets.
Joel Joslin (33:47):
Right, yeah, the regrets are, I mean, like, I wish I hadn't gotten
sick in Paris, and a couple other things,like, could have picked a different hotel
for part of Normandy, but yeah, I don'thave any, like, really major regrets.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Was the budget reasonable?
Did you find France more expensiveor less expensive than Italy overall?
I'd say, a little less, Paris is probablymore expensive than Rome, but once I
(34:11):
got out of Paris, I felt like everythinggets a lot cheaper, and Italy, you know,
Venice and Florence are still expensive.
Especially Florence, I was surprisedhow expensive Florence was.
I did go to Ravenna, which is a smallcity that was pretty cheap, but on the
whole, I thought France was cheaper.
The budget was mostly reasonable, therewere a couple things I could have done
(34:33):
differently to save some money, butoverall, yeah, for the length of time,
I didn't feel like it was excessive.
Annie Sargent (34:40):
It was a long time to stay, you know, and which more and more
people are trying to stay longer becauseinternational flights are getting more
expensive, and I think typically it isbetter to stay a couple of weeks if you
can, three weeks is a lot for most people.
Joel Joslin (34:57):
Yeah.
Italy was two weeks, so my nextinternational trip, we'll see.
Annie Sargent (35:01):
Yeah.
Do you travel a lotinternationally typically?
Joel Joslin (35:04):
I've taken three international trips.
The first one was in 2015, andthen the second one wasn't until
2022, so that's a long gap.
I always had stuff going on, like I hadto move, or finances, or COVID, of course.
Annie Sargent (35:17):
Yeah.
Our favorite thing COVID.
Joel Joslin (35:19):
Ideally I'd like to take an international trip
every year, but we'll see.
Annie Sargent (35:23):
Yeah.
I love the photo yousent me with the helmet.
Joel Joslin (35:28):
Oh, yeah, yeah, like, that was a good picture
from the Strasbourg Museum, yeah.
Annie Sargent (35:32):
Yes, I tried on the helmet as well, didn't
do as good a job as you did.
I think everybody tries on that helmet.
Yeah.
Well, fantastic talking to you.
It's good to talk to somebody whois willing to admit that things
didn't go 100 percent perfectly, butover three weeks, what are the odds
that nothing would go wrong, right?
(35:53):
Even in real life, if you think aboutyour real life in three weeks, well,
something upsetting is going to happen,probably at one point or another,
unless you have a very charmed life.
Some boss, or coworker, or someoneis going to annoy you, right?
Yeah.
yeah.
When you ask me my favorite foods, I don'tthink I mentioned the desserts, so I'll
(36:14):
say I really like a lot of the sweets.
Fantastic.
Well, Joel, thank you so much.
And well, thank you for talking to me,thank you for being a good sport about the
vicissitudes of recording a podcast, and Iwish you some, some more wonderful trips.
Joel Joslin (36:29):
All right, well, yeah, thank you for having me on, Annie.
Have a good day.
Annie Sargent (36:32):
Merci beaucoup.
Au revoir.
Joel Joslin (36:33):
Au revoir.
Annie Sargent (36:40):
The Join Us in France travel podcast is written, hosted,
and produced by Annie Sargent andCopyright 2024 by AddictedToFrance.
It is released under a CreativeCommons, attribution, non-commercial,
no derivatives license.
This is Join Us in France episode 489,
quatre cent quatre vingt neuf.
Bonjour, I'm Annie Sargent, and Join Usin France is the podcast where we take
a conversational journey through thebeauty, culture and flavors of France.
Today, I bring you a trip report withJoel Joslin where he showcases his 21 day
(00:38):
solo traveler's journey through France.
And he does it in awonderfully candid manner.
I love that because Ilove to keep it real.
This podcast is supported by donorsand listeners who buy my tours and
services, including my ItineraryConsult Service, my GPS self-guided
tours of Paris on the Voice Map app,or take a day trip with me around the
(01:01):
southwest of France in my electric car.
You can browse all of that at myboutique joinusinfrance.com/boutique.
Patreon supporters get the episodeas soon as it's ready and ads free.
There won't be a magazine today becauseI'm away exploring the beautiful
Aveyron Department for a few days.
(01:21):
I'll be back next week with detailsabout access around the Olympic sites
especially before the opening ceremony.
But I do want to thank allmy patrons who have kept this
podcast going for a long time.
And a shout out this week to newpatrons: Patty Mulkeen, Krista
Critter, Carol Tumey, Rebecca A.
(01:44):
S.
and Kristi R.
And to all of my current patrons,it's wonderful to have you on board
in the community of francophiles.
I'll post some photos of my Aveyronvisit next week, because the new
messaging feature of Patreon worksreally well, so I'm enjoying that.
(02:04):
How do you become a patronand get this podcast ads free?
Go to patreon.com/JoinUs and to supportElyse, go to patreon.com/ElysArt.
And thank you very much.
(02:34):
Bonjour Joel, and welcometo Join Us in France!
Joel Joslin (02:37):
Hi Annie, thank you for having me.
Annie Sargent (02:39):
Lovely to see you, and we have an interesting
conversation laid out today.
You had a rather long trip to France.
You were here for 21 days,and this was a solo trip.
So can you tell us when yourtrip took place and more or less
briefly where you went so thatthen we can dig in more details?
Joel Joslin (03:00):
Yeah, so I went to France last October 2022,
end of September, I guess.
I went to spent about a week inParis, and then five days in Normandy,
three days in Brittany, four days inStrasbourg, and three days in Nice.
Annie Sargent (03:17):
Oh, so you went all over the place.
Did you land into Paris?
Joel Joslin (03:21):
Yes.
Annie Sargent (03:22):
And flew out of Paris as well?
Joel Joslin (03:24):
I flew out of Nice.
Annie Sargent (03:26):
Out of Nice, okay.
And how did you getaround most of that time?
Joel Joslin (03:30):
A lot of it was by train, so I went from Paris to Normandy,
to Brittany by train is pretty easy.
I used a car some inNormandy, which actually...
but if I could change one thingabout my trip, I probably would
have used one less, because I reallydidn't really need it, and I could
have gotten a more central hotel.
It was helpful for the Aigle deMont St-Michel, but I probably
didn't need it for the rest of it.
Annie Sargent (03:51):
Interesting.
Joel Joslin (03:51):
To get from St.
Malo, and Brittany to Strasbourg, Ihad to change trains a couple of times.
It was a day mostly on the train,but I didn't mind it, you know,
like a long train ride is a lot morerelaxing, like a long drive or flight.
Annie Sargent (04:04):
That's true.
Joel Joslin (04:05):
There's a lot of nice scenery, so it was just
a day of rest a little bit.
And then I flew Strasbourgto Nice on Volotea.
It was like two hours.
Annie Sargent (04:13):
Oh yeah, not my favorite airline.
Did everything go well?
Joel Joslin (04:17):
Yeah, well, it was fine.
We have budget lines, super budget lineslike that in the US too, I think they're
generally okay for short trips, I think.
Annie Sargent (04:24):
Yeah, and it's true that in France, if it's like you experienced,
if you go from Brittany all the wayto Strasbourg, you have to go through
Paris, you will have to change trainsin Paris, and if you had tried to
do Strasbourg to Nice, you probablywould have had to go back to Paris
as well and change trains in Paris.
So, you know, it's one of the reasons whythe regional airlines are still needed.
(04:48):
We can't do everything by train, eventhough lots of French people would
like to, but the other issue thatcomes up is that French trains are
not cheap, when you compare them toother countries in Europe, like Spanish
trains, Italian trains, German trains,we're quite expensive by comparison.
And so that's why we still have a lotof people driving and taking airplanes.
(05:10):
Even those not very good Voloteaflights that I don't like,
but you know, such is life.
Joel Joslin (05:15):
Well, it was so.., Volotea it was so cheap, I didn't really mind it.
Annie Sargent (05:19):
Exactly.
It's very cheap.
Yeah, very cheap.
So I'm interested in what you said aboutBrittany, cause I usually recommend that
people take the train into Brittany,but then rent a car, especially if
they're going to do all the landingbeaches and all that by themselves.
Perhaps you had a tour, right?
Joel Joslin (05:36):
You mean Normandy?
Right?
Annie Sargent (05:37):
Normandy.
Sorry.
Sorry.
Yes.
Joel Joslin (05:38):
Yeah, so I, well, okay, so I spent, I was in a
couple locations in Normandy.
I spent the first two days inRouen, which I really liked Rouen.
It's a very nice town, nice city, but,yeah, if I were to live in France, which
I don't think will ever happen, it'sjust hypothetically, I might pick Rouen,
because it's a very, very pretty cityand just the right size city for me.
(05:58):
And it's close to Paris,so it's very good location.
So yeah, I really liked Rouen.
And then I got a car for the, like,more western central Normandy.
I took a tour for the D-Day stuff,which a lot of those roads are
really, really tricky, like the smallcountry roads you have to go through.
So I don't think I couldbail out that car either.
Annie Sargent (06:16):
Where do you normally drive in the US?
Joel Joslin (06:18):
Well, I live in North Carolina.
Annie Sargent (06:20):
Okay.
Okay.
Joel Joslin (06:21):
Central North Carolina, Raleigh Durham.
Annie Sargent (06:24):
So it's interesting because, you know, if you take a
tour, you can see a lot very fast.
Those tour guides, which companydid you do your tour with?
Joel Joslin (06:34):
I don't remember the name.
Annie Sargent (06:35):
Was it perhaps Overlord Tours?
Joel Joslin (06:38):
I don't think so.
Annie Sargent (06:39):
Okay.
Okay.
Yeah, there's a bunch of companies thatdo this, and there are some companies
that will also drive you to the Mont St.
Michel, but from Bayeux.
Where were you staying in Normandy?
Joel Joslin (06:50):
I stayed in like a kind of a countryside hotel.
I kind of, in retrospect, I thinkprobably would have been better if
I just stayed in Bayeux and justgot in a car to get to Mont St.
Michel.
That's the only time I really needed it.
Annie Sargent (07:03):
That makes sense.
That makes sense.
Yeah, you can do a lot in Francewith just tour guides and the train.
But there is no way to getfrom Bayeux to Mont St.
Michel by train as far as I know.
Joel Joslin (07:15):
I think you can go take a train to Rennes and then a shuttle bus,
but that seems like so much trouble.
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (07:21):
Yeah, yeah, so Dol-de-Bretagne is the place, or
Rennes, I think, probably, are placeswhere you could get a train to close,
so you get to Dol-de-Bretagne, andthen from there you can take a bus.
Honestly, that's for people whohave time, and who could, you
know, who don't mind spending awhole day just in transportation.
(07:42):
Most people want to drive to the Mont St.
Michel, spend half a daythere, and leave the next day.
Is that what you did?
Joel Joslin (07:50):
Yeah, pretty much.
I got delayed going to Mont St.
Michel because I got aflat tire on the way.
I'm not really used to European roads,but they fixed it after a couple hours.
And then I had a pleasant drivethere, and yeah, I saw it and
left, mid, late afternoon.
And yeah, then I dropped my car off atSaint Malo and checked into my hotel.
Annie Sargent (08:08):
Aha.
So your flat tire thing, what happened?
Did you just call the assistanceand they took care of you?
Joel Joslin (08:15):
Yeah, it took them a while, but they got to it eventually.
Annie Sargent (08:17):
Yeah, usually assistance in France, I mean, you can get
any assistance anywhere in France.
It's just a question of waiting,and waiting, and waiting.
So they, I assume they towed your carto a repair, to a tire place, and then
you waited while they fixed the car?
Joel Joslin (08:35):
No, they just replaced it there.
Annie Sargent (08:36):
Oh, OK, even better.
Joel Joslin (08:38):
I was there three nights in Saint Malo.
If I'd been in Brittany one or two moredays I would have wanted a car then, but,
you know, I wasn't there that long, so.
I did take the ferry to Dinard though.
Annie Sargent (08:47):
How did you like Mont St.
Michel, the time you spentthere and Saint Malo?
I'd love to hear youropinions about these places.
Joel Joslin (08:53):
I really enjoyed both of them, like, Saint Malo, when there
it was like kind of a cloudy drizzlyday, which isn't the best for photos,
but it's, you know, very atmospheric.
I really enjoyed Mont St.
Michel and Saint Malo, I likeda lot too, I liked walking along
the walls and seeing the sea andI liked the really extreme tides.
Annie Sargent (09:13):
Yeah.
Joel Joslin (09:14):
That at low tide, like there's land bridges to
outer islands and at high tide thewaves are attacking the sea walls.
Annie Sargent (09:21):
Yes.
This weekend, as a matterof fact, is a high tide.
We're recording this in the lateOctober and this weekend is a high tide.
And you can see, I mean, this is normalfor Saint Malo, you can see the water
totally hitting the first row of houses.
It's quite spectacular to see that.
(09:42):
I mean, they must have very good windowsand doors because they get hit really
hard with those windows and doors.
Some of these houses are reallyclose to the wall, aren't they?
Joel Joslin (09:52):
Yeah.
And I like the food.
There are a lot of goodcrepes and seafood.
Annie Sargent (09:55):
Yeah.
Oh yeah.
Yeah.
Crepes, you can...
and it's pretty inexpensive too.
I mean, seafood is more expensive,but crepes are not very expensive.
Joel Joslin (10:03):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I had a lot of crepes and galettes there.
Annie Sargent (10:06):
Did you get tired of eating out all the time?
Joel Joslin (10:08):
Not really, I mean, I tended to, the way I did it, I tended,
like, breakfast, most of the time Iwould just go to a boulangerie and get
a croissant or something with my coffee.
Then for lunch, I'd sit down and getsomething like a cheese plate or maybe
a sandwich or something like that.
And then for dinner, I'd get, somethinga big, like, three or four course
(10:29):
meal, so that way I could kind ofpace myself how much I ate out.
Annie Sargent (10:33):
Yeah.
What sort of budget did youhave for food on this trip?
Do you remember?
More or less?
Joel Joslin (10:39):
I think for breakfast and lunch, I went fairly cheap.
For dinner, I spent a littlemore, but I didn't go to,
like, super high priced places.
I would usually get, for dinner, I'dusually get, like two drinks, starter,
main course and dessert, maybe oneother thing, and I tried to stay under
fifties, maybe sixty euros for it.
(11:00):
Which was, especially once I gotout of Paris, wasn't that difficult.
Annie Sargent (11:04):
Yeah, yeah, Paris is always more expensive for everything.
Anyway.
Okay.
So, was three nights inSaint Malo too long perhaps?
Joel Joslin (11:13):
Not really.
I mean, I was kind of exhausted, soit was nice to take it a little slow.
One more night would have, therewould, and I think, and I could
go, I rode the ferry over tocheck out Dinard a little bit too.
Annie Sargent (11:24):
Uh-huh.
Joel Joslin (11:25):
One more night would have been too much though, but without a car,
but if I stayed any longer, I would havewanted to get a car and drive around.
Annie Sargent (11:33):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
No, it's a really beautifulplace and lots of good weather
at times, at times, not always.
So, late September to October,Do you feel like you lucked out
on the weather or not so much?
Joel Joslin (11:45):
Yeah, I would say so.
It didn't rain that much andthe temperature was good.
Annie Sargent (11:48):
All right, let's get into your favorites.
Like I asked you to rank yourfavorites that you saw on this trip.
So this is where we jumparound a little bit.
But you listed the firstas Chartres Cathedral.
Tell me more.
Joel Joslin (12:01):
I took a day trip there from Paris, and it was, was very beautiful,
and I liked the chateau village too.
I almost wanted to spend a night there,but I ended up going back to Paris.
Yeah, I really enjoyed that.
It was very beautiful.
Annie Sargent (12:15):
And it felt like a village to you.
Joel Joslin (12:17):
Yeah, yeah.
Annie Sargent (12:19):
It's a city, but it's not a huge city.
I mean, when you're out of Paris, itfeels like a very small place, doesn't it?
Joel Joslin (12:26):
Sure.
Yeah, Mont St.
Michel I really liked.
I really enjoyed Strasbourg, and I tooka group tour of the Alsatian countryside.
We went to─ Mittelwihr,Eguisheim, and Colmar.
Annie Sargent (12:38):
Very nice, was this a bus tour or something, or
was it the, like a small vehicle?
Joel Joslin (12:43):
It was a van.
Annie Sargent (12:44):
And was it all English speakers in the van?
Joel Joslin (12:47):
Yeah, I think most of the others were from
Germany, but they spoke English.
Annie Sargent (12:50):
And what about the food in Alsace?
It's very different from therest of the country, isn't it?
Joel Joslin (12:55):
Yeah, yeah, the food was, I liked the food, it was very different.
You know, more German, obviously.
I had some really good sausage andsome really good Black Forest cake.
The last meal I had inStrasbourg wasn't the best.
I think I picked kind of atourist trap place, but besides
that, I enjoyed the food.
Annie Sargent (13:13):
How much time did you spend planning your evening meals?
I mean, at lunchtime, obviouslyyou kept it simple, but for your
evening meals, are you the type ofperson who does a ton of research or
you just like to go with the flow?
Joel Joslin (13:25):
Usually, I mean, I wouldn't pick them out days in advance.
I would usually try to get areservation for where I was going to
eat in the evening by afternoon tomake sure they'd have a spot for me.
But yeah, I would just, I'd go by, like,hotel recommendations a lot of the time,
or think guidebooks in a couple cases,and, or just what seemed good to me.
Annie Sargent (13:46):
Hopefully you listened to the podcast before you went as well?
Joel Joslin (13:49):
Yeah, I listen to some episodes.
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (13:52):
Because there are some good recommendations on the podcast as well.
So that's very cool.
All right.
And then the other things that you listare in the South, St-Paul de Vence.
Joel Joslin (14:01):
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
Well, I was in Nice three days, whichwas a good day, way to end the trip.
Yeah.
And I spent one day, well,morning, I think I went to
the Forum for the same day.
I also went to the Chagall Museum,but anyway, I went, yeah, I took
the bus to Saint Paul de Vence andyes, just spent a few hours there.
It was very nice.
Annie Sargent (14:22):
So that was, yeah, because getting to Saint Paul de Vence
is not the easiest thing in the world.
So probably the tourist office toldyou how to get the bus or something?
Joel Joslin (14:30):
I think I followed a guide I'd read before about it.
Yeah, but the bus drive, I mean,well, once you get out of the
city anyway, it's very scenic.
Annie Sargent (14:38):
Yes.
So what, I forgot to ask atthe beginning, how many times
had you visited France before?
Was this your first time or?
Joel Joslin (14:45):
I had been once before, in like 2015, I think, I went to,
went to Britain, and then I wentto Paris for a few days at the end.
And Paris, that was the bestpart of the trip, so I wanted to
go back and see more of France.
So, yeah, actually, Paris, the trip got,I've told you about before, the trip
got off to a little bit of a rough startbecause I got sick a few days into Paris.
(15:08):
I wasn't like seriouslysick, just a mild cold.
If it had happened like late in thetrip, I just pushed through it, but
it was early, so I decided I just gotto rest this off, so I spent like a
whole day and at least half of twomore days just lying in my hotel room.
Annie Sargent (15:22):
Did you have to see a doctor or no?
Joel Joslin (15:23):
No, no, it was nothing serious.
Annie Sargent (15:25):
Yeah.
That's a bummer when you getsick and you waste, I mean, I
guess you need to get better.
So, you know, you spend some time in bed,I guess that's just how it's going to go.
Joel Joslin (15:36):
Mm hmm.
Annie Sargent (15:36):
In Paris, did you have things you wanted to do or are you
just the type of travel you, you strikeme as the type of traveler who just
shows up somewhere and looks around.
Joel Joslin (15:45):
There have been some museums I wanted to go to.
I did like the Musée Rodin.
I made it there.
Yeah, there were a few differentthings I wanted to do, but
I had to cancel a lot of it.
Annie Sargent (15:54):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So Paris was not the best part ofthe trip, but then things got better.
But you know, this happensto a lot of people.
They make plans and then they can'tfollow the plan as, as well as they
had hoped for because somethinghappens, you know, a family member
gets sick or they get sick or whatever.
Yeah.
Joel Joslin (16:10):
Yeah, yeah, and while I was, like, in my hotel, just sitting in
my hotel in Paris, also ended up justmaking a few other last minute changes
to the itinerary, like, just basicallydropping a couple one or two night
places and just consolidating a littlebit, which I think was for the best.
Annie Sargent (16:27):
Mm hmm.
you did.
I mean, you had a lot of things onyour 21 days, it's not impossible.
It's just, you know, you got arounda lot of different places and always
complicates your life a little bit.
Around Nice, did you see anythingelse besides Saint Paul de Vence?
Joel Joslin (16:44):
I went to the Chagall Museum and I took a walking tour.
Annie Sargent (16:47):
All right.
A walking tour with a group or a VoiceMap?
Joel Joslin (16:50):
Like a, yeah, the group.
We went up to the chateau, and yeah,it was, so yeah, I really enjoyed Nice.
Annie Sargent (16:57):
Yeah.
So did you go up to the château that,whereas there's no chateau, or did you
go to a chateau that actually exists?
Because I don't remember a chateauthat was occupied during the war.
Joel Joslin (17:07):
Well, there's like this, there's a fort, like you have
to take an elevator part of the way.
Annie Sargent (17:12):
Okay, okay.
Joel Joslin (17:13):
There's a big rampart overlooking the sea.
Annie Sargent (17:15):
So the Château Hill is what it is.
Joel Joslin (17:17):
Yeah, and then there's the ruins of an old
chateau a little behind that.
Yeah.
yeah, I really like the food in Nice too.
It's like, nice mix of Mediterraneanfreshness and French complexity, I guess.
Annie Sargent (17:30):
Yeah, no, it's, it's really good.
They serve you the best pizzas in Nice.
I love, I love all the pizzas.
And, if you go to the episodes thatwe've had about Nice, especially the one
with the lady that wrote the VoiceMaptour, I can't remember her name or the
episode number, I'll put it in the shownotes, but she recommended a lot of
really good restaurants in Nice becauseshe's been living there for decades.
(17:53):
And so she's tried them all.
And so she, she had a few that,you know, come out on top.
Joel Joslin (17:58):
I don't remember most of the restaurants now.
I did write, send you one, Femme duBoulangerie, which isn't just a bakery.
Yeah, I enjoyed my dinner there so much.
I had lunch there a couple days later.
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (18:10):
THat's a good sign.
Joel Joslin (18:11):
Yeah, I enjoyed pretty much every meal I had in Nice.
I had one of those, I forget whatit's called, but it's basically
a Niçoise salad sandwich.
with olive oil drizzled all over it.
Annie Sargent (18:20):
Ah, yes, Pam Bagnard, Pam Bagnard, with tuna fish in it, right?
Joel Joslin (18:25):
That was really good.
Yeah, had that for lunch one day.
Annie Sargent (18:28):
Very good.
Oh, all right, and now we yank backto Strasbourg because you liked the
Strasbourg Cathedral and some museums.
I would like to hear what, which ones,and what you recommend people do there.
Joel Joslin (18:40):
Yeah, the cathedral's really nice, it's got a big square around it
with a lot of cool stuff, and there'sa museum about the cathedral nearby.
There's like kind of this triplemuseum of like, I think, fine arts
decorations and ancient stuff.
I only made the fine artsone, but it's really nice.
And then there's the, a fewblocks away, there's the Museum
(19:01):
of the City of Strasbourg,
which, yeah, I really enjoyed that too.
Part of it was closed forrenovations or something.
Annie Sargent (19:08):
It's a very good one.
I think that was my favorite,The History of Strasbourg,
because I just like history.
Joel Joslin (19:16):
Yeah.
I took the boat tour too.
Annie Sargent (19:18):
Yes, the boat tours are fantastic in Strasbourg.
I love that.
I thought that was reallydone better than most cities.
Joel Joslin (19:26):
Yeah, yeah, it was really nice.
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (19:28):
You had mentioned Rouen in the beginning, but you
did a walking tour in Rouen.
Was it again a group tour?
Joel Joslin (19:34):
Where?
Annie Sargent (19:35):
Rouen.
Joel Joslin (19:35):
Oh, Rouen, I don't think I did a walking tour there.
Annie Sargent (19:38):
Okay.
Oh, you said walking around Rouen.
So you just liked the city.
Joel Joslin (19:44):
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (19:44):
Did you find it that different from other cities?
Like, is it very differentfrom Strasbourg or...?
Joel Joslin (19:50):
It's not like, hugely different, I just like the feel of it.
And I went to like the Joan of Arc,the place where they have the trial
reenacted and one or two other spots.
Annie Sargent (19:58):
All right, so, your D-Day beach tour.
Do you remember all theplaces where they took you?
Joel Joslin (20:04):
We went to Pointe du Hoc.
No, I'm butcheringpronunciation there, but.
Yeah, yes.
I think, one of the beaches,maybe Omaha and the cemetery.
It was a half day tour.
Annie Sargent (20:16):
Oh yeah, then, and did you feel that was too much, like some
people really love these historicaltours, did you feel it was too much,
did you feel it was just enough?
Joel Joslin (20:26):
I thought it was just the right amount.
Annie Sargent (20:27):
Uh Huh.
They didn't throw too muchhistory at you all at once?
Joel Joslin (20:30):
No, I mean, it was, it felt just right.
Annie Sargent (20:33):
Are you generally a history, like a history fan, do
you read history books or anything
Joel Joslin (20:38):
like that?
Yeah, yeah, I do.
Annie Sargent (20:39):
Mm-hmm
Joel Joslin (20:40):
I actually have a history degree, undergrad.
Annie Sargent (20:42):
Oh, there you go.
So, did you specialize in anything?
Joel Joslin (20:46):
Not really, no.
Annie Sargent (20:47):
Just a general...
but did you do much Europeanhistory or mostly US history?
Joel Joslin (20:52):
I did more European.
My, actually my senior seminar relevantto this was about the French Revolution,
but now I work in computer science.
Annie Sargent (20:59):
Very good, very good.
Now, you went to a museum inParis that I have not seen,
it's the Gustave Moreau Museum.
Joel Joslin (21:07):
Yeah, yeah, that was, I forgot about that one.
Yeah, it's about the Frenchpainter Gustave Moreau.
It's pretty small, but hasa lot of nice paintings.
Yeah, I did that thefirst day I was there.
Annie Sargent (21:17):
So is that, so did you like it because it's a smaller museum
that you can get through quickly or?
Joel Joslin (21:24):
Yeah, it was a good size, and it had a lot of nice paintings.
Annie Sargent (21:27):
Yeah.
It sounds like you, you like medium sizedcities, perhaps medium sized museums,
you don't love the Louvre, you know,like spend the whole day in the Louvre.
Joel Joslin (21:36):
I actually, I actually do enjoy the Louvre.
I've been there once, I didn't makeit there this time, but someday maybe
I'll go again and see more of it.
Annie Sargent (21:45):
Are there things that you wish you had known about Paris, or about
France in general that you want to sharewith everybody that you just discovered
or you were surprised by or whatever?
Joel Joslin (21:56):
I don't know, like if the biggest thing I would have probably
changed from the final itineraryI ended up with, like I said, was
just staying in Bayeux for like WestCentral Normandy and just getting
a car the day I went to Mont St.
Michel and then Saint Malo.
I was mostly good about avoiding touristtraps, but there were one or two I ended
(22:17):
up in for restaurants, so I just, youknow, you probably don't want to go, at
least for, like, dinner, you probablydon't want to go to places that are,
like, on the squares facing the big sites.
A few blocks back, it'll be.
Annie Sargent (22:34):
Yeah.
so that's always an interesting questionis, you know, touristy, what's touristy?
Well, sometimes, and this is areality in France in minor towns, you
don't really have a lot of choice.
Like tomorrow, Elyse and I are goingto visit some towns in the Gers, so
it's a rural department, where we'regoing is two hour drive from Toulouse
(22:58):
and we're not going to find a lot ofrestaurants, you know, there's not, we
might have a choice between two or three.
So it's in cases like that, youhave to go to the restaurant that's
open on the town square becausethat's what's open, you know.
Otherwise it's going to be a sandwichor a grocery store stop or something,
Joel Joslin (23:19):
Sure, yeah, just mostly medium to large cities.
Annie Sargent (23:22):
Yeah.
Medium large cities, you usuallyget more, a lot more choice and I
don't know, touristy to me doesn't,I mean, obviously you're a visitor
from the US, you're a tourist.
And so there's no shame in goingto touristy places so long as
you get a good experience, agood meal for a decent price.
(23:42):
If the prices are inflated, or if thefood is just not so interesting or
whatever, that's a different matter.
Joel Joslin (23:51):
Yeah, I had a, I ended up, I did have dinner at a couple places
like that, but I enjoyed the vastmajority of the meals I had a lot, so...
Annie Sargent (24:00):
Yeah.
What's your favorite thing toorder when you're in France?
Joel Joslin (24:03):
Let's see, I like, well, this is a really basic answer, the croissants
are really good, I liked escargots, thecheese, I'd usually get some large meat
thing for dinner or occasionally fish.
Annie Sargent (24:15):
So is, like, if they have escargot as an appetizer,
you will always take that?
Joel Joslin (24:20):
Most of the time.
Annie Sargent (24:22):
That's funny to me because that's what tourists do.
French people don't typicallyorder escargot because we can
have it any time and you know...
But visitors, they want to trythe escargot, of course they do.
And it's pretty tasty because all thatbutter and garlic, mmm, it's good.
Joel Joslin (24:39):
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (24:42):
That's good.
Let's see.
Ah, you went, you had a souffléat one of the restaurants
you mentioned in your notes.
Joel Joslin (24:49):
Oh yes, yes.
It was a dessert souffléwith like this caramel sauce.
It was very good.
Annie Sargent (24:54):
Mmm, yes, yes, soufflé is something else.
Joel Joslin (24:59):
Pantruchet.
Yeah, I was one of two restaurantsand I guess it's been a year since
the trip so I can't remember everyrestaurant I ate at, but that was one
of the best restaurants I ate in Paris.
Annie Sargent (25:09):
It's called what?
Le pain ou le Le lapin
Joel Joslin (25:11):
Le Pantruche.
Annie Sargent (25:12):
Okay.
Interesting.
I'll try and find it and put a...
Joel Joslin (25:15):
And yeah, there's also another restaurant in Paris Pony.
I went there a couple times.
It was a good place to go to while I wassick because it was near my hotel and
it's just, it's like a good brasserieslash bar slash burgers, like the kind of
no fuss food you want when you're sick.
It was good.
Annie Sargent (25:34):
One of the questions I ask on the form is what did you
learn about France on this trip?
And your answer is I learned howvaried and diverse the country is.
I'd like you to, you know, tell memore about this because you did get
around to a lot of different regions.
Joel Joslin (25:49):
Right, so, well, first there's just a whole lot of different
landscapes there, there's the coasts inBrittany, and the mountains and hills
around Alsace, and then Nice, which isalso coastal, but a completely different
kind, and then there's lots of differentcultures, Paris is Paris, of course,
and then Alsace is more German, Nice ismore Italian and also a little British.
(26:13):
Kind of funny, it's anItalian-French town that was, lot
of it was built by the British.
Annie Sargent (26:16):
Yeah, there were a lot of, a lot of British move there.
The weather is pleasant.
Joel Joslin (26:21):
The cuisine and food is very different from region to region too.
Annie Sargent (26:24):
Mm hmm.
Very good.
So, the last question we'regoing to get into is, did you
make any mistakes on this trip?
And this is where I want you to takeyour time and just tell me about the
mistakes because other people, we wantthem to avoid mistakes if they can.
Joel Joslin (26:37):
Yeah, I mentioned I didn't really need a car in Normandy
except for getting to Mont St.
Michel, so, I wasn't there long enoughthat I really needed one besides that.
I think my initial itinerary was busierwith more stops than I ended up with,
so I did end up changing it, while Iwas in Paris, so it worked out pretty
(26:58):
well, but I think the one I had plannedwas a little bit more aggressive, and
I think that would have been a mistake
.Annie Sargent: So what did you remove?
Uh, I moved a few, a few things, like, I was originally
gonna, spend a night in Mont St.
Michel, and go to a couple otherplaces in Provence besides Nice.
Strasbourg actually was originallygoing to be a day trip from Paris,
(27:19):
and I ended up changing thataround, I was too sick to go there.
And yeah, so it was actually prettydifferent, but I think the final
itinerary worked out pretty well.
Annie Sargent (27:28):
Uh huh.
So you have to be nimble.
I mean, that's just a fact.
And because you were travelingby yourself, you were able to.
It's harder when you're with you know,your significant other, or with your
parents, or with your friends, orbecause getting everybody to agree
on one thing is pretty difficult.
Joel Joslin (27:47):
Yeah, so the first half of the trip had some ups and
downs, but on the whole, I thinkit all turned out really well.
Annie Sargent (27:53):
Mm hmm.
Mm hmm.
It's funny.
You said, I forgot that I generallydo not enjoy driving in Europe.
Joel Joslin (27:59):
Yeah, yeah,
Annie Sargent (28:00):
Yeah.
The narrow roads, did you rent a bigcar or how big was this car you got?
Joel Joslin (28:05):
It wasn't that big.
I don't know what brand it was, but,yeah, it was medium, it was medium sized,
but I don't know, it's just like theroads in the US, most parts of the US
are a lot wider, so like just gettingused to the European roads is tricky.
Annie Sargent (28:23):
Yeah.
It is, it is,when you arenot used to it it's...
yeah you said you got a flat tirefrom hitting a curb, it happened to me
once as well, it happens to all of us.
Joel Joslin (28:32):
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (28:33):
Yeah, that's just never, never a good thing, but, honestly, there
are places, and in Normandy, if you're notgoing to do a tour, you can't get to those
places without a car, so it just depends.
If your plan is to take a tour,then you don't need a car really,
ever, because if you set yourself,if you're in Bayeux, and you take a
(28:57):
Normandy beach tour, and then you takeanother tour to take you to Mont St.
Michel, which you can do, somecompanies do that, then that's it, you
don't need a car for Normandy at all.
I was talking to somebody just a fewdays ago, who was interested in touring
around Occitanie where I live, and it's,I, you know, like, I don't know how you
(29:18):
do it without, it's either a tour, likeif you want to go to the Dordogne, if
you're in Toulouse and you want to goto the Dordogne, it's either a tour or
a private driver, or you rent a car.
You know, you can't get to those places.
You know, it's just a fact.
And there's so many places whereyou don't need a car, you know, at
all, like, it's fine, it's fine.
Joel Joslin (29:38):
And like, the one nice thing.
Then you get tours, like, sometimes youcan go through places a little faster
than you'd like, like, I didn't, I wasn'table to see as much as Colmar as I ideally
would like on the tour, but the nice thingis, since you don't have to concentrate
on driving, you can just, like, enjoythe scenery as much as you want.
Annie Sargent (29:54):
Yeah.
Joel Joslin (29:55):
And the Alsatian countryside is very beautiful.
Annie Sargent (29:58):
Very nice, isn't it?
And the other way to enjoyit is to just take buses.
They have a good regional bus system.
But it's, again, it'sfor people who have time.
So if you're going to be in Strasbourgfor a few days, you can take a bus to
most of these villages, a public bus,like a city bus, regional bus, I guess.
(30:18):
And that will take you, typically thatbus is going to be full of teenagers
who don't have a driver's license yetand older people who don't want to
drive anymore, and they take the bus.
And you have a bus like pretty muchevery hour to go to these places like
Colmar and Riquevire and all that.
So, you can do it on the bus, butit takes longer, everything takes
(30:38):
longer if you do it that way.
A tour is really the most efficientway to do it, they will just take you.
And sometimes they yank youout a little bit too fast.
It sounds like perhaps in Colmar theysaid, let's move on a little too fast.
Joel Joslin (30:51):
Yeah, yeah, I was, I had actually been hoping to do
the Unterlinden, which I wasn'table to, but maybe someday.
Annie Sargent (30:57):
You mean, did you say Unterlinden?
You didn't get to see the museum?
Joel Joslin (31:01):
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (31:01):
Ah, yeah, yeah.
And it is a big museum.
I mean, you can just go to the retable,to the, you know, the altarpiece, and
just see that, but it is true that if youwant to see the whole museum, it would
take a good two, perhaps three hours.
You know, it's not one of the tinyones, that we have in some places.
And one of the things that you mentionedis that perhaps your itinerary was
(31:25):
overambitious and that's a, that'sgood advice for most people just to...
Joel Joslin (31:29):
I'd say it was, the original one I had planned was too ambitious.
And then the one I revised, like, I was,you know, I was in my hotel room a lot in
Paris, and I realized, yeah, especiallynow that I'm sick, this is just too much.
So I, like, fortunately I wasable to just call the hotels and
get a few things shifted around.
So, yeah, it worked out, itworked out, the itinerary I ended
(31:52):
up with worked out pretty well.
Annie Sargent (31:54):
And what did you do for internet access?
Did you purchase a plan?
What did you do?
Joel Joslin (31:59):
Yeah, I bought an international plan, and also
the hotels had Wi Fi, so, youknow, I could use it there a lot.
Annie Sargent (32:05):
And it sounds like you didn't use apps particularly
to book your hotels or whatever.
Did you mostly call them?
Yeah.
Joel Joslin (32:13):
Yeah, mostly I did it through the hotel's website,
that tends to be the cheapest.
There are a couple apps I used.
I used Omio for trains.
Annie Sargent (32:21):
Omio?
Joel Joslin (32:22):
Yeah, O M I O.
Yeah, it just, it's for booking trainsin Europe, I don't know if they do
other continents, but it just putsmost regional trains together into one
search, and then you can book from there.
Annie Sargent (32:34):
That's pretty good.
I mean, I don't think I'veheard about this one before.
Joel Joslin (32:38):
Yeah, it's pretty handy.
Annie Sargent (32:39):
Sounds good.
Joel Joslin (32:39):
I went to Italy recently and I used it there too.
Annie Sargent (32:41):
Aha, so compare France and Italy now.
Joel Joslin (32:45):
I really, I really enjoyed both, I think I, I think
I liked France a little better,but yeah, I really enjoyed both.
Annie Sargent (32:52):
In what ways?
Is it the food?
Is it the people?
Is it the scenery?
Is it the museums?
The diversity perhaps?
I think France is more diverse.
Joel Joslin (33:01):
Yeah, the food, I think the scenery, both have a lot of
beautiful scenery, but I'd give aslight advantage to France probably.
And yeah, I like, France seems to havemore like different types of food, of
things in the country, more the diversity.
But I really enjoy both of them.
Annie Sargent (33:16):
Yeah, in Italy, it felt like it was one church after another.
So many gorgeous churches in Italy.
It's unbelievable.
Joel Joslin (33:23):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I like gothic churches a little betterthan Baroque, so there's that too.
Annie Sargent (33:28):
Ah, yes.
Yeah.
That's a big, that's a big one, because inItaly, they're mostly baroque, you know,
and in Nice as well, it's a lot of Baroquechurches, they're beautiful, but yeah.
Okay, let's see.
So, overall, you thoughtyour trip was restful.
Joel Joslin (33:44):
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (33:45):
Doesn't sound like you have major regrets.
Joel Joslin (33:47):
Right, yeah, the regrets are, I mean, like, I wish I hadn't gotten
sick in Paris, and a couple other things,like, could have picked a different hotel
for part of Normandy, but yeah, I don'thave any, like, really major regrets.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Was the budget reasonable?
Did you find France more expensiveor less expensive than Italy overall?
I'd say, a little less, Paris is probablymore expensive than Rome, but once I
(34:11):
got out of Paris, I felt like everythinggets a lot cheaper, and Italy, you know,
Venice and Florence are still expensive.
Especially Florence, I was surprisedhow expensive Florence was.
I did go to Ravenna, which is a smallcity that was pretty cheap, but on the
whole, I thought France was cheaper.
The budget was mostly reasonable, therewere a couple things I could have done
(34:33):
differently to save some money, butoverall, yeah, for the length of time,
I didn't feel like it was excessive.
Annie Sargent (34:40):
It was a long time to stay, you know, and which more and more
people are trying to stay longer becauseinternational flights are getting more
expensive, and I think typically it isbetter to stay a couple of weeks if you
can, three weeks is a lot for most people.
Joel Joslin (34:57):
Yeah.
Italy was two weeks, so my nextinternational trip, we'll see.
Annie Sargent (35:01):
Yeah.
Do you travel a lotinternationally typically?
Joel Joslin (35:04):
I've taken three international trips.
The first one was in 2015, andthen the second one wasn't until
2022, so that's a long gap.
I always had stuff going on, like I hadto move, or finances, or COVID, of course.
Annie Sargent (35:17):
Yeah.
Our favorite thing COVID.
Joel Joslin (35:19):
Ideally I'd like to take an international trip
every year, but we'll see.
Annie Sargent (35:23):
Yeah.
I love the photo yousent me with the helmet.
Joel Joslin (35:28):
Oh, yeah, yeah, like, that was a good picture
from the Strasbourg Museum, yeah.
Annie Sargent (35:32):
Yes, I tried on the helmet as well, didn't
do as good a job as you did.
I think everybody tries on that helmet.
Yeah.
Well, fantastic talking to you.
It's good to talk to somebody whois willing to admit that things
didn't go 100 percent perfectly, butover three weeks, what are the odds
that nothing would go wrong, right?
(35:53):
Even in real life, if you think aboutyour real life in three weeks, well,
something upsetting is going to happen,probably at one point or another,
unless you have a very charmed life.
Some boss, or coworker, or someoneis going to annoy you, right?
Yeah.
yeah.
When you ask me my favorite foods, I don'tthink I mentioned the desserts, so I'll
(36:14):
say I really like a lot of the sweets.
Fantastic.
Well, Joel, thank you so much.
And well, thank you for talking to me,thank you for being a good sport about the
vicissitudes of recording a podcast, and Iwish you some, some more wonderful trips.
Joel Joslin (36:29):
All right, well, yeah, thank you for having me on, Annie.
Have a good day.
Annie Sargent (36:32):
Merci beaucoup.
Au revoir.
Joel Joslin (36:33):
Au revoir.
Annie Sargent (36:40):
The Join Us in France travel podcast is written, hosted,
and produced by Annie Sargent andCopyright 2024 by AddictedToFrance.
It is released under a CreativeCommons, attribution, non-commercial,
no derivatives license.
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