March 17, 2024 • 50 mins
In this episode, Regina recounts her captivating month-long exploration of France's hidden treasures in Aveyron, Dordogne, and the Basque Country. Joined initially by her sister and later by her partner, they embarked on an adventure through some of France's most scenic landscapes, medieval towns, and illustrious caves.
Regina shares the invaluable insights gained from an itinerary consultation with Annie, highlighting the importance of strategic planning for adventurous travelers. The journey is enriched by visits to "Plus Beaux Villages," where the beauty of France's countryside is on full display. Regina discusses the challenges and rewards of navigating rural France by car, emphasizing the enchantment of driving through less-traveled roads and the logistical nuances of fueling and parking.
The episode delves into the cultural experiences of local markets, the delights of French cuisine, and the tradition of enjoying an Apéro. Special attention is given to the selection of accommodations that allow for immersive local experiences, the strategy for visiting markets, and making the most of vacation purchases like a Basque beret. Regina's adventure through cave paintings, including a detailed account of visiting Pech-Merle and Font de Gaume, offers listeners a glimpse into prehistoric art.
The episode also covers private tours of vineyards in Gaillac and Saint Emilion, showcasing the diversity of French wines. Closing with personal reflections on the trip, Regina emphasizes the philosophy of "less is more," advocating for depth over breadth in travel experiences. Join us to uncover the rustic charms and hidden gems of Aveyron, Dordogne, and the Basque Country—a journey through France's heartland that promises to inspire and enchant.
Table of Contents for this Episode
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Annie Sargent (00:16):
This is Join Us in France episode 485,
quatre cent quatre-vingt-cinq.
Bonjour, I'm Annie Sargent, and Join Usin France is the podcast where we take
a conversational journey through thebeauty, culture, and flavors of France.
Today, I bring you a trip report withRegina Logan about spending almost a
(00:36):
month exploring the southwest of France.
They went to the Aveyron, the Dordogne,and the Basque Country, and were
surprised how lovely it all was.
And these are not parts of the countrythat we talk about every week, so
I think you'll enjoy this episode.
This podcast is supported by donors andlisteners who buy my tours and services,
(00:56):
including my itinerary consult service,my GPS self-guided tours of Paris on the
VoiceMap app, or take a day trip with mearound the Southwest in my electric car.
You can browse all of that in myboutique JoinUsInFrance.com/boutique.
There won't be a magazine part ofthe podcast today again, because I
was away in Paris all week writingmy new GPS self-guided food tour
(01:20):
of Paris on the VoiceMap app.
When will this food tour come out?
Before the end of March, for sure.
I will give you more detailsin next Sunday's episode.
I don't have any new patronsto thank today because I'm
pre-recording all of this.
But I want to thank all of you who keepthis podcast going by donating on Patreon.
(01:41):
To join this wonderful community offrancophiles, go to patreon.com/joinus.
And to support Elyse, goto patreon.com/ElysArt.
And please don't click on the 'Joinfor free' button, because if you
(02:02):
do, Elyse and I get no supportand you get nothing extra either.
So it's a lose-lose situation.
Next week on the podcast, first of all,I'll be back at my desk in Toulouse,
so it'll be back to business as usualwith an episode with Elyse on the
trailblazing female artist who defied18th century conventions to become
(02:23):
Marie Antoinette's favorite portraitistand a celebrated figure across Europe.
Her name was Elisabeth Vigée LeBrun, and you need to hear about her.
(02:44):
Bonjour Regina Logan, andwelcome to Join Us in France.
Regina Logan (02:47):
Hi, and bonjour, Annie, I'm very happy to be here.
Annie Sargent (02:51):
Very happy to talk to you.
You had quite the trip.
It was a long trip, wasn't it?
Regina Logan (02:55):
It was, it was a month.
Annie Sargent (02:59):
Yeah.
So tell us when this wasand who all was with you.
Regina Logan (03:02):
Sure.
It was from early September to earlyOctober, like the 7th of September
to the 7th or 8th of October of 2023.
I started out with my older sister,we were together for maybe 10 days
or so, and then my partner joined us.
The three of us for a few days, andthen my sister peeled off and it was my
partner and me for the last two weeks.
Annie Sargent (03:22):
Aha, very good.
You went to a lot of places, sotell us quickly all the places
that you hit on this trip.
Regina Logan (03:29):
Okay.
Well, first of all, your itineraryplan was awesome because honestly, I
had not heard of most of this, so wewere in Southwest France, in general.
The Aveyron and the Dordogne, mostly.
Annie Sargent (03:41):
Right.
Regina Logan (03:42):
And then the Pays Basque, and we ended in Paris for a few days.
Annie Sargent (03:46):
Well, okay.
So what you had asked me was, becausewe did an itinerary planning session,
and what you had asked me was to, whatI remember is that you wanted me to
keep the great bits when your partnerwas going to join you, but you also
wanted to do stuff with your sister.
So I was like, huh, okay.
I have to save the best bits, it'shard to do, like, it's really hard
(04:09):
to do, keep you moving, and also takeyou to all these beautiful things.
But of course, in the Southwest, there's alot that you can see that's really great.
And the Aveyron, I thought was,it's a part of France that most
people haven't heard of very much.
It doesn't come up that much,even on the podcast, because, you
know, most people go to Paris,honestly, and they keep it at that.
(04:31):
But you were more adventurous,so that's wonderful.
Okay, so tell us someof your favorite things.
We're not going to take yourtrip in order that you had it, so
that's just not that interesting.
But I want to hear about your favoriteactivities and places on this trip.
Regina Logan (04:47):
Sure.
Well, because we drove, which wecan talk about later, the mostly,
wonderful things about driving, afew challenges, but not terrible.
Our favorite things is reallygoing to the small villages,
primarily, or smaller towns.
We hit a lot of Les Plus BeauxVillages, and there are also small
towns that are just as beautiful, thatare not on the official Plus Beaux
(05:10):
Villages, the most beautiful places.
But what we really wanted to do issomething that we can't do in the United
States, which is go to medieval towns.
Annie Sargent (05:17):
Right.
Regina Logan (05:18):
But that was probably our favorite thing, was going
to some of the medieval towns.
Of course, there's castles every turnof the road, it seems like there's
a castle, which is quite wonderful.
And then we also went to two differentcaves with the prehistoric paintings.
And because of your, you know, yourpodcast is so amazing, but especially
(05:38):
the one about Padirac, we went thereand that was, those caves are wonderful.
Annie Sargent (05:45):
Yes.
Regina Logan (05:46):
And then some of the bigger towns that, again, hadn't heard of,
but pretty well known, like Sarlat, weloved Sarlat, and we also loved Albi,
and I'm trying to think of where else.
We tried to stay more than two nights inany, once in a while, we were just like,
had just one night going through, butwe tried to stay more, and Cahors was
(06:07):
another place that we really enjoyed,and Bayonne, those are our big towns.
Annie Sargent (06:11):
The ones that you enjoy.
And you know what, it's also a challengewhen you don't want to keep moving
every day, but you want to see a lot.
You have to consider, you know, the prosand cons of changing hotels every day.
Regina Logan (06:27):
Yes.
Annie Sargent (06:28):
And, you know, seeing as much as you want to.
So, the way you go around that is thatyou pick a place that has more than
one interesting thing to do, right?
And then you can see more.
And you mentioned the Plus Beaux Villagesthat there were some that were really
pretty that were not a Plus Beau Village,and that's because there are some strict
(06:50):
criteria to be a Plus Beau Village.
You have to have under 2.000 inhabitants,and you have to pay into a charter, so
every year you have to pay your duesto be part of the Plus Beaux Villages.
And some municipalities don't really wantto do that, or they have too many people.
So, you know, between 2.000 peopleand 2.010 people, well, the village
(07:15):
hasn't changed that much, right?
But they have to have a cut offpoint, and that's just how it works.
So that's one of the reasonswhy some villages that are just
stunning are not on the list and,you know, that's just how it is.
And there are so many, especiallyaround the Dordogne, there's so
many that are pretty, that you couldvery easily spend a few hours in.
(07:39):
Rarely more than a fewhours, to tell you the truth.
Did you find that, you know, onceyou have walked around the village
and seen the castle or had a mealor whatever, you were done, right?
Regina Logan (07:49):
Yeah, except for we stayed in Autoire, which is quite small.
Annie Sargent (07:53):
Yeah.
Regina Logan (07:54):
So it was kind of fun just staying there, I mean,
again, using it as a base to go out.
And another thing I wanted to pointout about Les Plus Beaux Villages,
and it's a very famous one, thename of which is escaping me right
now, is that they're on everybody'slist, including the tour buses.
Annie Sargent (08:11):
Yes.
Regina Logan (08:11):
So, you know, when a tour bus arrives at a small
village, it's pretty much overrun.
So the nice thing about going to the justas beautiful villages that are not on the
list is that they don't have tour buses.
Annie Sargent (08:25):
Right, and that's the beauty of renting a car.
Because I talk to an awful lot of peoplewho know that in France we have good
public transportation, and we are veryhappy to have good public transportation,
but it's mostly between cities.
It is rarely between villages.
(08:45):
So you might have public transportationbetween a city and a village, but
not between village A and village B.
So you know, you wanted to move on toanother next beautiful village, but you
can't because you have to go back to thecity and back out to the other village.
And the other thing that you haveto be careful about is that Google
is very good at listing all publictransportation, including some that
(09:10):
will never work for tourism becausethey are designed for students.
So just this morning I was working on anitinerary for somebody else and noticed
that they had said, Oh, we're pretty surewe can go between this village and that
village, well, that small town in thatvillage, and I looked into it and yes,
there's a bus, but it's a school bus.
(09:33):
So don't trust everythingyou read online about public
transportation, just in general,do not expect public transportation
between Village A and Village B.
Regina Logan (09:44):
And we never did.
I mean, because we had the car, exceptfor Paris, of course, we did not have
any interest in driving in Paris,we had spent like four days in Paris
at the end, and we had turned inour car in Bordeaux, and we actually
flew from Bordeaux to Paris at the
Annie Sargent (09:59):
end.
Oh, you did, that's unusual.
Regina Logan (10:00):
Yeah.
It was a little bit quicker,actually, even though the
train, you know, there's a TGV.
Annie Sargent (10:06):
TGV yeah, it's very fast.
Regina Logan (10:08):
Anyway, we flew and it was wonderful to then use
public transportation in Paris.
Annie Sargent (10:14):
Yes.
Big cities, you don't need a car,but I'm talking villages, so, you
know, 1000 people, 2000 people,that's what I have in mind.
Bigger than that, yes, wehave public transportation.
So you particularly liked all thesebeautiful medieval villages that you saw.
You liked your markets.
So I want to hear about themarkets that you enjoyed.
Regina Logan (10:35):
Well, probably like a lot of the people who listen to
your podcast, we're kind of foodies.
And so, we just love everything aboutfood, including the beautiful markets.
So we planned most of our itineraryusing your recommendations to be in
the villages on their market day.
And since they're different everyplace, Sarlat has a pretty famous,
(10:58):
quite large market on Saturday andWednesday, and we were staying there.
So we actually went bothSaturday and Wednesday.
And staying somewhere, anothernice reason, is that we could
get there early before it gottoo crowded, which was great.
And just looking at all the fruits,and vegetables, and the cheese, the
wonderful cheese and everything elsein the market, and then of course, the
(11:18):
markets have a lot of non-food items,which is always fun to look through.
Annie Sargent (11:22):
Yeah Sarlat has a lot of, you know, they sell, I remember buying
some really funky bowls in Sarlat.
You can buy, you know, tablecloths,things like that, that you don't,
perhaps not expect to find in a market.
Recently, I was recording an episodewith my sister in law and She was
surprised that there was a personat the market selling underwear.
(11:46):
She was like, who would buytheir underwear at the market?
And I told her, lots of people do, becauseif you're an old granny and you have
this one pair of panties that you like,you just want that one, and you know the
lady at the market will get it for you.
And that's why, that's why, yeah.
Regina Logan (12:10):
The only clothing item that we bought at markets was
mostly scarves, because the scarveswere very nice and very inexpensive.
And then my partner bought a coupleof, at two different times, hats.
Annie Sargent (12:24):
Mm hmm.
Regina Logan (12:25):
Very French kind of, not quite a beret, more like a workman's hat.
Anyway, and then we actuallydid buy some Basque berets.
Annie Sargent (12:34):
There you go.
Regina Logan (12:35):
We were in that country, which was kind of fun.
Annie Sargent (12:38):
Yeah, have you worn them since?
Regina Logan (12:39):
He wears his every day.
I'm waiting for my, I'm inChicago, so it's not quite
cold enough yet for me, but...
Annie Sargent (12:46):
It will get there.
It will get there.
Yeah, that's great.
Yes.
And so the market in Sarlat is very nice,and I think a lot of items are overpriced,
but you know, it's a popular market wherethere's lots of visitors, it's fair game.
You're going to try and, you know, geta little more money out of the people.
(13:07):
That's just how it works.
Regina Logan (13:10):
The other thing, the markets, bring me to the thought that
because we stayed, maybe you're goingto ask me this later, but we stayed
primarily in Airbnbs, except Paris, weonly stayed in Airbnbs, so that we had
the fun of shopping for food occasionally,and then we could cook in our Airbnb,
because they had a full kitchen.
And a couple of timeswe had a complete house.
(13:32):
Small, but complete.
So, that was making shoppingfor food even more fun.
Annie Sargent (13:37):
Exactly.
If you have a kitchen, that'seven, you know, you can try things.
Did you try anything adventurous?
Did you cook anything adventurous?
Regina Logan (13:44):
We didn't cook anything adventurous, but we did try a few things.
I mean, there's, my partnerloves escargot, which these
days isn't that adventurous.
We all like escargot, so we tried those.
We didn't make them ourselves.
We got those at a restaurant.
Annie Sargent (13:58):
Yeah.
Regina Logan (13:59):
But nothing too out of the ordinary.
Annie Sargent (14:01):
Okay.
That's good.
The number three thing that you listis Aperol while people watching.
Aperol, oh yes, that's afavorite for a lot of people.
Regina Logan (14:11):
Yes, and I had had Kir before, but I had not had Kir Royale
Annie Sargent (14:17):
Ah...
Regina Logan (14:18):
For your listeners, Kir is very typically French white,
not particularly, and the regularKir is white wine with Cassis.
I think it's the liqueur.
Annie Sargent (14:29):
Crème de Cassis.
Yep.
Regina Logan (14:30):
But the Kir Royale is champagne.
Annie Sargent (14:34):
Yes.
Regina Logan (14:35):
Crème de Cassis, which became quickly my favorite aperitif.
Annie Sargent (14:40):
That's very nice.
Yes.
That's a, so not every placewill offer that, but when they
do, it's usually very nice.
Yeah.
And you especially liked it onPlace de la Liberté in Sarlat.
That's great.
So every day, at the end of theday, you just knew you could
go back and have some apéro.
Regina Logan (14:56):
And watch, and the fact that there were enough people
to make people watching wonderful andfascinating, but not the huge crowds.
By the end of the day, the markethad, you know, closed up and cleared
off, but there were still peoplehanging around, so that was fun.
Annie Sargent (15:11):
So you were there in, you know, September through October, and it's
actually high season in the Dordogne.
September is quite highseason in the Dordogne.
So is October, and then at the end ofOctober, by the time school vacations end
for French kids, everything shuts down.
(15:31):
So we're recording this on November 21st.
If you went to Sarlat thismonth, it would be dead.
And a lot of the restaurants wouldnot even open unless it's the weekend
or unless there's something specialgoing on, because the full time
population of Sarlat is not that great.
You don't need hundreds of restaurants,which you do in high season.
Regina Logan (15:53):
Sure.
We did have one little funny littleanecdote, so, Autoire, which is
a very small village where we hadthis just charming little house.
And there's two restaurantsand one epicerie, a little
grocery with a boulangerie.
Annie Sargent (16:09):
Yeah.
Regina Logan (16:10):
Neither of the restaurants were open for dinner, and the baker
from the boulangerie was on vacation.
Annie Sargent (16:17):
Oh.
Regina Logan (16:18):
So really no food.
And so one of the things that wasquite nice, there was another kind of a
combination food type shop and souvenirs.
And we started chatting with a woman.
Luckily, my French is decent, so I coulddo a lot of chatting, which I love to do.
(16:38):
And she said, Oh, there's no bread here.
We said, yeah, we noticed.
And she said, well, on my way in thefollowing day, I'll stop at the bakery in
my town, where she lived, and she broughtus some bread, which I thought was lovely.
Just lovely as her to do for us.
Because we, the only thing aboutdriving is no one in our party wanted
(16:58):
to drive in the dark, on those ruralroads that there's no light, and
you don't know where you're going.
And so luckily, it was still light outat that point, until I don't know, maybe
8 or so, but we weren't going to ventureout somewhere to drive home in the dark.
Annie Sargent (17:13):
Yeah.
So, Autoire, for people who don'tknow, and most people wouldn't
know, it's a little bit north ofFigeac, and it's just east of Sarlat.
So you were not staying inSarlat, you were staying in
Autoire, is that what it is?
Regina Logan (17:27):
No, we stayed in both.
Annie Sargent (17:28):
Ah, oh, both.
Okay.
Ah, okay.
Oh, they're not that farfrom each other, are they?
Regina Logan (17:33):
I honestly don't remember because I'd have to look at our itinerary,
but we've got a little bit of a circle.
I don't recall, but they were sodifferent from each other because
Autoire is tiny, tiny, and Sarlat is...
Annie Sargent (17:47):
It's a good sized town.
Yeah, it goes dead in the winter,but it's a good sized town.
Yeah.
Regina Logan (17:52):
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (17:53):
Wonderful.
You enjoyed the cave painting,so the cave, the painted caves,
those are always a big hit.
Regina Logan (18:01):
Yes.
And the one thing, we rarely madeadvance reservations anywhere for
anything, including Paris, except for LeGouffre de Padirac, which is a regular
cave, as you, I don't remember whatyour, which episode it was, but your
wonderful episode, and that I rememberyou used to go there a lot as a child.
Annie Sargent (18:22):
Yes.
Regina Logan (18:23):
So we did get those tickets in advance.
And then the two different,we did not go to,
Annie Sargent (18:27):
Lascaux.
Regina Logan (18:28):
Lascaux, no, because we wanted to go to the original
ones, and so we went to...
Pech Merle?
Yes, we went to La Grotte de Pech Merle,I have a story for that in a second,
and we went to La Font de Gaumme.
And both of those you had to reserve inadvance, but you had to wait until like a
month before you were going to go there,so the websites are pretty, pretty easy
(18:49):
to, from the US, we got our tickets.
But can I tell you a littlestory about Pech Merle?
Annie Sargent (18:55):
Of course.
Regina Logan (18:56):
So, we used our GPS to get around, on our phone, on my phone,
and we put in Pech Merle, not knowingthat Pech Merle means, there's a lot of
Pech in the Grotto, La Grotte de PecheMerle, so we're trying, it's just at
this point, it was just my older sisterand me, we're driving and driving, and
we're going down like this little road,and then we're going, do you know what
(19:19):
a two track is, we're going down a twotrack, which is basically through an
orchard, to just little dirt tracksI don't know, tractors or something.
And we're going and we're saying,you know, this doesn't seem right.
Annie Sargent (19:35):
Not right.
No, no, not right.
Regina Logan (19:37):
So we figured out how to turn it around.
We came back and we got to aplace where there was a farm.
And there were a couple guys outside.
And we asked him about Pech Merle and hesaid, and this was by the way, kilometers
away from where we, like an hour's worth.
Annie Sargent (19:54):
Oh my goodness.
Oh...
Regina Logan (19:56):
I think Pech Merle in general, I've forgotten what it means,
it might mean hilly place, or something.
Annie Sargent (20:03):
Right, right.
I'm not sure what it means,but it's a common name.
Like, you know, youcould find another one.
Yeah.
So if you don't say La Grotte de PechMerle, then you'll find the right one.
It's the same with Roquefort.
If you just say, I want to go to Roquefortbecause you know about Roquefort cheese.
There's a lot of Roquefort in France.
Regina Logan (20:24):
Yeah, yeah.
Annie Sargent (20:25):
You might be in the wrong one.
Yeah.
Pech Merle is a beautifulcave and it's not that big.
It's fairly accessible.
I mean, there are some steps.
When you first enter, you have to go downperhaps 50 steps, but then it's fairly
flat, you know, it's well developed.
So for people who have mobilityissues, it's doable, unless you
(20:47):
cannot take steps obviously, and it'snot very large, but it's got some
really nice stuff and it's well lit.
Regina Logan (20:54):
Yes.
Annie Sargent (20:55):
Unlike the other one that you liked, which is Font de Gaume,
where they really don't turn on thelights very much, not very long at all,
it's like seconds and then it's off.
Regina Logan (21:06):
Yeah, although they were very nice there.
My partner sees fine in the light, but hedoesn't see very well in the dark at all.
They let him use a flashlight.
I mean, not the whole time, but just sohe could see where his steps were going.
So that was great.
And both places had lovely guideswho spoke English, which was great
(21:27):
because neither, well, my sisterspeaks a little French, my partner
speaks no French, but there were, theyalso limit the number of guests that
can be in any group, which is great.
And I don't remember if it wasPech Merle or Font de Gaume, but we
decided to go early in the morningbecause they check for, if there
gets to be too much carbon dioxide,because it degrades the paintings.
(21:50):
So they will close, they check it,they're very careful, which is great,
but they will close the tour ifit gets to, the CO2 gets too high.
Annie Sargent (21:59):
And it has to do with the temperature, because the
temperature in the cave is prettysteady, but it does, I mean, the
outside temperature does affect it some.
And I wrote a blog post about howto get tickets for Font de Gaume,
there is a definite trick to this.
And so if you go to joinusinfrance.comand you go to the Blog tab, you'll see
(22:21):
a blog post called 'Tips for visitingFont de Gaume' in the Dordogne.
Because so many people just, they give upin frustration, they can't get tickets.
Regina Logan (22:30):
I believe you can't get them more than a month before you want.
Annie Sargent (22:34):
Exactly.
They open them.
So it depends on the season.
So for July and August, they openthem a little bit earlier, but
the rest of the year, I think theyjust open them until the 30th.
I don't remember.
Just read the blog post.
I wrote it, but it was a long time ago,so I don't remember all the details.
But yes, there's a question ofwhen the tickets become available.
And people get frustrated becausethey try to get tickets six
(22:56):
months in advance and you can't.
Fantastic.
You really enjoyed the Gouffre de Padirac.
We have to talk about this for a second.
Gouffre de Padirac is a beautiful place.
It's, so Gouffre, how do youtranslate that into English?
It's a big hole in the ground.
Regina Logan (23:10):
Yeah, I mean, just seeing the picture is just crazy because it
looks like a big hole in the ground,huge, and the elevator and their steps go
down, down, down, down, down, down, down.
Annie Sargent (23:21):
Yes.
So you have some steps, elevator, someparts of the way, and when you get to
the bottom, it's you get in a boat andyou get a boat ride underneath this cave.
It's just so much fun andit's fantastic for the kids.
So we did it several times whenI was a child and they take your
picture as you get close to the end.
(23:42):
And that's the one picture my parentsalways bought was the picture of us.
Because we knew where it was, youlook up, you know, and so I have
pictures of me at different ages.
Regina Logan (23:52):
Oh, that's funny.
And they took our picture and we,you know, so I can't, a few Euros.
Annie Sargent (23:58):
Yeah, it's a few euros.
And that you should alsoreserve because it fills up.
And so it's not as restrictive becauseit's not a painted cave, but it fills
up, it's very popular with people.
So go in advance.
You took a private winery tour in Gaillac.
Oh, Domaine Duffau.
Tell me about that.
Regina Logan (24:19):
Well, first of all, we've never heard of Gaillac before,
you know, for you and Elyse, and itwas a really lovely, it was just us
and one of the women who works there,there were no other people, and it
was just really fun to see everything.
You know, we could see the fields withboth of the, we went to another one
(24:40):
in Saint Emilion, but you could seethe fields where everything's grown.
And then you walk through the vineyards,and you see the, where the grapes had been
harvested, but you know, the explanationof how they do the harvesting, and then
what they do, the whole everything.
From the vineyards, the fields, thevineyards, you go inside and see
(25:00):
all the different machinery thatthey use, and then of course you
have a tasting afterwards, and youcan buy some and especially things
that you wouldn't get anywhere,certainly I don't think they export,
especially from this little tiny...
Annie Sargent (25:10):
Yeah, only the very big vineyards can export.
It's not worth it, by the way,you have to have, you know,
imagine selling wine to Costco.
You'd need to produce so much like, orany grocery store, any grocery chain.
Wonderful.
So you like Gaillac wines.
Regina Logan (25:28):
Yes, it was different.
We tend to be red wine drinkersand I'm pretty sure that's
where we got the white wine.
But yeah, it was different,and that was fun.
Because I believe, and I think I learnedthis from your podcast, that there are
grapes there that are not anywhere else.
Annie Sargent (25:43):
Mm.
Yeah.
A lot of areas in Francehave a typical local grape.
I think, what's it called in Gaillac?
I know this.
It's going to come backto me when it's too late.
Anyway, they do have a grapevariety that's specific to Gaillac,
you have to have that, otherwiseyou can't get an AOC pretty much.
(26:03):
So, yeah, that's important.
Well, now I'm going to have to go checkout Domaine Duffau 'cause I'm looking
for a place to go with a bootcamp.
So I tried three of them already,but I didn't try that one, so
I'm going to have to go try it.
It's not very far from my house, so it'seasy, and I like to go buy some wine.
It's good.
All right.
Another wine place you enjoyed St.
Émilion.
Regina Logan (26:23):
Yeah, so obviously St.
Émilion is very famous for its grapesand its wine, but we wanted, again,
to go kind of off the beaten path.
We didn't want to go to one ofthe great big cobb, one of the
great big chateaus, rather.
And so we went to this, anotherlittle family run place.
I mean, it's been in existence forseveral hundred years, the one in St.
Émilion, but it was small.
(26:44):
And once again, we got towalk out into the vineyards.
And there's one of the roads they'reusing to get around and their property,
has been there since Roman times,which was so cool, and it's been in
the same family, I want to say 3-400years, that particular vineyard.
So, again, we had a very lovelyguide who spoke English, which
(27:06):
was again, nice for my partner.
So, I would really recommend, if peoplewant to go to vineyards, I think it's fun
to go to the small ones that you're nevergoing to hear about unless you are there.
Annie Sargent (27:15):
Yes.
I agree.
I tend to agree.
Because if you go to the big famous ones,but it's always like a balance, you want
to see the famous places or do you wantto see the more genuine local things?
And we should mention that St.
Émilion is a Bordeaux vineyard.
It's not very far fromBordeaux at this point.
So you were making your way west.
Regina Logan (27:36):
I'm sorry to say something about St.
Émilion, which I'm disappointed frommy perspective, or our perspective,
it was so crowded, we couldhardly drive through the streets.
It was just jammed.
And so we stopped for maybe 15minutes and then we said, there's
just too many people here as famousas it is and as beautiful as it is.
(27:56):
And so we continued on from there.
Annie Sargent (27:58):
Yeah, St.
Émilion is a place where you haveto book to go into the, they have a,
church, a very interesting church,but you have to book to get in
and it attracts a lot of people.
They have a few restaurants and stuff,but it's best if you book in advance or
you're not going to get in because it'sjust really popular, especially September,
(28:19):
October, it's really, really popular.
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
It's harvest time.
Number seven that you list isdriving back country roads.
So I want to hear aboutyour driving experience.
You said, you mentioned thatyou might get back to it.
So let's talk about it.
Regina Logan (28:33):
Okay.
So I would say 1000 percent if you candrive and you are comfortable driving,
taking the back country roads were great,and sometimes a little, well, there's
almost no traffic, except for when you getto a larger town where there's traffic.
The things that through I drove, thefirst part when it's just my sister
and me, I drove the whole time.
(28:53):
She was my navigator.
And then when my partner joined us,he drove and I was..., So even with
a GPS, you still need a navigator.
And for me, one of thehardest things was turnabouts?
Now, what do you call them?
The roundabouts.
Yes, the roundabouts.
Annie Sargent (29:09):
Really?
Regina Logan (29:10):
Yes, and I'll tell you why.
Because Siri in her infinite wisdomon the GPS I was using, Siri would say
something like, take the second exit.
She also has a really bad Frenchaccent, but take the second exit
onto Boulevard Charles de...
So you get to the second exit,there's no Boulevard Saint, you
(29:33):
know, anything Boulevard Charlesde Gaulle or anything else listed.
It's like D83 or, you know,it's like that country road.
Annie Sargent (29:40):
Yeah.
Regina Logan (29:41):
So you have to know that.
You have to know which D, because theseare mostly D level, smaller roads.
But once I kind of got used to that,and then the only other thing about
driving that we had to get used to,well, there's two things actually,
one is parking and the other is gas.
So, can I talk about those now?
(30:03):
Just as a hint, so we're Americanand we had American credit cards from
big banks, Chase Bank, Citibank, andthere were a number of gas stations
that would not take our credit cards.
So, we finally figured out, and thiswas, even on the big tollway, we would
take the auto route to the tollwayto get from point A to point B if
(30:25):
we had a lot of territory to cover.
So we had to figure out how to payfor gas, and what, one very lovely man
helped us, and if there's a person,sometimes they're not, there's no humans
there at all, and then you're kind oflike, well, what are we supposed to do?
So, wouldn't take credit cards,but at the ones that had people...
Annie Sargent (30:43):
An attendant.
Regina Logan (30:44):
Attendant, thank you.
They weren't gas station attendants, theywere attendants inside to sell you food
or whatever, but could pay, like, givethem 40 euros or however, how much worth
of gas you thought you were going to get.
And then they would set the pumpout, go back and get that much.
So that turned out, we figuredthat out after a after a while.
Annie Sargent (31:04):
When you're at big, the freeway gas areas, they usually
have a little restaurant, they have astore, they have all sorts of things.
Yes, and there's a person you can say,okay, I'm on pump number three and I
want to put in 50 euros worth of gas.
Regina Logan (31:20):
Exactly.
Oh, and I have to say somethingabout the little stores, which I
thought was quintessential France.
I loved it.
In these little gas station stores, whichin the US we might call an Oasis on a
tollway, they had for sale foie gras.
Annie Sargent (31:35):
Yeah.
Regina Logan (31:36):
In the gas station, which I thought was, you know.
They also had like, I don't know, otherjunky food, but that was pretty funny.
Annie Sargent (31:43):
Yeah, the gas stations in France are very different from
the ones in the US aren't they?
Regina Logan (31:48):
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (31:49):
Yeah.
Regina Logan (31:49):
And then the only other thing, and this has to do with
going to villages, and folks shouldbe aware that there's no parking.
First of all, they oftentimes don'teven let cars in, which is good.
They're very tiny, very windy roads.
And so you park on the outside ofthe town, and then you have to walk 5
or 10 minutes, whatever to get into.
But so, don't, we learned this veryquickly, don't put in your GPS, the
(32:15):
center, the centre village, or theold village or anything, because it'll
take you somewhere you can't really go.
So you can map to...
Annie Sargent (32:23):
The parking lot.
Regina Logan (32:24):
Yeah, and then you park on the side.
Annie Sargent (32:26):
All of these GPSs, they can show you the nearest parking lot.
So yeah, that's what you should look for.
Yeah, good to know.
And when I do itineraries, I mean,I didn't know all the places you
were going to stop, but I oftengive the address of the most central
parking lot you can use for thattown, because it's helpful, you know.
(32:47):
But yes, don't expect to be, you know,parking right by the city center.
In a lot of these villages youcan't, they won't let you in.
Regina Logan (32:54):
But even towns as big as like Albi and Cahors, which I don't
know how big they are, but they're a lotbigger than the little villages, even
those we had to park on the outskirts,not the outs, it makes it sound
like it's five miles away, it's not.
Annie Sargent (33:05):
No, no, but it is, there are parking lots for people who can visit.
That's what they're madefor daytime kind of visits.
Regina Logan (33:13):
Well, I have one more thing that I'd like to add, again, I don't know
about non-American credit cards, but inFrance, credit cards have a pin, you know.
In the US, credit cards do not have a pin,debit cards do, but credit cards don't.
So a lot of times when you're parked andthen you're leaving the parking lot, you
(33:33):
know, to get the arm of the parking, soyou can get out, you know, you put your
money in, or you put your credit card in,and then it would ask for your four digit
pin, but we didn't have a four digit pin.
Or we found that if you just wait longenough, the machine, I guess, figures
like, oh, okay, and then it would openand we could get out without the pin.
Annie Sargent (33:50):
Ha!
Ha, ha, ha!
Those people are just not going to do it.
Ha, ha, ha, ha!
They want you out of there.
Oh, that's funny.
That's funny.
All right.
All right.
Let's see.
Oh, you enjoyed serendipitous discoveries.
Let's see.
Tell us more about that.
Regina Logan (34:10):
Okay, two of the coolest things that, who knew, you know?
So we went, this is when I was withmy sister, we went to the Château de
Belcastel and there was a beast, amedieval bestiary, you know, mythological
beasts, kind of like a display.
So you had to go up to the castle, whichis up on top of the hill, and you pay
(34:31):
a little bit to get into the grounds.
And they were, do you knowwhat animatronics are?
Often, they're oftentimes in theUnited States, they'll be like,
mostly for children, like thedinosaurs that are, that move.
These were animatronic mythical beasts.
And they were scattered throughoutthe grounds and also inside the
castle, and it was very cool.
(34:53):
And there was an explanation how theMoyen Age in the Middle Ages, people
believe these beasts were real.
So, they were just very, very coolbecause we, certainly something we were
not expecting so that was very unusual.
And it's not permanent exhibit it wasthere for a couple of months, maybe.
So, that was cool.
And then, the other thing that weparticularly found serendipitous and
(35:16):
loved, it was the Fête de Gastronomiein Sarlat, and which I believe
was annual, but we didn't know.
It was there.
It was when we were there, and we sawhim setting up and knew I'd stop and
say, Oh, what are you setting up here?
The vendor told us, you know, come backthis evening and there's all these vendors
with different kinds of food, there'sa dance floor, the people were dancing,
(35:37):
mostly sound like polka music to me.
And then you sit at these big long tableswith people, as it turned out, at our
table, there was a French couple, therewas a couple from Australia, and there
was a woman from Vancouver, Canada.
And so it's just, it's really fun, andyou get to try, sample all these local
foods from local vendors, meet new people.
It was really fun.
Annie Sargent (35:58):
Sounds really pleasant.
Yes.
So you mentioned Belcastelbefore, and that's in the Aveyron.
So that's kind of, if you knowwhere the Dordogne is, Aveyron
is east of there, quite a ways.
An hour and a half drive, perhapstwo hours drive from there, but
it's a gorgeous, gorgeous area.
Regina Logan (36:17):
And we were not staying, we were not staying in
Sarlat when we went to Belcastel.
I can't remember, we werestaying somewhere near.
Annie Sargent (36:22):
Yeah, you can't, it's not a day trip, it's too far for a day trip.
Yeah.
But we had, I remember we had workedin some time in the Aveyron area
because I think it's gorgeous, it'sjust really, Belcastel per se is
also a very nice little village.
Musée Basque in Bayonne, I haven't,I don't think I've been to that one.
(36:43):
Tell me about it.
Regina Logan (36:44):
Oh, it was, really gave a very interesting history.
There's a little video, vintage video inblack and white that you can watch, but
then the exhibit just really explainsthe Basque people, where they came from.
Folks may know that the Basque languageis extraordinary and that it is not
related to any other known language.
Annie Sargent (37:06):
Very unique.
Yes.
Regina Logan (37:07):
Very unique.
And just how they ended up wherethey are, both on the French
side and the Spanish side.
We only wanted to stayin France for this trip.
We didn't go to the Spanish side.
The museum was a really goodintroduction to the basque
culture, and I highly recommend it.
And we loved Bayonne also.
That was your recommendation.
You said, yeah, you might notlike Biarritz Knowing how you got
(37:28):
to know me through our workingtogether, and we loved Bayonne.
We liked it a little bit.
It's not like the back of theBayonne, but it's a little less
known, I think, than Biarritz.
Annie Sargent (37:36):
Yeah, so there's pros and cons to both, but if you want
the more genuine French town, Bayonneis it, Biarritz, not that Biarritz
is not a genuine French town, butit gets a lot more visitors, it's
a town with more money, you know,nicer hotels, nicer restaurants.
Bayonne is more like, you know, it'spretty, it has pretty parts, and
(37:58):
obviously it has a very good Musée Basque.
In Bayonne, I remember goingto the Chocolate Museum, which
I thought was fun, you know.
I didn't know anything aboutchocolate when we went, so
I learned a lot about that.
Regina Logan (38:08):
And they have, they also had a nice market, and they also had plenty
of restaurants that, you know, that youcould go to, and a marché, a market also.
So, we liked it.
It was fun.
Annie Sargent (38:20):
So, of all these areas, so you were in Toulouse, you were in
Aveyron, you were in the Dordogne,you were in the Basque country.
If you had to go back to one ofthem, which one would you pick?
Regina Logan (38:32):
Oh, man, that's a really hard question.
So for Toulouse, I know it's yourhometown, so we only were there overnight.
Yeah, I can't really talk aboutToulouse other than I'd like to
go back to it, and explore it.
Honestly, Annie, I don'tthink I can choose.
They were one, they were all wonderful.
I just can't, I think...
Annie Sargent (38:52):
They're very different, aren't they?
I mean, these are regions with a lot ofpersonality, very specific personality
that comes from the land, from thelandscape, from the foods, from the,
you know, the wines in the area.
And they are quite different, all of them.
So, you know...
But you talked more aboutthe Dordogne, though.
(39:12):
You spent more timetalking about the Dordogne.
You listed more Dordogne stuff.
Regina Logan (39:16):
Oh.
Interesting.
I don't think I actually evenknew, like, it's not like a
line that says you are leaving.
Annie Sargent (39:23):
That's true.
That's true.
Regina Logan (39:25):
So I might not even know what was where.
Annie Sargent (39:27):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's interesting.
Okay.
So I'm going to skip Rue Daguerre,we'll get back to that in a
second, you like Cahors as a city.
That's also one that doesn'tget visited that much.
What did you enjoy there?
Regina Logan (39:41):
Oh my gosh, it's the pont, the bridge Valentré,
which is a UNESCO World Heritagesite, one of the most beautiful,
beautiful bridges you will ever see.
It's from the Moyen Age, alsothe Middle Ages, I'm pretty sure.
And it's just, it's gorgeous.
The bridge is wonderful.
I mean, that's the only thing I remember.
We spent a lot of timetaking pictures there.
(40:02):
And then, I don't remember what riveris there, but we took it, because we had
two different boat rides, but we took aboat ride there, whatever that river is.
Annie Sargent (40:11):
So, La Roque-Gageac, I'm pretty sure that's the Dordogne.
Regina Logan (40:15):
No, that was, I think that was the second, we
also took a boat ride in Cahors.
Annie Sargent (40:20):
Oh, in Cahors you did, okay.
Regina Logan (40:22):
Yeah, I don't remember.
I don't remember what the river was.
Sorry.
Annie Sargent (40:26):
I'll look it up.
I don't know it off thetop of my head either.
Is it the Lot?
It is the Lot.
Regina Logan (40:32):
Okay.
So, you know, it's alwaysfun to take a boat ride.
Annie Sargent (40:35):
Yes.
I love the
Regina Logan (40:36):
boat ride.
You could also get kayaks, I think,there as well in the Dordogne.
We weren't quite thatadventuresome to try kayaks.
Maybe if we were younger, but we're not.
Annie Sargent (40:45):
Well, anywhere you go, you can rent kayaks, you can rent
bikes, you know, anywhere you go.
I know I sound like a broken record,but there's great hikes to be had
anywhere in France, if you're lookingfor that, just go to Komoot and look
for bike rides, hikes, whatever,anywhere, and you'll find some.
There's some everywhere.
(41:06):
So let's talk about RueDaguerre in Paris.
This is not one that comes up a lot, sowe want to talk about it, so, because
we don't have a lot of time left.
Regina Logan (41:14):
Well, first of all, thanks to you, we stayed in the 14th
Arrondissement, which is not, it'snot one of the main arrondissements,
I think a lot of tourists becausethere's not a lot of touristy stuff
there, which was totally fine with us.
It's still super convenient to everything.
We did not go to the very famoustower, Montparnasse Tower, which
(41:34):
we did not go up in, but we heardhere it has a wonderful view.
Anyway, that's the 14th.
But the Rue Daguerre was just this greatlittle street with all kinds of markets
and restaurants, and full of life.
We went once in the evening and wasstill going strong when we left, probably
after dinner around nine or ten o'clock.
And then in the morning, ourlast morning, we went back up
(41:56):
and we had breakfast there.
It was all just very lively.
And I think, again, a little bit off thebeaten path for most American tourists.
Annie Sargent (42:05):
Yeah.
Well, and the crazy thing is it'sright across from the Catacombs.
It's really close to the Catacombs.
It's also really close to theMusée de la Libération de Paris,
which is one I highly recommend.
So this is a part of Paris thathas plenty of things to do.
You're also not very far from theCimetière Montparnasse, which is
(42:29):
just as cool as Père Lachaise.
People don't really talk about it as much.
So, you know, people don't know, butif you're going to spend a day in
Montparnasse area, definitely there'smore that you can do in that area.
And there's some reallycool restaurants as well.
So yeah, a really nice area.
Regina Logan (42:48):
We did end our trip at La Rotonde, which is a famous restaurant.
Annie Sargent (42:53):
I like it.
Good food.
They have really good veal liver.
Oh, the best in France.
Regina Logan (42:59):
I haven't tried veal liver, but we had good fish.
Annie Sargent (43:03):
There you go.
There you go.
So you list a few favorite restaurantsand that's going to be all in your guest
notes, including one in Toulouse thatI have not been to, Le Court Circuit.
Got to go.
Got to go.
Regina Logan (43:15):
It was in a little tiny place, and we only stayed one night there,
as I mentioned, but our Airbnb hosts wereadorable, a young couple, cute little kid,
and they lived in the apartment buildingright next to where the Airbnb was,
and we asked them, where would you go?
We want to walk, because it was dark, andwe didn't even have our car yet anyway.
And so we just walked over there and avery youthful, I don't know if it's near
(43:38):
a university, but there are a lot ofyoung people there, which was pretty cool.
Annie Sargent (43:41):
I will have to, I will have to go, yeah, I will have to try it.
You have one in Corde du Ciel, you haveone in Cahors, you have one in Bayonne.
Yeah, yeah, you have abunch of them, restaurants.
Just go look at the guest notes.
They're really good.
What did you learn aboutFrance on this trip?
Because this was not your first rodeo.
So did you learn anything?
Regina Logan (44:00):
Honestly, it just confirmed the joie de vivre that
we find in France that, you know,just taking it easy, really enjoying
food, wine, talking with friends
. Annie Sargent: Company, being with friends.
Company, yes, being with friends and just, you know,
you could flânner, you could bea flânneur, flânneuse, just, you
(44:20):
know, wandering through the streets.
It just confirmed what I already knew andloved about France, I have to be really
honest, it wasn't anything particularly,nothing new, but except that now I want
to go back every single year and goto a different part of France or go.
That's always a hard one, do you goback to where you were because you
loved it or do you try something newbecause you haven't been there yet.
Annie Sargent (44:38):
Ah, that's the question.
That's always the question.
So same at restaurants.
Do you go back to arestaurant you really like?
Do you eat the same thing you alreadygot or do you try something new?
That's hard.
And there's people who will answerthat question very differently
depending on their personality,and there's no good or bad answer.
Any pearls of wisdom that you wantto share, that didn't come up yet?
Regina Logan (45:00):
The only thing, and I think you had asked me to
sort of give a name to this trip.
Annie Sargent (45:06):
Yes.
Regina Logan (45:07):
Less is more.
I cannot say it enough.
Less is more.
Don't try to do everything.
You know, if you're lucky,you'll get back another time.
But even if not, go fordepth rather than breadth.
You know, you really staysomewhere for a few days.
Don't try to do 8 million things,you know, in particularly, maybe in
(45:28):
Paris as well, but wherever you are.
It was great.
Because then you have time for theserendipitous things that will happen
and rather than trying to go, Oh,my God, we have this itinerary, we
have to be here by three o'clock.
Oh, the other thing is time.
They're not kidding when they sayall the shops close from 12 to 2,
but all the restaurants are open.
You've said this before too, so ifyou arrive somewhere, like we did
(45:49):
until we figured this out, oh we'llgo to the tourist bureau first,
find out about this place where weare, and then we'll go to lunch.
Well you get to the tourist bureau andit's not open, so start with lunch...
Annie Sargent (46:00):
If it's time to eat, just go eat.
Regina Logan (46:02):
Exactly, exactly, I would say that's my, if it's less is more, then
under that if it's time to eat, go to eat.
Annie Sargent (46:08):
Yes.
No, it's really, really important.
And people don't, you know, themost difficult people to convince
of this is people who are used tojust eating when they're hungry.
Don't do that in France,because you won't eat.
Regina Logan (46:22):
Or you carry around a baguette and some good fromage and you...
Annie Sargent (46:25):
Or you carry on something, but if you just wait to, if
you only eat when you get hungry, well,you know, I mean, in Paris, there's
stuff open all the time, but outsideof Paris or in big cities, I'm not
talking, I'm talking about big citiesin general, you'll find something.
But in these quaint little villages,the chef is not sticking around day and
night, you know, he shows up at 11 andhe leaves at, well, a two or something.
(46:50):
And good luck eatingoutside of those hours.
That's just how it is.
Regina Logan (46:53):
I know that we're running out late, I think, but I have to give
a plug for your walking tours in Paris.
Annie Sargent (46:59):
Go ahead.
Regina Logan (47:00):
Awesome.
They were awesome.
We had gotten the Marais and theQuartier Latin, the Latin Quarter, and
we actually couldn't even, there wereso much, they were so comprehensive.
We probably only did them foreach one for an hour to two.
And that didn't finish because therewas just, they were great though, they
were very, we did get lost once in awhile, but we would just go back, we'd
(47:22):
follow your directions and go backto where we should have been and turn
left instead of right or whatever.
Annie Sargent (47:26):
Oh, yeah.
Regina Logan (47:28):
They were really great.
Annie Sargent (47:29):
Yeah.
They make your life easy.
And if you enjoy just not beingtoo stuck on your phone, then the
walking tours are good because youcan listen to me telling you where
it is you're supposed to go next.
Now, sometimes you miss a turn orsomething, but I'm very, very careful
to tell you exactly, you know, Itest those things so many times.
(47:51):
I send people who don't know Paris,all of that, because you got to
get these little things right.
But thank you so much.
Yes.
I put in a lot of time.
I'm thinking about doing another one forthe Louvre area because I really like
that area and I know it very well, andso I think it'd be interesting to guide
people through that area and take them tosome of the places I love, but will see.
(48:14):
There's always more I couldbe doing with my time.
Well, thank you so much, Regina.
It's been delightful working withyou and talking to you today.
And I hope you get many, many morechances to come back to France.
Merci, moi au aussi.
Thank you.
Me too.
Merci.
Au revoir.
Au revoir.
Bye bye.
(48:40):
The Join Us in France travelpodcast is written, hosted, and
produced by Annie Sargent andCopyright 2024 by AddictedToFrance.
It is released under a CreativeCommons, attribution, non-commercial,
no derivatives license.
This is Join Us in France episode 485,
quatre cent quatre-vingt-cinq.
Bonjour, I'm Annie Sargent, and Join Usin France is the podcast where we take
a conversational journey through thebeauty, culture, and flavors of France.
Today, I bring you a trip report withRegina Logan about spending almost a
(00:36):
month exploring the southwest of France.
They went to the Aveyron, the Dordogne,and the Basque Country, and were
surprised how lovely it all was.
And these are not parts of the countrythat we talk about every week, so
I think you'll enjoy this episode.
This podcast is supported by donors andlisteners who buy my tours and services,
(00:56):
including my itinerary consult service,my GPS self-guided tours of Paris on the
VoiceMap app, or take a day trip with mearound the Southwest in my electric car.
You can browse all of that in myboutique JoinUsInFrance.com/boutique.
There won't be a magazine part ofthe podcast today again, because I
was away in Paris all week writingmy new GPS self-guided food tour
(01:20):
of Paris on the VoiceMap app.
When will this food tour come out?
Before the end of March, for sure.
I will give you more detailsin next Sunday's episode.
I don't have any new patronsto thank today because I'm
pre-recording all of this.
But I want to thank all of you who keepthis podcast going by donating on Patreon.
(01:41):
To join this wonderful community offrancophiles, go to patreon.com/joinus.
And to support Elyse, goto patreon.com/ElysArt.
And please don't click on the 'Joinfor free' button, because if you
(02:02):
do, Elyse and I get no supportand you get nothing extra either.
So it's a lose-lose situation.
Next week on the podcast, first of all,I'll be back at my desk in Toulouse,
so it'll be back to business as usualwith an episode with Elyse on the
trailblazing female artist who defied18th century conventions to become
(02:23):
Marie Antoinette's favorite portraitistand a celebrated figure across Europe.
Her name was Elisabeth Vigée LeBrun, and you need to hear about her.
(02:44):
Bonjour Regina Logan, andwelcome to Join Us in France.
Regina Logan (02:47):
Hi, and bonjour, Annie, I'm very happy to be here.
Annie Sargent (02:51):
Very happy to talk to you.
You had quite the trip.
It was a long trip, wasn't it?
Regina Logan (02:55):
It was, it was a month.
Annie Sargent (02:59):
Yeah.
So tell us when this wasand who all was with you.
Regina Logan (03:02):
Sure.
It was from early September to earlyOctober, like the 7th of September
to the 7th or 8th of October of 2023.
I started out with my older sister,we were together for maybe 10 days
or so, and then my partner joined us.
The three of us for a few days, andthen my sister peeled off and it was my
partner and me for the last two weeks.
Annie Sargent (03:22):
Aha, very good.
You went to a lot of places, sotell us quickly all the places
that you hit on this trip.
Regina Logan (03:29):
Okay.
Well, first of all, your itineraryplan was awesome because honestly, I
had not heard of most of this, so wewere in Southwest France, in general.
The Aveyron and the Dordogne, mostly.
Annie Sargent (03:41):
Right.
Regina Logan (03:42):
And then the Pays Basque, and we ended in Paris for a few days.
Annie Sargent (03:46):
Well, okay.
So what you had asked me was, becausewe did an itinerary planning session,
and what you had asked me was to, whatI remember is that you wanted me to
keep the great bits when your partnerwas going to join you, but you also
wanted to do stuff with your sister.
So I was like, huh, okay.
I have to save the best bits, it'shard to do, like, it's really hard
(04:09):
to do, keep you moving, and also takeyou to all these beautiful things.
But of course, in the Southwest, there's alot that you can see that's really great.
And the Aveyron, I thought was,it's a part of France that most
people haven't heard of very much.
It doesn't come up that much,even on the podcast, because, you
know, most people go to Paris,honestly, and they keep it at that.
(04:31):
But you were more adventurous,so that's wonderful.
Okay, so tell us someof your favorite things.
We're not going to take yourtrip in order that you had it, so
that's just not that interesting.
But I want to hear about your favoriteactivities and places on this trip.
Regina Logan (04:47):
Sure.
Well, because we drove, which wecan talk about later, the mostly,
wonderful things about driving, afew challenges, but not terrible.
Our favorite things is reallygoing to the small villages,
primarily, or smaller towns.
We hit a lot of Les Plus BeauxVillages, and there are also small
towns that are just as beautiful, thatare not on the official Plus Beaux
(05:10):
Villages, the most beautiful places.
But what we really wanted to do issomething that we can't do in the United
States, which is go to medieval towns.
Annie Sargent (05:17):
Right.
Regina Logan (05:18):
But that was probably our favorite thing, was going
to some of the medieval towns.
Of course, there's castles every turnof the road, it seems like there's
a castle, which is quite wonderful.
And then we also went to two differentcaves with the prehistoric paintings.
And because of your, you know, yourpodcast is so amazing, but especially
(05:38):
the one about Padirac, we went thereand that was, those caves are wonderful.
Annie Sargent (05:45):
Yes.
Regina Logan (05:46):
And then some of the bigger towns that, again, hadn't heard of,
but pretty well known, like Sarlat, weloved Sarlat, and we also loved Albi,
and I'm trying to think of where else.
We tried to stay more than two nights inany, once in a while, we were just like,
had just one night going through, butwe tried to stay more, and Cahors was
(06:07):
another place that we really enjoyed,and Bayonne, those are our big towns.
Annie Sargent (06:11):
The ones that you enjoy.
And you know what, it's also a challengewhen you don't want to keep moving
every day, but you want to see a lot.
You have to consider, you know, the prosand cons of changing hotels every day.
Regina Logan (06:27):
Yes.
Annie Sargent (06:28):
And, you know, seeing as much as you want to.
So, the way you go around that is thatyou pick a place that has more than
one interesting thing to do, right?
And then you can see more.
And you mentioned the Plus Beaux Villagesthat there were some that were really
pretty that were not a Plus Beau Village,and that's because there are some strict
(06:50):
criteria to be a Plus Beau Village.
You have to have under 2.000 inhabitants,and you have to pay into a charter, so
every year you have to pay your duesto be part of the Plus Beaux Villages.
And some municipalities don't really wantto do that, or they have too many people.
So, you know, between 2.000 peopleand 2.010 people, well, the village
(07:15):
hasn't changed that much, right?
But they have to have a cut offpoint, and that's just how it works.
So that's one of the reasonswhy some villages that are just
stunning are not on the list and,you know, that's just how it is.
And there are so many, especiallyaround the Dordogne, there's so
many that are pretty, that you couldvery easily spend a few hours in.
(07:39):
Rarely more than a fewhours, to tell you the truth.
Did you find that, you know, onceyou have walked around the village
and seen the castle or had a mealor whatever, you were done, right?
Regina Logan (07:49):
Yeah, except for we stayed in Autoire, which is quite small.
Annie Sargent (07:53):
Yeah.
Regina Logan (07:54):
So it was kind of fun just staying there, I mean,
again, using it as a base to go out.
And another thing I wanted to pointout about Les Plus Beaux Villages,
and it's a very famous one, thename of which is escaping me right
now, is that they're on everybody'slist, including the tour buses.
Annie Sargent (08:11):
Yes.
Regina Logan (08:11):
So, you know, when a tour bus arrives at a small
village, it's pretty much overrun.
So the nice thing about going to the justas beautiful villages that are not on the
list is that they don't have tour buses.
Annie Sargent (08:25):
Right, and that's the beauty of renting a car.
Because I talk to an awful lot of peoplewho know that in France we have good
public transportation, and we are veryhappy to have good public transportation,
but it's mostly between cities.
It is rarely between villages.
(08:45):
So you might have public transportationbetween a city and a village, but
not between village A and village B.
So you know, you wanted to move on toanother next beautiful village, but you
can't because you have to go back to thecity and back out to the other village.
And the other thing that you haveto be careful about is that Google
is very good at listing all publictransportation, including some that
(09:10):
will never work for tourism becausethey are designed for students.
So just this morning I was working on anitinerary for somebody else and noticed
that they had said, Oh, we're pretty surewe can go between this village and that
village, well, that small town in thatvillage, and I looked into it and yes,
there's a bus, but it's a school bus.
(09:33):
So don't trust everythingyou read online about public
transportation, just in general,do not expect public transportation
between Village A and Village B.
Regina Logan (09:44):
And we never did.
I mean, because we had the car, exceptfor Paris, of course, we did not have
any interest in driving in Paris,we had spent like four days in Paris
at the end, and we had turned inour car in Bordeaux, and we actually
flew from Bordeaux to Paris at the
Annie Sargent (09:59):
end.
Oh, you did, that's unusual.
Regina Logan (10:00):
Yeah.
It was a little bit quicker,actually, even though the
train, you know, there's a TGV.
Annie Sargent (10:06):
TGV yeah, it's very fast.
Regina Logan (10:08):
Anyway, we flew and it was wonderful to then use
public transportation in Paris.
Annie Sargent (10:14):
Yes.
Big cities, you don't need a car,but I'm talking villages, so, you
know, 1000 people, 2000 people,that's what I have in mind.
Bigger than that, yes, wehave public transportation.
So you particularly liked all thesebeautiful medieval villages that you saw.
You liked your markets.
So I want to hear about themarkets that you enjoyed.
Regina Logan (10:35):
Well, probably like a lot of the people who listen to
your podcast, we're kind of foodies.
And so, we just love everything aboutfood, including the beautiful markets.
So we planned most of our itineraryusing your recommendations to be in
the villages on their market day.
And since they're different everyplace, Sarlat has a pretty famous,
(10:58):
quite large market on Saturday andWednesday, and we were staying there.
So we actually went bothSaturday and Wednesday.
And staying somewhere, anothernice reason, is that we could
get there early before it gottoo crowded, which was great.
And just looking at all the fruits,and vegetables, and the cheese, the
wonderful cheese and everything elsein the market, and then of course, the
(11:18):
markets have a lot of non-food items,which is always fun to look through.
Annie Sargent (11:22):
Yeah Sarlat has a lot of, you know, they sell, I remember buying
some really funky bowls in Sarlat.
You can buy, you know, tablecloths,things like that, that you don't,
perhaps not expect to find in a market.
Recently, I was recording an episodewith my sister in law and She was
surprised that there was a personat the market selling underwear.
(11:46):
She was like, who would buytheir underwear at the market?
And I told her, lots of people do, becauseif you're an old granny and you have
this one pair of panties that you like,you just want that one, and you know the
lady at the market will get it for you.
And that's why, that's why, yeah.
Regina Logan (12:10):
The only clothing item that we bought at markets was
mostly scarves, because the scarveswere very nice and very inexpensive.
And then my partner bought a coupleof, at two different times, hats.
Annie Sargent (12:24):
Mm hmm.
Regina Logan (12:25):
Very French kind of, not quite a beret, more like a workman's hat.
Anyway, and then we actuallydid buy some Basque berets.
Annie Sargent (12:34):
There you go.
Regina Logan (12:35):
We were in that country, which was kind of fun.
Annie Sargent (12:38):
Yeah, have you worn them since?
Regina Logan (12:39):
He wears his every day.
I'm waiting for my, I'm inChicago, so it's not quite
cold enough yet for me, but...
Annie Sargent (12:46):
It will get there.
It will get there.
Yeah, that's great.
Yes.
And so the market in Sarlat is very nice,and I think a lot of items are overpriced,
but you know, it's a popular market wherethere's lots of visitors, it's fair game.
You're going to try and, you know, geta little more money out of the people.
(13:07):
That's just how it works.
Regina Logan (13:10):
The other thing, the markets, bring me to the thought that
because we stayed, maybe you're goingto ask me this later, but we stayed
primarily in Airbnbs, except Paris, weonly stayed in Airbnbs, so that we had
the fun of shopping for food occasionally,and then we could cook in our Airbnb,
because they had a full kitchen.
And a couple of timeswe had a complete house.
(13:32):
Small, but complete.
So, that was making shoppingfor food even more fun.
Annie Sargent (13:37):
Exactly.
If you have a kitchen, that'seven, you know, you can try things.
Did you try anything adventurous?
Did you cook anything adventurous?
Regina Logan (13:44):
We didn't cook anything adventurous, but we did try a few things.
I mean, there's, my partnerloves escargot, which these
days isn't that adventurous.
We all like escargot, so we tried those.
We didn't make them ourselves.
We got those at a restaurant.
Annie Sargent (13:58):
Yeah.
Regina Logan (13:59):
But nothing too out of the ordinary.
Annie Sargent (14:01):
Okay.
That's good.
The number three thing that you listis Aperol while people watching.
Aperol, oh yes, that's afavorite for a lot of people.
Regina Logan (14:11):
Yes, and I had had Kir before, but I had not had Kir Royale
Annie Sargent (14:17):
Ah...
Regina Logan (14:18):
For your listeners, Kir is very typically French white,
not particularly, and the regularKir is white wine with Cassis.
I think it's the liqueur.
Annie Sargent (14:29):
Crème de Cassis.
Yep.
Regina Logan (14:30):
But the Kir Royale is champagne.
Annie Sargent (14:34):
Yes.
Regina Logan (14:35):
Crème de Cassis, which became quickly my favorite aperitif.
Annie Sargent (14:40):
That's very nice.
Yes.
That's a, so not every placewill offer that, but when they
do, it's usually very nice.
Yeah.
And you especially liked it onPlace de la Liberté in Sarlat.
That's great.
So every day, at the end of theday, you just knew you could
go back and have some apéro.
Regina Logan (14:56):
And watch, and the fact that there were enough people
to make people watching wonderful andfascinating, but not the huge crowds.
By the end of the day, the markethad, you know, closed up and cleared
off, but there were still peoplehanging around, so that was fun.
Annie Sargent (15:11):
So you were there in, you know, September through October, and it's
actually high season in the Dordogne.
September is quite highseason in the Dordogne.
So is October, and then at the end ofOctober, by the time school vacations end
for French kids, everything shuts down.
(15:31):
So we're recording this on November 21st.
If you went to Sarlat thismonth, it would be dead.
And a lot of the restaurants wouldnot even open unless it's the weekend
or unless there's something specialgoing on, because the full time
population of Sarlat is not that great.
You don't need hundreds of restaurants,which you do in high season.
Regina Logan (15:53):
Sure.
We did have one little funny littleanecdote, so, Autoire, which is
a very small village where we hadthis just charming little house.
And there's two restaurantsand one epicerie, a little
grocery with a boulangerie.
Annie Sargent (16:09):
Yeah.
Regina Logan (16:10):
Neither of the restaurants were open for dinner, and the baker
from the boulangerie was on vacation.
Annie Sargent (16:17):
Oh.
Regina Logan (16:18):
So really no food.
And so one of the things that wasquite nice, there was another kind of a
combination food type shop and souvenirs.
And we started chatting with a woman.
Luckily, my French is decent, so I coulddo a lot of chatting, which I love to do.
(16:38):
And she said, Oh, there's no bread here.
We said, yeah, we noticed.
And she said, well, on my way in thefollowing day, I'll stop at the bakery in
my town, where she lived, and she broughtus some bread, which I thought was lovely.
Just lovely as her to do for us.
Because we, the only thing aboutdriving is no one in our party wanted
(16:58):
to drive in the dark, on those ruralroads that there's no light, and
you don't know where you're going.
And so luckily, it was still light outat that point, until I don't know, maybe
8 or so, but we weren't going to ventureout somewhere to drive home in the dark.
Annie Sargent (17:13):
Yeah.
So, Autoire, for people who don'tknow, and most people wouldn't
know, it's a little bit north ofFigeac, and it's just east of Sarlat.
So you were not staying inSarlat, you were staying in
Autoire, is that what it is?
Regina Logan (17:27):
No, we stayed in both.
Annie Sargent (17:28):
Ah, oh, both.
Okay.
Ah, okay.
Oh, they're not that farfrom each other, are they?
Regina Logan (17:33):
I honestly don't remember because I'd have to look at our itinerary,
but we've got a little bit of a circle.
I don't recall, but they were sodifferent from each other because
Autoire is tiny, tiny, and Sarlat is...
Annie Sargent (17:47):
It's a good sized town.
Yeah, it goes dead in the winter,but it's a good sized town.
Yeah.
Regina Logan (17:52):
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (17:53):
Wonderful.
You enjoyed the cave painting,so the cave, the painted caves,
those are always a big hit.
Regina Logan (18:01):
Yes.
And the one thing, we rarely madeadvance reservations anywhere for
anything, including Paris, except for LeGouffre de Padirac, which is a regular
cave, as you, I don't remember whatyour, which episode it was, but your
wonderful episode, and that I rememberyou used to go there a lot as a child.
Annie Sargent (18:22):
Yes.
Regina Logan (18:23):
So we did get those tickets in advance.
And then the two different,we did not go to,
Annie Sargent (18:27):
Lascaux.
Regina Logan (18:28):
Lascaux, no, because we wanted to go to the original
ones, and so we went to...
Pech Merle?
Yes, we went to La Grotte de Pech Merle,I have a story for that in a second,
and we went to La Font de Gaumme.
And both of those you had to reserve inadvance, but you had to wait until like a
month before you were going to go there,so the websites are pretty, pretty easy
(18:49):
to, from the US, we got our tickets.
But can I tell you a littlestory about Pech Merle?
Annie Sargent (18:55):
Of course.
Regina Logan (18:56):
So, we used our GPS to get around, on our phone, on my phone,
and we put in Pech Merle, not knowingthat Pech Merle means, there's a lot of
Pech in the Grotto, La Grotte de PecheMerle, so we're trying, it's just at
this point, it was just my older sisterand me, we're driving and driving, and
we're going down like this little road,and then we're going, do you know what
(19:19):
a two track is, we're going down a twotrack, which is basically through an
orchard, to just little dirt tracksI don't know, tractors or something.
And we're going and we're saying,you know, this doesn't seem right.
Annie Sargent (19:35):
Not right.
No, no, not right.
Regina Logan (19:37):
So we figured out how to turn it around.
We came back and we got to aplace where there was a farm.
And there were a couple guys outside.
And we asked him about Pech Merle and hesaid, and this was by the way, kilometers
away from where we, like an hour's worth.
Annie Sargent (19:54):
Oh my goodness.
Oh...
Regina Logan (19:56):
I think Pech Merle in general, I've forgotten what it means,
it might mean hilly place, or something.
Annie Sargent (20:03):
Right, right.
I'm not sure what it means,but it's a common name.
Like, you know, youcould find another one.
Yeah.
So if you don't say La Grotte de PechMerle, then you'll find the right one.
It's the same with Roquefort.
If you just say, I want to go to Roquefortbecause you know about Roquefort cheese.
There's a lot of Roquefort in France.
Regina Logan (20:24):
Yeah, yeah.
Annie Sargent (20:25):
You might be in the wrong one.
Yeah.
Pech Merle is a beautifulcave and it's not that big.
It's fairly accessible.
I mean, there are some steps.
When you first enter, you have to go downperhaps 50 steps, but then it's fairly
flat, you know, it's well developed.
So for people who have mobilityissues, it's doable, unless you
(20:47):
cannot take steps obviously, and it'snot very large, but it's got some
really nice stuff and it's well lit.
Regina Logan (20:54):
Yes.
Annie Sargent (20:55):
Unlike the other one that you liked, which is Font de Gaume,
where they really don't turn on thelights very much, not very long at all,
it's like seconds and then it's off.
Regina Logan (21:06):
Yeah, although they were very nice there.
My partner sees fine in the light, but hedoesn't see very well in the dark at all.
They let him use a flashlight.
I mean, not the whole time, but just sohe could see where his steps were going.
So that was great.
And both places had lovely guideswho spoke English, which was great
(21:27):
because neither, well, my sisterspeaks a little French, my partner
speaks no French, but there were, theyalso limit the number of guests that
can be in any group, which is great.
And I don't remember if it wasPech Merle or Font de Gaume, but we
decided to go early in the morningbecause they check for, if there
gets to be too much carbon dioxide,because it degrades the paintings.
(21:50):
So they will close, they check it,they're very careful, which is great,
but they will close the tour ifit gets to, the CO2 gets too high.
Annie Sargent (21:59):
And it has to do with the temperature, because the
temperature in the cave is prettysteady, but it does, I mean, the
outside temperature does affect it some.
And I wrote a blog post about howto get tickets for Font de Gaume,
there is a definite trick to this.
And so if you go to joinusinfrance.comand you go to the Blog tab, you'll see
(22:21):
a blog post called 'Tips for visitingFont de Gaume' in the Dordogne.
Because so many people just, they give upin frustration, they can't get tickets.
Regina Logan (22:30):
I believe you can't get them more than a month before you want.
Annie Sargent (22:34):
Exactly.
They open them.
So it depends on the season.
So for July and August, they openthem a little bit earlier, but
the rest of the year, I think theyjust open them until the 30th.
I don't remember.
Just read the blog post.
I wrote it, but it was a long time ago,so I don't remember all the details.
But yes, there's a question ofwhen the tickets become available.
And people get frustrated becausethey try to get tickets six
(22:56):
months in advance and you can't.
Fantastic.
You really enjoyed the Gouffre de Padirac.
We have to talk about this for a second.
Gouffre de Padirac is a beautiful place.
It's, so Gouffre, how do youtranslate that into English?
It's a big hole in the ground.
Regina Logan (23:10):
Yeah, I mean, just seeing the picture is just crazy because it
looks like a big hole in the ground,huge, and the elevator and their steps go
down, down, down, down, down, down, down.
Annie Sargent (23:21):
Yes.
So you have some steps, elevator, someparts of the way, and when you get to
the bottom, it's you get in a boat andyou get a boat ride underneath this cave.
It's just so much fun andit's fantastic for the kids.
So we did it several times whenI was a child and they take your
picture as you get close to the end.
(23:42):
And that's the one picture my parentsalways bought was the picture of us.
Because we knew where it was, youlook up, you know, and so I have
pictures of me at different ages.
Regina Logan (23:52):
Oh, that's funny.
And they took our picture and we,you know, so I can't, a few Euros.
Annie Sargent (23:58):
Yeah, it's a few euros.
And that you should alsoreserve because it fills up.
And so it's not as restrictive becauseit's not a painted cave, but it fills
up, it's very popular with people.
So go in advance.
You took a private winery tour in Gaillac.
Oh, Domaine Duffau.
Tell me about that.
Regina Logan (24:19):
Well, first of all, we've never heard of Gaillac before,
you know, for you and Elyse, and itwas a really lovely, it was just us
and one of the women who works there,there were no other people, and it
was just really fun to see everything.
You know, we could see the fields withboth of the, we went to another one
(24:40):
in Saint Emilion, but you could seethe fields where everything's grown.
And then you walk through the vineyards,and you see the, where the grapes had been
harvested, but you know, the explanationof how they do the harvesting, and then
what they do, the whole everything.
From the vineyards, the fields, thevineyards, you go inside and see
(25:00):
all the different machinery thatthey use, and then of course you
have a tasting afterwards, and youcan buy some and especially things
that you wouldn't get anywhere,certainly I don't think they export,
especially from this little tiny...
Annie Sargent (25:10):
Yeah, only the very big vineyards can export.
It's not worth it, by the way,you have to have, you know,
imagine selling wine to Costco.
You'd need to produce so much like, orany grocery store, any grocery chain.
Wonderful.
So you like Gaillac wines.
Regina Logan (25:28):
Yes, it was different.
We tend to be red wine drinkersand I'm pretty sure that's
where we got the white wine.
But yeah, it was different,and that was fun.
Because I believe, and I think I learnedthis from your podcast, that there are
grapes there that are not anywhere else.
Annie Sargent (25:43):
Mm.
Yeah.
A lot of areas in Francehave a typical local grape.
I think, what's it called in Gaillac?
I know this.
It's going to come backto me when it's too late.
Anyway, they do have a grapevariety that's specific to Gaillac,
you have to have that, otherwiseyou can't get an AOC pretty much.
(26:03):
So, yeah, that's important.
Well, now I'm going to have to go checkout Domaine Duffau 'cause I'm looking
for a place to go with a bootcamp.
So I tried three of them already,but I didn't try that one, so
I'm going to have to go try it.
It's not very far from my house, so it'seasy, and I like to go buy some wine.
It's good.
All right.
Another wine place you enjoyed St.
Émilion.
Regina Logan (26:23):
Yeah, so obviously St.
Émilion is very famous for its grapesand its wine, but we wanted, again,
to go kind of off the beaten path.
We didn't want to go to one ofthe great big cobb, one of the
great big chateaus, rather.
And so we went to this, anotherlittle family run place.
I mean, it's been in existence forseveral hundred years, the one in St.
Émilion, but it was small.
(26:44):
And once again, we got towalk out into the vineyards.
And there's one of the roads they'reusing to get around and their property,
has been there since Roman times,which was so cool, and it's been in
the same family, I want to say 3-400years, that particular vineyard.
So, again, we had a very lovelyguide who spoke English, which
(27:06):
was again, nice for my partner.
So, I would really recommend, if peoplewant to go to vineyards, I think it's fun
to go to the small ones that you're nevergoing to hear about unless you are there.
Annie Sargent (27:15):
Yes.
I agree.
I tend to agree.
Because if you go to the big famous ones,but it's always like a balance, you want
to see the famous places or do you wantto see the more genuine local things?
And we should mention that St.
Émilion is a Bordeaux vineyard.
It's not very far fromBordeaux at this point.
So you were making your way west.
Regina Logan (27:36):
I'm sorry to say something about St.
Émilion, which I'm disappointed frommy perspective, or our perspective,
it was so crowded, we couldhardly drive through the streets.
It was just jammed.
And so we stopped for maybe 15minutes and then we said, there's
just too many people here as famousas it is and as beautiful as it is.
(27:56):
And so we continued on from there.
Annie Sargent (27:58):
Yeah, St.
Émilion is a place where you haveto book to go into the, they have a,
church, a very interesting church,but you have to book to get in
and it attracts a lot of people.
They have a few restaurants and stuff,but it's best if you book in advance or
you're not going to get in because it'sjust really popular, especially September,
(28:19):
October, it's really, really popular.
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
It's harvest time.
Number seven that you list isdriving back country roads.
So I want to hear aboutyour driving experience.
You said, you mentioned thatyou might get back to it.
So let's talk about it.
Regina Logan (28:33):
Okay.
So I would say 1000 percent if you candrive and you are comfortable driving,
taking the back country roads were great,and sometimes a little, well, there's
almost no traffic, except for when you getto a larger town where there's traffic.
The things that through I drove, thefirst part when it's just my sister
and me, I drove the whole time.
(28:53):
She was my navigator.
And then when my partner joined us,he drove and I was..., So even with
a GPS, you still need a navigator.
And for me, one of thehardest things was turnabouts?
Now, what do you call them?
The roundabouts.
Yes, the roundabouts.
Annie Sargent (29:09):
Really?
Regina Logan (29:10):
Yes, and I'll tell you why.
Because Siri in her infinite wisdomon the GPS I was using, Siri would say
something like, take the second exit.
She also has a really bad Frenchaccent, but take the second exit
onto Boulevard Charles de...
So you get to the second exit,there's no Boulevard Saint, you
(29:33):
know, anything Boulevard Charlesde Gaulle or anything else listed.
It's like D83 or, you know,it's like that country road.
Annie Sargent (29:40):
Yeah.
Regina Logan (29:41):
So you have to know that.
You have to know which D, because theseare mostly D level, smaller roads.
But once I kind of got used to that,and then the only other thing about
driving that we had to get used to,well, there's two things actually,
one is parking and the other is gas.
So, can I talk about those now?
(30:03):
Just as a hint, so we're Americanand we had American credit cards from
big banks, Chase Bank, Citibank, andthere were a number of gas stations
that would not take our credit cards.
So, we finally figured out, and thiswas, even on the big tollway, we would
take the auto route to the tollwayto get from point A to point B if
(30:25):
we had a lot of territory to cover.
So we had to figure out how to payfor gas, and what, one very lovely man
helped us, and if there's a person,sometimes they're not, there's no humans
there at all, and then you're kind oflike, well, what are we supposed to do?
So, wouldn't take credit cards,but at the ones that had people...
Annie Sargent (30:43):
An attendant.
Regina Logan (30:44):
Attendant, thank you.
They weren't gas station attendants, theywere attendants inside to sell you food
or whatever, but could pay, like, givethem 40 euros or however, how much worth
of gas you thought you were going to get.
And then they would set the pumpout, go back and get that much.
So that turned out, we figuredthat out after a after a while.
Annie Sargent (31:04):
When you're at big, the freeway gas areas, they usually
have a little restaurant, they have astore, they have all sorts of things.
Yes, and there's a person you can say,okay, I'm on pump number three and I
want to put in 50 euros worth of gas.
Regina Logan (31:20):
Exactly.
Oh, and I have to say somethingabout the little stores, which I
thought was quintessential France.
I loved it.
In these little gas station stores, whichin the US we might call an Oasis on a
tollway, they had for sale foie gras.
Annie Sargent (31:35):
Yeah.
Regina Logan (31:36):
In the gas station, which I thought was, you know.
They also had like, I don't know, otherjunky food, but that was pretty funny.
Annie Sargent (31:43):
Yeah, the gas stations in France are very different from
the ones in the US aren't they?
Regina Logan (31:48):
Yeah.
Annie Sargent (31:49):
Yeah.
Regina Logan (31:49):
And then the only other thing, and this has to do with
going to villages, and folks shouldbe aware that there's no parking.
First of all, they oftentimes don'teven let cars in, which is good.
They're very tiny, very windy roads.
And so you park on the outside ofthe town, and then you have to walk 5
or 10 minutes, whatever to get into.
But so, don't, we learned this veryquickly, don't put in your GPS, the
(32:15):
center, the centre village, or theold village or anything, because it'll
take you somewhere you can't really go.
So you can map to...
Annie Sargent (32:23):
The parking lot.
Regina Logan (32:24):
Yeah, and then you park on the side.
Annie Sargent (32:26):
All of these GPSs, they can show you the nearest parking lot.
So yeah, that's what you should look for.
Yeah, good to know.
And when I do itineraries, I mean,I didn't know all the places you
were going to stop, but I oftengive the address of the most central
parking lot you can use for thattown, because it's helpful, you know.
(32:47):
But yes, don't expect to be, you know,parking right by the city center.
In a lot of these villages youcan't, they won't let you in.
Regina Logan (32:54):
But even towns as big as like Albi and Cahors, which I don't
know how big they are, but they're a lotbigger than the little villages, even
those we had to park on the outskirts,not the outs, it makes it sound
like it's five miles away, it's not.
Annie Sargent (33:05):
No, no, but it is, there are parking lots for people who can visit.
That's what they're madefor daytime kind of visits.
Regina Logan (33:13):
Well, I have one more thing that I'd like to add, again, I don't know
about non-American credit cards, but inFrance, credit cards have a pin, you know.
In the US, credit cards do not have a pin,debit cards do, but credit cards don't.
So a lot of times when you're parked andthen you're leaving the parking lot, you
(33:33):
know, to get the arm of the parking, soyou can get out, you know, you put your
money in, or you put your credit card in,and then it would ask for your four digit
pin, but we didn't have a four digit pin.
Or we found that if you just wait longenough, the machine, I guess, figures
like, oh, okay, and then it would openand we could get out without the pin.
Annie Sargent (33:50):
Ha!
Ha, ha, ha!
Those people are just not going to do it.
Ha, ha, ha, ha!
They want you out of there.
Oh, that's funny.
That's funny.
All right.
All right.
Let's see.
Oh, you enjoyed serendipitous discoveries.
Let's see.
Tell us more about that.
Regina Logan (34:10):
Okay, two of the coolest things that, who knew, you know?
So we went, this is when I was withmy sister, we went to the Château de
Belcastel and there was a beast, amedieval bestiary, you know, mythological
beasts, kind of like a display.
So you had to go up to the castle, whichis up on top of the hill, and you pay
(34:31):
a little bit to get into the grounds.
And they were, do you knowwhat animatronics are?
Often, they're oftentimes in theUnited States, they'll be like,
mostly for children, like thedinosaurs that are, that move.
These were animatronic mythical beasts.
And they were scattered throughoutthe grounds and also inside the
castle, and it was very cool.
(34:53):
And there was an explanation how theMoyen Age in the Middle Ages, people
believe these beasts were real.
So, they were just very, very coolbecause we, certainly something we were
not expecting so that was very unusual.
And it's not permanent exhibit it wasthere for a couple of months, maybe.
So, that was cool.
And then, the other thing that weparticularly found serendipitous and
(35:16):
loved, it was the Fête de Gastronomiein Sarlat, and which I believe
was annual, but we didn't know.
It was there.
It was when we were there, and we sawhim setting up and knew I'd stop and
say, Oh, what are you setting up here?
The vendor told us, you know, come backthis evening and there's all these vendors
with different kinds of food, there'sa dance floor, the people were dancing,
(35:37):
mostly sound like polka music to me.
And then you sit at these big long tableswith people, as it turned out, at our
table, there was a French couple, therewas a couple from Australia, and there
was a woman from Vancouver, Canada.
And so it's just, it's really fun, andyou get to try, sample all these local
foods from local vendors, meet new people.
It was really fun.
Annie Sargent (35:58):
Sounds really pleasant.
Yes.
So you mentioned Belcastelbefore, and that's in the Aveyron.
So that's kind of, if you knowwhere the Dordogne is, Aveyron
is east of there, quite a ways.
An hour and a half drive, perhapstwo hours drive from there, but
it's a gorgeous, gorgeous area.
Regina Logan (36:17):
And we were not staying, we were not staying in
Sarlat when we went to Belcastel.
I can't remember, we werestaying somewhere near.
Annie Sargent (36:22):
Yeah, you can't, it's not a day trip, it's too far for a day trip.
Yeah.
But we had, I remember we had workedin some time in the Aveyron area
because I think it's gorgeous, it'sjust really, Belcastel per se is
also a very nice little village.
Musée Basque in Bayonne, I haven't,I don't think I've been to that one.
(36:43):
Tell me about it.
Regina Logan (36:44):
Oh, it was, really gave a very interesting history.
There's a little video, vintage video inblack and white that you can watch, but
then the exhibit just really explainsthe Basque people, where they came from.
Folks may know that the Basque languageis extraordinary and that it is not
related to any other known language.
Annie Sargent (37:06):
Very unique.
Yes.
Regina Logan (37:07):
Very unique.
And just how they ended up wherethey are, both on the French
side and the Spanish side.
We only wanted to stayin France for this trip.
We didn't go to the Spanish side.
The museum was a really goodintroduction to the basque
culture, and I highly recommend it.
And we loved Bayonne also.
That was your recommendation.
You said, yeah, you might notlike Biarritz Knowing how you got
(37:28):
to know me through our workingtogether, and we loved Bayonne.
We liked it a little bit.
It's not like the back of theBayonne, but it's a little less
known, I think, than Biarritz.
Annie Sargent (37:36):
Yeah, so there's pros and cons to both, but if you want
the more genuine French town, Bayonneis it, Biarritz, not that Biarritz
is not a genuine French town, butit gets a lot more visitors, it's
a town with more money, you know,nicer hotels, nicer restaurants.
Bayonne is more like, you know, it'spretty, it has pretty parts, and
(37:58):
obviously it has a very good Musée Basque.
In Bayonne, I remember goingto the Chocolate Museum, which
I thought was fun, you know.
I didn't know anything aboutchocolate when we went, so
I learned a lot about that.
Regina Logan (38:08):
And they have, they also had a nice market, and they also had plenty
of restaurants that, you know, that youcould go to, and a marché, a market also.
So, we liked it.
It was fun.
Annie Sargent (38:20):
So, of all these areas, so you were in Toulouse, you were in
Aveyron, you were in the Dordogne,you were in the Basque country.
If you had to go back to one ofthem, which one would you pick?
Regina Logan (38:32):
Oh, man, that's a really hard question.
So for Toulouse, I know it's yourhometown, so we only were there overnight.
Yeah, I can't really talk aboutToulouse other than I'd like to
go back to it, and explore it.
Honestly, Annie, I don'tthink I can choose.
They were one, they were all wonderful.
I just can't, I think...
Annie Sargent (38:52):
They're very different, aren't they?
I mean, these are regions with a lot ofpersonality, very specific personality
that comes from the land, from thelandscape, from the foods, from the,
you know, the wines in the area.
And they are quite different, all of them.
So, you know...
But you talked more aboutthe Dordogne, though.
(39:12):
You spent more timetalking about the Dordogne.
You listed more Dordogne stuff.
Regina Logan (39:16):
Oh.
Interesting.
I don't think I actually evenknew, like, it's not like a
line that says you are leaving.
Annie Sargent (39:23):
That's true.
That's true.
Regina Logan (39:25):
So I might not even know what was where.
Annie Sargent (39:27):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's interesting.
Okay.
So I'm going to skip Rue Daguerre,we'll get back to that in a
second, you like Cahors as a city.
That's also one that doesn'tget visited that much.
What did you enjoy there?
Regina Logan (39:41):
Oh my gosh, it's the pont, the bridge Valentré,
which is a UNESCO World Heritagesite, one of the most beautiful,
beautiful bridges you will ever see.
It's from the Moyen Age, alsothe Middle Ages, I'm pretty sure.
And it's just, it's gorgeous.
The bridge is wonderful.
I mean, that's the only thing I remember.
We spent a lot of timetaking pictures there.
(40:02):
And then, I don't remember what riveris there, but we took it, because we had
two different boat rides, but we took aboat ride there, whatever that river is.
Annie Sargent (40:11):
So, La Roque-Gageac, I'm pretty sure that's the Dordogne.
Regina Logan (40:15):
No, that was, I think that was the second, we
also took a boat ride in Cahors.
Annie Sargent (40:20):
Oh, in Cahors you did, okay.
Regina Logan (40:22):
Yeah, I don't remember.
I don't remember what the river was.
Sorry.
Annie Sargent (40:26):
I'll look it up.
I don't know it off thetop of my head either.
Is it the Lot?
It is the Lot.
Regina Logan (40:32):
Okay.
So, you know, it's alwaysfun to take a boat ride.
Annie Sargent (40:35):
Yes.
I love the
Regina Logan (40:36):
boat ride.
You could also get kayaks, I think,there as well in the Dordogne.
We weren't quite thatadventuresome to try kayaks.
Maybe if we were younger, but we're not.
Annie Sargent (40:45):
Well, anywhere you go, you can rent kayaks, you can rent
bikes, you know, anywhere you go.
I know I sound like a broken record,but there's great hikes to be had
anywhere in France, if you're lookingfor that, just go to Komoot and look
for bike rides, hikes, whatever,anywhere, and you'll find some.
There's some everywhere.
(41:06):
So let's talk about RueDaguerre in Paris.
This is not one that comes up a lot, sowe want to talk about it, so, because
we don't have a lot of time left.
Regina Logan (41:14):
Well, first of all, thanks to you, we stayed in the 14th
Arrondissement, which is not, it'snot one of the main arrondissements,
I think a lot of tourists becausethere's not a lot of touristy stuff
there, which was totally fine with us.
It's still super convenient to everything.
We did not go to the very famoustower, Montparnasse Tower, which
(41:34):
we did not go up in, but we heardhere it has a wonderful view.
Anyway, that's the 14th.
But the Rue Daguerre was just this greatlittle street with all kinds of markets
and restaurants, and full of life.
We went once in the evening and wasstill going strong when we left, probably
after dinner around nine or ten o'clock.
And then in the morning, ourlast morning, we went back up
(41:56):
and we had breakfast there.
It was all just very lively.
And I think, again, a little bit off thebeaten path for most American tourists.
Annie Sargent (42:05):
Yeah.
Well, and the crazy thing is it'sright across from the Catacombs.
It's really close to the Catacombs.
It's also really close to theMusée de la Libération de Paris,
which is one I highly recommend.
So this is a part of Paris thathas plenty of things to do.
You're also not very far from theCimetière Montparnasse, which is
(42:29):
just as cool as Père Lachaise.
People don't really talk about it as much.
So, you know, people don't know, butif you're going to spend a day in
Montparnasse area, definitely there'smore that you can do in that area.
And there's some reallycool restaurants as well.
So yeah, a really nice area.
Regina Logan (42:48):
We did end our trip at La Rotonde, which is a famous restaurant.
Annie Sargent (42:53):
I like it.
Good food.
They have really good veal liver.
Oh, the best in France.
Regina Logan (42:59):
I haven't tried veal liver, but we had good fish.
Annie Sargent (43:03):
There you go.
There you go.
So you list a few favorite restaurantsand that's going to be all in your guest
notes, including one in Toulouse thatI have not been to, Le Court Circuit.
Got to go.
Got to go.
Regina Logan (43:15):
It was in a little tiny place, and we only stayed one night there,
as I mentioned, but our Airbnb hosts wereadorable, a young couple, cute little kid,
and they lived in the apartment buildingright next to where the Airbnb was,
and we asked them, where would you go?
We want to walk, because it was dark, andwe didn't even have our car yet anyway.
And so we just walked over there and avery youthful, I don't know if it's near
(43:38):
a university, but there are a lot ofyoung people there, which was pretty cool.
Annie Sargent (43:41):
I will have to, I will have to go, yeah, I will have to try it.
You have one in Corde du Ciel, you haveone in Cahors, you have one in Bayonne.
Yeah, yeah, you have abunch of them, restaurants.
Just go look at the guest notes.
They're really good.
What did you learn aboutFrance on this trip?
Because this was not your first rodeo.
So did you learn anything?
Regina Logan (44:00):
Honestly, it just confirmed the joie de vivre that
we find in France that, you know,just taking it easy, really enjoying
food, wine, talking with friends
. Annie Sargent: Company, being with friends.
Company, yes, being with friends and just, you know,
you could flânner, you could bea flânneur, flânneuse, just, you
(44:20):
know, wandering through the streets.
It just confirmed what I already knew andloved about France, I have to be really
honest, it wasn't anything particularly,nothing new, but except that now I want
to go back every single year and goto a different part of France or go.
That's always a hard one, do you goback to where you were because you
loved it or do you try something newbecause you haven't been there yet.
Annie Sargent (44:38):
Ah, that's the question.
That's always the question.
So same at restaurants.
Do you go back to arestaurant you really like?
Do you eat the same thing you alreadygot or do you try something new?
That's hard.
And there's people who will answerthat question very differently
depending on their personality,and there's no good or bad answer.
Any pearls of wisdom that you wantto share, that didn't come up yet?
Regina Logan (45:00):
The only thing, and I think you had asked me to
sort of give a name to this trip.
Annie Sargent (45:06):
Yes.
Regina Logan (45:07):
Less is more.
I cannot say it enough.
Less is more.
Don't try to do everything.
You know, if you're lucky,you'll get back another time.
But even if not, go fordepth rather than breadth.
You know, you really staysomewhere for a few days.
Don't try to do 8 million things,you know, in particularly, maybe in
(45:28):
Paris as well, but wherever you are.
It was great.
Because then you have time for theserendipitous things that will happen
and rather than trying to go, Oh,my God, we have this itinerary, we
have to be here by three o'clock.
Oh, the other thing is time.
They're not kidding when they sayall the shops close from 12 to 2,
but all the restaurants are open.
You've said this before too, so ifyou arrive somewhere, like we did
(45:49):
until we figured this out, oh we'llgo to the tourist bureau first,
find out about this place where weare, and then we'll go to lunch.
Well you get to the tourist bureau andit's not open, so start with lunch...
Annie Sargent (46:00):
If it's time to eat, just go eat.
Regina Logan (46:02):
Exactly, exactly, I would say that's my, if it's less is more, then
under that if it's time to eat, go to eat.
Annie Sargent (46:08):
Yes.
No, it's really, really important.
And people don't, you know, themost difficult people to convince
of this is people who are used tojust eating when they're hungry.
Don't do that in France,because you won't eat.
Regina Logan (46:22):
Or you carry around a baguette and some good fromage and you...
Annie Sargent (46:25):
Or you carry on something, but if you just wait to, if
you only eat when you get hungry, well,you know, I mean, in Paris, there's
stuff open all the time, but outsideof Paris or in big cities, I'm not
talking, I'm talking about big citiesin general, you'll find something.
But in these quaint little villages,the chef is not sticking around day and
night, you know, he shows up at 11 andhe leaves at, well, a two or something.
(46:50):
And good luck eatingoutside of those hours.
That's just how it is.
Regina Logan (46:53):
I know that we're running out late, I think, but I have to give
a plug for your walking tours in Paris.
Annie Sargent (46:59):
Go ahead.
Regina Logan (47:00):
Awesome.
They were awesome.
We had gotten the Marais and theQuartier Latin, the Latin Quarter, and
we actually couldn't even, there wereso much, they were so comprehensive.
We probably only did them foreach one for an hour to two.
And that didn't finish because therewas just, they were great though, they
were very, we did get lost once in awhile, but we would just go back, we'd
(47:22):
follow your directions and go backto where we should have been and turn
left instead of right or whatever.
Annie Sargent (47:26):
Oh, yeah.
Regina Logan (47:28):
They were really great.
Annie Sargent (47:29):
Yeah.
They make your life easy.
And if you enjoy just not beingtoo stuck on your phone, then the
walking tours are good because youcan listen to me telling you where
it is you're supposed to go next.
Now, sometimes you miss a turn orsomething, but I'm very, very careful
to tell you exactly, you know, Itest those things so many times.
(47:51):
I send people who don't know Paris,all of that, because you got to
get these little things right.
But thank you so much.
Yes.
I put in a lot of time.
I'm thinking about doing another one forthe Louvre area because I really like
that area and I know it very well, andso I think it'd be interesting to guide
people through that area and take them tosome of the places I love, but will see.
(48:14):
There's always more I couldbe doing with my time.
Well, thank you so much, Regina.
It's been delightful working withyou and talking to you today.
And I hope you get many, many morechances to come back to France.
Merci, moi au aussi.
Thank you.
Me too.
Merci.
Au revoir.
Au revoir.
Bye bye.
(48:40):
The Join Us in France travelpodcast is written, hosted, and
produced by Annie Sargent andCopyright 2024 by AddictedToFrance.
It is released under a CreativeCommons, attribution, non-commercial,
no derivatives license.
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