May 20, 2024 • 30 mins
Exploring AI’s Role in Legal Research, Data Analysis, and Client Management
Tanner Jones, your host and Vice President of Business Development at Consultwebs, welcomes you to another episode of the LAWsome Podcast by Consultwebs.
In this episode, he is joined by Karl Seelbach, an attorney, founder of Skribe.ai, and expert in legal marketing. They discuss the evolution of AI in the legal field and how AI tools have transformed legal research, data analysis, and legal marketing. Karl shares his experiences with different AI tools and the challenges of implementing them. They also explore the role of AI in decision-making, client management, and running a law firm. Karl provides insights on how to get started with AI in the legal field and emphasizes the importance of testing and evaluating different tools.
Key Takeaways:
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AI tools have revolutionized legal research, enhancing efficiency and enabling natural language interactions with software.
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Implementing AI tools in the legal field can present challenges, such as choosing the right tool and addressing risks like hallucinations.
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AI can assist in decision-making by analyzing large data sets, spotting inconsistencies, and assessing exposure or potential jury verdicts.
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AI tech can also be leveraged to improve client management, from intake processes to chatbots and AI-powered phone support.
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Staying ahead in the legal tech space required resting and evaluating different AI solutions, considering cost-benefit analysis, and attending legal tech conferences.
Timestamps:
00:01 - Introduction to Karl Seelbach
01:45 - Evolution of AI in Legal Research
03:49 - Challenges of Implementing AI in Legal Research
04:10 - Leveraging AI Tools for Legal Research
08:10 - AI in Data Analysis and Case Evaluation
11:26 - Using AI for Assessing Jury Verdicts and Risk
12:07 - Starting with AI in Legal Practices
14:15 - AI in Medical Record Analysis
15:15 - AI in Client Management and Intake
18:22 - The Future of AI in Legal Marketing
19:14 - Ethical Considerations and Deep Fakes
21:35 - Introducing Scribd AI
22:43 - Speed and Efficiency in Legal Practices
25:25 - Staying Ahead with Legal Tech
27:20 - Final Thoughts and Advice
Best way to contact Karl:
Tweetables and Quotes:
“If you’re not online, you’re invisible to potential clients. A strong digital presence is no longer optional, it’s essential.” @consultwebs
“ SEO is about making sure your law firm is found by those who need your services. It’s about visibility and relevance.” @consultwebs
“Content marketing is about providing value. If you can educate and inform your audience,
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:03):
LAWsome by Consultwebs breakthroughinsights to build a thriving law
firm with your host Tanner Jones.
Hello to all you LAWsome listeners.
Today on the show, I'm excited to betalking with Carl Silbach, a seasoned
lawyer and founder of Doyle and Silbach.
(00:24):
Carl started his career in thelegal field as a courtroom advocate.
At South Texas College of Law in Houston,Carl's legal career blossomed when
he worked for Winstead PC, one of thelargest law firms in Texas, where he
spent almost a decade of his career.
He was mentored by former appellatejudges, litigators, and by seasoned
trial lawyers within the state.
(00:44):
This experience helped him gaininvaluable knowledge and expertise
in areas like personal injury,employment litigation, business.
From there, Carl took a leap and he cofounded his law firm, Doyle Silbach.
He's earned a reputation as a skilledadvocate and a whip smart lawyer,
as described by many colleagues.
Today's topic is the evolution of AI inthe legal field, transforming research,
(01:09):
data analysis, and legal marketing.
Thanks for coming tothe show, Carl Tanner.
Thanks for having me.
I'm glad to be here.
Absolutely.
This topic seems to be just coveringthe airwaves right now because it's
so impactful to any industry, butobviously legal, there's been some
major transformation AI tools todayhave really changed legal research
(01:33):
enhancing efficiency and helpingyou really anticipate the future.
Analyze information at agreater scale than ever before.
And this type of innovative technologyis clearly streamlined a lot within
a law form, or at least has potentialto do so that's really where I'd
like to start, Carl, from yourexperience and really practically
speaking for our listeners, how have.
(01:55):
Different AI tools changed thetraditional legal research method.
Yeah, no, it's a great question.
And I think what's interestingis it's not that AI hasn't
been behind the scenes before.
Is that the way we're interactingwith the software is changing, right?
With the large language models beingable to actually have a conversation.
With the software where you don't haveto know exactly what the codes are
(02:18):
or like the string of characters thatyou need to run in Westlaw or Lexis.
Now you can just ask it using naturallanguage and kind of interact with it.
So that's pretty cool.
When I think about my legal career,so I started practicing law in 2006.
With Winstead, I was just an associate.
I would say a lot of the research, eventhough we were trained on Lexis and
(02:38):
Westlaw software websites, in law school,there were still a lot of people went
to the library, especially a lot of thepartners that I worked with at the time.
I was, I've always been a techie.
I just love technology.
So it really wasn't my style.
I was very much no, I can, I don't needto go to the library and go find the book.
I can.
(02:59):
In a few keystrokes, I can pull upthe case, but with the AI powered
tools, what we're seeing is.
An evolution, right?
So I remember years ago, thiswas just before I made partner.
So probably in 2013, 2014, aconversation at the firm of, hey, do
we really need this physical libraryspace or can we make it smaller?
(03:21):
And 1 of the partners with good intentionssaid, if we don't have the library, where
am I going to go find this and this whenI need a case when I need to get the
case, or I need to get whatever it is.
And I remember someone said1st of all, you're the partner.
You shouldn't be doing that anyway.
And 2nd of all, you shouldjust use your computer.
(03:42):
So eventually the books became almostlike decoration in the hallway.
And so that's been a bigshift in and of itself.
And that's been really neat to watch.
But now I think we're justreally tip of the iceberg.
Things are about to changeand I think change pretty,
rapidly over the next 2 to 5
years.
(04:03):
I would agree.
And yeah, that's it.
It's going to only exponentially increasein terms of just the pacing of change.
And I think to some degree that'sintimidating and I think it's helpful
to go ahead and start with maybe theintimidating concept, which would be the
challenges personally, any challengesyou faced in implementing some of these
AI tools related to legal research.
(04:25):
Can you speak to that?
Yeah
absolutely.
I think one of the challenges, especiallyas a business owner myself, right?
I left the world of big law in 2015 witha really good friend of mine, trick Doyle.
We opened our own firm.
We've since grown that to 14attorneys, 11 team members,
many of which are paralegals.
So it's still a small firm, butgrowing we have a lot of fun
(04:46):
and work hard for our clients.
But I'd say one of the challengesis How do you which tool to pick and
the AI, the risks associated withthings like hallucinations people
not knowing how to use it correctly.
Those can be a bit concerning.
But if we take a step back andwe think about your original
question and your follow up about.
(05:08):
What tools can you use and how canyou actually implement this in your
practice in a way that can makeyour law firm more efficient and you
do a better job for your clients?
I think back to beforechat GPT was popular.
There was already some prettycool tools on the market case.
Text has one, they called it, I think it'sstill called Cara, And this was again,
(05:30):
before OpenAI wa was a, household name.
You could just drop a brief infrom an opponent and it would go
in and it would basically extractall the cases, all the key points.
And so things like thathave existed, but now.
It's one step further.
So if you look at some of the tools,and obviously case text is one of
the big players in legal research.
(05:51):
Lexis AI or Lexis Plus AI, Ithink is what they call it.
Westlaw Precision.
If you've looked at any of thesetools, they all have a similar
interface and a similar result.
And there's a reason for that.
Okay.
It's not I don't think thisis a dirty little secret.
It's not.
It's not like all of these companiesjust magically invented large
(06:12):
language models all in the same year.
They're all leveraging, for themost part, OpenAI's API, right?
So it's a very similar experience.
They're most likely hittingOpenAI's API and getting a result.
And so the things that you see in thatinterface are You know, draft a sample
(06:33):
email to the client on this topic.
Summarize this case for me.
Explain to me the law on XYZin the context of a employment
harassment case or whatever it is.
It doesn't, and it does a very goodjob of providing, I think the attorney
or the paralegal with the first draft.
(06:54):
The nice thing about using a legalpurpose built solution for anything, but
particularly for legal research, is Theyare layering in existing cases so that
when that result comes back, you don'thave to worry about a fake case, right?
Because we've had litigatorsfile briefs with the court
(07:15):
with cases that did not exist.
And I don't think thoselitigators were doing it to try
to pull one over on the court.
I think they were just eitherlazy or didn't understand the
technology they were using.
So that gets the risk of that happening.
I won't say it's eliminated by using 1of the names that I've mentioned, but
it's significantly reduced the risk ofyou citing something that doesn't exist.
(07:40):
But it's not just legal research, right?
There's a lot of different layersto using a I, and I view it through
the lens of a litigator and youcan use a, I, for everything from
speeding up your discovery processes.
To helping you analyze and capturelegal testimony faster, to getting
ready for trial, helping youpick a jury doing jury research.
(08:04):
There's just so many different ways.
That you can add and layer in AI to yourpractice that will make you a better
litigator and that doesn't even startto get into all the ways you can use AI
as a business owner to help you get morebusiness, improve your client intake.
So it's, exciting time tobe an attorney, I think.
Yeah I, would totally agree.
(08:26):
You've, we've hit on a little bitfocusing around the data analysis and case
evaluation around legal data evaluation.
But obviously, yes, there, it can bea mile deep or a mile wide within your
practice on how you want to use it.
What about specifically helping youmake decisions in, any part of the case,
(08:47):
whether it's the discovery part, whetherit's the legal analysis, have you had any
personal experiences of where this type oftechnology has clearly guided you to make
a better decision in the practice of law?
So, let me think about the bestway to answer this question.
I think there's a couple ofdifferent pieces to this.
(09:08):
One is the use of ai.
Everybody, when they talk about AI today,for the most part, especially people
who aren't software developers, tend tobe talking about generative ai, right?
Because that's what they see in the news.
People have played around withGoogle Bard or chat GPT, or
now X has one, for interacting.
(09:31):
So from a generative AI standpoint.
In analyzing a bunch of data, I thinkwhere the opportunity comes in to
help you with the case, and I haveused it for this purpose, is taking
a large data set, and keep in mind,I only know what I know, which is
primarily personal injury defense work.
We also do some real estate litigation andsome commercial litigation, but it'd be
(09:52):
taking A big stack of documents, right?
Digital documents.
I hope everyone's not using paper still,but and helping summarize that or spot
inconsistencies right between testimonyand evidence and things like that.
And so there definitely arethings that you can use for that.
Even GPT.
If you subscribe to a pro plan, whichgives you some more settings to help
(10:14):
configure your privacy settings.
Can help with that.
And so I think part of it is just usingthe benefit of what open a I has built and
others to help you take a large data set,analyze it faster and spot inconsistencies
or consistencies in the evidence thatyou're looking at to evaluate your case.
(10:36):
The other side of this,I am really curious.
To see how it develops.
And so you asked about, in thecontext of what I do assessing
exposure or looking at potentialjury verdicts and things like that.
I think that opportunityis absolutely there.
I'm sure there's companiesthat are tackling it.
I just haven't found them yet.
(10:56):
I haven't used them yet.
We tend to use Lexus,a verdict search tool.
I think they may have layered ina little bit of their offering
into the verdict search.
I haven't personally tinkered with it yet.
That's usually something Iassigned to my associates.
Thanks.
But I definitely see an opportunityfor just I was talking about the data
within the case to take and applyit to all of this existing verdict
(11:21):
information to the extent you canget your hands on it settlement
information or arbitration results andbe able to more quickly analyze and
spot hey, based on your case facts.
Here's where we think your risk is.
So that's definitelywhere things are headed.
I don't think there'sany question about that.
Yeah, that's fascinating.
And I, think you may have, or I canalmost guarantee we have listeners
(11:45):
who are hearing this and maybe theyhaven't even dipped a toe into this.
Maybe they still have the libraryand in the back of the office,
like we were talking about where.
Based on what you know, and I thinkit's clear you're, definitely on the
cutting edge of the tech world as alitigator based on your experience here.
(12:06):
Where is a good place to start, right?
If they're just so new to this andseemingly there are a lot of different
ways that they can pursue this, wherehave you found that they can find maybe
the best impact within their practice?
So I, I think it, I think the lowestrisk place to start, if you just want to
dip your toe in the water, is probablyjust one of chat GPT, subscribe to
(12:32):
the probe plan, or use Google BARDand just use it for some drafting.
Just use it to get you your 1st draft.
If you're going to be doing research andtrying to cite cases, I would suggest
using 1 of the case management platformor not case management, excuse me, legal
research platforms, case text or Lexusor Westlaw precision, because then you'll
(12:57):
have the benefit of not worrying as muchabout hallucinations and fake case sites.
But I think that would be one benefit.
Pretty easy place to start on thekind of litigator tools and my
tool belt side of things would be.
It helps a lot with drafting.
There's even companies like I thinklegal nation is 1 of the ones that
I've seen even up as another companythat actually specifically to legal
(13:20):
will help you draft pleadings.
They'll help you draftdiscovery documents.
I met even up CEO.
This past summer at a conference, and theyhelp plaintiff personal injury attorneys
take the information about their case,the medical records, what their client has
to say about what happened, and actuallyhelp them craft using AI, a demand
letter, and they put even recommendedhere's what to ask for based on our data.
(13:46):
I think those are some really,neat tools that are out there.
The 1 that I would.
And again you can only do soyou only have so many cycles.
You can only do so many things so fast.
I'm really interested in getting myhands on 1 that's really good at medical
record analysis and summarization.
I know there are some out there.
I actually haven't had achance to test them yet.
But that's pretty interesting because thattends to be a pain point for any law firm
(14:10):
that does personal injury, whether you're
and when you're getting ready for adeposition or whatever it is, trial,
mediation, getting a handle on thoserecords faster can only help you.
Yeah that's really the power.
It's this, type of technology certainlyis not replacing lawyers by any means,
(14:33):
but what it's doing is, providing anincredible tool to serve clients better
to serve them more efficiently and faster.
And that's really what I'm hearing.
And we've talked really around the areaof the practice of law here, but clearly
running a business itself requiresclients and it requires, at least for
a successful business, happy clients.
(14:55):
And part of that is through just how weengage our clientele for any business.
But legal is no different.
You have to manage those clientsand AI it's role in that there are
opportunities that are growing in termsof how to, manage overall perspective
clients and, provide a good experience.
And so I'm curious, have you turnedthat corner within the business?
(15:18):
Have you leveraged AI or tech tobe able to serve clients or provide
wow, experiences in some way?
Yeah, a little bit.
I'd say scratching the surface.
And when I think about.
Let's get out of the kind ofthe litigator in the trenches
and let's talk business owner.
There are all sorts of tools outthere that, you know, even before GPT
(15:42):
offered some really powerful softwaresuites that could help you, with
intake help you track potential leads.
My firm uses HubSpot.
For social media, we use buffer and thesetool now, these tools have layered in
again, probably by hitting open eyes API.
They've started layinglayering in generative AI.
(16:04):
So now you can begin to.
More quickly, easily draft content, right?
And so a lot of us, particularlyattorneys, a lot of attorneys have great
ideas for things that they want to do.
It's just a matter of finding the time towrite that article or the time to write
that LinkedIn post or whatever it may be.
And I think now you can dictateyour notes or type up your notes
(16:29):
real quick and drop them into one ofthese tools, whether it's something
like a buffer or even HubSpot and itwill do a pretty decent first draft.
I think of it as a really fastassistant who is also pretty darn
creative and can throw togethersomething for you really quick based
on the prompts that you give it.
And so the better you get it prompting,the better your results is going to be.
(16:53):
And the other thing that I'veseen, I don't have a need for
this because we represent.
Large companies for the most part.
For attorneys that are doingplaintiff personal injury the chat
bots, in my opinion, used to suck.
I didn't ever want to talk to achat bot, but that is changing
really fast with generative AI.
(17:14):
So the chap, the quality of the chat bot.
Is gotten really, good.
There's companies out there.
Gideon is 1 that I've seen.
There's a couple of other competitorsto that focus a little bit on legal.
And I think there's probably.
That's the 1st step and client intakeand talking to potential clients who
(17:34):
maybe land on your website at midnight.
I think the next step inthe not too distant future.
Is going to be a power intakephone support to where either
making the call or taking the call.
It is actually a power person, right?
And they are part of software andI just saw an article in the last.
(17:59):
2 weeks where someone had alreadystarted using that type of technology.
In politics, and they were makingthousands of calls to potential voters.
and having conversations with these votersas an AI powered call specialist, right?
(18:20):
Like a call support type person.
And so it'll be very interestingto see how that takes off how
potential clients respond to it.
But the quality keepsgetting better and better.
That's what I'm experiencing as well.
Carl.
It's fascinating.
I think right now it's, we're alljust trying To to catch up get used
(18:41):
to it to some degree and naturallyas it becomes more mainstream I think
the consumer base overall will becomemore accepting to it particularly
because it's serving them better It'syou know their time as you mentioned.
I mean on your website should be workingfor your business 24 7 And the more you
(19:02):
can layer on some of this AI technology,just as you're suggesting this, chat bot
the, animation basically creating animatedattorneys of your office and feeding in
your voice, actually you, have the abilityessentially to have your own animation
on your site, answering questions allthe time and that technology is here.
(19:27):
It's really crazy to think because thenext step and whether this happens next
year or the following or within fiveyears, I don't know, the quality of,
we'll call it a deep fake, but thiswould be intentional by an attorney.
We are not too far away fromyou probably being able to take
this podcast recording, right?
It's enough of me talking.
It's enough of you talking to take it.
(19:50):
And say, you know what?
We really like that podcastwith Tanner and Carl.
We want them to do another1 on a different topic.
Here's a prompt.
And all of a sudden, it's just createdwith our boys with our likeness.
And that's a scary thing.
But it's not too.
I think the problem isgoing to be, two things.
One, people being completelyoverwhelmed with too much
(20:13):
information, too much content, andat some point it becomes noise.
So that's going to be a tricky thingto manage in the future for companies
like Consultwebs, for example, thatdoes, that helps with SEO, that
helps with marketing it's how do youleverage AI in a way that doesn't
just, it all ends up just being noise.
And so that's, going tobe interesting to watch.
(20:35):
For me.
When I take, if I take a step back andwe can talk about more tools AI stuff.
I love talking about thosethings, but for me and what I do.
I always say to my to my team, tomy associates, my paralegals, even
when we interview people to comejoin the firm, our job is to find
out the truth for our clients, right?
(20:57):
Is to find out what happened?
Whose fault is it?
How bad was the person injured?
And what's a reasonablevalue, if any, that should be
offered to settle this case?
And that's for me, the faster I can getto that decision and the less expensive
it is for me to get to that decision.
The better and I think where softwareplays into this is software is
(21:21):
going to help us bring down thecost of litigation by making things
that used to take a lot of time,take much, much, less time, right?
It's going to speed it up.
And so like with, that'sone of the things.
From my standpoint, that's 1 ofthe things that kind of inspired me
and prompted me to start scribe A.
I.
is a legal tech company that Istarted last year with a good
(21:43):
friend of mine, Tom Irby, and thegoal there is to help attorneys.
Take depositions and other typesof testimony faster for less money
and get a result the same day.
They take the depositionget a sync transcript.
And it's all about reducingthe cost, making it easier for
(22:04):
attorneys to not have to decide.
Do I want to take this deposition?
Because, I don't know.
Can my client afford it?
It's so expensive to take a deposition,or maybe I've got a hearing next week.
I'm not even going to get theresult unless I pay triple to a
court reporting agency transcript.
And so it's with, software, we can do it.
(22:27):
That's just it.
And really the sky istruly the limit here.
It's a matter of identifyingas a business owner where, are
your key gaps in your business?
Where are you, where are yourinefficiencies and, at least giving you a
starting point because you're right there,there's huge time savings potential here.
And, clearly it's a great wayto serve the client and help
(22:48):
your business in the process.
Yeah.
I think in today's world,speed is not just important.
I would say it's a requirement.
And the world moves really fast.
You can't wait.
For weeks or more to go to the nextstep in your case, because you have some
piece of your machine that's slow, right?
(23:09):
It all needs to be likea well oiled machine.
I had an attorney we were talkingto recently who is a scribe
customer and he put it like thisand I thought it was pretty clever.
He said, look, a lawsuitis not like fine wine.
It does not get better with age.
And his point was.
(23:30):
He wants everyone on his team to as soonas I get a case, this is a plaintiff's
firm in Houston to just dive into thecase and figure out what do we need to do?
What discovery do we need to send?
What depositions do we need totake and let's go do it right?
And don't be afraid to take depositionsjust because of the cost if we
(23:53):
can find a lower cost way to do itand get the results really fast.
1 of the best ways to get.
Okay.
To the core of the case is to just getthe witnesses in the hot seat and put them
under oath and see what they have to say.
And it's been a lot of fun.
Just seeing how I can impact all that.
There's another company that I cameacross lately that I thought was,
this is a really clever use of.
(24:15):
And the name of the company is emotiontrack and what they can do for attorneys
is they can take video depositions and andthe attorneys can package them together.
So you can create videoclips from your depositions.
You can do a little self recordedzoom or something, doing a little
opening statement and emotion track.
(24:37):
We'll take that.
That package.
We'll call it and they will send it.
They'll put it in front of hundreds ofeyeballs and they will actually track the
sentiment like a sentiment analysis of thepeople who are responding and listening
to this evidence and they're able toget, they're able to help you assess.
(24:58):
Credibility of witnesses, but they'realso able to help you assess the value
of your case, which can be pretty,which can be informative, both for
a plaintiff's lawyer, who's tryingto decide what's a demand in a case
as well as a defense lawyer like me,who's trying to help guide my client.
On what's a reasonable amountto pay to resolve this case.
(25:20):
And so there's just again, I thinkwe're tip of the iceberg right now.
There's a lot of companies that aretrying to play in the legal tech space.
And it's just a reallyfun time to be involved in
it.
I'm curious, Carl, you, from your.
Experience in this, like,how are you staying ahead?
How are you testing this software?
How are you learning about it?
(25:40):
Have you found that there are certainconventions you attend to stay up to
date certain, individuals you follow?
What's been your secret?
Yeah, so that's a good question.
My seat's a little uniquebecause I like legal tech a lot
and I'm a legal tech founder.
Some of the companies I mentioned, Imet last year at the legal tech fund.
(26:00):
They had a big conference in Miami.
I wasn't able to go this year.
I had a conflict, but theyactually just had their other
1, which is more focused on.
Who are the up and cominglegal tech companies?
And then there's and otherfunders that are there talking
about kind of hot topics.
So that's 1 of the ways thatI've been exposed to it.
But some of there's othergreat conferences, right?
Clio has a big 1 Clio con everyyear that my firm uses Clio
(26:24):
for case management software.
Association does theirtech show every year.
There's tons of podcasts.
This is one example, but there'sa ton of legal tech podcast.
I think a lot of attorneys willalso just get their recommendations
through word of mouth, right?
We tend to get overwhelmed withemails and email marketing.
(26:45):
Sometimes it gets my attention.
Sometimes it doesn't.
It feels like noise.
I think I had one offer me tobuy me Chick fil A if I would hop
on a zoom call with them aboutsomething, which which was tempting.
Yeah, it got your attention.
Apparently it got my attention.
It got my attention.
I hadn't had anyone offered tobuy me Chick fil A before in that.
(27:05):
Carl I'm grateful for the timeyou shared on the Lawson show.
You've given us a lot of wisdom andI know our listeners are appreciative
as well, any final or closing thoughtsthat you would have for our viewers?
Those interested in this inthe world of AI and tools?
Sure.
A couple things.
So
one anyone who's interested in the scribepiece of this, SKRI b.ai which is a
(27:29):
modern platform for taking depositions,but also for uploading and analyzing.
Your audio and video files inyour case, anyone who's interested
in that, shoot me an email.
It's Carl Krl at scribe sk RIBe.ai, and you'll get a discount for
being a awesome podcast listener.
Give you a complimentary useof the tool so you can kick the
(27:51):
tires and see what it's about.
So that piece I justwanted to mention briefly.
Otherwise, the scribe teamwould kick me if I forgot.
The second part though, isagain, putting my law firm
owner hat on for just a minute.
I think it's important to testbefore you implement some of these
technologies, and I would suggestyou test them yourself and maybe find
(28:12):
1 or 2 or maybe 3 or 4 fellow teammembers that could test them with you.
Because I think the worst.
The worst thing you could do asa law firm owner is just roll out
GPT to your entire staff withoutany training, without any guidance.
If you do that, I think the chancesare you're going to end up in the news
for doing some type of hallucinationis going to come back to bite you.
(28:38):
And not all publicity is goodpublicity and to be frank with you
I think I mentioned earlier, I'mstill in the early testing phase on
a lot of this we haven't rolled outa ton of AI solutions firm wide.
We're trying to figure outwhich 1 is the best 1 for us.
And which 1, can we justify the cost?
The 1 thing we didn't cover and I'lljust end with this thought is some
(29:01):
of these are very expensive tools.
Some of these are very, pricey.
So you have to look at costbenefit analysis and think
about it from the standpoint of.
Is it a pass through expense?
Is this something my client willpay either at the end of the case?
If I'm a plaintiff's attorney or on mymonthly invoice, if I'm doing defense
(29:22):
work, or is this going to be overhead?
And so I think that will play apretty big factor in just how quickly
AI gets adopted in the legal space.
But I'm by no means an expert.
I'm actually studying this stuff.
I want to test more of these softwares.
If anyone's listening that does a softwareand legal tech, shoot me an email.
I'd love to connect.
(29:42):
I'd love to test your platformand give you some feedback.
But it's a lot of fun.
And I think that it's definitelygoing to change the, I don't think
it's going to replace attorneys.
I do think it's goingto reduce the number of.
Support staff that you need.
I'm not like, I don't think you'll laypeople off, but I think once you layer
(30:02):
in some of these solutions, you willbe able to turn your cases faster.
You'll, be able to do more with less.
I guess is what I'm saying.
Thank you for, being the 1out here helping, the legal
profession stay ahead of the curve.
Grateful for your time.
Carl and thank you We'lllook forward to the next one.
Hopefully it'll be us andnot AI that is recreating.
(30:24):
So that's right.
If anybody says anythingcrazy, it's not me.
It must be AI bot.
There's the disclaimer.
Thanks Carl.
Thanks Tanner.
Appreciate it.
Yes, sir.
Take care.
LAWsome by Consultwebs with TannerJones for show notes, links, and info.
Go to Consultwebs.
com slash podcast.
Be sure to subscribeand leave us a review.
(30:45):
Watch for the next LAWsome episode todiscover more breakthrough insights
to build a thriving law firm.
LAWsome by Consultwebs breakthroughinsights to build a thriving law
firm with your host Tanner Jones.
Hello to all you LAWsome listeners.
Today on the show, I'm excited to betalking with Carl Silbach, a seasoned
lawyer and founder of Doyle and Silbach.
(00:24):
Carl started his career in thelegal field as a courtroom advocate.
At South Texas College of Law in Houston,Carl's legal career blossomed when
he worked for Winstead PC, one of thelargest law firms in Texas, where he
spent almost a decade of his career.
He was mentored by former appellatejudges, litigators, and by seasoned
trial lawyers within the state.
(00:44):
This experience helped him gaininvaluable knowledge and expertise
in areas like personal injury,employment litigation, business.
From there, Carl took a leap and he cofounded his law firm, Doyle Silbach.
He's earned a reputation as a skilledadvocate and a whip smart lawyer,
as described by many colleagues.
Today's topic is the evolution of AI inthe legal field, transforming research,
(01:09):
data analysis, and legal marketing.
Thanks for coming tothe show, Carl Tanner.
Thanks for having me.
I'm glad to be here.
Absolutely.
This topic seems to be just coveringthe airwaves right now because it's
so impactful to any industry, butobviously legal, there's been some
major transformation AI tools todayhave really changed legal research
(01:33):
enhancing efficiency and helpingyou really anticipate the future.
Analyze information at agreater scale than ever before.
And this type of innovative technologyis clearly streamlined a lot within
a law form, or at least has potentialto do so that's really where I'd
like to start, Carl, from yourexperience and really practically
speaking for our listeners, how have.
(01:55):
Different AI tools changed thetraditional legal research method.
Yeah, no, it's a great question.
And I think what's interestingis it's not that AI hasn't
been behind the scenes before.
Is that the way we're interactingwith the software is changing, right?
With the large language models beingable to actually have a conversation.
With the software where you don't haveto know exactly what the codes are
(02:18):
or like the string of characters thatyou need to run in Westlaw or Lexis.
Now you can just ask it using naturallanguage and kind of interact with it.
So that's pretty cool.
When I think about my legal career,so I started practicing law in 2006.
With Winstead, I was just an associate.
I would say a lot of the research, eventhough we were trained on Lexis and
(02:38):
Westlaw software websites, in law school,there were still a lot of people went
to the library, especially a lot of thepartners that I worked with at the time.
I was, I've always been a techie.
I just love technology.
So it really wasn't my style.
I was very much no, I can, I don't needto go to the library and go find the book.
I can.
(02:59):
In a few keystrokes, I can pull upthe case, but with the AI powered
tools, what we're seeing is.
An evolution, right?
So I remember years ago, thiswas just before I made partner.
So probably in 2013, 2014, aconversation at the firm of, hey, do
we really need this physical libraryspace or can we make it smaller?
(03:21):
And 1 of the partners with good intentionssaid, if we don't have the library, where
am I going to go find this and this whenI need a case when I need to get the
case, or I need to get whatever it is.
And I remember someone said1st of all, you're the partner.
You shouldn't be doing that anyway.
And 2nd of all, you shouldjust use your computer.
(03:42):
So eventually the books became almostlike decoration in the hallway.
And so that's been a bigshift in and of itself.
And that's been really neat to watch.
But now I think we're justreally tip of the iceberg.
Things are about to changeand I think change pretty,
rapidly over the next 2 to 5
years.
(04:03):
I would agree.
And yeah, that's it.
It's going to only exponentially increasein terms of just the pacing of change.
And I think to some degree that'sintimidating and I think it's helpful
to go ahead and start with maybe theintimidating concept, which would be the
challenges personally, any challengesyou faced in implementing some of these
AI tools related to legal research.
(04:25):
Can you speak to that?
Yeah
absolutely.
I think one of the challenges, especiallyas a business owner myself, right?
I left the world of big law in 2015 witha really good friend of mine, trick Doyle.
We opened our own firm.
We've since grown that to 14attorneys, 11 team members,
many of which are paralegals.
So it's still a small firm, butgrowing we have a lot of fun
(04:46):
and work hard for our clients.
But I'd say one of the challengesis How do you which tool to pick and
the AI, the risks associated withthings like hallucinations people
not knowing how to use it correctly.
Those can be a bit concerning.
But if we take a step back andwe think about your original
question and your follow up about.
(05:08):
What tools can you use and how canyou actually implement this in your
practice in a way that can makeyour law firm more efficient and you
do a better job for your clients?
I think back to beforechat GPT was popular.
There was already some prettycool tools on the market case.
Text has one, they called it, I think it'sstill called Cara, And this was again,
(05:30):
before OpenAI wa was a, household name.
You could just drop a brief infrom an opponent and it would go
in and it would basically extractall the cases, all the key points.
And so things like thathave existed, but now.
It's one step further.
So if you look at some of the tools,and obviously case text is one of
the big players in legal research.
(05:51):
Lexis AI or Lexis Plus AI, Ithink is what they call it.
Westlaw Precision.
If you've looked at any of thesetools, they all have a similar
interface and a similar result.
And there's a reason for that.
Okay.
It's not I don't think thisis a dirty little secret.
It's not.
It's not like all of these companiesjust magically invented large
(06:12):
language models all in the same year.
They're all leveraging, for themost part, OpenAI's API, right?
So it's a very similar experience.
They're most likely hittingOpenAI's API and getting a result.
And so the things that you see in thatinterface are You know, draft a sample
(06:33):
email to the client on this topic.
Summarize this case for me.
Explain to me the law on XYZin the context of a employment
harassment case or whatever it is.
It doesn't, and it does a very goodjob of providing, I think the attorney
or the paralegal with the first draft.
(06:54):
The nice thing about using a legalpurpose built solution for anything, but
particularly for legal research, is Theyare layering in existing cases so that
when that result comes back, you don'thave to worry about a fake case, right?
Because we've had litigatorsfile briefs with the court
(07:15):
with cases that did not exist.
And I don't think thoselitigators were doing it to try
to pull one over on the court.
I think they were just eitherlazy or didn't understand the
technology they were using.
So that gets the risk of that happening.
I won't say it's eliminated by using 1of the names that I've mentioned, but
it's significantly reduced the risk ofyou citing something that doesn't exist.
(07:40):
But it's not just legal research, right?
There's a lot of different layersto using a I, and I view it through
the lens of a litigator and youcan use a, I, for everything from
speeding up your discovery processes.
To helping you analyze and capturelegal testimony faster, to getting
ready for trial, helping youpick a jury doing jury research.
(08:04):
There's just so many different ways.
That you can add and layer in AI to yourpractice that will make you a better
litigator and that doesn't even startto get into all the ways you can use AI
as a business owner to help you get morebusiness, improve your client intake.
So it's, exciting time tobe an attorney, I think.
Yeah I, would totally agree.
(08:26):
You've, we've hit on a little bitfocusing around the data analysis and case
evaluation around legal data evaluation.
But obviously, yes, there, it can bea mile deep or a mile wide within your
practice on how you want to use it.
What about specifically helping youmake decisions in, any part of the case,
(08:47):
whether it's the discovery part, whetherit's the legal analysis, have you had any
personal experiences of where this type oftechnology has clearly guided you to make
a better decision in the practice of law?
So, let me think about the bestway to answer this question.
I think there's a couple ofdifferent pieces to this.
(09:08):
One is the use of ai.
Everybody, when they talk about AI today,for the most part, especially people
who aren't software developers, tend tobe talking about generative ai, right?
Because that's what they see in the news.
People have played around withGoogle Bard or chat GPT, or
now X has one, for interacting.
(09:31):
So from a generative AI standpoint.
In analyzing a bunch of data, I thinkwhere the opportunity comes in to
help you with the case, and I haveused it for this purpose, is taking
a large data set, and keep in mind,I only know what I know, which is
primarily personal injury defense work.
We also do some real estate litigation andsome commercial litigation, but it'd be
(09:52):
taking A big stack of documents, right?
Digital documents.
I hope everyone's not using paper still,but and helping summarize that or spot
inconsistencies right between testimonyand evidence and things like that.
And so there definitely arethings that you can use for that.
Even GPT.
If you subscribe to a pro plan, whichgives you some more settings to help
(10:14):
configure your privacy settings.
Can help with that.
And so I think part of it is just usingthe benefit of what open a I has built and
others to help you take a large data set,analyze it faster and spot inconsistencies
or consistencies in the evidence thatyou're looking at to evaluate your case.
(10:36):
The other side of this,I am really curious.
To see how it develops.
And so you asked about, in thecontext of what I do assessing
exposure or looking at potentialjury verdicts and things like that.
I think that opportunityis absolutely there.
I'm sure there's companiesthat are tackling it.
I just haven't found them yet.
(10:56):
I haven't used them yet.
We tend to use Lexus,a verdict search tool.
I think they may have layered ina little bit of their offering
into the verdict search.
I haven't personally tinkered with it yet.
That's usually something Iassigned to my associates.
Thanks.
But I definitely see an opportunityfor just I was talking about the data
within the case to take and applyit to all of this existing verdict
(11:21):
information to the extent you canget your hands on it settlement
information or arbitration results andbe able to more quickly analyze and
spot hey, based on your case facts.
Here's where we think your risk is.
So that's definitelywhere things are headed.
I don't think there'sany question about that.
Yeah, that's fascinating.
And I, think you may have, or I canalmost guarantee we have listeners
(11:45):
who are hearing this and maybe theyhaven't even dipped a toe into this.
Maybe they still have the libraryand in the back of the office,
like we were talking about where.
Based on what you know, and I thinkit's clear you're, definitely on the
cutting edge of the tech world as alitigator based on your experience here.
(12:06):
Where is a good place to start, right?
If they're just so new to this andseemingly there are a lot of different
ways that they can pursue this, wherehave you found that they can find maybe
the best impact within their practice?
So I, I think it, I think the lowestrisk place to start, if you just want to
dip your toe in the water, is probablyjust one of chat GPT, subscribe to
(12:32):
the probe plan, or use Google BARDand just use it for some drafting.
Just use it to get you your 1st draft.
If you're going to be doing research andtrying to cite cases, I would suggest
using 1 of the case management platformor not case management, excuse me, legal
research platforms, case text or Lexusor Westlaw precision, because then you'll
(12:57):
have the benefit of not worrying as muchabout hallucinations and fake case sites.
But I think that would be one benefit.
Pretty easy place to start on thekind of litigator tools and my
tool belt side of things would be.
It helps a lot with drafting.
There's even companies like I thinklegal nation is 1 of the ones that
I've seen even up as another companythat actually specifically to legal
(13:20):
will help you draft pleadings.
They'll help you draftdiscovery documents.
I met even up CEO.
This past summer at a conference, and theyhelp plaintiff personal injury attorneys
take the information about their case,the medical records, what their client has
to say about what happened, and actuallyhelp them craft using AI, a demand
letter, and they put even recommendedhere's what to ask for based on our data.
(13:46):
I think those are some really,neat tools that are out there.
The 1 that I would.
And again you can only do soyou only have so many cycles.
You can only do so many things so fast.
I'm really interested in getting myhands on 1 that's really good at medical
record analysis and summarization.
I know there are some out there.
I actually haven't had achance to test them yet.
But that's pretty interesting because thattends to be a pain point for any law firm
(14:10):
that does personal injury, whether you're
and when you're getting ready for adeposition or whatever it is, trial,
mediation, getting a handle on thoserecords faster can only help you.
Yeah that's really the power.
It's this, type of technology certainlyis not replacing lawyers by any means,
(14:33):
but what it's doing is, providing anincredible tool to serve clients better
to serve them more efficiently and faster.
And that's really what I'm hearing.
And we've talked really around the areaof the practice of law here, but clearly
running a business itself requiresclients and it requires, at least for
a successful business, happy clients.
(14:55):
And part of that is through just how weengage our clientele for any business.
But legal is no different.
You have to manage those clientsand AI it's role in that there are
opportunities that are growing in termsof how to, manage overall perspective
clients and, provide a good experience.
And so I'm curious, have you turnedthat corner within the business?
(15:18):
Have you leveraged AI or tech tobe able to serve clients or provide
wow, experiences in some way?
Yeah, a little bit.
I'd say scratching the surface.
And when I think about.
Let's get out of the kind ofthe litigator in the trenches
and let's talk business owner.
There are all sorts of tools outthere that, you know, even before GPT
(15:42):
offered some really powerful softwaresuites that could help you, with
intake help you track potential leads.
My firm uses HubSpot.
For social media, we use buffer and thesetool now, these tools have layered in
again, probably by hitting open eyes API.
They've started layinglayering in generative AI.
(16:04):
So now you can begin to.
More quickly, easily draft content, right?
And so a lot of us, particularlyattorneys, a lot of attorneys have great
ideas for things that they want to do.
It's just a matter of finding the time towrite that article or the time to write
that LinkedIn post or whatever it may be.
And I think now you can dictateyour notes or type up your notes
(16:29):
real quick and drop them into one ofthese tools, whether it's something
like a buffer or even HubSpot and itwill do a pretty decent first draft.
I think of it as a really fastassistant who is also pretty darn
creative and can throw togethersomething for you really quick based
on the prompts that you give it.
And so the better you get it prompting,the better your results is going to be.
(16:53):
And the other thing that I'veseen, I don't have a need for
this because we represent.
Large companies for the most part.
For attorneys that are doingplaintiff personal injury the chat
bots, in my opinion, used to suck.
I didn't ever want to talk to achat bot, but that is changing
really fast with generative AI.
(17:14):
So the chap, the quality of the chat bot.
Is gotten really, good.
There's companies out there.
Gideon is 1 that I've seen.
There's a couple of other competitorsto that focus a little bit on legal.
And I think there's probably.
That's the 1st step and client intakeand talking to potential clients who
(17:34):
maybe land on your website at midnight.
I think the next step inthe not too distant future.
Is going to be a power intakephone support to where either
making the call or taking the call.
It is actually a power person, right?
And they are part of software andI just saw an article in the last.
(17:59):
2 weeks where someone had alreadystarted using that type of technology.
In politics, and they were makingthousands of calls to potential voters.
and having conversations with these votersas an AI powered call specialist, right?
(18:20):
Like a call support type person.
And so it'll be very interestingto see how that takes off how
potential clients respond to it.
But the quality keepsgetting better and better.
That's what I'm experiencing as well.
Carl.
It's fascinating.
I think right now it's, we're alljust trying To to catch up get used
(18:41):
to it to some degree and naturallyas it becomes more mainstream I think
the consumer base overall will becomemore accepting to it particularly
because it's serving them better It'syou know their time as you mentioned.
I mean on your website should be workingfor your business 24 7 And the more you
(19:02):
can layer on some of this AI technology,just as you're suggesting this, chat bot
the, animation basically creating animatedattorneys of your office and feeding in
your voice, actually you, have the abilityessentially to have your own animation
on your site, answering questions allthe time and that technology is here.
(19:27):
It's really crazy to think because thenext step and whether this happens next
year or the following or within fiveyears, I don't know, the quality of,
we'll call it a deep fake, but thiswould be intentional by an attorney.
We are not too far away fromyou probably being able to take
this podcast recording, right?
It's enough of me talking.
It's enough of you talking to take it.
(19:50):
And say, you know what?
We really like that podcastwith Tanner and Carl.
We want them to do another1 on a different topic.
Here's a prompt.
And all of a sudden, it's just createdwith our boys with our likeness.
And that's a scary thing.
But it's not too.
I think the problem isgoing to be, two things.
One, people being completelyoverwhelmed with too much
(20:13):
information, too much content, andat some point it becomes noise.
So that's going to be a tricky thingto manage in the future for companies
like Consultwebs, for example, thatdoes, that helps with SEO, that
helps with marketing it's how do youleverage AI in a way that doesn't
just, it all ends up just being noise.
And so that's, going tobe interesting to watch.
(20:35):
For me.
When I take, if I take a step back andwe can talk about more tools AI stuff.
I love talking about thosethings, but for me and what I do.
I always say to my to my team, tomy associates, my paralegals, even
when we interview people to comejoin the firm, our job is to find
out the truth for our clients, right?
(20:57):
Is to find out what happened?
Whose fault is it?
How bad was the person injured?
And what's a reasonablevalue, if any, that should be
offered to settle this case?
And that's for me, the faster I can getto that decision and the less expensive
it is for me to get to that decision.
The better and I think where softwareplays into this is software is
(21:21):
going to help us bring down thecost of litigation by making things
that used to take a lot of time,take much, much, less time, right?
It's going to speed it up.
And so like with, that'sone of the things.
From my standpoint, that's 1 ofthe things that kind of inspired me
and prompted me to start scribe A.
I.
is a legal tech company that Istarted last year with a good
(21:43):
friend of mine, Tom Irby, and thegoal there is to help attorneys.
Take depositions and other typesof testimony faster for less money
and get a result the same day.
They take the depositionget a sync transcript.
And it's all about reducingthe cost, making it easier for
(22:04):
attorneys to not have to decide.
Do I want to take this deposition?
Because, I don't know.
Can my client afford it?
It's so expensive to take a deposition,or maybe I've got a hearing next week.
I'm not even going to get theresult unless I pay triple to a
court reporting agency transcript.
And so it's with, software, we can do it.
(22:27):
That's just it.
And really the sky istruly the limit here.
It's a matter of identifyingas a business owner where, are
your key gaps in your business?
Where are you, where are yourinefficiencies and, at least giving you a
starting point because you're right there,there's huge time savings potential here.
And, clearly it's a great wayto serve the client and help
(22:48):
your business in the process.
Yeah.
I think in today's world,speed is not just important.
I would say it's a requirement.
And the world moves really fast.
You can't wait.
For weeks or more to go to the nextstep in your case, because you have some
piece of your machine that's slow, right?
(23:09):
It all needs to be likea well oiled machine.
I had an attorney we were talkingto recently who is a scribe
customer and he put it like thisand I thought it was pretty clever.
He said, look, a lawsuitis not like fine wine.
It does not get better with age.
And his point was.
(23:30):
He wants everyone on his team to as soonas I get a case, this is a plaintiff's
firm in Houston to just dive into thecase and figure out what do we need to do?
What discovery do we need to send?
What depositions do we need totake and let's go do it right?
And don't be afraid to take depositionsjust because of the cost if we
(23:53):
can find a lower cost way to do itand get the results really fast.
1 of the best ways to get.
Okay.
To the core of the case is to just getthe witnesses in the hot seat and put them
under oath and see what they have to say.
And it's been a lot of fun.
Just seeing how I can impact all that.
There's another company that I cameacross lately that I thought was,
this is a really clever use of.
(24:15):
And the name of the company is emotiontrack and what they can do for attorneys
is they can take video depositions and andthe attorneys can package them together.
So you can create videoclips from your depositions.
You can do a little self recordedzoom or something, doing a little
opening statement and emotion track.
(24:37):
We'll take that.
That package.
We'll call it and they will send it.
They'll put it in front of hundreds ofeyeballs and they will actually track the
sentiment like a sentiment analysis of thepeople who are responding and listening
to this evidence and they're able toget, they're able to help you assess.
(24:58):
Credibility of witnesses, but they'realso able to help you assess the value
of your case, which can be pretty,which can be informative, both for
a plaintiff's lawyer, who's tryingto decide what's a demand in a case
as well as a defense lawyer like me,who's trying to help guide my client.
On what's a reasonable amountto pay to resolve this case.
(25:20):
And so there's just again, I thinkwe're tip of the iceberg right now.
There's a lot of companies that aretrying to play in the legal tech space.
And it's just a reallyfun time to be involved in
it.
I'm curious, Carl, you, from your.
Experience in this, like,how are you staying ahead?
How are you testing this software?
How are you learning about it?
(25:40):
Have you found that there are certainconventions you attend to stay up to
date certain, individuals you follow?
What's been your secret?
Yeah, so that's a good question.
My seat's a little uniquebecause I like legal tech a lot
and I'm a legal tech founder.
Some of the companies I mentioned, Imet last year at the legal tech fund.
(26:00):
They had a big conference in Miami.
I wasn't able to go this year.
I had a conflict, but theyactually just had their other
1, which is more focused on.
Who are the up and cominglegal tech companies?
And then there's and otherfunders that are there talking
about kind of hot topics.
So that's 1 of the ways thatI've been exposed to it.
But some of there's othergreat conferences, right?
Clio has a big 1 Clio con everyyear that my firm uses Clio
(26:24):
for case management software.
Association does theirtech show every year.
There's tons of podcasts.
This is one example, but there'sa ton of legal tech podcast.
I think a lot of attorneys willalso just get their recommendations
through word of mouth, right?
We tend to get overwhelmed withemails and email marketing.
(26:45):
Sometimes it gets my attention.
Sometimes it doesn't.
It feels like noise.
I think I had one offer me tobuy me Chick fil A if I would hop
on a zoom call with them aboutsomething, which which was tempting.
Yeah, it got your attention.
Apparently it got my attention.
It got my attention.
I hadn't had anyone offered tobuy me Chick fil A before in that.
(27:05):
Carl I'm grateful for the timeyou shared on the Lawson show.
You've given us a lot of wisdom andI know our listeners are appreciative
as well, any final or closing thoughtsthat you would have for our viewers?
Those interested in this inthe world of AI and tools?
Sure.
A couple things.
So
one anyone who's interested in the scribepiece of this, SKRI b.ai which is a
(27:29):
modern platform for taking depositions,but also for uploading and analyzing.
Your audio and video files inyour case, anyone who's interested
in that, shoot me an email.
It's Carl Krl at scribe sk RIBe.ai, and you'll get a discount for
being a awesome podcast listener.
Give you a complimentary useof the tool so you can kick the
(27:51):
tires and see what it's about.
So that piece I justwanted to mention briefly.
Otherwise, the scribe teamwould kick me if I forgot.
The second part though, isagain, putting my law firm
owner hat on for just a minute.
I think it's important to testbefore you implement some of these
technologies, and I would suggestyou test them yourself and maybe find
(28:12):
1 or 2 or maybe 3 or 4 fellow teammembers that could test them with you.
Because I think the worst.
The worst thing you could do asa law firm owner is just roll out
GPT to your entire staff withoutany training, without any guidance.
If you do that, I think the chancesare you're going to end up in the news
for doing some type of hallucinationis going to come back to bite you.
(28:38):
And not all publicity is goodpublicity and to be frank with you
I think I mentioned earlier, I'mstill in the early testing phase on
a lot of this we haven't rolled outa ton of AI solutions firm wide.
We're trying to figure outwhich 1 is the best 1 for us.
And which 1, can we justify the cost?
The 1 thing we didn't cover and I'lljust end with this thought is some
(29:01):
of these are very expensive tools.
Some of these are very, pricey.
So you have to look at costbenefit analysis and think
about it from the standpoint of.
Is it a pass through expense?
Is this something my client willpay either at the end of the case?
If I'm a plaintiff's attorney or on mymonthly invoice, if I'm doing defense
(29:22):
work, or is this going to be overhead?
And so I think that will play apretty big factor in just how quickly
AI gets adopted in the legal space.
But I'm by no means an expert.
I'm actually studying this stuff.
I want to test more of these softwares.
If anyone's listening that does a softwareand legal tech, shoot me an email.
I'd love to connect.
(29:42):
I'd love to test your platformand give you some feedback.
But it's a lot of fun.
And I think that it's definitelygoing to change the, I don't think
it's going to replace attorneys.
I do think it's goingto reduce the number of.
Support staff that you need.
I'm not like, I don't think you'll laypeople off, but I think once you layer
(30:02):
in some of these solutions, you willbe able to turn your cases faster.
You'll, be able to do more with less.
I guess is what I'm saying.
Thank you for, being the 1out here helping, the legal
profession stay ahead of the curve.
Grateful for your time.
Carl and thank you We'lllook forward to the next one.
Hopefully it'll be us andnot AI that is recreating.
(30:24):
So that's right.
If anybody says anythingcrazy, it's not me.
It must be AI bot.
There's the disclaimer.
Thanks Carl.
Thanks Tanner.
Appreciate it.
Yes, sir.
Take care.
LAWsome by Consultwebs with TannerJones for show notes, links, and info.
Go to Consultwebs.
com slash podcast.
Be sure to subscribeand leave us a review.
(30:45):
Watch for the next LAWsome episode todiscover more breakthrough insights
to build a thriving law firm.
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