How to Build Your Brand the Right Way with Monique Idemudia

Episode Transcript
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Tiffany Youngren (00:00):
Hey there, I'm Tiffany Youngren host of next up

(00:02):
nation where we help podcastersand youtubers with vision become
preeminent thought leaders intheir industries. You are about
to have the incredibleopportunity to listen as we dig
into the why, who and what of apodcaster show. Then at the end,
we're gonna identify onepowerful how one action that she
can take for results in the next30 days. Let's welcome Monique

(00:24):
Idemudia, a host of DragonDigital Marketing Podcast.
Monique, welcome.

Monique Idemudia (00:29):
Hi, thank you so much for having me, Tiffany.
I'm so excited to be here.

Oh, I'm excited to have you as well. I'm
i like i said i was listening toyour show beforehand. So I'm
really excited to dig in. Andjust a little bit about Monique
Dragon Digital Marketing Podcasthas released 49 episodes from
March 13 of 2020 until the dayof this recording, which is June
22 2021. Monique is the founderlike with other marketing agency

(00:58):
with the same name as thepodcast, Dragon digital
marketing, and it's an agencyfor small businesses based in
St. Petersburg, Florida. She isa bright, execution driven
consultant, public speaker andeducator. So Monique, tell me
why did you start Dragon DigitalMarketing podcast?

Yeah, I wanted. So I'm an inbound
marketer, I'm all about contentand publishing that content,
distributing it online, andproviding as much value as I
possibly can for my audience.And I don't do any, you know,
cold outreach, or cold callingadvertising and any of that
stuff. So in the pandemic,everybody was sitting at home,

(01:39):
were locked down. And I wassaving a lot of time, I didn't
have to, you know, commuteanymore. I ordered everything,
literally every little thingonline. I have barely had to
leave the house for anything.And I had so much extra time
when podcasting was just youknow, it's a growing industry
was blowing up in popularity. SoI was like, let me start a

(02:00):
podcast for my digital marketingagency and get into podcasting.
And I haven't regretted it eversince.

That's so I mean, is it? Is it something
that you just did? Because youloved or did you have some kind
of outcome that you wanted outof it? Were you inspired by
something?

Yes. So I just have a lot to talk about, I have
so much content, it helps me torepurpose my content, it helps
me to network and get to knowmore people, I get to interview
great people, I get to be onguests and other people's
podcasts. Like Like I'm a nextup nation right now. I get to
learn so much myself and buildmy online presence and you know,

(02:41):
have another channels so tospeak, that I can use to market
myself and promote my agency andjust be seen as a thought leader
and get out there buildawareness, where people can
discover me, so there's so so somany benefits of being a
podcaster and having a podcast,and it gives me more content, it

(03:04):
helps me with my SEO, it helpsme with so many things. The
benefits of having a podcast forany business are just yeah,
almost endless. So it just madesense. It just clicked. I guess
it was a time issue that I hadinserted it even earlier than
that. But I've always likedlistening to podcasts myself. I

(03:24):
knew kind of like the landscapeand what was out there. I knew
the other marketing podcasts,the most popular ones, and most
of them are for marketers, so Iwanted to, you know, put a
different take on it and makeone that's actually for business
owners and not for marketers.

Oh, I love it. You know, I always I always say
that podcasting is a contentmarketers dream. You know, How
many years did we spend workingwith our clients? You know, we
started as a, you know, web we,we develop websites, and then we
robot blog posts, repurpose theminto social media and into email
campaigns. And it was always amatter of when I would talk to

(04:02):
new clients or potentialclients. They're just like, I
don't know what we would writeabout. And of course, we're
like, oh, well, there are these,you know, this idea and this
idea. But with podcasting, itjust creates itself. It's like
it is just you don't have tocome. The editorial calendar is
so much easy. Like I just feelit before we even help people
with podcasts. We that's how wedid it was without a podcast.

(04:23):
And then when we startedincorporating the podcast, I was
like, Oh my gosh, this is somuch easier. So I love that you
does it sounds like you're kindof in that same space where you
like to organically bring in,you know, attention for your
clients through through content.And so how was that transition?
Did you have that sameexperience where it was just

(04:44):
exciting to have that contentpractically write itself?

Yes, absolutely. Um, a lot of the
times the guests already includetopics that they want to talk
about in their pitches that theysend to you. So you can just
pick your favorite topic thatyou haven't talked about yet, or
you would just, you know like tocover next from the list that
they give you. And everythingjust falls into place. You can

(05:09):
have different episodes, episodeformats, too. So when I am an
expert on the same topic, we canmake it more of like a natural
conversation. And it's like50/50, I talk 50% of the time,
my guest talks 50% of the time,and it's just a conversation.
Whereas when I'm not an expertmyself on the topic, I just take
a step back, and I just ask thequestions, and let the person

(05:33):
talk the entire time and getenlightened myself and learn
something new. and benefit fromit just as my audience would.
And then I take the transcriptsfrom every episode. So it gives
me a blog post essentially, andmore a test content that I can
just put all the way down totweets, basically, I can just

(05:53):
put like one quote or take onesentence or two sentences of it,
make a tweet out of it, make asocial media post out of it for
LinkedIn, Facebook, whatever. Soit's really, really versatile
the amount of content that I cancreate from it. And then I also
always record the video and makeit like a video cast as well.
And I upload the video versionon YouTube. I also embed it on

(06:15):
my website, I create a shownotes page for each of my
episodes, where I put you know,everything that was mentioned,
sometimes people mention handytools that they like, resources,
other websites, statistics,whatever it may be. And I have
the s how notes page. And I alsoalways put a summary there. So
people don't have to take notes,they have like a little

(06:37):
checklists, or actionable tips,exercises, whatever it may be
everything that has been talkedabout. So people can really take
action on it. And they don'tjust feel hyped up, I want to
make it as helpful as I possiblycan. And all of that gives me so
much content, the video gives memore content. Even and I can

(06:58):
take you know, little videosnippets from it that I can also
share on social. I use it for myemail newsletter campaigns a lot
too. So I use the insights thatwe've been talking about in one
of my episodes and make it anemail newsletter. And yes, this
is so many different things.Yeah, do with the content, it's

(07:18):
really great.

Well, good for you for really optimizing that a
lot of times I'm having thisconversation. And I'm always
like, if you don't do anythingelse, like have a blog post, and
I have to say when I looked atyour blog, it is the poster
child of what I think anexcellent show notes is I really
enjoyed being able to scroll tothe bottom and you have you

(07:42):
know, like a list of these arethe 10 things that you should do
based on what we just heard. Andin addition to the story format,
because I feel like you know,some of us are like, give me
just the bullets and some peoplelike that story. And so they
want to hear it. And I feel likeyou do a really good job of
combining that. So very good.And before we talked before we
spoke, you had said that whatyou want from your show is brand

(08:06):
awareness, authority and thoughtleadership. Um, in fact, I think
in one of your episodes youcoined, what was it? There's
like a acronym, there's eta, orwhat was the Oh, yes, yeah. See,
expertise, authority and trust?Yes. Excellent. Why do you think
that that's so important.

Um, it just helps people to get to know you
better. And, you know, people dobusiness with people. So it's
not about you know, the brandname or the company name, but we
always want to know who's theperson who's the face behind
that logo, or behind that, youknow, company name behind that
brand. So we want to get to knowthe person. And it's important,

(08:46):
not just that the person, youknow, is real and authentic and
sympathetic to us. But you alsoneed to know that they're
trustworthy. Are they actuallyan expert on what they claim to
be an expert in? So is there anyproof of their expertise? Do
they have any content out therethat backs it up? Is there
social proof? You know, doesthat person have any media

(09:09):
appearances, online presence,all those kinds of things. And
that is just like a prerequisiteto make people trust you.
Because it's an online world,most people don't get the
opportunity to meet you in reallife in person. So that's all if
they have if they perform aGoogle search for you, you know
what comes up when they do that.So you need to build trust

(09:32):
digitally, so to speak, andcontent marketing is the way to
do it. And if you're reallyreally good at it, you become an
authority in your field overtime. So you're not just
trustworthy and you're not justyou know, an expert, but you're
also an authority and like thego to resource. What's your
website look like? Are you likea content hub of all different

(09:56):
things like blog posts podcastepisodes videos, other
collaboration, conference talks,speeches that you given, and all
the different media that you'vebeen featured in. And people can
see that and you're a trustedresource that your you know, the
people in your audience come to,to learn to, you know, just get

(10:18):
value, get their questionsanswered, get their problem
solved, and just, you know, findhelp. And that's what you want
to achieve. And that helps youin almost any regard than the
acronym eat, or EA T, actuallycomes from the SEO space,
because that's what Google wantsto see, when they rank a website

(10:39):
on top of the search results.They don't want to you know,
leave their own users, Google'susers to spammy shady websites,
where people claim things thatare not proven and you know,
give, I don't know, phonyadvice, or whatever. We're
whatever it might be to uspeople or get their money, scam,

(11:00):
dumb, so many different things,websites that are not secure
websites that load slowly, allthose kinds of things. So they
want to make sure that only thebest of the best pages rank and
ETS a huge factor in that. Andyou own you can only prove it
over time. And that's why it'sso important. Yeah.

Well, and so let's kind of move on to to like
who it is that you serve youwhat you just said, I'm a mat
use, you know, you mentionedthat your small business owners
like that's who your primaryaudience is. And I like on
behalf of small business owners,that sounded overwhelming.
Honestly, like, there's a lot ofstuff out there. But I'm sure
that you're I mean, I'velistened to you and I've seen

(11:44):
your website, like there's anapproach to it to build on to
the different pieces, but justgetting it out there. And
really, the first thing comesdown to who you're speaking to,
I you know, you're so good attarget audiences. So I'm
imagining that you probably haveit pretty pinned down to what
kind of small businesses thatyou work with, can you share
that a little bit.

Um, so our agency dragon digital marketing
is for small businesses, andeverything is designed for small
businesses. Small businesses isbasically every business that
has less than 200 employees. Andwe target businesses that really
want to grow, they really wantto grow and scale, they don't
want to be small anymore. Andsmall doesn't mean you know,

(12:28):
adding a lot of people andadding a lot of employees, you
can be even a one personbusiness and generate millions
of dollars every year and bereally successful. So the size
is up, you know, comes also downto the revenue. And that's
business owners who reallybelieve in marketing and believe
in being inbound and providingvalue and creating content and

(12:49):
attracting people to themorganically because they trust
and their products and services.They know that they're superior.
And their challenge is to letthe world know and make people
see how amazing it is that theydo. And yeah, basically attract
people to them organically growtheir online presence. And they

(13:11):
don't believe in growing solelythrough, you know, being
intrusive, advertising, cold,emailing cold, LinkedIn, direct
messaging, cold calling all ofall of those methods. They don't
want to be seen as that becauseit doesn't fit their philosophy
and their brand and what theywant to do. So that's, that's

(13:34):
who we focus on in a nutshell.most business owners are not
younger people, they're older,they're like in the boomer
generation, they're not reallytechnical. So they're easily
overwhelmed by technical stuff.And there's a lot of technical
stuff in digital marketing. Soyeah, that's what that's what we
help people with basically.

Yeah. Okay. Well, and I know you mentioned
in there about, you know, thatthem having trouble being sent
you seen as being a challenge.So in your words, what problem
do you solve for the people whoare specifically listening to
your show? And I'm, I mean, andlet's just clarify to are the
people listening to your show?are you imagining that's the

(14:16):
same audience that you work withfor your business?

Yes, exactly. Yeah, that's the goal. So that's
what all of our content servesto. There might be other like,
if you imagine your targetaudience and you imagine like
this, like this target like thisbull's eye, the content is
created for the center point forfor the perfect ideal target
customer, but automatically,you're going to attract people

(14:44):
in the circles around thatperson. So there might be the
you know, one or one or a coupleof marketers listening to or
other people or people fromother countries because we focus
on solely the United Statesmarket at this point but our
target audience our core targetaudience, our ideal customers,

(15:05):
as well. So it's all tailored tothem. And the basic problem that
we help people solve is to beseen by the right people and say
the right things to the rightpeople, and be at the right
places. Where are the peoplethat you want to reach, hang out
and create content thatbasically solves their problems,

(15:31):
answers their questions, handlestheir objections, and just
educates them and inspires them,informs them about what they
need to know some people are noteven problem aware yet. So
you'd have to start from thevery basics. So the basics, as
you've already said, is todefine the target audience and

(15:51):
to create by your personas, thatis the very first step before
you can do anything you need toknow. Okay, who are the people
who I want to reach in the firstplace? What do they like? What
do they don't like that much?Where do they hang out? what
purpose do they hang out incertain places for and then you
decide, okay, in order to reachmy goals, I have to be on social

(16:14):
media platforms XYZ, I have tocreate XYZ content, and just
reverse engineer it that way.And really, really serve those
people. And that's how youbecome successful. And that's
what we help clients to do inthe digital and online world.
Love it. Love it.

One thing that you said on your podcast was
that you want to help peoplecontinue the conversation, their
ideal clients having already andjust continue that conversation
with what they're saying. Ithought that was really

Exactly you want to join the conversation
already going on back yourcustomers head. Yeah,

right. Exactly. And really, it's funny,
because podcasting is exactlythe same way we call it, you
know, in marketing, you know,I've done a lot of, you know,
avatars, you know, before, aftergrids, you know, transformation
statements. But with podcasting,a lot of times I found that
marketers skip that. And it'slike, and we call the audience
promise. So like, if someonelistens to your show over the

(17:13):
course of a year, whattransformation Do you expect
that they'll have, even if theynever work for you work with
you. And so it's reallyinteresting to hear. And it's
nice when we're doing a showthat's congruent with what we do
for a living, because it's easy,right? You're already on track.
To do that you don't have tocreate this whole other persona,
you don't have to create thiswhole new transformation. It's

(17:34):
really a continuation of it. SoI think it seems like that's
what your show is and how you'veapproached it. So you've been
podcasting for over a year? Whathave you been getting feedback?
Specifically, I want to know,have you had ways to evaluate
your content? And really lookedat? Is it resonating? Have you

(17:57):
made adjustment based on thatfeedback?

Yes. So obviously, I look at the stats,
and I see correlations of whattopics people like the most and
which episodes are the mostlistened to and the most
downloaded. And when you knowwhich ones do not get as many
listens, and as many downloads.And Funny enough, copywriting is
my number one most populartopic. So whenever I publish

(18:25):
something about copywriting,people just like it a lot. And a
lot of people struggle withwriting. And you know, making it
beginner friendly. For peoplewho are not industry experts
like themselves, we tend to use,you know, jargon and just
technical terms, because that'show we speak on a day to day
basis. But a lot of peoplestruggle with breaking it down.

(18:48):
And there's this quote fromAlbert Einstein that basically
says, If you can't explain itfor a little child, you don't
even understand it yourself. Sothat's a key point that we do to
really, really break it downinto simple terms. And there is
a concept, there's a structurethat each and every episode
follows. So whenever I have anexpert on my show about a simple

(19:10):
about a certain topic, it startswith a quick question, what is
blank? Why is blank important?Why should small business owners
even care about implementing it?And then we start with, you
know, with some myths,basically, it's not just for
large businesses, you do notneed a million dollar marketing
budget to realize it. There'ssmall and simple steps that you

(19:33):
can take today that are alreadygoing to make a huge difference,
because your chances are youcompetitors are not doing that
already. Because they'reparalyzed themselves and they
believe you know, all of themess and false false beliefs
that are around there or theyjust have analysis paralysis,
and they're overwhelmed with thetechnical stuff. They don't know

(19:53):
who to ask or who to hire. Theymaybe had bad experiences before
because they just wanted to workwith somebody in Fiverr and
realized that's maybe not thequality of work that they need,
and then it goes into the How topart. And that is actionable
steps, step one, this is whatyou have to do first step two,
this is what you have to donext, and so on and so forth.

(20:15):
And it basically becomes a list.And that's the list that you've
talked about that I always putin the show notes that people
can see at a glance, andexecute, and there's always it
has to be action packed. Itcan't just be you know, bla bla
bla bla bla, two people aretalking and then you don't know
what the takeaway is that makeit very, very clear what the

(20:36):
takeaway is, I have people youknow, include exercises, or
specific action steps that theycan take, I offer help a lot of
the times I have a template, ora value added guide, or a
checklist or whatever myselfthat I offer, that will be my
lead magnet for the episodethen. So every single episode
offers a lead magnet as well,that they can download directly

(21:00):
on the show notes page for free,and then join my email list. And
that's what I do. And then inthe end, I give the guests a
chance to talk about themselvesand talk about you know, their
business, promote their newbook, or course or whatever it
may be. So they got a couple,they got got a couple of minutes

(21:20):
that they can do it in the end.But that's not the main focus of
the episodes. And none of theepisodes really focus on the
person and their backgroundstory and what the name of their
dog is. And nobody really talksabout. So we get to the meat and
potatoes right away. There isalways a teaser, which is
basically a compilation ofhighlights throughout the

(21:42):
episode that I put in the verybeginning even before the intro,
so people just know what toexpect. And they listen to the
entire episode. And you know,they don't waste the first two,
three minutes with hearing theintro music and and Hi, my name
is Monique Idemudia. I'm yourhost and you're listening to
episode number da-da-da and thisis the dragon digital marketing,

(22:02):
podcast and flow. You know,that's just boring people people
have short attention spans sogive them some value in the
very, very beginning. And that'skind of the recipe that I
follow, I get some really goodfeedback from it. Because it's
really for people to learn. Andit's not for, you know, people
to get all hyped up about what'spossible. And then they still

(22:24):
don't take any action on it. SoI want people to take action on
it. And I make it as easy aspossible for people to take
action on it. A lot of theepisodes have a summary in the
end as well where put everythingin a nutshell again and sum it
all up if it's been a whole lot,and it's been a really long,
comprehensive episode. Sothere's really no excuse. And

(22:47):
that's the transformationprocess. I take a person from a
novice at any given topic, and Imake them educated enough and
dangerous enough so to speak. Sothey can do it themselves on a
very basic level, they canimplement some stuff themselves,
they can give it to somebody ontheir team. And they have enough
knowledge to know what to lookfor when hiring a consultant or

(23:10):
a digital marketing agency to doit for them. And it's no longer
just this mystery for them, theyget the basics. And each episode
is also about just one specifictopic. So we talk about just
video marketing, or pressrelease marketing or buyer
persona marketing, or you know,podcast marketing, whatever it

(23:31):
may be in one episode, and we donot jump, you know, from topic
to topic within the sameepisode. So it's really, um,
yeah, basically categorize forthe different channels so people
can know what to expect whenthey're looking to implement a
certain thing in their business.And they really know what they

(23:52):
get. So yeah, you basicallyscroll through the episode
titles, and you instantly knowwhat you're going to get. It's
not clickbait, it's not, youknow, a mysterious title that
you not really know. So you canjump in and they're all
evergreen. So if you want tolearn about a topic that I've
published a couple of monthsago, you can see that from the
episode title, and it's stillgonna be really, really relevant

(24:14):
for you. And you do not have to,you know, worry about just that
just the latest episode thathave been released matter or
something like that. So it'sreally a long term resource that
I building there.

Yeah, that's great. So that kind of leads me
to another question is with somany so many marketing podcast
because you said it yourself?Like, it seems like most I mean,
it's probably not I don't knowif it's true, but it to a
marketer, it seems like it'smostly marketing podcasts that
are available. What is yourunique value proposition?

Yeah, my unit in a nutshell, my unique value
proposition is that it's apodcast for small business
owners and not for marketers,and I teach small business
owners do digital marketingstrategies and tactics that they
can implement in their own smallbusiness and they can do it
themselves. And I break it down,I make it very, very simple. And

(25:12):
I don't confuse them with jargonor technical terms, and I give
them actionable steps. And it'svery concise, and there's
basically no fluff about it.

Okay and so as you have you gotten feedback,
like directly on your show fromlisteners, or has it mostly been
looking at the data?

Oh, both both. Yeah, sometimes I get messages
on social media, or just commentunderneath my content that
people really liked it and it'shelped them out and they learn
something. Sometimes peoplereply to my newsletter, which I
also always really, really like.That's also a tip that I can
give you don't use like a noreply email, or any generic
email that people can't respondto. But really encourage a

(25:54):
conversation and, you know,allow people to give you
feedback. So yeah, I get thereare some times when I just meet
people on a networking event,and they're like, Hey, I tuned
into your podcast, I reallyliked it. So yeah. And the rest
is from stats. I would say,though, that it's more from
actual people. And I also caremore about the advice that I get

(26:17):
from people directly, then fromthe podcasting stats, just
because the stats are not asadvanced when it comes to
podcasting, yet, you can't seeyou know, as many things as your
website, website analytics, orother analytics, tools, social
media, analytics, etc, give youit's very, very basic as of now.
Yeah.

Unless you unless you do some really
advanced tricks in thebackground and eBuy it's
unreliable. So what I'm, I haveto ask to your really good about
your call to action? What hasbeen your capture rate? Like?
How many leads Would you saythat you get from your call to

(26:57):
action? Which is your buyerpersona worksheet? Right? Isn't
that right? Is that you,

um, most of the time, most of the time,
because it's so fundamental, andeverything builds on knowing
your audience. And most of thetime, it's our free buyer
persona template that I use as alead magnet. But there's other
lead magnets too, depending onthe topic, there is a free email
marketing campaign planningcalendar, there's an SEO
checklist. For branding relatedtopics, I have a free brand new

(27:27):
course called brand story, howyou can basically build a brand
and tell your story and yourstories, what makes your brand
unique, and how you stand outfrom your competitors. So
there's a there's a bunch ofthings, um, the podcast is
actually, the, if you look atit, from a surface level, the

(27:47):
least effective lead generationmechanism that I have in my
business, it's still a good one,and I'll continue to pursue it.
But there's definitely so ifyou're doing if you're trying to
do a podcast just for leadgeneration, and don't do it if
that's your main goal. Butthere's so so many other
benefits from it. The mainbenefits from podcasting is not

(28:10):
lead generation, it's reallybuilding your online presence,
the content that you get fromit, the content marketing
benefits, and the networkingbenefits that you get from all
of the people that you need, andthat you get in touch with.
Because if you had aconversation, and you sat down
with a person for an hour, it'snot like those, you know, empty

(28:31):
connections that you just havesitting around their LinkedIn,
but you don't really know theperson, you're not really
connected, you haven't ever, youknow, really connected. Anyways.
So that's what podcasting opensa lot of doors for you, it makes
your platform more interestingfor a lot of people, when you
can create that win winsituation, and they get

(28:54):
something out of it, which is,you know, more exposure for
them. Maybe it's a backlink fortheir SEO, just though, you
know, mention them online,whatever it may be. So that's
what podcasting is the mostpowerful for, for lead
generation, it is stilleffective. But there's other
things that you'd probablyrather want to do if that's your

(29:17):
main goal

well, and money to let me just, I just
want to kind of back up to like,what I'm trying to do right now
is establish like a baseline oflike, these are the things that
you're doing so that when wemove into the next part, I'm not
making assumptions, because Iknow there are like a million
things that you're doing andyou're just getting so much out
of it. But they're alwaysindicators. And one of the cool
things is I've done a lot ofthese hot seats, and I'm able to

(29:39):
see some trends. And so byunderstanding the lead side of
it, sometimes I mean, I'veliterally had podcasters come on
and they're getting leads likecrazy, I mean hand over fist.
And I've one thing that I foundtoo is that when we treat our
podcasts like a landing page,it's amazing because Then it's

(30:00):
just a matter of like, is thatthe format? Is it that, you
know, they're not listening toit as far in as our call to
action is, you know, and then isour call to action? The
headline, you know, I know youhad a writer on recently, and
that's what they said, you know,we spend more time on our
headline than on the content.And so it's really helpful for
me to ask all these questions.I, I, you know, there are

(30:20):
personally I'm like, yeah, I'mlike, I'm with you. It's like
relationships, the number onething, there is nothing that I
get out of podcasting that Ivalue and cherish more than the
people I meet on the show. Andthe people who reach out after
the show, I mean, there if Ididn't get anything else I that
would be enough for me, youknow? So I 1,000% agree with?

Absolutely, yeah, me too. I agree. And then
networking and relationshipbenefits are the base one.
Everything is basically what youmake it you know, how you how
you design it from the get goand what you want out of it, and
then you can use it for whateveryou want to use it. It's more
like, you know, reinforcingcertain things. And making

(31:05):
people feel better that they'vemade the right decision, because
it's another it's another pointwhere I can showcase my
expertise on and it just, youknow, help people to feel
better. And to just bereassured, so to speak. Hello.
That's what I think it helpswith the most it's really 80.
Yeah. But again, yeah, dependson the podcast. You're right.

That's awesome. Okay, so and I know
you've we've talked about yourblog, and you've got a really
amazing social media strategy.And have you joined any online
groups or forums that werecreated, like for businesses who
are trying to, to, you know, getbetter at marketing or just

(31:50):
entrepreneurial sites ingeneral? And just answer
questions and kind of be thereas a Have you kind of engaged in
anything like that to get known.And eventually, I know, none of
us want to be salesy on thegroup. So we're, you know,
providing so I and I know yourapproach. So I'm assuming you're
the same way, but have you gonein and, and done much of that to

(32:12):
become more of a presence andmake people more aware of your
brand? Right? Yeah,

absolutely. Absolutely. I'm in a couple of
groups. I'm in a bunch of groupson LinkedIn. I'm also a member
of the C suite network, which isa network for entrepreneurs and
business owners basically see Clevel executives to network and
to help each other out, answereach other's questions, you find

(32:38):
content collaboration, there,everything you need, basically.
And my approach is not to besalesy, obviously, but all I
have to do is basically getpeople to follow me and to
connect with me, because if theydo that, they'll see my content.
And I post daily on everynetwork that I'm on. So content

(32:59):
is really everything if you'rean inbound marketer, and you
don't focus on outboundmarketing, and then I'm
automatically on their radar.And I can automatically stay top
of mind with my content, andthey'll see the value in it,
they see the knowledge and Ihave the expertise that I can
bring to the table. And thenover time, it can be weeks, it

(33:19):
can be months for some for somepeople, but they make that
connection in their headthemselves. And they come to
that realization themselves. Idon't have to brag about myself,
because nobody, you know, likesdoing that, and telling people
Oh, I'm so great, I've won this.And that award, I've achieved
this in that it's so much betterand more effective if they can

(33:40):
see for themselves. And in theirown pace that is so important
too. So they can stop me if theywant to. There's enough content
out there for that. But they canalso let it you know, flow as
well. And whenever it will be itwill be and you're still cycle
gets a lot longer if you do thatstrategy. But the quality of all

(34:05):
of your interactions, and whatyou build your business on, and
your brand is just so muchbetter. And it's more pleasant,
and it's just more positive andall the feedback that you get
and all the interactions. Sothat's how I approach it.
Basically, I help people out andanswer their question. And all
of those groups, I try toprovide as much value as I

(34:26):
possibly can. And then I say,hey, let's connect on LinkedIn.
And most of the people the vastmajority of the people obviously
say yes, because who has, youknow, something against
connecting with somebody onLinkedIn? And then that's how
everything starts. A fan.LinkedIn is also because I'm in
b2b. It's a very, very importantchannel for me personally for

(34:47):
you, it might be something else.But um, so yeah, so that's how I
approach it.

Yeah, LinkedIn is great. That's, well, that's
good. That's so good. And sowhen you invite people onto your
show as a guest How do youdetermine who you want? Like? Do
you just put a call out there?Or do you? Do you like have a
list of people? And then youreach out to them? How, what is
your approach? Just?

Yeah, sure. So that is all inbound to all the
people reach out to me, I get somany different pitches every
single day on social by email,then there are those agencies
out there that are podcastingagencies, basically. And they're
pitching their clients to me asguests. And I just look through

(35:31):
the pitches. And if it's a goodpitch, I have all the
information that I need toalready get their bio on the
page with their expert in sometopic suggestions, social media
links, links to episodes thatthey've been a guest on before.
So I can like really check themout and see what what kind of
value they can add, if they're,you know, a good fit. And that's

(35:53):
how I decide and then I'll justbasically reply, hi, I think
you're a great fit. Here's myschedule. With scheduling link,
you can grab the time. Andthat's it, basically. So it's
really, really simple. There'sno back and forth or whatever. A
lot of people have a podcast,one sheet, which is like a
resume with their most importantinformation that also includes a

(36:15):
headshot of them. So it has thatfor my episode thumbnails as
well. So you already haveeverything that you need right
off the bat, basically, there'salso those matchmaking platforms
like PatMatch and matchmaker.fm, where you can find guests, I
had profiles created there. Andthe beginning when I just
started my podcast, I havedeactivated them now, because

(36:38):
it's been so much like I'mgetting so much that I don't
even have to, you know, activelylook for guests anymore. So
yeah, so podcasting is reallyblowing up right now. And it's
on its way to become a billiondollar industry. So if you're
looking to start a podcast, youdo not have to worry about you
know, finding no guests anymore.I will not gonna be one of your

(37:01):
problems is going to be theleast of your problem.

And I have to say like, and I and I say this
all the time, but it seems likeovernight, it went from 550,000
to 2 million over 2 millionpodcasts. And, you know, three
out of every five quits. Sothere's that too. But even with
that, when when the pandemic,you know, I was podcasting. In
fact, I wrote a book based oninterviews before podcasting was
a thing. And then when podcastcame out, I'm like, I love

(37:26):
interviewing people, like I loveputting them on a platform, and
you know, like extracting howgenius they're like, it's my
favorite thing. And so I justdid a marketing podcast for
small business owners, calledchat and grow. And it was just
so much fun. And then I startedanother one, because someone had
given me the idea of, you know,interviewing people who are in
my ideal audience. And so I wasmeeting clients and

(37:49):
collaborators and, and alsoscreening out people I didn't
want to work, and things likethat. And, and but I still is
doing content marketing, as Iwas, as I had started to do from
the beginning. And then when thepandemic came, I had multiple
coaches and mentors just belike, yeah, you should go show
people how you're doing this,because you're similar to what

(38:12):
you're doing. It's like, youknow, multiplying the content, I
had a system and VA is and allthese things, and they're like,
you should show people how to dothat. And, um, but it just
seemed like, right at that pointwhere everybody got into it, it
seemed like everybody waspodcasting. Everybody was giving
people advice on podcasting,even if they had just gotten
into it. Like it was their firstpodcast. And, you know, in the

(38:34):
first two months, they had100,000 people, did they have
sales? No, did they know any ofthe people? No. So I was always
one of those. Like, if you'renot building relationships, it's
just not worth it to, you know,right. And so I just, I kind of
almost was like, why did Idecide to, you know, go,
podcasting. I liked it so muchbetter when I wasn't a pot, you
know, like I was just podcastingfor myself. But what I love is

(38:58):
right now, I feel like there's anew transformation happening.
And there's a lot more interest,kind of more away from the
commercialization of it and awayfrom, you know, at first,
everybody wanted the first100,000 500,000 downloads that
it took to make 20 bucks amonth, you know, I mean, and it
was like, I like that's not whyI podcast, I can't help you, you

(39:20):
know. And so that way, I'mpodcasting. And so, but now,
like what you're talking aboutwhere people are starting to
come back to I just want to beon everybody's show. I just want
to get out there and do it.They're valuing, getting help to
do it and things like that. So Ifeel like there's more of a true
podcasting culture, formulatingthen in the big, you know,

(39:44):
explosion that happened earlyon, have you do you? I mean, I
know you got into it right aboutat that March point. And I don't
want to get too in the weedsbecause I want to make sure to
keep my promise to you. But justreal briefly, like do you have
you seen anything like that orhave you As a culture shift
again in this industry, yes,absolutely

the good will survive is to say what
everything. So a lot of peopleget into something because they
want to hop on a trend. Theywant to make quick money, they
want to make a quick buck.They're just, you know, I'll
live for the hype or whatever.But they're not serious about
it. They don't love podcastingas a medium. They don't want to,
you know, genuinely buildrelationships and do it for the

(40:26):
love of it. So they'll eithernot be successful in the long
run, or they'll just give up.I've heard what's the statistic
again, like most podcasts, don'teven have their first 10
episodes or whatever. So rightmost people wait. Yeah.

It's called pod fade. And yes, yeah. I
remember at 550,000 podcasts podfade happen at seven episodes.

Seven. Yeah, right. I know, under 10. It's
crazy.

Just now told me it's 12. But I think that
that's because it became morepopular to release more in the
beginning. Like for myself, I'mlike, okay, so pod fades at 12.
We launched this with 12episodes, and honestly, our
first 12 episodes of next stepnation was what we had until
just recently, because we'vebeen, like testing, I always
say, like, My show is thetesting ground. And so, but even

(41:16):
with that, you know, now we havelike, 30 episodes that we're
gonna, like, push out in thenext couple months, but you
know, it definitely is a thing.I'm just glad that it's, it's
coming back around. Andultimately, as an industry, the
content is what needs to matter.I feel like, you know, the why.
And our approach to it createsthat, like, it's a it's a

(41:39):
indicator of the heart behindit. But ultimately, at the end
of the day, what listeners careabout is do I want to listen to
the content. So anyway, soagain, I don't absolutely I
could talk about that all day,cuz I'm guessing, but I, you
know, let's kind of I just, Ihave kind of these bullet
questions for you. And then wecan kind of move into this next

(41:59):
part. So I'm just gonna ask youa few questions, just to kind of
clarify a few things. Um, so Igot an idea of who your guests
are that you bring on. Andusually they're specialists just
to clarify, is that right? Likethey're people who are experts
in your in the realm? what iwhat i say it's like, you share
an audience, but you don'tdirectly compete with each
other.

Yes, exactly. Yeah. So I invite subject matter
experts on the top they sent myepisode is about each episode is
on one specific topic. And thenI asked them the right
questions. And I asked themreally simple questions. So they
don't even get to, you know, getgoing on their high level, but
they're really keeping it reallysimple. And I yeah, I basically,

(42:43):
I'm the moderator, I make surethat it really stays. Yeah,
small business owners should beable to comprehend it, and get
actionable takeaways from it andnot be overwhelmed. That is the
worst case scenario that I wantto avoid at all costs to have
people more confused. Yeah, willWellman paralyze Them before

(43:05):
they were listening?

Yeah, for sure. That's why I'm not allowed
to talk about SEO, because Ifeel like I want I want my
listeners to be able to hearwhat I'm saying. But if I start
talking about SEO, lookout, it'snot going to be fun for anybody
to have an assistant I'd belike, Okay, can you just could
you listen to me for like fiveminutes, I want to talk to you
about this really great tool forlike, it was about metadata or
something. And she's just like,fine. It's just like, get to go

(43:29):
off about the solution that Ifound. So yeah, yeah, I feel
you. So I think it's really goodthat you keep it approachable,
and can you know, consumable byyour audience? And so just real
quick, do you? Do you pick thetopics? Or do you filter through
the guests and decide who whatthe topics will be based on the

(43:49):
experts that are coming to you?

That's upon sometimes people recommend
really amazing topics, forexample, the press release
marketing episode that Ipopulation that you enjoyed very
much. My guest, Mickey Kennedy,he basically proposed a topic to
me and I was like, Oh, great.Yeah, let's talk about that. And
sometimes it's me who proposes atopic. So it really it really

(44:11):
depends on how the rightdecision suggestions are. And
it's also very subjective. Youknow, maybe I've already
published an episode. You know,the week prior to that about the
same topic that I don't need totalk about that again, but if
they're an expert, and they'resuper knowledgeable, I'm happy
to still have them on the showand just talk about something
else. So it really it reallydepends. Yeah.

Okay, awesome. And, um, so also, I want to kind
of just real quickly ask youabout your audience. If you
don't mind. Like, I have threeparts to this. What is your
audience like? What is the sizeof your audience, as you would
estimate it based on the crappystatistics that were provided
with and that could include youknow, your website gets this

(44:54):
much your YouTube gets this muchyour podcast gets about this
many downloads, what platformgets the most. And what gets
them there? What have you founda few picks one way, what has
been the most effective way toget them there?

As the way website, I would say is my is
definitely my vote most valuabledigital asset, because it's the
main driver of revenue, andthere's everything on there. So
the website bundles, all of thecontent that I created that I
put out there, then social mediais really important for me,

(45:29):
which is LinkedIn, and then myemail list. So those are
definitely the top three. Andthen after that, it's my blog,
and my podcast, and my onlinecourse. Um, yeah,

so what is your audience size, would you
say?

It's about a million people and about 10,000
people are in the very core ofit 10 to 10,000, businesses are
at the very core bit better,like the very ideal clients,
which means really smallbusinesses with over
proportionally high revenue. Sothey got the budget to spend,

(46:09):
and they can do the most things.And they just need a strategy
and plan of action that istailored to them, not a cookie
cutter template of a whateverstandard funnel that you can buy
out there, but really want towork with me as a consultant.
And I can analyze the situationrecommend what's best for them.
And we can implement it without,you know, having to Penny pinch,

(46:33):
so to speak. And so when you didthey have experience with
marketing, and they feel thatinbound philosophy, they believe
in the philosophy of doingbusiness by being human and
personal will and providingvalue, and they're not even
interested in going down thatold school route? So that is
really important to Well,

let me clarify, how many downloads Do
you get per month, let's say orwithin the first seven days,
however you measure it? And howlike, how many visits? Do you
have your website's? Like, howbig is your literal audience?
Like people listening andwatching you?

Yeah, the podcast is around 1000. The
whack The website is around five6000. Okay. And social media all
combined is maybe like 7000.Awesome, awesome. So it's not
super large. But it's verytargeted. That's,

that's actually really, really good.
You know, a lot of times, youknow, I, you know, in
podcasting, it's so funny forbeing an industry where the
statistics are so unreliable,they're always changing the
metrics to they're like, Oh, youhave to find out, like, how many
listens you get in the firstseven days, then it's the first
then it's the first 30 days,then it's back to the first
seven days. I mean, if you talkto 10, podcasters, they've had

(47:51):
advice all across the spectrum.And I do and I always say, like,
at the end of the day, we justhave to look at trends, you
know, because a download, if youreally look at it, you have you
really don't know what that is,like it could be they listen to,
you know, it's different. Idon't know, there's just so many
different variables. So

I love to see how long people are exactly
listening. And when you have thebiggest jump off and like, as
you can do with your videoanalytics, basically, for your
podcasts,

well, and you can use analytic tools to do
that, and put those special, youknow, attribution links in there
and things like that. Which, ifit were further, we're all
guinea pigs right now. So eventhat I feel like Well, I mean,
we could, you know, hiresomebody to do that. But let's
just focus on producing it andwatching trends. So I and I, and

(48:46):
I do believe we're getting rightinto that space of the big boys
understanding how to do itinternally, because I feel like
that's what the market demandsisn't. You know, I mean, the
awesome, brilliant geeky peoplewho can do that, I think will go
out and and hustle that but Ithink the rest of us are just

(49:08):
gonna be like, no big boys. Youguys are just gonna figure this
out. Like, this is why we don'tdo free hosting, you know, so,
and I and I do think there it'sso much improved. So I'll say

yes. And it's improving really fast already.
So there's already so many morethings that you can measure
right now. Versus like, even sixmonths ago. So Exactly. It's
definitely improving. That'strue.

Well, and I'm on Lipson, and it's actually
getting pretty, I never thoughtthat would happen. Like I've
been with Lipson since day one.And I'm like, Wow, this looks
like one of the originalwebsites of the world of the
internet. And, um, but they haveit in kind of beta where you can
opt to go over to their newplatform, and it's really
pretty, so I will I will justgive them a little shout out

(49:56):
that they're doing a great jobthere. But um, so would you
consider You're just going toask me like, four more questions
would you want is would youconsider your show profitable?
If someone asked you thatquestion? Well, I guess I just
did. But

yeah, it's a it's a tough ROI to measure, I
would say yes. But I can'tpinpoint it down to a specific
value like this is how much itcosts me to produce an episode.
And this is what every episodeon average, returns to me in
revenue or in profit. But it'sreally one more element of my

(50:32):
online presence that I can useas like an anchor point to
delight and nurture my audience,basically. And they turn to
clients over time, and it's morecontent, and I repurpose it
across all the other channelsthat I'm using, basically. So
it's definitely profitable. It'sbenefiting me on so many levels.

(50:52):
So again, I would say yes, butit's not a numbers value. It's
just very qualitatively Yeah.

Well, it's a marketing play. Like I always
try to tell people, you know,just like you would hire a
marketing company, it's it'sevaluating ROI like that. I
mean, I will say, I mean, we dohave ways to, to profit without
hurting the content, things likethat. But it's also just
legitimate as a free standingmarketing play for sure. So do

(51:22):
you do all the production andthe promotion yourself? Or do
you delegate,

I do sell myself and I delegate some of
it. So social media marketing, Idelegate most of it. I'm the
scheduling and evaluating whichguests I want on the show, I do
all of it myself, I look at allof the people myself, and I look
at their, you know, socialprofiles and online presences.

(51:47):
And then I determine if they'rea good fit or not. I'm editing,
cutting and stuff like that. Itdepends. I still do a lot myself
though, with editing style thatI just like, and I'm more happy
when I so whenever I have time,and I can free up time I
leverage marketing automation alot in my business. Yeah. So

(52:09):
when I came free,

it's a great assistant, don't you think?
person you know, and if and ifthat assistant messes up? It's
my fault. Yeah, it helps me whenI hire humans, because I'm like,
oh, was that my fault? Wait, no,was it? Yeah. Right. Was I
supposed to Yeah. So you know,it's really uh, you know,

(52:31):
manager helper. Also, I love it.I love it that you do
automation, too. I'm such anautomation geek. That's the
other thing I shouldn't probablytalk about too much. So you do
some of the editing and thecutting and things like that. Or
sometimes you delegate it,whoever you're writing.

Um, that is almost all outsourced or
delegated, or I have a lot ofguest bloggers and guest
contributors people that reachout to me, and I have a look at
their content. And sometimes,you know, it's super low
quality. And then I tell them,it's not a good fit for lack.
And sometimes it's reallyamazing. And I also work with a
lot of agencies when it comes tothat. So there's a lot of like,

(53:09):
blog, blogger, outreach agenciesand content marketing agencies
that are writing really, reallygreat research articles with
great sources and you know,everything and I can literally
almost just copy and paste itand put it on my blog and their
client gets a backlink. And Ihave fresh content, and we're
all happy. But I also do someblogging myself, okay, started

(53:30):
doing all of the bloggingmyself, when I launched a blog,
I have written all of thearticles, but now it's like, mix
and match. And I love also thatI get to focus on the things
that I love doing the most. Soyeah, other other people can do
the writing. And I really lovethe podcasting and filming
videos more than more thanwriting. Yeah, content creation.

Well, and before this interview, I had
asked you if you would ratherfocus on preeminence or profit,
because I feel like I want tomake sure that when we're
talking about it, we'reoptimizing our time. But I
always talk about both becauseit's hard to get one without the
other. Right. And so, um, andthis really cuts into exactly
why I feel like profit is soimportant, because if you can't

(54:16):
delegate it, it isunsustainable. It just is like,
I don't care how much we lovepodcasting. It's fun until it's
not fun anymore. And if we havetoo many of those things, that
it's not our highest and bestuse, or it's just not our zone
of genius. I mean, some of thethings I do definitely not my
highest issues, but I love it.So it just gives, it's like I'm

(54:37):
sitting watching TV with myhusband, and I get to do that
part of my work, you know. Andso I think that that keeps it
sustainable. It makes it so thatpod fade is less likely if
you're able to delegate thosethings. So I think that that's
really why

you should do what you love in your own
business. That's why we havecreated that freedom for
ourselves. And if you choose todo something yourself, it should
always be because you want to doit. And not because you have no
other option and you can'toutsource it, and you have to do
it yourself. So that's how italways should be. And my best

(55:12):
tip for that is always create aprocess, create a standard
operating procedure SLP that youshare with people. And it makes
it really easy for you to trainpeople to teach people and to
just find assistants who can doit for you. And it's really
clear and it's standardized. Andyou can ensure that you still

(55:33):
have the quality of yourcontent. In short, if you choose
not to do something yourself,that's really really important.

Exactly. In fact, one of the first 12 I the
first 12 episodes of next upnation I called my masterclass
because we interviewed just thetop in the industry, I feel like
we covered just about everytopic, you would need to really
build a great podcast and one ofthe people we interviewed was
Nathan Hersh and he has acompany called outsource school,

(56:02):
he's he started free up, whichis a very well known VA hiring
company. But now he's got thisout, he calls it outsource
school, but it they it's full ofslps. So it's got SLP for
writing for social media forsales for like every department

(56:24):
that a business so and they'realways asking like, Okay, guys,
what do you need next? And, andI could not agree more, in fact,
he even had, and so I, and itgoes back to like, go listen to
that, not you, you know, likegold is anybody who wants help
with that, like, it sounds likeyou've got it going on. But a
lot of times, I feel likebusiness owners are intimidated
by that, because we've all hadexperiences that scar a little

(56:47):
bit. Because we're like tryingto run our business and we hire
somebody, and we're not reallyputting as much thought or
energy into it. And those SRP isreally, you have to give people
the tools that they need to besuccessful. It's funny, because
I say the same thing aboutwebsites, I say that every page
is like an employee, and itneeds a goal and a way to do it.

(57:08):
And humans think about how muchmore important that is, you
know, cuz that's a person whowants to succeed. And, and if
you have a willing person, andthey're not succeeding, it's us.
And as business owners, it'shard, you know, so it's not
anything against the businessowner, like they're a bad
person. Although a lot of times,that's how people come out

(57:28):
feeling is like they failed atit. And so I think slps are like
the life raft. No, it's like, ifyou did nothing else, just get
yourself some recipes. And whatI The reason I thought of
Nathan's interview, he reallyputs it well about how the more
detailed you are, the lessexpensive it is. And a lot of
times podcasts are a side gig,right? So people are running a

(57:52):
business, and then Oh, I love apodcast, and I want a podcast
well, and they don't really havea lot of vision for profit or
what they're doing. But they'rehaving fun to get listeners.
And, and ultimately, they'regoing to need to like I always
say it's like, if you don'tdelegate, you know, you're in
trouble. And, and like Nathansaying, he goes through the
three different levels of hiringand how, basically, it comes

(58:15):
down to how detailed are you, ifyou're not very detailed, you
need to be ready to pay a lotbecause that person has to do
the thinking. And everybody'sdoing the thinking, but it's
just a more strategic hire, it'snot somebody who's just gonna,
like do the tasks. And a lot oftimes podcasters are such
control freaks, that you betterjust write down the stuff and

(58:37):
be, you know, pay less, becauseyou want to done a specific way
yourself

to do that and to execute your task
consciously, and make the effortto write down every single step,
no matter how little that stepmight be. Because for the other
person, it's not just a logicalno brainer, that that's how you
do that. And that's how you getfrom this to that. But you have

(59:02):
to write it out and put it inwriting, and really treat your
business like a franchise, themore detailed the better have
processes for everything. Andthat's how you grow in scale.
That's so important. BecauseYeah, that's what scaling is.
Basically you want to removeyourself, from the day to day
work of your business more andmore, and work on your business

(59:26):
more than in your business. Andreally, you are the one who
strategizes and navigates theship, so to speak words going
and people need direction andthings have to work even if
you're not there. I think that alot of businesses would
collapse. In Two, three, fourweeks, and that would be it. All

(59:52):
of their clients will be unhappyand things would just you know,
end up in chaos. So you don'twant that to happen. That's why
it's So important. Yeah,

Tiffany Youngren (01:00:01):
absolutely, absolutely. And, um, let's see,
I think that that was about it.Um, as you saw, I was taking
notes throughout the wholething. So if it looks like I was
distracted, I was reallydocumenting as I went, because,
you know, this next part iscoming. So one of the things
that you again, kind of goingback to what we said at the

(01:00:23):
beginning, the thing is that youcan envision from your show your
your, you know, what you want toget out of it, is the brand
awareness, the authority and thethought leadership. If you were
to pick something that wasbetween you and achieving that,
what would that thing be? Inyour question? I think I'm on

(01:00:43):
track pretty much. Yeah.Awesome. Awesome. Um, and but
you I'm, I mean, I'm guessingyou're here because you want to
grow your audience. So is thattrue? Exactly. And okay, one
other thing. Okay. Now, I keepsaying one more question. But
one thing you mentioned on theforum, because we do have a form

(01:01:03):
that people fill out before theycome on the show, is that you
mentioned that you wanted togrow your audience, and optimize
based on the changes that Applerecently made? Are you referring
to the subscription model?

Monique Idemudia (01:01:17):
Oh, yes, absolutely. So that's a new goal
now to also get more subscriberson the podcast. I feel like the
listeners that I'm getting rightnow are my audience members, who
I just I just tell them,basically, Hey, I just published
a new episode, it's about XYZ goahead and check it out. And then
they do, but it's not really youknow, people who stumble upon

(01:01:41):
the podcast, because you know,if your list is, if your podcast
is not trending, or in the top100 list or whatever, from
Apple, it's really, really hardfor people to discover you show
in the first place. So I want toget more subscribers. So my avid
listeners, my subscribers aresubscribed, and that's how they

(01:02:02):
always get notified. And then Ialso want to focus on you know,
having more visibility withinpodcasting apps or platforms
that more people can actuallydiscover the show. So okay,
that's like a, like a new goalof mine. I think it's gonna be
really, really important in thefuture, otherwise, Apple

(01:02:22):
wouldn't have launched thefeature and having subscribers
on your on your podcast will bejust as important as having, you
know, a certain amount ofsubscribers on social media. So
you want to keep an eye on that.And yes, I'm, I'm taking it
seriously. And I willincorporate more calls to action
to do that in the future. In myepisodes, too.

It's funny if Apple or Google make a move,
we're all like, okay, orSpotify? Oh, yeah, we're like,
okay, Oh, here we go. Everybody.Look alive. Yes. That's awesome.
Okay, so if it's okay with you,we're gonna go ahead and move
into the kind of my take on itand continue the discussion. But
I want to just want to talk moreabout first we're going to talk

(01:03:06):
about the things that I see thatyou're doing well, which is
they're abundant. So anythingthat I have to say is just going
to be about tweaking somethingthat you're already doing and
barely even that the first partwill be, like I said, what I
feel like you're doing well. Thesecond part will be
opportunities that I see. Andnot in any kind of priority, but

(01:03:27):
just like in general likeobservations. And then the last
thing I'll share is like ifthere was one thing that you
could do that I could see thatyou could grow in the next 30
days, that would that would beit. So I just want to clarify
too now. We talked aboutpreeminence. We talked about
getting listeners. So would yousay you're really looking in
general for listeners? Or do youspecifically want Apple

(01:03:49):
subscribers?

Both and I hope that my subscribers will
also not just subscribe, butalso listen regularly.

Yeah, okay, but if you could pick one, like
if you had to focus on onething,

then I pick listeners.

Yeah, okay. Okay, cool. Love it. Let me just
make one more note. Sosubscriber part. And you can see
like clarifying that just helpedme know, like, would that have
anything to do with it if I werethe boss of the world and gave
you one thing, but since that'snot the priority, it really is

(01:04:23):
just generally getting morelisteners. We'll just focus on
that for now. But okay, so itdrives your permission to
transition into this next phase.

Honestly, Yeah! So excited I love getting
feedback and I'm you know,always open to get feedback and
get a you know, also implementfrom other people's tips. I love
I used to being in the role ofthe one giving all the tips. So
I love to receive the advice andI'm really excited. I know that
you're a true expert on it. Oh,I'm ready.

I'm excited. I love like i said i love it. And
this is more fun when I'm kindof a fan of Already of what
you're doing, which I am, youknow, I was a high school
cheerleading coach. And when Ijumped in and started coaching,
I love these girls, but theywere the worst cheerleaders
ever. My pastor who was also oneof our best friends, he was a

(01:05:17):
basketball referee. And when Itook the position as the head
high school cheerleading coach,he was like, oh that's cool. And
I told him, he was just like,Oh, my gosh, they're so
terrible. And I'm like, you'rethe pastor, like, what the heck
are you even supposed to saythat, you know, but they were,
they were just miserablyterrible. And within about 90

(01:05:39):
days, they became awesome. Butthe things that I was telling
them in the first, you know,months, was a lot different than
what I was telling them sixmonths down the road, you know,
six months down the road, theyactually ended up competing by
the end of the year, which wasour goal was that they wanted to
be competition ready. And sowhile we were preparing for
competition, the conversationwas just completely different. I

(01:06:02):
wasn't teaching them how tocheer. I was teaching them how
to move their arm just a littlebit perfectly, you know, more
precisely, I should say. So Ifeel like that's where we're at.
I feel like that you just you'realready a pro, you know exactly
what you're doing. And soanything I observe is just going
to be I think you're alreadydoing it. Well, it just this is

(01:06:24):
something that I am seeing thatyou're probably won't even come
as a surprise to you. Excuse me.So as I move into that, I always
want to start with the four Psof preeminence. I feel like
these are the four things thatare really important actually is
important for preeminence and tohave a sustainable show, but
also a growing show. Number oneis to know your purpose, which

(01:06:48):
we talked about in thebeginning, your why why did you
start it? What are you hoping toaccomplish? Know Your people
really dial in on yourmessaging, which your proact you
teach people about that?optimize the promotion of your
show, which honestly, I don'tthink there's one thing I'm
gonna have to say that you coulddo better at that. I think your
repurposing remarketing is justspot on. And then fourth,

(01:07:12):
earning proceeds or profit tohelp pay for delegating. So
those are the four things that Ithink I always try to have that
framework in mind when we gothrough this. So I really feel
like number one, you're amazingat the at the blog post and the
website. You know, I agree withyou, it's the greatest asset
anyone's going to find it's thetop way people find your show,

(01:07:35):
you know, when they're lookingon Apple for podcasts? Yeah,
there's there's some otherthings we have to do optimize,
optimize it. However,everybody's on Google looking up
topics, right? So they'relooking up, do press releases
matter anymore, you know, andboom, there's your interview.
And there's, you know, that'sexposure, and then it's just a
matter of how do we convert thatinto your top priority. And then

(01:07:59):
number two is you and back tothe blog, again, the fact that
you have clear takeaways, notes,actionable steps, it's one thing
to talk about having actionablesteps. It's another thing to say
like just go look at the shownotes, I've got a list, you
don't have to take notes, I feellike there's a there's a video
that I watch regularly aboutreal estate investing. And I

(01:08:20):
love it. And he's super smart.And he just like drops bonds all
the time, like I'm justconstantly, but I can just sit
and listen to him. Because Iknow that I can go back to this
website and grab the show notes.And I feel like yours is
formatted so much like that,that it's just brilliant. And so
it's consistent with the goalthat you want to accomplish with

(01:08:41):
your show. You also have a greatcall to action that makes sense.
I'm always telling people youknow, as a podcaster. Everybody
wants to build this authorityand trust and have people know
that they know their stuff. Butif they don't have a next step
for those people, once thathappens, like assume that it's
going to work, you know, likeyou want to build authority,

(01:09:04):
okay, you're building it. So nowwhat and so having that next
step or call to action, a lot ofpeople are held back because
they feel like it's too salesy,but it's actually the opposite.
I feel like it's too selfish notto, and you have a really good
one, it feels natural, it feelslike I mean, honestly, the the
audience is number one andknowing your audience, I feel

(01:09:25):
like any other step, it's youknow, does it matter? Like if
you don't know who you'retalking to you, how do you build
great content? How do you sendgood emails, you know, so, but
on the other hand, you havelisteners who have been
listening and so they're like,yeah, I already did that one. So
what else you got for me, youknow, um, and then I love your
format. And I'm probably callingit the wrong thing, but I always

(01:09:48):
call it a cold open wherethere's just content from the
middle that just gets plopped atthe beginning. I love that,
because it really gives it getsto the meat of it before they
even start listening. And you doall this work to drive people to
your show. And then if you don'tgrab them in that first little
bit of time, you're shootingyourself in the foot. And I

(01:10:09):
think that you did a really goodjob of that. And even beyond the
cold open, it doesn't drag on,it really does a good job of
just like moving on. And then Ilove your outro, too, I thought
your outro was really good, aswell. So great format, you know,
your audience, you repurposeyour content like a pro, because
you are a pro. And then Okay, sothis is another thing, this is

(01:10:30):
such a pet peeve of mine, and Iam so sorry to like, I love my
guests so much. And I am soproud of them. Like, I think
they're brilliant. But so often,I'll say what is your web
address, and they'll give meapple or they'll give me
Spotify, or they'll give me andit's like, just give me your web
address. Like, if you don't haveyour podcast on, then, you know,
put it on there and then give itto me. But I just feel like it

(01:10:54):
needs to be people are goingfrom one platform to another. It
just needs to not be freaky,like anything we can do to
remove those barriers, thebetter. And so I love I love
that you do that you also havein your descriptions I saw on
Spotify, you have a link rightin the first part, which I think
is brilliant. Also I and we'regoing to be releasing an episode

(01:11:16):
with Mark Kumar. And he, hemakes bank like he profits so
much. In fact, he was on I'mjust like, I don't even know,
Why are my show like, seriously.I mean, I had ideas for him
because like, I don't reallycare because I already make
money at it. I'm like, Okay,great. But that's how you can
grow your audience. So I don'tknow what else to say. But, but
that's one thing he does, it'sso everything he says to do when

(01:11:37):
it comes to profit, I've alreadystarted changing how I do
things. So when we were talkingabout our podcast, being this
whole conversion rateoptimization exercise, I feel
like having that link in thefirst paragraph, I think was
just spot on. So good job onthat. Um, so any feedback or

(01:11:58):
feelings about that, or?

Yeah, I agree with you and everything so far.
And I do all of that, um,purposefully. Yeah. So it's not
an accident.

Yeah, sure. Awesome. Awesome. I, you know,
as a mark marketer to marketers,though, don't you feel like
sometimes people don't notice,like, just like things just,
like, I just want to acknowledgeyou like, very good job, I see
what you're doing. You're doingit really, really well. I have a
lot of respect for how youpodcast and how you formulate
you also just get to the pointto you're really good at that on

(01:12:31):
your show. In fact, um, do youso you must have an outline. And
you kind of mentioned itearlier, where typically your
your questions are formatted ina really specific way. And so
it's answered in a reallyspecific way as well, yes,

I don't want to waste any person's time I
want them to get value, I wantit to be value packed. And I
want to not just get straight tothe point, but have the entire
episode be about the point. Thewhole point.

Yeah. Okay. And so let me just talk about
just some areas that in again,this may fit within what you're
doing, it may not, but it's justthings I observed that maybe I
just want to bring up that Ifeel like could potentially be
opportunities. Number one is, sothe call to action, I just think

(01:13:21):
is brilliant. There's an episodethat we do in the first 12 in
the masterclass series for nextstep nation with Tom Schwab. And
he is like the premier guestmarketer. So he is all about the
guests coming on the show. Andhe trains and as a host, I
thought this was brilliant andreally helpful. His people go

(01:13:44):
into shows, and they get leads.So they go on the show, and
people sign up for their stuff.And I thought, wow, as a guest,
you know, maybe our expectationsas well should be higher, if
they can do it as guests, right.And so it just made me think
that one of the things that hedoes that he swears by, and he's

(01:14:05):
been doing this for a long time,is that he's got he, they
actually have three levels ofcalls to action. They have the
easy like the free, and thenthe, the it's just like a
funnel. So then it's like thenext step, like the not very
expensive thing. And thenthey've got they're like, hey,
if you actually want to workwith me, this is you don't have

(01:14:26):
to go through my funnel. This ishow you just like work with me.
For myself, I've translated thatinto two, because I feel like
three's a lot as a host,especially because our listeners
hear all this stuff over andover again. But having that free
gift, especially for newlisteners is really valuable.
Because you know, you know, youknow all the reasons and we
talked about on the show all thetime. But the other thing is

(01:14:48):
having that third level stepbecause then again going back to
that thought that or the secondlevel or even mixing it up, but
having those two steps becausepeople have been listening to
you for a long time becausethat's what you want. You want
loyal listeners, right? You justdon't want people randomly
listening. And so you want themto feel like, you know, you've
been listening a long time. Thisis how you just like you, you

(01:15:10):
email this email. And that's howyou I'm the one that you get or
you go to this website, you fillout this form, I'm the one that
you meet with or you know, orwhatever your processes are,
this is the person that you meetwith. And that having those two
levels, I think, is is reallyhelpful. The other is to
consider having your called andagain, I hate even talking about
messing up with your format,because I, I love it. But I also

(01:15:35):
with the as an optimizationspecialist, I'm always thinking
like, Okay, so how can we kindof play with it? And maybe not
change it a ton, but maybe finda way to softly do a call to
action? Not at the end of theshow? Or do your your main call
to action at the end of theshow? Where, in fact, I had one

(01:15:55):
guest where he said, Yeah, I domy call to act. In fact, it's
the same one. It's Mark Kumar,I'm pretty sure he's the one who
said this. So like I said,anything he says about
converting is like gold to me,but and he he will go he'll be
talking about something and thenhe'll just drop it like, Oh,
yeah, you know, this. And by theway, if this is something you
need help with, and I It feelsweird as a host to kind of, and

(01:16:17):
I asked him that I'm like, Well,isn't that weird? Because like,
you're talking to this person,and then you just oh, by the
way, you know, here's this carsalesman that's trying to sell a
car in the meantime, and he'slike, No, it doesn't. I get
sales all the time, was like,okay, so but it's always that.
He said, it's always at a spotwhere it's natural. It's just,
but anyway, just there are a lotof ways to do it. And you're

trying it out for sure. Yes. And because I
know, some people have thoseheartbreaks where it's like,
just completely interrupted inthe episode like a commercial
break when you're watching TV,and they have this pre recorded
insert that they just put inthere. That is Yeah, so salesy
and promotional. almost feelslike an ad and you're just in
your head, turning your earsoff, basically. And you're,

(01:17:03):
yeah, you're just waiting, oryou're skipping and the player
you like, fast forward 15seconds, please.

And I need to, I need to revisit this with them
too. Because I don't know. Like,I wonder if it would work as
well. And I'm actually testingwith my show with this whole
series is, you know, right nowwe have it towards the
beginning, but just messingaround with like, as you're
listening or as we I have a Ihave a creative assistant that

(01:17:30):
that's the person who pulls coolcontent, like it's like, oh,
that was interesting. And sowhether it's her myself, just
listening for that break waslike, Oh, this would be a great
spot to put that little insertwhere it is an insert, and it's
huge. It's huge. You sayingsomething like, you know, now
might be a good time, just tolet you know that this is how I
help people. This is you know,how you get a hold of me. And

(01:17:52):
then if this is your first timeto the show, don't even worry
about it. I got some free foryou. Like I have a gift for you
just to say thank you orsomething like that. So it's
like genuinely from you. It'sgenuinely what your the message
you're trying to be. But we'remore obvious about it instead of
hoping that they assume theright thing. Does that make
sense? Yeah, definitely makessense. Yeah. And then going back

(01:18:13):
to the subscribers, and we'vewe're testing this right now
too. But with the call to actionbeing earlier, I really like
having the last call to actionto be to subscribe, like a high.
Wasn't that awesome? Becauseyou're still here? I'm assuming
you like the show.

Right?

It's it's a good time to go press subscribe.

Much more sense than given beginning
before you even know.

Yeah

like it because you know, you just
started listening. So

yeah, and then hopefully, they listened to the
next episode as well. And thenthey get that call to action
again. And so then that way,it's soft still. And it's a, you
know, joining theirconversation. But it again, if
they're trusting you, they'rewanting to know these things. So
it's not like you're trying topush anything on them. Right.
Um, and then the third thing isguest management. This is

(01:19:05):
actually something I feel like,it's my, like, it's my
superpower. I love it. In fact,I only recently started, like,
you approached me as well, and Iget pitched all the time from
people. So we do have a processfor our guests. Once you're in,
it's like, I care so much aboutmy guests. So I just want them

(01:19:27):
treated awesome. I want them toget great value. I want it to be
everything they hope it is andthen to get great promotion
afterwards. But getting in isharder. It's kind of like the In
fact, I'm really quick to cancelif, like if someone doesn't show
up, unless they're like, dude,I'm so sorry. But if they're
like, Oh, well, I you know, Mycar broke, you know, like, not
my car broke down because Iwould totally be cool with that.

(01:19:48):
But like, Oh, you know, Oh, Iforgot that. I'm kinda like
okay, well, sorry, did work. Youknow, because it really I just
feel like you're takingsomebody's spot like this is you
know, like, we put so much intoit as hosts, like we put so much
into preparing, you know,research promotion, all of it.
And, and I want to until Idon't. And then I'm like,

(01:20:12):
nevermind, like this is allabout the relationships. I feel
bad now. And and I have to say,I get over it quick to like I
had one person that just didn'tshow up was like, Oh, I forgot
about it. No, I thought it was adifferent time. And I'm like,
how could you have like, you'vegot my emails, you know, like,
there's a Google version.There's like everything.

Oh, yeah, the reminders, all of that. So you
should take.

And I have, I mean, I've screwed up. So I get
it, that stuff happens. But atthe end of the day, I don't like
all that part. Like I don't likeall the I love screening, like I
have to be the one to screen itsounds like we're similar like
that, like, No, they're notcoming on the show, unless I
personally have looked at it waslike, Okay, I read everybody's

(01:20:58):
answers. I'm like, Okay, this isgonna be so much fun, you know,
um, but I just feel like ifthere was a way to make it more
streamlined for you, maybe, thenyou could open up the
floodgates, but they're gonnaself fall off. You know what I
mean? Like, for example, like,and I haven't gone through your
process, but do you have a formthat you use? or anything? No,

I don't have a form, I really eliminate all the
friction. Um, I think it justmakes it easier if they provide
all of the information that Ineed anyways, as a host, right?
They're in their pitch. And mostof the pitches are professional
pitches from you know, agencies,or people that are really
experienced with being a gueston podcast, I don't even have a

(01:21:42):
need for form anymore. I have itall in their email, or in their
podcast, one sheet.

Well, and it depends on what do you use the
form for? So if I was using theform just for information, I
probably wouldn't use it.Because you're right, like the
pitches have all of that in it?I mean, there are things I want
to know. But most of what I ask,are qualifying questions.
They're like, is this a good fitfor my show? Because even

(01:22:07):
though, on paper, they are likein, you've had great show, so I
know, but it's just iteliminates it, you're able to
open it up to more people, butyet filter it before it gets to
you. So you don't even have tolook at it. You know, yes, maybe
some of the information isrepeated from there one sheet,
but it shows that they'recommitted to being on your show,

(01:22:27):
like it shows commitment, itshows, you know, it's formatted
in a way that it's self sifting,you know, have you ever had
problems with like, once youhave someone coming on your show
that or has it just all beensmooth, like, smooth, that's so
awesome,

those people just they have, they're already
experts, and they have an onlinepresence. They know how
important it is. That's whythey're interested. And being a
guest on my podcast in the firstplace, they get the importance.
And there's just a lot of proofout there that they absolutely
know what they're talking about.And they're subject matter
experts, and I do not have toworry about them not being able

(01:23:05):
to answer any of my questions.And I see that really quickly.
So I don't do a whole lot ofresearch on them. I just
basically scroll through theirsocial profiles and their
websites for like, a couple ofminutes, like under five
minutes, sometimes even. And Iget a really, really good
understanding of who they are,and what I can expect. So yeah,

(01:23:25):
I guess it depends on, you know,your show, and what kind of show
you have, if you don't have ashow like that, where you have,
you know, experts on, you mightwant to screen people more. And
yeah, everybody should dowhatever makes sense for them.

Well, and we're really strategic about our
guests, too. So like, it's morethan just topical in it. And I
don't even just mean next stepnation like, in when, when I
help when I do consulting forother, we actually have a tool
that does the guest managementthat we you know, share with our
podcasters. But you know, a lotof times the people who come on

(01:24:01):
our show, we want a relationshipbeyond that. So we're either
looking for collaboration orsomething, not that it happens
usually happens naturally, or itdoesn't happen. But even if it
happens naturally, if there'snot some sort of really
deliberate, this is how we seethis playing out. Because this
is the type of people that we'reworking with, you know, that
really comes more into themonetization and the optimizing

(01:24:24):
the relationships kind ofthings, which is why I you know,
it's not going to end up on myone thing list, but I just would
say like, of the things that Iobserved. I think that I'm just
kind of putting, I think youcould get so much out of your
guests as far as like afterwardsand then also reduce some of
the, you know, the longer you dothis, the more I don't know, the

(01:24:47):
more you're going to I don'tknow, maybe you're different
than I am, but I've just likeafter a while I'm like no, I
just want to make sure you know,and I go

that's perfectly fine. Everybody has
their own systems. Yeah. justsent that I've also been really
lucky with the reliability. ingeneral. They're all
professional people. They showup on time. Very rarely has it
happened that somebody forgot ordidn't show up. Yeah, really?
Yeah. Most of them do. Andthey're prepared. And yeah, what

(01:25:19):
else? I wanted to say somethingelse, and I forgot about it now.
Um, it's just yeah, it's justreally reliable. It's really
smooth. I never really ran intoa lot of issues ever with any
guests.

Yeah, well, and I have to say to my guests
have all been awesome. So Idon't have any issues. But I
also will say that when I firststarted doing this, like you,
I'm automated. So I just, I feellike that's my assistant to
like, do the intake. And then bythe time I'm meeting with my
guest, it's just kind of spoonfed. And I've been able to kind

(01:25:52):
of open it up to more people, soAnd also, yeah, anyway. And then
if I come up with somebody thatI invite, they automatically go
into that system, and then theyget the same kind of thing. So
anyway, before we Yeah, like, Ifeel like too, that's probably
not a priority. But you know,down the road as you have like,

(01:26:12):
a million listeners, and youknow, you're only having famous
people on your show, that mightbe something that work, you
could do, okay, so an

I'm really particular about, I want to have
the people on my show that areable to provide the most value
to my target audience. It's allabout my audience. So it's not
about having, you know,celebrities, or the most famous
people on my show, but I wantpeople that can break things
down in the way that I want themto. And I know it helps my

(01:26:43):
audience members out the best.And there's not this, you know,
huge gap between them, becausehow can a small business owner
relate to a person who has builtan eight figure business or
whatever, you know, they live inentirely new and totally
different worlds. So I reallywant to invite people who can
provide the most value, and I'mnot, you know, chasing guests
based on that. That's also acriteria where I know, they're

(01:27:08):
probably not a good fit for myshow, if their entire pitches
about, Oh, I got 50,000followers, and they're and I
got, you know, I got this andthat, and it's all about some,
you know, some meaningless statsabout how many followers they
got, they got other thingsthey've achieved, but it's not
what shows me, hey, that's how Ican provide value to your

(01:27:32):
audience. You know, it's all Me,me, me and achievements that
don't tell me that you canprovide a lot of value to my
audience. Exactly.

Well, and I think that there's a lot to be
said, For that I, you know,definitely, I always feel like
content is king. So if anythinghurts the content, whether it's
monetization, or how we'rebringing guests on, it's out
like it has to really, you know,sometimes we'll use a different
strategy just to shake it up. Sostart pouring. But it has to

(01:28:02):
still achieve that audiencepromise, like I was telling you
about earlier. And, you know, Iknow when we're doing our
strategy, we, and when I'mcoaching, same thing is that,
you know, having like a 5% ofthe time having a rock star,
what I call a rock star on ourshow, I love doing that, because
I feel like people, a lot oftimes limit themselves. And

(01:28:25):
mindset is usually what holdsbusiness business owners back.
And people who have achievedlike, there already were, you
know, we all aspire to be likeyou said, you know, you want
people who wants to be able tosee themselves having that kind
of revenue. And so when we seethese people who've achieved
these amazing things, it's Ithink it's nice, just to kind of

(01:28:46):
bring us out of our own space,it kind of takes it from looking
really closely at the paper tokind of sitting back and going
Yes, this is Yeah, this is whatevery once in a while. Yeah,
exactly, exactly. But I agreewith you. That well, and just to
kind of on the other side of it,like I'm like you like if they

(01:29:07):
tell me they have 50,000followers, maybe I care just
because but probably not.Because usually, I don't like
that as a metric. I like, likehow many people engage with you
based on what you put out therethat that's impressive to me.
Um, and, you know, yes, we'vehad people with a lot of
followers, bestselling books.And I will tell you, those

(01:29:30):
episodes do really, really well.You know, they get listened to
by more people, we get exposedto more people that wouldn't
have found us otherwise. But itis never, I'm going to them
going. You are the type ofperson who would inspire the
people that we're talking towhat do you think, you know, if
we teamed up so I agree with youwholeheartedly, right. So with

(01:29:51):
that, so we talked about someareas of opportunity, which is
so helpful, because then itgives me a sense of a better
sense of like, where you'rewanting To go, what kinds of
things fit in better with whatyou're trying to do. At the end
of the day, if you were to justmake one change that I feel
would would really help you getmore listeners, it's definitely

(01:30:13):
something that you have to tweakand kind of play around with.
But I do think it's just thathow to structure the call to
action. But having that, becauseyour show is shorter, it's very
to the point, I think thathaving a subscribe now at the
end of the show would be reallyeffective. Again, you want more
listeners. So when it comes tothat, I would just say that. I

(01:30:38):
mean, again, I don't know what Iwas thinking. I just think,
again, this, like, Wow, mynumber one advice has nothing to
do with getting more listeners.However, it does have everything
to do with getting loyallisteners, you know. So as
you're building kind of yourtribe, per se, it's really like
they're there. Okay, now you'vegot them, you know, they're on

(01:31:00):
your email list, or they have acloser relationship with you,
then they're referring, right,what's the number two way that
people find shows is throughreferrals? So if you've got
these people who are close,they're like, Yeah, I was
listening to her show. And thenI, you know, I got this free
download. I think it reallyhelped you, you know, did you
know that since I found mytarget audience that now this is

(01:31:21):
where I'm at? Or Oh, I heardthis on this other show. So
you've got beyond just like morelisteners, you've gotten that
loyal listener base that willthe referrals are the I feel
like the most valuable listenersyou're gonna get. So you just
really get those goldenlistener. So I would say that
that would be the thing that Iwould play with is just getting
them for deeper into becoming aloyal listener helpful. Yeah,

(01:31:47):
definitely. Okay. Good, good.Well, is there anything else
that you wanted to add when itcomes to what we just talked
about, like growing yourlistener base? The observations,
anything like that? think I'veshared everything. Okay.
Awesome. Well, and too, asyou're listening to this show,

(01:32:07):
be sure to go check out dragonDigital Marketing podcast, you
can look it up on your favoritepodcasting platform or go to
dragon dash digital dashmarketing, com hit podcast, and
Monique, is there anywhere elsethat people can find you or
anything else you want everybodyto know?

The best way is the website. Because there
you can find all of the content,the podcast of lack the free
branding course. All otherresources, the free downloads
and cheat sheets, checklists,templates, all of that I have on
there that you can grab. Andthere you can also find all the
social links on LinkedIn,Facebook, Twitter, and on

(01:32:45):
YouTube. And that's also thebest way to reach out. So yeah,
I love that website. And haseverything you need on there.

Well, I have to say, you know, I, when I when
I do my research, because Ipromise two things. One, I
promise, an actionable step thatyou can take that will help you
get more listeners, but thenalso that I'm prepared. And in
doing so I usually will listento bits and pieces of a lot of
episodes. And then I'll listento a bulk of one episode. And we

(01:33:14):
talked about it beforehand, thepress release episode you had
and the person was that youinterviewed. What was his name?
Mickey Kennedy. Yeah, yeah.Awesome, obviously. I mean, he
he does press releases for what,like a third of the shark tank
of the people who end up onShark Tank and yeah, I he just

(01:33:34):
was so, so helpful. And wetalked about beforehand how
before the internet pressreleases was really how I got
out there. And it hasn'tchanged. Like it's just so
powerful. And it's a it's agreat way to get out there. So I
highly recommend that episode.The other one that I listened to
a bit was, it was a writer who'salso a poet like at night. He's

(01:33:57):
a poet and I just thought thatwas so fascinating. Like, that's
somebody who really likes towrite. So I would say like you
definitely have great guests, Ihighly recommend the show.
Monique, is there anything elseyou'd like to add before we

I am good. So yeah, thank you so much. For
wrap?
those shout out of your of yourof your favorite episodes of
mine. Definitely check it out.And again, the website URL is
dragon dash digital dashmarketing.cam

Awesome. Well, hey everybody, don't be average.
Be brave, take action and makemagic happen. Thank you for
listening.

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