March 17, 2025 • 36 mins
What if a simple conversation could save a life?
Suicide prevention is a topic that carries immense weight, yet it’s often shrouded in stigma. In this episode, Agi Keramidas speaks with Michael Jarvis, Digital Partnerships Lead at Campaign Against Living Miserably (CALM). They explore the vital work CALM is doing to combat suicide, the warning signs to watch for, and practical ways we can all make a difference.
- Discover actionable strategies to support someone experiencing suicidal thoughts.
- Learn how to break the stigma and create safe spaces for open conversations.
- Find out how simple tools and CALM’s resources can help people navigate life’s toughest moments.
Listen to this life-changing episode and learn how you can be part of the movement to prevent suicide and spread hope.
This episode is our participation in this year's Podcasthon, an incredible charitable event in the podcasting world!
During Podcasthon, multiple podcasts dedicate one episode of their show to a charity, and release them simultaneously in mid-March 2025. The objective of this coordinated effort is to raise awareness for a huge number of charities worldwide.
CALM charity: https://www.thecalmzone.net/
˚
KEY POINTS AND TIMESTAMPS:
03:07 - Overview of CALM and Michael Jarvis's Involvement
08:55 - Addressing Stigma Around Suicide and Mental Health
11:54 - Understanding the Nature of Suicidal Thoughts
13:00 - Describing the Experience of Suicidal Thoughts
17:49 - Identifying Warning Signs in Others
19:40 - Reaching Out to Support Someone Struggling
24:35 - Encouraging Those with Suicidal Thoughts to Reach Out
29:17 - CALM's Website and How to Support the Charity
34:00 - Final Thoughts and Call to Action
˚
MEMORABLE QUOTE:
"It’s a very common and almost human experience to go through suicidal thoughts at different points in one’s life."
˚
VALUABLE RESOURCE:
CALM charity: https://www.thecalmzone.net/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Agi Keramidas (00:00):
Did you know that one in five people will
experience suicidal thoughts atsome point in their lives? Yet
stigma keeps many from reachingout. What if simply asking, Are
you really okay? Could save alife? I Agi, welcome to Personal
(00:24):
Development mastery podcast. Iam your host, Agi Keramidas, and
this is episode 484 this year weare participating in podcast
zone, an incredible charitableevent in the podcasting world.
Podcast on is an event wheremultiple podcasts dedicate one
(00:47):
episode of their show to acharity and release them
simultaneously in mid March 2025to create a massive
international wave of inspiringaudio content. The objective of
this coordinated effort is toraise awareness for a huge
number of charities worldwide.
This year, it's over 1500podcasts participating, and
(01:13):
today I am dedicating thisepisode of personal development
mastery to highlight and supporta cause that I feel compelled to
share with you, campaign againstliving miserably, C, A, L, M,
calm. It is a suicide preventioncharity fighting to reduce the
(01:40):
devastating impact of suicide inthe UK. In the following
conversation, we talk aboutsuicide prevention, breaking
mental health, stigma and thepower of community support, this
episode could make a realdifference. If you know someone
(02:00):
who might be struggling or whowants to learn more about mental
health and suicide prevention,please share this conversation
with them. You never know theimpact it might have. Now, let's
get started today. It is mypleasure to speak with Michael
(02:23):
Jarvis, Michael, you are thedigital partnerships lead at
campaign against livingmiserably, c, a, l, m. Calm CALM
is a suicide prevention charityfighting to reduce the
devastating impact of suicide inthe UK, you are on a mission to
(02:45):
help people and their misery,not their lives. Michael,
welcome to the show. It's apleasure and also my duty to
highlight calm charity in thisyear's podcast on event.
Michael Jarvis (03:04):
Thank you so much for having me. It's a
pleasure to be part of it.
Agi Keramidas (03:07):
As I said, it is a pleasure and a sense of duty
at the same time, because it is,you know, COVID mission to
prevent suicide is a topic I wastelling you just before we
started recording, I feelcompelled to discuss and share,
(03:28):
and there is one statistic Iread in your website, which I
hadn't read before, and I foundunsettling, that one In five
people will have suicidalthoughts at some point in their
lives, which is a number way. Ididn't think that it would be so
big. I suppose many peopledon't. So in this conversation,
(03:53):
among other things, I would liketo explore suicide prevention
and the role of calm before wego there, I would like to ask
you to tell us briefly aboutcalm, but also your involvement
in calm and how it came about.
Michael Jarvis (04:16):
Course. Thank you. Yeah, so, like, like you
mentioned, so campaign againstliving miserably, also known as
calm. We're a suicide preventioncharity. We're here for anyone
struggling with life. We do thisin lots of ways. We've got
plenty of tools and resources tohelp people get the support they
need. That includes a helpline,which is open every day. It's
(04:39):
free, it's anonymous, and itgives support to anyone affected
by suicide or suicidal thoughts.
So that's you might bestruggling yourself, but you
might be worried about someoneelse, or you might have been
bereaved by suicide. You cancall the helpline for support,
and I think, like we sort oftouched on already, but people
who feel. Feel suicidal, theyoften say they don't want to
(05:01):
die. It's more that they kind ofwant that pain and misery that
they're experiencing to stop.
And when you're in thatposition, when you're
struggling, it can quite easilybecome like It's like there's no
way out, like you feel likethere's no other option but
suicide. And we get, we get thatfeeling at calm. We know we
(05:22):
understand where people arecoming from. We also know that
it never is the only option, andthere's always a reason to stay.
So that's why, as you mentionedat the beginning, our mission is
to help people in their miseryand not their lives. And we do
this through our services andour tools. We do this through
(05:42):
advice on helping other peoplenavigate the challenges that
might bring people to the brink.
And we'll get onto the differentways that we that we do that,
whether it's through our onlinetools that people can use, or
whether it's our guides thatpeople can can read, or it's the
helpline. And then finally, wecampaign, so it's in the name
campaign against every majorpeople, but we campaign to
ensure that everyone has theknowledge and skills to unite
(06:03):
against suicide, becauseultimately, we can't prevent
suicide through just one or twopeople or a couple of charities.
Everyone has to play their part,and everyone has a part to play.
I guess my personal connectionto this is quite close, quite
profound. A few years ago,actually, quite a few years ago.
Now, about 10 years ago, I losta very close friend to suicide.
(06:27):
His his name was Matt. He was 24when he when he died. So still
quite young. We felt, we feltolder at the time. But, you
know, looking back, we were allvery young, and it was, yeah,
like I say, very profoundexperience to go through
bereavement by suicide.
(06:47):
Obviously, all bereavement iscan be very difficult and
emotional. Bereavement bysuicide has a particularly
unique character and feel to it.
There's many, many emotionswrapped up of maybe a bit of
anger, maybe a bit of guilt,obviously sadness and regret,
and many stages in that of couldI have done something more to be
(07:09):
there for my friend? With withMatt, his experience when I was
grieving made me think, right? Iwant to do something in his
memory. I want to make adifference. So I decided to run
the Brighton marathon. Brightonis a city on the south coast of
of the UK. It's my hometown aswell, and I ran, ran the
Brighton marathon in Matt'smemory, but for calm. So for the
(07:32):
charity, I didn't work, work atcalm at that point, but so
worked and fundraised.
Fundraised for calm. And throughthat experience, I got exposed
to the charity, started talkingto some of the team, and then
when a job came up a couple ofyears later, I thought,
absolutely, that's exactly whatI want to go and do. So now I
get to, I get to go to workevery day before that can make a
(07:52):
big difference. Sometimes Ithink about Matt and the kind of
what he'd think about it, butnow it's, it's just a job that
I'm very proud to be able to
Agi Keramidas (08:02):
do. Thank you for sharing this story and how it
happened, and fundraising fromBrighton marathon to becoming
actively involved in thatcharity. It's, it sounds very
fascinating as a story, youknow, as a series of events,
(08:25):
Michael, before I discuss withyou, suicide prevention in
particular, there is somethingthat I would like to address,
and that is the stigma arounddiscussing suicide, mental
health in general, but suicide,I think there is even more. So.
(08:50):
How can we address this? How canwe reduce this?
Michael Jarvis (08:57):
It's an absolutely crucial question, and
actually the substance of that,and the substantive impact of
that is, we saw some statisticsrecently from the Office for
National Statistics, that's thegovernment body who revealed
that actually suicide is at itshighest rate in the UK, at
least, that it's been since for25 years, and you know that's
(09:24):
that could be all these peoplebehind these massive numbers are
real people. It could be afriend, a mother, a colleague,
anyone can feel suicidal. And asyou said, in fact, one in five
of us will experience suicidalthoughts at some point. It's a
very common and almost humanexperience to go through at
different different points inone's life, and yet there is
(09:48):
this stigma still around it.
Some of this stems fromhistorical, historical
backgrounds. So for example,until quite recently in the. UK,
so a few decades ago, it was acrime. So that's where we get
the phrase committed suicidefrom, because it was a crime to
attempt suicide, and you can beprosecuted for it. So that's
(10:10):
why, in general, we now tend tonot use the word commit suicide,
but might say attempted suicideinstead. This as a more kind of
helpful way to to look at itwhen, when it comes to stigma,
some of the thing that we wantto do is to change the
conversation around mentalhealth and suicide, because we
(10:31):
know that when people bring itout into the open, when people
talk about it, so many peoplehave that shared experience,
whether it's personally, whetherit's someone that's been
impacted that they know, and ourcampaigns and the work that we
do try to cut through the noiseof a lot of the Mental Health
conversation going on and usingpowerful methods embedded into
(10:53):
cultural society and people'slives, so that we're not trying
to shout from a Different angle.
So for example, we use thingslike music and comedy and sport
and gaming and everything inbetween to try and weave our
messages into the cultural,cultural character, I guess, of
(11:16):
people's lives, and encouragepeople to reach out to help.
Reach out for help and talk toothers. So that's that's our
approach at calm. And there aremany other ways of doing and
that starts at a smaller level,encouraging people to have open
conversations with their friendsand realizing that actually the
worst thing you can do is nottalk about it. It's not really
going to be a bad outcome fromtalking about it. Nothing worse
(11:40):
than not talking about it. Andthen all the way up to those
kind of national campaigns, eveninternational campaigns where
we're trying to change theculture and change the kind of
vocabulary around suicide tobreak out through that stigma.
Agi Keramidas (11:54):
Thank you. There is one thing that you said, I
underlined it in my notes, thatyou said that not only is common
suicidal thoughts, I mean, butit's part of human experience. I
had never thought of it before,but when, when I think of it is
like a like a consciousexperience. I suppose it's
(12:14):
normal in a way, to at somepoint question when that
experience would end, but that'sa very something interesting
that I got. But let's talk aboutsuicide awareness in particular,
and direct the conversationthere. And I would like to ask
(12:36):
you, I will ask the question asit is, and feel free to answer
in as little or much detail asyou want. My question is, what
are suicidal thoughts? But moreimportant than that, how do they
feel? Because I think there is acertain weight, shall we say, in
(12:56):
them, compared to other negativethoughts, absolutely,
Michael Jarvis (13:02):
absolutely. And it's essential that we
understand that at calm, becausethat's what guides all of our
products, all of our tools, allof our services. And I think
just quickly coming back to theit's a human experience type
thing, and how common it is.
There's an estimate that in theUK there are around 200,000
suicides attempts per year, andabout 125 people die per week.
(13:26):
So many more, many fewer deathsthan attempts. But really, you
know, if someone's getting intoa position where they feel like
they need to attempt at thatpoint, that's an awful situation
that shouldn't have got to thatthat far, and coming on to then
what suicidal thoughts are. Imean, at their base, it's, it's
(13:49):
about not wanting to live, asyou say, it's, it's about
wanting to try and end that painthat they're going through, and
then actively planning how tohow to end it, and these
thoughts talking about whythey're so human, they can come
from so many emotions ordifferent life events, and
anyone can experience them. Thisisn't just reserved for people
(14:12):
with mental health issues. Thisisn't reserved for people that
have gone through huge traumas.
In fact, in many cases, it canbe the combination of a few
different life events that justhappened all at the same time.
And that said, you know, thereare quite a few factors which
might trigger these thoughts orhave a contributive kind of
(14:36):
impact, so things like majorloss or trauma or setback, like
losing a loved one or or a jobor having kind of financial
difficulties, things like traumaand post traumatic stress
syndrome coming from difficultlife events. Mental health is a
(14:57):
is a big one. So if you have gotdepression or. Anxiety, then
that is quite a key indicator ofhigher risk of suicidal
thoughts. But then, as I said,things like loneliness or
experiencing bullying or havingmaybe thoughts around one's
identity, all of these thingscan contribute into a kind of
(15:20):
underlying sense of I haven'tgot much self worth. I feel very
entrapped. It's like I don't Idon't see another way out. And I
feel very lonely. I feel like Ican't connect with people or
talk to people about this andthose three things, a lack of
self worth, a lack of feelinglike there's anything else I can
do to that kind of entrapment,and then the isolation, that
(15:43):
loneliness, when those threethings come together, that's
when someone is at real risk ofsuicidal thoughts. And I guess
how they feel is going to bedifferent to different people,
but quite often they'll emergeduring times of distress or
sadness, some of these will befleeting feelings. So it might
(16:04):
be an extended period ofsadness, throughout which you
get fleeting moments ofsuicidality. And for most
people, they are temporary.
However, when these thoughtspersist and they come back and
again and again, they can spiraland they can become
overwhelming, and if you'restruggling with persistent
suicidal thoughts, it'sessential you talk to someone,
(16:25):
because that's how we break thatcycle. We break the spiral. We
stop it from becomingoverwhelming. And actually quite
a lot of the advice that we giveis super practical and super
pragmatic. It's about if you'restruggling, or if you feel like
you're going down that path.
(16:46):
What can you change? Is thereanything you can change that's
really triggering that? Andactually just give yourself some
time to stay and decide not todo anything, because there's a
really good chance that thosefeelings will be gone even
within an hour, you know thatmoment will pass, and that's
then when you can get advice andsupport and put in place things
(17:09):
that will prevent you fromgetting there again in the
future. So yeah, it's, I thinkquite often, people will think
of suicidal thoughts as quitefundamental, concrete things
that you know a person issuicidal, that is them, when
actually that is not the case.
It's someone who might be goingthrough a really tough time, and
(17:29):
for an hour they feel suicidal,and then they decide to act on
it. And that's, that's how ithappens quite, quite often.
Sometimes it will be persistent,as we say, and people will have
suicidal thoughts over a longtime. But that's not always the
case, and it comes in alldifferent shapes and forms.
Agi Keramidas (17:49):
Thank you for this answer, and you also
answered a couple of more thingsthat I wanted to clarify. So
thank you for doing it already,but I wanted to ask. One was why
people have suicidal thoughts?
And you described, you said, Iremember a phrase. You said that
this is not reserved for peoplewho have mental health. It is.
(18:11):
It can happen to anyone. Soalso, of course, the life's
events or factors like this. Andthe other thing was about
warning signs, shall we say,because there are different. You
(18:32):
know, it's different. If youhave a fleeting thought that
lasts a few seconds. It'sdifferent, different when you
are you use the phrase that Ithink is a very key in in all
this, and I will highlight thiswas spiral, spiral down. It is
(18:53):
when you know the it goes waymore than one initially thought
that this thought would turninto so there is one other you
know, regarding suicideawareness, one other angle that
I would like to see this from,and that is from the angle of
(19:16):
identifying some signs on adifferent on another person. I
suppose that is something veryimportant and useful. So I would
like to hear your thoughts onthat and anything you would like
to add on what I said.
Michael Jarvis (19:40):
Yeah, absolutely, absolutely, um,
because we said at the top,preventing suicide is something
we can all play a part in, andwe've all got a part to play.
And actually, just by learning afew fairly simple, fairly basic
things to pick up and bringabout, bring around with you in
your your daily life. If you canmake quite a quite a big impact
(20:03):
and be much more aware to thepeople around you and asking
someone how they there's a,there's, you know, asking
someone how they really feel.
Like asking, how are you doing,and then asking, actually, how
are you doing? Again, that's,that's a, that's a bit of a
trope nowadays, but it'sactually something really
believe in. And some, you know,that kind of brief, oh, I'm
good. Don't worry about it. I'mfine. Can often, quite can quite
(20:25):
often hide the real kind ofemotion and turmoil going on.
And we like to say, you know,we're not experts in this. And
actually, you'll know yourfriends, and you'll know the
people around you better thanbetter than most. So if you feel
like there's something up withsomeone, then that is always a
good moment to do it. So youknow, regardless of if you have
(20:47):
something specific, you canpoint out, like a specific sign,
if you feel like there'ssomething up, there's a good
chance there might be. And theworst case scenario of asking if
someone's if how someone'sreally doing is they go, Yeah,
I'm completely fine. Why are youasking about it? Whereas the
worst case scenario of notasking is obviously much more,
(21:08):
much more impactful and kind ofcatastrophic. So that said,
thinking there are some warningsigns that someone might be
struggling to cope. Andactually, we've got, I'm gonna
list a few of you, three ofthese for you, but they're on
our website. There's, there'splenty more for people to look
at. So things like drastic moodswings or irritability. And
(21:31):
again, this is all relevant tothe person or relative to the
person, I should say. So ifsomeone's quite calm, usually
maybe quite quiet, and suddenlythey become a bit manic and
loud, then that's an indicationthat something, something might
be going on similarly, the otherway, withdrawing from social
activities, maybe a lack ofenergy or motivation, even
(21:52):
physical things like neglectingpersonal hygiene or appearance.
Maybe if there's someone whotakes a lot of care in their
appearance, and then slowlyseems to be, yeah, losing that,
losing that care that also mightbe linking into kind of risk
taking or reckless behavior ifthey if they weren't before,
quite a big one maybe towardsthe a good sign that someone has
(22:17):
really made plans to to attemptsuicide, is that they start
giving away possessions. Sothat's something that we'll
you'll see. They won'tnecessarily say why, but they'll
start giving away possessions topeople around them, and then, of
course, saying goodbye toothers, saying goodbye as if
they're not going to see youagain. And you might pick up on
(22:38):
these things and be like, Oh,that's that feels slightly odd.
That's, that's out of place. Andour advice here is, if you're
concerned, it's better to ask,don't be afraid and openly use
the word suicide. So it's, it'sa it's a sticky word to use. We
still got that stigma around it.
(22:59):
You know, I've been working init for three years or so, and I
still sometimes find myselfgoing suicide, you know, to try
and get it, get it out there,but actually talking openly
about suicide and asking, Areyou thinking about suicide? If
you think someone's struggling,will never increase the risk,
and it's always going to helpsomeone make make them feel less
(23:20):
isolated. The advice after thatis that if they were, if they
respond and say yes, acknowledgetheir feelings, make sure you're
actively listening which which,I can tell you're great at
repeating back things to peopleand showing that you've really
listened to them, and offeringreassurance and then being
(23:41):
certain that it's not your job,it's not your responsibility to
make sure that they are safegoing forward, or at least, it's
not your responsibility aloneand that actually there are
services like calm, there areservices like Samaritans. There
are other friends and familythat they can talk to. You can
talk to their GP. That's whereyou need to start bringing in
(24:01):
the network of options. Andagain, there's lots of advice on
our website about the differentthings that you might take
someone towards, but just inthat moment, having the bravery
to talk about suicide openlywith someone can make all the
difference. And all it takes, asI mentioned before, is getting
them through that next hour,maybe two hours, maybe saying
(24:24):
right, get through today andlater on, I'll help you call the
GP, or I'll help you call yourparents. That can make a massive
difference, and that can be allyou need to do sometimes.
Agi Keramidas (24:35):
Thank you, and I like that. You are ahead of me.
You are answering my nextquestion before I access so I
think this, there is a nice flowto this conversation. My next
question will be dealing with,you know, suicidal thoughts and
(24:58):
you you have discussed. Already,you mentioned some things. I
would like to ask you also, ifwe look at it from because you
mentioned from the perspectiveof someone who is concerned
about their friend and askingthem, are you thinking about
suicide? And I would like to askthe reversal. If one finds
(25:23):
themselves in the position ofthinking about and want to reach
out to someone does the samething applied. Do you go
straight at it and say, youknow, I'm thinking, or I'm of
suicide, or I have suicidalthoughts.
Michael Jarvis (25:43):
So from the out perspective, so at calm we talk
quite a lot about there's been alot. There's been a big push on
encouraging people to reach out,which is really important, and
that's, I'll come back to thatin a second. It's vitally
important as well, that othersare taught how to reach in and
so that there is, there is thatmeeting in the middle, and
(26:05):
that's, that's where, when wetalk about using the word
suicide, you're you're creatingan environment for that person
where they know you'recomfortable and safe talking
about the word suicide, so theydon't have to hide it behind
different words or differentvocabulary, or they don't have
to hide their true feelingsbecause they know you don't feel
(26:25):
stigmatic towards towards it.
The other way round, I guess, isslightly more sensitive, because
it's always going to be down tothat person and their their
sense of their own safety andwhat they feel they can
communicate. So, yes, ouradvice, you know, in a our
advice would be, if you arefeeling suicidal, reach out and
(26:46):
directly talk to someone andsay, I am feeling suicidal. We
know that can be incredibly hardto do. So in fact, just just a
case of reaching out to someoneand saying, I'm struggling right
now can be an easier way to openup that conversation. It's
whatever works for that personin that moment. We wouldn't want
(27:09):
the word suicide to be a blockerto reaching out in in some way
we quite find so our helpline,our suicide prevention helpline,
completely anonymous, as youmentioned, paid professionals.
So all of our helpline staff areusually therapists or counselors
or some kind of support workerwith a background in in this.
(27:33):
And they're all trained, which Ithink is this is a brilliant
part of our helpline. They'reall trained in specific issues
that might be trending, ortrending is the wrong word, but
there might be a commonexperience at that time. So for
example, during the cost ofliving crisis, all of our
helpline staff got training onfinancial issues so that they'd
(27:53):
have really pragmatic, practicaladvice on what to give to people
who are struggling with money,but the anonymous side of it is
actually really helpful. Youknow, it can be great talking to
a friend or family member.
Sometimes it's way easier totalk to a stranger or someone
that you know, someone youhaven't met, someone that can
(28:14):
offer an objective butcompassionate perspective on it,
and then give you advice on whatto do next. So that's what we'd
encourage to do, is just reachout in whatever way you feel is
possible at that point, ifyou're feeling suicidal, then
the helpline is there for you.
The remit is for suicidalpeople. If you're worried about
(28:35):
someone who's suicidal, or ifyou're bereaved by suicide, if
you're not quite as far as thatat that point, then we've still
got lots of tools and serviceson our website, and there's lots
of other mental health supportout there. But yeah, sometimes
talking to a professionalstranger can make a big
difference and make it easier.
Agi Keramidas (28:58):
Talking about the helpline, the tools on the
website and so on. I would liketo ask you to share with us the
website and where people canfind that even more importantly,
how can listeners support calm?
Michael Jarvis (29:17):
Yeah, absolutely. So our website is
the calm zone.net so it's thecalm zone.net will on there.
You'll find a mixture of supportand tools and services, things
about our existing campaignsthat are going on that you can
get involved in. But our toolsthere'll be connections to the
(29:38):
helpline. So you can find thehelpline there. There's also all
of our guides and our How toarticles. So that's practical
advice, real tips on how to getthrough whatever you're going to
be, whether that's exam stress,whether that's job issues,
whether that's loneliness.
There's about 50 differentarticles on different topics
there with connections todifferent. Support Services as
(29:59):
well, and there's a bunch ofonline tools as well which you
can use. There's a goodsometimes to take a pause and
reset. There's one that I'veused before called offload your
thoughts, which is literallyjust a box on our website. You
can type in whatever you'refeeling, whatever you're
struggling with, press Enter andit disappears when we're not
(30:20):
collecting any data. Don'tworry. It just disappears into
the into the digital ether,never to be seen again. And
actually, the research and thestatistics on that is that it
makes a substantive differenceon alleviating your worries. And
it can be as simple as that, youjust write it down, send it
away. So I use that not often,but I've definitely used it a
(30:42):
few times, and it's and it'sworked for me. So you don't even
have to be, you know, feeling inthat suicidal point. You might
just have a worry or an issue,write it down, send it away, and
suddenly it feels bettersomehow, which is an interesting
one for human psychology, isn'tit? And then, how can people get
involved? We'd love as manypeople as possible to get
(31:04):
involved, because we're a UKbased charity, but our tools and
services are availableinternationally. It doesn't
suicide prevention doesn't startwith one or two people that
there's a there's a part for allof us to play, and that means
you can get involved and make adifference. So you know, the
simplest way is, is donating,where we're in a position where
(31:28):
demand for our services is upand donations are being
squeezed, and the costs of ourservices are also going up. So
we're in quite a dangerousposition, as are many charities
in the sector where we'regetting squeezed, and because of
that, in a way as well, ourdemand is our demand is going
(31:49):
up. So by donating, by making aregular gift, every pound you
donate is going to help us makesure that we can continue being
there for people who need us.
For every pound you donate 80 3pso 83% of that will go to our
programs and our campaigns andour services, and then the
(32:10):
remaining 17% will be spent onadministration and fundraising
so that we can raise more moneyto make sure that our services
still going to be there. So it'sa good chunk so and then another
way you could do it, which Iabsolutely love, and obviously
this is how I got involved incalm, is by fundraising. So
whether that's organizing yourown event, we've seen people do
bake sales and gigs and comedyshows ice bucket challenges, or
(32:35):
whether it's running running amarathon or doing a fundraising
stream online, it's such,particularly if you've got
personal experience of it, it'ssuch an amazing feeling to raise
some money for an incredibleorganization, I would say, and
you get brilliant support, andyou get to join the kind of calm
fundraiser community, which isamazing. And then it doesn't
(33:00):
have to be just aboutfundraising like I said, I would
really encourage people to go toour website and read some of our
how to guides so that you canlearn how to spot the signs of
if someone's struggling to cope,what to do if you're feeling
like you need some support, justlearning some simple skills and
signposting that you can thatyou can go to, And if you're not
(33:20):
up for that right now, thereally simple thing you can do
is just sign up to ournewsletter, because then you'll
get, every month, you'll get afour or five curated points
saying, here are two or threeskills you could learn. Here's a
new campaign that we're workingon, here's a fundraising event,
which we'd love you to join, andthen you can just have a choice,
because it's not going to be allyear round, necessarily for
(33:42):
people, but sometime or sometimein the year, they might want to,
you might want to get involved.
So yeah, there's fundraising,donating, learning, just going
on a website and looking at thecontent we have, and then that
newsletter will bring everythingtogether once a month into your
inbox.
Agi Keramidas (34:00):
Thank you so much. I would encourage our
listeners, the mastery seeker,to follow through and go to the
website. Michael, there wasbefore I wrap up, I just
remembered something you weresaying about that tool that you
write your type your thoughts,and they go away. You send them
(34:21):
away. The word that came to mymind was cathartic. It sounds
like really so absolutely I wantto thank you very much for this
conversation today, I believe weshared the very important
message that deserves and mustbe heard much more than it is
(34:46):
right now, because also of itssublor The we talked about it
earlier, the stigma around it.
So I'm very happy. That weshared this formation and these
resources, really, I want towish you from my heart the very
(35:08):
best with carrying on with yourmission as charity, with suicide
prevention and changing the waypeople talk about it and deal
with it, as you were saying, Iwill leave it to you for your
final part in words,
Michael Jarvis (35:32):
thank you. No, it's been a real pleasure to be
to be on here. And like I said,the really important bit of work
that we try to do is breakingdown stigma and getting the word
out, and that means partneringwith comedy, music, sports and
podcasts. Hopefully, we're goingto do more and more of that
because, because people like youand podcasts like this have a
(35:56):
real positive influence and arole to play in people's lives.
So the more that we can partnerwith people like you and get
into, get into these rightspaces. That's that's the kind
of thing we want to be doing. Soyeah, thank you again for the
opportunity.
Agi Keramidas (36:13):
If this conversation resonated with you,
take action. Visitthecalmzone.net to access life
saving resources or considerdonating to help calm continue
their vital work. Together, wecan break the stigma and support
those in need. Until next time,stand out, don't fit in.
Did you know that one in five people will
experience suicidal thoughts atsome point in their lives? Yet
stigma keeps many from reachingout. What if simply asking, Are
you really okay? Could save alife? I Agi, welcome to Personal
(00:24):
Development mastery podcast. Iam your host, Agi Keramidas, and
this is episode 484 this year weare participating in podcast
zone, an incredible charitableevent in the podcasting world.
Podcast on is an event wheremultiple podcasts dedicate one
(00:47):
episode of their show to acharity and release them
simultaneously in mid March 2025to create a massive
international wave of inspiringaudio content. The objective of
this coordinated effort is toraise awareness for a huge
number of charities worldwide.
This year, it's over 1500podcasts participating, and
(01:13):
today I am dedicating thisepisode of personal development
mastery to highlight and supporta cause that I feel compelled to
share with you, campaign againstliving miserably, C, A, L, M,
calm. It is a suicide preventioncharity fighting to reduce the
(01:40):
devastating impact of suicide inthe UK. In the following
conversation, we talk aboutsuicide prevention, breaking
mental health, stigma and thepower of community support, this
episode could make a realdifference. If you know someone
(02:00):
who might be struggling or whowants to learn more about mental
health and suicide prevention,please share this conversation
with them. You never know theimpact it might have. Now, let's
get started today. It is mypleasure to speak with Michael
(02:23):
Jarvis, Michael, you are thedigital partnerships lead at
campaign against livingmiserably, c, a, l, m. Calm CALM
is a suicide prevention charityfighting to reduce the
devastating impact of suicide inthe UK, you are on a mission to
(02:45):
help people and their misery,not their lives. Michael,
welcome to the show. It's apleasure and also my duty to
highlight calm charity in thisyear's podcast on event.
Michael Jarvis (03:04):
Thank you so much for having me. It's a
pleasure to be part of it.
Agi Keramidas (03:07):
As I said, it is a pleasure and a sense of duty
at the same time, because it is,you know, COVID mission to
prevent suicide is a topic I wastelling you just before we
started recording, I feelcompelled to discuss and share,
(03:28):
and there is one statistic Iread in your website, which I
hadn't read before, and I foundunsettling, that one In five
people will have suicidalthoughts at some point in their
lives, which is a number way. Ididn't think that it would be so
big. I suppose many peopledon't. So in this conversation,
(03:53):
among other things, I would liketo explore suicide prevention
and the role of calm before wego there, I would like to ask
you to tell us briefly aboutcalm, but also your involvement
in calm and how it came about.
Michael Jarvis (04:16):
Course. Thank you. Yeah, so, like, like you
mentioned, so campaign againstliving miserably, also known as
calm. We're a suicide preventioncharity. We're here for anyone
struggling with life. We do thisin lots of ways. We've got
plenty of tools and resources tohelp people get the support they
need. That includes a helpline,which is open every day. It's
(04:39):
free, it's anonymous, and itgives support to anyone affected
by suicide or suicidal thoughts.
So that's you might bestruggling yourself, but you
might be worried about someoneelse, or you might have been
bereaved by suicide. You cancall the helpline for support,
and I think, like we sort oftouched on already, but people
who feel. Feel suicidal, theyoften say they don't want to
(05:01):
die. It's more that they kind ofwant that pain and misery that
they're experiencing to stop.
And when you're in thatposition, when you're
struggling, it can quite easilybecome like It's like there's no
way out, like you feel likethere's no other option but
suicide. And we get, we get thatfeeling at calm. We know we
(05:22):
understand where people arecoming from. We also know that
it never is the only option, andthere's always a reason to stay.
So that's why, as you mentionedat the beginning, our mission is
to help people in their miseryand not their lives. And we do
this through our services andour tools. We do this through
(05:42):
advice on helping other peoplenavigate the challenges that
might bring people to the brink.
And we'll get onto the differentways that we that we do that,
whether it's through our onlinetools that people can use, or
whether it's our guides thatpeople can can read, or it's the
helpline. And then finally, wecampaign, so it's in the name
campaign against every majorpeople, but we campaign to
ensure that everyone has theknowledge and skills to unite
(06:03):
against suicide, becauseultimately, we can't prevent
suicide through just one or twopeople or a couple of charities.
Everyone has to play their part,and everyone has a part to play.
I guess my personal connectionto this is quite close, quite
profound. A few years ago,actually, quite a few years ago.
Now, about 10 years ago, I losta very close friend to suicide.
(06:27):
His his name was Matt. He was 24when he when he died. So still
quite young. We felt, we feltolder at the time. But, you
know, looking back, we were allvery young, and it was, yeah,
like I say, very profoundexperience to go through
bereavement by suicide.
(06:47):
Obviously, all bereavement iscan be very difficult and
emotional. Bereavement bysuicide has a particularly
unique character and feel to it.
There's many, many emotionswrapped up of maybe a bit of
anger, maybe a bit of guilt,obviously sadness and regret,
and many stages in that of couldI have done something more to be
(07:09):
there for my friend? With withMatt, his experience when I was
grieving made me think, right? Iwant to do something in his
memory. I want to make adifference. So I decided to run
the Brighton marathon. Brightonis a city on the south coast of
of the UK. It's my hometown aswell, and I ran, ran the
Brighton marathon in Matt'smemory, but for calm. So for the
(07:32):
charity, I didn't work, work atcalm at that point, but so
worked and fundraised.
Fundraised for calm. And throughthat experience, I got exposed
to the charity, started talkingto some of the team, and then
when a job came up a couple ofyears later, I thought,
absolutely, that's exactly whatI want to go and do. So now I
get to, I get to go to workevery day before that can make a
(07:52):
big difference. Sometimes Ithink about Matt and the kind of
what he'd think about it, butnow it's, it's just a job that
I'm very proud to be able to
Agi Keramidas (08:02):
do. Thank you for sharing this story and how it
happened, and fundraising fromBrighton marathon to becoming
actively involved in thatcharity. It's, it sounds very
fascinating as a story, youknow, as a series of events,
(08:25):
Michael, before I discuss withyou, suicide prevention in
particular, there is somethingthat I would like to address,
and that is the stigma arounddiscussing suicide, mental
health in general, but suicide,I think there is even more. So.
(08:50):
How can we address this? How canwe reduce this?
Michael Jarvis (08:57):
It's an absolutely crucial question, and
actually the substance of that,and the substantive impact of
that is, we saw some statisticsrecently from the Office for
National Statistics, that's thegovernment body who revealed
that actually suicide is at itshighest rate in the UK, at
least, that it's been since for25 years, and you know that's
(09:24):
that could be all these peoplebehind these massive numbers are
real people. It could be afriend, a mother, a colleague,
anyone can feel suicidal. And asyou said, in fact, one in five
of us will experience suicidalthoughts at some point. It's a
very common and almost humanexperience to go through at
different different points inone's life, and yet there is
(09:48):
this stigma still around it.
Some of this stems fromhistorical, historical
backgrounds. So for example,until quite recently in the. UK,
so a few decades ago, it was acrime. So that's where we get
the phrase committed suicidefrom, because it was a crime to
attempt suicide, and you can beprosecuted for it. So that's
(10:10):
why, in general, we now tend tonot use the word commit suicide,
but might say attempted suicideinstead. This as a more kind of
helpful way to to look at itwhen, when it comes to stigma,
some of the thing that we wantto do is to change the
conversation around mentalhealth and suicide, because we
(10:31):
know that when people bring itout into the open, when people
talk about it, so many peoplehave that shared experience,
whether it's personally, whetherit's someone that's been
impacted that they know, and ourcampaigns and the work that we
do try to cut through the noiseof a lot of the Mental Health
conversation going on and usingpowerful methods embedded into
(10:53):
cultural society and people'slives, so that we're not trying
to shout from a Different angle.
So for example, we use thingslike music and comedy and sport
and gaming and everything inbetween to try and weave our
messages into the cultural,cultural character, I guess, of
(11:16):
people's lives, and encouragepeople to reach out to help.
Reach out for help and talk toothers. So that's that's our
approach at calm. And there aremany other ways of doing and
that starts at a smaller level,encouraging people to have open
conversations with their friendsand realizing that actually the
worst thing you can do is nottalk about it. It's not really
going to be a bad outcome fromtalking about it. Nothing worse
(11:40):
than not talking about it. Andthen all the way up to those
kind of national campaigns, eveninternational campaigns where
we're trying to change theculture and change the kind of
vocabulary around suicide tobreak out through that stigma.
Agi Keramidas (11:54):
Thank you. There is one thing that you said, I
underlined it in my notes, thatyou said that not only is common
suicidal thoughts, I mean, butit's part of human experience. I
had never thought of it before,but when, when I think of it is
like a like a consciousexperience. I suppose it's
(12:14):
normal in a way, to at somepoint question when that
experience would end, but that'sa very something interesting
that I got. But let's talk aboutsuicide awareness in particular,
and direct the conversationthere. And I would like to ask
(12:36):
you, I will ask the question asit is, and feel free to answer
in as little or much detail asyou want. My question is, what
are suicidal thoughts? But moreimportant than that, how do they
feel? Because I think there is acertain weight, shall we say, in
(12:56):
them, compared to other negativethoughts, absolutely,
Michael Jarvis (13:02):
absolutely. And it's essential that we
understand that at calm, becausethat's what guides all of our
products, all of our tools, allof our services. And I think
just quickly coming back to theit's a human experience type
thing, and how common it is.
There's an estimate that in theUK there are around 200,000
suicides attempts per year, andabout 125 people die per week.
(13:26):
So many more, many fewer deathsthan attempts. But really, you
know, if someone's getting intoa position where they feel like
they need to attempt at thatpoint, that's an awful situation
that shouldn't have got to thatthat far, and coming on to then
what suicidal thoughts are. Imean, at their base, it's, it's
(13:49):
about not wanting to live, asyou say, it's, it's about
wanting to try and end that painthat they're going through, and
then actively planning how tohow to end it, and these
thoughts talking about whythey're so human, they can come
from so many emotions ordifferent life events, and
anyone can experience them. Thisisn't just reserved for people
(14:12):
with mental health issues. Thisisn't reserved for people that
have gone through huge traumas.
In fact, in many cases, it canbe the combination of a few
different life events that justhappened all at the same time.
And that said, you know, thereare quite a few factors which
might trigger these thoughts orhave a contributive kind of
(14:36):
impact, so things like majorloss or trauma or setback, like
losing a loved one or or a jobor having kind of financial
difficulties, things like traumaand post traumatic stress
syndrome coming from difficultlife events. Mental health is a
(14:57):
is a big one. So if you have gotdepression or. Anxiety, then
that is quite a key indicator ofhigher risk of suicidal
thoughts. But then, as I said,things like loneliness or
experiencing bullying or havingmaybe thoughts around one's
identity, all of these thingscan contribute into a kind of
(15:20):
underlying sense of I haven'tgot much self worth. I feel very
entrapped. It's like I don't Idon't see another way out. And I
feel very lonely. I feel like Ican't connect with people or
talk to people about this andthose three things, a lack of
self worth, a lack of feelinglike there's anything else I can
do to that kind of entrapment,and then the isolation, that
(15:43):
loneliness, when those threethings come together, that's
when someone is at real risk ofsuicidal thoughts. And I guess
how they feel is going to bedifferent to different people,
but quite often they'll emergeduring times of distress or
sadness, some of these will befleeting feelings. So it might
(16:04):
be an extended period ofsadness, throughout which you
get fleeting moments ofsuicidality. And for most
people, they are temporary.
However, when these thoughtspersist and they come back and
again and again, they can spiraland they can become
overwhelming, and if you'restruggling with persistent
suicidal thoughts, it'sessential you talk to someone,
(16:25):
because that's how we break thatcycle. We break the spiral. We
stop it from becomingoverwhelming. And actually quite
a lot of the advice that we giveis super practical and super
pragmatic. It's about if you'restruggling, or if you feel like
you're going down that path.
(16:46):
What can you change? Is thereanything you can change that's
really triggering that? Andactually just give yourself some
time to stay and decide not todo anything, because there's a
really good chance that thosefeelings will be gone even
within an hour, you know thatmoment will pass, and that's
then when you can get advice andsupport and put in place things
(17:09):
that will prevent you fromgetting there again in the
future. So yeah, it's, I thinkquite often, people will think
of suicidal thoughts as quitefundamental, concrete things
that you know a person issuicidal, that is them, when
actually that is not the case.
It's someone who might be goingthrough a really tough time, and
(17:29):
for an hour they feel suicidal,and then they decide to act on
it. And that's, that's how ithappens quite, quite often.
Sometimes it will be persistent,as we say, and people will have
suicidal thoughts over a longtime. But that's not always the
case, and it comes in alldifferent shapes and forms.
Agi Keramidas (17:49):
Thank you for this answer, and you also
answered a couple of more thingsthat I wanted to clarify. So
thank you for doing it already,but I wanted to ask. One was why
people have suicidal thoughts?
And you described, you said, Iremember a phrase. You said that
this is not reserved for peoplewho have mental health. It is.
(18:11):
It can happen to anyone. Soalso, of course, the life's
events or factors like this. Andthe other thing was about
warning signs, shall we say,because there are different. You
(18:32):
know, it's different. If youhave a fleeting thought that
lasts a few seconds. It'sdifferent, different when you
are you use the phrase that Ithink is a very key in in all
this, and I will highlight thiswas spiral, spiral down. It is
(18:53):
when you know the it goes waymore than one initially thought
that this thought would turninto so there is one other you
know, regarding suicideawareness, one other angle that
I would like to see this from,and that is from the angle of
(19:16):
identifying some signs on adifferent on another person. I
suppose that is something veryimportant and useful. So I would
like to hear your thoughts onthat and anything you would like
to add on what I said.
Michael Jarvis (19:40):
Yeah, absolutely, absolutely, um,
because we said at the top,preventing suicide is something
we can all play a part in, andwe've all got a part to play.
And actually, just by learning afew fairly simple, fairly basic
things to pick up and bringabout, bring around with you in
your your daily life. If you canmake quite a quite a big impact
(20:03):
and be much more aware to thepeople around you and asking
someone how they there's a,there's, you know, asking
someone how they really feel.
Like asking, how are you doing,and then asking, actually, how
are you doing? Again, that's,that's a, that's a bit of a
trope nowadays, but it'sactually something really
believe in. And some, you know,that kind of brief, oh, I'm
good. Don't worry about it. I'mfine. Can often, quite can quite
(20:25):
often hide the real kind ofemotion and turmoil going on.
And we like to say, you know,we're not experts in this. And
actually, you'll know yourfriends, and you'll know the
people around you better thanbetter than most. So if you feel
like there's something up withsomeone, then that is always a
good moment to do it. So youknow, regardless of if you have
(20:47):
something specific, you canpoint out, like a specific sign,
if you feel like there'ssomething up, there's a good
chance there might be. And theworst case scenario of asking if
someone's if how someone'sreally doing is they go, Yeah,
I'm completely fine. Why are youasking about it? Whereas the
worst case scenario of notasking is obviously much more,
(21:08):
much more impactful and kind ofcatastrophic. So that said,
thinking there are some warningsigns that someone might be
struggling to cope. Andactually, we've got, I'm gonna
list a few of you, three ofthese for you, but they're on
our website. There's, there'splenty more for people to look
at. So things like drastic moodswings or irritability. And
(21:31):
again, this is all relevant tothe person or relative to the
person, I should say. So ifsomeone's quite calm, usually
maybe quite quiet, and suddenlythey become a bit manic and
loud, then that's an indicationthat something, something might
be going on similarly, the otherway, withdrawing from social
activities, maybe a lack ofenergy or motivation, even
(21:52):
physical things like neglectingpersonal hygiene or appearance.
Maybe if there's someone whotakes a lot of care in their
appearance, and then slowlyseems to be, yeah, losing that,
losing that care that also mightbe linking into kind of risk
taking or reckless behavior ifthey if they weren't before,
quite a big one maybe towardsthe a good sign that someone has
(22:17):
really made plans to to attemptsuicide, is that they start
giving away possessions. Sothat's something that we'll
you'll see. They won'tnecessarily say why, but they'll
start giving away possessions topeople around them, and then, of
course, saying goodbye toothers, saying goodbye as if
they're not going to see youagain. And you might pick up on
(22:38):
these things and be like, Oh,that's that feels slightly odd.
That's, that's out of place. Andour advice here is, if you're
concerned, it's better to ask,don't be afraid and openly use
the word suicide. So it's, it'sa it's a sticky word to use. We
still got that stigma around it.
(22:59):
You know, I've been working init for three years or so, and I
still sometimes find myselfgoing suicide, you know, to try
and get it, get it out there,but actually talking openly
about suicide and asking, Areyou thinking about suicide? If
you think someone's struggling,will never increase the risk,
and it's always going to helpsomeone make make them feel less
(23:20):
isolated. The advice after thatis that if they were, if they
respond and say yes, acknowledgetheir feelings, make sure you're
actively listening which which,I can tell you're great at
repeating back things to peopleand showing that you've really
listened to them, and offeringreassurance and then being
(23:41):
certain that it's not your job,it's not your responsibility to
make sure that they are safegoing forward, or at least, it's
not your responsibility aloneand that actually there are
services like calm, there areservices like Samaritans. There
are other friends and familythat they can talk to. You can
talk to their GP. That's whereyou need to start bringing in
(24:01):
the network of options. Andagain, there's lots of advice on
our website about the differentthings that you might take
someone towards, but just inthat moment, having the bravery
to talk about suicide openlywith someone can make all the
difference. And all it takes, asI mentioned before, is getting
them through that next hour,maybe two hours, maybe saying
(24:24):
right, get through today andlater on, I'll help you call the
GP, or I'll help you call yourparents. That can make a massive
difference, and that can be allyou need to do sometimes.
Agi Keramidas (24:35):
Thank you, and I like that. You are ahead of me.
You are answering my nextquestion before I access so I
think this, there is a nice flowto this conversation. My next
question will be dealing with,you know, suicidal thoughts and
(24:58):
you you have discussed. Already,you mentioned some things. I
would like to ask you also, ifwe look at it from because you
mentioned from the perspectiveof someone who is concerned
about their friend and askingthem, are you thinking about
suicide? And I would like to askthe reversal. If one finds
(25:23):
themselves in the position ofthinking about and want to reach
out to someone does the samething applied. Do you go
straight at it and say, youknow, I'm thinking, or I'm of
suicide, or I have suicidalthoughts.
Michael Jarvis (25:43):
So from the out perspective, so at calm we talk
quite a lot about there's been alot. There's been a big push on
encouraging people to reach out,which is really important, and
that's, I'll come back to thatin a second. It's vitally
important as well, that othersare taught how to reach in and
so that there is, there is thatmeeting in the middle, and
(26:05):
that's, that's where, when wetalk about using the word
suicide, you're you're creatingan environment for that person
where they know you'recomfortable and safe talking
about the word suicide, so theydon't have to hide it behind
different words or differentvocabulary, or they don't have
to hide their true feelingsbecause they know you don't feel
(26:25):
stigmatic towards towards it.
The other way round, I guess, isslightly more sensitive, because
it's always going to be down tothat person and their their
sense of their own safety andwhat they feel they can
communicate. So, yes, ouradvice, you know, in a our
advice would be, if you arefeeling suicidal, reach out and
(26:46):
directly talk to someone andsay, I am feeling suicidal. We
know that can be incredibly hardto do. So in fact, just just a
case of reaching out to someoneand saying, I'm struggling right
now can be an easier way to openup that conversation. It's
whatever works for that personin that moment. We wouldn't want
(27:09):
the word suicide to be a blockerto reaching out in in some way
we quite find so our helpline,our suicide prevention helpline,
completely anonymous, as youmentioned, paid professionals.
So all of our helpline staff areusually therapists or counselors
or some kind of support workerwith a background in in this.
(27:33):
And they're all trained, which Ithink is this is a brilliant
part of our helpline. They'reall trained in specific issues
that might be trending, ortrending is the wrong word, but
there might be a commonexperience at that time. So for
example, during the cost ofliving crisis, all of our
helpline staff got training onfinancial issues so that they'd
(27:53):
have really pragmatic, practicaladvice on what to give to people
who are struggling with money,but the anonymous side of it is
actually really helpful. Youknow, it can be great talking to
a friend or family member.
Sometimes it's way easier totalk to a stranger or someone
that you know, someone youhaven't met, someone that can
(28:14):
offer an objective butcompassionate perspective on it,
and then give you advice on whatto do next. So that's what we'd
encourage to do, is just reachout in whatever way you feel is
possible at that point, ifyou're feeling suicidal, then
the helpline is there for you.
The remit is for suicidalpeople. If you're worried about
(28:35):
someone who's suicidal, or ifyou're bereaved by suicide, if
you're not quite as far as thatat that point, then we've still
got lots of tools and serviceson our website, and there's lots
of other mental health supportout there. But yeah, sometimes
talking to a professionalstranger can make a big
difference and make it easier.
Agi Keramidas (28:58):
Talking about the helpline, the tools on the
website and so on. I would liketo ask you to share with us the
website and where people canfind that even more importantly,
how can listeners support calm?
Michael Jarvis (29:17):
Yeah, absolutely. So our website is
the calm zone.net so it's thecalm zone.net will on there.
You'll find a mixture of supportand tools and services, things
about our existing campaignsthat are going on that you can
get involved in. But our toolsthere'll be connections to the
(29:38):
helpline. So you can find thehelpline there. There's also all
of our guides and our How toarticles. So that's practical
advice, real tips on how to getthrough whatever you're going to
be, whether that's exam stress,whether that's job issues,
whether that's loneliness.
There's about 50 differentarticles on different topics
there with connections todifferent. Support Services as
(29:59):
well, and there's a bunch ofonline tools as well which you
can use. There's a goodsometimes to take a pause and
reset. There's one that I'veused before called offload your
thoughts, which is literallyjust a box on our website. You
can type in whatever you'refeeling, whatever you're
struggling with, press Enter andit disappears when we're not
(30:20):
collecting any data. Don'tworry. It just disappears into
the into the digital ether,never to be seen again. And
actually, the research and thestatistics on that is that it
makes a substantive differenceon alleviating your worries. And
it can be as simple as that, youjust write it down, send it
away. So I use that not often,but I've definitely used it a
(30:42):
few times, and it's and it'sworked for me. So you don't even
have to be, you know, feeling inthat suicidal point. You might
just have a worry or an issue,write it down, send it away, and
suddenly it feels bettersomehow, which is an interesting
one for human psychology, isn'tit? And then, how can people get
involved? We'd love as manypeople as possible to get
(31:04):
involved, because we're a UKbased charity, but our tools and
services are availableinternationally. It doesn't
suicide prevention doesn't startwith one or two people that
there's a there's a part for allof us to play, and that means
you can get involved and make adifference. So you know, the
simplest way is, is donating,where we're in a position where
(31:28):
demand for our services is upand donations are being
squeezed, and the costs of ourservices are also going up. So
we're in quite a dangerousposition, as are many charities
in the sector where we'regetting squeezed, and because of
that, in a way as well, ourdemand is our demand is going
(31:49):
up. So by donating, by making aregular gift, every pound you
donate is going to help us makesure that we can continue being
there for people who need us.
For every pound you donate 80 3pso 83% of that will go to our
programs and our campaigns andour services, and then the
(32:10):
remaining 17% will be spent onadministration and fundraising
so that we can raise more moneyto make sure that our services
still going to be there. So it'sa good chunk so and then another
way you could do it, which Iabsolutely love, and obviously
this is how I got involved incalm, is by fundraising. So
whether that's organizing yourown event, we've seen people do
bake sales and gigs and comedyshows ice bucket challenges, or
(32:35):
whether it's running running amarathon or doing a fundraising
stream online, it's such,particularly if you've got
personal experience of it, it'ssuch an amazing feeling to raise
some money for an incredibleorganization, I would say, and
you get brilliant support, andyou get to join the kind of calm
fundraiser community, which isamazing. And then it doesn't
(33:00):
have to be just aboutfundraising like I said, I would
really encourage people to go toour website and read some of our
how to guides so that you canlearn how to spot the signs of
if someone's struggling to cope,what to do if you're feeling
like you need some support, justlearning some simple skills and
signposting that you can thatyou can go to, And if you're not
(33:20):
up for that right now, thereally simple thing you can do
is just sign up to ournewsletter, because then you'll
get, every month, you'll get afour or five curated points
saying, here are two or threeskills you could learn. Here's a
new campaign that we're workingon, here's a fundraising event,
which we'd love you to join, andthen you can just have a choice,
because it's not going to be allyear round, necessarily for
(33:42):
people, but sometime or sometimein the year, they might want to,
you might want to get involved.
So yeah, there's fundraising,donating, learning, just going
on a website and looking at thecontent we have, and then that
newsletter will bring everythingtogether once a month into your
inbox.
Agi Keramidas (34:00):
Thank you so much. I would encourage our
listeners, the mastery seeker,to follow through and go to the
website. Michael, there wasbefore I wrap up, I just
remembered something you weresaying about that tool that you
write your type your thoughts,and they go away. You send them
(34:21):
away. The word that came to mymind was cathartic. It sounds
like really so absolutely I wantto thank you very much for this
conversation today, I believe weshared the very important
message that deserves and mustbe heard much more than it is
(34:46):
right now, because also of itssublor The we talked about it
earlier, the stigma around it.
So I'm very happy. That weshared this formation and these
resources, really, I want towish you from my heart the very
(35:08):
best with carrying on with yourmission as charity, with suicide
prevention and changing the waypeople talk about it and deal
with it, as you were saying, Iwill leave it to you for your
final part in words,
Michael Jarvis (35:32):
thank you. No, it's been a real pleasure to be
to be on here. And like I said,the really important bit of work
that we try to do is breakingdown stigma and getting the word
out, and that means partneringwith comedy, music, sports and
podcasts. Hopefully, we're goingto do more and more of that
because, because people like youand podcasts like this have a
(35:56):
real positive influence and arole to play in people's lives.
So the more that we can partnerwith people like you and get
into, get into these rightspaces. That's that's the kind
of thing we want to be doing. Soyeah, thank you again for the
opportunity.
Agi Keramidas (36:13):
If this conversation resonated with you,
take action. Visitthecalmzone.net to access life
saving resources or considerdonating to help calm continue
their vital work. Together, wecan break the stigma and support
those in need. Until next time,stand out, don't fit in.
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