233: Healing the Patriarchal Wound with Mother Gaia

The collective carries a “God wound” because of patriarchal dogma and the rejection of communion with nature as a way to connect to the Divine.

After being disillusioned by dogmatic religious teachings, a profound experience with a Native American medicine man opened Mare Cromwell (@greatmotherloveway) to channel the messages of Mother Gaia. 

She shares her transformational journey of surrendering to the Earth Mother's guidance through the sacred act of writing...in her books "The Great Mother Bible" and "Messages from Mother Earth Mother." Through the process of opening to Gaia's loving presence, Mare learned to give voice to her long-suppressed earth-honoring spiritual nature and discovered that self-compassion and reverence for the natural world were the gateways to her healing.

 

• Nature’s COMMUNICATION with our souls is as natural as a mother & child’s.

• The critical need to honor the SACRED FEMININE and our connection to Mother Earth

• Words and language as a PORTAL for shedding religious wounding and reclaiming our place in the web of life

WATCH this episode on my YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/@SoulRoseShow

Mare will be guiding us in a free Mother Gaia GROUP MEDITATION on May 13th. To attend, ask to join our private Facebook group, Soul Rose COMMUNITY! https://www.facebook.com/groups/353442392180748/

 

...

Get my Free WHOLE BODY Healing Mini-Course: 

https://www.cherieburton.com/freeminicourse

 

Follow Mare on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/greatmotherloveway/

 

Mare mentioned the Thousand Goddesses gathering that takes place every Fall. The next one is Nov 2nd. These are ceremonies all over the world, invoking the divine feminine www.1000goddesses.net

 

Follow me on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/cherie.burton/

Episode Transcript

(00:02):
Mare, thank you so much for being on the Soul Rose Show, and
thank you to our mutual friend Melissa for connecting us.
Well, I'm really honored to be here. I just, I think this is going to
be a very fun conversation, Cherie. Yeah. And I am saying your name,
right? Yeah, yeah. Great. Yeah.

(00:22):
You know, when you and I talked, however, Minnie, a couple of weeks ago,
I had taken some notes, and then you sent me your books, and I
had some time to do some reflection on our conversation,
which was we actually went really deep, really fast, which I appreciated. We
did. We just leaped right into it. We totally did. And so I
have these great notes. But also, when I got your books after the fact, I

(00:45):
was like, ooh, there's even better stuff for us to explore. But
today we're going to just dial in on
who and what mother Gaia is,
and we'll start there. But then I also want to move us into
this discussion around what is happening to
the resources and kind of

(01:08):
the vision for the future and then also
some wounding around God that,
you know, like, if mother could talk about the God wound, what
would she say? And we're going to have some discussions around religion as
well. But let's start with
a little of your story, just the condensed, like how this

(01:30):
path found you, how mother found you. And I'm always
intrigued by women who just say yes to divine mother.
And I'm curious. I know a little of your. Well, I do know your story,
but I'm thinking our listeners would be super curious, like, why is she
channeling Gaia, Mother? And what is Mother
Gaia? And. Yeah, lead us into that. Right.

(01:53):
Well, first of all, I want to share a little bit about
Mother Gaia. I call her mother Gaia. A lot of people call her Earth Mother
Mother Earth. She has different names and all sorts
of different cultures. All indigenous peoples
work with her, honor her, revere her. They never lost their
connection with her. So she goes by Pachamama

(02:16):
in the andes. I mean,
there are many, many names for her. And she is our
planetary caretaker. She is a very, very
powerful spiritual being. And a lot of people who are
raised in the abrahamic traditions know of,
for instance, the archangels. And the analogy I

(02:38):
draw is that think of the archangels and who they are as
very powerful spiritual beings and know that mother Gaia
is another type of spiritual being. And
from what I understand, this is, may get there, out there for people, is
there are planetary caretakers for every planet in the universe.
There are specific types of spiritual beings who take on this

(03:01):
role and having said that,
Earth is a very unique planet. We
are a planet of tremendous biodiversity, tremendous, tremendous
beauty, and we also are a planet
that from the very get go, the creation of the
planet was. There's a spiritual blueprint

(03:24):
that was put into place for Earth to be a planet of very high spiritual
consciousness. And all this evolution
that has been taking place since the very first cell evolved in the water
has been coordinated under a
divine plan, a master plan, to rise,
raise up the spiritual energies here on the planet with humans being part

(03:46):
of this. And
so. And you're welcome to ask me any questions there. If you want for me
to elaborate about our planetary caretaker before I get into how it
is that I have surrendered. Yeah, I love it. It's reminding me of, like,
guardians of the galaxy. Sorry to be so light about it, but

(04:07):
I have heard in many spiritual circles and
by different, you know, consciousness teachers,
that, yes, I mean,
humanity is, I want to say,
like a grand, universal experiment,
but it's also just this testing ground for

(04:28):
how consciousness can expand and evolve under certain
conditions. Earth being, I guess, a little more
treacherous than you're. I mean, it holds this polarity
as opposed to many other planets. That's
why there's such a vested interest from, let's just say,
caretakers of other planets or other

(04:52):
life forms. You could say, have this vested interest
in what's happening on earth because of its, like you're saying, the
biodiversity and the complexity.
Well, that's a really good question. It's complicated.
My understanding, what you're talking about, it's
very complicated. First of all,

(05:15):
there are many, many conscious beings here on Earth, beyond
humans. And I'm just going to go right out there and say, hello,
Sasquatch. It's so funny.
Sorry, I don't mean to interrupt you. I was just conversation about
that with someone. Well, I have a sister that lives in Oregon, so, anyway,
move along with that. Okay, go ahead.

(05:37):
Yeah. No, Sasquatch are a very misunderstood
species, if I might call them a species. They are a species here on Earth.
They're very, very highly evolved, and yet they
have been perceived by our western culture to be
big, hairy monsters. You know, Bigfoot. They're stupid,
and it's completely erroneous. And

(06:00):
they are highly, highly intelligent. They're considered one of the
guardians, caretakers of mother Gaia. Their role on the
planet is very important, and they're the only being on the
planet that can appear in the physical, that hasn't been trapped, hasn't
been domesticated. You won't find them in zoos. They're too smart for
that. And so I'm just talking about them

(06:22):
as an example of a very, very highly conscious being here
on the planet along with humans.
And the fact of the matter is, actually, is that the trees are very, very
conscious. The flowers. And then.
I love working with the nature spirit realms. They very much exist
in the multidimensional planes around us. They're incredibly conscious and

(06:44):
very highly evolved. So we have, within
our western mindset, and this is where I use the term cultural
conditioning, have been given this story that
humans are the apex of all life here on
earth. And that's never been the truth. And it's really.
This perception has not served us, and it's not serving the

(07:06):
planet and all the other beings here on the planet, by any means.
Have you heard of the luminaries? Like the book, the luminary?
It's a book that somebody channeled or wrote that I read many,
many years ago. I want to say I read it 15 years ago about guardians
over their different crystals and rocks

(07:27):
and the elementals and.
You know what I mean? Like guardians of the air and the fire and the
water. And is that in
conjunction with Mother Gaia? And is she sort of the main
overseer of all of those realms?
Sorry, I'm asking, reflect. No, I love your questions.

(07:50):
I love your questions. There are spiritual
councils on many, many levels. In many
domains here on Earth. There are spiritual councils off planet.
And the elementals that you're
talking about, the luminaries, is an interesting term.
I didn't read that book. And if I understood what you're asking.

(08:12):
There is, for instance, within the water
realms, there's a king and the queen, elemental,
over the water realms. And they're not
hierarchical the way we think of hierarchical. And yet they still are the
overarching beings that within
their realms, there are many, many other water nature spirits.

(08:34):
It's vast intelligence within the water. And the same goes for the air, the
same goes for fire. There's a mother of fire,
father of fire, and then there's mother
of Earth. But that's not Earth mother. That's a different elemental, sort
of king and queen.
And here's an interesting side fact that's very important, actually,

(08:57):
to consider at this time, is that a lot of the extreme weather that's happening
these days is not just because of
climate change, due to rising CO2 levels. It's because
these elementals, who are very powerful spiritual beings, are
whipping up the energies within these storms to clear the denser
energies. They're constantly coming in

(09:19):
because we humans are really good at getting caught up in our drama
trauma, which is something we're going to touch on more.
I know in this interview of why are we so caught up in our drama
trauma? Why are we so caught up in our fear and anxiety and sense of
lack? And these energies get mired in the
multidimensional planes here on Earth. And so these really big storms are

(09:41):
clearing the energies and it's all making
way for the rising of the energies on the planet,
supporting that so that we can make the shift that we're in the
midst of to a new earth, to a new,
what people call the ascension. Yeah.
That narrative flies in the face of a punitive God who's destroying

(10:03):
the earth because we're so evil and
controlling the elements and the seas. You know what I'm saying? I was
actually taught in my religion of origin that Satan has control of
all water, all waters of the earth. Oh, my
gosh. That is so. I know
I was serving a mission for the Lds church when I was in my early

(10:25):
twenties, and we were not allowed to go near water for that
reason, so. Oh, that makes me so
sad. Water so nurturing. Yeah.
There was no talk of mother just being clear here, right?
Yeah. No talk of math. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Okay. She got. No, you go ahead.

(10:49):
No, I was just going to say, just to sort of, I know this is,
we're trying to give language to these powers and
forces and roles that
these powerful beings play. And
so I know it's hard to put into language, but just further
clarifying about mother Gaia. So she's her own

(11:10):
sovereign spiritual being,
because I think of mother Gaia and I think of, and I think a lot
of other people think of mother Earth this way,
as that, how can a planet have its own spirit
or be its own being? And I'm trying to, in my
mind, marry those two ideas

(11:33):
conceptually. Right? Like, is she
a form of a personage?
You know what I'm saying? Or, I mean, she is feminine.
Obviously she is
feminine. She doesn't body the divine
feminine. She. Gosh, I'm trying

(11:54):
to figure out how to answer your question, because to me it just is like,
well, she is. You know, but for those of
us who have this conditioning around literality, when you talk
about a being, it goes straight to a
human formed
consciousness. Spirit form.

(12:15):
Yeah, a human and spirit form.
Yeah.
Well, this is why I draw the analogy of, if you think about the
archangels, most of them have never been in
the physical here on earth. If you have.
Don't ask me to go into specifics there.

(12:37):
For instance, Enoch is in the early, the
first testament, the first book of the Bible,
and he's a very powerful spiritual being who
chose to take on a human body for a couple of incarnations. But
for the most part, he is a spiritual being who
exists in the spiritual planes, within the universal realms, and supports

(12:59):
Earth. So mother Gaia is
a spiritual being who is
not human. She never was human. She comes from
a specific group of spiritual beings who have
the role of being planetary caretakers,
and she carries a lot of energy.

(13:24):
I can feel her coming in a lot of times,
and I haven't even told this story about how it is that I surrendered to
serve her. We'll get to that. I know, because I'm like,
yeah, well. I hope I'm making sense with
it. It does make sense to me. Totally does. It wouldn't, like, I would have
kept drilling you on it before just to kind of be. Because in

(13:46):
my. My old belief system,
life and I think our brains have to do this
for us to make sense of the world. And it's
like, what form is she in? I would have
had to know because of the way that I
was conditioned. How could this being be real if they don't

(14:09):
have, even in spirit form, a human personage?
Right. It's just hard for us to connect
to beings like, you're saying, the sasquatch and other things. Like, at least I know
that form because I've seen, you know, whatever
the art and the pictures and whatnot. But for what we're talking
about, for people to

(14:31):
connect
to Mother Gaia, it's hard to
connect if we don't have a semblance in our mind
of what form she is in.
No, I hear you. And this is. It's interesting to me because
mother Gaia and the Virgin Mary are very, very close. They work

(14:54):
together very closely, and yet
it's very easy to find a statue or an image
of the Virgin Mary. I mean, I actually wear
a miraculous medal around my neck that represents the Virgin Mary, but
I also wear a turtle. And the turtle
represents Mother Gaia in a number of different native traditions

(15:16):
here in North America for Turtle island. So,
you know, we use symbols. Native peoples use
symbols for her.
She. Some people draw her as a human
looking body, and there was like. There was a parquet ad. I don't know if
you remember this many, many years ago. I kind of. The banner.

(15:39):
Yes. It's like, it's not nice to fool mother Nature, you know,
and they give her a parquet and tell her it's better, and she tastes it
and she likes it, and then she's told it's margarine. And in there, they have
her as an actress wearing a poofy blouse and a fruffy
skirt. But this is where
it's really important for us to do what we can to expand

(15:59):
our minds, expand our imaginations, because
even outside of mother Gaia herself, we
are surrounded by all these spiritual beings who
support the vitality, all life on the planet. And there
are people that I know personally who can see nature spirits. They can
see the gnomes, they can see the dwarves. I know people like that too.

(16:21):
Yeah. Yeah. So I would say that's
similar, although mother Gaia is much, much bigger. Okay.
Yeah, yeah, that's in my mind, I
just see, like, I have. I'm just going to
show this to everyone who's watching on YouTube,
but I have this beautiful, like, I have seven archetypes on my wall

(16:44):
in cards, like, images from different card decks. I
have this one is Sophia,
which is mother of all, mother of the universe.
Mother Sophia, you know, she's different than Gaia, but
I need it. And she's in a rose in the universe in this card. This
is a Rebecca Campbell deck from the rose deck.

(17:06):
And for me, I just have to see the symbol like you're talking about.
I have to look at it so that I feel that connection
visually to who I'm communicating
with. And, you know, it's just one artist's rendition, but
for me, it resonates because it's a rose. And that's my symbol
in my archetypal subconscious. That's the symbol that

(17:29):
resonates for me. Well, you have one of
my books next to you there, right? The great mother Bible. Do. Will
you show that? Because that image is
what mother Gaia, when I was working on that book with her, because that's a
series of conversations with her, and people can't see it right now because I'm
talking. Unless you have. I don't know how you. No, I have it. It's a

(17:50):
gallery view. Yeah, they can see it. Oh, great. Perfect. So
she wanted that image. She wanted the wrinkles in her
face. She wanted to be seen as
just embodying so much love
toward all life here on earth and toward this glowing
orb, which is the new earth coming in. So if that helps

(18:11):
you to use to look at that image.
Yeah. Like it. Really? Yes. Okay. Yes. And it's
so funny because I think even in the email I'm like, I just read your
grandmother book. I know. And I'm like, I read on the book she's
talking about. I know what it's called. But that was. Yeah, yeah.
So, yeah, that makes sense because I study depth psychology,

(18:33):
jungian and archetypal,
how our subconscious speaks to us through symbols. Exactly what
you're saying. You know, we see it. You even say
the word archangel, and immediately I'm like, oh, yeah,
okay. I get what they mean to me. In my brain, in my mind,
what I see, which is not wings and a sword, it's

(18:55):
different. But I think we got too caught up. And
then the reason I'm drilling you on this is because I know
that my past self, like I said in
my old belief system, would have needed
form. Form to know the mystery of it, to
understand it before I could believe it was real.

(19:18):
Right? And so now, just using these
archetypes and these symbols, it can
be enough for me now, right? But before, I was just like, oh, my
gosh, this feels like cosmic soup stuff. This feels like nothing
I can hold on to and attach to. Feels so
ethereal. You know?

(19:40):
I have a strong temptation right now to
call on mother to come in spiritually
so that you can feel this energy,
because this is where.
And I hear what you're saying, and I can understand what you're saying because I
probably was there many years ago with my catholic upbringing,

(20:01):
but now we're. Going to go there. We are going to go there. We're going
to go there. But now I've come to a place where
if I feel an energy coming in, I can
discern this is another spiritual being coming in. I don't need to see it.
Some people can. I work with people who can, but I can feel
it. And I can. I can discern. And usually gets the point when, if

(20:24):
I'm talking about a spiritual being, they come in anyway because
multidimensionally, they know they're being mentioned,
so. And I still want to get to the story of how it is that
I have gotten so close to mother. We'll get to that in a moment.
But are you okay with that? Yeah. I want to flow with what's coming through
for sure. Okay. All right.

(20:45):
Oh, I am that. I am
humbly calling on mother, mother Gaia.
To please come and fill
Cherie's space. In my space.
Help us feel you, mother. Help us experience you.

(21:08):
Please touch our hearts.

(21:46):
Yeah. If I can speak, it feels
like a pulse, like my heartbeat, like
something co regulating with my heartbeat. That's how I feel it. And I
also feel in my second chakra womb
area just this really beautiful, peaceful glow.

(22:06):
And it's almost like, oh, well, I was
waiting for something to bowl me over, but then I realized, like,
I feel this way a lot. She's always
there, right? Yes. But thank you
for that beautiful assurance and reminder for calling that
in. I think we forget to ask, you know. Oh,

(22:28):
yeah, we need to call them in, you know. I mean, that's
one of the things universal law is that they're not meant to come in
until we ask, you know, we have free will.
We can choose to work with them or not, you know, invite their love in
or not, but they're yearning for us to call on them and invite their
love in. And it was interesting because I got the sense that she was behind

(22:50):
you, like, you know, this beautiful,
hugely warm hearted being, just holding you,
like, holding you from behind. I was feeling. I
could feel that, too. I could feel just an
overall warmth around me,
a glow. Yeah. Yeah.

(23:12):
And, you know, love is huge, and I. And I think that
there's just a lot of fear around connecting to something other than
a father God somewhere in the heavens. So we'll get
to that, the fear around that. But I want you to take
us through, because I know you had a really pronounced health
crisis that led you into this path that you're on now.

(23:36):
And usually there's this rite of passage that every healer way
shower teacher goes through to put them kind of
like, in the work they're doing and on the map of consciousness that they're meant
to be on. So. Yeah. Why don't you share with our listeners about evolution for
you? Well, I had
already apprenticed with a Cherokee medicine woman for

(23:58):
14 years, and then she and I parted ways,
and the following year,
I befriended an Algonquin medicine man. Shortly
after, the teacher and I disconnected,
and we really hit it off,
and there were all sorts of miracles happening just when

(24:19):
we met. I went to one of his workshops, and
about a year later, he contacted me because he lived in a different state from
where I was. And he said, gaia. He calls her Gaia. And he'd been
working closely with Gaia for many, many years, and she actually appeared
to him one time as a column of wispy vapor on a trail.
He was hiking by himself. And she appeared and

(24:43):
identified herself as Gaia. And they had a really long conversation, like 3 hours, and
she proceeded to tell him certain things that were going to happen in his life
right after they met. And he was like, oh, no, that's impossible.
I can't. You know, that won't happen. And they all happened. And
so his rapport with her was very close, so she contacted him where
they were in communication. He was doing ceremony, and she

(25:05):
requested that he and I do a ceremony together for her
a month later. And he contacted me, and I said, oh, yes, of course
I will do that. You know, I'd love to do that. And
I hadn't been feeling well for a number of months. And later on that month,
this was May of 2012. Later on that month, at the end of
May, I was diagnosed with lymphoma, cancer of the

(25:27):
lymph nodes. And this was four days before I
was scheduled to do the ceremony with this Algonquin medicine man.
And I knew I was going to do the ceremony. Nothing was going to stop
me, even though I was freaking out about this diagnosis and afraid of what the
doctors were going to ask me to do and take and chemo and etcetera,
etcetera. And so I drove up to

(25:48):
the northern part of Pennsylvania, kind of met halfway because he's in the
Hudson river valley, and I was in Maryland at the time,
and we did a ceremony in a forest there, a huge state
forest. And he said to me just prior to starting the
ceremony, he knew what my situation was. He knew I had the cancer diagnosis and
all that. And he said, I'm going to be

(26:10):
bringing Gaia's energy and conscious into your energy body, but I don't know how
you're going to disconnect afterwards. And my response to him in the moment
was, I'm not worried because I know whatever's meant to happen is going to
happen. And I know my life is a served mother already
because I've been an environmentalist and then studied with a Cherokee teacher. And so I'd
already been developing a really strong sense of

(26:31):
birth mother and mother Gaia. But this took her to another
level because right at the end of the ceremony, she started talking to
me very clearly, like, you're hearing me right now.
Then she said that if I surrendered to her to the extent she would ask
me to surrender, that she would help me heal from the cancer without the doctors.
And of course, in that moment, I'm like, yes, of course. Big

(26:54):
fat, yes. So I kind of joke about it. Like, she got me,
you know, she got me. I mean, if it had been a year
before, I would have been like, I don't really know. This sounds, like, really big
and scary, you know? But in that situation, I was terrified and she's like,
I'm here to help you, but the deal is that you surrendered to me
to follow through on what she was going to ask me to do. And so

(27:16):
that's what's played out since that early June of
2012. And there's so many miracles that have happened, like,
within, gosh, a week and a half after that. I was
spiritually called by the dolphins and whales, and I knew it was mother working through
them to go to the ocean and do ceremony. And I love doing
ceremony. I learned a lot about doing it when I was with the

(27:37):
Cherokee teacher. And on the way to the
beach, three hour drive, I filled my little car
up with. I had a little TDI diesel golf
vw. I filled it up to full, and
then I went tootling down the highway to get to my destination on the
coast. And the gas tank stayed on full

(27:59):
for 110 miles. Wow. And I was kind
of freaking out, going, oh, my God, it's broken. It's broken. And I'm living
off my savings right now. And I was working on a whole other book. And
then it started going down normally after 110 miles. And that's
when I turned to mother because she and I were talking, but she was silent

(28:19):
as I was freaking out. I think she was probably humored by my
freak out. I turned her. I said, you must be doing
this. She said, this is so, you know, to trust me. I'm
taking care of you. Trust me.
And I've had so many miracles beyond that. But
that was a pretty interesting one. And then when I got to the

(28:41):
beach, she, you know, I was there for, I guess, three
nights. I was up in the middle of the night doing ceremony. I was on
the beach doing ceremony. I was in my car doing ceremony because I kicked off
the beach at 10:00 p.m. Because that's what they do on Assateague in Virginia.
And essentially, Mother said, she came through so strongly. She was
talking with me the whole time. She said, I want you to put this other

(29:02):
book aside that you're working on. This is what I want you to write. This
is the title, and these are all the chapter headings. And then she gave
me the very first chapter, which is her message to us
women. And which book is that? The first.
That's the first one. That's the messages from Mother earth. Mother book. Yeah,
I'm just gonna hold it up. Yeah, I have. That was written in.

(29:24):
Yeah, that was written in five weeks, the summer of 2012. I like the forms
that you wrote these in. It's so relatable because you have kind of this
fictional character named Sarah who's having this conversation with Mother Earth, which
is very much paralleling your own. Yeah,
well, you know, putting it in a second person like that, I really liked.
Well, Cherie, it's the only way I could have done it

(29:48):
because it was freaking me out that I am talking
with mother and I'm writing a book with her. It was freaking me
out. And so mother's like, well, we'll just come up with
a character, and her name is Sarah. And then I found out afterwards that
Sarah is in the Bible. She's the first woman
who's talked about in Sarah of the Old Testament.

(30:10):
Yeah. And I went, oh, my gosh. There was no coincidence with that.
But mother said, you married to Abraham. No less when we're talking about the
abrahamic religions. There we go. Oh, gosh, I'm
getting energy on that. Interesting. He's probably one of
the most misunderstood figures in the Old Testament, but go ahead. Yeah,
yeah, I'm certain that's true. And I know there are a lot of misunderstood ones,

(30:33):
especially all the women. Yeah.
Their history. That's part of the conversation. Yeah,
yeah. They were rewritten from a patriarchal lens to fit the narrative
of the Roman Catholic Church. Their agenda. Yeah,
yeah, yeah, yeah. Many, many rewrites and edits. And I'm just
picturing you in your, in your car in your little volkswagen going to the

(30:56):
beach and having this conversation with mother. And I'm like,
that is so cool. Because there was a
properness, you know, a propriety about
connecting to the divine in a certain setting with
a certain, you know, it's like,

(31:17):
you know, contextually, we weren't taught
that, that mother could meet us where we're at. We weren't even taught that.
There wasn't, you know, we, we couldn't even. There was no
place for that in the paradigms. Yeah, yeah.
That we all grew up in. I mean, honestly, one of
the best ways I work with her, one of the best places is in the

(31:40):
bathtub. I've had profound spiritual
experiences in the bathtub. I do water ceremony. I bless the
water. I call on the spirit team. So I pour sacred water in the bathtub.
But don't, you know, Satan has control of the waters. Weren't you ever told
that? I'm just kidding. Oh, gosh, that's so sad.
That's so sad. No, he doesn't. Let's just put that

(32:03):
out there. He does not. It's not happening.
Never did. I know if anyone could see my eye roll right now. It's
like, well, and I'm thinking of the
whales and the dolphins because I work with them spiritually. And, you know, they're
like, that is so ridiculous. Absolutely
ludicrous. Okay, so you do these ceremonies

(32:25):
and I'm a huge, like, I think that the
kind of the wave of the future will be women sitting in these sacred
circles and men too, and doing these ceremonies
that, you know, I guess you could say
have been labeled paganistic from a very
ignorant lens. Paganism is,

(32:48):
well, you probably know the history that their worship, quote
unquote worship of earth was paganism. And the
churches hated any kind of nature
connection or any kind of these elementals or anything working
with that they deemed heretical. And so
that's why there isn't this nature connection, this very

(33:10):
natural connection. It's been like,
no, you have to do it this way to get to the real
source.
Yeah. And do you know the word pagan actually means
from the land? All of our ancestors were
pagan, so to speak. To me, it's just indigenous. I don't

(33:32):
use it. Yeah, it just means indigenous, you know.
And my sense is that, I mean,
yeah, patriarchal religions, it was all
about control. It was all about making sure
that people were
complying with what the state wanted them to do. And

(33:54):
the state took over the church. And it was never at all what Christ was
about when Christ was born and
taught and did all the miracles that he did in
Israel when he was alive, and Christ
actually revered the divine feminine. Mary Magdalene and Christopher
were very, very close. And yet all of

(34:16):
his teachings, almost all his teachings have gotten really
warped and taken over
by powers that be, that want to control.
And I think that these powers at b, they were
afraid. They were afraid of the powers of these

(34:37):
healers, these medicine people, these
shamans. And yet the irony is, and I spent a winter
actually researching the historical Jesus because my very first book,
which I didn't send to you, which I should have sent to you, called. If
I gave you God's phone number, that book took me seven years to
write. And that was before mother Gaia came in so strongly

(34:58):
into my life. But that book is
based on the question, if I gave you God's phone number, what would you do
with it? So I interviewed Christians and Jews and agnostics
and the cherokee medicine woman I was with and Afghani sufi
people who were spiritual but not religious. It was very,
very broad, very, very open minded. Look at the question of

(35:20):
God and what do people think about who God is and what would they want
to talk to God about if they believed in a God?
And fundamentalists would come up to me because I
promoted the book. All over the country, I was at the front of borders and
barnes and noble and doing book talks and talks at
very open minded churches, unitarian churches, but

(35:42):
in the bookstores, the fundamentalist christians would come up, and
they were so offended by my book once they started to get a sense of
what it was about and just started raging at me.
And that was the, that was kind of the exception. But it happened
enough that, that I spent a
winter at the time, I had a gardening business, so I'd work in the growing

(36:04):
season, promote the book, you know, on the side, and then I would
spend the winter to write or read. And so there's
a well known, oh, historian out of
a university. I think he's probably retired now, and I can't place his name,
but he's written a number of books. One of them is called meeting jesus AGAin.
For the first time, he talks about how christ was a

(36:26):
shaman. And at that time, yeah, in that
time, in that part of the world, all over the world, actually,
every village had a shaman, and they were performing
what would be called miracles, but they were doing shamanic
work. And when I read that, I went, bingo.
Same with, yeah, I've written. I've read, like, wisdom

(36:48):
Jesus by different, you know, yogi masters and
even the Buddhist Christ Buddhists, and, like, how
Christ was literally going all over the world to gather these wisdom teachings and
meeting with indigenous people and just learning the ways of the spirit
in all its forms. And that Mary
Magdalene, when the seven devils that he cast out of her was

(37:10):
actually clearing her, he was doing a wisdom, like you're
saying, sort of a shamanistic wisdom type of clearing for
her, as opposed to her just being so evil that she was
possessed by seven demons. Right. The deeper teaching of that
is that she was at his feet learning these
traditions and that she had this desire to be attuned in that

(37:33):
way. You could call it a Kundalini awakening, call it many things, but
yeah, he was facilitating that for her. And if you look at some of the
gnostic texts, they're very reflective of
this wisdom. Jesus, as you say. But when we
say shaman, there's a certain visual of that in our head, like a
native, let's just say a native elder in a headdress or something

(37:54):
dancing around a fire. Some people have that visual
that's a. Shaman, but they don't need to look like
that, you know? I mean, honestly, some of the work I do is
shamanistic. I don't dance well. I do sacred fire
ceremony. It's true. But I don't think I embody the image you
were just describing. No, but I imagine so many people who are connected to

(38:16):
the Christ, the Christ and Christ consciousness who do
this kind of work. And like you were saying, there's
vitriol coming from these fundamentalist
camps, which is the antithesis of love, by the way. It's instant
judgment. It's fear. It's not the way of Christ. It's
not inclusive. It's very fear based.

(38:37):
And having come from a background very similar to that, I will tell you
that they think they are doing the right thing by calling you out.
They feel it is that Christ has sent them on a mission
to call you out because you're practicing heresy
and you're not connected to the one divine creator

(38:58):
which is a man. Yes.
And not to diminish that, I'm just saying, like, I do have a
respect for people who are in that camp
because they are fully convinced they are doing the right
thing, that they are. They don't.
They're very blind to that. They're operating in a fear based

(39:20):
reality. So they're projecting that fear.
Yeah. What you're touching on is how powerful dogma
can be and how people can
be convinced that they are doing the right thing. Even if it
is not coming from a place of love, it is certainly not
coming from a place of oneness. And

(39:43):
there's no compassion that's within their
actions and their thoughts. And
it's very tragic. And it's been playing out for
hundreds and hundreds of years, and it has
played out in how we. It's, you know,
it's interesting because the roots of it, in some ways, well, I don't know if

(40:05):
I can go there. I was gonna say the roots of it lie in, you
know, when somebody's really different than us, we're concerned, we're afraid,
you know, we feel a little threatened. And there are sociological studies on that.
When, you know, people living in tribal villages and a stranger would appear on the
edge of the village, there was always kind of little concern, is this safe? Is
it not safe? But it's gotten, you know,

(40:26):
and this is where if anything is coming from a place
of fear, it's not coming from the truest essence of
spirituality. That's for the highest good. Right? It's
not. Well, and there's. They even, you know,
we're taught to be a God fearing people,
and people conflate that word God fearing

(40:49):
with trembling for God and bowing and I'm so nothing next
to you. And so they've taken that mentality
into their interactions with others, and they feel like they are the God status
because they have all the answers and they're holding all this truth
and that those who are opposed to the truth they hold should fear and tremble
also. Does that make. I didn't put this. This

(41:11):
is part of my deconstruction process from a very high demand
ideology that I was raised with. It's a
very militant type of way of
going about things. I just, I just, again, I
just send compassion also. But I also want to call it out because
it really does hurt a lot of people. It's hurting. It's hurting us

(41:35):
more than it's helping us advance spirituality on the earth.
Yes. I mean, that was one of the things that came forward to me again
and again was the arrogance, the arrogance of these
fundamentalists who were so offended by my
book and making me wrong. Making what was in the book

(41:55):
wrong, making other people's belief systems wrong.
Yeah, it's a sagness. It's an arrogance.
And Christ had strong words about that with the religious leaders of
his time. Yeah. But, you know, it's funny because
I'm hearing mother talking to me right now, and mother loves all
of her children. Yeah. What she also

(42:18):
has a broader picture of that very few of us have is how it
is that my Cherokee teacher called it, you know,
the angry God religions, which is how it's written into the great mother
Bible, too. The angry God religions, because the
creator was never, has never, will never be
an angry being. It's

(42:40):
just not mad at us. That's how, like, God's mad at you was kind of
this thing that got ingrained in me when I did something wrong.
God's mad at you, or you disappointed Jesus, or you made Jesus sad. Our heavenly
fathers. Yeah, you gotta repent. And then you get, it's a
never. Ending guilt and the shame and you're
never good enough and you're always in trouble, and

(43:02):
especially if you're a woman because you're dirty, because
you have moon cycles. It just goes on and on and
on to diminish us. And like, I have
a friend who just put a book out about how we are all divine
sparks. We're divine sparks. You know, every
single one of us, we all embody the

(43:24):
creation within us. We embody mother within us. And if
we only knew that, to me, the truth, and I'm always
leery if someone says the truth. You know, this is the truth. But I'm just.
Yeah. To me, the truth is that
we are so loved. We are so
incredibly loved by all of these spiritual beings. Mother Gaia

(43:47):
loves us hugely. Sophia loves us hugely. I call her
the creatrix, the great divine feminine of the universe.
Creator loves us hugely. Our ancestors love us
hugely. It goes on and on. The archangels love us beyond.
It's all beyond words. Yeah. And we. Oh,
yeah. I. I feel like the. The greatest

(44:08):
lie that we've been sold is that we are separate from all of that love,
that we have to earn it. Yeah. Through our worthiness. And that's
where. That's where I just encourage people to open the
door. Open the door and walk through and know
that the love is there. I
think that would be my response to the fundamentalist camp as well,

(44:32):
like, just reflecting back to them
love. Right. This is just so interesting that you feel so
strongly about this. You must care so much about
humanity, and I can relate to that because I care so much,
too. Fact, my heart is so full of love. So full of love
for our planet, for humanity, for God, and just handing that

(44:54):
back to them, for them to, you know,
I feel like that's what Jesus would do. He always taught in parables what
we have, the writings in the New Testament. He never. He never gave
direct answers. He let people stew in the mystery
and the paradox of everything that he
was doing. Like you were saying, all these miracles. Yeah. He tapped

(45:17):
into the power of the earth, the power
of the elements, and I think
we want to put him in, like, a suit and tie in some respects and
polish him up and make him and
brand him. So
I have really strong feelings about that. You have a whole chapter in

(45:40):
your book, chapter eleven in the great mother Bible,
on the God wound. And you. And you were raised Catholic, so it's
called on the Catholic Church and God woundedness.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, I
never. You go. No, go ahead.

(46:00):
Well, when I was promoting that first book,
if I gave you God's phone number, I really did not
have a strong sense initially of how
many people grew up in these
dogmatic, angry God religions that Judaism,
Christianity. I didn't run into that many muslim people,

(46:22):
but they're a lesser percentage of our population.
I did interview a sufi man in the book, but anyway,
and then when I started doing talks at unitarian
churches and I would say the word God,
people, there was like a trigger reaction, like people were.
It's a huge trigger. Yeah, it can be a huge trigger for

(46:45):
people. Yeah. Oh, it's tremendous. And it's very unfortunate.
And unfortunate is not even the right word. That's putting it too
mildly. And that was when I realized that there is
a very. There's a. I don't know what percentage of our
population, but there are a lot of people who are God wounded.
And it's not that God wounded them. It's that

(47:07):
the dogmatic religions in which they grew up
taught them a form of God, which
is what we've just been talking about, that is very fear based,
controlling. You're never good enough. You know, it's kind
of like Santa Claus, and you're going to get a sack of coals if you're
judged by Santa Claus to have been not the greatest child.

(47:28):
And they're always being micromanaged and always being watched to see
if you're naughty or nice. Santa is an archetype of
God in our culture, actually.
And yet, when I walked away from the catholic church,
because it was really not fulfilling me, and I was in my early twenties,
much as, to my parents chagrin.

(47:52):
And I ended up actually spending seven years at a yoga center
where there was a guru doing a lot of teaching and teaching different types of
one major form of yoga, kripalu yoga center. And
this guru talked about a creator being. I
forget even the word that he used, which was not at all
angry, was, you know, compassionate and loving.

(48:14):
And I'm like, this makes so much more sense to me. You know,
I will embrace this model, so to speak,
because, you know, the. The cultural conditioning
of the. The catholic faith is
very strong, and I'm still dealing with levels of shame and guilt,
you know, and not feeling good enough. It still rises up

(48:37):
in me now, and I'm in my early sixties now.
It's an ongoing process of healing. I think even, like you said,
we're swimming in it by osmosis, even if people weren't,
I can literally tell you every single person that I have interviewed on this
podcast has some kind of a God wound or a religious wound, even if they're
completely still faithful in their religion or whatever, or if they've left

(48:59):
or whatever, or if they never went to church at all.
America was founded on this God
fearing colonizer,
manifest destiny, sort of
this hierarchical way from the monarchy, from
all the way back in England. Right? So America is coming from the

(49:22):
Vatican, too. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But it came from
Europe. I mean, these wounded people came from Europe. And,
you know, the Cherokee teacher that I was with talked about how there were prophecies
that there were going to be people coming in these great
big, you know, winged boats, and these people
needed healing. They knew already that these

(49:45):
colonists who were going to come were very wounded.
Unfortunately, the opportunities did not arise for them to
offer the healings that could have happened because
indigenous peoples don't have an angry
God. Cosmology. So interesting.
Yeah. In their realms, the world in which they live

(50:06):
is very, very abundant. Everyone takes care of each
other. They know how to work
with the forest. They know how to work with the animals. They are doing
dreaming journeys to communicate with the overarching
devas of the deer, for instance, that they want to hunt. And it's
all in this place of reverence and love and honoring the web of

(50:29):
life. It's so much
healthy. I want to read an excerpt from this chapter, but I also want
to speak to something that came to my mind as you were talking.
Mormonism is my religion of origin. I think I shared with you. I'm a 7th
generation on my direct matrilineal line. My mother's mother's
mother's, all the way back to the beginning of the church. And Mormons are

(50:51):
big on genealogy. So I've done a lot of, you know, my, my mother and
her mother and her. They've just done so much genealogy. Well, I am actually
related to a cherokee princess on my mother's line as well.
Her father was chief Opengate, and I want
to find out more about her. So, listeners, if you know anything, let me know.
But it occurred to me that I also

(51:14):
just have that little, a little dip into that indigenous on that
same line. And she actually
married one of my great something
grandfathers who was member of the Church of Jesus Christ of
latter day Saints. So I just, I'm fascinated
by how these connections happen in our lines

(51:36):
and that we are the embodiment that, like, I can say,
oh, yes, I have this Mormon heritage, but what about this other? And what about
that? And what about my european ancestry? And, and that's why I
followed, I think I shared with you the celtic roselinage
in Ireland and Scotland, which is also a big part of what I
hail from genealogically.

(51:57):
So I think knowing that we're all connected
doesn't matter if you do your pedigree charts and all of your genealogy
and all of your ancestry, we're all still connected.
We're all still in this, like you call it, the web of love or the
web of life by birthright.
We're all connected to each other.

(52:20):
Yeah. And we're connected with the trees. We're connected with the
water. You know, we're connected to the animals.
You know, we could not live if it weren't for
what is provided for us by all of these. I call them the sacred, seen,
and unseen ones. Can you ask the great mother about
mosquitoes? Because my son keeps asking me, why are there mosquitoes? I'm

(52:43):
just, I'm being, I'm being light, but I want to read
these. I want to read these two paragraphs while we were talking about the Godwin.
Okay. This is part of what you wrote here from mother.
There are many women and men who won't or can't leave their more
patriarchal religions. And I do love them. I love them just as much as I
love my two legates who have left the religion of birth. To find spiritual

(53:05):
community in more open, all embracing churches or other groups.
Many have turned to Buddhism, yoga or meditative meditation groups or
other alternatives. So many of my human children are God
wounded. It's so sad. And it's not because the great
mystery wounded them. It certainly wasn't I that wounded them
either, because they were not learning much about me in their churches or

(53:27):
synagogues or mosques. It's the version of God they learned
while they were young and how God was described to them that
wounded their hearts and their spirit. They were taught to fear
God. God would punish them. Yet this
is so far from the truth. But again, these have been teachings
influenced by those who are leaving me now.

(53:49):
And you just go on. It's such a relief to see their energies departing. It's
time to heal these ways of perceiving the great mystery, since the creator has
never been about fear,
only about the divine love. And what
I guess occurs to me, too, is
that, you know, I was taught that this life is a

(54:10):
test of faith and that
I needed to have to hold a certain amount of fear to stay grounded
in keeping myself in check. Being warned
about people like you, mayor.
My mother warned me. Um, but no, it was just this, like, if

(54:32):
you don't hold a certain amount of. And you, and
some people have even conflated that fear with respect
or, um, it, or reverence.
Um, and I think I shared with you that, like,
my whole, most of my. My favorite part of growing up in the
church was girls camp. Um, going out in

(54:55):
nature and connecting. Now, those were my most spiritual experiences. Or with
music. It wasn't sitting reverently with my dress
and my legs crossed and my arms folded and my head bowed, and there's a
beautiful, divine place for that. I'm not mocking it. But the
lights were fluorescent. It was stiff. There
was a holding back. There was an air of

(55:17):
not enoughness. And it was also mixed with this
beauty of spirit. So it was hard to parse out
what was true and what wasn't for me, until I got much
older and realized that my health was being
affected. I was told that
people who put the earth over

(55:39):
everything else are people who have this really dark
agenda. Anyway. I could go on and on and on, but
you talk about, we get that it's just sanitizing.
It's. It's whitewashing nature and
cycles and rhythms and
reality and rawness as not spiritual.

(56:03):
It's the domestication of our spirits, right?
Oh, I'm thinking of the way you're wording that. The domestication
of our spirit.
Yeah, that's. That's one way to word it.
It's such a disconnection from

(56:27):
a much more balanced, more
harmonious, more divine, feminine infused
spirituality that is the basis for all
life.
And you know that already

(56:49):
it's kind of at a loss for words right now because
my head is spinning a little. I haven't delved. So,
yeah, you know, I mean, this is
where I have arrived. I'll word it this way, is that
I love the creator. I
don't really know exactly who the creator is.

(57:12):
I love the term the great mystery, because to me, if
we're incarnate in a physical body, we don't fully understand. It's
only when we pass over and we're in the spirit realms that we can start
to understand the complexity, the intelligence, the
tremendous love that is embodied in the creator.
But I also believe in the creatrix, which

(57:34):
is part of the great mystery. But, and
this is where it gets a little hard to define for me. And I'm still
not, you know, I'm still there in the great mystery end of things. But there
is a powerful, powerful, divine feminine force within the
universe that has birthed everything within the
universe, including Mother Gaia, including this

(57:55):
planet, including my soul and your
soul and beings who are living in
planets way in another galaxy. And
within all of this is this huge web of
love. And I believe
we are here incarnate to find our way back to

(58:17):
the love, the divine love, and
to find our way back so that we can embody the
divine love and calling in the christed one, the Christ conscious is
one way to do it. Mother Gaia loves the christed
one. She's calling for all of us to open our hearts
and energies to the christed one. But not the dogmatic,

(58:41):
angry God version of Christ, but who
Christ really was as a highly, highly evolved soul
and who embodied. But even the trees, right?
Yeah, but the trees embody the Christ consciousness. I mean, this is
maybe out there for a lot of people, but, you know, we
live in a planet that is so incredibly

(59:03):
beautiful and complex, and there's psychic
hotlines between all the trees, the bushes, the
flowers, the winds, the clouds. I mean, if we
only knew, like, the communication channels that are beyond the human
realms that are happening all the time, and the spiritual
councils that are at play or at work, depending on how you

(59:25):
want to word it, that are coordinating what's happening on the
planet to bring us to a planet of much
higher love and to
wean us from the fear, to invite us
forward, to shed the fear. This is what's happening right
now, and we're all invited to it. We're invited

(59:46):
to this party. And frankly, the planet's going to go
there regardless. The question is how many humans are going to wake up
enough to evolve into that
place? I think we all have free will. Yeah.
Yes. And I feel like
the fundamentalist fear that we spoke to of the dogma people who have been,

(01:00:08):
let's just say, indoctrinated with a lot of dogma and fear, and
there is a great reticence for them to consider
the path of oneness, even though if you
really look at Christ's teachings, it was all, the father and I are
one. He was teaching oneness is teaching that interconnectivity.

(01:00:29):
And I remember you saying in our last conversation
that you had talked to some kind of an elder, wise
teacher that talked to you about what he foresaw in the future of
religions. Do you want to speak to that a little bit? Yeah.
He was a Shoshone elder, Shoshone medicine man,
extraordinarily gifted. Benny Lebeau. And he

(01:00:51):
mentioned to me one time, because I studied under him, he was my guardian,
spiritual guardian. When I was writing the great mother Bible, I
was under his wing. He said that
in time, organized religion will not be making it
through the transitions ahead in the future, because the
energetics of those religions just

(01:01:13):
won't mesh. There's too
much density, there's too much fear.
And in order for us to evolve into
this next sort of iteration of
evolution, we have to shift out of the fear. We have to
heal ourselves from the fear. And I dance with this every day.

(01:01:34):
I mean, I have my own anxieties. I have my own fears,
and then because of my spiritual practice, so I'm able
to start to tap into rising up above it and
healing it. Whatever is within me that's wounded enough, that draws it in.
Yeah, I same dance. I'm in the same dance.
Yeah. And I think it's also because we're just picking up on the collective. Like,

(01:01:56):
no matter how much work we do within ourselves, we're still going to pick up
on the collective stuff. And
as Christ did beings, as Christ consciousness in connection
to that, however you like, metaphorically, even want to say it,
we can move that through us and transmute it.
Transmute it. But we don't always have the awareness, like we're all

(01:02:18):
doing when we do the work for ourselves, we're doing the work for everyone. Not
as christed, you know, but also, like, we
don't always have the awareness because we're so
programmed and so conditioned in this
fear mind virus that we don't always have the
awareness that we're swirling in that. So I

(01:02:41):
see Mother Earth, Gaia, I see that as a
way to ground analytics
with that truth of who we actually are.
If you were giving somebody I know you're going to come into our Facebook community,
Sol rose community, and you're going to do this beautiful guided
meditation to anchor in our connection to

(01:03:04):
the root chakra and the heart of mother, which I'm really looking forward
to that the day after Mother's Day on May 13. Perfect
time. But what would you say, practically, when you say that
you. You move through this every day, that you're sort of walking through
that fear and that anxiety? Do you have any kind of
an anchoring practice that you do that you might be able to share with

(01:03:26):
us? I
do a number of things. One of the things that I do, honestly, is
I visualize my energy body, my aura,
as a bubble, maybe an egg shaped bubble, and I visualize mirrors
on the outside, and I put it out there on the spirit
plane. My intention is to not take in

(01:03:48):
anything that is coming in from outside of me. So,
yes, we have a lot of drama, trauma, fear within the
human matrix of energetics. And I am such an empath, I
absorb it in a millisecond. So that's one
exercise. Yeah, that's great. Yeah, that's great. And that's something you teach
to children, too. That's a beautiful, simple visual. Yes.

(01:04:10):
And then I connect with mother. And again,
I'm going to leave that. And I could do a short version here while we're
on, depending on how much longer we want to go. Yeah, we're almost ready
to wrap up. But yeah, we can. Yeah, but I connect with
mother and her heart every day. I actually energetically
drop to her heart and invite her to fill

(01:04:32):
me with her love. And I feel her coming into my womb space. I feel
her coming into my heart chakra.
There are a lot of different things I do beyond that, but that is a
big part of it. We just
started our women's wisdom circle and that's one of the things that I'm having our
participants do together is to anchor right into mother earth by dropping

(01:04:54):
in all of our thoughts into our heart and down into our womb
space, out through the root chakra into Mother Earth for that connection.
And I think people can just get creative, right. Whatever visual
works for them. I think it extends beyond
belief systems, what we're talking about. And I love the great
mystery as a term for God as well because

(01:05:17):
it's so personal for each one of us, who and what creator
is, who and what mother Earth is. And
so I love that you've brought these and I'm just going to hold them up
to so you can tell people where to find them. But the
ones, what was the name of the first book? If I gave you God's phone
number. If I gave you God's phone number? Yeah.

(01:05:38):
Yeah. And this one is. They're available.
They're all on Amazon. You can go to my website with great Motherlove
Earth and I can autograph one for you. But they're available
as ebooks. You can order them from any bookstore. You can
find them all over. Yeah. Yeah. Well, thank you so much

(01:05:59):
for the work you're doing. It's, it's brave, it's bold, it's
heart based, it's a gift.
And also, thank you for your books and for your
time. And I'm grateful that we were able to go so deep. I'm,
I feel like I peppered you with all these really deep, you know?
Oh, no, they were beautiful questions. They were. They were. It's wonderful.

(01:06:22):
I like being poked and pushed and nodded to, nudged to go
deeper. And if we have a millisecond, everyone who's
listening is invited to participate in the thousand
goddesses gathering global grid. Thank you for bringing.
Yeah. This is based on a tibetan prophecy that when a thousand goddesses or
tibetan torahs unite, this will shift the tone of our sacred earth

(01:06:44):
from fear to compassion. This is exactly what we've been talking about. And
so these are ceremonies all over the world. They can be simple
ceremonies or larger ceremonies. Women gathering in circle, men joining
them to support them to call in the divine feminine to call
in these powerful, beautiful, spiritual ones who want to help
us. And it's all about healing the planet,

(01:07:07):
healing the denser realms of fear and
anxiety, et cetera, et cetera. Thank you. It's happening every fall,
and I know this. November, right? November 1.
November 1, yeah. We'll put the link to that in the show
notes. That'd be great. It's just the number
1000. 1000 goddesses net, correct?

(01:07:28):
Yes. Okay. Yes. Thank you so much, mayor. This was
really enlightening. I
loved speaking with you. Thank you for having me. It's been very rich.