136. It’s All Connected: The Powerful Link Between Your Gut Microbiome, Mental and Physical Health Ft. Liinn Rivers

Struggling with mental health, chronic illness and/or trauma can feel like an endless battle. In today's show, we take a deep dive into the symbiotic relationship between our gut health and mental/physical well-being. Linn, an expert in holistic and functional medicine, shares her own compelling story of healing and how she now empowers others to navigate through the complexities of chronic diseases with a better understanding of their gut microbiome.

The gut-brain connection is a fascinating frontier, and in this episode, we discuss its hidden connections that radically influences our health and behavior. Linn shares the profound impact of dietary choices on our mental health, explaining how the foods we eat can either trigger or alleviate conditions ranging from autoimmune diseases to insulin resistance. Her unique perspective on the carnivore diet, carbohydrate reduction, and the controversial role of plant-based toxins challenges conventional medical treatments. It's a revealing look at how adjusting our daily nutrition might just be the key to unlocking a healthier, more balanced self.

We discuss the crucial role of the gut microbiome in emotional recovery and how certain dietary adjustments can help rewire our neurological responses. Linn shares actionable advice on incorporating probiotics, balancing meals, and listening to our bodies' intuitive needs—particularly for women during pivotal life stages.

Connect with Linn: https://www.linnrivers.com/

Chapters:

 0:00
Intro/What is the Gut Microbiome?

 9:40
The Gut-Brain Connection in Mental Health

 24:29
The Impact of Diet on Health

 29:58
Impact of Diet on Insulin Resistance

 37:03
Balancing Diet for Gut Health

 45:46
Gut Health and Dietary Choices

 52:36
Nutrition, Health, and Intuition

 1:00:00
Healing Trauma Through Physical Health

 1:03:47
Healing Trauma Through Gut Health

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello everyone and welcome back to the A Word to
the Wise podcast, a space wherewe curate conversations around
mind, body, spirit and personaldevelopment.
I'm your host, yumi Moses.
Today on the show, I'm going tobe speaking with Lynn Rivers.
Lynn is a functional health andwellness expert and educator.
She has an educationalbackground in holistic and

(00:21):
functional medicine andmicrobiome therapy.
She teaches people all over theworld have to take their health
into their own hands mind, body, spirit and her experience
spans over 15 years and sheassists people in overcoming
chronic health conditions andmental disorders.
And that is exactly what we'regoing to get into in today's

(00:42):
show.
So I talked to Lynn on the showtoday about the gut microbiome,
which I asked her to define andalso ask her to discuss how it
affects our physical and mentalhealth.
We discussed the link betweenthe gut, mental health,
neurological disorders andchronic disease.
We also discussed the best dietfor a healthy gut and whether

(01:05):
or not probiotics are useful.
I learned so much from Lynn inthis episode and I believe you
will too.
This content is not intended tobe a substitute for professional
medical advice, diagnosis ortreatment.
Always seek the advice of yourphysician or other qualified
health providers with anyquestions you may have regarding

(01:28):
a medical condition.
And with that let's get intothe show.
Lynn, welcome to the show,welcome to A War to the Wise.

(01:48):
It's so good to have you.
How are you?

Speaker 2 (01:51):
I'm fantastic.
Thanks for having me.

Speaker 1 (01:52):
I have a lot of questions regarding the gut
microbiome because I've heardabout it, but I will admit that
I am not an expert on it at alland I don't know that much about
it.
And I hear people throw aroundthe word holistic health all the
time and I'm really not surewhat that is either.
So I'm hoping that this sessioncan be helpful to my listeners

(02:14):
who aren't quite sure what thatis, or even if they are, this is
just like additionalinformation for them.
So you have over 15 years ofeducation in the holistic health
field and you assist a lot ofpeople in overcoming chronic
health conditions and mentalhealth disorders.
So I want to first start byasking you how did you develop a

(02:36):
passion for holistic health?

Speaker 2 (02:39):
Yeah, well, this is a great way to really introduce
myself because it was my ownlife journey that led me to it.
It was kind of just part of myjourney.
I had a pretty tumultuous first, really 30 plus years of my
life.
It was a lot of constantturmoil and I had pneumonia when
I was one and two and thatturned into a lot of emotional

(03:01):
trauma due to the fear that Itook on as a child from my
parents thinking that I wasgoing to die, and it turned into
asthma.
The majority of my childhoodand teen years I was in and out
of the hospital on steroids,always on antibiotics.
I had gut dysbiosis very earlyon in life, which we will get
more into, and I grew up with analcoholic.

(03:23):
Most of my family died before Iwas 15.
I lost my partner, the samecancer that my mom died of.
I had two near-deathexperiences endometriosis,
hormonal disturbances of alldifferent kinds, really really
heavy depression, suicidal.
Most of my teens and twenties.

(03:43):
I really took all of that that Iwent through and reached a
point.
It was during my lastnear-death experience where I
really thought oh my god, I cameback here again.
What do I need to do different?
Because I don't want to keepdoing the same repeat of living
out the same problems andinviting the same people into my
life.

(04:03):
That was where I actuallystarted diving into functional
medicine and that's where thingsstarted changing for me.
It was this moment of claritythat my body needed to be happy
and healthy in order for me tothrive in this life.
I'll talk so much more aboutthis, but really that was the
premises of me really comingforth and stepping into a much

(04:25):
better version of myself.
It put me on a journey ofreally going inwards and finding
myself, finding what I wantedfrom this life and how I wanted
to show up and what it meant tobe human and how to do this
human life well and not just getby.
I turned all of that around andI healed myself through all of

(04:48):
these different things andovercame all these things.
Then I realized that I wantedto share this information
because I'm someone who Ipractice what I preach and I did
not enjoy putting certaininformation out unless I myself
understood it and was able toteach it from a really grounded
space.
Now that's what I'm doing.
I'm helping others all over theworld transform their lives and

(05:10):
to see mental health conditionsfrom a completely different
perspective that very few peopleare talking about at this time.

Speaker 1 (05:18):
Thank you, lynn, for sharing that.
That was so much in there andshameless plug for my other
podcast, shifting Dimensions,because I definitely want to get
into your near-deathexperiences and it just sounds
like you endured so much traumaand a lot of people who go
through those types ofexperiences kind of buckle

(05:39):
underneath them.
But it seems like you're takingwhat happened to you and you
turned it into your purpose inthis life, which is helping
people heal mentally, physically, spiritually even.
We're going to focus on thephysical and mental part of that
in this conversation.
I want to start off by askingwhat is holistic health?

Speaker 2 (06:02):
Holistic health is really finding the root cause to
illness.
It's healing from a naturalperspective.
I should say functionalmedicine is more the root cause
of illness, but having aholistic approach is really
finding out the natural way ofhealing.
What do you need to be eating?
What supplements can you take?
How do you bring your body backinto balance?

(06:22):
What exercises are you doing?
How are you incorporatingeverything natural into your
life in order to be the betterversion of yourself?
The way that I like to look atit is WHOL, the holistic healing
right, like becoming a wholeversion of yourself through
natural means.

Speaker 1 (06:39):
It's yeah, because everything's connected and I
think over the last couple ofyears, especially last year,
there are a lot of conversationsaround the cause or the root
cause for mental healthdisorders, physical disorders,
and a lot of times within themedical space they tend to kind
of focus on the symptoms but notthe root cause, and sometimes

(07:02):
you have to go to the root causeand something that you're
passionate about is the gutmicrobiome.
Right, and there's so muchthere.
So again, to level set, what isa gut microbiome?
What is that?

Speaker 2 (07:14):
Yeah, I'm gonna let me jump into that, but really
quick I want to touch in on whatyou just said.
Yeah, when you go to a doctorand you're diagnosed with a
specific condition or anythingof that sort, those conditions
alone there are actuallysymptoms.
Those are the symptoms that aresaying, hey, your body's out of
balance, but the doctorsprescribe you to try to treat
those conditions of what they'recalling them.
But that's actually your bodysaying hey, something's out of

(07:36):
alignment.
Yes, and what is typicallyleading to those imbalances is
your gut microbiome, and our gutmicrobiome is basically the way
that I like to think of it.
Is our trillions of babies thatwe're carrying with us, and
they rely on us.
They need us to take care ofthem, and when we take care of
them, they take care of us.
It's a symbiotic relationship.

(07:59):
Your digestive tract starts fromthe second you put something in
your mouth, even before yourdigestive tract actually kicks
in, and it goes all the way toyour rectum and your anus, and
all everything that's in thereis your microbiome.
No, granted, we do havemicrobiome all over our body.
However, it's like around ahundred trillion is what they're

(08:20):
estimating is actually just inour gut alone.
A hundred trillion, there's somany more microbiome organisms
in our being than there arehuman cells, like that's
something to wrap your headaround, right?
And when your gut is dysbioticwhich means that there's
bacteria, there's viruses, fungi, all these different forms of

(08:41):
species within the microbiomeand when it's out of balance, it
can cause a ton of differentsymptoms.
And we're finding that over 85%of disease out there can be
linked back to a dysbiotic gut.
And so you're basically feedingeverything that you eat, you're
feeding your gut microbiome,and if there's any dysbiosis,

(09:04):
you're feeding that andinflaming.
Whatever is out of balance is areally easy way to say that,
and so it really puts it intoperspective of oh my god, when
I'm eating, I'm not feeding mycells, I'm feeding the
microbiome, which then you know,can produce certain nutrients
for us or they can causeproblems for us.
It really depends on what,what's going on in there and

(09:27):
what we're doing for it.

Speaker 1 (09:29):
You know, listening to you talk about this, I
remember my first kind ofcuriosity into this topic of the
gut microbiome was how itaffected the brain.
There is this whole conversationabout the brain-gut connection
and especially how it affectsmental health right, and I want
to talk a little bit about somechronic illnesses a little bit

(09:49):
later, but I want to kind oftouch on the mental health part
really quickly and I rememberthinking, huh, that's
interesting, because there was acertain time, I'd say last year
, where I just felt myselfreally feeling sad and I was
like there's actually nothinggoing on in my life right now
that's causing this sadness.

(10:11):
So I thought intuitively, evenbefore I started hearing these
conversations, I'm like could itbe my diet?
Could I be eating foods that Idon't feel good afterwards
eating Because I'd eat certainthings and I would just kind of
feel lethargic, so on and soforth.
So I actually started toincorporate what people might

(10:34):
consider more healthy foods orjust kind of eating a little bit
differently and obviouslymoving my body as well.
But I noticed a shift in mymind and my mental health.
So I kind of want to talk alittle bit about how does the
gut microbiome affect the brain?

Speaker 2 (10:52):
This is my favorite topic and the reason is because
that was kind of what solidifiedmy healing right.
I had so much depression andanxiety and aggressive behaviors
and all of these things growingup that I needed to figure out
what was going on with that.
And when I started tapping intothe microbiome and finding out
that there are literallyspecific bugs in our system I

(11:15):
call them bugs they're bacteria,viruses, fungi, the sorts,
right but they can actuallycause aggressive behavior.
They can cause so manydifferent things that we don't
even think about.
They can be the reason thatwe're attracted to certain
people, why we're cravingcertain foods.
Even people who are obese havedifferent microbiomes.
Like, there are certain thingsthat can actually cause these

(11:36):
sensations and these feelingsand these desires.
And when we look at the gutbrain connection, our biggest
nerve is the largest nerve inthe body and it's a beautiful
nerve and it goes to all of themain organs and there are
literally millions of nervesthat come from our gut to the
brain.
So there's no wonder thatthere's so much of a connection

(11:58):
between our gut and our brain,right?
And so when we look at the factthat when we eat certain foods
and we have any kind ofdysbiosis happening.
That food is feeding thatdysbiotic bacteria which, if
it's already overloaded, isgoing to cause more symptoms.
And the more we eat, the moreit progresses.
And we want the bacteria, allof these things, to be in a

(12:23):
specific balance.
Even the viruses are good forus, even the fungi are good for
us, but it's when these thingsget out of balance that we
really start seeing trouble.
And the connection we weretalking about earlier, the
connection to certain diseases.
Over 80% of these disease canbe traced back to the gut
microbiome, and we're talkingAlzheimer's, dementia, all of

(12:44):
these different neurologicalaspects and these psychological
conditions and depression andall of these things that I
experienced, the anxiety aspectand depression and all of this
and our gut microbiome isdirectly linked to that, to the
point where, when you eatsomething and it affects your
gut microbiome, you will knowwithin 30 minutes of eating

(13:05):
because you will have a reaction.
There is a chemical responsehappening.
Our gut microbiome is a bigpiece of it and I talk about
this differently than a lot ofmicrobiologists because there's
so many components that playinto it and one of the things is
, if you have a dysbiotic gut,chances are you also have leaky
gut.
A large percentage of thepopulation has leaky gut, and

(13:27):
what that means is that yourintestinal barrier is not tight.
We have tight junctions andthey kind of get weak and then
particles can start seepingthrough into your bloodstream
that would not normally seepinto your bloodstream.
And so when that happens,that's where you start noticing
a lot of different symptoms allof the neurological conditions

(13:49):
that we talked about, and foodintolerances, allergies the
whole nine yards because yourimmune system kicks in and it's
like, hey, this isn't supposedto be here, we need to get rid
of this.
And so that's where a lot ofdifferent problems happen.
And where I really like to takethis and it's a much different
direction than a lot of peopleare talking about is the fact
that certain foods that we deemhealthy right, we have a

(14:13):
tendency to go on these fads andeveryone jumps on these
bandwagons, so everyone startedeating all these heavy vegan
diets or high vegetable diets,and the reality is we would not
have access to all of thesegroups of food without
importation.
So our bodies are not adaptedto these specific foods that

(14:34):
we've brought over, and that'swhy, when you go over to, a lot
of people go to India and theyend up with what they call the
deli belly, and that's becausethey don't have the gut bacteria
.
For the foods that they'reeating over there it's no
different to the foods thatwe're importing, right, and so
we used to eat these foods insmall quantities, so our body

(14:54):
was getting good nutrients fromthem, it wasn't being overloaded
with all these differentchemicals, because plants have
chemicals that protectthemselves from being eaten to
that people don't realize, likesalicylates, oxalates, phytates,
lectins, you know all thesedifferent.
They're actually neurotoxins.
And so when we're eating theseplants and first off they're not

(15:15):
ripe right, we picked themright before they're ripe
because we're trying to do theimport, the importing of them.
Our body has to process all ofthose toxins, and so your gut
bacteria is one of the firstoffenders, but it's not going to
be able to process all of that,and then, if you have leaky gut
, then it's going to seep in,and then your liver has to take

(15:36):
over and work on the rest of it,spelling all of those toxins
along with all the other workthat it's already doing.
So this is one of the mainreasons that we're seeing so
many people with all of thesedigestive disorders, so many
different kinds.
I mean we could go down thelist of them, but there's so
many people who have digestiveissues because they're
overloading their body with allof these different plant

(15:58):
chemicals that we would normallynot have.
When we used to eat, we had aprotein, we had a carb and we
had a vegetable.
It was a simple, easy, balanceddiet that our body could
assimilate and our gut bacteriawas kept more in check and it
wasn't being overloaded with allof these compounds that it
could not literally break down,and I think that's why one of

(16:21):
the biggest shadows, if you will, of the microbiome world is
it's talked about to eat morevegetables and eat more fiber.
It's good for your microbiome,but the reality is the people
who tend to have a dysbiotic guttend to have leaky gut.
Therefore, it's creatinganother cascade of symptoms, and
so then it just startsworsening the symptoms, right?
So you're feeding them all ofthese chemicals, and I want to

(16:45):
bring up one specifically calledsolicylates and that was the
big game changer for me anddiving into research about it,
because this specific chemicalalone is directly linked to
autism, depression, aggressivebehavior.
And then we go into the physicalsymptoms, where people who have
the dark rings around theireyes or the nose, polyps,

(17:08):
running noses.
This is all directly linked tosolicylates, and one of the big
ones that was mind blowing forme because I had it the majority
of my life was tinnitus.
I had tinnitus the majority ofmy life and you're not going to
be able to Google what causestinnitus and solicylates pop up.
You have to know aboutsolicylates and Google

(17:30):
solicylates and tinnitus inorder for it to pop up and find
out that it is directly linkedto tinnitus.
And so when I removed thesespecifically from my diet and
did a complete elimination andreally went bare pretty much
carnivore diet so I can reset mybody, at one point and I took
all of them out, my entire beingshifted.

(17:53):
I went from chronic depressionand having all of these really
out of suicidal.
I think I might have alreadymentioned that throughout my 20s
.
That's just how I was, andafter I stopped eating those, I
remember sitting there andthinking like my God, is this
how I'm supposed to feel on aregular basis?
I'm supposed to be calm andhappy.

(18:14):
It wasn't my norm.
It actually took me by surpriseand that's what got me into
really researching what'sactually causing mental illness
and why are people not actuallygetting over their traumatic
experiences in life, because thereality is we have traumatic
experiences and that's it.
People have bad things happenall the time and we can move on

(18:36):
Like we don't need to dwell onthese things.
We can move forward.
It's not the trauma that'sholding us back.
It was our body and what we'reputting in it and how it's
processing things that wascausing these emotional
disturbances to continue poppingup over and over again.
I kept having outlashes andbecause of what we hear about in
society, we automatically think, oh well, I guess I haven't

(18:59):
healed through my trauma.
Oh, I guess I still need to goback and uncover XYZ.
The reality is a lot of peoplewho are having depressive
episodes and these outbursts itis absolutely.
I have no doubt that it is 99%linked to what you're eating,
how it's affecting yourmicrobiome, how it's affecting
your digestion in general andwhen you switch that.

(19:19):
I mean.
It doesn't take much for peopleto switch their diet and to
feel a difference within a week,and so it's just really
profound and the research behindit is more and more.
But the reality is none of usare experts in microbiome,
because we're barely touchingthe surface of what it actually
is and we're looking at, hey, 10years down the road we might

(19:41):
have a probiotic where, ifsomeone has dementia, they say
here, take this probiotic,because then it's going to be
correcting the imbalance thatyou don't have this specific
species.
You need to get more of this.
So you give them a probiotic ofthat specific one and there's
so much to it.
But the reality is I don'tthink it's 80% of diseases
linked to it.
Like 95 to 100% of it is linkedto this, because when you look

(20:06):
at it from the simpleperspective of what's the first
thing you do, you put food inyour mouth and that is what
starts causing issues.
Right, when you have a fastedperson, they start getting
better, they start feelingdifferent and then they start
eating again and they starthaving symptoms again.
So I really think there's moreto it than just this 80% of what
we're seeing so far.

Speaker 1 (20:27):
I wasn't a trans, just listening to you, because
it really takes the literaldefinition of like listen to
your gut.
We hear that all the timelisten to your gut, listen to
your gut.
But it seems like our gutreally has so much power over
our well-being, on a physicaland on a mental level as well.

(20:49):
There's so much that you saidthere, right, so one I wanna
clarify what does it mean tohave a dysbiotic gut?
Does that mean a gut that's outof rhythm and there's not a lot
of healthy bacteria in there?
Cause you said that dysbiotic,a dysbiotic gut is linked to a
leaky gut, and I just wanna makesure that I fully understand
what that means.

Speaker 2 (21:10):
Yeah, so a dysbiotic gut means that you have an
imbalance in bacteria andviruses and all of these of the
sort.
So, like I said, you have allof these different species and
they are great together whenthey are working in harmony and
they're in a specific balance,right.
But the second you have toomuch of one species that can
cause a slew of symptoms, andthat bacteria doesn't mean that

(21:33):
it's bad, it just means thatit's good in a certain quantity,
and then when it'soverpopulated, they can start
causing issues.
And so it's kind of funny whenyou look at it in the world,
like there are people and theycan either show up in a positive
way or they can show up in anegative way.
Our gut bacteria does the samething.
It's when it's in balance it'sgreat.
When it's not, it's not goodfor us.

(21:54):
And I think about myself.
I'm like when I'm in balanceI'm awesome, but when I'm not,
watch out, so yeah, yeah,exactly, and you mentioned
solicitates correct.

Speaker 1 (22:04):
Is it called solicitates?
Yeah, what foods have thosechemicals in them?

Speaker 2 (22:09):
So the majority of plants have solicitates.

Speaker 1 (22:12):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (22:13):
There are higher offenders, like zucchini is
really high, macadamia nuts aresuper high, coconut is high.
There are.
So certain foods have reallyhigh level of chemicals and
those are some of the ones thatare high in solicitates, and one
of the best ways that you canlook at this really easily is
there are a lot of people whocan't take aspirin.
Aspirin is a high content ofsolicitates.

(22:36):
That's where they get the.
That's the chemical compoundthat aspirin is right.
So if someone can't takeaspirin, they definitely should
not be eating foods high insolicitates.
But they don't learn thesethings right, and so again, you
think about how toxic aspirin isto the system.
That is exactly what these,these same compounds, are doing

(22:56):
to the body, just to a lesserdegree.

Speaker 1 (22:59):
Interesting.
So I have there's so much hereand I'm trying to gather my
thoughts because I have ahundred questions now.
So what you said about thevegetables, first of all, that
blows my mind because that'severything you hear.
Eat more vegetables.
Not to villainize vegetablesper se, I don't think that's
what you're trying to do.
But it's interesting because Ihad this woman on the show who

(23:23):
was talking about healingthrough her autoimmune disorders
.
She had a slew of them.
The doctors were doing so manydifferent tests and nothing was
coming up in the data as to whyshe was having these autoimmune
diseases.
So of course, like a lot ofpeople who find themselves in
these situations, they kind oftake their own health into their

(23:45):
own hand, right, stillconsulting with her doctors.
But she started going on thishealing journey and something
she found out cause she was avegan.
Actually, something she foundout was that I think the
chemical leptin is in tomatoes,if I'm not mistaken, and she
found out that that was one ofthe reasons.

(24:08):
That was something that wastriggering a lot of her
autoimmune disorders.
So when she cut back on that,in addition to like reducing her
stress, et cetera, she realizedthat her symptoms and her
autoimmune disorders almost kindof went into remission,
reversed.

(24:28):
So here you talk about.
This is so mind blowing.
Because then I think to myselfthen every time I have an
ailment and I go to the doctor,why isn't the first thing they
do checking my gut?

Speaker 2 (24:42):
Yeah, yeah, I mean that is the question, right,
it's so.
Here's a funny thing.
I literally just got off of apodcast interview with someone
before you who literally broughtup the leptins and tomatoes
literally the same thing and sothere's something to that today
and it is.
There are so many differentcompounds in plants that people

(25:03):
can have reactions to and no onethinks of that.
Because unfortunately, with thehuman brain, we evolve into
thinking with our ego andunfortunately ego can pull us
away from our ancestral roots ofwhat is actually best for our
body and start finding all ofthese like oh, but it's not
morally right to eat meat, or isyou know?

(25:24):
We should be moving.
The reality is our bodies comefrom earth, they were of this
earth and there's so many waysthat you can look at that where
I understand people's like it'san emotional eating pattern to
try to switch into a diet, butthe reality is your body needs
certain things and the numberone diet right now that people

(25:44):
are finding to cure autoimmunediseases, at least to put it in
remission so they can figure outtheir body, is the carnivore
diet.
Literally, just eating meatcompletely removes that
inflammation from your system.
You're no longer having toprocess toxins from any of the
plant sources or all of the youknow, the insulin, whatever you
wanna call it.

(26:04):
It's not giving you insulinshots anymore, the boosters of
what I like to call it, whereyou're literally just glucose
loading with all of thesedifferent carbs, because we do.
We have a heavy carb society.
A lot of people eat so manycarbs and they're not even aware
of it.
And when you're spiking yourglucose and your insulin like
this, like it causes so manydifferent diseases, like that is

(26:27):
probably one of the firstthings to look at when people
have chronic health conditions.
And so when you go on acarnivore diet and you allow
your body to reset, that's themoment where people can
understand what they're supposedto feel like.
And so when people can likewrap their head around, like,
okay, let me not think about mydiet from this ego space or what
I wish were true, let meactually give my body what it

(26:50):
needs, that's where things startchanging, because then you
actually start researching andunderstanding these things.
No one talks about plantcompounds like this.
No one's talking about the factthat they have their own things
that are causing problems.
Now, can everyone?
Is this for everybody?
No, not necessarily.
There are certain people outthere who have the best
microbiome and they can digestanything they put in their body,

(27:12):
but is it still going to causeissues down the road by them,
like putting that in animpactful way, like eating all
of these things in heavy loads?
Right, we're not supposed to beeating tons of blueberries one
or two.
And I always like to think ofthings as the smaller the food,
the less quantity we're supposedto eat of it.
Because even almonds when youthink about almonds, for example

(27:35):
, they're small, but think abouthow much water it takes to grow
one almond a gallon of waterper almond those are not meant
to be eaten as like a main meal.
But people do.
We shovel this food because wethink like, oh, these are good
for us, but we forget about thelectins, we forget about the
phytates, all of these chemicalcompounds that our body is

(27:55):
literally not digesting.
And so, coming back to thepoint of why don't we get this
information when we go to thedoctors?
First off, the Western medicalsystem is not geared towards
helping people.
They treat symptoms, and justbecause they're wearing a white
coat does not make them smart.
They are trained.
Anyone can get trained toprescribe medicine.
Anyone can get prescribed tohear a thing and diagnose a

(28:19):
symptom.
That's not smart, right?
That is just like hey, I'mgoing to school and I'm learning
how to diagnose people.
That's not helping you getbetter and so you're not going
to get these things from yourregular Western medical system.
That is set up for acuteconditions.
They are perfect for acutemedical conditions.
If you're bleeding and you needto be sewn up or you have a

(28:40):
rupture of appendix, definitelygo see them.
But when you have chronichealth conditions, they're not
going to help you.
It's going to make you worseand you don't need to be filling
your body with more medication.
And so they're not.
Of course, they're not going tobe like oh, let's check your
gut.
They don't even believe in thatbecause that's not in their
training capacity.
They're not trained for this,so they're never going to bring

(29:02):
this to your attention.

Speaker 1 (29:04):
This is such an illuminating conversation.
For me, it's interesting thatyou mentioned you know the whole
medical industry and you'reprobably triggering a lot of
egos with that statement, right,if they're listening to this.
And it's interesting because Iwas talking to someone who's a
pharmacist and they told me thatsometimes it's really hard for

(29:27):
them to do their job becausethey see people coming in
constantly for, like, high bloodpressure medication and these
types of medications over andover again.
And they said to me candidlythat I tell my patients
sometimes like, listen, this isnot a life sentence, you don't
have to have, for example, highblood pressure forever, because

(29:48):
it's kind of told to you thatonce you have high blood
pressure, you have high bloodpressure forever, right?
So people feel disempowered toreally seek other methods of
healing.
And the gut microbiome, withwhat we've been discussing,
seems like it's linked to somany different things.
But even with the whole dietsituation that we were just
talking about, for example, it'sinteresting because I was going

(30:10):
to ask you, is that foreveryone?
Because I know people who havehad pretty bad reactions in
terms of their mental health, interms of their physical health,
who've cut out meat, forexample, and it's like night and
day for them.
They're just vegan orvegetarian, right, and focusing

(30:31):
on those foods and not eatingany sort of meats, and they seem
to be doing better mentally andphysically, right, and some
people have reversed certainchronic pain or illnesses that
they were facing once they gotoff meat.
So I just want to dig deeperinto that a little bit.
Like is everyone's gut?
Is it a case by case basis?

(30:52):
Do people need to go get a guttest to kind of figure out okay,
these foods work for me, thesefoods don't work for me?
Because, like you kind ofalluded to, I'm assuming that
this is not a blanket in termsof diet and nutrition.
It can't be the same foreveryone.

Speaker 2 (31:12):
Right?
Of course not okay.
And so that's going to be oneof the big topics.
Because, first off, yes, ifpeople are upset about hearing
this about the Western medicalsystem, the reality is you can't
ignore it at this point and I'mreally proud of those
pharmacists being able to reachthat point and I think we're
going to start seeing that moreand more, where people are going
to realize like, oh my God, youdon't have to be on medication,

(31:33):
you can actually heal yourself,right, and I think, as our
generation starts kicking in,we're going to see more of that.
But the older generations, whoare still locked in to the old
mainstream mentality, you're notgoing to see that in the
Western medical system.
Now, as far as the diet'sconcerned, the reason these
people are seeing bigger, likethey're seeing results by going

(31:55):
vegan, is because they'reremoving two major components.
So meat is high in sulfur andso when you're combining all of
these high sulfur vegetables andthese high sulfur foods, those
combinations are what wreakhavoc.
So, yes, you're going to startfeeling better when you go on a
vegan diet or a just a carnivorediet.
That's because you're removingthese major compounds where your

(32:16):
liver is trying to process allof these.
A lot of people are going tohave methylation issues, which
is what kicks into processingall of these compounds like
brotherhood sulfur orsalicylates or anything of that
sort.
Now, when you do that, youmight feel better for a while.
I have known a lot of peoplewho are in their 50s 60s and

(32:36):
they went vegan in their 20s,but they started feeling the
difference there.
The reason is you can feel sogood at going on a vegan diet at
first because again, you'reseparating and not compounding
these sulfur compounds andcausing a lot of other issues
for your liver to digest stufflike that.
But then when you startconsuming all of these,

(32:57):
unfortunately the vegan diet isa high carb diet.
There's barely any way to getby a vegan diet by reducing your
carbon take.
It's almost impossible, becausethen you start eating more rice
, you start eating more grains,you start eating more beans.
You're eating high carb foods.
Yes, some of them might be likea slower glucose spike, but

(33:20):
they're still going to be highglucose.
That will eventually lead toinsulin resistance.
Over 90 percent of thepopulation is insulin resistant
and barely any of them know ituntil they are prediabetic.
Where that comes from?
The majority of that insulinresistance is from our carb

(33:41):
intake.
We eat way more carbs thanwe're intended to and we should
not be having those insulinspikes as regularly as we do.
That ends up adding up overtime and people start feeling it
later in life.
This is why we tend to findpeople starting to be diagnosed
prediabetic when they're intheir 40s, because their system

(34:02):
is just catching up and thatinsulin resistance is moving
into prediabetes and then thatprediabetes into diabetes.
I myself was prediabetic and Idid not realize I was insulin
resistant and that was what wascausing the majority of my
problems.
Do I think I'll be able to eatmore plants at a certain point
in my life?

(34:22):
Yes, will I ever eat a ton ofthem at once?
No, because we're not meant toeat one main source as a whole.
We're supposed to have abalanced diet, but the insulin
resistance creates so manydifferent symptoms in the body
and it doesn't affect just oneorgan.
It literally affects yourentire being.

(34:42):
I mean your legs, your arms,your liver, your stomach,
everything it's affecting andyour brain, which they used to
think it didn't affect, but itdoes.
If people understood this onesimple thing insulin resistance
that's going to be the key forthem actually getting through
life with more of an easy, andthey're just going to have an

(35:03):
easier time moving through lifewithout having so many chronic
conditions.

Speaker 1 (35:08):
The quality of the car matter and the reason I'm
asking that is because I watchedthis documentary on Netflix and
where this guy was visitingdifferent blue zones around the
world, which, in these zones,are zones where people live to
90 plus Some people are like 103, 120.

(35:28):
And part of his research waslooking at what kept these
people alive.
So, outside of daily activity,outside of having friends and
family and community, they.
He also looked at their diet,right, and a lot of these people
were still eating breads.

(35:48):
Granted, they were making thesebreads from scratch, right.
For example, like in Italy Ithink he went to I'm forgetting
the city but they were making alot of carb dense foods, right.
And then, I think, in Japan,they were really big on eating
these purple sweet potatoes,right, so their diets were very

(36:10):
carb heavy.
But these people were extremelyhealthy, right, because they're
living to 90 plus 100 andsomething.
So does the quality of the carbmatter?
Because I know, for example, inAmerica, they put chemicals in
everything and I'll eat certainbreads.
I really enjoy bread, forexample, but I'm getting to the

(36:30):
age where, like, I can taste thesugar Like I'm.
Like, is bread supposed to havethis much sugar in it?
So does the quality of the carbmatter, and also does it matter
how much sugar is being putinto something.

Speaker 2 (36:47):
Well.
So there's a lot that goes intothis, because insulin
resistance is not only aboutcarbs.
I mean, even the air that webreathe can cause insulin
resistance.
Right, there's so manydifferent triggers that can
cause insulin resistance, butwhen it comes to carbs, you also
have to think about the fact,like I always like.
Going back to Japan and theirbasis.
They ate rice, but they ateminimal, right, they didn't

(37:09):
overeat things.
They actually had a smallportion of rice with fish and
every.
You know their portion sizeswere just ideal for their body
and they have.
I don't remember the same, butthey have that method, if you
will, where when they feel halffull, they stop eating.
Right, and that alone is key.
Here in America are you kidding?

(37:30):
People shovel food like they'renever going to eat again and
they're eating more.
A lot of other countries, theynaturally intermittent.
Best they eat, you know, in themorning and then they eat again
for dinner and it's early.
The time you eat can also playa huge impact on it, because
your digestion is best in themorning.
Hours Around 11, 10, 11 am iswhen you have the best digestion

(37:53):
, and then you get past fouro'clock and it starts declining.
A lot of people tend to eat sixo'clock, seven o'clock, and
then they go to bed by 10.
Their food's not digested yet.
So it really all just depends onwhen you're eating these carbs
and how many you're eating,because in other countries, like
you're talking about with bread, bread is just a part of their
diet along with all of theseother things that they're eating

(38:15):
.
It's not bread on top of bread.
You know, like here I couldn'ttell you what their carb count
is, but a single like a bun fora hamburger has over 40 grams of
carbs.
I eat 20 grams of carbs a day.
You know, like I'm not a nocarb person, but the mentality
of overeating and eating so manydifferent carbs, like French

(38:35):
fries along with the hamburger,along with other things on their
plate that are heavy carbs,like that's over easily 100
grams of carbs in one meal thatsomeone's consuming, and when
you think about how much 100carbs is good.
Let me try to put it this waywhen you check your blood
glucose, your level spike byfour points for every gram of

(39:00):
carbs you intake.
Ok, so when you eat 100 gramsof carbs, you're multiplying
that by four.
That is a high blood glucose.
Like people don't pay attentionto the fact that they are
spiking really high.
And then your body has to tryto come up with the insulin to
take care of all of this, and itdoesn't, and that's why we end
up getting insulin resistant andwe don't process all of this

(39:22):
stuff.
And other countries just tend tohave a better mentality around
the way that they eat food.
And I mean, let me put it toyou this way Over 50 percent of
Americans at this point areeither pre diabetic or have
diabetes.
So that should say to you rightthere that we are eating way
too many carbs, because carbsare sugar.

(39:42):
It's not like a lot of peoplelike to think, like oh well, I
cut out sugar, so I'm good.
No, carbs are sugar, likethat's another form of sugar.
And so when you can bring thatback, it doesn't mean stop
eating carbs.
It just means bring it back.
Like don't make that theentirety of your meal.
Really balance it off.
Like we lost the idea ofbalancing our food long ago.

(40:06):
And I just I think about mygrandpa and how he used to eat,
and he used to eat the samething every single day A piece
of toast, eggs and bacon, andthat was his breakfast, and then
for dinner he'd have steak, youknow, whatever, and it was just
like a easy, balanced meal.
He never ate vegetables hecouldn't.
His body actually was similarto mine, and he died at 90.

(40:27):
He was the only one in myfamily who died to live to old
age, but he was actually stillhealthy.
He was still working on hisroof at the age of 40.
He just happened to have anaccident at the age of 90 when
he died, and so there's a lot tothink about it.
Though they had a balanced plan.
They, they, just they didn'tovereat.
My grandpa's generation didn'tovereat.

(40:48):
They worked on the farms.
They had everything that theyneeded just from the farm, and
now we have food everywhere.
Everywhere you go, there's foodin reach, you know.

Speaker 1 (40:59):
Yeah, there's food everywhere and it's so much
chemically enhanced food as well, so much high fructose corn
syrup.
So even when you're eatingsomething that, yes, it's a carb
, it's obviously not asdetrimental as eating.
Eating a piece of bread again,maybe in Europe is not going to

(41:21):
be the same thing as eating apiece of bread in America,
because there are regulations ofwhat can go into the food
versus what can go into the foodhere in America are two
different things.
So I do like that.
Again, it's not a sense ofcutting everything out, because
I think when people hear that,they freak out because you know
the keto diet was such a bigthing for a long time and

(41:45):
personally for me.
I think I tried that for threedays and literally felt like I
was going crazy because I'm likeI'm just, I need a slice of
bread or something right.
So I'm more for the holisticapproach, but like not
overeating, if that makes anysense, like to your point, but
at the same time stillacknowledging the impacts of

(42:06):
those food.
And because I can tell when myglucose has spiked right.
If I eat food and I immediatelyfeel super tired after
especially if I have like abreakfast sandwich in the
morning I can tell when myglucose has spiked.
I don't have a glucose monitor.
I know that that's a thing nowthat people sell, you could kind

(42:29):
of wear it like a watch orsomething.
But I can tell when I eatcertain foods and I still feel
like light on my feet and I'mstill pretty good to go, versus
when I eat something else andI'm like, oh, I feel so tired, I
have theitis, and I think a lotof people can identify with
that.
How can people tell if theirgut is completely out of whack?

Speaker 2 (42:50):
Well, first let me touch in on that, because I used
to be.
I was against the keto diet fora long time because I just
thought it was another fad diet.
And then I started doing theresearch into it and I was like,
oh my God, there's actuallysomething to this.
So I jumped on the keto dietand that is where my body
started shifting.
And the reality is, the reasonmost people don't make it past

(43:11):
the first week on keto isbecause their body is striving
to try to get those carbs tokeep that high blood glucose
going, because there's a systemthat's running where it's like,
oh, insulin spiking, I need moreglucose.
Their body is just trying topreserve itself.
It's idea, even though we'renot supposed to be running on

(43:31):
that kind of glucose on aregular basis.
So your body's literally tryingto be like, oh, but I need my
kick, I need my kick.
It's almost like an addictionis what happens, and so it's
like it takes moving past thatrough point to really start
seeing benefits.
People find massive benefits bydropping 20 plus pounds within
the first week of being on keto,once they reach that point

(43:54):
where their body is starting toutilize that fat for fuel.
So there's a lot to the ketodiet, and one that it took me a
while to get into, but once Idid I was just like wow, that's
really profound.
But now I understand why peopleare using it.
But back to your other question.
So will you ask one more timeplease?

Speaker 1 (44:10):
Yes, of course, and I just want to respond to what
you're saying because, as you'retalking and I try to talk for
the audience, right, because wethink about living life, for
example.
So I'm Nigerian and in myculture it's very carb heavy
right, so a lot of beans, a lotof rice, a lot of plantains, all

(44:31):
really good stuff.
So I'm trying to picture myselfat a family gathering and
having to overthink Again.
You're not saying don't havecarbs, right?
But I guess what I'm trying toask is is there a healthy medium
, right?
For some people?
Maybe they're able to do thewhole keto thing.

(44:52):
Is there a world where peoplecan still manage their diet and
their health of their gutmicrobiome by, like you said,
maybe not necessarily cuttingfoods out, but eating them in
moderation, not overdoing it?
Or is it one of those thingswhere you're not really going to
see any sort of health benefitsunless you completely or you're

(45:15):
80% more into keto than anyother diet?

Speaker 2 (45:20):
Yeah, so actually this is a great way to lead into
the question that you askedagain about the gut microbiome
and how to know right, and thereality is, if someone is
dealing, this is actually goingto answer your question anyway.
When someone is dealing withimmense gut dysbiosis, they're
going to know, becauseeverything they eat makes them
feel bad.
They're always tired, they'realways angry or irritable or

(45:41):
they are always depressed oranything that you give them food
reactions.
If you have skin conditions,that is 100% an indicator that
you have gut dysbiosis.
Skin conditions do not comefrom the outside unless you are
wearing makeup or something ofthat nature that's going to
affect your skin.
That way, everything else stemsfrom inside your body, and so

(46:05):
when you have acne or you haverosacea or psoriasis or any of
these eczema all theseconditions that is because your
gut is dysbiotic.
Those are ways to really telllike something's not right.
That is your gut.
There's no more denying this.
We're proving it time and timeagain through microbiome, the

(46:26):
microbiome therapy and researchand all of these different
avenues.
And so, with that being said,if someone has these conditions
and they're to the extent that Iwas where I literally almost
had a heart attack from throwinga frisbee.
Those are where you want to stopand actually get extreme.
Go on an extreme diet for evenjust a week, so you know what

(46:48):
you're looking for, so you knowwhat feeling you're supposed to
come back to.
And then from there, because itis an elimination diet, you
start adding things back in oneat a time so you can find out
what's triggering this, what'scausing me to have these
symptoms.
And I always want to remindpeople don't make excuses Like,

(47:08):
yes, a lot of people want tolive a happy life and eat food,
but we're not supposed to eatfood for this like enjoyment of
life.
We're supposed to eat food forour survival.
Like food was not meant forthis.
Like party and eat all thesethings all the time and look at
this new food.
Food was meant for survival.
We're supposed to eat tosurvive and thrive.
And so really be honest withyourself.

(47:31):
If you are feeling bad enoughand there is something that's
just digging you up time andtime again and you're just like
man, like I don't really want tofeel this way anymore, allow
yourself to get strict for justa week.
Even so you can figure thingsout If you're not in that bad a
condition and you eat things andevery once in a while you feel
kind of off.

(47:52):
A lot of people have depressiveepisodes after eating heavy
carbs because when you fluctuateyour blood glucose levels
you're going that messes withyour emotions, like it is
directly connected to youremotional well-being and you'll
know.
Like if you're having carbintolerances of any kind, you're
going to know, and I like toalways, I like to remind people

(48:15):
of that.
Yes, go extreme if you need to.
If you don't have to learn tocut back, just watch yourself
and think about when you go out,what are you eating and how can
you do it in a balanced waywhere you're still getting
things that you love to eat.
But you don't have to go soextreme.
If you don't have to, thendon't.
But also remember to payattention that there is a way of

(48:37):
eating that's going to take youthrough life in a much easier
way, versus if you keep eatingthe way that you are, five years
from now you may not be.
You know where you're at rightnow.

Speaker 1 (48:47):
It might be worse, yeah but as you're talking, I'm
also something else popped intomy mind, because a lot of people
say fiber is extremelyimportant and a lot of people on
the keto diet talk about howthey suffer from constipation
because there's not much fiberin their diet anymore, since

(49:10):
they're mostly eating meats.
Is that accurate and how do you?
And what's the role of fiber ingetting enough fiber for your
gut microbiome?
Does that actually affect it?

Speaker 2 (49:23):
So there's a lot of different scientific studies out
there that show opposites ofeach other.
There's some studies that showyou don't eat fiber at all.
That fiber is actually kind ofa lie.
If you will, really, yeah.
But then there's others thatshow that fiber does feed your
gut microbiome but at the sametime, if you have dysbiosis,
you're not going to want to feedthe gut microbiome because

(49:43):
you're not just feeding the goodones, you're feeding all of
them, right.
So that's where it comes downto a lot of functional medicine
practitioners.
They will say if you have acertain gut dysbiosis, don't eat
fiber.
You need to cut down on thefiber because you're going to be
feeding these bacterias andwhile you're going through
treatment whether you choose togo through a regular antibiotic
approach or you use naturalantibiotics like herbal remedies

(50:05):
, those while you're doing that,you don't want to be feeding
these bacteria, as you want tobe able to wipe them out and get
the ones that need to be, youknow, swept away If they're
overpopulated.
You don't want to be feedingthem while you're trying to
clear them out.
So a lot of practitioners willsay don't eat fiber while you're
clearing out your gut from adysbiosis.
Now, on the other side of it, Ithink there are certain.

(50:30):
On a keto diet, I eat plenty offiber.
I eat more than 50 grams offiber a day and I'm on keto.
Keto does not mean no carbs orit doesn't mean no vegetables.
A lot of people still eat theircertain vegetables.
I mean, like even zucchini.
I can't do zucchini, but onezucchini is only three grams of
carbs right, and you want tostick between 20 to 50 grams of

(50:50):
carbs on a ketogenic diet?
That is so easy.
Like.
I have keto bread that isdelicious and it's only four
grams per slice.
Most bread is 30 grams perslice 30 grams of carbs.
You're eating with just onepiece of toast, right, and so
with the keto toast that I have,it's four grams.
And then you add in, likezucchini and another vegetable

(51:12):
and that's like okay.
So you're added up and you eata whole zucchini and then you
add in, like zucchini and you'reonly at like, seven grams of
carbs, right, and so it's nothard to still eat a wide variety
of food while being on theketogenic diet.
It's just you're cutting outthe high glucose-biking foods
which we're not supposed to beeating in large quantities.
We just happen to at this pointin life because we have access

(51:34):
to it and everyone thinks like,oh, I have access to this, so it
should be okay.
Not, it's just a rewiring, it'sa reframing of what we're
actually supposed to be doingversus what we think that we can
do just because we have accessto it.

Speaker 1 (51:49):
Right.
Have you ever worked withpregnant women who, for example,
I know this woman who she wasvegan and then when she got
pregnant, she started cravingmeat, or vice versa, for example
.
But even women who are about tostart their cycle, their period

(52:13):
, for example I know that myappetite changes and I start to
crave a little bit more sugar,et cetera.
Have you worked with anyonegoing through that?
And then, what are yourthoughts on those cravings at
critical points in the body andhow it's changing?

Speaker 2 (52:33):
Okay, I'm just.
This is like favorite topicshere.
Every single pregnant womanthat I've worked with started
eating meat when they gotpregnant.
They literally could not.
Their body was just like giveme meat.
Like they went from vegan to Iwant a hamburger right now and
there's nothing they could do tostop those cravings.
Right, and I'm really thankfulfor those women listening to

(52:54):
their body, because that is yournatural, intuitive body seeing
this is what I need.
You're making a baby and I needthese nutrients.
If we go back to the beginningof time, we know that what built
our brain was meat.
That was what we survived on.
Meat was what actuallyliterally built our brain, right

(53:16):
, and so our bodies know like,hey, we're building this fetus,
we know what we need, eat this,and our body naturally tells us
what to eat.
Okay, and like now, when thesewomen aren't pregnant, they can
go back to their own views andwhat they think that they need
and not eat it because theirbody's not.
They're like well, whatever,like this isn't you, but if

(53:37):
you're going to build a baby, weneed to.
We need these.
You know these nutrients.
And so working with them.
That is what I typically foundRight.
They all went through that andyou asked me another another.
There's a second part to thatquestion.

Speaker 1 (53:53):
I was also asking in terms of our women or people who
get periods.

Speaker 2 (53:59):
So the big point to that is women.
Women specifically need 18milligrams of iron a day, 18.
This is going to be a kick, ashocking study for you.
So I did a study on all of myclients for a couple of years.
Every single woman, everysingle woman who is still
menstruating, had a low iron andthe sense of their iron was low

(54:24):
, but low ferritin.
And so many of them wereactually so low that had they
gone to the hospital and hadtheir iron levels checked, they
would have had a bloodtransfusion.
Their iron levels were so low.
And the reality is that evenwhen you are eating meat, most
women still are not gettingenough iron, because we lose
that every single month.
So we have to maintain thatRight.

(54:45):
And so meat you can get aboutlike three milligrams of iron
out of each serving.
So when women eat that and theystart craving it, it's because
they need iron.
Their bodies were made to.
You know they're bleeding, sothey have to replenish that and
that's why we need women tend toactually need more meat than
men, and that's another bigshocking thing because usually

(55:07):
it's men who eat more meat, butthey only need a small
percentage of iron and they getthat easily through the meat
content, so they end upoverdoing their irons more often
than not.

Speaker 1 (55:18):
Interesting because I've heard it flip the other way
around.
I had a doctor come on the showand he basically was saying
that sugar is the link to almostall diseases and all health
issues and he was making a casefor that.
And he said that when I hadasked him about nutrition and
stuff, he said that women couldprobably eat more, benefit more

(55:43):
from a vegetarian diet than menactually.
So it's so interesting becausethen it's like what study, like
who's right?
You know what I mean, becauseeveryone's kind of saying
there's a point where everyone'ssaying the same thing, but I
tend to hear different rules ofthought when it comes to the
nutrition piece.

Speaker 2 (56:02):
Well it really comes into when you think about the
certain nutrients that womenneed more than men.
And when we look at that, it'swhen you overdo iron.
You can have the same symptomsas when you have iron deficiency
anemia, which a lot of women do.
And the reality is we can't dowithout iron Iron.
When your iron levels are low,your progesterone levels drop

(56:24):
and when your progesterone dropsit actually lowers your iron.
It's like this hand-in-handcycle and it throws our hormones
out of whack big time if wehave low iron, which is why a
lot of women tend to have reallybad periods or really bad
symptoms.
And it comes down to the factthat the one thing that's
highest in iron is meat.

(56:44):
You cannot get a high source ofvegetables that is high in iron
.
The next closest thing areinsects.
Like I think it's like threegrams of crickets or something I
can't really remember how much,but it has 18 milligrams of
iron.
And when you really think aboutthings, it's like yeah, you
know what Cultures?
There's a lot of cultures whodo eat insects and there's a lot

(57:07):
of cultures who, they do eatnothing but meat.
And we have to look at thosethings as a whole and not just
like the pieces of what'shappening in America.
No one likes to take intoaccount what are our nutrient
deficiencies and what do we havemore of, and a lot of people
are taking multivitamins whenthey don't need to be taking
multivitamins.
And the course that I'mcreating goes through all of

(57:28):
this, because people should beable to know what their nutrient
panels are on a daily basis andwhat they actually need more of
versus what they're eating toomuch of.
Because when you take amultivitamin and you're not
balancing your iron with yourcalcium or your magnesium and
all these things, it throws yourbody out of whack.
And yes, it's sugar, one of thebiggest causes to disease.

(57:49):
Yes, because of insulinresistance, and everything can
come back to insulin resistance.
So that's not wrong.
But we also have to look at thebody as a whole and what the
body needs.
And women when they're irondeficient, anemic, and they're
trying to have a baby, thecomplications are enormous, and
so that and again it comes backto that thing of okay, women

(58:12):
crave meat when they're pregnantor when they're going on their
period, it's because their bodyis telling them hey, I need this
nutrient.
Our body is a tool and it isconstantly talking to us, like
if we could learn to listen toour body, we would know exactly
what we need versus what we'rejust like shoving into it and
trying to fit to make it work.

(58:34):
And so it's really an intuitivething, and in my near death
experiences I was shown a lot ofthis stuff which I'm not going
to talk about right now.
But there's like this ease toreally understanding the human
body and everyone's justskipping over it.
Everyone just sees it as likethis separate entity from them,
instead of realizing, hey, thisis your vehicle and if you

(58:55):
listen to it, you'll know how totake care of yourself.

Speaker 1 (58:59):
Have you heard of the work from Dr Gepa Marte?
He talks about how trauma andunresolved trauma can affect
people's health, right.
So, for example, I think therewas a study I hope I'm not
misquoting this or saying thisincorrectly but essentially, if

(59:19):
people have certain ways ofcoping with their trauma that
they have not resolved and theykeep it in their body, sometimes
it could manifest as autoimmunedisease, it could manifest as
cancer, and I know that you lookat the whole person, you have a
holistic approach and I justwant to hear your thoughts on.

(59:39):
I know everything feeds intoeach other.
I know that the gut affects thebrain, it affects mental health
, but how much and I don't thinkyou'd have the numbers for this
but how much of trauma and allof the hardships of life also
affect someone's health?

Speaker 2 (01:00:00):
So this is where maybe I mentioned it in the
beginning, but this has been thebiggest topic in podcast lately
for me, and the reality is, yes, your trauma is going to affect
your physical body because it'sgoing to affect your vagus
nerve and the way you processinformation.
However, it's actually theopposite that people need to
start looking at, and they donot have a healthy body that is

(01:00:23):
grounded and working properly.
Therefore, turning your vagusnerve off and saying like, hey,
you don't have to be in fight orflight and your gut is fine and
you're not leaking and all ofthese things that are happening
in your body.
That causes those traumaticevents to continue to replay and
the neurological wiring ofthose traumas are going to
continue because you're notgoing to be in a body that's

(01:00:45):
able to process new neurons,you're just going to.
Your body is out of balance, sothese traumas keep coming in
and you just keep reliving thatsame moment over and over.
The traumas are the way that Ilike to look at.
The traumatic aspects aresomatic, like we can feel them
in our body, but the beautifulthing about that is you can move

(01:01:05):
through that with somatictherapy and moving your body,
doing yoga, really moving yourbody and working through that
from a somatic perspective,while you are getting your body
in check too, and then be ableto, like, actually navigate your
trauma from a completelydifferent perspective, because
we're going back to the gutmicrobiome again.
When your gut microbiome isdysbiotic and it's causing all

(01:01:27):
of these symptoms to arisementally and you're being set
off, you're getting aggressive,you're sad, depressed, whatever
it is, whatever's coming up fromthis is going to make you think
that things are connected toyour past, that this is about
your trauma, and then you'rejust going to continue reliving
those being like, oh man, thismust be because of what happened

(01:01:47):
when I was two years old, andit just is stuck in my body and
it's replaying.
So then your mind is going tocontinue rewiring those programs
of like, oh okay, like we'rejust going to continue re
looping this over and over again.
But when you actually fix yourbody and you're coming from a
healing, grounded space and yourbody is able to do the work
that it needs to in order toheal those neurons, in order to

(01:02:08):
refire and reprogram yoursubconscious mind right, then
you can actually look at thesetraumatic experiences from a
completely different perspective.
So, yes, they play, it's a handin hand.
One of does affect the other,but the reality is you cannot
work through that trauma ifyou're in an unhealthy body.
It's just going to keep comingup the same way over and over

(01:02:30):
again until you're able to sitthere in a calm space and look
at it from a completelyoutsider's perspective.

Speaker 1 (01:02:38):
I think what you're saying is true and the reason
I'm saying that is because Irealized the biggest shifts in
consciousness that I've ever had, or the biggest shifts in
healing from my quote, unquotepast, or healing from issues
that I guess people would callshadow work, has come from me

(01:03:03):
prioritizing my physical health.
The biggest leaps and bounds orprogress that I've made in that
space have come simultaneouslywhen I was focused on my
physical health, so moving andtrying to eat better.
So I think there's so much towhat you're saying there and
it's interesting because a lotof these conversations are had

(01:03:26):
separately.
You're talking about the gut,microbiome, the gut brain
connection, but I don't reallyhear a lot of conversations that
talk about what's feeding intoeach other.
Is the trauma from the pastfeeding into the gut or is the
gut feeding into the trauma?
And it sounds like what you'resaying is the stuff in the past
happened and those traumaticevents happened.

(01:03:47):
But if you're trying to shiftinto a new paradigm, if you're
trying to release and heal, youcan't heal without having a body
that's able to kind of rewireitself.

Speaker 2 (01:03:59):
Exactly Because it's a body that's creating.
This is the easiest way for meto say this.
It is your body that iscreating the emotional responses
, not the traumatic experience.
The experience is outside ofyou.
Your body is what's causing theemotional outburst, the
aggressive tendencies, a PTSDepisode.

(01:04:20):
That is a physical response.
That is not a trauma, justbeing like, oh hey, I'm an
external thing and I'm going tocome like, slap you in the face.
Your body is having the triggerrelease and so when you can
stop your body from having thosereleases, you can look at that
and you're like, oh, thathappened to me in the past, but

(01:04:41):
I'm not there anymore.
That's then my body is what'sholding that in there.
So it is literally a physicalresponse.
And if we can remember that itis a physical response, that's
happening, meaning you can feelit and you can see it, then that
is why we need to work on thephysical aspect of it, because I
can't even tell you how muchwork I did on the traumatic

(01:05:03):
events from my childhood.
I did yoga, somatic therapy,talk therapy, all of these
different rakeys and all ofthese healing modalities to work
through that stuff, and suredid it help me understand it?
Yes, but did I stop havingemotional outbursts from it.
No, when did that stop?
When I started understandingwhat was happening in my body on
a physiological level and thatit was causing these upheavals

(01:05:26):
because it was setting off mybiggest nerve and continuing to
refire these programs in mybrain.
And then, when I stopped doingthat, I no longer had those
triggers and then I stoppedreacting to external situations.
And then I was like, oh my God,I've already healed through
that traumatic stuff.
My body just wasn't healed.
My body wasn't given thatchance to reset right.

(01:05:48):
Because we're in our society wetend to go to one extreme, to
the other and we gethyper-focused on like, oh, all
this traumatic stuff you got togo into the spiritual.
People forget it's mind, bodyand spirit.
Your body is responsible forthe physical reactions that
you're having because of thosetraumatic events and it needs to
be brought back to center too.

Speaker 1 (01:06:10):
Wow, this is really good.
I think I can talk to youforever.
I have two last questionsbefore we close out the show.
I have to have you back to havea part two on this.
So the question I want to askis how does this relate to
addictions?
Because a lot of people aresuffering from grief, right,

(01:06:33):
they've lost the loved one, somehave lost their jobs, some have
gone through really traumaticevents in life which you can
relate to, and they are addictedto a lot of substances.
They're addicted to food,alcohol, drugs, however you want
to call it, because the pain isso much there's some pain

(01:06:53):
people go through in life thatit just really brings you to
your knees, especially when youlose a loved one.
I guess what I'm trying to askis can you the focus on the gut
microbiome helps someone, forexample, recover from addiction
a little bit faster?

Speaker 2 (01:07:14):
Yes, I will tell you why, and that is because there
are actually bacteria that causeaddiction.
When we're talking like that,there are literally bacteria in
your gut that can cause anythingyou're experiencing.
It's real.
We find that there are certainbacteria species that are

(01:07:36):
directly linked to alcoholismversus heroin.
If someone one person can takeheroin and they'll never touch
it again, that's because theydon't have the gut microbiome
that's saying, hey, I want this,while other people can.
That might sound so simplistic,but that's the reality.
We literally have these thingsthat are sending what if they're

(01:07:58):
overpopulated and there's a lotof them they're going to
respond with like I hate more ofthis, more of this.
This is again why it comes backto.
We're talking about even peoplewho are obese.
There's literally bacteria thatcause obesity because they say
give me more of these, give memore of this food.
They're actually causing theperson to crave those specific
foods.
It's with any addiction acrossthe board that our gut is having

(01:08:23):
a response to.

Speaker 1 (01:08:27):
Good.
My next question and my finalquestion before we close out the
show is how do we get betterbacteria in our gut?
I know obviously that could bethrough food, but there are a
lot of supplements out there andyou can see this can in my hand
.
I'm drinking this soda calledSuper B.
It's supposed to be a probioticsoda.

(01:08:49):
A lot of those are on themarket.
I just want to hear yourthoughts on probiotic
supplements.
Do you think those are helpful?
Are they gimmicks?
You don't have to endorse anyspecific probiotic company on
the show if you don't want to,but I just want to hear your
thoughts on how people canimprove their gut and do
supplements help and do sodasprobiotic sodas help as well.

Speaker 2 (01:09:13):
My first question would be what's the sugar
content on that?

Speaker 1 (01:09:16):
I got the one that has zero grams of sugar.
I stay away from the ones thathave sugar in it and I can
actually read the ingredients.
It's filtered water, organiccane sugar, organic raspberry
powder, organic pomegranatepowder, and it says that the
sugar is eliminated duringfermentation.
Those are all of theingredients, and it has zero

(01:09:38):
grams of sugar.
We have to take the word for it.

Speaker 2 (01:09:41):
The probiotics is a big piece and there's a lot to
probiotics.
I could definitely not diveinto that, but I am actually
creating a course that has allthe information that someone
would get if they came into a$3,000 consultation and they're
getting it for $50 during thepre-launch sale right now.
In this I talk about probiotics.
I highly recommend a probioticevery single meal.

(01:10:05):
That is because those are goingto help you process the food
that you're eating that youmight not have the gut
microbiome for.
One of the simplest steps thatpeople can take is to
incorporate a probiotic intotheir daily eating.
I recommend going on tointermittent fast for everybody.

(01:10:25):
That's across the board.
Now you're going to want tofigure out which one works best
for you, because there'sdifferent levels to intermittent
fasting.
When you can intermittent fastand only eat twice a day and
take a probiotic with each meal,that alone is going to really
shift your gut.
It's going to help you so much.
The reason I mentioned thecourse is because there's so

(01:10:46):
much to probiotics.
You're not going to just go outand go to Walmart or go to
Target and buy one off the shelf.
Chances are you're not going toget anything from those.
You really need to understandwhat kind of probiotics you're
taking, which ones causehistamine reactions.
There are certain strains thatcause more histamine in the gut.
A lot of people can alreadyhave histamine producing

(01:11:07):
bacteria which they don't needmore of.
Probiotics are a big topic but,yes, probiotics are extremely
beneficial, even when they areconsidered dead.
A lot of times they'll doresearch and they find out that
the bacteria has died once itreaches the intestines.
But they still find that eventhough they are dead, they are

(01:11:29):
still creating a response in thegut.
Like I said before, no one'stechnically an expert on these
little guys yet, because there'sbarely touching the surface,
but we do know that they'restill actually benefiting people
drastically.
I cannot go a meal withouttaking a probiotic.
I noticed the differenceimmediately and so it is.

(01:11:50):
It's a game changer.
Don't just expect to find onethat has all these different
probiotics and then think it'sgood.
That's unfortunately not theway they work.
There's a lot that goes into it.

Speaker 1 (01:12:01):
Thank you for that.
I'm going to make sure I go tothe store this weekend and get a
probiotic, even though you saidthat there's a lot that goes
into it, so I probably need totake your course as well, just
to make sure that I'm taking theright one.
Lynn, thank you so much forthis conversation.
I learned so much, and I'm surethe listeners learned so much
as well.
We just basically scratched thesurface on this conversation,

(01:12:22):
so I appreciate you forexplaining as much as possible.
I always like to ask all myguests for final words of wisdom
to the listeners.
I know you've been dropping alot of gems throughout the show,
but gems that you have that youkeep in your back pocket as you
go through life, or it could berelated to what we've been
talking about.

Speaker 2 (01:12:43):
Well, I think, first off, to take what resonates and
labor doesn't, and to open yourmind to different ways of doing
things.
I think we get so stuck on thisone-way track that this is the
only way to heal or this is theonly way to do things.
But to really pay attention tothere are people out there who
we were doing so much research,and the information that we're
putting out there is for you totake and try.

(01:13:05):
Try different things and findwhat works for you.
That's in every aspect of yourlife.
Really just open up and thinklike, okay, life is an
experience.
Let's try all these differentthings and find what works best
for me.
See how I feel better andreally invest in yourself.
Really take the time and energyto know who you are on all

(01:13:25):
levels and what's going to getyou to the life that you want.
If you want to be a betterperson in all areas of your life
, take the steps to get there.
Don't make excuses.
It's so easy to make excuses,which is actually why I made the
course $50, because I wantpeople to take advantage of this
to learn about their body andtheir mind and what they're

(01:13:45):
creating.
Just really allow yourself togrow.
I always think about it, asthis might sound extreme, but
why be here if you're not goingto grow and get better as a
being, if you're going tostagnate?
Is that really what you want todo for the rest of your life?

Speaker 1 (01:14:04):
Thank you.
Where can people find you ifthey want to connect with you,
to learn more about your work oreven take your course?

Speaker 2 (01:14:12):
Everything's on my website, wwwlynne riverscom, and
that's L-I-N-N riverscom.
You can find everything thatyou need on there.

Speaker 1 (01:14:21):
Thank you, Lynn, for stopping by the show today.

Speaker 2 (01:14:23):
Yeah, thanks so much for having me.

Speaker 1 (01:14:25):
Thank you guys so much for tuning into today's
episode and a big shout out toLynn for stopping by the show.
If you're interested inlearning more about Lynn, please
check out the show notes, whereyou can find a link to her
website, wwwlynne riverscom.
You can follow A Word to theWise on Instagram and TikTok at
A Word to the Wise podcast.
We're also on YouTube at A Wordto the Wise podcast.

(01:14:46):
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Please rate, leave a review,share and subscribe wherever you
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Until next time, peace and love, always, always, always.