August 20, 2025 • 42 mins
There has never been a better time to check back in with our friend and Rotary Peace Builder Dennis Wong. Peace in the world and in ourselves can be hard to find, and we all need to work PEACE is our job in Rotary.
Join me as I talk to those "amazing people turning their Actions 2 Impact all over the world. #BE THE CHANGE
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Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_01 (00:00):
Hi everyone, I'm Gwen Jones and welcome once
again to the Action to Impactpodcast, the weekly podcast
where I introduce you to thoseamazing people who are turning
their actions into impact.
So over the last couple ofweeks, we've reconnected with
some old friends, everyone fromEvan Burrell way across the
(00:22):
world in Australia to just a fewweeks ago, we revisited the Rose
Parade.
Well, I had another friend Iwanted to bring back to the
show.
Why?
Because these are some really,one could argue, scary times.
We in Rotary are peace builders.
In fact, we build entireuniversities just for peace.
(00:44):
But if you're looking at anynews feed or evening news show,
what are we seeing?
Well, not a lot of peace.
So who do we bring back to theshow?
Who do we revisit?
Our dear friend, Dennis Wong.
He is one of the originalRotarian peace builders, and he
(01:05):
has some wise words for us, somecalming, soothing words for us,
and some challenges for us.
That's right, some challenges.
One, just for a hint, is turningour four-way test uphill.
side down.
Literally.
Let's talk about it, shall we?
(01:26):
Dennis Wong and peace throughthe world is our topic today.
And as always, I'm so gladyou've joined us.
(01:48):
Welcome back to the show,everybody.
The Action to Impact podcast isback.
And the last time this man wason my show, it was the I'm a
Rotarian podcast.
So he's been on both podcasts, Iguess, technically.
His name is It's Dennis Wong,and he was one of my earliest
guests.
And the reason why I brought himback is because he is a Rotarian
(02:09):
peace builder.
And I was laughing with Dennisbefore the show because before
when we interviewed, there wasno such thing as a war in Gaza,
a war in Ukraine, people takingpotshots at each other, back and
forth, a struggle with peacewith ourselves as well as
others.
And I sent him out an emailsaying, Dennis, I need you back
(02:33):
on the show because I'm notquite sure what has happened.
And so I need some sanity.
Dennis Wong, welcome back to theshow.
It's lovely to see you again,sir.
SPEAKER_02 (02:42):
Well, thank you, Gwen.
And it's good to be back andgood to see you.
And yes, just peace has been,you know, the area that I've
been focused on.
And I think there's a lot thatwe as Rotarians can do.
SPEAKER_01 (02:59):
Well, Sina, and that's the greatest way to start
off a show because my intro islike, I know Gwen, God.
And for you to pipe upimmediately and say, there's
hope and with peace, with hopecomes a lot of peace and with
peace comes a lot of hope andbringing hope to the world was
just one of our, being the hopein the world was just one of our
(03:20):
slogans not too far, not toolong ago.
But remind everybody what youstarted and why you call
yourself a Rotarian peacebuilder.
SPEAKER_02 (03:32):
Well, there's two things.
One is the fact that I reallybelieve in Rotary.
And since we talked, Gwen, a fewyears ago, really I've evolved
as far as my thinking, as far aspeace and also being a Rotarian
and what we could do.
And I'm always reminded aboutour mission.
(03:54):
is the events, understanding,goodwill, and peace.
And then, of course, there's ourvision about creating change and
lasting change.
So really, that idea, as far asour mission, I looked at what we
can do as Rotarians.
(04:15):
And one of the things that Idiscovered over the last few
years is the fact that we alwaystalk about the four-way test.
But I think we don't reallyfully embrace the Rotarian code
of conduct.
And the Rotarian code of conductsays, by the way, as a Rotarian,
I will.
I will act with integrity andhigh ethical standards.
(04:41):
I will deal fairly with othersand treat them with respect.
And I will help those withspecial needs.
And I will...
improve people's quality of lifeand well-being in my community
and in the world.
And I will mentor young people.
(05:02):
And I add, especially byexample.
So really, in a sense, thatcommitment to do what we're
supposed to do, I think reallytouches on what we have the
tools.
We have the mission and we havethe tools to be peace builders.
And peace builders are really,again, bringing people together,
(05:24):
solving problems.
And also, again, I think one ofthe things that is missing today
is trust.
And if you look at everything asfar as conflicts and they talk
about trying to bring peopletogether, there's a lack of
trust.
And so really, I matched up thisidea of being a Rotarian, the
(05:50):
Rotarian using the Rotarian codeof conduct, and also our other
tools, the four-way text, etcetera.
And I said, you know, that's whowe are.
And if we use these things, wecould be peacebuilders.
And since we're Rotarian, howabout a Rotarian peacebuilder?
And so I'm really, you know,feel comfortable with that
(06:11):
concept.
with that identity that we cando something in moving towards
the peace and just being aRotarian.
SPEAKER_01 (06:22):
Well, and I think what's always quite amazing is
that compared to other nonprofitcivics organizations, as far as
the trustworthy issue, I'vebrought up on this show many
times that the Taliban doesn'ttrust anybody, but they'll trust
Rotarians to put drops ofvaccines in their children's
(06:43):
mouths so that even the Talibanis willing to stop and work from
a place of peace for the benefitof their children.
And that's how trustworthy,using your words, Rotary is.
And do you think people don'treally understand that or
remember that?
Well,
SPEAKER_02 (07:02):
again, I think we don't stress this enough.
I think we don't stress thebenefits.
And as I mentioned, that's why Ireally feel I love the Rotarian
Code of Conduct.
Remember the last couple ofthings about helping those in
needs and then improvingpeople's lives and well-being.
(07:24):
And everybody around the worldwould say, yes, yes.
And that's part of us.
And that's what we're committedto.
So I think it's really,sometimes we forget and forget.
And moving forward, sometimeswho we are, we look for, you
know, the fancy answer orwhatever it is, you know, or
looking for the, you know, as Isaid, the hero who's going to
(07:47):
take over and tell us what to dowith the, you know, the magic
of, you know, whatever it is.
And we forget that withinourselves, we're committed and
we can do things that can make adifference on a personal,
personal level and also ingroups.
And this is where, you know,I've added the fact that in
(08:09):
addition to being trustworthy,is really what the impact is
when we lead by example.
And like you said, you know, inGaza, when we lead by example,
where we show that we care aboutthe kids, we care about people,
and we're actually willing to gointo conflict zones to do help,
(08:33):
That really proves the fact thatwe really care and are willing
to do what's right.
SPEAKER_01 (08:40):
You know, Dennis, you brought up, do we kind of
use the four-way test as like acrutch?
Because I think it's veryinteresting to say that the
four-way test is not officiallya rotary motto.
It is, you know, you can go to aWalgreens right now.
and see the four-way test backin the break room because the
person, the gentleman whostarted Walgreens actually
(09:01):
wrote, was one of the writers ofthe four-way test.
But do you think people go, oh,the four-way test, that's all we
need.
And I ask my listeners, do youthink a lot of people have no
idea what the code of conduct,when was the last time my
listeners read the code ofconduct?
I'm throwing myself under thebus here, Dennis, because I
cannot remember the last time Iread the Code of Conduct.
(09:26):
I think it's in my folder when Ibecame a member 10 years ago.
SPEAKER_02 (09:30):
Well, you're right.
And it's unfortunate in a way.
There's two things.
First of all, yes, not manypeople know the Rotarian Code of
Conduct.
It's in your
SPEAKER_01 (09:40):
magazine.
Everybody can give you thefour-way test.
I mean, there's flags all overthe place of the four-way test.
SPEAKER_02 (09:46):
And also, by the way, I've been a student of the
four-way test.
And When I first joined Rotary,I saw the four-way test and then
understood basically, you know,coming from a business
background and strategy, youknow, the four-way test was
where Herbert J.
Taylor really created thefour-way test as a business
(10:09):
strategy.
SPEAKER_01 (10:09):
Absolutely.
It
SPEAKER_02 (10:11):
was a business strategy to, you know, say this
is what makes my companydifferent.
This is what...
And you can...
You can trust my company to dothe right
SPEAKER_01 (10:21):
thing.
Which is why it makes sense tobe in a break room at Walgreens
drugstore.
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (10:27):
Exactly.
So it's really, it's acomplimentary to the libertarian
code of conduct.
And I, but then I think, yes,it's easy.
I think what people, you know,In fact, when I first started, I
think 10 years ago, not manypeople knew the four-way test.
(10:47):
Really?
Yeah.
I mean, you ask most people.
I don't think they know thefour-way test without looking at
their banner.
SPEAKER_01 (10:56):
I would say I get at least three out of four of them
because there's two that arereally close together that I mix
up.
SPEAKER_02 (11:04):
Yeah.
But that's okay.
I mean, in a sense, becausealso, again, I looked at it a
little differently.
Most people, which is good, theysee the four-way test as
something about being honest.
And I look at, again, as abusiness guy, I look at it as an
approach to problem solving,which, again, what Herbert J.
(11:24):
Taylor looked at as solving hisbusiness problem.
And also the fact that I thinkI've written, I had a brochure
on the four-way test.
I've written a blog on thefour-way test.
And what came up to me was thefact that we struggle to use it
in a sense of being a problemsolving.
(11:44):
And I just, you know, becausestarting with, is it the truth?
I think it's somewhat true.
Good idea.
SPEAKER_01 (11:52):
Vast.
But it's kind of vast becausewhat's truth for you, Dennis,
may be different than truth forme, right?
SPEAKER_02 (11:59):
Exactly.
And so that's the problem with,you know, how to use it.
And if we start with, is it thetruth?
There's different truths fordifferent people.
And I found it easier, noteasier, but maybe more
effective.
If you flip the test and flipthat it started out, well, it'd
be beneficial to all concerned.
(12:19):
and start there, what would bebeneficial to all concerned.
And then the next one is, youknow, will it build good, will
it build friendships?
If you just took those two ofthe four weight tests, I think
it's more, I think, productiveand more interesting
conversations.
So instead of being anadversarial advocate, who's got
(12:42):
the truth, who hasn't, here'sour shared goal.
Here's our shared outcome thatwe want.
You know, wherever we are, thisis where we want to be.
And so I think that's the thingabout the four-way test.
And also then, when youcomplement it with the Rotarian
Code of Conduct about theintegrity and everything else,
(13:04):
and also the fact that, onceagain, it reaffirms the fact
that improving people's qualityof life and well-being.
And really, that's the thingthat also the four-way test
should be pointing at as far as,you know, improving people's
lives.
And of course, the biggest thingabout improving people's lives
(13:26):
is hopefully is having peace, beit peace in the community, peace
in the world, and also peacewithin ourselves.
SPEAKER_01 (13:35):
So, I started the show by saying these are very
interesting times.
When we spoke before, like Isaid, Ukraine hadn't happened.
And the stuff that's going on inGaza and Israel hadn't happened.
And the mental health crisisthat we're having right now.
You just mentioned peace inourselves that we're having
right now is just awful.
(13:56):
Do you think it's as easy as...
Be trustworthy, lead by example,find the opportunity and the
challenges.
Is it as easy as those simplerotary basics that could help
all those countries find peace?
(14:17):
Is it that simple?
Am I being too naive in thatquestion?
SPEAKER_02 (14:23):
It's simple in a sense that I think in lasting,
like I say, in any lastingchange, any lasting change for
people is when you get peopleinvolved and also people
actually solving the problemsthemselves in many ways, as
opposed to somebody coming inwith an answer how to do it.
(14:45):
And the thing is, in order tosolve problems, I think you have
to have being able to identifythe underlying causes and have
the, you know, I guess...
SPEAKER_01 (14:57):
And do the research.
Why is there a war?
Why is there a conflict?
Yeah,
SPEAKER_02 (15:03):
because not only do we want to solve the immediate
problem, we want to solve thelong-term problem.
And I think when you have trust,you can, you know...
bring in a lot of differentideas because it really is
you're not trying to judge who'ssmarter than the other person
(15:24):
etc but you trust each other tothat we are sharing the same
goal and when and then we'relooking at certain options and
things and one of the thingsthat i think in in in uh
Trustworthy and being trusty isalso this whole idea of
innovation and creativity.
(15:45):
And one of the quotes that I'malways reminded of is the fact
that trust opens up new andunimagined possibilities.
Because right now, sometimes welook for the quick answer or
whatever it is.
But when you trust each otherand you're willing to go the
(16:06):
next step, the extra options andthings, because, you know, we're
trying to do the same thing.
I think it opens up creativity.
And so this is one of the thingsthat, and, you know, and also
just there's a couple of quotesthat I'm, you know, Think about
(16:26):
this whole idea of trust.
Without trust, there can be nogenuine peace because you can
have treaties.
And you've seen it.
People have treaties, but thenthey break them.
Right.
And
SPEAKER_01 (16:39):
that particular day and that second, I agree
SPEAKER_02 (16:43):
with you.
Exactly.
So it's treated themselves.
And it's really, it's aboutbeing trusted.
And we know in our ownrelationships, people you trust
and people you don't trust.
And even when you havedisagreements, you can open up
and talk with people you trustand try to find solutions or
whatever it is.
(17:03):
And the other thing which isamongst countries is the United
Nations Secretary GeneralAntonio Guterres, because when I
was at the UN and they weretalking about the nuclear
weapons and the SecurityCouncil, and he mentioned, you
know, trust is in short supply.
And we can see it now withwhat's happening, you know, with
(17:24):
be it Ukraine, Gaza and things,where the United Nations is
supposed to be really a worldbody that addresses these
issues, you know, are sort oflike important as far as, you
know, getting the solutionsbecause people don't trust these
other nations, et cetera.
So I put trust really high inthe list as far as, and I think
(17:51):
being Rotarian and bringing ourmission, vision, our values and
principles really lead to beingtrustworthy.
And also I like, you know, whatthe, Stephanie Urchik, The Magic
of Rotary.
I really got, really love itbecause also her conversation, I
(18:12):
think her story about how shegot the magic of, you know,
Rotary is the fact that she wason a service trip in the
Dominican Republic and a cleanwater project.
And so they poured dirty waterinto this water filter and out
came clean water.
And the boy said, wow.
That's magic.
(18:34):
And I think this is what we asRotarians and using our tools
that we have really cantransform, transform conflicts
and division into belonging andtrust and changing hate to love.
(18:55):
And this is, I think we have avery powerful message But we're
not necessarily telling it in apowerful way yet.
And this is one of the thingsthat I'm trying to do as far as
people can feel comfortableabout being a Rotarian peace
builder and using the magic ofRotary to transform bad to good
(19:22):
things.
et cetera, and war to peace.
And I don't, well, I don't haveall the answers.
I think I might not even haveany of the answers, but I know I
have the ability to maybeprovide a platform where people
who are involved can gettogether and and try to find the
(19:46):
right things where everybody,and when it's beneficial, all
concerned, to improve people'slives.
And I think that that's our, youknow, Rotarian, in a way,
mission.
Again, I go back to, you know,advancing, understanding,
goodwill, and peace.
So...
SPEAKER_01 (20:06):
So, you said at the beginning of this, Dennis, that
we don't brag enough.
And so, could you tell ourlisteners...
What is Rotary doing right nowfor peace?
I mean, we hear about thesepeace universities that we help
sponsor, if not build.
We hear about peace polls.
(20:27):
But what are we actively doingas Rotarians to build peace?
What can you brag a little bitabout us?
SPEAKER_02 (20:35):
Well, I think there's the last few years, by
the way.
I think what peace polls havedone is engage a lot of
Rotarians, members, to beactive, to doing something, and
also to being, thinking aboutwhat it all means.
And one of the things, you know,my dream has been, when I
(20:57):
started with Al Jubitz, theRotarian National Group for
Peace, a dozen years ago, mydream was the fact that we have
two million Rotarianpeacebuilders.
Every member of Rotary is apeacebuilder.
And that was my dream, the factthat everybody is involved in
(21:17):
what they can do.
So I think the Peace Pulse hasengaged a lot of people to do
something.
And I think there's more andmore people are doing it, which
is good because, you know, Ipick up my, I guess...
Google alerts on the Peace Poll,and I see every day that there's
(21:39):
some Rotary Club has planted aPeace Poll somewhere in their
community.
So that's really very positivebecause not only does it engage
people in the idea of peace, itpublicizes it.
SPEAKER_01 (21:53):
Right, and not just the Rotary.
And for those of you who don'tknow what a Peace Poll is, they
are these, first of all, lookthem up.
Google them, as Dennis justsaid.
And you'll see several pictures,literally from all around the
world, of these beautiful poststhat go in the ground that are
rotary peace poles, designatingthat every time you go by this
pole, think of a world of peaceand harmony, as well as other
(22:17):
things.
Please.
SPEAKER_02 (22:19):
Yeah, no, and not only planted, it planted
anywhere you go, because I'vegot a personal...
that I can take with me anywhereI want.
SPEAKER_03 (22:30):
Yay!
SPEAKER_02 (22:30):
And also, so we plant it, quote, at a lot of the
events, wherever we go.
And also, we had a full-wavespeech contest at an auditorium.
We can have a Peace Bowl there.
If you have a districtconference or whatever it is,
you can have a Peace Bowl there.
So it's really, in a sense,amazing.
(22:52):
As I said, half peaceful willtravel.
So that's one thing.
So that's been a very, verypositive element as far as
getting people involved.
I think more and more it'sbecoming the leadership,
(23:12):
especially with starting, Iguess, Stephanie Orchek.
And peace has always beenimportant.
But it's never necessarily, youknow, had the spotlight on it.
Which
SPEAKER_01 (23:25):
is so funny because there's part of me that thinks
to myself, if we fix theenvironment and we had peace,
then people would have jobs.
People would have clean water.
People would have, you know,safe hygiene for their children.
People would have food to eat.
I mean, to me, it's like, why ispeace the...
Oh, yeah.
(23:45):
And by the way...
Oh, yeah.
By the way, maybe we should bepeaceful now.
It just seems like we're goingbackwards in that department.
SPEAKER_02 (23:55):
Well, in some ways, you're right.
And Gwen, you're a believer.
And the thing is, and, you know,one of the things that, like,
is, you know, the idea is if youhad peace and a lot of other
things would be a lot easier.
Wouldn't they now?
And I think...
As you mentioned, even be itGaza and Pakistan and the Rotary
(24:21):
thing, is when they stopped thethree days in Gaza to administer
the vaccine, Antonio, again, UNSecretary Antonio Guterres said,
you know, peace might be theultimate vaccine for polio.
UNKNOWN (24:40):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (24:40):
Because you notice the last few places where we had
polio and we were administeringpolio, it's really been in
conflict zones.
SPEAKER_01 (24:54):
It has been.
SPEAKER_02 (24:55):
Yeah.
Yeah.
So you think about it as thefact that it was a more peaceful
area.
It just makes it easier toadminister anything, to do
anything, to get agreements on alot of different things.
Yeah.
So anyway, what I thinkStephanie Urchak and now the new
(25:16):
president, Francisco, hasmentioned the fact that the top
three priorities are poliomembership and peace.
And so now that peace is on, Iguess, on a higher plane, it's
an opportunity to talk aboutwhat does that mean?
What does peace mean to you?
What does peace mean to theclub, district, et cetera?
(25:39):
So it's now...
Again, once you can have adialogue, it makes a difference.
And it makes a difference whenpeople's thinking, makes a
difference in how creativitycomes in.
Also, the fact that I'm glad thelast or the most recent program
(26:00):
of scale, which I just noticedis the fact that where Rotary
instituted, what, three yearsago, a$2 million grant program.
This year was awarded to a peaceprogram in Colombia, which was,
I think, organized by two peacefellows, and in bringing peace
(26:23):
to about four counties inColombia.
And so I think that's bringingthis whole idea of what peace
means and what we can do inpeace is coming more to the
forefront.
SPEAKER_01 (26:39):
And in your area, you do that with a position
called a peace chair for yourdistrict.
And I found this reallyinteresting because my district
doesn't have one of these.
And so, Dennis, you have adistrict chair like position as
(27:01):
the peace builder and our otherclubs kind of bringing this on
as a, what, what is a peacebuilder position or chair?
SPEAKER_02 (27:11):
Well, I think it's really, again, one is bringing
attention to the thing.
And also I think then itprovides an opportunity to put
together programs and, and thelike.
And one of the things that Isaid earlier, When we started,
(27:32):
first of all, in our district,it helped to have a district
governor who was behind thisidea.
SPEAKER_01 (27:39):
And let's just say district governors that are
hearing my voice, Dennis issaying, it's lucky we had a
district governor that was forPete's building.
Like, this shouldn't be ararity, Dennis.
I'm sorry, but that's like thefunniest thing.
Every district governor shouldbe going, Yeah.
Why don't we all have peacechairs?
SPEAKER_02 (27:59):
And also, you know, again, it's really the peace
chair brings to the districtdifferent ideas as far as what's
happening in the Rotary worldabout people doing peace.
And, you know, there's, again,so as a peace co-chair, we
brought together the idea of theRotarian Nation Group for Peace
(28:21):
Peace Builder Club program.
And from that, a number of clubsjoined in to join the Rotarian
National Group for Peace asmembers and also have their
clubs as peace builder clubs.
And one of the unique things,actually, our district governor
here is 7980.
There
SPEAKER_01 (28:41):
you go.
Shout out to 7980 that has
SPEAKER_02 (28:44):
a
SPEAKER_01 (28:45):
peace chair.
SPEAKER_02 (28:46):
And D.G.
called him a Robert friend.
He had a special spin to peace.
And he had a program, it'scalled Opus with Peace.
Opus with Peace.
Which really brings music andthe arts to peace.
And, you know, and we know thatthere's in music and the arts
(29:08):
and things, it's a way ofbringing people together and
enjoying talking about peace.
And so I think we've, so theyadded, so it's not just, you
know, quote, conflict,resolution, conflict,
transformation, but it's reallysomething that touches people,
their own lives, and why peacecomes.
(29:30):
is important why peace is alsobeneficial to one's own life and
also you know like we say we hadyou know we addressed what two
years ago whatever with uh aboutmental health and you know
SPEAKER_01 (29:48):
yeah Under Gordon McAnally was very much under
SPEAKER_02 (29:51):
peace within ourselves.
Inner peace is very important.
And so I think there's a, sowhat it is, it's a, you kind of
like brought a lot of differentideas and said, you know, just
add it.
Maybe there's a quote, what wedo in peace could touch and
improve what we're doing inother areas too.
And so it's really, I guess it'sa commitment and that we want
(30:16):
to, now that it's, One of ourtop three priorities, you know,
some areas and districtgovernors, et cetera, will start
saying, oh, it's importantenough that we appoint somebody
to say, you know, be a peacechair.
Is peace
SPEAKER_01 (30:38):
really quite easy and we make it hard?
SPEAKER_02 (30:42):
No, it's, you know, it's really, it's been, it's
been an interesting journey.
I guess, gig in moving forward.
And again, I've learned so muchas far as getting involved with
this idea of peace.
And again, like I said, there'sthings in the moving into the
(31:05):
music and the arts with Peace.
And also, I've learned certainthings about even, you know,
psychology and other thingsabout, you know, trauma and
different things and how you cando it.
And also, again, like I said,with Peace, he can make a lot of
other things, you know, morepractical as far as being
(31:29):
successful.
And I think so.
SPEAKER_01 (31:31):
So, find this all again where this passion for
peace comes from dennis i meanyou you well and you and you
laugh but i mean maybe anybodycan say you know that they want
but i mean there are some peoplewho are i mean you're very
passionate about it where doesthat passion for peace come from
SPEAKER_02 (31:53):
well i think well first of all you know i
SPEAKER_01 (31:56):
i
SPEAKER_02 (31:57):
I'm a 20-year-old veteran of Rotary.
Okay.
And my first few years, I wasable to get involved.
And I got involved with a lot ofdifferent things, water
projects, education, andeverything else.
And then I read, you know, thisarticle in Rotary magazine and
read about...
(32:17):
It was a peace issue.
Okay.
You know, I think it was in, youknow, 2012 or whatever it is.
And I said, you know...
Again, I said, you know, ifwe're at peace, a lot of things
could happen that would be very,very positive.
And also, I guess it was partlymy background, my upgrowing.
(32:41):
I was very fortunate to be bornand raised in Hawaii.
Aloha.
You know, diversity was aninteresting thing.
And I like to say in Hawaii thateveryone's a minority.
Everyone, everybody, differentnationalities, different
(33:02):
generations, and et cetera, etcetera.
And so I saw a lot of peoplegetting together, getting along
together.
And so it's a combination ofbeing grateful, being partly of
service, and also finding thatmaybe this is an area that we
(33:23):
should really explore furtheror, you know, do more than we'll
be doing so far at thatparticular thing because we're
doing service.
And also, by the way, there wasthat year our international, you
know, president was Tanaka, histheme was peace through service.
(33:45):
And so that kind of also helpedpropel my course of, you know,
where I was looking at.
And And I think, again, Ievolved.
So I started the RotarianNational Group of Peace, which
is interesting.
And also that's when actuallythe Rotary Peace Centers was
(34:05):
kind of like growing up and wewere getting more peace.
So also I found that's where theaction was.
And
SPEAKER_01 (34:15):
the Peace Building was where the action was.
Okay.
SPEAKER_02 (34:18):
And then that's where I could probably
contribute more and better to Inother areas, there are other
people who are better than I asfar as, you know, the other
areas of service.
And so, you know, I saw thisarea as kind of like interesting
and I could excel at it.
SPEAKER_01 (34:38):
I love it.
I love it.
So I've only got one morequestion for you.
And I thank you.
I know you're a busy guy wakingup on the West Coast to talk to
a woman on the East Coast.
So I thank you so much.
But let's say that the PeaceBuilder chair, becomes a
position all in Rotary.
Like every single district,talking to you district
(34:59):
governors, every single zoneleader, there are peace builders
as part of everybody's board.
When that happens, what doesRotary look like with all of
those peace builders?
What is that gonna make?
What's the concrete evidencewe're gonna start seeing if we
have that many peace buildersMillions of them all over the 2
(35:23):
million peacebuilders that youhad talked about.
What is that going to be doing?
SPEAKER_02 (35:28):
Well, I think, again, I think it really
provides the visibility of whowe are as Rotarians and what our
goals and purpose are.
And when you add that numbers,and the thing is, I say, you
know, the talents that we have,2 million people, the talents in
(35:52):
problem solving and the like,mediation in social work and
things that are connected withbringing peace, it would be
enormous.
So I think the impact on ourcommunities and also the impact
(36:16):
of The associations that we'repart of, you know, we're part of
the United Nations, we're partof UNESCO and other things.
So you got Rotarians and just,you know, the whole identity and
brand will make a big, bigdifference as far as Art Brody
itself, attracting people.
(36:38):
who are interested in what we'redoing and want to join in what
we're doing, which is what morecan you do than being a peace
builder?
And also this wholesatisfaction.
So I think it would be a new ageof Rotary in many ways.
We've been at it for talkingabout polio and being identified
(37:01):
as far as the second diseasethat's eliminated.
So just think of what So we arevery, as we should, pride, be
proudful, pride as far as ourwork at Polio.
Just think, the next decade,whatever it is, if we bring
(37:22):
peace to a lot of differentareas, I mean, how big of a
success story would that be?
And one of the things, by theway, Rotary has, we have a lot
of tools that the that we're notusing as much as, you know,
which is another session,probably, the tools that we
(37:43):
have, the tools that we havethat maybe, and also, by the
way, which is one of the thingsthat we also have a lot of
money.
You know, we got a lot of moneyin the coffers.
It's just a matter of how we useit and how we direct it.
And so we've got a lot of thingsthat potentially we have that if
(38:05):
we focus on, this area of peace,I think it'd be amazing.
And we would amaze evenourselves as far as what we can
accomplish.
SPEAKER_01 (38:16):
Wow.
So maybe the first disease waswar and maybe the second, you
know, and how to solve all thediseases after that is peace.
Maybe it's just that simple.
SPEAKER_02 (38:28):
Well, you know, what we had, you know, is polio, is
preventing polio.
And what we hope It's just likeany disease.
How do we prevent it?
And not necessarily just cureit.
How do we prevent it?
And that's peace.
Again, one of the peace fellowswas quoted in saying, you know,
(38:48):
I became, you know, joinedRotary, became a peace fellow to
prevent wars, not just toaddress the consequences of war.
So really prevention is really,really what can we do to prevent
(39:10):
violence?
What can we do to prevent wars,et cetera, et cetera.
And I think this, again, goingback to who we are, our values,
our principles, our mission,it's really directed to
preventing things, bad thingsfrom happening.
SPEAKER_01 (39:29):
I love it.
Dennis Wong, thank you forcoming back on the show.
Thank you for being a rotarypeace builder.
And I do a shout out one moretime to all my district
governors.
Let's have some peace builders.
I know Dennis would help you ifyou're interested in having that
be a board position, even if westart at the clubs, don't you
think?
Even if we just had a person atevery club that was in charge of
(39:55):
peace and peace building, whatan amazing rotary it would be.
Dennis, thank you so much forjoining me.
It's always wonderful to seeyour face, sir.
Thank you.
Thank you.
SPEAKER_02 (40:05):
You're welcome.
And as I said, I welcome anyinquiries, whatever I can help.
And so, you know.
Please, you know, give a shoutout to me as far as your
interest.
I love to hear from PeaceBuilders because, again,
sometimes I hear some peopledoing amazing things out there.
SPEAKER_00 (40:28):
I love it.
Yeah, let's do it.
SPEAKER_01 (40:34):
So I'm bringing up that topic again.
Presidents, boards, districtboards, international boards.
I mean, come on.
Do we have a position for peace?
Do we have a constant 24 hours aday, 360 position that just
wants peace?
(40:54):
Because I stick with Dennis.
The way you're going to curepolio, the way you're going to
cure anger, the way you're goingto cure starvation, the way
you're going to cure clean waterand sanitation, the way you're
going to cure people beingscared, just being scared is if
(41:16):
we find peace, not only in theworld, but in ourselves.
Thank you, Dennis, for bringinga joyful conversation, a
peace-filled conversation.
And again, a challenge to youpresidents, district governors,
zone chairs.
I think more peace positionswould be awesome.
(41:40):
And I think you listening isalso awesome.
If you know a Rotarian ornon-Rotarian that is turning
their actions into impact, Iwant to know about it.
please please RotarianPod atgmail.com and you know the
routine tell a friend downloadus give me reviews you know with
(42:05):
this name change it's just thatlittle tweak that helps the
world know that we're out herealright then until next week
take care of yourself and theworld around you and we'll hear
you next time on the Action toImpact podcast thank you as
always for listening.
We'll talk to you soon.
(42:26):
Bye-bye.
Hi everyone, I'm Gwen Jones and welcome once
again to the Action to Impactpodcast, the weekly podcast
where I introduce you to thoseamazing people who are turning
their actions into impact.
So over the last couple ofweeks, we've reconnected with
some old friends, everyone fromEvan Burrell way across the
(00:22):
world in Australia to just a fewweeks ago, we revisited the Rose
Parade.
Well, I had another friend Iwanted to bring back to the
show.
Why?
Because these are some really,one could argue, scary times.
We in Rotary are peace builders.
In fact, we build entireuniversities just for peace.
(00:44):
But if you're looking at anynews feed or evening news show,
what are we seeing?
Well, not a lot of peace.
So who do we bring back to theshow?
Who do we revisit?
Our dear friend, Dennis Wong.
He is one of the originalRotarian peace builders, and he
(01:05):
has some wise words for us, somecalming, soothing words for us,
and some challenges for us.
That's right, some challenges.
One, just for a hint, is turningour four-way test uphill.
side down.
Literally.
Let's talk about it, shall we?
(01:26):
Dennis Wong and peace throughthe world is our topic today.
And as always, I'm so gladyou've joined us.
(01:48):
Welcome back to the show,everybody.
The Action to Impact podcast isback.
And the last time this man wason my show, it was the I'm a
Rotarian podcast.
So he's been on both podcasts, Iguess, technically.
His name is It's Dennis Wong,and he was one of my earliest
guests.
And the reason why I brought himback is because he is a Rotarian
(02:09):
peace builder.
And I was laughing with Dennisbefore the show because before
when we interviewed, there wasno such thing as a war in Gaza,
a war in Ukraine, people takingpotshots at each other, back and
forth, a struggle with peacewith ourselves as well as
others.
And I sent him out an emailsaying, Dennis, I need you back
(02:33):
on the show because I'm notquite sure what has happened.
And so I need some sanity.
Dennis Wong, welcome back to theshow.
It's lovely to see you again,sir.
SPEAKER_02 (02:42):
Well, thank you, Gwen.
And it's good to be back andgood to see you.
And yes, just peace has been,you know, the area that I've
been focused on.
And I think there's a lot thatwe as Rotarians can do.
SPEAKER_01 (02:59):
Well, Sina, and that's the greatest way to start
off a show because my intro islike, I know Gwen, God.
And for you to pipe upimmediately and say, there's
hope and with peace, with hopecomes a lot of peace and with
peace comes a lot of hope andbringing hope to the world was
just one of our, being the hopein the world was just one of our
(03:20):
slogans not too far, not toolong ago.
But remind everybody what youstarted and why you call
yourself a Rotarian peacebuilder.
SPEAKER_02 (03:32):
Well, there's two things.
One is the fact that I reallybelieve in Rotary.
And since we talked, Gwen, a fewyears ago, really I've evolved
as far as my thinking, as far aspeace and also being a Rotarian
and what we could do.
And I'm always reminded aboutour mission.
(03:54):
is the events, understanding,goodwill, and peace.
And then, of course, there's ourvision about creating change and
lasting change.
So really, that idea, as far asour mission, I looked at what we
can do as Rotarians.
(04:15):
And one of the things that Idiscovered over the last few
years is the fact that we alwaystalk about the four-way test.
But I think we don't reallyfully embrace the Rotarian code
of conduct.
And the Rotarian code of conductsays, by the way, as a Rotarian,
I will.
I will act with integrity andhigh ethical standards.
(04:41):
I will deal fairly with othersand treat them with respect.
And I will help those withspecial needs.
And I will...
improve people's quality of lifeand well-being in my community
and in the world.
And I will mentor young people.
(05:02):
And I add, especially byexample.
So really, in a sense, thatcommitment to do what we're
supposed to do, I think reallytouches on what we have the
tools.
We have the mission and we havethe tools to be peace builders.
And peace builders are really,again, bringing people together,
(05:24):
solving problems.
And also, again, I think one ofthe things that is missing today
is trust.
And if you look at everything asfar as conflicts and they talk
about trying to bring peopletogether, there's a lack of
trust.
And so really, I matched up thisidea of being a Rotarian, the
(05:50):
Rotarian using the Rotarian codeof conduct, and also our other
tools, the four-way text, etcetera.
And I said, you know, that's whowe are.
And if we use these things, wecould be peacebuilders.
And since we're Rotarian, howabout a Rotarian peacebuilder?
And so I'm really, you know,feel comfortable with that
(06:11):
concept.
with that identity that we cando something in moving towards
the peace and just being aRotarian.
SPEAKER_01 (06:22):
Well, and I think what's always quite amazing is
that compared to other nonprofitcivics organizations, as far as
the trustworthy issue, I'vebrought up on this show many
times that the Taliban doesn'ttrust anybody, but they'll trust
Rotarians to put drops ofvaccines in their children's
(06:43):
mouths so that even the Talibanis willing to stop and work from
a place of peace for the benefitof their children.
And that's how trustworthy,using your words, Rotary is.
And do you think people don'treally understand that or
remember that?
Well,
SPEAKER_02 (07:02):
again, I think we don't stress this enough.
I think we don't stress thebenefits.
And as I mentioned, that's why Ireally feel I love the Rotarian
Code of Conduct.
Remember the last couple ofthings about helping those in
needs and then improvingpeople's lives and well-being.
(07:24):
And everybody around the worldwould say, yes, yes.
And that's part of us.
And that's what we're committedto.
So I think it's really,sometimes we forget and forget.
And moving forward, sometimeswho we are, we look for, you
know, the fancy answer orwhatever it is, you know, or
looking for the, you know, as Isaid, the hero who's going to
(07:47):
take over and tell us what to dowith the, you know, the magic
of, you know, whatever it is.
And we forget that withinourselves, we're committed and
we can do things that can make adifference on a personal,
personal level and also ingroups.
And this is where, you know,I've added the fact that in
(08:09):
addition to being trustworthy,is really what the impact is
when we lead by example.
And like you said, you know, inGaza, when we lead by example,
where we show that we care aboutthe kids, we care about people,
and we're actually willing to gointo conflict zones to do help,
(08:33):
That really proves the fact thatwe really care and are willing
to do what's right.
SPEAKER_01 (08:40):
You know, Dennis, you brought up, do we kind of
use the four-way test as like acrutch?
Because I think it's veryinteresting to say that the
four-way test is not officiallya rotary motto.
It is, you know, you can go to aWalgreens right now.
and see the four-way test backin the break room because the
person, the gentleman whostarted Walgreens actually
(09:01):
wrote, was one of the writers ofthe four-way test.
But do you think people go, oh,the four-way test, that's all we
need.
And I ask my listeners, do youthink a lot of people have no
idea what the code of conduct,when was the last time my
listeners read the code ofconduct?
I'm throwing myself under thebus here, Dennis, because I
cannot remember the last time Iread the Code of Conduct.
(09:26):
I think it's in my folder when Ibecame a member 10 years ago.
SPEAKER_02 (09:30):
Well, you're right.
And it's unfortunate in a way.
There's two things.
First of all, yes, not manypeople know the Rotarian Code of
Conduct.
It's in your
SPEAKER_01 (09:40):
magazine.
Everybody can give you thefour-way test.
I mean, there's flags all overthe place of the four-way test.
SPEAKER_02 (09:46):
And also, by the way, I've been a student of the
four-way test.
And When I first joined Rotary,I saw the four-way test and then
understood basically, you know,coming from a business
background and strategy, youknow, the four-way test was
where Herbert J.
Taylor really created thefour-way test as a business
(10:09):
strategy.
SPEAKER_01 (10:09):
Absolutely.
It
SPEAKER_02 (10:11):
was a business strategy to, you know, say this
is what makes my companydifferent.
This is what...
And you can...
You can trust my company to dothe right
SPEAKER_01 (10:21):
thing.
Which is why it makes sense tobe in a break room at Walgreens
drugstore.
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (10:27):
Exactly.
So it's really, it's acomplimentary to the libertarian
code of conduct.
And I, but then I think, yes,it's easy.
I think what people, you know,In fact, when I first started, I
think 10 years ago, not manypeople knew the four-way test.
(10:47):
Really?
Yeah.
I mean, you ask most people.
I don't think they know thefour-way test without looking at
their banner.
SPEAKER_01 (10:56):
I would say I get at least three out of four of them
because there's two that arereally close together that I mix
up.
SPEAKER_02 (11:04):
Yeah.
But that's okay.
I mean, in a sense, becausealso, again, I looked at it a
little differently.
Most people, which is good, theysee the four-way test as
something about being honest.
And I look at, again, as abusiness guy, I look at it as an
approach to problem solving,which, again, what Herbert J.
(11:24):
Taylor looked at as solving hisbusiness problem.
And also the fact that I thinkI've written, I had a brochure
on the four-way test.
I've written a blog on thefour-way test.
And what came up to me was thefact that we struggle to use it
in a sense of being a problemsolving.
(11:44):
And I just, you know, becausestarting with, is it the truth?
I think it's somewhat true.
Good idea.
SPEAKER_01 (11:52):
Vast.
But it's kind of vast becausewhat's truth for you, Dennis,
may be different than truth forme, right?
SPEAKER_02 (11:59):
Exactly.
And so that's the problem with,you know, how to use it.
And if we start with, is it thetruth?
There's different truths fordifferent people.
And I found it easier, noteasier, but maybe more
effective.
If you flip the test and flipthat it started out, well, it'd
be beneficial to all concerned.
(12:19):
and start there, what would bebeneficial to all concerned.
And then the next one is, youknow, will it build good, will
it build friendships?
If you just took those two ofthe four weight tests, I think
it's more, I think, productiveand more interesting
conversations.
So instead of being anadversarial advocate, who's got
(12:42):
the truth, who hasn't, here'sour shared goal.
Here's our shared outcome thatwe want.
You know, wherever we are, thisis where we want to be.
And so I think that's the thingabout the four-way test.
And also then, when youcomplement it with the Rotarian
Code of Conduct about theintegrity and everything else,
(13:04):
and also the fact that, onceagain, it reaffirms the fact
that improving people's qualityof life and well-being.
And really, that's the thingthat also the four-way test
should be pointing at as far as,you know, improving people's
lives.
And of course, the biggest thingabout improving people's lives
(13:26):
is hopefully is having peace, beit peace in the community, peace
in the world, and also peacewithin ourselves.
SPEAKER_01 (13:35):
So, I started the show by saying these are very
interesting times.
When we spoke before, like Isaid, Ukraine hadn't happened.
And the stuff that's going on inGaza and Israel hadn't happened.
And the mental health crisisthat we're having right now.
You just mentioned peace inourselves that we're having
right now is just awful.
(13:56):
Do you think it's as easy as...
Be trustworthy, lead by example,find the opportunity and the
challenges.
Is it as easy as those simplerotary basics that could help
all those countries find peace?
(14:17):
Is it that simple?
Am I being too naive in thatquestion?
SPEAKER_02 (14:23):
It's simple in a sense that I think in lasting,
like I say, in any lastingchange, any lasting change for
people is when you get peopleinvolved and also people
actually solving the problemsthemselves in many ways, as
opposed to somebody coming inwith an answer how to do it.
(14:45):
And the thing is, in order tosolve problems, I think you have
to have being able to identifythe underlying causes and have
the, you know, I guess...
SPEAKER_01 (14:57):
And do the research.
Why is there a war?
Why is there a conflict?
Yeah,
SPEAKER_02 (15:03):
because not only do we want to solve the immediate
problem, we want to solve thelong-term problem.
And I think when you have trust,you can, you know...
bring in a lot of differentideas because it really is
you're not trying to judge who'ssmarter than the other person
(15:24):
etc but you trust each other tothat we are sharing the same
goal and when and then we'relooking at certain options and
things and one of the thingsthat i think in in in uh
Trustworthy and being trusty isalso this whole idea of
innovation and creativity.
(15:45):
And one of the quotes that I'malways reminded of is the fact
that trust opens up new andunimagined possibilities.
Because right now, sometimes welook for the quick answer or
whatever it is.
But when you trust each otherand you're willing to go the
(16:06):
next step, the extra options andthings, because, you know, we're
trying to do the same thing.
I think it opens up creativity.
And so this is one of the thingsthat, and, you know, and also
just there's a couple of quotesthat I'm, you know, Think about
(16:26):
this whole idea of trust.
Without trust, there can be nogenuine peace because you can
have treaties.
And you've seen it.
People have treaties, but thenthey break them.
Right.
And
SPEAKER_01 (16:39):
that particular day and that second, I agree
SPEAKER_02 (16:43):
with you.
Exactly.
So it's treated themselves.
And it's really, it's aboutbeing trusted.
And we know in our ownrelationships, people you trust
and people you don't trust.
And even when you havedisagreements, you can open up
and talk with people you trustand try to find solutions or
whatever it is.
(17:03):
And the other thing which isamongst countries is the United
Nations Secretary GeneralAntonio Guterres, because when I
was at the UN and they weretalking about the nuclear
weapons and the SecurityCouncil, and he mentioned, you
know, trust is in short supply.
And we can see it now withwhat's happening, you know, with
(17:24):
be it Ukraine, Gaza and things,where the United Nations is
supposed to be really a worldbody that addresses these
issues, you know, are sort oflike important as far as, you
know, getting the solutionsbecause people don't trust these
other nations, et cetera.
So I put trust really high inthe list as far as, and I think
(17:51):
being Rotarian and bringing ourmission, vision, our values and
principles really lead to beingtrustworthy.
And also I like, you know, whatthe, Stephanie Urchik, The Magic
of Rotary.
I really got, really love itbecause also her conversation, I
(18:12):
think her story about how shegot the magic of, you know,
Rotary is the fact that she wason a service trip in the
Dominican Republic and a cleanwater project.
And so they poured dirty waterinto this water filter and out
came clean water.
And the boy said, wow.
That's magic.
(18:34):
And I think this is what we asRotarians and using our tools
that we have really cantransform, transform conflicts
and division into belonging andtrust and changing hate to love.
(18:55):
And this is, I think we have avery powerful message But we're
not necessarily telling it in apowerful way yet.
And this is one of the thingsthat I'm trying to do as far as
people can feel comfortableabout being a Rotarian peace
builder and using the magic ofRotary to transform bad to good
(19:22):
things.
et cetera, and war to peace.
And I don't, well, I don't haveall the answers.
I think I might not even haveany of the answers, but I know I
have the ability to maybeprovide a platform where people
who are involved can gettogether and and try to find the
(19:46):
right things where everybody,and when it's beneficial, all
concerned, to improve people'slives.
And I think that that's our, youknow, Rotarian, in a way,
mission.
Again, I go back to, you know,advancing, understanding,
goodwill, and peace.
So...
SPEAKER_01 (20:06):
So, you said at the beginning of this, Dennis, that
we don't brag enough.
And so, could you tell ourlisteners...
What is Rotary doing right nowfor peace?
I mean, we hear about thesepeace universities that we help
sponsor, if not build.
We hear about peace polls.
(20:27):
But what are we actively doingas Rotarians to build peace?
What can you brag a little bitabout us?
SPEAKER_02 (20:35):
Well, I think there's the last few years, by
the way.
I think what peace polls havedone is engage a lot of
Rotarians, members, to beactive, to doing something, and
also to being, thinking aboutwhat it all means.
And one of the things, you know,my dream has been, when I
(20:57):
started with Al Jubitz, theRotarian National Group for
Peace, a dozen years ago, mydream was the fact that we have
two million Rotarianpeacebuilders.
Every member of Rotary is apeacebuilder.
And that was my dream, the factthat everybody is involved in
(21:17):
what they can do.
So I think the Peace Pulse hasengaged a lot of people to do
something.
And I think there's more andmore people are doing it, which
is good because, you know, Ipick up my, I guess...
Google alerts on the Peace Poll,and I see every day that there's
(21:39):
some Rotary Club has planted aPeace Poll somewhere in their
community.
So that's really very positivebecause not only does it engage
people in the idea of peace, itpublicizes it.
SPEAKER_01 (21:53):
Right, and not just the Rotary.
And for those of you who don'tknow what a Peace Poll is, they
are these, first of all, lookthem up.
Google them, as Dennis justsaid.
And you'll see several pictures,literally from all around the
world, of these beautiful poststhat go in the ground that are
rotary peace poles, designatingthat every time you go by this
pole, think of a world of peaceand harmony, as well as other
(22:17):
things.
Please.
SPEAKER_02 (22:19):
Yeah, no, and not only planted, it planted
anywhere you go, because I'vegot a personal...
that I can take with me anywhereI want.
SPEAKER_03 (22:30):
Yay!
SPEAKER_02 (22:30):
And also, so we plant it, quote, at a lot of the
events, wherever we go.
And also, we had a full-wavespeech contest at an auditorium.
We can have a Peace Bowl there.
If you have a districtconference or whatever it is,
you can have a Peace Bowl there.
So it's really, in a sense,amazing.
(22:52):
As I said, half peaceful willtravel.
So that's one thing.
So that's been a very, verypositive element as far as
getting people involved.
I think more and more it'sbecoming the leadership,
(23:12):
especially with starting, Iguess, Stephanie Orchek.
And peace has always beenimportant.
But it's never necessarily, youknow, had the spotlight on it.
Which
SPEAKER_01 (23:25):
is so funny because there's part of me that thinks
to myself, if we fix theenvironment and we had peace,
then people would have jobs.
People would have clean water.
People would have, you know,safe hygiene for their children.
People would have food to eat.
I mean, to me, it's like, why ispeace the...
Oh, yeah.
(23:45):
And by the way...
Oh, yeah.
By the way, maybe we should bepeaceful now.
It just seems like we're goingbackwards in that department.
SPEAKER_02 (23:55):
Well, in some ways, you're right.
And Gwen, you're a believer.
And the thing is, and, you know,one of the things that, like,
is, you know, the idea is if youhad peace and a lot of other
things would be a lot easier.
Wouldn't they now?
And I think...
As you mentioned, even be itGaza and Pakistan and the Rotary
(24:21):
thing, is when they stopped thethree days in Gaza to administer
the vaccine, Antonio, again, UNSecretary Antonio Guterres said,
you know, peace might be theultimate vaccine for polio.
UNKNOWN (24:40):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (24:40):
Because you notice the last few places where we had
polio and we were administeringpolio, it's really been in
conflict zones.
SPEAKER_01 (24:54):
It has been.
SPEAKER_02 (24:55):
Yeah.
Yeah.
So you think about it as thefact that it was a more peaceful
area.
It just makes it easier toadminister anything, to do
anything, to get agreements on alot of different things.
Yeah.
So anyway, what I thinkStephanie Urchak and now the new
(25:16):
president, Francisco, hasmentioned the fact that the top
three priorities are poliomembership and peace.
And so now that peace is on, Iguess, on a higher plane, it's
an opportunity to talk aboutwhat does that mean?
What does peace mean to you?
What does peace mean to theclub, district, et cetera?
(25:39):
So it's now...
Again, once you can have adialogue, it makes a difference.
And it makes a difference whenpeople's thinking, makes a
difference in how creativitycomes in.
Also, the fact that I'm glad thelast or the most recent program
(26:00):
of scale, which I just noticedis the fact that where Rotary
instituted, what, three yearsago, a$2 million grant program.
This year was awarded to a peaceprogram in Colombia, which was,
I think, organized by two peacefellows, and in bringing peace
(26:23):
to about four counties inColombia.
And so I think that's bringingthis whole idea of what peace
means and what we can do inpeace is coming more to the
forefront.
SPEAKER_01 (26:39):
And in your area, you do that with a position
called a peace chair for yourdistrict.
And I found this reallyinteresting because my district
doesn't have one of these.
And so, Dennis, you have adistrict chair like position as
(27:01):
the peace builder and our otherclubs kind of bringing this on
as a, what, what is a peacebuilder position or chair?
SPEAKER_02 (27:11):
Well, I think it's really, again, one is bringing
attention to the thing.
And also I think then itprovides an opportunity to put
together programs and, and thelike.
And one of the things that Isaid earlier, When we started,
(27:32):
first of all, in our district,it helped to have a district
governor who was behind thisidea.
SPEAKER_01 (27:39):
And let's just say district governors that are
hearing my voice, Dennis issaying, it's lucky we had a
district governor that was forPete's building.
Like, this shouldn't be ararity, Dennis.
I'm sorry, but that's like thefunniest thing.
Every district governor shouldbe going, Yeah.
Why don't we all have peacechairs?
SPEAKER_02 (27:59):
And also, you know, again, it's really the peace
chair brings to the districtdifferent ideas as far as what's
happening in the Rotary worldabout people doing peace.
And, you know, there's, again,so as a peace co-chair, we
brought together the idea of theRotarian Nation Group for Peace
(28:21):
Peace Builder Club program.
And from that, a number of clubsjoined in to join the Rotarian
National Group for Peace asmembers and also have their
clubs as peace builder clubs.
And one of the unique things,actually, our district governor
here is 7980.
There
SPEAKER_01 (28:41):
you go.
Shout out to 7980 that has
SPEAKER_02 (28:44):
a
SPEAKER_01 (28:45):
peace chair.
SPEAKER_02 (28:46):
And D.G.
called him a Robert friend.
He had a special spin to peace.
And he had a program, it'scalled Opus with Peace.
Opus with Peace.
Which really brings music andthe arts to peace.
And, you know, and we know thatthere's in music and the arts
(29:08):
and things, it's a way ofbringing people together and
enjoying talking about peace.
And so I think we've, so theyadded, so it's not just, you
know, quote, conflict,resolution, conflict,
transformation, but it's reallysomething that touches people,
their own lives, and why peacecomes.
(29:30):
is important why peace is alsobeneficial to one's own life and
also you know like we say we hadyou know we addressed what two
years ago whatever with uh aboutmental health and you know
SPEAKER_01 (29:48):
yeah Under Gordon McAnally was very much under
SPEAKER_02 (29:51):
peace within ourselves.
Inner peace is very important.
And so I think there's a, sowhat it is, it's a, you kind of
like brought a lot of differentideas and said, you know, just
add it.
Maybe there's a quote, what wedo in peace could touch and
improve what we're doing inother areas too.
And so it's really, I guess it'sa commitment and that we want
(30:16):
to, now that it's, One of ourtop three priorities, you know,
some areas and districtgovernors, et cetera, will start
saying, oh, it's importantenough that we appoint somebody
to say, you know, be a peacechair.
Is peace
SPEAKER_01 (30:38):
really quite easy and we make it hard?
SPEAKER_02 (30:42):
No, it's, you know, it's really, it's been, it's
been an interesting journey.
I guess, gig in moving forward.
And again, I've learned so muchas far as getting involved with
this idea of peace.
And again, like I said, there'sthings in the moving into the
(31:05):
music and the arts with Peace.
And also, I've learned certainthings about even, you know,
psychology and other thingsabout, you know, trauma and
different things and how you cando it.
And also, again, like I said,with Peace, he can make a lot of
other things, you know, morepractical as far as being
(31:29):
successful.
And I think so.
SPEAKER_01 (31:31):
So, find this all again where this passion for
peace comes from dennis i meanyou you well and you and you
laugh but i mean maybe anybodycan say you know that they want
but i mean there are some peoplewho are i mean you're very
passionate about it where doesthat passion for peace come from
SPEAKER_02 (31:53):
well i think well first of all you know i
SPEAKER_01 (31:56):
i
SPEAKER_02 (31:57):
I'm a 20-year-old veteran of Rotary.
Okay.
And my first few years, I wasable to get involved.
And I got involved with a lot ofdifferent things, water
projects, education, andeverything else.
And then I read, you know, thisarticle in Rotary magazine and
read about...
(32:17):
It was a peace issue.
Okay.
You know, I think it was in, youknow, 2012 or whatever it is.
And I said, you know...
Again, I said, you know, ifwe're at peace, a lot of things
could happen that would be very,very positive.
And also, I guess it was partlymy background, my upgrowing.
(32:41):
I was very fortunate to be bornand raised in Hawaii.
Aloha.
You know, diversity was aninteresting thing.
And I like to say in Hawaii thateveryone's a minority.
Everyone, everybody, differentnationalities, different
(33:02):
generations, and et cetera, etcetera.
And so I saw a lot of peoplegetting together, getting along
together.
And so it's a combination ofbeing grateful, being partly of
service, and also finding thatmaybe this is an area that we
(33:23):
should really explore furtheror, you know, do more than we'll
be doing so far at thatparticular thing because we're
doing service.
And also, by the way, there wasthat year our international, you
know, president was Tanaka, histheme was peace through service.
(33:45):
And so that kind of also helpedpropel my course of, you know,
where I was looking at.
And And I think, again, Ievolved.
So I started the RotarianNational Group of Peace, which
is interesting.
And also that's when actuallythe Rotary Peace Centers was
(34:05):
kind of like growing up and wewere getting more peace.
So also I found that's where theaction was.
And
SPEAKER_01 (34:15):
the Peace Building was where the action was.
Okay.
SPEAKER_02 (34:18):
And then that's where I could probably
contribute more and better to Inother areas, there are other
people who are better than I asfar as, you know, the other
areas of service.
And so, you know, I saw thisarea as kind of like interesting
and I could excel at it.
SPEAKER_01 (34:38):
I love it.
I love it.
So I've only got one morequestion for you.
And I thank you.
I know you're a busy guy wakingup on the West Coast to talk to
a woman on the East Coast.
So I thank you so much.
But let's say that the PeaceBuilder chair, becomes a
position all in Rotary.
Like every single district,talking to you district
(34:59):
governors, every single zoneleader, there are peace builders
as part of everybody's board.
When that happens, what doesRotary look like with all of
those peace builders?
What is that gonna make?
What's the concrete evidencewe're gonna start seeing if we
have that many peace buildersMillions of them all over the 2
(35:23):
million peacebuilders that youhad talked about.
What is that going to be doing?
SPEAKER_02 (35:28):
Well, I think, again, I think it really
provides the visibility of whowe are as Rotarians and what our
goals and purpose are.
And when you add that numbers,and the thing is, I say, you
know, the talents that we have,2 million people, the talents in
(35:52):
problem solving and the like,mediation in social work and
things that are connected withbringing peace, it would be
enormous.
So I think the impact on ourcommunities and also the impact
(36:16):
of The associations that we'repart of, you know, we're part of
the United Nations, we're partof UNESCO and other things.
So you got Rotarians and just,you know, the whole identity and
brand will make a big, bigdifference as far as Art Brody
itself, attracting people.
(36:38):
who are interested in what we'redoing and want to join in what
we're doing, which is what morecan you do than being a peace
builder?
And also this wholesatisfaction.
So I think it would be a new ageof Rotary in many ways.
We've been at it for talkingabout polio and being identified
(37:01):
as far as the second diseasethat's eliminated.
So just think of what So we arevery, as we should, pride, be
proudful, pride as far as ourwork at Polio.
Just think, the next decade,whatever it is, if we bring
(37:22):
peace to a lot of differentareas, I mean, how big of a
success story would that be?
And one of the things, by theway, Rotary has, we have a lot
of tools that the that we're notusing as much as, you know,
which is another session,probably, the tools that we
(37:43):
have, the tools that we havethat maybe, and also, by the
way, which is one of the thingsthat we also have a lot of
money.
You know, we got a lot of moneyin the coffers.
It's just a matter of how we useit and how we direct it.
And so we've got a lot of thingsthat potentially we have that if
(38:05):
we focus on, this area of peace,I think it'd be amazing.
And we would amaze evenourselves as far as what we can
accomplish.
SPEAKER_01 (38:16):
Wow.
So maybe the first disease waswar and maybe the second, you
know, and how to solve all thediseases after that is peace.
Maybe it's just that simple.
SPEAKER_02 (38:28):
Well, you know, what we had, you know, is polio, is
preventing polio.
And what we hope It's just likeany disease.
How do we prevent it?
And not necessarily just cureit.
How do we prevent it?
And that's peace.
Again, one of the peace fellowswas quoted in saying, you know,
(38:48):
I became, you know, joinedRotary, became a peace fellow to
prevent wars, not just toaddress the consequences of war.
So really prevention is really,really what can we do to prevent
(39:10):
violence?
What can we do to prevent wars,et cetera, et cetera.
And I think this, again, goingback to who we are, our values,
our principles, our mission,it's really directed to
preventing things, bad thingsfrom happening.
SPEAKER_01 (39:29):
I love it.
Dennis Wong, thank you forcoming back on the show.
Thank you for being a rotarypeace builder.
And I do a shout out one moretime to all my district
governors.
Let's have some peace builders.
I know Dennis would help you ifyou're interested in having that
be a board position, even if westart at the clubs, don't you
think?
Even if we just had a person atevery club that was in charge of
(39:55):
peace and peace building, whatan amazing rotary it would be.
Dennis, thank you so much forjoining me.
It's always wonderful to seeyour face, sir.
Thank you.
Thank you.
SPEAKER_02 (40:05):
You're welcome.
And as I said, I welcome anyinquiries, whatever I can help.
And so, you know.
Please, you know, give a shoutout to me as far as your
interest.
I love to hear from PeaceBuilders because, again,
sometimes I hear some peopledoing amazing things out there.
SPEAKER_00 (40:28):
I love it.
Yeah, let's do it.
SPEAKER_01 (40:34):
So I'm bringing up that topic again.
Presidents, boards, districtboards, international boards.
I mean, come on.
Do we have a position for peace?
Do we have a constant 24 hours aday, 360 position that just
wants peace?
(40:54):
Because I stick with Dennis.
The way you're going to curepolio, the way you're going to
cure anger, the way you're goingto cure starvation, the way
you're going to cure clean waterand sanitation, the way you're
going to cure people beingscared, just being scared is if
(41:16):
we find peace, not only in theworld, but in ourselves.
Thank you, Dennis, for bringinga joyful conversation, a
peace-filled conversation.
And again, a challenge to youpresidents, district governors,
zone chairs.
I think more peace positionswould be awesome.
(41:40):
And I think you listening isalso awesome.
If you know a Rotarian ornon-Rotarian that is turning
their actions into impact, Iwant to know about it.
please please RotarianPod atgmail.com and you know the
routine tell a friend downloadus give me reviews you know with
(42:05):
this name change it's just thatlittle tweak that helps the
world know that we're out herealright then until next week
take care of yourself and theworld around you and we'll hear
you next time on the Action toImpact podcast thank you as
always for listening.
We'll talk to you soon.
(42:26):
Bye-bye.
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