March 5, 2025 • 46 mins
In this episode, we are joined by some of the most influential leaders in the vacation rental industry. From VRMA (Vacation Rental Management Association), we welcome Executive Director Anne Gardner and Chair of the Board of Directors Jodi Refosco. Representing VR Nation, we have President Matt Tisdall and Executive Director Heidie Henriksen. Together, we dive into the exciting evolution of both organizations, their upcoming conferences, and the importance of collaboration in shaping the future of vacation rentals.
With two major events on the horizon: the VRMA Foundations: Frontline Excellence Training in Savannah and the VR Nation National Conference in Austin, we discuss what attendees can expect, how these events foster industry-wide education, and why networking is more critical than ever. Beyond conferences, the conversation highlights the growing need for unified advocacy, support for small and large operators, and the push toward greater professionalization of the industry.
Whether you're a seasoned property manager, a new entrant in short-term rentals, or a vendor supporting this space, this episode is packed with valuable insights into where the industry is headed and how we can all work together for collective success.
Key Topics Discussed:
1️⃣Introducing the panel: Key leaders from VRMA & VR Nation
2️⃣What makes each association unique & where they collaborate
3️⃣Upcoming conferences: What to expect in Savannah & Austin
4️⃣The importance of advocacy and professionalization in vacation rentals
5️⃣How VRMA & VR Nation are supporting both small and large operators
6️⃣The role of vendors & suppliers in the evolving vacation rental landscape
7️⃣Educational initiatives for short-term rental operators
8️⃣The need for industry-wide collaboration in an ever-changing market
Upcoming Events Mentioned:
VRMA Foundations: Frontline Excellence Training – April 14-15, 2025 | Savannah, GA
VR Nation National Conference – April 27-28, 2025 | Austin, TX
VRMA Executive Summit – May 28-30, 2025 | South Beach, FL
Connect with our Guests on LinkedIn:
Matthew Tesdall: https://www.linkedin.com/in/matthewtesdall/
Heidie Henriksen: https://www.linkedin.com/in/heidieh/
Anne Gardner: https://www.linkedin.com/in/anne-gardner-mba-cae/
Jodi Refosco: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jodirefosco/
Ready to take your operations to the next level? Visit https://tnsinc.com/podcasts-alex-and-annie/ to learn more.
Get $50 credit and $0 onboarding fee when you sign up for Beyond, the leading dynamic pricing tool for vacation rentals: http://beyondpricing.info/alexandannie
#vacationrentals #vrma #vrnation
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Alex Husner (00:01):
Music. Welcome to Alex and Annie the real women of
vacation rentals with more than35 years combined industry
experience, Alex Husner andAnnie Holcomb have teamed up to
connect the dots betweeninspiration and opportunity,
seeking to find the one storyidea, strategy or decision that
led to their guests big ahamoment. Join them as they
(00:23):
highlight the real storiesbehind the people and brands
that have built vacation rentalsinto the $100 billion industry
it is today. And now it's timeto get real and have some fun
with your hosts, Alex and Annie.
We'll start the show in just aminute, but first a message from
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That's t, N, S, I, N,c.com/podcasts-alex-and-annie,
to learn more. Welcome to Alex,Annie, the real women of
(01:36):
vacation rentals. I'm Alex andI'm Annie, and we are joined
today by a whole panel ofvacation rental superstars. We
have from vrma The ExecutiveDirector and Gardner and Chair
of the Board of Directors, Jodyrafasco, along with from VR
nation. We have President MattTisdale and Executive Director
Heidi Henrickson. Welcomeeverybody. Hi. Thanks for
Unknown (01:59):
having us. Well, we've got a group here, so I know it's
going to be hard to be hard torein everybody in, but we
thought the easiest thing to dois just kind of go around. And I
don't know how we all look toeach other on the screen, but
maybe start with Anne and Jodiand then go over to Matt and
Heidi. Just a littleintroduction about yourself and
what you do in vacation rentals.
Anne Gardner (02:15):
Sure. Thanks so much for for having us. This is
first for me since joining theteam with vrma. But as you said,
I'm Ann Gardner. I am theExecutive Director for vrma, and
I have been with the team sincethe end of April of 24 and
really glad to be here. Comefrom a background in organized
(02:35):
real estate and propertymanagement and commercial real
estate as well. And so justreally, really, super glad to be
part of our industry. I'm acompletely hooked fan and all in
and just really glad to be hereand learn from these pros today
on our call.
Jodi Refosco (02:54):
Hi, I'm Jodi rafasco. I am the VR may board
chair, and I am out of WesternMaryland. I have a vacation
rental company of about 10properties. Before this, I had a
company of over 500 homes. ButI've been in the industry for
probably 25 years, and I'm realexcited to be here, and I
(03:15):
appreciate you guys inviting usand looking forward to the
conversation. I'm
Matt Tesdall (03:19):
Matthew TESOL, president of be our nation. I
currently reside south ofPortland, south of all the fun
activities over COVID, butcloser to the wine country. So
if you like wine, this is whereyou need to come. I own family
time vacation rentals. Alongwith my wife, we're in Oregon,
Idaho and southern Utah. Sohappy to be on and join all
(03:40):
these amazing people. Great.
Heidie Henriksen (03:41):
Happy to be here, too. I'm Heidi Hendrix and
Executive Director at VR nation.
Joined the association in Augustof last year, 2024 and have
about a 25 year career in shortterm rentals, starting as a host
myself and then working for aluxury property manager in Park
City, Utah, works for quite afew different facets of the
vocational industry, and mostrecently, co founded a nonprofit
(04:04):
called Astro. And then, like Isaid, joined VR nation just last
year. So excited to be heretoday. Awesome.
Alex Husner (04:13):
Well, super excited to have you guys. And I think
you know, today we wanted tojust learn a little bit more
about what's going on betweenthe two organizations, and most
importantly, the event that youboth have coming up in April.
There's two, two great eventscoming up, one on this side of
the East Coast, in Savannah, andthe other one down in Austin.
Maybe just give us and we cankick it off with you. Heidi,
(04:35):
just kind of an idea of whatyou're looking forward to for
you guys, this is your secondconference as VR nation, but how
many for the whole Associationnow? So VR
Heidie Henriksen (04:44):
nation launched in 2011 and I think our
conferences, if I recall, Matt,you might have to help me out
here, started in about 2015 on aregional basis. So last year,
our regional conference in Boisewas when we announced our
rebrand and migration to anational organization. So this
is in April, our first nationalconference. We're incredibly
(05:04):
excited about
Matt Tesdall (05:05):
br nation going from Northwest BRP, which is a
regional Northwest conference inHawaii and Canada and those kind
of places, really has been abouta two year project that we've
worked on in the board. I'vebeen part of the board for about
six years in differentcapacities, currently the
president for this year, nextyear, but the that's what we
were excited about. Ourconference has always been
(05:26):
intimate, and, you know, a lotof fun, a lot of collaboration,
and a lot of just workingtogether. And that's what the
our vendors say when they whenthey've come and, you know, it's
the same vendors that go to allthese conferences, whether it's
vra or us. And so that's justsuper exciting. We're really
excited to have this in Austinon the end of April, there 27th
(05:47):
and 28th on Sunday, Monday, atthe JW Marriott and and so
that's exciting. And I know you,Jody and Ann, you guys have your
the it's the front of lineconference right in Savannah.
Jodi Refosco (05:59):
Yeah, we have our frontline excellence conference
is April 14 to the 15th inSavannah at the convention
center. We had a EasternConference I think there, years
ago, it was a great event. It'sa great location. It's kind of
close to a lot of drive tomarket there. And it's we
pivoted. So like give you guyssome history is that we used to
have, like us, in the spring, anEast Coast show and the West
(06:21):
Coast show, and we, years ago,made him to be one event, which
is supposed to alternate Coastspring, the spring forum. And it
was supposed to work towards thefront line, but kind of just
grew, and we kind of came moreof like a mini international so
it was, it was a little bitbigger than what we intended. So
this conference, we pivoted. Wemoved it to Savannah, we moved
(06:42):
it to kind of focus onoperations, front desk and then
their managers. So there's likethree tracks. So it's very
different than what we've seenin the past, much more of a
smaller, intimate setting thanwe've seen, but it's real
exciting. It's something that Ireally look forward to, but it's
definitely different than whatwe, you guys, would have seen in
(07:02):
spring the past couple years.
You know
Matt Tesdall (07:04):
the I remember back in the day Jody that when
Burma had the like you said, theEast West. I always go to the
Western Conference, because Ilike to it was, it was, it
wasn't small, but it was smallerthan the the National
Conference, and it was in Reno.
And you had one of the best, oneof the best closing setting, you
know, closing, not seminars, butclosing speaker that talked
(07:24):
about bringing all the stuff youlearn in this, in this during
the show, and how to implementit throughout the year. And it
was all done with sticky notes.
I've used this so many times indifferent organizations. I loved
it, and I kept that back then Iwas working on my my desk in the
kitchens where I built thebusiness, and I had it posted up
on the wall, all my stickynotes. My wife was like, what is
(07:47):
that? I go, it's my action planfor the year, and I could take a
sticky note off every time Iaccomplished it. I use that so
much. Yeah,
Jodi Refosco (07:53):
I went. I was always at the Eastern
Conference, right? And then myfather used to be on the board
too, back in the day, and hebrought me out to a Western
Conference. And, well, I'm amountain region, right? But just
on the East Coast, just smallermountains, and everybody's got
out there. So I remember comingout to the Western Conference.
I'm like, This is amazing. It'slike, My people, I found them.
It was really because it wasenlightening. I was like,
(08:16):
talking about things ourmountain thinking it was brand
new ideas. And hear it. No, Ijust haven't been talking to the
mountain people.
Matt Tesdall (08:22):
Yeah, you gotta come to the west coast, the Wild
West. Yeah, it
Jodi Refosco (08:25):
was, it was very cool. So now, yes, I remember
the West Coast, East Coast, butthis will be different. So it's
going to be cool. More operationstyle and line to bring more
employees with you, more staffwith you, and that it's more
cost effective. So it'sexciting. That's awesome. I
Alex Husner (08:39):
know Annie and I attended when it was NW, VRP,
two years ago in Reno, and thatwas actually the first time I
had ever been to Reno, but thatwas a great event. And one thing
that we really loved about thatwas exactly what you said, Matt,
that it was more of an intimatekind of feel, a smaller
conference, but also it just hada different kind of feel to it
than some of the conference. AndI think that's one thing I've
(09:00):
noticed, is just conferenceshave different feels when you're
there, like just, just theatmosphere and, you know, the
tone and the way that things arerun, like it has a different
vibe depending on what show thatyou're at. But you guys do some
fun things that we didn't get tosee it last year, but I saw
videos of the the housekeepingOlympics that you did. Are you
doing anything like that thisyear? We're doing
Matt Tesdall (09:20):
a couple. We're doing the host GPO pickleball,
which I which, I think, are youguys doing that too? Are you
doing a pickleball? Did I seethat
Jodi Refosco (09:27):
they do that at international conference
pickleball tournament? Yeah,Vegas
Matt Tesdall (09:31):
in October, right?
Mm, hmm, the seniors, yeah. Butanyway, so we're doing that
second annual with host GPO. Andthen also we're doing the second
annual housekeeping Olympics, Ithink Heidi did. We've added a
couple categories to that thisyear.
Heidie Henriksen (09:46):
We did. We had three categories last year. So
this year we're adding a fourthcategory, revolving shower
curtains. So it's it's meant tobe fun, engaging and still very
educational. So we kind of pointout best practices. Or cleaning
teams and operational teams onthose different aspects. And
there's a vacuum relay, there'sa bed making competition, and
(10:07):
there's a gorgeous, goldentrophy up for grabs. So it's
gonna be a good event.
Jodi Refosco (10:12):
It sounds very dark. Yeah, I was gonna say,
Unknown (10:15):
but is somebody gonna show us how to fold fitted
sheets? Because that's the thing
Jodi Refosco (10:19):
that's still Joe will help Absolutely. Okay,
wingspan, yeah, might never looklike his.
Unknown (10:27):
So I think one of the things that I think is really
interesting for the vrma and isjust the pivot back to kind of
what you used to do, and I thinkthat that's going back to the
core of what vrma was years ago.
And I think it's good becauseit's got people talking this
year and are excited and knowingthat we're not going to be able
to go to like, I'm not doingboth for my company. I'm going
to do VR nation and then do theinternational but I think that's
(10:49):
like spreading people's thoughtprocesses out over multiple
conferences. And it's it'sfostered a sense of more
collaboration, which I think is,again, what we're what this
podcast is about. This episodeis about, is talking about the
collaboration between theorganization. So I thought like,
maybe Anne and Heidi, from yourperspective, the two different
associations, where do you guyssee the collaborative effort
(11:11):
moving forward? For you guys,
Anne Gardner (11:16):
sure, I think that's a great question and
great segue. And so from, fromour perspective, as far as in,
in being able to, you know,bring VR ma forward and make
sure that we're really alignedwith where our members are and
where our industry really has,has areas of need for us to be
(11:38):
involved is to start, just as wesaid, first off, with the
programming and but then movinginto the fact that we are, we
are a year round. We're a tradeorganization representing an
industry and the areas ofconcern and protection within
advocacy and making sure that weare in that leadership role as
(11:59):
far as research and providinginsights and being able to
support our members in in thestate and local affiliation
organizations, but also justthroughout the country and in
those efforts. And so that's areal area where VR May is, I
think, has a great opportunityin a collaborative frame. And so
(12:23):
Heidi, we were part of aconversation with a couple of
other other organizations a fewweeks ago. I think we have
another conversation coming upthis week, and just being able
to see how we can be additive inprotecting our industry, making
sure that you have the right foruse and enjoyment and to build
your business and to grow yourbusiness, and so that we're
(12:45):
doing it in ways that are addingto our communities and really
showing the true economic impactand value. And so those are
conversations where there's roomfor everyone. We need everyone
in that conversation and doingthat shared lift together. And
so for for me, that's really thefirst area that that I come to
(13:06):
where we say, Here's fantasticcollaborative opportunity where
we can all live. Well said,
Heidie Henriksen (13:11):
and I'd love to chime in also, I know one of
the first things I did in my newrole was reach out to Anne and
invite her and anotherrepresentative to our
conference, and then us do thesame. We met in person for a
good hour and had a wonderfulconversation about how our two
organizations can becomplimentary to our efforts and
what we do for the industry as awhole, and really focusing on
(13:33):
elevating standards together. Sowe've had good conversations.
We've come together on theadvocacy front to make sure that
we're complimentary on thoseefforts as well, in partnership
with some other organizations.
And from an industryperspective, if you look at
other industries, such as thehotel world, you've got multiple
organizations supportingeveryone as a whole, and that's
something we're very focused ondoing as well with this in VR
(13:54):
nation and VR mazecollaboration, so making sure
all those resources areavailable. Great.
Unknown (14:02):
Matt And Jody, maybe pivot over to you guys. So from
your perspective, what do yousee the ability to collaborate
moving forward? I think you knowyou guys, Jodi, you've been with
VR may for a very long time, andhave already been kind of in the
leadership roles on the board.
What do you know? I think thatthe the idea of bringing the
associations together to worktogether, is, is something that
we've all wanted to see. So Ithink it's really great that
(14:23):
this is happening. But from youreach individual, you know, kind
of vantage points within theorganizations, what do you see
beyond advocacy? What do you seeother collaborations that are
possible? Well,
Jodi Refosco (14:33):
yeah, I mean, this is, first of all this. I feel
like this is great. I mean,it's, I've been a part of VR
May. I was on VR may board, Ithink starting in 2013 maybe,
and I was the president then,and at that time, there really
was no there was no other likeconferences or associations kind
of similar to us. And then outof COVID, they all spring up.
(14:55):
And I feel like our industry haschanged so much since then,
right? Our industry? Has grownrapidly, especially since COVID
and a lot of differentassociations. Like I remember
you guys up there when you hadthe NW, vrma, and it was
Michelle acavela was
Matt Tesdall (15:11):
on it right? Was, yeah,
Jodi Refosco (15:13):
yes. There we go.
Thank you. And I remember hertrying to bring us together on
different levels. And you knowit there was ways that we could
work together. And we, I thinkwe struggled a little bit then,
and so when I came back onto theboard and when I took this
position, I'm like, Let'scollaborate. You know, there's
no reason that we all sit in oursilos. What we're all doing is
trying to lift theprofessionalism of our industry,
(15:34):
inside and outside of advocacy,right? You know, we're more well
known than like before, COVID,people were barely talking about
vacation rentals, right? Theywere talking about staying in
hotels, and now they're moretalking about vacation rentals.
And now we have regulationsbecause of, they've blown up,
and we've had some bad actorsout there. So I think
collaboration could be alongsideof, we could talk about
(15:55):
different conferences and lifteach other up, because I feel
like we also do fill a differentspace, right? And I think
working together. I mean, wejust did, I just with the board,
did a two and a half day boardretreat in January, and we were
doing a whole strategic plan andoperation analysis, and one of
the things was collaboration. Imean, it was a big part of what
we talked about. So I lookforward to conversations like
(16:17):
this with David and Heidi andall the other associations out
there, because I feel like weall fill a space and have a and
have a lane a little bit. Imean, it does kind of go over a
little bit, but I feel like weall can lift each other up. So
it's, I'm very much forward,looking forward to it, yeah. I
mean,
Matt Tesdall (16:34):
very well said Jody, that's exactly how how we
feel. And let's face it, ourindustry has morphed over the
years. Okay? I mean, COVID andbefore that, and some of the
OTAs that have come along inrecent this last decade has
really changed our landscape,and we have serious fights on
our hand. I know you mentionedadvocacy, but there's other
(16:55):
things as well, and it's havingthat local representation.
Sometimes it's the smallergroups the bigger groups. I
mean, just that, that, ingeneral, is so important to us.
So I saw, I agree with whatHeidi said. I've been in this
business almost 20 years. I cutmy teeth with Verba. I did
that's where I started, when Iwas doing my, you know, on the
west coast, mostly honestly. Andthen when you would have the
(17:17):
wet, you know, the region, orthe national conferences on the
west, that's where I would go.
But without that, I wouldn't bewhere I am on the educational
standpoint. And back in thosedays, serving on the ambassador
program and being involved inthat. And when new members come
on and thanking them and saidthanks for being in a meeting
with the conference. And anybodywho knows me, I'm really more of
an in person kind of guy. Ireally like the talking to
(17:37):
people in person. And this isgreat. I love this, but this is
not natural, but it's so theeducational piece is key. And
just for you personally, it'sabout networking. I love the
networking. That's what I loveabout us coming together and
having more moments like this,whether it's in Vegas at a
national conference or anexecutive Summit, all of that is
(17:59):
really key. And you have onecoming the executive summit
right in May. I think,
Jodi Refosco (18:06):
yeah, yeah, we have one. So we have a second
kind of spring event, but thisis more senior level may, 28 in
South Beach. And it's, have youguys been to an executive
Summit? I haven't actually, no.
So I was president of er Maywhen we had our first one, but
my fifth grader was graduatingfifth grade, and I couldn't miss
it, so I went for the boardmeeting, and literally missed
(18:28):
running the first executiveSummit. Mike Carrington ended up
running it for me, but I was andthen just that time of year was
really hard for me, so I wentlast year, and I loved it. I
just love, I love smaller,intimate set. You know, there's
a reason for the larger ones,but there's also a reason for
the smaller ones, and that one'smore, well, it's all executive
(18:49):
level, so it's more of like ahigh level networking. And
something that's different thisyear is we're bringing the
suppliers or the sponsors intothe room with us, because I feel
like it's very important to beable to collaborate with them
too, because it's nice whenyou're like, trying to drive an
idea, right? And you sit down.
(19:09):
Look, well, have you seen thisacross the industry? Because I
only see what I see in my area,right? And it's not just VRMs,
but the the suppliers, too. Sothat's, yeah, that's coming on
the 28th if you haven't gottenyou guys should come it is, it
is, it was so amazing. And I hadyou talk about your sticky
notes. I had, like, notebooksupon notebooks, and I had a
whole notebook full of justideas, because it was like, and
(19:31):
it was more intimate. So like,you could ask questions, and,
like, get answers from othersenior level, exact. So it kind
of cool. I'm excited about if I
Anne Gardner (19:39):
can also offer Alex and Annie, we know you're
fans of being able to pass alongopportunities, and so we have
also reimagined this event andthat it is completely new with a
whole new focus and effort. Andso we wanted to provide to your
viewers a list. Code that wewill share with you for trying
(20:04):
out that executive Summit, andjust how that is also sort of re
imagined, new, as Jody said,much more intimate, but the
level of programming and detailthat's involved in this event,
it's really driven by a superengaged number of our members.
And as we said, It is not aboutthe content in a room and
(20:28):
keeping folks in like an exhibithall. It's really a truly
participatory and integratedevent. Because the fact is, is
that, you know, our innovationdoesn't come from one side of
our industry. Our innovationcomes from the whole and so
we're all learning and growingtogether and so participating.
And it's a, it's a new focus.
And in some regards, I think, asyou said, Matt, it's a, it's a
(20:50):
return home, if you will. So
Alex Husner (20:54):
yeah, that's that's such a great point, too. And I
think, you know, the vendors andsuppliers in this space have
gotten kind of frustrated atsome events over the last few
years, just because they feltseparated from where the
property managers are. And youknow, a lot of that comes down
to the venue really, to behonest. But I think having them
in the same place is going to begreat. And you know, at the end
(21:15):
of the day, the suppliers in ourspace are so important to what
we all do. I mean, they'reseeing things from a different
lens than we are as propertymanagers and vice versa, but as
suppliers that they get to talkto companies all over the
country and in the world, theperspective that they bring back
to property managers is reallyimportant, so I think it is good
to have them more in thoseactive conversations, and not so
(21:38):
much of okay, they're walking bya booth and They're going to try
and grab you, but like, let'shave, like, real, authentic
conversations, and that's howsales should happen anyways,
right? So I'm sure they're goingto be just thrilled about that.
Matt Tesdall (21:49):
It's like speed dating.
Alex Husner (21:51):
Yeah, right, exactly. We'll be back in just a
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Unknown (22:00):
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using beyond it's beenrevolutionary for our business.
We are now in a huge growthphase during the slow market,
which is crazy, and we've heardfeedback from other sales agents
and owners that they've talkedto our competitors and they
don't have the data that wehave. And that is what is
helping a lot of people makedecisions. Do
(23:49):
you want to keep pricing theseproperties yourself every day,
or do you want to have aprofessional do it if you are
really serious about growing anykind of vacation rental company,
you really do need the data andthe backup from beyond to help
you move forward. It's verydifficult in any market to fully
truly understand what's going onin the area, and beyond will
help
Alex Husner (24:08):
you do that, ready to maximize your vacation rental
revenue with smarter pricing.
Beyond makes it easy withcutting edge dynamic pricing and
revenue management tools. Getstarted today with a $50 credit
and free onboarding when yousign up at beyond pricing, dot
info, slash Alex and Annie takecontrol of your pricing
strategy. But beyond today, a
Matt Tesdall (24:28):
lot of these vendors, they were PMS at one
point, right?
Alex Husner (24:31):
Or maybe they just have a vice versa. You know,
there's both sides.
Matt Tesdall (24:35):
And over the years, these become our friends,
honestly, and we hang out. We govisit them. They come here and
drink wine, you know, you go tothe you go to your beach. I
mean, it's so much fun. Yeah,
Unknown (24:44):
I wanted to ask you guys, so we had recently
interviewed Tim ro from VRBO,and one of the things that we
talk about on the show a lot iseducation. And how do we get
education in front of those newentrants to the space and. And I
think that, you know, vrma, afew years ago, announced that
they were going to allow peoplethat were, you know, smaller
operators, one unit, to to jointhe association. And it kind of,
(25:07):
like, when it, when it wasannounced, there was, like, two
schools of thought. Some peoplewere like, Absolutely not. We
don't want them. And otherpeople, like, I Alex and I had
this conversation too. Like Iwas like, we have to get them
in, and we want them in. Like,from the beginning, you know,
you could get them to water, butyou can, you make them drink.
But like, looking at, I think,VR nation, you've taken a kind
of a similar approach, butbecause you're not, you haven't
been around as long, and maybehave, like, this legacy belief
(25:29):
system that you know, that themembers have, that you want to
engage with these smaller, youknow, these smaller PMS. And so
what do you see? I feel likebetween the two associations can
continuing to jump off thecollaboration part, there's an
opportunity to really engagewith these smaller operators in
these niche markets, these newermarkets that sort of have
(25:49):
emerged that aren't yourtraditional vacation rental or
maybe short term urban marketsto help them get educated. So do
you see that there's like,education sessions and maybe
webinars, things that bothassociations can do together, to
that we can offer out to thelarger the larger community of
short term rentals. How
Matt Tesdall (26:08):
do you have a big, big passion on this? You want
to, you want to take this onefor the our nation side?
Heidie Henriksen (26:12):
Sure, yeah, I know that's a big piece of our
focus. I would say at least 20%of the content at our
conference, at our road showsand the educational initiatives
that we focus on is driven andtargeted at that self managing
or RBO host Astro, theassociation I co founded, has
merged with VR nation, so wehave welcomed those members into
(26:32):
our portfolio, and so we're verykeen on making sure we address
those individuals with all theresources that they need. A lot
of them are staying in theirlane and doing okay and not
really looking for help. Butthere's also a big majority out
there that don't know our bothof our organizations exist and
that we can be supporting them.
So we're definitely focused onon those initiatives, and the
(26:53):
content that those self managinghosts are looking for, or how
they run their hostingbusinesses, in most cases, is
very different from how aproperty management company
operates. So trying to fulfilltheir needs, from an education
standpoint, is definitely a bigchallenge. I mean, I would say
we welcome the collaboration onthat front
Matt Tesdall (27:13):
it, let's face it, most of us started with one or
two or handful of properties. Imean, I start with, we start
with one. It was our cabin. Andyou know, back in 2007 eight,
you couldn't afford anythinganymore because everything was
going to the to the heck andhandbag. So you told my wife,
we're going to start rentingthis cabin out if we're going to
keep it. She says, Absolutelynot. I said, I go, I gotta sell
(27:35):
it. She goes, Okay, you can rentit.
Anne Gardner (27:38):
Sure, yeah, if I'd love to follow on. Heidi, your
energy and enthusiasm there,because I we share it in that
regard. And so it's, it'sexciting. And as, as you
reference, Annie, we, we had aninitiative in 2022 where we
said, why don't we try this outand welcome in, just
individuals, if you will. And soI think our membership and
(28:01):
whatnot are showing us that theindividuals who are in that
space are truly theiraspirational hospitality. They
are looking most of the time tobe in that space and grow a
business. And so for us, it's amatter of really doing some
research right now. You know,Jody and I have been talking, it
seems like sometimes multipletimes a day since our retreat in
(28:22):
Las Vegas about, you know, wayswe are going to really serve up
value and so, and you're right,Heidi, it's a it's a bit like
boil in the ocean. You know whenthe individual owner operators
are looking for amenity sheetsand they're looking for styling
tips and, you know, things likethat. That is very different
than when we have the PMsshootout, if you will, of 15
(28:44):
vendors broad across in a majora major room in the conference
in October. And so it is a bitof being able to make sure that
we're positioned so that when weare in that space, we're able to
adequately serve the needs, andso that we're also helping them
in that path forward. And so,Matt, you were talking about how
(29:08):
vra gave you your start, and Iwill say that to go back to our
initial meeting we were talkingabout in April foundations, you
know, in the last eight or ninemonths, so many of these
conversations of what does VRmay mean to you, what's been
your experience? So many folkstold me just what you said, vrma
helped them get their start,that vra was foundational to
(29:29):
their beginnings. And so I thinkyou can can see a focus and a
channel there. And so as we lookinto how do we work with and
serve value up for the largersegment of short term rental and
vacation rental that'sdefinitely going to be a focus
of let's make sure we're addingvalue and helping someone with
(29:50):
their their business and theirvision of their trajectory,
Jodi Refosco (29:53):
yeah, and to add on. I mean, when we did that,
um, promotion, you know, I thinkVR may had a great idea to do
that and open that. Up, but Ifeel like they didn't move fast
enough to add the value thatthat segment needed. And I mean,
I could be, you know, example ofthat segment. I mean, I had a
company of 520 plus properties,sold it, and now I ran own and
(30:14):
manage my own properties. I have10 of them, you know. And there
are different needs. So, youknow, when we look at VR May,
and the membership now, like,for us, I mean, the memberships
change. It's need to use yourword Matt. It's morphed. It's
like, it's not just vacationrental managers, but it's also
short term rental managers. AndAnnie, you know, I think you
kind of, you made it very plainto see for me when you you, I
(30:37):
don't know where I heard you sayit, but like, you live in a
vacation destination. Youvacation at short term rentals,
and it's like that is a bigsegment, and there's a segment
of the United States that Idon't think is served by VR
nation or VR May. And who isthat? And who do they determine
so I think there's a lot oflearning, I mean, for the
industry to figure out who theproperty managers are and then
(31:01):
to address their needs. And Ithink that's why there is plenty
of space for people to grow hereand to be here, and it's
collaborating so we can give themost high level education no
matter what segment they areserving. You know, from the
Matt Tesdall (31:15):
numbers that we see, only about 10% of the
property management companiesout there go to a conference of
the year. Yep, 10
Alex Husner (31:25):
I would believe that,
Unknown (31:27):
yeah, 90% I
Matt Tesdall (31:29):
mean, we have so much work to do that probably my
generation is not going tofinish at all after that,
because it's just we have suchan opportunity. That's why I
think we keep talking aboutcollaboration, innovation, all
that stuff, and that is thefoundation here in education. I
just think we have a long roadahead of us to bring everybody
(31:50):
together. Yeah,
Alex Husner (31:50):
we've been asked that question quite a bit on
some of the podcasts that Annieand I have been on, of like, you
know, what's the differencebetween a vacation rental versus
a short term rental? And avacation rental is a short term
rental, but a short term rentalisn't necessarily a vacation
rentals, kind of how we phrasethat rental back to people.
Because, I mean, really, youknow, the urban short term
rentals, it's, it really is adifferent business model, you
(32:12):
know, and for them, like, youknow, that they're not getting
for the most part, I mean, likethe the repeat business that
these vacation destinations get,it's, just that's not that's not
there, right? So for thosepeople to be trying to focus on,
you know, direct bookings andrepeat business like there,
sometimes I feel like people areselling them strategies that are
just never going to inherentlywork. But I do think that there
is more of an opportunity, noteven just looking at size of
(32:34):
property managers, but alsolocations and just different
types, and bringing more ofthose people into the fold. And
I will say, when we were at VRmay last fall, and then immen,
which was, I think, kind of aregood examples of VR may
obviously more vacation rentals,and immen is kind of more the
short term rentals. But saw acouple operators that I know out
of Ohio, that they went to both,and it was, you know, it was
(32:56):
nice to see that, that they juststarted going to conferences.
But they do fall more in that,you know, urban operator type of
a model, but that'll beinteresting to follow as we
continue moving forward.
Heidie Henriksen (33:06):
It seems like there's a lot of terms in this
industry that could use someclarification. On that note, out
between the ER and str and allof the different acronyms. And
some people call it a vacationmanagement company, and other
call it a property managementcompany. And trying to bring
some of that standardization tothe industry would be helpful. I
think for a lot of people,
Unknown (33:26):
we do love our acronyms. That is, that is one
thing that is for sure, I thinkthat you guys have started
exactly what Alex and I likewhen we started this podcast.
One of the things that we reallywanted to to hone in on, not be
so focused on just vacationrentals, but really kind of look
at the industry overall, becauseit was, kind of, it was
spreading, and it was growing indifferent areas. And so, you
(33:47):
know, we kind of cringe everytime we talk to somebody who's
like, oh yeah. Well, I was, youknow, getting my education from
this guy on YouTube who does,like, rental arbitrage, and, you
know, whatever. And so it'slike, oh gosh, we just, we have
to get all on the same page. ButI think there's an opportunity,
you know, that rising tide liftsall boats. I mean, I think that
we're, if we're workingtogether, we don't have
necessarily the same mission,but I think if we're all kind of
(34:07):
seeing from the same hymnal, soto speak, and like, here's what
your basics you should be, andthen it can, you know, it can
morph out from the from thedifferent markets. I think
that's it's at least a startingpoint. It just feels like we're
finally in a place where peopleare talking. And one thing that
came out of COVID that I feltlike we were all in agreement on
was we needed a unified voice.
But that never really kind ofcame together. So I applaud you
guys for really trying to getthat unification. I'll think
Anne Gardner (34:32):
something that that I saw Heidi and Matt is
news of your road show, and Ithought that was really
exciting. Talk about, we talkabout, how do we extend, right?
How do we bring, you know, noteveryone, we've had so much
conversation about conferencesand meetings and whatnot, but
And you talk about how few areactually attending, and so how
(34:52):
do we disperse and unify andelevate the industry and when
outside of those events and. Andso I'm I was super excited to
see about your road show. I'dlove to hear a little bit about
that and where you see thatgoing next. Because bringing the
content and bringing this to ouroperator communities, I think,
is, is super exciting, really.
Matt Tesdall (35:14):
Where the vision from this came in is a big
passion of mine when I becamePresident, that I want to go out
and I want to meet the peoplewhere they are. Not everybody
either has time or money orwhatever to be able to go to our
conferences in different states,but that's that's the goal,
right? But sometimes you got tobring it to them. And honestly,
I learned this from Amy haina,from the member the old VRM
(35:37):
Intel, and when she did one herein Portland area with this, some
vendors and herself, and it waslike 50 people, super simple
lunch and some some really goodbreakout sessions. And when I
talked to the board, I said,guys, this is what we need to
do. We need to be out, and weneed to bring it to multiple
areas of the country so thatsmaller operators, or even
(36:00):
larger operators, can just gettogether and we could, you know,
shake hands and kiss babies,let's say, I mean, just be
close. And that's, that's whereit came from. So this year, it
starts in Portland on March 11,at the Kennedy School. Anybody's
familiar with the West Coast,there's the McMinn brothers that
have done a great job takingthese old churches and schools,
(36:22):
whatnot, and turning them intothese fantastic venues. So this
is at the Kennedy School. Andthen our next one in Mays in
Florida, I think Heidi,
Unknown (36:32):
yeah, it's in Sarasota, Bradenton area, yep. And then
Matt Tesdall (36:36):
we're going to go to the Truckee Northern, you
know, Nevada, California, there.
And then I think, then theDenver or Telluride q3 is Brevig
q4 is
Heidie Henriksen (36:46):
Truckee Tahoe, get around the whole country,
including our conference inAustin. And like Matt said,
really focused on education. Wehave a series of tracks on
safety certifications, cleaningcertifications. It's all covered
by your VR nation membership.
And like Matt said, too, it'sgot lunch involved and bringing
in some local experts. We've gotthe Oregon restaurant Lodging
(37:06):
Association participating in ourPortland event. So talking about
some new house bills in theareas, how it could impact short
term rentals, so it really couldimpact the entire state. Really
excited to bring this to a morelocal level. Yeah,
Alex Husner (37:20):
I think that's great to do also, for for the
suppliers and your sponsors, forthem to be able to go out and
more, you know, reasonably froma cost perspective, be able to
get in front of managers,because it's, it's a lot of
money for them too. I mean, ifthey're going to a market
individually, to, you know, goand set meetings. And sometimes
it helps just when you're withother vendors that you have
relationships with, and you cankind of go at it together. So
(37:43):
that's that's gonna be reallycool to see it remind me of the
VR may connect. That's what Iwas just gonna say, yeah. What's
the future for that? Ann andJody? Do you think those will
come back at some point?
Jodi Refosco (37:52):
Yeah, I think they're gonna come back. I feel
like we had to, like, pull backeverything and kind of start
afresh, right? So I feel likethat we had to focus on, you
know, our major events, which,you know, we pulled back. We're
not doing European, we're justdoing the International, you
know, the spring event and theexecutive Summit. But I see the
connects coming. I thinkconnects have to be strategic,
(38:14):
of where you have them, and Ithink it's very important to
have really good boots on theground, like operators to help
out with that area. But I thinkit's smart to you to me take the
education content to ourmembers. It's very smart what
you guys are doing. But yeah, Isee it's coming back in the
future. Just we needed to startanew and kind of focus on what
was most important to ourmembers at the time. So
Unknown (38:36):
we wanted to ask a question about membership, just
from the two differentperspectives. What would you
what would you say? Each of yousay is the value proposition for
each organization? For anybodythat's listening and thinking,
like, Well, which one should Ibe? Should I do both? Should I
do one? You know, like, whatshould be the things that they
should consider when looking atboth of the associations? I
mean, for
Matt Tesdall (38:55):
me, I don't think it's, I don't think it's an
either, or it's not an either.
Or for me personally, so I thinkyou'd look at the International
Conference, whether it's inVegas or on the East Coast or
whatever, is fantastic. You haveeverybody there. It could be
daunting for some people whohave a hard time with super
large crowds, because it is big,but that is the benefit for me.
And just take, take my VRnation, head off for a minute,
(39:16):
and just me as a PM, so I bringmy team to those and then each
my team members, they have theirfocus, whether it's, you know,
an area manager for me orhousekeeping manager. They can
do their own meetings with theirown people, and they can with
their own vendors, and they canfind, you know, some new
products that are in there. Youlook at a VR nation, where you
mean, we both have education,clearly, maybe they like our
(39:42):
housekeeping Olympics, I don'tknow, but there's fun things
that we can do, verycollaborative and and very hands
on, and just, you know,definitely smaller than the
national conference, but veryimpactful. And so for me, it's
not either or, it's both. Yeah,
Jodi Refosco (39:58):
I probably go along same. Mind, you know, I
feel like there's like we allbelieve in education. We're all
believing in advocacy, right?
We're, you know, at VR May,right now, we're focusing on
advocacy. We're focusing on themembership and the content we're
giving to our members. We havethe VRP Council, which everybody
that knows VRP, it came in andmerged with VR may in 2019 2020
(40:22):
I think. And then, you know,we're working with the council
now, which my husband, well, youguys have Dirk. You know Dirk,
and my husband, Joe, has beenon, I think he was the president
of VRP for like, six or sevenyears. I was like, Don't you
have, like, a don't you go offat any time. Why are you the
president forever? But we mergedtogether, so the VHP is a big
(40:45):
thing for us. But no, I don'tthink it's either or either you
like, I think there's thingsthat you're going to find that
are that matter to you as amember. And, you know, I feel
like, just like I said, there's,there's going to be a lot of
different associations to join,and you got to pick what you
think feel that vibes best withyou. And you know, VR, Ma, yes,
(41:06):
we've been around. This is our40th year, which, when I say
I've been in business 25 years,I've been in part of VR may for
that long because, like, I waslike, the college kid that went
along with my parents to theconferences and so like, yeah,
we've been around forever. Butthat also means we have to learn
(41:26):
to pivot and move and change andfight, because our members are
moving. So I think it's, I don'tknow, I think it's not an either
or. I think is, you know, hey,you're gonna have to find who
vibes best with you. And youknow, you try, we're all
educating, and we're all goingto bring some different aspects
to the game. So I think youshould check us along. I love
Unknown (41:48):
that, and I agree with you. I just was curious to see
if there was anydifferentiators. And so if
somebody wants to join, couldthey get a deal to join both?
Oh, so
Jodi Refosco (41:58):
those are conversations to be happy. I
Unknown (42:02):
mean, I'm on the membership committee for vrma,
so, like, I'm thinking, like,how do we, how do we, like,
Corley, this into somethingbigger and, like, help everybody
out, right?
Jodi Refosco (42:10):
So it's interesting. Like, that was
something so go back to Michelleacavela, back in the day, that
was something that we've triedto do. Like, if you're a member
of a local Alliance, like NC, VRMay, or northeast VR mayor, or
whatever it'd be. How do you Howcan you make it membership? I
think at the time, logistics wasdifficult, and it just didn't
(42:32):
make sense. There's other waysto go about it. Like, I've
talked to Anne about, like,well, like, Wouldn't it be cool
to have like, you know, VRnations, or Amy high note, or
whoever, come in and do asession at one of our
conferences and vice versa, likewe're, yeah, but as far as
membership, I don't know. Ithink there is logistics there,
but it is something that's beentalked about for like, a decade.
(42:55):
So yeah, it's, I'm sure there'sways to work something out.
Unknown (42:58):
Well, let's throw it out in the universe and make it
Ann and Heidi. It also applies
Heidie Henriksen (43:04):
on the vendor side, right? There's a lot of
vendors out there thinking, whoshould I support? Well, it's not
an either or. It should be aboth. We've had a lot of vendors
come our way. Have beenincredibly supportive, which is
fantastic, and they're 100%backing the RMA as well. And
while our board of directors isall vacation rental management
company owners, we have sixadvisory boards that are
(43:27):
comprised of individuals fromall over the industry, vendors,
property managers, individualhosts, thought leaders. So we're
trying to bring everybodytogether in that sense, and have
a common voice on how weapproach the industry, what we
do with the Association, butthere's definitely, there's room
for the vendors to participateon both sides. I completely
agree there. Yeah,
Alex Husner (43:47):
I think there's a ton of power, and just the whole
mindset there of it's not, orit's and, and, you know, what
does that mean? We always talkabout collaboration over
competition, but collaborationand competition like it's not or
for it, for for any of these soI love that, and I think this is
something that's been neededwithin our industry for a long
(44:07):
time. So it's, it's superexciting to see it in front of
us and and see how this is goingto play out this year.
Anne Gardner (44:14):
Well, absolutely.
I mean, I think that it's, it'sa great opportunity for us to
look at how we are able to serveour industry and in those
supportive ways. And part ofthis is, even if we're offering
a similar program, you know,everyone has their own way of
doing it, right. And so, youknow, just look at the
differentiation within ouroperators and our companies. And
(44:37):
so it's, it's always a differentflavor and an opportunity to
improve and enhance and buildupon what we all have done and
say, you know, I personally amreally invigorated and inspired
by what you know our colleaguesare doing with VR nation. And I
think it just, it just helpssharpen everyone. Yeah, and
(44:58):
brings us all forward. And so Ifind it invigorating and
stimulating, and can't wait tosee how things develop for us
both. Iron
Matt Tesdall (45:09):
sharpens iron
Alex Husner (45:10):
Exactly. It's not a good one, too. Yeah, very cool,
Heidie Henriksen (45:14):
you know. And heart and soul of this industry,
I feel, is your biggestcompetitor taking you over to
meet the lead that you've beentrying to get in touch with for
the last six months, right? Weare all in this to put together,
to get ahead, and it's not anall for one mentality. So
Unknown (45:31):
co opetition, as we always say on the show, it's co
opetition,
Alex Husner (45:35):
yeah, exactly.
Well, super awesome having youguys here today, and we can't
wait to be in attendance atthese shows this spring. I know,
personally, I'll be at VR nationand the VR may executive Summit.
And Annie, you're going to VRnation. Awesome. Well, we can't
wait to hear how it goes afterafter all of them, and maybe
we'll do a recap before we gointo the fall to hear how
(45:56):
everything went. But thank youguys so much, and we appreciate
everything that you do for theindustry and just your true
passion towards just helpingout, because this, this is not
an easy job that any of youhave, and not even your main
job, except for maybe Anne orAnne. Heidi, are you full time
too? Heidi, I am. Yes. You areokay, so you guys do, but yeah,
(46:17):
awesome. Well, if anybody wantsto reach out, we're going to put
your contact information in theshow notes. Just be easier to do
that. But if anyone wants to getin touch with Annie and I, you
can go to Alex and Anniepodcast.com and until next time,
thanks for tuning in, everybody.
Unknown (46:42):
You
Music. Welcome to Alex and Annie the real women of
vacation rentals with more than35 years combined industry
experience, Alex Husner andAnnie Holcomb have teamed up to
connect the dots betweeninspiration and opportunity,
seeking to find the one storyidea, strategy or decision that
led to their guests big ahamoment. Join them as they
(00:23):
highlight the real storiesbehind the people and brands
that have built vacation rentalsinto the $100 billion industry
it is today. And now it's timeto get real and have some fun
with your hosts, Alex and Annie.
We'll start the show in just aminute, but first a message from
our premier brand sponsor,
Unknown (00:41):
track, with a comprehensive suite of native
tools and over 70 technologypartners, track is the most
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business faster, easier and moreprofitable,
Alex Husner (00:53):
built for the unique needs of enterprise
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Unknown (01:05):
trusted by many of the largest and most successful
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Alex Husner (01:15):
Ready to take your operations to the next level.
Visit t, N, S, I, N,c.com/podcasts-alex, dot com
slash podcasts, dash, Alex dashand dash, Annie to learn more.
That's t, N, S, I, N,c.com/podcasts-alex-and-annie,
to learn more. Welcome to Alex,Annie, the real women of
(01:36):
vacation rentals. I'm Alex andI'm Annie, and we are joined
today by a whole panel ofvacation rental superstars. We
have from vrma The ExecutiveDirector and Gardner and Chair
of the Board of Directors, Jodyrafasco, along with from VR
nation. We have President MattTisdale and Executive Director
Heidi Henrickson. Welcomeeverybody. Hi. Thanks for
Unknown (01:59):
having us. Well, we've got a group here, so I know it's
going to be hard to be hard torein everybody in, but we
thought the easiest thing to dois just kind of go around. And I
don't know how we all look toeach other on the screen, but
maybe start with Anne and Jodiand then go over to Matt and
Heidi. Just a littleintroduction about yourself and
what you do in vacation rentals.
Anne Gardner (02:15):
Sure. Thanks so much for for having us. This is
first for me since joining theteam with vrma. But as you said,
I'm Ann Gardner. I am theExecutive Director for vrma, and
I have been with the team sincethe end of April of 24 and
really glad to be here. Comefrom a background in organized
(02:35):
real estate and propertymanagement and commercial real
estate as well. And so justreally, really, super glad to be
part of our industry. I'm acompletely hooked fan and all in
and just really glad to be hereand learn from these pros today
on our call.
Jodi Refosco (02:54):
Hi, I'm Jodi rafasco. I am the VR may board
chair, and I am out of WesternMaryland. I have a vacation
rental company of about 10properties. Before this, I had a
company of over 500 homes. ButI've been in the industry for
probably 25 years, and I'm realexcited to be here, and I
(03:15):
appreciate you guys inviting usand looking forward to the
conversation. I'm
Matt Tesdall (03:19):
Matthew TESOL, president of be our nation. I
currently reside south ofPortland, south of all the fun
activities over COVID, butcloser to the wine country. So
if you like wine, this is whereyou need to come. I own family
time vacation rentals. Alongwith my wife, we're in Oregon,
Idaho and southern Utah. Sohappy to be on and join all
(03:40):
these amazing people. Great.
Heidie Henriksen (03:41):
Happy to be here, too. I'm Heidi Hendrix and
Executive Director at VR nation.
Joined the association in Augustof last year, 2024 and have
about a 25 year career in shortterm rentals, starting as a host
myself and then working for aluxury property manager in Park
City, Utah, works for quite afew different facets of the
vocational industry, and mostrecently, co founded a nonprofit
(04:04):
called Astro. And then, like Isaid, joined VR nation just last
year. So excited to be heretoday. Awesome.
Alex Husner (04:13):
Well, super excited to have you guys. And I think
you know, today we wanted tojust learn a little bit more
about what's going on betweenthe two organizations, and most
importantly, the event that youboth have coming up in April.
There's two, two great eventscoming up, one on this side of
the East Coast, in Savannah, andthe other one down in Austin.
Maybe just give us and we cankick it off with you. Heidi,
(04:35):
just kind of an idea of whatyou're looking forward to for
you guys, this is your secondconference as VR nation, but how
many for the whole Associationnow? So VR
Heidie Henriksen (04:44):
nation launched in 2011 and I think our
conferences, if I recall, Matt,you might have to help me out
here, started in about 2015 on aregional basis. So last year,
our regional conference in Boisewas when we announced our
rebrand and migration to anational organization. So this
is in April, our first nationalconference. We're incredibly
(05:04):
excited about
Matt Tesdall (05:05):
br nation going from Northwest BRP, which is a
regional Northwest conference inHawaii and Canada and those kind
of places, really has been abouta two year project that we've
worked on in the board. I'vebeen part of the board for about
six years in differentcapacities, currently the
president for this year, nextyear, but the that's what we
were excited about. Ourconference has always been
(05:26):
intimate, and, you know, a lotof fun, a lot of collaboration,
and a lot of just workingtogether. And that's what the
our vendors say when they whenthey've come and, you know, it's
the same vendors that go to allthese conferences, whether it's
vra or us. And so that's justsuper exciting. We're really
excited to have this in Austinon the end of April, there 27th
(05:47):
and 28th on Sunday, Monday, atthe JW Marriott and and so
that's exciting. And I know you,Jody and Ann, you guys have your
the it's the front of lineconference right in Savannah.
Jodi Refosco (05:59):
Yeah, we have our frontline excellence conference
is April 14 to the 15th inSavannah at the convention
center. We had a EasternConference I think there, years
ago, it was a great event. It'sa great location. It's kind of
close to a lot of drive tomarket there. And it's we
pivoted. So like give you guyssome history is that we used to
have, like us, in the spring, anEast Coast show and the West
(06:21):
Coast show, and we, years ago,made him to be one event, which
is supposed to alternate Coastspring, the spring forum. And it
was supposed to work towards thefront line, but kind of just
grew, and we kind of came moreof like a mini international so
it was, it was a little bitbigger than what we intended. So
this conference, we pivoted. Wemoved it to Savannah, we moved
(06:42):
it to kind of focus onoperations, front desk and then
their managers. So there's likethree tracks. So it's very
different than what we've seenin the past, much more of a
smaller, intimate setting thanwe've seen, but it's real
exciting. It's something that Ireally look forward to, but it's
definitely different than whatwe, you guys, would have seen in
(07:02):
spring the past couple years.
You know
Matt Tesdall (07:04):
the I remember back in the day Jody that when
Burma had the like you said, theEast West. I always go to the
Western Conference, because Ilike to it was, it was, it
wasn't small, but it was smallerthan the the National
Conference, and it was in Reno.
And you had one of the best, oneof the best closing setting, you
know, closing, not seminars, butclosing speaker that talked
(07:24):
about bringing all the stuff youlearn in this, in this during
the show, and how to implementit throughout the year. And it
was all done with sticky notes.
I've used this so many times indifferent organizations. I loved
it, and I kept that back then Iwas working on my my desk in the
kitchens where I built thebusiness, and I had it posted up
on the wall, all my stickynotes. My wife was like, what is
(07:47):
that? I go, it's my action planfor the year, and I could take a
sticky note off every time Iaccomplished it. I use that so
much. Yeah,
Jodi Refosco (07:53):
I went. I was always at the Eastern
Conference, right? And then myfather used to be on the board
too, back in the day, and hebrought me out to a Western
Conference. And, well, I'm amountain region, right? But just
on the East Coast, just smallermountains, and everybody's got
out there. So I remember comingout to the Western Conference.
I'm like, This is amazing. It'slike, My people, I found them.
It was really because it wasenlightening. I was like,
(08:16):
talking about things ourmountain thinking it was brand
new ideas. And hear it. No, Ijust haven't been talking to the
mountain people.
Matt Tesdall (08:22):
Yeah, you gotta come to the west coast, the Wild
West. Yeah, it
Jodi Refosco (08:25):
was, it was very cool. So now, yes, I remember
the West Coast, East Coast, butthis will be different. So it's
going to be cool. More operationstyle and line to bring more
employees with you, more staffwith you, and that it's more
cost effective. So it'sexciting. That's awesome. I
Alex Husner (08:39):
know Annie and I attended when it was NW, VRP,
two years ago in Reno, and thatwas actually the first time I
had ever been to Reno, but thatwas a great event. And one thing
that we really loved about thatwas exactly what you said, Matt,
that it was more of an intimatekind of feel, a smaller
conference, but also it just hada different kind of feel to it
than some of the conference. AndI think that's one thing I've
(09:00):
noticed, is just conferenceshave different feels when you're
there, like just, just theatmosphere and, you know, the
tone and the way that things arerun, like it has a different
vibe depending on what show thatyou're at. But you guys do some
fun things that we didn't get tosee it last year, but I saw
videos of the the housekeepingOlympics that you did. Are you
doing anything like that thisyear? We're doing
Matt Tesdall (09:20):
a couple. We're doing the host GPO pickleball,
which I which, I think, are youguys doing that too? Are you
doing a pickleball? Did I seethat
Jodi Refosco (09:27):
they do that at international conference
pickleball tournament? Yeah,Vegas
Matt Tesdall (09:31):
in October, right?
Mm, hmm, the seniors, yeah. Butanyway, so we're doing that
second annual with host GPO. Andthen also we're doing the second
annual housekeeping Olympics, Ithink Heidi did. We've added a
couple categories to that thisyear.
Heidie Henriksen (09:46):
We did. We had three categories last year. So
this year we're adding a fourthcategory, revolving shower
curtains. So it's it's meant tobe fun, engaging and still very
educational. So we kind of pointout best practices. Or cleaning
teams and operational teams onthose different aspects. And
there's a vacuum relay, there'sa bed making competition, and
(10:07):
there's a gorgeous, goldentrophy up for grabs. So it's
gonna be a good event.
Jodi Refosco (10:12):
It sounds very dark. Yeah, I was gonna say,
Unknown (10:15):
but is somebody gonna show us how to fold fitted
sheets? Because that's the thing
Jodi Refosco (10:19):
that's still Joe will help Absolutely. Okay,
wingspan, yeah, might never looklike his.
Unknown (10:27):
So I think one of the things that I think is really
interesting for the vrma and isjust the pivot back to kind of
what you used to do, and I thinkthat that's going back to the
core of what vrma was years ago.
And I think it's good becauseit's got people talking this
year and are excited and knowingthat we're not going to be able
to go to like, I'm not doingboth for my company. I'm going
to do VR nation and then do theinternational but I think that's
(10:49):
like spreading people's thoughtprocesses out over multiple
conferences. And it's it'sfostered a sense of more
collaboration, which I think is,again, what we're what this
podcast is about. This episodeis about, is talking about the
collaboration between theorganization. So I thought like,
maybe Anne and Heidi, from yourperspective, the two different
associations, where do you guyssee the collaborative effort
(11:11):
moving forward? For you guys,
Anne Gardner (11:16):
sure, I think that's a great question and
great segue. And so from, fromour perspective, as far as in,
in being able to, you know,bring VR ma forward and make
sure that we're really alignedwith where our members are and
where our industry really has,has areas of need for us to be
(11:38):
involved is to start, just as wesaid, first off, with the
programming and but then movinginto the fact that we are, we
are a year round. We're a tradeorganization representing an
industry and the areas ofconcern and protection within
advocacy and making sure that weare in that leadership role as
(11:59):
far as research and providinginsights and being able to
support our members in in thestate and local affiliation
organizations, but also justthroughout the country and in
those efforts. And so that's areal area where VR May is, I
think, has a great opportunityin a collaborative frame. And so
(12:23):
Heidi, we were part of aconversation with a couple of
other other organizations a fewweeks ago. I think we have
another conversation coming upthis week, and just being able
to see how we can be additive inprotecting our industry, making
sure that you have the right foruse and enjoyment and to build
your business and to grow yourbusiness, and so that we're
(12:45):
doing it in ways that are addingto our communities and really
showing the true economic impactand value. And so those are
conversations where there's roomfor everyone. We need everyone
in that conversation and doingthat shared lift together. And
so for for me, that's really thefirst area that that I come to
(13:06):
where we say, Here's fantasticcollaborative opportunity where
we can all live. Well said,
Heidie Henriksen (13:11):
and I'd love to chime in also, I know one of
the first things I did in my newrole was reach out to Anne and
invite her and anotherrepresentative to our
conference, and then us do thesame. We met in person for a
good hour and had a wonderfulconversation about how our two
organizations can becomplimentary to our efforts and
what we do for the industry as awhole, and really focusing on
(13:33):
elevating standards together. Sowe've had good conversations.
We've come together on theadvocacy front to make sure that
we're complimentary on thoseefforts as well, in partnership
with some other organizations.
And from an industryperspective, if you look at
other industries, such as thehotel world, you've got multiple
organizations supportingeveryone as a whole, and that's
something we're very focused ondoing as well with this in VR
(13:54):
nation and VR mazecollaboration, so making sure
all those resources areavailable. Great.
Unknown (14:02):
Matt And Jody, maybe pivot over to you guys. So from
your perspective, what do yousee the ability to collaborate
moving forward? I think you knowyou guys, Jodi, you've been with
VR may for a very long time, andhave already been kind of in the
leadership roles on the board.
What do you know? I think thatthe the idea of bringing the
associations together to worktogether, is, is something that
we've all wanted to see. So Ithink it's really great that
(14:23):
this is happening. But from youreach individual, you know, kind
of vantage points within theorganizations, what do you see
beyond advocacy? What do you seeother collaborations that are
possible? Well,
Jodi Refosco (14:33):
yeah, I mean, this is, first of all this. I feel
like this is great. I mean,it's, I've been a part of VR
May. I was on VR may board, Ithink starting in 2013 maybe,
and I was the president then,and at that time, there really
was no there was no other likeconferences or associations kind
of similar to us. And then outof COVID, they all spring up.
(14:55):
And I feel like our industry haschanged so much since then,
right? Our industry? Has grownrapidly, especially since COVID
and a lot of differentassociations. Like I remember
you guys up there when you hadthe NW, vrma, and it was
Michelle acavela was
Matt Tesdall (15:11):
on it right? Was, yeah,
Jodi Refosco (15:13):
yes. There we go.
Thank you. And I remember hertrying to bring us together on
different levels. And you knowit there was ways that we could
work together. And we, I thinkwe struggled a little bit then,
and so when I came back onto theboard and when I took this
position, I'm like, Let'scollaborate. You know, there's
no reason that we all sit in oursilos. What we're all doing is
trying to lift theprofessionalism of our industry,
(15:34):
inside and outside of advocacy,right? You know, we're more well
known than like before, COVID,people were barely talking about
vacation rentals, right? Theywere talking about staying in
hotels, and now they're moretalking about vacation rentals.
And now we have regulationsbecause of, they've blown up,
and we've had some bad actorsout there. So I think
collaboration could be alongsideof, we could talk about
(15:55):
different conferences and lifteach other up, because I feel
like we also do fill a differentspace, right? And I think
working together. I mean, wejust did, I just with the board,
did a two and a half day boardretreat in January, and we were
doing a whole strategic plan andoperation analysis, and one of
the things was collaboration. Imean, it was a big part of what
we talked about. So I lookforward to conversations like
(16:17):
this with David and Heidi andall the other associations out
there, because I feel like weall fill a space and have a and
have a lane a little bit. Imean, it does kind of go over a
little bit, but I feel like weall can lift each other up. So
it's, I'm very much forward,looking forward to it, yeah. I
mean,
Matt Tesdall (16:34):
very well said Jody, that's exactly how how we
feel. And let's face it, ourindustry has morphed over the
years. Okay? I mean, COVID andbefore that, and some of the
OTAs that have come along inrecent this last decade has
really changed our landscape,and we have serious fights on
our hand. I know you mentionedadvocacy, but there's other
(16:55):
things as well, and it's havingthat local representation.
Sometimes it's the smallergroups the bigger groups. I
mean, just that, that, ingeneral, is so important to us.
So I saw, I agree with whatHeidi said. I've been in this
business almost 20 years. I cutmy teeth with Verba. I did
that's where I started, when Iwas doing my, you know, on the
west coast, mostly honestly. Andthen when you would have the
(17:17):
wet, you know, the region, orthe national conferences on the
west, that's where I would go.
But without that, I wouldn't bewhere I am on the educational
standpoint. And back in thosedays, serving on the ambassador
program and being involved inthat. And when new members come
on and thanking them and saidthanks for being in a meeting
with the conference. And anybodywho knows me, I'm really more of
an in person kind of guy. Ireally like the talking to
(17:37):
people in person. And this isgreat. I love this, but this is
not natural, but it's so theeducational piece is key. And
just for you personally, it'sabout networking. I love the
networking. That's what I loveabout us coming together and
having more moments like this,whether it's in Vegas at a
national conference or anexecutive Summit, all of that is
(17:59):
really key. And you have onecoming the executive summit
right in May. I think,
Jodi Refosco (18:06):
yeah, yeah, we have one. So we have a second
kind of spring event, but thisis more senior level may, 28 in
South Beach. And it's, have youguys been to an executive
Summit? I haven't actually, no.
So I was president of er Maywhen we had our first one, but
my fifth grader was graduatingfifth grade, and I couldn't miss
it, so I went for the boardmeeting, and literally missed
(18:28):
running the first executiveSummit. Mike Carrington ended up
running it for me, but I was andthen just that time of year was
really hard for me, so I wentlast year, and I loved it. I
just love, I love smaller,intimate set. You know, there's
a reason for the larger ones,but there's also a reason for
the smaller ones, and that one'smore, well, it's all executive
(18:49):
level, so it's more of like ahigh level networking. And
something that's different thisyear is we're bringing the
suppliers or the sponsors intothe room with us, because I feel
like it's very important to beable to collaborate with them
too, because it's nice whenyou're like, trying to drive an
idea, right? And you sit down.
(19:09):
Look, well, have you seen thisacross the industry? Because I
only see what I see in my area,right? And it's not just VRMs,
but the the suppliers, too. Sothat's, yeah, that's coming on
the 28th if you haven't gottenyou guys should come it is, it
is, it was so amazing. And I hadyou talk about your sticky
notes. I had, like, notebooksupon notebooks, and I had a
whole notebook full of justideas, because it was like, and
(19:31):
it was more intimate. So like,you could ask questions, and,
like, get answers from othersenior level, exact. So it kind
of cool. I'm excited about if I
Anne Gardner (19:39):
can also offer Alex and Annie, we know you're
fans of being able to pass alongopportunities, and so we have
also reimagined this event andthat it is completely new with a
whole new focus and effort. Andso we wanted to provide to your
viewers a list. Code that wewill share with you for trying
(20:04):
out that executive Summit, andjust how that is also sort of re
imagined, new, as Jody said,much more intimate, but the
level of programming and detailthat's involved in this event,
it's really driven by a superengaged number of our members.
And as we said, It is not aboutthe content in a room and
(20:28):
keeping folks in like an exhibithall. It's really a truly
participatory and integratedevent. Because the fact is, is
that, you know, our innovationdoesn't come from one side of
our industry. Our innovationcomes from the whole and so
we're all learning and growingtogether and so participating.
And it's a, it's a new focus.
And in some regards, I think, asyou said, Matt, it's a, it's a
(20:50):
return home, if you will. So
Alex Husner (20:54):
yeah, that's that's such a great point, too. And I
think, you know, the vendors andsuppliers in this space have
gotten kind of frustrated atsome events over the last few
years, just because they feltseparated from where the
property managers are. And youknow, a lot of that comes down
to the venue really, to behonest. But I think having them
in the same place is going to begreat. And you know, at the end
(21:15):
of the day, the suppliers in ourspace are so important to what
we all do. I mean, they'reseeing things from a different
lens than we are as propertymanagers and vice versa, but as
suppliers that they get to talkto companies all over the
country and in the world, theperspective that they bring back
to property managers is reallyimportant, so I think it is good
to have them more in thoseactive conversations, and not so
(21:38):
much of okay, they're walking bya booth and They're going to try
and grab you, but like, let'shave, like, real, authentic
conversations, and that's howsales should happen anyways,
right? So I'm sure they're goingto be just thrilled about that.
Matt Tesdall (21:49):
It's like speed dating.
Alex Husner (21:51):
Yeah, right, exactly. We'll be back in just a
minute, but first a message fromour premier brand sponsor
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Heidie Henriksen (21:58):
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Unknown (22:00):
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(22:43):
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Really showing owners what thepotential can be for their units
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(23:27):
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We are now in a huge growthphase during the slow market,
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(23:49):
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Alex Husner (24:08):
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Matt Tesdall (24:28):
lot of these vendors, they were PMS at one
point, right?
Alex Husner (24:31):
Or maybe they just have a vice versa. You know,
there's both sides.
Matt Tesdall (24:35):
And over the years, these become our friends,
honestly, and we hang out. We govisit them. They come here and
drink wine, you know, you go tothe you go to your beach. I
mean, it's so much fun. Yeah,
Unknown (24:44):
I wanted to ask you guys, so we had recently
interviewed Tim ro from VRBO,and one of the things that we
talk about on the show a lot iseducation. And how do we get
education in front of those newentrants to the space and. And I
think that, you know, vrma, afew years ago, announced that
they were going to allow peoplethat were, you know, smaller
operators, one unit, to to jointhe association. And it kind of,
(25:07):
like, when it, when it wasannounced, there was, like, two
schools of thought. Some peoplewere like, Absolutely not. We
don't want them. And otherpeople, like, I Alex and I had
this conversation too. Like Iwas like, we have to get them
in, and we want them in. Like,from the beginning, you know,
you could get them to water, butyou can, you make them drink.
But like, looking at, I think,VR nation, you've taken a kind
of a similar approach, butbecause you're not, you haven't
been around as long, and maybehave, like, this legacy belief
(25:29):
system that you know, that themembers have, that you want to
engage with these smaller, youknow, these smaller PMS. And so
what do you see? I feel likebetween the two associations can
continuing to jump off thecollaboration part, there's an
opportunity to really engagewith these smaller operators in
these niche markets, these newermarkets that sort of have
(25:49):
emerged that aren't yourtraditional vacation rental or
maybe short term urban marketsto help them get educated. So do
you see that there's like,education sessions and maybe
webinars, things that bothassociations can do together, to
that we can offer out to thelarger the larger community of
short term rentals. How
Matt Tesdall (26:08):
do you have a big, big passion on this? You want
to, you want to take this onefor the our nation side?
Heidie Henriksen (26:12):
Sure, yeah, I know that's a big piece of our
focus. I would say at least 20%of the content at our
conference, at our road showsand the educational initiatives
that we focus on is driven andtargeted at that self managing
or RBO host Astro, theassociation I co founded, has
merged with VR nation, so wehave welcomed those members into
(26:32):
our portfolio, and so we're verykeen on making sure we address
those individuals with all theresources that they need. A lot
of them are staying in theirlane and doing okay and not
really looking for help. Butthere's also a big majority out
there that don't know our bothof our organizations exist and
that we can be supporting them.
So we're definitely focused onon those initiatives, and the
(26:53):
content that those self managinghosts are looking for, or how
they run their hostingbusinesses, in most cases, is
very different from how aproperty management company
operates. So trying to fulfilltheir needs, from an education
standpoint, is definitely a bigchallenge. I mean, I would say
we welcome the collaboration onthat front
Matt Tesdall (27:13):
it, let's face it, most of us started with one or
two or handful of properties. Imean, I start with, we start
with one. It was our cabin. Andyou know, back in 2007 eight,
you couldn't afford anythinganymore because everything was
going to the to the heck andhandbag. So you told my wife,
we're going to start rentingthis cabin out if we're going to
keep it. She says, Absolutelynot. I said, I go, I gotta sell
(27:35):
it. She goes, Okay, you can rentit.
Anne Gardner (27:38):
Sure, yeah, if I'd love to follow on. Heidi, your
energy and enthusiasm there,because I we share it in that
regard. And so it's, it'sexciting. And as, as you
reference, Annie, we, we had aninitiative in 2022 where we
said, why don't we try this outand welcome in, just
individuals, if you will. And soI think our membership and
(28:01):
whatnot are showing us that theindividuals who are in that
space are truly theiraspirational hospitality. They
are looking most of the time tobe in that space and grow a
business. And so for us, it's amatter of really doing some
research right now. You know,Jody and I have been talking, it
seems like sometimes multipletimes a day since our retreat in
(28:22):
Las Vegas about, you know, wayswe are going to really serve up
value and so, and you're right,Heidi, it's a it's a bit like
boil in the ocean. You know whenthe individual owner operators
are looking for amenity sheetsand they're looking for styling
tips and, you know, things likethat. That is very different
than when we have the PMsshootout, if you will, of 15
(28:44):
vendors broad across in a majora major room in the conference
in October. And so it is a bitof being able to make sure that
we're positioned so that when weare in that space, we're able to
adequately serve the needs, andso that we're also helping them
in that path forward. And so,Matt, you were talking about how
(29:08):
vra gave you your start, and Iwill say that to go back to our
initial meeting we were talkingabout in April foundations, you
know, in the last eight or ninemonths, so many of these
conversations of what does VRmay mean to you, what's been
your experience? So many folkstold me just what you said, vrma
helped them get their start,that vra was foundational to
(29:29):
their beginnings. And so I thinkyou can can see a focus and a
channel there. And so as we lookinto how do we work with and
serve value up for the largersegment of short term rental and
vacation rental that'sdefinitely going to be a focus
of let's make sure we're addingvalue and helping someone with
(29:50):
their their business and theirvision of their trajectory,
Jodi Refosco (29:53):
yeah, and to add on. I mean, when we did that,
um, promotion, you know, I thinkVR may had a great idea to do
that and open that. Up, but Ifeel like they didn't move fast
enough to add the value thatthat segment needed. And I mean,
I could be, you know, example ofthat segment. I mean, I had a
company of 520 plus properties,sold it, and now I ran own and
(30:14):
manage my own properties. I have10 of them, you know. And there
are different needs. So, youknow, when we look at VR May,
and the membership now, like,for us, I mean, the memberships
change. It's need to use yourword Matt. It's morphed. It's
like, it's not just vacationrental managers, but it's also
short term rental managers. AndAnnie, you know, I think you
kind of, you made it very plainto see for me when you you, I
(30:37):
don't know where I heard you sayit, but like, you live in a
vacation destination. Youvacation at short term rentals,
and it's like that is a bigsegment, and there's a segment
of the United States that Idon't think is served by VR
nation or VR May. And who isthat? And who do they determine
so I think there's a lot oflearning, I mean, for the
industry to figure out who theproperty managers are and then
(31:01):
to address their needs. And Ithink that's why there is plenty
of space for people to grow hereand to be here, and it's
collaborating so we can give themost high level education no
matter what segment they areserving. You know, from the
Matt Tesdall (31:15):
numbers that we see, only about 10% of the
property management companiesout there go to a conference of
the year. Yep, 10
Alex Husner (31:25):
I would believe that,
Unknown (31:27):
yeah, 90% I
Matt Tesdall (31:29):
mean, we have so much work to do that probably my
generation is not going tofinish at all after that,
because it's just we have suchan opportunity. That's why I
think we keep talking aboutcollaboration, innovation, all
that stuff, and that is thefoundation here in education. I
just think we have a long roadahead of us to bring everybody
(31:50):
together. Yeah,
Alex Husner (31:50):
we've been asked that question quite a bit on
some of the podcasts that Annieand I have been on, of like, you
know, what's the differencebetween a vacation rental versus
a short term rental? And avacation rental is a short term
rental, but a short term rentalisn't necessarily a vacation
rentals, kind of how we phrasethat rental back to people.
Because, I mean, really, youknow, the urban short term
rentals, it's, it really is adifferent business model, you
(32:12):
know, and for them, like, youknow, that they're not getting
for the most part, I mean, likethe the repeat business that
these vacation destinations get,it's, just that's not that's not
there, right? So for thosepeople to be trying to focus on,
you know, direct bookings andrepeat business like there,
sometimes I feel like people areselling them strategies that are
just never going to inherentlywork. But I do think that there
is more of an opportunity, noteven just looking at size of
(32:34):
property managers, but alsolocations and just different
types, and bringing more ofthose people into the fold. And
I will say, when we were at VRmay last fall, and then immen,
which was, I think, kind of aregood examples of VR may
obviously more vacation rentals,and immen is kind of more the
short term rentals. But saw acouple operators that I know out
of Ohio, that they went to both,and it was, you know, it was
(32:56):
nice to see that, that they juststarted going to conferences.
But they do fall more in that,you know, urban operator type of
a model, but that'll beinteresting to follow as we
continue moving forward.
Heidie Henriksen (33:06):
It seems like there's a lot of terms in this
industry that could use someclarification. On that note, out
between the ER and str and allof the different acronyms. And
some people call it a vacationmanagement company, and other
call it a property managementcompany. And trying to bring
some of that standardization tothe industry would be helpful. I
think for a lot of people,
Unknown (33:26):
we do love our acronyms. That is, that is one
thing that is for sure, I thinkthat you guys have started
exactly what Alex and I likewhen we started this podcast.
One of the things that we reallywanted to to hone in on, not be
so focused on just vacationrentals, but really kind of look
at the industry overall, becauseit was, kind of, it was
spreading, and it was growing indifferent areas. And so, you
(33:47):
know, we kind of cringe everytime we talk to somebody who's
like, oh yeah. Well, I was, youknow, getting my education from
this guy on YouTube who does,like, rental arbitrage, and, you
know, whatever. And so it'slike, oh gosh, we just, we have
to get all on the same page. ButI think there's an opportunity,
you know, that rising tide liftsall boats. I mean, I think that
we're, if we're workingtogether, we don't have
necessarily the same mission,but I think if we're all kind of
(34:07):
seeing from the same hymnal, soto speak, and like, here's what
your basics you should be, andthen it can, you know, it can
morph out from the from thedifferent markets. I think
that's it's at least a startingpoint. It just feels like we're
finally in a place where peopleare talking. And one thing that
came out of COVID that I feltlike we were all in agreement on
was we needed a unified voice.
But that never really kind ofcame together. So I applaud you
guys for really trying to getthat unification. I'll think
Anne Gardner (34:32):
something that that I saw Heidi and Matt is
news of your road show, and Ithought that was really
exciting. Talk about, we talkabout, how do we extend, right?
How do we bring, you know, noteveryone, we've had so much
conversation about conferencesand meetings and whatnot, but
And you talk about how few areactually attending, and so how
(34:52):
do we disperse and unify andelevate the industry and when
outside of those events and. Andso I'm I was super excited to
see about your road show. I'dlove to hear a little bit about
that and where you see thatgoing next. Because bringing the
content and bringing this to ouroperator communities, I think,
is, is super exciting, really.
Matt Tesdall (35:14):
Where the vision from this came in is a big
passion of mine when I becamePresident, that I want to go out
and I want to meet the peoplewhere they are. Not everybody
either has time or money orwhatever to be able to go to our
conferences in different states,but that's that's the goal,
right? But sometimes you got tobring it to them. And honestly,
I learned this from Amy haina,from the member the old VRM
(35:37):
Intel, and when she did one herein Portland area with this, some
vendors and herself, and it waslike 50 people, super simple
lunch and some some really goodbreakout sessions. And when I
talked to the board, I said,guys, this is what we need to
do. We need to be out, and weneed to bring it to multiple
areas of the country so thatsmaller operators, or even
(36:00):
larger operators, can just gettogether and we could, you know,
shake hands and kiss babies,let's say, I mean, just be
close. And that's, that's whereit came from. So this year, it
starts in Portland on March 11,at the Kennedy School. Anybody's
familiar with the West Coast,there's the McMinn brothers that
have done a great job takingthese old churches and schools,
(36:22):
whatnot, and turning them intothese fantastic venues. So this
is at the Kennedy School. Andthen our next one in Mays in
Florida, I think Heidi,
Unknown (36:32):
yeah, it's in Sarasota, Bradenton area, yep. And then
Matt Tesdall (36:36):
we're going to go to the Truckee Northern, you
know, Nevada, California, there.
And then I think, then theDenver or Telluride q3 is Brevig
q4 is
Heidie Henriksen (36:46):
Truckee Tahoe, get around the whole country,
including our conference inAustin. And like Matt said,
really focused on education. Wehave a series of tracks on
safety certifications, cleaningcertifications. It's all covered
by your VR nation membership.
And like Matt said, too, it'sgot lunch involved and bringing
in some local experts. We've gotthe Oregon restaurant Lodging
(37:06):
Association participating in ourPortland event. So talking about
some new house bills in theareas, how it could impact short
term rentals, so it really couldimpact the entire state. Really
excited to bring this to a morelocal level. Yeah,
Alex Husner (37:20):
I think that's great to do also, for for the
suppliers and your sponsors, forthem to be able to go out and
more, you know, reasonably froma cost perspective, be able to
get in front of managers,because it's, it's a lot of
money for them too. I mean, ifthey're going to a market
individually, to, you know, goand set meetings. And sometimes
it helps just when you're withother vendors that you have
relationships with, and you cankind of go at it together. So
(37:43):
that's that's gonna be reallycool to see it remind me of the
VR may connect. That's what Iwas just gonna say, yeah. What's
the future for that? Ann andJody? Do you think those will
come back at some point?
Jodi Refosco (37:52):
Yeah, I think they're gonna come back. I feel
like we had to, like, pull backeverything and kind of start
afresh, right? So I feel likethat we had to focus on, you
know, our major events, which,you know, we pulled back. We're
not doing European, we're justdoing the International, you
know, the spring event and theexecutive Summit. But I see the
connects coming. I thinkconnects have to be strategic,
(38:14):
of where you have them, and Ithink it's very important to
have really good boots on theground, like operators to help
out with that area. But I thinkit's smart to you to me take the
education content to ourmembers. It's very smart what
you guys are doing. But yeah, Isee it's coming back in the
future. Just we needed to startanew and kind of focus on what
was most important to ourmembers at the time. So
Unknown (38:36):
we wanted to ask a question about membership, just
from the two differentperspectives. What would you
what would you say? Each of yousay is the value proposition for
each organization? For anybodythat's listening and thinking,
like, Well, which one should Ibe? Should I do both? Should I
do one? You know, like, whatshould be the things that they
should consider when looking atboth of the associations? I
mean, for
Matt Tesdall (38:55):
me, I don't think it's, I don't think it's an
either, or it's not an either.
Or for me personally, so I thinkyou'd look at the International
Conference, whether it's inVegas or on the East Coast or
whatever, is fantastic. You haveeverybody there. It could be
daunting for some people whohave a hard time with super
large crowds, because it is big,but that is the benefit for me.
And just take, take my VRnation, head off for a minute,
(39:16):
and just me as a PM, so I bringmy team to those and then each
my team members, they have theirfocus, whether it's, you know,
an area manager for me orhousekeeping manager. They can
do their own meetings with theirown people, and they can with
their own vendors, and they canfind, you know, some new
products that are in there. Youlook at a VR nation, where you
mean, we both have education,clearly, maybe they like our
(39:42):
housekeeping Olympics, I don'tknow, but there's fun things
that we can do, verycollaborative and and very hands
on, and just, you know,definitely smaller than the
national conference, but veryimpactful. And so for me, it's
not either or, it's both. Yeah,
Jodi Refosco (39:58):
I probably go along same. Mind, you know, I
feel like there's like we allbelieve in education. We're all
believing in advocacy, right?
We're, you know, at VR May,right now, we're focusing on
advocacy. We're focusing on themembership and the content we're
giving to our members. We havethe VRP Council, which everybody
that knows VRP, it came in andmerged with VR may in 2019 2020
(40:22):
I think. And then, you know,we're working with the council
now, which my husband, well, youguys have Dirk. You know Dirk,
and my husband, Joe, has beenon, I think he was the president
of VRP for like, six or sevenyears. I was like, Don't you
have, like, a don't you go offat any time. Why are you the
president forever? But we mergedtogether, so the VHP is a big
(40:45):
thing for us. But no, I don'tthink it's either or either you
like, I think there's thingsthat you're going to find that
are that matter to you as amember. And, you know, I feel
like, just like I said, there's,there's going to be a lot of
different associations to join,and you got to pick what you
think feel that vibes best withyou. And you know, VR, Ma, yes,
(41:06):
we've been around. This is our40th year, which, when I say
I've been in business 25 years,I've been in part of VR may for
that long because, like, I waslike, the college kid that went
along with my parents to theconferences and so like, yeah,
we've been around forever. Butthat also means we have to learn
(41:26):
to pivot and move and change andfight, because our members are
moving. So I think it's, I don'tknow, I think it's not an either
or. I think is, you know, hey,you're gonna have to find who
vibes best with you. And youknow, you try, we're all
educating, and we're all goingto bring some different aspects
to the game. So I think youshould check us along. I love
Unknown (41:48):
that, and I agree with you. I just was curious to see
if there was anydifferentiators. And so if
somebody wants to join, couldthey get a deal to join both?
Oh, so
Jodi Refosco (41:58):
those are conversations to be happy. I
Unknown (42:02):
mean, I'm on the membership committee for vrma,
so, like, I'm thinking, like,how do we, how do we, like,
Corley, this into somethingbigger and, like, help everybody
out, right?
Jodi Refosco (42:10):
So it's interesting. Like, that was
something so go back to Michelleacavela, back in the day, that
was something that we've triedto do. Like, if you're a member
of a local Alliance, like NC, VRMay, or northeast VR mayor, or
whatever it'd be. How do you Howcan you make it membership? I
think at the time, logistics wasdifficult, and it just didn't
(42:32):
make sense. There's other waysto go about it. Like, I've
talked to Anne about, like,well, like, Wouldn't it be cool
to have like, you know, VRnations, or Amy high note, or
whoever, come in and do asession at one of our
conferences and vice versa, likewe're, yeah, but as far as
membership, I don't know. Ithink there is logistics there,
but it is something that's beentalked about for like, a decade.
(42:55):
So yeah, it's, I'm sure there'sways to work something out.
Unknown (42:58):
Well, let's throw it out in the universe and make it
Ann and Heidi. It also applies
Heidie Henriksen (43:04):
on the vendor side, right? There's a lot of
vendors out there thinking, whoshould I support? Well, it's not
an either or. It should be aboth. We've had a lot of vendors
come our way. Have beenincredibly supportive, which is
fantastic, and they're 100%backing the RMA as well. And
while our board of directors isall vacation rental management
company owners, we have sixadvisory boards that are
(43:27):
comprised of individuals fromall over the industry, vendors,
property managers, individualhosts, thought leaders. So we're
trying to bring everybodytogether in that sense, and have
a common voice on how weapproach the industry, what we
do with the Association, butthere's definitely, there's room
for the vendors to participateon both sides. I completely
agree there. Yeah,
Alex Husner (43:47):
I think there's a ton of power, and just the whole
mindset there of it's not, orit's and, and, you know, what
does that mean? We always talkabout collaboration over
competition, but collaborationand competition like it's not or
for it, for for any of these soI love that, and I think this is
something that's been neededwithin our industry for a long
(44:07):
time. So it's, it's superexciting to see it in front of
us and and see how this is goingto play out this year.
Anne Gardner (44:14):
Well, absolutely.
I mean, I think that it's, it'sa great opportunity for us to
look at how we are able to serveour industry and in those
supportive ways. And part ofthis is, even if we're offering
a similar program, you know,everyone has their own way of
doing it, right. And so, youknow, just look at the
differentiation within ouroperators and our companies. And
(44:37):
so it's, it's always a differentflavor and an opportunity to
improve and enhance and buildupon what we all have done and
say, you know, I personally amreally invigorated and inspired
by what you know our colleaguesare doing with VR nation. And I
think it just, it just helpssharpen everyone. Yeah, and
(44:58):
brings us all forward. And so Ifind it invigorating and
stimulating, and can't wait tosee how things develop for us
both. Iron
Matt Tesdall (45:09):
sharpens iron
Alex Husner (45:10):
Exactly. It's not a good one, too. Yeah, very cool,
Heidie Henriksen (45:14):
you know. And heart and soul of this industry,
I feel, is your biggestcompetitor taking you over to
meet the lead that you've beentrying to get in touch with for
the last six months, right? Weare all in this to put together,
to get ahead, and it's not anall for one mentality. So
Unknown (45:31):
co opetition, as we always say on the show, it's co
opetition,
Alex Husner (45:35):
yeah, exactly.
Well, super awesome having youguys here today, and we can't
wait to be in attendance atthese shows this spring. I know,
personally, I'll be at VR nationand the VR may executive Summit.
And Annie, you're going to VRnation. Awesome. Well, we can't
wait to hear how it goes afterafter all of them, and maybe
we'll do a recap before we gointo the fall to hear how
(45:56):
everything went. But thank youguys so much, and we appreciate
everything that you do for theindustry and just your true
passion towards just helpingout, because this, this is not
an easy job that any of youhave, and not even your main
job, except for maybe Anne orAnne. Heidi, are you full time
too? Heidi, I am. Yes. You areokay, so you guys do, but yeah,
(46:17):
awesome. Well, if anybody wantsto reach out, we're going to put
your contact information in theshow notes. Just be easier to do
that. But if anyone wants to getin touch with Annie and I, you
can go to Alex and Anniepodcast.com and until next time,
thanks for tuning in, everybody.
Unknown (46:42):
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