November 13, 2023 • 34 mins
The Army investigated, arrested, and tried to break LT. Col. Jason G. Pike. Since the age of seven, he has refused to be defined by his early learning disability diagnosis and instead bravely forged his path toward success. Jason's journey is chronicled in his National Best Selling Book, Soldier Against All Odds.
In this episode, we will delve into his book, his life journey, and how he turned his experiences into a platform to inspire and encourage others. Jason's story reaffirms that one can defy expectations and achieve the unimaginable with determination and perseverance.
Soldier Against All Odds is a beacon of hope and inspiration for anyone grappling with similar adversities. Jason's remarkable story is a striking example of how self-belief and tenacity can genuinely transform lives.
So, let's enjoy his story.
To connect with Jason: https://www.jasonpike.org/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Daniela SM (00:08):
Hi, I'm Daniela.
Welcome to my podcast, becauseeveryone has a story, the place
to give ordinary people, stories, the chance to be shared and
preserved.
Our stories become the languageof connections.
Let's enjoy it, connect andrelate, because everyone has a
story.
Welcome, my guest is Lt.
(00:33):
Col Jason Pike.
From age seven, jason has showneveryone that he can succeed
despite the odds.
He refused to let hisshortcomings define him and made
his way in life.
Here is his journey, equallyrepresented by success and
struggle.
He pushed onwards with astunning refusal to quit.
(00:57):
His greed, resilience andremarkable vulnerability shine
through.
I had a great time meetingJason.
He was energetic, in full speed, and the conversation was the
life of.
I would have not met him if itwasn't for the podcast, so let's
enjoy Jason's story.
Welcome, jason, to the show.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (01:16):
Hey, well , thank you very much.
I appreciate being here.
I got a book out I can shareyou some stories.
Daniela SM (01:21):
Yes, and why do you want to share your story?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (01:24):
Because everyone said that I probably
couldn't make it in the militaryor in education or any type of
profession, and they had goodreason to believe that.
And so my story is one ofinspiration, hope and survival,
a refusal to quit that was sortof handed down to me from my
father and that's why I wantedto share it, yeah.
Daniela SM (01:47):
Yes, and I appreciate it.
When I met you for a pre-chat,it was quite inspiring to listen
to you and your energy, so I'mglad you're here.
So, jason, tell me, when doesyour story start?
It starts when.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (02:00):
I'm about eight or nine years old when I
well, seven years old when Ifailed the first grade, I was
diagnosed very early with alearning disability, meaning
just understanding reading andwriting are very difficult even
now.
Oh, by the way, I'm an author,go figure that one out.
But really that's true and itwas that was the first time they
(02:21):
identified it as a professionaleducational psychologist.
So I had two more times as anadult life, even after college
education, where professionallymost of your viewers and
yourself, I'm sure, can do much,much better on any standardized
test than I can, and so, though, I've got three college degrees
(02:42):
that started at age seven.
I was not expected to really domuch, except maybe do manual
labor.
There was not a whole lot ofexpectations that were put
placed upon me.
That's kind of where it went.
That's where it started, thestory started.
Daniela SM (02:55):
So at age seven, when they told you that you had
a learning disability, did itmake you feel bad?
Were you already thinking thatyou were never going to make
anything or it didn't matter toyou at that age?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (03:05):
At that age I'm just looking at friends.
I failed the first grade and soI had to repeat the first grade
because of English and readingand writing.
So to me I just said well, Iguess I'm different, maybe not
in a good way, but it wasn'treally.
It was more like I was missingmy friends that went on to the
next class.
The parents were probably moredisappointed than I was, but
(03:26):
they didn't show it, they didn'tlabel me.
I just kind of knew thatacademics were probably not
going to be in the cards, andthat's the way I pretty much
looked at academics of any type,of any sort, all the way up to
the until I graduated from highschool.
Daniela SM (03:40):
And so what happened ?
You didn't repeat any more, anymore years, only the first
grade.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (03:45):
No, I just sort of got along.
I was not in any collegepreparatory classes and even the
high school counselor told methat any type of higher
education would not be in thecards for me.
That was well known.
But I joined the military, theNational Guard, a reserve force
out of South Carolina.
From there my career sort ofstarted to change.
(04:06):
I went into a criminalcorrectional facility in Fort
Silla, oklahoma, in 1983,because I couldn't get my stuff
together.
I wasn't able to drink thewater coming out of the fire
hose and basic training that'sthe initial training that I had.
And so what happened was theysent me through a different
level of hill in that facilityfor about four hours and I
(04:26):
decided at that point that Icould probably do anything,
regardless of what people say.
I come out of basic trainingbecause I did make it, barely
barely made it.
I finished up my high schoolyear and I decided that I was
going to go to a junior college.
A junior, it's a communitycollege where you start from the
basics, and I figured that Icould do more than I thought or
(04:50):
other people thought, because Ihad been through a different
level of hell that I've neverbeen through in the military or
because of the.
I went to a special facilitybecause I was one of the worst
privates and I came out of theremaybe wired too tight or what
have you I decided I was goingto college and I was going to
stay in the military and that'seventually what I did.
(05:10):
I eventually went on to getthree different.
I got a bachelor's and twomaster's degrees.
Eventually I did become asenior military officer but I
decided I could do a whole lotmore from thing I went through
and the very initial stages ofthe military.
Daniela SM (05:24):
Jason, can you explain a little bit more what
happened when you said that youcouldn't drink out of the fire
hose?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (05:30):
In basic training they tell you to do
many things very fast.
Do this, do that.
There's acronyms.
You have to learn things veryquickly or you're not going to
adapt, like everyone else was.
I was not able to adapt to theinitial parts of the military in
the very beginning.
What the drill sergeant did?
The sergeant in charge he sentme and another soldier that
(05:52):
wanted they wanted to break us,wanted to either kick us out or
break us.
One guy did break and we gotout.
I stayed in the military and Istayed in and graduated from the
basic training.
This criminal correctionalfacility was not meant for
criminals.
It was a motivational program,kind of like a drug deal.
It wasn't probably legal forthem to do that.
(06:13):
What they did is they sent usthere to either break us or make
us in the military as amotivational technique a
different level of hell than Iwas in already, which was pretty
bad.
We made big rocks into smallrocks.
We climbed over obstaclecourses until our hands and our
arms and our legs were bloodiedand broken.
(06:35):
I'm saying the uniforms werebroken and torn and blood coming
out.
So we went through a whole lotof screaming and yelling
constantly for four hours.
It was sort of a scaredstraight type of a program.
I came out of there, I didn'tbreak, I stayed in and
eventually I was able tograduate from the basic training
(06:55):
.
But that experience, which wasonly about four hours, and then
just graduating from the initialbasic training, which was three
months, I thought that I couldprobably do a whole lot more.
Sometimes, when you go to helland come back, you feel that
even though you think you can doa little bit more, it's kind of
like don't break you, make youstronger thing, and that's kind
(07:15):
of what happened with me.
Daniela SM (07:17):
And what went through your brain to not break
and keep strong.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (07:23):
Well, at that time I thought I was being
kicked out of the military.
At that time I thought I wasgoing into criminal correctional
facility for good, to beprocessed out or to go to a jail
or to go to a further on.
At the time there was nointernet, there's no cell phones
.
We don't know.
We just know that we done badthings because we can't do what
(07:44):
the drill sergeant told us to do.
That's what I thought.
When I look back in hindsight,it was more of a motivational
technique for us and also theentire platoon, because he
threatened everybody else.
Once we came back we were sortof guinea pigs and you're
setting examples of guinea pigs.
When we came back to theplatoon we were all bloodied up,
(08:07):
broken up, looking like hell,and then he had the platoon go
look at us and he says if any ofyou don't do what I tell you to
do, you're going to go to thatfacility.
So he scared the entire platoonas well, because he was
threatening them that they wouldgo to the facility.
But no one else did that.
I know of just me and thatother guy.
That's where I got the initialconcept of thinking I can do a
(08:32):
whole lot more than what myadvice, high school and other
people say that I could do.
It was at that point, it wasforming in my mind right there.
Daniela SM (08:41):
Okay, your challenges didn't face you.
You just thought I am strong, Ican continue.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (08:47):
Yeah, I just said I can strong, I can
continue, get other people'shelp if I need help and just
keep on going and just notquitting was basically what it
was.
I think maybe I don't know thedrill sergeant probably saw that
I was doing the best I couldand I wasn't giving up.
Who knows, he may have given mea few breaks, I don't know, but
(09:07):
he knew that I was doing thebest I could and I wasn't going
to quit.
I did keep working at things,whether it be putting my weapons
together, practicing, whatevertask I had.
I would do that and he wouldsee that, and so he knew that I
was doing my best and wasn'tgoofing off at all.
I think that's probably whatset me up to graduate from there
.
Daniela SM (09:27):
And when you graduate from there, you kept in
the military, of course, andthen you went to different
college.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (09:32):
I stayed in the reserve forces for a
while.
I stayed as National Guard.
We were the less than best.
I did everything from thebottom, whether it be from a
private or whether fromacademics or even from the
military.
I was an active duty in thebeginning.
I was National Guard.
A good question some people haveasked me is there's entrance
tests to the military.
(09:52):
How did you pass your entrancetest?
If I have a learning disability, that's a good question.
I don't know.
I don't know how I did that.
That's a good question.
I don't know the answer.
Probably shouldn't pass anytype of standardized test
because I know I don't pass.
I know I took the entrance testto the college twice and I know
I was really low.
But I come back from thatfacility and I finish up my 12th
(10:15):
grade year of high school.
I had failed the first grade,so I was a year older.
I did that between my juniorand senior year of high school.
I decided then I was going todo my best I could on my last
year and then try to enter intoa community college and then go
to ROTC eventually and become anofficer.
(10:36):
That's what I did.
I went to a community collegeand it was a junior college that
forgave any type of problemsthat you might have and they
just allowed you in.
That was really no type of.
And then I went into a juniorcollege and transferred to
Clemson University, which is amore reputable college, and I
(10:56):
got out of there Not inengineering and I didn't do it,
didn't do it very quickly, I didit in educational.
It was an educational degree,nothing very difficult and it
was on the five-year plan.
I went through ROTC now ROTC,reserve officer training Corps.
That was much, much easier thanThen then then getting the
(11:16):
education because I'd alreadybeen enlisted, I'd already been
through a lot of training and soROTC was very easy for me.
It was just getting the goingto and getting the basics in the
classes and getting the collegedegree.
The reason you need a collegedegree is because I was one.
Becoming officer, I felt that Icould do more.
I did become an officer.
I did get my college degree alittle bit took, took me a
(11:39):
little bit longer, but I did.
I mean and that's where itstarts on as an officer and then
I eventually went on to activeduty.
So but you said also that youhave two masters.
I have two masters degree.
I got one masters at ClintonUniversity and I got another
masters at Colorado StateUniversity Later on, maybe like
ten years later.
So I was an officer at thistime, with the first one with
(12:00):
the National Guard and then thesecond one with the active duty.
So what I learned eventually isif you've got a learning problem
, like I do, you can get extratime for the test or Extra time
for any type of test.
I didn't know that.
But if you get an educationalpsychologist to write down that
you've got issues learning andreading and writing or you're
slow or what have you, they canget give you more Attention or
(12:23):
give you more time.
I had to have extra time.
I had to study extra, but thenI also had to have extra time to
process and then once I hadthat extra time, I did on
average just about as good assomeone who had prepared.
That was normal or just youknow.
So that helped me out a lot andI did that.
I use that eventually as atechnique to get through various
(12:44):
tests and things.
Daniela SM (12:45):
And you wanted to do the masters because you will
move up in ranks on the militarymove up.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (12:50):
Yeah, just like any professional, I
was really thinking I might wantto break out of this disability
, whatever they call it.
I said no, I couldn't break outof it, I couldn't just run
through it, because it's justwho you are.
You can't break it, you can'tfight it.
You've just got a manageraround it, and that took me a
while to figure that out, butit's a management technique.
(13:11):
It's not necessarily you can'tjust scrape it away from your,
your, your skull or somethingand say it's gone.
That's because it's just whoyou are and you manage around it
.
And I eventually did that andlearned how to do that very well
, not just with education, butwith many other things in life.
Daniela SM (13:27):
But so you went through all these years knowing
that there was somethingDifferent from you.
However, you didn't have theknowledge or the assistance or
the support to learn more.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (13:38):
No, not really.
For the most part I didn't talkabout it.
I never wanted to say anything.
I was ashamed about it.
I was ashamed just to go to thejunior college.
Because I was different.
I knew that I process thingsdifferently.
Some people call it a littlebit form of autism.
Some people call it a littleform of Asperger syndrome.
I don't know.
I don't know what the thing is.
(13:58):
Could some people have saiddyslexia?
I just know that processing isslow.
I have a higher creativitylevel Well, creativity because I
have to have something, so I'mpretty creative with things, how
to manage things or how tomanage around situations.
However, to accomplish the jobit did cause me trouble,
especially in my younger years,on behavior.
(14:18):
I've been arrested a few times,but I've got out of these
situations and just kept ongoing Because I thought that I
was untouchable.
In the very beginning I saidthey told me I couldn't get a
college degree.
They told me, and I did allthese things and I thought that
I could do anything and I wassort of above the law in many
ways.
But that's not true.
You can have confidence but youcan't have too much like you're
(14:38):
above everything, and so I hadto get myself knocked down a few
times to go on further.
A lot of these stories in thisbook A Soldier Against All Odds
are just really unbelievablestories when I don't think a lot
of people would have stayed.
I went through driving under theinfluence charges which we know
in the military.
You're out of here.
(14:59):
That was a second time.
I almost got kicked out Talkedabout the first time a DUI.
I learned how to go through anappeal process and I got out of
that.
When I'm saying I'm, when I sayI got out of it, that doesn't
mean that it didn't affect me.
It took two years to do it.
Conventional wisdom is you'renot going to survive anything
like drugs or alcohol issues atall, because the military is
(15:22):
much more strict than thecivilian sector.
The military they have a higherstandard.
I went through a two-yearappeal process.
That that may not sound thatspecial to you, but in the
military it is.
Most people do not survive thatI had to go through two years
of showing that I have theability and the strength and the
you know, the knowledge tocontinue on with my career and
(15:44):
that most people would just giveup on that process.
Daniela SM (15:46):
Jason, you were in a roller coaster of feeling I can
do it, I got a college, I canget in here, and then sometimes
you made a mistake Due to yourbehavior, and then you get into
real trouble.
Then you feel really low.
Your colleagues didn't help youbecause perhaps you they bully
you.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (16:04):
So it was constantly up and downs,
constantly up and downs and thebullying was pretty much behind
your back type of thing.
But for the most part, yeah,did they know I was different?
Oh, yeah, there was someassignments I did well and when
I was not managed, yeah.
But yeah, there was a rollercoaster ride.
It was ups and downs, wickedups and downs.
My colleagues, my peers, I sortof looked at me.
(16:27):
Well, you know, I don't know,there was a few of them that
said I'm okay, but I think yougot it right as far as they
looked at me a littledifferently, when I was placed
in charge of troops or soldiers,I did pretty well.
I thought I did very well as acommander or if I had any type
of authority.
I knew how to take care ofsoldiers.
I was very compassionate tothem, empathetic with them maybe
(16:47):
a little bit too much and so,but I did do that.
I did take care of my sergeantsand things of that nature.
So I did play a good role as amanager or a leader.
Now other assignments staffofficer assignments, things of
that nature I didn't do too wellin, but they're just really
dependent on the job.
And if I was left alone, likeyou are when you're a leader or
(17:10):
a commander, and I allowed mytroops to help take care of me
which I need to take care of Idid really well and then I could
take care of them in my own way.
But when I was micromanaged orsort of directed to do things, I
didn't do too well.
It really depended on thesituation and there were many
different situations in themilitary because every two to
three years we moved to adifferent place.
(17:31):
Even though we're in the army,we have to deal with different
people and different littlethings across the spectrum of
the military.
Daniela SM (17:38):
So you are very adaptable, for sure.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (17:40):
I'm pretty adaptable.
We have to be.
Yeah, I've lived nine yearsoverseas in five different
countries, so I've got 31 yearsin the military.
Pretty much eat every type offood that there is.
Yeah, I'm pretty adaptable.
Daniela SM (17:52):
Okay, so you finished your studies and you
were going around the world.
Then what happened?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (17:57):
Well, I did 31 years and what happened
was at the end of my 31 years mymother was dying and I wanted
to write a book.
I just had it had been naggingon me, these crazy stories that
are in this book.
I didn't know how to write abook.
I didn't know anybody who wrotea book before.
I didn't know how I was gonnawrite a book and after she died
(18:18):
I started talking about it withthe family.
My sister didn't.
I don't think she wanted.
She didn't want me to.
She didn't want me to writeabout it.
But let's see, if you write abook, a memoir, you had to be
honest with yourself andeventually I got a ghostwriter.
I went through Upwork website.
I just was playing around.
I put a description out on whatI wanted to do.
I went through about a threeyear process of writing this
(18:39):
book, which was painful, verypainful, put me in the hospital.
I almost died because of thisbook.
The flashbacks and the memoriesjust, really just stressed me
out and I was sitting in a chairfor a long hour stressing.
Blood clots started to form inmy lungs and my legs from the
sitting.
The doctors thought that I wasa smoker.
(19:01):
Just been a drinker, not asmoker.
He says well, you're gonnapretty much die.
You not only do, you got bloodclots in your legs and lungs,
you've also got pneumonia.
I was in the ICU for three daysand it was because of this book
.
It's in the first page of thetestimony.
You'll see the details therethat where I was scheduled to
die, I reacted really well tothe heparin blood thinner and
(19:23):
the antibiotics.
I eventually got out of therein five days.
But no, it was because of thisbook.
It was a stress.
I've only had one or twoanxiety attacks after that.
But the ICU, the blood clots,that was the big one.
That's where I was sitting downtoo long.
I changed my behavior to whereI'm sitting now, but most of the
time I stand.
This book, like any life, theway this thing, I had my ghost
(19:47):
writer.
He wanted to.
You gotta show the dirt.
You gotta show yourvulnerability.
I did not grow up showingvulnerability.
The weaknesses that I have,that you'll see in here.
All the details of a life.
A life is gonna be dirty.
See, this memoir is a littledifferent than most, because I'm
not gonna tell you that Iconquered Afghanistan or did all
these great and I did goodthings and I had a lot of years,
(20:09):
I got a lot of awards, I've gota lot of degrees, but what I'm
saying is this book comes tocross.
Think of a senior managerthat's in an organization or the
Army and military telling youall their weaknesses and what
they've done that are foul upsand screw ups and things of that
nature.
I'm not perfect.
I had a whole lot of issues anda lot of, a lot of problems
(20:29):
along the way and this is how Iovercame them and these are the
little ways.
It's humor, but it's true humor, of how all these stupid things
, theascos, failures thatoccurred and how I got around
them and how I got through them.
So the a lot of military, bigmilitary men will say I did this
and did this and did this, Ihave a wonderful family and all
(20:50):
that about it and I'm gonna showyou.
Hey, this is how I came alongand I ain't that perfect at all
and you and you'll maybeidentify, or somebody will maybe
draw some lessons out there.
Daniela SM (21:01):
Even though that you were feeling ill and you nearly
die, you still thought thatthis was kind of like a
cathartic, or you just wanted totell your story.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (21:09):
Oh, I just wanted to tell my story.
Something that I had that wasnagging on me, sort of like a
passion that you have thatovertakes you, almost like an
obsession, and I said I got todo it.
I never quit anything, so if Iquit this I'm gonna really look
bad.
I wanted my father to write astory.
This is about him and me, butI'm telling you my story through
him.
I tell a little bit about myfather, yeah, and so I thought I
(21:32):
got to do this thing.
I understand that reading andwriting are my worst subjects,
so that stressed me out too, butI had I did have help, a lot of
anxiety of Lots of issues, dirt.
I was sitting down.
I wasn't exercising like I usedto.
That's what also formed theblood plot.
Daniela SM (21:49):
I see, I see Sounds fascinating and I love that you
took that approach.
So I guess you telling thestory like that now you are free
from all your guilt or whateveryou were feeling before- it was
the hardest, probably thehardest long-term project I've
ever done in my life.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (22:07):
I've been through a whole lot of things.
I would rather go toAfghanistan, I'd rather go to
war than have to do another bookagain.
I don't, but it's done now, soit's done.
Daniela SM (22:18):
Wow, that's incredible.
Well, I find it superinteresting and, of course, we
have to read your book.
So the book took three years,and then what happened when he
came out?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (22:28):
Oh gosh, they told me to do podcasts.
Since I met you back in March,I've done over 25 podcasts and
I've gotten the word out.
It's become a number onebestseller according to Amazon
and the the statistics of whatthey do it.
And now we're we're working ona second book, but I it's gonna
be about how to get yourveterans benefits.
It's a self-help guide.
We got examples of how to dothat, but I'm not gonna kill
(22:51):
myself on this one.
I guarantee you that.
And see this one a soldieragainst all odds right here.
This was the one I'm nearlydied on, so the other one we're
working on is gonna be not asintense.
It's not gonna be as crazy asthis one.
Daniela SM (23:04):
Wow, that's incredible, jason.
I love that you are heretelling your story.
Colleagues, read the book toyour family.
What about your sister?
What do they say about the?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (23:13):
book.
Sister and brother Don't say adamn thing to me.
I think they want to staysilent.
It's see, this is my story.
I'm telling it from myperspective.
We didn't grow up to be outthere.
We're more like a restrictedfamily when we grew up, and even
in the military, you don't sayyour vulnerabilities, and so now
I want to tell the stories out,and so my mother and my father
(23:34):
passed away, so I thought thatit would be a good time after
that.
Now my colleagues a lot of themare either Admiring me very,
very much or they're like alittle bit over here at distance
, but most of them have admiredme.
If you just look at the reviews, you're gonna see a whole lot
of colleagues that have comeonline on Amazon and that's
where it's at.
It's on Amazon.
(23:54):
It's on Jason backorg.
You'll see the reviews over ahundred reviews and a lot of
them are my soldiers.
Or are there colleagues thatI've worked with around over the
years?
Daniela SM (24:04):
Looking back and all the things that you have shared
today.
You have achieved so muchcompared with other people.
Maybe maybe other people gotmedals for being number one and
whatever, but you have doneagainst the odds, how you said,
and also you have done thingsthat are out of the ordinary For
people like you.
You know, in the militarypeople are no vulnerable like
(24:25):
you say.
Yeah, we're not vulnerable,we're.
I didn't grow up in a familythat was vulnerable the military
is.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (24:30):
We do not show our weaknesses, we don't
show our vulnerability.
I grew up with storytellingDon't tell me what a plural and
noun is or things of that nature, I don't know but I understand
storytelling and so I wanted toalways tell this story.
My dad was a great storyteller,so I thought that I could try
to work off him and I have ahave a book that's meant in our
(24:51):
memories At least in my familymemories and that'll be out
there.
It's always been something thatit's kind of what a bucket list
.
It's a big, big bucket listthat's gone.
You know getting this out andyou know Giving a little bit
inspiration and hope to otherfolks.
Yeah, you, I've always feltthat I was blessed in some way,
sometimes only one or two timescursed, but I thought I was
(25:12):
blessed most of the time becauseI wasn't supposed to do this.
I wasn't supposed to graduatecollege, I was not supposed to
go and achieve these ranks andall the ribbons that you'll see.
This was not in the cards,according to the experts, and I
defied the experts, and so oncethese things kept going on
throughout my life.
You know you talked about thatroller coaster and every time I
(25:34):
went up.
I went down, went up, I thought, wow, I didn't like the crazy
roller coaster ride.
I mean, I wish I could benormal.
My mother always said, son, whycan't you be normal like
everyone else?
I said, well, I don't know howto be, I just know how to be me.
And she walked away mad at me.
But no, and I did, wish I was alittle bit more normal, without
all the ups and downs, causeeverybody else, you know
(25:57):
everybody has ups and downs, butwhy does mine have to be so
down?
I just said that's just the waylife is gonna be, apparently.
Daniela SM (26:04):
I like your answer that I just don't know how to be
normal.
I know how to be me.
That's pretty good.
Exactly so, jason, after 31years of being in the military
and you decided to leave, howwas that feeling?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (26:17):
Oh, I was burned out.
I had post traumatic stresssyndrome.
I had been through so much, Ihad been totally drained and
exhausted.
I was burned out afterAfghanistan.
Then I took a Germany.
I retired out of Germany.
It took two years over there.
Didn't really do a whole lotover there, I just tried to ride
my time out.
Then I just sought medical help,A lot of mental health therapy,
things of that nature, andtried to get back into the
(26:40):
workforce eventually.
But I wanted to just focus onmy mental post-traumatic stress
and things of that nature and Idid.
And then I eventually got intoa federal position with the
Centers for Disease Control.
I did that for a few years andthen I went ahead and published
the book.
When I published the book Iquit the federal force, the
Centers for Disease Control,because I wanted to focus on the
(27:01):
book, the podcasting and theexpression of the book.
But yeah, that's kind of howthis thing has been since
retirement.
Retirement was a transition,was a problem because you've
been moving around, You've beengoing up the ladder.
Disassignment, that'sassignment, and then now all
they're ever known was my battlefatigue.
I don't even know how to dress.
I would just put on one uniformall my life and now I have to
(27:24):
dress.
So you have to adapt to adifferent type of environment
than you're used to.
Daniela SM (27:29):
Yes, and you're full of energy, as I can see from
looking at you.
So what do you do?
All day you can be sitting onlyon podcasts.
I'm sure you have to channelyour energy.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (27:38):
This morning I did wind sprints for
about 50 minutes and then I wentto a sauna.
One of my therapy sessions isgo from a sauna to an ice bath
and when I'm in the sauna I dosit-ups and sit-ups.
But no, I do have a lot ofenergy.
I try to find ways to get thisenergy out every day.
I'm 57 years old.
Physical fitness is a big partof me.
(27:59):
It has always been because Iwas in the military.
Daniela SM (28:02):
OK, you do sit-ups on a sauna.
Sauna, yeah, I do sit-ups inthe sauna.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (28:06):
And what I want to do is get really hot
and sweaty.
And then I get out of there andI jump into an ice bath and
then I start to shiver.
And then I'll go back to thesauna, get really hot and sweaty
and go back to the ice bath andget shivery.
That really does a whole lot tome.
It makes me feel calmerafterwards.
Daniela SM (28:22):
And how long do you stay in the water?
Five minutes, ok.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (28:25):
Usually to a point of shivering.
Daniela SM (28:27):
But you're always traveling, so how do you manage
to find a sauna and a coldplunge?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (28:32):
I was in Korea for six years.
So if you go to a city such asAtlanta, houston and Dallas some
of the bigger cities they'llhave these Korean saunas and
that's where you're going tofind them.
But you'll have to GoogleKorean saunas In San Antonio,
texas that's where I live at.
They've got a evolved humantherapy and they've got one
there.
It's a new thing and I learnedabout this over in Korea years
(28:55):
ago because I used to go out.
I lived out in the villages inKorea, and in Korea they have
these things, these saunas andthese ice baths.
These are just facilities allover the place, and so now I
find ways when I'm traveling tofind them.
And if I can't find that, I canalways get a sauna at a gym and
then just use a cold shower.
Daniela SM (29:16):
I see Interesting.
Thank you for sharing that.
And, Jason, through your timewhile you were having soldiers,
did you meet people that werelike you and how do you treat
them Well?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (29:29):
as a commander, I was always very
compassionate and empathetictowards everybody's special
needs or things of that naturemaybe too much so.
I was really good as acommander or as a leader, as a
father or someone who leads orsomeone who can show the way or
the light to kids or youngerfolks.
I was always good with that.
There was just other situationswhere they gave me the details
(29:51):
and tried to tell me what to doon the details, like if you were
to tell me to fill out aspreadsheet or to do this, it
would take a whole lot moreenergy from me and brain power
than it would be an averageperson Like, for example, when I
was in the Centers for DiseaseControl, I had help.
I had a nephew and a niece whowould come online and help me
out a little bit, filling outthings and things that I don't
(30:12):
know.
I learned how to get help.
I learned creative ways aroundthings, especially if I had to
do them.
That's what's difficult is forme to do the details.
Daniela SM (30:23):
Jason, and you are not even a bit curious to know
what you're learning?
Lt Col. Jason G. (30:27):
disabilities- Not really.
I'm pretty much.
Because I've lived through itso long.
I have been identified threedifferent times as someone who's
just a slow learner.
My processing mechanism is much, much slower.
I think that's the best way youcan probably diagnose it.
Those folks who have diagnosedit just means I just take a lot,
(30:47):
a lot, a lot more time to do atask which in the military or in
life you can't.
You don't have a lot of time,but I can compensate around that
If I get other people's help orI do other things.
Then that's how I foundcreative ways to get around this
.
Daniela SM (31:06):
Well, obviously you have weaknesses, but your
strengths are definitely empathyand compassion that perhaps
other people didn't have it.
That's your talent.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (31:17):
Yeah, I'm a very good commander of
empathy and talent.
The competition and thebackstabbing that occurred in
any organization I was not goodwith, because everything's
competitive as you move up aladder, whether you're in the
executive branches or whatever.
They look at me as they cantell that maybe I'm not at their
standard and then thereforethere's I could be a possible
(31:39):
easy pushover.
That's part of the things Inever did like.
But give me some soldiers, giveme a commander.
What have you and I do betterthan they are probably because
there's a lot of brutal, brutal,unsympathetic commanders and
people out there who treat theirsoldiers really, really bad.
Daniela SM (31:56):
Well, I am glad to hear that you were the good
leader, Jason.
I think it is incredible thatyou managed to remember all
these details and put ittogether in one book.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (32:05):
Well, what it was.
It was somebody who wasinterviewing me just like you're
interviewing me over and overand over again, sometimes on the
same subject over a period ofyears, and it was squeezing the
lemon out of the juice and hewas writing it down, writing it
down, typing, or he wasrecording it and then typing it,
and then he got it all.
He threw some stuff out thatweren't relevant and it was just
(32:27):
a long, painful process.
This is all it was.
It's not like I remembered allthis stuff.
I went through a squeezing overa period of years to get this
stuff out.
That's a story of its own.
And I went through the audiobook.
I'm the person, I'm thenarrator.
Someone says, well, if you'regoing to do a book, you ought to
do an audio book.
I said, okay, when I did theaudio book, when I started
reading through the manuscript,I came up with more stories.
(32:50):
I remembered those things.
So when I thought it was over,it was not over.
I thought, wow.
And then my ghostwriter sayswhen that stuff happens to you,
just keep on talking.
Whatever it is what comes toyour mind that you remember at
that moment, because I can'twrite too well, just go ahead
and speak it into the systemthere and then I'll capture it
now and that's how we wentthrough that.
(33:10):
But that was by accident, itwasn't planned, and we got a lot
more juice out of these storiesby going through me doing the
narrating part of the audio.
Daniela SM (33:19):
I think it's wonderful that you are narrating
it, because that makes the bookso much more fun to listen to.
So, Jason, I am.
It is incredible how proud youare of the product of your book
and all your life.
So I am excited that you arehere and that you were able to
share all these.
I'm grateful for that becauseyour energy and your willingness
(33:44):
to go against all the odds itis amazing and inspiring.
So thank you so much forsharing.
Well, thank you very much forhaving me.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (33:52):
Yes, you can find the book Soldier
Against All Odds on Amazon.
Put it in your browser ASoldier Against All Odds and
you'll see a many, many podcaststoo many podcasts, I think and
then you'll see the descriptionin my website, jasonpikeorg.
Jasonpikeorg, yeah, Iappreciate your support and your
(34:12):
willingness to interview me.
Daniela SM (34:14):
Yes, no, it has been a pleasure and thank you for
the gift of getting to meet youAll right.
I hope you enjoyed today'sepisode I am Daniela and you
were listening to, becauseEveryone has a Story.
Please take five seconds rightnow and think of somebody in
your life that may enjoy whatyou just heard, or someone that
has a story to be shared andpreserved.
(34:35):
When you think of that person,shoot them a text with the link
of this podcast.
This will allow the ordinarymagic to go further.
Join me next time for anotherstory conversation.
Thank you for listening.
Hasta pronto.
Hi, I'm Daniela.
Welcome to my podcast, becauseeveryone has a story, the place
to give ordinary people, stories, the chance to be shared and
preserved.
Our stories become the languageof connections.
Let's enjoy it, connect andrelate, because everyone has a
story.
Welcome, my guest is Lt.
(00:33):
Col Jason Pike.
From age seven, jason has showneveryone that he can succeed
despite the odds.
He refused to let hisshortcomings define him and made
his way in life.
Here is his journey, equallyrepresented by success and
struggle.
He pushed onwards with astunning refusal to quit.
(00:57):
His greed, resilience andremarkable vulnerability shine
through.
I had a great time meetingJason.
He was energetic, in full speed, and the conversation was the
life of.
I would have not met him if itwasn't for the podcast, so let's
enjoy Jason's story.
Welcome, jason, to the show.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (01:16):
Hey, well , thank you very much.
I appreciate being here.
I got a book out I can shareyou some stories.
Daniela SM (01:21):
Yes, and why do you want to share your story?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (01:24):
Because everyone said that I probably
couldn't make it in the militaryor in education or any type of
profession, and they had goodreason to believe that.
And so my story is one ofinspiration, hope and survival,
a refusal to quit that was sortof handed down to me from my
father and that's why I wantedto share it, yeah.
Daniela SM (01:47):
Yes, and I appreciate it.
When I met you for a pre-chat,it was quite inspiring to listen
to you and your energy, so I'mglad you're here.
So, jason, tell me, when doesyour story start?
It starts when.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (02:00):
I'm about eight or nine years old when I
well, seven years old when Ifailed the first grade, I was
diagnosed very early with alearning disability, meaning
just understanding reading andwriting are very difficult even
now.
Oh, by the way, I'm an author,go figure that one out.
But really that's true and itwas that was the first time they
(02:21):
identified it as a professionaleducational psychologist.
So I had two more times as anadult life, even after college
education, where professionallymost of your viewers and
yourself, I'm sure, can do much,much better on any standardized
test than I can, and so, though, I've got three college degrees
(02:42):
that started at age seven.
I was not expected to really domuch, except maybe do manual
labor.
There was not a whole lot ofexpectations that were put
placed upon me.
That's kind of where it went.
That's where it started, thestory started.
Daniela SM (02:55):
So at age seven, when they told you that you had
a learning disability, did itmake you feel bad?
Were you already thinking thatyou were never going to make
anything or it didn't matter toyou at that age?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (03:05):
At that age I'm just looking at friends.
I failed the first grade and soI had to repeat the first grade
because of English and readingand writing.
So to me I just said well, Iguess I'm different, maybe not
in a good way, but it wasn'treally.
It was more like I was missingmy friends that went on to the
next class.
The parents were probably moredisappointed than I was, but
(03:26):
they didn't show it, they didn'tlabel me.
I just kind of knew thatacademics were probably not
going to be in the cards, andthat's the way I pretty much
looked at academics of any type,of any sort, all the way up to
the until I graduated from highschool.
Daniela SM (03:40):
And so what happened ?
You didn't repeat any more, anymore years, only the first
grade.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (03:45):
No, I just sort of got along.
I was not in any collegepreparatory classes and even the
high school counselor told methat any type of higher
education would not be in thecards for me.
That was well known.
But I joined the military, theNational Guard, a reserve force
out of South Carolina.
From there my career sort ofstarted to change.
(04:06):
I went into a criminalcorrectional facility in Fort
Silla, oklahoma, in 1983,because I couldn't get my stuff
together.
I wasn't able to drink thewater coming out of the fire
hose and basic training that'sthe initial training that I had.
And so what happened was theysent me through a different
level of hill in that facilityfor about four hours and I
(04:26):
decided at that point that Icould probably do anything,
regardless of what people say.
I come out of basic trainingbecause I did make it, barely
barely made it.
I finished up my high schoolyear and I decided that I was
going to go to a junior college.
A junior, it's a communitycollege where you start from the
basics, and I figured that Icould do more than I thought or
(04:50):
other people thought, because Ihad been through a different
level of hell that I've neverbeen through in the military or
because of the.
I went to a special facilitybecause I was one of the worst
privates and I came out of theremaybe wired too tight or what
have you I decided I was goingto college and I was going to
stay in the military and that'seventually what I did.
(05:10):
I eventually went on to getthree different.
I got a bachelor's and twomaster's degrees.
Eventually I did become asenior military officer but I
decided I could do a whole lotmore from thing I went through
and the very initial stages ofthe military.
Daniela SM (05:24):
Jason, can you explain a little bit more what
happened when you said that youcouldn't drink out of the fire
hose?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (05:30):
In basic training they tell you to do
many things very fast.
Do this, do that.
There's acronyms.
You have to learn things veryquickly or you're not going to
adapt, like everyone else was.
I was not able to adapt to theinitial parts of the military in
the very beginning.
What the drill sergeant did?
The sergeant in charge he sentme and another soldier that
(05:52):
wanted they wanted to break us,wanted to either kick us out or
break us.
One guy did break and we gotout.
I stayed in the military and Istayed in and graduated from the
basic training.
This criminal correctionalfacility was not meant for
criminals.
It was a motivational program,kind of like a drug deal.
It wasn't probably legal forthem to do that.
(06:13):
What they did is they sent usthere to either break us or make
us in the military as amotivational technique a
different level of hell than Iwas in already, which was pretty
bad.
We made big rocks into smallrocks.
We climbed over obstaclecourses until our hands and our
arms and our legs were bloodiedand broken.
(06:35):
I'm saying the uniforms werebroken and torn and blood coming
out.
So we went through a whole lotof screaming and yelling
constantly for four hours.
It was sort of a scaredstraight type of a program.
I came out of there, I didn'tbreak, I stayed in and
eventually I was able tograduate from the basic training
(06:55):
.
But that experience, which wasonly about four hours, and then
just graduating from the initialbasic training, which was three
months, I thought that I couldprobably do a whole lot more.
Sometimes, when you go to helland come back, you feel that
even though you think you can doa little bit more, it's kind of
like don't break you, make youstronger thing, and that's kind
(07:15):
of what happened with me.
Daniela SM (07:17):
And what went through your brain to not break
and keep strong.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (07:23):
Well, at that time I thought I was being
kicked out of the military.
At that time I thought I wasgoing into criminal correctional
facility for good, to beprocessed out or to go to a jail
or to go to a further on.
At the time there was nointernet, there's no cell phones
.
We don't know.
We just know that we done badthings because we can't do what
(07:44):
the drill sergeant told us to do.
That's what I thought.
When I look back in hindsight,it was more of a motivational
technique for us and also theentire platoon, because he
threatened everybody else.
Once we came back we were sortof guinea pigs and you're
setting examples of guinea pigs.
When we came back to theplatoon we were all bloodied up,
(08:07):
broken up, looking like hell,and then he had the platoon go
look at us and he says if any ofyou don't do what I tell you to
do, you're going to go to thatfacility.
So he scared the entire platoonas well, because he was
threatening them that they wouldgo to the facility.
But no one else did that.
I know of just me and thatother guy.
That's where I got the initialconcept of thinking I can do a
(08:32):
whole lot more than what myadvice, high school and other
people say that I could do.
It was at that point, it wasforming in my mind right there.
Daniela SM (08:41):
Okay, your challenges didn't face you.
You just thought I am strong, Ican continue.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (08:47):
Yeah, I just said I can strong, I can
continue, get other people'shelp if I need help and just
keep on going and just notquitting was basically what it
was.
I think maybe I don't know thedrill sergeant probably saw that
I was doing the best I couldand I wasn't giving up.
Who knows, he may have given mea few breaks, I don't know, but
(09:07):
he knew that I was doing thebest I could and I wasn't going
to quit.
I did keep working at things,whether it be putting my weapons
together, practicing, whatevertask I had.
I would do that and he wouldsee that, and so he knew that I
was doing my best and wasn'tgoofing off at all.
I think that's probably whatset me up to graduate from there
.
Daniela SM (09:27):
And when you graduate from there, you kept in
the military, of course, andthen you went to different
college.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (09:32):
I stayed in the reserve forces for a
while.
I stayed as National Guard.
We were the less than best.
I did everything from thebottom, whether it be from a
private or whether fromacademics or even from the
military.
I was an active duty in thebeginning.
I was National Guard.
A good question some people haveasked me is there's entrance
tests to the military.
(09:52):
How did you pass your entrancetest?
If I have a learning disability, that's a good question.
I don't know.
I don't know how I did that.
That's a good question.
I don't know the answer.
Probably shouldn't pass anytype of standardized test
because I know I don't pass.
I know I took the entrance testto the college twice and I know
I was really low.
But I come back from thatfacility and I finish up my 12th
(10:15):
grade year of high school.
I had failed the first grade,so I was a year older.
I did that between my juniorand senior year of high school.
I decided then I was going todo my best I could on my last
year and then try to enter intoa community college and then go
to ROTC eventually and become anofficer.
(10:36):
That's what I did.
I went to a community collegeand it was a junior college that
forgave any type of problemsthat you might have and they
just allowed you in.
That was really no type of.
And then I went into a juniorcollege and transferred to
Clemson University, which is amore reputable college, and I
(10:56):
got out of there Not inengineering and I didn't do it,
didn't do it very quickly, I didit in educational.
It was an educational degree,nothing very difficult and it
was on the five-year plan.
I went through ROTC now ROTC,reserve officer training Corps.
That was much, much easier thanThen then then getting the
(11:16):
education because I'd alreadybeen enlisted, I'd already been
through a lot of training and soROTC was very easy for me.
It was just getting the goingto and getting the basics in the
classes and getting the collegedegree.
The reason you need a collegedegree is because I was one.
Becoming officer, I felt that Icould do more.
I did become an officer.
I did get my college degree alittle bit took, took me a
(11:39):
little bit longer, but I did.
I mean and that's where itstarts on as an officer and then
I eventually went on to activeduty.
So but you said also that youhave two masters.
I have two masters degree.
I got one masters at ClintonUniversity and I got another
masters at Colorado StateUniversity Later on, maybe like
ten years later.
So I was an officer at thistime, with the first one with
(12:00):
the National Guard and then thesecond one with the active duty.
So what I learned eventually isif you've got a learning problem
, like I do, you can get extratime for the test or Extra time
for any type of test.
I didn't know that.
But if you get an educationalpsychologist to write down that
you've got issues learning andreading and writing or you're
slow or what have you, they canget give you more Attention or
(12:23):
give you more time.
I had to have extra time.
I had to study extra, but thenI also had to have extra time to
process and then once I hadthat extra time, I did on
average just about as good assomeone who had prepared.
That was normal or just youknow.
So that helped me out a lot andI did that.
I use that eventually as atechnique to get through various
(12:44):
tests and things.
Daniela SM (12:45):
And you wanted to do the masters because you will
move up in ranks on the militarymove up.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (12:50):
Yeah, just like any professional, I
was really thinking I might wantto break out of this disability
, whatever they call it.
I said no, I couldn't break outof it, I couldn't just run
through it, because it's justwho you are.
You can't break it, you can'tfight it.
You've just got a manageraround it, and that took me a
while to figure that out, butit's a management technique.
(13:11):
It's not necessarily you can'tjust scrape it away from your,
your, your skull or somethingand say it's gone.
That's because it's just whoyou are and you manage around it
.
And I eventually did that andlearned how to do that very well
, not just with education, butwith many other things in life.
Daniela SM (13:27):
But so you went through all these years knowing
that there was somethingDifferent from you.
However, you didn't have theknowledge or the assistance or
the support to learn more.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (13:38):
No, not really.
For the most part I didn't talkabout it.
I never wanted to say anything.
I was ashamed about it.
I was ashamed just to go to thejunior college.
Because I was different.
I knew that I process thingsdifferently.
Some people call it a littlebit form of autism.
Some people call it a littleform of Asperger syndrome.
I don't know.
I don't know what the thing is.
(13:58):
Could some people have saiddyslexia?
I just know that processing isslow.
I have a higher creativitylevel Well, creativity because I
have to have something, so I'mpretty creative with things, how
to manage things or how tomanage around situations.
However, to accomplish the jobit did cause me trouble,
especially in my younger years,on behavior.
(14:18):
I've been arrested a few times,but I've got out of these
situations and just kept ongoing Because I thought that I
was untouchable.
In the very beginning I saidthey told me I couldn't get a
college degree.
They told me, and I did allthese things and I thought that
I could do anything and I wassort of above the law in many
ways.
But that's not true.
You can have confidence but youcan't have too much like you're
(14:38):
above everything, and so I hadto get myself knocked down a few
times to go on further.
A lot of these stories in thisbook A Soldier Against All Odds
are just really unbelievablestories when I don't think a lot
of people would have stayed.
I went through driving under theinfluence charges which we know
in the military.
You're out of here.
(14:59):
That was a second time.
I almost got kicked out Talkedabout the first time a DUI.
I learned how to go through anappeal process and I got out of
that.
When I'm saying I'm, when I sayI got out of it, that doesn't
mean that it didn't affect me.
It took two years to do it.
Conventional wisdom is you'renot going to survive anything
like drugs or alcohol issues atall, because the military is
(15:22):
much more strict than thecivilian sector.
The military they have a higherstandard.
I went through a two-yearappeal process.
That that may not sound thatspecial to you, but in the
military it is.
Most people do not survive thatI had to go through two years
of showing that I have theability and the strength and the
you know, the knowledge tocontinue on with my career and
(15:44):
that most people would just giveup on that process.
Daniela SM (15:46):
Jason, you were in a roller coaster of feeling I can
do it, I got a college, I canget in here, and then sometimes
you made a mistake Due to yourbehavior, and then you get into
real trouble.
Then you feel really low.
Your colleagues didn't help youbecause perhaps you they bully
you.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (16:04):
So it was constantly up and downs,
constantly up and downs and thebullying was pretty much behind
your back type of thing.
But for the most part, yeah,did they know I was different?
Oh, yeah, there was someassignments I did well and when
I was not managed, yeah.
But yeah, there was a rollercoaster ride.
It was ups and downs, wickedups and downs.
My colleagues, my peers, I sortof looked at me.
(16:27):
Well, you know, I don't know,there was a few of them that
said I'm okay, but I think yougot it right as far as they
looked at me a littledifferently, when I was placed
in charge of troops or soldiers,I did pretty well.
I thought I did very well as acommander or if I had any type
of authority.
I knew how to take care ofsoldiers.
I was very compassionate tothem, empathetic with them maybe
(16:47):
a little bit too much and so,but I did do that.
I did take care of my sergeantsand things of that nature.
So I did play a good role as amanager or a leader.
Now other assignments staffofficer assignments, things of
that nature I didn't do too wellin, but they're just really
dependent on the job.
And if I was left alone, likeyou are when you're a leader or
(17:10):
a commander, and I allowed mytroops to help take care of me
which I need to take care of Idid really well and then I could
take care of them in my own way.
But when I was micromanaged orsort of directed to do things, I
didn't do too well.
It really depended on thesituation and there were many
different situations in themilitary because every two to
three years we moved to adifferent place.
(17:31):
Even though we're in the army,we have to deal with different
people and different littlethings across the spectrum of
the military.
Daniela SM (17:38):
So you are very adaptable, for sure.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (17:40):
I'm pretty adaptable.
We have to be.
Yeah, I've lived nine yearsoverseas in five different
countries, so I've got 31 yearsin the military.
Pretty much eat every type offood that there is.
Yeah, I'm pretty adaptable.
Daniela SM (17:52):
Okay, so you finished your studies and you
were going around the world.
Then what happened?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (17:57):
Well, I did 31 years and what happened
was at the end of my 31 years mymother was dying and I wanted
to write a book.
I just had it had been naggingon me, these crazy stories that
are in this book.
I didn't know how to write abook.
I didn't know anybody who wrotea book before.
I didn't know how I was gonnawrite a book and after she died
(18:18):
I started talking about it withthe family.
My sister didn't.
I don't think she wanted.
She didn't want me to.
She didn't want me to writeabout it.
But let's see, if you write abook, a memoir, you had to be
honest with yourself andeventually I got a ghostwriter.
I went through Upwork website.
I just was playing around.
I put a description out on whatI wanted to do.
I went through about a threeyear process of writing this
(18:39):
book, which was painful, verypainful, put me in the hospital.
I almost died because of thisbook.
The flashbacks and the memoriesjust, really just stressed me
out and I was sitting in a chairfor a long hour stressing.
Blood clots started to form inmy lungs and my legs from the
sitting.
The doctors thought that I wasa smoker.
(19:01):
Just been a drinker, not asmoker.
He says well, you're gonnapretty much die.
You not only do, you got bloodclots in your legs and lungs,
you've also got pneumonia.
I was in the ICU for three daysand it was because of this book
.
It's in the first page of thetestimony.
You'll see the details therethat where I was scheduled to
die, I reacted really well tothe heparin blood thinner and
(19:23):
the antibiotics.
I eventually got out of therein five days.
But no, it was because of thisbook.
It was a stress.
I've only had one or twoanxiety attacks after that.
But the ICU, the blood clots,that was the big one.
That's where I was sitting downtoo long.
I changed my behavior to whereI'm sitting now, but most of the
time I stand.
This book, like any life, theway this thing, I had my ghost
(19:47):
writer.
He wanted to.
You gotta show the dirt.
You gotta show yourvulnerability.
I did not grow up showingvulnerability.
The weaknesses that I have,that you'll see in here.
All the details of a life.
A life is gonna be dirty.
See, this memoir is a littledifferent than most, because I'm
not gonna tell you that Iconquered Afghanistan or did all
these great and I did goodthings and I had a lot of years,
(20:09):
I got a lot of awards, I've gota lot of degrees, but what I'm
saying is this book comes tocross.
Think of a senior managerthat's in an organization or the
Army and military telling youall their weaknesses and what
they've done that are foul upsand screw ups and things of that
nature.
I'm not perfect.
I had a whole lot of issues anda lot of, a lot of problems
(20:29):
along the way and this is how Iovercame them and these are the
little ways.
It's humor, but it's true humor, of how all these stupid things
, theascos, failures thatoccurred and how I got around
them and how I got through them.
So the a lot of military, bigmilitary men will say I did this
and did this and did this, Ihave a wonderful family and all
(20:50):
that about it and I'm gonna showyou.
Hey, this is how I came alongand I ain't that perfect at all
and you and you'll maybeidentify, or somebody will maybe
draw some lessons out there.
Daniela SM (21:01):
Even though that you were feeling ill and you nearly
die, you still thought thatthis was kind of like a
cathartic, or you just wanted totell your story.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (21:09):
Oh, I just wanted to tell my story.
Something that I had that wasnagging on me, sort of like a
passion that you have thatovertakes you, almost like an
obsession, and I said I got todo it.
I never quit anything, so if Iquit this I'm gonna really look
bad.
I wanted my father to write astory.
This is about him and me, butI'm telling you my story through
him.
I tell a little bit about myfather, yeah, and so I thought I
(21:32):
got to do this thing.
I understand that reading andwriting are my worst subjects,
so that stressed me out too, butI had I did have help, a lot of
anxiety of Lots of issues, dirt.
I was sitting down.
I wasn't exercising like I usedto.
That's what also formed theblood plot.
Daniela SM (21:49):
I see, I see Sounds fascinating and I love that you
took that approach.
So I guess you telling thestory like that now you are free
from all your guilt or whateveryou were feeling before- it was
the hardest, probably thehardest long-term project I've
ever done in my life.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (22:07):
I've been through a whole lot of things.
I would rather go toAfghanistan, I'd rather go to
war than have to do another bookagain.
I don't, but it's done now, soit's done.
Daniela SM (22:18):
Wow, that's incredible.
Well, I find it superinteresting and, of course, we
have to read your book.
So the book took three years,and then what happened when he
came out?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (22:28):
Oh gosh, they told me to do podcasts.
Since I met you back in March,I've done over 25 podcasts and
I've gotten the word out.
It's become a number onebestseller according to Amazon
and the the statistics of whatthey do it.
And now we're we're working ona second book, but I it's gonna
be about how to get yourveterans benefits.
It's a self-help guide.
We got examples of how to dothat, but I'm not gonna kill
(22:51):
myself on this one.
I guarantee you that.
And see this one a soldieragainst all odds right here.
This was the one I'm nearlydied on, so the other one we're
working on is gonna be not asintense.
It's not gonna be as crazy asthis one.
Daniela SM (23:04):
Wow, that's incredible, jason.
I love that you are heretelling your story.
Colleagues, read the book toyour family.
What about your sister?
What do they say about the?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (23:13):
book.
Sister and brother Don't say adamn thing to me.
I think they want to staysilent.
It's see, this is my story.
I'm telling it from myperspective.
We didn't grow up to be outthere.
We're more like a restrictedfamily when we grew up, and even
in the military, you don't sayyour vulnerabilities, and so now
I want to tell the stories out,and so my mother and my father
(23:34):
passed away, so I thought thatit would be a good time after
that.
Now my colleagues a lot of themare either Admiring me very,
very much or they're like alittle bit over here at distance
, but most of them have admiredme.
If you just look at the reviews, you're gonna see a whole lot
of colleagues that have comeonline on Amazon and that's
where it's at.
It's on Amazon.
(23:54):
It's on Jason backorg.
You'll see the reviews over ahundred reviews and a lot of
them are my soldiers.
Or are there colleagues thatI've worked with around over the
years?
Daniela SM (24:04):
Looking back and all the things that you have shared
today.
You have achieved so muchcompared with other people.
Maybe maybe other people gotmedals for being number one and
whatever, but you have doneagainst the odds, how you said,
and also you have done thingsthat are out of the ordinary For
people like you.
You know, in the militarypeople are no vulnerable like
(24:25):
you say.
Yeah, we're not vulnerable,we're.
I didn't grow up in a familythat was vulnerable the military
is.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (24:30):
We do not show our weaknesses, we don't
show our vulnerability.
I grew up with storytellingDon't tell me what a plural and
noun is or things of that nature, I don't know but I understand
storytelling and so I wanted toalways tell this story.
My dad was a great storyteller,so I thought that I could try
to work off him and I have ahave a book that's meant in our
(24:51):
memories At least in my familymemories and that'll be out
there.
It's always been something thatit's kind of what a bucket list
.
It's a big, big bucket listthat's gone.
You know getting this out andyou know Giving a little bit
inspiration and hope to otherfolks.
Yeah, you, I've always feltthat I was blessed in some way,
sometimes only one or two timescursed, but I thought I was
(25:12):
blessed most of the time becauseI wasn't supposed to do this.
I wasn't supposed to graduatecollege, I was not supposed to
go and achieve these ranks andall the ribbons that you'll see.
This was not in the cards,according to the experts, and I
defied the experts, and so oncethese things kept going on
throughout my life.
You know you talked about thatroller coaster and every time I
(25:34):
went up.
I went down, went up, I thought, wow, I didn't like the crazy
roller coaster ride.
I mean, I wish I could benormal.
My mother always said, son, whycan't you be normal like
everyone else?
I said, well, I don't know howto be, I just know how to be me.
And she walked away mad at me.
But no, and I did, wish I was alittle bit more normal, without
all the ups and downs, causeeverybody else, you know
(25:57):
everybody has ups and downs, butwhy does mine have to be so
down?
I just said that's just the waylife is gonna be, apparently.
Daniela SM (26:04):
I like your answer that I just don't know how to be
normal.
I know how to be me.
That's pretty good.
Exactly so, jason, after 31years of being in the military
and you decided to leave, howwas that feeling?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (26:17):
Oh, I was burned out.
I had post traumatic stresssyndrome.
I had been through so much, Ihad been totally drained and
exhausted.
I was burned out afterAfghanistan.
Then I took a Germany.
I retired out of Germany.
It took two years over there.
Didn't really do a whole lotover there, I just tried to ride
my time out.
Then I just sought medical help,A lot of mental health therapy,
things of that nature, andtried to get back into the
(26:40):
workforce eventually.
But I wanted to just focus onmy mental post-traumatic stress
and things of that nature and Idid.
And then I eventually got intoa federal position with the
Centers for Disease Control.
I did that for a few years andthen I went ahead and published
the book.
When I published the book Iquit the federal force, the
Centers for Disease Control,because I wanted to focus on the
(27:01):
book, the podcasting and theexpression of the book.
But yeah, that's kind of howthis thing has been since
retirement.
Retirement was a transition,was a problem because you've
been moving around, You've beengoing up the ladder.
Disassignment, that'sassignment, and then now all
they're ever known was my battlefatigue.
I don't even know how to dress.
I would just put on one uniformall my life and now I have to
(27:24):
dress.
So you have to adapt to adifferent type of environment
than you're used to.
Daniela SM (27:29):
Yes, and you're full of energy, as I can see from
looking at you.
So what do you do?
All day you can be sitting onlyon podcasts.
I'm sure you have to channelyour energy.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (27:38):
This morning I did wind sprints for
about 50 minutes and then I wentto a sauna.
One of my therapy sessions isgo from a sauna to an ice bath
and when I'm in the sauna I dosit-ups and sit-ups.
But no, I do have a lot ofenergy.
I try to find ways to get thisenergy out every day.
I'm 57 years old.
Physical fitness is a big partof me.
(27:59):
It has always been because Iwas in the military.
Daniela SM (28:02):
OK, you do sit-ups on a sauna.
Sauna, yeah, I do sit-ups inthe sauna.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (28:06):
And what I want to do is get really hot
and sweaty.
And then I get out of there andI jump into an ice bath and
then I start to shiver.
And then I'll go back to thesauna, get really hot and sweaty
and go back to the ice bath andget shivery.
That really does a whole lot tome.
It makes me feel calmerafterwards.
Daniela SM (28:22):
And how long do you stay in the water?
Five minutes, ok.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (28:25):
Usually to a point of shivering.
Daniela SM (28:27):
But you're always traveling, so how do you manage
to find a sauna and a coldplunge?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (28:32):
I was in Korea for six years.
So if you go to a city such asAtlanta, houston and Dallas some
of the bigger cities they'llhave these Korean saunas and
that's where you're going tofind them.
But you'll have to GoogleKorean saunas In San Antonio,
texas that's where I live at.
They've got a evolved humantherapy and they've got one
there.
It's a new thing and I learnedabout this over in Korea years
(28:55):
ago because I used to go out.
I lived out in the villages inKorea, and in Korea they have
these things, these saunas andthese ice baths.
These are just facilities allover the place, and so now I
find ways when I'm traveling tofind them.
And if I can't find that, I canalways get a sauna at a gym and
then just use a cold shower.
Daniela SM (29:16):
I see Interesting.
Thank you for sharing that.
And, Jason, through your timewhile you were having soldiers,
did you meet people that werelike you and how do you treat
them Well?
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (29:29):
as a commander, I was always very
compassionate and empathetictowards everybody's special
needs or things of that naturemaybe too much so.
I was really good as acommander or as a leader, as a
father or someone who leads orsomeone who can show the way or
the light to kids or youngerfolks.
I was always good with that.
There was just other situationswhere they gave me the details
(29:51):
and tried to tell me what to doon the details, like if you were
to tell me to fill out aspreadsheet or to do this, it
would take a whole lot moreenergy from me and brain power
than it would be an averageperson Like, for example, when I
was in the Centers for DiseaseControl, I had help.
I had a nephew and a niece whowould come online and help me
out a little bit, filling outthings and things that I don't
(30:12):
know.
I learned how to get help.
I learned creative ways aroundthings, especially if I had to
do them.
That's what's difficult is forme to do the details.
Daniela SM (30:23):
Jason, and you are not even a bit curious to know
what you're learning?
Lt Col. Jason G. (30:27):
disabilities- Not really.
I'm pretty much.
Because I've lived through itso long.
I have been identified threedifferent times as someone who's
just a slow learner.
My processing mechanism is much, much slower.
I think that's the best way youcan probably diagnose it.
Those folks who have diagnosedit just means I just take a lot,
(30:47):
a lot, a lot more time to do atask which in the military or in
life you can't.
You don't have a lot of time,but I can compensate around that
If I get other people's help orI do other things.
Then that's how I foundcreative ways to get around this
.
Daniela SM (31:06):
Well, obviously you have weaknesses, but your
strengths are definitely empathyand compassion that perhaps
other people didn't have it.
That's your talent.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (31:17):
Yeah, I'm a very good commander of
empathy and talent.
The competition and thebackstabbing that occurred in
any organization I was not goodwith, because everything's
competitive as you move up aladder, whether you're in the
executive branches or whatever.
They look at me as they cantell that maybe I'm not at their
standard and then thereforethere's I could be a possible
(31:39):
easy pushover.
That's part of the things Inever did like.
But give me some soldiers, giveme a commander.
What have you and I do betterthan they are probably because
there's a lot of brutal, brutal,unsympathetic commanders and
people out there who treat theirsoldiers really, really bad.
Daniela SM (31:56):
Well, I am glad to hear that you were the good
leader, Jason.
I think it is incredible thatyou managed to remember all
these details and put ittogether in one book.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (32:05):
Well, what it was.
It was somebody who wasinterviewing me just like you're
interviewing me over and overand over again, sometimes on the
same subject over a period ofyears, and it was squeezing the
lemon out of the juice and hewas writing it down, writing it
down, typing, or he wasrecording it and then typing it,
and then he got it all.
He threw some stuff out thatweren't relevant and it was just
(32:27):
a long, painful process.
This is all it was.
It's not like I remembered allthis stuff.
I went through a squeezing overa period of years to get this
stuff out.
That's a story of its own.
And I went through the audiobook.
I'm the person, I'm thenarrator.
Someone says, well, if you'regoing to do a book, you ought to
do an audio book.
I said, okay, when I did theaudio book, when I started
reading through the manuscript,I came up with more stories.
(32:50):
I remembered those things.
So when I thought it was over,it was not over.
I thought, wow.
And then my ghostwriter sayswhen that stuff happens to you,
just keep on talking.
Whatever it is what comes toyour mind that you remember at
that moment, because I can'twrite too well, just go ahead
and speak it into the systemthere and then I'll capture it
now and that's how we wentthrough that.
(33:10):
But that was by accident, itwasn't planned, and we got a lot
more juice out of these storiesby going through me doing the
narrating part of the audio.
Daniela SM (33:19):
I think it's wonderful that you are narrating
it, because that makes the bookso much more fun to listen to.
So, Jason, I am.
It is incredible how proud youare of the product of your book
and all your life.
So I am excited that you arehere and that you were able to
share all these.
I'm grateful for that becauseyour energy and your willingness
(33:44):
to go against all the odds itis amazing and inspiring.
So thank you so much forsharing.
Well, thank you very much forhaving me.
Lt Col. Jason G. Pike (33:52):
Yes, you can find the book Soldier
Against All Odds on Amazon.
Put it in your browser ASoldier Against All Odds and
you'll see a many, many podcaststoo many podcasts, I think and
then you'll see the descriptionin my website, jasonpikeorg.
Jasonpikeorg, yeah, Iappreciate your support and your
(34:12):
willingness to interview me.
Daniela SM (34:14):
Yes, no, it has been a pleasure and thank you for
the gift of getting to meet youAll right.
I hope you enjoyed today'sepisode I am Daniela and you
were listening to, becauseEveryone has a Story.
Please take five seconds rightnow and think of somebody in
your life that may enjoy whatyou just heard, or someone that
has a story to be shared andpreserved.
(34:35):
When you think of that person,shoot them a text with the link
of this podcast.
This will allow the ordinarymagic to go further.
Join me next time for anotherstory conversation.
Thank you for listening.
Hasta pronto.
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