October 11, 2024 • 26 mins
📚 Get John’s book It’s Not About the Devil:
https://bit.ly/3YkRksz
National Center for Missing & Exploited Children:
https://www.missingkids.org/home
National Center on Sexual Exploitation:
https://endsexualexploitation.org/
______________________________________
In this episode of Behind The Mike Podcast, host Mike Stone welcomes back author and advocate John DiGirolamo to dive deep into the dangers of online predators and the growing issue of teen sexting.Â
Drawing from real-life stories featured in John’s latest book, "It's Not About the Devil", this episode explores the alarming tactics predators use to exploit vulnerable teens and the devastating impact it has on their lives.
Learn how David Gomez, a middle school officer’s shocking discovery of teen sexting opened the door to a larger, more sinister problem involving online predators. John discusses the real risks, the psychological impact on teens, and why every parent needs to be aware of how quickly predators can strike—even within 24 hours.
John’s new book tackles critical issues like human trafficking, online exploitation, and spiritual warfare, focusing on three powerful true stories: an undercover officer posing as a 13-year-old girl, an abortion doctor turned pro-life advocate, and an insider’s look at exorcisms.
Don’t miss this eye-opening conversation about the real-world tactics of predators, the influence of media on our teens, and what parents can do to protect their children in today’s digital world.
____________
KEY TOPICS:
⚠️ The dangerous rise of teen sexting and its emotional consequences
🎯 How online predators target teens within 24 hours
đź‘®. Insights from an undercover officer who posed as a 13-year-old girl
ℹ️ Why it’s crucial for parents to stay informed and involved
📚. John’s latest book and its exploration of evil in today’s society
___________________________________________
đź”” Subscribe for more episodes on faith, family, and protecting our youth.
đź‘Ť Like, share, and comment if you found this episode helpful!
___________________________________________
TIMESTAMPED CHAPTERS:
00:00 - Introduction and Welcome Back
00:44 - John's New Book
02:12 - Focus on Online Predators
04:06 - Evil in Society
05:22 - Dramatized Nonfiction Stories
07:15 - Profile of a School Resource Officer
10:21 - Why Sexting is Dangerous
11:20 - Parents' Misconceptions
13:03 - Sextortion and Online Predators
15:24 - Real-Life Case Examples
16:12 - Expanding the Scope: Beyond Local Schools
God, doubt, and proof walk into a podcast... it goes better than you’d expect!
Listen on: Apple Podcasts Spotify
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
I'm back with John DiGirolamo, and we had him on
the show not too long ago.
If you haven't heard thisepisode, I want you to look this
one up.
It's called Protecting Teensfrom Human Trafficking and it's
John's fight against childexploitation Really good stuff.
This has become a rampant thingin our country.
We've been hearing more andmore about it online and on the
(00:41):
news, but we're going tocontinue a little bit along
those lines and then we're goingto jump into another topic
totally.
So this is going to be athree-part series with John,
because he's got a new book outthat was released a few months
ago and it touches on all ofthese things.
So we're going to hit this hard.
We're going to glean from John.
(01:01):
John, welcome back to the show.
We thank you for coming back on.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Yeah, thanks for having me.
I really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Yeah, absolutely so.
Your new book we'll brieflytouch on it and, again, I'm
going to put this preface at thebeginning.
This is not a book review.
I found John a while back and Iloved the research that he's
doing on some of these topics.
And this book I'll let you talkabout it, john, but this book
really hits on three topics thatI think are so incredibly
(01:31):
important in our society today.
So, john, I'll let you talkabout the book.
Tell us who you are, for thosewho don't know, and what you're
doing.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
Yeah, so I'm an author of four books and I've
kind of got a theme going whereI'm looking to tell stories of
what's going on in our societyand I've kind of focused on
difficult topics humantrafficking, online exploitation
, et cetera, exploitation etc.
(02:08):
And uh and so, uh, you know, mylatest book it's not about the
devil really talks about, youknow, the ultimate predator,
which is satan, and some of theevil going on in our society
that is targeting vulnerablepeople.
Um, and so it's all non-fiction, it where I'm interviewing real
people there's case files,testimony etc.
And I'm putting together plotlines, story, emotion, dialogue,
(02:31):
action etc to reveal what'sgoing on in these people's lives
but also the broader picture ofwhat's going on in our society,
and doing that throughstorytelling.
And so I call it dramatizednonfiction.
I wanted to read like afast-paced fiction novel, but
it's all true, it's all realstuff.
(02:53):
So you know, the devil is busyin our modern society and his
greatest trick is to convince usthat he doesn't exist.
And I think a lot of peoplehave kind of fallen into that
thought process in our secular,growing secular world.
So I focused on three people.
I focused on a police officerwho goes undercover online as a
(03:19):
13-year-old girl and everyparent needs to know what
happens and how these predatorsare operating.
The second story is about anabortion doctor who becomes a
pro-life advocate and it's adecades-long journey and how
that happens and how she seesthe value of the unborn, and
(03:39):
then the insider's view to whatgoes on in an exorcism.
I interviewed the guy whoco-wrote the training manual for
exorcists so I really got theinside scoop.
So really three differentstories, but they're tied
together by kind of thepredatory practices of people
(04:01):
and of really, you know, evilbehavior.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Boy, that's really good, and that's exactly why I
invited you back is because theenemy is real.
Satan is real, yeah, and hemasquerades as an angel of light
.
We read through Scripture quitea bit about Satan and his
practices.
We're supposed to be wise asserpent and gentle as doves.
(04:28):
We want to bring that wisdomthat you've gleaned from these
stories to those who arewatching and listening, because
it's so important to understandthe enemy's tactics, because if
we don't, we're going to fallfor them.
Yeah, we're going to fall forthem, yeah, and I think that's
really what's happened to oursociety today is years ago, I
think we were more sensitive tothings that were considered bad,
(04:51):
and now it's almost like wepraise those who are creating
their own truth.
And I think it's important whatyou have to say about each of
these topics.
So that's really what ourpodcasts, our next three
episodes, are going to be thisone we'll talk about the online
predators, and then we'll talkabout the abortion doctor who
(05:14):
experienced a shift in how sheviewed that whole practice, and
then it'll still be in time forHalloween of all times We'll
talk about the exorcism stuffand what you've gleaned from
that.
So let's start off with today'sepisode Online Predators.
(05:35):
Now, last time we talked aboutthis a little bit.
We talked about the traffickingand how that can work, but I
want you to tell us what youlearned from this online
predator situation with theofficer, and I got to read just
a little bit of the book and itstarts out with a, I believe, a
14-year-old girl who quoteunquote innocently shared a
(05:57):
topless picture with the boy.
And then you brought in thisSRO, this officer, who was in
the schools and had to deal withthat.
So that's kind of set the stage.
Let me have you tell us, then,what you got from this and tell
us a little bit about thegentleman who is actually.
(06:19):
These, again, are real stories.
Tell us about the gentlemanwho's actually in law
enforcement and was onlineposing.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Yeah, you know, I was doing a lot of talks about
human trafficking and I keptgetting questions about the
online piece of that, and Iwanted to explore the broader
picture, because there's a lotof predators out there online,
but they may be doing otherthings besides trafficking and
it's actually a bigger problemthan trafficking in general.
(06:50):
So I interviewed Officer DavidGomez, who's a very well-known
police officer, school resourceofficer who trains other law
enforcement people, teens aswell as parents.
He's got a pretty largeFacebook following and he gives
tips on a regular basis, and soI wanted to profile his story,
(07:12):
his life, how did he become anexpert?
And so it starts out with he'sgot this job in a middle school
as a school resource officer,and he gets called to two kids
fighting.
Nothing really unusual aboutthat except, to his surprise, it
(07:32):
was because one of the teengirls had sent a topless photo
to the other girl's boyfriend,and so it was causing a lot of
drama, and what he discoveredwas that this was not a one-off.
This was something that'shappening in the middle school
(07:54):
level as well as high school,and so the story starts out by
kind of getting your attentionof what's going on.
What is going on with the teenbrain at this time that makes
them think that that's an okaything to do.
And so the story progresses ofdealing with these two teens.
(08:18):
You know the officer talks toparents who don't seem to be as
involved or don't seem to be asdisturbed by this as he was.
And when he startedinvestigating this he found out
that many of these boys wereasking pictures from multiple
(08:39):
people and it just kind of blewup from there where it went,
from these two people heinvestigated to it, landed up
confiscating over 20 differentteen phones that had explicit
pictures and we're seeing teensexting as a real, significant
issue.
(09:00):
I've talked to teachers, peopleon superintendents, school
boards etc.
And they all say every one ofthem from around the country
that this is happening rightunder our nose around the
country, that this is happeningright under our nose and it
starts at the middle schoollevel and and so you know, for
(09:21):
his story it developed into um,not just looking at that, but
who else is out there asking forpictures besides classmates?
And it really kind of in hismind begged the questions why,
where and how predators areoperating, because a predator
(09:44):
could also approach a teen andtry to get explicit pictures.
And once they do, then it's notjust in a class, in a classmate
type of situation, which is badenough, but it gets worse
because then you have no ideawho's on the other side of that
(10:06):
digital transaction, if you will, or the other side of that
keyboard trying to get thisteen's picture.
And so we really kind ofexplore the why, where and how,
and I think that's somethingthat we should go into.
Speaker 1 (10:20):
Yeah for sure.
Now you said something that isa bit shocking to me, and that
is that the girl's parentsdidn't quite see the extreme.
I guess extreme, I guess theshock of it all.
My wife and I, we have now 20and 21-year-old kids.
(10:40):
They're in college age and backin middle school.
This is something that we haddiscussions about because it was
happening back then.
This would have been seven,eight years ago.
First of all, why is this sodangerous?
I get it, but I also know thereare parents out there who feel
(11:01):
like you know it's going tohappen.
It's really not a big deal andI think you'll probably get into
that.
But what, initially, do youhave to say to those parents
that just feel like you knowwhat they're?
Just kids it's, you know, it'sjust a part of growing up in
this digital age.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Yeah, those parents are not looking out for their
kids.
You know we live in a parentalgeneration that wants to be the
friend and not be the parent.
You can be the friend when yourkid is 30.
When they're 14, that is notthe time to do that.
But if you look at kind of thebroader picture, you've got um,
(11:42):
the media, celebrities et cetera, telling parents you can do
this in a safe way.
You can.
You know, and I'm just here totell you, there is no safe way
for anyone, kid or adult, tosend an explicit picture of
themselves.
You lose complete control overwhat happens next and we've
(12:03):
heard of terms like revenge porn, where somebody sends a picture
, they break up and then nextthing you know they're being
extorted for some other reason.
The other piece of this is whatis the media telling kids?
Well, it's telling them thesame thing you can do this in a
safe way, send it to a trustedfriend, etc.
(12:24):
That just doesn't happen.
So you've got this messagetelling kids one, you can do it
safely and two, it's kind of nobig deal.
But the reality is is once a, aperson sends that, they lose
control and you look back atwhat, the why sorry, the why are
(12:49):
predators doing doing this?
Why do they want to exploitkids?
Well, they're either looking toget pictures to get money or
they want to meet for a physicalencounter.
So when it comes to sexting,there's ramifications that the
teen brain is just not thinkingof One.
(13:11):
Those digital images lastforever.
A lot of times there's regretand shame, so they're going to
many times have emotional issues, depression, self-harm, suicide
etc.
And it can lead to a lot ofthis cyberbullying, etc.
(13:35):
But it becomes broader whenit's not just a classmate, when
it's somebody out there.
And a great example of this ishow predators target teen boys
and there's a tactic, a veryspecific tactic that they use.
I've talked to more than onepolice officer who have said
(13:57):
that this tactic can happen inless than 24 hours.
And so what is that tactic Inpractical terms?
A teen boy will get approachedonline by a profile that's a
very good looking, saycollege-age girl, and they're
going to want to join theirsocial network.
(14:18):
Teen boy sees good-looking girl, you know, click sure, I'll
accept that friendship follower,etc.
All of a sudden, that teen boystarts getting unsolicited
explicit pictures from this girl, many times that could be
downloaded from a pornographicwebsite.
So this, this quote you know,hot girl is sending explicit
(14:43):
pictures to the boy.
Then she will say, well, I'veshown you, now you show me.
And pressures the teen boy tosend pictures back to her.
Many times they're tricked intothis.
They succumb, they will sendthese pictures and immediately
they get extorted for money Ifthey pay.
(15:05):
Five minutes later they'reasking for more money again and
if they don't pay, they willthreaten to send these pictures,
these embarrassing pictures ofthis boy, to that person's
social network, to their parents, their friends, their teachers,
et cetera.
This is a very real tactic,happens way too often.
(15:27):
And now this boy is stuck.
What does he do?
He, his money is going to runout, probably real fast, and he,
he's going to have, you know, alot of mental anguish over this
, and this is a real issue thatwe've seen.
You know suicide attempts aswell, as you know really taking
(15:50):
one's own life because of this,and it can happen so fast and
that's what parents don'tunderstand.
Speaker 1 (15:56):
This can happen in less than 24 hours and and
that's just a really, reallydisturbing trend that we're
starting to see in our societytoday so I think you kind of
expanded on the the generalthought that it's just here
(16:17):
within my community, it's justwithin my son or my daughter's
school.
You just blew that out of thewater because I know that For
those who listen and watchregular I work at Covenant Eyes
my full-time job and so we seethe statistics coming in all the
time of the same thing thatteen depression, teen suicide,
(16:39):
the anxiety, all those thingsand they really are related to a
lot of what you just talkedabout.
Let's face it, john, if wewould have had cell phones
growing up, our lives would havelooked a lot different than
what they do now.
Because generally and you knowthis is a generalization we all
(16:59):
do things we wished we wouldn'thave done when we were growing
up.
Heck, I still do them today, youknow.
But we, you can't take thosethings back.
You know, when you say thatstuff is on the Internet forever
, it really is.
It's stored somewhere, whetheryou want to believe it or not.
Talk about those kids who knowexactly what you're talking
(17:26):
about because they've been there.
Maybe they've just shared aphoto, maybe they went through
that extortion process, maybethey have been asked to meet up
with someone because of thosesexting photos.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
Right.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
What do you say to those kids now that are kind of
going yeah, I get it.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
Yeah, I mean you can.
Certainly, if you know whereyour picture has maybe been
posted, you can try to scrub theinternet of that it is.
It is really difficult.
There's different resources,such as, you know, the National
Center of Missing and ExploitedChildren.
They've got some resources tohelp parents not only have these
(18:07):
discussions but also to youknow what happens if, if the, if
the horses are already out ofthe barn, so to speak.
Yeah, but they really have tohave those.
They have to have thoseconversations with their parents
, with a trusted adult.
They can't do it alone.
You know most parents are goingto react with wanting to support
(18:30):
their child and understand thatthey made a mistake.
And how do you deal with it andmove on from there?
But until that kid has thatdiscussion, they're really going
to spiral downward and thepredator is counting on that
embarrassment they're countingon.
(18:52):
Well, you showed me this.
Now you've got to show me moreputting that pressure on them,
on that teen, and then it justgets worse and worse and they
just can't.
You know they just can't getout of that situation and so
they've got to have thoseconversations.
You know it could be somethingwhere, if they have been cyber
(19:12):
bullied.
You know there's definitelycounseling available and things
like that.
But they have to know thatthere are resources, there's
people that love them and theycannot solve this on their own.
They've got to go to thattrusted adult, their parents,
etc.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
Yeah, such great advice, john.
The child or the teen who'slistening right now, who's in
that situation.
Listen, I've not been there.
I've not had this happen to me,but I do know as an adult.
I know John is, is is right onthere's hope.
It may be embarrassing, it maybe humiliating, but you need to
(19:53):
go get the resources that areavailable to you to help you out
of the mess.
So don't don't think this isyou know, there's no end to this
.
The hard part is justconfessing and reaching out.
Speaker 2 (20:06):
Yeah, I mean now is the time, if you're in that
situation, both for the parentand the child to lean on God,
lean on Jesus, for that support,for knowing that it's not just
your parents that love you.
God loves you too.
Now's the time to remind themall about that, that they're not
(20:28):
in it alone and they've got aloving God who wants to help
them get through this.
And so it's an opportunity tokind of reiterate some of those
biblical values.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
Absolutely, John.
You brought up one resource forparents who are listening, you
know go to a pastor, a trustedspiritual advisor, counselor.
There's counseling out therethat can help and there's also
organizations out there who arefighting this stuff daily, who
know how to help you get throughthis.
Speaker 2 (21:18):
Organizations out there who are fighting this
stuff daily, who know how tohelp you get through this.
So, yeah, boy, it's a, it's atough thing, but it's a reality
in today's world and that has tohappen often and early.
You can't just have it whenthey're 15 and be done with it.
You've got to start out withhaving these conversations about
predators, about being safeonline and honestly delaying
(21:43):
their smartphone usage, theironline activity, as much as
possible.
So you know there's things likedumb phones, which a lot of
parents are using.
There's parental controlsoftware which is guardrails but
is definitely, you know, worthlooking into for sure.
And you know, if your kid has asmartphone, you've got to be
(22:09):
diligent, you've got to belooking at that on a regular
basis.
And you know, probably thebiggest tip is the predators are
going to where the kids are.
So if it's a young kid, they'regoing to.
You know ABC, mouse, roblox,minecraft, fortnite, social
media, instagram, snapchat andTikTok are the big three.
(22:32):
Where they're, they're hangingout, and so the place to check
is going to be those chat rooms,private messaging, et cetera.
And just look at thoseconversations and you can kind
of take a step back.
You wouldn't let your11-year-old wander the mall by
(22:55):
herself.
Why would you let her wanderthe internet by herself?
Speaker 1 (22:59):
Yeah, yeah, exactly right.
The predators are out there andthey're coming to your kids.
Your kids don't have to findthem.
They are basically in a reallycrude way.
They're the bait and thosepredators are going to find them
.
So you, as a parent, have totake those precautions.
Look, more and more apps noware coming out where they can
(23:21):
hide stuff, so that even ifyou're looking at your kid's
phone, there's all kinds of waysthat they can hide those apps
that John was just talking aboutthe Roblox and the TikToks and
all those things.
But parents know what your kidsare doing on their devices.
I've talked to other people whoare experts in this, saying
(23:42):
don't let your child take theirphone into their bedroom or into
the bathroom.
Make sure that they're in apublic place or in the living
room with the rest of the family.
It's just too easy for them toget sucked into this.
So, john, that's going to wrapup this episode.
I'm going to give you last word, but I really think that this
(24:05):
is so incredibly important forour parents and for those teens
who are listening and thosemiddle schoolers who are going.
Man, I messed up.
Listen, there's hope.
John, I'm going to give you afinal word, and then we'll move
on next week to our next topic.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
Okay, yeah, you know, the, the, the, the kid may not
be looking for trouble, buttrouble is definitely looking
for them and they just have tobe aware of that.
If, if they get a message or afriend request from someone they
don't know, just you know,ignore it.
Uh, the problem is a lot ofteens.
(24:41):
They want big following numbers, big friend numbers.
There's a little bit ofself-esteem of having a thousand
friends and followers.
I guarantee not all thosethousand people are really your
friend and caution and prudenceis definitely the way to go and
(25:01):
try to live at that time.
Online they could be addicted.
Even if there's not a predator,they could be just wasting a
lot of time watching silly catvideos.
That's not great to do either.
Speaker 1 (25:15):
Amen, Amen.
Well, John, thank you forjoining us.
Parents and teens and middleschoolers who are watching,
check out the links in thedescription in the show notes.
We're going to have some greatresources there for you to
follow up on and listen.
Just be diligent.
The enemy is like a prowlinglion seeking who he may devour.
(25:39):
It's just getting too easy intoday's society.
So, John, thanks again forjoining us and be with us next
time as we talk about abortion.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
Yep, thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1 (25:52):
Absolutely Take care.
God bless you.
I'm back with John DiGirolamo, and we had him on
the show not too long ago.
If you haven't heard thisepisode, I want you to look this
one up.
It's called Protecting Teensfrom Human Trafficking and it's
John's fight against childexploitation Really good stuff.
This has become a rampant thingin our country.
We've been hearing more andmore about it online and on the
(00:41):
news, but we're going tocontinue a little bit along
those lines and then we're goingto jump into another topic
totally.
So this is going to be athree-part series with John,
because he's got a new book outthat was released a few months
ago and it touches on all ofthese things.
So we're going to hit this hard.
We're going to glean from John.
(01:01):
John, welcome back to the show.
We thank you for coming back on.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Yeah, thanks for having me.
I really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Yeah, absolutely so.
Your new book we'll brieflytouch on it and, again, I'm
going to put this preface at thebeginning.
This is not a book review.
I found John a while back and Iloved the research that he's
doing on some of these topics.
And this book I'll let you talkabout it, john, but this book
really hits on three topics thatI think are so incredibly
(01:31):
important in our society today.
So, john, I'll let you talkabout the book.
Tell us who you are, for thosewho don't know, and what you're
doing.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
Yeah, so I'm an author of four books and I've
kind of got a theme going whereI'm looking to tell stories of
what's going on in our societyand I've kind of focused on
difficult topics humantrafficking, online exploitation
, et cetera, exploitation etc.
(02:08):
And uh and so, uh, you know, mylatest book it's not about the
devil really talks about, youknow, the ultimate predator,
which is satan, and some of theevil going on in our society
that is targeting vulnerablepeople.
Um, and so it's all non-fiction, it where I'm interviewing real
people there's case files,testimony etc.
And I'm putting together plotlines, story, emotion, dialogue,
(02:31):
action etc to reveal what'sgoing on in these people's lives
but also the broader picture ofwhat's going on in our society,
and doing that throughstorytelling.
And so I call it dramatizednonfiction.
I wanted to read like afast-paced fiction novel, but
it's all true, it's all realstuff.
(02:53):
So you know, the devil is busyin our modern society and his
greatest trick is to convince usthat he doesn't exist.
And I think a lot of peoplehave kind of fallen into that
thought process in our secular,growing secular world.
So I focused on three people.
I focused on a police officerwho goes undercover online as a
(03:19):
13-year-old girl and everyparent needs to know what
happens and how these predatorsare operating.
The second story is about anabortion doctor who becomes a
pro-life advocate and it's adecades-long journey and how
that happens and how she seesthe value of the unborn, and
(03:39):
then the insider's view to whatgoes on in an exorcism.
I interviewed the guy whoco-wrote the training manual for
exorcists so I really got theinside scoop.
So really three differentstories, but they're tied
together by kind of thepredatory practices of people
(04:01):
and of really, you know, evilbehavior.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Boy, that's really good, and that's exactly why I
invited you back is because theenemy is real.
Satan is real, yeah, and hemasquerades as an angel of light
.
We read through Scripture quitea bit about Satan and his
practices.
We're supposed to be wise asserpent and gentle as doves.
(04:28):
We want to bring that wisdomthat you've gleaned from these
stories to those who arewatching and listening, because
it's so important to understandthe enemy's tactics, because if
we don't, we're going to fallfor them.
Yeah, we're going to fall forthem, yeah, and I think that's
really what's happened to oursociety today is years ago, I
think we were more sensitive tothings that were considered bad,
(04:51):
and now it's almost like wepraise those who are creating
their own truth.
And I think it's important whatyou have to say about each of
these topics.
So that's really what ourpodcasts, our next three
episodes, are going to be thisone we'll talk about the online
predators, and then we'll talkabout the abortion doctor who
(05:14):
experienced a shift in how sheviewed that whole practice, and
then it'll still be in time forHalloween of all times We'll
talk about the exorcism stuffand what you've gleaned from
that.
So let's start off with today'sepisode Online Predators.
(05:35):
Now, last time we talked aboutthis a little bit.
We talked about the traffickingand how that can work, but I
want you to tell us what youlearned from this online
predator situation with theofficer, and I got to read just
a little bit of the book and itstarts out with a, I believe, a
14-year-old girl who quoteunquote innocently shared a
(05:57):
topless picture with the boy.
And then you brought in thisSRO, this officer, who was in
the schools and had to deal withthat.
So that's kind of set the stage.
Let me have you tell us, then,what you got from this and tell
us a little bit about thegentleman who is actually.
(06:19):
These, again, are real stories.
Tell us about the gentlemanwho's actually in law
enforcement and was onlineposing.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Yeah, you know, I was doing a lot of talks about
human trafficking and I keptgetting questions about the
online piece of that, and Iwanted to explore the broader
picture, because there's a lotof predators out there online,
but they may be doing otherthings besides trafficking and
it's actually a bigger problemthan trafficking in general.
(06:50):
So I interviewed Officer DavidGomez, who's a very well-known
police officer, school resourceofficer who trains other law
enforcement people, teens aswell as parents.
He's got a pretty largeFacebook following and he gives
tips on a regular basis, and soI wanted to profile his story,
(07:12):
his life, how did he become anexpert?
And so it starts out with he'sgot this job in a middle school
as a school resource officer,and he gets called to two kids
fighting.
Nothing really unusual aboutthat except, to his surprise, it
(07:32):
was because one of the teengirls had sent a topless photo
to the other girl's boyfriend,and so it was causing a lot of
drama, and what he discoveredwas that this was not a one-off.
This was something that'shappening in the middle school
(07:54):
level as well as high school,and so the story starts out by
kind of getting your attentionof what's going on.
What is going on with the teenbrain at this time that makes
them think that that's an okaything to do.
And so the story progresses ofdealing with these two teens.
(08:18):
You know the officer talks toparents who don't seem to be as
involved or don't seem to be asdisturbed by this as he was.
And when he startedinvestigating this he found out
that many of these boys wereasking pictures from multiple
(08:39):
people and it just kind of blewup from there where it went,
from these two people heinvestigated to it, landed up
confiscating over 20 differentteen phones that had explicit
pictures and we're seeing teensexting as a real, significant
issue.
(09:00):
I've talked to teachers, peopleon superintendents, school
boards etc.
And they all say every one ofthem from around the country
that this is happening rightunder our nose around the
country, that this is happeningright under our nose and it
starts at the middle schoollevel and and so you know, for
(09:21):
his story it developed into um,not just looking at that, but
who else is out there asking forpictures besides classmates?
And it really kind of in hismind begged the questions why,
where and how predators areoperating, because a predator
(09:44):
could also approach a teen andtry to get explicit pictures.
And once they do, then it's notjust in a class, in a classmate
type of situation, which is badenough, but it gets worse
because then you have no ideawho's on the other side of that
(10:06):
digital transaction, if you will, or the other side of that
keyboard trying to get thisteen's picture.
And so we really kind ofexplore the why, where and how,
and I think that's somethingthat we should go into.
Speaker 1 (10:20):
Yeah for sure.
Now you said something that isa bit shocking to me, and that
is that the girl's parentsdidn't quite see the extreme.
I guess extreme, I guess theshock of it all.
My wife and I, we have now 20and 21-year-old kids.
(10:40):
They're in college age and backin middle school.
This is something that we haddiscussions about because it was
happening back then.
This would have been seven,eight years ago.
First of all, why is this sodangerous?
I get it, but I also know thereare parents out there who feel
(11:01):
like you know it's going tohappen.
It's really not a big deal andI think you'll probably get into
that.
But what, initially, do youhave to say to those parents
that just feel like you knowwhat they're?
Just kids it's, you know, it'sjust a part of growing up in
this digital age.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Yeah, those parents are not looking out for their
kids.
You know we live in a parentalgeneration that wants to be the
friend and not be the parent.
You can be the friend when yourkid is 30.
When they're 14, that is notthe time to do that.
But if you look at kind of thebroader picture, you've got um,
(11:42):
the media, celebrities et cetera, telling parents you can do
this in a safe way.
You can.
You know, and I'm just here totell you, there is no safe way
for anyone, kid or adult, tosend an explicit picture of
themselves.
You lose complete control overwhat happens next and we've
(12:03):
heard of terms like revenge porn, where somebody sends a picture
, they break up and then nextthing you know they're being
extorted for some other reason.
The other piece of this is whatis the media telling kids?
Well, it's telling them thesame thing you can do this in a
safe way, send it to a trustedfriend, etc.
(12:24):
That just doesn't happen.
So you've got this messagetelling kids one, you can do it
safely and two, it's kind of nobig deal.
But the reality is is once a, aperson sends that, they lose
control and you look back atwhat, the why sorry, the why are
(12:49):
predators doing doing this?
Why do they want to exploitkids?
Well, they're either looking toget pictures to get money or
they want to meet for a physicalencounter.
So when it comes to sexting,there's ramifications that the
teen brain is just not thinkingof One.
(13:11):
Those digital images lastforever.
A lot of times there's regretand shame, so they're going to
many times have emotional issues, depression, self-harm, suicide
etc.
And it can lead to a lot ofthis cyberbullying, etc.
(13:35):
But it becomes broader whenit's not just a classmate, when
it's somebody out there.
And a great example of this ishow predators target teen boys
and there's a tactic, a veryspecific tactic that they use.
I've talked to more than onepolice officer who have said
(13:57):
that this tactic can happen inless than 24 hours.
And so what is that tactic Inpractical terms?
A teen boy will get approachedonline by a profile that's a
very good looking, saycollege-age girl, and they're
going to want to join theirsocial network.
(14:18):
Teen boy sees good-looking girl, you know, click sure, I'll
accept that friendship follower,etc.
All of a sudden, that teen boystarts getting unsolicited
explicit pictures from this girl, many times that could be
downloaded from a pornographicwebsite.
So this, this quote you know,hot girl is sending explicit
(14:43):
pictures to the boy.
Then she will say, well, I'veshown you, now you show me.
And pressures the teen boy tosend pictures back to her.
Many times they're tricked intothis.
They succumb, they will sendthese pictures and immediately
they get extorted for money Ifthey pay.
(15:05):
Five minutes later they'reasking for more money again and
if they don't pay, they willthreaten to send these pictures,
these embarrassing pictures ofthis boy, to that person's
social network, to their parents, their friends, their teachers,
et cetera.
This is a very real tactic,happens way too often.
(15:27):
And now this boy is stuck.
What does he do?
He, his money is going to runout, probably real fast, and he,
he's going to have, you know, alot of mental anguish over this
, and this is a real issue thatwe've seen.
You know suicide attempts aswell, as you know really taking
(15:50):
one's own life because of this,and it can happen so fast and
that's what parents don'tunderstand.
Speaker 1 (15:56):
This can happen in less than 24 hours and and
that's just a really, reallydisturbing trend that we're
starting to see in our societytoday so I think you kind of
expanded on the the generalthought that it's just here
(16:17):
within my community, it's justwithin my son or my daughter's
school.
You just blew that out of thewater because I know that For
those who listen and watchregular I work at Covenant Eyes
my full-time job and so we seethe statistics coming in all the
time of the same thing thatteen depression, teen suicide,
(16:39):
the anxiety, all those thingsand they really are related to a
lot of what you just talkedabout.
Let's face it, john, if wewould have had cell phones
growing up, our lives would havelooked a lot different than
what they do now.
Because generally and you knowthis is a generalization we all
(16:59):
do things we wished we wouldn'thave done when we were growing
up.
Heck, I still do them today, youknow.
But we, you can't take thosethings back.
You know, when you say thatstuff is on the Internet forever
, it really is.
It's stored somewhere, whetheryou want to believe it or not.
Talk about those kids who knowexactly what you're talking
(17:26):
about because they've been there.
Maybe they've just shared aphoto, maybe they went through
that extortion process, maybethey have been asked to meet up
with someone because of thosesexting photos.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
Right.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
What do you say to those kids now that are kind of
going yeah, I get it.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
Yeah, I mean you can.
Certainly, if you know whereyour picture has maybe been
posted, you can try to scrub theinternet of that it is.
It is really difficult.
There's different resources,such as, you know, the National
Center of Missing and ExploitedChildren.
They've got some resources tohelp parents not only have these
(18:07):
discussions but also to youknow what happens if, if the, if
the horses are already out ofthe barn, so to speak.
Yeah, but they really have tohave those.
They have to have thoseconversations with their parents
, with a trusted adult.
They can't do it alone.
You know most parents are goingto react with wanting to support
(18:30):
their child and understand thatthey made a mistake.
And how do you deal with it andmove on from there?
But until that kid has thatdiscussion, they're really going
to spiral downward and thepredator is counting on that
embarrassment they're countingon.
(18:52):
Well, you showed me this.
Now you've got to show me moreputting that pressure on them,
on that teen, and then it justgets worse and worse and they
just can't.
You know they just can't getout of that situation and so
they've got to have thoseconversations.
You know it could be somethingwhere, if they have been cyber
(19:12):
bullied.
You know there's definitelycounseling available and things
like that.
But they have to know thatthere are resources, there's
people that love them and theycannot solve this on their own.
They've got to go to thattrusted adult, their parents,
etc.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
Yeah, such great advice, john.
The child or the teen who'slistening right now, who's in
that situation.
Listen, I've not been there.
I've not had this happen to me,but I do know as an adult.
I know John is, is is right onthere's hope.
It may be embarrassing, it maybe humiliating, but you need to
(19:53):
go get the resources that areavailable to you to help you out
of the mess.
So don't don't think this isyou know, there's no end to this
.
The hard part is justconfessing and reaching out.
Speaker 2 (20:06):
Yeah, I mean now is the time, if you're in that
situation, both for the parentand the child to lean on God,
lean on Jesus, for that support,for knowing that it's not just
your parents that love you.
God loves you too.
Now's the time to remind themall about that, that they're not
(20:28):
in it alone and they've got aloving God who wants to help
them get through this.
And so it's an opportunity tokind of reiterate some of those
biblical values.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
Absolutely, John.
You brought up one resource forparents who are listening, you
know go to a pastor, a trustedspiritual advisor, counselor.
There's counseling out therethat can help and there's also
organizations out there who arefighting this stuff daily, who
know how to help you get throughthis.
Speaker 2 (21:18):
Organizations out there who are fighting this
stuff daily, who know how tohelp you get through this.
So, yeah, boy, it's a, it's atough thing, but it's a reality
in today's world and that has tohappen often and early.
You can't just have it whenthey're 15 and be done with it.
You've got to start out withhaving these conversations about
predators, about being safeonline and honestly delaying
(21:43):
their smartphone usage, theironline activity, as much as
possible.
So you know there's things likedumb phones, which a lot of
parents are using.
There's parental controlsoftware which is guardrails but
is definitely, you know, worthlooking into for sure.
And you know, if your kid has asmartphone, you've got to be
(22:09):
diligent, you've got to belooking at that on a regular
basis.
And you know, probably thebiggest tip is the predators are
going to where the kids are.
So if it's a young kid, they'regoing to.
You know ABC, mouse, roblox,minecraft, fortnite, social
media, instagram, snapchat andTikTok are the big three.
(22:32):
Where they're, they're hangingout, and so the place to check
is going to be those chat rooms,private messaging, et cetera.
And just look at thoseconversations and you can kind
of take a step back.
You wouldn't let your11-year-old wander the mall by
(22:55):
herself.
Why would you let her wanderthe internet by herself?
Speaker 1 (22:59):
Yeah, yeah, exactly right.
The predators are out there andthey're coming to your kids.
Your kids don't have to findthem.
They are basically in a reallycrude way.
They're the bait and thosepredators are going to find them
.
So you, as a parent, have totake those precautions.
Look, more and more apps noware coming out where they can
(23:21):
hide stuff, so that even ifyou're looking at your kid's
phone, there's all kinds of waysthat they can hide those apps
that John was just talking aboutthe Roblox and the TikToks and
all those things.
But parents know what your kidsare doing on their devices.
I've talked to other people whoare experts in this, saying
(23:42):
don't let your child take theirphone into their bedroom or into
the bathroom.
Make sure that they're in apublic place or in the living
room with the rest of the family.
It's just too easy for them toget sucked into this.
So, john, that's going to wrapup this episode.
I'm going to give you last word, but I really think that this
(24:05):
is so incredibly important forour parents and for those teens
who are listening and thosemiddle schoolers who are going.
Man, I messed up.
Listen, there's hope.
John, I'm going to give you afinal word, and then we'll move
on next week to our next topic.
Speaker 2 (24:20):
Okay, yeah, you know, the, the, the, the kid may not
be looking for trouble, buttrouble is definitely looking
for them and they just have tobe aware of that.
If, if they get a message or afriend request from someone they
don't know, just you know,ignore it.
Uh, the problem is a lot ofteens.
(24:41):
They want big following numbers, big friend numbers.
There's a little bit ofself-esteem of having a thousand
friends and followers.
I guarantee not all thosethousand people are really your
friend and caution and prudenceis definitely the way to go and
(25:01):
try to live at that time.
Online they could be addicted.
Even if there's not a predator,they could be just wasting a
lot of time watching silly catvideos.
That's not great to do either.
Speaker 1 (25:15):
Amen, Amen.
Well, John, thank you forjoining us.
Parents and teens and middleschoolers who are watching,
check out the links in thedescription in the show notes.
We're going to have some greatresources there for you to
follow up on and listen.
Just be diligent.
The enemy is like a prowlinglion seeking who he may devour.
(25:39):
It's just getting too easy intoday's society.
So, John, thanks again forjoining us and be with us next
time as we talk about abortion.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
Yep, thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1 (25:52):
Absolutely Take care.
God bless you.
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