From Cars to Roofs: The Unexpected Connection Between Industries

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Ty Cobb-Backer sits down with Woody Casey, owner of AJ's Dent, for a candid conversation about entrepreneurship, building trust, and creating industry connections that transcend traditional boundaries.

• Woody shares his journey from college graduate to paintless dent repair business owner
• How a chance invitation to a roofing convention created unexpected industry connections
• The surprising parallels between the roofing and automotive repair industries
• Building a referral system between roofing companies and dent repair that creates transparency
• Overcoming trust issues to empower team members and delegate effectively
• The entrepreneurial mind described as a "merry-go-round" with multiple ideas spinning simultaneously
• Finding solutions by stepping away from problems rather than forcing answers
• Redefining success beyond financial metrics to include family presence and personal growth
• Learning to give clear direction while still empowering team members
• The importance of vulnerability and humility in leadership
• How struggles and challenges prepare us for future opportunities to help others

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Episode Transcript

Ty Cobb Backer (00:00):
Welcome back everybody to Behind the Tool
Belt, episode 276.
I'm your host, ty Cobb-Backer,and thank you for joining us on
this Wednesday edition.
Today we have another specialguest.
Stay tuned and we will be backafter our short intro from our

(00:34):
sponsors.

Speaker 2 (00:38):
Welcome to Behind the Tool Belt, where the stories
are bold, the conversations arereal and the insights come to
you live, raw and uncut.
Every week, host Ty Cobb-Backersits down with game changers,
trailblazers and industryleaders who aren't afraid to
tell it like it is no filters,no scripts, just the truth.

(01:00):
Please welcome your host ofBehind the Tool Belt, ty.

Ty Cobb Backer (01:05):
Cobb-Backer, welcome back to another episode
of Behind the Tool Belt, thepodcast where we dive into the
minds of industry leaders whoare changing the game
construction contracting andbeyond.
Today I have another awesomeguest, my friend Woody Casey.
How the hell are you doing,buddy?

Woody Casey (01:22):
I'm doing good.
Thanks for having me.

Ty Cobb Backer (01:23):
Yeah, thanks for coming all the way up here.
So, if I didn't mention yet,woody is in studio live with us
today.
He flew the whole way up herefrom Dallas, texas, and Woody
and I have a little bit of ahistory.
I met Woody a couple years ago.
Vic and myself, and I thinkChris Hofstra, ran into you at
SRC in Denton.

(01:44):
I think that was the first timewe ever met at that ice storm
in Denton, texas, which is stillone of probably my favorite
conferences.

Woody Casey (01:54):
Just because it was an incredible experience
because, being snowed in forseveral days, it was a core
group of people, it wasn't big,sorry.
April hall, um, she puts on anamazing show every year.
It's my favorite of all theones I get to go to, but
attendance kind of fell off forbecause of that snowstorm.
But for those of us that werethere, I got to know a lot of

(02:16):
people very well in the three,four days that we were snowed in
, so it was an amazingexperience I wouldn't recommend
it for a conference.
But you know, having done it Ilook back at that's some of the
funnest experiences I've had asfar as the conference goes.
Just being confined in a spacewith people and having to get to
know people because you'reforced in for an introvert it's

(02:38):
perfect for me to make me getout of my shell.

Ty Cobb Backer (02:41):
So, yeah, I can agree with that Same same and
most people wouldn't believe it,but I I'm also an introvert,
introverted, but that, that showwas a good show.
I got to Steven Spence.
Like you said, there was a coregroup of people.
Steven Spence with project map,it got to know him real, real
well and there was a there was agood group, good core group of

(03:04):
people and I think the hotelhandled it well as far as like
not running out of suppliesbecause that was, like, my
biggest concern.

Woody Casey (03:13):
There's a lot of things that that hotel did
behind the scenes to make surethat we were taken care of, and
one was the most people probablydon't know this, but the staff
didn't go home.
They stayed there in the hotel.
They gave them rooms so theywere on for a while, they'd be
out, they'd get some hours offand they kind of rotated.
But, yeah, the staff didn't gohome and so we got to see the
same people over and over againand there was the uh, the odd

(03:36):
night where I have to stay upall night, um, having fun, um,
and the girl that did thebreakfast comes down and she
goes you guys are down herealready.
She goes, I'll get breakfast,and I'm like, holy crap, it's
time for breakfast already.
Yeah, it was.
It was a lot of fun.
So, yeah, yeah, that was a.
That was an odd fluke for me tobe able to stay up all night.

Ty Cobb Backer (03:54):
Yeah, I normally don't do that yeah, no, we
ended up staying up pretty latetoo.
We actually ended up.
We rented it.
I think it was a jeep wagoneerthe the new Jeep Wagoneer
four-wheel drive.
We're from up north, so alittle ice storm isn't going to
affect us.
So we went and found a Buc-ee'sthat was open.
Never got to experienceBuc-ee's before and it was an

(04:17):
experience that I will neverforget.
And that place was packed Likethere was people from all over
the country in this one Buc-ee's, I feel like all over the world
.
It felt like because nobody wason the road, but when you went
to Buc-ee's it was lit up like africking Roman candle.

Woody Casey (04:32):
Buc-ee's is one of those.
I didn't realize what a touristattraction it is.
Friends of mine from anotherstate were there and they're
like, well, we have to go see abucky's and I'm like it's a gas
station.
Why, like well, we've heardabout it, we've seen it, you
know it's on our list of thingsto do and it's like okay, but
they have gas stationseverywhere yeah, yeah, bucket

(04:54):
list, I can believe it.

Ty Cobb Backer (04:55):
I mean, we've gone to a couple of them.
Uh, there was the newest onethat we've been to is right
outside, I think greenville,south carolina, going down 95,
or Charlotte, maybe Charlotte,north Carolina, somewhere down
95.
For us it was the newer.
We watched it being built so wehad to stop in there.
But I don't think we'll do itagain.
It's just too busy, too crazy,and we were hauling a trailer

(05:19):
the Beyond and Tool Belt trailerheading south and it's just too
much.
I don't know how truck driversthey don't allow truck drivers
in there, yeah, I oh okay Idon't.
Eyes aren't allowed in thereyeah, I don't blame them because
we barely got through with thetrailer on the back, yeah, it
says no semis allowed.

Woody Casey (05:33):
Okay, so makes sense, makes sense.
They uh, when they opened thefirst one, so the first one
outside of texas went to floridaand that was, I mean it made
you know Bucky's expanding andall that.
So it's, it's good on them.
They've created a verydefinable niche, so to speak,
and you know they have, they've,they've branded some of their

(05:55):
own stuff.
I was on a plane one time wetalk about happenstance kind of
meetings I'm on a plane one timewith the guy that supplies the
soda, little small town guy thatjust happened to start
supplying sodas to bucky's andthen his company has expanded
because of how big bucky's hasgotten and he's like it's I

(06:16):
never thought I could get thisbig, let alone have a, a brand
like this that carries me, hegoes, I'm getting into other
places because of them.
So it's one of those thingsthat you know the high tide
raises all boats kind of a thing.
Yeah, and if you go intobuckies they don't have they got
a few of the name brands.
You know the, the top brands,but they're all this off brand
and nothing is that brandbecause they're good sodas.

(06:37):
But yeah yeah, it's just one ofthose things where they have
this little supplier or had alittle supply.

Ty Cobb Backer (06:41):
He's getting bigger now, yeah, but it's you
know, it's just right place,right time yes, exactly, we were
kind of talking about thatearlier, where your network
becomes your net worth.
Yeah, and that's a perfectexample of, you know, providing
a great service and a greatproduct at a, you know, a
reasonable price, I wouldimagine.
And now he, he has theopportunity to provide buckies

(07:02):
with all their beverages, ortheir sodas that particular soda
, I guess.
But no, it's good, it's good.
So for those of you that don'tknow Woody, I guess we should
probably introduce Woody andtell us a little bit about Woody
.
Woody isn't from the roofingindustry and I want to get into
that conversation like wherethat connection came from, and

(07:24):
I'm sure you can thatconversation like where that
connection came from, and I'msure you can, you can share that
with us on from your backgroundof things like that.
But we met Woody at a roofingconvention and I got the, I get
the, the the privilege to be ina mastermind group with, with
Woody as well.
Vic got to share some time withhim this past.
What was it January this past?

(07:45):
What was it January this past?
January, I think we all went toCayman and Woody has been a
huge influence on me, especiallywhen it comes to stepping
outside my comfort zone Becausescuba diving is not, you know, I
don't know, very comfortable.
At times I don't know verycomfortable.

(08:07):
At times it's becomecomfortable for me.
But you've been an inspirationfor me of watching you and how
relaxed you are in the waterallows me to know that this is
fun.
It reminds me you watching youand just having fun under the
water and stuff like that.
So I appreciate that and Iappreciate you a lot.
So give us a little background.
Tell us what industry you're inand then how you a lot.
So give us, give us a littlebackground.
You know, you know what.
Tell us what industry you're inand then and then how, how you

(08:28):
got to this industry.
Okay, and then what it was like, what it's like now and how you
got here.

Woody Casey (08:34):
So what you want, what you're saying and what I'm
hearing is you want me to talkfor three hours nonstop.

Ty Cobb Backer (08:39):
You put it into a 30 minute.

Woody Casey (08:42):
Yeah, my name is Woody Casey.
I'm the owner of AJ's Dent.
We are a paintless dent repaircompany.
We fix hail damage on cars,minor dents, door dings, that
kind of stuff.
But I'll have to paint the carI got in the industry in 95.
Kind of a fluke I was workingat in Omaha, nebraska Shout out

(09:04):
to Eric.
I was working in a place calledQ's automotive and, having
graduated college a couple ofyears before um and having
realized that I was not builtfor corporate um, I was not
built to sit in a cubicle and Iwas not built to play nice in um
, those kinds of settings Ilearned I was fine in college.

(09:24):
But when I got out of college Irealized that there's no filter
between my brain and my mouthand my mouth runs faster than my
brain.
So, um, being in a corporatestructure was going to work for
me.
So I was working in anautomotive industry which,
growing up on a farm, I've gotvery good skills with cars and I
can fix almost anything exceptclocks, um.
But I was working in anautomotive and one of the guys I

(09:46):
work with had quit and comes ina week later and says he's
learning how to fix dents incars without having to paint it.
And this is a 95.
And I'm like, yeah, it'simpossible.
I've been around cars all of mylife.
If there was anything out therelike that, I would have heard
about it.
He goes no, no, it's true.
And so I went and checked itout, interviewed, got hired and
started my career there, workedbriefly for that company those

(10:10):
in the roofing industry canrelate to not getting paid.
I worked for two months.
That well, I worked for sixmonths for that company, for
about two months.
For not getting paid, um leftthat company.
Um, there's a short story abouthow we got aj's dent the name.
But um went on to start my ownbusiness and start working as a

(10:32):
subcontractor for other peoplemoved to colorado in 98.
Um had an opportunity.
I worked for a company calledadb auto body and glass from 97
to 98.
They opened up some stores outthere.
I went out there.
We parted ways about six monthslater and I started on my own,
had a great time living inColorado, working there, built a

(10:55):
decent sized business there.
The downturn in the economy in07, 09, we took a big hit.
I lost 30% of my body shops.
They went under um, some ofthem owing me money which caused
some financial hardships for me.
Um came back from that and youknow we're still going strong.
So we're still trying to gostrong, I guess Um.

(11:18):
And the second part of yourquestion is why am I in the
roofing space?
Yeah, so about six years ago, Iguess.
Now um shout out to charliechina, um friend of ours, went
to work for him out in vegas andhe was uh tied in to win the
storm.
And I come into work one dayand kim goes tosh is going to um

(11:41):
sell us tickets to a roofingconvention.
So we're going to do a zoomcall and I looked at kim and I
said, uh, you know, we work oncars, not roofs.
And she goes.
Tasha's a good friend andtasha's done some of our
marketing and some of our um uh,internet stuff, a website
design, and good friend.
So she's like we can spend anhour listening to her to give a

(12:03):
pitch.
She needs way to practice on.
I'm like, okay, great, sitspend an hour listening to her
to give a pitch.
She needs somebody to practiceon.
I'm like, okay, great, sit down.
And she goes through a pitch.
She does a great job.
Charlie's off screen a littlebit just coaching her here and
there she gets all done.
And I lean over to Kim.
I said, buy two tickets, Idon't care what they cost, just
buy two tickets.
It'll make her look good, youknow.

(12:27):
So we did a couple months go byand kim goes hey, you know we
got these tickets to thatroofing thing.
And I'm like again, kim, that'sroofing, we're in cars, and she
goes, but it's in vegas.
And I'm like, okay, we'll makeit a company trip.
I said, um, get your husband,get two rooms, we'll get tickets
, airplane tickets, we'll flyout there for the weekend.
Call it a work trip, air quotesand, uh, have some fun in vegas

(12:50):
.
And I like to play poker andyou know, if I don't go to the
roofing convention, I'll justplay poker for the whole time.
So we go out there and, ofcourse, we got to put on
appearance because we didn't payfor the tickets.
So we go down and the firstpeople we run into is the Valor
Roofing out of Denver, coloradoFriends Wars.
I'm like, oh well, there mightbe people here, we know, so
start walking around.
This first time I ever saw SamTaggart I watched these guys get

(13:13):
up on stage and get awards forbeing million dollar producers
and I was in the process oftrying to hire outside
salespeople and there was someroofing companies you know a lot
of roofing companies there andstarting to have conversations
with them, realizing that wehave a lot of things in common.
We have to deal with adjusterswho don't know what they're
doing.
We have to deal with insurancecompanies who don't want to pay

(13:36):
for what we do and, at the endof the day, we have the same
clients, their customers, whohave hail damage on roofs, have
hail damage on cars.
So, coming back from that event, and I can honestly say Sam
Taggart is probably the one whohad the biggest impact on me at
that event and just his hismindset on sales and stuff.

(13:56):
Maybe start to think about that.
So, coming back, I sat down withKim and our IT guy and he said
I want something that I canpresent to roofing companies.
There's plenty of crossoverbetween roofers and paintless
dent repair people, and I knowplenty of companies in my
industry that will see a roofer,a sales guy, walking down the

(14:17):
street and say, hey, for everycar you bring me, I'll give you
a couple hundred bucks.
So that guy spends half his dayselling cars back and forth for
this PDR company, painlessdinner company, and the guy
who's paying him to be on thedoors is losing money.
So I didn't want to do that.
So I wanted something that wastransparent, something that I

(14:38):
could be held accountable for,because going into it, I
realized that those clients arethe roofing company's clients,
not mine.
So I have to be at a highstandard in order to get them to
refer, because you don't wantto refer somebody that's going
to do a bad job.
Right, if you're putting a roofon there and you outsource your
windows or your gutters, theygot to show up the day they say

(14:58):
they're going to.
They got to put on a qualityproduct, otherwise it makes you
look bad.
So I want something that were,if six months down the road
there's a problem, the roofingcompany can call me and ask me
and I will know what's going on.
So part of that process wasthat we use JobNimbus.
It doesn't work for my industrybut it works great for yours.

(15:18):
So we started using that as ourCRM so that we could track
every interaction with everycustomer.
So you can call us six monthsfrom now and ask us what
happened.
The other thing that I told myIT guy was I want something that
is gets it.
When we get the leads, we knowwhere it came from and they're
not just out handing outbusiness cards.
So something that was trackable.

(15:39):
So he built us a webpage.
So we built a landing page forevery roofing company that we
work with.
It's logoed with their logo andit's a little bit about us and
a little bit about how theprocess works.
But, most importantly, there'sa client fill out form on it and
they fill that out.
We get an email.
It shows us which roofingcompany sent it, which sales
guys sent it to us.

(15:59):
So cause we pay commission backto the roofing company.
Support and our checks don't goto the individual sales guys,
they go actually to the roofingcompany because I want every
owner to know what their guysare doing, if they're giving us
leads, if they're not giving usleads, what the return is on
that.
So I want everything to be ableto go through the company owner
first and then out to the salesguys.
So we pay commission back tothe roofing company and then

(16:22):
they split up between them andtheir sales guys.
So that's kind of how all thatkind of came about.
And we worked.
We've had the privilege ofworking with I couldn't tell you
how many roofing companies, butwe've worked with quite a few,
mostly in the hell belt Atlanta,chicago, minneapolis, denver.
Our brick and mortars areDenver for for 20 years, um,

(16:46):
dallas, fort worth area foreight and minneapolis for three.

Ty Cobb Backer (16:51):
Wow that you know, for someone like me that
makes complete sense.
You know what I mean, but I andthat's why I wanted you to
explain it to our viewers here,because, you know, once they
found out that that you own owna, a Denton repair company for
vehicles, they're probably likewhy, what's the connection?
You know what I mean and I andI'm and I'm asking that question

(17:12):
because I asked myself thatquestion when I saw you in
Denton Um, so that's why Iwanted to explain to you.
But but, um, that makes so muchsense.
And it's funny story too aboutwhen the storm.
It's funny how, when the stormhas such, has had such an impact
on our industry, whether peoplewant to admit that or not.

(17:40):
You know to go, cause you knowconferences, you know there
wasn't many back then, and so we, we went out to Vegas, cause I
think the first couple of few atleast, were in Vegas, at least
the one that we went to was inVegas.
And we went out there and wecame back different, like, first

(18:02):
and foremost we thought that wewere hot shit on a silver
platter.
But when we got there werealized real quick that we were
just a cold turd on a paperplate doing the volume that we
did at that time, okay, butbecause of that, it had opened
our eyes to so much more and wediscovered that we weren't by
ourselves anymore.
And you said Sam Taggart had animpact on you.
Well, scott Riopala I don't knowif you know him or not

(18:23):
Interstate Roofing he was one ofthe speakers there and he is
giving me goosebumps right nowJust thinking about it had such
a huge impact.
His personal story resembles alot of Jana and I's personal
story, and so it resonated.
Everything that he was talkingabout, from the ebbs and flows
and personal difficulties andprofessional difficulties and

(18:47):
everything Like basically, hejust shared a story up on stage.
It wasn't like he was droppingnuggets out there, it was just
more inspirational.

Woody Casey (18:53):
He's a true bootstraps.
Yeah, from nothing, yeah.

Ty Cobb Backer (18:57):
Something saying you know that's it's giving me
goosebumps right now, I mean.
And then we ran into Eric andPaul Reed for the very first
time that met Eric and I wasterrified to go over there again
I'm an introvert, right.
So on the expo flooreverybody's got their signs up
and it said roofers in recovery.

(19:20):
So that could mean one of twothings that could be a recovery.
There's a lot of insuranceadjusters and claims and and and
just it.
It's an insurance stormrestoration recovery.
You know, conference that we'reat, but we were kind of like
what, what is that?
So janna, being the littlesocial butterfly that she is,

(19:42):
she walks over to their boothand basically their booth is
like three couches and a coffeetable with just some dudes
sitting around cutting it up.
And Jana was like hey, what,what, what is this about?
And of course we've learned.
We learned what it was and ofcourse this is like the greatest
day of my life.
I would listen to Scott, rita,paula on stage.

(20:03):
We're at a roofing conference.
We're not in this by ourselvesanymore, you know, it just
opened up the whole roofingindustry to us and and so it
sounds like you kind of had thatsame aha moment when you came
back home, your juices wereflowing, you know.

Woody Casey (20:19):
It's yes In a way I never really imagined you know,
I we talk about this a lot.
I don't really consider myself asmart person, but I know I am
and in some ways.
But when you meet people likeSam, like Scott, like Paul and
other people that are in theindustry and you know I've got a

(20:39):
lot of friends in the industrynow that they may not be any
smarter than what you are theyjust think about things a little
bit differently and learninghow to open your mind to other
possibilities.
In my industry I've made a lotof mistakes.
I was very close minded for along time.
I was very being an introvert,you know.

(21:01):
I got a lot of things on myplate for a long time and I did
very well with it, and then thatplate started to shrink and I
couldn't think, I couldn'tfigure out how to get off and
get another plate, so to speak,and so my plate started
shrinking, started shrinking,started shrinking.
And then 07, 08, 09 hit and itreally shrunk and I struggled

(21:22):
and I went back to what I knew,which was traveling and chasing
hail and, yeah, I can make greatmoney doing that, but that's
not where my passion or I wantedto build my business, not work
for somebody else's business.
So, going to the roofingconference and I tell this to
everybody in the in the roofingindustry I have better friends
and more connections inside theroofing industry than I ever did

(21:43):
in my own, and it's weird tosay that because I've been in
mine for 30 years.
I've been in roofing for likesix not that I'm actually in
roofing, I'm just in the spaceand the friends I call when I
need somebody to talk to are inthe roofing industry.
The friends I call when I needadvice, the friends I call when
I have a great day they're inthe roofing industry, they're
not in mine.
It's amazing how the roofingindustry is where I wish my

(22:08):
industry was.
My industry is starting to getthere, but it's a decade behind
the roofing industry.
We're still in my industry.
There's still a lot ofcutthroats out there, a lot of
shady characters, a lot of guyswho do business every year and
then change their company nameso they can hire new guys and
screw more people over and Iknow it's happened in the
roofing industry.

(22:28):
But you guys are rising abovethat a lot faster than we are
and I really love that aboutyour industry that you got guys
who will put on mastermindgroups with other roofing owners
and be supportive even ifthey're in the same market.
It's amazing to watch that andthat camaraderie and that, that
kinship, fellowship, that'sthere.

(22:50):
I absolutely.
It's one of the things like Iget goosebumps sitting here
talking to you about thisbecause it's it means so much to
me because I've been able to dothings in my life that I never
thought I would.
Some it's from the connectionsI've made in the roofing
industry and some it's just fromthe industry that I'm in
because it's like roofing, it'sgood money.

(23:11):
You know, yeah, I have acollege degree but I got a lot
of friends that are in myindustry that maybe not made out
of high school but they'remaking six figures a year.
I've traveled all over the worldWe've talked about this before
in scuba diving.
There isn't hardly anywhere inthe world that you can go scuba
diving that I haven't been.
My list of places I still wantto go to is small.

(23:31):
My list of places I want to goback to is very huge and I get
that freedom and that financialability to be able to do that.
And my girlfriend and I aregoing to the Maldives in a week
and I can't wait to take herthere.
You know going to the mallthese in a week and I can't wait
to take you there.
You know I don't get tooexcited about things until I get
there because I've had badtrips, but you know I'm talking

(23:51):
about it like this.
I'm fucking excited about going.
You know, I get a 10 days.
I get to go scuba diving.
I get to show this stuff off toa girl I love.
You know it's, it's amazing tome.
So, and it's I can truly saythat scuba diving is one of my
biggest passions.

Ty Cobb Backer (24:07):
So yeah, I know that for sure and I've got to
witness that and experience thatwith you, alongside with you.
You mentioned something earlier.
You know about not being thesmartest guy and and and and I
think you know it soundsnegative, but but I know you're
not putting yourself down.
And then you did follow up withsaying you know it sounds
negative, but I know you're notputting yourself down.
And then you did follow up withsaying you know, in certain

(24:28):
facets, certain areas, right, oryou don't think of things the
way that other people might.
And I think, as business ownersor parents or leaders of
whatever, I think that can beone of our greatest strengths
knowing that we do havedeficiencies, weaknesses that
we're not so good in.

(24:48):
And obviously you've identifiedthat.
How long did it take you and wetalked about this earlier before
, offline here but how long didit take you to be able to put
the pride and the ego down, like, when did you identify, like,
look, I'm going to raise my hand, I'm waving the white flag here

(25:08):
.
I need to surround myselfaround smarter people, like,
what?
Was there a moment, was there atragedy?
Was there something in yourcareer where you're kind of like
you know what I need to open upand I need to start asking for
help so probably a little bit ofit started.

Woody Casey (25:26):
Um, there there's.
There's a couple of turningpoints in my life.
Um, one was, uh, realizing thatfamily is not family, um, that
the family will take if you letthem, and I thought that I could
be the Superman and the herofor everybody, and it cost me a

(25:50):
lot, um, so, coming on thebackside of that, um, I had to
kind of change a little bit.
But when I say I had to change,it probably took me three or
four years.
Um, in our mastermind group,eric's talking about trust, and

(26:11):
for me it's trust.
Um, I got to the point I didn'ttrust anybody, and not to go
too deep into this, but I toldyou, I've been.
I went to therapy a long timeago and what my therapist told
me is, when the people thatteach you how to trust meaning
your parents break your trust,it is hard to recover.

(26:32):
And so there's a point in mylife and I can't pinpoint it
specifically, but it's probablyeight, nine years ago where I
kind of just threw my hands upand said, okay, god, if this is
what you're going to, this isthe way you're going to treat me
.
I'm just going to just open upand let everything happen that

(26:55):
can possibly happen to me.
I'm tired of being closed off,I'm tired of living a negative
life, so to speak.
And I just said you know what,I'm going to start trusting
people until they prove I can't.
And then I'm just I'm apessimist.
I tell people I'm a pessimistwith an optimistic hope.
And it's funny and people likewell, why are you a pessimist?

(27:16):
Well, if you believe the worst,the only true things that
surprise you is things that arebetter.
So if you go through life as apessimist, your your.
Your emotions that come to youare happiness and joy because
things are better than youexpected them to be, whereas if
you're an optimist and thingshappen, then you're the opposite
of that You're sad because badthings happen.
So if you expect the bad thingsand you plan for them, then

(27:38):
everything that happens to youis easy.
You know, one of my favoriteshows is Navy Seals, and the
only easy day was yesterday.
So if you kind of look at lifeas you wake up, you know it's
going to be a battle, but you'reprepared and you're going to
get through it.
And then tonight when you go tobed, you can reflect on it and
see how well you did.
So back to that trust thing.

(28:00):
So I started opening up.
I have a Kim that works for me.
She's my operations manager.
She has stuck with me throughthick and thin.
She's been with me now, I think, 14 years, 15 years, something
like that.
She's seen the good in me,she's seen the bad in me and
she's still there.

(28:20):
Her family's my family.
So Kim has I shouldn't say thison the air Kim has access to
everything I own.
If she really wanted to screwme over, she could.
She's probably the one personin my life that has.
She has my personal bankaccounts.
She has all my information.
She has every password I have.

(28:41):
Because she's a person who runsmost of my business life and my
finances.
I have to trust her to do that,and I do.
She's been a wonderful personin my life.
She's happily married.
So not to me, but yeah, it's.
Trusting her was probably one ofthe ways that caught me to

(29:04):
start trusting others and I lookat people who are surrounded by
a lot of great friends and Itell people I don't have a lot
of great friends, I have a lotof few.
I have a few friends that Igreatly admire and appreciate,
but over the last six, eightyears my friendship circle has
grown immensely to.
I couldn't even tell you howmany friends I have now.

(29:25):
You know it's it's.
It's been a complete changing.
But back to your originalquestion was I don't know when
that really took hold in my life.
It's been a very gradual climbfor me.
It's something I struggle with.
You know we talked aboutjudging people based on
appearances earlier.
I still fall guilty of that andI'm pleasantly surprised a lot

(29:48):
when people aren't what theythought they were in a negative
way.

Ty Cobb Backer (29:51):
So yeah, no, great response.
I like it was a great answer.
Like not no, not knowing whenthat exactly took place.
In it, it's progress, right itit.
It takes time, I think, cause Iwas just sitting here thinking
back to like that I'm still notperfect at you know.
Um, you know, I still want toknow all the answers, I still

(30:13):
want to be Superman, I stillwant to get in there and help
people and and uh.
But you know it, I think therewas, there was, there was a
tragedy in my life where itbegan, I think, and it may have
started even before then, butand I talk about this a lot as
well it was the passing of mymom, and before she passed away,
she, I had the privilege tohave her move in with us for a

(30:36):
couple of years up until sheliterally passed away in our
home and we were out one nightand, and you know, everything
came through my cell phone,everything came through.
I mean all of it sales calls,repairs, service, everything
leads.
It was the company phone and Iknow I always answered it, but I

(30:58):
was really burning both candlesat the end here.
You know I was, you know notthat I was taking care of my mom
.
My significant other, jana, has, god bless, her too took care
of my mom full time basically,and at that point in time she
had worked at TC BackerConstruction.
My son busted out two kids backto back.
We got two beautifulgrandchildren.

(31:18):
So she at that time it was kindof like a decision we had to
make.
You know, jana, who I had lost,who was my ride or die co-pilot
and drove me because I had lostmy license for a long, long,
long, long time, I think almost15 years total.
And so Jana drove me to theappointments, sales calls, I
mean all of it measurements,meetings, all kinds of stuff.

(31:40):
But anyhow, we decided to forher to to be at, stay at home,
grandmom and and take care of mymom at the same time, which was
beautiful for both my mom, herand the grandchildren Joel and
Quinn.
And so I had lost my voice ofreasoning, not that I couldn't

(32:00):
talk to Jana, but she wasn'twith me every day, but anyhow,
we went out to dinner one nightand my mom said two things to me
that were very profound andwe've heard these a lot, but I
heard it.
First thing she said to me wasis that life is too short?

(32:21):
No shit, right, Looking at awoman who's battling her second
battle with cancer, and she saidyou need help, was the second
thing she said to me.
And, boy, she had no idea howtrue that was, psychologically,
physically, mentally,emotionally at that point in
time, because the phone rang.
The phone rang and I actuallyred buttoned it for the first

(32:41):
time because that's how I fed myfamily, that's how I was able
to have my mom move in with usand take care of her, and not
that my mom, she, they own a barand a restaurant.
My dad's still with us, thankgoodness, and um, you know.
So she, they, they own a barand a restaurant.
I grew up in the hospitalityindustry and um, but I heard

(33:03):
what she said and I think that'swhen for me, my guard, I have
trust issues.
I always will.
I work on it on a day to daybasis and I really feel like a
lot of it comes from not justpride, you know, and ego, and
but it's fear of trusting peoplebecause of and I think a lot of
it had to do with my oldmisbehaviors, you know what I

(33:26):
mean.
It's almost like if you'resignificant others accusing you
of you know cheating on them allthe time, chances are they're
probably cheating on you becausethey have a guilty conscience.
And I think I think for me,growing up in a, in my
profession here, because I I'veliterally used to be the
youngest, but now I'm one of theoldest people here at TC Backer
today, the top five, I wouldsay, of the older old heads.

(33:54):
I'm an old head today, right, Iguess a 50, 50 ish is
considered an old head, butanyhow, I feel like you know.
So I went and I tried to findsome help and we did, we had a
great team.
But I didn't run it that way,like I didn't empower people,
like they kind of waited outsidemy door and waited for me to
give them direction, opposed toempowering them to make
decisions on their own kind ofthing.

(34:15):
And the culture was good.
It was a good, it's a good wayto run things if you want to
stay relatively small.
But I knew that there were somuch more and I felt like I had
a lot of time to make up becauseI had pissed away most of my
childhood and my teens and earlytwenties and and just pissed
away and just felt like you know, finally I got my shit together
and I got to make up for losttime.

(34:37):
So, like I'm running, running,running, put my head down,
running, and then when shepassed, like I, just how I
grieved with it was is I went towork.
And then when she passed, likeI, just how I agreed with it was
is I went to work and I workedhard and have I still really
haven't even looked up the enjoyit yet, I think.
But anyhow, I knew that I wasn'tthe smartest.
Ok, I knew I wasn't thesmartest person in the room and

(35:03):
I heard it, I read it, I'dlisten to it, someplace where
it's like I needed to surroundmyself around smarter people
than me and certain aspects ofof my professional life, and so
I had to find these people thatI trusted.
You know, maybe not with mypersonal bank account and things
like that, that that that kindof trust that's.

(35:23):
But I understand having a Kim,and you've spoke very highly.
So, kim, if you're watchingthis Woody has never had an ill
thing.
He always says very positivethings.
So whoever this Kim chick isman, she must be a rock star.
But I too have a Kim here thathas been with us for 11 years

(35:43):
now.
I've had Perry, who's been withus damn near 17 years now, and
these people who are smarterthan me if it wasn't for Perry,
you know we had a decision tomake back in the day Do we go
with Peachtree Accounting or dowe go with QuickBooks.
And back then I don't even knowif Peachtree is still around.
We chose, thank goodness,quickbooks.
Perry helped get that up going.
Like I'm not a CPA, by no means,you know so I delegated and

(36:07):
empowered again here we getempower people to and leverage
their strengths, because Perry'spretty nerdy and he's good with
numbers and very organized andyou know, that way gave Jana

(36:29):
some time to to kind of backaway from the business a little
bit.
And then, like Chris Baker, wegot Glenn.
Like all of these really smartpeople that are making decisions
right on a day to day basis,and they're probably having a
meeting upstairs right now thatI don't even know what the fuck
they're discussing, and they'reprobably having a meeting
upstairs right now that I don'teven know what the fuck they're
discussing, right, but if wewant to be and want to have
impact and want to empowerpeople and create change in

(36:51):
people's lives, we have to letgo.
And I think if you can reallyhave that mindset of you know,
getting the ego, getting thepride, getting the fear,
removing fear and again, I'm notsaying that it doesn't creep in
every now and then and I don'twonder what the hell are they
talking about?
Are they talking about me?
Are they talking about howshitty of a leader I might be?
And that's crazy talk.

(37:12):
Do you know what I mean?
But I do feed myself shitsometimes, you know, and I know
that I'm the only one that canreally blow this thing up
meaning in a bad way, if Istormed out, if I'm having a bad
day, and I take it out on them,or you know, and and rip away
that responsibility that I gavethem and and I think by me

(37:33):
removing that nobody can do itas quick and as fast and as hard
and as long as I can, you knowcause I thought that I held on
to everything for so long toolong, you know and thought
nobody could do it any better.
This is what's crazy is is Ithink everybody in this building
has done everything that I'veever done way better than I
could do it then and definitelynow.

Woody Casey (37:52):
For me it was control.
I'm a control freak.
I want to know everything.
Like you said, I want to.
I know everything and I want tobe involved in everything.
And one of those side effectsof not trusting people is not
sharing.
And I don't know if Kim knows Itell this story, but I owned a
men's salon for almost a yearand Kim made a mistake one day.

(38:16):
So I came in the next day andwe were going to have a
conversation about it and I saidwhy did you make this decision?
And she goes because of this,this and this.
And I was like well, what aboutthis, this and this?
She goes.
Well, I didn't know that and myproblem was I was always taught
information is power and poweris what you want.

(38:38):
I realized that for me to bemore successful and to be better
, I have to freely give all theinformation I have.
You may not agree with it andyou may not understand it or
whatever, but it's my job and Itell people this all the time
that I'm going to overshare, Italk too much, I know that, and

(39:02):
I'm going to tell you too manythings about myself, about my
personal life, about all the badthings about me, but I always
figure that the more informationpeople have, the better
decisions they can make.
And that was kind of a turningpoint for me and Kim and our
relationship was the realizationthat if I'm going to let her
have the power to make thedecisions, I also have to give

(39:22):
her all the information I have.
And I tell people this all thetime If I die tomorrow, the
company's not going to suffer,but if Kim dies or quits I'm
screwed.
You know, because she does somany of the our relationship is
is very symbiotic.
There are a lot of things thatI'm really good at and there are

(39:42):
a lot of things that she isreally good at, and the thing is
, is those don't they're?

Ty Cobb Backer (39:51):
not the same.

Woody Casey (39:51):
Um, there there's overlap, but there's not that
much overlap.
You know, people in my lifegirlfriend get upset because I
don't know what day of the weekit is, I don't know what's on my
calendar, I don't know what'smy schedule like, because Kim
does, you know, and and if Iwant to do something, kim has to
put on my schedule so that Iknow that it's coming up.
I can lose months because I gotmy head down and I'm working

(40:13):
and I don't know what.
Someone will say hey, you know,this trip's coming up in
January.
Yeah, we've got months.
Dude, it's December.
Okay, that means I got to startfiguring that out, you know, so
it's.
I don't.
I don't think of a calendar inlinear.
It's kind of abstract for me.
So you can tell me something'scoming up in October and I'm

(40:34):
like, okay, and I'll forgetabout it.
I don't think that it's fivemonths away or six months away
or whatever.
It's just it's abstract, it'sout there somewhere.
So the other thing that Kim hashelped me do is get the rubbish
out of my brain.
I'll come in and we don't do itnow as much as I used to, but we
have what we call data dumpdays where I'll come in and I'll

(40:57):
have 15 different thingsrolling around my head and I
can't think straight becausethey're cluttering up my mind,
and so I'll tell Kim and she'llwrite them all down, and then
we'll go through and cross outthe ones that are not our bad
ideas and we'll look at otherthings about hey, let's find
somebody that can do this for usor do that, or this is
something we're going to work onand, unfortunately for Kim, a

(41:17):
lot of that falls on hershoulders to get that stuff done
, because I think of thesethings and that I need to
implement them, but I have noidea how to implement them, so I
have to make her go findsomebody that can implement that
or teach us how to implement ormake us better.
So, yeah, for me it waslearning to give up control and
I still struggle with that.

Ty Cobb Backer (41:35):
Yeah, yeah, me too, me too, and I think
transparency you touched ontransparency there.
It's like the more informationthat we devolve, divulge, the
better off we are, because themore that we hold on to and the
less that they know they can'tperform at the level that we're
expecting them to perform at,and less mistakes are made.
You know what I mean?

(41:55):
Because she made a mistake andhow we I think we deal with that
too and realize those ahamoments Like it sounds like you
had like an aha moment, like noshit.

Woody Casey (42:06):
I tell everybody that story about kim and I I
know tim kim takes it good,naturally, like she should, but
you know, for me that's that'sso key for a lot of us that we
were talking about salespeopleand and and giving in and
potential.
And you know, we look at, wehire them based on what we think

(42:26):
they can accomplish and thenwhen they don't, is it because
we didn't pour enough into themor they're not performing on
their own and me just pouringeverything I can into somebody
One, I get emotionally attachedto that person as an individual.
I don't want them to fail, butalso having enough realization
that you can't make somebodysucceed if they don't have the

(42:50):
drive, the work ethic to show upevery day and get it done.
You can train somebody to bethe best, but if they never
implement it, they're nevergoing to be.
So that's kind of that, thatdichotomy, and we talked about
that.
I told you about that nfl sonya,that nfl coach that said, son,
your potential is going to getme fired.
Of that, that dichotomy, and wetalked about that.
I told you about that NFL Sonia, that NFL coach that said,
sonia, your potential is goingto get me fired and I have to
remind myself of that when I amlooking at somebody's

(43:13):
performance is are theyperforming to where they should
be?
Are my expectations too highfor them?
Am I not allowing them enoughgrace to fail and then succeed?
Or are they just not performingbecause of something on their
end?
Yeah, and sometimes it's a hardlook inside and for me, I

(43:36):
always beat my own standards.
You know, in our mastermindgroup I talk about sales, that
that's where I struggle andthat's what I'm trying to hire
and get done, but I don't alwayshold myself to that same
accountability that I hold the,that I want to hold the sales
guys to Right.

Ty Cobb Backer (43:52):
So, yeah, that was weird.
Things got glitchy.
Now I'm guilty of that too, youknow.
I'm guilty of not holding to myown standards that I expect

(44:15):
everybody else to.
And I was talking to Jana lastnight I think it was last night
about um being able to read mymind.
Like what do you mean?
You can't read my mind.
Like, and she has, she'slearned how to read my mind.
Because I was giving Tam shitthe other day.
I was like you need to knowwhat I need before I know I need
it.
You know what I mean?

(44:35):
It's kind of like Jana was likeshe can't read your mind, you
know what I mean.
And I's kind of like Jan waslike she can't read your mind.
Do you know what I mean?
And I don't know if Tam wouldbe watching this or not, but we
were kind of having a discussionabout Tam, my assistant because
not that she fails, by no means, she has definitely improved
the quality of my life and thebusiness just because of like
yesterday she was like don'tforget this, don't forget this,

(44:55):
don't forget this.
And then, five minutes later,she knows me well enough to
remind me again Did you do this,did you do that, did you do
this, you know, and it's like we, we need that.
But getting back to like thedirection thing, like I've been
using, there's a cemetery overhere.
I've been using that as ametaphor here lately.
You know I'm guilty of tellingpeople just go go to the

(45:20):
cemetery with zero direction,just get over there, you'll
figure out what you got to dowhen you get over there.
Okay, well then they're kind oflike duke to doing their way
over there, trying to figure outlike why the hell is he sending
me over to the cemetery, whenall along what I needed you to
do was is there's actually anoak tree that's in that cemetery
over there, and every time thewind blows it's damaging the top
of one of the tombstone.
Okay, well, if I would havegave you just that much clarity,

(45:42):
you'd be like oh shit, okay,grab the chainsaw, run over
there.
But then when you got overthere, you discovered there's
two other oak trees and becauseof the empowerment right they
already know they might say hey,there's two other oak trees
over besides one.
Do you want me to take care ofthem?
Yep, so they're over there.
They clean up the oak trees.
Well, then they discover shit.

(46:03):
There's leaves all over theplace.
Maybe I'll rake it up.
They'll rake up the leaves,then they discover, hey, the
grass is getting a little tootall.
Yep, mow the grass, then theycan start seeing the actual
faces of these tombstones.
They're like, hey, we can'tread the words, maybe we should
power wash it.
Right, but with just thatlittle bit of clarity up front,
right, it doesn't even have tobe a whole lot, but just some

(46:25):
direction, right?
So they're not like trying tofigure it out.
And then I'll get pissedbecause they didn't figure it
out with very little.
Just go over to the cemetery.
As far as directions go, right,cause I'm I'm guilty of busting
people shit up Like what do youmean?
You didn't figure it out, justfigure it out, you know.
And for the longest time,glenn's job description.
He asked me what I had wentthrough and asked everybody to

(46:49):
write out their job descriptionsfor me.
And Glenn calls me up.
He's kind of pissed off at me alittle bit, quite frankly,
because one I think he thoughtthat I thought that he wasn't
doing enough and that's why Iwanted everybody to write out
their job descriptions.
And had nothing to do with that.
And and Glenn's like, and hewas like what is my job

(47:11):
description and, honestly, theonly thing that I told him was
is whatever it takes, and thatwas good enough for him, like it
really was.
But like a year later I'm likethat's not good enough either,
like I really literally have to.
So here, most recently, I'mwriting clarity notes to
everybody from Ty, clarity notesfrom Ty and I've done four so

(47:35):
far.
I've reviewed three of them withthree of our teammates and
after the conversations, becausewe're implementing some new
things and some changes arecoming and stuff like Like I
don't know how to do this shit,but we're going to do it Right,

(48:01):
I'll have these great, grandiose, fricking ideas.
I don't know how to F, we'regoing to do it, but guess what?
We're going to find someone oryou're going to figure it out
how to do this, and I know thatabout myself.
So, anyhow, I, giving moredirection and being more clear,
I think is something over thatI've recently have really trying

(48:22):
to hone in that skill becausefortunately it is a skill and
it's something that I can workon and I can get better at.
And that's only because if I'mnot clear on the vision, how am
I supposed to expect ourteammates to be clear on what
they're supposed to be doingevery day and the importance of
what it is that they're doingand how it affects everything
else.

Woody Casey (48:43):
Clarity is.
You sparked something in mejust with that.
You know I'm trying to hiresalespeople and I just think
salespeople are salespeoplebecause that's you know, not
being in the sales side ofthings, to me it's like go out
and sell.
You're like how You're yoursales guy.
You should know how you know.
So having that clarity issomething that is definitely

(49:04):
something I need to work on.
And when you're talking aboutjob description, kim and I have
a running joke that her jobdescription is written in pencil
because it's subject to changeit and change it whenever I need
it to be.

Ty Cobb Backer (49:17):
Your job is whatever I tell you your job is
yeah Right, yeah no, andbasically that's what I was
telling Glenn like whatever ittakes.
But that was enough motivationfor for me to for him to be like
okay, whatever it takes.

Woody Casey (49:29):
We talked about that a little bit earlier.
One of the best pieces ofadvice I ever got from somebody
was, you know, not being thesmartest person in the room and
hiring the smartest person inthe room.
And we talked about A and Bstudents work for C students and
when you give an A and Bstudent clarity and direction,
they're going to follow that tothe end of the road.

(49:51):
But if you do that with a Cstudent, they're going to go
okay.
And then what?
Or they're not going to go onthat path because it doesn't fit
their.
You know the way you know theirbrain works.
And then what?
Or they're not going to go onthat path because it doesn't fit
their.
You know the way you know theirbrain works, and I have this
conversation a lot that my braindoesn't work linear, you know
it works abstract, it's avisionaries, you know it's, it's
I'm all over the board, youknow.

(50:11):
So I can't sit and be taskorientated as much as I used to
be able to because my brainworld, you know, and it's off.
On another tangent, I'll be inthe middle of a conversation
with somebody on the phone andforget that I'm in the middle of
a conversation on the phone andstart dialing somebody else.
And I've done that and it'slike crap, I forgot.

(50:33):
You know, sorry, you know,because they hear me.
What are you doing?
I'm like, oh fuck, I wascalling, all right, you know
because they hear me.
What are you doing?
I'm like, oh, I'm just callingsomebody else.
You know, it's like crap.
You know so it's, I've donethat and I and I.
The thing is, I can say I'vedone it more than once.
Yeah, you know so it's.
My brain just doesn't alwayswork the way other people's do

(50:53):
and it took me a long time torealize that it was okay to do
that, yeah, and to be that way.
You know, that's probably whenyou're talking about you know,
coming into your own andfiguring out your own path.
That, for me, one of thebiggest realizations and what I
saw.
And I told a friend of minethis a long time ago that they
they asked what I was thinkingand I said you really want a lot
of thinking, or you know likeyeah, I'm like okay, imagine a

(51:17):
merry-go-round with 12 horses onit.
You got the lights, you got themusic, you got the disco ball in
the middle.
It's flashing lights, it's loud.
Each horse in thatmerry-go-round is a completely
different topic, and I'mthinking about four at any one
time.
And if you imagine four of thembeing lit up and then one's
going to start to dim and twomore, so I'll be thinking about
five and then that's going todrop down to three and I'll be

(51:38):
back to four, my brain justscatters out like that and
somebody will have a problem,something in the business or
something, and I won't have theanswer right away and I will
kind of ignore it.
And all of a sudden in the backof my brain comes this flashing
beacon of oh, here's how it'ssolved, here's how you fix it,
here's your, your operation,here's the plan, the procedure,

(52:05):
whatever.
And it just shows up in mybrain.
And but if I sit there andconcentrate on it and try and
fix it, I can't get the answer.
But if I let the back of mybrain just have at it, it's
amazing.
It'll come to me either late atnight or first thing in the
morning, and also I'm like ohyeah, that's how we do it, so
yeah, no, I'm, I'm, I'm a lot ofthe same.

Ty Cobb Backer (52:22):
It's funny you're talking about trying to
call somebody else while you'realready on the phone with
somebody else.
Yesterday I caught myself.
I called somebody and put myphone down and jumped on my
laptop, literally forgot that Icalled somebody and I could hear
them and I was like, oh shit,they're like Ty Ty Cause I
didn't have it on speakerphone.
So I'm guilty of similar thingsto myself, cause my brain it

(52:47):
moves a hundred miles an hourand for me I call it my twilight
.
Some of my best solutions orideas come to me right before.
I don't know if I'm waking up,but I'm still asleep, okay, and
I'll have these like aha momentsof like this is exactly what we
need to do to fix this or someof my.

(53:08):
I think my best ideas come tome in that twilight, like when I
stopped thinking and stop beingso fixated on a solution for
something because that's notconducive to me is like I'm
trying to force a fix.
You know what I mean it's like,but if I can just walk away
from it, you know for a littlebit that usually always the the

(53:29):
idea of what we need to do orthe direction of the vision that
we need to go in.
That's when it comes to me.
Now I am also good at like.
This morning, baker came to meand he was like hey, there's
something that that transpiredovernight I need your guidance
on.
Like oh, okay, cool, um, and itwas just kind of like bam bam,
bam, okay, cool, yep, nope,we'll just do this.

(53:50):
Because of the experience thatI do have and and the
empowerment that I've given him,I was kind of actually glad he
came to me looking for advice,um, because I I had, you know,
experience in that similarsituation that he's dealing with
or dealt with this morning.
But big, big, grandiose, youknow things.
Because, like I was telling youearlier, this winter has been

(54:12):
rough for us up here, this, thispast winter, and things were
slow, which slow means cashflowslows down.
I'm already thinking of nextwinter.
You know, most people just showup to work every day.
They don't even think aboutmaybe they're thinking about
Friday and payday, you know, onMonday, but and that's not a bad
thing either but I'm alreadythinking what can we do?

(54:34):
What can I control?
I can't control the weather, Ican't, I can't do it.
So one of the plans that I'vecome up with.
Obviously we're kind of pullingthings back.
You know things like I had aVerizon cell phone okay, we use
AT&T.
I had owned a landscapingbusiness for about five years,

(54:54):
acquired one and this pastwinter we decided that all of
our contracts ended.
We had a three-year contractwith a local county and
everything just kind of just.
It was just that it worked outgood.
I saw a window, I jumped out ofit.
I was like, look, we're off thehook, we're done.
Nothing was wrong, it wasprofitable, we did good.
But I knew how busy thisroofing season was going to be,

(55:16):
with some new, larger accounts,that we landed more sales reps,
because we also do a lot of newconstruction and different
avenues insurance, newconstruction, retail.
We kind of have our irons in acouple of different fires
because I've learned goingthrough seven, eight, nine and
ten that you can't keep youreggs all in one industry or form

(55:36):
of roofing, that you know thatwe do Shit.
I kind of lost my train ofthought here.
Where the hell was I going withthat?
Woody, help me out here.

Woody Casey (55:47):
Don't ask me Okay.

Ty Cobb Backer (55:49):
Squirrel I just had a squirrel moment, but shit,
I don't, I totally forgot wherethe hell I was going with that
and that's, that's one of the.
Yeah, I do that too.
Yeah.

Woody Casey (56:01):
You go down a tangent and forget what your
point was.

Ty Cobb Backer (56:03):
Yeah, I totally forget what the hell my point
was.
On that you have no idea, okay.

Woody Casey (56:09):
Stop processing, getting somewhere.

Ty Cobb Backer (56:14):
Yeah, oh, so I'm thinking of next year.
Things were pulling.
Oh, so I'm thinking of nextyear.
Things were pulling.
Oh, so the Verizon.
So it was 150 bucks a month.
That's $1,800 a year.
Do you know what I mean?
So it's like.
So it's given me time to kindof go back through and dissect
things, because there's no sensein spending $1,800 a year on a
Verizon Verizon bill.

(56:36):
That Horizon no longer existsand everybody knows it was tc
backer anyhow.
So if there is something thatthey want to call us for,
they'll just call the numberhere.
Because we rebranded everything.
It was red, black and white.
It looked.
If you out of your profile youwould have thought it was a tc
backer truck and not a horizontruck, because we complemented
both facets and we still do somelandscaping, but not at the

(56:59):
commercial scale that we weredoing.
We had a bunch of commercialaccounts and stuff like that,
but so we kind of just dissolved.
That brought the manpower,brought the vehicles, brought
the resources over.
So there's been things changescoming because I'm already
thinking about next year.
Like we're not going to do snowplowing next year.
It just turned into an overtimefricking fuckery free for all

(57:21):
of overtime.
That people you know, not thatthey didn't deserve it, but it's
overhead that we don't need toabsorb next winter If there is
another long winter, rightBetween equipment breaking down
the financial burden that thatcreates, and then the trucks
down and we're not getting outto these parking lots fast.
It was just this whole thing.
It was like you know what.
We don't need any of thatstress.

(57:42):
So, through why this washappening to me?
Right Cause I wanted to look atit Like why is this happening to
, why is this happening for usright now?
It had me dive back into what wecan do to improve things next
winter and that's being thevisionary right.
I might not be able to do allof these things right myself,

(58:03):
but because of the team thatwe've created here, it's kind of
like all right, we need to makesure we cut back on overtime
next winter.
We need to dissolve Horizon, weneed to get rid of the Verizon
bill, along with all kinds ofother things.
Could I sit around and make allthese phone calls all day long
and and delete this and andsubtract that, and yeah, of

(58:23):
course, but because I've learnedto trust my team, I guess,
circling back to the wholetrusting, I don't think this is
where I was going with this, butat least we're not just oddly
staring at each other right now,not saying anything but the
circle back on our conversationof empowering other people and
trusting other people.
You know, thank goodness I'vebeen able to trust people enough
to handle things that need tobe done within the business,

(58:46):
even when my back is turned.

Woody Casey (58:49):
And it goes back to surrounding yourself with
people.
My favorite thing is justsurrounding yourself with
smarter people, you know, andand part of that, and to go back
to a little bit, what we saidbeginning was, you know, being
the dumbest guy in the room.
You know, I don't say that fromuh, uh, self-deprecating or
self-grandiocing kind of a thing.

(59:10):
Um, to truly learn to be humblearound people and we talked
about this a little bit earlierum, about being in a room full
of people you respect and beingvulnerable inside that room.
You know, it's to me, it'screated avenues and it's created
friendships I never thought Icould have, you know, because I

(59:30):
don't come in there with mychest out and a big head on my
shoulders.
Trust me, I've got an ego.
You know, I've got pride and Istill have that.
You asked that earlier when,when could I set the pride aside
?
20 minutes ago, you know, or 20minutes from now.
You know I'm very prideful.
You know I'm.
You look at where I came fromand the amount of traveling I've

(59:52):
done and the things I've got todo all over the world and see,
I'm very prideful in my stuff,but every, every once in a while
, when I get a little bit toobig of a head on my shoulder.
The man upstairs kicks me inthe nuts and says, um, pay
attention, yeah, this isn'tabout you.
There's something else and youtalk about.
Why is this happening for me?

(01:00:13):
I love that mantra because Ijust had this conversation with
a friend of mine, um, a coupleweeks ago.
He's went through some issuesand it's like, remember, you're
going through trials andtribulations right now for a
reason, it seems to prepare youfor something that's coming,
which is probably the truth, butyou don't know what's coming up
, and it could be years ago.

(01:00:36):
A friend of mine's her dad diedand they were very, very close
and she was upset and we werehaving a conversation about it
and she's like I can'tunderstand why god would take
such a wonderful human being.
You know my father, this that Isaid you have no idea.
I said there may be a time whenyou're standing at the airport
and you're in line with somebodywho just lost their father and

(01:00:56):
you can offer words of comfortand words of words of wisdom to
them, and it may be only a fiveminute conversation, but that
conversation can mean the worldto that person and without you
having gone through what youwent through, you wouldn't have
been able to help that person inthat moment.
So, yeah, our lives get hard,our lives get get get tough, and

(01:01:17):
there are things that I've gonethrough that I'm like why, why
do I have to go through this?
Why is this happening to me?
We talked about my 2023 year,which was a crap year of a year
for me.
I don't know why I went throughthat I probably never know but
I got through it.
You know there are times whereI was outside kicking a tree
because I was just angry at theworld and angry at everything,

(01:01:40):
and but I got through it.
You know I'm not as financiallyset as I would like to be where
I'm at right in my life rightnow, but there's a path forward
and every day, like I said, weget up and we take that extra
step and we go one more step,one more step and pretty sure
you're going to be there.
So you know, it's just it'struly being humble is very hard.

(01:02:04):
It's probably it's a lot harderto be humble than it is to be
prideful.
And we talked about beingcomfortable, being uncomfortable
, and that's part of it.
You know, I'm putting myself inplaces where I'm extremely
uncomfortable Roofing shows,conferences.
Last year I spoke at three ofChad Michael's events.
The smallest was 150, largestwas like 300.

(01:02:28):
Being up in front of there for10 minutes terrifies me.
I get tunnel vision.
I have a hard time just puttingwords in front of each other
just to get them out, and I'veonly got.
You know, the first time Ispoke was like three months.
The last time I spoke was nine.
You know, I got morecomfortable doing it and it
wasn't as bad.
So but yeah, it's still stilltough.

Ty Cobb Backer (01:02:50):
Yeah, it is being resilient to, you know,
bouncing back, you know, afterbad news or bad situation or
even a bad year, you know, andhaving the tenacity to just keep
moving forward.
You know, I think that's thething about entrepreneurship
that social media lately, ornowadays, or always has been,
doesn't show.
You know that it's always theglam shots and it's not.

(01:03:13):
It's never the ugly stuff.
And if it is ugly stuff, it'susually somebody pointing other
people's shit out, right, andthey're probably the ones that
are pointing the finger havethree pointing back at them.
You know what I mean.
And this isn't easy and ithasn't been easy.
It's, you know, we've beendoing this for for 17 years now
and it's, it's not, it's notbeing been easy.
You know there's always, youknow, a correction year here in

(01:03:34):
aerothon in the mix, or just anoff year, and and you know it
always looks pretty on theoutside.
But you know, but it it, itisn't, it's, it can, it can,
quite frankly, get pretty uglyat times.

Woody Casey (01:03:52):
That's one of those things about social media is
nobody ever posts theirnegatives.
Um, they're there.
It's all about the, the trips,the pictures, the, the wild
moments, but you don't see the23 hours in 50 minutes of all
the crap.
They got through to get that 10minutes and I can.
I can.
I'm as guilty of this as anybodybeing jealous of other people's

(01:04:14):
success, and I've had to teachmyself to be grateful for other
people's success and to offergenuine words of I am so proud
of what you accomplished.
You know, you and I talkedabout what happened to us in the
past and things like that.
Where you're at today isn'tanywhere near where you used to

(01:04:35):
be.
Congratulations, you know,being able to say that and
genuinely mean that it's.
Sometimes it's a struggle forme, because you look at people
who you don't think work as hardas you do or put in the effort
you did, and they were blessedwith a storm at the right time,
or they hired the right personto create their sales team that

(01:04:56):
made them millions of dollars,and you're like I went over your
struggle and trying to figurethat out.
Why are they winning and I'mlosing?
They're just winningdifferently.
You're still winning If youwake up every day and you go to
work and you're trying, you'restill winning, and
congratulations for that.
But sometimes it's a struggleand that's pride saying why is
it them and not me, pride sayingwhy is it them and not me.

(01:05:20):
You know.
So, having kind of trying hardto put my pride and my jealousy
aside, which I struggle with, tobe able to be happy for other
people's accomplishments, to methat's one of the biggest things
that probably turned the cornerin my life was that attitude of
gratitude that you learn that,dude, just because somebody else

(01:05:41):
is successful doesn't mean youcan't be.
You know, it's not like there'slimited amount of success out
there, you know, and everybody'ssuccess is different, you know.
You look at I'll use my, mymom's generation for an example
their greatest success wasraising a family.
You know, they didn't careabout jobs outside of the home
for the most part, but nowadaysthat level they don't look on

(01:06:05):
them the same way.
But you raise kids and put themout in the world and they're
doing fine and successful.
That's success.
Yeah, you know, that's just adifferent level of success.
You can see guys who have allthe money in the world and a
crappy home life.
Their kids are worthless, andthey may see me successful in
business, but they're notsuccessful at home.

(01:06:26):
So success is relative towherever, how you define it.

Ty Cobb Backer (01:06:30):
Yeah.
However, you want to grade thatNow.
It's funny you brought that upbecause yesterday I felt like I
was pretty, I feel like I had apretty successful day, and it
wasn't financially, it wasn't,you know, monetarily, it wasn't,
wasn't even professionally.
I felt like, you know, jana hadto go to the doctors and get
some, I guess, some medicalprocedures done and I was

(01:06:54):
grateful that I was able toleave work and go and be there
for that and take her and bringher home.
And then later that day my soncalled me, twisted his ankle and
he called me right.
I went, I picked him up, I wasavailable, Right, and we were
sitting in urgent care lastnight for a couple hours and you

(01:07:14):
know I wasn't like gosh dangkids.
You know I got better things todo.
My gratitude was my mindset wasman, how grateful am I?
I wouldn't rather, I wouldrather not be anywhere else, but
right here with him, right now,you know, and I felt like that
to me in that moment because Idon't always have those moments,

(01:07:36):
that attitude of gratitude, ofhow successful that to me I had
a successful day.
I was there for my family allday, all day doing dad shit.
You know what I mean and howgrateful I was to be able to do
it.
I was also at work.
I was in and out doing.
You know I didn't let anythingover here fall to the wayside or
anything like that, you know.

(01:07:57):
But that's not what I meant bythe successful part of it.
The successful part of it isthat I was.
I was there for the household.
You know what I mean, causeJana's usually the one holding
the fort down.
You know what I mean.
She works her ass off now, morethan she probably did when she
worked here at TC back everysingle day taking care of all of
us knuckleheads on a day to day.

(01:08:22):
And it was, it was, and itwasn't even like it's my turn.
You know what I mean.
To babysit.
You know I don't babysit mychildren.
I'm a fucking father today.
You know what I mean.
And and do dad shit, and that'show.
Really, yeah, I look at work asas success too, but not as
important as I used to like.
My priorities are a little bitdifferent today and I think that
just is is maturing as as anadult today a little bit, and
not letting my ego andselfishness get in the way of.

(01:08:44):
Like man, I should be at workright now and um you know making
money and uh, you know it's not, it's not.
you can have all the money inthe world and still be miserable
as hell.
You know, and I've been there,I've done that, and you know
what.
It comes and goes and ebbs andflows, man, and it's like I had
to seek out happiness in otherrealms, outside of money.

Woody Casey (01:09:08):
When Junior my son was little I did pretty well.
Not great by anybody'sstandards, but I did well and I
didn't make six figures in ayear.
You know my average years were40 to 60, but I was a stay at
home dad Well not stay at home,but yeah, I worked.
But when you talk about success,at that time in my life my

(01:09:29):
success was my son always madeit to practice because I took it
.
You know I never missed a game.
You know, from the time hestarted soccer up until high
school, you know I went to everypractice, every game.
I think in all those years Ithink I can count on one hand
the number of practices I missedbecause I was out of town.
But to me that was that's my.

(01:09:50):
My greatest achievement wasbeing able to do that for him
and for me I mean, now that youknow he's on his own and 32, and
yes, I am that much older butthat's one of those things I
think about in those days ofwatching him practice and
watching him play and just beingon the sidelines, just enjoying

(01:10:12):
the fact that I got to do that.
I'll take that to my grave.

Ty Cobb Backer (01:10:17):
No doubt man.
No doubt, no doubt.
Well, we've been on here for anhour and 12 minutes and it's
getting getting to be close toone 30 here, woody, and I know
you've got to take off soon, butthank you for sharing your
insight with our audience.
Man, thanks for having me, Ihope it was entertaining for
everybody.

(01:10:37):
It was great.
You did a great job.
So thank you so much for comingon and thank you everyone for
joining us on this episode ofBehind a Tool Belt, and if you
found any value in today'sepisode, share it with someone
in your crew and make sure yousubscribe for more interviews
with leaders in our trade.
So until next week, you guystake care of each other.

(01:11:00):
And again, woody, thank you forjoining us, thank you for
having me.
You guys have a great day.