January 3, 2023 • 31 mins
Today we kick off 2023 with my dear friend, Susie Larson!
Join me in this part one of two episodes as Susie talks about her book, Fully Alive. Susie points out that in order for a person to heal physically, a person must also heal spiritually and emotionally. Everything about our health is connected and for true health to be achieved, all aspects of the person must be addressed.
She also shares some of her personal traumas that affected her health and healing journey. There is so much to learn from this discussion as we begin 2023.
Connect with Susie Larson :
https://www.susielarson.com/
Suggested Resource Links:
- BOOK: Fully Alive
- BOOK: Strong in Battle
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Ivelisse Page (00:06):
Hi, I'm Ivelisse Page and thanks for listening to
the Believe Big podcast, theshow where we take a deep dive
into your healing with healthexperts, a integrative
practitioners biblical faithleaders, and cancer thrivers
from around the globe.
(00:34):
Welcome to today's episode onthe Believe Big podcast.
My name is Ivelisse Page, andtoday we are gonna step out of
the physical side of healingpractices and do a special two
part episode on the role thatour emotional health has on our
physical health.
You are in for a treat becausemy guest today is a dear friend
(00:55):
of mine and one of the mostincredibly, godly women I know,
Susie Larson.
Susie is a national speaker,bestselling author, and the host
of the Daily Talk show, SusieLarson Live, heard on the Faith
Radio Network with over 3.5million downloads.
Susie has written, are you readyfor this, 19 books.
(01:16):
I love it! And many articles.
She has been a guest on Focus onthe Family, Family Life Today,
as well as many other socialmedia and media outlets.
Susie's passion is to see peopleeverywhere awakened to the value
of their soul, the depth ofGod's love, and the height of
their calling in Christ Jesus.
(01:38):
Welcome Susie to the show.
Susie Larson (01:40):
So honored to be with you Ivelisse.
Thank you for having me.
You're one of my favorite peopletoo, so what an honor to be with
you.
Ivelisse Page (01:45):
Aw.
Well, our listeners are alwaysinterested in discovering what
our guest favorite health tipis, and I know you have many,
but can you share one of themwith us?
Susie Larson (01:55):
Wow, I almost couldn't put it into one thing.
I feel like my morning, quiettime, my workout plan, going to
bed at a consistent time, and ofcourse diet and hydration.
Those are all really importantthings for me, and they make a
very big difference in my life.
So sorry, I can't really boil itdown.
If I had to boil it down, itwould be time with the Lord,
because from there he'll tellyou what you need, what you're
(02:17):
missing, what you might need toadd to your rhythm.
And that changes from season toseason, how we have to be so in
tune with our bodies.
So, sorry, I can't boil it down.
Normally I'm an overachiever.
But.
Ivelisse Page (02:27):
You are.
Well, I love that because itties into what we're talking
about.
You know, so many times we'refocused on the physical side of
healing, and especially withwhat we do with Believe Big, but
our emotions and our spirituallife has such a huge impact in
our physical healing.
And so today, I wanted to focuson your book Fully Alive.
(02:48):
That is my, absolute, and I'mnot just saying because you're
in front of me, but my absolutefavorite book on the mind, body
and soul connection.
And then we're gonna have youback on to share your personal
story of wholeness that haveoccurred over the last two
years.
So, let's get started.
You say that Fully Alive is abook you never planned to write.
(03:09):
Why so?
Susie Larson (03:10):
You know, it goes in so deep to exactly as you
said, the emotional connectionto our bodies.
I really thought not that I'dachieved these lessons, but I
thought I had learned them.
My backstory is I contractedLyme disease as a young mom
during my pregnancy, and Ibattled ferociously.
I was very sick with Lyme forabout seven years, and then for
about 20 years, I managed.
(03:31):
A handful of times a year Icouldn't get out of bed.
But other than that, I was afitness instructor.
I was very focused on doing mypart and then asking God to do
what he would do and just tryingto get through it and manage
life around that.
But then about seven years ago,I had a massive relapse and, the
book really was the fruit out ofthat.
But what happened was, if Icould just give you context, and
(03:52):
it's kind of cramming a lot intoa short amount of time, but just
so people understand where I'mcoming from.
I grew up in a large family.
I grew up in a denominationwhere I knew God was real.
But I didn't really know Jesuswas accessible.
You know?
I mean, I had a sense of God'spresence.
I absolutely knew he was real.
I was a people pleaser.
And when I was about nine yearsold, I suffered a sexual trauma
at the hands of some boys in ourneighborhood.
Well, that opened a canyon offear insecurity, self contempt,
(04:15):
and I didn't tell anybody.
I didn't know what to do withwhat had happened.
And then about a year later, I'mjust 10 years old, four feet
tall, walking home from school.
And I was jumped by a differentgroup of boys and beat up real
bad.
And they laughed wildly as theypunched me and pulled fistfuls
of hair kicked me.
And now in my adult mind, I knowthey were high on something cuz
they had this crazed look andthey just, for sport, were
(04:36):
beating up this little girl andthey walked away when they were
done with me laughing.
And I might, I had a fat lip andscratched a face and snarled
hair, but I got up from thatmoment, and I heard in my ear, I
can get you anytime, anywhereand God will never stop me.
So I'm pregnant with my thirdson.
I'm on bedrest for six monthswith this precious little baby,
and the doctors let me get upone time just to see if I was
(04:58):
okay to get up.
And I met my old collegeroommates for lunch.
I was super careful.
It was a fall day.
I was in bed by night cuz I wascontracting again.
But two weeks from that outingmy face started to go numb and,
and my short term memory startedto do funky things and I was
having numbing down my arms anddizziness and, body pain and
fatigue and all those things.
And I couldn't believe I hadthree more months to go on this
(05:20):
pregnancy that these wereoverlapping crises.
So coming to Christ in, like ineighth, ninth grade, I was super
passionate about God, but Ididn't have the undergirding of
a really solid biblicalfoundation.
So by this point I really didn'tknow why I was a"have not", why
my friends had health, they hadwealth, and I had neither.
And I had used up most of myfriend favors on the six months
(05:41):
of bedrest.
So the fact that there werethese overlapping crises was
very traumatic for me.
So once my son was born, it wasa year later that I'd found out
that deer tick, that one daythat I was up latched on,
deposited that bacteria took offbasically, and ravaged my
health.
And, so it fed into my earagain.
I can get to anytime, anywhere.
And it just felt true and itfelt like the enemy was
(06:03):
orchestrating scenarios toreinforce the lie.
And again, I didn't have enoughof a foundation to really
challenge that so much.
I dealt with a lot of fear, alot of anxiety, and I fought
hard for my health.
And so even though there wasfruit in my life and I had a
passion for God and he was usingme in different areas, the seven
years ago, that moment in thebathroom, I was getting ready to
head to the radio station and Iknew that the inflammation is
(06:26):
starting to rise, cuz again, itwould happen several times a
year, but it came surging inheavier doses.
And in the bathroom that day, mywhole head went numb, my neck
went numb, my esophagus spasmed.
Like when I looked down,everything knotted up in my
throat and in my esophagus andmy arms went numb.
And then the pressure in my headwas like someone was turning a
vice.
Like I thought my head was gonnabreak from the pain.
(06:48):
And I'm like, No, no, no, no,no, no, no.
Please God, no.
I just thought, not at this age.
I've been fighting for so longand trying to navigate with a
good attitude.
Please don't make me go throughthis again.
And I hear the whisper in myspirit,"the storms reveal the
lies we believe and the truthswe need".
And I'm like, What?
And it really, Ivelisse, if youcould peel the sky back in the
bathroom that day, it was like achaotic, supernatural battle is
(07:11):
what it felt like.
Because the fear, the panic, thedread, the despair, the
disappointment that God wasletting me go through this
again.
But I hear that,"the stormsreveal the lies we believe and
the truths we need".
And I'm like, What?
What's the lie that I believe?
And that came thundering in myear.
I can get to you anytime,anywhere.
God will never stop me.
And the Lord said, that's thelie and you've lived with it
(07:31):
your whole life.
It is not true that he can getto you anytime, anywhere.
It is not true that he's hadopen access, Susie.
You don't know what I'veprevented in your life.
You don't even have any ideawhat I've provided in your life.
No, He said you've believed thisand it's time to face it down.
I'm not gonna let you lose.
But I have to let you fight.
And that began this journey thatI never wanted, but I wouldn't
(07:53):
trade it now because I startedto see that there were things
shoved in the basement of mysoul, unresolved traumas and
hardships.
And when anybody who battleslong term illness or severe
acute illness, it's a trauma,it's a second trauma.
There's the physical trauma,then there's the emotional
trauma.
And, I did not realize theconnection.
And because it affected my brainso, I'm a live talk radio host
(08:13):
and an author, at this point, Iwas having trouble spelling very
basic words.
I was putting wrong words in mysentences and trying to cover up
for it on live talk radio.
I'm writing a book and I t h e re and e i r I couldn't remember
which one went where, and I hadto google it.
I've actually written 20 books.
So at this point I think I hadwhat, 15, 16, 17 books under my
(08:34):
belt and I had to google themeaning of basic words.
It was horrific.
And I just couldn't believe it.
Well, long story short,apparently people with chronic
lyme also have a susceptibilityto mold, not being able to
process it.
And I'd had unknowing repeatedexposure to black mold that
attacked my brain.
So when they did an MRI, theyfound seven areas of either
atrophy like damage or swelling.
(08:55):
My MRI looked pretty bad.
And, so this journey is I had toget my brain back.
I knew neuroplasticity was athing and so I started to bring
on brain scientists.
I just started to go for adeeper dive and the Lord really
showed me what happens in thesoul happens in the cells.
And I feel like he brought meback to that place of trauma in
a way to go, you're not all theway healed yet.
And sometimes we feel like he'spulling us back to punish us or
(09:18):
because he refuses to deliverus.
But no, it's so he can deliverus, because I know things now I
didn't know then.
I know God's word, like I didn'tknow it, then I know Him.
And so it wasn't wasted on me soFully Alive is really a book on
internal healing inner healing.
And the very physiological, thevery direct connection
physiologically to the emotionsthat we feel.
So, it's so good to honor thestory that God is writing with
(09:41):
our lives and to give some roomto breathe around those things
you're feeling and trust God tolead you to a better place.
Ivelisse Page (09:47):
Wow! What an incredible, story of God's
faithfulness through that.
And I love that at those momentswhere you felt weakest, that He
stepped right in and gave youthose words.
And I wanna go back to somethingyou said.
You said"the storms of lifereveal the lies we believe and
the truths we need".
Susie Larson (10:07):
Mm-hmm.
Ivelisse Page (10:08):
And I believe those lies are greater to fight
than sometimes the physicalillness itself.
Susie Larson (10:14):
Yeah.
Ivelisse Page (10:14):
And so, when you heard,"I can get you anytime
anywhere and God will never stopme", what practically did you do
to stand strong when the enemywhispered those lies?
What is some tools that, I knowthat there are many people
listening today that there arelies that are being spewed at
them, but what did you do inparticular to combat those lies
(10:34):
after hearing?
Susie Larson (10:36):
Good, good question.
First of all, I wanna say thatprior to that, it was
whack-a-mole with fear andanxiety.
I was just, trying to deal withit, put it under my feet and do
my best.
But in this place, when Istarted to realize, again, the
physiological impact, like twoof my doctors, I've got three
doctors, believers, justbrilliant and amazing.
But two of them, you know, daysapart from each other had said
to me, Susie, you've gotinflammation off the charts in
(10:58):
your body, we can help you withthat.
But fear opens a door to acascade, an inflammatory
response in your body.
You gotta do something about thefear.
We're gonna help you with theother stuff, but you gotta help
us by doing something about thatfear.
And so I decided to employ azero tolerance policy on fear.
And I did a deep dive study onfear, it's very interesting.
(11:19):
And I know you know thisIvelisse, but, that our brain
only operates on one of twofuels scientifically.
Scientists, apart from faith,have discovered that our brain
is either operating on the fuelof fear or love.
Now, don't you think that'samazing how science is slowly
catching up with what waswritten in scripture all those
years ago?
Because scripture says there'sno fear in love.
Perfect love, casts out fear.
(11:40):
And what was so interesting atone of the points when I had to
get labs done, when everythingwas going crazy in my body, I
showed to be extremelydehydrated, but I drink 70
ounces of water a day.
I'm like, how is that possiblethat I'm dehydrated when I'm
drinking so much water?
And Dr.
Troy said, well, when you're infear, your body your cells even
shut down into fight flight.
So you don't even get thebenefit of your disciplines.
(12:02):
So you can be doing all thediscipline actions in the world,
if you're not dealing withemotions, especially like fear
and anxiety, it's like you'vegot a divided kingdom within
you, one foot on the gas, onefoot on the break.
So I had to go to war with thatfear.
And I had to just decide everyday to turn my back on it and
behold faith and say, Lord, I'mterrified.
It feels true that I've had tolive through everything I fear.
(12:24):
It feels true, that I don'tenjoy the protections that other
people do, but I'm gonna believethat you are good.
Your promises are true.
You will always make away fromme.
And then I learned about aneural pathways.
When you repeat and repeat andrepeat, your body kind of
defaults to that mindset.
And if it's a negative one, itbecomes a super highway.
So you don't become lesstriggerable, you become more
(12:45):
triggerable and if you put a"road closed" sign on that
neural pathway and say, I'm notgonna have those repetitive
thoughts anymore.
After about 40 days, your braindeletes the pathway.
So the thing is, if you decideI'm gonna pave a new trail, you
have to almost take sidesagainst yourself in that the
self of you, that part of youthat wants to be bent towards
destruction because you're sohurt and it just seems easier to
(13:06):
expect the worst.
You have to go no, no, becauseGod has wired me for life.
If you study the human body,it's wired for life.
So I put a"road closed" signthere as best as I could, and I
imagined a new neuro pathway andmy prayer was, God is good.
His promises are true, and he'salways gonna make a way for me.
And Lord I, I pray that you'dshow me the ways you have
preserved me.
And he started to show me theways, the things that didn't
(13:29):
happen to me.
And I've spent days in a rowthanking God for all the things
that didn't happen to me.
Because He had a shield ofprotection around me.
And in due time what happenswhen you blaze a new neuro
pathway in your brain when youare triggered because you've
been practicing that pathway,when the enemy pokes into you,
immediately your thoughts go, ohwait, I've been here before.
God is good.
His promises are true.
(13:50):
For me, it worked.
Maybe I just have kind of ananalytical mind, but I needed to
understand how the body works,how it relates to how God wired
us, and that helped me a lot, isto really just deal with my
fears daily, moment by moment,and in due time picturing new
neural pathways being formed inmy brain and really also,
getting back to the place ofunderstanding that God is good.
(14:13):
Because I think when you walkthrough enough hardship that
becomes up for grabs.
In my other book, one that justcame out Strong in Battle, I
said over and over again daily,we're given an opportunity to
either accuse God or trust himand, and the enemy wants it that
way.
But the more that we can settleon the fact that God is so good
and so for us and he wants ourbest, the easier it'll be for us
(14:34):
to navigate these hard times.
Ivelisse Page (14:35):
You know, out here in Colorado, there's so
many beautiful hikes and whenyou're talking about those neuro
pathways, for me, I love seeingpictures of what that looks
like.
And when you're on a trailthat's been there before, it's
smooth, it's easy.
You know how to get to the top.
There's no confusion.
Right?
But when you are going into thewilderness and there isn't any
(14:56):
path.
It's hard.
You have to think harder andit's more difficult, which is
why it's hard sometimes to putthat roadblock.
I love how you said that, to putthat roadblock, road closed, and
it's gonna take time for thatpath to not be easy to follow
anymore.
Susie Larson (15:11):
Exactly.
Ivelisse Page (15:12):
And the more you follow that new path, the more
that it clears the way for thenext time.
Susie Larson (15:17):
Mm-hmm.
Ivelisse Page (15:18):
I love that image, that you shared.
Something else that you talkedabout in your book is that you
learn from a counselor friendabout women and men in their
late thirties who are dealingwith severe anxiety, fear, and
you share that the body neverforgets the traumatic memories
and hurtful events.
You say your body remembers,your brain remembers and your
(15:38):
soul remembers.
Can you talk about that?
Susie Larson (15:41):
Yeah, I'll first reference the counselor friend.
She was saying that not onlywere they dealing with anxieties
and fears, but physiologicalsymptoms that doctors could not
diagnose.
It is so hard when you're infear and anxiety and then crazy
things start to happen in yourbody.
Again, it's almost like thisdouble trauma going, okay, now
something terrible's gonnahappen.
And even people who aren'thypochondriacs, the enemy wants
to get you into a place whereyou're just turning every which
(16:03):
way because the arrows arezinging.
And when these doctors wouldsay, I don't find anything.
And so then they would go tocounseling and, she said, we get
them into just the sense ofGod's presence and His love.
And once they reconnect againwith the love of the Father,
these things untangle.
The fears and anxieties and thesymptoms just slowly waned and
went away.
She said 80% of the time, thesepeople who were very wound up
(16:24):
with physical symptoms andemotional stress, the love of
the Father just solved it.
She said once in a while therewould be a hidden something that
they needed to find, and I justthink that's so important.
And I didn't read this wholebook, but I read parts of it and
I'm sure you've heard of it, Dr.
van der Kolk I think is hisname, the Body Keep Score.
But he said, after trauma, theworld is experienced through a
different nervous system.
(16:45):
So while others are showing upand enjoying the moment and
being fully present, this is myparaphrase, the person who's
been through trauma is justconstantly trying to suppress
inner chaos.
And I can't tell you Ivelisse Imean, how many times I've been
in a situation where everybodyseems fully present and fully
enjoying and my face is goingnumb, or my vision is starting
to blur, or I'm starting to feela little dizzy, or my knee's
(17:05):
weak, and I'm like, No, no, no,no, no, no.
I'm trying to engage.
I'm trying to listen but I'mlike, oh, and it is hard.
And, and I think when you walkthrough certain things, we have
an incident and then you have anemotional response to it.
It's like they say nerves thatfire together, wire together.
So you could be awoken in themiddle of the night abrubtly to
something that was terrifyingand you have an emotional
response and those things bondtogether and the enemy knows
(17:27):
that.
So whatever he can do to createreminiscent traumas, to keep you
triggered, keep you bracing forimpact.
And that's the thing I've beenthinking a lot about is after
these last three years, I wrotethis before the last three
years, this released years ago,but even more so now, the
enemy's got us locking ourelbows, bracing for impact,
which keeps us in fight flight.
It's like if he can't make yousick with the virus, he's gonna
(17:49):
make you sick with fear aboutthe virus and anything else
that's going on, socially.
He has gotten away with murder.
And the thing is, when we havethese past traumas, where the
nerves have fired together andwired together, and we've not
resolved those with God.
Those are open door accesspoints for the enemy to
re-trigger and re-traumatize,and that's what he wants to do
is keep us triggered.
(18:09):
But the Lord says, I've notgiven you a spirit of fear.
I've given you a spirit ofpower, love, and sound mind.
In that scripture, the way itbreaks down, you think about
where people are at right now,reacting in the flesh, grabbing
for themselves, seeming to havelost their minds.
The opposite of that power,love, and sound mind.
Power, the original word isdunamis, where we get the word
(18:29):
dynamite.
He's given us a spirit of power,explosive power.
We can stand against theassaults of the enemy and walk
in an otherworldly way thatmakes people wonder.
What we're about.
I mean that there's such powerin our steps, in our words and
our prayers that we are of thekingdom of God.
That's power.
Love is the agape love.
It's the love that lays its lifedown for another.
(18:50):
So in a day when everybody'sgrabbing for themselves, we know
so well that we overcome by theblood of the lamb, the word of
our testimony, and we love notour lives, even unto death.
Going, even if you were to tryto take my life, life is short,
eternity is long.
I have a long eternal destinythat you cannot touch, and I'm
only here for eternity's sake,so I'm gonna live to the fullest
(19:10):
and I'm gonna love, well.
I'm not gonna let yourbitterness, your lawlessness,
bait me into bitterness andlawlessness.
I'm gonna respond in an oppositespirit because he's given me a
spirit of power, love.
And then sound mind is exactlythat.
A reasoning mind.
It's war skill.
It's an ability to discernwhat's going on and navigate
wisely.
What gifts God has given us.
(19:32):
But we don't operate in thatflow when we're leaving the
stuff in our basementunresolved.
And that's why, again, God isnot allowing a storm to reveal
the lie, just to stir us up.
It's to show us the truths thatwe need.
Here's that phrase again.
The storms reveal the lies webelieve and the truths we need.
And I'll just say it, and I saidit several times in the book,
(19:52):
that there are times God knowsyou're strong enough.
He knows when you've beenpositioned and you're ready and
he will allow an overplayedenemy attack only to position
you for freedom cuz he knowswhat's in you.
He knows what's hindering you,and he needs you on the field
and he wants you full, healedand whole because he's got more
for you to do.
Ivelisse Page (20:09):
Wow.
That is even blessing me as I'mhearing you speak, you know, cuz
there are so many arrows thatare constantly trying to
discourage and to bombard us ona daily basis.
And that truth is so powerfulfor people to cling to and to
hold onto.
And sometimes we feel like, wellI already thought I dealt with
that.
I thought I had uncovered that.
(20:29):
You share a another great visualin your book about the farmer
having to pull up the bouldersfrom the farmland.
Can you share about that story?
Susie Larson (20:37):
Okay, so because I wrote this a few years ago, I'm
hoping I can remember that.
But, I remember I was walkingthrough this time where God was
just uprooting all kinds ofthings and one of the things the
Lord showed me, he says, you'regreat unearthing will be the
devil's undoing.
Because these things weresurfacing for me that were
really traumatizing and superpainful.
And when we were out to eat withmy sister and her husband, they
(20:59):
lived out on a farm at the time,and they, said, our boys do this
every summer for the localfarmers, is that every season
the land gives up the bouldersand they move them so they can
prepare for a new harvest.
Is that what you're talkingabout?
Ivelisse Page (21:11):
Yes.
Susie Larson (21:11):
Is that the story?
And I thought that was sohelpful to me because I felt
like my land was so exposed.
It's like I couldn't tidy thisup in a nice bow.
And I think when you're walkingthrough those great unearthings,
because especially in the West,we treasure, put together facade
so much.
We idolize it, in fact.
There's not a lot of room andspace for those unearthing and
undoings, but that's a sacredspace that God has really
(21:33):
cordoned off because he'sgetting ready to do a new thing.
But I fear Ivelisse, some of usidolize appearance so much that
we'll do everything we can topreempt and get around that
thing because we don't wannadeal.
And what we don't know is Godwants to heal.
It's what he's trying to do isallow for some space so that He
can do a new thing in you.
Ivelisse Page (21:53):
A journey towards wholeness will surface issues
from the past, kind of like yourtraumas from when you were
younger.
What do you say to thoselistening today who are afraid
to face those past hurts?
Susie Larson (22:06):
That's one of the things that I think the enemy,
again, works over time,threatening.
It will swallow you whole.
But if God's saying it's time,he's with you every step of the
way, and I do think it is wisenot to isolate.
I think it's wise to seek outspiritual mentors, godly
friends, a pastor that youtrust, a spiritual director or a
counselor.
I went back to counseling tothat friend.
I just did a few sessions withher over the course of a few
(22:26):
months because quite honestly, Iwas so hurt and disappointed in
God that he allowed itinitially, and once I started to
sort through it, I'm like, No,He is up to something here.
I'm going with Him in this.
We're not meant to go through italone, but it is a lie from the
pit of hell that you won't getthrough it.
He's threatening to expose you,but what he's scared of is his
exposure.
(22:47):
You know, your threat to him isvery connected to his threat to
you, and so just shut him down.
I mean, that's one of the otherthings in the book I talk a lot
about, is really not giving somuch air time to him not having,
conversations around that orletting him spew in our ears.
That's what your shield is for,to block those fiery arrows and
any kind of threat or taunt hesends your way.
(23:07):
Because, we have to clear thefield of all these competing
emotions if we wanna win thebattle.
And that really is important todeal quickly with those things.
And those are the things that Isort of let linger and swirl in
my head or stay in my basement.
And they were just places thatthe enemy could use to plague
and torment.
I'm much more alert now to thosekinds of things, encroaching and
infringing on my property, so tospeak.
Ivelisse Page (23:29):
So much of us are always constantly focused on our
physical side, you know,physical side of healing, and
this part is really really hardand, whether it's forgiveness,
whether it's a trauma orwhatever that has gone through,
and I know we're gonna sharethat next time as far as your
story is on how God used,forgiveness and the people in
your life to work through thingsfrom your past.
(23:52):
Knowing what you know now, whydo you recommend that women take
time to grieve their losses?
So many times we're just likepush, off full steam ahead and
trying to move forward and putit behind us.
Why do you think it's importantfor us to grieve the losses?
Susie Larson (24:07):
Because Jesus wants to meet us there, in the
valley of the shadow.
And there are plenty of psalmsof lament that show how
important that process is, and Idid write about that Steven
Arterburn in the book.
It was years ago when I had himon the show.
And this again was years priorto what we've just walked
through in the last three years.
But he said, Susie, one of thegreat epidemics in the church is
unresolved grief, that we've gota series of losses, hurts, and
(24:29):
disappointments, and we've takenno time to deal with them.
And I think maybe you've metsomeone who's got this
unresolved grief and it cloudsyour view of everything.
When Jesus says, I'm doing a newthing, you perceive it?
He makes all things new andthose who wait on the Lord will
renew their strength.
They'll run and not get weary.
They'll walk and not faint.
And there's a new strength thateven exceeds your age.
(24:51):
You know, young people willstumble and fall.
Even the young people who are atthe peak of their health will
wear out and stumble and fall.
But God wants to infuse you witha new strength and power.
And I don't know who said itfirst.
I quoted all the time.
I'm gonna have to go find theperson who wrote it, but this
author said, a thousand peopleare waiting on the other side of
your obedience.
And to think it's so importantto know your story isn't just
about you.
(25:11):
And I think nursing a grudge andnursing a hurt where you're
coddling it and protecting itmakes you very inward focused.
But when you offer that hurt toGod to say, I'm gonna own it,
I'm gonna admit it, I'm gonnafeel it so I can heal it.
I'm gonna walk it through withGod.
Then you're able to give comfortbecause of the comfort you
received.
And I think if you refuse togrieve, you're refusing God's
(25:34):
comfort.
Because, the thing is too, Ithink we see some of the great
losses that others have had, andso we let it minimize the losses
we've had.
But comparing your hurt tosomeone else in that regard will
never help you heal.
It doesn't matter how big theirloss is and how small yours
seems.
If it hits you big, it's becauseit's probably connected to
something deeper that you're noteven remembering.
(25:55):
And when you start to give somehonor and space to that and say,
why is this hitting me so hard?
And the Lord will say, actually,when you were a child, something
similar happened.
You remember?
And then he'll bring you back tosomething happened in your
school classroom.
Something mean your teachersaid, and it seemed
inconsequential.
But your little heart, it feltvery big and again, unresolved.
And the thing is, God isconstantly, constantly bringing
(26:15):
us back to these places so hecan put a truth where a lie has
been planted.
Ivelisse Page (26:21):
I'm hearing you say that I'm seeing the wave
behind you and the wave behindme.
And I know it's the cover,almost identical of one of your
recent books.
But as you were talking aboutthat, it reminded me of
something that Dr.
Turner mentioned when we talkedabout emotional healing from her
book.
And she said, a great way topicture getting into that
(26:41):
grieving process in a healthyway is to picture an ocean wave.
And as the feelings come intoyour body, like just you kind of
take it in and then you let itback out into the ocean.
Susie Larson (26:56):
I like that.
Ivelisse Page (26:56):
Take it in.
Feel what you're feeling andthen let it back out into the
ocean.
But I wanna add one more thingthat you said as you're taking
it in.
Replace that lie with God'struth.
And when you replace that liewith God's truth, you're able to
release it into His ocean ofpeace and promise for your life.
And so I hope that visual helpsto encourage someone today to
(27:17):
say, you know what, God hassomething more for me.
He says that his thoughts of meoutnumber the grains of sand.
Even as he cares for the birds,he thinks of me even more so.
Susie Larson (27:27):
Amen.
Ivelisse Page (27:27):
I love that it's important for us to not just
bury it, but to take it in, askGod to heal it and release it.
Susie Larson (27:34):
Mm-hmm.
Ivelisse Page (27:35):
In a small amount.
You don't have to do it all atone time.
Kind of like those boulders.
Each year we may have to removesome of those boulders and work
on the ones that come on thenext year.
Susie Larson (27:45):
You know, one thought I'll just add to that,
that sometimes people aregrieving and they're like, But I
don't know what the lie is.
And one of the ways you can helpidentify it is if you can finish
this sentence (27:53):
I'm not worth BLANK.
So I was at an event one day andI asked women to finish the
sentence, I'm not worth, and didanything come to your mind?
And some said, I'm not worthbeing a wife or a mother or
being healed.
Or being protected or beingdefended or being rescued.
And I think when you can get tothe bottom of what you believe
(28:14):
about that, then you can find atruth.
For me, it was not worth healingand not worth protecting.
And it's like I was a seasonedbeliever at that point, but if I
was honest, because I was rightin the thick of this battle
years ago, again, it was sodevastating for me.
I thought, okay, now I gottafind truth that refutes that lie
because the enemy's constantlybuilding a case in our presence.
And then he is constantly inGod's presence building a case
(28:37):
against us.
We're the ones who remove himfrom that equation.
And because Jesus is intercedingday and night, so we gotta do
some of the work of uprooting,those lies.
And what the theme throughoutthe book is we pursue healing
and then we pray for a miracle.
We do what we can do and then weask God to do it only He can do.
But we have to start and endwith the foundation that God is
good.
He's pursuing us, He loves us,as you said, he thinks
(28:59):
constantly about us and not oneof those thoughts involves
rolling his eyes and breathing aheavy sigh.
He never goes, you know what Imean?
He loves us.
He loves us.
He's got a fatherly protectionfor us, and when we start to
really count on that, then we'resafe to heal so that it starts
and it ends with His love andHis care for us.
Ivelisse Page (29:19):
That was just beautiful what you just shared.
But before we close, is thereanything in regards to the book
that you feel that I didn't askthat you would feel is important
for our listeners to take withthem today.
Susie Larson (29:31):
I appreciate that.
I'll just add that there is acompanion D V D, and there are
groups that have gone through ittogether that have found healing
together.
Some go through it alone, but Ijust feel like the healing
process needs to happen incommunity and I think that's one
of the reasons I think Believe.
Big is such a brilliant, Godgiven idea because in
collaboration and community iswhen I think God does his best
(29:52):
work.
So I would sure encourage you toconsider that, getting together
with a few women.
You'll be surprised.
There have been women who'veemailed me, pastors wives and
leaders who said, I went intothis with a leadership mindset
going, I'm gonna help all thepeople who are hurting.
I was not ready for what Godwould unearth in me, but I'm
free.
God has delivered me from somethings I'd forgotten about or
stuffed.
And I just think he's on amission right now, healing his
(30:15):
people and positioning us sothat we can represent Him to a
world in need.
So.
Ivelisse Page (30:19):
We'll definitely put the links to that in our
show notes for people who wouldlike to have those resources.
Susie, thank you so much fortaking time out of your busy
schedule to be with us today.
I want everyone to be listeningout cuz we're gonna have part
two of this story where you willhear Susie's incredible miracle
story she's walking out rightnow from her Lyme disease.
(30:40):
It's such a powerful story thatI wanted to make sure we had
enough time to unpack it and theprocess that you went through.
So I look forward to talkingwith you again soon.
Susie Larson (30:50):
I just love you dear Sister.
Thank you and I look forward toour time next time.
Ivelisse Page (31:01):
If you enjoyed this episode and you'd like to
help support our podcast, pleasesubscribe and share it with
others.
Be sure to visit believebig.orgto access the show notes and
discover our bonus content.
Thanks again and keep BelievingBig!
Hi, I'm Ivelisse Page and thanks for listening to
the Believe Big podcast, theshow where we take a deep dive
into your healing with healthexperts, a integrative
practitioners biblical faithleaders, and cancer thrivers
from around the globe.
(00:34):
Welcome to today's episode onthe Believe Big podcast.
My name is Ivelisse Page, andtoday we are gonna step out of
the physical side of healingpractices and do a special two
part episode on the role thatour emotional health has on our
physical health.
You are in for a treat becausemy guest today is a dear friend
(00:55):
of mine and one of the mostincredibly, godly women I know,
Susie Larson.
Susie is a national speaker,bestselling author, and the host
of the Daily Talk show, SusieLarson Live, heard on the Faith
Radio Network with over 3.5million downloads.
Susie has written, are you readyfor this, 19 books.
(01:16):
I love it! And many articles.
She has been a guest on Focus onthe Family, Family Life Today,
as well as many other socialmedia and media outlets.
Susie's passion is to see peopleeverywhere awakened to the value
of their soul, the depth ofGod's love, and the height of
their calling in Christ Jesus.
(01:38):
Welcome Susie to the show.
Susie Larson (01:40):
So honored to be with you Ivelisse.
Thank you for having me.
You're one of my favorite peopletoo, so what an honor to be with
you.
Ivelisse Page (01:45):
Aw.
Well, our listeners are alwaysinterested in discovering what
our guest favorite health tipis, and I know you have many,
but can you share one of themwith us?
Susie Larson (01:55):
Wow, I almost couldn't put it into one thing.
I feel like my morning, quiettime, my workout plan, going to
bed at a consistent time, and ofcourse diet and hydration.
Those are all really importantthings for me, and they make a
very big difference in my life.
So sorry, I can't really boil itdown.
If I had to boil it down, itwould be time with the Lord,
because from there he'll tellyou what you need, what you're
(02:17):
missing, what you might need toadd to your rhythm.
And that changes from season toseason, how we have to be so in
tune with our bodies.
So, sorry, I can't boil it down.
Normally I'm an overachiever.
But.
Ivelisse Page (02:27):
You are.
Well, I love that because itties into what we're talking
about.
You know, so many times we'refocused on the physical side of
healing, and especially withwhat we do with Believe Big, but
our emotions and our spirituallife has such a huge impact in
our physical healing.
And so today, I wanted to focuson your book Fully Alive.
(02:48):
That is my, absolute, and I'mnot just saying because you're
in front of me, but my absolutefavorite book on the mind, body
and soul connection.
And then we're gonna have youback on to share your personal
story of wholeness that haveoccurred over the last two
years.
So, let's get started.
You say that Fully Alive is abook you never planned to write.
(03:09):
Why so?
Susie Larson (03:10):
You know, it goes in so deep to exactly as you
said, the emotional connectionto our bodies.
I really thought not that I'dachieved these lessons, but I
thought I had learned them.
My backstory is I contractedLyme disease as a young mom
during my pregnancy, and Ibattled ferociously.
I was very sick with Lyme forabout seven years, and then for
about 20 years, I managed.
(03:31):
A handful of times a year Icouldn't get out of bed.
But other than that, I was afitness instructor.
I was very focused on doing mypart and then asking God to do
what he would do and just tryingto get through it and manage
life around that.
But then about seven years ago,I had a massive relapse and, the
book really was the fruit out ofthat.
But what happened was, if Icould just give you context, and
(03:52):
it's kind of cramming a lot intoa short amount of time, but just
so people understand where I'mcoming from.
I grew up in a large family.
I grew up in a denominationwhere I knew God was real.
But I didn't really know Jesuswas accessible.
You know?
I mean, I had a sense of God'spresence.
I absolutely knew he was real.
I was a people pleaser.
And when I was about nine yearsold, I suffered a sexual trauma
at the hands of some boys in ourneighborhood.
Well, that opened a canyon offear insecurity, self contempt,
(04:15):
and I didn't tell anybody.
I didn't know what to do withwhat had happened.
And then about a year later, I'mjust 10 years old, four feet
tall, walking home from school.
And I was jumped by a differentgroup of boys and beat up real
bad.
And they laughed wildly as theypunched me and pulled fistfuls
of hair kicked me.
And now in my adult mind, I knowthey were high on something cuz
they had this crazed look andthey just, for sport, were
(04:36):
beating up this little girl andthey walked away when they were
done with me laughing.
And I might, I had a fat lip andscratched a face and snarled
hair, but I got up from thatmoment, and I heard in my ear, I
can get you anytime, anywhereand God will never stop me.
So I'm pregnant with my thirdson.
I'm on bedrest for six monthswith this precious little baby,
and the doctors let me get upone time just to see if I was
(04:58):
okay to get up.
And I met my old collegeroommates for lunch.
I was super careful.
It was a fall day.
I was in bed by night cuz I wascontracting again.
But two weeks from that outingmy face started to go numb and,
and my short term memory startedto do funky things and I was
having numbing down my arms anddizziness and, body pain and
fatigue and all those things.
And I couldn't believe I hadthree more months to go on this
(05:20):
pregnancy that these wereoverlapping crises.
So coming to Christ in, like ineighth, ninth grade, I was super
passionate about God, but Ididn't have the undergirding of
a really solid biblicalfoundation.
So by this point I really didn'tknow why I was a"have not", why
my friends had health, they hadwealth, and I had neither.
And I had used up most of myfriend favors on the six months
(05:41):
of bedrest.
So the fact that there werethese overlapping crises was
very traumatic for me.
So once my son was born, it wasa year later that I'd found out
that deer tick, that one daythat I was up latched on,
deposited that bacteria took offbasically, and ravaged my
health.
And, so it fed into my earagain.
I can get to anytime, anywhere.
And it just felt true and itfelt like the enemy was
(06:03):
orchestrating scenarios toreinforce the lie.
And again, I didn't have enoughof a foundation to really
challenge that so much.
I dealt with a lot of fear, alot of anxiety, and I fought
hard for my health.
And so even though there wasfruit in my life and I had a
passion for God and he was usingme in different areas, the seven
years ago, that moment in thebathroom, I was getting ready to
head to the radio station and Iknew that the inflammation is
(06:26):
starting to rise, cuz again, itwould happen several times a
year, but it came surging inheavier doses.
And in the bathroom that day, mywhole head went numb, my neck
went numb, my esophagus spasmed.
Like when I looked down,everything knotted up in my
throat and in my esophagus andmy arms went numb.
And then the pressure in my headwas like someone was turning a
vice.
Like I thought my head was gonnabreak from the pain.
(06:48):
And I'm like, No, no, no, no,no, no, no.
Please God, no.
I just thought, not at this age.
I've been fighting for so longand trying to navigate with a
good attitude.
Please don't make me go throughthis again.
And I hear the whisper in myspirit,"the storms reveal the
lies we believe and the truthswe need".
And I'm like, What?
And it really, Ivelisse, if youcould peel the sky back in the
bathroom that day, it was like achaotic, supernatural battle is
(07:11):
what it felt like.
Because the fear, the panic, thedread, the despair, the
disappointment that God wasletting me go through this
again.
But I hear that,"the stormsreveal the lies we believe and
the truths we need".
And I'm like, What?
What's the lie that I believe?
And that came thundering in myear.
I can get to you anytime,anywhere.
God will never stop me.
And the Lord said, that's thelie and you've lived with it
(07:31):
your whole life.
It is not true that he can getto you anytime, anywhere.
It is not true that he's hadopen access, Susie.
You don't know what I'veprevented in your life.
You don't even have any ideawhat I've provided in your life.
No, He said you've believed thisand it's time to face it down.
I'm not gonna let you lose.
But I have to let you fight.
And that began this journey thatI never wanted, but I wouldn't
(07:53):
trade it now because I startedto see that there were things
shoved in the basement of mysoul, unresolved traumas and
hardships.
And when anybody who battleslong term illness or severe
acute illness, it's a trauma,it's a second trauma.
There's the physical trauma,then there's the emotional
trauma.
And, I did not realize theconnection.
And because it affected my brainso, I'm a live talk radio host
(08:13):
and an author, at this point, Iwas having trouble spelling very
basic words.
I was putting wrong words in mysentences and trying to cover up
for it on live talk radio.
I'm writing a book and I t h e re and e i r I couldn't remember
which one went where, and I hadto google it.
I've actually written 20 books.
So at this point I think I hadwhat, 15, 16, 17 books under my
(08:34):
belt and I had to google themeaning of basic words.
It was horrific.
And I just couldn't believe it.
Well, long story short,apparently people with chronic
lyme also have a susceptibilityto mold, not being able to
process it.
And I'd had unknowing repeatedexposure to black mold that
attacked my brain.
So when they did an MRI, theyfound seven areas of either
atrophy like damage or swelling.
(08:55):
My MRI looked pretty bad.
And, so this journey is I had toget my brain back.
I knew neuroplasticity was athing and so I started to bring
on brain scientists.
I just started to go for adeeper dive and the Lord really
showed me what happens in thesoul happens in the cells.
And I feel like he brought meback to that place of trauma in
a way to go, you're not all theway healed yet.
And sometimes we feel like he'spulling us back to punish us or
(09:18):
because he refuses to deliverus.
But no, it's so he can deliverus, because I know things now I
didn't know then.
I know God's word, like I didn'tknow it, then I know Him.
And so it wasn't wasted on me soFully Alive is really a book on
internal healing inner healing.
And the very physiological, thevery direct connection
physiologically to the emotionsthat we feel.
So, it's so good to honor thestory that God is writing with
(09:41):
our lives and to give some roomto breathe around those things
you're feeling and trust God tolead you to a better place.
Ivelisse Page (09:47):
Wow! What an incredible, story of God's
faithfulness through that.
And I love that at those momentswhere you felt weakest, that He
stepped right in and gave youthose words.
And I wanna go back to somethingyou said.
You said"the storms of lifereveal the lies we believe and
the truths we need".
Susie Larson (10:07):
Mm-hmm.
Ivelisse Page (10:08):
And I believe those lies are greater to fight
than sometimes the physicalillness itself.
Susie Larson (10:14):
Yeah.
Ivelisse Page (10:14):
And so, when you heard,"I can get you anytime
anywhere and God will never stopme", what practically did you do
to stand strong when the enemywhispered those lies?
What is some tools that, I knowthat there are many people
listening today that there arelies that are being spewed at
them, but what did you do inparticular to combat those lies
(10:34):
after hearing?
Susie Larson (10:36):
Good, good question.
First of all, I wanna say thatprior to that, it was
whack-a-mole with fear andanxiety.
I was just, trying to deal withit, put it under my feet and do
my best.
But in this place, when Istarted to realize, again, the
physiological impact, like twoof my doctors, I've got three
doctors, believers, justbrilliant and amazing.
But two of them, you know, daysapart from each other had said
to me, Susie, you've gotinflammation off the charts in
(10:58):
your body, we can help you withthat.
But fear opens a door to acascade, an inflammatory
response in your body.
You gotta do something about thefear.
We're gonna help you with theother stuff, but you gotta help
us by doing something about thatfear.
And so I decided to employ azero tolerance policy on fear.
And I did a deep dive study onfear, it's very interesting.
(11:19):
And I know you know thisIvelisse, but, that our brain
only operates on one of twofuels scientifically.
Scientists, apart from faith,have discovered that our brain
is either operating on the fuelof fear or love.
Now, don't you think that'samazing how science is slowly
catching up with what waswritten in scripture all those
years ago?
Because scripture says there'sno fear in love.
Perfect love, casts out fear.
(11:40):
And what was so interesting atone of the points when I had to
get labs done, when everythingwas going crazy in my body, I
showed to be extremelydehydrated, but I drink 70
ounces of water a day.
I'm like, how is that possiblethat I'm dehydrated when I'm
drinking so much water?
And Dr.
Troy said, well, when you're infear, your body your cells even
shut down into fight flight.
So you don't even get thebenefit of your disciplines.
(12:02):
So you can be doing all thediscipline actions in the world,
if you're not dealing withemotions, especially like fear
and anxiety, it's like you'vegot a divided kingdom within
you, one foot on the gas, onefoot on the break.
So I had to go to war with thatfear.
And I had to just decide everyday to turn my back on it and
behold faith and say, Lord, I'mterrified.
It feels true that I've had tolive through everything I fear.
(12:24):
It feels true, that I don'tenjoy the protections that other
people do, but I'm gonna believethat you are good.
Your promises are true.
You will always make away fromme.
And then I learned about aneural pathways.
When you repeat and repeat andrepeat, your body kind of
defaults to that mindset.
And if it's a negative one, itbecomes a super highway.
So you don't become lesstriggerable, you become more
(12:45):
triggerable and if you put a"road closed" sign on that
neural pathway and say, I'm notgonna have those repetitive
thoughts anymore.
After about 40 days, your braindeletes the pathway.
So the thing is, if you decideI'm gonna pave a new trail, you
have to almost take sidesagainst yourself in that the
self of you, that part of youthat wants to be bent towards
destruction because you're sohurt and it just seems easier to
(13:06):
expect the worst.
You have to go no, no, becauseGod has wired me for life.
If you study the human body,it's wired for life.
So I put a"road closed" signthere as best as I could, and I
imagined a new neuro pathway andmy prayer was, God is good.
His promises are true, and he'salways gonna make a way for me.
And Lord I, I pray that you'dshow me the ways you have
preserved me.
And he started to show me theways, the things that didn't
(13:29):
happen to me.
And I've spent days in a rowthanking God for all the things
that didn't happen to me.
Because He had a shield ofprotection around me.
And in due time what happenswhen you blaze a new neuro
pathway in your brain when youare triggered because you've
been practicing that pathway,when the enemy pokes into you,
immediately your thoughts go, ohwait, I've been here before.
God is good.
His promises are true.
(13:50):
For me, it worked.
Maybe I just have kind of ananalytical mind, but I needed to
understand how the body works,how it relates to how God wired
us, and that helped me a lot, isto really just deal with my
fears daily, moment by moment,and in due time picturing new
neural pathways being formed inmy brain and really also,
getting back to the place ofunderstanding that God is good.
(14:13):
Because I think when you walkthrough enough hardship that
becomes up for grabs.
In my other book, one that justcame out Strong in Battle, I
said over and over again daily,we're given an opportunity to
either accuse God or trust himand, and the enemy wants it that
way.
But the more that we can settleon the fact that God is so good
and so for us and he wants ourbest, the easier it'll be for us
(14:34):
to navigate these hard times.
Ivelisse Page (14:35):
You know, out here in Colorado, there's so
many beautiful hikes and whenyou're talking about those neuro
pathways, for me, I love seeingpictures of what that looks
like.
And when you're on a trailthat's been there before, it's
smooth, it's easy.
You know how to get to the top.
There's no confusion.
Right?
But when you are going into thewilderness and there isn't any
(14:56):
path.
It's hard.
You have to think harder andit's more difficult, which is
why it's hard sometimes to putthat roadblock.
I love how you said that, to putthat roadblock, road closed, and
it's gonna take time for thatpath to not be easy to follow
anymore.
Susie Larson (15:11):
Exactly.
Ivelisse Page (15:12):
And the more you follow that new path, the more
that it clears the way for thenext time.
Susie Larson (15:17):
Mm-hmm.
Ivelisse Page (15:18):
I love that image, that you shared.
Something else that you talkedabout in your book is that you
learn from a counselor friendabout women and men in their
late thirties who are dealingwith severe anxiety, fear, and
you share that the body neverforgets the traumatic memories
and hurtful events.
You say your body remembers,your brain remembers and your
(15:38):
soul remembers.
Can you talk about that?
Susie Larson (15:41):
Yeah, I'll first reference the counselor friend.
She was saying that not onlywere they dealing with anxieties
and fears, but physiologicalsymptoms that doctors could not
diagnose.
It is so hard when you're infear and anxiety and then crazy
things start to happen in yourbody.
Again, it's almost like thisdouble trauma going, okay, now
something terrible's gonnahappen.
And even people who aren'thypochondriacs, the enemy wants
to get you into a place whereyou're just turning every which
(16:03):
way because the arrows arezinging.
And when these doctors wouldsay, I don't find anything.
And so then they would go tocounseling and, she said, we get
them into just the sense ofGod's presence and His love.
And once they reconnect againwith the love of the Father,
these things untangle.
The fears and anxieties and thesymptoms just slowly waned and
went away.
She said 80% of the time, thesepeople who were very wound up
(16:24):
with physical symptoms andemotional stress, the love of
the Father just solved it.
She said once in a while therewould be a hidden something that
they needed to find, and I justthink that's so important.
And I didn't read this wholebook, but I read parts of it and
I'm sure you've heard of it, Dr.
van der Kolk I think is hisname, the Body Keep Score.
But he said, after trauma, theworld is experienced through a
different nervous system.
(16:45):
So while others are showing upand enjoying the moment and
being fully present, this is myparaphrase, the person who's
been through trauma is justconstantly trying to suppress
inner chaos.
And I can't tell you Ivelisse Imean, how many times I've been
in a situation where everybodyseems fully present and fully
enjoying and my face is goingnumb, or my vision is starting
to blur, or I'm starting to feela little dizzy, or my knee's
(17:05):
weak, and I'm like, No, no, no,no, no, no.
I'm trying to engage.
I'm trying to listen but I'mlike, oh, and it is hard.
And, and I think when you walkthrough certain things, we have
an incident and then you have anemotional response to it.
It's like they say nerves thatfire together, wire together.
So you could be awoken in themiddle of the night abrubtly to
something that was terrifyingand you have an emotional
response and those things bondtogether and the enemy knows
(17:27):
that.
So whatever he can do to createreminiscent traumas, to keep you
triggered, keep you bracing forimpact.
And that's the thing I've beenthinking a lot about is after
these last three years, I wrotethis before the last three
years, this released years ago,but even more so now, the
enemy's got us locking ourelbows, bracing for impact,
which keeps us in fight flight.
It's like if he can't make yousick with the virus, he's gonna
(17:49):
make you sick with fear aboutthe virus and anything else
that's going on, socially.
He has gotten away with murder.
And the thing is, when we havethese past traumas, where the
nerves have fired together andwired together, and we've not
resolved those with God.
Those are open door accesspoints for the enemy to
re-trigger and re-traumatize,and that's what he wants to do
is keep us triggered.
(18:09):
But the Lord says, I've notgiven you a spirit of fear.
I've given you a spirit ofpower, love, and sound mind.
In that scripture, the way itbreaks down, you think about
where people are at right now,reacting in the flesh, grabbing
for themselves, seeming to havelost their minds.
The opposite of that power,love, and sound mind.
Power, the original word isdunamis, where we get the word
(18:29):
dynamite.
He's given us a spirit of power,explosive power.
We can stand against theassaults of the enemy and walk
in an otherworldly way thatmakes people wonder.
What we're about.
I mean that there's such powerin our steps, in our words and
our prayers that we are of thekingdom of God.
That's power.
Love is the agape love.
It's the love that lays its lifedown for another.
(18:50):
So in a day when everybody'sgrabbing for themselves, we know
so well that we overcome by theblood of the lamb, the word of
our testimony, and we love notour lives, even unto death.
Going, even if you were to tryto take my life, life is short,
eternity is long.
I have a long eternal destinythat you cannot touch, and I'm
only here for eternity's sake,so I'm gonna live to the fullest
(19:10):
and I'm gonna love, well.
I'm not gonna let yourbitterness, your lawlessness,
bait me into bitterness andlawlessness.
I'm gonna respond in an oppositespirit because he's given me a
spirit of power, love.
And then sound mind is exactlythat.
A reasoning mind.
It's war skill.
It's an ability to discernwhat's going on and navigate
wisely.
What gifts God has given us.
(19:32):
But we don't operate in thatflow when we're leaving the
stuff in our basementunresolved.
And that's why, again, God isnot allowing a storm to reveal
the lie, just to stir us up.
It's to show us the truths thatwe need.
Here's that phrase again.
The storms reveal the lies webelieve and the truths we need.
And I'll just say it, and I saidit several times in the book,
(19:52):
that there are times God knowsyou're strong enough.
He knows when you've beenpositioned and you're ready and
he will allow an overplayedenemy attack only to position
you for freedom cuz he knowswhat's in you.
He knows what's hindering you,and he needs you on the field
and he wants you full, healedand whole because he's got more
for you to do.
Ivelisse Page (20:09):
Wow.
That is even blessing me as I'mhearing you speak, you know, cuz
there are so many arrows thatare constantly trying to
discourage and to bombard us ona daily basis.
And that truth is so powerfulfor people to cling to and to
hold onto.
And sometimes we feel like, wellI already thought I dealt with
that.
I thought I had uncovered that.
(20:29):
You share a another great visualin your book about the farmer
having to pull up the bouldersfrom the farmland.
Can you share about that story?
Susie Larson (20:37):
Okay, so because I wrote this a few years ago, I'm
hoping I can remember that.
But, I remember I was walkingthrough this time where God was
just uprooting all kinds ofthings and one of the things the
Lord showed me, he says, you'regreat unearthing will be the
devil's undoing.
Because these things weresurfacing for me that were
really traumatizing and superpainful.
And when we were out to eat withmy sister and her husband, they
(20:59):
lived out on a farm at the time,and they, said, our boys do this
every summer for the localfarmers, is that every season
the land gives up the bouldersand they move them so they can
prepare for a new harvest.
Is that what you're talkingabout?
Ivelisse Page (21:11):
Yes.
Susie Larson (21:11):
Is that the story?
And I thought that was sohelpful to me because I felt
like my land was so exposed.
It's like I couldn't tidy thisup in a nice bow.
And I think when you're walkingthrough those great unearthings,
because especially in the West,we treasure, put together facade
so much.
We idolize it, in fact.
There's not a lot of room andspace for those unearthing and
undoings, but that's a sacredspace that God has really
(21:33):
cordoned off because he'sgetting ready to do a new thing.
But I fear Ivelisse, some of usidolize appearance so much that
we'll do everything we can topreempt and get around that
thing because we don't wannadeal.
And what we don't know is Godwants to heal.
It's what he's trying to do isallow for some space so that He
can do a new thing in you.
Ivelisse Page (21:53):
A journey towards wholeness will surface issues
from the past, kind of like yourtraumas from when you were
younger.
What do you say to thoselistening today who are afraid
to face those past hurts?
Susie Larson (22:06):
That's one of the things that I think the enemy,
again, works over time,threatening.
It will swallow you whole.
But if God's saying it's time,he's with you every step of the
way, and I do think it is wisenot to isolate.
I think it's wise to seek outspiritual mentors, godly
friends, a pastor that youtrust, a spiritual director or a
counselor.
I went back to counseling tothat friend.
I just did a few sessions withher over the course of a few
(22:26):
months because quite honestly, Iwas so hurt and disappointed in
God that he allowed itinitially, and once I started to
sort through it, I'm like, No,He is up to something here.
I'm going with Him in this.
We're not meant to go through italone, but it is a lie from the
pit of hell that you won't getthrough it.
He's threatening to expose you,but what he's scared of is his
exposure.
(22:47):
You know, your threat to him isvery connected to his threat to
you, and so just shut him down.
I mean, that's one of the otherthings in the book I talk a lot
about, is really not giving somuch air time to him not having,
conversations around that orletting him spew in our ears.
That's what your shield is for,to block those fiery arrows and
any kind of threat or taunt hesends your way.
(23:07):
Because, we have to clear thefield of all these competing
emotions if we wanna win thebattle.
And that really is important todeal quickly with those things.
And those are the things that Isort of let linger and swirl in
my head or stay in my basement.
And they were just places thatthe enemy could use to plague
and torment.
I'm much more alert now to thosekinds of things, encroaching and
infringing on my property, so tospeak.
Ivelisse Page (23:29):
So much of us are always constantly focused on our
physical side, you know,physical side of healing, and
this part is really really hardand, whether it's forgiveness,
whether it's a trauma orwhatever that has gone through,
and I know we're gonna sharethat next time as far as your
story is on how God used,forgiveness and the people in
your life to work through thingsfrom your past.
(23:52):
Knowing what you know now, whydo you recommend that women take
time to grieve their losses?
So many times we're just likepush, off full steam ahead and
trying to move forward and putit behind us.
Why do you think it's importantfor us to grieve the losses?
Susie Larson (24:07):
Because Jesus wants to meet us there, in the
valley of the shadow.
And there are plenty of psalmsof lament that show how
important that process is, and Idid write about that Steven
Arterburn in the book.
It was years ago when I had himon the show.
And this again was years priorto what we've just walked
through in the last three years.
But he said, Susie, one of thegreat epidemics in the church is
unresolved grief, that we've gota series of losses, hurts, and
(24:29):
disappointments, and we've takenno time to deal with them.
And I think maybe you've metsomeone who's got this
unresolved grief and it cloudsyour view of everything.
When Jesus says, I'm doing a newthing, you perceive it?
He makes all things new andthose who wait on the Lord will
renew their strength.
They'll run and not get weary.
They'll walk and not faint.
And there's a new strength thateven exceeds your age.
(24:51):
You know, young people willstumble and fall.
Even the young people who are atthe peak of their health will
wear out and stumble and fall.
But God wants to infuse you witha new strength and power.
And I don't know who said itfirst.
I quoted all the time.
I'm gonna have to go find theperson who wrote it, but this
author said, a thousand peopleare waiting on the other side of
your obedience.
And to think it's so importantto know your story isn't just
about you.
(25:11):
And I think nursing a grudge andnursing a hurt where you're
coddling it and protecting itmakes you very inward focused.
But when you offer that hurt toGod to say, I'm gonna own it,
I'm gonna admit it, I'm gonnafeel it so I can heal it.
I'm gonna walk it through withGod.
Then you're able to give comfortbecause of the comfort you
received.
And I think if you refuse togrieve, you're refusing God's
(25:34):
comfort.
Because, the thing is too, Ithink we see some of the great
losses that others have had, andso we let it minimize the losses
we've had.
But comparing your hurt tosomeone else in that regard will
never help you heal.
It doesn't matter how big theirloss is and how small yours
seems.
If it hits you big, it's becauseit's probably connected to
something deeper that you're noteven remembering.
(25:55):
And when you start to give somehonor and space to that and say,
why is this hitting me so hard?
And the Lord will say, actually,when you were a child, something
similar happened.
You remember?
And then he'll bring you back tosomething happened in your
school classroom.
Something mean your teachersaid, and it seemed
inconsequential.
But your little heart, it feltvery big and again, unresolved.
And the thing is, God isconstantly, constantly bringing
(26:15):
us back to these places so hecan put a truth where a lie has
been planted.
Ivelisse Page (26:21):
I'm hearing you say that I'm seeing the wave
behind you and the wave behindme.
And I know it's the cover,almost identical of one of your
recent books.
But as you were talking aboutthat, it reminded me of
something that Dr.
Turner mentioned when we talkedabout emotional healing from her
book.
And she said, a great way topicture getting into that
(26:41):
grieving process in a healthyway is to picture an ocean wave.
And as the feelings come intoyour body, like just you kind of
take it in and then you let itback out into the ocean.
Susie Larson (26:56):
I like that.
Ivelisse Page (26:56):
Take it in.
Feel what you're feeling andthen let it back out into the
ocean.
But I wanna add one more thingthat you said as you're taking
it in.
Replace that lie with God'struth.
And when you replace that liewith God's truth, you're able to
release it into His ocean ofpeace and promise for your life.
And so I hope that visual helpsto encourage someone today to
(27:17):
say, you know what, God hassomething more for me.
He says that his thoughts of meoutnumber the grains of sand.
Even as he cares for the birds,he thinks of me even more so.
Susie Larson (27:27):
Amen.
Ivelisse Page (27:27):
I love that it's important for us to not just
bury it, but to take it in, askGod to heal it and release it.
Susie Larson (27:34):
Mm-hmm.
Ivelisse Page (27:35):
In a small amount.
You don't have to do it all atone time.
Kind of like those boulders.
Each year we may have to removesome of those boulders and work
on the ones that come on thenext year.
Susie Larson (27:45):
You know, one thought I'll just add to that,
that sometimes people aregrieving and they're like, But I
don't know what the lie is.
And one of the ways you can helpidentify it is if you can finish
this sentence (27:53):
I'm not worth BLANK.
So I was at an event one day andI asked women to finish the
sentence, I'm not worth, and didanything come to your mind?
And some said, I'm not worthbeing a wife or a mother or
being healed.
Or being protected or beingdefended or being rescued.
And I think when you can get tothe bottom of what you believe
(28:14):
about that, then you can find atruth.
For me, it was not worth healingand not worth protecting.
And it's like I was a seasonedbeliever at that point, but if I
was honest, because I was rightin the thick of this battle
years ago, again, it was sodevastating for me.
I thought, okay, now I gottafind truth that refutes that lie
because the enemy's constantlybuilding a case in our presence.
And then he is constantly inGod's presence building a case
(28:37):
against us.
We're the ones who remove himfrom that equation.
And because Jesus is intercedingday and night, so we gotta do
some of the work of uprooting,those lies.
And what the theme throughoutthe book is we pursue healing
and then we pray for a miracle.
We do what we can do and then weask God to do it only He can do.
But we have to start and endwith the foundation that God is
good.
He's pursuing us, He loves us,as you said, he thinks
(28:59):
constantly about us and not oneof those thoughts involves
rolling his eyes and breathing aheavy sigh.
He never goes, you know what Imean?
He loves us.
He loves us.
He's got a fatherly protectionfor us, and when we start to
really count on that, then we'resafe to heal so that it starts
and it ends with His love andHis care for us.
Ivelisse Page (29:19):
That was just beautiful what you just shared.
But before we close, is thereanything in regards to the book
that you feel that I didn't askthat you would feel is important
for our listeners to take withthem today.
Susie Larson (29:31):
I appreciate that.
I'll just add that there is acompanion D V D, and there are
groups that have gone through ittogether that have found healing
together.
Some go through it alone, but Ijust feel like the healing
process needs to happen incommunity and I think that's one
of the reasons I think Believe.
Big is such a brilliant, Godgiven idea because in
collaboration and community iswhen I think God does his best
(29:52):
work.
So I would sure encourage you toconsider that, getting together
with a few women.
You'll be surprised.
There have been women who'veemailed me, pastors wives and
leaders who said, I went intothis with a leadership mindset
going, I'm gonna help all thepeople who are hurting.
I was not ready for what Godwould unearth in me, but I'm
free.
God has delivered me from somethings I'd forgotten about or
stuffed.
And I just think he's on amission right now, healing his
(30:15):
people and positioning us sothat we can represent Him to a
world in need.
So.
Ivelisse Page (30:19):
We'll definitely put the links to that in our
show notes for people who wouldlike to have those resources.
Susie, thank you so much fortaking time out of your busy
schedule to be with us today.
I want everyone to be listeningout cuz we're gonna have part
two of this story where you willhear Susie's incredible miracle
story she's walking out rightnow from her Lyme disease.
(30:40):
It's such a powerful story thatI wanted to make sure we had
enough time to unpack it and theprocess that you went through.
So I look forward to talkingwith you again soon.
Susie Larson (30:50):
I just love you dear Sister.
Thank you and I look forward toour time next time.
Ivelisse Page (31:01):
If you enjoyed this episode and you'd like to
help support our podcast, pleasesubscribe and share it with
others.
Be sure to visit believebig.orgto access the show notes and
discover our bonus content.
Thanks again and keep BelievingBig!
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