February 12, 2024 • 28 mins
Did you know???
Around 63% of physicians suffer symptoms of burnout and this affects their personal lives as well as their professional work.
About 3/10 practices have had a physician leave because of burnout (so group practices and systems are really caring about focusing on wellness too).
In this episode with Dr. Mary Wilde:
Mary shares her personal story of physician burnout and the moment it all hit her while at her mother’s bedside while she was pregnant.
She then breaks down the insight into the conflict that can lead to burnout along with how to recognize the early signs of physician burnout (Maslach’s Inventory) and the 3 key ways to address it today.
Have you seen the images of Mt. Zion national park in Utah? It is one of those bucket list places that demands experiencing first hand and this March 21-23, 2024, not only can you join Mary and a faculty of Physician leaders including some pretty stellar instructors who have worked with wellness leaders including Deepak Chopra you’ll also get CMEs for attending this Physician Renewal Retreat and giving yourself the gift of care and restoration. This retreat is the easiest “Yes!” you will say this year.
Physician Renewal Retreat:
https://drmarywilde.teachable.com/p/physician-renewal-retreat-southern-utah?affcode=1136232_rbj-i5fv
About my Guest, Dr. Mary Wilde:
Dr. Mary Wilde is an integrative pediatrician, author, podcaster, TEDx speaker, and mom of 8. She's the creator of “Resilience School” an online program for kids and families struggling with anxiety. As a physician, keynote speaker, and conference & retreat host, Dr. Mary has helped thousands of parents and professionals on the path to greater wellness & resilience.
🔗 Connect with Carole Jean Whittington:
Take the Spicy Pepper Burnout Quiz and explore Carole Jean's new book 'Unleashing Sustainable Energy' at the Whittington Well-Being website.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:20):
Hello and welcome to today's episode.
I am Too Late by my good friend Doctor Mary Wild, and we're
going to be talking all things physician burnout today.
This is such a great topic because around 63% of physicians
suffer from symptoms of burnout and this effects not just your
personal life but your professional life.
(00:40):
And about 3 in 10 practices havea physician leave because of
burnout. So this is a really important
place if you are a practice manager, if you are a physician
within a practice or in a hospital system, it's really
important that we are focusing on our physician Wellness.
My guest today is Doctor Mary Wild and she is an integrative
(01:04):
pediatrician, author, podcast TEDx speaker and mom of eight.
She's the creator of Resilience School, which is an online
program for kids and families, families struggling with anxiety
as a physician, keynote speaker and conference and retreat host.
And we're going to share a little bit about that.
Mary's got a great retreat coming up to help physicians
(01:25):
begin to bring in some energy and restoration.
Mary has helped thousands of parents and professionals on the
path to greater Wellness and resilience.
Welcome to the show, Mary. I'm so excited that you're here
with me today. Thank you so much.
Happy to be here. So Mary, I know that you've had
your own personal journey and experience through burnout and
(01:47):
you've got some really great insights because there was
something that you mentioned that I thought, oh, that is so
important. And that was how we can be most
susceptible to burnout in the areas where we feel the deepest
commitment. So, Mary, what has your burnout
experience been in the world? Yes.
And I think it's important to acknowledge that we all have our
(02:10):
own story and that we can come in and out of burnout and be on
the edge of it. And and so it's just good to be
educated about it so we can recognize it early.
But my burnout story isn't only in the professional realm, but
kind of the whole entire life package realm.
So I sometimes joke that if caregiving was an extreme sport,
(02:35):
I'd be like an ultra marathoner at certain times in my life.
Because, you know, there was a time when I was a mom of seven,
pregnant with my eighth child, working part time as a
hospitalist at a local hospital,and the caregiver for my elderly
mom who had suffered 2 strokes. And so she needed total care
(02:58):
like turning, changing tube feeding and all this.
And amazingly, you know, things were actually I was I was
keeping my head above water mostly.
But I just remember this really pivotal moment where I was
reaching over my mom in her hospital bed at my house and and
(03:23):
she perhaps in confusion or desperation, I'm not sure.
But she reached out and like started pulling my hair and
digging her nails into my arm with the one arm of hers that
worked. And it just was so jarring and
and a really difficult moment tohave the person who had nurtured
(03:49):
me and the person that I had dedicated a lot in my current
situation to helping and and andfocusing on and caring for to
have them. You know, harming me and and you
know, I I had to just run out ofthe room and I remember just
(04:12):
flopping down on on the bed, youknow in in an opposite bedroom
and and just, you know, crying. And it was just really, really
difficult. And it as I have thought about
physician burnout, I think abouthow we also have gone into
(04:33):
medicine with such dedication. And you know, we all take the
Hippocratic Oath, you know, first do no harm.
But yet it is so jarring when the very system that, you know
we are there and have dedicated ourselves to is actually harming
us. And so I think it's just really
important to have ways to recognize burnout and then also
(04:58):
ways to acknowledge when when weneed to take some steps to get
ourselves out of burnout as well.
Mary, that's a strong and powerful story.
And when you were sharing that you know the the quote that you
(05:19):
know remember so often when he works in the hospital was you
can't kill the caregiver and we sometimes as caregivers are so
busy trying to make sure that everybody else is OK we forget
to care for ourselves and. You have this beautiful.
(05:42):
Quote that I just love that you shared and I'd love you to kind
of share what the quote is, But then also kind of speak, what
does this mean to you? How does this resonate?
Why did it stand out for you, Mary?
So I found this quote by the author EB White, who said I
wake, he said something like this.
I'm paraphrasing it a little bitto shorten it up, but I wake
(06:02):
every morning with the conflict of whether to save the world or
to savor it, and that makes it hard to plan my day.
And I think sometimes as physicians we have this really
idealistic mentality. We're wanting to serve and take
care of the people around us. And sometimes when we're in a
broken hospital system or medical system, we don't feel
(06:26):
like it's working. Like we're set up to deliver the
care that we have wanted to give.
And because of the intense demands in medicine, often we
are taught to live in a state ofself denial.
I remember as a resident, you know, just putting off these
needs to for sleep and food and you know, even needing to go to
(06:49):
the bathroom, that you just kindof shut down your awareness of
that. And as a paediatrician, we would
call that a sensory processing disorder.
You know, there's this introsceptive sense of being
able to be in tune with your needs.
And we sometimes turn that off because we're working so hard in
(07:12):
the service of others. So that quote by EV White
really, really spoke to that conflict of sometimes we're
trying to save the world and we forget that we need to care for
ourselves so it can be sustainable.
And there is the magic word. That is the word that I talk
about so often. What is sustainable?
(07:34):
And you know when you talk aboutsensory sensing disorder and
it's just like OK, you know we we so easily focus on the top
five senses and and but there's seven that we really have to
consider and that's the vestibular, our balance and then
the proprioception. How do we recognize and and and
feel our our presence and our own body.
(07:58):
It's spatially in the world, andthose are the areas that are
most impacted in burnout. And in my global SPICY research
study over the last three years,we've had participants in over
93 countries and over half a million people.
And the data says 100% of respondents say that they
experience a heightened sense ofsensory input during burnout.
(08:22):
And we are. You're talking about something
so important, Mary. We are like, taught to suppress
our own needs, especially as caregivers.
You mean think about when you gothrough residency, any
internships or, you know, shadowing that you do.
It's like, oh, second of Buttercup, keep pushing through.
This is the hours, this is what we work.
This is how it goes. So what are some of those early
(08:46):
warning signs that you want people to kind of start to, you
know, if you're a healthcare provider, if you're a physician,
what are some of the things thatearly warning signs that we
should be looking for? So I like to go back to the
Masloc inventory of burnout, andthe main three areas that this
(09:06):
measures are first, emotional exhaustion.
And this also can encompass somephysical exhaustion and mental
exhaustion. But it's especially the
emotional exhaustion then also depersonalization.
And that is when we start, you know, putting off our own needs,
(09:28):
but also that we start kind of having some resentment and
cynicism towards the humanness of others as well.
And so when we start getting more jaded, we start not
enjoying our patience as much. And this is a sign that it's
it's not that our personality ischanging or that the world is
(09:51):
all dark and bleak, but sometimes it's just that we are
exhausted and we are in a place of burnout.
We need to stop and renew. The third area is the area of
personal accomplishment and how we relate to that.
And and often in a state of burnout, we're really feeling a
low sense of personal accomplishment.
We're not feeling like we're making a difference.
We're not feeling rewards of ourefforts.
(10:12):
And so when you combine those three things of being
emotionally exhausted, being cynical and jaded and you know,
less in touch with our own humanness and the humanness of
others, and then feeling like everything is sort of futile,
that is a recipe for feeling very unwell and and being burned
out. Oh my goodness, we are talking
(10:34):
about the burnout cocktail. That is the Burnout cocktail and
it's, you know, I love that, thefirst one that you talk about.
And I am definitely steeped in some Maslox myself.
But as we look at that, you know, we also have to look at
our nourishment. And that's one of the things
that you know, we are denying that we've talked about before.
(10:56):
And in my global spicy research study, the number one unmet
nourishment need is emotional safety and not emotional safety
so much with other people. The bigger element was feeling
emotionally safe within ourselves.
And so how you're talking about that showing up, that's a big
one. So what, how did those three
(11:18):
things show up in your life, Mary?
How did you recognize those and and maybe how are you
recognizing those in other physicians to kind of help bring
this conversation about more often?
Well you know, definitely when Ihad that, that moment of
(11:39):
decision, that pivotal moment with my mom, it was one of those
moments where I was just feelinglike I can't do this anymore.
Like I don't have the bandwidth and and it's kind of feeling
like our hope is lost. I you know my my actions are
futile and and that was really adifficult moment and and I see
(12:02):
that too I work a lot with parents in the burnout space and
helping them recognize burnout because across the board when
we're in a burnout state we're not performing at our optimal
performance. I've heard it said, you know the
question isn't are you have I done enough work today?
(12:23):
It's have I rested enough that Ican show up and do my most
loving and important work. And so performance always is is
influenced when we are emotionally exhausted, when you
know we feel jaded and when we don't have hope and and see the
(12:46):
fruits of our efforts like we'vekind of lost our why.
So in their very early signs andin the the Maslach inventory,
there, there are some different layers of it.
So sometimes maybe you only are experiencing some emotional
exhaustion and maybe you're experiencing some anxiety and
(13:11):
depression or maybe you're only seeing some cynicism or maybe
you're only feeling like you're not seeing results from your
work. And those are just a sign to
just start paying attention because we're all somewhere
along this continuum of energized and engaged all the
(13:32):
way down to being completely burned out like we're somewhere
on that continuum at all times. And so it's it's important to be
able to check in with ourselves and and and not blame ourselves.
But recognize that in some ways it's a product of our
circumstance and the fact that we have been trying to push
forward without the proper resources.
(13:54):
And this, this reminds me quickly of another instance I
remember early in my marriage, my husband is a distance runner
and he loves, you know, he marathons and ultra marathons
and things like that. I was a sprinter in high school
and I would always tell my husband, you know, I I'm just
(14:15):
not a distance person, I can't do that.
And then. And he started asking me, how
much sleep have you gotten? Did you, did you eat anything?
Did you drink anything? And I realized that when I was
defining myself as someone who could not do distance running, I
I hadn't eaten for eight hours. I didn't bring water with me.
(14:39):
I was often sleep deprived, you know.
And so that's just not fair. And a lot of times, we're not
being fair to ourselves when we're judging ourselves harshly
when this exhaustion, this cynicism, this discouragement
creeps up. Oh, you just hit a really good
spot that some people might be recognizing in this
(15:02):
conversation. That's such a big one.
You know, we have these expectations.
We have these social norms. We have these internal
expectations that we have created for ourselves based on
what we perceive or think other people expect of us.
And we don't stop to check in with, well, I married myself.
(15:24):
You know, like they say you can't kill the caregiver.
They say put your oxygen mask onfirst before you put your
child's on on the airplane. I mean, we know these things.
It's not. Like.
We're not aware of it, but are we applying it?
The question aren't we sleeping?Are we drinking some water?
You know have we eaten in the last 8 hours?
(15:46):
And I think you know that story that you share of your
experience and thank you so muchfor sharing that so openly and
vulnerably, Mary, because that'sa tough moment when all of these
things, it's like the perfect storm has come together in this
one moment for you where you know, and I think we have to
also look at how do we define ourselves in our role because
(16:10):
it's sometimes that definition that gets us in a place where
we're not looking at our own nourishment needs.
And I think that happens a lot in healthcare providers, more so
maybe I think then the overall population and then we're really
talking about women in healthcare.
We're really amping up that thatperspective.
(16:33):
What are some of your thoughts on that, Mary?
Yes, it is just it's pretty astounding to look at some of
the data that the suicide rate among physicians is 2 to three
times that of the normal population and and that's higher
in women. So many times we have just
unrealistic expectations of ourselves and and we're trying
(16:57):
to perform superhuman feats and and kind of run on empty and run
and run and run and it's just like we said before it's not
sustainable so. So I would love to share some
ways that I think that we can begin addressing burnout.
(17:21):
And as I kind of thought about aframework for this, You know,
you look at the whole debate online and and with different
people in the burnout space, andsome people are really talking
about, oh, it's a broken system.And some people are saying, oh,
you know, we need to just do allthis inner work.
And I really think that you can't just exclusively do one or
(17:44):
the other. You know, we would never look at
a friend in a toxic relationshipand say you just need to do
inner work. Just just do inner work, you
know we always have to address the systems, so that's external
to us ourselves. Then we do have to do the inner
work, the the self-care, learning how to implement even
(18:08):
micro renewal practices in our lives so it is sustainable.
It doesn't. Renewal and self-care doesn't
have to take more time necessarily, although sometimes
it is necessary to pause and rest in a more intentional way.
And then also there's this interplay between external and
(18:30):
internal. And that's how we interface with
our external world. And and I think what's really
important in that at that edge is recognizing that we have say
that we have a voice and we havemore decisions to make and more
power than we realize. And there's certain things that
(18:54):
can be non negotiables for us. For example, you know, one thing
that has helped prevent professional burnout in my life
is I've, I've usually been really good at setting firm
boundaries to allow me to keep my priorities with my family as
(19:15):
I have young kids. And you know, recently about 60
years ago, I moved to a smaller community.
I had moved from the big city ofMinneapolis where I was doing
moonlighting and hospitals work.And then I came to this smaller
area where there wasn't part time work and I was offered a
position in, you know, the main pediatric practice in town.
(19:37):
They had a lunch for me. They're like yay, meet doctor
Mary Wild. And then when they found out
that I just wanted to work part time and I wasn't going to
budget on that, then they had tosay we're sorry.
And I had to say OK, well thank you for the lunch, but and I I
ended up making, you know, opening my own practice because
(19:58):
I I wanted to create something that fit my life and my value
system and that honoured my balance.
So I think there you know these three things.
There's this addressing systems addressing the interface between
external and internal and and one of the main areas.
(20:20):
Is just recognizing the say thatwe do have and then the third is
the inner work, which I like to think of as finding sanctuary.
So they're like 3 s s there of systems and then say recognize
that we have say and and then sanctuary, finding sanctuary
where we can really renew ourselves and become
(20:44):
unencumbered, untangled, unwound, and then really return
to our life's work. So much better.
Oh gosh, yes. And and Mary, you talk about
things and and you and I are so much in line and of the same
heart around this addressing of how do we become energy masters.
(21:08):
And it really is about our energy mastery and you know you
do something that I just love. I I talk about just doing these
little nano vacations, these little nano breaks.
And I I think that that's one thing that gets in the way
sometimes when people think about how do I recharge, You
know it has to be like this big giant thing.
(21:29):
But you do something that you hand out and share called your
micro Moments, your micro recharge.
Share some of that that concept with us.
Like. Micro.
Well, it's, it's funny, 'cause when I was initially introduced
to this concept of micro renewal, I was in Minneapolis
(21:50):
and I went to this hair studio, it was the Aveda Hair Institute
and and they said, you know, we have, what do they call it,
something like rituals of renewal.
I think they said you get to choose a ritual of renewal as
you're here. Would you like a cup of tea or
would you like a head massage orwould you like, you know, a
(22:12):
really quick manicure? And so, and I I actually like,
almost started crying because itwas in this time of high
burnout, just to have someone offer me just a couple minutes
of care, it really made a difference.
And so I I thought a lot about the fact that we have to find
(22:38):
ways to implement it in our daily living.
We sometimes we can't pause, sometimes we need to pause, but
sometimes we can't. And so I have some different
micro renewal practices that I teach and I have actually like a
a micro renewal card deck that I've created for physicians.
And and I'll just share one of the things, it is A1 breath
(23:03):
meditation from Tiknath Han. And it's just saying as I
breathe in, I'm breathing in, asI breathe out, I'm breathing
out. And I love that because it's
just like connecting to the moment, connecting to the
breath, which we always have with us.
And it's just just getting to the simple Zen presence of it is
(23:30):
what it is. And and so just in one breath we
can change our state. And so that's just one example
but I also think you know sometimes we really need to take
a little bit of a longer time and give ourselves a pause.
I know that I have a friend in the Wellness space and she sent
(23:52):
me an e-mail recently and in thethe her closing she she said
pause the world can wait and then signed her name and and I I
just love that because sometimeswe think the world can't wait
that the world can't get along without us for just a second
while we you know pause and breathe and recharge but it can
(24:17):
and it will be better for it as we return in a renewed state.
I also think of ships at sea, how they get barnacles on them
and and sometimes all they need to do is find fresh water and
the barnacles fall off. Whereas if you don't go to fresh
water and you stay only in the marine water you have to like
(24:40):
scrape and jackhammer barnacles off.
I mean they're like tenacious and and they cause a boat to
have a lot more drag and and require a lot more fuel and so
be much less efficient and I think that's a good metaphor.
So what I'd love to do is inviteall the physicians within the
(25:03):
sound of this, this broadcast toan upcoming retreat that we have
in Southern Utah. So we are going to be hiking at
Zion National Park. We're going to do yoga in the
Canyon. We're going to practice
mindfulness with a mindfulness teacher that has studied with,
you know, John Cabot Zinn and Deepak Chopra and all all these
(25:26):
big gurus we're going to be having writing workshops.
And bonus, you get 10 CME credits.
So it's like one of those doublewhammies, but it's a total
totally MD faculty and it's justfor three days.
(25:46):
So I really invite you to to extend that message to yourself
of pause. The world can wait and do what
you need to do to recharge yourself, so you can actually
show up and savor the world as you're saving it in your own
(26:07):
sphere. Because I really don't think it
has to be a dichotomy. Let's find a way to do both.
Oh, absolutely. And this beautiful retreat is
coming up on March 21st through the 23rd.
The links will be down in the show notes so that you can go
get your ticket. Go ahead and take that pause.
(26:28):
The world can wait, it absolutely can.
And when you invest in yourself and the renewal from micro all
the way up to those bigger moments, it all comes back to
you. And it is about your energy,
mastery and your well-being. Mary, thank you so much for
(26:50):
joining us here today. How can people connect with you
on LinkedIn? Instagram.
Where can they go find you to follow and learn more about the
amazing things that you? Teach.
And burnout. Thank you.
So I can be found on Instagram at Doctor Mary Wilde DRMARYWILDE
and also at Doctor Mary wilde.com.
(27:14):
Fantastic. Y'all, go connect with Mary.
She is fabulous. She is one of my peeps in the
world that I absolutely adore. And if you are in healthcare, if
you're a physician and guys, those Cmes, those are gold.
This is like the best way to go get not only your recharge, but
to get those Cmes because you know, we all got to have those
little things every year they'redoing our credentialing things.
(27:37):
We got to have them. So here you go.
You can do it and get some bang for your buck because this is
one of the most affordable retreats and the quality of the
things that are going to be happening at this retreat.
Holy cow, I cannot tell you thisis such an immense value.
Mary, you've put together an incredible retreat and I can't
wait for everyone to join you. Thanks so much for being here.
(27:59):
Make sure you connect with Doctor Mary Wild and join me
next week for another conversation going deeper and to
burn out an hour. Energy Mastery, Take care.
Hello and welcome to today's episode.
I am Too Late by my good friend Doctor Mary Wild, and we're
going to be talking all things physician burnout today.
This is such a great topic because around 63% of physicians
suffer from symptoms of burnout and this effects not just your
personal life but your professional life.
(00:40):
And about 3 in 10 practices havea physician leave because of
burnout. So this is a really important
place if you are a practice manager, if you are a physician
within a practice or in a hospital system, it's really
important that we are focusing on our physician Wellness.
My guest today is Doctor Mary Wild and she is an integrative
(01:04):
pediatrician, author, podcast TEDx speaker and mom of eight.
She's the creator of Resilience School, which is an online
program for kids and families, families struggling with anxiety
as a physician, keynote speaker and conference and retreat host.
And we're going to share a little bit about that.
Mary's got a great retreat coming up to help physicians
(01:25):
begin to bring in some energy and restoration.
Mary has helped thousands of parents and professionals on the
path to greater Wellness and resilience.
Welcome to the show, Mary. I'm so excited that you're here
with me today. Thank you so much.
Happy to be here. So Mary, I know that you've had
your own personal journey and experience through burnout and
(01:47):
you've got some really great insights because there was
something that you mentioned that I thought, oh, that is so
important. And that was how we can be most
susceptible to burnout in the areas where we feel the deepest
commitment. So, Mary, what has your burnout
experience been in the world? Yes.
And I think it's important to acknowledge that we all have our
(02:10):
own story and that we can come in and out of burnout and be on
the edge of it. And and so it's just good to be
educated about it so we can recognize it early.
But my burnout story isn't only in the professional realm, but
kind of the whole entire life package realm.
So I sometimes joke that if caregiving was an extreme sport,
(02:35):
I'd be like an ultra marathoner at certain times in my life.
Because, you know, there was a time when I was a mom of seven,
pregnant with my eighth child, working part time as a
hospitalist at a local hospital,and the caregiver for my elderly
mom who had suffered 2 strokes. And so she needed total care
(02:58):
like turning, changing tube feeding and all this.
And amazingly, you know, things were actually I was I was
keeping my head above water mostly.
But I just remember this really pivotal moment where I was
reaching over my mom in her hospital bed at my house and and
(03:23):
she perhaps in confusion or desperation, I'm not sure.
But she reached out and like started pulling my hair and
digging her nails into my arm with the one arm of hers that
worked. And it just was so jarring and
and a really difficult moment tohave the person who had nurtured
(03:49):
me and the person that I had dedicated a lot in my current
situation to helping and and andfocusing on and caring for to
have them. You know, harming me and and you
know, I I had to just run out ofthe room and I remember just
(04:12):
flopping down on on the bed, youknow in in an opposite bedroom
and and just, you know, crying. And it was just really, really
difficult. And it as I have thought about
physician burnout, I think abouthow we also have gone into
(04:33):
medicine with such dedication. And you know, we all take the
Hippocratic Oath, you know, first do no harm.
But yet it is so jarring when the very system that, you know
we are there and have dedicated ourselves to is actually harming
us. And so I think it's just really
important to have ways to recognize burnout and then also
(04:58):
ways to acknowledge when when weneed to take some steps to get
ourselves out of burnout as well.
Mary, that's a strong and powerful story.
And when you were sharing that you know the the quote that you
(05:19):
know remember so often when he works in the hospital was you
can't kill the caregiver and we sometimes as caregivers are so
busy trying to make sure that everybody else is OK we forget
to care for ourselves and. You have this beautiful.
(05:42):
Quote that I just love that you shared and I'd love you to kind
of share what the quote is, But then also kind of speak, what
does this mean to you? How does this resonate?
Why did it stand out for you, Mary?
So I found this quote by the author EB White, who said I
wake, he said something like this.
I'm paraphrasing it a little bitto shorten it up, but I wake
(06:02):
every morning with the conflict of whether to save the world or
to savor it, and that makes it hard to plan my day.
And I think sometimes as physicians we have this really
idealistic mentality. We're wanting to serve and take
care of the people around us. And sometimes when we're in a
broken hospital system or medical system, we don't feel
(06:26):
like it's working. Like we're set up to deliver the
care that we have wanted to give.
And because of the intense demands in medicine, often we
are taught to live in a state ofself denial.
I remember as a resident, you know, just putting off these
needs to for sleep and food and you know, even needing to go to
(06:49):
the bathroom, that you just kindof shut down your awareness of
that. And as a paediatrician, we would
call that a sensory processing disorder.
You know, there's this introsceptive sense of being
able to be in tune with your needs.
And we sometimes turn that off because we're working so hard in
(07:12):
the service of others. So that quote by EV White
really, really spoke to that conflict of sometimes we're
trying to save the world and we forget that we need to care for
ourselves so it can be sustainable.
And there is the magic word. That is the word that I talk
about so often. What is sustainable?
(07:34):
And you know when you talk aboutsensory sensing disorder and
it's just like OK, you know we we so easily focus on the top
five senses and and but there's seven that we really have to
consider and that's the vestibular, our balance and then
the proprioception. How do we recognize and and and
feel our our presence and our own body.
(07:58):
It's spatially in the world, andthose are the areas that are
most impacted in burnout. And in my global SPICY research
study over the last three years,we've had participants in over
93 countries and over half a million people.
And the data says 100% of respondents say that they
experience a heightened sense ofsensory input during burnout.
(08:22):
And we are. You're talking about something
so important, Mary. We are like, taught to suppress
our own needs, especially as caregivers.
You mean think about when you gothrough residency, any
internships or, you know, shadowing that you do.
It's like, oh, second of Buttercup, keep pushing through.
This is the hours, this is what we work.
This is how it goes. So what are some of those early
(08:46):
warning signs that you want people to kind of start to, you
know, if you're a healthcare provider, if you're a physician,
what are some of the things thatearly warning signs that we
should be looking for? So I like to go back to the
Masloc inventory of burnout, andthe main three areas that this
(09:06):
measures are first, emotional exhaustion.
And this also can encompass somephysical exhaustion and mental
exhaustion. But it's especially the
emotional exhaustion then also depersonalization.
And that is when we start, you know, putting off our own needs,
(09:28):
but also that we start kind of having some resentment and
cynicism towards the humanness of others as well.
And so when we start getting more jaded, we start not
enjoying our patience as much. And this is a sign that it's
it's not that our personality ischanging or that the world is
(09:51):
all dark and bleak, but sometimes it's just that we are
exhausted and we are in a place of burnout.
We need to stop and renew. The third area is the area of
personal accomplishment and how we relate to that.
And and often in a state of burnout, we're really feeling a
low sense of personal accomplishment.
We're not feeling like we're making a difference.
We're not feeling rewards of ourefforts.
(10:12):
And so when you combine those three things of being
emotionally exhausted, being cynical and jaded and you know,
less in touch with our own humanness and the humanness of
others, and then feeling like everything is sort of futile,
that is a recipe for feeling very unwell and and being burned
out. Oh my goodness, we are talking
(10:34):
about the burnout cocktail. That is the Burnout cocktail and
it's, you know, I love that, thefirst one that you talk about.
And I am definitely steeped in some Maslox myself.
But as we look at that, you know, we also have to look at
our nourishment. And that's one of the things
that you know, we are denying that we've talked about before.
(10:56):
And in my global spicy research study, the number one unmet
nourishment need is emotional safety and not emotional safety
so much with other people. The bigger element was feeling
emotionally safe within ourselves.
And so how you're talking about that showing up, that's a big
one. So what, how did those three
(11:18):
things show up in your life, Mary?
How did you recognize those and and maybe how are you
recognizing those in other physicians to kind of help bring
this conversation about more often?
Well you know, definitely when Ihad that, that moment of
(11:39):
decision, that pivotal moment with my mom, it was one of those
moments where I was just feelinglike I can't do this anymore.
Like I don't have the bandwidth and and it's kind of feeling
like our hope is lost. I you know my my actions are
futile and and that was really adifficult moment and and I see
(12:02):
that too I work a lot with parents in the burnout space and
helping them recognize burnout because across the board when
we're in a burnout state we're not performing at our optimal
performance. I've heard it said, you know the
question isn't are you have I done enough work today?
(12:23):
It's have I rested enough that Ican show up and do my most
loving and important work. And so performance always is is
influenced when we are emotionally exhausted, when you
know we feel jaded and when we don't have hope and and see the
(12:46):
fruits of our efforts like we'vekind of lost our why.
So in their very early signs andin the the Maslach inventory,
there, there are some different layers of it.
So sometimes maybe you only are experiencing some emotional
exhaustion and maybe you're experiencing some anxiety and
(13:11):
depression or maybe you're only seeing some cynicism or maybe
you're only feeling like you're not seeing results from your
work. And those are just a sign to
just start paying attention because we're all somewhere
along this continuum of energized and engaged all the
(13:32):
way down to being completely burned out like we're somewhere
on that continuum at all times. And so it's it's important to be
able to check in with ourselves and and and not blame ourselves.
But recognize that in some ways it's a product of our
circumstance and the fact that we have been trying to push
forward without the proper resources.
(13:54):
And this, this reminds me quickly of another instance I
remember early in my marriage, my husband is a distance runner
and he loves, you know, he marathons and ultra marathons
and things like that. I was a sprinter in high school
and I would always tell my husband, you know, I I'm just
(14:15):
not a distance person, I can't do that.
And then. And he started asking me, how
much sleep have you gotten? Did you, did you eat anything?
Did you drink anything? And I realized that when I was
defining myself as someone who could not do distance running, I
I hadn't eaten for eight hours. I didn't bring water with me.
(14:39):
I was often sleep deprived, you know.
And so that's just not fair. And a lot of times, we're not
being fair to ourselves when we're judging ourselves harshly
when this exhaustion, this cynicism, this discouragement
creeps up. Oh, you just hit a really good
spot that some people might be recognizing in this
(15:02):
conversation. That's such a big one.
You know, we have these expectations.
We have these social norms. We have these internal
expectations that we have created for ourselves based on
what we perceive or think other people expect of us.
And we don't stop to check in with, well, I married myself.
(15:24):
You know, like they say you can't kill the caregiver.
They say put your oxygen mask onfirst before you put your
child's on on the airplane. I mean, we know these things.
It's not. Like.
We're not aware of it, but are we applying it?
The question aren't we sleeping?Are we drinking some water?
You know have we eaten in the last 8 hours?
(15:46):
And I think you know that story that you share of your
experience and thank you so muchfor sharing that so openly and
vulnerably, Mary, because that'sa tough moment when all of these
things, it's like the perfect storm has come together in this
one moment for you where you know, and I think we have to
also look at how do we define ourselves in our role because
(16:10):
it's sometimes that definition that gets us in a place where
we're not looking at our own nourishment needs.
And I think that happens a lot in healthcare providers, more so
maybe I think then the overall population and then we're really
talking about women in healthcare.
We're really amping up that thatperspective.
(16:33):
What are some of your thoughts on that, Mary?
Yes, it is just it's pretty astounding to look at some of
the data that the suicide rate among physicians is 2 to three
times that of the normal population and and that's higher
in women. So many times we have just
unrealistic expectations of ourselves and and we're trying
(16:57):
to perform superhuman feats and and kind of run on empty and run
and run and run and it's just like we said before it's not
sustainable so. So I would love to share some
ways that I think that we can begin addressing burnout.
(17:21):
And as I kind of thought about aframework for this, You know,
you look at the whole debate online and and with different
people in the burnout space, andsome people are really talking
about, oh, it's a broken system.And some people are saying, oh,
you know, we need to just do allthis inner work.
And I really think that you can't just exclusively do one or
(17:44):
the other. You know, we would never look at
a friend in a toxic relationshipand say you just need to do
inner work. Just just do inner work, you
know we always have to address the systems, so that's external
to us ourselves. Then we do have to do the inner
work, the the self-care, learning how to implement even
(18:08):
micro renewal practices in our lives so it is sustainable.
It doesn't. Renewal and self-care doesn't
have to take more time necessarily, although sometimes
it is necessary to pause and rest in a more intentional way.
And then also there's this interplay between external and
(18:30):
internal. And that's how we interface with
our external world. And and I think what's really
important in that at that edge is recognizing that we have say
that we have a voice and we havemore decisions to make and more
power than we realize. And there's certain things that
(18:54):
can be non negotiables for us. For example, you know, one thing
that has helped prevent professional burnout in my life
is I've, I've usually been really good at setting firm
boundaries to allow me to keep my priorities with my family as
(19:15):
I have young kids. And you know, recently about 60
years ago, I moved to a smaller community.
I had moved from the big city ofMinneapolis where I was doing
moonlighting and hospitals work.And then I came to this smaller
area where there wasn't part time work and I was offered a
position in, you know, the main pediatric practice in town.
(19:37):
They had a lunch for me. They're like yay, meet doctor
Mary Wild. And then when they found out
that I just wanted to work part time and I wasn't going to
budget on that, then they had tosay we're sorry.
And I had to say OK, well thank you for the lunch, but and I I
ended up making, you know, opening my own practice because
(19:58):
I I wanted to create something that fit my life and my value
system and that honoured my balance.
So I think there you know these three things.
There's this addressing systems addressing the interface between
external and internal and and one of the main areas.
(20:20):
Is just recognizing the say thatwe do have and then the third is
the inner work, which I like to think of as finding sanctuary.
So they're like 3 s s there of systems and then say recognize
that we have say and and then sanctuary, finding sanctuary
where we can really renew ourselves and become
(20:44):
unencumbered, untangled, unwound, and then really return
to our life's work. So much better.
Oh gosh, yes. And and Mary, you talk about
things and and you and I are so much in line and of the same
heart around this addressing of how do we become energy masters.
(21:08):
And it really is about our energy mastery and you know you
do something that I just love. I I talk about just doing these
little nano vacations, these little nano breaks.
And I I think that that's one thing that gets in the way
sometimes when people think about how do I recharge, You
know it has to be like this big giant thing.
(21:29):
But you do something that you hand out and share called your
micro Moments, your micro recharge.
Share some of that that concept with us.
Like. Micro.
Well, it's, it's funny, 'cause when I was initially introduced
to this concept of micro renewal, I was in Minneapolis
(21:50):
and I went to this hair studio, it was the Aveda Hair Institute
and and they said, you know, we have, what do they call it,
something like rituals of renewal.
I think they said you get to choose a ritual of renewal as
you're here. Would you like a cup of tea or
would you like a head massage orwould you like, you know, a
(22:12):
really quick manicure? And so, and I I actually like,
almost started crying because itwas in this time of high
burnout, just to have someone offer me just a couple minutes
of care, it really made a difference.
And so I I thought a lot about the fact that we have to find
(22:38):
ways to implement it in our daily living.
We sometimes we can't pause, sometimes we need to pause, but
sometimes we can't. And so I have some different
micro renewal practices that I teach and I have actually like a
a micro renewal card deck that I've created for physicians.
And and I'll just share one of the things, it is A1 breath
(23:03):
meditation from Tiknath Han. And it's just saying as I
breathe in, I'm breathing in, asI breathe out, I'm breathing
out. And I love that because it's
just like connecting to the moment, connecting to the
breath, which we always have with us.
And it's just just getting to the simple Zen presence of it is
(23:30):
what it is. And and so just in one breath we
can change our state. And so that's just one example
but I also think you know sometimes we really need to take
a little bit of a longer time and give ourselves a pause.
I know that I have a friend in the Wellness space and she sent
(23:52):
me an e-mail recently and in thethe her closing she she said
pause the world can wait and then signed her name and and I I
just love that because sometimeswe think the world can't wait
that the world can't get along without us for just a second
while we you know pause and breathe and recharge but it can
(24:17):
and it will be better for it as we return in a renewed state.
I also think of ships at sea, how they get barnacles on them
and and sometimes all they need to do is find fresh water and
the barnacles fall off. Whereas if you don't go to fresh
water and you stay only in the marine water you have to like
(24:40):
scrape and jackhammer barnacles off.
I mean they're like tenacious and and they cause a boat to
have a lot more drag and and require a lot more fuel and so
be much less efficient and I think that's a good metaphor.
So what I'd love to do is inviteall the physicians within the
(25:03):
sound of this, this broadcast toan upcoming retreat that we have
in Southern Utah. So we are going to be hiking at
Zion National Park. We're going to do yoga in the
Canyon. We're going to practice
mindfulness with a mindfulness teacher that has studied with,
you know, John Cabot Zinn and Deepak Chopra and all all these
(25:26):
big gurus we're going to be having writing workshops.
And bonus, you get 10 CME credits.
So it's like one of those doublewhammies, but it's a total
totally MD faculty and it's justfor three days.
(25:46):
So I really invite you to to extend that message to yourself
of pause. The world can wait and do what
you need to do to recharge yourself, so you can actually
show up and savor the world as you're saving it in your own
(26:07):
sphere. Because I really don't think it
has to be a dichotomy. Let's find a way to do both.
Oh, absolutely. And this beautiful retreat is
coming up on March 21st through the 23rd.
The links will be down in the show notes so that you can go
get your ticket. Go ahead and take that pause.
(26:28):
The world can wait, it absolutely can.
And when you invest in yourself and the renewal from micro all
the way up to those bigger moments, it all comes back to
you. And it is about your energy,
mastery and your well-being. Mary, thank you so much for
(26:50):
joining us here today. How can people connect with you
on LinkedIn? Instagram.
Where can they go find you to follow and learn more about the
amazing things that you? Teach.
And burnout. Thank you.
So I can be found on Instagram at Doctor Mary Wilde DRMARYWILDE
and also at Doctor Mary wilde.com.
(27:14):
Fantastic. Y'all, go connect with Mary.
She is fabulous. She is one of my peeps in the
world that I absolutely adore. And if you are in healthcare, if
you're a physician and guys, those Cmes, those are gold.
This is like the best way to go get not only your recharge, but
to get those Cmes because you know, we all got to have those
little things every year they'redoing our credentialing things.
(27:37):
We got to have them. So here you go.
You can do it and get some bang for your buck because this is
one of the most affordable retreats and the quality of the
things that are going to be happening at this retreat.
Holy cow, I cannot tell you thisis such an immense value.
Mary, you've put together an incredible retreat and I can't
wait for everyone to join you. Thanks so much for being here.
(27:59):
Make sure you connect with Doctor Mary Wild and join me
next week for another conversation going deeper and to
burn out an hour. Energy Mastery, Take care.
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