July 26, 2025 • 45 mins
In Episode 209 of our “Things That REALLY Matter” series on Beyond Chronic Burnout, Carole Jean Whittington and Becca Lory Hector dive deep into the often-overlooked world of subtle trauma—especially how it uniquely impacts autistic women.
Together, they explore how lifelong patterns like people-pleasing, hyper-vigilance, emotional suppression, and the fear of being “too much” are often rooted in trauma we were never taught to recognize. From personal stories to practical tools, this episode is a must-watch if you’re navigating burnout, masking, or the struggle to prioritize your own needs.
💬 “People-pleasing at the expense of your own well-being is a giant trap. It masquerades as politeness or kindness.” — Becca Lory Hector
💬 “I reclaim calm. It is mine. It belongs to me.” — Carole Jean Whittington
🔎 Topics Covered:
Subtle trauma in autistic women
The impact of masking and emotional suppression
Communication, boundaries, and burnout recovery
Self-worth without performance
How to reclaim calm and rest without guilt
🎧 Listen to the full episode on your favorite podcast platform or watch right here.
🔗 Download the free checklist: 22 Subtle Signs of Trauma 📬 Get weekly insights inside The Recharge: https://energize.whittingtonwellbeing.com/products/courses/view/1180958
#BeyondChronicBurnout #AutisticWomen #SubtleTrauma #NeurodivergentBurnout #PeoplePleasing #SelfWorth #AutismAndTrauma #ReclaimRest #AutisticVoices #BurnoutRecovery
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Y'all are in for such a great talk today around things that
really matter because Becca and I've been talking and we believe
that some of the things that block the things that really
matter most to us, it's the Dangtrauma.
And it's mainly the subtle unrecognized trauma that so many
of us have experienced and we just don't recognize it because
(00:21):
maybe one of these things on this list, we're going to go
over 20 different items of subtle trauma that might be
blocking the things that really matter to you.
You're your joy, you're just your wealth, your health, your
well-being, all the goodness that is meant for us in life.
There's so much crap that just blocks it.
And Beck and I are going to go through these top 20 things and
(00:44):
we have a special surprise we'regoing to share with you at the
end. So stick around, Becca, you're
ready. I am so ready turn every shadow.
To Vibrant artistic voices, fearless and free, No chance can
(01:06):
hold what's meant to be. We've got stories the world must
hear, Breaking the silence loud and clear.
Becca, Carol Jean. We're here to say the things
that got away the way. Together hear him lie.
(01:32):
We're standing strong and shaking, proud, sharing one
riders here to cry for every woman.
Here's room for all. OK, so this first one, this
(01:55):
first one, really this one, thiswas a big one for me.
I know, I know, you shared. This one has been a big one for
you too. Here we go, folks.
Strap in, We're ready to go for a ride.
Here it is. Number one for the two of us, I
think for both of us, this isn'tin any particular order, but I
would say this is number one fora lot of people.
(02:17):
It's totally wrong. People pleasing at the expense
of your own well-being, right? This is a trap.
That's what this is. It is a giant trap, right?
Please like me. Please like me.
Please like me enough. I don't care if I have to erase
myself for you to like me, right?
(02:40):
Really rough, you guys this one is a habit that people really
have a hard time breaking and I think it's because it
masquerades as politeness or kindness right if.
You're a good. Person right?
You're a good girl or a good person if you're doing these
things right. You get compliments for being
(03:03):
this kind of person, right? But there's nobody saving you
when the detriment of this thingcomes to get you right, when
you're too exhausted to do the very basics for yourself, right.
What are some of the ways that Ithink that you think people
pleasing is a result of the trauma that that you and kind of
how it incorporates into your life?
(03:25):
Well, this. Is the big one saying yes when
inside I'm screaming no and thenI'm exhausted or worse I'm like
carrying that resent. Yes, being resentful.
Aw, we do that all the time, right.
I did all of these nice things and I'm not getting anything
(03:45):
back right, and that's because we're doing all these things not
for the right. Why behind radar, Why behind the
people pleasing is just please like me, right and or I notice
sometimes it's please just just be done with me is what I want.
Whatever you need from me, Just I just want to be done with you.
So I'll people please you just to get rid of you too, right?
(04:08):
Like that kind of thing. That's another one for me.
Because that ties into one of our later ones looking for the
conflicty thing. It is.
And so that's a rough one. That's our first one.
And I, I like to remind people that it, it's sneaky, this one,
'cause it, it does not greed. And so you, if this is something
that you are guilty of people pleasing to the point of your
(04:30):
own discomfort, your own displeasure, your own
exhaustion, right. That is about priorities and
boundaries. And that's what's really
underneath that. And we got to take a look at it.
When you learn to value yourself, you don't people
please quite so much. Right, exactly.
Well, here's #2 y'all ready? You strapped in?
We're we're on a roll. Here we go, being hyper aware of
(04:54):
other people's moods. What?
How's this one show up for you, Becca?
This one to me is really deep rooted and it's painful.
This one is attached to a lot ofpain and a lot of unhealed pain
from like my childhood from me. So for me, being hyper focused
on other people's moods, are hyper aware of other people's
(05:16):
moods. You're you're on guard all the
time when you're like that. And to me, it's a part of that
fight, flight and being, you know, just on guard all the
time, right, that we get stuck in.
And I think we take somehow responsibility for everyone
else's comfort in the room around us all the time.
And that's what this comes from.You're looking for little
(05:39):
moments of discomfort. And because those things don't
come naturally to us, it's extrawork.
It's like even more work than the usual for most people.
Right. Like before I even recognize
this. I mean, I can look back now that
I know what I know, but I was like, I would walk into a room
and I would be so tuned in, likeI would be exerting so much
(06:01):
energy, tapping into what's the emotion of the room, of the
people in the room. Am I safe?
Correct. Am I safe and am I or am I
sticking out right? Like is am I, is my energy so
different from it? And I think that for a lot of
us, we feel very early on that feeling that your energy is
different when you come into a room, right?
(06:22):
Very early for us that that happens and it becomes this
hyper vigilance about other people's, you know, discomfort
and it feels very one sided. It doesn't ever feel like people
are giving it back, right. And so again, I want to say,
what's your why behind that hyper fixation, right?
And I think every time we look at all of these and we think
(06:44):
about the why behind, we're gonna come back to that drama,
right? Just really basic.
The way we express things as autistic's not the same right as
other people. And I think the subtle part of
this too, for me, how it came inwas, you know, when I was
little, I didn't have the understanding, you know, of
(07:06):
people in relationships having conflict and that being OK like
that. There's something called healthy
conflict, right? And my parents had healthy
conflict, sometimes not healthy,but but for the most part, it
was like, now looking back, it was healthy conflict.
It was how they were working outthings together.
But as a little autistic kid whowas super attuned to all the
(07:30):
things, anytime they had any kind of disagreement, I
immediately was like going to the people pleasing.
I became hyper aware like are they fussing right?
You know, because. Their energy to each other and
the anchors. Heartless to me, right?
Why are we responsible for that though?
(07:50):
Where did that sense of responsibility for other
people's emotions come from, right?
It's a crazy thing. We and five year olds, we don't
think about gravity stuff. We're just, and it's so it's a
really interesting thing becausewhat we learn as adults as there
is healthy conflict. And the more you value and
respect yourself and prioritize your life and have boundaries,
(08:13):
the more there is a setup for that because there's something
to argue over, right? There's something to have
conflict over in that area. And so I think you know what the
difference of course, is the waywe learn to react and express
our emotions. I think as we get older,
hopefully we get better at that.But you know, just watching
(08:34):
people though. I mean, I also say to people
though now though, and I'm goingto turn this on to Ted for a
second, this hyper fixation becomes a skill set for us later
on though. So let's not, you know, Pooh,
Pooh it away is all terrible, right?
It's just like masking. Masking isn't great for us or
sustainable, but it's also a skill set, right?
But if you learn to use it voluntarily and consciously,
(08:56):
right? And this is similar.
We are consummate observers, right?
And that's where this comes fromis just being hyper aware of all
of those things. Well, Becca, take us into our
third one. Sure, this one we talked about
recently, right? Feeling like rest must be
(09:16):
earned. That was worthy of a whole
episode that that guy, right? Not allowed to sit still.
So what was our big take away oryour big take away from that
episode and and rest needing to be earned?
Oh my gosh, just that productivity hustle mentality
that I grew up in, you know, I mean, my, my parents are like on
(09:41):
the, the very edge. My dad is definitely in it.
My mom's on the very edge of thebaby boomer group, right?
So they came in with this like hustle mentality.
I mean, my grandfather grew up, you know, and, and my dad too
experienced the depression. And so it was always this, this
message of you gotta work to earn anything.
(10:01):
Don't sit still. Right, like there's only nothing
you should be doing. Right.
Yeah. Sitting still is like you hadn't
earned the right for that. You you don't have a diamond
tiara on your head. Correct, correct.
You always right. That's right.
Well, now we've earned it, right, Just like settle it on a
little bit. But that's really, you know, I,
(10:22):
I think something we all have tounpack for ourselves.
Where did that come from? Because rest is like food,
right? They go in the same category.
They're necessities, they're notoptions.
And so that productivity, you know, it comes from our
environment. It comes from your growing up,
and as an adult you get have theright to question whether you
still think that's true, right? And it goes so deeply.
(10:48):
Oh yeah. No, you still have more to say,
please. It it, it goes so deeply to that
core of our belief and knowing of our worthiness.
Oh yes, right. Here's another theme.
Are you seeing it pop up in every single one?
Right, About valuing yourself right?
(11:09):
A lot of our trauma has told us that we don't have value.
A lot of that drama has taken away our self-confidence has
taken away, you know, a lot of those pieces for us.
And so that's where a lot of this is coming from, right?
It's wait, So when I start to get to understand my value that
just by breathing I have it right, then we get to work
(11:34):
through some of these bigger pieces, right?
And we know what happens when wetry to lean into OK, I don't
have to earn my rest. We're struggling to feel safe
when things are calm. Yep, this one is something I am
still dealing with right now as we talk, right?
This is something that I, I understand that I need rest.
(11:57):
I understand that I'm building in all of these tools for
myself, that I've done a lot of self-awareness work.
I've done a lot of shadow work. I've done a lot of all of this
other stuff and that the reward for that is the calm, right?
The reward for all of that work is the calm.
And yet I have yet to find comfort in the calm.
(12:19):
I am still right. I have, I can't quite let go.
I don't quite believe that it will stay right.
I think that's my big thing, like, oh, it's good now.
So when I'm in the good, I always go, oh, so the bad is
coming, right? That's how do I prepare for.
I can't really enjoy the now andthe calm, but we've done the
(12:40):
work to get ourselves here, so this part is still hard for me.
I don't have a solution for thisone.
This one is still alive and wellin in my life.
So yeah, if you have solutions on this, I'd like to hear them.
This is definitely something that I have learned to receive,
graciously receive. And there are still moments that
(13:04):
it peaks up again and it's like,oh, but I did, I immediately
want to jump up and do something, you know, or like, I
was floating in the pool yesterday, right?
Like I had worked, I had done two groups.
I mean, I had a huge day yesterday and I was like, OK,
I'm going to go out and float inthe pool because there has to be
(13:25):
this harmony, this reciprocity of action and, and resting.
And so I'm floating in the pool.And do you know what I did?
I stopped floating in the pool. I walked over, grabbed a little
skimmer thing, and I start chasing bugs all over the pool.
But it's fun for me. And I caught myself for a
minute. I'm like, wait a minute, Did I
get up and feel compelled to clean the pool because I
(13:48):
couldn't just float here becauseit was feeling a little
uncomfortable, like I needed some activity?
Right. But then I was like, no, I
actually do enjoy this, but I had to question the motivation.
Yeah. And I was like, and I'm good
with like scooping out the bugs I'm worried are going to come
over here and bite me. And the rest, the skimmer can
(14:11):
get them. But there's still this
evolution. But for me, it really took a lot
of building trust within my own nervous system because when my
nervous system responded, my brain responded for me.
And so it was really just using breath work when I felt like
(14:34):
this compulsion of like I got tobe doing something to just go
hold on, take 3 deep breaths, drop your shoulders open, close
your jaw less than 30 seconds, right?
And then check back in. It's like, no.
And I think the biggest part waswhen I planted the flag and I
said, I reclaim calm. It is mine.
(14:56):
It belongs to me. Right, like that feels like my
natural state, right is calm, right?
And so I don't, this battle is something that I have to work my
way through in some way, right? But it's certainly, and for me,
and I don't know if other peoplefeel this way, for me, it's
(15:18):
rooted very much in a scarcity mentality.
For me, I grew up very much in ascarcity mentality.
I did not grow up very privileged at all.
And so the idea that my life should be calm, my brain
immediately goes, oh, that's 'cause I, I forgot to do
something. If it's calm, it's 'cause
something I'm forgetting to do, something that should be
(15:40):
interrupting my calm, right? Wow.
Which is really a wholly loaded package, right?
Of all the things that Becca thinks are wrong with her,
right? All my insecurity is wrapped up
in this, this idea that not feeling safe, right?
Not feeling financially stable, not feeling emotionally stable
(16:03):
or psychologically stable for most of my life, all of those
things. And so my norm to myself is not
calm, and calm is new for me, yeah.
It, it is definitely something I'm learning to enjoy, which I
never thought I would. And that we talked about it on a
(16:25):
previous show. But that experiment I did back
at Christmas where I, I waited to see how long it would make
people of my brain just like really shut off.
And my body went, Oh yeah, we can do that.
Yeah. We're rigid.
We're so rigid about, you know, all those and that's the piece I
want to let go of, right? Like there it's almost an armor
(16:46):
that when, when we talk about going through this process, you
kind of are taking off little pieces of your armor each time,
you know? I always would you say that I
it's been such a thing. We were talking about it in our
own Baylor group last week and it was, you know, in my early
experience and, and sort of the story that I tell about when I
was younger and had my first burnout experience, you know, I
(17:07):
had this blazer that I wore at school and it was my armor
essentially. It's it's what felt like it
protected me. This physical thing protected
me. I said, now I have sparkly
regalia that I wear. So I shine in the world.
I want to be noticed. I'm not trying to fend the world
off. And and those shifts happen when
we start to recognize these subtle things that show up.
(17:31):
So Becka, take us into our next one here.
All right, so this one is. I am grateful to have gotten rid
of this habit over apologizing for things that aren't your.
Fault. Right.
People use the word sorry for all the wrong reasons.
Most of the time we say sorry when it's not even appropriate
(17:52):
for it to be there, right? And this is very tied to that
people pleasing thing, I think, right?
The idea that if we take ownership and responsibility for
whatever the error is, right, that people will like us.
They don't have to then take responsibility for whatever the
error is. But I also think there's a very
autistic piece of this, which isthat so often we are used to
(18:16):
being told we're in the wrong, that we just assume that if
something's gone wrong, it must be us.
Right, it's the pre emptive apologizing.
Exactly, it's the oh, oh, something was miscommunicated.
It's probably me. Oh, you right, like it's and
that kind of habit too. So it's loaded up for this over
apologizing for us. We have two different reasons
(18:38):
for doing it. And so we do it a lot.
You know, it's habitual and my favorite, the way that I taught
myself or re taught myself to dothis.
One of the ways places I used tosay sorry a lot was in emails or
with meetings, like in workplacescenarios where I would say
sorry for being late, sorry for the delay in my e-mail response
(18:59):
because it took me two hours instead of 10 minutes.
Sorry for, you know, all of these things when you know, it's
not like something that I need to apologize where there was no
expectation set about when I needed to do.
I'm setting that expectation. So when I learned to flip that
in my head and say what I'm really saying to this person is
(19:20):
thank you for waiting for my response.
Thank you for, you know, your flexibility.
Thank you for right. So now when I say to people I
need to reschedule, I don't say I'm sorry to bother you or I'm
sorry for that. Whatever I need to reschedule
with you. I just say I need to reschedule
with you. I appreciate your flexibility,
(19:42):
right? Because that's what I really
want to say, right? Not I'm sorry.
So that's I, I challenge you guys with that and find the
space in your life where you do the I'm sorry the most like gut
reaction is sorry, sorry, sorry.Or you apologize habitually
before saying what it is that you have to say.
Find those spots and script yourself a new response, right?
(20:07):
And just use it until that becomes the habit.
Is what I say. There is nothing to add to that
I that I 1000% right there with you because that was a big one
for me too. To really break that.
The only thing I would would addto this section on the on the
apologizing thing, especially for those of us in certain
(20:29):
societies as women. Reclaim your Dang power.
Please. Please, you are allowed to take
up space. You do not have to apologize for
your existence and anything thatyou do.
No, it's real up. I live in New England and in New
England we have a saying. We are kind, but we are not
(20:49):
nice, right? Which means that if you need
something and I can help you, I have the kindness in me to help
you with that. But I'm not going to sit here
and tell you how pretty you are all the time and tell you how
happy life is and tell, right? I'm not going to sugarcoat
things, but that doesn't make mean unkind person.
(21:10):
And that's what this is, right? Just not apologizing for
yourself and taking up your space, right is what you should
be doing, right? Not to have leads to be like
exist and be right exactly who you are right in your own
timing, which is another piece that I think we don't ever get
(21:32):
as autistic as timing, the timing that works for us.
Oh right, we need to do a whole episode on that one right there.
Yeah OK. The next one is avoiding
conflicts at all cost y'all. I had like full on visceral
response to any the slightest wavering of conflict.
(21:55):
Like it made me physically sick.I mean, it would twist my
stomach and not I would be like nauseous.
I wouldn't be able to sleep because I would be like playing
everything through my head and it just I would minimize
whatever I needed in the moment.Even if it was something that
was hurting me, if it was causing conflict, I would just
(22:18):
suffer to make sure that I was avoiding any potential conflict.
I would apologize people, please.
I mean, you roll all those things into one, right Here is
the heart conflict. I think this is such an
interesting one because my response to conflict and the
dislike of conflict was to self sabotage.
So I used, I started conflicts and so that I had control of
(22:41):
them, right? So that there's, I found,
especially in my like teenage and early 20s, I was a very kind
of, I went through a very rebellious phase and you know,
it was like, OK, well, if there's going to be conflict and
it's going to come at me and I don't understand it, well, I
might as well start it before that happens and create the
conflict from my end, right? And that's really a self
(23:03):
sabotage, right? It's assuming that things are
going to go that way and also arrogant to assume that you can
have control over situations that you know are involving
other people. Right?
But conflict became this thing. It's like, let me get good at it
then like let then let me be theexpert at conflict.
And like, let me out conflict you then, because it felt like
(23:25):
everything for me was a conflict.
Any choice that I made was not going to be good enough for
people. What I wore, what I wrote about,
where I lived, what I liked, allof those things I felt were kind
of really under a microscope, right?
And so I feel like I took almostthe other direction because of
all my trauma into like, initiating conflict, right?
(23:47):
And being kind of one of those spiky people that's always kind
of out to like start things right I'm.
So glad you're referenced 'causeI'm not and I need.
That well, it serves me well. Now I will tell you, there are
certainly times where my very, very loud New York mouth and my
direct autisticness, you know, is certainly valuable.
(24:09):
But you know, certainly areas where it just I was like, you
know what? I am the conflict.
Watch me be the conflict. I love it and you know, I, I
love that we can talk about thisavoiding conflicts at all costs
from different perspectives because as humans we generally
move in three ways. We either turn inward during
(24:31):
stress and conflict or we move against like you were saying,
like I'm going to create the damn conflict.
You know, I'm going to make sureit comes to a head quick 'cause
I just like. Listen to it real quick.
Right. And then we've got people that
that subtly look for what does everybody else think before I
even pick a side of a conflict. Yep, that that's seeking for
(24:53):
approval. So there's a lot of this is part
of our communication, right? Our trauma around communication
and clear communication, right? And so this one is a good one.
I think folks should think aboutthis, right?
No matter what side of conflict you took or what direction you
took with conflict, the way we communicate with people and the
(25:14):
way we choose to respond to people is where our power really
is, right? So play in here.
Definitely play that I I cannot recommend play enough.
So, Becca, this one you said wasreally something you wanted to
talk about. Yes, downplaying our own
experiences is the next one, andso this one for me is probably
(25:38):
the backbone of most of my autistic struggles, right?
I am someone who very much experiences my autism
internally, right? It's a lot of sensory issues, a
lot of communication issues thatdon't like it doesn't
necessarily impact the folks that I'm I'm working with.
It's more about my understanding.
I think of the way things function.
(26:01):
But this my sensory space is somewhere where and food too
safe foods, things like that. Those two areas really for me, I
downplayed all of my right. It was always like I forced
myself to eat what I didn't wantto eat rather than explaining
that, you know, I'm weird and I don't like this because of this
little piece on it or whatever it is, right?
(26:22):
Same thing with sensory, right? I went through.
It's why I called my book AlwaysBring Your Sunglasses, because I
was afraid to bring my sunglasses.
People with places because of people's judgement around
wearing sunglasses inside or wearing them in certain
environments. And so I would just let myself
suffer because every time I saidlights are painful to me, people
(26:42):
would tell me it's not possible.Your eyeballs don't have nerve
endings or whatever BS they weremaking up at this time, right?
And so I was told that it wasn'tpossible.
And so I just learned to push through and I learned to
minimize all my discomfort and treat it as though it wasn't a
priority and it shouldn't be important because I was the only
one experiencing it. And I wasn't making anyone else
(27:05):
uncomfortable. It was just making me
uncomfortable. And so, yeah, to people, I
downplay my experiences. And I had this thought come up
too recently about downplaying our experiences where I've been
thinking, you and I have both been thinking about telling your
story, right? And the story that we tell
ourselves in our head versus what reality is and all of those
(27:26):
things, right? And a lot of the time I, you
know, I told a story to people that I was fine, right?
And I really was not fine anyway, right?
But it's like that. So what story are we telling
ourselves about that, You know, are you telling yourself it's OK
to struggle with your sensory because nobody else is
uncomfortable? That's part of my story.
(27:49):
I lived that story. And so it's important to think
about that piece of it because we have to, you know, no one
else is going to take care of those pieces for you.
No one's coming in to swoop in and make you sensory
comfortable. So you, you have to really learn
to own that piece instead of downplaying it so much for other
people. But yeah.
(28:10):
Do you do this as well? Is this another one for you?
I can say that I don't know because of unrecognized early
trauma, alexithymia, Co occurring health conditions.
Everything to me was suffering and I just thought I didn't know
any different. So I I didn't know that I was
(28:33):
even downplaying it. I just thought everybody else
was suffering. They just handled it better than
I did until I started to learn, oh, other people don't.
And then I was like, what? Right, you're not in this play
too like. What?
Your skin's not on fire? What?
How do you sit there? I mean, it's amazing when that
(28:56):
right, that lifts up for you andyou're like, hold on, right?
I don't have to because and you're like, well, then I don't
have to do that anymore. I could start to think about
what's really happening for me, because that's what everyone
else does. This is what they're needs
first. There's a moment when that
happens and you kind of recognize that bit.
There, there totally is. This next one is the one that
(29:20):
probably showed up more for me than this last one.
And it's this deep fear of beingtoo much because I was told
you're so, you're too loud, you're too happy.
I was told I was too happy. Yo, that's just wrong.
Who tells somebody they're too happy?
I don't know. It's messed up.
(29:42):
Right, it's really messed up then remember so many.
Times like tone it down, Reggie.That's right.
And but this is such an interesting one to me because
here we are. We're going to have again where
I went the total other directionwith this, right?
This deep fear of being too much.
I think I heard it so much as a kid that then again, I went, you
(30:03):
know what, let me show you too much.
You know what I mean? That I was just like, you think
that's too much because I'm working really hard not to be
too much right now. So let me not work so hard.
Let me show you what that looks like, right?
And so I, you know, I became, I think too much, You know, it was
in a very rebellious way that I became too much.
(30:25):
But I just, I stopped keeping mymouth shut.
I never edited myself. I did lots of things where where
I think I intentionally pushed people right as a way.
Damn, you're my heroine. But it's not necessarily a
healthy either, right? Because then you get you get
kind of cast as the the villain in every story, right?
(30:49):
I was the villain in every story.
It was always my fault. I was always too angry.
I was always rude, right? There was never a positive
adjective attached to me anywhere, right?
And that's what I was signing onfor, right?
That was the choice that I was making because I felt lost in
the world. And I was like, well, if you
(31:09):
know, then nobody likes me, thenwatch nobody like me, right?
Like, let me show you how easy it is not to like me.
And that became my persona for avery long time.
That was my my wall, right? That protected me from, from
everyone in, in the way that some people choose people
pleasing. I think I chose, you know, I
(31:32):
dare you. Yeah.
When I was in 6th grade and I upto that point, I mean, I was
like gregarious and really happyand flutie and everybody was
wonderful and I love just being in the world.
Even though there were a lot of things I didn't understand, I
was still happy being me. And then I started to get picked
(31:55):
on by a group of girls who said I was too much, too loud, too
happy. You know, I said stupid things,
You know, Why are you wearing earrings like her?
Those are her earrings. I'm like, whoa.
And Klein sells them to everybody.
I can own them. Well, you know, I mean, that
kind of stuff. And so there was this point, the
(32:16):
shift that happened, that I paused.
And then I agreed to all that crap and I thought, I'm too
much. So do you know what I did?
I stopped talking. I stopped being happy.
I stopped just being free and open.
And I spent then probably the next six or seven years being
(32:38):
quiet. And this is what really got me.
The next year, those same exact girls then criticized and
ridiculed me for being so quiet,right.
Because no one's ever happy, right?
That's the truth. And so it's a really interesting
thing that we like you can choose to be too much in lots of
different ways. And and you know, I think again,
(33:00):
it was like, I know I'm going tobe too much.
And so let me just be too much ahead of time.
Let me just get ahead of the curve and be too much in front
of it, right? And but that doesn't work out
for us either. And so it's really, you know,
this idea that there could even be too much or that you have to
be this, this desire for sameness is what it is of every,
(33:22):
right. We were taught that, right?
That's all That doesn't come naturally to us as people.
We are taught that from people. And I, it's interesting that you
had that moment with girls, because I also had that moment
with girls because girls are mean by the way, and nasty.
And I would rather be a boy and get punched in the face than
treated the way girls treat other girls.
(33:45):
But I had this similar moment. For me, it was when I was 8
years old. And it was like, I wasn't
interested in dresses. I wanted to play in our my
garden. I wanted to climb trees.
I wanted. Right.
And that was fine and, well, acceptable until a certain age.
And for me, it was 8. And at 8, it was like, no, now
you're supposed to be wearing pink and you're supposed to,
like, make up and you're supposed to write all of these
(34:05):
things. And yeah, that was when this
fear of being too much or fear of, you know, not fitting him
became. Yeah.
And then when it shifts into this own internal judge of you
judging yourself too much, it can.
It can we. Let them live in your hat,
right? We let them.
It's not our voice that's sayingthat.
(34:26):
It's, it's not. It's an echo of their voices,
right? And that can carry forward and
begin to put up boundaries and blockers and giant mountainous
Ridge caps all around the thingsthat really matter to you.
So this next one I can't wait todiscuss.
(34:50):
This is a good one. Difficulty making decisions now.
This one, right, I think is well, well rooted in self trust,
right? This is stolen.
It was stolen from me. I don't know if it was stolen
from you, but right when you're told that the way you are
innately, the way you you exist and choose to do things innately
(35:12):
is broken and needs to be fixed all the time, right?
I mean, that's really, I feel like for me, you let you stop
learning to trust your gut at that point and you stop trusting
your gut and this rolls in and aren't we a lovely package?
When you've been told why are you doing it that way, that's
weird. No one else is experiencing
(35:32):
that. And then it starts to erode at
that internal self trust. And then it's like, Oh well, if
I'm doing this wrong or if my experience of this isn't right,
like we are didn't even questionour own experience.
We know damn good and well it happened, but it's right.
Maybe I'm wrong. So then it's like, oh God, it's
(35:54):
not safe for me to make a choicebecause I've been told so many
times I was wrong. Or the other side of that is
when I've made decisions, bad things have happened and I've
gotten hurt. I can't trust my own choices
because, you know, we just don'tsee the things other people see,
you know? And so it culminates into like,
this perfect storm of decision. Fatigue builds up too, because
(36:20):
Oh my God, how many decisions dowe have to make in the damn day?
Seriously. Oh my God, I hate it.
Thank I'm have to tell you one of the reasons I love my husband
to death is because I can literally turn to him and just
say I don't fucking know. Can you please just decide for
me? Right Did.
I borrow him. Right, because I just I will
(36:43):
stand especially like if we haveto order food or I have to, I'm
in the supermarket and I have tochoose a product, please, I
could be there for I can spreadsheet between the ice
creams to decide which one I want.
And so sometimes I'm just like, babe, I can't today I just could
you just decide whatever it is, I'll be happy with it because
I'd rather eat that than not decide.
(37:04):
So here's like, and it's it's terrible decision for TV.
I hate it. It's so interesting.
I I do something similar with myhusband.
I'm like OK, my cup is full to capacity.
Like I have no more bandwidth for anything.
Just pick. I don't care.
I really don't take me. With you just drag take me and
I'm fine. Like I am so happy to just be
(37:27):
the cart behind the horse, you know, let's just go for it, OK?
So this next one I think is really good.
I can't wait to have a conversation on this one.
So this is number 10. I feel we're we're our 36 minute
mark y'all. And so back in I'll share where
we're going to share this next 10 with you, because we really
do want to dig into all twenty of these.
(37:48):
So we got a little special surprise.
So just hang on, let's talk about this last one real quick.
All right, so this one is so interesting to me because I
recently wrote a post about thison social media because I right,
think it's so annoying, this thing.
I hate it when people praise us for getting through the struggle
(38:08):
and we become inspiration because we've gotten through the
struggle when those are the verysame people that created the
struggle for us in the first place.
I loved the post that you wrote on this by the way.
It was so. This.
Would you please? Thank you so much.
Would you please stop doing thatto me like it's not.
It doesn't make it better. You made me jump through hoops
(38:31):
and then you tell me how well I jumped through the hoops.
Get out of here. Nobody had to have the hoops in
the 1st place right that. Is it's even like, Oh my gosh,
you're so resilient. I'm so inspired.
I can't believe you jumped through all those hoops with two
broken legs, but you're the one that gave me the damn broken
legs and made me jump through the hoops just so I could be OK.
(38:53):
Right, just so I could fit whatever it is that you're And
so this to me is a big, this is a red flag for me in terms of
like toxic people, right? I have little list in my head of
the my little red flags that when people do these things,
they are no Nos for me. Like, I don't care how long
we've been friends. I don't care if I just met you
(39:14):
and you think I'm judging you too quickly.
I don't care. These are my boundaries around
certain things, and this is one of them.
Because this to me is as good asgaslighting this is.
I mean, this is one of those truly toxic behaviors that I
have only seen the neuro majority participate in.
(39:34):
Yeah, not something that autistic people do to other
autistic people or other neurodivergent.
People not at all. And where this can be like that
really subtle indicator that there has been some trauma in
the past. It's like when you're being
praised for being resilient, butinside you feel like you're
barely holding it together, but somehow that little, that little
(39:58):
Gold Star. Yay.
OK. Right.
Yeah, Beat the board. Yay.
Right. It's all of that kind of thing.
And so, but when you unpack where it's coming from, it's a
dirty compliment, right? It's not.
That dirty compliment? Yeah, it's a dirty.
Nasty. It's a passive aggressive way,
(40:21):
right? It doesn't genuinely mean what
it means. And so I say you're right,
because what people do is we're so happy for our Gold Star that
even though we're feeling like we're barely holding it
together, we're gonna try to sustain that for another Gold
Star. Somehow that makes me worthy and
acceptable and I can belong. That that's that's deeply
(40:45):
wounding. That is energy training.
Yeah, I mean, it is. And then it's like not you don't
admit to yourself then that you're barely holding it
together and so you don't do anyof the self-care or you're not
aware you break your interception.
There's so it's so many bad things, right result from just
not admitting. You know what?
(41:05):
No, though. I mean, yeah, I'm glad I was
able to do it, but I'd like to never do it again.
Thank you. This.
Is what you can duct tape on somebody's mouth so they can
never say they're not OK. Yeah, it's really, this is a bad
and it's sneaky. So you'll this one you find
everywhere. And again, it's another one of
those things that is manipulatedto look like a compliment,
(41:28):
manipulated to look like right when.
And so we go, oh, thank you. Right when we should be saying
is, well, if you hadn't created the mess in the 1st place, I
wouldn't have had to be so damn resilient.
Exactly. Yes.
As we wrap up this very powerful, hopefully incredibly
(41:50):
service oriented conversation like this has really served you
today. It has supported you back.
And I also want you to know thatyou don't need to have a
dramatic story or a specific diagnosis or anything like that
to have experienced trauma. Trauma can be slow.
It can be quiet. It can be insidious and
(42:12):
cumulative. It can come from constantly
being misunderstood, unsupported, or told to hide
your authentic self and the things that you need.
It can come from chronic invalidation or growing up
without the emotional scaffolding that you needed.
And you deserve support. You deserve healing.
(42:34):
You deserve compassion and rest,even if you were never, quote UN
quote the one who had it the worst.
This is not a comparison. This is about what you need and
where you are. That was good.
I don't want to say anything else.
(42:55):
That's very pretty. So here, here's the surprise.
Becca and I were playing becausewe like to play and have fun,
and this is a pretty heavy topic, but we decided we can
still play and we could still have fun and we could still talk
about the heavy stuff because these are the things that really
matter. So next week, be sure you check
both Becca Laurie Hector and Carol Jane Whittington at
(43:16):
Whittington well-being because we're both going to write
articles with those last 10 items on our list of our top 20.
We may even have a little bonus 1 here and really dig into those
and kind of like our show today,we're going to share our
perspectives on these and this is going to be really fun
because you can go read both of them and see how did Becca feel
(43:37):
an experience and we're not. Going to cheat.
I don't want to see you at CarolJane's writing.
She's not going to look at what I'm writing.
We're going to go it's going to be a surprise for us to to look
at the other person's perspective and I think this is
a really good one. I hope you'll, you know when you
see that 10 come out, take the time and go through them
yourselves, right? Get through those the last 10
and and take a look at where they live in your life, right?
(44:00):
And and if you're ready to get rid of them and all of those
things. But I'm excited to continue this
conversation because this is a fun one.
It is, and we got a little treatthat's coming with it.
We're going to have that top 20 list of those subtle trauma
things that you may not have identified to get in the way of
things that really matter. We're going to have a checklist
for you, so you can just download it and go through it
(44:21):
and have fun reading all the articles.
And be sure to share the show with a friend.
Reach out, you know, if you're in a group and you know, just
share the show. Let somebody else also have the
opportunity to get to meet Beccaand I because we love to meet
new folks and say hi to us over on Instagram or LinkedIn.
We hang out over there pretty regularly.
Thanks so much for being here totalk more about the things that
(44:42):
really matter. We'll see you next month.
Thanks for being here. It's been quiet.
All right, let's turn the tide. Stop shelf guests dropping
wisdom bombs. Join us next week where the
energy's strong beyond crying burnout.
We're breaking free podcast pumping full of energy tips and
(45:06):
tricks to push strong fight fastpace and fun.
You'll feel alive energy mastery.
Come along for the ride behind Beyond Quantum.
We're on the rise. Join us as we form our top shot
guests that need to energy throughout us.
Y'all are in for such a great talk today around things that
really matter because Becca and I've been talking and we believe
that some of the things that block the things that really
matter most to us, it's the Dangtrauma.
And it's mainly the subtle unrecognized trauma that so many
of us have experienced and we just don't recognize it because
(00:21):
maybe one of these things on this list, we're going to go
over 20 different items of subtle trauma that might be
blocking the things that really matter to you.
You're your joy, you're just your wealth, your health, your
well-being, all the goodness that is meant for us in life.
There's so much crap that just blocks it.
And Beck and I are going to go through these top 20 things and
(00:44):
we have a special surprise we'regoing to share with you at the
end. So stick around, Becca, you're
ready. I am so ready turn every shadow.
To Vibrant artistic voices, fearless and free, No chance can
(01:06):
hold what's meant to be. We've got stories the world must
hear, Breaking the silence loud and clear.
Becca, Carol Jean. We're here to say the things
that got away the way. Together hear him lie.
(01:32):
We're standing strong and shaking, proud, sharing one
riders here to cry for every woman.
Here's room for all. OK, so this first one, this
(01:55):
first one, really this one, thiswas a big one for me.
I know, I know, you shared. This one has been a big one for
you too. Here we go, folks.
Strap in, We're ready to go for a ride.
Here it is. Number one for the two of us, I
think for both of us, this isn'tin any particular order, but I
would say this is number one fora lot of people.
(02:17):
It's totally wrong. People pleasing at the expense
of your own well-being, right? This is a trap.
That's what this is. It is a giant trap, right?
Please like me. Please like me.
Please like me enough. I don't care if I have to erase
myself for you to like me, right?
(02:40):
Really rough, you guys this one is a habit that people really
have a hard time breaking and I think it's because it
masquerades as politeness or kindness right if.
You're a good. Person right?
You're a good girl or a good person if you're doing these
things right. You get compliments for being
(03:03):
this kind of person, right? But there's nobody saving you
when the detriment of this thingcomes to get you right, when
you're too exhausted to do the very basics for yourself, right.
What are some of the ways that Ithink that you think people
pleasing is a result of the trauma that that you and kind of
how it incorporates into your life?
(03:25):
Well, this. Is the big one saying yes when
inside I'm screaming no and thenI'm exhausted or worse I'm like
carrying that resent. Yes, being resentful.
Aw, we do that all the time, right.
I did all of these nice things and I'm not getting anything
(03:45):
back right, and that's because we're doing all these things not
for the right. Why behind radar, Why behind the
people pleasing is just please like me, right and or I notice
sometimes it's please just just be done with me is what I want.
Whatever you need from me, Just I just want to be done with you.
So I'll people please you just to get rid of you too, right?
(04:08):
Like that kind of thing. That's another one for me.
Because that ties into one of our later ones looking for the
conflicty thing. It is.
And so that's a rough one. That's our first one.
And I, I like to remind people that it, it's sneaky, this one,
'cause it, it does not greed. And so you, if this is something
that you are guilty of people pleasing to the point of your
(04:30):
own discomfort, your own displeasure, your own
exhaustion, right. That is about priorities and
boundaries. And that's what's really
underneath that. And we got to take a look at it.
When you learn to value yourself, you don't people
please quite so much. Right, exactly.
Well, here's #2 y'all ready? You strapped in?
We're we're on a roll. Here we go, being hyper aware of
(04:54):
other people's moods. What?
How's this one show up for you, Becca?
This one to me is really deep rooted and it's painful.
This one is attached to a lot ofpain and a lot of unhealed pain
from like my childhood from me. So for me, being hyper focused
on other people's moods, are hyper aware of other people's
(05:16):
moods. You're you're on guard all the
time when you're like that. And to me, it's a part of that
fight, flight and being, you know, just on guard all the
time, right, that we get stuck in.
And I think we take somehow responsibility for everyone
else's comfort in the room around us all the time.
And that's what this comes from.You're looking for little
(05:39):
moments of discomfort. And because those things don't
come naturally to us, it's extrawork.
It's like even more work than the usual for most people.
Right. Like before I even recognize
this. I mean, I can look back now that
I know what I know, but I was like, I would walk into a room
and I would be so tuned in, likeI would be exerting so much
(06:01):
energy, tapping into what's the emotion of the room, of the
people in the room. Am I safe?
Correct. Am I safe and am I or am I
sticking out right? Like is am I, is my energy so
different from it? And I think that for a lot of
us, we feel very early on that feeling that your energy is
different when you come into a room, right?
(06:22):
Very early for us that that happens and it becomes this
hyper vigilance about other people's, you know, discomfort
and it feels very one sided. It doesn't ever feel like people
are giving it back, right. And so again, I want to say,
what's your why behind that hyper fixation, right?
And I think every time we look at all of these and we think
(06:44):
about the why behind, we're gonna come back to that drama,
right? Just really basic.
The way we express things as autistic's not the same right as
other people. And I think the subtle part of
this too, for me, how it came inwas, you know, when I was
little, I didn't have the understanding, you know, of
(07:06):
people in relationships having conflict and that being OK like
that. There's something called healthy
conflict, right? And my parents had healthy
conflict, sometimes not healthy,but but for the most part, it
was like, now looking back, it was healthy conflict.
It was how they were working outthings together.
But as a little autistic kid whowas super attuned to all the
(07:30):
things, anytime they had any kind of disagreement, I
immediately was like going to the people pleasing.
I became hyper aware like are they fussing right?
You know, because. Their energy to each other and
the anchors. Heartless to me, right?
Why are we responsible for that though?
(07:50):
Where did that sense of responsibility for other
people's emotions come from, right?
It's a crazy thing. We and five year olds, we don't
think about gravity stuff. We're just, and it's so it's a
really interesting thing becausewhat we learn as adults as there
is healthy conflict. And the more you value and
respect yourself and prioritize your life and have boundaries,
(08:13):
the more there is a setup for that because there's something
to argue over, right? There's something to have
conflict over in that area. And so I think you know what the
difference of course, is the waywe learn to react and express
our emotions. I think as we get older,
hopefully we get better at that.But you know, just watching
(08:34):
people though. I mean, I also say to people
though now though, and I'm goingto turn this on to Ted for a
second, this hyper fixation becomes a skill set for us later
on though. So let's not, you know, Pooh,
Pooh it away is all terrible, right?
It's just like masking. Masking isn't great for us or
sustainable, but it's also a skill set, right?
But if you learn to use it voluntarily and consciously,
(08:56):
right? And this is similar.
We are consummate observers, right?
And that's where this comes fromis just being hyper aware of all
of those things. Well, Becca, take us into our
third one. Sure, this one we talked about
recently, right? Feeling like rest must be
(09:16):
earned. That was worthy of a whole
episode that that guy, right? Not allowed to sit still.
So what was our big take away oryour big take away from that
episode and and rest needing to be earned?
Oh my gosh, just that productivity hustle mentality
that I grew up in, you know, I mean, my, my parents are like on
(09:41):
the, the very edge. My dad is definitely in it.
My mom's on the very edge of thebaby boomer group, right?
So they came in with this like hustle mentality.
I mean, my grandfather grew up, you know, and, and my dad too
experienced the depression. And so it was always this, this
message of you gotta work to earn anything.
(10:01):
Don't sit still. Right, like there's only nothing
you should be doing. Right.
Yeah. Sitting still is like you hadn't
earned the right for that. You you don't have a diamond
tiara on your head. Correct, correct.
You always right. That's right.
Well, now we've earned it, right, Just like settle it on a
little bit. But that's really, you know, I,
(10:22):
I think something we all have tounpack for ourselves.
Where did that come from? Because rest is like food,
right? They go in the same category.
They're necessities, they're notoptions.
And so that productivity, you know, it comes from our
environment. It comes from your growing up,
and as an adult you get have theright to question whether you
still think that's true, right? And it goes so deeply.
(10:48):
Oh yeah. No, you still have more to say,
please. It it, it goes so deeply to that
core of our belief and knowing of our worthiness.
Oh yes, right. Here's another theme.
Are you seeing it pop up in every single one?
Right, About valuing yourself right?
(11:09):
A lot of our trauma has told us that we don't have value.
A lot of that drama has taken away our self-confidence has
taken away, you know, a lot of those pieces for us.
And so that's where a lot of this is coming from, right?
It's wait, So when I start to get to understand my value that
just by breathing I have it right, then we get to work
(11:34):
through some of these bigger pieces, right?
And we know what happens when wetry to lean into OK, I don't
have to earn my rest. We're struggling to feel safe
when things are calm. Yep, this one is something I am
still dealing with right now as we talk, right?
This is something that I, I understand that I need rest.
(11:57):
I understand that I'm building in all of these tools for
myself, that I've done a lot of self-awareness work.
I've done a lot of shadow work. I've done a lot of all of this
other stuff and that the reward for that is the calm, right?
The reward for all of that work is the calm.
And yet I have yet to find comfort in the calm.
(12:19):
I am still right. I have, I can't quite let go.
I don't quite believe that it will stay right.
I think that's my big thing, like, oh, it's good now.
So when I'm in the good, I always go, oh, so the bad is
coming, right? That's how do I prepare for.
I can't really enjoy the now andthe calm, but we've done the
(12:40):
work to get ourselves here, so this part is still hard for me.
I don't have a solution for thisone.
This one is still alive and wellin in my life.
So yeah, if you have solutions on this, I'd like to hear them.
This is definitely something that I have learned to receive,
graciously receive. And there are still moments that
(13:04):
it peaks up again and it's like,oh, but I did, I immediately
want to jump up and do something, you know, or like, I
was floating in the pool yesterday, right?
Like I had worked, I had done two groups.
I mean, I had a huge day yesterday and I was like, OK,
I'm going to go out and float inthe pool because there has to be
(13:25):
this harmony, this reciprocity of action and, and resting.
And so I'm floating in the pool.And do you know what I did?
I stopped floating in the pool. I walked over, grabbed a little
skimmer thing, and I start chasing bugs all over the pool.
But it's fun for me. And I caught myself for a
minute. I'm like, wait a minute, Did I
get up and feel compelled to clean the pool because I
(13:48):
couldn't just float here becauseit was feeling a little
uncomfortable, like I needed some activity?
Right. But then I was like, no, I
actually do enjoy this, but I had to question the motivation.
Yeah. And I was like, and I'm good
with like scooping out the bugs I'm worried are going to come
over here and bite me. And the rest, the skimmer can
(14:11):
get them. But there's still this
evolution. But for me, it really took a lot
of building trust within my own nervous system because when my
nervous system responded, my brain responded for me.
And so it was really just using breath work when I felt like
(14:34):
this compulsion of like I got tobe doing something to just go
hold on, take 3 deep breaths, drop your shoulders open, close
your jaw less than 30 seconds, right?
And then check back in. It's like, no.
And I think the biggest part waswhen I planted the flag and I
said, I reclaim calm. It is mine.
(14:56):
It belongs to me. Right, like that feels like my
natural state, right is calm, right?
And so I don't, this battle is something that I have to work my
way through in some way, right? But it's certainly, and for me,
and I don't know if other peoplefeel this way, for me, it's
(15:18):
rooted very much in a scarcity mentality.
For me, I grew up very much in ascarcity mentality.
I did not grow up very privileged at all.
And so the idea that my life should be calm, my brain
immediately goes, oh, that's 'cause I, I forgot to do
something. If it's calm, it's 'cause
something I'm forgetting to do, something that should be
(15:40):
interrupting my calm, right? Wow.
Which is really a wholly loaded package, right?
Of all the things that Becca thinks are wrong with her,
right? All my insecurity is wrapped up
in this, this idea that not feeling safe, right?
Not feeling financially stable, not feeling emotionally stable
(16:03):
or psychologically stable for most of my life, all of those
things. And so my norm to myself is not
calm, and calm is new for me, yeah.
It, it is definitely something I'm learning to enjoy, which I
never thought I would. And that we talked about it on a
(16:25):
previous show. But that experiment I did back
at Christmas where I, I waited to see how long it would make
people of my brain just like really shut off.
And my body went, Oh yeah, we can do that.
Yeah. We're rigid.
We're so rigid about, you know, all those and that's the piece I
want to let go of, right? Like there it's almost an armor
(16:46):
that when, when we talk about going through this process, you
kind of are taking off little pieces of your armor each time,
you know? I always would you say that I
it's been such a thing. We were talking about it in our
own Baylor group last week and it was, you know, in my early
experience and, and sort of the story that I tell about when I
was younger and had my first burnout experience, you know, I
(17:07):
had this blazer that I wore at school and it was my armor
essentially. It's it's what felt like it
protected me. This physical thing protected
me. I said, now I have sparkly
regalia that I wear. So I shine in the world.
I want to be noticed. I'm not trying to fend the world
off. And and those shifts happen when
we start to recognize these subtle things that show up.
(17:31):
So Becka, take us into our next one here.
All right, so this one is. I am grateful to have gotten rid
of this habit over apologizing for things that aren't your.
Fault. Right.
People use the word sorry for all the wrong reasons.
Most of the time we say sorry when it's not even appropriate
(17:52):
for it to be there, right? And this is very tied to that
people pleasing thing, I think, right?
The idea that if we take ownership and responsibility for
whatever the error is, right, that people will like us.
They don't have to then take responsibility for whatever the
error is. But I also think there's a very
autistic piece of this, which isthat so often we are used to
(18:16):
being told we're in the wrong, that we just assume that if
something's gone wrong, it must be us.
Right, it's the pre emptive apologizing.
Exactly, it's the oh, oh, something was miscommunicated.
It's probably me. Oh, you right, like it's and
that kind of habit too. So it's loaded up for this over
apologizing for us. We have two different reasons
(18:38):
for doing it. And so we do it a lot.
You know, it's habitual and my favorite, the way that I taught
myself or re taught myself to dothis.
One of the ways places I used tosay sorry a lot was in emails or
with meetings, like in workplacescenarios where I would say
sorry for being late, sorry for the delay in my e-mail response
(18:59):
because it took me two hours instead of 10 minutes.
Sorry for, you know, all of these things when you know, it's
not like something that I need to apologize where there was no
expectation set about when I needed to do.
I'm setting that expectation. So when I learned to flip that
in my head and say what I'm really saying to this person is
(19:20):
thank you for waiting for my response.
Thank you for, you know, your flexibility.
Thank you for right. So now when I say to people I
need to reschedule, I don't say I'm sorry to bother you or I'm
sorry for that. Whatever I need to reschedule
with you. I just say I need to reschedule
with you. I appreciate your flexibility,
(19:42):
right? Because that's what I really
want to say, right? Not I'm sorry.
So that's I, I challenge you guys with that and find the
space in your life where you do the I'm sorry the most like gut
reaction is sorry, sorry, sorry.Or you apologize habitually
before saying what it is that you have to say.
Find those spots and script yourself a new response, right?
(20:07):
And just use it until that becomes the habit.
Is what I say. There is nothing to add to that
I that I 1000% right there with you because that was a big one
for me too. To really break that.
The only thing I would would addto this section on the on the
apologizing thing, especially for those of us in certain
(20:29):
societies as women. Reclaim your Dang power.
Please. Please, you are allowed to take
up space. You do not have to apologize for
your existence and anything thatyou do.
No, it's real up. I live in New England and in New
England we have a saying. We are kind, but we are not
(20:49):
nice, right? Which means that if you need
something and I can help you, I have the kindness in me to help
you with that. But I'm not going to sit here
and tell you how pretty you are all the time and tell you how
happy life is and tell, right? I'm not going to sugarcoat
things, but that doesn't make mean unkind person.
(21:10):
And that's what this is, right? Just not apologizing for
yourself and taking up your space, right is what you should
be doing, right? Not to have leads to be like
exist and be right exactly who you are right in your own
timing, which is another piece that I think we don't ever get
(21:32):
as autistic as timing, the timing that works for us.
Oh right, we need to do a whole episode on that one right there.
Yeah OK. The next one is avoiding
conflicts at all cost y'all. I had like full on visceral
response to any the slightest wavering of conflict.
(21:55):
Like it made me physically sick.I mean, it would twist my
stomach and not I would be like nauseous.
I wouldn't be able to sleep because I would be like playing
everything through my head and it just I would minimize
whatever I needed in the moment.Even if it was something that
was hurting me, if it was causing conflict, I would just
(22:18):
suffer to make sure that I was avoiding any potential conflict.
I would apologize people, please.
I mean, you roll all those things into one, right Here is
the heart conflict. I think this is such an
interesting one because my response to conflict and the
dislike of conflict was to self sabotage.
So I used, I started conflicts and so that I had control of
(22:41):
them, right? So that there's, I found,
especially in my like teenage and early 20s, I was a very kind
of, I went through a very rebellious phase and you know,
it was like, OK, well, if there's going to be conflict and
it's going to come at me and I don't understand it, well, I
might as well start it before that happens and create the
conflict from my end, right? And that's really a self
(23:03):
sabotage, right? It's assuming that things are
going to go that way and also arrogant to assume that you can
have control over situations that you know are involving
other people. Right?
But conflict became this thing. It's like, let me get good at it
then like let then let me be theexpert at conflict.
And like, let me out conflict you then, because it felt like
(23:25):
everything for me was a conflict.
Any choice that I made was not going to be good enough for
people. What I wore, what I wrote about,
where I lived, what I liked, allof those things I felt were kind
of really under a microscope, right?
And so I feel like I took almostthe other direction because of
all my trauma into like, initiating conflict, right?
(23:47):
And being kind of one of those spiky people that's always kind
of out to like start things right I'm.
So glad you're referenced 'causeI'm not and I need.
That well, it serves me well. Now I will tell you, there are
certainly times where my very, very loud New York mouth and my
direct autisticness, you know, is certainly valuable.
(24:09):
But you know, certainly areas where it just I was like, you
know what? I am the conflict.
Watch me be the conflict. I love it and you know, I, I
love that we can talk about thisavoiding conflicts at all costs
from different perspectives because as humans we generally
move in three ways. We either turn inward during
(24:31):
stress and conflict or we move against like you were saying,
like I'm going to create the damn conflict.
You know, I'm going to make sureit comes to a head quick 'cause
I just like. Listen to it real quick.
Right. And then we've got people that
that subtly look for what does everybody else think before I
even pick a side of a conflict. Yep, that that's seeking for
(24:53):
approval. So there's a lot of this is part
of our communication, right? Our trauma around communication
and clear communication, right? And so this one is a good one.
I think folks should think aboutthis, right?
No matter what side of conflict you took or what direction you
took with conflict, the way we communicate with people and the
(25:14):
way we choose to respond to people is where our power really
is, right? So play in here.
Definitely play that I I cannot recommend play enough.
So, Becca, this one you said wasreally something you wanted to
talk about. Yes, downplaying our own
experiences is the next one, andso this one for me is probably
(25:38):
the backbone of most of my autistic struggles, right?
I am someone who very much experiences my autism
internally, right? It's a lot of sensory issues, a
lot of communication issues thatdon't like it doesn't
necessarily impact the folks that I'm I'm working with.
It's more about my understanding.
I think of the way things function.
(26:01):
But this my sensory space is somewhere where and food too
safe foods, things like that. Those two areas really for me, I
downplayed all of my right. It was always like I forced
myself to eat what I didn't wantto eat rather than explaining
that, you know, I'm weird and I don't like this because of this
little piece on it or whatever it is, right?
(26:22):
Same thing with sensory, right? I went through.
It's why I called my book AlwaysBring Your Sunglasses, because I
was afraid to bring my sunglasses.
People with places because of people's judgement around
wearing sunglasses inside or wearing them in certain
environments. And so I would just let myself
suffer because every time I saidlights are painful to me, people
(26:42):
would tell me it's not possible.Your eyeballs don't have nerve
endings or whatever BS they weremaking up at this time, right?
And so I was told that it wasn'tpossible.
And so I just learned to push through and I learned to
minimize all my discomfort and treat it as though it wasn't a
priority and it shouldn't be important because I was the only
one experiencing it. And I wasn't making anyone else
(27:05):
uncomfortable. It was just making me
uncomfortable. And so, yeah, to people, I
downplay my experiences. And I had this thought come up
too recently about downplaying our experiences where I've been
thinking, you and I have both been thinking about telling your
story, right? And the story that we tell
ourselves in our head versus what reality is and all of those
(27:26):
things, right? And a lot of the time I, you
know, I told a story to people that I was fine, right?
And I really was not fine anyway, right?
But it's like that. So what story are we telling
ourselves about that, You know, are you telling yourself it's OK
to struggle with your sensory because nobody else is
uncomfortable? That's part of my story.
(27:49):
I lived that story. And so it's important to think
about that piece of it because we have to, you know, no one
else is going to take care of those pieces for you.
No one's coming in to swoop in and make you sensory
comfortable. So you, you have to really learn
to own that piece instead of downplaying it so much for other
people. But yeah.
(28:10):
Do you do this as well? Is this another one for you?
I can say that I don't know because of unrecognized early
trauma, alexithymia, Co occurring health conditions.
Everything to me was suffering and I just thought I didn't know
any different. So I I didn't know that I was
(28:33):
even downplaying it. I just thought everybody else
was suffering. They just handled it better than
I did until I started to learn, oh, other people don't.
And then I was like, what? Right, you're not in this play
too like. What?
Your skin's not on fire? What?
How do you sit there? I mean, it's amazing when that
(28:56):
right, that lifts up for you andyou're like, hold on, right?
I don't have to because and you're like, well, then I don't
have to do that anymore. I could start to think about
what's really happening for me, because that's what everyone
else does. This is what they're needs
first. There's a moment when that
happens and you kind of recognize that bit.
There, there totally is. This next one is the one that
(29:20):
probably showed up more for me than this last one.
And it's this deep fear of beingtoo much because I was told
you're so, you're too loud, you're too happy.
I was told I was too happy. Yo, that's just wrong.
Who tells somebody they're too happy?
I don't know. It's messed up.
(29:42):
Right, it's really messed up then remember so many.
Times like tone it down, Reggie.That's right.
And but this is such an interesting one to me because
here we are. We're going to have again where
I went the total other directionwith this, right?
This deep fear of being too much.
I think I heard it so much as a kid that then again, I went, you
(30:03):
know what, let me show you too much.
You know what I mean? That I was just like, you think
that's too much because I'm working really hard not to be
too much right now. So let me not work so hard.
Let me show you what that looks like, right?
And so I, you know, I became, I think too much, You know, it was
in a very rebellious way that I became too much.
(30:25):
But I just, I stopped keeping mymouth shut.
I never edited myself. I did lots of things where where
I think I intentionally pushed people right as a way.
Damn, you're my heroine. But it's not necessarily a
healthy either, right? Because then you get you get
kind of cast as the the villain in every story, right?
(30:49):
I was the villain in every story.
It was always my fault. I was always too angry.
I was always rude, right? There was never a positive
adjective attached to me anywhere, right?
And that's what I was signing onfor, right?
That was the choice that I was making because I felt lost in
the world. And I was like, well, if you
(31:09):
know, then nobody likes me, thenwatch nobody like me, right?
Like, let me show you how easy it is not to like me.
And that became my persona for avery long time.
That was my my wall, right? That protected me from, from
everyone in, in the way that some people choose people
pleasing. I think I chose, you know, I
(31:32):
dare you. Yeah.
When I was in 6th grade and I upto that point, I mean, I was
like gregarious and really happyand flutie and everybody was
wonderful and I love just being in the world.
Even though there were a lot of things I didn't understand, I
was still happy being me. And then I started to get picked
(31:55):
on by a group of girls who said I was too much, too loud, too
happy. You know, I said stupid things,
You know, Why are you wearing earrings like her?
Those are her earrings. I'm like, whoa.
And Klein sells them to everybody.
I can own them. Well, you know, I mean, that
kind of stuff. And so there was this point, the
(32:16):
shift that happened, that I paused.
And then I agreed to all that crap and I thought, I'm too
much. So do you know what I did?
I stopped talking. I stopped being happy.
I stopped just being free and open.
And I spent then probably the next six or seven years being
(32:38):
quiet. And this is what really got me.
The next year, those same exact girls then criticized and
ridiculed me for being so quiet,right.
Because no one's ever happy, right?
That's the truth. And so it's a really interesting
thing that we like you can choose to be too much in lots of
different ways. And and you know, I think again,
(33:00):
it was like, I know I'm going tobe too much.
And so let me just be too much ahead of time.
Let me just get ahead of the curve and be too much in front
of it, right? And but that doesn't work out
for us either. And so it's really, you know,
this idea that there could even be too much or that you have to
be this, this desire for sameness is what it is of every,
(33:22):
right. We were taught that, right?
That's all That doesn't come naturally to us as people.
We are taught that from people. And I, it's interesting that you
had that moment with girls, because I also had that moment
with girls because girls are mean by the way, and nasty.
And I would rather be a boy and get punched in the face than
treated the way girls treat other girls.
(33:45):
But I had this similar moment. For me, it was when I was 8
years old. And it was like, I wasn't
interested in dresses. I wanted to play in our my
garden. I wanted to climb trees.
I wanted. Right.
And that was fine and, well, acceptable until a certain age.
And for me, it was 8. And at 8, it was like, no, now
you're supposed to be wearing pink and you're supposed to,
like, make up and you're supposed to write all of these
(34:05):
things. And yeah, that was when this
fear of being too much or fear of, you know, not fitting him
became. Yeah.
And then when it shifts into this own internal judge of you
judging yourself too much, it can.
It can we. Let them live in your hat,
right? We let them.
It's not our voice that's sayingthat.
(34:26):
It's, it's not. It's an echo of their voices,
right? And that can carry forward and
begin to put up boundaries and blockers and giant mountainous
Ridge caps all around the thingsthat really matter to you.
So this next one I can't wait todiscuss.
(34:50):
This is a good one. Difficulty making decisions now.
This one, right, I think is well, well rooted in self trust,
right? This is stolen.
It was stolen from me. I don't know if it was stolen
from you, but right when you're told that the way you are
innately, the way you you exist and choose to do things innately
(35:12):
is broken and needs to be fixed all the time, right?
I mean, that's really, I feel like for me, you let you stop
learning to trust your gut at that point and you stop trusting
your gut and this rolls in and aren't we a lovely package?
When you've been told why are you doing it that way, that's
weird. No one else is experiencing
(35:32):
that. And then it starts to erode at
that internal self trust. And then it's like, Oh well, if
I'm doing this wrong or if my experience of this isn't right,
like we are didn't even questionour own experience.
We know damn good and well it happened, but it's right.
Maybe I'm wrong. So then it's like, oh God, it's
(35:54):
not safe for me to make a choicebecause I've been told so many
times I was wrong. Or the other side of that is
when I've made decisions, bad things have happened and I've
gotten hurt. I can't trust my own choices
because, you know, we just don'tsee the things other people see,
you know? And so it culminates into like,
this perfect storm of decision. Fatigue builds up too, because
(36:20):
Oh my God, how many decisions dowe have to make in the damn day?
Seriously. Oh my God, I hate it.
Thank I'm have to tell you one of the reasons I love my husband
to death is because I can literally turn to him and just
say I don't fucking know. Can you please just decide for
me? Right Did.
I borrow him. Right, because I just I will
(36:43):
stand especially like if we haveto order food or I have to, I'm
in the supermarket and I have tochoose a product, please, I
could be there for I can spreadsheet between the ice
creams to decide which one I want.
And so sometimes I'm just like, babe, I can't today I just could
you just decide whatever it is, I'll be happy with it because
I'd rather eat that than not decide.
(37:04):
So here's like, and it's it's terrible decision for TV.
I hate it. It's so interesting.
I I do something similar with myhusband.
I'm like OK, my cup is full to capacity.
Like I have no more bandwidth for anything.
Just pick. I don't care.
I really don't take me. With you just drag take me and
I'm fine. Like I am so happy to just be
(37:27):
the cart behind the horse, you know, let's just go for it, OK?
So this next one I think is really good.
I can't wait to have a conversation on this one.
So this is number 10. I feel we're we're our 36 minute
mark y'all. And so back in I'll share where
we're going to share this next 10 with you, because we really
do want to dig into all twenty of these.
(37:48):
So we got a little special surprise.
So just hang on, let's talk about this last one real quick.
All right, so this one is so interesting to me because I
recently wrote a post about thison social media because I right,
think it's so annoying, this thing.
I hate it when people praise us for getting through the struggle
(38:08):
and we become inspiration because we've gotten through the
struggle when those are the verysame people that created the
struggle for us in the first place.
I loved the post that you wrote on this by the way.
It was so. This.
Would you please? Thank you so much.
Would you please stop doing thatto me like it's not.
It doesn't make it better. You made me jump through hoops
(38:31):
and then you tell me how well I jumped through the hoops.
Get out of here. Nobody had to have the hoops in
the 1st place right that. Is it's even like, Oh my gosh,
you're so resilient. I'm so inspired.
I can't believe you jumped through all those hoops with two
broken legs, but you're the one that gave me the damn broken
legs and made me jump through the hoops just so I could be OK.
(38:53):
Right, just so I could fit whatever it is that you're And
so this to me is a big, this is a red flag for me in terms of
like toxic people, right? I have little list in my head of
the my little red flags that when people do these things,
they are no Nos for me. Like, I don't care how long
we've been friends. I don't care if I just met you
(39:14):
and you think I'm judging you too quickly.
I don't care. These are my boundaries around
certain things, and this is one of them.
Because this to me is as good asgaslighting this is.
I mean, this is one of those truly toxic behaviors that I
have only seen the neuro majority participate in.
(39:34):
Yeah, not something that autistic people do to other
autistic people or other neurodivergent.
People not at all. And where this can be like that
really subtle indicator that there has been some trauma in
the past. It's like when you're being
praised for being resilient, butinside you feel like you're
barely holding it together, but somehow that little, that little
(39:58):
Gold Star. Yay.
OK. Right.
Yeah, Beat the board. Yay.
Right. It's all of that kind of thing.
And so, but when you unpack where it's coming from, it's a
dirty compliment, right? It's not.
That dirty compliment? Yeah, it's a dirty.
Nasty. It's a passive aggressive way,
(40:21):
right? It doesn't genuinely mean what
it means. And so I say you're right,
because what people do is we're so happy for our Gold Star that
even though we're feeling like we're barely holding it
together, we're gonna try to sustain that for another Gold
Star. Somehow that makes me worthy and
acceptable and I can belong. That that's that's deeply
(40:45):
wounding. That is energy training.
Yeah, I mean, it is. And then it's like not you don't
admit to yourself then that you're barely holding it
together and so you don't do anyof the self-care or you're not
aware you break your interception.
There's so it's so many bad things, right result from just
not admitting. You know what?
(41:05):
No, though. I mean, yeah, I'm glad I was
able to do it, but I'd like to never do it again.
Thank you. This.
Is what you can duct tape on somebody's mouth so they can
never say they're not OK. Yeah, it's really, this is a bad
and it's sneaky. So you'll this one you find
everywhere. And again, it's another one of
those things that is manipulatedto look like a compliment,
(41:28):
manipulated to look like right when.
And so we go, oh, thank you. Right when we should be saying
is, well, if you hadn't created the mess in the 1st place, I
wouldn't have had to be so damn resilient.
Exactly. Yes.
As we wrap up this very powerful, hopefully incredibly
(41:50):
service oriented conversation like this has really served you
today. It has supported you back.
And I also want you to know thatyou don't need to have a
dramatic story or a specific diagnosis or anything like that
to have experienced trauma. Trauma can be slow.
It can be quiet. It can be insidious and
(42:12):
cumulative. It can come from constantly
being misunderstood, unsupported, or told to hide
your authentic self and the things that you need.
It can come from chronic invalidation or growing up
without the emotional scaffolding that you needed.
And you deserve support. You deserve healing.
(42:34):
You deserve compassion and rest,even if you were never, quote UN
quote the one who had it the worst.
This is not a comparison. This is about what you need and
where you are. That was good.
I don't want to say anything else.
(42:55):
That's very pretty. So here, here's the surprise.
Becca and I were playing becausewe like to play and have fun,
and this is a pretty heavy topic, but we decided we can
still play and we could still have fun and we could still talk
about the heavy stuff because these are the things that really
matter. So next week, be sure you check
both Becca Laurie Hector and Carol Jane Whittington at
(43:16):
Whittington well-being because we're both going to write
articles with those last 10 items on our list of our top 20.
We may even have a little bonus 1 here and really dig into those
and kind of like our show today,we're going to share our
perspectives on these and this is going to be really fun
because you can go read both of them and see how did Becca feel
(43:37):
an experience and we're not. Going to cheat.
I don't want to see you at CarolJane's writing.
She's not going to look at what I'm writing.
We're going to go it's going to be a surprise for us to to look
at the other person's perspective and I think this is
a really good one. I hope you'll, you know when you
see that 10 come out, take the time and go through them
yourselves, right? Get through those the last 10
and and take a look at where they live in your life, right?
(44:00):
And and if you're ready to get rid of them and all of those
things. But I'm excited to continue this
conversation because this is a fun one.
It is, and we got a little treatthat's coming with it.
We're going to have that top 20 list of those subtle trauma
things that you may not have identified to get in the way of
things that really matter. We're going to have a checklist
for you, so you can just download it and go through it
(44:21):
and have fun reading all the articles.
And be sure to share the show with a friend.
Reach out, you know, if you're in a group and you know, just
share the show. Let somebody else also have the
opportunity to get to meet Beccaand I because we love to meet
new folks and say hi to us over on Instagram or LinkedIn.
We hang out over there pretty regularly.
Thanks so much for being here totalk more about the things that
(44:42):
really matter. We'll see you next month.
Thanks for being here. It's been quiet.
All right, let's turn the tide. Stop shelf guests dropping
wisdom bombs. Join us next week where the
energy's strong beyond crying burnout.
We're breaking free podcast pumping full of energy tips and
(45:06):
tricks to push strong fight fastpace and fun.
You'll feel alive energy mastery.
Come along for the ride behind Beyond Quantum.
We're on the rise. Join us as we form our top shot
guests that need to energy throughout us.
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