213 - Why Every Autistic Woman Needs to Hear Michelle’s Story Before Trying Another Program

So many autistic and ADHD women find themselves stuck in the same cycle: trying program after program, searching for the one that will finally “fix” the burnout, overwhelm, and constant self-doubt.

But what if the problem isn’t you—it’s that most programs are too surface-level, never addressing your unique needs, identity, and lived experience?

In this episode of Beyond Chronic Burnout, Michelle, a participant in the UnVeiling Method’s Accelerate Membership, shares her journey from anxiety, self-criticism, and feeling lost… to discovering peace, gratitude, and a deep connection to her authentic autistic/ADHD self.

Through journaling, group support, and tools like the Enneagram, Harmony Cycle, and Rest Modules, Michelle learned how to:

• Ask herself meaningful questions that brought clarity
  

• Recognize her true needs (without guilt)
  

• Release the pressure of “fixing” herself
  

• Embrace her neurodivergent identity with compassion
  

Her story is proof: you don’t have to keep guessing, masking, or settling for burnout.

✨ 👉 Take the quiz now (free) and get your first custom audio guide → https://energize.whittingtonwellbeing.com/products/courses/view/1155744

This is your starting line. Don’t guess. Diagnose.

And IF you haven’t taken the quiz in the last 30 days, now is the time to re-evaluate where you are—so you don’t find yourself in the same place 30+ days from now.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Are you tired of trying program after program only to feel like
nothing really changes? If you've ever felt lost,
overwhelmed, or stuck in burnoutas an autistic or ADHD woman,
this episode is for you. Today you'll hear Michelle's
story, how she went from anxiety, self doubt and constant

(00:22):
self guessing. The finding peace, clarity, and
finally feeling at home in her autistic and ADHD identity.
She's going to share what made all the difference inside the
unveiling methods, accelerate membership, and why so many
other approaches fall short. If you've ever thought, what's

(00:44):
wrong with me, why can't I just get this right?
You'll want to stick around because Michelle's journey will
show you what's possible when you stop guessing and start
understanding yourself with compassionate curiosity and
clarity. Let's dive in.
Step out of the shadows. Feel the power will rise.

(01:06):
Catch the spark inside you. Let your spirit fly.
Be on the chronic burner, Carol Jeans your guy.
Find your step. Be with a nice joy all the time.
So is forward, bright and bold. Leave the bird apart behind.

(01:29):
In this journey hearts unfold. How is yours seeking find?
This is a real honor for me. I, I just am tickled to death

(01:50):
and my heart is bursting to be able to have this conversation
with you, Michelle. Michelle is a student of the
Unveiling Method and she startedthe program in April of 2024
with my first small group cohortwhere I ventured out no longer
doing just one on ones, but doing small groups.
And Michelle was one of the first people to raise their hand

(02:11):
and go, OK, I'm in and we'll talk about that.
But Michelle, I would love for you to share because a couple of
weeks ago I gave you a challenge.
And of course, I can't challengeyou without challenging myself.
I don't ever do anything that I haven't done or that I'm not
willing to do. And I said, Michelle, I would
love for you to grab your journals because you you've been

(02:33):
journaling this whole time. Go back and find that journal
from March of 2024 and just readwhat you were writing.
Who were you almost a year ago? Who did you discover?
Michelle, Where? Where were you a year ago?

(02:56):
I was a mess. I was really, really a mess.
I didn't trust myself. I was overwhelmed.
I was really, really down. And it was just I had so many

(03:21):
dark feelings. I didn't know where I belonged.
I felt on display and invisible at the same time in a negative
way. I was anxious about every

(03:45):
decision. I just I was reactive.
I couldn't express myself. I had a hard time.
Just like I felt like my feelings were just too complex

(04:05):
to express. But looking back, I feel like it
wasn't that they were too complex.
It was that I didn't know them well enough because I wasn't
getting close enough to them because they were scary.
And I look back at this journal,this poor girl, I feel so bad

(04:27):
for her. And I noticed like sometimes I
would write words really massively big or I would draw
like a picture that just just all sass and vinegar and and
then I would just be like, you know, just letting it all out.

(04:51):
I was just letting it all out. And I was you because I remember
when you first told me to journal, you were trying to show
me that this was a space where Iwould be allowed to do that.
And I thought, oh, good, I can just write it and I don't have
to worry about who's going to respond in what way.

(05:13):
And you know, this is hilarious.I see.
I wrote, I drew some flames and I wrote resentment and rage.
And then then I have like this other one where like I'm in the
middle and there's this circle and there's all this stuff, all
these arrows coming at me. I just, I just felt like the

(05:35):
target and but there was something else I noticed.
I noticed questions. I was getting curious and like
gradually it started to be more questions, then more venting.

(05:59):
And that's a technique that I'vekind of been working on.
It's like when I have a feeling instead of making a decision
about it or putting a meaning onit or feeling like I have to
solve it right away, like I don't want to feel that way.

(06:20):
I got to fix that. I ask a question and you know
that I'm just that one little act can take you so far because
there's a million ways to ask a question and when you ask one
question that leads to 10 other questions, right?
Because it's just like it opens up all these things, you know

(06:41):
and then suddenly it's not so scary anymore.
You're just going through your boxes and doing your purging and
you're Do I want this anymore? No, not really.
Let's get rid of that. Or.
You really have embraced passionate curiosity.

(07:06):
You really have that was that's been a big shift.
So if you look back at the Michelle before we started
Foundation Builder in April lastyear and you said she she was
really struggling, she was overwhelmed.
You know, there was a lot of like all the arrows, everything
was coming at me. There was rage and these big
flames. And what were some of the things

(07:28):
that you were telling yourself? Oh, my Gray hair.
Life is hostile. I feel alone.
Let's see effort out. Nothing in everyone else gets

(07:57):
what they want and need. I'm just surviving.
It's funny, I asked right underneath of that.
Are these thoughts true and helpful?
That one, that one definitely needed challenging, but it's OK.
It's OK. I don't.

(08:18):
I don't have to be right and I don't have to be correct and I
don't have to be perfect. I just have to be me the best.
That. Isn't me that I can be.
And that is a very different answer than the one that I got
back in April and May, which wasI've got to make sure I do

(08:39):
everything and it's all got to be done at this time frame and
it has to be perfect and I can'tmake a mistake.
Gerald G Did I miss anything? What did I not understand?
Oh my God, it was so bad. It was so.
Bad. But you're not alone and

(08:59):
starting there. There's somebody right now that
feels the same way. Yeah, I did.
Yeah, I'm so proud of all of your I, I, when I hear your
story, I just, I just, I am so awe inspired because I mean,

(09:23):
I've honestly, I feel like you were even further down than I
was. I mean, you were way down there
and I just how did you do it? Like, how did you go from that
to like, wow, you are just putting it out there and helping
so many people. And I'm so thankful, so

(09:47):
incredibly thankful. Exactly the same way you're
doing it right now. You were doing what I did, but
faster with a clearer path and tools.
Yes, absolutely. Absolutely.
Wow, I'm so glad I didn't have to do that alone.

(10:13):
And I'm glad that I was able to figure some stuff out so that
other people didn't have to do what I did alone.
That's important. It is so.
Important. We're Better Together.
Absolutely. Oh my gosh, I, I just, I don't
feel alone anymore. And I think I have found my

(10:35):
community and most definitely we're going to get through this.
We are. I wouldn't even say we're
getting through it. I say we're creating what we
want as we're in it. Yeah, Yeah, that's what I'm

(10:56):
talking about. That's what I'm talking about.
So Michelle, I got a juicy question for you from the I'm
I'm a mess. Bless her heart from a year ago.
She was struggling. Everything was coming at her.
Everything was going out and nothing was coming in.

(11:18):
How? Did you decide that you were
going to do something different that you were?
How did you decide to work with me?
What came across your path that you said, you know what, I'm
ready even though I don't know what I don't know, I'm ready.
What made that happen for you? Well, I'll tell you what, I went

(11:41):
to therapy for childhood trauma and I made progress on that
point in that realm. And then I realized that I that
wasn't the whole thing and I started watching videos about

(12:01):
autism and ADHD. So I was really starting to have
my suspects, my suspicions and and I was just, I was like, I'm
going to find out what this is and what if this is me and it
and how I can get help. I'm going to find it.

(12:23):
And then I don't remember how I found you in particular, but I
remember listening to I read your book because I was like, Oh
yeah, she's she's talking about what I'm talking about.
So I read her book. I read your book and then you
had the the nine day energy pod and because I was like, I, I

(12:48):
think I had come to the place where I totally need help, like
not my therapist because God love him, you know, he was there
for that particular purpose. And I think that was a good
beginning to the journey. But you know, I realized I
needed more targeted, you know, specialized help.

(13:11):
And so I watched that, I listen to that nine day energy pod and
I was like, I, I was taking notes and I was like, Oh my God,
yes, she's that, that she's saying it, She's saying what I'm
going through. And I, I think the, the thing

(13:35):
was, is when I was listen, when I listen to the energy pod, the
thing that really clicked was, oh, hey, this is going to be a
journey. This isn't going to be me
solving my problem and getting fixed, me fixing myself.
And, and now I'll be all nice and shiny for everybody and
nobody has to worry about me. I was like, that's what I want.

(13:59):
I want that journey. I want to find out where I,
where I am, where did I go? Who am I, What's what's
happening? And I mean, the truth be told,
if I was a rich woman, I would have signed up with you as an
individual. Boom.
Right off the bat. I wouldn't have hesitated.

(14:20):
That money was there. I would have flung it at you.
But you know, you had some, somemore affordable things.
And I was just like, OK, all right.
And we're going, we're doing it.We're going to do this because I
didn't want to stay where I was.I didn't want to stay there and,

(14:41):
and, and just flailing and trying and, and still not
getting anywhere. And it's ongoing and it will be
life lifelong. It will be lifelong.
And who knows? Who knows what's next?

(15:06):
Who knows? Because the only thing that's
stopping wonder, all these wonderful things happening, is
my choices, my own choices, Me. I can make beautiful things
happen. I can do that.

(15:26):
But I have to have to be willingto receive it.
It's it really is kind of funny.It's almost like, well, there it
is. Michelle, are you going to take
it or not you. Know it.
Has to be a certain nature. I have to have control over it.
Like, no, you don't. No, you don't.

(15:50):
And you know you'd be bored anyway if you had control over
everything. You would be bored out of your
mind. Well.
You've heard me say this a few times, Michelle.
So what? Yeah.
Who says? Who says?
Who says exactly, Exactly. I I did a lot of questioning.

(16:13):
Everything's up. Everything is up for a question
now. It's like you were.
Afraid to ask questions in the beginning.
You're afraid to ask questions at the beginning.
You're like, no, no, no. It's, it's got to go this way
because that's what it says. There's no question in this
Kelsey. So, so when you signed up for

(16:35):
Foundation Builder, was was thatan easy decision?
Was that just like a a quick yes?
Oh my God. Yeah.
Were you? Rise because it it's, you know,
it was a lower ticket thing. It was a, it was a beta.
It wasn't like a whole lot of anything, but it was.
Were you surprised about the level of support and

(16:59):
personalization that you've had through the whole program this
year? I, I have, honestly, it is the
most impactful thing I have everdone in my entire life.
And honestly, I mean, the value is just so far above what I've

(17:22):
paid financially and just even what I put in when I put in a
lot. But like, you know, working with
the tools and doing the journaling and doing the
reflecting and all of that, thathas been a joy.
That has been a joy because I feel like everything that I put

(17:47):
into it came back to me a thousandfold, a thousandfold.
So there's my scales. There's your scales.
Yeah. We pulled a card, an Oracle
Dreamscape card, because I was trying to do this portrait.
She's like, heck yes. We got like she drew like the.

(18:07):
It was the perfect card. It was so beautiful.
So. So, Michelle, I'm going to ask
you and your scales, were you happy with your decision or has
it been a disappointment? Anyway.
Is there anything I can do better or was this like really
good? I mean, are you asking me if I

(18:32):
was happy with my decision? I just realized I don't think I
can be any happier. I don't know.
Maybe I shouldn't have done this.
You're. Hilarious.
No, I, I 1000%, I am more than happy.

(18:54):
I'm more than ecstatic. And every little bit of effort
that I have put into it literally has just exploded,
exploded with, I don't know, just so many benefits like

(19:19):
peace, executive function. I mean, I, I was afraid to
drive. I was afraid to drive.
And I mean, I never would have thought that I'd been there
because, I mean, I'm in my 50s and I've driven on the Baltimore
Beltway and the DC Beltway. I mean, I've done it all.

(19:40):
OK, like. That's some serious, serious
driving. I know how to drive and I've
done it before without the anxiety but for some reason my
anxiety was so bad I just it wasa big deal to do even 1 errand.
I was like OK what time of day am I going to go?

(20:01):
What what route am I going to take?
What music am I going to be playing?
How am I going to calm myself down if I have an anxiety?
It was just this huge thing. I laugh now because now I'm just
like, oh, my charger's dead. Oh, let's go get a new one.
And oh, by the way, while I'm out, I'll do this and this and

(20:22):
I'll enjoy it the whole time. I mean, how can how can you put
a price on that? How can you put a price on that?
And I mean, shoot, if I can hit a walk at 200 miles an hour and
then pick myself up and find a better way to be in leadership

(20:47):
of my own life, why would I not do that?
I have to do that. The only other option is total
destruction. And we get to choose.
Yes, I know. I'm like, I'm not controlling my

(21:10):
life, but I am making my own true choices.
And that feels really good. It feels amazing.
But you have to know what you want.
You have to know what you want before you make the choice,
right? And if you don't know who you
are, and you don't really know what's going on inside of you,
how are you going to make a goodchoice?

(21:33):
Michelle, do you think that you've learned who you are?
You've discovered unveiled who you are this year. 1000 percent,
1000% yes. What's been the biggest surprise
that you've discovered about your authentic?
Self a surprise. The biggest surprise is just

(22:02):
because I'm autistic, I'm not broken.
I'm actually happy being autistic.
I like it. It's who I am.
It's quirky, but who cares? I like it.
It serves me. I love how I'm attentive to
detail and I love how I'm selective in my social

(22:22):
interactions. And I love that I don't have to
follow someone else's script or someone else's expectation.
I'm happy I'm good with it. Even the ADHDI mean I I'm not
going to lie, sometimes I'm likenow brain I need.

(22:45):
You to behave? Well, I talk to my squirrels.
You know I do. Yeah, yeah.
And if I'm telling you that Harmony cycle that we did, holy
cow, that has been a super game changer.

(23:06):
I'm like, Oh my God, I understand myself so much better
physically, hormonally. Like I can really feel it when
I'm moving into. I'm like, oh, I must be moving
into the next phase, like and sure enough.
I love how when we have group sessions and you're just

(23:27):
throwing up, well, I'm in Maloudio this week and
everybody's nodding because we all know what you mean and it's
so nice, right? It's.
Wonderful. Because now it's like, because I
had suspected for a long time I was like, there were times when
the ADHD was so bad, so bad, andI was like, what is going on?

(23:48):
Like, I know I have ADHD, but really this is just too much.
And now I understand it's those hormones are are shifting and
they're changing and I can just be like, oh, OK, so I need to, I
need to give myself what I need during that phase for that
particular thing and it'll be fine.

(24:09):
And it's, that's harmonious. I don't need to be, you know, at
the same level of performance for the entire month.
I can go through those cycles and there's pros and cons to
each cycle. Each part of that cycle has its
pros and cons. And when you capitalize on the
pros and minimize the cons, guess what?

(24:33):
It's not as hard and you're not like it's.
A good major for me. That's why I said I haven't
learned everything. I've only been doing this three
or four months, but I got to teach you all everything that
I've learned because you've got to know for.
Real for real, because just eventhe the minute understanding is
has been a huge help. A huge help.

(24:55):
No, I don't have me. To share the next one when we
dive into all the Co occurring health conditions that happen in
our cycles. Oh my gosh.
That's going to be a good one and.
It's, it has Carol, it has just been a journey.
It has been that journey that I was really, really craving.

(25:17):
Like I just didn't want to keep doing life the same way and the
Harmony cycle and all that. It's all part of it.
It's all part of it. Because now I'm so excited.
I'm like, wait, you mean I can keep learning and then my life
gets better when I learn and I receive and I'm curious like,

(25:37):
oh, I like this. Oh, that's so good.
What has been as you began when you think about back to
foundation builder, you know, westart with the spicy pepper
dashboard and if any of you havedone the the three day road map
out of burnout, that's where we start was this with the spicy
pepper dashboard and we revisit that.

(25:58):
But all the way from the spicy pepper dashboard to now where
you're aligning those 7 forms ofrest in in our accelerate
program. What's the part that really made
the biggest shift for you? Which module, which discussion?
Was it anagram? Was it values?
Was it boundaries? Was it, you know, learning more

(26:20):
about the seven forms of rest other than sleep?
Was it the self-care plan from the inside out where we did
reflection work and we did the thought thermostat and
discovered the traps in our mind?
I mean, what was the thing that really made an impact on you?
I think the biggest impact was when I learned through my

(26:43):
enneagram that I am a hoarder. I'm like, I'm a digital hoarder.
I'm a knowledge hoarder. And I realized that that was
coming from a place of not being, not feeling safe.
Like I had, I had to gather, gather, gather, gather.
I had to have everything, have everything, make sure I have

(27:04):
everything. The Enneagram had I think it
just illuminated that that particular point.
It's really illuminated some of the other things like the
thought traps and the those things were kind of, I'd kind of

(27:26):
in the back of my mind sort of suspected that that was going on
And learning about those really helped me to to address it and
make adjustments and, and that was good, but that aneogram.
It's powerful and y'all, I'm laughing because Michelle and I

(27:48):
are both of five and she and I have really supported one
another through our our purging.She's even inspired me to purge
some of my digital hoarding because I'm, I'm bad at that.
It, it was so good that Michellesaid, I guess it was back in
January and she we were in our group meeting and she said, OK,
well, I've done this and this. I cleaned up my inbox.

(28:09):
I don't have any unread things in my inbox.
Carol Jean And I was like, I betthat feels so good.
I hadn't done that a long time. Now I'm gonna fess up to this.
I'll tell y'all. I told Michelle I was like, oh,
Michelle. I have like 3 or 4 years worth
of open tabs on my phone. It's so bad that there are no
longer numbers. There's a little sideways :)

(28:32):
because there's no place for digits to go.
And this was the thing and I hadto e-mail Michelle when I did it
because I was really like, this was solidarity right here
together supporting one another.And that's what the unveiler
community is about. And I got my phone and I was
going through them one by one making a decision.

(28:53):
Am I going to keep this? Do I need this?
And about 5 or 6 in, I stopped and I went, what are you doing,
Carol? Jim, this is crazy pants.
This is going to take you a month.
One by one. You've got so and and I even had
tabs grouped into groups. There was like tabs in my.
Tabs y'all and. I told Michelle I went, am I

(29:16):
going to need this right now? Am I going to miss it if I
delete it? Have I looked at any of these in
three or four years that I've opened and I saw stuff that I
was like, it didn't even load because the page wasn't even
there anymore. It was so old.
And at that point I discovered Ididn't even know this existed.
I was just looking for some tools on how I could delete some

(29:36):
of this stuff. I discovered a delete all button
and I just said you know what I am safe and I know that there is
anything I need to look up. Google is not going anywhere.
I'll probably get new, better information.
And I hit the delete all button and the minute I did it, I felt

(29:58):
like physically lighter. I immediately messaged Michelle.
It was like, you're not going tobelieve what I did.
She was like, Oh my gosh, that'slike huge.
But I did not because of Michelle.
I did that because she was therefor me in a way that I needed.

(30:22):
And that's what's so beautiful about our community is that we
show up for each other, not justfor ourselves.
Oh, yeah, I really enjoy the group aspect, honestly, I love,
I love, I really love listening to other people.
I just love hearing their stories, listening to the tone
of their voice, just kind of tapping into where they're at.

(30:46):
And I'm so glad you did that purge.
I'm you know what it was for me was just like I said to myself,
now, Michelle, I, I, I sat myself down and I said, I want
you to be honest. I got a question for you.
I'm going to be honest. I want you to be really, really
honest. Can you even look at or read or

(31:11):
do something with all of those things?
Is it even possible? Is it?
Possible that's that's a qualityquestion.
Yeah. And I said, well, no, but I
wanted to be there just in case.And then I was like, OK, but are

(31:32):
you going to? And I was like, probably not.
OK, so here's the question then.Really.
When you asked yourself that question and you got radically
honest with yourself, would you have even asked that question or

(31:55):
felt comfortable saying what wastrue a year ago?
No, no, because I was on my track.
I thought I knew what I was doing and I knew what I needed
to collect, and I was collecting.
Collecting. We are collecting.
My collections kept me safe. Like my collections was like,

(32:17):
OK, it's there and and I'll haveit and and I won't leave
anything out and I will know allthe things I have to know.
And and I was just like, I got to your place.
I was like, this is crazy pants.Like maybe I don't want to know
all these things. Maybe there's only certain
things I want to know. Maybe I only want to know the

(32:38):
most impactful things. And you're right.
It's not going anywhere. It's not like, you know, Oh my
God, it's lost forever. Like I know it feels like that
at first because I, I didn't grow up in the digital world and
imagine you didn't either were some similar to my.

(32:59):
But there's this feeling you have like if you delete
something, it, it's not there anymore and you can't get it
back. And that's kind of a, that's
sort of a fear thing, you know? But I, I just finally said, you
know what? This isn't keeping me safe.
It's just loading me down. Did you feel the same physical

(33:23):
release that I did, or did you have something different?
I I definitely felt a light, a lightness.
It was like deciding to do it was harder than actually doing
it. It was, it was like working my
way through the decision process.

(33:44):
It was just like, maybe I shouldjust keep these little things or
I don't know, maybe and, and I just and I was like, OK, stop,
stop, stop, stop, stop. Right.
It's so great 'cause once we didthat together and, you know, we
kind of teamed up to support oneanother.

(34:05):
I created a boundary, a rule, and I said, OK, I'm not going to
have more than 10 tabs open. And once a week on Sundays and I
do the sterner alignment Sundays.
I look and see, is there anything that I really need to
carry over that I hadn't handledor hadn't done anything with?
And if I hadn't touched it and Idon't plan on touching it, I
delete everything back down except for one thing that I

(34:27):
keep. That's my little TV show.
I keep up. That's it.
But do you know that just knowing that we did that
together, knowing that I feel somuch lighter physically, and
then I really proved to myself that I didn't need all of that
data. Yeah, it.

(34:49):
Was. Huge it was.
Yeah, Seriously. Seriously.
That wasn't and I was like curious decision.
It was like, whoa, OK, cool. That wasn't I.
Know and then it's just like whydidn't I do this earlier why did
I wait so long right I. Know.
And he was. Like, well, I I had to have some

(35:13):
things happen so I could do it and it did.
And then I chose right? Oh yeah, when the time's right,
the time's right. It's always perfect timing.
We're never late. We're always in perfect timing.
And I, I think that ADHD part ofmy brain had me fooled for so
long because of time blindness and you know, all the stuff that

(35:35):
I was always behind. Somehow everybody else was ahead
of me. And I've learned that I'm not
behind. I'm only behind when I start
comparing myself to other people's highlight reel with my
everyday reel. Yeah.
Yeah, exactly. I mean, when you think about it,

(35:57):
behind. Behind what?
Well, and you know, if you've read The Big Leap by Gay Hendrix
and you've looked at Einstein time and Newtonian time, you
know that we are the masters of our time.
So we can only be behind if we choose to be behind.

(36:17):
Yeah, yeah. We are always right on time.
We are the masters of time. Michelle, I'm really curious,
when you started to look at the program and you read the book,
had you looked at other programs?
How were they different? What then?
What was out on the market when you first started looking?

(36:40):
I didn't really see a lot of autistic coaches.
I but I did happen across some ADHD coaches and I just felt
like they struck me as just a little bit more superficial and

(37:09):
like more focused on tangible executive function kind of
things. And I didn't really trust that
that that would take me into a new place now because I had

(37:33):
already, I mean, I'm always working on myself.
So like I've done a lot of reading.
I, you know, I watch a lot of videos like I'm, I'm always
seeking, seeking. And I just didn't think that
that was going to be the whole the whole package that I really

(37:57):
needed, which was the combined autism and ADHD, which is such
an interesting combination, don't you think?
It it is. It's a beautiful combination
when you figure out how all the parts work and how they work
together. Yeah, Yeah, I think so.

(38:20):
I think so I and just as I'm talking to you, I'm realizing
now I'm like, oh, like I've really let go of the whole
pathological mindset about it. It's like, oh, I got to fix my
autism. I have to fix my ADHD.
And you know, I got to, I like constantly fighting it, you

(38:41):
know, right. Fighting against it and
everything. I'm like, wait a minute.
I don't really look at it that way anymore.
It's more like, oh, I have this beautiful, complex brain that
does amazing things, and maybe it doesn't do it the same way as

(39:06):
maybe the majority. I mean, I'm not going to try.
I'm not trying to like put neurotypicals down, but you
know, it's like, it's just different and I like it.
I like it that way. I, I wouldn't want to be any
other way. And I, I, hey, like accentuate

(39:29):
the, the, the pros and minimize the cons.
Isn't that what we're all doing?Like we want to bring out, bring
out the best in ourselves And, and you know, if there's, if
there is a con or a negative, then, you know, turn it into a

(39:51):
positive. I'm passionately curious about
it. Yeah, I'm just curious about it.
Yeah, it's not nearly as bad or negative, you know, as as you
might think. It just was a little dicey there

(40:11):
for a while because I didn't have any understanding.
And that's what's so sad and that's why I'm so thankful for
you. And I just wish that you could
be everywhere for everybody at because I'm thinking my poor
little self when I was growing up, you know, I just, I had a

(40:33):
very problematic family. It was a generational time
where, you know, people were homogenized.
Everyone had to be the same. You couldn't be different.
It was very bootstrappy. You know if you had an idea it

(40:54):
was poo pooed or dismissed or ifyou had a problem, I will get
over it or oh you brought that on yourself or whatever.
It was just a very no win situation.
And then when you pile on the complexity that autism, the

(41:17):
ADHD, when you pile that on and it's not being addressed, it's
like then you've got more traumajust from just from that, just
from from not feeling like you belong or knowing where you
belong or it's silences you makes you small.

(41:42):
Yeah. So, but now, I mean, I feel
really blessed because I feel like culture has changed.
We're very much more like a inclusive and that's I've had
that discussion with the employment officer today and he
was just amazing. I, I'm lucky, I live in Oregon

(42:04):
and we're, we're very inclusive minded and a lot, lots of people
working towards more harmony in that area.
And yeah, it doesn't have to be,oh, you know, she's autistic,
she's weird. We need to keep her over there
like, or we have to take care ofher because she can't take care
of herself, you know? Oh, hell no, Hell no, That's not

(42:29):
going to happen. So yeah, we we need to celebrate
all of our differences. And because everyone I feel has
something to offer when, when I listen, like when I whenever and
I are coaching groups, I'm listening to people.
I get so much just from just from listening to other

(42:50):
perspectives. What are other people going
through? How are they seeing the world?
How are they experiencing the world?
How are they responding to the world?
And I just wow, I just, I just feel like if this kind of

(43:11):
support was available for children in schools or things
like that, you know, because whoknows what, what their home
life, you know, and I can't fault parents.
I mean, my parents, I mean, again, you can't know
everything, but there are some who don't aren't really tuned

(43:32):
in. They just, they're doing their
thing. And you know, in some cases it's
understandable, but kids need help.
I mean, I would hate, I hate theidea of I hate the idea of of
someone else living where I lived.
I don't want that. No one should do that.

(43:55):
No one should go through that. I agree, Michelle, since you're
coming up on your one year anniversary and I'm so excited,
we're going to have a big celebration for that big moment.
Oh. Yeah, it's going to.
Be great. It's going to be so great.
What would you say is the one thing that this program offers

(44:17):
the unveiling method that nothing else does?
I mean, we've got alignment Sundays, we have Accelerate, you
know, we've got the rapid recharge left, we have all the
workshops throughout the year. But I mean, is that different
from any other program or anything that you've tried?

(44:38):
What's different? I think, and I haven't really
tried a whole lot of other programs, I mean.
I would have to say that this program really put me in the
driver's seat and I don't know if if other programs are like

(45:00):
that. I feel like most of the time,
and I'm speaking from a little bit limited experience, but most
of the time I feel like it's OK.I'm going to show you how to do
your life. You do these three things and
your life will be great, you know, and we'll help you do
those three things. This is a journey, it's a

(45:28):
discovery and it's showing you how to drive your own car.
Could not get out. I'm pushing.
I'm driving my own autistic car and it's good.

(45:48):
I thought it was making it an inside joke that we had a couple
weeks ago in our group session. I said OK, y'all have come up
with like the perfect analogy for what burnout is or how we
get there. And it's we've been driving the
car with the check engine light on for years.
All of a sudden the car finally dies.
We're surprised it dies, but we don't worry about that.
We get out and we push the Dang car.

(46:11):
Oh. God, I laughed so hard when I Oh
my Lord, that's our in our. Heels in our suit wherever we're
at. And then I love whatever,
whatever Adam Baylor's layered in.
And. And she's like, yeah.
And then you realized there was an owner's manual that told you
you should have changed the oil.Yes.
Right. Exactly.

(46:32):
Yes. He's like, that's like all the
neurotypical rules. Like everybody else knows,
you're supposed to do that, but we don't know it till we're
pushing the car. Right.
I tell you, this is so perfect, right it?
It's absolutely perfect. Oh God, I mean, I was, I was the
the perennial push through, you know, like never give up.

(46:54):
You know, just if it's not working, work harder.
You didn't do enough, you didn'twork fast enough or you didn't
do this. You didn't do that.
Michelle, if you had to like putyour put your hat on and really
like side by Just the big differences, the

(47:25):
things that really have made your life yours.
I'm not afraid to give myself what I need.

(47:49):
I'm not afraid. I'm not afraid to ask.
I'm not afraid. I'm just not afraid.
I'm not afraid to be me, and I'mnot afraid to ask scary

(48:10):
questions. Yeah, I would have to say that's
that's really that's really sitting at the core now, because
I think before there's this, I had this like tight fist of

(48:33):
control and I was afraid, you know, that if I didn't do AB and
C just perfectly, that I would fall apart.
And I found out that that is nottrue.
It's not true. You know, sometimes you tell
yourself things. That's why you have to keep

(48:53):
asking the questions. Like let's make sure.
Like I know you're thinking and feeling that right now, but
let's make sure because sometimes we, I, I feel like I
told myself things that no, that's, that's just what you
told yourself to, to make yourself feel safer.

(49:14):
Because isn't it's easy right tosay, Oh, well, if I just do AB
and C, I'll be fine. Like that's the easy, that's the
easy thing. It's easy to say it, but not
only is it hard to do, it's it doesn't it doesn't result in in
the outcomes that you're you're craving and wanting doesn't do

(49:37):
those things. All the things you thought were
keeping you safe are not keepingyou safe.
They're just holding you back. Oh, that, that was a big
awareness point when I recognized that too.
Michelle, you said something really important and I'd love to
unpack it a little bit. You said, now I know what I

(49:57):
need. But if I'd asked you a year ago,
Michelle, what do you need? What would you have told me?
Yeah, I probably would have saidI don't know.
Right. I was so bad.
I mean. That's I think what, what we all
say, I don't know. I don't know what I need.
But today when you ask yourself what do I need?

(50:19):
How do you know what you need? How do I know?
How do I know what I need Well?

(50:46):
I don't know. I just know because it feels
good. Like it feels good when I, when
I get that thing that I need, the autonomy, the zone of
safety, the optimum steady state.
Like when I have those things, Ican manage conflict.

(51:08):
I can feel more open and expansive about my future.
I can enjoy my little things that I like to do that make me
feel good. There's no angst, you know I.

(51:32):
Remember you sending me a message and then in one of our
groups and you were like that question, Carol Jean?
I've never asked it. Now I'm paying attention.
I'm asking myself, what do I need in this moment?
Yeah. And you were getting really
compassionately curious. Do you think that because you've

(51:54):
been curious enough to just pause for a minute and ask, what
do I need? And in the program, we've gone
through so many different ways for you to experience different
types of energy and things that you have a point of reference to
go, well, I don't know what I need, but I'm going to ask the
question and I'm kind of kind ofgo through the forms of rest and

(52:16):
we'll go through like, do it. Let me see if I breathe this
time, how does it affect me? And did those types of things
really help you so you could answer what do I need right now?
Oh, yeah, 100%. And I've noticed a change
because a year ago, even the smallest things I would have no

(52:37):
clue about like, and my husband said, oh, well, what movie do
you want to watch or what restaurant do you want to go to
or what do you want to do tonight or just little things
like that. I would just come up blank, you
know, like I just, and I, I realized that at least part of
it was just a lifetime of going along to get along.

(53:01):
Let's, let's do what this personwants because that's what they
want and let's make them happy. Let's make them feel good.
Let's, you know, let's do what they want or whatever, or let's
not make waves. Let's not get all complicated
about, you know, I know, I know I've done that to myself.

(53:22):
I can, I can remember thinking back, I have done that a lot and
some of it is just like, it's too hard.
I don't want to figure it out. It's just easier.
It's just easier to go along with whatever.
But now the program, I think it's just really given me the

(53:42):
safety that I needed to, to go ahead and ask and then it's OK
and I don't have to feel guilty and it's OK for me to have
needs. Everyone has needs.
Why are why are my needs, you know, down here?
And everyone else is what's what's up with that?
That's that's crazy pants. So now I, it's it's great

(54:10):
because now if someone asks me aquestion, I'll be like,
sometimes I know the answer right away and it's very clear
and precise. And then other times I'm like, I
don't know, let me get back to you.
I'm going to think about that for a minute.
Or, you know, whatever it might be, I just, I feel in control,

(54:34):
Like I can answer it the way I want to answer it.
And I, I get to be at the table with everyone else.
And if I don't look like everyone else, or if I'm not
doing what everyone else is doing, So what?

(54:54):
So what? I mean, if it's that much of a
problem. Those two words are pretty
powerful. So what?
Yeah, yeah. I mean, if you don't like
hanging out with me, then go hang out with somebody else.
Yeah, I mean, we, we've been through a year of all kinds of

(55:15):
things together from family changes, friend changes, animal
changes, all of this stuff. And we we came into the room
together and we were back in thegreen room talking before we hit
record today. You were sharing with me your
experience on Monday, and you were just describing how it

(55:38):
felt. And I said, Michelle, do you
know what that is? You're like what, Carol Jean,
what, what are you feeling now? What is the experience in your
life? Because we heard what, what you,
what you felt like, what you were saying there.

(56:00):
All the arrows were coming at you.
Everything was going out. Nothing was coming in.
And you were just overwhelmed and it just didn't feel good.
You had flames drawing some big flames.
If you were mad. I mean, I, I, I did that.
What, what do you write and draw?
What do you feel today? Oh, I just have such an enormous

(56:30):
gratitude, just the deepest gratitude that that I've ever
had in my life. I, I've learned how to, how to

(56:52):
love myself. I never knew how to do that.
Now I do and it feels great. It feels marvelous, darling.

(57:15):
I mean, sometimes, you know, youpeople, there's people in your
life that like kind of give you the impression that you know,
somehow you don't deserve those things for whatever reason.
And that's unfortunate. That's really unfortunate.

(57:35):
So, but you know, I've had my experience with you to show me
something new. So just really, I'm feeling
really, really grateful right now and just, I feel, I don't

(58:03):
know, it's this weird calm and peace, like whatever comes, I'm
good. I'm still me.
The core is good. The core is good, really good.
So whatever else happens out there is just that's what

(58:25):
happens and. A year ago, when you started
Foundation Builder, could you imagine that you would even
experience or feel the way you feel today?
Did you think or know that this was possible?

(58:47):
Hell no, I don't know. Absolutely not.
I, I thought, oh, I'm finally going to like get my shit
together. You know, like I feel like
having my executive function under control.
I was like, it was all about lining in myself up, right?
Like get yourself in line, you know, get yourself together.

(59:09):
You know, it was, it was all of that bootstrapping and whip
crack. Oh my God, I was such a whip
cracker on yourself thing right now, because it was just
completely and utterly ludicroushow whip cracking I was and but
you know, I I've I did the work,I did the reflection, I

(59:33):
connected the dots and I figuredout, Oh, that's why I think like
that and that's why I treat myself that way and it you know
it, but it's all good. It's like I, I addressed it, I
went back and fixed it. And if I had not gone through

(59:54):
all of that trauma, I wouldn't be sitting here with you having
this lovely conversation. Yeah.
So now you know one of the questions I asked you when I
said, Michelle, do you know whatthis is?
And I said, and you said, no, what is it?
And I said, this is self with a capital S This is you

(01:00:18):
experiencing peace and being in your personal power.
That's just gold. And that is something now that

(01:00:39):
you've experienced, now that youclaimed it, because you did,
it's been yours the whole time it's been there.
The whole time. It's been inside of you covered
up. Do you feel like that this was a
process to go through the unveiling method And I, I think
I named it pretty well. I mean, you let me know.

(01:01:03):
It's so funny you say that because I've several times this
week I've been thinking, you know, that is such a good name
for this program. I am totally I I unveiling yes,
and it's a lifetime process likeand now I'm like all excited.
What else am I going to unveil? Like I'm all hooked, I'm all

(01:01:28):
hooked. I'm.
Hooked. I'll tell you 5, five years out
because November 2019 was when Igot into that place of
sustainable energy where I was out of burnout.
I was not shutting down, I was not melting down, and it was
consistent and I felt good consistently.

(01:01:49):
And I will tell you that when you describe to me back in the
green room how you were feeling and what you were, how you were
just experiencing your day on Monday, and I was hearing your
words and I was remembering. I remember when I started to

(01:02:09):
feel that way. And I asked you, Michelle, how's
your sleep? Yeah.
How's your sleep, Michelle? Yeah, well, I don't know.
For everyone listening, I struggle with sleep.
You know, for a long time I was like getting up at 2:00 in the

(01:02:33):
morning and it was awful, just awful.
Like I had no trouble falling asleep.
I could just couldn't stay asleep.
And now I'm consistently gettingat least six hours with maybe 1
interruption. But I would have to say that
more, more and more, it's more like 6 1/2 seven.

(01:02:58):
It's like creeping up to get a little bit longer, a little bit
longer and I feel like even lastnight I think I I hit 8 hours
so. What I loved is when I asked
you, I was like, and you were like, huh, hang on.
And you started to think about it and I was like, it'll creep
in. Is it creep?
Is it creeping in yet? You're like, Oh my gosh, it's

(01:03:20):
creeping. It is creeping.
That's. That's how it happens.
I mean, sleeps the first thing to go offline.
It's the last thing to come backonline when you're out of
burnout. How exciting does that feel
because you were a Habanero 4? In a high.
Degree of heat? Yeah, a year ago.

(01:03:42):
Yeah, it's, I don't know if it'stime blindness or what, but that
just seems so long ago now and. You're a whole.
New woman I am. I am a completely different.
I'm like, I'm just, I'm a whole new animal.
All right, so I'm going to ask the question that I asked myself

(01:04:03):
when I got to this place. Michelle, do you like you now?
I love me. That's even better.
You know, you know what? I'm so funny that you say that
because I've noticed in the last, I'd say two or three weeks
now, every once in a while in mythoughts and in my ruminations

(01:04:25):
or whatever, I find myself saying I like myself and I'm
looking in the mirror and I'm going I like you.
And I've been in, it's been showing up in my journals and
I'm bit and I've been very specific to like, I like certain
things, like I like this about me or whatever.

(01:04:47):
And I just listing it off and itwhen it happened, it was so
natural and it was just so free because in the beginning, Oh my
God, I just could not do it. Oh, when you started reflection
work? Oh God, Oh God, Carol, it's.
Painful, right? I had this.

(01:05:10):
One journey, everybody's mad at me when they all get to that
first one. What's that?
Everybody gets mad at me when they get to reflection work in
in the self-care plan from the inside out.
They're like Carol. Jake, this is horrible.
Oh, yeah, no, I there's just, I remember feeling that hard

(01:05:31):
resistance, really hard. Like I had this one journal that
was that it was like a it had questions in it and it's
supposed to help you like yourself or something.
And, and I just had so much resistance and like, even if,

(01:05:52):
even if I managed to write something down positive about
myself, it did not feel good. It just felt contrived and
forced and whatever. But you know, I'm going to be
honest, Carol, I was at at a level 4 habanero.
I was so desperate. I was like, I'm, I'm doing

(01:06:15):
everything I need to do to get out of this.
This is terrible. And I did the reflection work
for a week and I noticed a smallshift and then I moved on to
other things because I'm ADHD. But you know that default mode
network, it never stops. And I'm telling you, when the

(01:06:38):
time was right, it just came up and it just started rolling off.
And I was like, wow, this is different.
I didn't even have to. I didn't have to tell myself to
do it. I didn't feel resistance.
I didn't feel yucky. I it just was, Yeah, girl, not

(01:07:05):
in a ugly, prideful way either. It was just genuine, you know,
like joyful. Joyful.
As if like how I would love someone else you know so.
What I really have loved watching in your journey has
been that you really embraced the process when I said, listen,

(01:07:28):
you don't even have to do anything.
And I think you like, I think I broke your brain for a minute
when I said, Michelle, you don'thave to do anything.
If you get to the module or you get to this workbook and all you
do is just look at it and you look at it in a couple of
chunks. You don't have to do anything.
It's already doing its work. And when you're ready, it'll

(01:07:51):
show up. And you looked at me like I had
just sprung a third eye and turned colors.
I will not forget that. Carol Jean, you have definitely
broken my brain. Couple of times, but not in bad
ways, in fun ways, right? Oh no.

(01:08:11):
Oh no, absolutely not. No.
Do you feel like this has been from the beginning?
Because to me, this is really important.
And so I asked this question because I want to know what your
experience has been. My intention with this is that
you have known from the beginning, whether you believed

(01:08:32):
it yet or not, but you, you knowit and you begin to see it that
this is your life. You're the leader.
And through the whole entire process, did you feel like you
were in charge of what you did and how you did it?

(01:08:54):
Yeah, yeah, I really did. And now that you say that, that.
Oh OK, I get. That now I just break your brain
again. You broke my brain because I'm
like, oh guess what? My PDA didn't activate right?

(01:09:17):
Oh no, I was totally committed. I and, and also, but also not
guilty either. Like if for some reason I didn't
get enough work done or what I thought I should have got done,
I didn't have any guilt. And you know, I, I just thought

(01:09:37):
I've already done so much and I've already gotten like 1000
times more back and I know that I won't drop it.
I, I didn't, I trusted because sometimes I get a little leery
because I'm like, oh God, is this, am I going to fall off the
wagon and not finish or, you know, drop some ball or

(01:09:59):
something? I'm like, no, I was just like,
hell no, girl, that ain't going to happen.
It it's. I remember you asking yourself,
like, you were sharing that and you were like, I'm scared that
I'll fall off the wagon and thenyou like, inertia will kick in.
And if I don't keep doing this, then I'm not going to do it.
I'm going to forget about it. No, it just felt so natural.

(01:10:25):
And I, yeah, I totally felt in control.
I felt in complete control. I could do it as much or as
little however I wanted like. And look.
Didn't feel overwhelming becauseI, I just thought, well, you
know, I'll, when I'm ready to receive it, I'll receive it and,

(01:10:49):
and I can do you know, that comethrough it again.
Right. But so do you now trust that you
will still get where you're going and look, you got even
further than where you thought you would be?
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, I got way further I.
Think I remember in office hourswhen I had sent the message out

(01:11:10):
that said you don't have to havedone anything.
I don't care if you looked at this module, I don't care if you
did this workshop. Just show up.
Just show up for you. You don't have to do anything.
And I think when that happened, I remember you getting on the
call and you said thank you for giving me permission, for me to
give myself permission. Like right you.

(01:11:33):
Were like, thank you for helpingme give myself permission
because you were like, I wasn't going to show up because I
hadn't done anything. That was real early on.
That was like August. Yeah, I, I, to be honest, I, I
wouldn't have missed. I don't think I I would ever met

(01:11:54):
I if except for that one time I chose Dairy Queen over you,
Carol. I was so proud of you for
choosing Dairy Queen over me too, because that was a big
moment. When you sent me that e-mail, it
just made my heart so happy. It was so funny because I was
like, how did I let that happen?Like I clearly I needed the rest

(01:12:16):
and the recharge and the pause and and it was just great
because I didn't even realize ittill the next morning.
And then I was like, that's OK. I, I clearly I chose what I
needed for that moment. And it wasn't, it wasn't a,
there was no angst around it or anything.
It was no. Shame Storm, you were actually

(01:12:38):
excited about doing it, and I loved that.
I just and it was just such a serendipity thing.
It was so hilarious because I had been thinking about it.
My husband, I said, I really don't want to cook dinner.
I want to go to Dairy Queen and get a Oreo Blizzard.
Like it was just a very clear idea.
Like I knew specifically what I wanted.
And then he came down and he's like, hey, do you want to be

(01:13:02):
naughty? Do you want to like go to Dairy
Queen or something? And I was like, hey, you've been
in my brain. You see, like I am down for
that. I would never go very clean.
How did the How did he know I was thinking, 'cause I hadn't
said it out loud. I swear I have I'm.
Telling you your thoughts have great power.
They do. They really Do.

(01:13:24):
They really. Do I'm still trying to figure it
out like wait what? They really do, Michelle, as we
wrap. Up.
For whoever's listening today, and maybe they're in that place
where they feel like all the arrows are coming at them.
Maybe they're feeling the rage and all of the things you were
feeling this time last year. What do you want them to know

(01:13:50):
about what's possible? What's important from your heart
to theirs right now? Things aren't always as they
seem. Try not to immediately go to

(01:14:15):
that judgement that all is lost,that despair.
It's a terrible feeling. It's just, you know, and, and
it's like, I just know that feeling every day after day,
like, oh God, am I going to crash again?
Am I going to fail again or how am I ever going to get out of

(01:14:39):
this hole? When am I ever going to do
anything good in my life and just sit with it?
Just sit with it because I really do.
I really do think so. Whatever your body and your mind

(01:15:03):
is trying to tell you in that moment, it's important.
You should give it attention. Just listen.
Don't try to solve it, you know,don't even try to know.
Know it completely. Just be in it.
Be in that moment and feel it and know that you're safe.

(01:15:30):
You're safe. It's OK to be down.
It's OK to be burned out. You will.
You will figure it out. You just have to be quiet and
let it happen. Because I tell you what, Trying

(01:15:51):
to fight your way out? No, that's that takes energy,
fighting takes energy and it's just not energy well spent.
So it's interesting it, it seemsso simple, but at least in my

(01:16:17):
experience, I know every time I've done that for myself, when,
because I have, I still sometimes will go into that,
that dark cave of Oh my God. But now, now I am aware of it
and I'm like, oh, OK, it's cave time.

(01:16:37):
And it's not as scary. It's just, it's like, oh, OK, so
that's so there's some negative things here or there's some
things that don't feel right, ormaybe there's some fear, maybe
there's some anxiety. Let's experience that.
Let's find out what we can aboutthat.

(01:16:58):
Ask questions, but be kind, be kind.
I, I heard this, there was this trauma therapist I listened to
once and she was like, when she does her journaling, like, if

(01:17:19):
you like yourself, be kind. If you don't like yourself, be
kinder. And I just thought that was such
a nice overlap with what we learn in this program.
You know, it's such a simple thing, but for some reason, I

(01:17:40):
feel like somehow we end up denying ourselves.
Somehow we end up denying our own selves the kindness that we
would give to others in a heartbeat.
And you know what? Life is up and down.
It is up and down. So who's to say the down doesn't

(01:18:08):
have as much for you to learn asthe?
Well, you have witnessed my ups and my downs.
This year, yeah, yeah, you've had just had tornadoes, You had
the the putts that. Yep.
Kind of activated again. Yeah, yeah.

(01:18:30):
I don't know that's, but that was exactly what you just.
Shared. I did it with the unveiling
method. I did it with the same things
that you've learned this year, and I did it with our accelerate
circle. I showed up and I shared with

(01:18:52):
y'all. We have such a, we have such a
good. Group, we do, we do.
It's so it's such a special space.
It really, really is. I love it.
I do too. I miss it when, when we have,
you know, things going on or we don't have something that week.
I I definitely miss it. I miss you all.

(01:19:13):
Michelle, what's next for you? What are you dreaming?
Because you know, that was one of the things you shared when we
got on the call today and you'relike, Oh, I just, I was just
noticing the rhythm of the car and I was like, you know what
that is, right? You're like, no girl, Gene, what
is that? I was like, you're in the
present moment, remember? And you're just like, whoa, not

(01:19:38):
living in the past, not living in the future, living in the
present moment because it's in the present moment where we
create. So now that you're in the
present moment, you know what that feels like?
You are in the power of the present moment.
What is your heart calling you to create next?

(01:20:05):
Well, I'd love to create safe spaces for other people.
I, I've got like the heavy life stuff, you know, like get a job,

(01:20:33):
get out of debt, save up for retirement, all of that.
Like I get that, but in my heart, I sort of feel like
trying to, to knock that out directly is, is not going to be
the way. I feel like there's another path

(01:20:55):
to get there and it's going to involve.
It's going to involve letting goof of some more fear, fear of

(01:21:23):
fear of, I don't know, the brainis amazing how how it can
generate fear. It's just, I have so many
questions around that, like how can you be afraid of so many
things that haven't even happened?
You don't even know what happened, but you're still
afraid of them? I want to let that go, let that

(01:21:53):
fear just not necessarily disappear, but just have less
importance. And I want my dream.
Yeah, Yeah, that's it. I want the kind.
Of I mean dangerous snake is a good healthy fear it serves.

(01:22:16):
Us, right, Right. Yeah.
But only if we're in the presence of it, right?
So we have that differentiator. I see where you're going with
this. Yeah.
It's it's just, it's like, I don't know what the next thing

(01:22:37):
is necessarily, but I have this like sort of, I don't.
Think you do? Feeling like it's going to be
amazing, you know, like I'm justalmost too amazing, you know
what I mean? Like it's just kind of fluttery
and and sparkly and I just. That's that self energy, that

(01:23:00):
present moment, that personal power of creation.
Because the first thing you saidwas I want to create safe spaces
for other people. Yeah.
I can't wait for us to have our Thrive destination statement.
Oh my God, I can't wait. Flush them together.

(01:23:22):
That's going to be really fun because that's going to take
what you just shared, put it together in this really
beautiful statement that you canstart crafting and sharing
really feeling into. Yeah, so.
That's process. You said it.
That's exactly what's next for me is really drilling down into

(01:23:47):
that. My first my first Thrive
destination statement was thingsjust saw her and I just AM.
It's a good. Place to start?
I think I reached that. Things just are and I just am.
So boom, time for a new one. Look what you.
Created. Look what you created, though.

(01:24:08):
I know you set the intention That, my friend, is powerful.
Thank you so much for agreeing to come on and share your
journey, your experiences, and some of those really, you know,
sometimes tender moments along the way with everyone today

(01:24:29):
because I know that that's something that I would have
liked to have heard. Yeah, yeah.
Oh God, yeah. I'm thrilled Beyond thrill,
beyond words to to be in this conversation with you, Owen.

(01:24:50):
It was not a hard decision to make at all.
I was honored is. This to your friends.
Oh God, I yes I would. I would.
I would recommend it to school districts and I think we need it

(01:25:11):
everywhere. Strangers on the street,
perhaps? Yeah, yeah.
Hey, you, you want to be in the unfailing method?
Come on. Michelle, thank you for being
here. Thank you for sharing your
heart, sharing your journey. Thank you, Carol.

(01:25:32):
And really standing here proverbially in this moment with
you is it means so much to me because from a personal
standpoint, we are living my Thrive destination statement and

(01:25:57):
to have you in that is just the most incredible blessing and
gift in my life. Thank you.
Oh, Carol, I'm just sitting in that.

(01:26:21):
Me too. I'm I, I OK, I'm going to draw.
I'm going to make a picture for you.
So here's the picture. You and I are at the top of a
mountain sitting down and we have our and we're looking out
on the Vista and we're we have our arms around each other and

(01:26:44):
we're just checking it out. Yeah, we're taking a moment to
pause and appreciate the rare air at the top of the mountain.
Yeah, yeah. And as we enjoy it, as we settle
into it, as we fully receive what it feels like to be here,

(01:27:13):
that beautiful sparkle comes andthat excitement of creation
comes, and we laugh and we look at each other and we go, Now
which one's the next one? Yeah, Lookout world.
What? Looks fun, right?

(01:27:36):
Thank you for that. Yeah, yeah, I.
Think a year of meditations. Is I don't quite have the words
for this, they said. This is a very tender, just a
very tender feeling. I don't quite have the words.

(01:27:58):
That's all. Right, that the words, I,
there's probably a word out there, but I, I don't know what
that is yet. It has to be a very special
word, obviously. Well, if anybody comes up with a

(01:28:18):
really great word, it'll be you.You come up with really good
ones. I'll search high and low.
Nah, the DMN is going to deliverit while you're in the bath.
There you go, hot dog. That's a fact.

(01:28:38):
I love default network DMN. Is that what we're calling it?
I love that thing. Oh God.
It is. It's a it is like the most
underutilized part of our brain other than BDNF, brain derived
neurotropic factor. Oh, OK, Whoa.

(01:29:01):
We'll play around with that one.It'll be fun.
We're always doing a little science, little experiment, a
little play, a little heart. We we kind of.
Roll it all in, don't we? Oh, I love it.
I love it because you never know, right?
You just have to track things. We don't we we show up and we

(01:29:23):
just see where it takes us everyweek.
Yeah, yeah. It's a a journey, sometimes a
surprise, always an adventure. Yeah.
Yeah. And we always get to know who we
are a little more. Yeah, yeah.

(01:29:44):
But I mean, there's always more to know.
Always, thank God, because otherwise, I mean, what a sad
thing come to the end. Yeah, right.
It's never boring. And you know what I love is that
we get to learn more about each other, too.
Yeah. And our, our support, our

(01:30:06):
network, our our friendships arealways growing and developing
too, which is very nice. I really love that.
Yeah, we have our net. Nobody falls off the trapeze
without all four corners. There she goes.

(01:30:29):
We got you. Don't worry, don't worry.
That's so true. I feel like there's plenty of
elbow room and plenty of room tostumble and it it's totally
safe. Feels good.
Jump as high as you want, the net will catch you.
It's all good that. Is so true.
What a fantastic to do. Some trust falls.

(01:30:52):
Yeah, yeah, that's it. Trust falling.
Time to trust fall. I love it.
Oh, Michelle, thank you so much for being here.
This is this was so wonderful. And if you've heard Michelle's
story, if this has spoken to your heart, if you're in that
place where you're just like, OK, I'm done.

(01:31:12):
I have got I want to do something.
I want to change the way I feel.Reach out got a lot of different
options and the unveiling methodis here to be of service to you.
Do not let financial constraintsbe the reason that you don't

(01:31:33):
reach out. We've started the scholarship
fund and we've got a lot of options and a lot of supports to
meet you where you are. Do not ever let that be a
reason. Michelle has supported a
scholarship because she's in theaccelerate circle.
So thank you, Michelle. Wow, right?

(01:31:53):
Wow. Michelle's story is such a
powerful reminder that burnout recovery doesn't come from
surface level fixes. It comes from creating safety,
clarity and practices that trulyfit who you are.
And if you're wondering where you are on your burnout journey

(01:32:14):
right now, don't guess. Assess Take the free Spicy
Pepper Burnout Quiz today and you'll get your very first
custom audio guided designed foryour unique burnout level.
Get started at Whittington wellbeing.com or grab the link
in the show notes. And be sure to join me again

(01:32:35):
tomorrow because Alice is here to share the radical step.
And she wasn't so sure about this when I suggested it, but
it's such a great experience. But the radical step that she
took that completely changed herburnout recovery journey.
And I mean, it was the breakthrough moment.
Trust me, you don't want to missthis one.

(01:32:56):
It might be exactly what you need right now.
Until then, remember, redefine unmasking, reclaim your comfort
zone and restore your optimum steady state.
And do it with support and community here with us on Beyond
Chronic Burnout. Be sure to subscribe and set the
notification bell so you don't miss Alice's story and insights

(01:33:20):
tomorrow and all the goodness wehave coming up next week in our
self-care September series. See you then.
It's been quiet. All right.
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(01:33:44):
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