A Comprehensive Guide to Using Cannabis for Your Pet with Dr. Casara Andre

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Curious whether cannabis can actually help your dog or cat—and how to do it without risking a scary night of wobbling and worry? I sit down with veterinarian Dr. Casara Andre to unpack a safe, practical roadmap for pet parents who want evidence-based guidance, not guesswork. From the endocannabinoid system’s (ECS) role in pain, mood, and balance to the real differences between THC and CBD in animals, this conversation translates complex science into clear steps you can use today.

We explore why dosing isn’t simply about body weight, how biphasic effects make more a potential problem, and why journaling sleep, appetite, mobility, and reactivity is the secret to finding the minimum effective dose. You’ll learn how to choose products that won’t backfire, what a trustworthy certificate of analysis looks like, how to interpret “full spectrum” vs “broad spectrum,” and why a CBD-dominant plant extract with trace THC is often a sensible starting point. We also dig into the overlooked MVPs: CBDA for GI inflammation and nausea, CBG for muscle relaxation and seizure support, and terpene profiles that nudge outcomes toward calm or clarity.

If this helped you or someone you love with a furry friend, subscribe, share the episode, and leave a review. Discover more about Dr. Casara Andre and her work at Veterinary Cannabis. 

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Episode Transcript

SPEAKER_00 (03:16):
What happens when you take a love of food, a
passion for culture, and a deepknowledge of cannabis and you
toss them into one bowl?
You get Bite Meat, the podcastthat explores the intersection
of food, culture, and cannabisand helps cooks make great
edibles at home.
I'm your host, Margaret, acertified Gangier, TCI certified
cannabis educator, and I believeyour kitchen is the best
dispensary you'll ever have.

(03:38):
Together we'll explore thestories, the science, and the
sheer joy of making safe,effective, and unforgettable
edibles at home and for lessmoney.
So preheat your oven and getready for a great episode.
Now, today I am very excited tointroduce to you Dr.
Cassara Andre.
She is a veterinarian byeducation and training and is

(03:59):
committed to providingveterinary practitioners, animal
caregivers, and the emergingcannabis industry with a
science-backed, clinicallyapplicable, patient-focused
education on the safe use ofcannabis and animals.
And it is a wealth ofinformation that distills that
knowledge in a clear and conciseway.
And we cover everything you needto know to use cannabis safely

(04:21):
and effectively for your belovedfurry friends.
Like how to choose the rightproducts, safe dosing protocols,
the animal ECS, and knowing thesigns of cannabis toxicity in
animals.
If you have pets, this episodeis for you.
And without making you wait anylonger, please enjoy this
conversation with Dr.
Cassara Andre.

(04:46):
So we're live, and I'm verythrilled to be joined today by
Dr.
Cassara Andre.
And I was just hoping before weget started, if you could tell
the listeners of ByteMe a littlebit about yourself and your
cannabis journey and whatbrought you here today.

SPEAKER_01 (05:00):
Absolutely.
Well, thank you.
I'm thrilled to be here.
Um, definitely a fan of yourwork and excited to interface
with your audience.
It's always a pleasure to havequestions about pet safety come
our way.
Love to answer those type ofconversations.
Um yeah, I am a practicingveterinarian in Colorado, which
is out of the United States.
And I have to say that probablythat is what has put me into a

(05:23):
lot of these emerging markets,both on the cannabis side.
Now we're doing a lot of workwith the psychedelic side.
So, what has sort of been neededby the patients around us?
What is the patient need?
Where is our need for harmreduction?
What's the community need frommy colleagues as veterinarians?
Um, when Colorado changed someof our cannabis policies as the

(05:44):
veterinary community, we werefaced with what are we supposed
to do about this?
How do we respond?
How do we give guidance to ourto our pet parents?
So I have to say that it's justbeen a privilege to watch some
of these markets emerge over thepast couple of years and to
hopefully be a really effectivevoice at advocating for animal
safety in the midst of that, butthen also really bringing

(06:05):
questions about what can we dofrom a therapeutic side as well.

SPEAKER_00 (06:07):
Yeah, and that's sort of why I wanted to have you
on today, because I definitelyhave a lot of listeners who have
pets of their own and are verycurious about how they can best
use these compounds to help themin their own health journeys for
their pets.
But there's a lot of confusionaround it.
But before we get into somethingmore specific, you mentioned
that you uh the cannabis, ofcourse, and the psychedelic

(06:29):
medicine for animals.
And that's something that I'mnot really familiar with.
Can you talk a little bit aboutthat and what that looks like in
your practice?

SPEAKER_01 (06:36):
Yes, but I'll be careful because I could talk
about this for hours and hoursand hours.
So you'll have to stop me, butI'll keep it short.
Um again, animals are exposed towhatever we're interested in.
And thus, less questions fromyour listeners about can what
I've experienced from cannabisbe extrapolated to my animal, or

(06:57):
how should I be safe?
And so, really, we see whateverhumans are interested in, the
animals that are adjacent to usthat share our homes, our
families, our relationships, ourchoices, that they're affected
by that as well.
And particularly on thepsychedelic medicine side, it is
the same risks that we see fromcannabis, accidental ingestion,

(07:17):
malicious ingestion, umtherapeutic ingestion.
But particularly inpsychedelics, we see human
adjacent harm happening.
So as the human works withpsychedelics, if particularly if
there's a really strong bond tothe animal that's next to them,
you're affecting that animal insome really important ways that
we need to think about.
And definitely in my practice,we see incidences of harm.

(07:38):
Fortunately, cannabis gives us alot more clinical breadth to
work with.
All the molecules are prettysafe in terms of toxicity, as
long as you're working withplant-based materials.
Once you get into thesynthetics, even on the cannabis
side, we start to have a lotmore concerns.
So I'll I'll pause there, buthappy to elaborate in this or

(07:59):
future conversations.
It's definitely a fascinatingarea of science and definitely a
fascinating area of medicine.

SPEAKER_00 (08:05):
Yeah, that is very fascinating because I wasn't
even aware that some people werepotentially using psychedelics
in their for the health of theirpets.
And I'm sure that's a that couldbe an entire separate episode.
So I will definitely bookmarkthat because we may need to come
back to that at another time.
Now, your website also mentionsthat you focus on trauma-related

(08:26):
emotional disease in animals,especially when it comes to
canine PTSD.
How does cannabis play a role inyour trauma-aware, family unit
focused approach to treatment?

SPEAKER_01 (08:39):
Again, what a lovely question.
I it's something that I reallylove to chat about because I
think trauma-informed,trauma-aware veterinary care is
just beginning to come into ourindustry just as it begins to
broach human medicine and ourawareness of really needing to
care for nervous systems thathave been have received trauma

(09:00):
in a particular way.
And uh my background, my earlycareer was in the military.
I was a veterinarian for the USArmy Veterinary Corps, and so my
association with canine PTSD andhuman PTSD, and particularly the
intersection of those two andhow cross-species, interspecies

(09:20):
interaction affects both ofthose diseases in each species
has been part of my career for along time.
So that's really the basis of alot of why my work started down
that avenue.
But with cannabis in particular,we're working on the
endocannabinoid system.
And that system is responsiblefor balancing everything from

(09:41):
the somatic body to theautonomic nervous system to the
emotional body.
And so when we're dealing with atrauma-based case, just giving
the endocannabinoid system timeto heal and the endocannabinoid
system time to help that bodyregulate in its own time frame
is really, really core to that.
So I think that would be theeasiest way to describe that

(10:02):
work is helping the body heal inthe way that it wants to in the
time that it needs.
And cannabis gives us a reallygentle way to do that in a in a
method that's very clinicallyapplicable.

SPEAKER_00 (10:14):
And of course, you're always referring to pets
as we talk about this because itsounds very similar to what we
humans need as well.
So and I find it reallyinteresting that you mentioned,
like, I guess the bond betweenthe pet owner and the pet and
how much that can affect theirhealing.
And I find that reallyfascinating.
I mean, maybe it's notsurprising as someone who has

(10:35):
owned pets.
I don't have one right now, butyeah, that bond is pretty
special.

SPEAKER_01 (10:39):
And it's absolutely yeah, it's really interesting
that you touch on that.
But now yes, I I will just put apoint in clarification.
I am speaking about the animaljust from my perspective as a
veterinarian, but most of myclinical practice is in
interspecies medicine.
So an animal adjacent to a humanthat is healing from PTSD or an
emotional disorder, the pet'sendocannabinoid system does more

(11:05):
physiologic work to help theirhuman ground be regulated.
Does that make sense?
And again, you know, anotherhuge and fun conversation, but
just really being aware thatthat human-animal bond has
weight and physiologic work onboth sides.
If you've ever had an animalthat's a bit stressed out, you
know that it stresses you out.

(11:25):
Right.
Reverse also happens too.

SPEAKER_00 (11:27):
Yeah.
Okay.
Um, now you did already touch alittle bit on the
endocannabinoid system or theECS in humans.
And I think most of ourlisteners will probably be aware
that animals have an ECS aswell, but I'm sure it's
different.
Maybe you can just talk a littlebit about the ECS in animals.

SPEAKER_01 (11:46):
Yes.
Well, I am excited about thefact that your phrasing of that
question tells us we've come sofar.
I think that I would say it'sexciting that we think about
there being an ECS in humans andanimals as a core concept of
medicine.
And that was not true 10 yearsago, five years ago.
And so just to see that in ourconversations is amazing.

(12:11):
Us recognizing that there is asystem, endocannabinoid system
is so important in all medicalpractices, what no matter which
species you're dealing with,because an endocannabinoid
system of some form is in everyanimal that has a spine, so
vertebrates.
And they're all gonna be alittle bit different, but
they're similar enough so far aswe know, that we can make some

(12:32):
clinical extrapolations fromthat.
And why cannabis in uhveterinary species is
interesting is because they'remammals.
And so we know a lot about thehuman's ECS, so we can actually
extrapolate a lot fromhuman-based research to say,
well, how must this also applyto our companion animals, um,
even some of our uh like foodanimals, farm animals, because

(12:55):
they are mammals as well.
Their ECS is actually really,really similar.
We can see differences.
Dogs, for example, have a lotmore CB1 receptors, one of the
receptors within the ECS intheir cerebellum, and that's why
they get a very particular formof intoxication, but it's really
similar.
And so it's you really usefulfor us to extrapolate from

(13:15):
human-based research into ouranimal patients.

SPEAKER_00 (13:18):
And so, because some of those receptors, as well,
like you mentioned in dogs, thatthey have different, like more
CB1 receptors, does that meanthat a lot of the cannabis
cannabinoids like CBD or THCwill affect them very
differently than they would?
They're human owners.

SPEAKER_01 (13:33):
I would say more strongly and more potential for
a particular type ofintoxication.
So from the therapeutic side,clinical side, we are working
with really low doses and beingreally careful about how much we
administer and going reallyslowly.
So we can be pretty close towhat we know from the human
side.
But just as an example, dogshave a lot of CB1 receptors in

(13:54):
their cerebellum, and thecerebellum is what gives you
your balance and yourcoordination.
And so dogs get a veryparticular form of ataxia, it's
called static ataxia.
Um, and they're just miserable,they're just sort of standing
there, not able to move, kind ofswaying back and forth.
And so it is an intoxicationlike a human would experience,
but because those receptors arevery prominent on the

(14:17):
cerebellum, they're not able,they have a different form of an
um incoordination.

SPEAKER_00 (14:21):
Right.
And anybody who's ever seen adog overdose, unfortunately, on
cannabis, has probably seenthat.
But yeah, I didn't realize,obviously, I'm sure a lot of
listeners didn't realize eitherthat that affected their balance
so much.
Because I have seen pets wherethey've been accidentally dosed
and yeah, they're definitely notsteady on their feet.

(14:42):
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
That doesn't sound like a goodtime.
It sounds like when someone'shad too much to drink and you're
at that point where you can'tstand up straight, and that's
not a fun time.

SPEAKER_01 (14:51):
So or you know, as I see on your website, some of
your information about thebrownies that you didn't exactly
know how much was in there.
So again, that same concept, butalso the animal didn't know.
The animal didn't consent toeating the thing.
And so there's also that aspectof just not being aware of
what's going on that adds tothat confusion as well.

SPEAKER_00 (15:11):
I can I can totally imagine that.
Now, for pet owners who are kindof new to the idea of dosing
their pets with CBD or THC, canyou talk about why it's under
important to understand thedistinctions between the two?
Because I've always heard, youknow, dogs are they don't
tolerate THC, but I don't alwaysunderstand why.

(15:32):
Can they tolerate any of it?
Like maybe you can just touch onsome of that.

SPEAKER_01 (15:36):
Great question.
Importantly, the reason to knowthe difference between the
molecules is because they havereally different physiologic
effects.
The CBD molecule has verydifferent effects in the body
than THC.
And when in combination, there'salso going to be a different
effect there.
Our medical director uh likes tosay it's one pharmacology.
If you have different ratios ofall the molecules, you're still

(15:57):
putting it into the body at thesame time.
And the effects of the body aregoing to be relevant to what
molecules you actually put in.
So the molecules themselves arereally different, and we want to
make sure that the protocol thatwe're putting into the animal,
the molecular profile design,matches what that body needs.
For example, if we have acondition that needs a lot of

(16:19):
THC, the animal is going to beokay.
They're not going to get thatintoxication effect from even
high amounts of THC.
But if they don't need it andthey get too much THC, they're
going to have a really, really,really miserable night, really
miserable day.
So it's more about understandingwhat that animal's physiology
needs, what is the state oftheir endocannabinoid system,

(16:42):
and what are we trying to do?
How are we trying to supportthem?
What's the clinical goal thatwe're trying to get to there?

SPEAKER_00 (16:48):
So for most people then, if they decide that their
pet is perhaps aging and justhave a lot of aches and pains
and stuff, when would how wouldthey determine whether or not
they should give them THC orjust stick to CBD?

SPEAKER_01 (17:02):
Again, great question.
I would back that up and say, Iwould I guide my clients to
start with a plant extract.
And so plant extracts, like asclose to the natural form as you
can get, is gonna have a littlebit of THC.
So that is going to be as longas you start low, we're gonna
still start very, very small andvery, very slow.

(17:22):
That's gonna be safe for mostanimals as long as you don't
have other concurrentconditions, other medications
that are on board.
So it's not about avoiding THC.
It's about making sure that youhave a really clean product and
are starting as low as youpossibly can, and then very
carefully and honestlyevaluating the animal's response
to it because they can't tellus.

(17:44):
Our ability to observe how theyrespond to that and also give
them the option to opt in or outis really important how we work
with some of those ideas andanimals.

SPEAKER_00 (17:55):
So that so basically the observation is a key point.
And as always, start low and goslow, especially with your pets,
because as you said, they can'ttell you if it's too much.

SPEAKER_01 (18:04):
Absolutely.
And journaling is reallyimportant, as it is for the
human side, but particularly onthe animal side, because they
can't tell us.
But also as we change theendocannabinoid system, those
changes take place over time.
Um, most of those patterns andthose trends that we're looking
to adapt are going to changeover about 72 hours, a week, a

(18:24):
couple of weeks.
And it's really hard for us toremember all those subtle
changes.
Are you tracking how wellthey're sleeping, how much
they're interacting?
And we might have a generalimpression over time, but a
journal is a way that we takethose subjective, just kind of
watching observations and makethem objective, and then can
make some clinical assessmentsfrom that.

SPEAKER_00 (18:44):
Right.
And I'm a big advocate forwriting things down because I
have forgotten many, many timeswhen I'm doing experiments in my
kitchen, and you think, well,I'll just remember that.
And you never do because younever do.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Just life is busy, there's toomuch stuff in your head.
So yeah, journaling, I think, isa great way to keep track of how
your pets respond to whateverdosing you're giving them
because you want to be safe, ofcourse.

(19:06):
Absolutely.
Now we'll come back to some ofthat in a minute, but the market
is flooded with CBD products forpets.
And what are some of theimportant things that a pet
owner should look for if they'relooking to purchase somebody or
purchase something from areputable source?

SPEAKER_01 (19:22):
Safety.
And thus your your comment aboutreputable source.
So I would say that what makes asource reputable is that they
can demonstrate what's in theirproduct, where their product
came from, and that there's noobvious effects that are going
to be unsafe for the animal.
So with a certificate ofanalysis.
From the medical perspective,uh, I have to know what's going

(19:43):
into the patient.
As a pet parent, you want toknow that too.
So, yes, which molecules arebeing administered, that's
really important, but alsowhat's your freedom from
information?
That you don't have heavymetals, that you don't have
pesticides, that you don't havea lot of these other
contaminants.
If we're trying to do somethingfor the pet's benefit, adding a
bunch of lead to their dietbecause it's in the cannabis

(20:06):
product is not our goal.
So a reputable product haseasily accessible COAs that are
understandable, and that's a bigcaveat sometimes, and that
they're actually clean.
I've seen so many COAs onmarketed products that have lead
content in them, and it's on theCOA, and you can get the COA for
the product, but why would youput that in your animal?

(20:28):
So actually, doing the duediligence of asking the company
for their lab report, looking atit, and if you don't understand
it, asking for help there.
And can the company be reached?
Can they tell you about theirproduct?
Can they back it up from acustomer service perspective?

SPEAKER_00 (20:43):
Right.
So essentially a lot of the samethings you'd look for in a
product that you're buying foryourself because you don't want
to ingest some of thosecompounds.
I know myself, so why would wegive it to our beloved pets?

SPEAKER_01 (20:52):
Absolutely.
And think about that body weightdifference.
Yeah, right.
Something that should also notbe good for you, but you're a
human, a large human versus yoursmall cat or your small
chihuahua.
And even those very, very traceamounts can really, really,
really be damaging to even agenerally healthy animal, but
particularly we're trying to useit in a medical context where we

(21:14):
have other systems that arestruggling, we need that product
to be really clean.

SPEAKER_00 (21:18):
Right.
Now, sort of like going on withthis idea, uh, full spectrum,
broads, broad spectrum, andisolate are products that you
see on the market all the time.
Which one do you typicallyrecommend for our pets?

SPEAKER_01 (21:33):
Great question.
I love terminology questions.
That's like always a thing thatI love to talk about because
from the medical perspective,it's terminology that helps me
understand my clients'questions.
What is the product that they'rewanting to use?
What product are they using?
And just give us a way to talkto each other.
But the cannabis industry has alot of jargon, as you'll know.

(21:54):
And sometimes that in and ofitself makes it really difficult
to navigate.
And I would say that jargon is areason that we sort of see some
barriers between medicalcannabis use and the general
industry of cannabis.
It's hard for medicalpractitioners to interface with
some of the jargon.
And I'll give you an example.
So, full spectrum is a verycannabis industry jargon phrase

(22:19):
to say pretty, pretty complex.
There's a lot of molecules inthere.
Um, I don't particularly likethat phrase because to me, full
means every one of those slotson the spectrum should be
filled, that there should beexactly what was in the plant is
in my product.
And that's not usually what thatmeans.
So I teach my team to use theterm complex spectrum.

(22:39):
So it means that there's just alot in there, and it is complex,
which biology loves, complexthings, and it essentially says
there's a lot here, see the COA.
And I don't always love the termfull spectrum because it just
has a lot of different meanings.
I want to see the lab report.
So that's kind of my thing onthe full spectrum piece.
Similarly to broad spectrum, inmedicine, we would use the term

(23:03):
broad to mean it's gonna cover alot of things.
Like as an example, broadspectrum antibiotics.
That means that it's anantibiotic that's gonna get a
lot of different microbes andcover kind of a lot of different
spectrums.
But in cannabis jargon, thatmeans usually without THC.
And it there's just defined byjargon of the industry, but it

(23:27):
doesn't give you a lot ofmedical basis to bite into and
to kind of grab into.
So that's a difficult term, butbroad spectrum usually meaning
without THC.
And then isolates, isolates canbe anything.
Essential oils are isolates,they're isolates of one
particular molecule, and we canhave isolates of THC, isolates
of CBG, isolates of C B D.

(23:47):
And so it's really importantagain to know what molecules are
we talking about and not just bedistracted by the jargon.
So all that little rant aside.

SPEAKER_00 (23:57):
No, I suppose it's distinguish, I think, like
between especially in casethere's people listening who
don't uh necessarily know thedifference between full spectrum
and broad broad spectrum.
Sometimes it's hard to rememberall the jargon as well.
So I do appreciate that you tookthe time to explain that to us.

SPEAKER_01 (24:12):
And I think it's useful when you're trying to
talk to your veterinarian aboutit, that you kind of know why
there might be a bit of adisconnect and why we're all
trying to look at the labreport.
But if we pull jargon to theside, I would use a phrase a CBD
dominant.
So that hopefully that makessense to everyone that the most
prominent, the biggest volume ofmolecule in this product is the

(24:34):
CBD molecule.
So CBD dominant complexspectrum.
So lots of other backgroundmolecules with a good COA that
shows safety.
So that would be my answer oflike a good product to start
with, starting really low,really slow, and journaling.
That's a pretty safe way tostart most animals, as long as

(24:55):
they don't have other drugsyou're using, other uh
supplements that you're using,other herbs that you're using,
or other concurrent conditions.
If your animal's generallyhealthy, you're just kind of
wanting to give a little bit ofsupport, um, that's a pretty
good product to start with.

SPEAKER_00 (25:08):
Okay, that that definitely clarifies that
question.
So broad spectrum is what youwould recommend.
I guess broad spectrum, CBDdominant broad spectrum.

SPEAKER_01 (25:16):
Well, I I guess uh let me rephrase that because I I
would say that I would not usethe term broad spectrum because
I like having some THC in myproduct, but a plant-based
extraction.
So we're talking hemp level,little bit of THC, that that's
just one of the backgroundmolecules.
We're not having a lot of THC onboard.
So reasons that we would want abroad spectrum product would be

(25:39):
an animal that is very sensitiveto THC, or an owner that's very
sensitive to THC.
Sometimes owners just don't wantthat as part of the product, um,
or accessibility.
Maybe we can't access a productthat has THC.
So having THC in the mix is nota caution for me, as long as I
know it's there, I can see theCOA, and we're going really,

(25:59):
really slowly.

SPEAKER_00 (26:00):
So then does that, I guess that brings up the
question does the entourageeffect, I guess, affect pets the
same way they would us?

SPEAKER_01 (26:07):
Absolutely.
Okay.
Absolutely.
And what's so fun about it isit's mammalian medicine.
So from those concepts of theentourage effect, how these
molecules work together, it'sreally similar because we are
such close mammals and ourendocannabinoid systems are
really, really similar.

SPEAKER_00 (26:23):
Oh, very cool.
Now, let's talk about dosing fora minute, because I know this is
probably the question that a lotof people want answers to.
But the concept of a biphasicdose response curve is pretty
interesting.
Can you explain what that meansfor pet owners and who are
trying to find the right dosefor their pets?
Because you mentioned earlier asmall cat or a chihuahua, but
then somebody might have a dogthat weighs 100 pounds or more.

(26:46):
So how do you dose when there'ssuch variety in our animal
companions?

SPEAKER_01 (26:51):
Yes, yes, what a great question.
And I'll add to the question notjust a weight-based variability,
but that endocannabinoid system.
As we know from the human side,in the same person or the same
animal, your ECS can bedifferent from day to day.
Whatever challenges you'reundergoing, either your internal
environment or the externalenvironment, the support that

(27:14):
your ECS needs is going tochange.
And so that's that's really theconcept we need to take into
animal care is that thatanimal's ECS is different and
it's not really based on weight.
For an example, some of the workdone in elephants, the dose
would be the same as what youmight give a chihuahua.
So it is not based on bodyweight, it's really based on

(27:36):
what does this animal need andwhat are we observing.
So going back to the journal,how do we know if we're not
actually writing it down andreviewing it, looking at it, and
really thinking about how thatanimal's doing?
But I will go back to yourquestion about biphasic dosing,
because that's a really coolconcept.
So in general, biphasic meansthat there's two stages of a
biological effect based on thedosage amount.

(27:57):
So just that you're gonna getdifferent effects based on how
much you put into the body.
Okay, it's not simply give moreand you see more of the same
effect.
At some point in that dosingcurve, you're gonna see
different effects on the body.
Does that make sense kind of asa baseline to start from?

SPEAKER_00 (28:15):
Yeah, I think so.

SPEAKER_01 (28:16):
Yeah.
So if we take that concept andapply it to cannabis, and this
happens in a lot of othermolecules as well, cannabis is
just an interesting one.
And we'll talk about CBD kind ofparticularly.
If we see clinical effects at apretty low dose, it's easy for
us, particularly as humans, tothink, well, a little bit more
is better.
More is always a little bitbetter.
And that's just not true.

(28:37):
And so with biophasic dosing, wecan see that when one dose is
effective and we keep going up,at some point that dose becomes
either ineffective or negativehave negative effects.
And so that's really importantfor everyone to remember is that
there is a point on that dosingcurve when too much is too much.

(28:58):
And there is a point when toolittle is too little.
And so the point in the rule ofcannabis dosing is that it's
right for that patient and thatwe're willing to change it over
time because that animal'schanging too.

SPEAKER_00 (29:09):
It sounds a little like there's a law of
diminishing returns, then, whichis sort of like over time you
can give them higher doses, butthat's not necessarily going to
give them better effects.
It could even be a negativeeffect.

SPEAKER_01 (29:22):
Yes, unless we happen to have a disease
condition that requires more andmore support.
So that's why it's important tonot think about it as a hard and
fast rule and really look at theanimal.
For example, let's think about acancer case.
If we're really trying tosupport an animal through a
cancer process, there isdysregulation happening in that
animal's body at a growing rate,right?

(29:44):
That cancer system is growing.
And so we might need to continueto increase our dose to support
the body against that cancer.
And so we might keep going upand up and up and up and
continue to see positiveeffects, but that's because of
what's going on in that animal'sinternal environment.

SPEAKER_00 (30:02):
Right.
So I guess what you're saying iseach animal is pretty unique,
just like humans, because I talkabout that a lot when it comes
to humans.
Um and so you're not necessarilygoing by weight of the animal,
because I think that's sort of auh a common belief is that if
you have the hundred-poundanimal versus the 12-pound

(30:23):
animal, you should be basing iton weight.
But what you're saying is youwould start at the lowest
possible dose and just slowlywork your set way up until you
get the effects that you thedesired effects, which is
essentially what you would dofor yourself if you're just
starting out.

SPEAKER_01 (30:38):
Absolutely.
And thinking about yourmolecular profile.
Maybe it's not CBD or THC thatthat animal needs.
What about the other amazingmolecules, CBDA, CBG, some of
our terpen molecules?
Those are all really, reallyeffective in animals as well.
So, as an example, if you havean animal that's sensitive to
THC, but maybe you have adisease process where we really

(30:58):
want that on board, maybe werework our molecular profile to
lower the THC and have more CBGor some MRSing in there.
What can we actually do fromthat holistic perspective?
And I'll just throw in becauseit's amazing and curiosity
provoking, what are the otherways we can support the
endocannabinoid system that'snot cannabis?

(31:19):
Maybe cannabis is not the rightmodality for this animal.
So I think that's a really goodpoint just to say if you're
feeling that it's not working,something's just not, the
animal's not responding, or youfeel like something's not just
awry, uh, that's a good time toreach out for help so that we
can just look at what are all ofthe holistic pieces of this and
maybe move some things around,try a different modality, uh,

(31:40):
like massage, acupuncture,rehab, all of those support the
ECS.
Cannabis is just a really,really easy clinical way to do
that.

SPEAKER_00 (31:48):
Right.
Now, just to go back for asecond too, because you
mentioned CBDA.
So you're suggesting that someof these the ones where the acid
molecules have not been removedcan be really effective.
Can you talk a little bit moreabout that?
Because I find that prettyinteresting.

SPEAKER_01 (32:06):
Absolutely.
So again, mammalian medicine.
So we find that these othermolecules are also really
effective in animals.
And so you'll notice that I usecannabis as a term as a pretty
overarching umbrella.
And I'm usually speaking aboutthe plant, the cannabis plant,
and recognizing that we havemany, many molecules the plant
produces, hundreds ofcannabinoids, all these

(32:27):
terpenes, even deflavonoids.
And so, from a clinicalperspective, we think about all
of those being effective, doingsomething in the animal's body.
And I'll also remind everyonethat the entourage effect, we
think about that being as betterfor everybody, but you can also
have molecules that cancel eachother out.
What if you have some moleculesthat are a little bit uplifting

(32:48):
and also some that are a littlebit calming?
What happens then?
They're all still gonna interacttogether.
So it just requires a lot ofhumility from us from the
clinical side to observe theanimal.
What are we trying to do and bewilling to change our protocol
over time?
I love CBDA.
What a great inflammationcontrol, really good for GI
inflammation kind.

(33:09):
And getting that GI tract tocalm down, effective in nausea,
even anticipatory nausea.
So think about car rides, or ifyou have an animal that's going
for a chemo visit, they can kindof anticipate that feeling.
So really, really interestinguses there.
CBG is one of my favoritemolecules at the moment, really
good for muscle relaxation,fascial relaxation, even really

(33:30):
lovely in seizure control,because we can get that body to
relax and we don't have thatlittle nervous system as spun up
as it has to be.
So the minor cannabinoids, whichis also a misnomer because
sometimes those molecules can bethe most dominant molecule in
the product, are so lovely, solovely in animals.

SPEAKER_00 (33:47):
That's that's really amazing and so interesting
because I feel like a lot ofthose would be great for humans
as well.
But we tend to overlook thingslike the THCA and the CBDA
because we're always looking forthe often looking for the
intoxicating effects.
But it's just a nice reminderthat these can play a pretty big
role in our our own lives.

SPEAKER_01 (34:04):
So absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 (34:05):
Absolutely.
Now, if there is someone whowants to administer cannabis to
their pets at home, uh are theredifferences between the
effectiveness between oils,edibles, or other forms?
And like what's the best way togo about it?

SPEAKER_01 (34:18):
Absolutely.
Great question again.
I would say that most petparents feel more comfortable
beginning to interface with atreat.
And that's what most pet storesare pushing or product companies
are pushing.
But treats are really just easy.
That doesn't mean they'remedically useful because we have
extra ingredients that mighthave issues with allergies,

(34:39):
calories, we might have issuesthere.
So treats are just a verynon-clinical way to use
cannabis, and you're not reallygoing to see as much effect as
you could if we really dig intoit medically.
So tinctures are my favorite.
So tinctures with a high qualityoil, because where the oil comes
from matters almost as much asthe cannabis that's in it, and

(34:59):
that we know which molecules areactually in the product, that's
really where I like to start.
And again, in a tincture, youcan start with a drop and work
your way up to what you need.
So it gives you a lot ofversatility from a dosing
perspective.
Now, not every animal is okaywith an oil.
Think about a horse trying togive a horse an oil, it just
kind of dribbles out of theirmouth.

(35:20):
So there's formulations likepellets, um, paste can be really
common, powders can be reallygood if you have animals that
are sensitive to oils.
But in general, a tincture or anoil-based product is usually
where I like to start.

SPEAKER_00 (35:32):
Okay, so you could do a tincture, an oil-based
tincture.
Could you do like aglycerin-based tincture as well
if that's something thatsomeone's inclined to do?

SPEAKER_01 (35:40):
Potentially.
As long as the animal doesn'thave any issues with that base.
I like the oil bases becausemany times that palatability is
easier for the animals.
Um, like a safflower oil mightbe a bit better fit for a cat.
A hemp-based oil can be reallyum pleasant for some of the
dogs.
And so I really like for thoseoils to be as clean and as um

(36:00):
natural as we can have them sothat we're also not adding extra
things in.
There are waterble water-solubleproducts that are useful in
animals, especially if you wanta faster effect, but we're
usually working with oil-basedproducts.

SPEAKER_00 (36:13):
Okay.
Now that's good to know becauseI know there's a lot of
listeners that are obviouslymaking their own oils at home,
oils and tinctures.
So it's it's pretty simple tomake a lot of these as well.
So and they can also be added totreats or to food, different
ways to sort of get your pet totake something they might not
want to take out of life school.

(36:33):
Some of them are picky outthere, some of them not really.

SPEAKER_01 (36:37):
But some of them are also too eager, and especially
if your listeners are makingtheir edibles at home.
A really big clinical cautionthat we have around that is your
nosy dog putting their nose intoyour trash can after you've
strained out the cheeseclothfrom your edible making at home.
That can be a really, reallydangerous source of a lot of

(37:00):
harm for an animal because wehave now a foreign body
ingestion, a large amount ofTHC, a lot of plant material
that's going to take a long timeto come out of the body and
probably needs like clinical, ifnot surgical, intervention.
So that can be a reallyeffective way to get a product
and kind of make one foryourself and for your animal.
But remember that there are alot of cautions because your

(37:21):
animal doesn't know that thatcheesecloth or that pan of
butter isn't necessarily forthem.
So just being really carefulbecause animals don't know, and
we have to make sure we guardthem from some of those harms as
well.

SPEAKER_00 (37:33):
No, and that totally makes sense.
So to be very careful whenyou're disposing of any plant
material when you're doing theinfusion process, because I know
I have I have two daughters whoeach have a dog.
One will eat anything and theother one's super picky.
So I can see the one of themgetting into the trash can
afterwards for sure.
She's just gross.

(37:53):
So now, what are some of thecommon mistakes that you see pet
owners making when they'retrying to experiment with giving
their pets cannabis for thefirst time?

SPEAKER_01 (38:02):
I would say extrapolating from their own
experience.
And hopefully that makes sense.
Usually that's in a good and agenerous way, wanting their
animal to also experience thehealing benefits of this plant.
But remember that your animal'sECS and their ability to consent
or opt out is different thanyours.
So making sure that you areobserving your pet objectively,

(38:27):
having a really defined set ofgoals and journaling is the way
that we operate from a consentor cooperative care basis.
Your animal's experience is notyour experience, and your
experience is not your animals,but you are their guardian and
we are making choices for themevery day.
So wanting to extend the healingbenefits of this amazing plant

(38:48):
is so beautiful.
But we need to do that in a waythat really respects their
otherness, their own sense,their own species, and make sure
that we know how to say no.
When does that animal not wantthat dose?
When is it not appropriate forthem?
And also making sure that we'renot dosing the animal for our

(39:08):
behalf.
So why are you dosing yourself?
Is it for an anxiety disorder,something that you're struggling
with?
Giving your animal that samemedication, if that's not their
issue, is extrapolating andprojecting onto the animal in a
way that can be really unhealthyand unsafe.

SPEAKER_00 (39:26):
Right.
That's a great answer.
I mean, yeah.
I it kind of leads into the nextquestion I have in some respects
is the signs of THC toxicity.
And of course, you hopefullydon't get to that point, but it
does happen sometimes.
Um, can you talk about like whatthe signs are and what an owner
should do if their pet does havetoo much?

(39:48):
Stay calm.

unknown (39:49):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (39:51):
That's the basis.
Stay calm.
Okay.
Um, preventative is always best.
So making sure you're lockingyour stash up.
Um, dogs can get intoeverything.
Cats are great climbers.
Uh, the thing that your toddlercan't open, your animal probably
can.
So just being really aware thatthe cautions around just
preventing that risk can saveeveryone a lot of trouble, a lot

(40:14):
of concern, a lot of hurt.
But things happen, and animalsare very nosy about the things
we're interested in.
And so, if that intoxication isto happen, one, you staying
calm, lowering the sensoryenvironment.
So, just like humans, a THCintoxication is going to make
that animal really sensitive tolight, really sensitive to
sound.

(40:34):
So, you keeping your voice low,turning off the light, making
sure they're in a safe spot.
So, if they aren't sure wherethey are, they at least can
smell things that are familiar.
They're not going to run aroundand bump into furniture or fall
down a set of stairs.
So, what how can you make thatenvironment nice and comforting?
If that intoxication is veryextreme, they might need medical

(40:56):
care.
But remember that that trip tothe clinic with bright lights,
you driving really fast, it'snot really the best thing to do
in that scenario.
So, one prevent, see if you cantreat at home, maybe then call
the vet clinic in case you doneed to come in.
But what can you do at home?
And an important thing to knowis that CBD really is the
antidote to THC intoxication.

(41:18):
I'm sure you talk about thatfrom the human side.
So having a CBD isolate, so onlyCBD in that product at home, you
can administer to the animalthat has received too much THC.
And that CBD molecule will knockthe THC molecule off of the
receptor in a way that allowsthat high experience to come

(41:38):
down, that intoxicationexperience to come down.
Now, the animal still has tometabolize all of that THC out,
so you may need to redose acouple of times, but that's a
really, really effective andsafe way to help an animal
through an intoxication.
Also, limining works reallywell.
So the zest from a lemon, justlike in humans, and we often
will use that in clinics if wedon't have a CBDI solidal

(42:01):
around, just putting some it'sfrom the skin of a lemon, so it
has to be a zest of the lemon uhin front of a dog's face or an
animal's face will bring downthat high.
Just remember the THC moleculetakes a long time to metabolize.
So you're thinking more about umaromatherapy, putting something
in a diffuser.
So you need to keep treating,but knowing how you're going to

(42:23):
respond, if your animal does getinto something they shouldn't,
really can be an important harmreduction action.

SPEAKER_00 (42:28):
Yeah, I'm so glad that you mentioned that because
I know that that the panicresponse is so normal and
people, and I never reallyoccurred to me, of course, if
the they're the animal's havingsome sensory overload and then
you're rushing to a vet clinicor something like that, that
that's probably just gonna makethings a lot worse.
And most of the time they justtell you at the clinic, just let
them sleep it off.

(42:49):
So you end up going home andthey haven't really told you
anything specific about what youcan do.
Right.
Because I would imagine a lot ofvets aren't necessarily versed
on cannabis and pets to beginwith.

SPEAKER_01 (43:00):
I would say all vets are versed on the intoxication
experience.
So we have all seen thatintoxicated dog stumbling into
the clinic, and that's what mostof us have familiarity with.
We're not doing that from aclinical perspective.
And if there's something inbetween where you can manage it
at home, that's beautiful.
But calling your vet or your ERand saying, hey, this happened.

(43:23):
I might need some help.
Is there anything else I shouldknow or do?
Can really be a way to make surethe clinic is prepared in case
something were to happen.
Because you can get enough THCthat the dog can really
struggle, the animal canstruggle, but most of them can
be managed at home.
Um I will also add in a cautionthat it's other things that are
in cannabis products, thechocolate that are in the

(43:45):
brownies, the xylitol that's inthat candy, the wrapper, uh, the
cheesecloth itself, the foreignbody, the vape cartridge, that
those things are much more riskyand potentially lethal to the
animal than the cannabis itself.
So just because your animal atecannabis, there could be a lot

(44:06):
of risk in there because of theother things that are around.
Does that make sense?

SPEAKER_00 (44:10):
Yeah, it totally makes sense.
Because I've always long heardthat chocolate is very toxic to
dogs in particular.
And of course, if they eat yourtray of chocolate brownies, then
they're getting the chocolateand the cannabis.
Yeah.
That's like a double whammy.
So yeah, that totally makessense.
And that's good to know,actually, because I didn't know
that about the xylitol.

SPEAKER_01 (44:27):
Absolutely.
Xylitol is extremely toxic toanimals.
Even like a little bitty xylitolpiece of gum can be really,
really toxic.
So it's probably the otherthings that are in the product
in your chocolate bar, in yourpiece of candy, that are worth
that call to the veterinaryclinic.
The cannabis part's probablygonna be okay, but especially in

(44:48):
today's industry and market,it's the other ingredients we're
really concerned about.

SPEAKER_00 (44:52):
Right, which totally makes sense too, because not too
many dogs are getting into yourstash of weed.
Like they're they are maybegonna get into the brownies if
you're not careful, but I doubtthey're gonna like stick their
nose in your bag and just eatraw cannabis.

SPEAKER_01 (45:05):
Well, I'll tell you what happens a lot is the friend
that comes over and there'ssomething in their purse, or
there's something in thebackpack, and the dog is just
nosy and putting its noseeverywhere is like that's for
me.
I'm gonna eat it.
So that happens frequently.
Um, being really careful aboutjoints.
Will all of your users know whatthat is, or the roach, the end

(45:25):
of a joint in the gutter?
So many of my clients have hadtheir animal experience severe
intoxication because they're ona walk, just having a lovely
walk, and then suddenly theanimal begins to stumble and is
a toxic, and they grabbed ajoint that was in the gutter and
had all of that THC ingested andwere high because of it.

(45:47):
Or another really commonoccurrence is if someone pours
out bong water.
Hopefully, your users will knowwhat that means.
There's a lot of THC there.
And if the animal comes by andlicks up that water or kind of
sniffs around in the ground,they can also get intoxicated
from that.
So there are reasons your animalmight get intoxicated that don't

(46:07):
have anything to do with you.
And being really aware of yourenvironment is an important harm
reduction technique.

SPEAKER_00 (46:13):
Okay, that's excellent to know as well.
Because yeah, some of thosedogs, well, I'm thinking of my
daughter's dog, would probablydo something like that.
It's common.
It is really common, yes.
And I find that interestingthough, because also, like if
you have a joint that's justsitting on the ground that was
left outside, I mean, typicallyfor us humans, it would have to
be decarboxylated before itwould affect us.

(46:35):
So are dogs or pets moreaffected by um raw cannabis, I
guess?

SPEAKER_01 (46:42):
Usually what happens it's the end of a joint.
So if someone has smoked it andit's the roach at the end, the
little filter.
And so there is, it has beendecarboxylated.
Right.
So there's a lot of THC built upin that little part that the
person.
Exactly.
And then they've tossed thataway, which shame on them for
littering, put it somewhereelse.

(47:02):
Yeah.
But that piece is really easyfor the animal to pick up or at
least explore with their mouth,hold in their mouth for a
moment.
And who knows why?
But most dogs think they'redelicious and curiosity
provoking.
So they are gonna pick it up.
Like it really is a thing.
Sometimes I, for some of my verycurious animals, I encourage
their owners to use a muzzle, abasket muzzle where the animal

(47:23):
can breathe and drink and eat,but they can't pick stuff off
the ground, whether that begoose poop, other dogs poop,
joints.
And again, I live in Colorado,so there are things like uh
psychedelics on the ground,mushrooms that people have
thrown away, um, really, reallydangerous compounds.
So today's world is not alwayssafe for an animal, and we need
to be really aware of what theycould just inadvertently get

(47:46):
into because they're beingcurious.

SPEAKER_00 (47:48):
Okay.
Yeah, that's that's very goodadvice.
Now, you have talked a littlebit about it earlier, but what
are some of the most commonconditions that you see in your
practice that respondparticularly well to cannabis?

SPEAKER_01 (47:59):
Pain.
Pain is one of the most commonreasons that I think a pet
parent seeks or begins to thinkabout cannabis.
It's one of the ones thatcannabis just really, really
works well for.
Because pain is such a body-wideissue.
No matter where that pain iscoming from, the entire body is
involved in it, processing it,thinking about it, feeling it.

(48:20):
And so because we can supportthe endocannabinoid system
through cannabis, we're able toimpact a lot of that pain
pathway, inflammatory cascade insome really, really effective
ways at really, really lowdoses.
So I would say pain is a greatreason to think about cannabis
for your animal.
And we know a lot about whichmolecular profiles work really
well for different types ofpain.

(48:41):
So from a clinical perspective,that's a great one.
I would also begin to talk aboutcognitive decline.
That's a really common reasonfor owners to seek out cannabis,
the aging animal who justdoesn't seem quite as alert or
bright, maybe wandering, pacing,not really sure where they are.
Cannabis is a really beautifulneurologic support.

(49:03):
So helping that nervous systemrealign itself and find balance.
So that's another one that Ilove.
Uh definitely beginning to bemore on that clinical
intervention side, seizures,internal medicine cases.
And then I work mostly onbehavior, behavioral health.
And so behavior cases, andthere's a whole range of those,
are other really, really commonreasons for owners to be curious

(49:23):
about cannabis.

SPEAKER_00 (49:24):
Is there anything that pet owners should perhaps
not consider cannabis for?

SPEAKER_01 (49:29):
Yes, fantastic question.
So when I teach cannabisclasses, instead of saying a
contraindication, which means weshould not do this, I usually
say a clinical caution, meaningthat we should just have a very
clear idea of which moleculeswe're using, that they are
clean, you know, no heavy metalsinto our kidney failure patient,
please, and that we arejournaling effectively.

(49:51):
So, in that light, whenever wethink about cardiac cases, we
want to be really, reallycareful.
THC in particular will changeheart rate, blood pressure, and
if you have a cardiac case,those can be really detrimental.
However, we do see cannabinoidsbe cardioprotective.
And so sometimes we do usecannabis in cardiac cases, but

(50:12):
we're doing it really carefully,monitoring really carefully,
working with the cardiologist,et cetera.
So cardiac cases really deservea lot of caution.
Kidney cases are also reallyimportant to be careful with.
Most of these molecules can be abit dehydrating.
We can change some of theanimals' behavioral patterns,
maybe they're not drinking asmuch.
So again, just cautious.
And then behavioral patients.

(50:33):
While cannabis is really, reallyeffective in behavioral cases,
it's not just a magic pill thatmakes it better.
It's going to create anopportunity for something to be
better, but it could also makethat behavior case worse if
we're not approaching it in theappropriate way and giving that
behavior modification at thesame time.
So caution, that would alsoinclude a caution for me of

(50:54):
you're not just tossing acannabis treat to your dog
before you walk out the door andthey have separation anxiety.
But maybe we can use cannabis insome of our training sessions to
make that a little bit of aneasier learning curve for the
animal.

SPEAKER_00 (51:07):
Right.
Now, I guess this sort of bringsme to this question of how
should someone talk to their vetabout their use of cannabis?
Because I would imagine, like Ikind of mentioned earlier, that
many vets aren't really wellversed on the use of cannabis as
a treatment beyond the like theintoxication when they come in
and they've had too much.

SPEAKER_01 (51:26):
Great question, because most of the
veterinarians, particularly ingeneral practice or ERs, are
going to have seen thatintoxication.
And so I think it is a prettygut reflex, kind of a knee-jerk
reaction to say, oh, be careful.
I've seen so many cases wherethat's gone poorly.
And so making sure that theyhave an awareness of how it can

(51:46):
be used medically is important.
Knowing that cannabis molecules,whatever they are, CBD, THC,
CBDA, these are really powerfulphysiologic molecules that have
medicinal effects in the body.
Otherwise, we wouldn't betalking about it.
We use it for medicinal effects.
But if those molecules are in mypatient, it does affect my

(52:08):
dosing of other drugs, of otherherbs, of other modalities.
And so as a veterinarian, if Idon't know that these
cannabinoids are in my patient,there's a huge part of my
patient's history, its medicalhistory, that I'm not aware of.
Our medical director, Dr.
Gaver, just actually finishedhis master's thesis in
integrative medicine andcannabis research.

(52:30):
And his paper is on the use ofcannabis prior to anesthesia.
And we see that cannabis usedoes affect the doses of
anesthetics that we use.
So just a really good example ofyour primary care veterinarian
needs to know.
Even if they're not comfortabledirecting that protocol or
really going into the details ofit with you, it is medically

(52:52):
effective molecules in theirpatient that does affect the
dosing and the treatment thatalso might be added in.
So awareness would be the keyword there.

SPEAKER_00 (53:02):
Okay.
So just be like making sure thatyour the practitioner that
you're working with is aware ofhow you're using cannabis to
treat your animal before I guessanything happens.
Absolutely.
It's part of the medical record.

SPEAKER_01 (53:16):
Yeah, taking your COA and say, you know, this is
what I'm using.
Here are the molecules.
And that way you can actuallyhave a really good discussion
together.
So if you do want to broach thatum topic with your veterinarian,
taking in the COA, taking in theproduct and its label so that
you can together look at it andsay, here's what's going into
the patient.
Is this good?
Is this not good?
Or just to chart it over time.

(53:37):
Um, my patient's journals arepart of the medical record
because I can see what'shappening in their bodies over
time.

SPEAKER_00 (53:44):
Right.
Okay.
That's that's also good to know.
This I feel like I have amillion more questions, but I
want to be mindful of your time.
So I did want to.

SPEAKER_01 (53:52):
Well, I'm happy to talk about it all day, so ask
away.

SPEAKER_00 (53:55):
Um, what do you see happening in the field of uh
veterinary cannabis medicine,like in the next five to 10
years, that has you excited?

SPEAKER_01 (54:04):
Cannabis teaches us so much about the
endocannabinoid system.
And I say this to all of ourstudents in our certification
class.
Cannabis is cool because itshows us about the ECS.
But the endocannabinoid systemis really what's beautiful about
our patients, about mammals,about vertebrates, and cannabis
just gives us a really safe,clinically applicable way to

(54:26):
affect that system.
So, what I would love to seeover the next five to 10 years
is to continue this trajectoryof ECS being in our
conversation, cannabis beingless stigmatized, so we can
actually talk about should itwork, could it work, how did it
work?
And we're just beginning to seethis information put into
curriculum much slower than Ithink we should, but I think

(54:47):
within the next five to 10years, it is going to be a
mainstay of how we think aboutall types of medicine because
endocannabinoid system regulatesall the other subsystems that we
know about.
So understanding it from ascience and medicine perspective
better, an ECS, seeing itinvolved in curriculum more uh
widely, and then that we'redoing really clinically

(55:11):
significant research, that we'renot just changing the dose of
one molecule like CBD and justpulling it up and down, but
we're really looking into whatdo different mixes of molecules
do?
What happens in different cases?
So, really focusing onclinically applicable research
versus what a product wants donebecause they want to be able to
add their label research.

(55:32):
You know, we really want to knowhow does this work in a clinical
perspective.

SPEAKER_00 (55:36):
Yeah.
Now, two more questions for youtoday.
One is just to wrap up, what doyou think is the most important
piece of advice that you cangive to a pet owner who's
considering using cannabis tohelp their animal companion?

SPEAKER_01 (55:52):
I would reframe it from advice to a note of
gratitude.
Thank you for being involved andinvested in your animal's
health.
If you're curious about cannabisand exploring it as a modality,
it tells me a lot about whatyou're looking for, that animal
companion in your life.
So thank you.
My gratitude to you in how muchyou are invested in the health

(56:14):
of your animal and to reallykeep that at the center, that
you're not trying to do acertain dose or a certain
product.
You're looking for your animal'swell-being and their long-term
health.
And so then that would feed intomy piece of advice of keeping
that at the forefront.
Don't be swayed by themarketing, don't be swayed by
the pretty brand that has goodcolors and the paw print.

(56:35):
Really dig into the sciencebecause it is there.
Ask for the COA, be the annoyingcustomer that calls a million
times, ask for more, just likeyou would ask for better and
more for yourself.
Of course, we want that for ouranimals.
And if you're the pet parent whois curious about this, I know
that you're also that petguardian who is going to ask the
right questions, dig until youfind the right answers, and make

(56:57):
sure you're looking for theprofessionals who really can
back you up and have thatanimal's well-being at the
forefront of everyone's mind.

SPEAKER_00 (57:05):
That's a that's a beautiful way to approach that.
I really like that.
And I guess just to wrap thingsup, where can people learn more
about your work and you in theworld?

SPEAKER_01 (57:14):
Well, we would love to interface with any of your
audience.
I'm so excited to just becollaborating with you on this.
I think it's such an importanttopic to bring to the forefront.
We have a couple of ways I thinkpeople would find interesting to
interface.
Our website isvendorcannabis.org, where can
you just find generalinformation?
We have a certification classthat is open to medical

(57:34):
professionals, non-medicalprofessionals, pet parents that
are curious about biology, sothat's a really fun class to
involve in.
We have a community forum ifyou're looking for just some
case studies to look at or aplace, safe place to ask
questions.
And if you are a little bit moreon that clinical side, if you
have audience members that areinterested, maybe are animal
caregivers, um, pet sitters, dogwalkers, any of that, we also

(57:58):
have office hours and someshadowing opportunities because
that really is where we are nowas a medicine community is
sharing ideas, learning fromeach other because it is a new
science, it is a new medicine,and it is emerging and evolving
really quickly.
So sharing that acrossindustries is important.

SPEAKER_00 (58:14):
Excellent.
Well, I just want to say thankyou so much for your time today,
Sarah.
It was such a greatconversation, and I know
everyone listening will be ableto approach using cannabis with
their animal companions and feela lot, a lot better about it,
like they actually know whatthey're doing.
So I really appreciate your timeand thank you for joining me
today.

SPEAKER_01 (58:31):
Thank you so much.
What a fun conversation, what aprivilege, and best of luck to
everyone who's curious out thereabout cannabis.
Again, thanks for investing inyour animal and your
relationship with your animal.
That's a really beautiful thingto explore.

SPEAKER_00 (58:43):
I hope you enjoyed that conversation with Dr.
Kessara Andre.
Please share it with somebodythat you think would benefit
from listening to it.
Of course, you'll find all thedetailed show notes on the
website and the podcast app thatyou're using right now.
And continue the conversationover at the Bite Me Cannabis
Club.
And until next week, my friend,I'm your host, Margaret.
Stay hi.