Cannabis enthusiasts have been wasting hours in the kitchen unnecessarily. Vanessa Lavorato's scientific research proves what many never suspected - a 30-minute cannabis infusion extracts virtually the same amount of cannabinoids as a marathon 2-hour session. This revelation challenges one of the most persistent myths in cannabis cooking.
Want to transform your cannabis cooking experience and join a community of like-minded enthusiasts? Join us at the Bite Me Cannabis Club where we dive deeper into the science and art of making incredible edibles at home. Knowledge is power, especially when it gives you hours of your life back!
Stop lurking and start connecting—head to JoinBiteMe.com right now. Find a private community of cannabis growers, makers and lovers who are just as obsessed or curious as you are.
Visit the website for full show notes, free dosing calculator, recipes and more.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
Welcome, friends, to episode 301.
Today, we're talking aboutinfusion times and why you may
be infusing for longer than youneed to, and the science behind
it.
Stay tuned.
Welcome to Bite Me, the showabout edibles, where I help you
take control of your high life.
I'm your host and certifiedgongja, margaret, and I love
helping cooks make safe andeffective edibles at home.
(00:27):
I'm so glad you're here and weare back, friends.
Welcome to the podcast thatexplores the intersection of
food culture and cannabis.
I am your host, margaret, and Ijust want to say thank you,
friends, for being here.
If you're joining us for thefirst time, this is going to be
a great episode for you to tuneinto, because I'm going to save
you some time in the kitchenwhile you're still making great
(00:49):
edibles at home, which is whatthis podcast is all about.
And if you've been listeningfor a while, I'm going to save
you some time as well, and I amexcited about the topic of
today's episode.
So, please, please, enjoywhat's to come Now, before we do
get into today's episode.
As per the usual, I often liketo do something fun beforehand
and, as I've had no reviewslately, hint, hint, nudge, nudge
(01:12):
if you feel like leaving afive-star rating or review, it
would be much appreciated.
Or share this episode withsomeone that you care about,
because sharing is caring, and Ithink this information needs to
go to more people.
But in any case, before we getinto the main topic of today's
episode, I'm going to do astoner trivia question.
I'm going to pick a card fromthe deck at random, and the
(01:37):
stoner trivia question today isa movie question.
So for all you movie buffs outthere, bridget Fonda plays a
sexy stoner in what QuentinTarantino film Jackie Brown,
kill Bill, single White Femaleor True Romance?
That is a question that I wouldnot be able to answer with
(01:59):
confidence if I didn't alreadyknow the answer.
So the question is BridgetFonda plays a sexy stoner in one
Quentin Tarantino film JackieBrown, kill Bill, single white
female or true romance?
Now, if you guessed JackieBrown, you would be correct.
You can now give yourself agood pat on the back and reward
(02:20):
yourself with an edible orsomething to smoke or vape on me
.
So please go ahead and do that,and if you haven't already
settled in to listen to thisepisode with something tasty,
then by all means please do sonow.
Of course, what I've been makinglately is popcorn.
(02:40):
I have been obsessed withpopcorn ever since I made that
popcorn for the episode.
Recently I've been making a lotinfused, non-infused, both, it
doesn't really matter.
I've been loving popcorn.
There's something magical aboutmaking it in a pot.
It still gives me thrills.
And there's a local shop whereI pick up a lot of fruits and
(03:00):
vegetables from area farmers andthey have all these different
types of popcorn popping.
How many times can I saypopcorn in one episode?
This is one of these.
Drink your cannabis infusedbeverage.
Every time I say popcorn, thenyou would be getting pretty high
right now.
But in any case, the storecarries a surprisingly large
variety of GMO free popping cornand the different types are.
(03:24):
It's kind of interesting to trythe different types.
I've noticed differencesbetween them.
What I'm on right now is thishull-less variety.
I have been really obsessingwith popcorn and I'm probably
going to make those popcorntreats again sometime soon
because they're really good andI'm going to be going in a few
weeks.
Actually, at the time of thisrecording is only a couple of
weeks away, camp Canna.
At the time of this recordingis only a couple of weeks away,
(03:47):
camp Cana, and that is an adultsummer camp for stoners of all
types.
All are welcome and I'm reallylooking forward to that.
The only thing I hope is thatwe have great weather.
I went last year.
It was a blast.
Who knew that I was so good atarchery?
But the weather here lately hasbeen pretty rainy this spring
and I just hope that that doesnot extend to the weekend at
(04:07):
Camp Cana, because that would bea bit of a disappointment.
Canadians wait so long for goodweather, so long In any case.
That's what's exciting as faras what's coming up, and of
course, there are always new funthings happening in the Bite Me
Cannabis Club.
I can show you more over atjoinbitemecom and I have been
(04:31):
there a lot and I'm really proudof the community that we're
building over there.
There's some really wonderfulpeople who are contributing and
making it a really special place, and I would love to have you
there with me so we can talkfurther about all wonderful
things around cannabis.
(04:52):
This episode was really inspiredby Vanessa Lavorato, author of
how to Eat Weed and have a GoodTime, and she was on my podcast
very recently.
If you haven't listened to thatepisode yet, I highly recommend
it because there's a lot ofreally good information in that
episode.
One of the things we talkedabout was how infusion times are
much longer than they need toand how you may be wasting your
time a little bit, and I hate tosay that.
(05:13):
I mean, I've been doing thesame myself, and so I decided to
do a couple of experiments onmy own in my own home kitchen,
and I was really interested tosee what those results were.
We're going to take a big biteout of cannabis cooking myths
and serve up the science behindbetter edibles and, as you
(05:36):
already know, I'm your host,margaret, and today we are
tackling a persistent myth incannabis cooking, and I don't
even know if it's a persistentmyth.
It's just sort of whateverybody has done to this point
or thinks that they need to do,and it's the idea that you need
to infuse your butter or oilfor hours on end to get maximum
potency.
You've probably heard it beforeyou need to simmer butter or
(05:57):
oil for at least a couple ofhours to get all the good stuff
out, and I'm here to tell youthat I have learned.
The science says otherwise, andwe're going to explain why.
A 30 minute infusion canextract just as many
cannabinoids as a two hourmarathon session and we'll dive
into the chemistry behind thecannabinoid extraction.
Look at what the researchactually shows and save you
(06:20):
hours of unnecessary cookingtime.
Like I said, I want to saythank you to Vanessa, who
pointed this out not only in herbook, but also in our episode
together, which is what reallygot the wheels turning in my own
mind of like, how can I savetime?
Because we're all busy and ifyou'd like to make edibles at
home, being able to fit itbetter into your schedule will
make it easier to make them whenyou want them.
(06:43):
So, whether you're a seasonededible enthusiast or you're just
curious about making your firstbatch of can of butter, stick
around and in the next 20minutes you are going to learn
how to work smarter, not harder,when it comes to your cannabis
infusions.
So let's start with the bigquestion when did the idea come
(07:05):
from that?
I mean, that's what I've alwaysdone up to this point, and if
any infusion device that I havealso believes in this theory as
well.
I have three infusion devices Ihave an Ardent, I have a Levo 2,
and I have a Magical ButterMachine and they all infuse for
about two hours and, like manycooking traditions, it seems to
(07:27):
be a mix of folk wisdom,cautious overkill and a
misunderstanding of theunderlying science.
Now, back in the day, beforecooking with cannabis was
studied scientifically, peoplewere just trying things out in
their kitchen.
If somebody made a batch ofbrownies that didn't hit very
hard, they might think, well,maybe I just didn't cook the
infusion for long enough, andnext time they'd infuse for
longer.
And if that batch seemed morepotent whether due to longer
(07:50):
infusion time or just becausethey used better cannabis that
idea would stick, which kind ofmakes sense.
It's also worth noting that inthe prohibition area, most
people were making edibles withplant material that wasn't
exactly what you considerpremium, and they might be using
shake, trim or low qualitycannabis which could potentially
benefit from longer extractiontimes to compensate for the
(08:13):
lower potency.
That is something I haven'ttried in my own home kitchen yet
, but I will be, hopefully afterthis season of my outdoor grow,
which is going beautifully, as,as we speak, I'm optimistic.
It's early days, but I'll havesome trim, hopefully at the end
of that season, so I can see howthat works for infusion times
(08:33):
as well.
I'm going to be testing thatout.
But here's the thing we are notin prohibition area anymore,
and even if you live in a placewhere it's still prohibited, the
attitudes are really changingeven in those places.
So we still have access tobetter cannabis, better
equipment and, most importantly,actual scientific research on
how cannabinoid extraction works.
(08:54):
What does that research tell us?
That, with the right conditions, 30 minutes is plenty of time
to extract the cannabinoids thatyou want To understand why
short infusions can be just aseffective as long ones.
You need to understand a bitabout the science of extraction,
but don't worry, we'll keepthis.
Digestible.
Canninoids like thc and cbd arefat soluble.
(09:16):
That means they dissolvereadily into fats and oils, but
not in water, and this is why weinfuse cannabis into butter,
coconut oil, olive oil, allthose other fatty substances,
rather than just trying to make,say, cannabis tea with just
water.
When you heat cannabis in a fatsource, you're creating the
perfect environment for thosecannabinoids to leave the plant
material and dissolve into thefat, and this process is
(09:37):
governed by a few key factors.
One is temperature Heat speedsup the extraction process by
making the cannabinoids moremobile.
Two is surface area, andbreaking up your cannabis
increases the surface areaexposed to the fat and I don't
like to say grinding, because Ifind that grinding is a bit
overkill.
In my opinion, agitationstirring helps bring fresh fat
(10:00):
into contact with the plantmaterial and the fat itself.
Different fats have differentabilities to dissolve
cannabinoids, though at the endof the day, I think you just
need to infuse the fats that youwant to use in your own cooking
.
But did you notice what's not onthat list?
Time Beyond a certain point.
So let me explain why.
(10:21):
Extraction is what scientistscall an equilibrium process.
The cannabinoids will move froman area of high concentration
the plant to an area of lowconcentration the fat until they
reach a balance.
Once that equilibrium isreached, you can keep cooking
for hours, but you won't extractsignificantly more cannabinoids
(10:41):
.
So don't just take my word forit.
Let's look at what thescientific research actually
shows.
There's a fascinating studypublished in the Journal of
Molecules in 2022, which I canalso link in the show notes of
this episode over onbitemepodcastcom and it examined
cold ethanol extraction ofcannabinoids.
The researchers used asophisticated experimental
(11:04):
design to test differentextraction times, ranging from
about six minutes to 34 minutes,and what did they find?
The optimal extraction time wasjust 10 minutes.
At that point, they achievedextraction efficiencies of up to
102% at room temperature and97.7% at colder temperatures.
(11:26):
Wait, but how can you get morethan 100% extraction?
Well, that's likely due tosmall measurement variations,
but the point is clear theyextracted essentially all of the
available cannabinoids in just10 minutes.
Another study published in theArabian Journal of Chemistry
found that varying sonicationtime between 10 and 30 minutes
did not significantly affect theCBD and THC contents extracted.
(11:48):
In other words, once they hitthe 10 minute mark, continuing
to 30 minutes didn'tmeaningfully increase the amount
of cannabinoids.
They got out.
A comprehensive review inFrontiers in Natural Products
examined industrial cannabinoidextraction techniques and found
that contact time was just oneof the many factors affecting
extraction efficiency, and noteven the most important one.
(12:10):
Factors like solvent choice,temperature and the ratio of
solvent to plant material had amuch bigger impact on how much
of the cannabinoids wereextracted.
Now I know some of you might bethinking, but these studies use
specialized equipment andsolvents, not just a pot on my
stove with some butter.
And that's true.
But the underlying chemistry isthe same.
If professional extraction canhappen in 10 to 30 minutes with
(12:33):
the right conditions, your homeinfusion doesn't magically need
four times longer.
If time isn't the most criticalfactor.
What should you be focusing oninstead?
Here are the factors thatactually make a difference in
your infusion potency.
Decarboxylation this is theprocess of heating raw cannabis
(12:53):
to convert THCA into THC, andit's separate from the infusion
process and is crucial.
If you skip proper decarb, itdoesn't matter if you infuse for
30 minutes or three days.
Your edibles won't be nearly aspotent as they could be, and
I've done episodes ondecarboxylation which I will
also link in the show notes.
Then there's temperature Forinfusion.
(13:16):
You want your fat to be hotenough to efficiently dissolve
cannabinoids, but not so hotthat you start degrading them.
A gentle simmer, not a boil, isperfect, and you can aim for
around 160 degrees to 180degrees if you have a
thermometer and I have noticedthat's usually the temperature
that is set when I use myinfusion devices is 160 degrees
Fahrenheit typically.
Having said that, I almostnever actually check the
(13:39):
temperature of my infusions whenI'm doing them on the stove,
but that's another story.
There's the surface area, too,so you can break up your
decarbed cannabis into smallerbits.
If you didn't already do that,when you're decarboxylating it,
you don't need to grind it, youdon't need to pulverize it into
dust, but if you break it up, itwill improve extraction
efficiency.
(13:59):
Then there's stirring.
Regular gentle stirring helpsbring fresh fat into contact
with the plant material,speeding up the extraction
process.
Sometimes, when I'm doing myinfusions on the stove, I'll
just pick up the jar with anoven mitt, give it a little stir
and put it back into the water.
Some people do their infusionsa little bit differently.
When I'm doing it on the stove,I do it in a pot of water, and
(14:20):
I have my cannabis and the fatthat I'm using in a clean glass
jar in the pot of water, and Isimmer it.
That way, your technique mightbe a little bit different, but
the gentle stir remains the same.
Then there's your fat choice.
Some fats are better atdissolving cannabinoids than
others.
Coconut oil and butter arepopular choices because of their
(14:40):
high fat content.
I also recently did an episodeon why ghee makes a really good
fat for infusing, because italso has a very high fat content
MCT oil.
So if you're looking formaximum efficiency again, at the
end of the day, though, I thinkyou can just use whatever fat
that you are going to be usingfor whatever recipe you want to
be making.
(15:00):
I love having olive oil on hand, I've done avocado oil, I've
also done duck fat, and then, ofcourse, there's the ratio.
So using enough fat relative toyour cannabis is important.
A good starting ratio is maybea cup of fat to seven grams of
cannabis.
If you have a lower tolerance,you can always reduce that
amount as well, and be sure tofigure out the potency of that
(15:25):
afterwards using an onlinecalculator doing the math pen to
paper, that kind of thing.
So if you optimize for thosefactors, you'll get excellent
extraction in 30 minutes.
And here's a pro tip If youwant to be absolutely sure that
you're getting everything out,you could do a second wash with
fresh cannabis in the same fat,and that will add to the potency
(15:47):
and it's often more efficientstill than a long infusion still
than a long infusion.
So why should you care aboutthis?
What's the benefits of knowingthat 30 minutes is enough?
Well, there's a few.
There's several, first of all.
First and foremost, you'regoing to save time.
The most obvious benefit isthat you'll save hours of your
(16:10):
life, and if you make ediblesregularly, like I do, this adds
up to a lot of time that you canspend doing other things.
It might also mean that youdon't necessarily need to go out
and get a fancy infusion device.
I still use them prettyregularly, but keep in mind I
have a whole show about makingedibles.
If you can make an infusion onyour stove in 30 minutes, do you
(16:32):
really need that fancy infusiondevice?
And I say this as someone whoreally does love my devices.
But I don't want that to be abarrier to thinking they can
make great edibles at home.
Then there's better flavor, butlonger infusions will extract
more chlorophyll and plantcompounds that can make your
edibles taste green, and ashorter infusion can result in a
cleaner taste because it's justnot pulling out so much of that
(16:55):
stuff like the chlorophyll,plant compounds and all the
things that make it taste alittle grassy.
There's less risk ofcannabinoid degradation.
Thc can degrade when exposed toheat for extended periods.
By keeping your infusion timeshorter, you minimize the risk
of losing potency throughdegradation.
More consistent results withshorter, more controlled
(17:17):
processes you are likely to getmore consistent results from
batch to batch.
And of course, there's thelower energy use.
Less cooking time means lessenergy used, whether that's gas,
electricity or whatever heatsource you're using, and for
some folks this is a prettyimportant consideration.
I have friends in Europe whosay that their energy expenses
(17:38):
are a lot higher than what wemight be accustomed to where I
am.
So that is an importantconsideration and I want to
emphasize that.
I'm not saying you can't infusefor longer if you want to.
Like I mentioned, I still usemy infusion devices as well as
infusing on the stove, and ifyou have a method that works for
you and enjoy the ritual of along, slow infusion, by all
means continue.
(17:58):
Cooking should be enjoyable,but just know, scientifically
speaking, you're probably notgaining much potency after the
first minute 30 minutes if yourother variables are optimized.
Now, this is what I wanted tomention.
I did some experiments on my ownin my own home kitchen, and
here is what I found.
(18:18):
I was infusing flour into acouple of different fats, I did
olive oil and I did butter.
Now I did three and a halfgrams of three and a half grams.
It was a pretty.
They were pretty smallinfusions because I was going to
be doing a few of them, butthree and a half grams, it was a
pretty.
They were pretty smallinfusions because I was going to
be doing a few of them, butthree and a half grams into a
(18:38):
half cup of olive oil, and Ithink that was the first one
that I did.
I'm trying to find the pictureson my phone.
Why did I not get this outsooner?
And here is what happened.
So I did the method the sameway.
I did the pot of water on thestove when I put the three and a
half grams of cannabis in aclean glass jar with the half
cup of olive oil, and I did oneof those for 30 minutes and one
(19:01):
of those for two hours, and theresults were really interesting.
So so the one that was twohours, my extra virgin olive oil
infusion using decarbedcannabis, three and a half grams
to a half cup.
I got a result.
I used a tea check for this tomake it as official as possible.
In my experimentation I got 3.7milligrams per milliliter as a
(19:28):
result.
And then, when you compare thatto the 30 minute infusion of
extra virgin olive oil withthree and a half grams of
decarbed cannabis, I got 3.5milligrams per milliliters.
So by infusing it for anotherhour and a half, I had a net
return of 0.2 milligrams permilliliter.
(19:49):
So I did the same thing withbutter.
I think I did the butter onefirst.
I did the butter one first andI did the same thing.
Let me see here.
I did a bigger infusion becauseit was a CBD infusion and it
was the same thing.
In this case I used seven gramsof cannabis to 127 grams of
(20:15):
butter, using the same processesbefore.
127 grams is about a quarterpound of butter to seven grams
of cannabis and, if I recallcorrectly, it was a CBD
Charlotte's Angel cannabisinfusion.
Because I'd like to have CBDinfusions on hand as much as THC
infusions, I did a two hourinfusion and a 30 minute
(20:37):
infusion.
For the two hour infusion I gota result of 3.2 milligrams per
milliliter.
The 30 minute infusion, threemilligrams per milliliter a
difference of 0.2 milligrams permilliliter.
Once again, that hour and ahalf extra time netted me 0.2
milligrams per milliliter extranot a whole lot, which suggests
(21:00):
that you can really do saveyourself the time.
I thought that was reallyinteresting.
I'm going to be trying theexperiment with the next fat
infusion that I try because I dobelieve I wanted.
I do want to try it with thebeef tallow that I picked up.
I also tried it with thetinctures as well.
The results were a little bitdifferent with that, but of
course alcohol is a completelydifferent infusion medium.
I did a 10 minute tincturewhich gave me 2.6 milligrams per
(21:24):
milliliter, and then a 24 hourtincture doubled that 5.3
milligrams per milliliter.
Now I have a freezer tincturein right now that I'll be taking
out in a few days and I'll beinterested to see how much extra
milligrams per milliliter I getfor that one.
But leaving the tincture for anextra several hours in that
(21:44):
case did net double almostdouble the infusion potency.
But if you're looking to makesomething really quick and you
want it to be alcohol-based, youcan extract out cannabinoids in
just 10 minutes.
So that's really good to know.
If you want to make somethingquick, you have friends over,
you're doing something, anexperiment in the kitchen.
(22:04):
So those are my own personalexperiments with trying this.
So there you have it.
There is the science-backed casefor why you don't need to spend
hours infusing your cannabis ifyou don't want to.
The research clearly shows thatwith the right conditions, a
30-minute infusion can extractcannabinoids just as effectively
as longer methods.
I'll keep you up to date onthat as I continue with my own
(22:26):
experiments in the kitchen.
And you remember cannabis,cooking is both an art and a
science.
That's what makes it sointeresting.
The science tells us thatcannabinoid extraction reaches
equilibrium relatively quickly,but the art is in finding the
method and flavors that workbest for you and then using
those infusions into somethingcreative that you're going to
enjoy and that you're going towant to share with friends and
(22:48):
family.
So I hope this episode makesyou more efficient, consistent,
and that you end up with moreenjoyable edibles.
And if you've been spendinghours on infusions, you've just
gotten a big chunk of your lifeback, so use it wisely.
Maybe consider joining us atthe Bite Me Cannabis Club, where
I'm sure we'll be talking aboutthis more in depth.
Thank you for listening to BiteMe.
(23:09):
I hope you enjoyed this episode.
As always, I am your host,margaret, and until next time,
my friends, stay high.
Welcome, friends, to episode 301.
Today, we're talking aboutinfusion times and why you may
be infusing for longer than youneed to, and the science behind
it.
Stay tuned.
Welcome to Bite Me, the showabout edibles, where I help you
take control of your high life.
I'm your host and certifiedgongja, margaret, and I love
helping cooks make safe andeffective edibles at home.
(00:27):
I'm so glad you're here and weare back, friends.
Welcome to the podcast thatexplores the intersection of
food culture and cannabis.
I am your host, margaret, and Ijust want to say thank you,
friends, for being here.
If you're joining us for thefirst time, this is going to be
a great episode for you to tuneinto, because I'm going to save
you some time in the kitchenwhile you're still making great
(00:49):
edibles at home, which is whatthis podcast is all about.
And if you've been listeningfor a while, I'm going to save
you some time as well, and I amexcited about the topic of
today's episode.
So, please, please, enjoywhat's to come Now, before we do
get into today's episode.
As per the usual, I often liketo do something fun beforehand
and, as I've had no reviewslately, hint, hint, nudge, nudge
(01:12):
if you feel like leaving afive-star rating or review, it
would be much appreciated.
Or share this episode withsomeone that you care about,
because sharing is caring, and Ithink this information needs to
go to more people.
But in any case, before we getinto the main topic of today's
episode, I'm going to do astoner trivia question.
I'm going to pick a card fromthe deck at random, and the
(01:37):
stoner trivia question today isa movie question.
So for all you movie buffs outthere, bridget Fonda plays a
sexy stoner in what QuentinTarantino film Jackie Brown,
kill Bill, single White Femaleor True Romance?
That is a question that I wouldnot be able to answer with
(01:59):
confidence if I didn't alreadyknow the answer.
So the question is BridgetFonda plays a sexy stoner in one
Quentin Tarantino film JackieBrown, kill Bill, single white
female or true romance?
Now, if you guessed JackieBrown, you would be correct.
You can now give yourself agood pat on the back and reward
(02:20):
yourself with an edible orsomething to smoke or vape on me
.
So please go ahead and do that,and if you haven't already
settled in to listen to thisepisode with something tasty,
then by all means please do sonow.
Of course, what I've been makinglately is popcorn.
(02:40):
I have been obsessed withpopcorn ever since I made that
popcorn for the episode.
Recently I've been making a lotinfused, non-infused, both, it
doesn't really matter.
I've been loving popcorn.
There's something magical aboutmaking it in a pot.
It still gives me thrills.
And there's a local shop whereI pick up a lot of fruits and
(03:00):
vegetables from area farmers andthey have all these different
types of popcorn popping.
How many times can I saypopcorn in one episode?
This is one of these.
Drink your cannabis infusedbeverage.
Every time I say popcorn, thenyou would be getting pretty high
right now.
But in any case, the storecarries a surprisingly large
variety of GMO free popping cornand the different types are.
(03:24):
It's kind of interesting to trythe different types.
I've noticed differencesbetween them.
What I'm on right now is thishull-less variety.
I have been really obsessingwith popcorn and I'm probably
going to make those popcorntreats again sometime soon
because they're really good andI'm going to be going in a few
weeks.
Actually, at the time of thisrecording is only a couple of
weeks away, camp Canna.
At the time of this recordingis only a couple of weeks away,
(03:47):
camp Cana, and that is an adultsummer camp for stoners of all
types.
All are welcome and I'm reallylooking forward to that.
The only thing I hope is thatwe have great weather.
I went last year.
It was a blast.
Who knew that I was so good atarchery?
But the weather here lately hasbeen pretty rainy this spring
and I just hope that that doesnot extend to the weekend at
(04:07):
Camp Cana, because that would bea bit of a disappointment.
Canadians wait so long for goodweather, so long In any case.
That's what's exciting as faras what's coming up, and of
course, there are always new funthings happening in the Bite Me
Cannabis Club.
I can show you more over atjoinbitemecom and I have been
(04:31):
there a lot and I'm really proudof the community that we're
building over there.
There's some really wonderfulpeople who are contributing and
making it a really special place, and I would love to have you
there with me so we can talkfurther about all wonderful
things around cannabis.
(04:52):
This episode was really inspiredby Vanessa Lavorato, author of
how to Eat Weed and have a GoodTime, and she was on my podcast
very recently.
If you haven't listened to thatepisode yet, I highly recommend
it because there's a lot ofreally good information in that
episode.
One of the things we talkedabout was how infusion times are
much longer than they need toand how you may be wasting your
time a little bit, and I hate tosay that.
(05:13):
I mean, I've been doing thesame myself, and so I decided to
do a couple of experiments onmy own in my own home kitchen,
and I was really interested tosee what those results were.
We're going to take a big biteout of cannabis cooking myths
and serve up the science behindbetter edibles and, as you
(05:36):
already know, I'm your host,margaret, and today we are
tackling a persistent myth incannabis cooking, and I don't
even know if it's a persistentmyth.
It's just sort of whateverybody has done to this point
or thinks that they need to do,and it's the idea that you need
to infuse your butter or oilfor hours on end to get maximum
potency.
You've probably heard it beforeyou need to simmer butter or
(05:57):
oil for at least a couple ofhours to get all the good stuff
out, and I'm here to tell youthat I have learned.
The science says otherwise, andwe're going to explain why.
A 30 minute infusion canextract just as many
cannabinoids as a two hourmarathon session and we'll dive
into the chemistry behind thecannabinoid extraction.
Look at what the researchactually shows and save you
(06:20):
hours of unnecessary cookingtime.
Like I said, I want to saythank you to Vanessa, who
pointed this out not only in herbook, but also in our episode
together, which is what reallygot the wheels turning in my own
mind of like, how can I savetime?
Because we're all busy and ifyou'd like to make edibles at
home, being able to fit itbetter into your schedule will
make it easier to make them whenyou want them.
(06:43):
So, whether you're a seasonededible enthusiast or you're just
curious about making your firstbatch of can of butter, stick
around and in the next 20minutes you are going to learn
how to work smarter, not harder,when it comes to your cannabis
infusions.
So let's start with the bigquestion when did the idea come
(07:05):
from that?
I mean, that's what I've alwaysdone up to this point, and if
any infusion device that I havealso believes in this theory as
well.
I have three infusion devices Ihave an Ardent, I have a Levo 2,
and I have a Magical ButterMachine and they all infuse for
about two hours and, like manycooking traditions, it seems to
(07:27):
be a mix of folk wisdom,cautious overkill and a
misunderstanding of theunderlying science.
Now, back in the day, beforecooking with cannabis was
studied scientifically, peoplewere just trying things out in
their kitchen.
If somebody made a batch ofbrownies that didn't hit very
hard, they might think, well,maybe I just didn't cook the
infusion for long enough, andnext time they'd infuse for
longer.
And if that batch seemed morepotent whether due to longer
(07:50):
infusion time or just becausethey used better cannabis that
idea would stick, which kind ofmakes sense.
It's also worth noting that inthe prohibition area, most
people were making edibles withplant material that wasn't
exactly what you considerpremium, and they might be using
shake, trim or low qualitycannabis which could potentially
benefit from longer extractiontimes to compensate for the
(08:13):
lower potency.
That is something I haven'ttried in my own home kitchen yet
, but I will be, hopefully afterthis season of my outdoor grow,
which is going beautifully, as,as we speak, I'm optimistic.
It's early days, but I'll havesome trim, hopefully at the end
of that season, so I can see howthat works for infusion times
(08:33):
as well.
I'm going to be testing thatout.
But here's the thing we are notin prohibition area anymore,
and even if you live in a placewhere it's still prohibited, the
attitudes are really changingeven in those places.
So we still have access tobetter cannabis, better
equipment and, most importantly,actual scientific research on
how cannabinoid extraction works.
(08:54):
What does that research tell us?
That, with the right conditions, 30 minutes is plenty of time
to extract the cannabinoids thatyou want To understand why
short infusions can be just aseffective as long ones.
You need to understand a bitabout the science of extraction,
but don't worry, we'll keepthis.
Digestible.
Canninoids like thc and cbd arefat soluble.
(09:16):
That means they dissolvereadily into fats and oils, but
not in water, and this is why weinfuse cannabis into butter,
coconut oil, olive oil, allthose other fatty substances,
rather than just trying to make,say, cannabis tea with just
water.
When you heat cannabis in a fatsource, you're creating the
perfect environment for thosecannabinoids to leave the plant
material and dissolve into thefat, and this process is
(09:37):
governed by a few key factors.
One is temperature Heat speedsup the extraction process by
making the cannabinoids moremobile.
Two is surface area, andbreaking up your cannabis
increases the surface areaexposed to the fat and I don't
like to say grinding, because Ifind that grinding is a bit
overkill.
In my opinion, agitationstirring helps bring fresh fat
(10:00):
into contact with the plantmaterial and the fat itself.
Different fats have differentabilities to dissolve
cannabinoids, though at the endof the day, I think you just
need to infuse the fats that youwant to use in your own cooking
.
But did you notice what's not onthat list?
Time Beyond a certain point.
So let me explain why.
(10:21):
Extraction is what scientistscall an equilibrium process.
The cannabinoids will move froman area of high concentration
the plant to an area of lowconcentration the fat until they
reach a balance.
Once that equilibrium isreached, you can keep cooking
for hours, but you won't extractsignificantly more cannabinoids
(10:41):
.
So don't just take my word forit.
Let's look at what thescientific research actually
shows.
There's a fascinating studypublished in the Journal of
Molecules in 2022, which I canalso link in the show notes of
this episode over onbitemepodcastcom and it examined
cold ethanol extraction ofcannabinoids.
The researchers used asophisticated experimental
(11:04):
design to test differentextraction times, ranging from
about six minutes to 34 minutes,and what did they find?
The optimal extraction time wasjust 10 minutes.
At that point, they achievedextraction efficiencies of up to
102% at room temperature and97.7% at colder temperatures.
(11:26):
Wait, but how can you get morethan 100% extraction?
Well, that's likely due tosmall measurement variations,
but the point is clear theyextracted essentially all of the
available cannabinoids in just10 minutes.
Another study published in theArabian Journal of Chemistry
found that varying sonicationtime between 10 and 30 minutes
did not significantly affect theCBD and THC contents extracted.
(11:48):
In other words, once they hitthe 10 minute mark, continuing
to 30 minutes didn'tmeaningfully increase the amount
of cannabinoids.
They got out.
A comprehensive review inFrontiers in Natural Products
examined industrial cannabinoidextraction techniques and found
that contact time was just oneof the many factors affecting
extraction efficiency, and noteven the most important one.
(12:10):
Factors like solvent choice,temperature and the ratio of
solvent to plant material had amuch bigger impact on how much
of the cannabinoids wereextracted.
Now I know some of you might bethinking, but these studies use
specialized equipment andsolvents, not just a pot on my
stove with some butter.
And that's true.
But the underlying chemistry isthe same.
If professional extraction canhappen in 10 to 30 minutes with
(12:33):
the right conditions, your homeinfusion doesn't magically need
four times longer.
If time isn't the most criticalfactor.
What should you be focusing oninstead?
Here are the factors thatactually make a difference in
your infusion potency.
Decarboxylation this is theprocess of heating raw cannabis
(12:53):
to convert THCA into THC, andit's separate from the infusion
process and is crucial.
If you skip proper decarb, itdoesn't matter if you infuse for
30 minutes or three days.
Your edibles won't be nearly aspotent as they could be, and
I've done episodes ondecarboxylation which I will
also link in the show notes.
Then there's temperature Forinfusion.
(13:16):
You want your fat to be hotenough to efficiently dissolve
cannabinoids, but not so hotthat you start degrading them.
A gentle simmer, not a boil, isperfect, and you can aim for
around 160 degrees to 180degrees if you have a
thermometer and I have noticedthat's usually the temperature
that is set when I use myinfusion devices is 160 degrees
Fahrenheit typically.
Having said that, I almostnever actually check the
(13:39):
temperature of my infusions whenI'm doing them on the stove,
but that's another story.
There's the surface area, too,so you can break up your
decarbed cannabis into smallerbits.
If you didn't already do that,when you're decarboxylating it,
you don't need to grind it, youdon't need to pulverize it into
dust, but if you break it up, itwill improve extraction
efficiency.
(13:59):
Then there's stirring.
Regular gentle stirring helpsbring fresh fat into contact
with the plant material,speeding up the extraction
process.
Sometimes, when I'm doing myinfusions on the stove, I'll
just pick up the jar with anoven mitt, give it a little stir
and put it back into the water.
Some people do their infusionsa little bit differently.
When I'm doing it on the stove,I do it in a pot of water, and
(14:20):
I have my cannabis and the fatthat I'm using in a clean glass
jar in the pot of water, and Isimmer it.
That way, your technique mightbe a little bit different, but
the gentle stir remains the same.
Then there's your fat choice.
Some fats are better atdissolving cannabinoids than
others.
Coconut oil and butter arepopular choices because of their
(14:40):
high fat content.
I also recently did an episodeon why ghee makes a really good
fat for infusing, because italso has a very high fat content
MCT oil.
So if you're looking formaximum efficiency again, at the
end of the day, though, I thinkyou can just use whatever fat
that you are going to be usingfor whatever recipe you want to
be making.
(15:00):
I love having olive oil on hand, I've done avocado oil, I've
also done duck fat, and then, ofcourse, there's the ratio.
So using enough fat relative toyour cannabis is important.
A good starting ratio is maybea cup of fat to seven grams of
cannabis.
If you have a lower tolerance,you can always reduce that
amount as well, and be sure tofigure out the potency of that
(15:25):
afterwards using an onlinecalculator doing the math pen to
paper, that kind of thing.
So if you optimize for thosefactors, you'll get excellent
extraction in 30 minutes.
And here's a pro tip If youwant to be absolutely sure that
you're getting everything out,you could do a second wash with
fresh cannabis in the same fat,and that will add to the potency
(15:47):
and it's often more efficientstill than a long infusion still
than a long infusion.
So why should you care aboutthis?
What's the benefits of knowingthat 30 minutes is enough?
Well, there's a few.
There's several, first of all.
First and foremost, you'regoing to save time.
The most obvious benefit isthat you'll save hours of your
(16:10):
life, and if you make ediblesregularly, like I do, this adds
up to a lot of time that you canspend doing other things.
It might also mean that youdon't necessarily need to go out
and get a fancy infusion device.
I still use them prettyregularly, but keep in mind I
have a whole show about makingedibles.
If you can make an infusion onyour stove in 30 minutes, do you
(16:32):
really need that fancy infusiondevice?
And I say this as someone whoreally does love my devices.
But I don't want that to be abarrier to thinking they can
make great edibles at home.
Then there's better flavor, butlonger infusions will extract
more chlorophyll and plantcompounds that can make your
edibles taste green, and ashorter infusion can result in a
cleaner taste because it's justnot pulling out so much of that
(16:55):
stuff like the chlorophyll,plant compounds and all the
things that make it taste alittle grassy.
There's less risk ofcannabinoid degradation.
Thc can degrade when exposed toheat for extended periods.
By keeping your infusion timeshorter, you minimize the risk
of losing potency throughdegradation.
More consistent results withshorter, more controlled
(17:17):
processes you are likely to getmore consistent results from
batch to batch.
And of course, there's thelower energy use.
Less cooking time means lessenergy used, whether that's gas,
electricity or whatever heatsource you're using, and for
some folks this is a prettyimportant consideration.
I have friends in Europe whosay that their energy expenses
(17:38):
are a lot higher than what wemight be accustomed to where I
am.
So that is an importantconsideration and I want to
emphasize that.
I'm not saying you can't infusefor longer if you want to.
Like I mentioned, I still usemy infusion devices as well as
infusing on the stove, and ifyou have a method that works for
you and enjoy the ritual of along, slow infusion, by all
means continue.
(17:58):
Cooking should be enjoyable,but just know, scientifically
speaking, you're probably notgaining much potency after the
first minute 30 minutes if yourother variables are optimized.
Now, this is what I wanted tomention.
I did some experiments on my ownin my own home kitchen, and
here is what I found.
(18:18):
I was infusing flour into acouple of different fats, I did
olive oil and I did butter.
Now I did three and a halfgrams of three and a half grams.
It was a pretty.
They were pretty smallinfusions because I was going to
be doing a few of them, butthree and a half grams, it was a
pretty.
They were pretty smallinfusions because I was going to
be doing a few of them, butthree and a half grams into a
(18:38):
half cup of olive oil, and Ithink that was the first one
that I did.
I'm trying to find the pictureson my phone.
Why did I not get this outsooner?
And here is what happened.
So I did the method the sameway.
I did the pot of water on thestove when I put the three and a
half grams of cannabis in aclean glass jar with the half
cup of olive oil, and I did oneof those for 30 minutes and one
(19:01):
of those for two hours, and theresults were really interesting.
So so the one that was twohours, my extra virgin olive oil
infusion using decarbedcannabis, three and a half grams
to a half cup.
I got a result.
I used a tea check for this tomake it as official as possible.
In my experimentation I got 3.7milligrams per milliliter as a
(19:28):
result.
And then, when you compare thatto the 30 minute infusion of
extra virgin olive oil withthree and a half grams of
decarbed cannabis, I got 3.5milligrams per milliliters.
So by infusing it for anotherhour and a half, I had a net
return of 0.2 milligrams permilliliter.
(19:49):
So I did the same thing withbutter.
I think I did the butter onefirst.
I did the butter one first andI did the same thing.
Let me see here.
I did a bigger infusion becauseit was a CBD infusion and it
was the same thing.
In this case I used seven gramsof cannabis to 127 grams of
(20:15):
butter, using the same processesbefore.
127 grams is about a quarterpound of butter to seven grams
of cannabis and, if I recallcorrectly, it was a CBD
Charlotte's Angel cannabisinfusion.
Because I'd like to have CBDinfusions on hand as much as THC
infusions, I did a two hourinfusion and a 30 minute
(20:37):
infusion.
For the two hour infusion I gota result of 3.2 milligrams per
milliliter.
The 30 minute infusion, threemilligrams per milliliter a
difference of 0.2 milligrams permilliliter.
Once again, that hour and ahalf extra time netted me 0.2
milligrams per milliliter extranot a whole lot, which suggests
(21:00):
that you can really do saveyourself the time.
I thought that was reallyinteresting.
I'm going to be trying theexperiment with the next fat
infusion that I try because I dobelieve I wanted.
I do want to try it with thebeef tallow that I picked up.
I also tried it with thetinctures as well.
The results were a little bitdifferent with that, but of
course alcohol is a completelydifferent infusion medium.
I did a 10 minute tincturewhich gave me 2.6 milligrams per
(21:24):
milliliter, and then a 24 hourtincture doubled that 5.3
milligrams per milliliter.
Now I have a freezer tincturein right now that I'll be taking
out in a few days and I'll beinterested to see how much extra
milligrams per milliliter I getfor that one.
But leaving the tincture for anextra several hours in that
(21:44):
case did net double almostdouble the infusion potency.
But if you're looking to makesomething really quick and you
want it to be alcohol-based, youcan extract out cannabinoids in
just 10 minutes.
So that's really good to know.
If you want to make somethingquick, you have friends over,
you're doing something, anexperiment in the kitchen.
(22:04):
So those are my own personalexperiments with trying this.
So there you have it.
There is the science-backed casefor why you don't need to spend
hours infusing your cannabis ifyou don't want to.
The research clearly shows thatwith the right conditions, a
30-minute infusion can extractcannabinoids just as effectively
as longer methods.
I'll keep you up to date onthat as I continue with my own
(22:26):
experiments in the kitchen.
And you remember cannabis,cooking is both an art and a
science.
That's what makes it sointeresting.
The science tells us thatcannabinoid extraction reaches
equilibrium relatively quickly,but the art is in finding the
method and flavors that workbest for you and then using
those infusions into somethingcreative that you're going to
enjoy and that you're going towant to share with friends and
(22:48):
family.
So I hope this episode makesyou more efficient, consistent,
and that you end up with moreenjoyable edibles.
And if you've been spendinghours on infusions, you've just
gotten a big chunk of your lifeback, so use it wisely.
Maybe consider joining us atthe Bite Me Cannabis Club, where
I'm sure we'll be talking aboutthis more in depth.
Thank you for listening to BiteMe.
(23:09):
I hope you enjoyed this episode.
As always, I am your host,margaret, and until next time,
my friends, stay high.
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