The battle against premature aging begins with a single, crucial step—applying sunscreen daily. But with countless options flooding the market, how do you select one that's not only effective but also something you'll actually use consistently?
Two seasoned plastic surgeons, Dr. Sam Rhee and Dr. Lawrence Tong @yorkvilleplasticsurgery, cut through the noise with clarity that only comes from years of treating facial aging. Unlike many "dermatologist-recommended" lists that rarely consider practical usability, these surgeons deliver straightforward guidance grounded in both science and real-world application.
We dive deep into the differences between mineral and chemical sunscreens, exploring how UVA rays (the aging culprits) penetrate clouds and glass, silently damaging your skin even on overcast days or during your daily commute. As Dr. Tong soberly notes, "Once you get beyond a certain amount of sun damage, you cannot reverse that. No surgery, no lasers, no creams, no peels can fix that."
Beyond reviewing traditional favorites like La Roche-Posay and Elta MD, the conversation ventures into emerging alternatives from Asian and European markets that utilize advanced UV filters without the endocrine-disrupting concerns of conventional chemical options. These innovative formulations promise the cosmetic elegance people crave without compromising protection or environmental safety.
The best sunscreen is simply the one you'll use consistently. Whether you're bothered by white cast, concerned about chemical absorption, or seeking something that works seamlessly under makeup, this comprehensive guide helps you navigate options aligned with your personal priorities.
Ready to transform your relationship with sun protection? Listen now to discover how this small daily habit creates profound long-term benefits for your skin's health and appearance.
#SPF #Sunscreen #SkinCare #SunProtection #PlasticSurgery #HealthySkin #AgingGracefully #BeautyTips #UVProtection #DailySunscreen
#PerformanceEnhancement #HealthyLiving #GymLife #CrossFit #SportsNutrition #FitnessJourney #BotoxAndBurpees #podcast @botoxandburpeespodcast
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
All right, welcome to another episode of Botox and
Burpees.
I'm your host, sam Rhee, and Ihave with me my very special
guest, dr Lawrence Tong, fromToronto, canada.
You may have seen him on ourother podcast, three Plastic
Surgeons and a Fourth, whichunfortunately is going to be on
hiatus for a while, and so whilethat podcast is sort of in
(00:29):
limbo, I thought I would bringon LT, as he is affectionately
known, to talk about a coupletopics.
I've known LT since we wereresidents.
We trained together.
He was my chief at Universityof Michigan.
He is one of the most talentedplastic surgeons I know, and he
(00:51):
is also a Canadian, which meanshe right now is probably a lot
less controversial than maybesome of us Americans here right
now.
But anyway, all right to thetopic.
Our topic today is five bestfacial SPF sunscreens.
And why would you want tolisten to a couple plastic
(01:11):
surgeons talk about sunscreens?
Well, I'll tell you why Becausewhen I was looking up
sunscreens for myself, I noticedthat there were a bunch that
were quote dermatologistsrecommended, which is great.
However, when I looked at them,three of them are ones that I
really don't think are thatawesome if you have certain
considerations that areimportant to you in regards to
(01:33):
your health.
So I wanted to recruit anotherplastic surgeon to talk about
this, because I think in someways, we do see, similarly, a
lot of patients that have tonsof problems in terms of facial
aging.
We manage facial aging.
We do, obviously, facelifts,neck lifts, brow lifts, eye
(01:55):
lifts and in doing so, we alsogive a lot of recommendations in
terms of how patients canminimize aging, how they can
slow, prevent, treat some ofthese issues and in some ways, I
think we might be a little morepractical than some of the
dermatologists out there when itcomes to finding something that
(02:15):
works in terms of a sunscreenthat is best for you.
This show is not a substitutefor professional medical advice,
diagnosis or treatment.
It's for informational purposesonly.
Treatments and results may varybased on the circumstances,
situation and medical judgment.
After appropriate discussion,always seek the advice of your
surgeon or other qualifiedhealth care provider with any
questions you may have regardingmedical care, and never
(02:36):
disregard professional medicaladvice or delay seeking medical
advice for something in thisshow.
So why do we need sunscreen?
It's one of those things thatis obvious, but maybe the
details about it are not soobvious.
So, larry, let's talk a littlebit about SPF sun protection and
(02:59):
what sun exposure does to ourskin.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
All right.
So sun exposure is ultravioletradiation and that can have
effects on the skin that areundesired.
And basically, when we'retalking about ultraviolet rays
that affect the skin, we'reusually talking about UVA and
UVB, that's, ultraviolet A andultraviolet B, and they're
(03:26):
different because theycontribute to different types of
changes to the skin.
So UVA is a longer wavelengthultraviolet ray and it
penetrates deeply into thedermis, and this is the one that
causes photoaging, that is,wrinkling, loss of elasticity
and age spots.
(03:46):
It also contributes toformation of skin cancer and
creates oxidative stress, whichis creation of free radicals.
So what that means is that ifyou are exposed to UVA for a
cumulative period of time, youwill start looking older, and I
think it's very important tostress to everybody that once
(04:10):
you get beyond a certain amountof sun damage, you cannot
reverse that.
No surgery, no lasers, nocreams, no peels can fix that.
So it's very important topreserve what you have and
protect yourself against the sun.
So, anyways, uva is also a typeof radiation that can penetrate
(04:36):
clouds and glass, like in a car.
So for people who think that ifit's a cloudy day, they don't
need to wear sunscreen, that'sfalse.
It will still affect you.
So even on days where it doesnot look sunny, it is important
to wear sunscreen.
The other type of radiation isUVB.
This is a shorter wavelengthand this primarily affects the
(05:00):
epidermis, which is the skinsurface.
This is the type of radiationthat causes burning of the skin,
that gives you the sunburns,and this does not penetrate as
much, but this can.
Sorry.
This type of radiation is moreimportant for causing skin
(05:21):
cancers.
So both of these types ofultraviolet radiation are
harmful to you.
And you know, as plasticsurgeons we do not recommend
tanning of any type, because inthe long run you're going to pay
for it.
You're not going to be happywith it.
In the short term, when you'reyoung, you think nothing's going
to happen and it makes you lookbetter.
But in the long run, and makesyou look better, but in the long
(05:42):
run, it's not a good thing.
So it's very, very important tostress protection from the sun
for the short term and for thelong term.
Speaker 1 (06:00):
Absolutely, and I think a lot of the tanning
salons use primarily UVA, so youdon't necessarily feel a burn
like you do, because there'svery little UVB.
But in terms of aging, as yousaid, in terms of skin cancer
risk, it's terrible, terriblefor your skin, as you mentioned,
and so I think for everyone,sunscreen use has to be sort of
part of your daily regimen.
Don't feel like this issomething you need to not wear.
(06:23):
On certain days, like youmentioned, because it's cloudy
or because you don't see a lotof sunlight, like you will
experience more sun damage thanyou think, even on a day where
you don't see any bright sun.
So for sure that that wearingof daily sunscreen should be a
(06:43):
must for everybody, and sothat's why finding the sunscreen
that works for you, the bestsunscreen honestly is the one
that you're going to wear everyday.
It might be the best rated, itmight be awesome and everyone
loves it, but if you don't likethat sunscreen and you don't
wear it, then it's useless.
So let's help you find asunscreen that works for you.
(07:05):
There are really two types ofskin protectants here mineral
sunscreens and chemicalsunscreens.
So let's talk a little bitabout mineral sunscreens.
What are the mineral sunscreens, larry?
That?
Speaker 2 (07:16):
are offered.
So in general, mineralsunscreens are sunscreens that
reflect or disperse the lightthat comes to your skin, and you
know these are mainlyingredients like zinc oxide and
titanium dioxide.
The advantages of mineralsunscreen is that they work
(07:37):
immediately once you put them onand they're good for sensitive
skin.
There's less irritation andallergic reaction and it's
FDA-recognized as safe and itgives good UVA and UVB
protection.
For environmental concerns,it's typically safe for marine
ecosystems, because some of thechemicals in the chemical
(07:59):
sunscreens have actually beenshown to be harmful to marine
ecosystems.
There are some concerns aboutmineral sunscreens and Sam, if
you want to discuss those a bit.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Yeah.
The one thing that people hateis the white pasty look, and I
know that a lot of parents willslap mineral sunscreens like you
said, titanium dioxide or zincoxide on their kids because they
don't care what their kids looklike.
They just look like these whiteballs of powdery white paste on
them.
But they won't use that forthemselves because it looks
(08:34):
crappy, it's thick, it can begreasy, it's hard to put on
because of the texture and ifyou sweat or if you just kind of
physically wipe it off it it,you lose that protection.
So I feel like I have usedmineral sunscreens quite a bit
in the past and I I just feellike it's that those cons, and
(09:00):
especially in terms of the whitepasty texture, turns off a lot
of people like I know mydaughter, my wife they will
never use a mineral sunscreenjust because it just makes them
look like a ghost.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Yeah, and you're exactly right, it's mainly
relegated to children.
But there are, you know, we'lltalk about it later but there
are hybrids and differentformulations of the mineral
(09:35):
sunscreens that make them alittle bit more palatable.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
They all have terrible names that I can't ever
remember Avobenzone, oxybenzone, oxinoate, no so octinoxate,
homosalate, octisalate, and soall of these are chemicals that
block ultraviolet radiation andthe biggest problem, which you
mentioned?
(09:59):
Well, there are a couple bigproblems, so one of them is that
they have endocrine disruptingactivity, which S Virgin Islands
and Mexico because of that, andthose include oxybenzone and
(10:30):
octinoxate, so most sunscreensdon't include those two, but the
other three homosalate,avobenzone and octisalate are
still present in a lot ofsunscreens and they are still
considered at moderate or atsome risk in terms of endocrine
hormonal disruptive effects.
(10:51):
So how do you feel aboutchemical sunscreens and what do
you recommend to your patientsin terms of them?
Speaker 2 (10:59):
Dr.
Well, basically you should tryto tailor the sunscreen to
whatever the patient's needs are.
So one of the things that is apro with the chemical sunscreens
is that it just looks betterwhen you put it on.
So if somebody is consciousabout their appearance, then
(11:23):
you're probably going to headtowards a chemical sunscreen.
But if you have sensitive orreactive skin, then you're
probably better suited formineral-based sunscreens.
And you know, like you said atthe beginning, the one that
you're going to use is the onethat's going to give you the
best protection.
And if you have concerns aboutenvironmental concerns, a
(11:47):
mineral-based formulationreduces the ecological impact,
but you want to have a sunscreenthat has what's called
broad-spectrum protection.
When you hear about SPF SPFrating that people talk about is
that it only applies to UVB.
So when you're using asunscreen, you need to use one
(12:12):
that's designated as broadspectrum and that will cover
both UVA and UVB.
And with the chemicalsunscreens, you have to apply it
about 20 minutes, half an hour,before you actually go into the
sun, because they don't workimmediately.
So there's a number of factorsthat are used in deciding which
(12:35):
sunscreen to use and, Sam, Iknow you have a list of
sunscreens that have beendermatologically recommended and
I wonder if you could go oversome of those and how you feel
about them.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
Yeah, so let's talk about them.
You're absolutely right.
The best sunscreen is the onethat you use regularly and I
have used chemical sunscreens mywhole life.
I like them because I don'tlike the pasty look.
I've tried the pure mineralsunscreens and they just don't
look awesome.
And oftentimes I will justweigh the benefit risk about
(13:16):
chemical sunscreens and, likeyou said, the benefit of having
them not look terrible on me andthe ease of use.
I just like spraying them on or, you know, applying a stick to
my face and it's good, I'm goodto go.
But, as you've mentioned, thereare a couple.
Let's talk about the ones.
But I think we're going to havea couple alternatives that I
(13:37):
think now have come out whichmight actually provide the
benefit of a chemical sunscreenwithout all of these concerns
that people have raised aboutendocrine disruption, reef
safety, all of that.
There are two that are purelymineral based that
dermatologists have recommendedin general and if you like these
two, you're probably you shouldstick with them.
(13:59):
I think they work great.
I've used one of them and Ithink they're better than most
of the mineral sunscreens outthere.
The two that I've seen are LaRoche-Posay Antihelios Mineral
Tinted Sunscreen, spf 50.
This is a pure mineralsunscreen zinc oxide, titanium
(14:21):
dioxide.
It's slightly tinted to helpminimize that white cast and
it's ideal for sensitive skin.
And I have tried this one.
I like it.
The tint.
It doesn't really workperfectly for me, but out of all
the mineral sunscreens outthere I think this one is
reasonable.
Speaker 2 (14:39):
So I'm curious.
Well, I've never used thatbefore, but what does the tint
look like?
Is it supposed to be less white?
Speaker 1 (14:48):
Yes, it's like slightly brownish, I guess.
But, I kind of have brownishskin and it doesn't really match
, so it looks off on me like Ilook sick or something I don't
know.
I don't look healthy, it looks alittle odd.
I don't know, I don't lookhealthy, it looks a little odd.
The other one is VanicreamMineral Sunscreen SPF 30.
(15:08):
And this one is supposedly Ihaven't tried it, but supposedly
ideal for eczema or reactiveskin.
It's dye free, fragrance free,paraben free and it's also pure
zinc oxide and so it you know.
I think that that probablyworks better for some sensitive
skins.
(15:29):
Uh, the other thing it doescontain is ceramides for barrier
repair, and I have used lotionswith and without ceramides and
I would say, for some peopleceramides cause them to break
out and for other people they'retotally fine with it.
I think it really depends.
Like, I think CeraVe or Cerev,I don't know how you pronounce
(15:51):
it has ceramides and I've usedthat a lot in my practice, like
post-treatment, and some peoplejust break out with ceramides.
So I think you should try it,see if you like it.
The zinc oxide formulationmight be a little bit more easy
for your skin if you're someonewho tends to break out.
Speaker 2 (16:09):
Yeah, the Vanicream is a brand that we actually used
on our kids and seemed prettygood.
It did make them look a littlebit white, but you know they're
kids who cares.
Good sun protection isimportant.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
That's right Now, the three that the dermatologists
have recommended in general.
Now, these three are bothmineral plus chemical sunscreen
combinations, and the first oneI have also tried is Elta MD UV
Clear Face Sunscreen, and thisis both a mineral plus chemical
(16:46):
UV clear face sunscreen and thisis both a mineral plus chemical
.
It has micronized zinc andniacinamide plus octinoxate in a
7.5% formulation, and it's verynice in the sense that the zinc
is micronized so it's lesslikely to have this pasty
texture to it, have this likepasty texture to it.
(17:09):
Um, that, if you like niacin,niacinamide, it is, for a lot of
people, anti-inflammatory.
Um, if you are prone to acne orrosacea, it can be helpful in
terms of calming the skin.
Um, but uh, and they say nowhite cast, but I mean like
that's all relative.
I think I have a pretty darkcomplexion and so it does
lighten my skin when I put thaton there.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
Yeah, I've used the Elta MD.
I think all the sunscreens tosome extent, even the chemical
ones, give you some sort ofwhitish cast.
You just have to take some timeto sort of rub it in.
But the Elta MD is a goodproduct.
Speaker 1 (17:45):
Yeah.
Now the other two I have nottried.
The first one is Supergoop andthey have two types a
every-single-face watery lotionbrand and then an unseen
sunscreen brand, and both ofthese are pure chemical
sunscreens, no mineral to it,and that's why people love it.
Because it's a clear gel.
(18:06):
People have used it as a makeupprimer.
It can layer under makeup for alot of people.
It doesn't feel greasy.
It's very lightweight becauseit has no mineral component to
it, and so a lot of people inthe beauty industry favor this
type of sunscreen.
(18:29):
It does have four of thechemicals in there avobenzone,
homosalate, octosalate andoctocrylene in various
percentages.
And then the other one is DrIdris Disco Block I don't know
where they come up with thesemarketing names and this one is
a combo mineral plus avobenzone,homosalate, octacrylene and
(18:51):
octasalate.
It also contains some hexylresorcinol, so supposedly it
might help with melasma andhyperpigmentation.
It's a whipped formulation, soit's very light.
I haven't tried these two.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
Me neither.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
Okay.
So I mean, people love theSupergoop.
I'm not a makeup person, so Idon't put makeup on my face, but
, like I said, if you feel likethat one is the best in terms of
application, in terms of usingevery day, then you should use
(19:28):
it.
Now some application Veryquickly.
Let's talk a little bit aboutapplication, because I am one of
those people that will do itonce during the day and then
forget to put it on later, and Iprobably shortchange myself
when I do that.
So what are the general rulesin terms of how we should be
using sunscreen on a daily basis?
Speaker 2 (19:47):
So number one is you have to put enough on your face
or on your neck, because even ifyou have the best sunscreen and
it's a high SPF, if you don'tput enough it's not going to
give you the amount ofprotection that you use, that
you want to use.
So about a quarter of ateaspoon is what you're going to
(20:10):
use for the face and neck, andif it's a chemical sunscreen,
you want to use it about 15minutes before you go into the
sun.
So number one put the properamount.
Putting more is better thanputting an insufficient amount.
Number two reapplication.
So to be safe, you should beapplying every two hours when
(20:35):
you're outdoors, and also if youget wet due to swimming or
sweating or wiping your faceafter you with a napkin, you
should reapply.
And then you know you shoulduse something every day.
Like I said before, uvapenetrates piles in glass, so
(20:56):
when you're driving, you'regoing to have the effects of UV
radiation if your face is notprotected.
So sunscreen should be thoughtof as something you're using
every day, not just when it'ssunny, not just when you're, you
know, going outside.
Speaker 1 (21:13):
So that's how I would recommend yeah even on cold
days, snowy days.
Just make it part of your dailyregimen and then you don't even
have to think about it.
It's just like brushing yourteeth or something like.
That way it's not a thing whereyou're like oh it's sunny, I'm
going to put it on today.
Just put it on every day.
It makes it.
It just makes it so much easier.
And if you're worried aboutvitamin D deficiency um, normal,
(21:38):
you know, studies have shownthat people who use sunscreen
have normal vitamin D levels.
But if you are freaked out,just take supplements, like 99%
of the world does right nowanyway, for vitamin D and you'll
be fine.
So let's suppose you don't likethe mineral sunscreens and
you're freaked out about thechemical concerns.
(22:00):
Well, what can you do?
And fortunately, there are nownewer sunscreens available that
have not been fully approved inthe United States yet, but are
used throughout Asia as well asin Europe.
And these are newer UV filters,chemicals which do not have the
(22:23):
endocrine disrupting effects asfar as we know in terms of the
studies that have been completed, and they are not reef toxic or
damage marine ecosystems as ourcurrent US approved sunscreens
are.
And a lot of these areformulated to be very kind and
(22:49):
sort of glowy.
If you've ever seen some ofthese commercials for these
sunscreens, it's amazing.
It's almost like the skin lookslike it's popping off of the
screen because of the texture.
Popping off of the screenbecause of the texture.
So I will mention two which Ijust ordered and I'm going to
(23:10):
try, and hopefully they will beawesome for me.
The first one is Beauty ofJoseon Relief Sun, which is a
rice and probiotics formula.
This is available.
I did order it on Amazon.
It's a creamy lotion enrichedwith 30% rice extract and
fermented probiotics.
It's supposed to leave a satinglow with no white cast, and the
(23:34):
chemicals involved are UvinylA+, uvinyl T150, and Tinozorb M
m, and these are photostable,low absorption uv filters that
have been approved both in asiaand in the european union.
Um, the other one I'll justmention.
Well, I'll mention three reallyquickly.
(23:55):
The other two which I haven'tuh tried either round lab birch
juice moisturizing sunscreen uhhas birch sap, which I have no
idea why it would include birchsap, but it has that.
And then Skin 1004, centellaAir Fit Sunscreen Plus, which
actually this one has a mineralformula in it as well, so it
(24:17):
probably might have a little bitof a white cast.
You're going to have to try itout and see what you think.
Speaker 2 (24:25):
Well, the names of these just roll right off the
tongue.
But you know, if you ask me,anything that's sun protectant,
makes my skin look better andhas rice, I'm all for it.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
I eat rice almost every day.
I have no problems putting arice product on my face.
So, in closing, larry, well,let me ask you this what do you
use right now for your sunscreen?
Speaker 2 (24:57):
Right now I use a SkinMedica product that we sell
in our office.
It's an SPF 50.
I actually don't recall exactlywhat the ingredients are, but I
believe it is a chemicalsunscreen and that's what I use
every day and you know, I carryit around with me if I'm going
(25:18):
out biking or doing some sort ofoutdoor activity so I can
reapply as needed.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
Yeah, you have some of the best skin for a plastic
surgeon I've ever seen.
I will say that my skin agesterribly and I'm going to be
much better now in the futureabout wearing sunscreen, but
you've always had that Asianglow to you.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
You're making me feel uncomfortable.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
That has never made it.
No, I'm just kidding.
Thank you very much.
Uh, so um it is.
Speaker 2 (25:51):
you know, it is no thing that uh, that I I tried to
really not go in the sun asmuch as possible and uh, you
know, a lot of it's justgenetics as well, true, but we
can always do our best in termsof doing better.
Speaker 1 (26:06):
So, first thing, wear sunscreen.
Wear it every day, doesn'tmatter what type it is, as long
as you're actually liking it andusing it.
There are chemical sunscreens,mineral sunscreens, combos.
There are some new ones outthere, available from Asia and
Europe that might be more toyour liking or to your
(26:27):
preference and, as Larry said,you can do a lot by helping
yourself out and minimizing sundamage, skin cancers, so you
don't have to see us in theoffice so often.
Speaker 2 (26:41):
That's right.
Do it early, don't wait untilit's too late.
Once it's too late, it's toolate.
That's right.
Any other thoughts?
Do it early, don't wait untilit's too late.
Once it's too late, it's toolate, that's exactly right.
Speaker 1 (26:51):
So profound Larry.
Speaker 2 (26:52):
I love that All right .
Speaker 1 (26:53):
Thank you so much, and until next time.
We'll see you then.
All right, welcome to another episode of Botox and
Burpees.
I'm your host, sam Rhee, and Ihave with me my very special
guest, dr Lawrence Tong, fromToronto, canada.
You may have seen him on ourother podcast, three Plastic
Surgeons and a Fourth, whichunfortunately is going to be on
hiatus for a while, and so whilethat podcast is sort of in
(00:29):
limbo, I thought I would bringon LT, as he is affectionately
known, to talk about a coupletopics.
I've known LT since we wereresidents.
We trained together.
He was my chief at Universityof Michigan.
He is one of the most talentedplastic surgeons I know, and he
(00:51):
is also a Canadian, which meanshe right now is probably a lot
less controversial than maybesome of us Americans here right
now.
But anyway, all right to thetopic.
Our topic today is five bestfacial SPF sunscreens.
And why would you want tolisten to a couple plastic
(01:11):
surgeons talk about sunscreens?
Well, I'll tell you why Becausewhen I was looking up
sunscreens for myself, I noticedthat there were a bunch that
were quote dermatologistsrecommended, which is great.
However, when I looked at them,three of them are ones that I
really don't think are thatawesome if you have certain
considerations that areimportant to you in regards to
(01:33):
your health.
So I wanted to recruit anotherplastic surgeon to talk about
this, because I think in someways, we do see, similarly, a
lot of patients that have tonsof problems in terms of facial
aging.
We manage facial aging.
We do, obviously, facelifts,neck lifts, brow lifts, eye
(01:55):
lifts and in doing so, we alsogive a lot of recommendations in
terms of how patients canminimize aging, how they can
slow, prevent, treat some ofthese issues and in some ways, I
think we might be a little morepractical than some of the
dermatologists out there when itcomes to finding something that
(02:15):
works in terms of a sunscreenthat is best for you.
This show is not a substitutefor professional medical advice,
diagnosis or treatment.
It's for informational purposesonly.
Treatments and results may varybased on the circumstances,
situation and medical judgment.
After appropriate discussion,always seek the advice of your
surgeon or other qualifiedhealth care provider with any
questions you may have regardingmedical care, and never
(02:36):
disregard professional medicaladvice or delay seeking medical
advice for something in thisshow.
So why do we need sunscreen?
It's one of those things thatis obvious, but maybe the
details about it are not soobvious.
So, larry, let's talk a littlebit about SPF sun protection and
(02:59):
what sun exposure does to ourskin.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
All right.
So sun exposure is ultravioletradiation and that can have
effects on the skin that areundesired.
And basically, when we'retalking about ultraviolet rays
that affect the skin, we'reusually talking about UVA and
UVB, that's, ultraviolet A andultraviolet B, and they're
(03:26):
different because theycontribute to different types of
changes to the skin.
So UVA is a longer wavelengthultraviolet ray and it
penetrates deeply into thedermis, and this is the one that
causes photoaging, that is,wrinkling, loss of elasticity
and age spots.
(03:46):
It also contributes toformation of skin cancer and
creates oxidative stress, whichis creation of free radicals.
So what that means is that ifyou are exposed to UVA for a
cumulative period of time, youwill start looking older, and I
think it's very important tostress to everybody that once
(04:10):
you get beyond a certain amountof sun damage, you cannot
reverse that.
No surgery, no lasers, nocreams, no peels can fix that.
So it's very important topreserve what you have and
protect yourself against the sun.
So, anyways, uva is also a typeof radiation that can penetrate
(04:36):
clouds and glass, like in a car.
So for people who think that ifit's a cloudy day, they don't
need to wear sunscreen, that'sfalse.
It will still affect you.
So even on days where it doesnot look sunny, it is important
to wear sunscreen.
The other type of radiation isUVB.
This is a shorter wavelengthand this primarily affects the
(05:00):
epidermis, which is the skinsurface.
This is the type of radiationthat causes burning of the skin,
that gives you the sunburns,and this does not penetrate as
much, but this can.
Sorry.
This type of radiation is moreimportant for causing skin
(05:21):
cancers.
So both of these types ofultraviolet radiation are
harmful to you.
And you know, as plasticsurgeons we do not recommend
tanning of any type, because inthe long run you're going to pay
for it.
You're not going to be happywith it.
In the short term, when you'reyoung, you think nothing's going
to happen and it makes you lookbetter.
But in the long run, and makesyou look better, but in the long
(05:42):
run, it's not a good thing.
So it's very, very important tostress protection from the sun
for the short term and for thelong term.
Speaker 1 (06:00):
Absolutely, and I think a lot of the tanning
salons use primarily UVA, so youdon't necessarily feel a burn
like you do, because there'svery little UVB.
But in terms of aging, as yousaid, in terms of skin cancer
risk, it's terrible, terriblefor your skin, as you mentioned,
and so I think for everyone,sunscreen use has to be sort of
part of your daily regimen.
Don't feel like this issomething you need to not wear.
(06:23):
On certain days, like youmentioned, because it's cloudy
or because you don't see a lotof sunlight, like you will
experience more sun damage thanyou think, even on a day where
you don't see any bright sun.
So for sure that that wearingof daily sunscreen should be a
(06:43):
must for everybody, and sothat's why finding the sunscreen
that works for you, the bestsunscreen honestly is the one
that you're going to wear everyday.
It might be the best rated, itmight be awesome and everyone
loves it, but if you don't likethat sunscreen and you don't
wear it, then it's useless.
So let's help you find asunscreen that works for you.
(07:05):
There are really two types ofskin protectants here mineral
sunscreens and chemicalsunscreens.
So let's talk a little bitabout mineral sunscreens.
What are the mineral sunscreens, larry?
That?
Speaker 2 (07:16):
are offered.
So in general, mineralsunscreens are sunscreens that
reflect or disperse the lightthat comes to your skin, and you
know these are mainlyingredients like zinc oxide and
titanium dioxide.
The advantages of mineralsunscreen is that they work
(07:37):
immediately once you put them onand they're good for sensitive
skin.
There's less irritation andallergic reaction and it's
FDA-recognized as safe and itgives good UVA and UVB
protection.
For environmental concerns,it's typically safe for marine
ecosystems, because some of thechemicals in the chemical
(07:59):
sunscreens have actually beenshown to be harmful to marine
ecosystems.
There are some concerns aboutmineral sunscreens and Sam, if
you want to discuss those a bit.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Yeah.
The one thing that people hateis the white pasty look, and I
know that a lot of parents willslap mineral sunscreens like you
said, titanium dioxide or zincoxide on their kids because they
don't care what their kids looklike.
They just look like these whiteballs of powdery white paste on
them.
But they won't use that forthemselves because it looks
(08:34):
crappy, it's thick, it can begreasy, it's hard to put on
because of the texture and ifyou sweat or if you just kind of
physically wipe it off it it,you lose that protection.
So I feel like I have usedmineral sunscreens quite a bit
in the past and I I just feellike it's that those cons, and
(09:00):
especially in terms of the whitepasty texture, turns off a lot
of people like I know mydaughter, my wife they will
never use a mineral sunscreenjust because it just makes them
look like a ghost.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Yeah, and you're exactly right, it's mainly
relegated to children.
But there are, you know, we'lltalk about it later but there
are hybrids and differentformulations of the mineral
(09:35):
sunscreens that make them alittle bit more palatable.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
They all have terrible names that I can't ever
remember Avobenzone, oxybenzone, oxinoate, no so octinoxate,
homosalate, octisalate, and soall of these are chemicals that
block ultraviolet radiation andthe biggest problem, which you
mentioned?
(09:59):
Well, there are a couple bigproblems, so one of them is that
they have endocrine disruptingactivity, which S Virgin Islands
and Mexico because of that, andthose include oxybenzone and
(10:30):
octinoxate, so most sunscreensdon't include those two, but the
other three homosalate,avobenzone and octisalate are
still present in a lot ofsunscreens and they are still
considered at moderate or atsome risk in terms of endocrine
hormonal disruptive effects.
(10:51):
So how do you feel aboutchemical sunscreens and what do
you recommend to your patientsin terms of them?
Speaker 2 (10:59):
Dr.
Well, basically you should tryto tailor the sunscreen to
whatever the patient's needs are.
So one of the things that is apro with the chemical sunscreens
is that it just looks betterwhen you put it on.
So if somebody is consciousabout their appearance, then
(11:23):
you're probably going to headtowards a chemical sunscreen.
But if you have sensitive orreactive skin, then you're
probably better suited formineral-based sunscreens.
And you know, like you said atthe beginning, the one that
you're going to use is the onethat's going to give you the
best protection.
And if you have concerns aboutenvironmental concerns, a
(11:47):
mineral-based formulationreduces the ecological impact,
but you want to have a sunscreenthat has what's called
broad-spectrum protection.
When you hear about SPF SPFrating that people talk about is
that it only applies to UVB.
So when you're using asunscreen, you need to use one
(12:12):
that's designated as broadspectrum and that will cover
both UVA and UVB.
And with the chemicalsunscreens, you have to apply it
about 20 minutes, half an hour,before you actually go into the
sun, because they don't workimmediately.
So there's a number of factorsthat are used in deciding which
(12:35):
sunscreen to use and, Sam, Iknow you have a list of
sunscreens that have beendermatologically recommended and
I wonder if you could go oversome of those and how you feel
about them.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
Yeah, so let's talk about them.
You're absolutely right.
The best sunscreen is the onethat you use regularly and I
have used chemical sunscreens mywhole life.
I like them because I don'tlike the pasty look.
I've tried the pure mineralsunscreens and they just don't
look awesome.
And oftentimes I will justweigh the benefit risk about
(13:16):
chemical sunscreens and, likeyou said, the benefit of having
them not look terrible on me andthe ease of use.
I just like spraying them on or, you know, applying a stick to
my face and it's good, I'm goodto go.
But, as you've mentioned, thereare a couple.
Let's talk about the ones.
But I think we're going to havea couple alternatives that I
(13:37):
think now have come out whichmight actually provide the
benefit of a chemical sunscreenwithout all of these concerns
that people have raised aboutendocrine disruption, reef
safety, all of that.
There are two that are purelymineral based that
dermatologists have recommendedin general and if you like these
two, you're probably you shouldstick with them.
(13:59):
I think they work great.
I've used one of them and Ithink they're better than most
of the mineral sunscreens outthere.
The two that I've seen are LaRoche-Posay Antihelios Mineral
Tinted Sunscreen, spf 50.
This is a pure mineralsunscreen zinc oxide, titanium
(14:21):
dioxide.
It's slightly tinted to helpminimize that white cast and
it's ideal for sensitive skin.
And I have tried this one.
I like it.
The tint.
It doesn't really workperfectly for me, but out of all
the mineral sunscreens outthere I think this one is
reasonable.
Speaker 2 (14:39):
So I'm curious.
Well, I've never used thatbefore, but what does the tint
look like?
Is it supposed to be less white?
Speaker 1 (14:48):
Yes, it's like slightly brownish, I guess.
But, I kind of have brownishskin and it doesn't really match
, so it looks off on me like Ilook sick or something I don't
know.
I don't look healthy, it looks alittle odd.
I don't know, I don't lookhealthy, it looks a little odd.
The other one is VanicreamMineral Sunscreen SPF 30.
(15:08):
And this one is supposedly Ihaven't tried it, but supposedly
ideal for eczema or reactiveskin.
It's dye free, fragrance free,paraben free and it's also pure
zinc oxide and so it you know.
I think that that probablyworks better for some sensitive
skins.
(15:29):
Uh, the other thing it doescontain is ceramides for barrier
repair, and I have used lotionswith and without ceramides and
I would say, for some peopleceramides cause them to break
out and for other people they'retotally fine with it.
I think it really depends.
Like, I think CeraVe or Cerev,I don't know how you pronounce
(15:51):
it has ceramides and I've usedthat a lot in my practice, like
post-treatment, and some peoplejust break out with ceramides.
So I think you should try it,see if you like it.
The zinc oxide formulationmight be a little bit more easy
for your skin if you're someonewho tends to break out.
Speaker 2 (16:09):
Yeah, the Vanicream is a brand that we actually used
on our kids and seemed prettygood.
It did make them look a littlebit white, but you know they're
kids who cares.
Good sun protection isimportant.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
That's right Now, the three that the dermatologists
have recommended in general.
Now, these three are bothmineral plus chemical sunscreen
combinations, and the first oneI have also tried is Elta MD UV
Clear Face Sunscreen, and thisis both a mineral plus chemical
(16:46):
UV clear face sunscreen and thisis both a mineral plus chemical
.
It has micronized zinc andniacinamide plus octinoxate in a
7.5% formulation, and it's verynice in the sense that the zinc
is micronized so it's lesslikely to have this pasty
texture to it, have this likepasty texture to it.
(17:09):
Um, that, if you like niacin,niacinamide, it is, for a lot of
people, anti-inflammatory.
Um, if you are prone to acne orrosacea, it can be helpful in
terms of calming the skin.
Um, but uh, and they say nowhite cast, but I mean like
that's all relative.
I think I have a pretty darkcomplexion and so it does
lighten my skin when I put thaton there.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
Yeah, I've used the Elta MD.
I think all the sunscreens tosome extent, even the chemical
ones, give you some sort ofwhitish cast.
You just have to take some timeto sort of rub it in.
But the Elta MD is a goodproduct.
Speaker 1 (17:45):
Yeah.
Now the other two I have nottried.
The first one is Supergoop andthey have two types a
every-single-face watery lotionbrand and then an unseen
sunscreen brand, and both ofthese are pure chemical
sunscreens, no mineral to it,and that's why people love it.
Because it's a clear gel.
(18:06):
People have used it as a makeupprimer.
It can layer under makeup for alot of people.
It doesn't feel greasy.
It's very lightweight becauseit has no mineral component to
it, and so a lot of people inthe beauty industry favor this
type of sunscreen.
(18:29):
It does have four of thechemicals in there avobenzone,
homosalate, octosalate andoctocrylene in various
percentages.
And then the other one is DrIdris Disco Block I don't know
where they come up with thesemarketing names and this one is
a combo mineral plus avobenzone,homosalate, octacrylene and
(18:51):
octasalate.
It also contains some hexylresorcinol, so supposedly it
might help with melasma andhyperpigmentation.
It's a whipped formulation, soit's very light.
I haven't tried these two.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
Me neither.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
Okay.
So I mean, people love theSupergoop.
I'm not a makeup person, so Idon't put makeup on my face, but
, like I said, if you feel likethat one is the best in terms of
application, in terms of usingevery day, then you should use
(19:28):
it.
Now some application Veryquickly.
Let's talk a little bit aboutapplication, because I am one of
those people that will do itonce during the day and then
forget to put it on later, and Iprobably shortchange myself
when I do that.
So what are the general rulesin terms of how we should be
using sunscreen on a daily basis?
Speaker 2 (19:47):
So number one is you have to put enough on your face
or on your neck, because even ifyou have the best sunscreen and
it's a high SPF, if you don'tput enough it's not going to
give you the amount ofprotection that you use, that
you want to use.
So about a quarter of ateaspoon is what you're going to
(20:10):
use for the face and neck, andif it's a chemical sunscreen,
you want to use it about 15minutes before you go into the
sun.
So number one put the properamount.
Putting more is better thanputting an insufficient amount.
Number two reapplication.
So to be safe, you should beapplying every two hours when
(20:35):
you're outdoors, and also if youget wet due to swimming or
sweating or wiping your faceafter you with a napkin, you
should reapply.
And then you know you shoulduse something every day.
Like I said before, uvapenetrates piles in glass, so
(20:56):
when you're driving, you'regoing to have the effects of UV
radiation if your face is notprotected.
So sunscreen should be thoughtof as something you're using
every day, not just when it'ssunny, not just when you're, you
know, going outside.
Speaker 1 (21:13):
So that's how I would recommend yeah even on cold
days, snowy days.
Just make it part of your dailyregimen and then you don't even
have to think about it.
It's just like brushing yourteeth or something like.
That way it's not a thing whereyou're like oh it's sunny, I'm
going to put it on today.
Just put it on every day.
It makes it.
It just makes it so much easier.
And if you're worried aboutvitamin D deficiency um, normal,
(21:38):
you know, studies have shownthat people who use sunscreen
have normal vitamin D levels.
But if you are freaked out,just take supplements, like 99%
of the world does right nowanyway, for vitamin D and you'll
be fine.
So let's suppose you don't likethe mineral sunscreens and
you're freaked out about thechemical concerns.
(22:00):
Well, what can you do?
And fortunately, there are nownewer sunscreens available that
have not been fully approved inthe United States yet, but are
used throughout Asia as well asin Europe.
And these are newer UV filters,chemicals which do not have the
(22:23):
endocrine disrupting effects asfar as we know in terms of the
studies that have been completed, and they are not reef toxic or
damage marine ecosystems as ourcurrent US approved sunscreens
are.
And a lot of these areformulated to be very kind and
(22:49):
sort of glowy.
If you've ever seen some ofthese commercials for these
sunscreens, it's amazing.
It's almost like the skin lookslike it's popping off of the
screen because of the texture.
Popping off of the screenbecause of the texture.
So I will mention two which Ijust ordered and I'm going to
(23:10):
try, and hopefully they will beawesome for me.
The first one is Beauty ofJoseon Relief Sun, which is a
rice and probiotics formula.
This is available.
I did order it on Amazon.
It's a creamy lotion enrichedwith 30% rice extract and
fermented probiotics.
It's supposed to leave a satinglow with no white cast, and the
(23:34):
chemicals involved are UvinylA+, uvinyl T150, and Tinozorb M
m, and these are photostable,low absorption uv filters that
have been approved both in asiaand in the european union.
Um, the other one I'll justmention.
Well, I'll mention three reallyquickly.
(23:55):
The other two which I haven'tuh tried either round lab birch
juice moisturizing sunscreen uhhas birch sap, which I have no
idea why it would include birchsap, but it has that.
And then Skin 1004, centellaAir Fit Sunscreen Plus, which
actually this one has a mineralformula in it as well, so it
(24:17):
probably might have a little bitof a white cast.
You're going to have to try itout and see what you think.
Speaker 2 (24:25):
Well, the names of these just roll right off the
tongue.
But you know, if you ask me,anything that's sun protectant,
makes my skin look better andhas rice, I'm all for it.
Speaker 1 (24:41):
I eat rice almost every day.
I have no problems putting arice product on my face.
So, in closing, larry, well,let me ask you this what do you
use right now for your sunscreen?
Speaker 2 (24:57):
Right now I use a SkinMedica product that we sell
in our office.
It's an SPF 50.
I actually don't recall exactlywhat the ingredients are, but I
believe it is a chemicalsunscreen and that's what I use
every day and you know, I carryit around with me if I'm going
(25:18):
out biking or doing some sort ofoutdoor activity so I can
reapply as needed.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
Yeah, you have some of the best skin for a plastic
surgeon I've ever seen.
I will say that my skin agesterribly and I'm going to be
much better now in the futureabout wearing sunscreen, but
you've always had that Asianglow to you.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
You're making me feel uncomfortable.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
That has never made it.
No, I'm just kidding.
Thank you very much.
Uh, so um it is.
Speaker 2 (25:51):
you know, it is no thing that uh, that I I tried to
really not go in the sun asmuch as possible and uh, you
know, a lot of it's justgenetics as well, true, but we
can always do our best in termsof doing better.
Speaker 1 (26:06):
So, first thing, wear sunscreen.
Wear it every day, doesn'tmatter what type it is, as long
as you're actually liking it andusing it.
There are chemical sunscreens,mineral sunscreens, combos.
There are some new ones outthere, available from Asia and
Europe that might be more toyour liking or to your
(26:27):
preference and, as Larry said,you can do a lot by helping
yourself out and minimizing sundamage, skin cancers, so you
don't have to see us in theoffice so often.
Speaker 2 (26:41):
That's right.
Do it early, don't wait untilit's too late.
Once it's too late, it's toolate.
That's right.
Any other thoughts?
Do it early, don't wait untilit's too late.
Once it's too late, it's toolate, that's exactly right.
Speaker 1 (26:51):
So profound Larry.
Speaker 2 (26:52):
I love that All right .
Speaker 1 (26:53):
Thank you so much, and until next time.
We'll see you then.
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