May 2, 2023 • 46 mins
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jonathan (00:29):
My guest today is Danny Combs.
Danny's a fourth generationwoodworker and mechanical
tinkerer who grew up makingstuff with his family.
Eventually, he decided to followhis own path and went to
Nashville to play music.
His vibrant career includedvarious platinum albums with
Grammy and Oscar winningrecording artists.
Danny has two incrediblechildren, Dylan and Ellie.
(00:50):
When his son Dylan was diagnosedwith autism, Danny formed tact.
Teaching the autism communitytrades to help other kids like
his own and their families.
He's past board chair, presidentof the Autism Society of
Colorado.
He's in the Air Force Reserve,working in space system
operations and most recently, heco-founded the Colorado
Neurodiversity Chamber ofCommerce, Danny has a Master's
(01:12):
degree in education as a boardcertified cognitive specialist,
a certified autism specialist,and a classic car junkie.
Danny, welcome to the pod dude.
Danny Combs (01:22):
Welcome.
Thank you.
I appreciate it so much.
Jonathan (01:27):
So Danny, you are literally like a Renaissance
man.
Um, and uh, there's so much thatyou do that I wanna dig into,
but, but you're, you know,you're also a consummate
entrepreneur.
And tell me, when did yourealize that you were a
visionary builder, entrepreneur?
Danny Combs (01:43):
Oh, it's very flattering.
I dunno if I would necessarilythink of myself in all those
things.
I just, I like learning.
I love learning new things.
I love to read.
I like new experiences.
I find that best I can tell weget one shot at this and there's
so much to do.
So, I find that I'm alwayslooking and enjoying and trying
to really take it in.
I mean, my life was changedwith, with my son and I mean, I
(02:05):
would say for the better.
I feel like I'm exactly whereI'm supposed to be, but it
certainly was in a differentdirection for sure.
But, I just find that I have aunique background.
My parents were amazing.
My family, uh, lineage like.
I feel like I come from goodindividuals that raised me in a
nice way that gives me the toolsI need to be the person I need
to be for my son.
So it's, it's kind of neat howit feels like it all comes full
(02:26):
circle.
So, I'm just trying to do thebest I can with it.
So, yeah.
Appreciate it.
Jonathan (02:31):
tell me some more about Dylan, about your son and
the, the autism diagnosis andhow did that change your
perspective on the communityand, and on your world?
Danny Combs (02:40):
that's a great question.
It, it changed so much.
I mean, I, I feel like when Ifirst heard those words, I
didn't know nearly as much as Iknow now.
So, I mean, I definitely had adifferent perception too.
But I mean, it also, I.
Explained a lot and also broughta lot of like, oh, that makes so
much more sense now.
at the same time, but at thesame token too, I mean, the
(03:01):
world's changed so much since hewas diagnosed.
He's 14 now and he was youngerwhen, you know, we first got
those words have been in Denvernow for a decade.
So this was all the way back inNashville.
And, it was, Hard to hear,honestly.
Like I would love to tell youthat I had this great response.
Where was this?
Like, yay and let's go and allthat.
But I was.
I took it hard at first,honestly, selfishly I had all
(03:24):
these thoughts of like, youknow, does this change who I am
as a man, as a father, as like,will I ever be a grandfather?
Is my family name going to carryon?
I mean, all these selfishthoughts, but I'm just being
real and honest.
Kind of, kind of thoughts.
And then, um, You know, I feellike diving in and seeing how
amazing he was and all the loveand joy that he brought, that
(03:46):
really felt like something toget behind.
And, trying to support hisstrengths too, because I mean,
he was six, six and a halfbefore he could say like, I love
you dad, or really express in away that I really received.
It felt like, his affection.
And my daughter at that pointwas three and I was having more
conversations with her.
(04:07):
And, um, it was seeing hisstrengths in the way that he
could do things.
That was really the inspirationfor tact and the launching pad
that, you know, brought us hereto get to meet each other today.
So I always credit Dylan withchanging my life for the better.
I think he's taught me so muchand I've learned so much more
from him than I think I couldever teach him.
And, um, I'm really grateful forall of it.
(04:29):
So, yeah.
Jonathan (04:32):
Wow.
That idea of like, you'velearned so much more from him
than you could ever teach himthat's such a humbling, and you
have just this powerfulperspective, Danny.
Um, and I, I honor your journeyand I'm curious, was there a
very direct line from, Hisautism diagnosis to then your
sense that, huh?
our community needs something,um, you know, and, and, and then
(04:53):
forming tact or, you know, whatwas the need you saw in the
community that prompted you tostart tact?
Danny Combs (04:58):
That's a great question.
So, um, yes.
there was a, a great group, um,down in Nashville, just outside
of Nashville.
I lived on the old Hickory Lakethere and there was a group
called Little Fox Therapy.
so if they watched this, theywere great if out in Mountain
Juliet, just, to the east ofNashville there.
And, um, they were doing greatthings and it was a great team.
(05:20):
And, I gave them a whole bunchof money cuz I was paying for
everything out of pocket.
because nothing is covered inTennessee under any kind of
insurance, it's at all, which ispart of the catalyst of bringing
me to Colorado.
And, um, during that process, itwas just so he needs to do this,
he needs to change, that, heneeds to do X, Y, and Z.
(05:41):
And while yes, they identified,you know, areas of growth in him
and helped me discover somesuccess enablers that he needed.
I never once heard, and I'm notputting them down at all.
So I hope it doesn't come acrosslike that, but I never heard
what he was good at and likewhat he could do, or the things
that, you know, the potentialthat he did have.
And so seeing him able to makethings, fix things, visualize
(06:06):
things, conceptualize things, itstarted as simple as that of
just like, okay, these arethings that I can identify that
he's really good at.
And how do I find a way to buildthat up and help him see that in
himself?
You know, I've never wanted himto ever feel like this world he
needs to change for.
I've always wanted it to be, andI hope it, you know, the end of
(06:28):
my days, wherever Dylan ends up,that he looks at the world and
never realizes the struggle thatwe went through to get that
world in place.
I want him to just be like, thisis who I am.
They see me for who I am, andthey embrace it.
I think we had a long way to gofor that.
But, seeing those strengths inhim, started putting together
the idea of tact and seeing thatthere was no one else doing
(06:48):
anything like it.
And I actually had the chance tomeet Dr.
Temple Grandon and um, said,Hey, I've got this idea.
What do you think?
And she was a hundred percent inthe Catalyst where she was like,
you need to put down yourguitar.
Stop doing this.
Stop what you're doing and go dothis right now.
And for whatever reason, um, Idon't know if I just had too
much coffee that day, or just myheart or mind, whatever in that
(07:11):
place.
It was just like, okay.
And did.
And, it's been the best vice.
She's since become just a dearfriend and, she'll call me
sometimes outta the blue.
I was just on Colorado PublicRadio and, um, All of a sudden
she heard that apparently as shewas leaving a factory and
somewhere that she wasconsulting on, and I don't even
know where Colorado.
(07:31):
And she called me from theparking garage and is like, I
just heard you.
Thank you.
You did it right.
And she's just so sweet, andencouraging and just we're in
alignment in so many things andit just makes me happy that she
still takes the time to, to calland say that she's keeping up
with everything.
So, um, Yeah, that was a gamechanger.
And um, you know, it's grown alot since then and the world's
(07:53):
grown a lot since then, so it'skind of exciting to see, you
know, we're seven years in as ofnext month.
And it's wild to think that youknow where we are, seven years
in, it seems like others arestarting to get to a similar
place, and where we're gonna bein another seven, another
decade, another 20 years.
I don't know.
But I have a feeling it'sheading in a direction that it's
(08:15):
just finally start heading in.
So it feels like,
Jonathan (08:18):
Wow.
Okay, there's so much, Danny.
Now I need to unpack here.
First, just to be clear, this isthe Dr.
Temple Grandon from ColoradoState University, uh, ag
Professor ais, she's autisticherself, and she told you
directly, you've gotta put downyour guitar.
Go start this.
Danny Combs (08:35):
And when Temple tells you to do something, you
do it cuz she's usually right.
So, um, yeah, she's an amazingindividual.
She's like, um, you know,women's Hall of Fame, time
Magazine.
Hundred one most Influentialpeople.
She says a new book, that shewrote.
she's an extraordinary person.
She really is.
Jonathan (08:51):
Wow.
Well, so then, and I heard youdescribe Dylan A.
Little bit there.
Ha.
Did Dylan get the tinkerer, um,sort of woodworker jeans, or is
that Ellie,
Danny Combs (09:02):
I was so, hope so my friend.
No, definitely the tinkerer, butit seems like, you know, this
entire.
And I hate to stereotype, andI'm not trying to, but it seems
like the Gen Zers are definitelymore technology based and Dylan
definitely falls in line withthat.
But if I can definitely get himthinking outside the box in
regards to even what that lookslike technologically.
And you know, the new things wedo at TACT is we look at it from
(09:24):
a holistic approach of not justusing but diagnosing, fixing,
and assembling because there'sso much more to it than just
using these technologies, butgenuinely understanding them and
able to.
Fix them and maintain them andcreate the infrastructure to
sustain them.
I think is gonna be important.
So I'm hoping that taking that,you know, the tech stuff that
we're doing now at, at Tact,where we work with Microsoft now
(09:47):
with their, um, hollowlens doingmixed reality, augmented reality
stuff for some of the EV carstuff can hopefully be like a
unique blend behind his tech,you know, enjoyment and on,
tinkering.
So, doesn't have a carburetor,but it's okay.
So,
Jonathan (10:05):
Carburetor.
Who knows what a carburetor isthese days, right?
Huh?
The next generation.
So here's one of the things thatyou said earlier that so
resonated with me is I believe,this is not about like changing
those with autism.
Yes.
We have to support them everyway we can.
It's about creating a worldthat's more autism ready.
Right.
and more autism friendly.
and.
Meeting autistics where theyare.
(10:26):
But can you, do you have statsor tell me about this
extraordinary need for adultsand whether it's around
underemployment or unemployment?
Um, I don't know.
Did that factor in at all to,you know, to how you thought
about the change you wanted tomake?
Danny Combs (10:42):
you know it, it did to a degree at a time, but I
feel like he was so young and Iwas so young, even though.
It registered and it wasdefinitely one of the founding
pillars of what we wanted to doat TACT it definitely registers
more now as the older he'sgetting, and it makes it feel
that much more tangible and realin the impact we're having.
Um, and it's definitely becomemore in focus as we've fine
(11:04):
tuned it and gotten, um, Betterat it honestly, as far as
creating career opportunitiesfor individuals and that kind of
a quality of opportunity.
But when he was younger, youknow, you would read stats and
they haven't changed.
You know, that's the saddestthing, there's a office of
employment here in Coloradothat's doing some great stuff
and I remember going to one oftheir meetings and hearing this
was around the 30th anniversaryof ada, so it's since been a
(11:28):
couple years past that now, andtalking about how, you know,
there is accessibility.
More so in a lot of buildingsexcept for like our capital, um,
and some other buildings likethat that, you know, help accs
and supporters in a variety ofdifferent circumstances.
ADA's been great with that, butemployment hasn't changed, and
so it's like all of theseinitiatives and all of these
(11:48):
programs and all of these stepsthat we've taken for inclusivity
haven't really changed thelandscape of what that looks
like for the neurodivergentindividuals.
And that's wild to think thatthat's still behind even from
the fact of when he was, youknow, child when he was first
diagnosed and where we'vestarted so at TACT we have an
83% placement rate.
(12:09):
It's actually 83.3 to be exact,but, um, we have a pretty good
run as far as gettingindividuals placed, um, into
careers.
And hopefully we can keep thatgoing.
But if we can even change thelandscape five degrees.
That'll be, more than it's beenachieved in decades.
and it, it's about freaking timethat starts taking place.
Jonathan (12:32):
I want to dig in some more on this specific, coaching
and extraordinary job trainingprograms and placements that you
do, but like, why has this neednot yet been addressed?
If you were to pinpoint.
Danny Combs (12:44):
That's such a great question.
You know, it's something we askourselves all the time.
I know, I, I read so much, as aformer musician in my past life,
it's a similar conundrum in thesense of like, you look at every
study that ever comes out, everabout music education, and it
will tell you it makes yousmarter.
It increases X, Y, and Z forlike your future of life.
People that study music are moresuccessful, all these different
(13:06):
things.
And yet the arts are constantlythe first thing that programs
cut.
It makes no sense.
I think of it in a similar wayof, autism.
Employment neurodivergenteducation and inclusivity, and
where it's still something forwhatever reason, people are
afraid of and they hear thatword autism and they just either
(13:27):
have some perception in theirmind of what that looks like,
um, right or wrong, um, or theyjust are ignorant to it or,
there was a study that just cameout from the global disability
and association that they hadthis thing saying the average
accommodation costs less than$500 for the employer to make a
change.
500 bucks.
(13:48):
For the average and it's likefor, you know, our community, a
lot of times it could be more,it could be less.
let's just stick with the 500.
But I know we work with a lotwith electricians for example,
we get a lot of great companiesthat hire our graduates,
Wayfield Sturgeon, Rexel, thesegreat companies that hire our
graduates and talking to afriend that runs Wakefield, he
was telling me about a buddy ofhis that is inspired by what
(14:10):
Wakefield's doing.
Didn't hire a TACT grad, whichis totally okay, but did
embrace, hiring Neurodiverseindividuals and this person's so
proficient.
They've done the work of fourOther Neurotypicals because
they're that good at their joband it's such an incredible
story where they then went backto him and I'm like, man, your
company's onto it because thismakes so much more sense.
(14:34):
But it's taking people that havethat experience from a, I think
a business perspective that areshowcasing.
how it's making their entireculture better and not from this
programmatic, oh look, I'mclicking a d e i, um, box over
here on the corner.
But genuinely embracing aculture of inclusivity to
actually bring our community andall of our people together, um,
(14:57):
they're finally starting to getit, but we just need more
stories about that, and we needthose people to be more vocal
and showcase it and not try tojust hide it away and tuck it in
the corner, you know?
That's kind of how it feels now.
Jonathan (15:10):
what's crazy.
I mean, to your point, thisisn't just checking a d e I box
and, um, and doing the, theright thing.
This makes economic andfinancial sense.
I mean, one, electrician, itsounds like, um, neuro divergent
electrician did the work of fourNeurotypical.
And tell me more about what, um,Tax job, coaching and training
(15:32):
looks like specifically, likehelp paint a picture of that.
And then like, I'd love toshare, share more stories around
the successes, individualsuccesses in, in getting placed.
Danny Combs (15:43):
well, thanks.
We do it a little bitdifferently, um, in the sense
that, you know, we work with theemployers directly, to see
what's real and what they'reactually looking for.
We don't want it to have thisacademic, you know, off to the
side approach where it's like,we think we know what employers
want, but we don't actually knowwhat employers want.
So, um, we talked with theemployers directly to figure out
(16:04):
what's authentic and what'sreal.
And then as a small nonprofit,we serve a couple hundred kids
every year, or young adultsevery year, but we never have
more than six students perclass.
So we've set it up where we havea trade professional and an
autism professional using R B TA B C B A, a coda, somebody with
autism experience that's alsothere working with that trade
(16:24):
professional and they're workingtogether to make that training
as authentic as possible towardsthe job.
And when they do that, we'recreating what we call simulation
site where the students are ableto simulate what it's like
working for an employer, avariety of different capacities,
doing the same jobs, and sothey're getting the sounds, the
sensations, the tooling, thelanguage, the vocabulary, all of
(16:47):
those things at first.
And then when we get them.
Going towards a job.
Then we do work-based interviewsand portfolios and kind of on
the job training for that job.
And then we have a job coachthat's, you know, one-on-one
in-person, side-by-side withthem, which is great, as opposed
to a lot of people will use, youknow, zoom calls.
And if that's all you have, it'sbetter than nothing.
(17:09):
But we try to do things inperson because there's, a lot
more that's, achieved when it'ssomething in person.
and then.
It's kind of like a step, right?
Where they've learned thisskill, they've learned this
trade, then they've stepped intoworking with the employer, they
still have that tact personthat's there working with them,
and then that tact person kindof slowly fades out as they're
working at just that employer.
I.
(17:29):
That's really simplifying it,but to kind of put it in like a
linear graph, if that's evenpossible, just to showcase some
of the steps.
And then we do things like helpthem get tools because a lot of
trades and men and women, youknow, have to have their own
tools and we wanna, findpartners that are a, giving good
wages.
So the average TACT graduate hasa$19.86 cents starting salary.
(17:49):
We're finding partners that,Embrace advancement and not just
looking at, you know, aposition, but what is the
longevity and lifespan ofsomebody working in that trade
look like for the future.
So they have a whole career and,knock on wood, there's, there's
always learning and growth, butwe're able to individualize a
lot, which I think has helped tothe success of it.
(18:10):
Um, so yeah, it's gettingcloser, getting closer, still,
way to go, but we're gettingcloser for short.
Jonathan (18:16):
so you described, electricians.
What are some examples of theother trades that you're
commonly placing your, yourgraduates in?
Danny Combs (18:23):
we do a lot with auto mechanics.
That's, one of the things Ithink a lot of people think of
tact.
Cause we started it in a 58Chevy cuz.
That's mentioned my bio.
I love classic cars cuz they'reso freaking cool.
just so much more style.
so you know a lot with cars.
We work with Toyota, um, whichwe became the first program that
Toyota sponsored.
that's works with neurodivergentindividuals and they can
(18:45):
actually get Toyota certified.
Um, and get all of those certsthat they need to actually then
step into a job with a Toyotadealership.
So then we have Toyotadealerships that we partner with
too.
So it's neat to have thatalignment and kind of
progression with both ToyotaNational and then also with the
local dealerships so that thetraining that we're doing is
pretty neat.
so a lot in the auto mechanics.
(19:06):
We work with a bunch ofdifferent, car dealerships here
throughout, the Denver area aswell as groups like Advanced
Auto Parts and Jiffy Lubes.
Gosh, we've got so many.
there's 38 of our activebusiness partners right now, so
we're just starting with Excel,which we're super excited about.
The Nerded diversity at works,people that are, you know,
coming here to start working.
Also in, in Colorado, I've setup some new things that we
haven't got placed yet, but inpower, which we're looking
(19:28):
forward to that.
There's 38 businesses that wepersonally work with.
everything from the Denverairport, which is pretty cool,
some of the things that they'vedone there as well.
Um, a lot of electricalcompanies as you've mentioned.
also things like Southwestinstallers doing welding type
work, which we're pretty happyabout as well.
Um, So a bunch of differentstuff kind of all over the
(19:49):
spectrum, if you will.
That pun of, uh, employers.
Jonathan (19:53):
Where my mind keeps coming back to Danny is like,
what's it gonna take to expandtact to the entire country, if
not the world?
And, to get specific on this,what is the biggest barrier to
scaling?
Is it needing to build thesepartnerships given the intention
you place into, bringing,companies into the fold?
Is it, fighting enough,individuals to work with?
Is it finding the coaches?
Danny Combs (20:15):
That's a great question.
Um, Gosh, you know, it's, it'sinteresting there.
There's a couple really bigbarriers that we at least have
identified so far, but we don'teven know what we don't know as
we're trying to go national andwe're aware of that.
But the ones that we're aware ofat this point is.
First and foremost, you know, asa dad of a child with autism, we
decided that if people wannacome to us, we work with all
(20:37):
kinds of foundations, grantors,um, community centered boards to
create scholarships andopportunities for those to come.
We don't want it to ever be thisfee for service where parents
have done well, so they canbring their child to our program
or this individual themself tobring somebody.
We want it to be genuinely,attainable for all individuals
(20:58):
to come.
And so, That in itself isdifficult, where all across the
country, autism services arefunded differently.
So how do you create thosepathways all across the country?
There is no universal design inthat sense, or at obtainability
or accessibility for autismservices.
(21:18):
Um, So that's one of thebarriers that we've made.
If it was just fee for service,like a for-profit or a nonprofit
that is, you know, a schoolthat's just like, this is our
tuition go, that would beeasier, but it wouldn't be as
accessible.
So we try to avoid that.
the second one is, you know,part of the success, like you
mentioned, is having thoseemployers that want to jump in.
(21:41):
And so, Getting those businesspartners in different states or
different cities.
Gosh, that's hard too.
That's a really hard thing to dotoo.
So, um, those are two of theones that we've identified that
are the biggest ones.
And then there's, you know,things that are equally
important but also difficult.
as a 5 0 1 you'd have to set upseparate board of directors and
(22:03):
then the board of directors canoversee their board of directors
and there becomes all kinds of.
Of, you know, mundane thingsthat can become tricky, that are
also equally important.
But, you know, board ofdirectors, for example, they're
volunteers.
They're giving us their time.
We don't want to tax them with,okay, I need you to look over
the branch in Texas and the onein North Carolina and the one in
Idaho, you know, or whatever.
(22:24):
so those are the ones that we'restruggling with honestly.
Um, so we'll see.
We're trying to figure out howto overcome that for sure.
Jonathan (22:34):
Well, tell me more about, what it takes to bring an
employer on.
So if you've got like a Toyotathat's already inspired to want
to do this, how much trainingand shaping of their behavior
and their program do you have todo to get them ready to accept
tact graduates?
Danny Combs (22:49):
That's a great question too.
You're asking good ones.
Ironically, not very much.
That's one of the amazing thingsI think, within the trades, one
of the, Perks of the trades islanguage.
For example, autism andcommunication.
When you, when you look at howthose two correlate together.
Right.
Um, also within the trades,English as a second language has
already been embraced in avariety of different ways.
(23:12):
Mm-hmm.
So all of the language barriersthat could.
perhaps be difficult in like anIT setting for example, have
already been overcome in a lotof skilled trades organizations
because a lot of, let's sayyou're an electrician, well,
let's just say you're a nonmechanic.
Everything is laid out indiagrams, color coded A, B, C,
D, and it's broken downsequential.
(23:33):
I mean, it's a task analysis,already created for you and, um,
they've already.
Looked at it from thatperspective.
So for a lot of times for them,it's like they'll bring us,
their diagrams or what theirscope of work that they're
trying to do, and we don't evenhave to modify it.
It's just like, oh, great.
All right, thanks.
This is our lesson plan for theday.
(23:54):
Here you go, kids.
Cuz I mean, they're alreadythere in, in that regards.
Now getting them to embrace, avariety of different things,
could be a little bit moretricky, but, In that regard to
the scope of work of the actualtrade, not so much.
So, for a lot of it though, it'shelping them also then
communicate with their staff,because sometimes there still
is, you know, some unjust biasesthat exist within their own
(24:17):
community culture that they'reeither then working on
themselves or trying to address.
And then, creating that culture,at least at first.
But, tack just had our openhouse this past Friday and one
of my favorite parts about itwas one of our graduates that
working at a local cardealership, his boss came, a
bunch of his coworkers came.
There was like half a dozenindividuals from his company
(24:39):
that came to the open housewhere he's brought so much value
to the company just beinghimself.
Like who he is, which isincredible person.
And he, it's very talented thatthe company sees that and
they've rallied behind it andmade it part of their culture.
So it was so cool to see hiscoworkers coming to our open
house and being like, I lovewhat you guys are doing.
(25:01):
You know, this individual's beena great addition.
We need more.
And, you know, going from there.
So, little things like that arethe wins that keep you going,
you know?
Jonathan (25:09):
Yeah.
That's pretty extraordinary thatyou're creating culture change
in helping companies to becomepart of this more autism ready
world that feels so powerful.
But, you know, the other thing Iwanna come back to, like
economic reality here, I mean,as I understand it, correct me
if I'm wrong, but there's ashortage of skilled trades
people.
Danny Combs (25:28):
Mm-hmm.
Jonathan (25:29):
on the other hand, I mean, some of the stats I've
seen are, neurodivergentindividuals are up to like 80%
underemployed.
So doesn't this seem like if mydata is correct?
It doesn't seem like a no.
Danny Combs (25:42):
For every five skilled trades minimum that
leave the trade and retire onlyto enter the field.
So like Colorado for example,for every opening, there's two
individuals ready to fill it.
so in the skilled trades,especially like we need people
and not just people, we need toChange the stigma.
I mean, still, you know, I wentto college, I have a master's
degree.
Yay.
(26:02):
And I'm glad I did.
It was, it was great.
but we have to put forward thenotion that, skilled trades have
value and it's not this lesserthan, profession.
In fact, a lot of times theseindividuals.
Make a heck of a lot more thantheir blue collar counterparts,
if you will.
But people don't realize thatbecause of the stigma that's
(26:22):
around it.
And it's like, do you want to godo landscaping and make six
figures doing landscaping andhave control of your schedule?
Or do you wanna go work in anoffice and start fetching coffee
and work your way up and youknow, be at a college making 20,
30,000?
when you look at like theaverage starting salary too.
(26:43):
Of somebody leaving collegeversus somebody just entering
the trades, you know, um,electricians a few years in,
they're already pulling in 80 Ka year.
Do you wanna be a 22 year old,make an 80 k starting, or do you
wanna be a 22 year old that justgraduated with a quarter million
dollars in debt and you'rehoping that's gonna pay off
either?
It's fine.
I mean, you, you choose what youwant to choose.
(27:04):
It's free world, you know?
Go for it.
you know, helping individualsknow, anybody know that that is
an opportunity that exists thatmay not have been presented to
them.
Jonathan (27:15):
that kind of stigma is an entirely separate podcast,
but this idea like 80 K afterthree years with no debt
compared to like unemployed andlike extraordinary debt.
Danny Combs (27:25):
exactly.
And it's.
it's just, it's so interestingto me when people see that
that's a possibility, that theyaren't aware of.
I mean, um, It's, it's very realand it's very, very doable.
And it's like, you know, you thecool thing, seeing our community
be starting to be embraced in itwith the business partners that
we have that have done it, um,they're realizing it.
(27:46):
And then, that's a whole othertopic too, is changing the
culture around, if they'remaking a certain amount of
money, then they lose theirbenefits and SSI becomes a whole
other issue and benefitscounseling and that could be a
whole other discussion becauseso many families.
At least that we work with thatare now getting stepped into
careers, have to have thoseconversations and understanding
what that looks like.
Um, so, um, yeah, that's a wholeother topic, my friend, changing
(28:13):
the dichotomy of what that lookslike.
So,
Jonathan (28:15):
Totally.
You know what I've always saidabout that?
I've literally never understoodwhy employers are responsible
for.
health insurance and why thereisn't some other function.
And I say, look, if employersare responsible for health
insurance, I totally get that.
But then employers should alsobe responsible for car insurance
and for all these other things.
And, um, you know, uh, inspoiler alert, I don't know.
I think there's a lot to be saidfor a single payer system, but
(28:37):
I'm not gonna get into thattopic now, but, you know.
Yeah.
Danny Combs (28:42):
Why employers do that.
The sidebar conversation.
So that started during the GreatDepression, you know, FDR had
put a wage freeze where youcouldn't make any more money
than you were already making.
Um, so everybody was stuck,right?
As far as what they were pullingin.
And there was no room foradvancement in the country.
Everybody was frozen.
And so the loophole in the lawwas that organizations could Pay
(29:05):
for your health benefits, and ifyou no longer had to pay for
your health benefits, all of asudden it was a raise, right?
Because health insurance costscompanies so much money, and so
everybody, then all thecompanies started being like, I
can't pay you more than yourcurrent salary due to the law,
but I can pay for your healthinsurance and you'll be making
that much more money.
And so everybody.
(29:27):
Flipped to that.
Um, and it's never flipped back.
But um, yeah, that was fdr, sothanks.
Great depression,
Jonathan (29:35):
Dude, you just learned me something new.
I mean, it's traumatic.
Having to, like, every time youmove an employer and look, these
days most people are movingemployers every couple, few
years, right?
And you've gotta go find newinsurance.
Like that's just that, that justseems like not the kind of
society like we want forourselves.
Danny Combs (29:52):
And autism parents.
That's a, that's a heavy burden.
That's a heavy lift, man.
So, um, for sure.
that's, definitely somethingthat weighs on people for
finding gigs for sure.
Jonathan (30:02):
Hmm.
Well, you know, I know thejourney of, um, of
entrepreneurs, of businessbuilders is not always bright
and rosy.
So, Danny, what's been the mostchallenging part of your tech
journey so far?
Danny Combs (30:16):
Oh, we should, this would be one we have over many
beers, my friend, cuz there somany, uh, so many different
things.
But, getting TACT set up wastricky in the sense that it's
such a different approach, froma lot of traditional autism.
Uh, groups that are all doingamazing things.
Not to put anybody down, but,uh, we heard, no, gosh, more
(30:36):
times than I can tell you.
I know insurance, we were turneddown 13 times.
but so many partner groups wouldeven come to us and be like,
they would just flatly say, ourkids can't do this, which I
think is just bluntly wrong, uh,personally, and I think TACT has
proven that, but it's takenyears for us to actually
showcase within our owncommunity.
(30:58):
The capability of our kids, andwhat the potential that can be
realized when set up for thecorrect opportunity for success,
and recognizing that talent andstrength do exist, and how do we
set them up for success ratherthan a future that's less than
they deserve.
Um, businesses ironically hasnot been one of the, the hardest
(31:19):
part.
Getting businesses to jump onboard, knock on wood, um, has
been, something that's beenworking out.
creating scholarships andopportunities for people.
That's been really tricky too.
And it's taken time, it's takena lot of years to get all of
these foundations and groups tojump on board and, and
rightfully so.
I mean, they're, supporting uswith their resources and we want
(31:39):
to be good stewards for that.
And, you know, as a nonprofit,we.
we're voluntarily audited everyyear.
We have all of our financialsonline, like we want to be good
stewards and showcase that thesupport that people give us,
we're using those resources in away that serves the community.
Um, But, you know, gettingpeople on board to do those
things that, that's hard.
And COVID happened in 2020,right?
(32:01):
And like we had to do a completepivot, but kept it going.
And during that time period, forexample, we turned into, you
know, like a manufacturingfacility sense that we Had our
teachers manufacturing kits andwe sold thousands and thousands
of kits of things that we werethen shipping to schools and
parents at home to like keepmaking stuff, but like keeping
people working and, you know,keeping the mission and the
(32:22):
vision moving forward, duringodd economic times.
That's been really hard.
That's been really, really hard.
and then, finding great staff.
We have an amazing staff at TACTthat's been incredible.
Um, they work really hard.
They're, incredible humans doingamazing things, but trying to
get them to where they need tobe paid successfully too.
I mean, one of the great ironiesis our graduates are making more
(32:45):
money than our staff and like,That's, you know, kind of the
nature of nonprofits, but alsonot, acceptable in a lot of
ways.
we need to be able to pay ourstaff the same and that, you
know, view of what is accessibleand appropriate within
nonprofits too.
Um, You know, they're creatingfutures.
They need to be taken care ofand rewarded for the success
(33:07):
that they're, creating for ourcommunity.
And, a lot of grants, andrightfully so.
Again, like we're open book, ifanybody wants to look up tact,
like all means do we, we're,we're available, even check it
out.
But a lot of grants have that 8020 rule where it's like 80% goes
towards programming, 20% towardsadmin.
Get it.
You know, some grantorssometimes don't look at having a
(33:28):
building as.
programmatic, they look at thatadmin and it's like, I can't
have a program without abuilding.
but a lot of them are amazing.
And as things are evolving andour communities being more
embraced, we have amazingpartners and amazing grant tours
that support us.
So if any of them are watching,I hope they know how much
they're appreciated.
But, um, getting to this pointhas, it's taken a lot of time
and my hair looks brown in this,but it, Jesus, it was really
(33:50):
brown before we started this.
It's gotten a lot grayer.
It just takes.
A lot, there's been, many timeswhere the board of directors
will come to me, you know, for afew years.
My average work hours have beenabout 107, 110 hours per week.
Um, it's too much and itshouldn't be that, but it's
what's necessary to get themission forward.
(34:12):
So in the future, I'm hopingthat we can build it where, you
know, Danny doesn't have to keepworking those kind of hours.
That would be grace.
So,
Jonathan (34:20):
That, that feels like unsustainable.
You struck a nerve.
So I was in the nonprofit worldfor seven plus years.
I started an outdoor educationnonprofit in, um, in, in Reno,
Nevada, the Lake Tahoe area.
And it's going phenomenally.
Um, To this day, but this ideaof an arbitrary cap on the
percentage of admin hours nevermade sense to me.
And here's why.
(34:40):
I always ask the question.
Tell me how that gives youinsight into how we are best
fulfilling our mission.
Shouldn't the outcome be likehow well you're serving to your
mission as opposed to somearbitrary admin percentage?
Danny Combs (34:54):
No.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
Um, there was a great book, um,Dan, and I'm forgetting his last
name right now.
Michelle will come to me afteryou finish the podcast.
But he wrote a book calledUncharitable and it was a
fantastic book.
I dunno if you've ever seen hisTED talk either, but he was
talking about just that, whereit's like the nonprofit sector
makes up roughly 5 billion,throughout the country, but
(35:16):
we're tasked with.
Solving the most, you know,health problems, homelessness,
unemployment, why?
You know what I mean?
And like, how do we attract thesame talent?
You know, if somebody can, atalented individual can make the
same money at a non-profitversus a for profit.
They might choose to come to anonprofit and have a bigger
(35:37):
impact, but a lot of times it'sjust the reality of economics
where that talented person hasto choose a for-profit to take
care of their family in thenonprofit world, and then our
humanity and culture suffersfrom that.
I.
That, that's unnecessary.
So how do we create thatequality where, you know, no
matter what field, those peoplethat are working to make change
(35:57):
can also then be recognized forit and off the same level of
success and same level ofsupport they have for their
families.
Um, that could be a whole notherconversation or podcast too,
because I think that's aninteresting thing.
So, um, that's been a challengefor us, for sure.
Jonathan (36:13):
Well, the other thing that struck me, you know, I'm
very fond of saying, Danny, thatas an entrepreneur who's, you
know, put a business plantogether and is out, whether
you're trying to raise money,just get it started.
Like you almost have to be alittle bit crazy because you are
trying to convince people of aneed that's out there that
hasn't been met, and the onlyway you can meet that need.
Is through this organizationthat doesn't yet exist.
(36:35):
But it's one thing to be anentrepreneur, say in healthcare,
right, as an a, b, a provider orwhatever, to start it like a,
you know, a car dealership.
There's an analog that ourcommunities and funders and
investors have for, for thosebusinesses.
There is no analog though,right?
For tact that made it, it soundslike that much harder.
Danny Combs (36:52):
no, it, it made it exceedingly hard and even like
in the nonprofit world.
we just renovated our new space,which is is amazing, and all our
business partners jumped up andhelped us, if we went to the
bank and said, Hey, can we get aloan to renovate our space?
The answer would be no, becausewe are a nonprofit and you have
to either then have, you know,some individual that has a lot
(37:15):
of finances, that would back itup entirely at like, you know,
almost a three to one typeratio.
So one point million dollarrenovation.
Okay, great.
Find me somebody with 4 millionin liquidity city at the bank.
And yes, I'll, you know, loanyou to help the nonprofit.
But even that is looked atcompletely differently and it's,
you know, I feel bad for thebanks, it's just they're put in
a losing situation too, in, inthat regards.
(37:36):
Which is a weird thing to sayabout banks maybe, but everybody
is set up for not winning inthat regards.
And so we can get past some ofthese regulatory things that are
holding us down.
Um, We can, we can do so muchmore.
We could do so, so much more.
And I think, you know, tact isalready doing a lot.
And as we move forward, one ofthe things that I'm optimistic
(37:57):
in is that we're starting tocreate this movement that people
are paying attention to andpeople are paying attention and
they're more willing toactually, you know, pivot a
little bit or, you know, openthe door a little bit wider and,
If we can then show howsuccessful we can be with that,
then it keeps going.
And so, um, you know, we'reheaded in a good direction where
(38:18):
it is now versus where it wasseven years ago, very different.
So.
Jonathan (38:24):
Well, Danny, what's one thing every a b a business
owner should start doing and onething to stop doing?
Danny Combs (38:31):
I think every ABA business should start looking at
programs like tact andpartnering with them.
You know, we partner with a lotof great ABA groups and I think
working together and not lookingat the things we're doing is
scary, but recognizing that itworks in concert with what
you're already doing and youknow, there's so many.
Perks, and benefits to workingtogether.
(38:54):
I think that would be somethingthat would be really beneficial
to do.
I think there's a lot still thatdon't approach organizations
like tact.
That would be something thatthey could start doing that
could really have a big impact.
Um, you know, one Revel comes tomind, their ABA group that's
been sending students to TACTFirefly.
Um, they're amazing and byworking together we are able to
(39:14):
create some pretty uniqueoutcomes.
I think.
So that was what they shouldstart doing.
What should they stop doing?
Um, that's, that's a whole otherthing.
I think, I have double-edgedsword in that, in the sense that
I have it from a dad perspectiveand I think I.
Um, I also have it from the tactperspective and I think ABA
(39:36):
looked at with the right lightand they've headed in the right
direction.
You know, they have somebarriers and some traditions and
some things they're gonna haveto overcome, not from anything
that they're doing wrong, butjust some things that have been
done in the past.
So I think if they are at leastcognitive of those and try to
change that, I think that wouldbe beneficial.
Because, awareness andacceptance of those things and
(39:56):
acknowledgement of them ratherthan protecting that they didn't
take place, um, would be good.
So I think there's a lot ofreally good, um, BCBAs out there
doing super cool stuff, um, thatare, they themselves held back
by the stereotype and stigma ofwhat Behavioralism looks like.
So I think just acknowledging itmoving forward and then
partnering with groups like tactwould be, um, a beneficial
(40:18):
course towards moving towardsthe future.
For sure.
Jonathan (40:22):
Right on.
Well, Danny, where can peoplefind you in TACT Online.
Danny Combs (40:28):
So our website is buildwithtact.org.
I think that would be a greatstart.
Um, we're also on LinkedIn,Facebook, you know, all those
fun things.
I don't do the Instagram, but Ihere we're on that too, so that
would be a good one to check outas well.
Jonathan (40:42):
Right on.
And you have built out a newcenter, as I understand it, in
Englewood, Colorado, in theDenver metro area.
Is that right?
Danny Combs (40:49):
Yeah, absolutely.
We have this new, it's just over18,474 square feet.
And you know, the amazing thing,the town of Inglewood has jumped
on board and, and recommendingtact to all the businesses
there.
So as far as the community allcoming together, I think that's
a great example of that.
So I hope people can check usout.
Jonathan (41:09):
Right on.
And full disclosure tolisteners, so Danny, um, who is
based in the Denver metro area,actually lives like right up the
mountain for me on LookoutMountain.
I live in Golden.
So I think, Danny, you have thedistinction of you are the
closest person that's, I've everinterviewed.
So, I have not yet seen thecenter, um, and I can wait to do
so.
Danny Combs (41:30):
Well, great minds think alike, my friends.
So we, we picked the same placeto live, so it makes me happy.
Jonathan (41:36):
Bingo.
Alright.
Are you ready for the uh, hottake rapid fire questions?
Danny Combs (41:40):
Sure go for it.
Jonathan (41:43):
All right, Danny, you're on your deathbed.
What's the one thing you wannabe remembered for?
Danny Combs (41:49):
That I think that I lived as authentically as
possible, that I genuinely triedand was present and tried to be
a decent human.
Jonathan (41:59):
Yeah.
What's your most importantself-care practice?
Danny Combs (42:04):
Playing guitar and working on cars.
I have to turn a wrench, man.
I have to.
Jonathan (42:10):
That's so good to know that those things, I mean they
were like careers or at least aguitar play, but it can still be
a passion after it's a career.
Is that right?
Danny Combs (42:18):
Oh, absolutely.
The, the sound of a vintageMartin guitar, that's, that's
heaven for sure.
Absolutely.
Jonathan (42:25):
Uh, what's your favorite song and or music
genre?
Danny Combs (42:32):
You know, I don't have a favorite song that would
be terrible to say, but musicgenre.
I grew up in the AppalachianMountains in the Blue Ridge.
Bluegrass is uh, folk music,Americana.
That's my home, man.
That's the jam for sure.
Jonathan (42:45):
Oh man, brother, you know, which band?
Um, uh, my wife and I have seenmore than any other live show
Yonder, mountain String Band,actually up from, uh, Boulder
net.
Danny Combs (42:55):
Yeah, they are.
They definitely are.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Jonathan (42:58):
we love us some bluegrass.
Yeah, do do you have a YonderMountain story to share?
Danny Combs (43:03):
No, I was gonna there's a band called Watchhouse
that used to be mandolin orangeyears ago.
North Carolina Band.
Same kind of thing, but it'slike when you grow up with a
locally Yeah, you, uh, you stickwith that for sure.
Definitely.
Jonathan (43:14):
Ugh, I love it.
One of our favorites too.
What's one thing you'd tell your18 year old soft Danny?
Danny Combs (43:22):
It sounds weird.
Maybe this is just my mood atthe, at the time, but.
I used to believe and I thinkwhen I was younger that the
harder you worked, that that wasgonna be it.
And I think that's important forsure, but I think relationships
are even that much moreimportant.
And I think surrounding yourselfwith good people and having
relationships with those goodpeople, cuz man, do need those
(43:43):
people in your life.
And I think, um, I credit thosearound me that have supported me
and seen me and picked me upand, you know, especially when
I'm down or even held meaccountable when I'm high, um,
to know that, you know what'simportant.
So friendships, relationships,that's gonna be a thing that
carries you.
Jonathan (44:01):
Mm.
Beautifully said, well, if youcould only wear one style of
footwear for the rest of yourlife, what would it be?
Danny Combs (44:10):
So everybody gives me crap.
I don't, I don't wear socksexcept when I'm doing my
military stuff.
I have to wear socks.
But I'm a Birkenstock guy.
I grew up in Asheville, NorthCarolina, so I still have my
Birkenstock and New Balance.
Those would be it.
Yeah.
Jonathan (44:26):
Dude, there are very few days that went by in the
early mid nineties when I wasnot in my pair of Birkenstocks,
Danny Combs (44:32):
Oh, hell yeah.
I love that they're coming backtoo, but some of us never faded
away.
So
Jonathan (44:38):
right?
Like history is all about thosecycles.
Danny, this has been an absolutepleasure.
Thank you for all you're doingfor our community and for
neurodivergent individuals.
I appreciate you, dude.
Danny Combs (44:48):
thank you so much for your time.
I appreciate it.
Thank you for having me on.
It's always a pleasure.
My guest today is Danny Combs.
Danny's a fourth generationwoodworker and mechanical
tinkerer who grew up makingstuff with his family.
Eventually, he decided to followhis own path and went to
Nashville to play music.
His vibrant career includedvarious platinum albums with
Grammy and Oscar winningrecording artists.
Danny has two incrediblechildren, Dylan and Ellie.
(00:50):
When his son Dylan was diagnosedwith autism, Danny formed tact.
Teaching the autism communitytrades to help other kids like
his own and their families.
He's past board chair, presidentof the Autism Society of
Colorado.
He's in the Air Force Reserve,working in space system
operations and most recently, heco-founded the Colorado
Neurodiversity Chamber ofCommerce, Danny has a Master's
(01:12):
degree in education as a boardcertified cognitive specialist,
a certified autism specialist,and a classic car junkie.
Danny, welcome to the pod dude.
Danny Combs (01:22):
Welcome.
Thank you.
I appreciate it so much.
Jonathan (01:27):
So Danny, you are literally like a Renaissance
man.
Um, and uh, there's so much thatyou do that I wanna dig into,
but, but you're, you know,you're also a consummate
entrepreneur.
And tell me, when did yourealize that you were a
visionary builder, entrepreneur?
Danny Combs (01:43):
Oh, it's very flattering.
I dunno if I would necessarilythink of myself in all those
things.
I just, I like learning.
I love learning new things.
I love to read.
I like new experiences.
I find that best I can tell weget one shot at this and there's
so much to do.
So, I find that I'm alwayslooking and enjoying and trying
to really take it in.
I mean, my life was changedwith, with my son and I mean, I
(02:05):
would say for the better.
I feel like I'm exactly whereI'm supposed to be, but it
certainly was in a differentdirection for sure.
But, I just find that I have aunique background.
My parents were amazing.
My family, uh, lineage like.
I feel like I come from goodindividuals that raised me in a
nice way that gives me the toolsI need to be the person I need
to be for my son.
So it's, it's kind of neat howit feels like it all comes full
(02:26):
circle.
So, I'm just trying to do thebest I can with it.
So, yeah.
Appreciate it.
Jonathan (02:31):
tell me some more about Dylan, about your son and
the, the autism diagnosis andhow did that change your
perspective on the communityand, and on your world?
Danny Combs (02:40):
that's a great question.
It, it changed so much.
I mean, I, I feel like when Ifirst heard those words, I
didn't know nearly as much as Iknow now.
So, I mean, I definitely had adifferent perception too.
But I mean, it also, I.
Explained a lot and also broughta lot of like, oh, that makes so
much more sense now.
at the same time, but at thesame token too, I mean, the
(03:01):
world's changed so much since hewas diagnosed.
He's 14 now and he was youngerwhen, you know, we first got
those words have been in Denvernow for a decade.
So this was all the way back inNashville.
And, it was, Hard to hear,honestly.
Like I would love to tell youthat I had this great response.
Where was this?
Like, yay and let's go and allthat.
But I was.
I took it hard at first,honestly, selfishly I had all
(03:24):
these thoughts of like, youknow, does this change who I am
as a man, as a father, as like,will I ever be a grandfather?
Is my family name going to carryon?
I mean, all these selfishthoughts, but I'm just being
real and honest.
Kind of, kind of thoughts.
And then, um, You know, I feellike diving in and seeing how
amazing he was and all the loveand joy that he brought, that
(03:46):
really felt like something toget behind.
And, trying to support hisstrengths too, because I mean,
he was six, six and a halfbefore he could say like, I love
you dad, or really express in away that I really received.
It felt like, his affection.
And my daughter at that pointwas three and I was having more
conversations with her.
(04:07):
And, um, it was seeing hisstrengths in the way that he
could do things.
That was really the inspirationfor tact and the launching pad
that, you know, brought us hereto get to meet each other today.
So I always credit Dylan withchanging my life for the better.
I think he's taught me so muchand I've learned so much more
from him than I think I couldever teach him.
And, um, I'm really grateful forall of it.
(04:29):
So, yeah.
Jonathan (04:32):
Wow.
That idea of like, you'velearned so much more from him
than you could ever teach himthat's such a humbling, and you
have just this powerfulperspective, Danny.
Um, and I, I honor your journeyand I'm curious, was there a
very direct line from, Hisautism diagnosis to then your
sense that, huh?
our community needs something,um, you know, and, and, and then
(04:53):
forming tact or, you know, whatwas the need you saw in the
community that prompted you tostart tact?
Danny Combs (04:58):
That's a great question.
So, um, yes.
there was a, a great group, um,down in Nashville, just outside
of Nashville.
I lived on the old Hickory Lakethere and there was a group
called Little Fox Therapy.
so if they watched this, theywere great if out in Mountain
Juliet, just, to the east ofNashville there.
And, um, they were doing greatthings and it was a great team.
(05:20):
And, I gave them a whole bunchof money cuz I was paying for
everything out of pocket.
because nothing is covered inTennessee under any kind of
insurance, it's at all, which ispart of the catalyst of bringing
me to Colorado.
And, um, during that process, itwas just so he needs to do this,
he needs to change, that, heneeds to do X, Y, and Z.
(05:41):
And while yes, they identified,you know, areas of growth in him
and helped me discover somesuccess enablers that he needed.
I never once heard, and I'm notputting them down at all.
So I hope it doesn't come acrosslike that, but I never heard
what he was good at and likewhat he could do, or the things
that, you know, the potentialthat he did have.
And so seeing him able to makethings, fix things, visualize
(06:06):
things, conceptualize things, itstarted as simple as that of
just like, okay, these arethings that I can identify that
he's really good at.
And how do I find a way to buildthat up and help him see that in
himself?
You know, I've never wanted himto ever feel like this world he
needs to change for.
I've always wanted it to be, andI hope it, you know, the end of
(06:28):
my days, wherever Dylan ends up,that he looks at the world and
never realizes the struggle thatwe went through to get that
world in place.
I want him to just be like, thisis who I am.
They see me for who I am, andthey embrace it.
I think we had a long way to gofor that.
But, seeing those strengths inhim, started putting together
the idea of tact and seeing thatthere was no one else doing
(06:48):
anything like it.
And I actually had the chance tomeet Dr.
Temple Grandon and um, said,Hey, I've got this idea.
What do you think?
And she was a hundred percent inthe Catalyst where she was like,
you need to put down yourguitar.
Stop doing this.
Stop what you're doing and go dothis right now.
And for whatever reason, um, Idon't know if I just had too
much coffee that day, or just myheart or mind, whatever in that
(07:11):
place.
It was just like, okay.
And did.
And, it's been the best vice.
She's since become just a dearfriend and, she'll call me
sometimes outta the blue.
I was just on Colorado PublicRadio and, um, All of a sudden
she heard that apparently as shewas leaving a factory and
somewhere that she wasconsulting on, and I don't even
know where Colorado.
(07:31):
And she called me from theparking garage and is like, I
just heard you.
Thank you.
You did it right.
And she's just so sweet, andencouraging and just we're in
alignment in so many things andit just makes me happy that she
still takes the time to, to calland say that she's keeping up
with everything.
So, um, Yeah, that was a gamechanger.
And um, you know, it's grown alot since then and the world's
(07:53):
grown a lot since then, so it'skind of exciting to see, you
know, we're seven years in as ofnext month.
And it's wild to think that youknow where we are, seven years
in, it seems like others arestarting to get to a similar
place, and where we're gonna bein another seven, another
decade, another 20 years.
I don't know.
But I have a feeling it'sheading in a direction that it's
(08:15):
just finally start heading in.
So it feels like,
Jonathan (08:18):
Wow.
Okay, there's so much, Danny.
Now I need to unpack here.
First, just to be clear, this isthe Dr.
Temple Grandon from ColoradoState University, uh, ag
Professor ais, she's autisticherself, and she told you
directly, you've gotta put downyour guitar.
Go start this.
Danny Combs (08:35):
And when Temple tells you to do something, you
do it cuz she's usually right.
So, um, yeah, she's an amazingindividual.
She's like, um, you know,women's Hall of Fame, time
Magazine.
Hundred one most Influentialpeople.
She says a new book, that shewrote.
she's an extraordinary person.
She really is.
Jonathan (08:51):
Wow.
Well, so then, and I heard youdescribe Dylan A.
Little bit there.
Ha.
Did Dylan get the tinkerer, um,sort of woodworker jeans, or is
that Ellie,
Danny Combs (09:02):
I was so, hope so my friend.
No, definitely the tinkerer, butit seems like, you know, this
entire.
And I hate to stereotype, andI'm not trying to, but it seems
like the Gen Zers are definitelymore technology based and Dylan
definitely falls in line withthat.
But if I can definitely get himthinking outside the box in
regards to even what that lookslike technologically.
And you know, the new things wedo at TACT is we look at it from
(09:24):
a holistic approach of not justusing but diagnosing, fixing,
and assembling because there'sso much more to it than just
using these technologies, butgenuinely understanding them and
able to.
Fix them and maintain them andcreate the infrastructure to
sustain them.
I think is gonna be important.
So I'm hoping that taking that,you know, the tech stuff that
we're doing now at, at Tact,where we work with Microsoft now
(09:47):
with their, um, hollowlens doingmixed reality, augmented reality
stuff for some of the EV carstuff can hopefully be like a
unique blend behind his tech,you know, enjoyment and on,
tinkering.
So, doesn't have a carburetor,but it's okay.
So,
Jonathan (10:05):
Carburetor.
Who knows what a carburetor isthese days, right?
Huh?
The next generation.
So here's one of the things thatyou said earlier that so
resonated with me is I believe,this is not about like changing
those with autism.
Yes.
We have to support them everyway we can.
It's about creating a worldthat's more autism ready.
Right.
and more autism friendly.
and.
Meeting autistics where theyare.
(10:26):
But can you, do you have statsor tell me about this
extraordinary need for adultsand whether it's around
underemployment or unemployment?
Um, I don't know.
Did that factor in at all to,you know, to how you thought
about the change you wanted tomake?
Danny Combs (10:42):
you know it, it did to a degree at a time, but I
feel like he was so young and Iwas so young, even though.
It registered and it wasdefinitely one of the founding
pillars of what we wanted to doat TACT it definitely registers
more now as the older he'sgetting, and it makes it feel
that much more tangible and realin the impact we're having.
Um, and it's definitely becomemore in focus as we've fine
(11:04):
tuned it and gotten, um, Betterat it honestly, as far as
creating career opportunitiesfor individuals and that kind of
a quality of opportunity.
But when he was younger, youknow, you would read stats and
they haven't changed.
You know, that's the saddestthing, there's a office of
employment here in Coloradothat's doing some great stuff
and I remember going to one oftheir meetings and hearing this
was around the 30th anniversaryof ada, so it's since been a
(11:28):
couple years past that now, andtalking about how, you know,
there is accessibility.
More so in a lot of buildingsexcept for like our capital, um,
and some other buildings likethat that, you know, help accs
and supporters in a variety ofdifferent circumstances.
ADA's been great with that, butemployment hasn't changed, and
so it's like all of theseinitiatives and all of these
(11:48):
programs and all of these stepsthat we've taken for inclusivity
haven't really changed thelandscape of what that looks
like for the neurodivergentindividuals.
And that's wild to think thatthat's still behind even from
the fact of when he was, youknow, child when he was first
diagnosed and where we'vestarted so at TACT we have an
83% placement rate.
(12:09):
It's actually 83.3 to be exact,but, um, we have a pretty good
run as far as gettingindividuals placed, um, into
careers.
And hopefully we can keep thatgoing.
But if we can even change thelandscape five degrees.
That'll be, more than it's beenachieved in decades.
and it, it's about freaking timethat starts taking place.
Jonathan (12:32):
I want to dig in some more on this specific, coaching
and extraordinary job trainingprograms and placements that you
do, but like, why has this neednot yet been addressed?
If you were to pinpoint.
Danny Combs (12:44):
That's such a great question.
You know, it's something we askourselves all the time.
I know, I, I read so much, as aformer musician in my past life,
it's a similar conundrum in thesense of like, you look at every
study that ever comes out, everabout music education, and it
will tell you it makes yousmarter.
It increases X, Y, and Z forlike your future of life.
People that study music are moresuccessful, all these different
(13:06):
things.
And yet the arts are constantlythe first thing that programs
cut.
It makes no sense.
I think of it in a similar wayof, autism.
Employment neurodivergenteducation and inclusivity, and
where it's still something forwhatever reason, people are
afraid of and they hear thatword autism and they just either
(13:27):
have some perception in theirmind of what that looks like,
um, right or wrong, um, or theyjust are ignorant to it or,
there was a study that just cameout from the global disability
and association that they hadthis thing saying the average
accommodation costs less than$500 for the employer to make a
change.
500 bucks.
(13:48):
For the average and it's likefor, you know, our community, a
lot of times it could be more,it could be less.
let's just stick with the 500.
But I know we work with a lotwith electricians for example,
we get a lot of great companiesthat hire our graduates,
Wayfield Sturgeon, Rexel, thesegreat companies that hire our
graduates and talking to afriend that runs Wakefield, he
was telling me about a buddy ofhis that is inspired by what
(14:10):
Wakefield's doing.
Didn't hire a TACT grad, whichis totally okay, but did
embrace, hiring Neurodiverseindividuals and this person's so
proficient.
They've done the work of fourOther Neurotypicals because
they're that good at their joband it's such an incredible
story where they then went backto him and I'm like, man, your
company's onto it because thismakes so much more sense.
(14:34):
But it's taking people that havethat experience from a, I think
a business perspective that areshowcasing.
how it's making their entireculture better and not from this
programmatic, oh look, I'mclicking a d e i, um, box over
here on the corner.
But genuinely embracing aculture of inclusivity to
actually bring our community andall of our people together, um,
(14:57):
they're finally starting to getit, but we just need more
stories about that, and we needthose people to be more vocal
and showcase it and not try tojust hide it away and tuck it in
the corner, you know?
That's kind of how it feels now.
Jonathan (15:10):
what's crazy.
I mean, to your point, thisisn't just checking a d e I box
and, um, and doing the, theright thing.
This makes economic andfinancial sense.
I mean, one, electrician, itsounds like, um, neuro divergent
electrician did the work of fourNeurotypical.
And tell me more about what, um,Tax job, coaching and training
(15:32):
looks like specifically, likehelp paint a picture of that.
And then like, I'd love toshare, share more stories around
the successes, individualsuccesses in, in getting placed.
Danny Combs (15:43):
well, thanks.
We do it a little bitdifferently, um, in the sense
that, you know, we work with theemployers directly, to see
what's real and what they'reactually looking for.
We don't want it to have thisacademic, you know, off to the
side approach where it's like,we think we know what employers
want, but we don't actually knowwhat employers want.
So, um, we talked with theemployers directly to figure out
(16:04):
what's authentic and what'sreal.
And then as a small nonprofit,we serve a couple hundred kids
every year, or young adultsevery year, but we never have
more than six students perclass.
So we've set it up where we havea trade professional and an
autism professional using R B TA B C B A, a coda, somebody with
autism experience that's alsothere working with that trade
(16:24):
professional and they're workingtogether to make that training
as authentic as possible towardsthe job.
And when they do that, we'recreating what we call simulation
site where the students are ableto simulate what it's like
working for an employer, avariety of different capacities,
doing the same jobs, and sothey're getting the sounds, the
sensations, the tooling, thelanguage, the vocabulary, all of
(16:47):
those things at first.
And then when we get them.
Going towards a job.
Then we do work-based interviewsand portfolios and kind of on
the job training for that job.
And then we have a job coachthat's, you know, one-on-one
in-person, side-by-side withthem, which is great, as opposed
to a lot of people will use, youknow, zoom calls.
And if that's all you have, it'sbetter than nothing.
(17:09):
But we try to do things inperson because there's, a lot
more that's, achieved when it'ssomething in person.
and then.
It's kind of like a step, right?
Where they've learned thisskill, they've learned this
trade, then they've stepped intoworking with the employer, they
still have that tact personthat's there working with them,
and then that tact person kindof slowly fades out as they're
working at just that employer.
I.
(17:29):
That's really simplifying it,but to kind of put it in like a
linear graph, if that's evenpossible, just to showcase some
of the steps.
And then we do things like helpthem get tools because a lot of
trades and men and women, youknow, have to have their own
tools and we wanna, findpartners that are a, giving good
wages.
So the average TACT graduate hasa$19.86 cents starting salary.
(17:49):
We're finding partners that,Embrace advancement and not just
looking at, you know, aposition, but what is the
longevity and lifespan ofsomebody working in that trade
look like for the future.
So they have a whole career and,knock on wood, there's, there's
always learning and growth, butwe're able to individualize a
lot, which I think has helped tothe success of it.
(18:10):
Um, so yeah, it's gettingcloser, getting closer, still,
way to go, but we're gettingcloser for short.
Jonathan (18:16):
so you described, electricians.
What are some examples of theother trades that you're
commonly placing your, yourgraduates in?
Danny Combs (18:23):
we do a lot with auto mechanics.
That's, one of the things Ithink a lot of people think of
tact.
Cause we started it in a 58Chevy cuz.
That's mentioned my bio.
I love classic cars cuz they'reso freaking cool.
just so much more style.
so you know a lot with cars.
We work with Toyota, um, whichwe became the first program that
Toyota sponsored.
that's works with neurodivergentindividuals and they can
(18:45):
actually get Toyota certified.
Um, and get all of those certsthat they need to actually then
step into a job with a Toyotadealership.
So then we have Toyotadealerships that we partner with
too.
So it's neat to have thatalignment and kind of
progression with both ToyotaNational and then also with the
local dealerships so that thetraining that we're doing is
pretty neat.
so a lot in the auto mechanics.
(19:06):
We work with a bunch ofdifferent, car dealerships here
throughout, the Denver area aswell as groups like Advanced
Auto Parts and Jiffy Lubes.
Gosh, we've got so many.
there's 38 of our activebusiness partners right now, so
we're just starting with Excel,which we're super excited about.
The Nerded diversity at works,people that are, you know,
coming here to start working.
Also in, in Colorado, I've setup some new things that we
haven't got placed yet, but inpower, which we're looking
(19:28):
forward to that.
There's 38 businesses that wepersonally work with.
everything from the Denverairport, which is pretty cool,
some of the things that they'vedone there as well.
Um, a lot of electricalcompanies as you've mentioned.
also things like Southwestinstallers doing welding type
work, which we're pretty happyabout as well.
Um, So a bunch of differentstuff kind of all over the
(19:49):
spectrum, if you will.
That pun of, uh, employers.
Jonathan (19:53):
Where my mind keeps coming back to Danny is like,
what's it gonna take to expandtact to the entire country, if
not the world?
And, to get specific on this,what is the biggest barrier to
scaling?
Is it needing to build thesepartnerships given the intention
you place into, bringing,companies into the fold?
Is it, fighting enough,individuals to work with?
Is it finding the coaches?
Danny Combs (20:15):
That's a great question.
Um, Gosh, you know, it's, it'sinteresting there.
There's a couple really bigbarriers that we at least have
identified so far, but we don'teven know what we don't know as
we're trying to go national andwe're aware of that.
But the ones that we're aware ofat this point is.
First and foremost, you know, asa dad of a child with autism, we
decided that if people wannacome to us, we work with all
(20:37):
kinds of foundations, grantors,um, community centered boards to
create scholarships andopportunities for those to come.
We don't want it to ever be thisfee for service where parents
have done well, so they canbring their child to our program
or this individual themself tobring somebody.
We want it to be genuinely,attainable for all individuals
(20:58):
to come.
And so, That in itself isdifficult, where all across the
country, autism services arefunded differently.
So how do you create thosepathways all across the country?
There is no universal design inthat sense, or at obtainability
or accessibility for autismservices.
(21:18):
Um, So that's one of thebarriers that we've made.
If it was just fee for service,like a for-profit or a nonprofit
that is, you know, a schoolthat's just like, this is our
tuition go, that would beeasier, but it wouldn't be as
accessible.
So we try to avoid that.
the second one is, you know,part of the success, like you
mentioned, is having thoseemployers that want to jump in.
(21:41):
And so, Getting those businesspartners in different states or
different cities.
Gosh, that's hard too.
That's a really hard thing to dotoo.
So, um, those are two of theones that we've identified that
are the biggest ones.
And then there's, you know,things that are equally
important but also difficult.
as a 5 0 1 you'd have to set upseparate board of directors and
(22:03):
then the board of directors canoversee their board of directors
and there becomes all kinds of.
Of, you know, mundane thingsthat can become tricky, that are
also equally important.
But, you know, board ofdirectors, for example, they're
volunteers.
They're giving us their time.
We don't want to tax them with,okay, I need you to look over
the branch in Texas and the onein North Carolina and the one in
Idaho, you know, or whatever.
(22:24):
so those are the ones that we'restruggling with honestly.
Um, so we'll see.
We're trying to figure out howto overcome that for sure.
Jonathan (22:34):
Well, tell me more about, what it takes to bring an
employer on.
So if you've got like a Toyotathat's already inspired to want
to do this, how much trainingand shaping of their behavior
and their program do you have todo to get them ready to accept
tact graduates?
Danny Combs (22:49):
That's a great question too.
You're asking good ones.
Ironically, not very much.
That's one of the amazing thingsI think, within the trades, one
of the, Perks of the trades islanguage.
For example, autism andcommunication.
When you, when you look at howthose two correlate together.
Right.
Um, also within the trades,English as a second language has
already been embraced in avariety of different ways.
(23:12):
Mm-hmm.
So all of the language barriersthat could.
perhaps be difficult in like anIT setting for example, have
already been overcome in a lotof skilled trades organizations
because a lot of, let's sayyou're an electrician, well,
let's just say you're a nonmechanic.
Everything is laid out indiagrams, color coded A, B, C,
D, and it's broken downsequential.
(23:33):
I mean, it's a task analysis,already created for you and, um,
they've already.
Looked at it from thatperspective.
So for a lot of times for them,it's like they'll bring us,
their diagrams or what theirscope of work that they're
trying to do, and we don't evenhave to modify it.
It's just like, oh, great.
All right, thanks.
This is our lesson plan for theday.
(23:54):
Here you go, kids.
Cuz I mean, they're alreadythere in, in that regards.
Now getting them to embrace, avariety of different things,
could be a little bit moretricky, but, In that regard to
the scope of work of the actualtrade, not so much.
So, for a lot of it though, it'shelping them also then
communicate with their staff,because sometimes there still
is, you know, some unjust biasesthat exist within their own
(24:17):
community culture that they'reeither then working on
themselves or trying to address.
And then, creating that culture,at least at first.
But, tack just had our openhouse this past Friday and one
of my favorite parts about itwas one of our graduates that
working at a local cardealership, his boss came, a
bunch of his coworkers came.
There was like half a dozenindividuals from his company
(24:39):
that came to the open housewhere he's brought so much value
to the company just beinghimself.
Like who he is, which isincredible person.
And he, it's very talented thatthe company sees that and
they've rallied behind it andmade it part of their culture.
So it was so cool to see hiscoworkers coming to our open
house and being like, I lovewhat you guys are doing.
(25:01):
You know, this individual's beena great addition.
We need more.
And, you know, going from there.
So, little things like that arethe wins that keep you going,
you know?
Jonathan (25:09):
Yeah.
That's pretty extraordinary thatyou're creating culture change
in helping companies to becomepart of this more autism ready
world that feels so powerful.
But, you know, the other thing Iwanna come back to, like
economic reality here, I mean,as I understand it, correct me
if I'm wrong, but there's ashortage of skilled trades
people.
Danny Combs (25:28):
Mm-hmm.
Jonathan (25:29):
on the other hand, I mean, some of the stats I've
seen are, neurodivergentindividuals are up to like 80%
underemployed.
So doesn't this seem like if mydata is correct?
It doesn't seem like a no.
Danny Combs (25:42):
For every five skilled trades minimum that
leave the trade and retire onlyto enter the field.
So like Colorado for example,for every opening, there's two
individuals ready to fill it.
so in the skilled trades,especially like we need people
and not just people, we need toChange the stigma.
I mean, still, you know, I wentto college, I have a master's
degree.
Yay.
(26:02):
And I'm glad I did.
It was, it was great.
but we have to put forward thenotion that, skilled trades have
value and it's not this lesserthan, profession.
In fact, a lot of times theseindividuals.
Make a heck of a lot more thantheir blue collar counterparts,
if you will.
But people don't realize thatbecause of the stigma that's
(26:22):
around it.
And it's like, do you want to godo landscaping and make six
figures doing landscaping andhave control of your schedule?
Or do you wanna go work in anoffice and start fetching coffee
and work your way up and youknow, be at a college making 20,
30,000?
when you look at like theaverage starting salary too.
(26:43):
Of somebody leaving collegeversus somebody just entering
the trades, you know, um,electricians a few years in,
they're already pulling in 80 Ka year.
Do you wanna be a 22 year old,make an 80 k starting, or do you
wanna be a 22 year old that justgraduated with a quarter million
dollars in debt and you'rehoping that's gonna pay off
either?
It's fine.
I mean, you, you choose what youwant to choose.
(27:04):
It's free world, you know?
Go for it.
you know, helping individualsknow, anybody know that that is
an opportunity that exists thatmay not have been presented to
them.
Jonathan (27:15):
that kind of stigma is an entirely separate podcast,
but this idea like 80 K afterthree years with no debt
compared to like unemployed andlike extraordinary debt.
Danny Combs (27:25):
exactly.
And it's.
it's just, it's so interestingto me when people see that
that's a possibility, that theyaren't aware of.
I mean, um, It's, it's very realand it's very, very doable.
And it's like, you know, you thecool thing, seeing our community
be starting to be embraced in itwith the business partners that
we have that have done it, um,they're realizing it.
(27:46):
And then, that's a whole othertopic too, is changing the
culture around, if they'remaking a certain amount of
money, then they lose theirbenefits and SSI becomes a whole
other issue and benefitscounseling and that could be a
whole other discussion becauseso many families.
At least that we work with thatare now getting stepped into
careers, have to have thoseconversations and understanding
what that looks like.
Um, so, um, yeah, that's a wholeother topic, my friend, changing
(28:13):
the dichotomy of what that lookslike.
So,
Jonathan (28:15):
Totally.
You know what I've always saidabout that?
I've literally never understoodwhy employers are responsible
for.
health insurance and why thereisn't some other function.
And I say, look, if employersare responsible for health
insurance, I totally get that.
But then employers should alsobe responsible for car insurance
and for all these other things.
And, um, you know, uh, inspoiler alert, I don't know.
I think there's a lot to be saidfor a single payer system, but
(28:37):
I'm not gonna get into thattopic now, but, you know.
Yeah.
Danny Combs (28:42):
Why employers do that.
The sidebar conversation.
So that started during the GreatDepression, you know, FDR had
put a wage freeze where youcouldn't make any more money
than you were already making.
Um, so everybody was stuck,right?
As far as what they were pullingin.
And there was no room foradvancement in the country.
Everybody was frozen.
And so the loophole in the lawwas that organizations could Pay
(29:05):
for your health benefits, and ifyou no longer had to pay for
your health benefits, all of asudden it was a raise, right?
Because health insurance costscompanies so much money, and so
everybody, then all thecompanies started being like, I
can't pay you more than yourcurrent salary due to the law,
but I can pay for your healthinsurance and you'll be making
that much more money.
And so everybody.
(29:27):
Flipped to that.
Um, and it's never flipped back.
But um, yeah, that was fdr, sothanks.
Great depression,
Jonathan (29:35):
Dude, you just learned me something new.
I mean, it's traumatic.
Having to, like, every time youmove an employer and look, these
days most people are movingemployers every couple, few
years, right?
And you've gotta go find newinsurance.
Like that's just that, that justseems like not the kind of
society like we want forourselves.
Danny Combs (29:52):
And autism parents.
That's a, that's a heavy burden.
That's a heavy lift, man.
So, um, for sure.
that's, definitely somethingthat weighs on people for
finding gigs for sure.
Jonathan (30:02):
Hmm.
Well, you know, I know thejourney of, um, of
entrepreneurs, of businessbuilders is not always bright
and rosy.
So, Danny, what's been the mostchallenging part of your tech
journey so far?
Danny Combs (30:16):
Oh, we should, this would be one we have over many
beers, my friend, cuz there somany, uh, so many different
things.
But, getting TACT set up wastricky in the sense that it's
such a different approach, froma lot of traditional autism.
Uh, groups that are all doingamazing things.
Not to put anybody down, but,uh, we heard, no, gosh, more
(30:36):
times than I can tell you.
I know insurance, we were turneddown 13 times.
but so many partner groups wouldeven come to us and be like,
they would just flatly say, ourkids can't do this, which I
think is just bluntly wrong, uh,personally, and I think TACT has
proven that, but it's takenyears for us to actually
showcase within our owncommunity.
(30:58):
The capability of our kids, andwhat the potential that can be
realized when set up for thecorrect opportunity for success,
and recognizing that talent andstrength do exist, and how do we
set them up for success ratherthan a future that's less than
they deserve.
Um, businesses ironically hasnot been one of the, the hardest
(31:19):
part.
Getting businesses to jump onboard, knock on wood, um, has
been, something that's beenworking out.
creating scholarships andopportunities for people.
That's been really tricky too.
And it's taken time, it's takena lot of years to get all of
these foundations and groups tojump on board and, and
rightfully so.
I mean, they're, supporting uswith their resources and we want
(31:39):
to be good stewards for that.
And, you know, as a nonprofit,we.
we're voluntarily audited everyyear.
We have all of our financialsonline, like we want to be good
stewards and showcase that thesupport that people give us,
we're using those resources in away that serves the community.
Um, But, you know, gettingpeople on board to do those
things that, that's hard.
And COVID happened in 2020,right?
(32:01):
And like we had to do a completepivot, but kept it going.
And during that time period, forexample, we turned into, you
know, like a manufacturingfacility sense that we Had our
teachers manufacturing kits andwe sold thousands and thousands
of kits of things that we werethen shipping to schools and
parents at home to like keepmaking stuff, but like keeping
people working and, you know,keeping the mission and the
(32:22):
vision moving forward, duringodd economic times.
That's been really hard.
That's been really, really hard.
and then, finding great staff.
We have an amazing staff at TACTthat's been incredible.
Um, they work really hard.
They're, incredible humans doingamazing things, but trying to
get them to where they need tobe paid successfully too.
I mean, one of the great ironiesis our graduates are making more
(32:45):
money than our staff and like,That's, you know, kind of the
nature of nonprofits, but alsonot, acceptable in a lot of
ways.
we need to be able to pay ourstaff the same and that, you
know, view of what is accessibleand appropriate within
nonprofits too.
Um, You know, they're creatingfutures.
They need to be taken care ofand rewarded for the success
(33:07):
that they're, creating for ourcommunity.
And, a lot of grants, andrightfully so.
Again, like we're open book, ifanybody wants to look up tact,
like all means do we, we're,we're available, even check it
out.
But a lot of grants have that 8020 rule where it's like 80% goes
towards programming, 20% towardsadmin.
Get it.
You know, some grantorssometimes don't look at having a
(33:28):
building as.
programmatic, they look at thatadmin and it's like, I can't
have a program without abuilding.
but a lot of them are amazing.
And as things are evolving andour communities being more
embraced, we have amazingpartners and amazing grant tours
that support us.
So if any of them are watching,I hope they know how much
they're appreciated.
But, um, getting to this pointhas, it's taken a lot of time
and my hair looks brown in this,but it, Jesus, it was really
(33:50):
brown before we started this.
It's gotten a lot grayer.
It just takes.
A lot, there's been, many timeswhere the board of directors
will come to me, you know, for afew years.
My average work hours have beenabout 107, 110 hours per week.
Um, it's too much and itshouldn't be that, but it's
what's necessary to get themission forward.
(34:12):
So in the future, I'm hopingthat we can build it where, you
know, Danny doesn't have to keepworking those kind of hours.
That would be grace.
So,
Jonathan (34:20):
That, that feels like unsustainable.
You struck a nerve.
So I was in the nonprofit worldfor seven plus years.
I started an outdoor educationnonprofit in, um, in, in Reno,
Nevada, the Lake Tahoe area.
And it's going phenomenally.
Um, To this day, but this ideaof an arbitrary cap on the
percentage of admin hours nevermade sense to me.
And here's why.
(34:40):
I always ask the question.
Tell me how that gives youinsight into how we are best
fulfilling our mission.
Shouldn't the outcome be likehow well you're serving to your
mission as opposed to somearbitrary admin percentage?
Danny Combs (34:54):
No.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
Um, there was a great book, um,Dan, and I'm forgetting his last
name right now.
Michelle will come to me afteryou finish the podcast.
But he wrote a book calledUncharitable and it was a
fantastic book.
I dunno if you've ever seen hisTED talk either, but he was
talking about just that, whereit's like the nonprofit sector
makes up roughly 5 billion,throughout the country, but
(35:16):
we're tasked with.
Solving the most, you know,health problems, homelessness,
unemployment, why?
You know what I mean?
And like, how do we attract thesame talent?
You know, if somebody can, atalented individual can make the
same money at a non-profitversus a for profit.
They might choose to come to anonprofit and have a bigger
(35:37):
impact, but a lot of times it'sjust the reality of economics
where that talented person hasto choose a for-profit to take
care of their family in thenonprofit world, and then our
humanity and culture suffersfrom that.
I.
That, that's unnecessary.
So how do we create thatequality where, you know, no
matter what field, those peoplethat are working to make change
(35:57):
can also then be recognized forit and off the same level of
success and same level ofsupport they have for their
families.
Um, that could be a whole notherconversation or podcast too,
because I think that's aninteresting thing.
So, um, that's been a challengefor us, for sure.
Jonathan (36:13):
Well, the other thing that struck me, you know, I'm
very fond of saying, Danny, thatas an entrepreneur who's, you
know, put a business plantogether and is out, whether
you're trying to raise money,just get it started.
Like you almost have to be alittle bit crazy because you are
trying to convince people of aneed that's out there that
hasn't been met, and the onlyway you can meet that need.
Is through this organizationthat doesn't yet exist.
(36:35):
But it's one thing to be anentrepreneur, say in healthcare,
right, as an a, b, a provider orwhatever, to start it like a,
you know, a car dealership.
There's an analog that ourcommunities and funders and
investors have for, for thosebusinesses.
There is no analog though,right?
For tact that made it, it soundslike that much harder.
Danny Combs (36:52):
no, it, it made it exceedingly hard and even like
in the nonprofit world.
we just renovated our new space,which is is amazing, and all our
business partners jumped up andhelped us, if we went to the
bank and said, Hey, can we get aloan to renovate our space?
The answer would be no, becausewe are a nonprofit and you have
to either then have, you know,some individual that has a lot
(37:15):
of finances, that would back itup entirely at like, you know,
almost a three to one typeratio.
So one point million dollarrenovation.
Okay, great.
Find me somebody with 4 millionin liquidity city at the bank.
And yes, I'll, you know, loanyou to help the nonprofit.
But even that is looked atcompletely differently and it's,
you know, I feel bad for thebanks, it's just they're put in
a losing situation too, in, inthat regards.
(37:36):
Which is a weird thing to sayabout banks maybe, but everybody
is set up for not winning inthat regards.
And so we can get past some ofthese regulatory things that are
holding us down.
Um, We can, we can do so muchmore.
We could do so, so much more.
And I think, you know, tact isalready doing a lot.
And as we move forward, one ofthe things that I'm optimistic
(37:57):
in is that we're starting tocreate this movement that people
are paying attention to andpeople are paying attention and
they're more willing toactually, you know, pivot a
little bit or, you know, openthe door a little bit wider and,
If we can then show howsuccessful we can be with that,
then it keeps going.
And so, um, you know, we'reheaded in a good direction where
(38:18):
it is now versus where it wasseven years ago, very different.
So.
Jonathan (38:24):
Well, Danny, what's one thing every a b a business
owner should start doing and onething to stop doing?
Danny Combs (38:31):
I think every ABA business should start looking at
programs like tact andpartnering with them.
You know, we partner with a lotof great ABA groups and I think
working together and not lookingat the things we're doing is
scary, but recognizing that itworks in concert with what
you're already doing and youknow, there's so many.
Perks, and benefits to workingtogether.
(38:54):
I think that would be somethingthat would be really beneficial
to do.
I think there's a lot still thatdon't approach organizations
like tact.
That would be something thatthey could start doing that
could really have a big impact.
Um, you know, one Revel comes tomind, their ABA group that's
been sending students to TACTFirefly.
Um, they're amazing and byworking together we are able to
(39:14):
create some pretty uniqueoutcomes.
I think.
So that was what they shouldstart doing.
What should they stop doing?
Um, that's, that's a whole otherthing.
I think, I have double-edgedsword in that, in the sense that
I have it from a dad perspectiveand I think I.
Um, I also have it from the tactperspective and I think ABA
(39:36):
looked at with the right lightand they've headed in the right
direction.
You know, they have somebarriers and some traditions and
some things they're gonna haveto overcome, not from anything
that they're doing wrong, butjust some things that have been
done in the past.
So I think if they are at leastcognitive of those and try to
change that, I think that wouldbe beneficial.
Because, awareness andacceptance of those things and
(39:56):
acknowledgement of them ratherthan protecting that they didn't
take place, um, would be good.
So I think there's a lot ofreally good, um, BCBAs out there
doing super cool stuff, um, thatare, they themselves held back
by the stereotype and stigma ofwhat Behavioralism looks like.
So I think just acknowledging itmoving forward and then
partnering with groups like tactwould be, um, a beneficial
(40:18):
course towards moving towardsthe future.
For sure.
Jonathan (40:22):
Right on.
Well, Danny, where can peoplefind you in TACT Online.
Danny Combs (40:28):
So our website is buildwithtact.org.
I think that would be a greatstart.
Um, we're also on LinkedIn,Facebook, you know, all those
fun things.
I don't do the Instagram, but Ihere we're on that too, so that
would be a good one to check outas well.
Jonathan (40:42):
Right on.
And you have built out a newcenter, as I understand it, in
Englewood, Colorado, in theDenver metro area.
Is that right?
Danny Combs (40:49):
Yeah, absolutely.
We have this new, it's just over18,474 square feet.
And you know, the amazing thing,the town of Inglewood has jumped
on board and, and recommendingtact to all the businesses
there.
So as far as the community allcoming together, I think that's
a great example of that.
So I hope people can check usout.
Jonathan (41:09):
Right on.
And full disclosure tolisteners, so Danny, um, who is
based in the Denver metro area,actually lives like right up the
mountain for me on LookoutMountain.
I live in Golden.
So I think, Danny, you have thedistinction of you are the
closest person that's, I've everinterviewed.
So, I have not yet seen thecenter, um, and I can wait to do
so.
Danny Combs (41:30):
Well, great minds think alike, my friends.
So we, we picked the same placeto live, so it makes me happy.
Jonathan (41:36):
Bingo.
Alright.
Are you ready for the uh, hottake rapid fire questions?
Danny Combs (41:40):
Sure go for it.
Jonathan (41:43):
All right, Danny, you're on your deathbed.
What's the one thing you wannabe remembered for?
Danny Combs (41:49):
That I think that I lived as authentically as
possible, that I genuinely triedand was present and tried to be
a decent human.
Jonathan (41:59):
Yeah.
What's your most importantself-care practice?
Danny Combs (42:04):
Playing guitar and working on cars.
I have to turn a wrench, man.
I have to.
Jonathan (42:10):
That's so good to know that those things, I mean they
were like careers or at least aguitar play, but it can still be
a passion after it's a career.
Is that right?
Danny Combs (42:18):
Oh, absolutely.
The, the sound of a vintageMartin guitar, that's, that's
heaven for sure.
Absolutely.
Jonathan (42:25):
Uh, what's your favorite song and or music
genre?
Danny Combs (42:32):
You know, I don't have a favorite song that would
be terrible to say, but musicgenre.
I grew up in the AppalachianMountains in the Blue Ridge.
Bluegrass is uh, folk music,Americana.
That's my home, man.
That's the jam for sure.
Jonathan (42:45):
Oh man, brother, you know, which band?
Um, uh, my wife and I have seenmore than any other live show
Yonder, mountain String Band,actually up from, uh, Boulder
net.
Danny Combs (42:55):
Yeah, they are.
They definitely are.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Jonathan (42:58):
we love us some bluegrass.
Yeah, do do you have a YonderMountain story to share?
Danny Combs (43:03):
No, I was gonna there's a band called Watchhouse
that used to be mandolin orangeyears ago.
North Carolina Band.
Same kind of thing, but it'slike when you grow up with a
locally Yeah, you, uh, you stickwith that for sure.
Definitely.
Jonathan (43:14):
Ugh, I love it.
One of our favorites too.
What's one thing you'd tell your18 year old soft Danny?
Danny Combs (43:22):
It sounds weird.
Maybe this is just my mood atthe, at the time, but.
I used to believe and I thinkwhen I was younger that the
harder you worked, that that wasgonna be it.
And I think that's important forsure, but I think relationships
are even that much moreimportant.
And I think surrounding yourselfwith good people and having
relationships with those goodpeople, cuz man, do need those
(43:43):
people in your life.
And I think, um, I credit thosearound me that have supported me
and seen me and picked me upand, you know, especially when
I'm down or even held meaccountable when I'm high, um,
to know that, you know what'simportant.
So friendships, relationships,that's gonna be a thing that
carries you.
Jonathan (44:01):
Mm.
Beautifully said, well, if youcould only wear one style of
footwear for the rest of yourlife, what would it be?
Danny Combs (44:10):
So everybody gives me crap.
I don't, I don't wear socksexcept when I'm doing my
military stuff.
I have to wear socks.
But I'm a Birkenstock guy.
I grew up in Asheville, NorthCarolina, so I still have my
Birkenstock and New Balance.
Those would be it.
Yeah.
Jonathan (44:26):
Dude, there are very few days that went by in the
early mid nineties when I wasnot in my pair of Birkenstocks,
Danny Combs (44:32):
Oh, hell yeah.
I love that they're coming backtoo, but some of us never faded
away.
So
Jonathan (44:38):
right?
Like history is all about thosecycles.
Danny, this has been an absolutepleasure.
Thank you for all you're doingfor our community and for
neurodivergent individuals.
I appreciate you, dude.
Danny Combs (44:48):
thank you so much for your time.
I appreciate it.
Thank you for having me on.
It's always a pleasure.
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