September 15, 2025 • 35 mins
Had an AHA or Insight? Share it:
Privacy isn’t free—and Tanner Haas is here to prove it.
In this episode of the Business Growth Architect Show: Founders of the Future, we cut through the noise about so-called “end-to-end encryption” and uncover what’s really happening when you send that photo, video, or text. Tanner reveals why free apps like WhatsApp and iMessage aren’t as private as they claim, and how their business model depends on turning your personal life into profit.
What I loved most about this conversation is Tanner’s straightforward honesty. He doesn’t mince words when it comes to exposing the games Big Tech plays with our data. He also shares his entrepreneurial journey—how frustration with misleading privacy promises pushed him to create FreedomChat, an app built on three non-negotiable pillars: true end-to-end encryption, no storage on servers, and zero commercial use of user data.
This is a wake-up call for anyone who’s ever said, “I have nothing to hide.” Privacy isn’t about hiding—it’s about your right to communicate safely with your family, friends, and colleagues without being turned into the product. Tanner’s passion and persistence will leave you rethinking the apps you use every day.
👉 Discover more of Tanner’s work and download FreedomChat at https://tannerhaas.com/
Resources Mentioned:
Tanner Haas: Website | FreedomChat
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Tanner Haas (00:00):
What makes my blood boil? People Deserve privacy.
(00:07):
What's yours should remainyours.
What makes my blood boil? If youdon't pay for a product, you are
the product.
BEATE CHELETTE (00:21):
My opening question for you today is,
Tanner, what makes your blood
Tanner Haas (00:26):
boil? What makes my blood boil are the number of
individuals being screwed by theUS healthcare system is number
one. Number two is the call itthe lame person mindset, meaning
that they believe they can't dosomething just because, just
because. So those two things, Iknow they're on different ends
(00:46):
of the spectrum, unrelated, butthose two things make my blood
boil more than anything else.
BEATE CHELETTE (00:51):
You started to create an app. So tell us about
this app, and your blood wasboiling when you built that one
Tanner Haas (01:01):
Didn't it correct?
It definitely did boil. And thistoo.
one is called Freedom Chat, andI mean that now has a different
connotation than it did two anda half years ago, but it is
designed for those that wantabsolute privacy and security,
which to me, shouldn't be a hardask, but it is so really
(01:22):
prompted me. What made my bloodboil is the amount of apps that
are truly unauthentic. You go ontheir website, they say, message
privately, and then encryption.
I mean, that's like a butt ofbuzzword, but when you actually
dive into it, what does end thatencryption actually mean? Like,
where's the end? So what thatreally means, if you ask me,
What send that encryption is itmeans no one, under any
(01:42):
circumstance, other than theintended recipient, can read a
message. But if you askWhatsApp, totally different
connotation behind that. Itmeans, well, if you report a
user, we can see it. If you backit up to another device, we can
see it. I mean that that juststarted to make my blood boil.
People Deserve privacy, whereveryou end on the spectrum,
(02:03):
political doesn't matter yourbelief, like everybody should be
able to talk to their friends,family and Associates in private
without somebody else lookingover their shoulder. Do you
think we're being lied to? Ithink we're being told more lies
than women are being told thetruth.
BEATE CHELETTE (02:23):
How do I know?
Right? So, why does this matter?
So does it matter on whether I'mon, like a WhatsApp, or people
go to signal, or, you know, anyof these other places, and it
says it's end to end encryption,nobody can go in. So you say,
that's a lie. Why does this
Tanner Haas (02:39):
matter? It matters because I think if you don't
have your privacy, you havenothing. And it doesn't just
stem from you sending a message.
It could be an image, it couldbe a video, it could be your
social security number, it couldbe a credit card, any little
thing, and it's also healthcareinformation, financial
information. So yeah, we arebeing lied to. It. It all
matters and the people, the mostcommon thing I hear for the
(03:05):
opposition is, well, I havenothing to hide. Doesn't matter
if you have something to hide ornot. It's just wait until
something happens. You run forsomething there's a hack at a
company that you were using. Allof a sudden, these conversations
that you might not have thoughtmeant anything, or out in the
open, that image or video that,I mean, it all matters, because
what's yours should remainyours. Just give people their
(03:28):
privacy, because as soon as youdon't have, I mean, look at
China, they have this socialcredit score. You It's group
think. You can't say somethingwithout being criticized. And
freedom of thought is theindividual expression, the
freedom to think and say whatyou believe, wherever you are, I
don't really care. Everybodyshould be able to say what is on
their mind, because the momentwe get away from that, people
are afraid to speak their mindbecause they fear of a leak or
(03:50):
some privacy repercussion.
That's when you just get asociety that's not creative. I
think there's so many risks.
It's interesting that people thefirst thing they might say is, I
have nothing to hide. I justthink that's a very weak
argument.
BEATE CHELETTE (04:05):
I don't think necessarily that it's about
hiding anything. I think it'sabout a right to a right to
enjoy what I pay for. So if Ipay for a phone and I want to
send my family a photo of my twoyear old granddaughter. I want
(04:25):
to be able to do that withoutfearing that that's going to end
up on some child porn sitebecause somebody hacked into
that. Right? What was thistrigger event that made you
create this? Because nobody,nobody, no entrepreneur ever
wakes up one morning and goeslike, oh, well, I'm going to do
something that nobody has everdone before. I'm going to take
this a lot more serious. Whatmade you do this?
Tanner Haas (04:48):
I'm so happy you just said what you said, because
that is such a misconception.
People think that Travis kalanitand Garrett camp, the guys that
started Uber, had this, oh, it'sepiphany. They knew the color
scheme. They knew what they'regoing to do. Like, that's not
how it works. It is you have amoment, and then you work on the
idea a little more and then itbecomes a little more refined,
so on and so forth. I had amarketing company, a website
(05:08):
creation firm, and we did reallywell. We had publicly traded
clients, some very successfulprivately held clients, and I
would manage some sites. I mean,this would range from
conservative websites to a goldmining company to healthcare
companies, pharmacies. I mean,we had clients all over the
spectrum, but one thing waspretty consistent from these
(05:29):
sites and even a pharmacy likethey were asking about, is their
information encrypted? Is itsecure this, some of these new,
new sites we were managing, werethey were concerned about their
privacy. And I was like, Okay,well, what is what is all this
about? And so I started to dosome research. Started to look
in the other the optionsWhatsApp, who claims they're
(05:51):
incredibly private, right? Butthey're owned and operated by
Facebook Meta, so obviously,right there, that's a red flag,
but when you dive into it, Ididn't like what I was seeing.
That your images and videos areall always stored on a server,
often indefinitely. They'reusually not encrypted on the
back end, so they're visibleeven when you delete it, even
after you delete it, even afteryou delete it, which is people
(06:13):
think I deleted that it's goneforever and it's no, it's not.
It's gone from your eyes, notfrom other people's eyes. So and
we'll all, I'll come back tothat, because that's a good
point, and that's why we came upwith a feature for freedom chat,
specifically for that. But themore I dove into it, the you see
the rate of cybersecurityincidents people's trust is
(06:37):
declining. Well, it reallyprompted, okay, maybe I'm going
to start something like this.
And then I just had two thingshappen firsthand. Number one was
I had a buddy of mine, and helives on Miami Beach. It's an
apartment, and he was filming,it's a beautiful home, but he
was filming his new hot tub andhis new cold tub, and he sent me
(07:00):
a video, didn't message me. Sendno text message. It was just a
video, and he was filming, hesays, look on my cold tub, hot
tub, cold tub, hot tub, like asa joke. And all of a sudden he
sent that awry message. And allover Safari, all over this is
when I had some social media. Ihave no social media anymore,
(07:20):
and I was being advertised forcold and hot tubs, and I'm like,
he didn't even text me. He justsent a video, and he was
narrating the video. And this isan iMessage, which is supposed
to be, they say, and thenencrypted. But no, I was getting
ads all over Safari. I wasgetting ads all over social.
When you look at iMessage, well,they actually sync with Safari.
(07:40):
So what you share, the contentin there can be used for
advertising purposes, and thenit can be shared with third
parties. Again, third parties isan ambiguous term that could
mean, I mean, where does itstop? What's a third party?
Anybody? So that was number one,and then the other one was my
grandma. She's super sweet lady,different. Last name lives
(08:02):
across the country from me. Gota call, and she called me
multiple times. I mean, back toback to back to back, and on the
last one, I answer because I'mthinking, oh my, somebody died.
Something's wrong. What? Whathappened? And she said, I got a
call that you were in a horriblecar accident. I need $25,000 for
surgery. And I'm like, no, no,please do not send that. I am
(08:24):
okay. And what's concerningabout that is she doesn't have
my last name. We're not in thesame state, anywhere near each
other. I had been in a caraccident once before. I did
require surgery. So it's kind oflike, well, how did they know
that she was my grandma. Howdoes she know? And then you go
back to it and say, Well, ifyou've ever used WhatsApp, all
(08:47):
your contacts are shared withthe parent company, and they use
that to see, well, how do youmessage each other? How do you
know each other? And all thatinformation is shared with third
parties. I mean, Facebook isnotoriously known for not giving
a rat's behind about yourprivacy. So it was these two
things. Were these companies. Imean, you see, I message or
(09:10):
iPhone, and they say, privacy,that's iPhone. That's just a
load of crap. That's what thatis. And then WhatsApp message
privately. It's like, okay, thisis just ridiculous. And so I was
like, You know what? I'm gonna Itexted five people, five of my
clients, super successful. Isaid, I'm thinking of starting
this. What do you think? Andthey said, go for it. And right
(09:33):
then. And there's like, Okay,I'm gonna make a private
messaging app with and thenencryption true, and then
encryption meaning we can't evendecrypt it under any
circumstances, no commercial useof user data and no storage or
messages on our server. So thethree pillars of privacy and I
just got off to the races, butthe more I worked on it, the
more refined the idea became,the more I connected with the
(09:57):
right people, places,circumstances and. Just crazy
how things unfold. Once you sortof decide I'm going to do this,
come hell or high water, I'mgoing to do this. It's amazing
how things just transpire.
BEATE CHELETTE (10:10):
So what you're saying is, what makes this idea
different is that you can I sayyou are a man of your word,
which is, well, I'm
Tanner Haas (10:22):
authentic. That's what I would use, and that's, I
don't like the fakeness. Andwhat I mean by that is, it's
like health care. That's what Isaid when it makes my blood
boil. I've been next startupwill be in the healthcare space.
So what causes the majority ofbankruptcies in this country?
It's medical debt. But as youknow that the majority of
(10:43):
hospitals in this country claimtheir nonprofit so those same
hospitals that go and garnishindividuals wages that inflate
something between two times and23 times, it's Medicare,
Medicaid, like what they wouldactually pay for it. So they'll
inflate it, let's say 20 times.
Send you a bill you don't pay.
They garnish your wage. But no,we're a non profit company, a
(11:06):
non profit organization. Wedon't pay state taxes. We don't
pay county federal they rip offpeople, they screw people, they
garnish their wage, and that'spart of my reason. Signal, which
you mentioned, claims are nonprofit. Same thing irks me
beyond belief, a nonprofit issupposed to be a church, a water
(11:26):
group, like something whereyou're going to get less than
market rate salaries, right?
That's a nonprofit. You're doingsomething for the good of
humanity. You're not going tocollect millions of dollars in
bonuses like a tech CTO. I mean,we saw this play out with open
AI, where we're a nonprofit.
You're not. You wanted itsupposed to be a little
incubator, and now, obviouslyyou're not a nonprofit. You guys
retain some top talent inSilicon Valley. Ridiculous,
(11:49):
medical, same thing. Signal,same thing. I despise that type
of stuff, like, just say you'rea for profit corporation. I'm a
capitalist. We want to makemoney. We're never going to sell
your data, though, because it'snot our business model. That's
not how I want to do things. Wewill will license out our
encryption, we'll havememberships. We'll keep our
costs down. So I would say I'mauthentic. And it irks me that
(12:10):
these other like just say whoyou are, what you believe, and
stand by that.
BEATE CHELETTE (12:15):
Do you think that this notion that people
want stuff for free really bitesthem in the butt ultimately,
because if I want a freemessenger app, instead of what
paying $100 a year forsomething, right? Is that a
price I pay for my desire foreverything to be free? Is there?
(12:39):
Is there something wrong with mybrain, is what I'm asking.
Tanner Haas (12:42):
If you don't pay for a product, you are the
product. I mean, every company'sgot to make money. So especially
these messaging apps, other thanfreedom chat, they store every
message on a server, cloudstorage costs become
ridiculously expensive. SoWhatsApp, Telegram, signal,
imessage. I mean, they're notdoing this out of the goodness
(13:04):
of their heart. So even likeemail service, I mean, Gmail is
notorious for scanning youremails. They use that to better
target ads for you. So it's likeif you're not paying for a
product, unless the company hasgiven you clear text as to why
you are the product they wantyou. They want your data, but
(13:24):
the use of data has become soambiguous. When they hear data,
they're like, that's my data.
Whoa. I mean, it's not just yourname and your email, it's where
you live, your politicalaffiliation, financial
information, social securitynumber identifiers, like a lot
of things that are going to beused against you, that they
build this persona of you. Imean, it's, we seem to change
(13:45):
the connotation behind the worddata. It's so much more than
that. It's you. It's everythingthat makes you who you are. They
have that, and they use thatagainst you.
BEATE CHELETTE (13:58):
Yeah, I see this all the time. You know, when I
was on vacation, I had a I thinkI don't even know that how many
fraud I've had on my creditcard. And I woke up to 72 wing
stop and pizza purchases.
Tanner Haas (14:14):
They had a good time with that card.
BEATE CHELETTE (14:15):
Holy smokes.
Whoever it was was hungry. Youknow, I was like, all pizza and
wing stop and go like, man,that's what people do with
stolen data. They go and buy buythemselves some fast food. At
least we live a moresophisticated. I mean, you know,
judging
Tanner Haas (14:29):
steakhouse honestly, like, exactly,
BEATE CHELETTE (14:31):
go get some decent food. You were saying
that privacy is an issue. Takeme through what happens if I
brush this off? Because you kindof said earlier, sometimes
people think, yeah, you know,whatever, I can't do anything
about this. So let's say I'mhaving this laissez faire
(14:51):
attitude. You said that's one ofthe things that really bother
you, the most people that justgo like, I nothing I can do so
there's nothing I can do aboutit. That's just the way it is.
Are you calling.
Tanner Haas (15:00):
Bullshit. I mean, of course, there's somebody can
do about everything, so whetherthat's I can't get in better
shape. Okay, that's bullshit. Ican't read more, okay? Nonsense,
I can't take care of my privacy.
Nonsense, it's the laws. Itdoesn't just apply to privacy.
It's everything, the I can't doit, the poor me mentality. I
(15:20):
think everybody should just beproactive, do a digital cleanup.
You would be so shocked andsurprised. I mean, Google your
name. Most people have so muchinformation out there, and
you're like, how did you getthis? Well, they crawled
websites. These companies shareyour information. I mean, they
have your address. There's like,one for safety reasons. Two,
just wait till you becomesomeone of power, like it
(15:43):
doesn't matter. You might notthink it matters. Now make a
little bit of money and see howmany fraud attempts. Right? You
can have your bank account trainyou somebody can take out a loan
and like, there's so many thingsthat you just want to cover.
Just do a digital cleanup,protect your conversations,
protect your privacy. Doesn'ttake that much time, doesn't
(16:05):
take that much effort. And ifyou're going to continue to use
these free services, they're notactually free. You are the
product, and sooner or later,it's going to come to bite you
in the ass. Promise you arethere
BEATE CHELETTE (16:18):
some things that I should be doing immediately.
Let's say I'm on WhatsApp.
Should I be doing thesedisappearing messages? Should I
not save my messages on theiPhone in perpetuity? Are there
just some basic, basic bestpractices that I should be
doing?
Tanner Haas (16:34):
You should be using freedom chat and disappearing
your messages. We call it selfdestruct, because ours is
actually self destruct. It'soften your device, the
recipients and the serverWhatsApp is disappearing
messages, but we'll still keepit on the server just in case.
Like, that's not disappearingmessage, that's it appears like
it's been removed, but it'sstill on their servers, often,
(16:55):
always indefinitely. So I wouldthat's why, like, when you send
a message on freedom chat, youcan send images, videos, gifts,
you can edit, unsend, selfdestruct, anything you self
destruct, you unsend. It's offyour device, software recipients
device, it's off our servers,and it's like it never happened.
(17:15):
And that just ensures we want togive people the same sense of
security as the spoken word Iand the other common argument I
hear, which is, again, nonsense,is, well, what about bad actors?
Well, there's bad actorseverywhere in the world. I mean,
there's bad actors on Discord,which has no end to end
encryption, and they can seeeverything. So was that a choice
on their part? I'm gonna beYeah. Shame on them. They should
(17:38):
have seen that. There's no endto encryption there, Instagram,
Facebook, for us, we have notolerance for anything illegal,
anything like that. So I wouldjust say it's not right to
police everybody, because thereare potential few bad actors
like assume the best in people,and we're just trying to give
everyday, not even justAmericans, everybody around the
(17:58):
world, the freedom to speakfreely and message privately.
When you
BEATE CHELETTE (18:03):
say freedom chat, I gotta say it. I feel the
Maga movement screaming in thebackground was that intended?
Tanner Haas (18:10):
No, it was not. And I'm not Maga. I'm an
independent. I just believe infreedom of speech, freedom of
thought, privacy. I definitelyhave more leanings on the
conservative side. I thinkhealthcare needs to be fixed.
And for me, like, there's not awhole lot of conservatives that
say the raise taxes, but we needto tax the crap out of these
(18:33):
healthcare companies. Getgovernment out. I think so.
Again, I don't want to be put inlike, this box that this is me
and this is what it's used for.
No, I freedom is ubiquitous. Thedesire for freedom is
ubiquitous. It's there was anews company in Taiwan that
wrote about us. Taiwan is veryfearful of a Chinese invasion,
like it's very important tothem. Bangladesh has just had a
(18:53):
huge blow up with their PrimeMinister. We had somebody write
about us there. So really, nowit's just been put in a box
because we're in the UnitedStates. But freedom is a desire
everywhere in the world, and Ithink it has a negative
connotation around the worldnow, but that the intention is
(19:14):
just to allow everybody to speakfreely and message privately.
And what is it? Is a freedomchat like,
BEATE CHELETTE (19:24):
No, I hear you.
I have to ask this, because myleanings definitely are been
working with artists and crazypeople all my entire life, so I
understand the human conditionon another side of this, but I
also look at this and I can'tstand the being put in a box of
that I have to like all thedoctrines of the one and all the
doctrines of the other. I don'tthink it works like that. I
(19:45):
think we got to get back tobasics, which is why I wanted
you on the show to say, look,privacy matters, security
matters, and here, here is athing. What kind of challenges
are you encountering? You know,so. I mean, the name being one,
I'm sure that people are notjust praising you. So what are
you up against as anentrepreneur with an idea that
(20:07):
makes the product the product,not the person the product?
Tanner Haas (20:14):
I mean, the name definitely is bittersweet, in
all honesty, because you can getone, let's say 40% of the
population in the US to be allexcited about you, use it, love
it, and then 50 to 60% willwrite it off. Just gives your
name, which I'm like, Okay, thatwasn't the intent freedom
(20:34):
anybody should. That should beeverybody's goal. Like you want
to be able to message privately.
That shouldn't just be aconservative issue or a liberal
issue. It's an everybody issue.
Everybody's had some sort ofprivacy mishap where. So that's
my take on that. But freedomchat is so much bigger than just
a so called conservativemessaging app. It's a cyber
(20:57):
security company. We've launchedfreedom chat for business, which
we allow companies could bedating apps. Could be a
healthcare company. They cancreate a white label of freedom
chat, meaning they take ourfeatures, our security, and
create their own messaging app.
So we work with dating apps. Weworked with another type of
messaging app. We worked with atelemedicine company. So our
(21:19):
security is going to be usedthen a lot more than just our
audience. I see our encryptionpowering a lot of the healthcare
market, so and then alsobuilding HIPAA compliant chat
solutions for healthcare,solutions for the legal
industry. Freedom chat is abrand within that portfolio of
(21:40):
what we do. It's not necessarilythe company.
BEATE CHELETTE (21:45):
I think that there's lots of applications.
There's a flip side to it. So ofcourse, illegal activities
probably want this really badly,because they cannot be tracked,
which is one of the things thegovernment probably is going to
have a look at you at some pointor another, because that's their
main concern. So you kind ofcan't get it right on every
level. Like, if it's freedom,it's freedom for everybody, and
(22:07):
you can't control it like that.
So in this since you've beendoing that, what's your personal
transformation? Like, what haveyou since found out about
yourself or learned aboutyourself, or anything that you
can share with our audience islike, well before it was this,
and now I'm not this
Tanner Haas (22:25):
is just gonna probably sound a little
boisterous and arrogant, but I'mwildly persistent, and I I
didn't discover that along this,but it just reinforced the fact,
like a lot of people, don'treally know what they can do
until you set out to do it. Andideas don't come out fully
formed. They become clearer asyou work on them. So that's why
a lot of people don't getstarted, or they don't continue,
(22:47):
because it's no that idea wasn'tthat clear, like, I wasn't sure
what to do. Well, most peoplearen't sure what to do. 99 I
mean, everybody like you takeone step, and then you just
figure it out. So this thepersonal transformation here is,
I am a much better entrepreneur,because this has been incredibly
difficult. I mean, building atruly private messaging app, the
(23:09):
amount of pen testing, theamount of security issues we've
had, the amount of securityfixes we've implemented. I mean,
it's just like it is a lot. It'snot like you have a product and
you release the product. Youhave to test it continuously.
The moment you think you're overthe hump, something happens and
oh my gosh, then you can quitand cry, or you can get up and
persist. So like this personaltransformation is it's my fourth
(23:35):
company. I started my first onewhen I was 18, sold the same
that one when I was 21 I used tothink that was difficult. It was
a nutrition company. And now I'mlike thinking like, if I wanted
cake, it was a piece of cake. IfI wanted to start another
nutrition company, get it to thesame level of scale, would
probably take me three to fourmonths. That's it, and it's not
(23:55):
I consider it a side hustle. I'mtalking to my wife, and we're
like, hey, let's you start aproduct company, because we want
some fun, like a side hustleback then I'm like, this is
consuming all my brain power.
It's just you. I feel myselflike I'm becoming a better
entrepreneur. I'm a betterleader. That's where the
personal transformations happen.
(24:16):
So it's kind of like peopleshould also look at starting a
company, running the company,like you're going to learn a
lot. You're going to become amuch better version of yourself.
It's not necessarily thefinancial success, of course,
that's what everybody's shootingfor. But you can take a lot of
swings, like some companies willwork out some won't you just
keep swinging? You're going tobecome a better entrepreneur, a
better person, a better leadereach time. So I wish, like,
(24:40):
people viewed it as that aswell, not just, Well, I made
this and didn't do well. No,it's like, what did you learn?
What did you do? What did youbecome? Because life's it's
short, but it's long, like,you're gonna have a lot of
opportunities, so you don't wantthese lessons to go to waste.
What's your favorite mistakethat I've ever made? Or in
general. Haha,
BEATE CHELETTE (25:03):
it's your favorite mistake. So you get to
pick it.
Tanner Haas (25:07):
My favorite mistake. I think there's like
three, my biggest mistake, andit's usually the opposite,
because a lot of people usuallymove super slow or pretty
conservative, not politically,but like, just in their thought
process and their thinking, theymove super slow. They're not
like, I'm going to go do thisand do this and start. For me,
(25:28):
when I start companies, it'susually a lot faster than it
should be. Meaning I do I willjust plow money. I will go move
ahead. Or we're going to dothis, we're going to do this,
we're going to and just keepgoing, going sometimes it makes
sense to make a plant. And I'velearned that, like my first
company, it was a nutritioncompany, and I decided I wanted
(25:48):
to have protein powder. I didn'tthink about the economics of the
business. I just thought, I'mgoing to do this. And so I wired
some money to this reallysupplement manufacturer. I
didn't know due diligence. Andso when they come back, and this
is the pricing, am I okay? Andthis is how much I'm going to
sell for. And then there'sshipping involved. And like, I'm
not going to make any money onthis product yet. I just wired
(26:11):
them some like, so the biggestmistake sometimes people need to
spend more time. Like AbrahamLincoln said, If I had seven
hours, I'd spend the first sixsharpening the AX for that means
like, set a plan, get organizedand progress forward. Don't just
sometimes, don't just jump intothings. But there's also, like,
the count. The flip side is somepeople usually just plan
(26:32):
forever, and then they use it asan excuse not to begin. So you
kind of have to, if you move tooquickly and you're usually
breaking too many things, thenyou should take a step back and
plan a little bit and progresslike sequentially. If you on the
flip side, you move too slow,then shut up, stop talking and
just begin. It'll never happen.
Yeah, that's my mistake. Isusually moving too fast when I
(26:57):
should have set a plan and slowdown. Do things a little more
meticulously, not necessarilymethodically, because you still
want to move quickly, but makesure you have your ducks in a
row and you're not scrambling somuch.
BEATE CHELETTE (27:11):
I like that a lot. Are you driven by any
spiritual, spiritual beliefs?
Tanner Haas (27:17):
My biggest thing is I desperately want when I'm on
my deathbed, that I just want tobe out of ideas, and I want to
know that I became the bestversion of myself. Like that is
that, to me is big. I reallyhate regret, like I hate regret,
(27:38):
and I only have really oneregret in my life. The end, it
stuck with me. And it wasbasketball growing up in high
school, like I didn't takeenough chances. And you some
people be like, Wow, that's astupid regret stuck with me
enough where I will start anycompany if it comes to my mind.
I don't care if I lose money. Idon't care. Like I met my wife
at the gym and I just went up toher. Like some people always
(28:01):
have regret for something, andso I wish I talked to that girl.
I wish I started this company. Iwish I hate that. I hate that
feeling. I will never feel that.
So for me, like my spiritualbelief is, I want to be the best
man I can become. I think thiswas a podcast I was listening
to, and I want to be like if I'mon my deathbed. I want. So
imagine like you are on yourdeathbed, and you have two and
(28:22):
there's God in the universe andtalking to you and saying, This
is what you could have beenshowing you that, showing you
the money, the fame, thehappiness, the health, the
belief in yourself, thespiritual, let's say
realization, and then this theother version of you. And this
(28:42):
is like that to me, terrifiedme. I want to know that I became
the best version of myselfinside out, helps as many people
as possible. Like, that's whatdrives me, and it's concerning.
Like, I mean, I think about thatall the time. I just never want
to be I missed
BEATE CHELETTE (29:04):
an opportunity.
Yeah, it's interesting that yousaid that I just had this like
thought over the weekend, and Iwas like, what drives me to
continue right at my age, whenpeople think about retirement
and I could just stop andenjoy life and do these these
things. But at the sametime, I think that when you're
(29:29):
impact driven, and that's whatI'm hearing from you, Tanner, is
that when you when you believethis calling, whatever the
calling is. That's why we dothis show. Is for people that
have this call and hownarcissistic or egoistic or
egocentric or boisterous it maysound,
Tanner Haas (29:51):
a call is a call, and you gotta answer it, and you
gotta answer there's fulltransparency I have. I want to
run for for office one day,2040, that's my goal. And I
don't want to, like, I, I wroteit in my for I just feel like
some people have a, you have acall for something that's, I
(30:13):
don't want to miss that call.
And I'll try. I'll try, like,health care, privacy, like I
might sound egotistical, like,Oh no, but I'm not if I feel
compelled to do something, if Ifeel this push from within,
answer
BEATE CHELETTE (30:26):
spiritual principle, yeah, that's a
spiritual principle of that isthe essence of a call. This has
been really an interesting,amazing conversation. The last
thing I want to just talk about,what part of your journey made
you trust the most in yourself,because you got to be a badass
(30:48):
to do what you do.
Tanner Haas (30:51):
I mean, it's just, I mean, you develop a unwavering
belief in yourself the more thatyou do it. So I wrote this. I'm
not trying to cross promotehere. I just honestly believe
this is again, I had a callingwhen I was 18, 19 to write some
books, and my second book wascalled How to achieve and
receive everything you want.
Obviously, I'm 19, I hadn'tachieved and received
(31:11):
everything, but I've read a lot.
I mean, a lot is since 16, I'vebeen reading three to four books
a week. So I'd say voraciousreader, and some of them are
Michael singer, the next termbiographies, to tech, to
anything. And like in that Iwrote number the number one
thing if you want to achieve andreceive anything you want, is
(31:32):
develop an ongoing belief inyourself. And I will be 100%
honest at that time, I did nothave an unwavering belief in
myself, an unwavering beliefthat means the world could go
against you and you still thinkyou're going to come out on top.
And that might be stupid,arrogant, whatever, but like
Roger Banister, thought he couldbreak a four minute the four
(31:54):
minute barrier in a mile.
Doctor, scientist said no, can'tbe done physically impossible.
It's like, No, I can do it. Andhe did it. And that's the thing
that, like most people, you'renot born. Most people, I'll say,
everybody, nobody's born withthis unwavering confidence. A
lot of them fake it. But thenonce you start to work on
yourself and you you get up,when you said you were going to
(32:15):
get up, you read the book. Yousaid you said you were going to
read. You ask that girl out whenyou said you were going to you
start that company, even thoughyou failed. You persist like,
that's when you start to developthis belief that you know what I
can do, what I say I'm going todo, and I'm going to like,
that's when you become proud ofwho you are. It's not born. You
(32:38):
don't have an unwavering belief.
And then you start all thesethings. You're a little shaky,
you start a company, you'restill shaky. You succeed, and
then you're like, damn, I can dothat. And that. That's how it
works. That's how you for me,that's I just get more confident
the more I work, and even if I'mfailing, it's like, what that
(33:00):
didn't kill me. I'm stillkicking that lawsuit I was in
still kicking this. I mean,that's really where that's the
most fun as an entrepreneur. Andit's not fun in it, but it's
when I think
BEATE CHELETTE (33:11):
it's a backbone that you're building. Yes, if
you, if you don't believe it,especially if you're asking for
money and investment money, ifyou don't believe what you're
doing, nobody will believe no.
Why are they
Tanner Haas (33:23):
going to write money if you're not willing to
put your own money on the table
BEATE CHELETTE (33:27):
exactly on a percent? So for someone who now
wants to get the app, where dothey
Tanner Haas (33:32):
go? You can go to freedomchat.com you don't need
me to spell it for you if you'relistening, just freedomchat.com
you got it download it on iOS orAndroid. You can go also, if you
want to see bookrecommendations, some of the
books I've written, you can goto tannerhaas.com that one I
might need to spell out, but I'msure they can see it in the
(33:53):
podcast description.
BEATE CHELETTE (33:55):
We'll make sure we have all the links and links
in this in the show note. Isthere one last thing you want to
leave the audience with beforewe sign off today.
Tanner Haas (34:03):
If you have a calling, if you have a push from
within, I mean a push likethere's a hand on the inside of
you, pushing you towardssomething. Go for it. Whether
that's asking somebody out,whether that's starting
something, getting in shape,doing some sort of competition,
just do it like stop thinking,just do it and you will not
(34:27):
regret
BEATE CHELETTE (34:27):
it. All right?
Tanner, well, that's been anamazing interview. Thank you so
much for your time and energyand for being here. I appreciate
you very much, and I can feelthe passion and the conviction,
and I'll vote for you. You gotmy vote.
Tanner Haas (34:39):
2040, I got a few million to get, but we're
actually a good start.
Appreciate it. All right.
BEATE CHELETTE (34:45):
Thank you so much, and until next time, and
that is is for us, for today,today's conversation really was
a deep dive into what happenswhen you have a really big,
daunting idea that will upsetquite a few people past. Simply
in the tech industry, when youtake a business model that
everybody's been following andyou flip it upside down, you
(35:05):
heard it from Tanner, spread theword, get the app, and as
always, guard your privacy, makesure that you're safe as you
possibly can be. And with that,we're going to sign off for
today and until next time andGOODBYE. That's it for this
episode of the Business GrowthArchitect Show Founders of the
Future. If you're done playingsmall and ready to build the
(35:27):
future on your terms, subscribe,share and help us reach more
Trailblazers like you. And ifyou're serious about creating,
growing and scaling a businessthat's aligned with who you are,
schedule your uncovery sessionat uncoverysession.com lead with
vision. Move with purpose.
Create your future.
What makes my blood boil? People Deserve privacy.
(00:07):
What's yours should remainyours.
What makes my blood boil? If youdon't pay for a product, you are
the product.
BEATE CHELETTE (00:21):
My opening question for you today is,
Tanner, what makes your blood
Tanner Haas (00:26):
boil? What makes my blood boil are the number of
individuals being screwed by theUS healthcare system is number
one. Number two is the call itthe lame person mindset, meaning
that they believe they can't dosomething just because, just
because. So those two things, Iknow they're on different ends
(00:46):
of the spectrum, unrelated, butthose two things make my blood
boil more than anything else.
BEATE CHELETTE (00:51):
You started to create an app. So tell us about
this app, and your blood wasboiling when you built that one
Tanner Haas (01:01):
Didn't it correct?
It definitely did boil. And thistoo.
one is called Freedom Chat, andI mean that now has a different
connotation than it did two anda half years ago, but it is
designed for those that wantabsolute privacy and security,
which to me, shouldn't be a hardask, but it is so really
(01:22):
prompted me. What made my bloodboil is the amount of apps that
are truly unauthentic. You go ontheir website, they say, message
privately, and then encryption.
I mean, that's like a butt ofbuzzword, but when you actually
dive into it, what does end thatencryption actually mean? Like,
where's the end? So what thatreally means, if you ask me,
What send that encryption is itmeans no one, under any
(01:42):
circumstance, other than theintended recipient, can read a
message. But if you askWhatsApp, totally different
connotation behind that. Itmeans, well, if you report a
user, we can see it. If you backit up to another device, we can
see it. I mean that that juststarted to make my blood boil.
People Deserve privacy, whereveryou end on the spectrum,
(02:03):
political doesn't matter yourbelief, like everybody should be
able to talk to their friends,family and Associates in private
without somebody else lookingover their shoulder. Do you
think we're being lied to? Ithink we're being told more lies
than women are being told thetruth.
BEATE CHELETTE (02:23):
How do I know?
Right? So, why does this matter?
So does it matter on whether I'mon, like a WhatsApp, or people
go to signal, or, you know, anyof these other places, and it
says it's end to end encryption,nobody can go in. So you say,
that's a lie. Why does this
Tanner Haas (02:39):
matter? It matters because I think if you don't
have your privacy, you havenothing. And it doesn't just
stem from you sending a message.
It could be an image, it couldbe a video, it could be your
social security number, it couldbe a credit card, any little
thing, and it's also healthcareinformation, financial
information. So yeah, we arebeing lied to. It. It all
matters and the people, the mostcommon thing I hear for the
(03:05):
opposition is, well, I havenothing to hide. Doesn't matter
if you have something to hide ornot. It's just wait until
something happens. You run forsomething there's a hack at a
company that you were using. Allof a sudden, these conversations
that you might not have thoughtmeant anything, or out in the
open, that image or video that,I mean, it all matters, because
what's yours should remainyours. Just give people their
(03:28):
privacy, because as soon as youdon't have, I mean, look at
China, they have this socialcredit score. You It's group
think. You can't say somethingwithout being criticized. And
freedom of thought is theindividual expression, the
freedom to think and say whatyou believe, wherever you are, I
don't really care. Everybodyshould be able to say what is on
their mind, because the momentwe get away from that, people
are afraid to speak their mindbecause they fear of a leak or
(03:50):
some privacy repercussion.
That's when you just get asociety that's not creative. I
think there's so many risks.
It's interesting that people thefirst thing they might say is, I
have nothing to hide. I justthink that's a very weak
argument.
BEATE CHELETTE (04:05):
I don't think necessarily that it's about
hiding anything. I think it'sabout a right to a right to
enjoy what I pay for. So if Ipay for a phone and I want to
send my family a photo of my twoyear old granddaughter. I want
(04:25):
to be able to do that withoutfearing that that's going to end
up on some child porn sitebecause somebody hacked into
that. Right? What was thistrigger event that made you
create this? Because nobody,nobody, no entrepreneur ever
wakes up one morning and goeslike, oh, well, I'm going to do
something that nobody has everdone before. I'm going to take
this a lot more serious. Whatmade you do this?
Tanner Haas (04:48):
I'm so happy you just said what you said, because
that is such a misconception.
People think that Travis kalanitand Garrett camp, the guys that
started Uber, had this, oh, it'sepiphany. They knew the color
scheme. They knew what they'regoing to do. Like, that's not
how it works. It is you have amoment, and then you work on the
idea a little more and then itbecomes a little more refined,
so on and so forth. I had amarketing company, a website
(05:08):
creation firm, and we did reallywell. We had publicly traded
clients, some very successfulprivately held clients, and I
would manage some sites. I mean,this would range from
conservative websites to a goldmining company to healthcare
companies, pharmacies. I mean,we had clients all over the
spectrum, but one thing waspretty consistent from these
(05:29):
sites and even a pharmacy likethey were asking about, is their
information encrypted? Is itsecure this, some of these new,
new sites we were managing, werethey were concerned about their
privacy. And I was like, Okay,well, what is what is all this
about? And so I started to dosome research. Started to look
in the other the optionsWhatsApp, who claims they're
(05:51):
incredibly private, right? Butthey're owned and operated by
Facebook Meta, so obviously,right there, that's a red flag,
but when you dive into it, Ididn't like what I was seeing.
That your images and videos areall always stored on a server,
often indefinitely. They'reusually not encrypted on the
back end, so they're visibleeven when you delete it, even
after you delete it, even afteryou delete it, which is people
(06:13):
think I deleted that it's goneforever and it's no, it's not.
It's gone from your eyes, notfrom other people's eyes. So and
we'll all, I'll come back tothat, because that's a good
point, and that's why we came upwith a feature for freedom chat,
specifically for that. But themore I dove into it, the you see
the rate of cybersecurityincidents people's trust is
(06:37):
declining. Well, it reallyprompted, okay, maybe I'm going
to start something like this.
And then I just had two thingshappen firsthand. Number one was
I had a buddy of mine, and helives on Miami Beach. It's an
apartment, and he was filming,it's a beautiful home, but he
was filming his new hot tub andhis new cold tub, and he sent me
(07:00):
a video, didn't message me. Sendno text message. It was just a
video, and he was filming, hesays, look on my cold tub, hot
tub, cold tub, hot tub, like asa joke. And all of a sudden he
sent that awry message. And allover Safari, all over this is
when I had some social media. Ihave no social media anymore,
(07:20):
and I was being advertised forcold and hot tubs, and I'm like,
he didn't even text me. He justsent a video, and he was
narrating the video. And this isan iMessage, which is supposed
to be, they say, and thenencrypted. But no, I was getting
ads all over Safari. I wasgetting ads all over social.
When you look at iMessage, well,they actually sync with Safari.
(07:40):
So what you share, the contentin there can be used for
advertising purposes, and thenit can be shared with third
parties. Again, third parties isan ambiguous term that could
mean, I mean, where does itstop? What's a third party?
Anybody? So that was number one,and then the other one was my
grandma. She's super sweet lady,different. Last name lives
(08:02):
across the country from me. Gota call, and she called me
multiple times. I mean, back toback to back to back, and on the
last one, I answer because I'mthinking, oh my, somebody died.
Something's wrong. What? Whathappened? And she said, I got a
call that you were in a horriblecar accident. I need $25,000 for
surgery. And I'm like, no, no,please do not send that. I am
(08:24):
okay. And what's concerningabout that is she doesn't have
my last name. We're not in thesame state, anywhere near each
other. I had been in a caraccident once before. I did
require surgery. So it's kind oflike, well, how did they know
that she was my grandma. Howdoes she know? And then you go
back to it and say, Well, ifyou've ever used WhatsApp, all
(08:47):
your contacts are shared withthe parent company, and they use
that to see, well, how do youmessage each other? How do you
know each other? And all thatinformation is shared with third
parties. I mean, Facebook isnotoriously known for not giving
a rat's behind about yourprivacy. So it was these two
things. Were these companies. Imean, you see, I message or
(09:10):
iPhone, and they say, privacy,that's iPhone. That's just a
load of crap. That's what thatis. And then WhatsApp message
privately. It's like, okay, thisis just ridiculous. And so I was
like, You know what? I'm gonna Itexted five people, five of my
clients, super successful. Isaid, I'm thinking of starting
this. What do you think? Andthey said, go for it. And right
(09:33):
then. And there's like, Okay,I'm gonna make a private
messaging app with and thenencryption true, and then
encryption meaning we can't evendecrypt it under any
circumstances, no commercial useof user data and no storage or
messages on our server. So thethree pillars of privacy and I
just got off to the races, butthe more I worked on it, the
more refined the idea became,the more I connected with the
(09:57):
right people, places,circumstances and. Just crazy
how things unfold. Once you sortof decide I'm going to do this,
come hell or high water, I'mgoing to do this. It's amazing
how things just transpire.
BEATE CHELETTE (10:10):
So what you're saying is, what makes this idea
different is that you can I sayyou are a man of your word,
which is, well, I'm
Tanner Haas (10:22):
authentic. That's what I would use, and that's, I
don't like the fakeness. Andwhat I mean by that is, it's
like health care. That's what Isaid when it makes my blood
boil. I've been next startupwill be in the healthcare space.
So what causes the majority ofbankruptcies in this country?
It's medical debt. But as youknow that the majority of
(10:43):
hospitals in this country claimtheir nonprofit so those same
hospitals that go and garnishindividuals wages that inflate
something between two times and23 times, it's Medicare,
Medicaid, like what they wouldactually pay for it. So they'll
inflate it, let's say 20 times.
Send you a bill you don't pay.
They garnish your wage. But no,we're a non profit company, a
(11:06):
non profit organization. Wedon't pay state taxes. We don't
pay county federal they rip offpeople, they screw people, they
garnish their wage, and that'spart of my reason. Signal, which
you mentioned, claims are nonprofit. Same thing irks me
beyond belief, a nonprofit issupposed to be a church, a water
(11:26):
group, like something whereyou're going to get less than
market rate salaries, right?
That's a nonprofit. You're doingsomething for the good of
humanity. You're not going tocollect millions of dollars in
bonuses like a tech CTO. I mean,we saw this play out with open
AI, where we're a nonprofit.
You're not. You wanted itsupposed to be a little
incubator, and now, obviouslyyou're not a nonprofit. You guys
retain some top talent inSilicon Valley. Ridiculous,
(11:49):
medical, same thing. Signal,same thing. I despise that type
of stuff, like, just say you'rea for profit corporation. I'm a
capitalist. We want to makemoney. We're never going to sell
your data, though, because it'snot our business model. That's
not how I want to do things. Wewill will license out our
encryption, we'll havememberships. We'll keep our
costs down. So I would say I'mauthentic. And it irks me that
(12:10):
these other like just say whoyou are, what you believe, and
stand by that.
BEATE CHELETTE (12:15):
Do you think that this notion that people
want stuff for free really bitesthem in the butt ultimately,
because if I want a freemessenger app, instead of what
paying $100 a year forsomething, right? Is that a
price I pay for my desire foreverything to be free? Is there?
(12:39):
Is there something wrong with mybrain, is what I'm asking.
Tanner Haas (12:42):
If you don't pay for a product, you are the
product. I mean, every company'sgot to make money. So especially
these messaging apps, other thanfreedom chat, they store every
message on a server, cloudstorage costs become
ridiculously expensive. SoWhatsApp, Telegram, signal,
imessage. I mean, they're notdoing this out of the goodness
(13:04):
of their heart. So even likeemail service, I mean, Gmail is
notorious for scanning youremails. They use that to better
target ads for you. So it's likeif you're not paying for a
product, unless the company hasgiven you clear text as to why
you are the product they wantyou. They want your data, but
(13:24):
the use of data has become soambiguous. When they hear data,
they're like, that's my data.
Whoa. I mean, it's not just yourname and your email, it's where
you live, your politicalaffiliation, financial
information, social securitynumber identifiers, like a lot
of things that are going to beused against you, that they
build this persona of you. Imean, it's, we seem to change
(13:45):
the connotation behind the worddata. It's so much more than
that. It's you. It's everythingthat makes you who you are. They
have that, and they use thatagainst you.
BEATE CHELETTE (13:58):
Yeah, I see this all the time. You know, when I
was on vacation, I had a I thinkI don't even know that how many
fraud I've had on my creditcard. And I woke up to 72 wing
stop and pizza purchases.
Tanner Haas (14:14):
They had a good time with that card.
BEATE CHELETTE (14:15):
Holy smokes.
Whoever it was was hungry. Youknow, I was like, all pizza and
wing stop and go like, man,that's what people do with
stolen data. They go and buy buythemselves some fast food. At
least we live a moresophisticated. I mean, you know,
judging
Tanner Haas (14:29):
steakhouse honestly, like, exactly,
BEATE CHELETTE (14:31):
go get some decent food. You were saying
that privacy is an issue. Takeme through what happens if I
brush this off? Because you kindof said earlier, sometimes
people think, yeah, you know,whatever, I can't do anything
about this. So let's say I'mhaving this laissez faire
(14:51):
attitude. You said that's one ofthe things that really bother
you, the most people that justgo like, I nothing I can do so
there's nothing I can do aboutit. That's just the way it is.
Are you calling.
Tanner Haas (15:00):
Bullshit. I mean, of course, there's somebody can
do about everything, so whetherthat's I can't get in better
shape. Okay, that's bullshit. Ican't read more, okay? Nonsense,
I can't take care of my privacy.
Nonsense, it's the laws. Itdoesn't just apply to privacy.
It's everything, the I can't doit, the poor me mentality. I
(15:20):
think everybody should just beproactive, do a digital cleanup.
You would be so shocked andsurprised. I mean, Google your
name. Most people have so muchinformation out there, and
you're like, how did you getthis? Well, they crawled
websites. These companies shareyour information. I mean, they
have your address. There's like,one for safety reasons. Two,
just wait till you becomesomeone of power, like it
(15:43):
doesn't matter. You might notthink it matters. Now make a
little bit of money and see howmany fraud attempts. Right? You
can have your bank account trainyou somebody can take out a loan
and like, there's so many thingsthat you just want to cover.
Just do a digital cleanup,protect your conversations,
protect your privacy. Doesn'ttake that much time, doesn't
(16:05):
take that much effort. And ifyou're going to continue to use
these free services, they're notactually free. You are the
product, and sooner or later,it's going to come to bite you
in the ass. Promise you arethere
BEATE CHELETTE (16:18):
some things that I should be doing immediately.
Let's say I'm on WhatsApp.
Should I be doing thesedisappearing messages? Should I
not save my messages on theiPhone in perpetuity? Are there
just some basic, basic bestpractices that I should be
doing?
Tanner Haas (16:34):
You should be using freedom chat and disappearing
your messages. We call it selfdestruct, because ours is
actually self destruct. It'soften your device, the
recipients and the serverWhatsApp is disappearing
messages, but we'll still keepit on the server just in case.
Like, that's not disappearingmessage, that's it appears like
it's been removed, but it'sstill on their servers, often,
(16:55):
always indefinitely. So I wouldthat's why, like, when you send
a message on freedom chat, youcan send images, videos, gifts,
you can edit, unsend, selfdestruct, anything you self
destruct, you unsend. It's offyour device, software recipients
device, it's off our servers,and it's like it never happened.
(17:15):
And that just ensures we want togive people the same sense of
security as the spoken word Iand the other common argument I
hear, which is, again, nonsense,is, well, what about bad actors?
Well, there's bad actorseverywhere in the world. I mean,
there's bad actors on Discord,which has no end to end
encryption, and they can seeeverything. So was that a choice
on their part? I'm gonna beYeah. Shame on them. They should
(17:38):
have seen that. There's no endto encryption there, Instagram,
Facebook, for us, we have notolerance for anything illegal,
anything like that. So I wouldjust say it's not right to
police everybody, because thereare potential few bad actors
like assume the best in people,and we're just trying to give
everyday, not even justAmericans, everybody around the
(17:58):
world, the freedom to speakfreely and message privately.
When you
BEATE CHELETTE (18:03):
say freedom chat, I gotta say it. I feel the
Maga movement screaming in thebackground was that intended?
Tanner Haas (18:10):
No, it was not. And I'm not Maga. I'm an
independent. I just believe infreedom of speech, freedom of
thought, privacy. I definitelyhave more leanings on the
conservative side. I thinkhealthcare needs to be fixed.
And for me, like, there's not awhole lot of conservatives that
say the raise taxes, but we needto tax the crap out of these
(18:33):
healthcare companies. Getgovernment out. I think so.
Again, I don't want to be put inlike, this box that this is me
and this is what it's used for.
No, I freedom is ubiquitous. Thedesire for freedom is
ubiquitous. It's there was anews company in Taiwan that
wrote about us. Taiwan is veryfearful of a Chinese invasion,
like it's very important tothem. Bangladesh has just had a
(18:53):
huge blow up with their PrimeMinister. We had somebody write
about us there. So really, nowit's just been put in a box
because we're in the UnitedStates. But freedom is a desire
everywhere in the world, and Ithink it has a negative
connotation around the worldnow, but that the intention is
(19:14):
just to allow everybody to speakfreely and message privately.
And what is it? Is a freedomchat like,
BEATE CHELETTE (19:24):
No, I hear you.
I have to ask this, because myleanings definitely are been
working with artists and crazypeople all my entire life, so I
understand the human conditionon another side of this, but I
also look at this and I can'tstand the being put in a box of
that I have to like all thedoctrines of the one and all the
doctrines of the other. I don'tthink it works like that. I
(19:45):
think we got to get back tobasics, which is why I wanted
you on the show to say, look,privacy matters, security
matters, and here, here is athing. What kind of challenges
are you encountering? You know,so. I mean, the name being one,
I'm sure that people are notjust praising you. So what are
you up against as anentrepreneur with an idea that
(20:07):
makes the product the product,not the person the product?
Tanner Haas (20:14):
I mean, the name definitely is bittersweet, in
all honesty, because you can getone, let's say 40% of the
population in the US to be allexcited about you, use it, love
it, and then 50 to 60% willwrite it off. Just gives your
name, which I'm like, Okay, thatwasn't the intent freedom
(20:34):
anybody should. That should beeverybody's goal. Like you want
to be able to message privately.
That shouldn't just be aconservative issue or a liberal
issue. It's an everybody issue.
Everybody's had some sort ofprivacy mishap where. So that's
my take on that. But freedomchat is so much bigger than just
a so called conservativemessaging app. It's a cyber
(20:57):
security company. We've launchedfreedom chat for business, which
we allow companies could bedating apps. Could be a
healthcare company. They cancreate a white label of freedom
chat, meaning they take ourfeatures, our security, and
create their own messaging app.
So we work with dating apps. Weworked with another type of
messaging app. We worked with atelemedicine company. So our
(21:19):
security is going to be usedthen a lot more than just our
audience. I see our encryptionpowering a lot of the healthcare
market, so and then alsobuilding HIPAA compliant chat
solutions for healthcare,solutions for the legal
industry. Freedom chat is abrand within that portfolio of
(21:40):
what we do. It's not necessarilythe company.
BEATE CHELETTE (21:45):
I think that there's lots of applications.
There's a flip side to it. So ofcourse, illegal activities
probably want this really badly,because they cannot be tracked,
which is one of the things thegovernment probably is going to
have a look at you at some pointor another, because that's their
main concern. So you kind ofcan't get it right on every
level. Like, if it's freedom,it's freedom for everybody, and
(22:07):
you can't control it like that.
So in this since you've beendoing that, what's your personal
transformation? Like, what haveyou since found out about
yourself or learned aboutyourself, or anything that you
can share with our audience islike, well before it was this,
and now I'm not this
Tanner Haas (22:25):
is just gonna probably sound a little
boisterous and arrogant, but I'mwildly persistent, and I I
didn't discover that along this,but it just reinforced the fact,
like a lot of people, don'treally know what they can do
until you set out to do it. Andideas don't come out fully
formed. They become clearer asyou work on them. So that's why
a lot of people don't getstarted, or they don't continue,
(22:47):
because it's no that idea wasn'tthat clear, like, I wasn't sure
what to do. Well, most peoplearen't sure what to do. 99 I
mean, everybody like you takeone step, and then you just
figure it out. So this thepersonal transformation here is,
I am a much better entrepreneur,because this has been incredibly
difficult. I mean, building atruly private messaging app, the
(23:09):
amount of pen testing, theamount of security issues we've
had, the amount of securityfixes we've implemented. I mean,
it's just like it is a lot. It'snot like you have a product and
you release the product. Youhave to test it continuously.
The moment you think you're overthe hump, something happens and
oh my gosh, then you can quitand cry, or you can get up and
persist. So like this personaltransformation is it's my fourth
(23:35):
company. I started my first onewhen I was 18, sold the same
that one when I was 21 I used tothink that was difficult. It was
a nutrition company. And now I'mlike thinking like, if I wanted
cake, it was a piece of cake. IfI wanted to start another
nutrition company, get it to thesame level of scale, would
probably take me three to fourmonths. That's it, and it's not
(23:55):
I consider it a side hustle. I'mtalking to my wife, and we're
like, hey, let's you start aproduct company, because we want
some fun, like a side hustleback then I'm like, this is
consuming all my brain power.
It's just you. I feel myselflike I'm becoming a better
entrepreneur. I'm a betterleader. That's where the
personal transformations happen.
(24:16):
So it's kind of like peopleshould also look at starting a
company, running the company,like you're going to learn a
lot. You're going to become amuch better version of yourself.
It's not necessarily thefinancial success, of course,
that's what everybody's shootingfor. But you can take a lot of
swings, like some companies willwork out some won't you just
keep swinging? You're going tobecome a better entrepreneur, a
better person, a better leadereach time. So I wish, like,
(24:40):
people viewed it as that aswell, not just, Well, I made
this and didn't do well. No,it's like, what did you learn?
What did you do? What did youbecome? Because life's it's
short, but it's long, like,you're gonna have a lot of
opportunities, so you don't wantthese lessons to go to waste.
What's your favorite mistakethat I've ever made? Or in
general. Haha,
BEATE CHELETTE (25:03):
it's your favorite mistake. So you get to
pick it.
Tanner Haas (25:07):
My favorite mistake. I think there's like
three, my biggest mistake, andit's usually the opposite,
because a lot of people usuallymove super slow or pretty
conservative, not politically,but like, just in their thought
process and their thinking, theymove super slow. They're not
like, I'm going to go do thisand do this and start. For me,
(25:28):
when I start companies, it'susually a lot faster than it
should be. Meaning I do I willjust plow money. I will go move
ahead. Or we're going to dothis, we're going to do this,
we're going to and just keepgoing, going sometimes it makes
sense to make a plant. And I'velearned that, like my first
company, it was a nutritioncompany, and I decided I wanted
(25:48):
to have protein powder. I didn'tthink about the economics of the
business. I just thought, I'mgoing to do this. And so I wired
some money to this reallysupplement manufacturer. I
didn't know due diligence. Andso when they come back, and this
is the pricing, am I okay? Andthis is how much I'm going to
sell for. And then there'sshipping involved. And like, I'm
not going to make any money onthis product yet. I just wired
(26:11):
them some like, so the biggestmistake sometimes people need to
spend more time. Like AbrahamLincoln said, If I had seven
hours, I'd spend the first sixsharpening the AX for that means
like, set a plan, get organizedand progress forward. Don't just
sometimes, don't just jump intothings. But there's also, like,
the count. The flip side is somepeople usually just plan
(26:32):
forever, and then they use it asan excuse not to begin. So you
kind of have to, if you move tooquickly and you're usually
breaking too many things, thenyou should take a step back and
plan a little bit and progresslike sequentially. If you on the
flip side, you move too slow,then shut up, stop talking and
just begin. It'll never happen.
Yeah, that's my mistake. Isusually moving too fast when I
(26:57):
should have set a plan and slowdown. Do things a little more
meticulously, not necessarilymethodically, because you still
want to move quickly, but makesure you have your ducks in a
row and you're not scrambling somuch.
BEATE CHELETTE (27:11):
I like that a lot. Are you driven by any
spiritual, spiritual beliefs?
Tanner Haas (27:17):
My biggest thing is I desperately want when I'm on
my deathbed, that I just want tobe out of ideas, and I want to
know that I became the bestversion of myself. Like that is
that, to me is big. I reallyhate regret, like I hate regret,
(27:38):
and I only have really oneregret in my life. The end, it
stuck with me. And it wasbasketball growing up in high
school, like I didn't takeenough chances. And you some
people be like, Wow, that's astupid regret stuck with me
enough where I will start anycompany if it comes to my mind.
I don't care if I lose money. Idon't care. Like I met my wife
at the gym and I just went up toher. Like some people always
(28:01):
have regret for something, andso I wish I talked to that girl.
I wish I started this company. Iwish I hate that. I hate that
feeling. I will never feel that.
So for me, like my spiritualbelief is, I want to be the best
man I can become. I think thiswas a podcast I was listening
to, and I want to be like if I'mon my deathbed. I want. So
imagine like you are on yourdeathbed, and you have two and
(28:22):
there's God in the universe andtalking to you and saying, This
is what you could have beenshowing you that, showing you
the money, the fame, thehappiness, the health, the
belief in yourself, thespiritual, let's say
realization, and then this theother version of you. And this
(28:42):
is like that to me, terrifiedme. I want to know that I became
the best version of myselfinside out, helps as many people
as possible. Like, that's whatdrives me, and it's concerning.
Like, I mean, I think about thatall the time. I just never want
to be I missed
BEATE CHELETTE (29:04):
an opportunity.
Yeah, it's interesting that yousaid that I just had this like
thought over the weekend, and Iwas like, what drives me to
continue right at my age, whenpeople think about retirement
and I could just stop andenjoy life and do these these
things. But at the sametime, I think that when you're
(29:29):
impact driven, and that's whatI'm hearing from you, Tanner, is
that when you when you believethis calling, whatever the
calling is. That's why we dothis show. Is for people that
have this call and hownarcissistic or egoistic or
egocentric or boisterous it maysound,
Tanner Haas (29:51):
a call is a call, and you gotta answer it, and you
gotta answer there's fulltransparency I have. I want to
run for for office one day,2040, that's my goal. And I
don't want to, like, I, I wroteit in my for I just feel like
some people have a, you have acall for something that's, I
(30:13):
don't want to miss that call.
And I'll try. I'll try, like,health care, privacy, like I
might sound egotistical, like,Oh no, but I'm not if I feel
compelled to do something, if Ifeel this push from within,
answer
BEATE CHELETTE (30:26):
spiritual principle, yeah, that's a
spiritual principle of that isthe essence of a call. This has
been really an interesting,amazing conversation. The last
thing I want to just talk about,what part of your journey made
you trust the most in yourself,because you got to be a badass
(30:48):
to do what you do.
Tanner Haas (30:51):
I mean, it's just, I mean, you develop a unwavering
belief in yourself the more thatyou do it. So I wrote this. I'm
not trying to cross promotehere. I just honestly believe
this is again, I had a callingwhen I was 18, 19 to write some
books, and my second book wascalled How to achieve and
receive everything you want.
Obviously, I'm 19, I hadn'tachieved and received
(31:11):
everything, but I've read a lot.
I mean, a lot is since 16, I'vebeen reading three to four books
a week. So I'd say voraciousreader, and some of them are
Michael singer, the next termbiographies, to tech, to
anything. And like in that Iwrote number the number one
thing if you want to achieve andreceive anything you want, is
(31:32):
develop an ongoing belief inyourself. And I will be 100%
honest at that time, I did nothave an unwavering belief in
myself, an unwavering beliefthat means the world could go
against you and you still thinkyou're going to come out on top.
And that might be stupid,arrogant, whatever, but like
Roger Banister, thought he couldbreak a four minute the four
(31:54):
minute barrier in a mile.
Doctor, scientist said no, can'tbe done physically impossible.
It's like, No, I can do it. Andhe did it. And that's the thing
that, like most people, you'renot born. Most people, I'll say,
everybody, nobody's born withthis unwavering confidence. A
lot of them fake it. But thenonce you start to work on
yourself and you you get up,when you said you were going to
(32:15):
get up, you read the book. Yousaid you said you were going to
read. You ask that girl out whenyou said you were going to you
start that company, even thoughyou failed. You persist like,
that's when you start to developthis belief that you know what I
can do, what I say I'm going todo, and I'm going to like,
that's when you become proud ofwho you are. It's not born. You
(32:38):
don't have an unwavering belief.
And then you start all thesethings. You're a little shaky,
you start a company, you'restill shaky. You succeed, and
then you're like, damn, I can dothat. And that. That's how it
works. That's how you for me,that's I just get more confident
the more I work, and even if I'mfailing, it's like, what that
(33:00):
didn't kill me. I'm stillkicking that lawsuit I was in
still kicking this. I mean,that's really where that's the
most fun as an entrepreneur. Andit's not fun in it, but it's
when I think
BEATE CHELETTE (33:11):
it's a backbone that you're building. Yes, if
you, if you don't believe it,especially if you're asking for
money and investment money, ifyou don't believe what you're
doing, nobody will believe no.
Why are they
Tanner Haas (33:23):
going to write money if you're not willing to
put your own money on the table
BEATE CHELETTE (33:27):
exactly on a percent? So for someone who now
wants to get the app, where dothey
Tanner Haas (33:32):
go? You can go to freedomchat.com you don't need
me to spell it for you if you'relistening, just freedomchat.com
you got it download it on iOS orAndroid. You can go also, if you
want to see bookrecommendations, some of the
books I've written, you can goto tannerhaas.com that one I
might need to spell out, but I'msure they can see it in the
(33:53):
podcast description.
BEATE CHELETTE (33:55):
We'll make sure we have all the links and links
in this in the show note. Isthere one last thing you want to
leave the audience with beforewe sign off today.
Tanner Haas (34:03):
If you have a calling, if you have a push from
within, I mean a push likethere's a hand on the inside of
you, pushing you towardssomething. Go for it. Whether
that's asking somebody out,whether that's starting
something, getting in shape,doing some sort of competition,
just do it like stop thinking,just do it and you will not
(34:27):
regret
BEATE CHELETTE (34:27):
it. All right?
Tanner, well, that's been anamazing interview. Thank you so
much for your time and energyand for being here. I appreciate
you very much, and I can feelthe passion and the conviction,
and I'll vote for you. You gotmy vote.
Tanner Haas (34:39):
2040, I got a few million to get, but we're
actually a good start.
Appreciate it. All right.
BEATE CHELETTE (34:45):
Thank you so much, and until next time, and
that is is for us, for today,today's conversation really was
a deep dive into what happenswhen you have a really big,
daunting idea that will upsetquite a few people past. Simply
in the tech industry, when youtake a business model that
everybody's been following andyou flip it upside down, you
(35:05):
heard it from Tanner, spread theword, get the app, and as
always, guard your privacy, makesure that you're safe as you
possibly can be. And with that,we're going to sign off for
today and until next time andGOODBYE. That's it for this
episode of the Business GrowthArchitect Show Founders of the
Future. If you're done playingsmall and ready to build the
(35:27):
future on your terms, subscribe,share and help us reach more
Trailblazers like you. And ifyou're serious about creating,
growing and scaling a businessthat's aligned with who you are,
schedule your uncovery sessionat uncoverysession.com lead with
vision. Move with purpose.
Create your future.
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