August 28, 2025 • 30 mins
Scaling a business shouldn’t feel like guesswork. If you’re tired of relying on referrals or one-off wins that can’t be repeated, this episode will show you a better way.
I’m joined by Don Traxler, leading growth strategist and founder of RevSpark Media, where he helps medical clinics, wellness brands, and franchise owners achieve seven- and eight-figure growth through predictable growth systems. Don’s expertise spans men’s health, regenerative medicine, weight loss clinics, telehealth, and franchising.
In this conversation, Don shares why cheap leads and AI automation alone create bottlenecks, why referrals are like “building on sand,” and how franchise operators can replicate scalable marketing systems across every location. We unpack how to move from unpredictable, random results into data-driven, high-intent client acquisition that fuels sustainable growth.
If you’re ready to replace chance with clarity, and growth with systems you can trust, this episode is for you.
Books Mentioned
- Getting Things Done by David Allen
- The 4-Hour Work Week by Tim Ferriss
Connect with Don at revsparkmedia.com or on LinkedIn. His book, The Franchise Advertising Excellence Playbook, is available now on Amazon.
Join Dr. William Attaway on the Catalytic Leadership podcast as he shares transformative insights to help high-performance entrepreneurs and agency owners achieve Clear-Minded Focus, Calm Control, and Confidence.
- Free 30-Minute Discovery Call:
Ready to elevate your business? Book a free 30-minute discovery call with Dr. William Attaway and start your journey to success.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Dr. William Attaway (00:00):
I am excited today to have Don
Traxler on the podcast.
Don is a leading growthstrategist and the founder of
RevSpark Media, where he helpsmedical clinics, wellness brands
and healthcare entrepreneursscale to seven and eight figure
growth through data-drivenpatient acquisition and
high-performance advertising.
(00:21):
Don's expertise spans men'shealth, regenerative medicine,
weight loss clinics, telehealthand more, building marketing
systems that deliver real,revenue-generating patients.
Don, I'm so glad you're here,man.
Thanks for being on the show.
Don Traxler (00:38):
Thanks for having me, william, excited to be here.
Intro (00:43):
Welcome to Catalytic Leadership, the podcast designed
to help leaders intentionallygrow and thrive.
Here is your host author andleadership and executive coach,
dr William Attaway.
Dr. William Attaway (01:00):
I would love to start today with you
sharing a little bit of yourstory with our listeners,
particularly around your journeyand your development as a
leader.
How'd you get started?
Don Traxler (01:12):
Yeah, I don't think we have time to go into all of
it here, but you know we'll doour best.
I honestly came from anengineering background.
I was a civil engineerOriginally, found that I had
what most engineers don't have,which is a personality.
Nice, right.
(01:40):
So I, um, I was fortunateenough to I was commuting 120
miles a day round trip for forthat job and, um, I listened to
a lot of podcasts, audio booksand all of that, and I ended up
finding a mastermind that Ibecame a part of, um called the
foundation, uh, with DaneMaxwell and uh, that was geez.
(02:03):
Back in 2013, I want to say, um,and the whole notion of that
was, you know, uh, finding aproblem to solve that was deep
enough in a market that youcould solve with a software as a
service company.
Uh, so I dove into that, um, Idid actually, you know, just to
fast track that story Um, Iended up, uh, meeting a bunch of
(02:25):
people from that Um.
They invited me to move toBoulder and live in an
entrepreneur house and I said,why not?
So I quit my engineering job,packed my car, went to Boulder,
um, the we did start a softwarecompany.
It was a little early for itstime.
But what led me into this wasactually all of that group of,
(02:48):
you know, of folks that I met.
It was really in the heydays ofdigital marketing.
It was just becoming a thingand, yeah, we sort of helped
each other, you know, realizethe opportunity and got started.
So I started Red Spark Mediageez, about 15 years ago now and
it looks a lot different todaythan it did back then and we've
(03:10):
gone through a lot of iteration.
But really, as it pertains tothe company now and development
as a leader to answer thosequestions my journey kind of
started out in necessity.
Here I wasn't trying to, youknow, run an agency or write a
book at first, right, I wastrying to help growth-minded
(03:33):
founders, you know, solve realproblems, and especially in
complex industries, right, likehealthcare and franchising.
And over time I really saw apattern, right, that there was
so much potential and peoplewere struggling because they
were largely still using, youknow, old school playbooks.
They were looking at it, as youknow, just a set and forget
(03:56):
kind of thing.
And you know, so I built thisas a really as us, being a true
growth partner, not just a spokeon a wheel company that you
hired to run some ads for youand what really kind of you know
drove me in the development asa leader was also out of
necessity right.
As we grew and we grew ourclient base, we grew our team
(04:19):
and that was a continuedlearning curve right.
And to know that you havepeople depending on you and you
have families you're supportingand mouths to feed, that
certainly drove the developmentas a leader right.
To figure it out, to dive inand do anything that I could to
(04:41):
be the best leader that I youknow that I could be.
So a lot of books, a lot ofmasterminds, a lot of leaning on
, you know, the community that Ihave to really you know,
foundationally be the bestleader that I could.
And also learn through mistakes, too.
Right, you know, that's one ofthe I think, one of the best
(05:03):
ways that we can learn how to bea leader.
Dr. William Attaway (05:06):
I agree.
You know, I think the mistakesthat you make.
Service is the pathway tosuccess.
So often, if you understand,failure is an event and not an
identity.
And one of the things Iappreciate about your journey is
that you know, no matter whereyou went, no matter what you did
, you know you were alwayskeeping that in mind.
You know and I think that'simportant and cannot be
(05:29):
overstated the importance ofmindset in successful
entrepreneurs like you.
You know you mentioned your bookand if folks are not familiar
with this, this is your new book, right?
The Franchise AdvertisingExcellence Playbook is your new
book, right, the FranchiseAdvertising Excellence Playbook.
(05:49):
And it is exactly that I mean,as I was, as I was reading this,
I thought this is, this is thefruit from so many mistakes or
learning opportunities, and nowyou put this into a format
people can just take and theycan execute straight from the,
from the, the, the truths andthe insight that you put in this
book.
What, what prompted this?
Like there's always a reason,the why you did it.
(06:12):
Why put all this, all yoursecret sauce, into a book?
Don Traxler (06:16):
you know.
I think the short answer is isthat we can't help everybody,
right, um, and we are reallyfortunate to have been able to
help a certain number offranchises and franchisees, you
know, to realize that there isthere is something different and
there is something better froma standpoint of being able to
(06:40):
not only have measurable successbut know what you should even
care about in terms of you knowwhat, what metrics are important
here?
Right, and really this is it'sspecifically for franchise
owners, whether, whether youhave two locations or 20, you
know who know that youradvertising should be performing
(07:03):
better, but you're kind offrustrated with the generic
approaches, um, the, thecorporate centric.
You know one campaign for everylocation, um, and you know who
really don't maybe evenunderstand, um, how this needs
to change from a multi-location.
You know coordination, um, andthe need for, like, systematic
(07:26):
replication, right Um it.
To me, it really it really stemsthe the best performing
franchise operations in, in ouropinion, and what we see is
those that start from thecentric, holistic approach, from
(07:47):
corporate and having thingsessentially systematized out
right.
That means more than just youradvertising campaign.
It means having a consistentuse of a CRM, right, and how the
marketing is going to beessentially deployed across
(08:07):
multiple locations, so that ifyou're at two locations and
you're all of a sudden going to10, well it's not as scary,
because then you know thatyou're just replicating this
same system every time and thatyou're going to get not only
consistent results but it'sconsistent management from you
know the corporate system aswell, so we dive into a lot of
(08:29):
that in the book and really it'sparticularly a powerful tool
for appointment-based franchises.
You know healthcare is anexample because we work a lot in
the healthcare market.
But home services and reallyany other kind of service-based
industry, you know wherecustomer lifetime value and
(08:50):
systematic excellence reallydetermines your success 100%.
Dr. William Attaway (08:56):
Talk about healthcare for a minute.
Like you've got a lot ofclients and have done a lot of
work to help people besuccessful in that industry.
What are the biggest mistakesthat you see these owners that
are making, these doctors andthe providers?
Don Traxler (09:16):
when it comes to marketing and patient
acquisition.
I think a lot of it is well.
For one, I think it's a faultof the market as market as a
whole.
Um, and what and what kind ofmessages are being disseminated
to these folks in the market,meaning from other agency owners
out there and things like that,right, there's such, there's
such an, a presence of um,sensationalism, right?
(09:40):
Um, and putting these sort ofsensationalized promises in
front of them of, hey, all youneed to do is, you know, create
some ads, we'll use AI, we'llautomate everything.
And it sounds great, right, whowouldn't want that?
Like, oh, I don't have to have,you know, human elements here,
(10:01):
I don't have to have peopleoperating, you know, on this all
the time.
I can just run an ad and AI andautomation will take care of
everything.
So people book appointments,show up, awesome.
The reality is is that AI isgreat to a certain, to a certain
point, right, but we still,especially in healthcare and
(10:22):
especially in high touchenvironments, where we still
especially in healthcare andespecially in high touch
environments, where, you know,if you're in anything like a
concierge level type of business, people expect to have human
interaction, you know, andthere's a huge part in that
which you're never going to geta commitment level out of
somebody that can just doeverything through AI and
(10:45):
automation and book their ownappointments and everything.
Your calendar will fill up, butyou'll have super high no-show
rates and largely it's becausepeople don't have that human
touch point.
There's no previous rapportbuilt, there's no commitment to
the appointments and to that.
You're going to end up wastinga lot of money and wasting a lot
(11:07):
of time to then figure out thatthat is one of the biggest
mistakes that you can make.
Wow.
Dr. William Attaway (11:15):
I think that's something that anybody
who's in that field can resonatewith.
We've got all these leads, allthese fantastic potential
customers, but then the no-showrate is so stinking high.
That's right, and it's soincredibly frustrating, because
you feel like you spent money toacquire these things but they
never panned out.
Don Traxler (11:35):
Yeah, even more so, william.
You're spending money on, sure,the acquisition of the leads
and the opportunities, but thesepeople take up valuable time on
, you know, your, yourpractice's calendar and that's
wasted time.
But it's also expense that youhave to pay your team, right,
you have, you have maybe a nurseor a PA or MA that they're
(11:59):
getting paid to sit there and,you know, waste the time when
this is allocated and set asidefor somebody that doesn't show.
So it kind of ends up beinglike a multiplication of cost
frustration as well.
As you know, these are peoplethat, especially from the
medical side, right, these arepeople that have spent so much
(12:21):
time in education and you knowthey're there ready to impart
that knowledge and help Well,but then when they don't show up
, that's incredibly frustrating,so very very.
Dr. William Attaway (12:37):
you talk a lot about high intent patients
versus just leads.
What is the difference versusjust leads?
What?
Don Traxler (12:44):
is the difference, yeah, Big difference is really.
How do I say this best?
So the advertising platformsmake it incredibly easy for you
to generate a lead right?
Facebook in particular.
They have what they call a highvolume lead form, which
(13:08):
essentially, you can click onthis ad and it will autofill
your information, which may ormay not even be correct, and you
can submit this thing withouteven knowing, sometimes, right
so, to the client, to thebusiness.
You may see oh man, we'regetting a ton of leads and
(13:29):
they're super cheap, you know, acouple dollars per lead.
But they repeatedly try to callpeople and they get things like
my name's not Bob, I didn'tsign up for anything, Stop
calling me Right.
And that, you know, obviouslyleads into the rest of that
frustration we already talkedabout.
Now I would venture a guess,and I would bet dollars to
(13:54):
donuts, that everyone would beway happier getting fewer leads
than are more likely to convert,even if they cost a little bit
more money, right?
So in order to achieve a higherintent lead, there are many
ways to do that in any sort oflead journey to ask them
(14:17):
specific questions, things thatthey actually need to fill out
and answer beyond just theirname, email and phone number
right.
The other part is and one thingthat we have invested in in our
company is actually building aconsumer data platform.
So data is really kind of thenext big thing, right, Data is
(14:39):
going to be as important as oilin terms of advertising.
And when you can start with abetter audience better meaning
understanding that you have adefined audience that has
already shown some sort ofintent then combine that with
those other lines of questioningthat I mentioned.
You have people that will bemore often than not, converting
(15:05):
not just into an appointment,but you'll have better
conversion rates into actualrevenue from that.
Dr. William Attaway (15:14):
And that's exactly what the owners want,
right.
So often they're just not surehow to get there.
They're just not sure how toget there, Right.
You know, I imagine that yourun into people who are like
well, you know, most of our newpatients come from referrals.
Yep, you know, most of our newbusinesses is word of mouth.
Is there advice that you wouldgive to people who have built
(15:37):
their business or their practicearound referrals and word of
mouth alone?
Like what would you say?
Don Traxler (15:43):
to them.
Yeah, I mean.
Well, congrats for one thing,right, congrats to you have
built a practice that issustaining you and your family,
and you know the employees thatyou have.
And I would ask are you happywith that?
Right, are you happy at thatlevel?
Because, if you're not, the onlyproblem with building a
(16:08):
business on a foundation ofreferral word of mouth is that
you have no way of scaling thatand you have no predictability.
You do not know if you're goingto have one referral this week
or 10 or not, right, um, sorelying on that to grow a
business is it's like building ahouse on sand, right, um, it's
(16:33):
really it's not a reliable andpredictable way to do that.
But utilizing, obviously,keeping referrals coming in is a
fantastic thing and nurturingthem and churning, you know,
really growing referrals fromeven new patients that are
generated is very important.
Now, having on top of that,having on top of that, a very
(16:57):
systematized and strategicallyfocused new patient generation
ecosystem, right, that is reallywhat will make the difference
and allow predictability interms of having growth goals
that are above and beyond that.
You know that level that youreach just from referrals and
(17:18):
word of mouth.
Dr. William Attaway (17:27):
That's good .
Can you think of a client thatyou have helped in this way to
get from that referral or wordof mouth only type of growth
into something that is scaling?
Don Traxler (17:34):
Absolutely.
The one that comes to mind isactually one of our first
franchise clients in a specificfranchise system.
They came to us actually in apretty dire situation.
I remember this distinctly Iwas actually trying to take a
(17:56):
vacation, and vacation as abusiness owner as I'm sure you
can understand and many peoplecan understand, it's a loaded
word, right, indeed, but Ireally could sense the necessity
and the priority here andessentially what had happened
was, within this franchisesystem, there were a certain
(18:17):
number of approved vendors thatthey could work with and this
particular client canvassing thearea they're doing things with
the local community to raiseawareness and bring in that
business from an organicstandpoint and word of mouth and
referral.
So they had grown that veryimpressively.
(18:51):
I mean, they were doing well.
However, they came to us in aposition where they had just
terminated with that otheragency and essentially they were
in panic mode because, well,they had expansion goals, they
had already started to, they hadsigned, you know, letter of
(19:13):
intent on the next you knowfranchise location and all of
that.
So to not have continuedopportunity coming in was a very
scary thing.
And so, you know, we, wequickly, um, we did what needed
to be done honestly, which wasto work quickly to get them back
at least up and running, wherethey were generating new
(19:36):
opportunity quickly, and fromthere, less than two months
later, we helped them achievetheir best month ever at that
time and actually were the topgrossing franchisee in that
franchise system.
And from there we helped them.
(19:57):
They went from that onelocation, they now have three
and are opening a fourth, reallyrelying very heavily on exactly
this system right, the systemand process of continuing to
drive high intent, patientopportunity, and that obviously
(20:19):
supplements the ground game andthe word of mouth and the
referral in order to reallyachieve some fantastic outcomes
here.
Dr. William Attaway (20:27):
That's awesome.
I want to talk about you for aminute.
We've been talking about yourbusiness and what you do, and I
think that is incrediblyimportant, but it all starts
with you as the business owner,as the point leader.
Your business, your clients,your team need you to lead at a
higher level today than they didfive years ago, and that same
(20:51):
thing is going to be true three,four, five years from now.
So how do you stay on top ofyour game?
How do you level up with thenew leadership skills that your
team and your clients and yourbusiness are going to need you
to have in the years to come?
Don Traxler (21:07):
Yeah, I, you know, honestly, I I look at this two
ways.
One, you know, being in aposition of leadership means
that in times of chaos andcomplexity and confusion, I need
to have clarity right, or Ineed to have as much clarity as
(21:28):
possible to then be able toalign people, resources and
envision to move that forwardand envision right to move that
forward.
And truly, william, especiallyin terms of, you know, our work
in franchises, I really staysharp by staying close to the
operators right, the franchisees, the founders and also other
(21:55):
marketers in the mix as well.
You know we have a really goodI'm fortunate to have a really
good network of you know, othercolleagues in the space where we
get together regularly anddifferent masterminds, and you
know we talk about what'sworking and what's not and it's
super important and I think it'stremendously important for
(22:15):
everyone, business owner or not,to surround yourself with, get
a mentor.
You know mentors can betremendously important,
certainly from a businessperspective, but also really in
your everyday life, right, andreally just also being around
peers that challenge my thinking.
(22:36):
That's good.
You know, like writing that bookwas, that was a huge level up
moment for me and you know thatwas really a big push from you,
know people that were a bitahead of me, and it really kind
of forced me to to codify what,what actually works right and
(23:02):
and not just what sounds good intheory, because, as a leader,
you know you, you sometimes areafforded those luxuries of um,
being able to dream a bit andyou know the massive drivers are
what really works, and not onlyunderstanding what works now,
(23:22):
but really having your ear tothe ground about what's going to
work next, right, what'schanging the landscape, what's
what's upcoming and and whenthings that could potentially
disrupt, you know like, I meanthe whole notion of AI coming
through and in such a big manner.
Really really important tounderstand how we're going to
(23:43):
embrace that and utilize it toour best abilities, but also to
remember that it isn't going totake everything over.
It is not going to replaceeverything, and it's even more
important to focus on the thingsthat it's not going to replace,
to make sure that we're reallyreally doing our best to show up
(24:06):
in those areas right.
So that's good.
Dr. William Attaway (24:09):
Yeah, I think that's an important point.
You know people.
People look at the uncertaintyahead.
They look at a time of change,like we're in with AI, and fear
seems to be rising.
You know what's this going todo to my job, my company, my
team.
What's this going to do to thejobs.
You know the people who workfor me and I think that's well
(24:33):
said.
You know there is the humanelement that will never be
replaced.
No-transcript.
Don Traxler (25:05):
Yeah, it's probably been mentioned many times on
your show and I know that youalso share the same feelings
surrounding this book, but it'sgetting things done so good,
david Allen.
Honestly, it's beentransformational in how I spend
my days and how I'm able toreally prioritize what is what
(25:25):
is super important, withoutlosing focus on, you know,
things that that may not need myattention right now but are
still very valuable you know to.
To focus on that.
That is absolutely been, uh, areally, really big one.
Um, the other plug that I wouldmake, which is uh, I haven't I
(25:47):
haven't heard too much about itlately, but um, four hour work
week by Tim Ferriss is, uh, yes,man, that one.
I don't think that book willever really um fall out of my
memory.
Um, one, I don't think thatbook will ever really fall out
of my memory.
It has certainly beentremendously impactful on how
I've grown business, how I'velooked to really make my time
(26:10):
most efficient, but I think italso obviously ties into getting
things done as well.
Right, it's all about usingyour time effectively.
That's so good.
Dr. William Attaway (26:23):
And for the listeners who didn't hear it,
we actually had David on theshow.
You can go back to season twoand listen to that episode with
David Allen, where he shared alittle bit about his system.
It's one that I've used foralmost 20 years now and it is
the best productivity systemthat I have found.
One more question, don.
This is one we ask everybody.
It's easy to look at you andthink, oh wow, man, don's just
(26:49):
got it going on.
His business is just up and tothe right.
He's never struggled like Istruggle.
He's never had challenges likeI have.
And it may be that some of thelisteners are thinking that If I
could snap my fingers and solveone problem in your business
right now, what would you wantthat problem to be?
Don Traxler (27:10):
Honestly, I think one of the most difficult things
to manage in a business,especially with scaling and
growth, is, um, the humanelement, right Um, especially
when things grow to a pointwhere you no longer, as a leader
(27:31):
, have the ability to be intouch with every, every person
on your team.
Um, and that certainly has been, uh, a point of, you know,
crack showing in our, in ourbusiness, many times.
Um, so, truly, I think, ifthere was a magic wand that
could help, would be helping tomake the human element a bit
(27:57):
more consistent, I suppose, inscaling, because that is a
problem that I know we face, andI know many other people in our
network face as well, and wesee it on the client side too.
You know, though, franchiseswill regularly have their like
(28:20):
their, uh, their office managersleave things like that Right Um
, where everything looks good onpaper.
Until that, you know, thathuman element ends up breaking
or or going away.
So that would be, if you can doit, william, help me out there.
Dr. William Attaway (28:37):
I mean I'll snap my fingers.
I can't guarantee anything'sgoing to happen.
No, I think that's very realand I appreciate that.
I think it's a good reminderthat, no matter where we are in
our business journey asentrepreneurs, everybody's
struggling.
Everybody's struggling withsomething.
Everybody's struggling withchallenges and problems.
They may look different orsound different, but nobody gets
(29:01):
off without having those.
Don, this has been such a greatconversation and I'm so
grateful for you, for your timeand the insights that you've
shared so generously today.
I know folks are going to wantto stay connected to you and
continue to learn more about youand from you and more about
what you're doing at RevSpark.
What's the best way for folksto do that?
Don Traxler (29:24):
Yeah, can absolutely go to our website,
revsparkmediacom.
I'm sure you'll include that inthe show notes.
Connect with me on LinkedIn.
I'm pretty active on there andI'm always, always open to
growing my connections there,and I do want to put it out
there that I am always open toanswering questions or being of
(29:47):
help and service, right, soplease don't hesitate to reach
out to me and I'd be more thanhappy to help if I can and if
anyone's in the franchise worldthat's listening.
You can find the book on Amazonas well.
Perhaps we can link that up inthe show notes as well.
Dr. William Attaway (30:06):
Absolutely.
We'll have all that linked inthe show notes, Don.
Thank you so appreciate yourtime today, man.
Don Traxler (30:12):
Thank you as well, William.
I am excited today to have Don
Traxler on the podcast.
Don is a leading growthstrategist and the founder of
RevSpark Media, where he helpsmedical clinics, wellness brands
and healthcare entrepreneursscale to seven and eight figure
growth through data-drivenpatient acquisition and
high-performance advertising.
(00:21):
Don's expertise spans men'shealth, regenerative medicine,
weight loss clinics, telehealthand more, building marketing
systems that deliver real,revenue-generating patients.
Don, I'm so glad you're here,man.
Thanks for being on the show.
Don Traxler (00:38):
Thanks for having me, william, excited to be here.
Intro (00:43):
Welcome to Catalytic Leadership, the podcast designed
to help leaders intentionallygrow and thrive.
Here is your host author andleadership and executive coach,
dr William Attaway.
Dr. William Attaway (01:00):
I would love to start today with you
sharing a little bit of yourstory with our listeners,
particularly around your journeyand your development as a
leader.
How'd you get started?
Don Traxler (01:12):
Yeah, I don't think we have time to go into all of
it here, but you know we'll doour best.
I honestly came from anengineering background.
I was a civil engineerOriginally, found that I had
what most engineers don't have,which is a personality.
Nice, right.
(01:40):
So I, um, I was fortunateenough to I was commuting 120
miles a day round trip for forthat job and, um, I listened to
a lot of podcasts, audio booksand all of that, and I ended up
finding a mastermind that Ibecame a part of, um called the
foundation, uh, with DaneMaxwell and uh, that was geez.
(02:03):
Back in 2013, I want to say, um,and the whole notion of that
was, you know, uh, finding aproblem to solve that was deep
enough in a market that youcould solve with a software as a
service company.
Uh, so I dove into that, um, Idid actually, you know, just to
fast track that story Um, Iended up, uh, meeting a bunch of
(02:25):
people from that Um.
They invited me to move toBoulder and live in an
entrepreneur house and I said,why not?
So I quit my engineering job,packed my car, went to Boulder,
um, the we did start a softwarecompany.
It was a little early for itstime.
But what led me into this wasactually all of that group of,
(02:48):
you know, of folks that I met.
It was really in the heydays ofdigital marketing.
It was just becoming a thingand, yeah, we sort of helped
each other, you know, realizethe opportunity and got started.
So I started Red Spark Mediageez, about 15 years ago now and
it looks a lot different todaythan it did back then and we've
(03:10):
gone through a lot of iteration.
But really, as it pertains tothe company now and development
as a leader to answer thosequestions my journey kind of
started out in necessity.
Here I wasn't trying to, youknow, run an agency or write a
book at first, right, I wastrying to help growth-minded
(03:33):
founders, you know, solve realproblems, and especially in
complex industries, right, likehealthcare and franchising.
And over time I really saw apattern, right, that there was
so much potential and peoplewere struggling because they
were largely still using, youknow, old school playbooks.
They were looking at it, as youknow, just a set and forget
(03:56):
kind of thing.
And you know, so I built thisas a really as us, being a true
growth partner, not just a spokeon a wheel company that you
hired to run some ads for youand what really kind of you know
drove me in the development asa leader was also out of
necessity right.
As we grew and we grew ourclient base, we grew our team
(04:19):
and that was a continuedlearning curve right.
And to know that you havepeople depending on you and you
have families you're supportingand mouths to feed, that
certainly drove the developmentas a leader right.
To figure it out, to dive inand do anything that I could to
(04:41):
be the best leader that I youknow that I could be.
So a lot of books, a lot ofmasterminds, a lot of leaning on
, you know, the community that Ihave to really you know,
foundationally be the bestleader that I could.
And also learn through mistakes, too.
Right, you know, that's one ofthe I think, one of the best
(05:03):
ways that we can learn how to bea leader.
Dr. William Attaway (05:06):
I agree.
You know, I think the mistakesthat you make.
Service is the pathway tosuccess.
So often, if you understand,failure is an event and not an
identity.
And one of the things Iappreciate about your journey is
that you know, no matter whereyou went, no matter what you did
, you know you were alwayskeeping that in mind.
You know and I think that'simportant and cannot be
(05:29):
overstated the importance ofmindset in successful
entrepreneurs like you.
You know you mentioned your bookand if folks are not familiar
with this, this is your new book, right?
The Franchise AdvertisingExcellence Playbook is your new
book, right, the FranchiseAdvertising Excellence Playbook.
(05:49):
And it is exactly that I mean,as I was, as I was reading this,
I thought this is, this is thefruit from so many mistakes or
learning opportunities, and nowyou put this into a format
people can just take and theycan execute straight from the,
from the, the, the truths andthe insight that you put in this
book.
What, what prompted this?
Like there's always a reason,the why you did it.
(06:12):
Why put all this, all yoursecret sauce, into a book?
Don Traxler (06:16):
you know.
I think the short answer is isthat we can't help everybody,
right, um, and we are reallyfortunate to have been able to
help a certain number offranchises and franchisees, you
know, to realize that there isthere is something different and
there is something better froma standpoint of being able to
(06:40):
not only have measurable successbut know what you should even
care about in terms of you knowwhat, what metrics are important
here?
Right, and really this is it'sspecifically for franchise
owners, whether, whether youhave two locations or 20, you
know who know that youradvertising should be performing
(07:03):
better, but you're kind offrustrated with the generic
approaches, um, the, thecorporate centric.
You know one campaign for everylocation, um, and you know who
really don't maybe evenunderstand, um, how this needs
to change from a multi-location.
You know coordination, um, andthe need for, like, systematic
(07:26):
replication, right Um it.
To me, it really it really stemsthe the best performing
franchise operations in, in ouropinion, and what we see is
those that start from thecentric, holistic approach, from
(07:47):
corporate and having thingsessentially systematized out
right.
That means more than just youradvertising campaign.
It means having a consistentuse of a CRM, right, and how the
marketing is going to beessentially deployed across
(08:07):
multiple locations, so that ifyou're at two locations and
you're all of a sudden going to10, well it's not as scary,
because then you know thatyou're just replicating this
same system every time and thatyou're going to get not only
consistent results but it'sconsistent management from you
know the corporate system aswell, so we dive into a lot of
(08:29):
that in the book and really it'sparticularly a powerful tool
for appointment-based franchises.
You know healthcare is anexample because we work a lot in
the healthcare market.
But home services and reallyany other kind of service-based
industry, you know wherecustomer lifetime value and
(08:50):
systematic excellence reallydetermines your success 100%.
Dr. William Attaway (08:56):
Talk about healthcare for a minute.
Like you've got a lot ofclients and have done a lot of
work to help people besuccessful in that industry.
What are the biggest mistakesthat you see these owners that
are making, these doctors andthe providers?
Don Traxler (09:16):
when it comes to marketing and patient
acquisition.
I think a lot of it is well.
For one, I think it's a faultof the market as market as a
whole.
Um, and what and what kind ofmessages are being disseminated
to these folks in the market,meaning from other agency owners
out there and things like that,right, there's such, there's
such an, a presence of um,sensationalism, right?
(09:40):
Um, and putting these sort ofsensationalized promises in
front of them of, hey, all youneed to do is, you know, create
some ads, we'll use AI, we'llautomate everything.
And it sounds great, right, whowouldn't want that?
Like, oh, I don't have to have,you know, human elements here,
(10:01):
I don't have to have peopleoperating, you know, on this all
the time.
I can just run an ad and AI andautomation will take care of
everything.
So people book appointments,show up, awesome.
The reality is is that AI isgreat to a certain, to a certain
point, right, but we still,especially in healthcare and
(10:22):
especially in high touchenvironments, where we still
especially in healthcare andespecially in high touch
environments, where, you know,if you're in anything like a
concierge level type of business, people expect to have human
interaction, you know, andthere's a huge part in that
which you're never going to geta commitment level out of
somebody that can just doeverything through AI and
(10:45):
automation and book their ownappointments and everything.
Your calendar will fill up, butyou'll have super high no-show
rates and largely it's becausepeople don't have that human
touch point.
There's no previous rapportbuilt, there's no commitment to
the appointments and to that.
You're going to end up wastinga lot of money and wasting a lot
(11:07):
of time to then figure out thatthat is one of the biggest
mistakes that you can make.
Wow.
Dr. William Attaway (11:15):
I think that's something that anybody
who's in that field can resonatewith.
We've got all these leads, allthese fantastic potential
customers, but then the no-showrate is so stinking high.
That's right, and it's soincredibly frustrating, because
you feel like you spent money toacquire these things but they
never panned out.
Don Traxler (11:35):
Yeah, even more so, william.
You're spending money on, sure,the acquisition of the leads
and the opportunities, but thesepeople take up valuable time on
, you know, your, yourpractice's calendar and that's
wasted time.
But it's also expense that youhave to pay your team, right,
you have, you have maybe a nurseor a PA or MA that they're
(11:59):
getting paid to sit there and,you know, waste the time when
this is allocated and set asidefor somebody that doesn't show.
So it kind of ends up beinglike a multiplication of cost
frustration as well.
As you know, these are peoplethat, especially from the
medical side, right, these arepeople that have spent so much
(12:21):
time in education and you knowthey're there ready to impart
that knowledge and help Well,but then when they don't show up
, that's incredibly frustrating,so very very.
Dr. William Attaway (12:37):
you talk a lot about high intent patients
versus just leads.
What is the difference versusjust leads?
What?
Don Traxler (12:44):
is the difference, yeah, Big difference is really.
How do I say this best?
So the advertising platformsmake it incredibly easy for you
to generate a lead right?
Facebook in particular.
They have what they call a highvolume lead form, which
(13:08):
essentially, you can click onthis ad and it will autofill
your information, which may ormay not even be correct, and you
can submit this thing withouteven knowing, sometimes, right
so, to the client, to thebusiness.
You may see oh man, we'regetting a ton of leads and
(13:29):
they're super cheap, you know, acouple dollars per lead.
But they repeatedly try to callpeople and they get things like
my name's not Bob, I didn'tsign up for anything, Stop
calling me Right.
And that, you know, obviouslyleads into the rest of that
frustration we already talkedabout.
Now I would venture a guess,and I would bet dollars to
(13:54):
donuts, that everyone would beway happier getting fewer leads
than are more likely to convert,even if they cost a little bit
more money, right?
So in order to achieve a higherintent lead, there are many
ways to do that in any sort oflead journey to ask them
(14:17):
specific questions, things thatthey actually need to fill out
and answer beyond just theirname, email and phone number
right.
The other part is and one thingthat we have invested in in our
company is actually building aconsumer data platform.
So data is really kind of thenext big thing, right, Data is
(14:39):
going to be as important as oilin terms of advertising.
And when you can start with abetter audience better meaning
understanding that you have adefined audience that has
already shown some sort ofintent then combine that with
those other lines of questioningthat I mentioned.
You have people that will bemore often than not, converting
(15:05):
not just into an appointment,but you'll have better
conversion rates into actualrevenue from that.
Dr. William Attaway (15:14):
And that's exactly what the owners want,
right.
So often they're just not surehow to get there.
They're just not sure how toget there, Right.
You know, I imagine that yourun into people who are like
well, you know, most of our newpatients come from referrals.
Yep, you know, most of our newbusinesses is word of mouth.
Is there advice that you wouldgive to people who have built
(15:37):
their business or their practicearound referrals and word of
mouth alone?
Like what would you say?
Don Traxler (15:43):
to them.
Yeah, I mean.
Well, congrats for one thing,right, congrats to you have
built a practice that issustaining you and your family,
and you know the employees thatyou have.
And I would ask are you happywith that?
Right, are you happy at thatlevel?
Because, if you're not, the onlyproblem with building a
(16:08):
business on a foundation ofreferral word of mouth is that
you have no way of scaling thatand you have no predictability.
You do not know if you're goingto have one referral this week
or 10 or not, right, um, sorelying on that to grow a
business is it's like building ahouse on sand, right, um, it's
(16:33):
really it's not a reliable andpredictable way to do that.
But utilizing, obviously,keeping referrals coming in is a
fantastic thing and nurturingthem and churning, you know,
really growing referrals fromeven new patients that are
generated is very important.
Now, having on top of that,having on top of that, a very
(16:57):
systematized and strategicallyfocused new patient generation
ecosystem, right, that is reallywhat will make the difference
and allow predictability interms of having growth goals
that are above and beyond that.
You know that level that youreach just from referrals and
(17:18):
word of mouth.
Dr. William Attaway (17:27):
That's good .
Can you think of a client thatyou have helped in this way to
get from that referral or wordof mouth only type of growth
into something that is scaling?
Don Traxler (17:34):
Absolutely.
The one that comes to mind isactually one of our first
franchise clients in a specificfranchise system.
They came to us actually in apretty dire situation.
I remember this distinctly Iwas actually trying to take a
(17:56):
vacation, and vacation as abusiness owner as I'm sure you
can understand and many peoplecan understand, it's a loaded
word, right, indeed, but Ireally could sense the necessity
and the priority here andessentially what had happened
was, within this franchisesystem, there were a certain
(18:17):
number of approved vendors thatthey could work with and this
particular client canvassing thearea they're doing things with
the local community to raiseawareness and bring in that
business from an organicstandpoint and word of mouth and
referral.
So they had grown that veryimpressively.
(18:51):
I mean, they were doing well.
However, they came to us in aposition where they had just
terminated with that otheragency and essentially they were
in panic mode because, well,they had expansion goals, they
had already started to, they hadsigned, you know, letter of
(19:13):
intent on the next you knowfranchise location and all of
that.
So to not have continuedopportunity coming in was a very
scary thing.
And so, you know, we, wequickly, um, we did what needed
to be done honestly, which wasto work quickly to get them back
at least up and running, wherethey were generating new
(19:36):
opportunity quickly, and fromthere, less than two months
later, we helped them achievetheir best month ever at that
time and actually were the topgrossing franchisee in that
franchise system.
And from there we helped them.
(19:57):
They went from that onelocation, they now have three
and are opening a fourth, reallyrelying very heavily on exactly
this system right, the systemand process of continuing to
drive high intent, patientopportunity, and that obviously
(20:19):
supplements the ground game andthe word of mouth and the
referral in order to reallyachieve some fantastic outcomes
here.
Dr. William Attaway (20:27):
That's awesome.
I want to talk about you for aminute.
We've been talking about yourbusiness and what you do, and I
think that is incrediblyimportant, but it all starts
with you as the business owner,as the point leader.
Your business, your clients,your team need you to lead at a
higher level today than they didfive years ago, and that same
(20:51):
thing is going to be true three,four, five years from now.
So how do you stay on top ofyour game?
How do you level up with thenew leadership skills that your
team and your clients and yourbusiness are going to need you
to have in the years to come?
Don Traxler (21:07):
Yeah, I, you know, honestly, I I look at this two
ways.
One, you know, being in aposition of leadership means
that in times of chaos andcomplexity and confusion, I need
to have clarity right, or Ineed to have as much clarity as
(21:28):
possible to then be able toalign people, resources and
envision to move that forwardand envision right to move that
forward.
And truly, william, especiallyin terms of, you know, our work
in franchises, I really staysharp by staying close to the
operators right, the franchisees, the founders and also other
(21:55):
marketers in the mix as well.
You know we have a really goodI'm fortunate to have a really
good network of you know, othercolleagues in the space where we
get together regularly anddifferent masterminds, and you
know we talk about what'sworking and what's not and it's
super important and I think it'stremendously important for
(22:15):
everyone, business owner or not,to surround yourself with, get
a mentor.
You know mentors can betremendously important,
certainly from a businessperspective, but also really in
your everyday life, right, andreally just also being around
peers that challenge my thinking.
(22:36):
That's good.
You know, like writing that bookwas, that was a huge level up
moment for me and you know thatwas really a big push from you,
know people that were a bitahead of me, and it really kind
of forced me to to codify what,what actually works right and
(23:02):
and not just what sounds good intheory, because, as a leader,
you know you, you sometimes areafforded those luxuries of um,
being able to dream a bit andyou know the massive drivers are
what really works, and not onlyunderstanding what works now,
(23:22):
but really having your ear tothe ground about what's going to
work next, right, what'schanging the landscape, what's
what's upcoming and and whenthings that could potentially
disrupt, you know like, I meanthe whole notion of AI coming
through and in such a big manner.
Really really important tounderstand how we're going to
(23:43):
embrace that and utilize it toour best abilities, but also to
remember that it isn't going totake everything over.
It is not going to replaceeverything, and it's even more
important to focus on the thingsthat it's not going to replace,
to make sure that we're reallyreally doing our best to show up
(24:06):
in those areas right.
So that's good.
Dr. William Attaway (24:09):
Yeah, I think that's an important point.
You know people.
People look at the uncertaintyahead.
They look at a time of change,like we're in with AI, and fear
seems to be rising.
You know what's this going todo to my job, my company, my
team.
What's this going to do to thejobs.
You know the people who workfor me and I think that's well
(24:33):
said.
You know there is the humanelement that will never be
replaced.
No-transcript.
Don Traxler (25:05):
Yeah, it's probably been mentioned many times on
your show and I know that youalso share the same feelings
surrounding this book, but it'sgetting things done so good,
david Allen.
Honestly, it's beentransformational in how I spend
my days and how I'm able toreally prioritize what is what
(25:25):
is super important, withoutlosing focus on, you know,
things that that may not need myattention right now but are
still very valuable you know to.
To focus on that.
That is absolutely been, uh, areally, really big one.
Um, the other plug that I wouldmake, which is uh, I haven't I
(25:47):
haven't heard too much about itlately, but um, four hour work
week by Tim Ferriss is, uh, yes,man, that one.
I don't think that book willever really um fall out of my
memory.
Um, one, I don't think thatbook will ever really fall out
of my memory.
It has certainly beentremendously impactful on how
I've grown business, how I'velooked to really make my time
(26:10):
most efficient, but I think italso obviously ties into getting
things done as well.
Right, it's all about usingyour time effectively.
That's so good.
Dr. William Attaway (26:23):
And for the listeners who didn't hear it,
we actually had David on theshow.
You can go back to season twoand listen to that episode with
David Allen, where he shared alittle bit about his system.
It's one that I've used foralmost 20 years now and it is
the best productivity systemthat I have found.
One more question, don.
This is one we ask everybody.
It's easy to look at you andthink, oh wow, man, don's just
(26:49):
got it going on.
His business is just up and tothe right.
He's never struggled like Istruggle.
He's never had challenges likeI have.
And it may be that some of thelisteners are thinking that If I
could snap my fingers and solveone problem in your business
right now, what would you wantthat problem to be?
Don Traxler (27:10):
Honestly, I think one of the most difficult things
to manage in a business,especially with scaling and
growth, is, um, the humanelement, right Um, especially
when things grow to a pointwhere you no longer, as a leader
(27:31):
, have the ability to be intouch with every, every person
on your team.
Um, and that certainly has been, uh, a point of, you know,
crack showing in our, in ourbusiness, many times.
Um, so, truly, I think, ifthere was a magic wand that
could help, would be helping tomake the human element a bit
(27:57):
more consistent, I suppose, inscaling, because that is a
problem that I know we face, andI know many other people in our
network face as well, and wesee it on the client side too.
You know, though, franchiseswill regularly have their like
(28:20):
their, uh, their office managersleave things like that Right Um
, where everything looks good onpaper.
Until that, you know, thathuman element ends up breaking
or or going away.
So that would be, if you can doit, william, help me out there.
Dr. William Attaway (28:37):
I mean I'll snap my fingers.
I can't guarantee anything'sgoing to happen.
No, I think that's very realand I appreciate that.
I think it's a good reminderthat, no matter where we are in
our business journey asentrepreneurs, everybody's
struggling.
Everybody's struggling withsomething.
Everybody's struggling withchallenges and problems.
They may look different orsound different, but nobody gets
(29:01):
off without having those.
Don, this has been such a greatconversation and I'm so
grateful for you, for your timeand the insights that you've
shared so generously today.
I know folks are going to wantto stay connected to you and
continue to learn more about youand from you and more about
what you're doing at RevSpark.
What's the best way for folksto do that?
Don Traxler (29:24):
Yeah, can absolutely go to our website,
revsparkmediacom.
I'm sure you'll include that inthe show notes.
Connect with me on LinkedIn.
I'm pretty active on there andI'm always, always open to
growing my connections there,and I do want to put it out
there that I am always open toanswering questions or being of
(29:47):
help and service, right, soplease don't hesitate to reach
out to me and I'd be more thanhappy to help if I can and if
anyone's in the franchise worldthat's listening.
You can find the book on Amazonas well.
Perhaps we can link that up inthe show notes as well.
Dr. William Attaway (30:06):
Absolutely.
We'll have all that linked inthe show notes, Don.
Thank you so appreciate yourtime today, man.
Don Traxler (30:12):
Thank you as well, William.
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