December 4, 2023 • 36 mins
Ever wondered how authentic conversations can transform the way you prospect? Join us on a journey with Adam Packard, the charismatic CEO of Ninja Prospecting. Adam’s compelling story of entrepreneurship, shaped by the influence of his father and his own personal experiences, will leave you inspired. He offers a fresh approach to prospecting, emphasizing that genuine conversations and a spam-free strategy are the keys to success. Regardless of your industry, you’ll learn to lead by example and apply these powerful prospecting principles.
Don't you just love when a business exceeds your expectations? Adam believes that the secret to Ninja Prospecting's success lies in underpromising and overdelivering. And it doesn't stop there. He also reveals how his background as a PGA Class A golf pro has shaped his unique leadership style. As we navigate the intricate maze of LinkedIn, listen in for Adam's words of wisdom on staying ahead of the game.
Join us as we explore the tumultuous emotional landscape of entrepreneurship. Filled with highs and lows, this thrilling ride requires a balanced mindset. Adam shares his proven strategies for managing emotions, with a focus on controlling what is directly in your hands and letting go of the rest. Remember, it's okay to disconnect and take a breather; in fact, it's necessary! Get ready to hear Adam's advice to his past self and how he turned the business from a sole responsibility into a shared experience.
Join Dr. William Attaway on the Catalytic Leadership podcast as he shares transformative insights to help high-performance entrepreneurs and agency owners achieve Clear-Minded Focus, Calm Control, and Confidence.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Welcome to Catalytic Leadership, the podcast designed
to help leaders intentionallygrow and thrive.
Here is your host author andleadership and executive coach,
dr William Attaway.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Hey, it's William and welcome to today's episode of
the Catalytic Leadership Podcast.
Each week, we tackle a topicrelated to the field of
leadership.
My goal is to ensure that youhave actionable steps you can
take from each episode to growin your own leadership.
Growth doesn't just happen.
My goal is to help you becomeintentional about it.
(00:37):
Each week, we spotlight leadersfrom a variety of fields,
organizations and locations.
My goal is for you to see thatleaders can be catalytic, no
matter where they are or whatthey lead.
I draw inspiration from thestories and journeys of these
leaders and I hear from many ofyou that you do too.
(00:57):
Let's jump in to today'sinterview.
I'm so excited today to haveAdam Packard on the podcast.
Adam is the CEO of NinjaProspecting, where they build
themselves as the opposite ofevery LinkedIn marketing company
Good, old-fashioned hard work,100% done for you.
In a world of spam and massmessaging.
(01:19):
They take you step-by-step tocreating and executing the ideal
strategy to fill your pipelinewith ideal prospects.
Adam, I'm so glad you're here.
I'm looking forward to thisconversation.
Thanks for being here.
Yeah, thanks for having meAppreciate it.
I would love for you to sharesome of your story with our
listeners, adam, particularlyaround your journey and your
(01:39):
development as a leader.
How did you get started?
Speaker 3 (01:44):
Oh, man Goes back a long ways.
I would say it probably startedwith my dad was an entrepreneur
growing up.
He started a copier business,grew it to 100 employees and
really showed me being abusiness owner is probably the
direction I need to go.
He was also a Dale Carnegieinstructor One thing that he
(02:09):
didn't force my brother and I,but he highly encouraged us to
go through that course.
I did that when I was probably20.
That got me into the wholepersonal development field.
My brother started working for amotivational speaker.
Again, I had the chance to hangwith a lot of the greats Jim
(02:31):
Rones and Tony Robbins and BrianTracy.
That's where my wholeleadership and learning from
some of these greats started andstarted the business with my
dad and my brother and didpretty well together.
We had to lead a team.
I really think leadership isleading by example.
I'm showing people the path.
(02:53):
Don't ask someone to dosomething that you're not doing
yourself.
In fact, I remember aninteresting story back when we
were in our company that webuilt together.
We had a group of about 30 ofour team members with us and we
brought in a motivationalspeaker.
I looked at him and I said, man, I wish more of our leaders
were here.
He looked at me and said yourleaders are here.
Speaker 1 (03:16):
I was like that's good.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
I was like, oh, that just stung, that was really good
.
Then I got out of the businessthat we were in and started a
corporate position and realizedthat really wasn't for me.
I got laid off probably six,seven years ago and that's where
I started to figure out what'snext for me.
(03:40):
I had a friend that needed somehelp generating some
opportunities for his newbusiness.
I found myself on LinkedIntrying to help them do that.
We got pretty good at it.
Hence Ninja prospecting was born, where we thought we were going
to be different in this space,but come to find out there are
thousands of people that dosomething similar in this regard
(04:00):
, but we pride ourselves inbeing different and having a
different approach and doingeverything manually and making
it feel more custom andone-on-one.
It's been an interestingjourney, for sure.
You look back over all thedifferent things that you do in
your past and you're like thishelped me do this and this
position helped me get here.
It's all stuffing.
You don't realize it untilyou're past that moment, but
(04:21):
when you look back at thetrajectory of the career, it's
definitely been building blocksfor what we've created here.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
There's no such thing as a wasted experience.
Is there yeah?
Speaker 3 (04:33):
no, 100%.
Yeah, always learn.
So you can either use it as alearning experience or you can
look at it as something that'sgoing to deter you.
So, yeah, even the you know Goddoesn't give you challenges to
you know, just crouch down.
You've got to rise above andsee how you level up.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
That's so true, so true.
Yeah, you know it's interesting.
You say there are thousands ofpeople in the space, in the
prospecting space on LinkedIn.
I think that's true because Ibelieve they are all in my inbox
.
At least that's how it feelsLike every week.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
They're in my inbox too, which is even funnier if
they would actually look at myprofile and realize they were
kind of competition, but notreally, because your approach is
really just garbage.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
So yeah, so what makes Ninja prospecting
different?
Like, what's the differentiatorfor you guys?
Speaker 3 (05:25):
You know it's a great question and people ask me that
all the time.
The hardest part is cuttingthrough the noise on LinkedIn
and sending someone a message toget their attention.
Yeah, I think that's the bigthing is, if you look at what
most companies do when it comesto prospecting and starting
conversations from coldstrangers, you have to just look
at it almost like you're, youknow, networking in a room full
(05:46):
of people striking up aconversation.
How would you naturally start aconversation with someone?
So we pride ourselves in beinganti-link, anti-spam.
The only goal that we have forwhat we do is to create new
conversations, create engagement, create curiosity, be
permission-based, ask the rightquestion and just have fun with
(06:10):
it.
I mean, if you look at themessaging that we do to strike
up conversations, I get a lot ofreplies back saying, hey, that
was a great message, it was areally unique approach and I
love your ideas here.
I don't need any help in thisspace, but I'll hang on to your
info.
To me, that's a win and we geta lot of that for our clients
too.
So really just trying tohumanize the approach.
Like I said, there's too muchspam, there's too many bots,
(06:33):
there's too many automationtools out there where you just
get plugged into a system and atemplate and just a mass message
.
So we take a different approachwhere we try to customize
everything based on who you'retrying to reach and what's
unique about your offer and whatmakes you different, and try to
make something that is almostan extension of your brand,
(06:54):
versus us coming in and justbeing a service provider.
So we come in more as a growthpartner where we make money when
you do.
That's our plan.
That's how I think it should be.
If we're good at what we do, weput our money where our mouth
is and say, hey, we can help youdo this if you need more
conversations and moreopportunities, but you have to
convert them on the other end,and that's how we both make
(07:15):
money.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
That is unique because so many of the
prospecting companies they wantmoney upfront.
They want, hey, you've got togive us this amount of money to
get started and then we're notgoing to be responsible for your
results.
Speaker 3 (07:29):
Yeah.
Well, there's a couple thingsto that.
So I do believe that bothparties have to have some skin
in the game, Otherwise,otherwise, we could be taken
advantage of and people are justusing us for generating
opportunities and notcompensating us at all.
So I think there has to be somekind of a partnership where you
have some skin in the game.
I have some skin in the game,but it is based on results and
(07:52):
if, for some reason, we don'tgenerate those results, then
we're not waiting three monthsand then pinging you and saying,
hey, you're up for renewal andyou're like well, you didn't
talk to me in three months andwe didn't get any results.
So we say, on top of it, wehave regular communication.
So any marketing is testing andtweaking.
I mean, you know that going in.
It's not like you're going torun a Facebook ad and six months
later check the stats.
(08:12):
You're probably checking itdaily to see if it's getting the
results and you're makingslight tweaks and adjustments.
The same thing with LinkedIn.
You have to adjust itconstantly just to kind of make
sure it's fine tuned and reallyfeels and flows the right way.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
So when you're, when you're talking about social
media I mean there's so manydifferent places why zero in on
LinkedIn?
Speaker 3 (08:33):
Honestly.
We started there because whenmy friend asked me for help, I
did some research as to who hisaudience was and the only place
I could find them easily was onLinkedIn.
I think it's a moreprofessional platform.
Although there is a lot of spamand garbage, the average net
worth and income of each user onLinkedIn is higher than any
other platform.
Just the search parameters whenyou use Sales Navigator, I can
(08:57):
find exactly who I'm looking for.
If I want to connect with theCEO of a Fortune 500 company
that also went to Penn State, Ican do that and make a
connection, whereas I can't findthem on Facebook.
I load Facebook Messenger.
I just get so much spam andgarbage there that it just feels
like a pitch fest, whereas Iuse LinkedIn more as a speed
(09:18):
networking.
Build relationships.
Yes, there might be someopportunities for us now, but
also keep the door open forpotential opportunities in the
future.
That's what you should do onLinkedIn is approach people the
right way.
You don't burn throughrelationship capital because you
approach them poorly and askthem to marry you on the first
date.
That's something we talkedabout that before.
It's like don't connect inpitch, don't connect and send me
(09:41):
your link to a calendar for adiscovery session.
Ask me a question Most of thesecompanies that reach out that
say I can fill your calendarwith 10 or 20 appointments a
week.
They don't even know what yourbusiness is.
That's shocking to me.
But again, they hope they throwenough messages out there that
something sticks and theygenerate some business.
(10:03):
But our approach is a little bitdifferent.
I like to have conversationswith people.
First find out who you are,what you're doing, who you're
trying to help seeing if we canhelp you get more of those
people in your pipeline.
Sometimes I can, sometimes Ican't.
I've turned away half the peoplethat I talked to, probably just
to say, hey, what you have isnot quite dialed in enough to
(10:25):
make it work for what we do.
Going to send them back to thedrawing board.
I send them all of ouronboarding stuff, even just to
say, hey, here is what you needto really dial this in if you
want to market yourself better.
The approaches are different.
If I'm talking to someone thatis targeting C-suite executives
and business owners, it's atotally different approach than
(10:46):
targeting a middle manager at acompany that's such an important
piece that most people justgloss over but who you're
reaching out to.
Well, I'm going to tell you ifyou're reaching out to founders
of startups, they're probablygetting 50 messages a day from
people pitching them services,left and right.
You better have somethingthat's unique, special,
different, whether it's in youroffer or in your approach to
(11:08):
them, to get them interested, tospark that conversation.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
You said something there that's interesting and
sure listeners caught on this.
You turned down half the peoplewho want to work with you.
Speaker 3 (11:22):
Yeah, in the beginning, when I started this,
it was anybody that had a creditcard and a LinkedIn account.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
You do what you can in the beginning.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
And I was signing up people for a year-long agreement
, and I'm looking back at that.
You talk about stepping stonesand learning from things,
realizing nobody that meets mecold off of a LinkedIn message
is going to want to sign up fora year out of the gate.
So we moved to smaller programsand now even just do month to
month.
But yeah, you definitelylearned as you go and realized
(11:54):
that there are some things thatwe probably could have done
better.
But yeah, I look for threethings when it comes to people
that I can help.
Number one is your audience onLinkedIn and is it dialed in
where it's more than justbusiness owners or salespeople.
They say the riches are in theniches.
I do believe that.
I think, in order to make acold message relevant, you have
(12:15):
to be specific to the audience.
So that's the key.
First thing is they have tohave a unique audience that
they're trying to reach.
Second thing is what's unique,special, different about you?
I mean, we work with a lot ofpeople in the coaching space and
, sadly, I talk to a lot ofcoaches and their offer is I
help business owners withleadership development and great
(12:38):
, but I'm going to throw up inmy mouth a little bit because
that's not good enough.
I can't market that it's goingto be white noise on LinkedIn.
So, almost looking at whetherit's your background or who you
serve or something in your offeror your approach or your
strategy or your tactics, whatis it that you do that's
different, special, unique, andwhat type of result can you help
(12:59):
people get From there?
I can work backwards and kind offigure out the best way to
approach it, and that's thesecond part.
And the third part is you haveto be able to convert people.
Sadly, there's a lot of peoplethat think that leads are their
problem, when, in fact, I fillthem with leads and they realize
I don't have a system to managethis.
I don't know how often tofollow up.
I don't know what to say when Ifollow up.
I don't know how to convert ona sales call.
(13:21):
So that's the hardest part ofour business is we're really
good at getting the conversationstarted and handing it off.
Sadly, there are a lot ofpeople on the other end that
don't have the system, structure, tools in place to be able to
manage the pipeline and knowwhat to do with it in order to
make the cash register ring.
Speaker 2 (13:40):
That's really good and I love that you've dialed in
your expectations, because Ithink so often that's a big hole
in a lot of businessrelationships.
Frustration comes from missedexpectations, right Well, if the
expectations aren't clearlydelineated from the get go, you
increase the likelihood offrustration and disappointment
(14:02):
by a factor of 10.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
Yeah, that's a great point and I talked to.
This is something I bring up on.
Every call is usuallyexpectations of clients are here
, service providers are here andno one's ever going to be happy
.
Clients are expecting oh, I'mgoing to bring in five 10
clients a month from this.
I am not your golden ticketholy grail.
We are one source of helpingyou generate new conversations.
(14:26):
If you're out there building abusiness, you need to have 10,
15 ways that you generateconversations.
Linkedin should definitely beone of them.
But, yeah, the expectations is abig one for us.
We're more in the under promise, over deliver, so we give a
guarantee of a certain number ofleads over a certain timeframe,
but it's really low ballingbecause I know what our average
clients bring in.
(14:46):
But I'd rather be the guy thatunder promises and over delivers
versus the guy that comes inand says, oh, I can fill your
calendar.
No, our average clients bringin one to two clients a month.
That's it.
That's not huge numbers, but ifyou're not bringing in any
right now on LinkedIn, that'skind of what we do.
Our best clients bring in fourto seven, and I do have clients
that don't bring in any, andthat's the challenge that I have
(15:10):
is I can't help them with thefollow up in the conversion part
.
They come to me saying I needmore opportunities.
I give them the opportunitiesand they can't take them and run
with them.
But yeah, expectations, keepingthose aligned and in check so
that we're both on the same pageis really important, but then
also the way that we structureit, it's more, like I said, more
(15:31):
of a growth partner.
So I'm trying to move away fromthat charge $1,000 a month and
be a service provider and bemore of a.
I'm going to help you as muchas I can to convert the ones
that I give you, because then weboth make money.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
Yeah, no, I think that's brilliant.
You know, when I was readingabout your background, I ran
across something that reallyintrigued me you are a PGA Class
, a golf group.
Speaker 1 (15:59):
That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
Yeah, that's not something that I expected to
find.
I mean, look at Penn State,looking at all these things that
you have done sales and whatnotYou're a golf pro.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
I am a golf pro.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
Yeah, I'm curious has there been things that you've
learned in that part of yourlife previously that have
carried over and have helped youas a business owner and as a
leader of teams now?
Speaker 3 (16:25):
That's a good question.
I mean, you look at, I alwaystell people I got into golf just
because I had no idea what Iwas going to do out of college
and I was good at golf.
So I got into golf as aprofession and I tell people it
was a fun experience when I wasin my early 20s.
I get to work at some greatgolf courses and meet some
awesome people.
But I always tell people youwork long hours, you don't make
(16:47):
any money and you don't get toplay any golf, so I kind of get
away from the golf industry.
I think you know, if I look athow golf applies to business and
leadership, I think you look atmore of golf when you're out
there, you know playing it byyourself.
You're the only one that cancall a penalty on yourself or
you're keeping your own score.
(17:08):
So there's little nuances inthe game of how you react to a
bad shot or a good shot, how youreact to your competitor
hitting a good shot or a badshot.
I think there's a lot of thingsthat you can learn from people
watching them on the golf course.
Are they throwing clubs, arethey swearing, are they yelling,
are they frustrated or are theykind of cool and common,
(17:29):
collected, and that's more of mystyle.
I think that kind of comesthrough in my leadership style
and then even on theconversations I have with people
is I'm not forcing it, I don'tget too high or too low
emotionally, I keep pretty evenkeel and I think that translates
well in business.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
Again, no wasted experience, right?
Everything that happens in yourlife you can learn from and
benefits you, or it's somethingyou can use to teach and benefit
other people.
I love that.
I'm curious how do you stay ontop of your game?
Like you know, you've got toconstantly be learning and
growing.
Like you know, your businessNinja Prospecting is going to
(18:08):
need you to lead at a higherlevel 12 months, 24 months you
know, five years from now thanyou are today.
It's going to need you to be abetter leader.
It's going to need you to be abetter entrepreneur.
How do you level up?
Speaker 3 (18:25):
I believe in having you know people that have gone
before me and know things that Idon't know and learning from
them.
So I have multiple coachesmyself that help me in certain
areas operations, mindset butyeah, you're right, I'm always
learning and growing.
I'm a personal developmentjunkie.
I've read every book you canimagine.
Applying it's another thing,but I've read all the books.
(18:47):
But that's good.
In this space, you have toconstantly evolve.
I think you know what workedfive years ago on LinkedIn
doesn't work today, and so ifyou're not staying on top of
things and realizing that shiftsneed to be made I mean five
years ago you could spam 100,150 connections a day, not be
very good at it and still getresults.
When LinkedIn put thelimitations on what we can do,
(19:10):
we've got to be a lot moreefficient and effective.
So I think you know constantlyevolving and seeing what's next.
Now we're coming out with awhole new platform and software
that we're building that will bekind of everything that you
need on LinkedIn, created foryou, which is going to be really
cool.
But yeah, I think you know whatI do personally.
(19:32):
I'm a morning person, so youknow 415, I'm up in the morning,
I get a couple hours of work in, where you know I'll do my
reading and I'll do somevisualizing, meditating,
journaling, kind of setting thetone for the day and kind of
just starting my day out theright way.
I found that when I sleep in andI'm, you know, kind of rushing
around in the morning, the daynever really goes that well.
(19:54):
So kind of giving myself alittle bit of space and time
just to sit back and reflect andthink I think that's one piece
that's missing for a lot ofentrepreneurs and leaders is
just taking that time to just be, still be in silence, you know,
silent your mind, turn off yourdevices and don't check your
email, you know, every threeseconds.
(20:15):
But it's a challenge.
I mean, you know there's a lotof demands coming from every
direction, whether it's clientsor my team, so I've got to
manage that and still have timefor myself.
But that's why I like to get upa couple hours early and make
sure I have time before thatlittle guy and mom wake up, so I
can kind of focus on me for alittle bit.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
That sounds incredibly healthy.
I love the balance that youhave there.
I love the rhythm that you havethere.
I think I love most theintentionality of what you built
.
That didn't just happen, yeahit's.
Speaker 3 (20:49):
It's taken a lot of work, a lot of trial and error,
a lot of you know getting a lotof nose.
You have to have thick skin inthis business.
I'll tell you, I get.
I get some nasty responses andI get some responses that make
my day, and it's it's.
You have to look at it and sayyou know, at the end of the day
I'm trying to make a meaningfulconnection with another human to
see if I can add value and be aresource.
(21:11):
That's it.
If I can help, great.
If not, you know, hopefully Ileft a better taste in your
mouth of what a lead gen guycould be or what a marketing guy
could be.
So that's our approach.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
You know it's easy for somebody to look at you and
so many other successfulentrepreneurs and say, oh wow,
you know his journey has justbeen up into the right.
I mean it's just there's beennothing but nothing but green,
blue skies and green pasturesfor this guy.
Speaker 3 (21:39):
He's not dealing with the same challenges that I deal
with.
He's not dealing with.
Speaker 2 (21:43):
You know difficult team members and difficult
clients and etc.
Etc.
Because you know we look at welook at the highlight reel,
right?
We look at what's online andit's so easy to think that my
guess is that you have had somechallenges as an entrepreneur.
Speaker 1 (22:03):
It's part of it.
Speaker 3 (22:05):
It's an everyday.
There's always challenges.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
What are some of the things that you have struggled
through as you have built intothis life?
Speaker 3 (22:14):
Oh man, that's a great question.
I think, looking back, thereare stretches where it's easy to
be in a good mood when thingsare going well.
It's not so easy to be in agood mood when things are
struggling or you have a bigpipeline of people that say
they're coming on board and theydon't.
(22:35):
How do you manage thoseemotions where you don't come
off as desperate?
I think managing my emotions isthe hardest part of this
business because it relies a loton me just staying with it and
focusing more on the activityWhenever I get in these funks.
If you look at the successcurve, I mean it's not a
(22:57):
straight line, it's up and down.
The key is how do you manageyour emotions when you're up?
How do you manage them whenyou're down?
It's easy to be in a good moodwhen things are up.
It's hard to be in a good moodwhen things are down.
But if you can keep an evenkeel and then just focus on the
things that you can control.
If I look at my calendar, whatcan I do to stay positive?
(23:18):
Well, I can add more value tomy clients.
I can reach out and offersupport.
I can have more conversations.
I can focus on the activitiesthat move the needle and maybe
detach a little bit from theresults and people coming on
board.
Because there are thosestretches and those waves where
you're like, gosh, everythingwas going great.
Now, all of a sudden, what'sgoing on?
(23:40):
Do I need to change something?
Is something wrong?
Whereas nothing's wrong.
You just need to focus on hey,just keep doing the right work.
You're doing good work, you'reattracting the right people.
Keep focus on your vision andyour belief and maybe focus a
little bit more on other peopleand worry less about yourself
and get out of your own way alittle bit.
That's what I do.
(24:01):
When I get in those funks theycome.
There are stretches where I'llhave a few weeks and I'll just
be completely frustrated.
But the following week, all ofa sudden, I bring on three, four
new clients and I'm like, oh,this is the greatest business in
the world.
Right, it's a management ofemotions, being in this role and
(24:21):
helping to move the businessforward.
But that's a great question.
Speaker 2 (24:25):
I love that.
I think that's something that awhole lot of people struggle
with emotional regulation andlearning how to manage those
peaks and valleys.
That's not easy, no.
Speaker 3 (24:39):
It's likely the mindset coach helps me quite a
bit Kind of telling, creating myown story, creating my own
vision, focusing on that.
Even this morning I was makingsome notes and I'm like I need
to.
I do my thing in the morning,but I think there are stretches
in the middle of the day or eventowards the end of the day
where I need to take a break,sit down 15 minutes, close my
(25:01):
eyes not take an app but justinternalize focus, regain my
composure and then get back toit.
I think there needs to be moreof that.
Take some time for yourself,like yesterday I worked for four
or five hours straight anddecided to just get up and go
for a walk and just get outsideand get some sunshine.
I think we need more of that asan entrepreneur to take time
(25:24):
for yourself and, whether it'staking your wife on a date or
taking your son to lunch,anything that takes you out of
it for a little bit, toreprioritize and realize why
you're doing it.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
I love the walk.
I think that's so useful.
I do the same thing when I getstuck on a problem.
I'm trying to create something,write something, and I just get
stuck and I can't seem to getbreak through it.
I'll do the same thing I'll gofor a walk.
I had a friend of mine, markBatterson, tell me this years
ago.
He said sometimes what you needis a change of place and a
(25:57):
change of pace.
When you have a change of placeand a change of pace, it can
bring you a change inperspective.
I go for that 15, 20 minutewalk and I come back and it's so
funny how often there's theanswer.
It's right there.
It was not there when I leftbecause I was stuck.
I needed a change of place anda change of pace.
Speaker 3 (26:19):
We went camping a few weeks ago and it was on a
Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Mondayis obviously my craziest day.
We get up there and of coursethere's a cell phone tower right
next to the campground.
We're up in the middle of themountains in Arizona, 7,000 feet
.
We drive in and I have zeroservice.
It says SOS on my phone.
We are unintentionallydisconnecting here for a few
(26:42):
days.
It gave me a chance to notfocus on all the messages coming
through and all the stuff onsocial media.
I just think and this is wherewe decided to go more of the
growth partner route to focus onmore of a win-win scenario.
I think anytime you can unplugcompletely, unplug, the world's
(27:06):
not going to come to an end.
The fires will be there whenyou get back.
You can put them out then.
But you need that time foryourself to just completely
detach from everything.
You unlock some creativity.
When we were kids growing up,we didn't have phones, we didn't
have all the gadgets and stuffmy parents would say go outside
(27:26):
and play.
We don't do that really withkids these days, but I think
being outside, beingdisconnected, just allows your
creativity to come through alittle bit more, and that's
definitely the case.
Speaker 2 (27:40):
If you were to go back six or seven years when you
started Ninja, and you could goback and tell yourself one
thing based on what you know now, what would you tell?
Speaker 3 (27:50):
yourself Buy Bitcoin would be one.
Oh, that's great.
I would say find more teammembers faster that can help you
fulfill and take some of thework off of your plate.
(28:11):
That's probably been thebiggest challenge is trying to
do it all myself, not leveragingother people, treating it more
as a business than as a job.
Look at myself more as ashareholder versus the guy that
has to do everything.
I have found some great teammembers, so I'm not doing
(28:33):
everything myself.
I still am pretty involved inthe business from a creative
aspect because I enjoy it.
I would have come into it moreas a how do I build this where I
can take myself out of it atsome point if I want to, if I
want to have that option andfind more team members faster.
That's smart.
(28:54):
I like that.
I think sometimes we have justthe big ego that, oh, no one can
do it as good as I can.
I need to be doing all theselittle things.
I'm like you know what, if Ican find someone that can do an
80% as good as what I think isgood, then it would freeze up a
couple hours in my day, but Ishould do that all day long.
So that would be what I wouldprobably go back and start over.
(29:18):
I would probably prioritizethat.
Speaker 2 (29:21):
I love that.
I have a sticky note on theleft monitor here at my desk and
I see it every day and there'sa question on it.
Is this the absolute best useof my time right now?
Speaker 3 (29:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
And so often I find myself looking at that and
thinking, no, somebody else cando this.
And I use the same 80% rule.
If somebody else can do this80% as good as I can, then I'd
have to let them do it andempower them.
Speaker 3 (29:45):
Yeah, yeah, hard to do in the beginning.
I do think it's important,though, in the beginning, to,
until you can offload that ontosomeone else, you have to know
how to do it yourself.
Yeah, because otherwise how canyou teach someone else to do it
?
So I think it was important tounderstand every aspect of what
we do and how to do it andpractice what we preach and the
business.
It's important to do ityourself first, but, yeah,
(30:07):
bringing on those right teammembers, it's a breath of fresh
air when I wake up and I know,okay, this is being handled,
that's being handled, I canfocus more on clients, I can
focus more on the creative stuffand don't have to worry so much
on the other details.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
Doing what only you can do.
Right, that's good.
You referenced earlier that youread a lot and that you've read
many, many, many books.
Is there one that stands outthat you would recommend to the
leaders who are listening?
Speaker 3 (30:37):
Yeah, there are many.
It depends on what area.
I know we talked about thisbefore.
There's so many different.
Are you talking mindset?
Are we talking business?
Right now, I'll tell you.
I go back to a few books that Itry to reread every year or two.
One of my favorite authors isJoseph Murphy A Power of your
Subconscious Mind.
I think that's a powerful bookeven though it was written so
(30:59):
long ago, and the examples arefunny with the numbers.
But I think the mindset part issuch an important piece that
people gloss over and they focusmore on the day-to-day or the
business or the operations.
I think you can get the mindsetpiece, which is a constant
challenge.
You're always learning, you'realways growing Anything.
Joseph Murphy, wayne Dyer I'm abig Wayne Dyer fan.
(31:21):
I actually get to meet him acouple times.
The Power of Intention isanother great one by Wayne Dyer.
Of course, everybody's going tosave the classics thinking,
grow Rich and how to win friendsand influence people, and seven
habits, and all those which areall great For me.
I think my favorite books arealways the ones that are more of
(31:43):
the mindset ones, the beliefones that help you expand the
magic of thinking big.
I'm a big Ogbandino fan too.
I read all of his, but I lovehis stories.
I mean God, just the way thathe can weave a message into a
story and keep you engaged andtell a powerful lesson.
Those are some of my favorites.
Speaker 2 (32:03):
I love that too.
Ogbandino is one of myfavorites.
Speaker 3 (32:07):
Yeah, the choice is my favorite one and he's on the
purple one, oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:11):
Absolutely that classic and awesome.
Yeah, yeah, typically, peopleare going to walk away from an
episode like this out of withone big idea.
If you could define what thatone big idea was going to be,
what would you want people towalk away with?
Speaker 3 (32:27):
I mean our specialty and I think my gift is turning
cold strangers into warm friends.
I think if you looked atnetworking and call it Legion,
call it outbound coldconversations starting.
If you looked at it as just away to spark a conversation and
(32:49):
meet someone new and add valueto them, not only could you have
an opportunity with them, butit also opens the door to a
conversation with anybody intheir network and keeps that
pipeline full.
I think too many peopleapproach prospecting from an
angle of I just need to bedirect and sell my product,
(33:10):
whereas if you took a differentapproach almost like joining a
networking group you don't joina networking group to sell the
other members in the group.
You join a networking group toget to know the other members in
the group.
Perhaps there's a chance thatthey could use your service, but
you want to be introduced totheir network.
So I think if you use LinkedInor any social tool as a way to
build and nurture relationships,you open yourself up to
(33:32):
building a much bigger pipelineover time.
The challenge is we live in aninstant gratification society
where I need it now and I needit done yesterday, when in fact
the best approach might actuallybe to slow down in order to
speed up.
So that would be my advice islook at it as a way to build and
nurture relationships, have funwith it, get creative.
(33:55):
Don't attach to what someonesays to one of your messages
that you send to someone, and beconsistent.
That's I mean talk about.
One of the key factors of oursuccess has been we are
consistently doing it everysingle day.
There's no break.
So finding a partner that canhelp you do that.
Speaker 2 (34:18):
I know folks are going to want to stay connected
to you and continue to learnfrom you and potentially explore
what Ninja could do for them.
What's the best way for peopleto find out more information
about that?
Speaker 3 (34:28):
I'm on LinkedIn 24 seven, so you can always find me
there.
Ninja prospectingcom is ourwebsite.
I don't have an emailnewsletter yet.
It's coming soon.
So if someone wanted to keep intouch that way but honestly
connect with me on LinkedIn,shoot me a message there or come
check out what we do on ourwebsite and if you'd like to
have a conversation and explore,there's no hard sell on our end
(34:50):
.
I like to meet people and seewhat we can do to add value and,
like I said, get intoconversation and see how we
might be able to help.
So yeah, linkedin is probablythe best spot to find me or our
website.
Speaker 2 (35:01):
Adam, this has been so helpful, so practical and so
much insights you've droppedhere.
Thank you so much for yourgenerosity today.
Speaker 3 (35:08):
Thank you for the opportunity.
I always, always enjoy sharingand meeting new people.
So, yeah, I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (35:13):
Thanks for joining me for this episode today.
As we wrap up, I'd love for youto do two things.
First, subscribe to thispodcast so you don't miss an
episode, and if you find valuehere, I'd love it if you would
rate it and review it.
That really does make adifference in helping other
people to discover this podcast.
Second, if you don't have acopy of my newest book,
(35:35):
catalytic Leadership, I'd loveto put a copy in your hands.
If you go tocatalyticleadershipbookcom, you
can get a copy for free.
Just pay the shipping so I canget it to you and we'll get one
right out.
My goal is to put this into thehands of as many leaders as
possible.
This book captures principlesthat I've learned in 20 plus
(35:57):
years of coaching leaders in theentrepreneurial space, in
business, government, nonprofits, education and the local church
.
You can also connect with me onLinkedIn to keep up with what
I'm currently learning andthinking about.
And if you're ready to take anext step with a coach to help
you intentionally grow andthrive as a leader, I'd be
(36:19):
honored to help you.
Just go tocatalyticleadershipnet to book a
call with me.
Stay tuned for our next episodenext week.
Until then, as always, leaderschoose to be catalytic.
Speaker 1 (36:35):
Thanks for listening to Catalytic Leadership with Dr
William Attaway.
Be sure to subscribe whereveryou listen to podcasts so you
don't miss the next episode.
Want more?
Go to catalyticleadershipnet.
Welcome to Catalytic Leadership, the podcast designed
to help leaders intentionallygrow and thrive.
Here is your host author andleadership and executive coach,
dr William Attaway.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Hey, it's William and welcome to today's episode of
the Catalytic Leadership Podcast.
Each week, we tackle a topicrelated to the field of
leadership.
My goal is to ensure that youhave actionable steps you can
take from each episode to growin your own leadership.
Growth doesn't just happen.
My goal is to help you becomeintentional about it.
(00:37):
Each week, we spotlight leadersfrom a variety of fields,
organizations and locations.
My goal is for you to see thatleaders can be catalytic, no
matter where they are or whatthey lead.
I draw inspiration from thestories and journeys of these
leaders and I hear from many ofyou that you do too.
(00:57):
Let's jump in to today'sinterview.
I'm so excited today to haveAdam Packard on the podcast.
Adam is the CEO of NinjaProspecting, where they build
themselves as the opposite ofevery LinkedIn marketing company
Good, old-fashioned hard work,100% done for you.
In a world of spam and massmessaging.
(01:19):
They take you step-by-step tocreating and executing the ideal
strategy to fill your pipelinewith ideal prospects.
Adam, I'm so glad you're here.
I'm looking forward to thisconversation.
Thanks for being here.
Yeah, thanks for having meAppreciate it.
I would love for you to sharesome of your story with our
listeners, adam, particularlyaround your journey and your
(01:39):
development as a leader.
How did you get started?
Speaker 3 (01:44):
Oh, man Goes back a long ways.
I would say it probably startedwith my dad was an entrepreneur
growing up.
He started a copier business,grew it to 100 employees and
really showed me being abusiness owner is probably the
direction I need to go.
He was also a Dale Carnegieinstructor One thing that he
(02:09):
didn't force my brother and I,but he highly encouraged us to
go through that course.
I did that when I was probably20.
That got me into the wholepersonal development field.
My brother started working for amotivational speaker.
Again, I had the chance to hangwith a lot of the greats Jim
(02:31):
Rones and Tony Robbins and BrianTracy.
That's where my wholeleadership and learning from
some of these greats started andstarted the business with my
dad and my brother and didpretty well together.
We had to lead a team.
I really think leadership isleading by example.
I'm showing people the path.
(02:53):
Don't ask someone to dosomething that you're not doing
yourself.
In fact, I remember aninteresting story back when we
were in our company that webuilt together.
We had a group of about 30 ofour team members with us and we
brought in a motivationalspeaker.
I looked at him and I said, man, I wish more of our leaders
were here.
He looked at me and said yourleaders are here.
Speaker 1 (03:16):
I was like that's good.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
I was like, oh, that just stung, that was really good
.
Then I got out of the businessthat we were in and started a
corporate position and realizedthat really wasn't for me.
I got laid off probably six,seven years ago and that's where
I started to figure out what'snext for me.
(03:40):
I had a friend that needed somehelp generating some
opportunities for his newbusiness.
I found myself on LinkedIntrying to help them do that.
We got pretty good at it.
Hence Ninja prospecting was born, where we thought we were going
to be different in this space,but come to find out there are
thousands of people that dosomething similar in this regard
(04:00):
, but we pride ourselves inbeing different and having a
different approach and doingeverything manually and making
it feel more custom andone-on-one.
It's been an interestingjourney, for sure.
You look back over all thedifferent things that you do in
your past and you're like thishelped me do this and this
position helped me get here.
It's all stuffing.
You don't realize it untilyou're past that moment, but
(04:21):
when you look back at thetrajectory of the career, it's
definitely been building blocksfor what we've created here.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
There's no such thing as a wasted experience.
Is there yeah?
Speaker 3 (04:33):
no, 100%.
Yeah, always learn.
So you can either use it as alearning experience or you can
look at it as something that'sgoing to deter you.
So, yeah, even the you know Goddoesn't give you challenges to
you know, just crouch down.
You've got to rise above andsee how you level up.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
That's so true, so true.
Yeah, you know it's interesting.
You say there are thousands ofpeople in the space, in the
prospecting space on LinkedIn.
I think that's true because Ibelieve they are all in my inbox
.
At least that's how it feelsLike every week.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
They're in my inbox too, which is even funnier if
they would actually look at myprofile and realize they were
kind of competition, but notreally, because your approach is
really just garbage.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
So yeah, so what makes Ninja prospecting
different?
Like, what's the differentiatorfor you guys?
Speaker 3 (05:25):
You know it's a great question and people ask me that
all the time.
The hardest part is cuttingthrough the noise on LinkedIn
and sending someone a message toget their attention.
Yeah, I think that's the bigthing is, if you look at what
most companies do when it comesto prospecting and starting
conversations from coldstrangers, you have to just look
at it almost like you're, youknow, networking in a room full
(05:46):
of people striking up aconversation.
How would you naturally start aconversation with someone?
So we pride ourselves in beinganti-link, anti-spam.
The only goal that we have forwhat we do is to create new
conversations, create engagement, create curiosity, be
permission-based, ask the rightquestion and just have fun with
(06:10):
it.
I mean, if you look at themessaging that we do to strike
up conversations, I get a lot ofreplies back saying, hey, that
was a great message, it was areally unique approach and I
love your ideas here.
I don't need any help in thisspace, but I'll hang on to your
info.
To me, that's a win and we geta lot of that for our clients
too.
So really just trying tohumanize the approach.
Like I said, there's too muchspam, there's too many bots,
(06:33):
there's too many automationtools out there where you just
get plugged into a system and atemplate and just a mass message
.
So we take a different approachwhere we try to customize
everything based on who you'retrying to reach and what's
unique about your offer and whatmakes you different, and try to
make something that is almostan extension of your brand,
(06:54):
versus us coming in and justbeing a service provider.
So we come in more as a growthpartner where we make money when
you do.
That's our plan.
That's how I think it should be.
If we're good at what we do, weput our money where our mouth
is and say, hey, we can help youdo this if you need more
conversations and moreopportunities, but you have to
convert them on the other end,and that's how we both make
(07:15):
money.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
That is unique because so many of the
prospecting companies they wantmoney upfront.
They want, hey, you've got togive us this amount of money to
get started and then we're notgoing to be responsible for your
results.
Speaker 3 (07:29):
Yeah.
Well, there's a couple thingsto that.
So I do believe that bothparties have to have some skin
in the game, Otherwise,otherwise, we could be taken
advantage of and people are justusing us for generating
opportunities and notcompensating us at all.
So I think there has to be somekind of a partnership where you
have some skin in the game.
I have some skin in the game,but it is based on results and
(07:52):
if, for some reason, we don'tgenerate those results, then
we're not waiting three monthsand then pinging you and saying,
hey, you're up for renewal andyou're like well, you didn't
talk to me in three months andwe didn't get any results.
So we say, on top of it, wehave regular communication.
So any marketing is testing andtweaking.
I mean, you know that going in.
It's not like you're going torun a Facebook ad and six months
later check the stats.
(08:12):
You're probably checking itdaily to see if it's getting the
results and you're makingslight tweaks and adjustments.
The same thing with LinkedIn.
You have to adjust itconstantly just to kind of make
sure it's fine tuned and reallyfeels and flows the right way.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
So when you're, when you're talking about social
media I mean there's so manydifferent places why zero in on
LinkedIn?
Speaker 3 (08:33):
Honestly.
We started there because whenmy friend asked me for help, I
did some research as to who hisaudience was and the only place
I could find them easily was onLinkedIn.
I think it's a moreprofessional platform.
Although there is a lot of spamand garbage, the average net
worth and income of each user onLinkedIn is higher than any
other platform.
Just the search parameters whenyou use Sales Navigator, I can
(08:57):
find exactly who I'm looking for.
If I want to connect with theCEO of a Fortune 500 company
that also went to Penn State, Ican do that and make a
connection, whereas I can't findthem on Facebook.
I load Facebook Messenger.
I just get so much spam andgarbage there that it just feels
like a pitch fest, whereas Iuse LinkedIn more as a speed
(09:18):
networking.
Build relationships.
Yes, there might be someopportunities for us now, but
also keep the door open forpotential opportunities in the
future.
That's what you should do onLinkedIn is approach people the
right way.
You don't burn throughrelationship capital because you
approach them poorly and askthem to marry you on the first
date.
That's something we talkedabout that before.
It's like don't connect inpitch, don't connect and send me
(09:41):
your link to a calendar for adiscovery session.
Ask me a question Most of thesecompanies that reach out that
say I can fill your calendarwith 10 or 20 appointments a
week.
They don't even know what yourbusiness is.
That's shocking to me.
But again, they hope they throwenough messages out there that
something sticks and theygenerate some business.
(10:03):
But our approach is a little bitdifferent.
I like to have conversationswith people.
First find out who you are,what you're doing, who you're
trying to help seeing if we canhelp you get more of those
people in your pipeline.
Sometimes I can, sometimes Ican't.
I've turned away half the peoplethat I talked to, probably just
to say, hey, what you have isnot quite dialed in enough to
(10:25):
make it work for what we do.
Going to send them back to thedrawing board.
I send them all of ouronboarding stuff, even just to
say, hey, here is what you needto really dial this in if you
want to market yourself better.
The approaches are different.
If I'm talking to someone thatis targeting C-suite executives
and business owners, it's atotally different approach than
(10:46):
targeting a middle manager at acompany that's such an important
piece that most people justgloss over but who you're
reaching out to.
Well, I'm going to tell you ifyou're reaching out to founders
of startups, they're probablygetting 50 messages a day from
people pitching them services,left and right.
You better have somethingthat's unique, special,
different, whether it's in youroffer or in your approach to
(11:08):
them, to get them interested, tospark that conversation.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
You said something there that's interesting and
sure listeners caught on this.
You turned down half the peoplewho want to work with you.
Speaker 3 (11:22):
Yeah, in the beginning, when I started this,
it was anybody that had a creditcard and a LinkedIn account.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
You do what you can in the beginning.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
And I was signing up people for a year-long agreement
, and I'm looking back at that.
You talk about stepping stonesand learning from things,
realizing nobody that meets mecold off of a LinkedIn message
is going to want to sign up fora year out of the gate.
So we moved to smaller programsand now even just do month to
month.
But yeah, you definitelylearned as you go and realized
(11:54):
that there are some things thatwe probably could have done
better.
But yeah, I look for threethings when it comes to people
that I can help.
Number one is your audience onLinkedIn and is it dialed in
where it's more than justbusiness owners or salespeople.
They say the riches are in theniches.
I do believe that.
I think, in order to make acold message relevant, you have
(12:15):
to be specific to the audience.
So that's the key.
First thing is they have tohave a unique audience that
they're trying to reach.
Second thing is what's unique,special, different about you?
I mean, we work with a lot ofpeople in the coaching space and
, sadly, I talk to a lot ofcoaches and their offer is I
help business owners withleadership development and great
(12:38):
, but I'm going to throw up inmy mouth a little bit because
that's not good enough.
I can't market that it's goingto be white noise on LinkedIn.
So, almost looking at whetherit's your background or who you
serve or something in your offeror your approach or your
strategy or your tactics, whatis it that you do that's
different, special, unique, andwhat type of result can you help
(12:59):
people get From there?
I can work backwards and kind offigure out the best way to
approach it, and that's thesecond part.
And the third part is you haveto be able to convert people.
Sadly, there's a lot of peoplethat think that leads are their
problem, when, in fact, I fillthem with leads and they realize
I don't have a system to managethis.
I don't know how often tofollow up.
I don't know what to say when Ifollow up.
I don't know how to convert ona sales call.
(13:21):
So that's the hardest part ofour business is we're really
good at getting the conversationstarted and handing it off.
Sadly, there are a lot ofpeople on the other end that
don't have the system, structure, tools in place to be able to
manage the pipeline and knowwhat to do with it in order to
make the cash register ring.
Speaker 2 (13:40):
That's really good and I love that you've dialed in
your expectations, because Ithink so often that's a big hole
in a lot of businessrelationships.
Frustration comes from missedexpectations, right Well, if the
expectations aren't clearlydelineated from the get go, you
increase the likelihood offrustration and disappointment
(14:02):
by a factor of 10.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
Yeah, that's a great point and I talked to.
This is something I bring up on.
Every call is usuallyexpectations of clients are here
, service providers are here andno one's ever going to be happy
.
Clients are expecting oh, I'mgoing to bring in five 10
clients a month from this.
I am not your golden ticketholy grail.
We are one source of helpingyou generate new conversations.
(14:26):
If you're out there building abusiness, you need to have 10,
15 ways that you generateconversations.
Linkedin should definitely beone of them.
But, yeah, the expectations is abig one for us.
We're more in the under promise, over deliver, so we give a
guarantee of a certain number ofleads over a certain timeframe,
but it's really low ballingbecause I know what our average
clients bring in.
(14:46):
But I'd rather be the guy thatunder promises and over delivers
versus the guy that comes inand says, oh, I can fill your
calendar.
No, our average clients bringin one to two clients a month.
That's it.
That's not huge numbers, but ifyou're not bringing in any
right now on LinkedIn, that'skind of what we do.
Our best clients bring in fourto seven, and I do have clients
that don't bring in any, andthat's the challenge that I have
(15:10):
is I can't help them with thefollow up in the conversion part
.
They come to me saying I needmore opportunities.
I give them the opportunitiesand they can't take them and run
with them.
But yeah, expectations, keepingthose aligned and in check so
that we're both on the same pageis really important, but then
also the way that we structureit, it's more, like I said, more
(15:31):
of a growth partner.
So I'm trying to move away fromthat charge $1,000 a month and
be a service provider and bemore of a.
I'm going to help you as muchas I can to convert the ones
that I give you, because then weboth make money.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
Yeah, no, I think that's brilliant.
You know, when I was readingabout your background, I ran
across something that reallyintrigued me you are a PGA Class
, a golf group.
Speaker 1 (15:59):
That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
Yeah, that's not something that I expected to
find.
I mean, look at Penn State,looking at all these things that
you have done sales and whatnotYou're a golf pro.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
I am a golf pro.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
Yeah, I'm curious has there been things that you've
learned in that part of yourlife previously that have
carried over and have helped youas a business owner and as a
leader of teams now?
Speaker 3 (16:25):
That's a good question.
I mean, you look at, I alwaystell people I got into golf just
because I had no idea what Iwas going to do out of college
and I was good at golf.
So I got into golf as aprofession and I tell people it
was a fun experience when I wasin my early 20s.
I get to work at some greatgolf courses and meet some
awesome people.
But I always tell people youwork long hours, you don't make
(16:47):
any money and you don't get toplay any golf, so I kind of get
away from the golf industry.
I think you know, if I look athow golf applies to business and
leadership, I think you look atmore of golf when you're out
there, you know playing it byyourself.
You're the only one that cancall a penalty on yourself or
you're keeping your own score.
(17:08):
So there's little nuances inthe game of how you react to a
bad shot or a good shot, how youreact to your competitor
hitting a good shot or a badshot.
I think there's a lot of thingsthat you can learn from people
watching them on the golf course.
Are they throwing clubs, arethey swearing, are they yelling,
are they frustrated or are theykind of cool and common,
(17:29):
collected, and that's more of mystyle.
I think that kind of comesthrough in my leadership style
and then even on theconversations I have with people
is I'm not forcing it, I don'tget too high or too low
emotionally, I keep pretty evenkeel and I think that translates
well in business.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
Again, no wasted experience, right?
Everything that happens in yourlife you can learn from and
benefits you, or it's somethingyou can use to teach and benefit
other people.
I love that.
I'm curious how do you stay ontop of your game?
Like you know, you've got toconstantly be learning and
growing.
Like you know, your businessNinja Prospecting is going to
(18:08):
need you to lead at a higherlevel 12 months, 24 months you
know, five years from now thanyou are today.
It's going to need you to be abetter leader.
It's going to need you to be abetter entrepreneur.
How do you level up?
Speaker 3 (18:25):
I believe in having you know people that have gone
before me and know things that Idon't know and learning from
them.
So I have multiple coachesmyself that help me in certain
areas operations, mindset butyeah, you're right, I'm always
learning and growing.
I'm a personal developmentjunkie.
I've read every book you canimagine.
Applying it's another thing,but I've read all the books.
(18:47):
But that's good.
In this space, you have toconstantly evolve.
I think you know what workedfive years ago on LinkedIn
doesn't work today, and so ifyou're not staying on top of
things and realizing that shiftsneed to be made I mean five
years ago you could spam 100,150 connections a day, not be
very good at it and still getresults.
When LinkedIn put thelimitations on what we can do,
(19:10):
we've got to be a lot moreefficient and effective.
So I think you know constantlyevolving and seeing what's next.
Now we're coming out with awhole new platform and software
that we're building that will bekind of everything that you
need on LinkedIn, created foryou, which is going to be really
cool.
But yeah, I think you know whatI do personally.
(19:32):
I'm a morning person, so youknow 415, I'm up in the morning,
I get a couple hours of work in, where you know I'll do my
reading and I'll do somevisualizing, meditating,
journaling, kind of setting thetone for the day and kind of
just starting my day out theright way.
I found that when I sleep in andI'm, you know, kind of rushing
around in the morning, the daynever really goes that well.
(19:54):
So kind of giving myself alittle bit of space and time
just to sit back and reflect andthink I think that's one piece
that's missing for a lot ofentrepreneurs and leaders is
just taking that time to just be, still be in silence, you know,
silent your mind, turn off yourdevices and don't check your
email, you know, every threeseconds.
(20:15):
But it's a challenge.
I mean, you know there's a lotof demands coming from every
direction, whether it's clientsor my team, so I've got to
manage that and still have timefor myself.
But that's why I like to get upa couple hours early and make
sure I have time before thatlittle guy and mom wake up, so I
can kind of focus on me for alittle bit.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
That sounds incredibly healthy.
I love the balance that youhave there.
I love the rhythm that you havethere.
I think I love most theintentionality of what you built
.
That didn't just happen, yeahit's.
Speaker 3 (20:49):
It's taken a lot of work, a lot of trial and error,
a lot of you know getting a lotof nose.
You have to have thick skin inthis business.
I'll tell you, I get.
I get some nasty responses andI get some responses that make
my day, and it's it's.
You have to look at it and sayyou know, at the end of the day
I'm trying to make a meaningfulconnection with another human to
see if I can add value and be aresource.
(21:11):
That's it.
If I can help, great.
If not, you know, hopefully Ileft a better taste in your
mouth of what a lead gen guycould be or what a marketing guy
could be.
So that's our approach.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
You know it's easy for somebody to look at you and
so many other successfulentrepreneurs and say, oh wow,
you know his journey has justbeen up into the right.
I mean it's just there's beennothing but nothing but green,
blue skies and green pasturesfor this guy.
Speaker 3 (21:39):
He's not dealing with the same challenges that I deal
with.
He's not dealing with.
Speaker 2 (21:43):
You know difficult team members and difficult
clients and etc.
Etc.
Because you know we look at welook at the highlight reel,
right?
We look at what's online andit's so easy to think that my
guess is that you have had somechallenges as an entrepreneur.
Speaker 1 (22:03):
It's part of it.
Speaker 3 (22:05):
It's an everyday.
There's always challenges.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
What are some of the things that you have struggled
through as you have built intothis life?
Speaker 3 (22:14):
Oh man, that's a great question.
I think, looking back, thereare stretches where it's easy to
be in a good mood when thingsare going well.
It's not so easy to be in agood mood when things are
struggling or you have a bigpipeline of people that say
they're coming on board and theydon't.
(22:35):
How do you manage thoseemotions where you don't come
off as desperate?
I think managing my emotions isthe hardest part of this
business because it relies a loton me just staying with it and
focusing more on the activityWhenever I get in these funks.
If you look at the successcurve, I mean it's not a
(22:57):
straight line, it's up and down.
The key is how do you manageyour emotions when you're up?
How do you manage them whenyou're down?
It's easy to be in a good moodwhen things are up.
It's hard to be in a good moodwhen things are down.
But if you can keep an evenkeel and then just focus on the
things that you can control.
If I look at my calendar, whatcan I do to stay positive?
(23:18):
Well, I can add more value tomy clients.
I can reach out and offersupport.
I can have more conversations.
I can focus on the activitiesthat move the needle and maybe
detach a little bit from theresults and people coming on
board.
Because there are thosestretches and those waves where
you're like, gosh, everythingwas going great.
Now, all of a sudden, what'sgoing on?
(23:40):
Do I need to change something?
Is something wrong?
Whereas nothing's wrong.
You just need to focus on hey,just keep doing the right work.
You're doing good work, you'reattracting the right people.
Keep focus on your vision andyour belief and maybe focus a
little bit more on other peopleand worry less about yourself
and get out of your own way alittle bit.
That's what I do.
(24:01):
When I get in those funks theycome.
There are stretches where I'llhave a few weeks and I'll just
be completely frustrated.
But the following week, all ofa sudden, I bring on three, four
new clients and I'm like, oh,this is the greatest business in
the world.
Right, it's a management ofemotions, being in this role and
(24:21):
helping to move the businessforward.
But that's a great question.
Speaker 2 (24:25):
I love that.
I think that's something that awhole lot of people struggle
with emotional regulation andlearning how to manage those
peaks and valleys.
That's not easy, no.
Speaker 3 (24:39):
It's likely the mindset coach helps me quite a
bit Kind of telling, creating myown story, creating my own
vision, focusing on that.
Even this morning I was makingsome notes and I'm like I need
to.
I do my thing in the morning,but I think there are stretches
in the middle of the day or eventowards the end of the day
where I need to take a break,sit down 15 minutes, close my
(25:01):
eyes not take an app but justinternalize focus, regain my
composure and then get back toit.
I think there needs to be moreof that.
Take some time for yourself,like yesterday I worked for four
or five hours straight anddecided to just get up and go
for a walk and just get outsideand get some sunshine.
I think we need more of that asan entrepreneur to take time
(25:24):
for yourself and, whether it'staking your wife on a date or
taking your son to lunch,anything that takes you out of
it for a little bit, toreprioritize and realize why
you're doing it.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
I love the walk.
I think that's so useful.
I do the same thing when I getstuck on a problem.
I'm trying to create something,write something, and I just get
stuck and I can't seem to getbreak through it.
I'll do the same thing I'll gofor a walk.
I had a friend of mine, markBatterson, tell me this years
ago.
He said sometimes what you needis a change of place and a
(25:57):
change of pace.
When you have a change of placeand a change of pace, it can
bring you a change inperspective.
I go for that 15, 20 minutewalk and I come back and it's so
funny how often there's theanswer.
It's right there.
It was not there when I leftbecause I was stuck.
I needed a change of place anda change of pace.
Speaker 3 (26:19):
We went camping a few weeks ago and it was on a
Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Mondayis obviously my craziest day.
We get up there and of coursethere's a cell phone tower right
next to the campground.
We're up in the middle of themountains in Arizona, 7,000 feet
.
We drive in and I have zeroservice.
It says SOS on my phone.
We are unintentionallydisconnecting here for a few
(26:42):
days.
It gave me a chance to notfocus on all the messages coming
through and all the stuff onsocial media.
I just think and this is wherewe decided to go more of the
growth partner route to focus onmore of a win-win scenario.
I think anytime you can unplugcompletely, unplug, the world's
(27:06):
not going to come to an end.
The fires will be there whenyou get back.
You can put them out then.
But you need that time foryourself to just completely
detach from everything.
You unlock some creativity.
When we were kids growing up,we didn't have phones, we didn't
have all the gadgets and stuffmy parents would say go outside
(27:26):
and play.
We don't do that really withkids these days, but I think
being outside, beingdisconnected, just allows your
creativity to come through alittle bit more, and that's
definitely the case.
Speaker 2 (27:40):
If you were to go back six or seven years when you
started Ninja, and you could goback and tell yourself one
thing based on what you know now, what would you tell?
Speaker 3 (27:50):
yourself Buy Bitcoin would be one.
Oh, that's great.
I would say find more teammembers faster that can help you
fulfill and take some of thework off of your plate.
(28:11):
That's probably been thebiggest challenge is trying to
do it all myself, not leveragingother people, treating it more
as a business than as a job.
Look at myself more as ashareholder versus the guy that
has to do everything.
I have found some great teammembers, so I'm not doing
(28:33):
everything myself.
I still am pretty involved inthe business from a creative
aspect because I enjoy it.
I would have come into it moreas a how do I build this where I
can take myself out of it atsome point if I want to, if I
want to have that option andfind more team members faster.
That's smart.
(28:54):
I like that.
I think sometimes we have justthe big ego that, oh, no one can
do it as good as I can.
I need to be doing all theselittle things.
I'm like you know what, if Ican find someone that can do an
80% as good as what I think isgood, then it would freeze up a
couple hours in my day, but Ishould do that all day long.
So that would be what I wouldprobably go back and start over.
(29:18):
I would probably prioritizethat.
Speaker 2 (29:21):
I love that.
I have a sticky note on theleft monitor here at my desk and
I see it every day and there'sa question on it.
Is this the absolute best useof my time right now?
Speaker 3 (29:32):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:33):
And so often I find myself looking at that and
thinking, no, somebody else cando this.
And I use the same 80% rule.
If somebody else can do this80% as good as I can, then I'd
have to let them do it andempower them.
Speaker 3 (29:45):
Yeah, yeah, hard to do in the beginning.
I do think it's important,though, in the beginning, to,
until you can offload that ontosomeone else, you have to know
how to do it yourself.
Yeah, because otherwise how canyou teach someone else to do it
?
So I think it was important tounderstand every aspect of what
we do and how to do it andpractice what we preach and the
business.
It's important to do ityourself first, but, yeah,
(30:07):
bringing on those right teammembers, it's a breath of fresh
air when I wake up and I know,okay, this is being handled,
that's being handled, I canfocus more on clients, I can
focus more on the creative stuffand don't have to worry so much
on the other details.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
Doing what only you can do.
Right, that's good.
You referenced earlier that youread a lot and that you've read
many, many, many books.
Is there one that stands outthat you would recommend to the
leaders who are listening?
Speaker 3 (30:37):
Yeah, there are many.
It depends on what area.
I know we talked about thisbefore.
There's so many different.
Are you talking mindset?
Are we talking business?
Right now, I'll tell you.
I go back to a few books that Itry to reread every year or two.
One of my favorite authors isJoseph Murphy A Power of your
Subconscious Mind.
I think that's a powerful bookeven though it was written so
(30:59):
long ago, and the examples arefunny with the numbers.
But I think the mindset part issuch an important piece that
people gloss over and they focusmore on the day-to-day or the
business or the operations.
I think you can get the mindsetpiece, which is a constant
challenge.
You're always learning, you'realways growing Anything.
Joseph Murphy, wayne Dyer I'm abig Wayne Dyer fan.
(31:21):
I actually get to meet him acouple times.
The Power of Intention isanother great one by Wayne Dyer.
Of course, everybody's going tosave the classics thinking,
grow Rich and how to win friendsand influence people, and seven
habits, and all those which areall great For me.
I think my favorite books arealways the ones that are more of
(31:43):
the mindset ones, the beliefones that help you expand the
magic of thinking big.
I'm a big Ogbandino fan too.
I read all of his, but I lovehis stories.
I mean God, just the way thathe can weave a message into a
story and keep you engaged andtell a powerful lesson.
Those are some of my favorites.
Speaker 2 (32:03):
I love that too.
Ogbandino is one of myfavorites.
Speaker 3 (32:07):
Yeah, the choice is my favorite one and he's on the
purple one, oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:11):
Absolutely that classic and awesome.
Yeah, yeah, typically, peopleare going to walk away from an
episode like this out of withone big idea.
If you could define what thatone big idea was going to be,
what would you want people towalk away with?
Speaker 3 (32:27):
I mean our specialty and I think my gift is turning
cold strangers into warm friends.
I think if you looked atnetworking and call it Legion,
call it outbound coldconversations starting.
If you looked at it as just away to spark a conversation and
(32:49):
meet someone new and add valueto them, not only could you have
an opportunity with them, butit also opens the door to a
conversation with anybody intheir network and keeps that
pipeline full.
I think too many peopleapproach prospecting from an
angle of I just need to bedirect and sell my product,
(33:10):
whereas if you took a differentapproach almost like joining a
networking group you don't joina networking group to sell the
other members in the group.
You join a networking group toget to know the other members in
the group.
Perhaps there's a chance thatthey could use your service, but
you want to be introduced totheir network.
So I think if you use LinkedInor any social tool as a way to
build and nurture relationships,you open yourself up to
(33:32):
building a much bigger pipelineover time.
The challenge is we live in aninstant gratification society
where I need it now and I needit done yesterday, when in fact
the best approach might actuallybe to slow down in order to
speed up.
So that would be my advice islook at it as a way to build and
nurture relationships, have funwith it, get creative.
(33:55):
Don't attach to what someonesays to one of your messages
that you send to someone, and beconsistent.
That's I mean talk about.
One of the key factors of oursuccess has been we are
consistently doing it everysingle day.
There's no break.
So finding a partner that canhelp you do that.
Speaker 2 (34:18):
I know folks are going to want to stay connected
to you and continue to learnfrom you and potentially explore
what Ninja could do for them.
What's the best way for peopleto find out more information
about that?
Speaker 3 (34:28):
I'm on LinkedIn 24 seven, so you can always find me
there.
Ninja prospectingcom is ourwebsite.
I don't have an emailnewsletter yet.
It's coming soon.
So if someone wanted to keep intouch that way but honestly
connect with me on LinkedIn,shoot me a message there or come
check out what we do on ourwebsite and if you'd like to
have a conversation and explore,there's no hard sell on our end
(34:50):
.
I like to meet people and seewhat we can do to add value and,
like I said, get intoconversation and see how we
might be able to help.
So yeah, linkedin is probablythe best spot to find me or our
website.
Speaker 2 (35:01):
Adam, this has been so helpful, so practical and so
much insights you've droppedhere.
Thank you so much for yourgenerosity today.
Speaker 3 (35:08):
Thank you for the opportunity.
I always, always enjoy sharingand meeting new people.
So, yeah, I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (35:13):
Thanks for joining me for this episode today.
As we wrap up, I'd love for youto do two things.
First, subscribe to thispodcast so you don't miss an
episode, and if you find valuehere, I'd love it if you would
rate it and review it.
That really does make adifference in helping other
people to discover this podcast.
Second, if you don't have acopy of my newest book,
(35:35):
catalytic Leadership, I'd loveto put a copy in your hands.
If you go tocatalyticleadershipbookcom, you
can get a copy for free.
Just pay the shipping so I canget it to you and we'll get one
right out.
My goal is to put this into thehands of as many leaders as
possible.
This book captures principlesthat I've learned in 20 plus
(35:57):
years of coaching leaders in theentrepreneurial space, in
business, government, nonprofits, education and the local church
.
You can also connect with me onLinkedIn to keep up with what
I'm currently learning andthinking about.
And if you're ready to take anext step with a coach to help
you intentionally grow andthrive as a leader, I'd be
(36:19):
honored to help you.
Just go tocatalyticleadershipnet to book a
call with me.
Stay tuned for our next episodenext week.
Until then, as always, leaderschoose to be catalytic.
Speaker 1 (36:35):
Thanks for listening to Catalytic Leadership with Dr
William Attaway.
Be sure to subscribe whereveryou listen to podcasts so you
don't miss the next episode.
Want more?
Go to catalyticleadershipnet.
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