December 28, 2024 • 52 mins
Carrie Matthews, a seasoned officer with 20 years in the Chicago Police Department, opens up about her life on the force. Growing up in a family rooted deeply in law enforcement, Carrie shares her unique perspective on the challenges that come with parenting as a police officer and growing up with a parent on the force. Her discussion about the importance of a support system beyond the uniform provides invaluable insights into maintaining a healthy work-life balance and keeping a well-rounded perspective in the face of daily demands.
Mental health is a critical topic that Carrie bravely addresses, shedding light on the emotional toll of policing. With personal stories, she shares the heartbreaking account of her father’s suicide after decades of service, bringing attention to the silent battles many officers face. This episode highlights the need to break the stigma surrounding mental health in law enforcement and stresses the importance of open dialogue and support systems for both officers and their families.
Communication emerges as a vital theme as Carrie discusses how expressing emotions and seeking support are important in dealing with grief and trauma. Her journey shows the power of human connections and empathy, encouraging officers to embrace vulnerability as a strength rather than a weakness. By challenging the typical "I'm fine" response, she advocates for genuine conversations that can help officers feel seen and heard, ultimately fostering a more compassionate and understanding environment within the law enforcement community.
Contact:
Instagram: @chicity_girl
LinkedIn: Carrie Matthews
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Tyra Valeriano (00:01):
Welcome to Chapter Blue, the podcast where
we discuss the world of lawenforcement through an honest
conversation on tough orcontroversial topics, real
stories, perspectives andexperience from officers all
around the world.
Whether you're here forinsights on mental health,
self-care, work-life balance,getting into law enforcement,
getting out of law enforcement,or just trying to learn about
(00:21):
personal and professionalchallenges officers face every
day, you've come to the rightplace.
I'm your host, tyra Valeriano,and whether I'm going solo or
speaking with a guest, eachepisode will discuss different
aspects of life behind the badge.
Let's turn the page and stepinto Chapter Blue.
Thank you to everyone fortuning in on this next episode
(00:42):
of Chapter Blue.
I am privileged to welcomeCarrie Matthews, who just
celebrated 20 years with ChicagoPD and she comes from a police
family sharing her experience ofwhat it was like to have
parenting in law enforcement andgrowing up to follow the same
career path.
Today, carrie is going to shareher story for the first time on
a podcast, so I feel veryhonored to be the person she
(01:05):
made the decision to share hermost vulnerable moments with.
Carrie's story is moving andraw, and it's based on struggles
on mental health and suicidefrom the job and reminding us of
the importance of changing thestigma.
Hi Carrie, thank you so muchfor taking time out of your
schedule to join me today.
If you would give the listenerssome more background about your
(01:27):
law enforcement career and whatyou're doing today?
Carrie Matthews (01:30):
Absolutely, and thank you very much for having
me talk with you today.
My name is Carrie Matthews.
I am a 20-year veteran of theChicago Police Department.
I come from a family of policeofficers.
My father was a police officer.
My brother is a retiredcommander.
My grandfather was a policeofficer, so it's definitely was
(01:54):
in the blood.
My mom we used to tease wouldsay she's the only one at
Thanksgiving without a gun, soit's definitely something that's
your calling.
I am married.
My husband's a police officer.
We actually met our firstsecond day in college.
We're friends for years andthen got married later in life.
(02:14):
I have two children a son at 16, a daughter that's 13.
And I guess that's about it.
Tyra Valeriano (02:24):
That's a long history of family in law
enforcement.
Do your kids want to becomepolice officers?
Carrie Matthews (02:32):
So, of course, like any children, they say it,
but I try to sway them to.
What I like to say is get abetter job.
Whatever they would choose todo, I would stand behind them.
But with the climate that it istoday, I would not advise it.
But you never know, I don'twant to take anything away from
(02:53):
them.
They could be great at it.
Tyra Valeriano (02:55):
That's a really interesting perspective.
I've also felt that way.
I have little ones and I've hadone tell me they wanted to be a
police officer.
But I think, as a parent andsomebody who served in law
enforcement and, as for you,still in law enforcement it is
the climate that changes theperspective of wanting to
encourage your child.
(03:16):
Of course, we support whateverdecision that they make, but it
is very different than what itused to be.
Carrie Matthews (03:23):
Absolutely different than what it used to
be, absolutely.
And growing up I did not.
My father did not bring any ofhis stories home, like we didn't
talk about it, so I never knewwhat he did, really, like I just
knew he was a police officerand, you know, don't drink or do
drugs because he'll find out,basically like he'll just know.
And my husband and I we don'tbring work home either, we don't
(03:47):
talk Sometimes the funny thingswe may speak about, but
normally there's no talk aboutit.
Which was good when they wereyounger.
But now, when the kids areolder, in schools and the other
kids of police officers are inthose schools and classes, they
seem to talk about some of thethings police shootings, police
(04:08):
suicides, car accidents whichcome up.
And my theory is I'll never lieto my kids if they ask me a
straight answer, but I'll neverjust come home and say a police
officer was shot, killed today.
Tyra Valeriano (04:22):
Right, what is it like being with the family?
You know you have a big familyof police officers.
How is it outside of that?
I mean, do you guys havefriends that are not police
officers and how is thatrelationship, because you come
from such a long line of lawenforcement?
Carrie Matthews (04:41):
So to me it was something that was very
important was to have what wecall our civilian friends.
Yes, I have friends within thedepartment, amazing people that
I've met through 20 years whoare some very good close friends
of mine.
But I also keep myself evenkeeled with civilian friends
(05:01):
moms, dads who we can go out andjust have conversations about
goofy things our kids did orthings we want to do, and it's
not all police talk.
I really don't like to talkabout police talk or police
stories when I'm out and about.
It's just something that I'vealways been like to tell the war
stories.
I don't do that, but I preferjust to.
(05:23):
I really friends to me arepeople who have my back and
support me, so that's who Ireally will surround myself with
.
Tyra Valeriano (05:31):
I'm interested to know what your experience as
a police officer has been like.
Number one you're a mom, so Iwant to hear how that transition
was for you.
When you were doing your career, you had kids and dealing with,
of course, traumatic events,and knowing that both you and
(05:53):
your husband are police officersand you have your family, how
did you deal with that?
How do you both deal with thatand how do you, how do you, keep
the family unit together?
What's your best advice forthose out there who have the
same situation as you?
Carrie Matthews (06:07):
Well, like as always, no marriage is perfect.
We've definitely had our upsand downs, our good times.
Bad times Before I got marriedis when I got on the job.
So I got on the job in Novemberof 2004.
I was not married.
I went through the academy.
I busted my butt to prove thatI needed to be there.
(06:29):
I believe that it was somethingin my own head, but also in the
reality of my dad and hispartners, or his way of life
with police officers when theyfirst got on.
You know that women shouldn'tbe on the job, they should be
behind a desk, all that type ofstuff.
So I wanted to definitely showthat I belong there and that I
(06:52):
could do the job.
So I busted my butt in theacademy and I landed up being
the valedictorian of the class,so number one, in academics,
which I was happy about.
But I thought that at the timethat once you were number one,
(07:14):
you got to pick the place whereyou could go in Chicago, what
district, what area, and ofcourse it wasn't that.
I didn't get that, but I didgive the speech at our
graduation, which I was verynervous about.
But I succeeded and my husbandand I got married in February of
(07:36):
2008.
So four years I was on the jobbefore getting married and
starting a family, beforegetting married and starting a
family and, of course, prior tothat, you're more.
I'm going to go, do what I needto do.
I take the risks.
I'm not really thinking aboutthe after effects.
You're going to chase people,you're going to run with
(07:57):
everybody.
You're going to do all thosethings and I didn't stop doing
that once I got married and hadchildren.
But I believe after events Iwould think, oh, that could have
went really bad, that couldhave been a bad decision.
You know, you always thinkabout it after the fact, which I
still do to this day.
(08:18):
I think of everything after thefact instead of during it,
because that could get us hurt.
But we always worked my husbandand I work different shifts, so
we were able to do that for ourkids and if something went on,
we would discuss it with eachother, like I've called him at
work and ask some advice, orhe's called me and ask some
(08:40):
advice about you know, reportwriting or something that
happened or a bad call that youwere on.
We definitely would talk aboutit.
And I've had some amazingpartners, which some of them
were females.
I've been partnered with a lotof females, which is great, but,
as you know, people will stepup to female officers more than
(09:03):
they will step up to maleofficers.
So I guess we would get into itmore hands-on sometimes because
they would test us.
So it's, it's been.
I won't say it's been easy forit with family, but it's.
I don't.
I don't know any different perse what a normal family is
without having a police officerfather or without being the
(09:26):
mother of it as well.
And I'm very hypervigilant andI'm very, I guess,
overprotective, some would saywith my kids.
I'm always looking around, I'mstill asking the questions of
who is your friends, who aretheir parents?
I check their phones constantly.
Social media was a no untiljust recently, but I check their
(09:48):
phones constantly just to makesure, because you never know.
Tyra Valeriano (09:52):
You never know, and I definitely think that's a
cop parent enhanced, because I'msure all parents do that.
I can't say that my parents didthat when I was young because
social media was not around theway it is now.
But, yes, I completely agreewith that.
You touched on something that Ifeel a lot of women in law
enforcement probably still feeltoday, and that's proving
(10:14):
yourself.
Of course, your situation wasslightly different than most
women.
They're probably not doing itto make sure they can prove to
their dad or you know the peoplewho have been working with
their dad that they can do thejob, but just in general, to the
department and the agency thatthey choose hey, I can do this.
And I feel like that is a reallygreat story to hear from your
(10:36):
side, just because you come froma background where this is just
something you have in yourblood and you're doing it
because you're like, hey, dad,I'm going to show you that I can
do it.
And here you are, 20 yearslater serving your community.
Still, you have a husband inlaw enforcement and your
children have experienced thislife that most kids don't have.
So it's really great to hearthat.
(10:57):
And now I'm curious you comewith a message, and it's a
message that is very relevant towhat the podcast is about, and
it is about mental health andwellness for first responders.
Law enforcement.
You have 20 years of experience.
I'm sure you have a ton ofstories that you could tell if
(11:20):
you needed to, but tell us alittle bit about why you have
such a passion for the mentalhealth aspect in law enforcement
.
Carrie Matthews (11:31):
Well, as I'm sure a lot of us, we've lost
friends, co-workers, patrolmen,sergeants, bosses by their own
hand, by suicide.
I have lost very close friendsthat are police officers with me
by them shooting themselvesthis past July, july of 2023, I
(11:57):
would say July 31st of 2023,.
I got the phone call in of 2023, I got the phone call in
regards to my dad had taken hisown life, that he had shot
himself.
My dad was a 35-year veteranwith the police department.
He had been retired since 2009.
(12:18):
He was a very strong man, verystubborn, took care of his
family, but also had his ups anddowns with drinking and things
like that With the job.
My father was shot on the jobin 1988, doing a search warrant
(12:41):
in his lake survived it.
Search warrant in his lakesurvived it.
He was off a year, which meantthat my friends used to call him
the warden because I had acurfew.
He was very strict on where wehad to be, so the warden was
home for a year nonstop for meand it was tough for me to be
(13:02):
able to go out and do anything.
But I understand it now as towhy he was the way he was back
then Very strict.
When I did receive the call, Iwas very I'm uncertain by it.
I didn't believe it because mydad was a gun guy, he was a
(13:23):
hunter, he knew his stuff.
So I knew it wasn't an accident.
I knew it wasn't the oldcleaning their gun situation did
(13:45):
it.
But I also believe that he didnot have a plan to do it.
I believe that it was just onthe fly.
My mom was retired as well.
She worked as a Juul bake shopmanager forever.
She got the job when she was 16years old, working for Juul,
which is a grocery store here,and with it, I would say, the
past 10 years.
She was battling dementia andAlzheimer's and my dad was her
(14:07):
primary caretaker and I wouldask him would you like to put
her in a home, do you need help?
He was very much of the policementality of I don't want people
in my home, I don't wantstrangers here, I don't trust
anybody.
Okay, so me working and workingin Chicago, days off, canceled,
(14:29):
long hours, my husband the same.
We did what we could to help,but it was definitely not enough
.
I would take my mom out with thekids, I would do things with
her again as much as I could,but I believe that it wore on
him.
I'm sure what wore on him wasthe 35 years on the job of
things that he saw.
(14:50):
Times were different.
His shooting he had been inmultiple shootings, by himself
as well, on the job, and I thinkthat taking care of my mom
might've just been the tippingpoint for him.
He was not one to talk abouthis problems, he was not one to
(15:10):
complain, he was not one to askfor help.
Really, you know, it was theI'll handle it myself, I'll take
care of it myself, everything'sfine, I'm fine and that's how I
was brought up.
Like you don't you take care ofyour business.
You don't, you know, act likeyou can't.
The word can't was not okay inmy household growing up.
(15:32):
It was I can.
So I believe that's a bigreason as to why he did it.
Him and my son, my father and myson were very, very, very close
.
My son would go over thereconstantly.
My daughter and my dad werevery close.
She was also close with my momboth of them and I truly believe
(15:57):
we went to Florida for my son'sgraduation it was his gift and
I truly believe that my fatherdid it then because no one was
going to accidentally walk in orbe there or find him.
I don't believe that he wouldhave wanted my kids to find him.
My mom went out with her highschool friend who happens to be
(16:21):
my godmother.
They've known each other for 60something years and she's the
one that found my father and hadcalled me.
And again, I didn't believe it.
I started to call people to getthem to the house.
I knew that there might've beenfirearms around, that I wanted
(16:41):
other people to take custody ofthem Because, again, I think,
just like my dad, who's in thehouse, who's going to be there,
who's touching what, I wantedpeople there that I trusted.
I landed up, calling my brotherto tell him to get there, and I
was trying to get home on thefirst flight from Florida the
next morning, flight fromFlorida the next morning and
(17:02):
even going there the next dayinto the house, there was no per
se crime scene.
There was no blood, a littlebit of blood on a pillow.
There was no note, there was noanswers as to why, which, to
this day, it haunts me that Ihave no idea why.
(17:24):
And, as police officers, that'swhat we want to know.
We want to know why, who, what,when, where and why, and I
don't know.
That morning, around 1230, oneo'clock, I had sent him a
picture of my son with aMandalorian in Florida, because
my dad would ask for, basically,proof of life for my kids,
because it was very hot and hewanted to make sure that they
(17:48):
had enough water, they werecooled down and I'm thinking
well, you didn't ask me how I'mdoing.
It was all about the kids.
The grandkids were definitelyhis favorites, and so I sent him
a picture and he said oh mygosh, connor looks great.
I bet he's having a great time.
I said yes, and he said youknow, he looks like he's having
(18:09):
fun.
I said yes, and that was thelast day.
I am grieving.
Every day I don't know why.
(18:30):
I get upset, because I want toknow why.
Because he was of the type thatyou would have never guessed it
had everything together, alwaystook care of everything, made
sure we always had everythingwasn't down.
He didn't talk about things, hewouldn't say things were rough
(18:50):
with my mom, so I had no idea.
The typical signs that peoplesay are there were not there at
all.
He had made plans with my kidsmy son was starting freshman
year, my daughter was startingsixth grade my nephew.
It was his birthday the nextday.
He had had plans with them todo things.
(19:12):
So again, it was very off keyfor me to do it and then to call
his friends and tell them andeverybody was saying we didn't
know or we had no idea.
Your dad never said anything.
We would ask him things.
But it was just very upsetting,to say the least, and trying to
(19:32):
move forward with it, because Iguess you don't ever know when
it's going to come up to you Ifthink like I'm fine and I'm
dealing with it.
I actually went to qualify.
We qualify yearly and I went toqualify with my gun already
suited up.
I go out on the line and thefirst shot that I fired there's
(19:56):
tears running down my face andI'm thinking what is wrong with
me?
You know, like you don't cry atwork.
That's not professional.
And all I thought was that wasthe last sound my dad heard and
it just came rushing.
So I took a deep breath, Ifocused, I got through it and
then I just kind of broke downwith some of my partners in the
(20:20):
car.
I said just let me have thisright now.
It was two guys that were withme.
I said just let me have this.
I don't know what's going on,but and they're great but nobody
talks about it.
Nobody talks about what'shappening to you.
Nobody talks about how terribleit is, especially as a police
officer, because you're supposedto have everything together,
(20:42):
you're supposed to keepeverything together.
We're okay, we're robots, we'renot human.
We can see this and then go onto the next call.
Basically, and I have notstopped speaking about it,
speaking about how it's made mefeel the past year, how it's
made my kids feel, or how youjust can't go on, you just don't
(21:04):
move on from this.
And I've had my own terribledark thoughts, which is scary,
because they say that whensomebody in your family kills
themselves, you are 50% to 60%higher to do it yourself or
(21:25):
somebody else in your family todo it, which scares me to death.
So that's why I'm very openabout it.
I talk to my kids about it,about how I feel, about
everything.
So they know that this was notthe right answer.
So they know that this was notthe right answer, that there are
things happening.
I'm in therapy.
I was going twice a week.
(21:45):
I've gone to retreats traumaretreat which is a fabulous.
It was a fabulous free retreatthat literally, I believe, saved
my life with this.
But there was nowhere for me toturn when this first happened.
I was searching for supportgroups, first responders,
(22:05):
support groups with people whoin their world has killed
themselves.
Not just a random support groupand I don't mean random by
anybody, I just meant firstresponders because I can't sit
next to somebody that doesn'tknow a police officer's life and
explain what goes, what we see,what goes through our heads,
(22:30):
and we have the accessibility tohandguns and it's so easy.
And I didn't want to sit nextto a mom where her child did it,
because it's just as terrible.
I wanted to be with kind of thesame people that knew kind of
where I was coming from andstill being on the streets or
(22:54):
having to talk to people aboutthis because there is nothing,
there was nothing around here.
There are organizations and youcould do Zoom and you could do
this, but I wanted a place whereI just grab some chairs, get
some coffee and talk to otherpolice officers and say how
(23:15):
crappy this is and how crappy wefeel.
Or if somebody is saying, youknow, I'm having the worst day,
I wish I was gone too, we feel.
Or if somebody's saying youknow I'm having the worst day, I
wish I was gone too.
Nobody's going to freak out.
They just know that you'rehaving this bad day and let's
talk through it and know thatwe've got your back, we are here
for you.
No one's pushing you, throwingyou into the hospital
immediately.
(23:36):
We're going to talk through itand see exactly why you're
feeling that way.
So this is my goal is to getthis started, that I didn't want
it to be through the departmentor through a church, because
some people, their loved ones,they may blame the department
that it happened or church.
You know, I'm not that.
(23:56):
I'm not Catholic, I'm notLutheran.
So I was trying to keep it inthe middle of just let's go talk
somewhere, we don't needanything.
I don't trying to keep it inthe middle of just let's go talk
somewhere, we don't needanything.
I don't want to do it at a barbecause you know, sometimes sour
depression, sorrow, depressionand coppers and alcohols would
not be a great combination.
(24:17):
And I just like I said, I'm justtruthful.
I was very angry.
I didn't even want to have awake because I was so angry with
him.
But I knew, in his 75 years ofliving, people loved him.
People loved working with him.
They wanted to pay theirrespects.
My kids had the right to dothat, to pay their respects.
(24:39):
So of course we did it, but Iwas very angry there with him as
well.
I always say my theory is Iwasn't enough to keep him here,
which that's one of the biggestthings that I'm working through,
and it's just very, very hardand I want people to know that
(25:00):
our line of work is not easy.
When you put personal andprofessional and they come
together, it's just sometimesit's just a storm, a tornado in
your head of trying to push thatto the side.
Tyra Valeriano (25:15):
Thank you so much for sharing your story.
I'm really sorry for the lossof your dad.
I can't imagine what you'vebeen through Just based on what
you're saying.
That is a lot to go through,especially just in the past year
.
How would you say that thisexperience has changed your
perspective on that mentalitythat you grew up with?
(25:36):
You know, deal with yourbusiness, deal with it, and you
know, move on, You'll be okay.
Do you think that thisdrastically changed that
perspective for you?
Carrie Matthews (25:47):
I absolutely do think that it has changed my
way of thinking, because I tookthat way of my dad's thinking of
what happens in the home staysin the home.
We keep everything close to thevest.
You don't talk about yourfeelings, you don't tell people
what's going on, you just dealwith it and move on, pack it
(26:08):
away, pack it away.
And then what happens is youexplode.
And I've had that happen wherefriends of mine will go out and
we'll just talk and I'm crying.
They have no idea why that'snot fair to them, and so that's
why now I'm more of let's talkabout it.
Let's talk about what'shappening.
What's happening at home,what's happening in your head,
(26:29):
what's happening with your kids,because a lot of people aren't
talking about it.
What's happening in your head,what's happening with your kids,
because a lot of people aren'ttalking about it.
What's happening with the callyou went on?
That's a lot to take in and tojust move past it.
There's a call that I have thatjust it haunts me A
three-year-old getting sexuallyassaulted by her grandfather,
and I was fairly new on the job,but I still can see that
(26:52):
three-year-old's face and thatwas one of those times where you
think is this job for me?
What am I doing?
This really happens and there'sthese people out here that are
these monsters.
You think about it and beforeyou get on the job you think
like, oh, I know, there's badpeople, there's bad people, but
until you're on the job youdon't really see those bad
(27:13):
people, until you're in it, andthere's no going away from that.
And so 20 years of that, or 25years my dad was on the job for
35 years, 35 years of that andno talking has to take its toll.
Has to take its toll.
Five years of no talking,people in officer-involved
(27:34):
shootings it takes a toll and Iwant people to know that it's
okay to talk.
I am part of our peer supportprogram, but I also know that
people don't trust anything thathas to do with the department.
So, putting that aside, I amwilling to talk to anybody at
any time about anything in hasto do with the department.
So, putting that aside, I amwilling to talk to anybody at
any time about anything inregards to.
(27:56):
I might not know what you've,what you've gone through, what
you're going through, but I doknow what it's like to lose
somebody that you've looked upto.
That was your hero that you'veloved for one day to be there
and the next to not be there,and want to know why.
And I just I won't stop.
(28:17):
I won't stop.
And I've had some people friendstell me you know things that
you put on Facebook or thingsthat you say it's a bit much
Like, don't you think you shouldtalk to your therapist about
that?
And my response is always ifit's making you uncomfortable,
that's exactly why I need to sayit out loud.
The reason that things arehappening are because no one's
talking about it.
So I'm of the thing of yes,let's talk about it.
(28:40):
If it makes you uncomfortable,let's talk about it.
It doesn't make me comfortable.
Tyra Valeriano (28:46):
Right, and that's the stigma that I feel is
really at the forefront rightnow is your dad is a perfect
example of.
You know, the, the ultimate lawenforcement officer, served his
career.
You know so many great thingsthat you said about him.
And later on down the road, itmay not be during the career.
(29:07):
During the career, it reallyjust settles with people when
they're retired and they'rehaving to really just adjust to
their life outside of lawenforcement and really soak in
everything that they've beenthrough.
And then, of course, there's theissues that are outside of work
.
Right, you have familysituations, you have your own
(29:27):
situations and I don't knowabout you, but I know that I
dove into work anytime.
I had issues at home and Iwould just stay busy and work,
and work, and work.
And that's probably adouble-edged sword, because
you're going into work knowingthat you're going to be dealing
with more things that you'regoing to have to deal with at
some point, and then you go homeand you're just not really
(29:48):
dealing with your issues at home.
So it's a really importantmessage to not be afraid to talk
about it.
And my husband and I have thisconversation.
You know there's this man's man, this appearance or this image,
or I don't want to call it afacade, because I do think that
there is a role that men play.
You know you have to be takingcare of the family.
(30:11):
There's just this role that menwant to have in their family,
understandably.
But when it comes to talkingabout the things that you're
struggling with, this is whereit has to change, and it doesn't
mean that you have to hold allthat in and this does not just
apply to men, it's obviouslywomen too.
But law enforcement, in thefirst responder field, there's
(30:38):
so much that the average personwill never experience in their
entire life, and here we aredealing with it on a daily basis
.
So, now that you are seeing atherapist and you are a part of
the peer support group, what doyou think is the biggest benefit
that you've seen from takingthat step?
Carrie Matthews (30:53):
So for me expressing that I go to a
therapist, I'm not embarrassedby it, I'm not ashamed by it,
and for me taking a social mediaand expressing how I feel, I've
actually had more people cometo me or send me messages in
regards to you know what?
I had a plan to kill myself, orI was wanting to do this, or I
(31:17):
wanted to do that, or do youhave five minutes to talk?
I have found that more peoplenow open up about it, because I
started the conversation andI'll say, okay, well, did you
try this or did you try that?
I?
I tried EMDR for the first time, which was an amazing thing.
(31:37):
Some in this group that I'm inwith this retreat, they call it
voodoo, bullshit and.
But it really worked.
But you don't know how it workshow it?
works and I'm.
It's a I wrap, it's I rapidmovement, desensitization, and
it's they do something withtheir fingers and your eyes.
(32:04):
You focus on one traumaticevent and they keep asking
questions over and over how doesthat make you feel?
Or let's go with that.
Let's go with that, and it'sjust something with your eyes
and your brain and restructuringit, where the trauma, when you
think about it, is still there,but it's not as emotional.
I suggest, if you haven't triedit, I definitely would look it
up and try it, because it's notamazing.
(32:26):
You know it sounds like oh wow,this is, you know the end, all,
but it's it helps.
It helps to get you through thenext step of what you're going
to try to heal.
It's actually something that Inever knew of about.
It's not hypnotizing oranything.
It's just your brain, your eyesand your way of thinking is
(32:48):
changing in the moment oftalking with the therapist and
your way of thinking is changingin the moment of talking with
the therapist.
And I've told people to do that.
I've told people to go to thisretreat that I constantly am
with.
I go to it, I help out whateverthey need, because I believe in
it.
I believe in talking about thisopenness and I know that there
(33:09):
are people that are the onesthat's saying I'm going to do it
, I'm going to do it.
They're showing the signs andI'm ready, right there, to step
in as well.
My fear is again, the ones whereyou don't see any signs.
It's the, it's the one that'sso happy, or they look like they
have their whole life togetherand they don't.
(33:30):
And at what?
I've told my therapist this andI've, at this retreat I've gone
to, I've even said I said I'mthe happiest person in the room.
I can make everybody laugh, Icould talk to everybody.
You guys would have no ideathat slowly on the inside I'm
dying.
And when you come out with thetruth of that, and when you come
(33:54):
out with the truth of that,then people kind of understand
like wait, I'm the same way.
You know, like you said, youdive into work a thousand
percent because you would ratherdeal with other people's
problems.
I'd rather deal with otherpeople's problems and deal with
my own.
We're fixers, so let's fix it.
Show me what, when, when.
But then for ourselves, we putourselves on the back burner and
all of a sudden we're justgetting pushed away and pushed
(34:16):
down, and pushed down until weexplode.
And then where do you start?
You don't even know where tostart with talking about your
feelings or thoughts.
Tyra Valeriano (34:25):
Right.
I want to go back to what yousaid about not feeling enough
that that crossed your mindbecause there was no answers and
I can relate to you a littlebit in this.
I've talked about this story ina different podcast, but when I
just want to touch a little biton it because I can relate to
what you're saying.
(34:46):
My grandfather he was in thearmy.
He retired from the army.
He was a very high ranking inthe army and I was very close to
my grandfather when I waslittle and I remember when I was
about five years old, he waswalking into the garage and he
told me hey, I'm really sick,and something along the lines
(35:08):
that he probably was not goingto make it.
So I was under the impressionthat my grandfather had died in
the hospital, because after thatconversation I didn't see him
again.
And it wasn't until I was 17years old that I found out that
my grandfather shot himself inthe room that I used to live in
for my whole entire childhoodand he obviously planned this.
(35:31):
He thought he was going to doit.
He knew he was going to do it.
So much to the fact that hetold me that.
But when I became an adult and I, you know, once I was 17 and I
realized what actually happened,I'm sure my mom and my grandma
went through the same emotionsas why, and were we not enough?
And there was also no notes.
Why, and were we not enough?
(35:54):
And there was also no notes.
So it leaves you wondering justwhat exactly it.
Maybe it's not one thing, butyou're going through your head
wondering what the heck happened.
Well, you know, as a kid, I'mfive years old and now that I'm
17 and understanding what did Ido?
Did I do something that hedidn't like?
And you know my, my grandma, mymom, just all these things are
going through your head and it,you know my, my grandma, my mom,
just all these things startgoing through your head and it's
, of course, it's not an answeryou're ever going to get.
(36:16):
So it's like talking to someoneis a great way to go about that
, because you're never going toget the answer that you want,
but being able to express thatto somebody and hear that, hey,
you are enough, and it wasn'tyou, you know it wasn't you, but
it's the reassurance, becauseyou can't help but think the
negative things that pop intoyour head just from time to time
(36:39):
, it's very difficult to dealwith.
So, with that being said, whatdo you think is a good way to
approach somebody that you workwith that isn't showing any
signs.
You know the happy person.
What's a good conversationstarter?
To check in on the people youwork with your partners and make
(37:00):
sure that everybody's okay.
What do you think is the bestway to do that?
Carrie Matthews (37:04):
So I am a very social person, have always been
my whole life and I'll talk toeverybody, anybody in the room,
you're new, you're old, you'vebeen there, whatever.
I will go up to you and I'lltalk to everybody.
I like to learn about theirlives or talk to them about
their kids.
How's your family, how's yourwife, how's your husband, what's
(37:24):
going on?
And then sometimes I just cansee in people I don't know
really how to explain it, justthey might not have to say it to
me just their way they are orhow they've been.
And I might just ask somebodystraight out like, how are you
doing?
And oh, I'm fine.
(37:45):
No, really, how are you doing?
Because we're all fine, everypolice officer is fine, every
police officer is okay, everypolice officer is okay.
And then I just kind of willmake them uncomfortable with not
just going like, oh, okay,you're fine, high five, you know
, see, a checkoff, it's more ofwell, what do you mean?
You know, or I know that you'regoing through this, or I heard
(38:06):
that your daughter's sick, orhow are you doing?
And sometimes that they willopen up a little more.
But my thing is, with the I'mfine or I'm okay, just question
it a little bit further.
Well, what do you mean?
You're okay, how do you knowyou're okay?
And it's actually come to helpme with that and because I like
(38:27):
to say that too, like, oh, howare you, I'm fine.
And they're like, oh, okay, areyou fine?
I'm really not fine.
You know, they know that.
And with the I am, you know,was I enough?
I actually got that tattooed onmy left wrist.
I had a ribbon for suicide onone side and my mom just passed
(38:48):
away, august of 2024, fromAlzheimer's.
So half of it is Alzheimer'sawareness and half is suicide
awareness.
And on my dad's side it says Iam enough.
Just to remind myself that I am.
It wasn't me as much as I willnever be sure that it wasn't To
(39:11):
remind myself that, no matterwhat I'm doing in this life, I
am enough.
I was raised a not the bestchildhood, not the worst
childhood, but very strict.
You know, do as you're told, dothis, we don't whine, we don't
cry.
There was no crying in my housegrowing up.
(39:32):
There was no waiting for thingsout.
It was pretty much what my dadsaid goes, you don't question
him.
I don't believe I ever swore inthat house growing up, and so
that's where I think that Iwonder all the time my dad
wasn't one never said I love you.
So you wonder that.
(39:54):
And now, with my kids, I tellthem daily, almost to exhaustion
, that I love them.
I want them to always know that, and and I tell my coworkers
too like you mean a lot to me,and one of my things that I
always say to everybody now isyour life matters.
I don't care who you are, Idon't care what you think is
(40:15):
happening.
Your bills, work sucks you knowwe all have supervisors that
suck things, but your lifematters, it's not.
This bad moment is going topass at some point.
I'm not going to say with asnap of a finger but things will
pass.
(40:36):
And I've even noticed in myselfwhen I'm having a really bad day
, if I just take a shower orjust walk outside, I'm actually
feeling better within that fiveminutes of.
Wow, I was really in the darkover there, but now I'm in the
light and I don't want to go toany more suicide funerals.
I don't want to have to tell myfriends I know what you're
(40:59):
going through.
I don't want anybody to knowwhat I'm going through and I
don't want my kids to ever feelhow that feels for somebody else
.
I think their grandfather andthen my mom.
It was enough for them.
I mean, that's two differentways that they both passed.
But for little kids it's verytrying and they're still not the
(41:25):
same.
They're still not the same andI just think that taking the
time, sometimes a five-minuteconversation, could just change
somebody's whole attitude.
Or they believe and think thatyou care and that you really
want to know how they areinstead of the pass-by in the
hall.
Tyra Valeriano (41:44):
Right, you know, as police officers I will, and
maybe you could disagree with me.
I'm not sure where you stand onthis but there becomes a point
where in my career you know youstart to dislike people in
general and you're not.
I've never really adjusted backinto being the extrovert that I
(42:07):
used to be prior to being inlaw enforcement.
I like people.
Now, now that I'm out of lawenforcement, I have learned that
some of the things that Iexperienced and that I chose to
close off and the perceptionsthat I have were very skewed
because of the job.
But you know, you do have tomake that a skill and you don't
(42:29):
have to be fake about it.
It's something that if you wantto actually make a difference
and tell somebody hey, you know,are you okay?
And I'm here to take the timeto listen, to work on that skill
, because we kind of lose thatalong the way in law enforcement
, where we're just hearingeverybody's problems, even
(42:49):
though we're trying to help themfix it, we end up having just
this view of we can't fix peoplebecause they keep doing it over
and over and over.
No matter how many times I tryto help them, they don't listen
and it gets old and we just kindof stop having this same
feeling of caring that we didback when we first became a
police officer.
(43:10):
Do you feel that that's kind ofsomething that we would have to
work on as law enforcementofficers?
Carrie Matthews (43:17):
Absolutely.
I joke about it that you know Ihate everybody.
I hate everybody equally and Idon't want to.
It's I feel like with this jobwe see the worst side of people
and we see no one's calling ussaying, hey, here's some cookies
, come to my house.
I just made this huge meal foryou guys.
(43:38):
It's always basicallysomebody's worst day.
That that's why we're showingup, and so we just start to get
tainted and our views on peopleare like oh great, here we go
again, this domestic again, andas much as we know, not
everything's routine andanything can happen at any
(43:59):
moment.
You know these people.
You're like oh, I hate thesepeople.
Can't they just get it togetheror can't they just move on?
And we know in reality when weactually sit and think about it,
they can't.
That's why they're calling us,that's why they need our help.
But I will say that I am not afan of groups or crowds or going
(44:22):
into restaurants.
I definitely do always have myback to the wall so I could see
everything that's going on infront of me and very distrusting
of people.
When people will tell me things, or just somebody walking past
saying something to my kids, youknow like, oh, I like your
shirt and of course in my headI'm thinking oh well, why do you
(44:43):
like their shirt?
Have you been looking at mydaughter?
You know things like that whereyou just what I say.
Normal people don't think likethat.
They just think that somebodywalked by and liked your
daughter's shirt.
Tyra Valeriano (44:55):
And I feel like right.
Carrie Matthews (44:57):
We do need to redirect our thoughts sometimes,
because not everybody in theworld is bad.
Not everybody's out to hurt us,you know.
Not everyone's trying to stealmy kids, even though they'll
bring them right back.
Tyra Valeriano (45:09):
Yeah, I like to think that too.
Okay, you know what if you want, but you know there's keepers,
you found it.
No refunds.
Carrie Matthews (45:20):
Yeah, right, but no I agree with you.
Disliking of people is yes.
Tyra Valeriano (45:26):
There was also something that you mentioned
about, you know, not wanting togo into the agency for help and
I've talked about this a lot toowhere, as a supervisor, I had a
couple officers who did come tome and you know you can only do
so much before you realize, hey, where are the resources at,
you know?
And officers don't want to usewhat the department or the
(45:49):
agency is giving them as aresource because they feel that
they're going to pry and they'renot safe to talk about what
they want to talk about, because, oh, I might, you know, be put
on admin leave.
What if they don't like what Isaid?
What's going on in my head?
They're going to find out, andthen there goes my job and all
these fears are there.
So, now that this experiencethat you've had, has it helped
(46:13):
you, you know, maybe make someconnections or networking for
the agency, or has the agencystepped in and maybe provided
some resources for officerswhere they don't have to go
through a supervisor or humanresources?
Carrie Matthews (46:29):
So, yes, I actually my therapist, I
actually use our EAPA, ouremployee assistance program.
I have a great therapist therewho's been with me a while, is
kind of on to my BS.
You know, when I say I'm okay,she's like okay.
Or when I all of a sudden feellike I'm, she always says don't
(46:50):
disappear on me, don't stopshowing up, because we all go
through those depression stages,and she, I know, is trying to
get the word out about thatthere is help and that you
aren't going to lose your job ifyou talk, and they do programs,
seminars, just like our uniondoes.
(47:12):
I just think that, like you said, anytime people think that they
go to a boss at work that theyare going to be penalized or
pointed out as that's the blacksheep of the watch or something
like that.
But I do believe that thatstereotype is changing because
more people are going to bossesfor help and they are sending
(47:33):
them somewhat in rightdirections.
I have some friends, very goodfriends, that are higher ups,
that are all about it and wanthelp.
But it takes the person to comeup and ask for the help because
there are places that you cango that don't have anything to
do with the department that areoutside the department that you
(47:54):
could talk to, and there are alot of seminars or a lot of
retreats, and people will postthem and share them in groups,
police officer groups or ChicagoPolice Department groups, and
if I've gone to some of them,I'll personally say I went to
this and it's not, you know,it's no BS, it's straightforward
(48:18):
.
They're not going to hurt you,they're not looking to
hospitalize you, they're notlooking to take your job away.
And I think that that's whathelps too is word of mouth of
people seeking help, no matterwhere they go, and saying I went
there and actually I feelbetter, or I am getting better,
or it did help me, it did workfor me, and I think that that
(48:40):
helps as well.
And I know that they are doingmore trainings for supervisors,
but I can't speak of thatbecause I'm not one.
More trainings for supervisors,but I can't speak of that
because I'm not one, but IChicago police department has a
very high suicide rate amongstthe officers, which is very sad,
(49:02):
you know, and again, I wish Icould stop them all and I wish I
could.
But I will not stop speakingabout it and bringing it, you
know, to the forefront of whatwe're doing, because if one
person could say, oh well,carrie said that, or, you know,
carrie said I could call her, orshe said I could go to this
place, or this place is safe,you know what, then what she's
saying might be true and I mighttry it.
(49:23):
And if I could literally helpone person just change their
mindset, then I would feel goodabout it.
I'll feel pretty good about it.
Tyra Valeriano (49:32):
I agree we are running out of time, but there
is a question that I do like toask all of my guests, and it's
based on their experience andwhat they've just went through
in their career.
What would be one piece ofadvice that you would give your
rookie self?
Carrie Matthews (49:52):
Don't take it all home in your head.
Don't let it rent space in yourhead that you have to talk
about it, let alone to yourpartner, your spouse, somebody.
But don't try to do it allyourself, because eventually you
will explode, and then you'realready too far to start with
(50:17):
the one thing that was botheringyou.
You could have stopped it.
Tyra Valeriano (50:23):
That's good advice.
I agree with that as well, andI think that's an important
message that newer officersshould hear even current
officers should hear, and Ithank you so much, carrie, for
sharing your story, yourexperience.
I completely love your messageand I am so sorry for the things
(50:43):
that you've experienced overthe past couple years.
I think what you are doing withyour experience is great and I
think it's a in addition to whatlaw enforcement needs.
I hope that the listeners wereable to get some insight on what
they can do or where they cango if they are struggling with
these same struggles.
Is there any contactinformation that you can share
(51:05):
with the listeners in case theywant to reach out to you?
Carrie Matthews (51:18):
So, yes, if they want to reach out to me,
I'm on Instagram as shy citygirl.
I'm on LinkedIn as CarrieMatthews.
Tyra Valeriano (51:20):
Thank you so much to the listeners.
Thank you guys for tuning in.
I hope you guys got somevaluable information today and
if there is one message that youcan take away from today, it is
to talk to someone, share withsomebody what you're going
through and just break thatstigma.
I appreciate your guys' support.
Thank you, carrie.
Again.
(51:41):
Everyone be safe and I will seeyou on the next one.
Thank you for joining me onChapter Blue.
If you enjoyed enjoyed today'sepisode, be sure to follow and
tag me on social media and sharewith your friends and fellow
officers.
If you're interested in joiningan episode, I'd love for you to
be a part of the conversation.
Until next time, stay safe,take care of yourself and
remember you're never alone inthis journey.
Welcome to Chapter Blue, the podcast where
we discuss the world of lawenforcement through an honest
conversation on tough orcontroversial topics, real
stories, perspectives andexperience from officers all
around the world.
Whether you're here forinsights on mental health,
self-care, work-life balance,getting into law enforcement,
getting out of law enforcement,or just trying to learn about
(00:21):
personal and professionalchallenges officers face every
day, you've come to the rightplace.
I'm your host, tyra Valeriano,and whether I'm going solo or
speaking with a guest, eachepisode will discuss different
aspects of life behind the badge.
Let's turn the page and stepinto Chapter Blue.
Thank you to everyone fortuning in on this next episode
(00:42):
of Chapter Blue.
I am privileged to welcomeCarrie Matthews, who just
celebrated 20 years with ChicagoPD and she comes from a police
family sharing her experience ofwhat it was like to have
parenting in law enforcement andgrowing up to follow the same
career path.
Today, carrie is going to shareher story for the first time on
a podcast, so I feel veryhonored to be the person she
(01:05):
made the decision to share hermost vulnerable moments with.
Carrie's story is moving andraw, and it's based on struggles
on mental health and suicidefrom the job and reminding us of
the importance of changing thestigma.
Hi Carrie, thank you so muchfor taking time out of your
schedule to join me today.
If you would give the listenerssome more background about your
(01:27):
law enforcement career and whatyou're doing today?
Carrie Matthews (01:30):
Absolutely, and thank you very much for having
me talk with you today.
My name is Carrie Matthews.
I am a 20-year veteran of theChicago Police Department.
I come from a family of policeofficers.
My father was a police officer.
My brother is a retiredcommander.
My grandfather was a policeofficer, so it's definitely was
(01:54):
in the blood.
My mom we used to tease wouldsay she's the only one at
Thanksgiving without a gun, soit's definitely something that's
your calling.
I am married.
My husband's a police officer.
We actually met our firstsecond day in college.
We're friends for years andthen got married later in life.
(02:14):
I have two children a son at 16, a daughter that's 13.
And I guess that's about it.
Tyra Valeriano (02:24):
That's a long history of family in law
enforcement.
Do your kids want to becomepolice officers?
Carrie Matthews (02:32):
So, of course, like any children, they say it,
but I try to sway them to.
What I like to say is get abetter job.
Whatever they would choose todo, I would stand behind them.
But with the climate that it istoday, I would not advise it.
But you never know, I don'twant to take anything away from
(02:53):
them.
They could be great at it.
Tyra Valeriano (02:55):
That's a really interesting perspective.
I've also felt that way.
I have little ones and I've hadone tell me they wanted to be a
police officer.
But I think, as a parent andsomebody who served in law
enforcement and, as for you,still in law enforcement it is
the climate that changes theperspective of wanting to
encourage your child.
(03:16):
Of course, we support whateverdecision that they make, but it
is very different than what itused to be.
Carrie Matthews (03:23):
Absolutely different than what it used to
be, absolutely.
And growing up I did not.
My father did not bring any ofhis stories home, like we didn't
talk about it, so I never knewwhat he did, really, like I just
knew he was a police officerand, you know, don't drink or do
drugs because he'll find out,basically like he'll just know.
And my husband and I we don'tbring work home either, we don't
(03:47):
talk Sometimes the funny thingswe may speak about, but
normally there's no talk aboutit.
Which was good when they wereyounger.
But now, when the kids areolder, in schools and the other
kids of police officers are inthose schools and classes, they
seem to talk about some of thethings police shootings, police
(04:08):
suicides, car accidents whichcome up.
And my theory is I'll never lieto my kids if they ask me a
straight answer, but I'll neverjust come home and say a police
officer was shot, killed today.
Tyra Valeriano (04:22):
Right, what is it like being with the family?
You know you have a big familyof police officers.
How is it outside of that?
I mean, do you guys havefriends that are not police
officers and how is thatrelationship, because you come
from such a long line of lawenforcement?
Carrie Matthews (04:41):
So to me it was something that was very
important was to have what wecall our civilian friends.
Yes, I have friends within thedepartment, amazing people that
I've met through 20 years whoare some very good close friends
of mine.
But I also keep myself evenkeeled with civilian friends
(05:01):
moms, dads who we can go out andjust have conversations about
goofy things our kids did orthings we want to do, and it's
not all police talk.
I really don't like to talkabout police talk or police
stories when I'm out and about.
It's just something that I'vealways been like to tell the war
stories.
I don't do that, but I preferjust to.
(05:23):
I really friends to me arepeople who have my back and
support me, so that's who Ireally will surround myself with
.
Tyra Valeriano (05:31):
I'm interested to know what your experience as
a police officer has been like.
Number one you're a mom, so Iwant to hear how that transition
was for you.
When you were doing your career, you had kids and dealing with,
of course, traumatic events,and knowing that both you and
(05:53):
your husband are police officersand you have your family, how
did you deal with that?
How do you both deal with thatand how do you, how do you, keep
the family unit together?
What's your best advice forthose out there who have the
same situation as you?
Carrie Matthews (06:07):
Well, like as always, no marriage is perfect.
We've definitely had our upsand downs, our good times.
Bad times Before I got marriedis when I got on the job.
So I got on the job in Novemberof 2004.
I was not married.
I went through the academy.
I busted my butt to prove thatI needed to be there.
(06:29):
I believe that it was somethingin my own head, but also in the
reality of my dad and hispartners, or his way of life
with police officers when theyfirst got on.
You know that women shouldn'tbe on the job, they should be
behind a desk, all that type ofstuff.
So I wanted to definitely showthat I belong there and that I
(06:52):
could do the job.
So I busted my butt in theacademy and I landed up being
the valedictorian of the class,so number one, in academics,
which I was happy about.
But I thought that at the timethat once you were number one,
(07:14):
you got to pick the place whereyou could go in Chicago, what
district, what area, and ofcourse it wasn't that.
I didn't get that, but I didgive the speech at our
graduation, which I was verynervous about.
But I succeeded and my husbandand I got married in February of
(07:36):
2008.
So four years I was on the jobbefore getting married and
starting a family, beforegetting married and starting a
family and, of course, prior tothat, you're more.
I'm going to go, do what I needto do.
I take the risks.
I'm not really thinking aboutthe after effects.
You're going to chase people,you're going to run with
(07:57):
everybody.
You're going to do all thosethings and I didn't stop doing
that once I got married and hadchildren.
But I believe after events Iwould think, oh, that could have
went really bad, that couldhave been a bad decision.
You know, you always thinkabout it after the fact, which I
still do to this day.
(08:18):
I think of everything after thefact instead of during it,
because that could get us hurt.
But we always worked my husbandand I work different shifts, so
we were able to do that for ourkids and if something went on,
we would discuss it with eachother, like I've called him at
work and ask some advice, orhe's called me and ask some
(08:40):
advice about you know, reportwriting or something that
happened or a bad call that youwere on.
We definitely would talk aboutit.
And I've had some amazingpartners, which some of them
were females.
I've been partnered with a lotof females, which is great, but,
as you know, people will stepup to female officers more than
(09:03):
they will step up to maleofficers.
So I guess we would get into itmore hands-on sometimes because
they would test us.
So it's, it's been.
I won't say it's been easy forit with family, but it's.
I don't.
I don't know any different perse what a normal family is
without having a police officerfather or without being the
(09:26):
mother of it as well.
And I'm very hypervigilant andI'm very, I guess,
overprotective, some would saywith my kids.
I'm always looking around, I'mstill asking the questions of
who is your friends, who aretheir parents?
I check their phones constantly.
Social media was a no untiljust recently, but I check their
(09:48):
phones constantly just to makesure, because you never know.
Tyra Valeriano (09:52):
You never know, and I definitely think that's a
cop parent enhanced, because I'msure all parents do that.
I can't say that my parents didthat when I was young because
social media was not around theway it is now.
But, yes, I completely agreewith that.
You touched on something that Ifeel a lot of women in law
enforcement probably still feeltoday, and that's proving
(10:14):
yourself.
Of course, your situation wasslightly different than most
women.
They're probably not doing itto make sure they can prove to
their dad or you know the peoplewho have been working with
their dad that they can do thejob, but just in general, to the
department and the agency thatthey choose hey, I can do this.
And I feel like that is a reallygreat story to hear from your
(10:36):
side, just because you come froma background where this is just
something you have in yourblood and you're doing it
because you're like, hey, dad,I'm going to show you that I can
do it.
And here you are, 20 yearslater serving your community.
Still, you have a husband inlaw enforcement and your
children have experienced thislife that most kids don't have.
So it's really great to hearthat.
(10:57):
And now I'm curious you comewith a message, and it's a
message that is very relevant towhat the podcast is about, and
it is about mental health andwellness for first responders.
Law enforcement.
You have 20 years of experience.
I'm sure you have a ton ofstories that you could tell if
(11:20):
you needed to, but tell us alittle bit about why you have
such a passion for the mentalhealth aspect in law enforcement
.
Carrie Matthews (11:31):
Well, as I'm sure a lot of us, we've lost
friends, co-workers, patrolmen,sergeants, bosses by their own
hand, by suicide.
I have lost very close friendsthat are police officers with me
by them shooting themselvesthis past July, july of 2023, I
(11:57):
would say July 31st of 2023,.
I got the phone call in of 2023, I got the phone call in
regards to my dad had taken hisown life, that he had shot
himself.
My dad was a 35-year veteranwith the police department.
He had been retired since 2009.
(12:18):
He was a very strong man, verystubborn, took care of his
family, but also had his ups anddowns with drinking and things
like that With the job.
My father was shot on the jobin 1988, doing a search warrant
(12:41):
in his lake survived it.
Search warrant in his lakesurvived it.
He was off a year, which meantthat my friends used to call him
the warden because I had acurfew.
He was very strict on where wehad to be, so the warden was
home for a year nonstop for meand it was tough for me to be
(13:02):
able to go out and do anything.
But I understand it now as towhy he was the way he was back
then Very strict.
When I did receive the call, Iwas very I'm uncertain by it.
I didn't believe it because mydad was a gun guy, he was a
(13:23):
hunter, he knew his stuff.
So I knew it wasn't an accident.
I knew it wasn't the oldcleaning their gun situation did
(13:45):
it.
But I also believe that he didnot have a plan to do it.
I believe that it was just onthe fly.
My mom was retired as well.
She worked as a Juul bake shopmanager forever.
She got the job when she was 16years old, working for Juul,
which is a grocery store here,and with it, I would say, the
past 10 years.
She was battling dementia andAlzheimer's and my dad was her
(14:07):
primary caretaker and I wouldask him would you like to put
her in a home, do you need help?
He was very much of the policementality of I don't want people
in my home, I don't wantstrangers here, I don't trust
anybody.
Okay, so me working and workingin Chicago, days off, canceled,
(14:29):
long hours, my husband the same.
We did what we could to help,but it was definitely not enough
.
I would take my mom out with thekids, I would do things with
her again as much as I could,but I believe that it wore on
him.
I'm sure what wore on him wasthe 35 years on the job of
things that he saw.
(14:50):
Times were different.
His shooting he had been inmultiple shootings, by himself
as well, on the job, and I thinkthat taking care of my mom
might've just been the tippingpoint for him.
He was not one to talk abouthis problems, he was not one to
(15:10):
complain, he was not one to askfor help.
Really, you know, it was theI'll handle it myself, I'll take
care of it myself, everything'sfine, I'm fine and that's how I
was brought up.
Like you don't you take care ofyour business.
You don't, you know, act likeyou can't.
The word can't was not okay inmy household growing up.
(15:32):
It was I can.
So I believe that's a bigreason as to why he did it.
Him and my son, my father and myson were very, very, very close
.
My son would go over thereconstantly.
My daughter and my dad werevery close.
She was also close with my momboth of them and I truly believe
(15:57):
we went to Florida for my son'sgraduation it was his gift and
I truly believe that my fatherdid it then because no one was
going to accidentally walk in orbe there or find him.
I don't believe that he wouldhave wanted my kids to find him.
My mom went out with her highschool friend who happens to be
(16:21):
my godmother.
They've known each other for 60something years and she's the
one that found my father and hadcalled me.
And again, I didn't believe it.
I started to call people to getthem to the house.
I knew that there might've beenfirearms around, that I wanted
(16:41):
other people to take custody ofthem Because, again, I think,
just like my dad, who's in thehouse, who's going to be there,
who's touching what, I wantedpeople there that I trusted.
I landed up, calling my brotherto tell him to get there, and I
was trying to get home on thefirst flight from Florida the
next morning, flight fromFlorida the next morning and
(17:02):
even going there the next dayinto the house, there was no per
se crime scene.
There was no blood, a littlebit of blood on a pillow.
There was no note, there was noanswers as to why, which, to
this day, it haunts me that Ihave no idea why.
(17:24):
And, as police officers, that'swhat we want to know.
We want to know why, who, what,when, where and why, and I
don't know.
That morning, around 1230, oneo'clock, I had sent him a
picture of my son with aMandalorian in Florida, because
my dad would ask for, basically,proof of life for my kids,
because it was very hot and hewanted to make sure that they
(17:48):
had enough water, they werecooled down and I'm thinking
well, you didn't ask me how I'mdoing.
It was all about the kids.
The grandkids were definitelyhis favorites, and so I sent him
a picture and he said oh mygosh, connor looks great.
I bet he's having a great time.
I said yes, and he said youknow, he looks like he's having
(18:09):
fun.
I said yes, and that was thelast day.
I am grieving.
Every day I don't know why.
(18:30):
I get upset, because I want toknow why.
Because he was of the type thatyou would have never guessed it
had everything together, alwaystook care of everything, made
sure we always had everythingwasn't down.
He didn't talk about things, hewouldn't say things were rough
(18:50):
with my mom, so I had no idea.
The typical signs that peoplesay are there were not there at
all.
He had made plans with my kidsmy son was starting freshman
year, my daughter was startingsixth grade my nephew.
It was his birthday the nextday.
He had had plans with them todo things.
(19:12):
So again, it was very off keyfor me to do it and then to call
his friends and tell them andeverybody was saying we didn't
know or we had no idea.
Your dad never said anything.
We would ask him things.
But it was just very upsetting,to say the least, and trying to
(19:32):
move forward with it, because Iguess you don't ever know when
it's going to come up to you Ifthink like I'm fine and I'm
dealing with it.
I actually went to qualify.
We qualify yearly and I went toqualify with my gun already
suited up.
I go out on the line and thefirst shot that I fired there's
(19:56):
tears running down my face andI'm thinking what is wrong with
me?
You know, like you don't cry atwork.
That's not professional.
And all I thought was that wasthe last sound my dad heard and
it just came rushing.
So I took a deep breath, Ifocused, I got through it and
then I just kind of broke downwith some of my partners in the
(20:20):
car.
I said just let me have thisright now.
It was two guys that were withme.
I said just let me have this.
I don't know what's going on,but and they're great but nobody
talks about it.
Nobody talks about what'shappening to you.
Nobody talks about how terribleit is, especially as a police
officer, because you're supposedto have everything together,
(20:42):
you're supposed to keepeverything together.
We're okay, we're robots, we'renot human.
We can see this and then go onto the next call.
Basically, and I have notstopped speaking about it,
speaking about how it's made mefeel the past year, how it's
made my kids feel, or how youjust can't go on, you just don't
(21:04):
move on from this.
And I've had my own terribledark thoughts, which is scary,
because they say that whensomebody in your family kills
themselves, you are 50% to 60%higher to do it yourself or
(21:25):
somebody else in your family todo it, which scares me to death.
So that's why I'm very openabout it.
I talk to my kids about it,about how I feel, about
everything.
So they know that this was notthe right answer.
So they know that this was notthe right answer, that there are
things happening.
I'm in therapy.
I was going twice a week.
(21:45):
I've gone to retreats traumaretreat which is a fabulous.
It was a fabulous free retreatthat literally, I believe, saved
my life with this.
But there was nowhere for me toturn when this first happened.
I was searching for supportgroups, first responders,
(22:05):
support groups with people whoin their world has killed
themselves.
Not just a random support groupand I don't mean random by
anybody, I just meant firstresponders because I can't sit
next to somebody that doesn'tknow a police officer's life and
explain what goes, what we see,what goes through our heads,
(22:30):
and we have the accessibility tohandguns and it's so easy.
And I didn't want to sit nextto a mom where her child did it,
because it's just as terrible.
I wanted to be with kind of thesame people that knew kind of
where I was coming from andstill being on the streets or
(22:54):
having to talk to people aboutthis because there is nothing,
there was nothing around here.
There are organizations and youcould do Zoom and you could do
this, but I wanted a place whereI just grab some chairs, get
some coffee and talk to otherpolice officers and say how
(23:15):
crappy this is and how crappy wefeel.
Or if somebody is saying, youknow, I'm having the worst day,
I wish I was gone too, we feel.
Or if somebody's saying youknow I'm having the worst day, I
wish I was gone too.
Nobody's going to freak out.
They just know that you'rehaving this bad day and let's
talk through it and know thatwe've got your back, we are here
for you.
No one's pushing you, throwingyou into the hospital
immediately.
(23:36):
We're going to talk through itand see exactly why you're
feeling that way.
So this is my goal is to getthis started, that I didn't want
it to be through the departmentor through a church, because
some people, their loved ones,they may blame the department
that it happened or church.
You know, I'm not that.
(23:56):
I'm not Catholic, I'm notLutheran.
So I was trying to keep it inthe middle of just let's go talk
somewhere, we don't needanything.
I don't trying to keep it inthe middle of just let's go talk
somewhere, we don't needanything.
I don't want to do it at a barbecause you know, sometimes sour
depression, sorrow, depressionand coppers and alcohols would
not be a great combination.
(24:17):
And I just like I said, I'm justtruthful.
I was very angry.
I didn't even want to have awake because I was so angry with
him.
But I knew, in his 75 years ofliving, people loved him.
People loved working with him.
They wanted to pay theirrespects.
My kids had the right to dothat, to pay their respects.
(24:39):
So of course we did it, but Iwas very angry there with him as
well.
I always say my theory is Iwasn't enough to keep him here,
which that's one of the biggestthings that I'm working through,
and it's just very, very hardand I want people to know that
(25:00):
our line of work is not easy.
When you put personal andprofessional and they come
together, it's just sometimesit's just a storm, a tornado in
your head of trying to push thatto the side.
Tyra Valeriano (25:15):
Thank you so much for sharing your story.
I'm really sorry for the lossof your dad.
I can't imagine what you'vebeen through Just based on what
you're saying.
That is a lot to go through,especially just in the past year
.
How would you say that thisexperience has changed your
perspective on that mentalitythat you grew up with?
(25:36):
You know, deal with yourbusiness, deal with it, and you
know, move on, You'll be okay.
Do you think that thisdrastically changed that
perspective for you?
Carrie Matthews (25:47):
I absolutely do think that it has changed my
way of thinking, because I tookthat way of my dad's thinking of
what happens in the home staysin the home.
We keep everything close to thevest.
You don't talk about yourfeelings, you don't tell people
what's going on, you just dealwith it and move on, pack it
(26:08):
away, pack it away.
And then what happens is youexplode.
And I've had that happen wherefriends of mine will go out and
we'll just talk and I'm crying.
They have no idea why that'snot fair to them, and so that's
why now I'm more of let's talkabout it.
Let's talk about what'shappening.
What's happening at home,what's happening in your head,
(26:29):
what's happening with your kids,because a lot of people aren't
talking about it.
What's happening in your head,what's happening with your kids,
because a lot of people aren'ttalking about it.
What's happening with the callyou went on?
That's a lot to take in and tojust move past it.
There's a call that I have thatjust it haunts me A
three-year-old getting sexuallyassaulted by her grandfather,
and I was fairly new on the job,but I still can see that
(26:52):
three-year-old's face and thatwas one of those times where you
think is this job for me?
What am I doing?
This really happens and there'sthese people out here that are
these monsters.
You think about it and beforeyou get on the job you think
like, oh, I know, there's badpeople, there's bad people, but
until you're on the job youdon't really see those bad
(27:13):
people, until you're in it, andthere's no going away from that.
And so 20 years of that, or 25years my dad was on the job for
35 years, 35 years of that andno talking has to take its toll.
Has to take its toll.
Five years of no talking,people in officer-involved
(27:34):
shootings it takes a toll and Iwant people to know that it's
okay to talk.
I am part of our peer supportprogram, but I also know that
people don't trust anything thathas to do with the department.
So, putting that aside, I amwilling to talk to anybody at
any time about anything in hasto do with the department.
So, putting that aside, I amwilling to talk to anybody at
any time about anything inregards to.
(27:56):
I might not know what you've,what you've gone through, what
you're going through, but I doknow what it's like to lose
somebody that you've looked upto.
That was your hero that you'veloved for one day to be there
and the next to not be there,and want to know why.
And I just I won't stop.
(28:17):
I won't stop.
And I've had some people friendstell me you know things that
you put on Facebook or thingsthat you say it's a bit much
Like, don't you think you shouldtalk to your therapist about
that?
And my response is always ifit's making you uncomfortable,
that's exactly why I need to sayit out loud.
The reason that things arehappening are because no one's
talking about it.
So I'm of the thing of yes,let's talk about it.
(28:40):
If it makes you uncomfortable,let's talk about it.
It doesn't make me comfortable.
Tyra Valeriano (28:46):
Right, and that's the stigma that I feel is
really at the forefront rightnow is your dad is a perfect
example of.
You know, the, the ultimate lawenforcement officer, served his
career.
You know so many great thingsthat you said about him.
And later on down the road, itmay not be during the career.
(29:07):
During the career, it reallyjust settles with people when
they're retired and they'rehaving to really just adjust to
their life outside of lawenforcement and really soak in
everything that they've beenthrough.
And then, of course, there's theissues that are outside of work
.
Right, you have familysituations, you have your own
(29:27):
situations and I don't knowabout you, but I know that I
dove into work anytime.
I had issues at home and Iwould just stay busy and work,
and work, and work.
And that's probably adouble-edged sword, because
you're going into work knowingthat you're going to be dealing
with more things that you'regoing to have to deal with at
some point, and then you go homeand you're just not really
(29:48):
dealing with your issues at home.
So it's a really importantmessage to not be afraid to talk
about it.
And my husband and I have thisconversation.
You know there's this man's man, this appearance or this image,
or I don't want to call it afacade, because I do think that
there is a role that men play.
You know you have to be takingcare of the family.
(30:11):
There's just this role that menwant to have in their family,
understandably.
But when it comes to talkingabout the things that you're
struggling with, this is whereit has to change, and it doesn't
mean that you have to hold allthat in and this does not just
apply to men, it's obviouslywomen too.
But law enforcement, in thefirst responder field, there's
(30:38):
so much that the average personwill never experience in their
entire life, and here we aredealing with it on a daily basis
.
So, now that you are seeing atherapist and you are a part of
the peer support group, what doyou think is the biggest benefit
that you've seen from takingthat step?
Carrie Matthews (30:53):
So for me expressing that I go to a
therapist, I'm not embarrassedby it, I'm not ashamed by it,
and for me taking a social mediaand expressing how I feel, I've
actually had more people cometo me or send me messages in
regards to you know what?
I had a plan to kill myself, orI was wanting to do this, or I
(31:17):
wanted to do that, or do youhave five minutes to talk?
I have found that more peoplenow open up about it, because I
started the conversation andI'll say, okay, well, did you
try this or did you try that?
I?
I tried EMDR for the first time, which was an amazing thing.
(31:37):
Some in this group that I'm inwith this retreat, they call it
voodoo, bullshit and.
But it really worked.
But you don't know how it workshow it?
works and I'm.
It's a I wrap, it's I rapidmovement, desensitization, and
it's they do something withtheir fingers and your eyes.
(32:04):
You focus on one traumaticevent and they keep asking
questions over and over how doesthat make you feel?
Or let's go with that.
Let's go with that, and it'sjust something with your eyes
and your brain and restructuringit, where the trauma, when you
think about it, is still there,but it's not as emotional.
I suggest, if you haven't triedit, I definitely would look it
up and try it, because it's notamazing.
(32:26):
You know it sounds like oh wow,this is, you know the end, all,
but it's it helps.
It helps to get you through thenext step of what you're going
to try to heal.
It's actually something that Inever knew of about.
It's not hypnotizing oranything.
It's just your brain, your eyesand your way of thinking is
(32:48):
changing in the moment oftalking with the therapist and
your way of thinking is changingin the moment of talking with
the therapist.
And I've told people to do that.
I've told people to go to thisretreat that I constantly am
with.
I go to it, I help out whateverthey need, because I believe in
it.
I believe in talking about thisopenness and I know that there
(33:09):
are people that are the onesthat's saying I'm going to do it
, I'm going to do it.
They're showing the signs andI'm ready, right there, to step
in as well.
My fear is again, the ones whereyou don't see any signs.
It's the, it's the one that'sso happy, or they look like they
have their whole life togetherand they don't.
(33:30):
And at what?
I've told my therapist this andI've, at this retreat I've gone
to, I've even said I said I'mthe happiest person in the room.
I can make everybody laugh, Icould talk to everybody.
You guys would have no ideathat slowly on the inside I'm
dying.
And when you come out with thetruth of that, and when you come
(33:54):
out with the truth of that,then people kind of understand
like wait, I'm the same way.
You know, like you said, youdive into work a thousand
percent because you would ratherdeal with other people's
problems.
I'd rather deal with otherpeople's problems and deal with
my own.
We're fixers, so let's fix it.
Show me what, when, when.
But then for ourselves, we putourselves on the back burner and
all of a sudden we're justgetting pushed away and pushed
(34:16):
down, and pushed down until weexplode.
And then where do you start?
You don't even know where tostart with talking about your
feelings or thoughts.
Tyra Valeriano (34:25):
Right.
I want to go back to what yousaid about not feeling enough
that that crossed your mindbecause there was no answers and
I can relate to you a littlebit in this.
I've talked about this story ina different podcast, but when I
just want to touch a little biton it because I can relate to
what you're saying.
(34:46):
My grandfather he was in thearmy.
He retired from the army.
He was a very high ranking inthe army and I was very close to
my grandfather when I waslittle and I remember when I was
about five years old, he waswalking into the garage and he
told me hey, I'm really sick,and something along the lines
(35:08):
that he probably was not goingto make it.
So I was under the impressionthat my grandfather had died in
the hospital, because after thatconversation I didn't see him
again.
And it wasn't until I was 17years old that I found out that
my grandfather shot himself inthe room that I used to live in
for my whole entire childhoodand he obviously planned this.
(35:31):
He thought he was going to doit.
He knew he was going to do it.
So much to the fact that hetold me that.
But when I became an adult and I, you know, once I was 17 and I
realized what actually happened,I'm sure my mom and my grandma
went through the same emotionsas why, and were we not enough?
And there was also no notes.
Why, and were we not enough?
(35:54):
And there was also no notes.
So it leaves you wondering justwhat exactly it.
Maybe it's not one thing, butyou're going through your head
wondering what the heck happened.
Well, you know, as a kid, I'mfive years old and now that I'm
17 and understanding what did Ido?
Did I do something that hedidn't like?
And you know my, my grandma, mymom, just all these things are
going through your head and it,you know my, my grandma, my mom,
just all these things startgoing through your head and it's
, of course, it's not an answeryou're ever going to get.
(36:16):
So it's like talking to someoneis a great way to go about that
, because you're never going toget the answer that you want,
but being able to express thatto somebody and hear that, hey,
you are enough, and it wasn'tyou, you know it wasn't you, but
it's the reassurance, becauseyou can't help but think the
negative things that pop intoyour head just from time to time
(36:39):
, it's very difficult to dealwith.
So, with that being said, whatdo you think is a good way to
approach somebody that you workwith that isn't showing any
signs.
You know the happy person.
What's a good conversationstarter?
To check in on the people youwork with your partners and make
(37:00):
sure that everybody's okay.
What do you think is the bestway to do that?
Carrie Matthews (37:04):
So I am a very social person, have always been
my whole life and I'll talk toeverybody, anybody in the room,
you're new, you're old, you'vebeen there, whatever.
I will go up to you and I'lltalk to everybody.
I like to learn about theirlives or talk to them about
their kids.
How's your family, how's yourwife, how's your husband, what's
(37:24):
going on?
And then sometimes I just cansee in people I don't know
really how to explain it, justthey might not have to say it to
me just their way they are orhow they've been.
And I might just ask somebodystraight out like, how are you
doing?
And oh, I'm fine.
(37:45):
No, really, how are you doing?
Because we're all fine, everypolice officer is fine, every
police officer is okay, everypolice officer is okay.
And then I just kind of willmake them uncomfortable with not
just going like, oh, okay,you're fine, high five, you know
, see, a checkoff, it's more ofwell, what do you mean?
You know, or I know that you'regoing through this, or I heard
(38:06):
that your daughter's sick, orhow are you doing?
And sometimes that they willopen up a little more.
But my thing is, with the I'mfine or I'm okay, just question
it a little bit further.
Well, what do you mean?
You're okay, how do you knowyou're okay?
And it's actually come to helpme with that and because I like
(38:27):
to say that too, like, oh, howare you, I'm fine.
And they're like, oh, okay, areyou fine?
I'm really not fine.
You know, they know that.
And with the I am, you know,was I enough?
I actually got that tattooed onmy left wrist.
I had a ribbon for suicide onone side and my mom just passed
(38:48):
away, august of 2024, fromAlzheimer's.
So half of it is Alzheimer'sawareness and half is suicide
awareness.
And on my dad's side it says Iam enough.
Just to remind myself that I am.
It wasn't me as much as I willnever be sure that it wasn't To
(39:11):
remind myself that, no matterwhat I'm doing in this life, I
am enough.
I was raised a not the bestchildhood, not the worst
childhood, but very strict.
You know, do as you're told, dothis, we don't whine, we don't
cry.
There was no crying in my housegrowing up.
(39:32):
There was no waiting for thingsout.
It was pretty much what my dadsaid goes, you don't question
him.
I don't believe I ever swore inthat house growing up, and so
that's where I think that Iwonder all the time my dad
wasn't one never said I love you.
So you wonder that.
(39:54):
And now, with my kids, I tellthem daily, almost to exhaustion
, that I love them.
I want them to always know that, and and I tell my coworkers
too like you mean a lot to me,and one of my things that I
always say to everybody now isyour life matters.
I don't care who you are, Idon't care what you think is
(40:15):
happening.
Your bills, work sucks you knowwe all have supervisors that
suck things, but your lifematters, it's not.
This bad moment is going topass at some point.
I'm not going to say with asnap of a finger but things will
pass.
(40:36):
And I've even noticed in myselfwhen I'm having a really bad day
, if I just take a shower orjust walk outside, I'm actually
feeling better within that fiveminutes of.
Wow, I was really in the darkover there, but now I'm in the
light and I don't want to go toany more suicide funerals.
I don't want to have to tell myfriends I know what you're
(40:59):
going through.
I don't want anybody to knowwhat I'm going through and I
don't want my kids to ever feelhow that feels for somebody else
.
I think their grandfather andthen my mom.
It was enough for them.
I mean, that's two differentways that they both passed.
But for little kids it's verytrying and they're still not the
(41:25):
same.
They're still not the same andI just think that taking the
time, sometimes a five-minuteconversation, could just change
somebody's whole attitude.
Or they believe and think thatyou care and that you really
want to know how they areinstead of the pass-by in the
hall.
Tyra Valeriano (41:44):
Right, you know, as police officers I will, and
maybe you could disagree with me.
I'm not sure where you stand onthis but there becomes a point
where in my career you know youstart to dislike people in
general and you're not.
I've never really adjusted backinto being the extrovert that I
(42:07):
used to be prior to being inlaw enforcement.
I like people.
Now, now that I'm out of lawenforcement, I have learned that
some of the things that Iexperienced and that I chose to
close off and the perceptionsthat I have were very skewed
because of the job.
But you know, you do have tomake that a skill and you don't
(42:29):
have to be fake about it.
It's something that if you wantto actually make a difference
and tell somebody hey, you know,are you okay?
And I'm here to take the timeto listen, to work on that skill
, because we kind of lose thatalong the way in law enforcement
, where we're just hearingeverybody's problems, even
(42:49):
though we're trying to help themfix it, we end up having just
this view of we can't fix peoplebecause they keep doing it over
and over and over.
No matter how many times I tryto help them, they don't listen
and it gets old and we just kindof stop having this same
feeling of caring that we didback when we first became a
police officer.
(43:10):
Do you feel that that's kind ofsomething that we would have to
work on as law enforcementofficers?
Carrie Matthews (43:17):
Absolutely.
I joke about it that you know Ihate everybody.
I hate everybody equally and Idon't want to.
It's I feel like with this jobwe see the worst side of people
and we see no one's calling ussaying, hey, here's some cookies
, come to my house.
I just made this huge meal foryou guys.
(43:38):
It's always basicallysomebody's worst day.
That that's why we're showingup, and so we just start to get
tainted and our views on peopleare like oh great, here we go
again, this domestic again, andas much as we know, not
everything's routine andanything can happen at any
(43:59):
moment.
You know these people.
You're like oh, I hate thesepeople.
Can't they just get it togetheror can't they just move on?
And we know in reality when weactually sit and think about it,
they can't.
That's why they're calling us,that's why they need our help.
But I will say that I am not afan of groups or crowds or going
(44:22):
into restaurants.
I definitely do always have myback to the wall so I could see
everything that's going on infront of me and very distrusting
of people.
When people will tell me things, or just somebody walking past
saying something to my kids, youknow like, oh, I like your
shirt and of course in my headI'm thinking oh well, why do you
(44:43):
like their shirt?
Have you been looking at mydaughter?
You know things like that whereyou just what I say.
Normal people don't think likethat.
They just think that somebodywalked by and liked your
daughter's shirt.
Tyra Valeriano (44:55):
And I feel like right.
Carrie Matthews (44:57):
We do need to redirect our thoughts sometimes,
because not everybody in theworld is bad.
Not everybody's out to hurt us,you know.
Not everyone's trying to stealmy kids, even though they'll
bring them right back.
Tyra Valeriano (45:09):
Yeah, I like to think that too.
Okay, you know what if you want, but you know there's keepers,
you found it.
No refunds.
Carrie Matthews (45:20):
Yeah, right, but no I agree with you.
Disliking of people is yes.
Tyra Valeriano (45:26):
There was also something that you mentioned
about, you know, not wanting togo into the agency for help and
I've talked about this a lot toowhere, as a supervisor, I had a
couple officers who did come tome and you know you can only do
so much before you realize, hey, where are the resources at,
you know?
And officers don't want to usewhat the department or the
(45:49):
agency is giving them as aresource because they feel that
they're going to pry and they'renot safe to talk about what
they want to talk about, because, oh, I might, you know, be put
on admin leave.
What if they don't like what Isaid?
What's going on in my head?
They're going to find out, andthen there goes my job and all
these fears are there.
So, now that this experiencethat you've had, has it helped
(46:13):
you, you know, maybe make someconnections or networking for
the agency, or has the agencystepped in and maybe provided
some resources for officerswhere they don't have to go
through a supervisor or humanresources?
Carrie Matthews (46:29):
So, yes, I actually my therapist, I
actually use our EAPA, ouremployee assistance program.
I have a great therapist therewho's been with me a while, is
kind of on to my BS.
You know, when I say I'm okay,she's like okay.
Or when I all of a sudden feellike I'm, she always says don't
(46:50):
disappear on me, don't stopshowing up, because we all go
through those depression stages,and she, I know, is trying to
get the word out about thatthere is help and that you
aren't going to lose your job ifyou talk, and they do programs,
seminars, just like our uniondoes.
(47:12):
I just think that, like you said, anytime people think that they
go to a boss at work that theyare going to be penalized or
pointed out as that's the blacksheep of the watch or something
like that.
But I do believe that thatstereotype is changing because
more people are going to bossesfor help and they are sending
(47:33):
them somewhat in rightdirections.
I have some friends, very goodfriends, that are higher ups,
that are all about it and wanthelp.
But it takes the person to comeup and ask for the help because
there are places that you cango that don't have anything to
do with the department that areoutside the department that you
(47:54):
could talk to, and there are alot of seminars or a lot of
retreats, and people will postthem and share them in groups,
police officer groups or ChicagoPolice Department groups, and
if I've gone to some of them,I'll personally say I went to
this and it's not, you know,it's no BS, it's straightforward
(48:18):
.
They're not going to hurt you,they're not looking to
hospitalize you, they're notlooking to take your job away.
And I think that that's whathelps too is word of mouth of
people seeking help, no matterwhere they go, and saying I went
there and actually I feelbetter, or I am getting better,
or it did help me, it did workfor me, and I think that that
(48:40):
helps as well.
And I know that they are doingmore trainings for supervisors,
but I can't speak of thatbecause I'm not one.
More trainings for supervisors,but I can't speak of that
because I'm not one, but IChicago police department has a
very high suicide rate amongstthe officers, which is very sad,
(49:02):
you know, and again, I wish Icould stop them all and I wish I
could.
But I will not stop speakingabout it and bringing it, you
know, to the forefront of whatwe're doing, because if one
person could say, oh well,carrie said that, or, you know,
carrie said I could call her, orshe said I could go to this
place, or this place is safe,you know what, then what she's
saying might be true and I mighttry it.
(49:23):
And if I could literally helpone person just change their
mindset, then I would feel goodabout it.
I'll feel pretty good about it.
Tyra Valeriano (49:32):
I agree we are running out of time, but there
is a question that I do like toask all of my guests, and it's
based on their experience andwhat they've just went through
in their career.
What would be one piece ofadvice that you would give your
rookie self?
Carrie Matthews (49:52):
Don't take it all home in your head.
Don't let it rent space in yourhead that you have to talk
about it, let alone to yourpartner, your spouse, somebody.
But don't try to do it allyourself, because eventually you
will explode, and then you'realready too far to start with
(50:17):
the one thing that was botheringyou.
You could have stopped it.
Tyra Valeriano (50:23):
That's good advice.
I agree with that as well, andI think that's an important
message that newer officersshould hear even current
officers should hear, and Ithank you so much, carrie, for
sharing your story, yourexperience.
I completely love your messageand I am so sorry for the things
(50:43):
that you've experienced overthe past couple years.
I think what you are doing withyour experience is great and I
think it's a in addition to whatlaw enforcement needs.
I hope that the listeners wereable to get some insight on what
they can do or where they cango if they are struggling with
these same struggles.
Is there any contactinformation that you can share
(51:05):
with the listeners in case theywant to reach out to you?
Carrie Matthews (51:18):
So, yes, if they want to reach out to me,
I'm on Instagram as shy citygirl.
I'm on LinkedIn as CarrieMatthews.
Tyra Valeriano (51:20):
Thank you so much to the listeners.
Thank you guys for tuning in.
I hope you guys got somevaluable information today and
if there is one message that youcan take away from today, it is
to talk to someone, share withsomebody what you're going
through and just break thatstigma.
I appreciate your guys' support.
Thank you, carrie.
Again.
(51:41):
Everyone be safe and I will seeyou on the next one.
Thank you for joining me onChapter Blue.
If you enjoyed enjoyed today'sepisode, be sure to follow and
tag me on social media and sharewith your friends and fellow
officers.
If you're interested in joiningan episode, I'd love for you to
be a part of the conversation.
Until next time, stay safe,take care of yourself and
remember you're never alone inthis journey.
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