January 7, 2025 • 45 mins
Doug White shares his profound journey from law enforcement to retirement, discussing the struggles of identity and mental health that follow a career behind the badge. By confronting his past, he talks about the importance of vulnerability, honesty, and seeking help, ultimately encouraging others to embrace their healing journeys.
• Doug's introduction as a veteran officer with a rich career
• The challenges faced during the transition to retirement
• The exploration of identity post-uniform
• Confronting psychological struggles deeply rooted in service
• The role of honesty and vulnerability in the healing process
• Insights from Doug's book, "Hiding in Plain Sight"
• The power of storytelling in forging connections and healing
• The importance of a supportive environment for first responders
• Doug’s key recommendations for current officers seeking balance and wellbeing
It's an episode you don't want to miss!
Books Mentioned:
- "Hiding in Plain Sight: The Truth about Trauma, Service, and the way Forward" by Doug White
Podcast:
- Tell This Story
Contact:
- DougWhiteOfficial.com
- Instagram: @tell_this_story
Let us know what you loved about this episode!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Tyra Valeriano (00:01):
Welcome to Chapter Blue, the podcast where
we discuss the world of lawenforcement through an honest
conversation on tough orcontroversial topics, real
stories, perspectives andexperience from officers all
around the world.
Whether you're here forinsights on mental health,
self-care, work-life balance,getting into law enforcement,
getting out of law enforcement,or just trying to learn about
(00:21):
personal and professionalchallenges officers face every
day, you've come to the rightplace.
I'm your host, tyra Valeriano,and whether I'm going solo or
speaking with a guest, eachepisode will discuss different
aspects of life behind the badge.
Let's turn the page and stepinto Chapter Blue.
Welcome back to Chapter Blueand thank you to those tuning in
(00:43):
for another episode.
Today's guest is a veteran and aretired officer with over 30
years of experience.
He comes with a joining missionto create a space where first
responders, veterans and theirfamilies can have those hard
conversations and reassure themthat their voice matters.
He's also published a book andstarted his own podcast.
It is my pleasure to introduceto you Doug White and to let him
(01:07):
tell us a little more abouthimself.
So go ahead, doug.
Doug White (01:11):
Good morning.
First, thank you very much foryour time and for giving me
access to your platform and youraudience here.
I'm very excited for ChapterBlue and what's Next for you.
So, yeah, just happy to be here.
Let's have a conversation aboutme.
I'm in Tampa, florida.
I was born and raised here.
(01:32):
I spent time in the military,assigned not here.
I was in Washington andfinished my active duty time and
came back here to Florida andworked for the sheriff's office
for 25 years and retired in Julyof 23.
So just doing the podcast andthe book thing, but we can turn
(01:52):
it into some speakingengagements.
Tyra Valeriano (01:55):
Very nice.
What is your retired life like?
It's been.
What a year now.
Doug White (02:00):
Yeah, a little over a year.
It's crazy, you know you don't.
Everybody says, well, you know,retire it's fantastic, or you
know I've got to find somethingto do.
There's so much more toretirement than just not working
, especially transitioning outof the first responder.
(02:22):
You know cultures and all thatstuff.
I'm sure you know.
You know very well about allthat stuff, but you know you're
this thing or these things forso many years.
You wake up the next morningand you're not that thing
anymore.
Um, you know you have to findnew, new purpose, new mission,
new meaning persona.
Um, depending on how in depthyou were involved in that
(02:42):
persona, your organization mayhave to find all new friends.
It's a very daunting thing, butthere is a win.
You can get through it.
Finding a coach such asyourself, some others out there
that are doing great work inthis space, it has been a
(03:03):
journey.
I've learned so much aboutmyself, but it took about.
It took probably three or fourmonths just for everything to
quiet down and it was dark for awhile.
Then you start trying to figureout the things that you want to
do, more or less by finding outwhat you don't want to do.
(03:24):
And, yeah, once you have thatbreakthrough everything gets
clear and it's nice, but it iscertainly a transition.
Tyra Valeriano (03:33):
Were you prepared in any way for the
transition?
Did you have any hobbies oranything that you were doing
outside of work that made thattransition a little easier?
Doug White (03:44):
No, the problem for me and I wrote a book about it I
was one of the people that wereoverinvested in the persona,
overinvested in the professionof what I was doing.
Yeah, I had the office and, ofcourse, I had a family.
I've been married four and ahalf years now to the same
person and had two teen kids,but everything came before that.
(04:09):
I was the very last primary.
Everything was the job, it wasthe mission, it was the
organization, the persona, youknow, and pretty much in that
order.
So my hobbies were either workor tagging along with the family
, doing the family things.
Um, I found triathlon uh,probably god, going on like a
(04:33):
couple years ago now and, uh, Ifound that physical fitness and
competing in triathlon wassomething that was able to stave
off a lot of the issues I washaving.
Wasn't aware that I was having.
Um, so the, the running and thefitness and triathlon, it was a
.
It was a very big part ofhelping in that transition.
(04:54):
Other than hobbies and thingsthat I enjoyed, nothing, nothing
to move into.
It's not like I was going to gofish or race motorcycles or
build a classic or anything likethat.
It was just, uh, retire andfind out what's next.
You know what am I going to dowhen I grow up.
Tyra Valeriano (05:11):
I have a lot of questions just based on what you
just shared.
First, um, you said that youreally just would you say that
your identity revolved aroundwork.
Was that who you were?
Were you the cop, is that whatyou would introduce yourself as
or bring it into conversationthat that's what you would do?
Doug White (05:29):
No, I didn't have to .
People knew.
When I walked into a room, Ijust had that swagger and the
presence about me.
It's not like I wore 5.11 pantsand thin blue line t-shirts all
over the place because I didn't.
The hypervigilance was there.
It's not like I was a walkingbillboard or anything, but it's
who I was.
All my decisions were based onwhich right, which wrong.
(05:54):
Is this safe?
Is this not safe?
What would the organizationthink?
How does this better serve theorganization, the mission and
the profession?
Tyra Valeriano (06:02):
Like I said everything else came last.
You did mention that everythingcame last, including yourself.
So when you retired, what doyou think was the biggest
struggle?
Or when did you realize, hey, Ididn't prioritize myself at all
?
Did you recognize that in thefield or did you really just
feel that more when you retired?
Doug White (06:23):
It was before I retired.
Actually, I was experiencingall of the physiological and
emotional issues that come alongwith complex PTSD.
The sleep was awful and hadbeen for years and years.
There were unresolved militaryissues for my service.
I was in from 93 to late 07.
(06:46):
So I spent 14 and a half yearsof service, plus 25 years with
the sheriff's office.
I was active in active reservesand so in the agency I worked
in, you know, we the last year Iworked we were last year, the
full year before I retired wewere over a million CAD calls
(07:08):
for service.
You know we're the largestagency in the country and it was
busy.
Having been a supervisor, I wasa lieutenant at one point and
there was no slowing me down.
I was at every call.
If there was a fight to be had,I was there.
If there was a chase I wasthere, threw down foot chases,
car chases.
I used to track with K-9 as alieutenant.
I mean, I was fully involvedand engaged in everything that I
(07:32):
did and I tried to outrun allof those things.
Like you know, it'll get betterwhen I'm a captain.
It'll get better when I get today shift.
It'll be better when I'm acaptain, or to get better when I
get to day shift.
It'll be better when I becomethe bomb squad commander, it'll
be better when this was alwaysup that moving goalpost, that
things will be better when I hitthe next benchmark.
And I never took time to reallystop and say hey, does everybody
(07:58):
else have nightmares?
If they can go to sleep?
The nightmares is thin.
Why am I tired at two o'clockin the afternoon?
I've got blood work done.
Why is my testosterone 168?
It should be 7 to 8 or 900.
All of these things.
Why am I angry when one of mykids does this?
(08:19):
When your body is in a constantstate of 8 or 9 out of 10, any
little thing that's stepped toten is very quick.
And I got promoted in 2018 tolieutenant and went to midnight
shift and, being more senior inmy career and senior in age at
(08:43):
the time, trying to adjust tomidnight shifts is not an easy
thing to do, especially whenyou're already having sleep
issues.
It happened again for years.
I was sleeping an hour to maybethree hours a day on days off,
and days off Sleep out near theold deal.
Of course, you never go to thedoctor and get checked out and
(09:05):
just you know go for a longerrun, you know drink more protein
or eat more protein, and youknow you don't pay attention to
that stuff.
And it got to a point, aboutApril to October of 2019, where
(09:25):
things that you're able tomanage when you're not sleeping
you can't manage anymore.
So those things physical issues, the actual physical pain, the
emotional issues, the mentalissues, the nightmares just
became more and more increased.
Couple that with having 24deputies and four supervisors
(09:45):
working for me and, uh, you know, one of the busiest sections
county those things start toplay on you and I was having
panic attacks and anxietyattacks, sometimes one and two a
day.
Uh, basically average aboutfour a week.
Uh, full-on, like I couldn'tget my armor, my shirt, my gun
(10:06):
belt off quick enough, laying onthe floor of my office with the
door closed and locked, I had afull on panic attack.
Nobody knew I was highperforming, no one had any clue.
The break came in October 2019.
I'm sitting behind a schoollooking at this orange traffic
(10:27):
cone.
It's 3 o'clock in the morningand it just came to me.
We got a pistol in the hip andit scared me because you and any
other first responder out thereI'm sure have had their fair
share of death notificationsdeath scenes and that's by
suicide they had to respond to.
So we can understand themechanics of it and the act of,
(10:49):
but I never was able toreconcile that for me.
I am having this thought and Irealize I'm actually staring at
my pistol right now.
That was the breaking moment.
It was enough to scare me butnot enough for me to get help.
That came three hours laterwhen I arrived home and my wife
was awake being awake on aSunday morning at 6 am is not
(11:12):
something she normally did and Iwalked in.
She asked me if I wouldconsider going to marriage
counseling with her.
It's crazy because we had noidea, and wouldn't, for months
later that three hours prior tothat, I had a pistol in my hand
thinking about taking my life,and we'd never had a
(11:33):
conversation like that beforemarriage counseling or anything
like that.
But you know, of course I hitmy knees.
Literally I was on my knees,hands clasped, crying.
My knees literally I was on myknees, hands clasped, crying
Probably the first tears I hadshed in the better part of 15 to
20 years, and the new tearsthey do burn quite a bit.
And, yeah, I begged and pleadedand it was her request.
(12:00):
That was actually her way ofnot being critical of me knowing
that if she had asked me to dothat with her, with us, that I
would get help, and if she hadcome at me with you're broken,
get help, that would not havelanded at all the way that she
did it.
(12:21):
Yeah, it was her strength thatled me to get help and that
started things.
There were some career hiccupsto my health issues and
performance issues later on, butmy off-road to retirement was
about 39 months.
I got a master's degree in thattime, got therapy and started
(12:44):
healing and all this other stuffand but I wasn't there.
So when I did retire there wasa half dozen things that I could
have done that would fall inline with what people would have
believed that I would do.
I still didn't know and itwasn't really until April of May
of this year that it finally Ifinally figured it out.
Tyra Valeriano (13:06):
That's a long answer to a very short question
so no, no, that's thank you forsharing that, and that's
actually as real and raw as youcould possibly get.
How was that conversation withyour wife?
I mean, you know, three hourslater you have her coming to you
.
I'm sure there's emotion therefor you, did you?
Did you take that as yes, I'mgoing to do it, I'm willing, or
(13:28):
was that?
Did it feel like a hit to you,you know?
Did you feel lower?
How did you have thatconversation with her?
Doug White (13:34):
It was.
It was actually kind of weirdCause I went immediately into
problem solving.
Not like I'm going to getmyself help in this way,
absolutely Whatever I can do tomake us better, what's going on?
What have I done?
What can I do, you know, turninto a perfect husband?
Still not getting it.
But it became veryaccommodating and we went to the
(13:56):
first counseling session thefollowing week and, you know, at
the end of the session thecounselor said there's nothing I
can do for you.
Tyra Valeriano (14:05):
I literally threw my hands in the air.
I was like, oh, that's it, andit was over.
Doug White (14:08):
My wife was confused , and so was the counselor.
She said no, you don'tunderstand.
You're each other's bestfriends.
I can give you a book to readon communication and boundaries,
but other than that there'snothing for you to work on.
I was very, very confused andOther than that, there's nothing
for you to work on.
I was very, very confused andthen that's when the
conversation turned to me.
I said how are you sleeping?
(14:29):
And my wife answered he doesn'tsleep.
And she elaborated and said no,for the better part of 15 years
I've laid awake and watched him.
He fights in his sleep, hestops breathing, he cries in his
sleep.
He doesn't dream.
If he does, it's a nightmare.
She said it was theheartbreaking thing she's ever
(14:50):
had to watch.
It really shocked me, tyra,because I'm sitting there
thinking and she didn't knowthis part.
But for six months leading upto this moment, I thought I was
just a huge bag of shit, I'm notcapable of being loved and I'm
not capable of being loved andI'm not deserving of love and
I'm just all these horriblethings.
And you know, I'm a lost cause.
(15:12):
And it turns out that, you know, I thought she hated my guts.
She basically not basically.
She literally paid attention toevery waking and sleeping
breath that I took.
It was just surreal.
Months later, I was here withher, where I was, just hours
(15:34):
prior to that, and it was justrecently, probably.
No, it was just after the book.
I handed her the manuscript andI said before this thing goes
to publish, is there anythingthat we need to take out?
And she read it cover to coverand she said there's things in
there that we've never spoken,there's things in here that I've
(15:54):
never put words to.
I didn't know.
It bothered me until I startedwriting.
I asked her at that point.
I said you know, when I camehome, you were awake that night.
What was your thought process?
She says, I was awake all nightpraying for you one to come
home safe just as I had alwaysdone at least one more time and
(16:15):
asking for guidance, what Icould do, what we could do to
save us and to save you, to saveus and to save you.
And I told her.
I said you know, it's funny thatyou mentioned faith, because
during that time I saw nogreater power.
I didn't see God.
There was nothing in my life.
It was darkness, hopelessness,completely vacant.
(16:38):
And before I could finish mysentence, she said did it ever
occur to you that you didn'thave to, because someone had
been praying for your safety forthe last 15 years?
You didn't see anything.
You didn't have to see God.
I was taking care of that.
And to know that she was awakedoing that Same time I was
(17:02):
holding a pistol Just now.
I'll never be and I'll neverbelieve anything else in this
world other than the fact thatmy wife was sent to me all those
years ago to save me.
Yeah, it wasn't an all at oncething.
(17:23):
It took a lot of time, a lot ofyears, a lot of introspection,
a lot of journaling, writing, alot of reading different books,
trying to get to the point whereI'm at now, and I am
unrecognizable now than evenwhen I was three months ago.
Tyra Valeriano (17:38):
That's great.
Doug White (17:39):
It's a journey.
Tyra Valeriano (17:41):
It is a journey.
What would you say is somethingthat helped you the most out of
all of the things or techniquesthat you used to try to get to
the bottom of where you neededto do your healing or you needed
to work on yourself?
What helped you the most out ofall of those things that you
did?
Doug White (18:00):
For me.
I don't like to use the wordvulnerability because that makes
it sound like it's a weakness.
Honesty, just taking a long,hard look and, um no, I don't
want you to have to put theparental control, uh have on
your podcast, but uh, I foundthat owning all of your shit,
(18:24):
every bit of it, the stuff youdon't want to talk about, the
stuff that uh, uh, that youdon't want to tell yourself you
have to.
The only way you're going toget through any of this is if
you face it and do the workintentionally and walk through
it.
You have to.
You've got to be still tofigure it out.
Once you figure it out, youhave to be honest, Continue
(18:47):
living the way you have beenliving or is there a better way?
And if there's a better way,you have to do the work.
You know I had to own myshortfalls as a husband.
I had to own my shortfalls as adad.
You know I gave everything to aprofession and to an
organization that was incapableof loving me back.
These are inanimate objects.
(19:09):
They're not capable of love orfeeling.
They're machines.
I placed my trust and my worthand my value in what I got from
that place.
It was a lot of rentedadmiration.
Quite frankly, the day youretire doesn't mean shit.
(19:31):
You give them back all of theirstuff, all of the things that
made you that thing, you giveback.
So once you realize that andyou own that, then you have to
atone for it and have thoseconversations with the people
you love and the people wholoved you.
So I did that and that that camethrough in the book.
(19:52):
So the book is it's an apologyletter to anyone who's loved me
for the last 30 years.
It's a love letter to my wife.
It's a love letter to myself.
I've had people call me, fromtier one operators to brand new
first responders who said thisknow, this is, this is fantastic
(20:14):
.
Or, hey, man, how come younever told me?
Or this is an owner's manualfor for any spouse and how to
deal with their their firstresponder and, um, you know
there's so many things in thisthat I've learned, but it all
started with owning a journeythe real, every bit of it.
Tyra Valeriano (20:33):
Tell us a little more about your book.
First, what's the name of yourbook and what prompted you to
want to write a book?
Doug White (20:40):
It's actually a funny story.
The second part the book iscalled Hiding in Plain Sight the
Truth About Karma Service andthe Way Forward.
The book started off as metalking trash, like hey, what
are you going to do when youretire?
It was like almost, quiteliterally, the million dollar
question what are you going todo?
(21:00):
I'm going to go work for thegovernment, go and support
special operations, I'm going togo teach bonds and bad guys,
like I did when I was acontractor, or I'll teach
undergrad.
I'll go teach college, becauseI used to teach in the academies
and I really enjoyed it, butnone of that stuff was setting
(21:23):
me on fire.
So I was like I'm going towrite a book.
I literally said that on theway out the door after my cake
party at the district.
I'm going to write a book.
I thought, what About all ofthis?
A couple of people were likeuh-oh.
Tyra Valeriano (21:38):
About all of this.
That says enough.
Doug White (21:41):
It's like what's he going to say, what's he know?
First of all, I don't get intoroom work, conjecture any of
that stuff.
It's not my business and Idon't care it's somebody else's
business.
But I business and I don't careit's somebody else's business.
But you know, I didn't knowwhat I was going to do and I
just sat down a few weeks afterI retired and I just started
typing on the laptop and I foundthat I was very honest with the
(22:04):
blank pages on the blank screenand just I mean, it's pouring
out of me.
I was typing away One day Iknocked out about 10,000 words
just sitting there not realizingwhere the time had gone, and it
got really, really dark becauseI was just letting loose of
things that I never thoughtbothered me, and one thing would
lead into another and anotherand another Started talking
(22:27):
about calls and events that Ihad gone to, found myself
actually at one point pushingaway from the whole project for
about six weeks because I wasjust a little ramped up.
And after several months I readwhat I had written.
It was probably January of thisyear, so probably six months of
(22:48):
just journaling.
I had about 77,000 words and aprinted paperback that's just
over 100 pages or something likethat, and I saw that I had
written myself in this hero'sjourney as a victim or a
bystander.
All of these things happened tome, and I think anybody who's
(23:09):
ever met me personally or hasever worked with me would never
use the word victim to describeme, and I didn't know why I'd
ever thought that of myself.
So I went back through it and Istarted working out every one
of those issues.
Why would I think this?
Why would I say that?
And I realized that it was thejournal that I should have been
(23:30):
keeping for 30 years, because,yes, journaling works.
I'm here to tell you as aperson who thought it was all
garbage it works.
Put that aside and startedtalking about the lessons I
learned from that in my 30 yearsof military and law enforcement
service.
And what this book is now Hidingin Plain Sight is the answers
(23:54):
to all of those questions.
Why would I think that?
What do I see now?
What is the way forward?
Very, very little of what's inthis book is what was in that
journal.
It's the answers to the journal, and that's really what it came
out of Me, just figuratively,given the bird.
As I walked out the door, thepanic people turned out to be
(24:19):
this great and powerful thing.
That's really.
I mean I've sold 600 copies.
It's been out for less than amonth now.
That's great.
Yeah, I don't know 600 peoplewho can read, so I'm I'm feeling
pretty good about it.
Um, but the feedback that I'mgetting is just, it's incredible
.
It's making a difference whatyou're doing here with chapter
(24:41):
blue and, and your next thing,this is making a difference.
Um, it'll.
You know.
You asked me before we startedabout the podcast and the book
and how everything's going it.
Uh, it takes a minute get legs,but once it does, there's not
going to be a day that goes bythat you're not going to get a
text or a message or somefeedback of someone that what
you're doing is helping.
It really is.
(25:02):
This is fantastic.
We all came into being a firstresponder because we wanted to
help people.
I didn't realize it would be 31years before I could really
start to see the impact of mewanting to help people through
this, so it's been a greatexperience.
Tyra Valeriano (25:19):
Thank you for that, and I kind of see a
correlation between the title ofyour book and what you said
earlier in the podcast.
You said that when you wereworking as a lieutenant, you
caught yourself having thesepanic attacks and nobody knew
and you would just go into youroffice.
(25:40):
I mean, it's kind of it'srelevant to each other.
And so it leads me to thequestion of do you think that
you gave any signs or signalsthat people could have
identified that you may havebeen struggling?
Doug White (25:51):
that you may have been struggling.
No, no, and I know that becauseone of the guys that used to
work for me back then.
He just sat down with the bookon I think it's Friday and he
read it cover to cover.
He's not a reader.
He was very upset with mebecause he never knew any of
(26:12):
that stuff.
My closest friends read thebook and were shocked.
I mean, like I've got a buddy.
He and I have known each otherfor 25 years.
He said why didn't you sayanything?
No one knew.
They were relieved.
They were like, oh my God,you're human.
Well, thank God for that.
You know, for 20, 25 years I'vebeen bringing my A game every
(26:39):
time I was around you, just tofind out you're a human being.
Yeah, my career.
It didn't end the way that Iwanted to.
Some of the issues I was havingled over to my administrative
issues.
I'll call it a book and set iton another podcast.
Very, very short order.
I wasn't paying attention to myadministrative duties and I
(27:00):
messed up everything the amountof time, the amount of money
that I was overpaid.
It was, I'll just say, over thecourse of the year, $2,000 was
the cost of my career.
I was demoted from lieutenant todeputy.
The four and a half month caseIA case that they did no one
(27:20):
knew but command staff.
They kept me in charge of myplatoon.
I ran my platoon flawlessly.
No one had any clue.
I was demoted on a Friday night, showed up to the hood Monday
morning working a day shift as adeputy, went back on a Tuesday
night at a midnight shift to seemy old platoon and explain to
(27:41):
them what had been going on inmy life for the last 15 years
and trying to figure things outand what I had done wrong.
I owned every bit of it fromthe very beginning.
Though I don't get to choose thepunishment, I do get to choose
and I respond to it.
I want to do it with grace andyou know the lesson here is take
care of yourself, just likeI've been telling them for
(28:04):
almost a decade at that point.
Take care of yourself.
It's okay not to be okay.
Being the biggest hypocrite inthe room and one of the
sergeants was angry, he startedcussing.
He actually kicked in the sideof his front door.
I didn't have to write the memoon that because I was no longer
a boss, but everyone wasastounded.
They thought I'd been promotedto captain.
(28:25):
So when I don't show up forwork on a Monday and they were
just waiting on the email, likewhat happened we thought you
were promoted to captain.
So no, I was high-performing,high-functioning and I hit it
very well, my wife didn't evenknow I was having panic attacks
until she saw one in lateDecember of 2008.
Even though we had been goingto counseling since late October
(28:48):
of that same year, I didn't seeany of that stuff.
And it had been two months andI'd been going through
counseling and I woke up onemorning in a full panic attack
and it scared her.
She almost called the ambulancethe full hour.
I was inconsolable and finallyit was that point that I told
(29:09):
her that I'd been having themfor now several months.
At that point, what you'veexperienced.
Tyra Valeriano (29:15):
I mean, we know that there is a ton of people
out there serving in firstresponder roles and military
that are dealing with these sameissues, and you actually set
the stage for showing officersnow that this is what can happen
when you don't address theissues that you need to address
(29:38):
or you choose to just soakyourself into the job and not
recognize that there are thingsthat you do have to work through
, and it doesn't always meanthat you have to go to a
therapist or you know you haveto do certain things.
There is no have to do this, itjust there is a way for
everyone, and it's different foreveryone.
(30:00):
What do you think would be themost important message out of
what you've experienced, toshare with officers today?
Doug White (30:10):
First, this is not something they experience.
This is something you willexperience.
You know our experiences, theplaces that we work, are all
very different, but we will allour bodies react the same way.
These are the physiological andemotional impacts that we will
have if we do not resolve traumaour own health, our own fitness
(30:32):
.
Whether it's therapy orexercise, whatever it is, I mean
, it's different for everysingle person.
One thing, and there's kind ofso many things, personal to
personal level own your shit.
Have the conversation withyourself.
If there's a better way to live, find it.
I'm doing all of this andtelling my story and revealing
(30:55):
the most embarrassing moments ofmy professional life and my
personal life, so that no oneelse is sitting behind that
school with a pistol in theirhand.
You know, not one more, and Iknow that's a hard thing to say
and it's not reality, becauseit's going to happen.
But if we could just stop it,it's all worth this.
(31:17):
As far as the most importantthing, I think this has got to
be a top-down, bottom-upapproach.
I think that the—and I callthem kids, but the people that
are coming the first responderprofessions now.
I think that they areemotionally intelligent enough
(31:38):
to own this as a vulnerabilityand wear it as a badge of honor,
knowing where their limitationsare and addressing that as they
move up.
But for the leadership anybodywho's still in the leadership
positions just suck it up or gofor a run or drink more water,
whatever it is.
Stop that.
(31:58):
You need people that arerespected in these disciplines
to stand in front of a room ofpeople and say here's my story.
People who have stood in thearena, people who have the
pedigree to say you know, I'vedone this, this is what I've
experienced, this is whathappened to me and this is what
has happened because I didn'ttake care of myself.
(32:20):
Like me, I tried to outrun it.
I thought I was strong enoughto be it myself and I did for
the better part of two decadesuntil I couldn't and it almost
cost me everything, quiteliterally, you know.
Is the answer having someonestanding there in a lab coat
saying this is what PTS is?
I don't think that's the answer.
But having somebody that hasbeen in a fistfight, somebody
(32:44):
that's been in a foot chase, acar chase, who handcuffed a
homicide suspect after a fight,somebody who has the pedigree to
say look, you know, this canhappen to anyone.
If it can happen to me, it canhappen to anybody Talking with
spouses, talking with familymembers, letting them know look,
this is what your firstresponder is going through.
If you think that firstresponder spouses aren't feeling
(33:05):
that because you're not talkingto them about your day, guess
again.
We wear this stuff on us, it'sour shirt.
They know we've had a bit.
They don't know what they'regoing to get.
We come walking into the doorso having them read my book, or
dozens of books out there likethis, listening to the podcast,
listening to this podcast,having these conversations with
(33:26):
them I deal with the responders.
You know every bit of this isimportant.
Tyra Valeriano (33:32):
I don't think there's a most thing, but just
being honest, I had aconversation with someone the
other day and he brought upexactly that honesty and when it
came to podcasts specifically,he mentioned, you know, a lot of
(33:53):
police podcasts are out thereand they're saying they want to
help but there's no solution.
And you really just hit thenail on the head, like it's not
even about giving everyone asolution.
It's showing Maybe you don'twant to call it vulnerability,
(34:15):
but we're showing thevulnerability of different areas
of our life and in the career,in our personal life during the
career and after, and showingeveryone else that we are human
and that if you're going throughthis, I'm here too and this is
how I work through it andeverybody, like I said, is going
to deal with it differently.
But it doesn't matter if I haveand probably you feel this way
(34:36):
about your podcast.
It doesn't matter if I have onedownload or 150 downloads,
because at the end of the day,there's going to be somebody who
listens to our podcasts andit's not really that we're
forcing a message.
We're sharing stories so thatpeople can be relatable in law
enforcement or first responderroles and say, hey, I feel that
(35:01):
way or I've been through thatand I want to know what they did
, because I think I'm strugglingwith that and I don't want to
talk to someone.
Or you know journaling, likeyou said.
I offer that a lot to clients incoaching sessions and for most
people it's you know why do Igotta do that?
That sounds dumb and you tellthem just try it.
(35:24):
You know, just try it and seehow it works for you and
surprisingly, it works for about95% of them.
And just you sharing yourexperience.
There's gonna be somebody outthere that can say, hey, I am
going through this and if thishelped him, I'm going to try it.
Maybe it'll help me.
And I think that is such animportant message.
You released the book and youstarted a podcast.
(35:49):
So what was your motivationbehind the podcast?
Doug White (35:54):
I did the podcast to support the book and the book
to support the podcast.
Whatever I can do to get myvoice out there so people can
get a hold of this.
I mean, if somebody called menow I guess the federal
government's the only one withthe big enough pockets but says,
hey, you're not going to make apenny off of this, but we're
going to buy 800,000 copies ofyour book, mission accomplished.
(36:18):
Would you like me to go speak?
I just, I can't pay for theairfare myself, but I'll take a
train.
You know, I just, I just wantthe.
I want it out there.
Yeah, it's why I did it.
I mean, it's vulnerability.
Yes, I wanted to come back tothat, but being unapologetic and
unafraid, only this is, this ismy journey, and if you have a
(36:42):
better story, I'd love to hearyou know.
I just, I think there's so manyof us that can do this, that
aren't doing this.
I just want to be a voice forpeople who aren't using their
voices.
There's so much power instorytelling, as you're finding
out, and you know, one downloador a thousand downloads, that's
great, and there's so manythings that I want to say.
I don't want to go on a tiradeor on any of this, but I have
(37:04):
found that the podcast isgetting a lot of traction and
that's why I was so excited whenI saw chapter one.
I'm going to do this podcast,I've transitioned and you know
your work.
It's just like, oh my God, thisis so great.
Somebody who knew this feeling?
And you get it, you get it, youget it.
So, yes, the answer is the sameas yours.
The feeling I get is the sameone you get.
(37:25):
It's just uh, it's magic whenyou get that one person and
you're going to get trolls, bythe way oh, I've gotten them,
I've had them okay okay, I gotone the other day, but why can't
you just suck it up?
you know, I I did, I was, I wasthis for 12 years.
I just suck it up.
Well, it's this for 12 years.
I just suck it up.
(37:45):
Well, that's fantastic.
Not that this is a competitionor anything, but I'm glad this
message is not for you.
I'm glad you haven't been there.
If you ever are there, I hopeyour heart's in a place where
you can receive this message.
You're not going to get a riseout of me.
What I'm giving is me.
There's no fight here.
The message is for you, thenthe message is for you.
(38:06):
If it's not, then I'm gladthat's.
Tyra Valeriano (38:10):
That's good you know and and that also goes to
show just still, the stigma.
We talk about the stigma allthe time and just what we've
learned.
I mean, obviously, I wasn't inlaw enforcement as long as you I
didn't retire with the 20 yearsbut I started in law
enforcement where this topic andthese things that we're talking
(38:34):
about were non-existent, so wewere not talking about these
things, and I learned the samething you did.
You tough it out, you're fine,you know.
You tough it out, you're fine,you're going to work through it.
You know, if you need to talkto somebody, we're here.
But that's not really what itwas.
It was more the dark humor.
Let's joke about it and thenmove on with our day.
And now here we are, you and I,among several other people that
(38:57):
I've met in this position, wherewe see value in sharing a
message that is going to helppeople who are still doing this
job because, in reality, theydeserve that.
They deserve it with as much asthey do.
They deserve to have some sortof knowledge and somebody to
tell them that you don't have todo that and that it's okay to
(39:21):
not hold it in, it's okay to notfeel okay and talk to someone
or do something about it, and Ithink it's great.
I don't know.
I have gotten trolls.
I've had trolls and I'm okaywith it too.
It doesn't bother me.
It's the same feeling.
You know, if the message isn'tfor you, it's not for you.
Doug White (39:38):
Yeah, you know it's funny For you, it's not for you.
Yeah, yeah, you know it's funny.
I've been hearing a lot ofpeople say well, I didn't do
this many years, or I only didthis many years.
There's 800,000 cops on thepayroll in this country.
Roughly there's 330 millionpeople in this country, so
you're one of 800,000.
I wish my wife was here.
She didn't account.
She'd give me the immediatemath and the percentage.
(40:02):
One of relatively a handful ofpeople who have decided to do
something to better theircommunity, to serve someone
other than themselves.
Whether you did that for a weekor whether you did it for 40
years, I've seen a difference.
You serve, you put on a uniform, you know what it feels like to
wear a gun, put on armor andput your life on the line for
someone that you've never met.
(40:23):
To me, I don't think there'sanything more courageous or more
honorable in that.
You know, if somebody says I'ma veteran but I only did 40
years, why do we have aqualifier on any of these
conversations?
You tested, you passed thebackground checks, you suited up
, you went into the general.
If it was one call or athousand calls, it doesn't
(40:48):
matter.
You made the choice to do it.
And, yeah, there's no qualifierother than that Thank you for
doing what you're doing andbeing a voice.
I am elated anytime somebodyjumps in on this mission.
I'm just happy to be part ofthis mission too, so we're all
(41:11):
doing the same thing.
Tyra Valeriano (41:13):
Well, thank you Back, right back at you.
You're doing a lot of greatthings.
I'm going to have to read yourbook.
I'm going to probably have toget it.
Doug White (41:27):
Do you have it on Amazon, where you can read it
digitally, or is it justpaperback?
It's paperback and ebookthrough Amazon.
It's on like 40 differentplaces that you can go get it
and I've been trying to do theaudible but I've been so busy
with everything else.
There will be an audible soon,but, yes, the book is on Amazon
and, yeah, get it.
It's an easy read, it'sstorytelling and it goes start
to finish and it ends with a winand there will be another book.
(41:50):
I've got another one in me,just from what I've learned
about writing this book.
Tyra Valeriano (41:56):
Well, that's great to hear.
We are running out of time, andthere is a question that I like
to ask all of my guests, andthat is if there was one piece
of advice you could give yourrookie self, what would it be?
I really just like to ask thisquestion without preparation,
because it gives you time.
Doug White (42:15):
No, because you get this.
Tyra Valeriano (42:17):
Yeah, and I want you to like as authentic as you
can be, because you've doneyears and you have learned so
much.
But you could just giveyourself one piece of advice out
of all of those years that youexperienced, what would you just
tell yourself?
Doug White (42:37):
I would tell myself to relax.
You're going to become the manyou have to be to survive the
next 30 years to serve yourpurpose.
But there is a win.
Basically, don't take yourselfso serious, because nobody gets
out of this alive.
Tyra Valeriano (42:55):
That's good.
Doug White (42:57):
That's really it.
But yeah, you will have tobecome this thing.
This thing is going to keep youalive and one day you will
fulfill your purpose.
Tyra Valeriano (43:11):
That's great thank you so much for sharing
your story, for sharing suchinsightful and impactful things
with everyone today.
I know that sometimes that maybe hard to talk about.
Maybe for others it might behard to hear because they may
have been in a similar situation.
But that vulnerability isexactly what the message is.
(43:36):
It's out there and your storyjust proves that it's okay to
feel these things and toacknowledge that maybe you need
to work on these things.
There's help.
You don't have to keep it in.
That's not our job to keep itin.
I do look forward to readingyour book, and do you have any
(43:59):
ways that our listeners cancontact you if they want to
reach out to you, whether it'sabout your book or your podcast?
What is the best way to contactyou?
Doug White (44:09):
I'm just about everywhere, but the one-stop
shop for that is my website,dougwhiteofficialcom.
Podcast the book speakingeverything is all right there.
Tyra Valeriano (44:21):
Okay so DougWhiteOfficial.
Okay so dougwhiteofficialcom.
All right, doug.
Well, thank you so much.
I appreciate your time todayFor the listeners.
Thank you for tuning in.
If you guys want to contactDoug, I will include that in the
description and if you want toknow more about his book,
that'll also be included there.
I appreciate you guys tuning inand I will see you on the next
(44:43):
one.
Thank you for joining me onChapter Blue.
If you enjoyed today's episode,be sure to follow and tag me on
social media and share withyour friends and fellow officers
.
If you're interested in joiningan episode, I'd love for you to
be a part of the conversation.
Until next time, stay safe,take care of yourself and
remember you're never alone inthis journey.
Welcome to Chapter Blue, the podcast where
we discuss the world of lawenforcement through an honest
conversation on tough orcontroversial topics, real
stories, perspectives andexperience from officers all
around the world.
Whether you're here forinsights on mental health,
self-care, work-life balance,getting into law enforcement,
getting out of law enforcement,or just trying to learn about
(00:21):
personal and professionalchallenges officers face every
day, you've come to the rightplace.
I'm your host, tyra Valeriano,and whether I'm going solo or
speaking with a guest, eachepisode will discuss different
aspects of life behind the badge.
Let's turn the page and stepinto Chapter Blue.
Welcome back to Chapter Blueand thank you to those tuning in
(00:43):
for another episode.
Today's guest is a veteran and aretired officer with over 30
years of experience.
He comes with a joining missionto create a space where first
responders, veterans and theirfamilies can have those hard
conversations and reassure themthat their voice matters.
He's also published a book andstarted his own podcast.
It is my pleasure to introduceto you Doug White and to let him
(01:07):
tell us a little more abouthimself.
So go ahead, doug.
Doug White (01:11):
Good morning.
First, thank you very much foryour time and for giving me
access to your platform and youraudience here.
I'm very excited for ChapterBlue and what's Next for you.
So, yeah, just happy to be here.
Let's have a conversation aboutme.
I'm in Tampa, florida.
I was born and raised here.
(01:32):
I spent time in the military,assigned not here.
I was in Washington andfinished my active duty time and
came back here to Florida andworked for the sheriff's office
for 25 years and retired in Julyof 23.
So just doing the podcast andthe book thing, but we can turn
(01:52):
it into some speakingengagements.
Tyra Valeriano (01:55):
Very nice.
What is your retired life like?
It's been.
What a year now.
Doug White (02:00):
Yeah, a little over a year.
It's crazy, you know you don't.
Everybody says, well, you know,retire it's fantastic, or you
know I've got to find somethingto do.
There's so much more toretirement than just not working
, especially transitioning outof the first responder.
(02:22):
You know cultures and all thatstuff.
I'm sure you know.
You know very well about allthat stuff, but you know you're
this thing or these things forso many years.
You wake up the next morningand you're not that thing
anymore.
Um, you know you have to findnew, new purpose, new mission,
new meaning persona.
Um, depending on how in depthyou were involved in that
(02:42):
persona, your organization mayhave to find all new friends.
It's a very daunting thing, butthere is a win.
You can get through it.
Finding a coach such asyourself, some others out there
that are doing great work inthis space, it has been a
(03:03):
journey.
I've learned so much aboutmyself, but it took about.
It took probably three or fourmonths just for everything to
quiet down and it was dark for awhile.
Then you start trying to figureout the things that you want to
do, more or less by finding outwhat you don't want to do.
(03:24):
And, yeah, once you have thatbreakthrough everything gets
clear and it's nice, but it iscertainly a transition.
Tyra Valeriano (03:33):
Were you prepared in any way for the
transition?
Did you have any hobbies oranything that you were doing
outside of work that made thattransition a little easier?
Doug White (03:44):
No, the problem for me and I wrote a book about it I
was one of the people that wereoverinvested in the persona,
overinvested in the professionof what I was doing.
Yeah, I had the office and, ofcourse, I had a family.
I've been married four and ahalf years now to the same
person and had two teen kids,but everything came before that.
(04:09):
I was the very last primary.
Everything was the job, it wasthe mission, it was the
organization, the persona, youknow, and pretty much in that
order.
So my hobbies were either workor tagging along with the family
, doing the family things.
Um, I found triathlon uh,probably god, going on like a
(04:33):
couple years ago now and, uh, Ifound that physical fitness and
competing in triathlon wassomething that was able to stave
off a lot of the issues I washaving.
Wasn't aware that I was having.
Um, so the, the running and thefitness and triathlon, it was a
.
It was a very big part ofhelping in that transition.
(04:54):
Other than hobbies and thingsthat I enjoyed, nothing, nothing
to move into.
It's not like I was going to gofish or race motorcycles or
build a classic or anything likethat.
It was just, uh, retire andfind out what's next.
You know what am I going to dowhen I grow up.
Tyra Valeriano (05:11):
I have a lot of questions just based on what you
just shared.
First, um, you said that youreally just would you say that
your identity revolved aroundwork.
Was that who you were?
Were you the cop, is that whatyou would introduce yourself as
or bring it into conversationthat that's what you would do?
Doug White (05:29):
No, I didn't have to .
People knew.
When I walked into a room, Ijust had that swagger and the
presence about me.
It's not like I wore 5.11 pantsand thin blue line t-shirts all
over the place because I didn't.
The hypervigilance was there.
It's not like I was a walkingbillboard or anything, but it's
who I was.
All my decisions were based onwhich right, which wrong.
(05:54):
Is this safe?
Is this not safe?
What would the organizationthink?
How does this better serve theorganization, the mission and
the profession?
Tyra Valeriano (06:02):
Like I said everything else came last.
You did mention that everythingcame last, including yourself.
So when you retired, what doyou think was the biggest
struggle?
Or when did you realize, hey, Ididn't prioritize myself at all
?
Did you recognize that in thefield or did you really just
feel that more when you retired?
Doug White (06:23):
It was before I retired.
Actually, I was experiencingall of the physiological and
emotional issues that come alongwith complex PTSD.
The sleep was awful and hadbeen for years and years.
There were unresolved militaryissues for my service.
I was in from 93 to late 07.
(06:46):
So I spent 14 and a half yearsof service, plus 25 years with
the sheriff's office.
I was active in active reservesand so in the agency I worked
in, you know, we the last year Iworked we were last year, the
full year before I retired wewere over a million CAD calls
(07:08):
for service.
You know we're the largestagency in the country and it was
busy.
Having been a supervisor, I wasa lieutenant at one point and
there was no slowing me down.
I was at every call.
If there was a fight to be had,I was there.
If there was a chase I wasthere, threw down foot chases,
car chases.
I used to track with K-9 as alieutenant.
I mean, I was fully involvedand engaged in everything that I
(07:32):
did and I tried to outrun allof those things.
Like you know, it'll get betterwhen I'm a captain.
It'll get better when I get today shift.
It'll be better when I'm acaptain, or to get better when I
get to day shift.
It'll be better when I becomethe bomb squad commander, it'll
be better when this was alwaysup that moving goalpost, that
things will be better when I hitthe next benchmark.
And I never took time to reallystop and say hey, does everybody
(07:58):
else have nightmares?
If they can go to sleep?
The nightmares is thin.
Why am I tired at two o'clockin the afternoon?
I've got blood work done.
Why is my testosterone 168?
It should be 7 to 8 or 900.
All of these things.
Why am I angry when one of mykids does this?
(08:19):
When your body is in a constantstate of 8 or 9 out of 10, any
little thing that's stepped toten is very quick.
And I got promoted in 2018 tolieutenant and went to midnight
shift and, being more senior inmy career and senior in age at
(08:43):
the time, trying to adjust tomidnight shifts is not an easy
thing to do, especially whenyou're already having sleep
issues.
It happened again for years.
I was sleeping an hour to maybethree hours a day on days off,
and days off Sleep out near theold deal.
Of course, you never go to thedoctor and get checked out and
(09:05):
just you know go for a longerrun, you know drink more protein
or eat more protein, and youknow you don't pay attention to
that stuff.
And it got to a point, aboutApril to October of 2019, where
(09:25):
things that you're able tomanage when you're not sleeping
you can't manage anymore.
So those things physical issues, the actual physical pain, the
emotional issues, the mentalissues, the nightmares just
became more and more increased.
Couple that with having 24deputies and four supervisors
(09:45):
working for me and, uh, you know, one of the busiest sections
county those things start toplay on you and I was having
panic attacks and anxietyattacks, sometimes one and two a
day.
Uh, basically average aboutfour a week.
Uh, full-on, like I couldn'tget my armor, my shirt, my gun
(10:06):
belt off quick enough, laying onthe floor of my office with the
door closed and locked, I had afull on panic attack.
Nobody knew I was highperforming, no one had any clue.
The break came in October 2019.
I'm sitting behind a schoollooking at this orange traffic
(10:27):
cone.
It's 3 o'clock in the morningand it just came to me.
We got a pistol in the hip andit scared me because you and any
other first responder out thereI'm sure have had their fair
share of death notificationsdeath scenes and that's by
suicide they had to respond to.
So we can understand themechanics of it and the act of,
(10:49):
but I never was able toreconcile that for me.
I am having this thought and Irealize I'm actually staring at
my pistol right now.
That was the breaking moment.
It was enough to scare me butnot enough for me to get help.
That came three hours laterwhen I arrived home and my wife
was awake being awake on aSunday morning at 6 am is not
(11:12):
something she normally did and Iwalked in.
She asked me if I wouldconsider going to marriage
counseling with her.
It's crazy because we had noidea, and wouldn't, for months
later that three hours prior tothat, I had a pistol in my hand
thinking about taking my life,and we'd never had a
(11:33):
conversation like that beforemarriage counseling or anything
like that.
But you know, of course I hitmy knees.
Literally I was on my knees,hands clasped, crying.
My knees literally I was on myknees, hands clasped, crying
Probably the first tears I hadshed in the better part of 15 to
20 years, and the new tearsthey do burn quite a bit.
And, yeah, I begged and pleadedand it was her request.
(12:00):
That was actually her way ofnot being critical of me knowing
that if she had asked me to dothat with her, with us, that I
would get help, and if she hadcome at me with you're broken,
get help, that would not havelanded at all the way that she
did it.
(12:21):
Yeah, it was her strength thatled me to get help and that
started things.
There were some career hiccupsto my health issues and
performance issues later on, butmy off-road to retirement was
about 39 months.
I got a master's degree in thattime, got therapy and started
(12:44):
healing and all this other stuffand but I wasn't there.
So when I did retire there wasa half dozen things that I could
have done that would fall inline with what people would have
believed that I would do.
I still didn't know and itwasn't really until April of May
of this year that it finally Ifinally figured it out.
Tyra Valeriano (13:06):
That's a long answer to a very short question
so no, no, that's thank you forsharing that, and that's
actually as real and raw as youcould possibly get.
How was that conversation withyour wife?
I mean, you know, three hourslater you have her coming to you
.
I'm sure there's emotion therefor you, did you?
Did you take that as yes, I'mgoing to do it, I'm willing, or
(13:28):
was that?
Did it feel like a hit to you,you know?
Did you feel lower?
How did you have thatconversation with her?
Doug White (13:34):
It was.
It was actually kind of weirdCause I went immediately into
problem solving.
Not like I'm going to getmyself help in this way,
absolutely Whatever I can do tomake us better, what's going on?
What have I done?
What can I do, you know, turninto a perfect husband?
Still not getting it.
But it became veryaccommodating and we went to the
(13:56):
first counseling session thefollowing week and, you know, at
the end of the session thecounselor said there's nothing I
can do for you.
Tyra Valeriano (14:05):
I literally threw my hands in the air.
I was like, oh, that's it, andit was over.
Doug White (14:08):
My wife was confused , and so was the counselor.
She said no, you don'tunderstand.
You're each other's bestfriends.
I can give you a book to readon communication and boundaries,
but other than that there'snothing for you to work on.
I was very, very confused andOther than that, there's nothing
for you to work on.
I was very, very confused andthen that's when the
conversation turned to me.
I said how are you sleeping?
(14:29):
And my wife answered he doesn'tsleep.
And she elaborated and said no,for the better part of 15 years
I've laid awake and watched him.
He fights in his sleep, hestops breathing, he cries in his
sleep.
He doesn't dream.
If he does, it's a nightmare.
She said it was theheartbreaking thing she's ever
(14:50):
had to watch.
It really shocked me, tyra,because I'm sitting there
thinking and she didn't knowthis part.
But for six months leading upto this moment, I thought I was
just a huge bag of shit, I'm notcapable of being loved and I'm
not capable of being loved andI'm not deserving of love and
I'm just all these horriblethings.
And you know, I'm a lost cause.
(15:12):
And it turns out that, you know, I thought she hated my guts.
She basically not basically.
She literally paid attention toevery waking and sleeping
breath that I took.
It was just surreal.
Months later, I was here withher, where I was, just hours
(15:34):
prior to that, and it was justrecently, probably.
No, it was just after the book.
I handed her the manuscript andI said before this thing goes
to publish, is there anythingthat we need to take out?
And she read it cover to coverand she said there's things in
there that we've never spoken,there's things in here that I've
(15:54):
never put words to.
I didn't know.
It bothered me until I startedwriting.
I asked her at that point.
I said you know, when I camehome, you were awake that night.
What was your thought process?
She says, I was awake all nightpraying for you one to come
home safe just as I had alwaysdone at least one more time and
(16:15):
asking for guidance, what Icould do, what we could do to
save us and to save you, to saveus and to save you.
And I told her.
I said you know, it's funny thatyou mentioned faith, because
during that time I saw nogreater power.
I didn't see God.
There was nothing in my life.
It was darkness, hopelessness,completely vacant.
(16:38):
And before I could finish mysentence, she said did it ever
occur to you that you didn'thave to, because someone had
been praying for your safety forthe last 15 years?
You didn't see anything.
You didn't have to see God.
I was taking care of that.
And to know that she was awakedoing that Same time I was
(17:02):
holding a pistol Just now.
I'll never be and I'll neverbelieve anything else in this
world other than the fact thatmy wife was sent to me all those
years ago to save me.
Yeah, it wasn't an all at oncething.
(17:23):
It took a lot of time, a lot ofyears, a lot of introspection,
a lot of journaling, writing, alot of reading different books,
trying to get to the point whereI'm at now, and I am
unrecognizable now than evenwhen I was three months ago.
Tyra Valeriano (17:38):
That's great.
Doug White (17:39):
It's a journey.
Tyra Valeriano (17:41):
It is a journey.
What would you say is somethingthat helped you the most out of
all of the things or techniquesthat you used to try to get to
the bottom of where you neededto do your healing or you needed
to work on yourself?
What helped you the most out ofall of those things that you
did?
Doug White (18:00):
For me.
I don't like to use the wordvulnerability because that makes
it sound like it's a weakness.
Honesty, just taking a long,hard look and, um no, I don't
want you to have to put theparental control, uh have on
your podcast, but uh, I foundthat owning all of your shit,
(18:24):
every bit of it, the stuff youdon't want to talk about, the
stuff that uh, uh, that youdon't want to tell yourself you
have to.
The only way you're going toget through any of this is if
you face it and do the workintentionally and walk through
it.
You have to.
You've got to be still tofigure it out.
Once you figure it out, youhave to be honest, Continue
(18:47):
living the way you have beenliving or is there a better way?
And if there's a better way,you have to do the work.
You know I had to own myshortfalls as a husband.
I had to own my shortfalls as adad.
You know I gave everything to aprofession and to an
organization that was incapableof loving me back.
These are inanimate objects.
(19:09):
They're not capable of love orfeeling.
They're machines.
I placed my trust and my worthand my value in what I got from
that place.
It was a lot of rentedadmiration.
Quite frankly, the day youretire doesn't mean shit.
(19:31):
You give them back all of theirstuff, all of the things that
made you that thing, you giveback.
So once you realize that andyou own that, then you have to
atone for it and have thoseconversations with the people
you love and the people wholoved you.
So I did that and that that camethrough in the book.
(19:52):
So the book is it's an apologyletter to anyone who's loved me
for the last 30 years.
It's a love letter to my wife.
It's a love letter to myself.
I've had people call me, fromtier one operators to brand new
first responders who said thisknow, this is, this is fantastic
(20:14):
.
Or, hey, man, how come younever told me?
Or this is an owner's manualfor for any spouse and how to
deal with their their firstresponder and, um, you know
there's so many things in thisthat I've learned, but it all
started with owning a journeythe real, every bit of it.
Tyra Valeriano (20:33):
Tell us a little more about your book.
First, what's the name of yourbook and what prompted you to
want to write a book?
Doug White (20:40):
It's actually a funny story.
The second part the book iscalled Hiding in Plain Sight the
Truth About Karma Service andthe Way Forward.
The book started off as metalking trash, like hey, what
are you going to do when youretire?
It was like almost, quiteliterally, the million dollar
question what are you going todo?
(21:00):
I'm going to go work for thegovernment, go and support
special operations, I'm going togo teach bonds and bad guys,
like I did when I was acontractor, or I'll teach
undergrad.
I'll go teach college, becauseI used to teach in the academies
and I really enjoyed it, butnone of that stuff was setting
(21:23):
me on fire.
So I was like I'm going towrite a book.
I literally said that on theway out the door after my cake
party at the district.
I'm going to write a book.
I thought, what About all ofthis?
A couple of people were likeuh-oh.
Tyra Valeriano (21:38):
About all of this.
That says enough.
Doug White (21:41):
It's like what's he going to say, what's he know?
First of all, I don't get intoroom work, conjecture any of
that stuff.
It's not my business and Idon't care it's somebody else's
business.
But I business and I don't careit's somebody else's business.
But you know, I didn't knowwhat I was going to do and I
just sat down a few weeks afterI retired and I just started
typing on the laptop and I foundthat I was very honest with the
(22:04):
blank pages on the blank screenand just I mean, it's pouring
out of me.
I was typing away One day Iknocked out about 10,000 words
just sitting there not realizingwhere the time had gone, and it
got really, really dark becauseI was just letting loose of
things that I never thoughtbothered me, and one thing would
lead into another and anotherand another Started talking
(22:27):
about calls and events that Ihad gone to, found myself
actually at one point pushingaway from the whole project for
about six weeks because I wasjust a little ramped up.
And after several months I readwhat I had written.
It was probably January of thisyear, so probably six months of
(22:48):
just journaling.
I had about 77,000 words and aprinted paperback that's just
over 100 pages or something likethat, and I saw that I had
written myself in this hero'sjourney as a victim or a
bystander.
All of these things happened tome, and I think anybody who's
(23:09):
ever met me personally or hasever worked with me would never
use the word victim to describeme, and I didn't know why I'd
ever thought that of myself.
So I went back through it and Istarted working out every one
of those issues.
Why would I think this?
Why would I say that?
And I realized that it was thejournal that I should have been
(23:30):
keeping for 30 years, because,yes, journaling works.
I'm here to tell you as aperson who thought it was all
garbage it works.
Put that aside and startedtalking about the lessons I
learned from that in my 30 yearsof military and law enforcement
service.
And what this book is now Hidingin Plain Sight is the answers
(23:54):
to all of those questions.
Why would I think that?
What do I see now?
What is the way forward?
Very, very little of what's inthis book is what was in that
journal.
It's the answers to the journal, and that's really what it came
out of Me, just figuratively,given the bird.
As I walked out the door, thepanic people turned out to be
(24:19):
this great and powerful thing.
That's really.
I mean I've sold 600 copies.
It's been out for less than amonth now.
That's great.
Yeah, I don't know 600 peoplewho can read, so I'm I'm feeling
pretty good about it.
Um, but the feedback that I'mgetting is just, it's incredible
.
It's making a difference whatyou're doing here with chapter
(24:41):
blue and, and your next thing,this is making a difference.
Um, it'll.
You know.
You asked me before we startedabout the podcast and the book
and how everything's going it.
Uh, it takes a minute get legs,but once it does, there's not
going to be a day that goes bythat you're not going to get a
text or a message or somefeedback of someone that what
you're doing is helping.
It really is.
(25:02):
This is fantastic.
We all came into being a firstresponder because we wanted to
help people.
I didn't realize it would be 31years before I could really
start to see the impact of mewanting to help people through
this, so it's been a greatexperience.
Tyra Valeriano (25:19):
Thank you for that, and I kind of see a
correlation between the title ofyour book and what you said
earlier in the podcast.
You said that when you wereworking as a lieutenant, you
caught yourself having thesepanic attacks and nobody knew
and you would just go into youroffice.
(25:40):
I mean, it's kind of it'srelevant to each other.
And so it leads me to thequestion of do you think that
you gave any signs or signalsthat people could have
identified that you may havebeen struggling?
Doug White (25:51):
that you may have been struggling.
No, no, and I know that becauseone of the guys that used to
work for me back then.
He just sat down with the bookon I think it's Friday and he
read it cover to cover.
He's not a reader.
He was very upset with mebecause he never knew any of
(26:12):
that stuff.
My closest friends read thebook and were shocked.
I mean, like I've got a buddy.
He and I have known each otherfor 25 years.
He said why didn't you sayanything?
No one knew.
They were relieved.
They were like, oh my God,you're human.
Well, thank God for that.
You know, for 20, 25 years I'vebeen bringing my A game every
(26:39):
time I was around you, just tofind out you're a human being.
Yeah, my career.
It didn't end the way that Iwanted to.
Some of the issues I was havingled over to my administrative
issues.
I'll call it a book and set iton another podcast.
Very, very short order.
I wasn't paying attention to myadministrative duties and I
(27:00):
messed up everything the amountof time, the amount of money
that I was overpaid.
It was, I'll just say, over thecourse of the year, $2,000 was
the cost of my career.
I was demoted from lieutenant todeputy.
The four and a half month caseIA case that they did no one
(27:20):
knew but command staff.
They kept me in charge of myplatoon.
I ran my platoon flawlessly.
No one had any clue.
I was demoted on a Friday night, showed up to the hood Monday
morning working a day shift as adeputy, went back on a Tuesday
night at a midnight shift to seemy old platoon and explain to
(27:41):
them what had been going on inmy life for the last 15 years
and trying to figure things outand what I had done wrong.
I owned every bit of it fromthe very beginning.
Though I don't get to choose thepunishment, I do get to choose
and I respond to it.
I want to do it with grace andyou know the lesson here is take
care of yourself, just likeI've been telling them for
(28:04):
almost a decade at that point.
Take care of yourself.
It's okay not to be okay.
Being the biggest hypocrite inthe room and one of the
sergeants was angry, he startedcussing.
He actually kicked in the sideof his front door.
I didn't have to write the memoon that because I was no longer
a boss, but everyone wasastounded.
They thought I'd been promotedto captain.
(28:25):
So when I don't show up forwork on a Monday and they were
just waiting on the email, likewhat happened we thought you
were promoted to captain.
So no, I was high-performing,high-functioning and I hit it
very well, my wife didn't evenknow I was having panic attacks
until she saw one in lateDecember of 2008.
Even though we had been goingto counseling since late October
(28:48):
of that same year, I didn't seeany of that stuff.
And it had been two months andI'd been going through
counseling and I woke up onemorning in a full panic attack
and it scared her.
She almost called the ambulancethe full hour.
I was inconsolable and finallyit was that point that I told
(29:09):
her that I'd been having themfor now several months.
At that point, what you'veexperienced.
Tyra Valeriano (29:15):
I mean, we know that there is a ton of people
out there serving in firstresponder roles and military
that are dealing with these sameissues, and you actually set
the stage for showing officersnow that this is what can happen
when you don't address theissues that you need to address
(29:38):
or you choose to just soakyourself into the job and not
recognize that there are thingsthat you do have to work through
, and it doesn't always meanthat you have to go to a
therapist or you know you haveto do certain things.
There is no have to do this, itjust there is a way for
everyone, and it's different foreveryone.
(30:00):
What do you think would be themost important message out of
what you've experienced, toshare with officers today?
Doug White (30:10):
First, this is not something they experience.
This is something you willexperience.
You know our experiences, theplaces that we work, are all
very different, but we will allour bodies react the same way.
These are the physiological andemotional impacts that we will
have if we do not resolve traumaour own health, our own fitness
(30:32):
.
Whether it's therapy orexercise, whatever it is, I mean
, it's different for everysingle person.
One thing, and there's kind ofso many things, personal to
personal level own your shit.
Have the conversation withyourself.
If there's a better way to live, find it.
I'm doing all of this andtelling my story and revealing
(30:55):
the most embarrassing moments ofmy professional life and my
personal life, so that no oneelse is sitting behind that
school with a pistol in theirhand.
You know, not one more, and Iknow that's a hard thing to say
and it's not reality, becauseit's going to happen.
But if we could just stop it,it's all worth this.
(31:17):
As far as the most importantthing, I think this has got to
be a top-down, bottom-upapproach.
I think that the—and I callthem kids, but the people that
are coming the first responderprofessions now.
I think that they areemotionally intelligent enough
(31:38):
to own this as a vulnerabilityand wear it as a badge of honor,
knowing where their limitationsare and addressing that as they
move up.
But for the leadership anybodywho's still in the leadership
positions just suck it up or gofor a run or drink more water,
whatever it is.
Stop that.
(31:58):
You need people that arerespected in these disciplines
to stand in front of a room ofpeople and say here's my story.
People who have stood in thearena, people who have the
pedigree to say you know, I'vedone this, this is what I've
experienced, this is whathappened to me and this is what
has happened because I didn'ttake care of myself.
(32:20):
Like me, I tried to outrun it.
I thought I was strong enoughto be it myself and I did for
the better part of two decadesuntil I couldn't and it almost
cost me everything, quiteliterally, you know.
Is the answer having someonestanding there in a lab coat
saying this is what PTS is?
I don't think that's the answer.
But having somebody that hasbeen in a fistfight, somebody
(32:44):
that's been in a foot chase, acar chase, who handcuffed a
homicide suspect after a fight,somebody who has the pedigree to
say look, you know, this canhappen to anyone.
If it can happen to me, it canhappen to anybody Talking with
spouses, talking with familymembers, letting them know look,
this is what your firstresponder is going through.
If you think that firstresponder spouses aren't feeling
(33:05):
that because you're not talkingto them about your day, guess
again.
We wear this stuff on us, it'sour shirt.
They know we've had a bit.
They don't know what they'regoing to get.
We come walking into the doorso having them read my book, or
dozens of books out there likethis, listening to the podcast,
listening to this podcast,having these conversations with
(33:26):
them I deal with the responders.
You know every bit of this isimportant.
Tyra Valeriano (33:32):
I don't think there's a most thing, but just
being honest, I had aconversation with someone the
other day and he brought upexactly that honesty and when it
came to podcasts specifically,he mentioned, you know, a lot of
(33:53):
police podcasts are out thereand they're saying they want to
help but there's no solution.
And you really just hit thenail on the head, like it's not
even about giving everyone asolution.
It's showing Maybe you don'twant to call it vulnerability,
(34:15):
but we're showing thevulnerability of different areas
of our life and in the career,in our personal life during the
career and after, and showingeveryone else that we are human
and that if you're going throughthis, I'm here too and this is
how I work through it andeverybody, like I said, is going
to deal with it differently.
But it doesn't matter if I haveand probably you feel this way
(34:36):
about your podcast.
It doesn't matter if I have onedownload or 150 downloads,
because at the end of the day,there's going to be somebody who
listens to our podcasts andit's not really that we're
forcing a message.
We're sharing stories so thatpeople can be relatable in law
enforcement or first responderroles and say, hey, I feel that
(35:01):
way or I've been through thatand I want to know what they did
, because I think I'm strugglingwith that and I don't want to
talk to someone.
Or you know journaling, likeyou said.
I offer that a lot to clients incoaching sessions and for most
people it's you know why do Igotta do that?
That sounds dumb and you tellthem just try it.
(35:24):
You know, just try it and seehow it works for you and
surprisingly, it works for about95% of them.
And just you sharing yourexperience.
There's gonna be somebody outthere that can say, hey, I am
going through this and if thishelped him, I'm going to try it.
Maybe it'll help me.
And I think that is such animportant message.
You released the book and youstarted a podcast.
(35:49):
So what was your motivationbehind the podcast?
Doug White (35:54):
I did the podcast to support the book and the book
to support the podcast.
Whatever I can do to get myvoice out there so people can
get a hold of this.
I mean, if somebody called menow I guess the federal
government's the only one withthe big enough pockets but says,
hey, you're not going to make apenny off of this, but we're
going to buy 800,000 copies ofyour book, mission accomplished.
(36:18):
Would you like me to go speak?
I just, I can't pay for theairfare myself, but I'll take a
train.
You know, I just, I just wantthe.
I want it out there.
Yeah, it's why I did it.
I mean, it's vulnerability.
Yes, I wanted to come back tothat, but being unapologetic and
unafraid, only this is, this ismy journey, and if you have a
(36:42):
better story, I'd love to hearyou know.
I just, I think there's so manyof us that can do this, that
aren't doing this.
I just want to be a voice forpeople who aren't using their
voices.
There's so much power instorytelling, as you're finding
out, and you know, one downloador a thousand downloads, that's
great, and there's so manythings that I want to say.
I don't want to go on a tiradeor on any of this, but I have
(37:04):
found that the podcast isgetting a lot of traction and
that's why I was so excited whenI saw chapter one.
I'm going to do this podcast,I've transitioned and you know
your work.
It's just like, oh my God, thisis so great.
Somebody who knew this feeling?
And you get it, you get it, youget it.
So, yes, the answer is the sameas yours.
The feeling I get is the sameone you get.
(37:25):
It's just uh, it's magic whenyou get that one person and
you're going to get trolls, bythe way oh, I've gotten them,
I've had them okay okay, I gotone the other day, but why can't
you just suck it up?
you know, I I did, I was, I wasthis for 12 years.
I just suck it up.
Well, it's this for 12 years.
I just suck it up.
(37:45):
Well, that's fantastic.
Not that this is a competitionor anything, but I'm glad this
message is not for you.
I'm glad you haven't been there.
If you ever are there, I hopeyour heart's in a place where
you can receive this message.
You're not going to get a riseout of me.
What I'm giving is me.
There's no fight here.
The message is for you, thenthe message is for you.
(38:06):
If it's not, then I'm gladthat's.
Tyra Valeriano (38:10):
That's good you know and and that also goes to
show just still, the stigma.
We talk about the stigma allthe time and just what we've
learned.
I mean, obviously, I wasn't inlaw enforcement as long as you I
didn't retire with the 20 yearsbut I started in law
enforcement where this topic andthese things that we're talking
(38:34):
about were non-existent, so wewere not talking about these
things, and I learned the samething you did.
You tough it out, you're fine,you know.
You tough it out, you're fine,you're going to work through it.
You know, if you need to talkto somebody, we're here.
But that's not really what itwas.
It was more the dark humor.
Let's joke about it and thenmove on with our day.
And now here we are, you and I,among several other people that
(38:57):
I've met in this position, wherewe see value in sharing a
message that is going to helppeople who are still doing this
job because, in reality, theydeserve that.
They deserve it with as much asthey do.
They deserve to have some sortof knowledge and somebody to
tell them that you don't have todo that and that it's okay to
(39:21):
not hold it in, it's okay to notfeel okay and talk to someone
or do something about it, and Ithink it's great.
I don't know.
I have gotten trolls.
I've had trolls and I'm okaywith it too.
It doesn't bother me.
It's the same feeling.
You know, if the message isn'tfor you, it's not for you.
Doug White (39:38):
Yeah, you know it's funny For you, it's not for you.
Yeah, yeah, you know it's funny.
I've been hearing a lot ofpeople say well, I didn't do
this many years, or I only didthis many years.
There's 800,000 cops on thepayroll in this country.
Roughly there's 330 millionpeople in this country, so
you're one of 800,000.
I wish my wife was here.
She didn't account.
She'd give me the immediatemath and the percentage.
(40:02):
One of relatively a handful ofpeople who have decided to do
something to better theircommunity, to serve someone
other than themselves.
Whether you did that for a weekor whether you did it for 40
years, I've seen a difference.
You serve, you put on a uniform, you know what it feels like to
wear a gun, put on armor andput your life on the line for
someone that you've never met.
(40:23):
To me, I don't think there'sanything more courageous or more
honorable in that.
You know, if somebody says I'ma veteran but I only did 40
years, why do we have aqualifier on any of these
conversations?
You tested, you passed thebackground checks, you suited up
, you went into the general.
If it was one call or athousand calls, it doesn't
(40:48):
matter.
You made the choice to do it.
And, yeah, there's no qualifierother than that Thank you for
doing what you're doing andbeing a voice.
I am elated anytime somebodyjumps in on this mission.
I'm just happy to be part ofthis mission too, so we're all
(41:11):
doing the same thing.
Tyra Valeriano (41:13):
Well, thank you Back, right back at you.
You're doing a lot of greatthings.
I'm going to have to read yourbook.
I'm going to probably have toget it.
Doug White (41:27):
Do you have it on Amazon, where you can read it
digitally, or is it justpaperback?
It's paperback and ebookthrough Amazon.
It's on like 40 differentplaces that you can go get it
and I've been trying to do theaudible but I've been so busy
with everything else.
There will be an audible soon,but, yes, the book is on Amazon
and, yeah, get it.
It's an easy read, it'sstorytelling and it goes start
to finish and it ends with a winand there will be another book.
(41:50):
I've got another one in me,just from what I've learned
about writing this book.
Tyra Valeriano (41:56):
Well, that's great to hear.
We are running out of time, andthere is a question that I like
to ask all of my guests, andthat is if there was one piece
of advice you could give yourrookie self, what would it be?
I really just like to ask thisquestion without preparation,
because it gives you time.
Doug White (42:15):
No, because you get this.
Tyra Valeriano (42:17):
Yeah, and I want you to like as authentic as you
can be, because you've doneyears and you have learned so
much.
But you could just giveyourself one piece of advice out
of all of those years that youexperienced, what would you just
tell yourself?
Doug White (42:37):
I would tell myself to relax.
You're going to become the manyou have to be to survive the
next 30 years to serve yourpurpose.
But there is a win.
Basically, don't take yourselfso serious, because nobody gets
out of this alive.
Tyra Valeriano (42:55):
That's good.
Doug White (42:57):
That's really it.
But yeah, you will have tobecome this thing.
This thing is going to keep youalive and one day you will
fulfill your purpose.
Tyra Valeriano (43:11):
That's great thank you so much for sharing
your story, for sharing suchinsightful and impactful things
with everyone today.
I know that sometimes that maybe hard to talk about.
Maybe for others it might behard to hear because they may
have been in a similar situation.
But that vulnerability isexactly what the message is.
(43:36):
It's out there and your storyjust proves that it's okay to
feel these things and toacknowledge that maybe you need
to work on these things.
There's help.
You don't have to keep it in.
That's not our job to keep itin.
I do look forward to readingyour book, and do you have any
(43:59):
ways that our listeners cancontact you if they want to
reach out to you, whether it'sabout your book or your podcast?
What is the best way to contactyou?
Doug White (44:09):
I'm just about everywhere, but the one-stop
shop for that is my website,dougwhiteofficialcom.
Podcast the book speakingeverything is all right there.
Tyra Valeriano (44:21):
Okay so DougWhiteOfficial.
Okay so dougwhiteofficialcom.
All right, doug.
Well, thank you so much.
I appreciate your time todayFor the listeners.
Thank you for tuning in.
If you guys want to contactDoug, I will include that in the
description and if you want toknow more about his book,
that'll also be included there.
I appreciate you guys tuning inand I will see you on the next
(44:43):
one.
Thank you for joining me onChapter Blue.
If you enjoyed today's episode,be sure to follow and tag me on
social media and share withyour friends and fellow officers
.
If you're interested in joiningan episode, I'd love for you to
be a part of the conversation.
Until next time, stay safe,take care of yourself and
remember you're never alone inthis journey.
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