The Cost of Opportunity: Dr. Rolly Lagutin’s Journey of Sacrifice and Love

Episode Transcript
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Jim Cripps (00:00):
You are the cap for whatever goes on in your store,
in your company, in yourdistrict, in your household.
However excited you are, whatyou believe is possible,
whatever that threshold is.
Hey, good afternoon.

(00:22):
Team Jim Cripps here with theCharge Forward podcast, and I
have a great guest for you today.
It is my long-term friend, Mr.
El Lagutin.
He's a rock star, he's just agreat family man, hardworking
dude that I am proud to call myfriend and I'm glad he's joined
me in the studio today.
Man, I'm so glad to be here.
It's exciting.
I love it, man.

(00:43):
So you know, we've known eachother almost a decade.

El Lagutin (00:47):
Right at it yeah.

Jim Cripps (00:48):
Right at it.

El Lagutin (00:49):
I think both Castle and Raleigh were about one.

Jim Cripps (00:52):
Yeah.

El Lagutin (00:52):
And they're both turning 11 or have turned 11.

Jim Cripps (00:55):
Yeah, well, and I remember the first time I ever
heard your name, brenda Wilt.
Yeah, she was like, hey, do youknow Ella Gooden?
And Brenda Wilt?
Yeah, she was like, uh, hey, doyou know ?
And I was like what?
And she goes, , and I I'm onthe phone.
You know, I'm in, I'm actuallyin California talking, talking

(01:16):
to her on the phone and I didn'tunderstand what she said.
And she goes, the sprint guy, ,and I was like, oh, yeah.
So, um, you know, I think we metthat next week and I knew who
you were, cause we'd been in thesame industry for, you know, a
decade or two decades beforethat and, um, you know, ended up

(01:40):
working together and it was akind of a trying time in in that
space and we went through justan insanity of of growth.
And you know, one of the thingsI remember about you is you
just jumped straight in Like itwasn't long after you started
working there, like just acouple of weeks, and we had to
grow like crazy.
And I was like, hey, I got akiosk in Ocala, california, that

(02:06):
I need picked up this evening.
And you were like, yeah, man,book the flight.
Uh, I'll, uh, I'll call Jennyand he's like all right, she
knows I'll be late oh man, Iremember that.

El Lagutin (02:18):
And, um, if you also remember about that trip,
raleigh decided to put hispocket knife in mycase and I got
stopped by TSA on the flightdown.
Yeah, I remember that.

Jim Cripps (02:32):
Well, and I don't know if you remember this, so
you know, not long after westarted working together, you
bought a Razor.
I bought a Razor.
We started riding together, allthe things, and I forget what
it was.
I was dropping off some tiresor something with Jason Wofford,
who worked at NES, and I forgetwhat was going on, but I

(02:57):
borrowed your truck.

El Lagutin (02:59):
Oh yes, because he worked at the power company
Right.

Jim Cripps (03:03):
Yes, and so I go to pull into the power company and
I did not know when I borrowedyour truck, it just never even
crossed my mind that yourfirearm was right there.
And of course I pull in andthis is a secure area where
you're not allowed to haveanything like that.
And I am sitting at the boothin a mild freak-out moment and

(03:24):
I'm like, no, no, I'm in thewrong place, let me.
And he was like just pull inand turn around.
I'm like no, no, no, I can backout, I can back you know so.
but yeah, it was fun and sincethat time, not only have we got
to know each other, become greatfriends, and you know our wives
get along, our kids get along,just all the things but one of
the reasons that, um, that youcame in today, is to tell your

(03:44):
dad's story.
Yeah, and it's.
You know I'm not going to saythat there's nothing like it,
because I'll, I'll guarantee youthat that somebody out there
has got a, you know, uh, animmigrant mom or dad that that
persevered through amazingthings.
But it does not take away fromhow amazing your dad's story is
and what they did in order toensure that you guys had a

(04:08):
better life.

El Lagutin (04:09):
Yeah, and it's.
You know it's a cool story andwhat I'm proud of is, um, where
I am today, who I am, right, butum, it's also cool that I am
first generation American, right, like I am.
I am the first person in myfamily to be born in the United
States, right, and when you hearthat, it's like it's you see it

(04:34):
on the news and you hear theelection and all this stuff.
But, um, me and you aren't thatfar removed from that and where
your, my life could havechanged or my life could have
taken a different direction, or,um, I wouldn't have met Jen,
right, Like, if I wasn't born inthe United States, I wouldn't

(04:54):
have Lucy and I wouldn't haveRaleigh, and um, it's all on the
foundation that my dad and mymom built for us, right, and so
that's cool.

Jim Cripps (05:06):
Well, and it was with extreme sacrifice, because
I didn't even know this untilrecently.
But you know they actually hada your.
Your older sister was born inthe Philippines and it was a
considerable amount of timebefore she was allowed to join
your parents.
Yeah, uh it.

El Lagutin (05:20):
Mainly it was visas, number one, and number two was
financial.
They just could not afford tobring her when they came Right.
My mom was pregnant with mewhen they came to the United
States, and so I think my dadknew that he's not going to be
able to provide for that, and sohe had to make that decision to
leave my older sister in thePhilippines for a while to with

(05:43):
his parents until they couldafford to get her here.
Yeah, that's crazy.

Jim Cripps (05:47):
Well, it's also to kind of.
The clock was ticking becausethey needed to get here before
you were born, so then theydidn't have a.
A a compounded, you know,financial problem with trying to
get two kids to the States, ummaking even less likely.

El Lagutin (06:02):
Yeah, and I think my dad uh, deep down wanted me to
be born here, right Like he.
He wanted me to be, you know,natural born citizen, so I think
that that was important to him.

Jim Cripps (06:14):
Well, and I think the other thing, too, that I
find, you know, just amazing isthat you know he was a doctor
there and and really had to comehere and start all over.

El Lagutin (06:23):
He, he really did, and you know, know, that's a
cool story in itself.
He went to med school in thePhilippines, graduated top of
his class, which is, you know,to think about that now is
incredible, right, like you haveto be wicked smart to do that,
and my dad was.
And then he did his residencyon Clark Air Force Base there in

(06:48):
the Philippines.
And, you know, the Air Forcecame to his medical school and,
hey, if you do your residencyhere, we'll give you an avenue
to get to the United States.
And he, he did that.
And so he did that, came to theUnited States and when he got
here, found out, you know, he isnot a licensed physician in the
United States, and so he justhad a new baby and needed to

(07:12):
figure that out, and so hisfirst job was in California.
So when they moved here, I wasborn in Oakland California.
I was born in OaklandCalifornia, um, and so his first
job in the United States wascounting baskets, coming off
ships, um, doing that.
And then he shined shoes, um,you know, going to from being a

(07:35):
doctor in the Philippines, youknow, um to coming to the United
States and not having anything,um, just to make it in the
United States Right and it's a.

Jim Cripps (07:47):
I think that just proves just how powerful that
dream was.
Yeah Right, you know, because Iyou know a lot of doctors and a
lot of just people in general.
You know we all have our egosright and our ego actually, uh,
I know it's meant to protect us,but it ends up getting in the
way a lot of times because maybewe're not willing to do that

(08:09):
thing that we're going to haveto do in order to survive or in
order to get to that goal and toshow that humility for him to
come here and say it's soimportant for my family to come
here to the United States and toflourish.
I'm willing to count baskets,shine shoes, do whatever I have
to do, even though I was adoctor.

(08:29):
But in order to get back tothat I've got, I've got to go.
What would what would be seenas even below the bottom right?

El Lagutin (08:36):
Yeah, and, and you know I think him doing that
stuff.
You know, he didn't just talkthe talk, he, he actually walked
it.
Um, he was willing to doanything he could to provide for
me and my sisters, right.
So there's three of us.
I have an older sister and ayounger sister and, um, you know
, he never, they never raised us, or you know, we weren't raised

(08:59):
in this.
You know, high society of my,you know I'm a doctor and my
kids aren't, you know.
So we were raised on hard work,um, you know, and and me having
a family now and going throughjob changes and going through
different careers in my life, um, I've never been ashamed to do
whatever I needed to do to putfood on the table or to make

(09:22):
sure the house is paid for, makesure my kids have a warm place
to sleep, right, and so, um, youknow I can, I can remember
going back and um losing.
I got laid off, um from one joband didn't have a, you know,
didn't know what I was going todo, and a buddy of mine owned a
drywall company and you and Iwasn't ashamed to go work and

(09:45):
carry mud and sheet rock aroundjust to make sure ends were
meeting.
That work ethic came from whatmy dad instilled in me.
He's like you're never too goodto do any particular job.

Jim Cripps (10:01):
Yeah, well, and so paint the picture for me.
Particular job so yeah, well,and and so paint the picture for
me how, how long did it takefor him to become a doctor here
in the States and get a role inthat in that capacity?

El Lagutin (10:11):
I would.
I think you know I don't knowthe timeline per se, but I do
remember the struggle as alittle kid, um, but you know he
got.
He did get a job at a hospitalin Chattanooga.
Um did.
He would have to go back down.
So we I grew up in Chattanooga,that's that's what I call home

(10:34):
Um, and so he would have to godown to Atlanta every weekend um
to Emory, and take um boardcertifying classes um so that he
could get back his boardcertificates.
And um several years I mean ittook it took several years for
for him to do that Um and and soin that time he's working seven
days a week.

(10:55):
Oh, all the time, um.
And so he was working at thehospital, um, and then my mom
was working at the same timejust to try to get us through.
And, crazy enough, you know allthe struggles that my parents
went through.
They still sacrificed andfigured out a way to put the
three of us through privateschool, which, growing up, we

(11:17):
took that for granted.
We didn't understand what thatlooked like.
But now that we all have kidsand you know I'm lucky enough or
blessed enough to say that youknow I'm able to put my kids
through private school andthat's a struggle on me and my
wife, you know it's like.
You know we have a great schoolsystem but we've chosen to have
a foundation of a Christianschool and that's why we put

(11:39):
them in the schools that they'rein now and Lucy can come back
and say that, hey, thank you forputting me through.
Silverdale is the school thatthey go to, um, it's really
helped me in college, um.
So that's, that's been ablessing to hear that part Um.
But now I I I think back andlook at the struggles that my
dad went through to put usthrough private school, um, and

(12:01):
trying to go through his boardsand trying to build up a
practice and trying to be thedoctor who he was, and so, and
the dad man, my dad didn't missanything, and so, um, that's,
that's been the cool part for meto see, and, and you know, um,
hopefully stepping into thoseshoes and be the dad that I,
that he was to me, to my kids,right, and so that's, that's the

(12:25):
best part of everything, yeah.

Jim Cripps (12:27):
Well, you know, one of the things that stands out in
my head is you know, y'alllived in Nashville for a long
time, we did, and because offamily and because you wanted
your kids to to, to grow up morein tune with your family, and
those types of things, um, youknow what was it?
2017, 2018?

El Lagutin (12:46):
Uh, 20, yeah, 2017, 2018, right around there.
Yeah, 16, 17, somewhere aroundthere.

Jim Cripps (12:53):
Yeah, you guys moved back to um, to Chattanooga.
We did, and that was a uh, thatmeant a significant job change
for you, yep, and you know,outside of your industry not not
outside of your scope, butoutside of your industry and, uh
, you know, it had its, it hadits season and there was, there
was good things and there waschallenges along with that, uh.

(13:13):
So if you will just kind ofwalk us through that Cause, I
mean, there's a lot of peoplethat would find a 50 reasons not
to pick up and move um and anddo what you did.

El Lagutin (13:23):
Yeah, um well, I have to say, the main thing is
is Jen, um, uh, so you know, she, she was working from home and
that was like a new thing, right.
So working from home was newand showed her job.
She was working from home, soshe was able to move wherever we
needed to move to, as long asshe was in a certain territory

(13:45):
so Chattanooga being one and shewas super supportive to say,
you know, hey, you know, I'vehad this every now and then,
every couple of years, I wouldsay, hey, I want to move back to
Chattanooga.
And so she would say, you know,it's not the right time right
now, or this and that.
And so she was reallysupportive one day and said, hey

(14:05):
, I've, I've been thinking aboutthis, I'm ready to move back if
you're ready to move back.
Um, and so we were able to moveback.
But when we did it the job thatI was doing here in Chet in
Nashville at the time, um, endedup having an opening in
Chattanooga and so I, I threw myname in the hat and ended up

(14:25):
getting it Um, so we were ableto move back.
And you know, we've been back, Ithink seven years, eight years
now.
Uh, we're going on eight yearsand, um, as you know, we lost my
dad, um, back in March, um, andso I'll never, ever regret that
sacrifice of moving back toChattanooga.

(14:46):
Yes, we gave up a lot, right,we gave up our house here in
Franklin, we gave up the city ofNashville and the sports and
the music scene all to go backto Chattanooga.
But I'll never, ever regretthat time.
To go back to Chattanooga andlet my kids spend that time with
my dad for the last seven years, that that is something that

(15:09):
I'll I'll never, ever regret,and it was invaluable.
No, yeah, you can't even put aprice on it Not at all, and so
Jen and I actually spoke aboutthis last week or so.
You know it's like.
You know, chattanooga is asmall town.
Everybody knows each other.
There's not a lot of transientpeople from Chattanooga, right,
and so Nashville is just a verytransient city and it's like

(15:32):
very eclectic and you know, yousee a lot of people that look
like me who's married tosomebody.
That looks like Jen, right, andso you don't see a lot of that
in Chattanooga.
It looks like Jen, right, andso you don't see a lot of that
in Chattanooga.
So, but the reward of my kidsbeing able to spend time with
Jen's mom in Chattanooga and mydad until he passed that that

(15:55):
was that's worth every bit ofthe sacrifice that we had to
make.
Oh yeah, absolutely.

Jim Cripps (16:01):
Well, you know, and we get along just swimmingly and
our spouses get along and ourkids get along.
And you know now Lucy's old,older than both Raleigh and
Castle, but she's fantastic andjust a lovely young woman going
to going to UT.
Yeah, you know, I constantlypray for you having having a
teenage, almost 20 year old.

(16:22):
You, you know, in another city,in college, just all the things
as a dad that you would worryabout.
But you know, one of the thingsthat kind of pops off in my
head is you told me not too longafter we met, you were telling
us the story of how you metJen's family for the first time.

(16:45):
Yes, and you went to theirfamily, get together Christmas,
whatever it was, and so, if youwill, please tell that story.

El Lagutin (16:54):
So Jen's family is from a very small town in North
Tennessee, jamestown, jamestown,tennessee.
So the very first time thatshe'd invited me to come it was
a family reunion.
So I went up there and for thefirst maybe hour or so I acted

(17:14):
like I didn't speak English.
Um, and so she.
Um, that was number one.
It's just hilarious to see, youknow how the interactions of
people's eyes like what isjennifer doing with this guy?
Like what in the world?
And then, um, I finally cameout.

(17:35):
You know, I have a southernaccent.
I'm, you know, filipino, the,but jennifer calls me a Filipino
redneck, and you know I have.

Jim Cripps (17:43):
I feel like that's pretty.
Yeah, you know, it's like.

El Lagutin (17:46):
I, um, you know, have a Southern accent and so I
speak, start speaking toeverybody.
Well, that in turns flipseverybody's heads up, you know.
It's like okay.
So first we didn't think hespoke English.
Now he speaks Southern.
Yeah, southern draw, and sothat was just it's hilarious.

Jim Cripps (18:07):
Yeah, 30 minutes later you're racing
four-wheelers and, yes,somebody's truck stuck in the
mud and got invited to thedrinking shed there, yes, there
you go.

El Lagutin (18:16):
So they weren't allowed to drink in the house,
and so, um which jennifer wasvery proud that I got invited by
her uncles to the drinking shit.

Jim Cripps (18:25):
So there you go.
Yeah, I love it.
Um well, man, and you know, oneof the things that I, that I
find uh, I don't want to sayinteresting about you, cause
that's not the right word MaybeI'm, I'm somewhat, uh I don't
want to say envious, causethat's too strong a word about
you is you have never met astranger in your entire life
Like you can walk up and strikeup a conversation with anybody

(18:47):
on this planet.
It's a skill that I strugglewith, but I mean you just you're
a master at it.

El Lagutin (18:52):
I don't think you struggle with it.
I don't think you give yourselfenough credit for it.
Um, no, I think that us moving,um, you know, jennifer and I
grew up in Chattanooga and wedecide that we we wanted to.
There's a great big world outthere, right.
And so we wanted to move aroundquite a bit.
And, uh, when we moved here toto Nashville, I think the

(19:16):
largest part of our marriage, um, we've spent here in Nashville,
right.
And so, um, we figured out that, um, so we figured out that
there's not a lot of people fromNashville that can say you're
probably the only friend that Ihave that can originally say,
like, hey, I'm from Nashvillearea, right, and so, other than

(19:37):
that, nobody from that lives inNashville or Franklin, it's very
rare that you find somebodythat's native to Nashville.
And so, I, we had to figure outthat, hey, everybody's in the
same boat, like, we're alltrying to make it here, and, and
we, it takes a village, andthat's my biggest thing so, like

(19:58):
, it takes a village to run yourlife and it also, you also need
a village to help you run yourlife, Right.
And so, um, I'm happy to bepart of several people's village
, um, I, I take that into very.
You know, I'm honored when I'mpart of somebody's village, but,
um, for me to be able to justopen up and talk to people,

(20:20):
they're they're just as timid atfirst as as but the first
person to you.
Just go out and talk tosomebody, you can find that you
are all on the same levelplaying field.
We're trying to figure out lifetogether, and it's easier to do

(20:40):
life as a team than it is byyourself, do life as a team than
it is by herself.
Um, so you know it's that'sjust the way I am, and I think I
was just born to be a littlebit outgoing.
Uh, jen is the opposite ofoutgoing Um, so I think it takes
both in a marriage to make thatwork.
And so, um, I think that way,and, um, I love, I love sales.

(21:04):
So that that's I'm.
I'm probably, um, just a avidsales guy, and so, if, if I'm
not selling a tchotchke, I'mselling myself, right?
And so, um, I want people tobuy into who I am and see that I
am real and I'm not trying to.
You know, pull one over on youand I'm here to help, and um,

(21:27):
call me anytime you need me andI'll I'll come and help.

Jim Cripps (21:30):
Right, yeah, no, and and I can speak to that a
hundred percent, you know, uh,whether it was at work or
whether it was as friends orwhatever.
You know, um, and, like I say,our, our kids are friends too.
Yeah, that's, uh, I love it.

El Lagutin (21:46):
Yeah, that's uh, I love it.
Yeah, raleigh looks forward tothe yearly Lake Winnie that when
you come town Right, and so, uh, I think that's cool that
they've been able to keep thatfriendship alive.

Jim Cripps (21:51):
Yeah, absolutely.
Um, well, you know, kind ofearly on, uh, you know we
started riding razors togetherand uh, that in in.
In my opinion, that is atotally separate bond, um,
especially at wind rock maybeit's that way everywhere in the
world, I don't know.
Um, but you know that's.
You work through some things,you're going to break down,

(22:13):
you're going to need somebody'shelp.
You know, you just all thedifferent things that can happen
out on a trail, uh, with, with,whether it's just the guys
riding, whether it's the wholefamily riding, whatever that
looks like.
But we absolutely just have ablast whenever we're with you
guys.

El Lagutin (22:34):
Having a razor at times can be the most stressful
part of life, like when you'redriving through the woods and
you break down.
It can be so stressful.
But yet again, what I wassaying, it's better to get
through life as a team so youdon't ever want to go into the
woods by yourself, right, youneed a team and I think that us

(22:56):
finding those challenges.
I think we look for thosechallenges, let's be honest.
Yeah, but when we break downand try to figure that out, to
me that is 90 percent of the funis to break down and try to
help people out.
So, man, we've you know, thecool thing about me and you is
we are more alike and our pathshave been very similar.

(23:19):
And when we met, when we firststarted working together and we
met, I was like Jim and I aregoing to be friends for life.
Number one we talked aboutrazors the very first day I
started working there, right.
Then we figured out that weboth worked at circuit city
together.
We knew a lot of the samepeople through the circuit city
channel and we worked like ourpaths were very similar until

(23:41):
they are today, right, and likeum, you have castle and I have
Raleigh, and I think that weraise our boys up the same way,
and yeah, they're.

Jim Cripps (23:50):
I think they're like three months apart.
Yeah, almost down to the day.

El Lagutin (23:53):
Yes, so, so, yeah, Raleigh will be 11 next week.
I know, yeah, I can't believeit.
It's awesome.

Jim Cripps (23:58):
Yeah, I love watching them grow up.
I think it's just fantasticwatching them become stronger
and, you know, just growing intowho they're supposed to be.
Yeah, um, you know, and I thinkthat I think that plays in a
large part why your dad did whathe did.
Is he had a vision whether hewas able to put it into words or
not that there was socompelling.

El Lagutin (24:19):
It was like I am willing to do this crazy, scary
thing and and I'm doing itbecause I think it's going to
pay off and that futuregenerations and now you know, I
think I think you guys are acase study for that yeah, I
think so, um, you know, alongwith my, my dad's hard work, um,

(24:40):
and his vision of seeing wherehe wanted us to be right is his
love, for his love and his faithwas very, very, very strong,
Right, and so dad instilled tothe three of us is hard work,
family, you know, you're herefor your family, thick and thin,

(25:01):
and his love for Christ, thatwas his biggest, his three
biggest things in life, and so Ithink dad instilled that in me,
and if I just follow thosethree steps, you know hard work,
family and God I will be.
You know to my kids what he wasto me, right, and so and I think

(25:23):
that if I'm half the dad thathe was to me, I'm, I'll be a
great dad, um, so hopefully, youknow the the future is going to
show that and I I strive forthat.
But my dad made all thesesacrifices to leave a legacy,
right, and so you know me and mysisters we all have kids and
man, they looked up to my dad somuch and he they respected him

(25:47):
so much.
But I think that they also gotthe hard work and the dedication
and the family life um throughmy dad, um and through us, and
so I think that's, that's to me,that's the most important thing
.

Jim Cripps (26:01):
Yeah, now I mean I would.
I would be amiss if I had saidit was all sunshine and rainbows
.
Um, cause you know, uh, now how?
How old were you when yourparents um?

El Lagutin (26:11):
divorced 12.
I was 12.
My younger sister was 10.
Um, my older sister was almost18.
I think about that time, if I'mnot mistaken, yeah.

Jim Cripps (26:20):
Yeah, and in a large part she's been absent from the
picture.

El Lagutin (26:26):
Yes, unfortunately I don't.
I don't.
I don't want to speak for mysisters, but I don't have a
relationship with my mom.
I care about my mom.
She'll always be my mom.
You only get one Right, and soI will always regard her and
respect her as as my mom.
You only get one Right and so,um, I will always regard her and
respect her as as my mom, mymother, um, because she made the

(26:49):
same sacrifices that my dad hadto make right To get here, um,
and so I'll always respect that.
And and you know it's still agift to you, it is still, yeah,
um, and if it wasn't for her, Iwouldn't have my kids, um, and
so I think, I think that, um, Ithink that's a tough part, um,

(27:13):
right, because growing up, she,she left, uh, you know, she was
in our lives until we, I wasabout 16, 17.
And then, um, she moved away andwe, we haven't really had a
relationship and when, when yousay relationship, it's um, we

(27:33):
say you're on the holidays or wesaw her on the holidays.
The past few years it hasn'tbeen that like that, um and I, I
won't say that, it hasn't beenhurtful, but I don't hold any
anger anymore.
You know, it's one of these.
It's like she's the one missingout at this point, right, like

(27:57):
she doesn't get to see my kidsgrow up Inside.
I've kind of put a barrier thatI actually would rather her not
, right, um, be around, becauseit's, it's hurtful every time.
I don't want to have to hashthat out anymore, but, um, she's
the one at this point missingout and um, yeah, it's

(28:18):
unfortunate, right and so.
But I, at the end of the day, Isee my wife, I see Jen be the
mother to her kids.
That I'm like, how does amother up and leave kids?
You know, it's like we enjoybeing around our kids and, as a
matter of fact, I like beg Lucyto spend more time with us.

(28:42):
But I understand, she's almost20 and once she's got to figure
out her own life as well, right,but um, I'll.
I don't think that me or Jenwill ever step away from our
kids and not want to be part ofthat, and so that's the hardest
part for me to understand.
Um, I'll never understand that.
But I've moved on, right, andso, again, I don't want to speak
for my sisters, but I thinkwe're all in the same boat, um,

(29:05):
on that.

Jim Cripps (29:06):
But yeah, and you know, I'm sure that was hard on
your dad too.
How did you see your dad changeafter that?

El Lagutin (29:14):
Um, you know the here's the thing Jim so, jim so,
uh, when they, when theydivorced, um, I will say, until
the day my dad passed away, um,my dad never spoke an ill word

(29:37):
about my mom.
That's powerful.
He.
He never did and I think healways respected mom for who she
was, um and the mother of hischildren.
And he never, ever let us talkbad about mom or air out our
grievances to him, about ourfrustrations about mom.
He would always stop us stilland say I don't want to hear
that, she's still your mom, youneed to respect her.

(29:58):
And he never spoke negativelyabout my mom and that was cool
to me now that I see it right.

Jim Cripps (30:13):
Well, I think it's probably because of his value
system.
Yeah, you know hard work,family and God.
Yeah, there's not really spacefor that kind of negativity or
to run down her name.

El Lagutin (30:28):
You're right, and I think he also did that as a
lesson to me as his only sonRight and so I think that he
kind of instilled that in methat no matter what, I'll
respect Jen instilled that in methat no matter what, I'll

(30:48):
respect Jen she's you know,she's the mother of my kids, so
that I don't want my kids toever hear me talk negatively
about Jen as a wife or as a mom.
You know we give each other ahard time here and there, but
you know nothing real that Iwould ever say negative in front
of the kids just because my dadnever did it Right, and so I

(31:11):
think that's just something thathe instilled in me.

Jim Cripps (31:13):
Well, you know, and Emily and I had this
conversation not too long agoand I forget who it was, but you
know, a friend of hers was justabout their spouse, hers was
just about their spouse and, um,and she had seen I don't know
if it was a tick tock or if itwas a you know a short or uh,

(31:33):
maybe maybe it was um with withyou know, somebody else, but it
was kind of like you shouldnever do that, because while you
might just be blowing off steamand you get over it 30 minutes
later, that person, until thenext time they see you, is still
carrying that and thenpotentially reignites it in you,

(31:55):
because this is the last thingthey remember about.
Oh, he was being afill-in-the-blank and he's still
being that.
And then you get fired back upand then now, all of a sudden,
there's another fight that Imean, that was, that was gone,
that was a, that was a fleeting,you know blowing off steam kind
of thing, and and I do thinkthat people inadvertently, um,

(32:18):
or maybe intentionally, I don'tknow, but they do that Um, and
and it's just not healthy, it'snot.

El Lagutin (32:27):
It is not, and I think me and you have spoken
about this a couple of timesright and like, jen is my life
partner, and so I also don'twant to paint this picture that

(32:49):
we have this.
You know we never get inarguments or anything like that,
but, um, at the end of the day,at the end of the day, I know
that my safe zone is Jen.
Um, I can be upset, I can besad, I can be happy.
We win together and we losetogether, right and so me,
knowing that she's always got myback and and I think hopefully
she knows that I've always gothers Um, there's, there's not.

(33:11):
Life is short and there's notenough time to sit in.
You know, degrade your partner,um, right and so, um, we were
on the same team.
So why not root for yourteammate, your teammate?
Right, like I'm not going toroot if me and you are on the
same team, I'm not going to rootfor you to fail.
Right and so, um, I thinkthat's the most, that's, it's

(33:33):
really important, right and soum I think it's.

Jim Cripps (33:38):
It's one of those things, because I mean where I
really like to operate whetherwe're talking about, uh,
personally or in business or uhany those things I like to
operate in this zone that I callselfish and selfless at the
same time.
Yeah, and so if you think aboutit, the most selfish thing you
could possibly do is root foryour teammate and the most

(33:58):
selfless thing that you couldpossibly do at the same time is
root for your teammate.
So I mean it's win-win.
Like you haven't, there isnever a reason why you would.
You would ever, um, you know,wish, wish a negative thing on
your partner in this life.

El Lagutin (34:13):
You're right, I mean it's, it's again.
Life's too short, right Like?

Jim Cripps (34:17):
or, in this case, what we're talking about is
painting them in a in a in a ina in a light that's unfavorable.
Um, you know and I think we'reboth incredibly fortunate in
this this actually comes up inalmost every episode, but, uh,
it wasn't by design, but when we, when we think about people who
charge forward and people whodefault to leaning in when other
people would give up, um, a lotof times it's because they have

(34:40):
a supportive spouse.
Yeah, and so for you and Jen,what do you?
What do you think?
Like, how important has thefact that you found each other
been to your lives?

El Lagutin (34:53):
You know, if it wasn't for Jen I will tell you
this I wouldn't be in the seatthat I am today.
I wouldn't have the life thatI've got today, Right, so you
know me, I'm very I like to takechances or I like to take risks
.
Sometimes they're not good,sometimes they're great.

(35:13):
But if it wasn't for Jen tokind of keep me anchored down at
times, I definitely wouldn't bewhere I am today.
But if it wasn't for Jen, Ialso wouldn't be as successful
as I am today.
Right, because there's there'sdifferent challenges that we
face, that she's like we need totake this opportunity and run

(35:35):
with it, like moving back toChattanooga, or you're not happy
in doing this day to day stuff.
Let's look at other options.
Um, you know I, I wouldn't havethe education that I've got
today without Jennifer.
Um, and so, and I think ourkids aren't who they are if it

(35:56):
wasn't for both of us.
Um, so you know, I think,choosing a spouse or me choosing
Jennifer, I don't ever want tosay it that way because luckily
she chose me.
I didn't get to choose her, itwas by luck that we met and you

(36:18):
know she picked me out ofeverybody, and so to me that
means more than anything um atall, cause I don't want to say
that I picked her cause.
That's definitely not thechoice.
You know the answer to that?
Sure.

Jim Cripps (36:33):
Sure, well, I think we're both just incredibly
fortunate.
We have great families and itstarts with, uh, you know great
parents that gave you afoundation and you know, leaving
your dad, you know living yourdad's example, and then, um, and
then having the, the luck andthe good fortune and the, the I
say it this way, your pickerwasn't broke, or her picker

(36:55):
wasn't broke.
Um, and to have a spouseselection is is such a big deal
to the overall, uh, happiness oflife, and and and again, with
two wonderful kids.
You know, and you know, earlyon, when we met, lucy was neck
deep in dance and I didn't evenknow that that was a space, like

(37:16):
I am, I am so not a girl dad, I, you know, of course.
You know castle was maybe two atthat time or one, and you were
like, hey, lucy's got a dancerecital, would you like to come?
And I was like sure, having noidea what we had signed up for,
I mean it was fantastic.
I mean, like the ability ofthese.

(37:38):
You could tell when did Lucystart and dance?
She was four.

El Lagutin (37:45):
Her first dance class.

Jim Cripps (37:45):
Yes, okay, and so we're going to go back, say,
nine years ago, so she wouldhave been roughly 10.
Yep, so the majority of herlife she was in dance, even at
10 years old, and the majorityof my life for her was at dance.
Yeah, oh yeah, um, but thesekids rocked it and you know
Emily went, you know I don'twant to say begrudgingly, but
she was like we're really goingto a dance recital and I'm like

(38:06):
you know it's for Lucy and shewas like okay, all right,
whatever.
And you know we go and castle'srocking along.
I mean it was, it was likenothing we'd ever been, we that,
that was our life.

El Lagutin (38:15):
Um, you know, and and again we were new to
nashville right, and so signinglucy up for dance got us to be
able to meet other people whowere in the same boat that we

(38:36):
were, and some of our greatestfriends to that till this day
are our dance family that we had.
Yeah, unfortunately, lucy quitdance, which breaks my heart
every day, but she stopped anddecided she wanted to cheer
instead, so but, but how awesomethat she had the presence of
mind to say I want to do this.

Jim Cripps (38:55):
Most kids would have just kept doing what mom and
dad had been putting into, andI'm doing this because I'm
supposed to do this, yep, butyou know, to have a
strong-willed daughter that hasa good foundation, knows who she
is, enough presence of mind athow old was she?
Like 13 or so?

El Lagutin (39:15):
Yeah, right around there To say Eighth grade yeah.

Jim Cripps (39:20):
To say I want to do something different.

El Lagutin (39:24):
It was hard on her.
I think you and I have spokenabout this.
We'll never push our kids to dosomething that they don't want
to do, but our kids will alwayshave an extracurricular activity
.
Right, because if it wasn't fordance, I think that Lucy, it
wouldn't be the person that sheis today.
Right, I think dance taught herhow to be confident.

(39:48):
It taught her hard work, ittaught her, it taught her
dedication and and how topractice and to get you know,
accomplish the things that shewanted to do, and so and it's
success, success along the way.
Yeah, I mean they.
They won a lot of trophies andshe um, you know, you know it's
been.
It was great to watch.

(40:08):
I loved it, um and I you know,matter of fact, her roommates,
um, from college, came and spentthe weekend with us and we
pulled up all of her old dancesand let them watch it, and so
they.
That was cool to see, Um, butit you know it's.
We will always make our kids dosome kind of extracurricular
activities.
We'll never push them to dowhat they don't want to do, but

(40:30):
they're always going to havesomething outside of school to
keep them busy.

Jim Cripps (40:35):
Yeah, absolutely.
Now, kind of along the way, whohave you seen is either a
mentor for you or for your dad,or maybe even Jen?
Who would you attribute somereal deal direction to?

El Lagutin (40:47):
Yeah, I think we have.
We have a couple and I learnedthis from my dad.
So my dad had two really goodfriends who were also mentors to
him Dr Weathers, who's his past, and and another doctor of his
friend, dr Dressler.

(41:09):
They were really good, you know, mentors to dad.
They they showed him you knowhow to, how to help build a
practice, or you know how to howto survive in Chattanooga, knew
the United States, and you knowI'll always be grateful to
watch them, take dad under hiswing and I think I have three

(41:31):
mentors that I've, you know,kind of cling to.
One is James Sella.

Jim Cripps (41:43):
You know him yeah.

El Lagutin (41:44):
So he's been a great mentor to me business wise.
He helped me a lot when Itransitioned from inside sales
to outside sales.
He really kind of took me underhis wing and kind of showed me
the ropes on that.
And then, dan, he was withSprint as well.
He was out of Memphis, hepassed a few years back and he

(42:05):
was probably one of my biggestmentors.
And then I think you know meand you being friends, I think
the way that we raise our kidstogether and we talk about
family and family first.
I think me and you are goodmentors to each other and I

(42:25):
think that and you are goodmentors to each other, you know,
and I think that's helpful.

Jim Cripps (42:30):
Yeah, bouncing ideas off of somebody that you think
you know doesn't not haveexactly the same opinion as you
do, but it also is a good enoughfriend to tell you when you're
out of bounds.
Yeah, you know, because there'sa lot of people that will
disagree with you because theydon't want conflict.
Those are not your real friends.
Your real friends will call youout on your mess.

El Lagutin (42:46):
Yeah, and I think that mentorship or those kind of
friends change in the season oflife that you've got, right,
and I think a lot of peoplethink a mentor they have to be
older than you or they don't,you know, and that's that's
really not the case.
I think that if you have to besome, you have to surround

(43:06):
yourself with like-mindedindividuals that will also call
you out on your crap, right?
And so I think that's the kindof friendships that you went,
you need in life and that turninto mentors, right.
And so I think in today's world, the past few years for me is
is we become really good friends.
Our wives hang out together alot, and it's Gary Meadows he's

(43:30):
probably the guy that I turn tonow.
His kids are older.
His youngest is Lucy's age andhis oldest is 24, 25.
And to see him walk through thatlife with his boys has helped,
has helped me figure out how towalk through life with my boy,
right.
And so, um, he, he's been agreat friend.

(43:50):
And um, when things aren'tgoing my way, he's the first to
call me out and be like life'snot that way, man, it's not
always going to go your way, youknow, buck up, you know.
And so it's like, um, he's beena really good mentor to me here
lately.
Um, my best friend for the past, my whole life, is Jeremy Um,

(44:11):
you know him, um, we workedtogether for a little while and,
um, he he's always been a greatmentor to me and helped me
through difficult times.
You know he, he was there theday my parents got divorced and
he was there the day dad died,you know.
And so we walk through lifetogether, and if it wasn't for
his friendship and support, Iwouldn't be where I am today,

(44:33):
and so I again.
Like I said earlier, it takes avillage, um, and, and that
village to me means more thananything.

Jim Cripps (44:40):
It does Well, and to talk about a little bit of a
God moment, Um, and when I start, when I bring this up, you're
going to remember this.
So this was like maybe a yearand a half ago.
Um, you, raleigh Castle and Iwent to Windrock and the night
before we we all got there alittle bit late, so we ended up

(45:01):
just meeting for dinner beforewe went to the cabin there a
little bit late, so we ended upjust meeting for dinner before
we went to the cabin and I askedabout you and Jeremy.
Yeah, and y'all had not spokenfor like a year, almost a year.
Yeah, yeah, and I was like youknow, how are you going to, how
are you going to do that?
And it was this back and forthof you know, well, it's it's
kind of in his court and me kindof poking at you and going well

(45:24):
, I mean, it can be in yourcourt and you can still help it
along.
And he I don't know if hecalled or he text while we were
at dinner.

El Lagutin (45:31):
Yeah, he actually text while we were riding Razors
in a trail and he said call mewhen you get a minute.
Yeah, which that was a, yeah,that was a God moment.
Yeah, um, which that was a uh,yeah, that was a God moment,
right, and so, um, jeremy is mybest friend, my ride or die, my,

(45:52):
you know, he's the, he's theguy that, um, he's, he's my
buddy, that we don't have totalk in the same room and we
know what, what, what we'resaying to each other.
Um and you know, long storyshort, I, I, he was gracious
enough to bring me on board athis work, um, at the company

(46:12):
that he owns.
Um, and so when, when I did, I,we both had every intention for
us to be there long-term, um,and so I ended up leaving Um, I,
I was able.
I got another opportunity on aleft.
I didn't handle it the rightway, um, you know we had every

(46:33):
intention.
You know we'd spoken about it.
Hey, if you're not happy here,or if you're not happy with me
being here, we need to have thatconversation up front.
Um and I didn't have thatconversation with him soon
enough, and it wasn't that Iwasn't happy there, I just had a
better opportunity somewhereelse and to be able to spend a
little bit more time with thefamily.

(46:54):
Sure, the position where I'm attoday, I have a lot more
flexibility, and so that kind ofput a bruise on our
relationship for a little while,um, and so we didn't speak for
a little while, um, and my hearthurt every day, um, until we

(47:15):
were able to patch things up, umand we, we talk almost every
day again, all right, and so, um, that again, that's what a true
friend is, is you can havethose disagreements and move on
and then kind of get backtogether, which again, that was
really hard.
That was probably the hardesttime of my life outside of my

(47:37):
family.
That was hard.
And for you to bring that upafter I hadn't thought about it
for a while, and then the next,like an hour later, me and him
are having a conversation on thephone and we work some things
out, which it was a blessing,and I'm grateful for that every
day.

Jim Cripps (47:57):
Yeah Well, you know God has a plan and you know
sometimes we see it andsometimes we don't, and
sometimes it needs to smack usupside the head.

El Lagutin (48:07):
Yeah, man, and um, you know, I again, I'll, I'll
never.
I made a mistake, you know, andI and I, I've.
I feel like I've owned up to it.
Um and I, I, I handled itincorrectly.

Jim Cripps (48:19):
Um, and yeah, I, I regret that, but um, the reality
is we're all going to makemistakes, yeah, and anytime
you're going to do business withsomebody that is that close a
friend, um, communication iscritical and you know, there's
never been a problem in theworld.
In fact, uh, uh, nick Heider,who owns this studio, uh, great

(48:40):
friend of mine, he, he says thisuh, there's never been a
problem in history that was madeworse by the best communication
.
Yeah, you're right, I mean,it's spot on, yeah, yeah.
So you know, and I encourageany employer, whether you're a
friend with somebody or not andthis gets a little bit lost in

(49:03):
translation, but this is thebest way I've found to describe
it to somebody.
If I was going way back when Iwould say think of a hitchhiker
these days, I would say think ofa ride share.
Um, but you know, imagine thatI'm in California and you are
looking for a job.
You're, you're on the side ofthe road, you've got your resume

(49:24):
and you know we have aconversation.
It's important and it is my job.
Now, I could say that it's bothof our job, but I'm going to
put it on the employer.
It is the employer's job tofind out what that potential
employee's goal is.
Where are they trying to get to, because, with you standing

(49:47):
there with your resume in yourhand, it may be that you need to
put food on your table, and itis literally to get out of the
proverbial rain.
Um, and I have a car.
Well, that gets you out of therain, yeah, but if we haven't
talked enough to understand thatyou're trying to get to Alaska
and I'm headed to Tennessee,well, because this is a two way
street, in that you're trying toget to Alaska and I'm headed to
Tennessee, well, because thisis a two-way street, in that

(50:07):
you're putting stuff into thejob, you're working, you've got
effort, you've got life, you'reputting into that.
So it's kind of like you'repaying for gas as we go, but
it's my car.
Well, you get more aggravatedthe closer we get to Tennessee,
the further you're getting awayfrom your goal.
So you get more frustrated andI, not knowing that which is

(50:29):
really my fault for not findingout but I get to wonder why is
he not being grateful?
Well, I'm allowing him to havea job, and so you're getting
more frustrated.
I'm getting more frustrated thefurther we go along, when,
really, if we would have knownthat our goals weren't aligned,
we'd have never gotten the cartogether Absolutely At the same
time, if I find out that you'reheaded to Texas and I'm headed

(50:53):
to Tennessee, there is a clearjumping off point, there is a
clear point where you should getout of the car, because that's
how you get to your goals, andI'm well aware of that and I'm
more likely to cheer you onbecause I'm like, hey, this is
your exit, right, this is whereyou're headed, this is good.
And and so I do think it's it'son the hiring person to really

(51:15):
dive deep into that and figurethat out, because if it's not
mutually beneficial, then it'snot.
It's not going to succeedAbsolutely.
So but?

El Lagutin (51:25):
but even in jobs, right, like we can talk about
that jobs, but that also happensin your life, or marriage, or
your kids, right?
So like communication is keyfor everything.
Um, and so you know, yeah, Ithink that the biggest mistakes

(51:46):
that I've made in life are frompoor communication.

Jim Cripps (51:50):
Oh, I think we could all, we could all probably hang
our hat on that right there Notbeing honest about what we're
trying to achieve or what we'relooking for in a situation and
then being mad at the otherperson for not knowing what.
We were unwilling to say, sure,yeah, I mean especially in
marriage.
Yeah, but, but in any situation, um, you know, uh, emily and I

(52:13):
talk about that, and I think youand I were both very fortunate
in that.
One, we, we had great spouseselection, whether it was our,
our selection or their selection, uh.
Two, we've got great kids bydesign.
It's not, it's not like thatjust happened.
We were very intentional withhow we raised them, what kind of
core values, but also becausewe have been wiser with our

(52:37):
financial decisions.
A lot of the things that a lotof people struggle with, we
don't because that's not a bigconcern in our household.
By design, like we, we, we madesmarter decisions, like, like I
think about when you guys movedfrom um, from Franklin, to

(52:57):
Chattanooga, you downsized bigtime, you know, um, and a lot of
people wouldn't do that.
They would be like oh no, no,no, we're moving back to town,
we're going to have what we havenow, or better, we went off to
Nashville and we've gotsomething to prove or whatever.
That looks like All foolishdecisions.

(53:20):
But you guys downsized and itlined up with the whole reason
you were moving back toChattanooga was for quality of
life and family.

El Lagutin (53:31):
Yeah, and simplicity .
I mean, that was the biggestthing.
Now would I move back toFranklin?
Yes, I would move back if Icould, but we're all so content
with where we're at and I don'teven know if you know this, jim
we downsized again.
We went to the golf course,right, we did Okay To a small,

(53:58):
another smaller house, um, andso we we've made these changes a
because the market's been rightand it's just been like we
could cash in on a little things, but then our expenses, the
older my kids get, you thinkthat they would go down, but
they're actually going up.
You know, college is not cheapand thankfully Lucy is smart,
she's very smart, and so she got.

(54:19):
School is paid for, but livingis not paid for, so we're having
to front that bill.
And you know we had three ruleswhen she went to college, and
you know number one is there's abudget.
So you know, whatever yourbudget is is what it's going to
be.
Number two is you have to staywithin a five-hour radius from

(54:45):
wherever we living, because youalso have a younger brother that
you still need to be um have arelationship with and you have
to keep that.
And our biggest number three,which the biggest rule to me was
you will not get a student loanfor your bachelor's.
Um.
So Lucy was able to stay inthose lines.

Jim Cripps (55:03):
I love it.
Yeah, I love it, but I mean, itwas, that was by design.
You put those, you put thoseparameters out there.
Yeah, and it wasn't like yousaid oh, you don't get to choose
, no, you get, you get to choose, and part of your choice is
also determined on how muchscholarship money you get.

El Lagutin (55:16):
Yes.
You know yeah she was all about.
She was going to go to Kentuckyand that's where she wanted to
go.
That's where, like she, we didthe visit, we did everything

(55:37):
that she, you know she wanted togo there.
After all the scholarships andafter the out-of-state and
everything, she was $1,500.
She was $1,500 a year overbudget and you know a lot of
people.
That doesn't sound like a lotof money and at the end of the
day it probably isn't that muchmoney if you look at it right.
But we had a budget Over budgetis still over budget Over,

(56:00):
budget is over budget.
And we gave her a budget and youknow a lot of people were like
go ahead and pay, that it's only$1,500 a year.
Um, she's worked really hard inhigh school to get to these
scholarships and I had to standmy ground and Jennifer wasn't
happy with me a lot of the timewhen it came to that.

(56:21):
But a budget's a budget and you, we have to teach our kids
today what a budget looks likeso that they don't live outside
of a budget later in life, Right, and so they're going to learn
from us.

Jim Cripps (56:35):
And if we, if we start now by saying, oh, it's OK
if it's over budget, yeah.

El Lagutin (56:39):
A budget's a budget, and so we had to stick to that.
And now she's grateful that sheended up going to UT.
She's an hour and 15 minutesdoor to door.
She gets to come home quite abit more.
Her and Raleigh's relationshipsblossomed a lot more because
she's able to still keep incontact.

Jim Cripps (57:00):
And he's getting older too.

El Lagutin (57:01):
Yeah, and he, you know, when we go up to Knoxville
and go to the UT games, um, he,she's um, asked him to stay in
the apartment with her, and sohe thinks that that's really
cool.
You know, he's with thesecollege kids and um, so that
that's been that and it was ablessing in disguise.
Now, was it hurtful to her atthe beginning?

(57:22):
It absolutely, um, she washeartbroken, Um, but I just
couldn't go back on my my youknow where I'd set the boundary
on that.

Jim Cripps (57:32):
Well, I think that's , I think that's critical,
because you showed her that asmuch as you love her so much,
you're willing to, like, inflictpain to teach a lesson.
Yeah, and it was inflictingpain on you too, and and on
Jennifer, and and like everybody, but it's that, it's that
important and it's.

(57:53):
You know, somebody would callit, some people would call that
tough love, but it really isjust love.
Yeah, like I love you enoughthat I'm willing to do this.

El Lagutin (57:59):
Yeah, Even though it as a dad you want to be able to
give your kids whatever theywant.
But you're at, that's not thebest route for you to do for
your kids, right?
I want to give everything I canfor my kids and I want them to

(58:19):
get whatever they want to apoint.
So you know we can't juststroke a check for everything,
and so they've learned that.
And you know there's differentthings.
Funny that we're talking aboutthis, but Lucy has even brought
up.
You know they're almost 10years apart and she's brought up

(58:41):
.
Well, when I was 10, I didn'tget to do that or I didn't have
that stuff.
Or you know he's got a TV inhis room and I still don't have
a TV in my room and things likethat.
But you know we've had toexplain to her that.
You know y'all are 10 yearsapart, number one and number two

(59:04):
.
Me and your mom are indifferent phases of our career
now, right, and we're a littlebit more mature in our career,
so we are able to afford thingstoday that we weren't able to
afford when you were 10.
So that's the biggestdifference.
It's not that we love him more.
Or those dollars were allocatedto Dan's, or that, yeah, or

(59:25):
those dollars were allocated todance, or that, yeah, or we were
trying to get to a point wherewe are today with our, you know,
our housing or you know thingslike that.
So those are lessons that she'shaving to learn now and see,
see that.
But you know, every, everystage of life there's a

(59:46):
sacrifice.
Some hurt more than others, butI think that we've done a good
job of trying to manage that.
Sure.

Jim Cripps (59:53):
Well, you know one of the things and I think some
people could see you know yourtake on that as being
controversial.
I think it's right, in linewith being a great parent, but
you know, one of the segmentsthat we have a little bit of a
little bit of fun with on theCharge 4 podcast is and I can't
say I came up with this myself.
It was actually from the GOATpodcast, the GOAT Consulting

(01:00:14):
podcast that I was on years ago,and so shout out to John and
Colby for that one.
But it's called Things we Thinkbut Do Not Say, and I know
you've got one that is justitching to get out.
So, if you will, please, please, share with everyone, because I
think that you can speak tothis so that everybody can hear

(01:00:35):
it.

El Lagutin (01:00:36):
Yeah.
So my biggest pain point rightnow, I think, is equality.
Everybody wants the same foreverything, and I think that in
the world that we live in,there's no such thing as

(01:00:58):
equality, because to be equalmeans you're taking something
from somebody and giving it toanother to make it equal, right.
And so I think of it as cups,right.
So if you have a cup that'sfull and one that's empty, to
make them equal, you have topour out of the full one to make

(01:01:19):
the other one you know to beequal, which now you have half
of one and a half of the other,and so the only way that I can
think of is there's no suchthing as equality.
To me, it doesn't matter,because we all have the same
choices and we all have the sameopportunities, especially to

(01:01:44):
live in the United States.
We all have the sameopportunities, especially to
live in the United States.
We all have the sameopportunities to get where you
want to go.
Now, my checking account mightbe different from your checking
account, but that's because ofthe choices that I've made Right
, and so I don't think that thatequal, that this whole push for

(01:02:06):
equality, is true today, right?

Jim Cripps (01:02:12):
Well, I think somebody could easily say well,
it wasn't fair that your dad gotto come to the United States
and be a doctor.
Well, so you're going todismiss the hard work, the risk.
Dismiss the hard work, the risk, the leaving a child in his
home country to come here tobuild a life, to shine shoes,

(01:02:36):
until he got back to being adoctor, to then provide for his
family.
I mean, hard work is whatyou're not accounting for in a
lot of those cases.
Yeah, and you know it's notfair, it's not in.
Well, I will say this.

(01:02:59):
So, uh, this is another anotherNick Heider, uh, uh, saying is
life's fair, everybody's priceis just different.
That's so good, and I think itsums the whole thing up.
Because what are you willing topay?
Because your dad was willing topay risk, he was willing to pay
the work in seven days a week,he was willing to not be a

(01:03:19):
doctor anymore, to go shineshoes, to then one day become a
doctor again, because he workedseven days a week in order to
provide for his family and to doall these things.
And then, at the same time, youand you and Jenny, uh, are you
and Jen making these decisionsthat are not necessarily fun
saying no to your daughter over1500 bucks on her college

(01:03:42):
decision when it was over budget.
But how big was the budget?
I mean percentage wise, itseems small.
But when, when the budget isout is out here, over budget is
still over budget.
And so how?
How many things in in Lucy'slife are changed because you
were willing to go?
Nope this, this, this was thebudget, yeah.

I mean it's again, it's sacrifices, right, Like you
have to make sacrifices and Idon't like to, I don't, I don't
like to.
There's a negative connotationwhen you hear the word sacrifice
, right, and so I don't thinkthat the every sacrifice is a
negative thing.
It's not, it doesn't have to benegative.
Sometimes you sacrifice time,um, so that you can do other

(01:04:28):
things and enjoy that other time, Right.
So me sacrificing my time rightnow doesn't necessarily mean
that's a negative thing.
It just means that I'm savingup for a different time.

Right, and so not everybody is willing to
sacrifice today for what theycould have tomorrow.

Right, and so I think that's an important thing.
So that's why I think the wholeequality talk, it bothers me a
lot.
And also, along those lines, isyou talking about my dad
immigrating to the United States?
Right, because I thinkimmigration talk right now is a

(01:05:08):
big pain point for a lot ofpeople.
Right, it's a hot button, andto me, my stance on that is my
parents are immigrants, right,and so you know there's a big
push with, you know, illegalimmigration and you know these
people aren't here legally andthese people you know illegal
immigration and you know thesepeople aren't here legally and

(01:05:29):
these people you know everybodysays these people, which that
bothers me because they'repeople and they are.
They are here because they'rewanting to better themselves in
the United States, and I'm notsaying that everybody should
come over illegally.
That's not what I'm saying.
What I'm what I'm saying.
What I'm saying is there's gotto be a line, right, because not

(01:05:52):
everybody looks in quotationmark, american, right, and so if
you say American, what doesthat look like?
And if you want to talk aboutimmigration and we're going to
bus everybody out that's hereillegally, at what step do you
stop?
Like, where's the line?
Right?
And so if you, you know my dadwas here.

(01:06:15):
He came here on a visa and heworked towards getting his
citizenship.
But I was born here, so I'mlegal, like, on all intents
purposes I'm legal.
But had my dad and mom not gonethrough the the steps to become
legal citizens of the UnitedStates and they stopped and they
were just here illegally andthey wanted to bust my dad and

(01:06:39):
mom back.
What about me?
And down your lineage?
Where's the line right?
Because if you look at it, alot of you know there's a lot of
people here in the UnitedStates that are settled and they
made a future.
You know they've made a greatlife for themselves here, but
their lineage is not herelegally.

(01:07:01):
So where do you draw the linewhere we're going to start
busting people out?

I know that's a hot button for a lot of people, but
no, I get it, and I don't knowthat there's there's a perfect
answer for it.
Um, you know, but I do thinkthere's.
That that's I feel like beingan American is is kind of a
spirit of, of, of hard work andhope and and those types of
things.
And you know, a few episodesago, um, giannis Las Manas was,

(01:07:30):
was here and he's from Latvia,yeah, and you know, I think he
he said it point blank.
He said you know, when I camehere, um, I was here and I was
working towards becoming acitizen and I knew that I
couldn't, you know, I forget ithad something to do with work.
And he was like I knew that Icouldn't, you know, I forget it
had something to do with work.
And he was like I wasn'twilling to do that because if I,

(01:07:50):
if I did that and I got caught,then that means you're out of
here and you don't ever get tocome back.
He was like I was trying tomake sure I did everything like
I was supposed to to become acitizen.
And I think there's so much tothat and almost to the point
where I'm like, you know, kidsshould have to go through a
civics class to do the thingsthat people who come here and

(01:08:11):
you know, come to the UnitedStates to become citizens should
have to do, so that theyunderstand what it means to be
an American, absolutely.
You know, I'm proud of thatflag and I'm proud of the
decisions we get to make becauseof it, but you know that that
didn't come easy.
People died for that and peoplestill die for it.

(01:08:31):
Die for it today.
Yeah, to take it for granted orto just be like, oh well, you
know, immigration doesn't matteror it's not a.
It's not a decision to be madelightly on either side of it.
It actually means like weshould actually spend the time
on it to to come to a conclusion, and then there will be hard
choices, no matter where thatline is drawn.

Absolutely, and I think that's the hardest part,
right Is like um, you have tomake those decisions not lightly
.
Um, we have to.
You know, you have to beeducated on it and get some, you
know, and you have to listen toboth sides.
That I think, that's, that's.
I think the biggest problemthat we have is that you know

(01:09:15):
you aren't willing to hear theother side and, and you know,
like you said earlier, I'mwilling to talk to anybody and
I'll be friends with anybody, Idon't care what your stance is
on political stuff or financialstuff.
Like we have a common groundsomewhere, yeah, but let's get
to that common ground, right,and then learn from each other.

Well, I think too.
So many times these days,people want to poke at each
other.
Instead of having this dialoguewhere it's like, cool, we'll
find the common ground, they'relike, oh, where can I poke at?
Yeah, and it's like, well, andI'm just going to leave, I'm not
going to be a part of that.
I mean, if that's, if that'swhat somebody's spirit is, we're
just not going to get along.
And and I'm not one that's allgoing to argue about it, I know

(01:09:57):
I'm I'm just going to removemyself from the conversation
Cause I that's not a good use ofmy time and I think one of the
one of the cool things aboutgetting older yes, I do think we
get a little wiser.
We can probably get a littlemore stubborn uh, you know those
types of things.
But I think also we we figureout that we're going to tolerate
BS far less, because we've gotbetter things to do.

(01:10:20):
That's spend time with family,or spend time working on who
we're supposed to become, orhelping somebody, mentoring
somebody.
There's far too many things todo than to put up with somebody
that's taking from your lifeAbsolutely.

And I think that's I think that's really important
too Right Is to be able to havethe strength to say I don't want
to do that anymore, I don't, Idon't want to listen to that
anymore, I'm not going to beinvolved with that anymore.
Around people that you knowthat they're always talking bad

(01:11:09):
about somebody else, um, I, Idon't, I'm not comfortable in
that situation, because when Ileave the table, am I the next
person that gets talked about?
So, um, I'm here to lift, tryto lift people up Like I'm.
I'm here to try to um, how canI help you?
How can I get you in a betterspot?

(01:11:31):
How can I, um, bless you.
You know, and I'm not, and I'mnot trying to be this holier
than thou guy, but, um, ifyou're part of my village, I'm
going to make sure that ourvillage is built strong, right,
and so I think that's important,yeah.

Well, speaking of build a building strong, you
know, um, I would say you and Iboth have been on a health
journey and especially back whenwe first met and not long
thereafter, we were far lesshealthy than we are today.
Yeah, absolutely.
And so, um, you know, I knowwhat that my journey has kind of
been like, but please sharewith our guests like what you
know.

(01:12:11):
I know you did some orangetheory for a while.
You know, dialing in your, inyour diet and, and it's not like
life hasn't happened.
I mean, you've gotten thrownsome some serious, uh,
roadblocks and challenges andheartache along the way.
Uh, but what?
How's the health journey?

and heartache along the way.
Uh, but what?
How's the health journey it'sdoing?
It's going really well.
So, um, at my heaviest I wastwo 55.
Um, I'm I'm down to one 85, one83.
I I've still got about 10 morepounds that I'd like to get to
do Um it, to do Um it.

(01:12:54):
It's been, it's been hard.
Um, I think the the the easiestpart for me was, um switching
up my diet.
Um, like I went on, I did ketofor a long time and then I got
bored with it and so I gained alittle bit of weight back, and
then now I'm just trying towatch portions um now and just
try to eat smarter.
I don't always make the rightdecisions on that, but it is

(01:13:15):
seeing my dad go through thehealth struggles that he went
through.
I have promised myself that Idon't.
I don't want to do that Like Idon't.
You know, I want to enjoy lifea little bit more.

But I remember us having those conversations,
cause it was like he's a doctor,he knows better and no, but you
can't.
You can't make your parents doanything.

Well, that, and doctors are the worst patients.
Let's just be honest.
Um so, um, I, just I, I want tobe able to enjoy, you know,
that style, that kind of life,you know, even the older I get.
And number one is I got tiredof being the fattest dad at the
baseball field.
Um, I, I got tired of, um, when, when it was time to do the

(01:14:01):
dads versus kids, to be theslowest dad on the field, um, I
got.
I got tired of that, you know,and I got tired of just not
being able to, you know, becomfortable in my own skin.
Um, and so I'm trying to get toget there.

It's still a work in progress, oh yeah, we're, I
mean, and it will be forever?
Um, because health is.
You know, health is constantlyevolving because we're getting
older and so we have to dothings differently.
But it's about trying to getthat health span and that
lifespan to match up so youdon't end up, you know, sick the
last 10 years of your life, ornot able to play with your

(01:14:38):
grandkids, or you know thosetypes of things.

Yeah, and you know that that that was hard for me
to watch for my dad Right.
And so he worked his whole life, man, he, he just, you know he
worked so hard.
We had a conversation with eachother and my dad was always
frugal.
He never wanted to spend a lotof money this and that.

(01:15:18):
And finally, one day I told himI was like Dad, listen, you
need to start spending some ofyour money because your health's
going down.
You need to enjoy spending someof your money because you know
your health's going down.
You need to enjoy some kind oflife, because if you don't spend
it, I'm going to spend it, youknow, and I don't want to have
money because you didn't right.

(01:15:40):
And so that was kind of a lightfor him that he was like you
know, you're right.
Well, then he really startedspending money.

So yeah, so you know , my parents were a little bit
the same way, you know, grew upand we were on a shoestring
budget and we, you know, it'snot like we ever went hungry,
but at the same time therewasn't, there wasn't much
leftover, if there was anythingleft over.
And then, you know, even alittle bit later in life, it was
a struggle for them and then,as things eased up and their

(01:16:10):
finances got in better shape,they were still incredibly
frugal, like just crazy frugal,and I was like Dad, I don't need
your money, I'm doing okay, mysister's doing okay, it's okay
to spend some.
And so he likes his custom cars?
Yeah, and I'm glad he does.

(01:16:30):
You know, in fact, the last onehe said something about going
to go get it and I looked at myschedule and I was like I can go
in the morning, like let's go,you know, but it is fun seeing
your parents enjoy life a little, and you know, uh, and I hate
that he didn't get to enjoy moreof that, but yeah, but he, dad,

(01:16:51):
enjoyed life and his biggestthing with the grandkids.

Um, you know he he spoiled them and I loved
watching him spoil them and thatthat was.
That's the coolest part foreverything.
So, yeah, absolutely.

All right.
So, uh, I got.
I got two other questions foryou.
We have a little bit of funwith this.
So let's just say,hypothetically I know I'm
throwing you on the spot withthis one Hypothetically, we're
putting on a charity bowlingtournament and you get to pick
four teammates, living orotherwise.
Could be celebrities, could bepro athletes, could be anybody

(01:17:26):
you, you even know their name,but you want to get as many eyes
on this charity event aspossible.
Could be celebrities, could bepro athletes, could be anybody
you even know their name, butyou want to get as many eyes on
this charity event as possible.
Who are your four players thatjoin you?
Living or it doesn't matter.
It doesn't matter Anybody.
Throughout history, throughouthistory.

Oh, okay, so JFK Okay.
Yeah, that's good All right, Ijfk would bring in a lot uh-huh
um muhammad ali, um tiger woodsand the last one.

(01:18:06):
You're gonna laugh, but I justreally want to ask him a lot of
questions.
P Diddy, oh wow, I got to know,I got to, I got.
I want, I want to know thetruth on that.
I want to hear some of that.

Well.
So it's funny that you say thatbecause, uh, ron Hicklin.
So a big shout out to the CTDbowling out there.
So Ron owns a bowling companyand Ron is just a force of
nature.
He, he decided as a teenagerthat he wanted to be a ball
designer.
Now, keep in mind that's,that's a job that five people in
the world had, and he grew upto become a ball designer.

(01:18:40):
So I mean, there's not manyjobs that are smaller than that.
You know, if you said you weregoing to be the, you know, the
pitcher for the New York Yankeesor something that's, there's
one guy, that's that, or youknow.
You know you got a few guysRight, but anyway, and he said
because if you're the lane guy,you put oil in the lanes and he
was like he did, he can do thelanes About fell off the stool,

(01:19:07):
all right.
So last question is so for thisevent, you get to pick a
commentator?
Who's?

going to commentate this event for you.
Oh, I'm going to say BarackObama, okay.

All right, barack Obama is going to commentate.

Just because I think he does very well in his public
speaking.
Okay, and he would bring in alot for the celebrity, for the
charity.
Oh, you'd have some donorsthere, that's for sure.

All right.
So we got JFK, muhammad Ali,tiger Woods, p Diddy and Obama.
So JFK and Ali are new.
But multiple people have saidTiger.
We had Virgil Herring on.
Tiger was on his list and itwas also on Quentin's list.
P Diddy's now come up twice andObama is new.
Okay, that's good stuff, allright.

(01:20:03):
The very last thing is have youput any thought into how you
want to be remembered?

Yeah, I have.
Going through my dad's passinghas been difficult.
You know, he was my hero andall that.
And I sit back and think aboutthe way I think about dad Right.
I sit back and think about theway I think about dad right and

(01:20:52):
since his passing, there are somany people that have reached
out that you have one person'sphone number that you have
remembered um to, because youcould call them and they would
always come help.
Um, that that's the way.
And then I want to beremembered as a great husband
and an amazing father.
That's, um, the four thingsthat that I want people to
remember.
That's the legacy that I wantto build.
Yeah.

Yeah, you want to matter to the people who matter.
Yes, absolutely, I love thatman.
Well L, thank you so much forcoming in and hanging out with
me today.
It's been an absolute pleasure.
Um, and to everybody out there,I hope, I hope you took
something away from this episode.
I hope you learned somethingfrom whether it be the stories
about El's dad and him believingin the American dream so much

(01:21:36):
to take the chance on himselfand to bet that he could create
a life worth living here in theUnited States and that it would
be the best thing he couldpossibly do for his family.
What a gift that has been to Eland his sisters and to future
generations.
Again, you can't go wrong bybetting on yourself and then, at

(01:21:57):
the same time, understand it'snot going to be given to you.
You have to put in that hardwork, you have to strive towards
it, and this myth of equalityis really that, because you are
the deciding factor in whetheryou and your family succeed, and
it's about building a strongfoundation, teaching future
generations that performancematters and that hard work

(01:22:20):
matters and that you have tohave a strong foundation or you
have to build it for you.
So, anyway, get out there.
Again, I wish you the best.
I hope that 2025 is going to bethe most amazing year that
you've ever had, and it will beif you decide to make it so
Until next time.
I'm Jim Cripps with the ChargeForward Podcast.
Special thanks, as always, toour friends here at HitLab

(01:22:42):
Studios, our friends at SenseCustom Development and Charge
Forward Solutions.
Take care Team is Jim Crippshere with the Charge Forward
Podcast.
I just want to tell you I loveyou.
I appreciate you listening, Iappreciate you for subscribing
and sharing the Charge ForwardPodcast with people you know and
you love, because that's whatwe're here for.
We are here to share theamazing stories, the things that

(01:23:06):
people have been through, theways that they were able to
improve their life, so that youcan take little nuggets from
theirs and help improve yourstory and be better tomorrow
than you were today.
I hope that this is the toolyou needed at the right time and
that you find value in theamazing guests that we bring
each and every week.
Thanks so much and don't forgetnew episodes drop every

(01:23:30):
Thursday.

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