May 25, 2024 • 51 mins
In this powerful episode of Chasing Thoughts, we welcome Ryan Skinner, a remarkable individual who transformed his life from the depths of addiction to the heights of purpose and success.
Ryan had it all but fell into the grip of addiction, leading him to jail. However, his story took a profound turn thanks to one man's compassion, which inspired Ryan to change his life. Today, Ryan has not only rebuilt his life but also established a thriving business. He is now a father, business owner, speaker and he hosts his own podcast called Cracking the Code.
Join us as Ryan shares his incredible journey of redemption, resilience, and the pursuit of purpose. This episode is a testament to the power of compassion and the strength of the human spirit. Don't miss it!
Chapters
00:00:00 Introduction
00:00:40 Ryan’s story
00:07:45 Ryan’s coaching business
00:11:15 The spiritual tool kit
00:18:23 Ryan’s path out of addiction
00:28:58 Shame is a product of a materialistic society
00:37:07 Cracking the Code podcast
00:49:13 Closing thoughts
To find out more about Ryan Skinner
Website—https://crackingthecodewithryanskinner.com
Instagram—https://www.instagram.com/crackingthecodewithryanskinner/
Tik Tok—https://www.tiktok.com/@crackingthecodewithryan
YouTube—https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCaep2AwIS8U36-X1OyCKuIg
If you are interested in the book Chasing The Scream by Johann Hart
https://www.amazon.com/Chasing-Scream-Opposite-Addiction-Connection/dp/1620408910
If you would like to know more about Mindy or Keith you can find them here:
Mindy Aisling (@mindyaisling)
Keith Dauch (@mastercheeseee)
More on Chasing Thoughts:
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Welcome to the Chasing Thoughts podcast.
(00:03):
Listen in as Mindy, Keith and their guests
take a deep dive into their own minds and souls
to investigate the beauty of imperfection,
challenge their beliefs
and embrace the richness of living a truly authentic life.
Welcome to Chasing Thoughts.
(00:24):
Hello everybody and welcome to season two,
episode 19 of the Chasing Thoughts podcast.
Today we have special guest, Ryan Skinner,
who we are so excited to get to know.
Welcome, Ryan.
Thank you for having me.
So I'd love to start with you,
sort of just sharing an overview of sort of your life story
(00:47):
and what kind of makes you into the human
that is here with us today.
It's funny, most of who I became, I became through pain, right?
Like a lot of people I think.
You know, I had a fairly normal up brand like most kids.
You know, I was very lucky. I had two parents, two good parents.
I had an aunt and uncle to help raise me
because I was back and forth with both houses.
(01:08):
They were tremendous.
I had another relative who was abusive,
but he died when I was really young in second grade.
So I mean, yeah, at least a scar if you're abused,
but it's not anything you can't come back from.
It was a very shy, awkward, nervous kid all through high school.
You know, the best way I describe it,
because my friends don't believe me,
is I never asked a girl to a dance.
It was whoever asked me. I was just so shy.
And I was just painfully shy.
(01:30):
In college, something changed.
So in seventh grade, my teacher knew I couldn't read well,
because I had dyslexia, but she noticed I was gifted with numbers.
She taught me finance. I got into the stock market.
I was featured in a lot of things with Peter Lynch and women's romance.
There was a big feature called the Wizkill Wall Street.
And then I knew in seventh grade what I would do for a living.
And that was important to me because I grew up,
(01:51):
my mom was a housekeeper.
My dad had two blue collar jobs.
So for me, I knew I, now I could at least make money.
And I always felt less than because we didn't have money.
Fast forward, I had to be in college and I ended up falling the wrong crowd.
There's a kid who's like a cousin to me and I love him,
but he's a tough guy and I'm not a tough guy.
I always say I'm like an iron marshmallow.
I pretend to be tough.
(02:13):
And I followed him around and next thing you know,
it's like if you act a certain way long enough,
you kind of get that way.
And next year I knew I found myself involved in dealing drugs,
other things just shouldn't be doing.
And you know, I went to college.
I had a scholarship for finance, not finance because I was really smart
with numbers.
And it's like, and I've always landed that way because of my ability to use
numbers, but I always wanted to be anything but me.
(02:36):
You know, I remember coming to college and my friend who was a real tough guy
would say to me, I would give anything to be you.
You could make well until six things.
Honestly, like I'm involved in organized crime.
Why don't you want to be you and I'd be thinking myself,
I want to be anybody but me, you know,
I started drinking more.
I never really paid attention at a young age.
I didn't drink because the uncle that was abusive was an alcoholic.
(02:57):
So I never, I associate alcoholism with abusing kids.
And when I started drinking,
I started feeling more comfortable in my own skin, you know,
and then I got involved in steroids and I got really into the gym and
everything was taken off on the outside,
faster cars, faster girls.
And on the inside I was losing who I was meant to be.
My father found out I was selling steroids and he threw me out of the house
(03:18):
by junior college.
He said, we don't own a new car.
We don't own any conditioner.
But you're ruining lives.
Get out of my house.
And I remember saying, I'll come back tomorrow for the rest of my stuff.
And he laughed.
He said, you don't ever come back here again.
This is my house.
And the day before I graduated college,
I asked if I could move back because the one thing I knew about my dad was
he had integrity, both my parents, you know,
just, he was a solid person.
So he said, you want to come back.
I don't want you drinking now once not at all.
(03:40):
You have a 10 p.m.
curfew seven days a week and that BMW you bought goes in the driver.
You're not driving.
You're not driving.
A drug deals car.
Your mother has a Volkswagen with no, no bumper and a bungee court holder.
You drive that.
And you know what I did because I wanted to have that integrity yet.
So I live with my parents.
So I was about 22 and they helped me find that.
I bought a two family because I had my business was doing well.
(04:01):
And I moved in with me.
I was a bad roommate.
I started drinking more hanging out with older guys in the business.
They were going out for scotch.
I didn't even like scotch, but I would just again try to fit in.
And then, and I was like, I don't know.
I had a major issue with health and I bled out.
I was drinking too much and I ended up in a coma.
And when I came out of it about a month later,
when I got the hospital, I go back and they said, yeah,
(04:23):
we're glad you're feeling better,
but we found tumors with cancer.
And we're going to have to do some surgeries.
And then ended up,
I see.
And I tell folks, I wasn't a victimized volunteer.
But those tough guys, I knew they were oxycard and dealers.
People would trade Rolexes up.
They were going to trade in a lot of ways.
And I was like, I'm not going to get that.
I was like, I'm not going to get that.
I'm not going to get that.
I'm not going to get it.
oxycardin dailies, people would trade Rolexes off their wrists for one pill.
(04:43):
And I thought I'd be exempt.
I thought I was stronger and they will weak and all that.
Next thing I knew, um, oxycardin dailies, what did you do?
Nine months later, they told me, they'd take me off the medicine.
We were done with the surgeries.
At that point, you weren't taking me off.
So I bought them on the street and before you knew it over three years, I went
through probably three quarters of a million dollars of savings, investments,
(05:04):
four, one K gone, two houses gone.
And, uh, before I knew it, I'm on the streets of Australia.
I mean, there's heroin act and, uh, and I thought that was the bottom.
I thought I was over.
And I remember getting in trouble.
I was on probation for this and that.
I remember going to jail the day I went to the courthouse.
I said to my friend, who's the chief probation, you're never going to home.
He come on.
Don't be like that.
And he said, I said, you wouldn't screw me.
(05:26):
He said, screw you.
You can get arrested fighting, drinking on probation.
He said, I'm holding it.
And that they say it's not before it's dawn.
It is.
I went to jail.
I did a little time.
Not much.
I got out through the grace God.
I asked for treatment rather than go out, go out back up to the street.
And, uh, my life changed.
(05:47):
I won't tell you it's been a relapse.
I did have a couple of relapses early on, but it's been amazing.
You know, I've had people in my life that is just spectacular.
I live a life around.
I'm dead.
I wouldn't say I'm perfectly comfortable with my skin because I think
anybody with addiction or anything, you're kind of broken out.
I don't think you have a fully whole again.
But man, I'll tell you, I have something to share and help all the people.
And the business that I lost came back 10 fold.
(06:08):
I mean, that's great.
I have a coach.
He was right.
Mentor other businessmen that go through midlife crisis addiction.
Uh, they own a business.
They had to insecure on how do I run my business and stay grounded.
And I've been able to take all the blessing and get all the pain turned
into a blessing.
It's been a positive.
So pretty lucky.
Yeah.
(06:28):
It's a beautiful story.
And I love how you said in the beginning that a lot of what you
thought of what has formed you was the suffering because it's true.
Our suffering carves us out.
And I also just love how you described your life sort of as this pursuit
of authenticity, like trying to find yourself deeper and deeper and feel
(06:52):
comfortable in your own skin, which I think is sort of the human experience.
Yeah, it's true.
Yeah.
So I think it's very relatable.
And for some of us it's an easier path than for other people.
Yeah.
I always say, you know, I don't learn how much I learned really hot lessons.
(07:13):
The reason why you know, in my twenties, if you asked who I was, I'd
hear you in my business card.
I'd let you know what I made of this and that.
What I drove.
At 44 years old, you know what I want people to know me as I'm a dad.
You know, I want people to see that I'm a good dad.
I want people to see like, you know, I help homeless people, but guys
in prison like that, that is far more important to me.
I mean, we all like nice stuff and I'm not going to say I don't, but I will tell
(07:35):
you, I would trade the sports card to make sure my daughter has the right
education for her autism any day of the week.
You know, that's what comes down to.
Yeah.
So tell us a little bit more about how you became a coach, why you decided
on that path and sort of what that looks like for you now.
(07:56):
So it was strange.
I originally, I always loved coach guys.
I always like going to the jail and running programs, helping guys
rebuild their lives, that's that.
And, and my business, my financial business exploded.
I won't lie to you.
It did better than I ever dreamt.
I mean, it did 10 times worse in my twenties, but the money wasn't enough.
It wasn't what it was about this time.
Like I don't want my legacy.
If somebody remembers why I leave behind to my kids or to a charity, that's not
(08:19):
what I want.
It's like, I want to why I leave in my kids.
Like I want my kids to have a different character because of my paints.
They don't have to one go through it and two more point that they're
empathetic to those that do.
And so I thought, oh, you know, I love coaching like other, you know,
guys who are trying to build businesses and whatnot.
So I'll just do that.
And it's funny.
I have clients that pay me ridiculous money and I have clients don't pay me
(08:41):
because they can't afford it.
I say, don't, you know, I'm happy to do it.
I'll meet you where you're at.
I just love doing it.
I like checking it with them daily.
I like knowing how their lives are going.
I want, I was blessed to come back and I, and I believe that there are certain
spiritual traits that I got, I don't even want to see treats.
Certain things I learned to build spiritually because I good mentor.
(09:01):
Nothing, nothing I say is authentic.
I'll say right now, I even come up with one good idea.
Trust me, but I've learned to live to follow some good ideas because my
ideas aren't so bright.
And I took these spiritual principles that laid out my kid feeling a toolkit.
And I built a life that I love and I applied them to my business and I said,
geez, you know, these work for me.
The spiritual principles don't work for anybody.
(09:22):
It's like gravity.
If I drop a kid, you drop a kid, they both hit the floor.
So I started trying with other guys and I said, wow, this is amazing.
And the reason I do it with men is it's not a sexism thing.
It's just, I feel it's more appropriate because I can relate to what
guys go through more, right?
I don't know what it's like to be a woman or try to be a first time mother.
And I can't relate, but I know it's like to be a guy and have a child and find
out your daughter had to his autism and scary as all hell.
(09:45):
Like I can relate to that all day.
And so I said, how do I pay it forward?
And the money part, frankly, sometimes you make it.
Sometimes you make great money.
Sometimes you don't make anything.
And that's not, I'm very fortunate.
I haven't, now it's easy for me.
I have the financial businesses that do very well.
So I don't really have to chase the money.
For me now it's a passion project.
Yeah.
(10:06):
Yeah, it's funny because Keith and I are very similar.
We are both coaches, but we both see clients on a range, right?
Of free to expect, because, you know, the truth is, is that a hundred
dollars doesn't have the same value to every single person, right?
People are at different stages of their life and everybody needs healing.
(10:28):
So if you're, if we are in a position to offer healing without charging
an exerbated amount, I feel like that's in alignment with making
the world a better place.
Absolutely.
You know, and I believe the universe, I don't know if I call it, sometimes I
say it's God, cause that's the only word I knew growing up, but
spirit of the universe is some kind of energy out there.
Then when I'm living the right way, when I'm praying, when I'm meditating,
(10:49):
when I'm trying to be of service to others, somehow if I do the right
thing and don't worry about the money, like I'm provided for, I don't know
how it works.
I really don't, but I know what you guys are doing is unique and special.
And you touch lives and if you can measure by dollars and cents, man, you
might leave somebody out there dying that could really use your help.
And an hour of your time, yeah, it's valuable, but man, what a pay off
(11:10):
if that person doesn't die.
There's your reward, you know?
Yeah.
Yeah.
I'd love to hear more about sort of your spiritual toolkit that you mentioned
because I believe that whether you call it spirituality or you have a different
name for it, energy, you're God, you have to have access to something other
(11:34):
than just this world.
Yes.
In order to be fulfilled and successful.
And a lot of times I know when clients come to me, it's like they don't want
to believe in the power of that stuff.
Like, oh, no, I don't need to spend 10 minutes meditating.
Like, no, no, I'm just going to make all my phone calls and you're like, well,
wait a second.
(11:54):
Right.
So talk a little bit about like that spiritual toolkit and what you have
found is really valuable in that.
I, yeah.
So again, I find everything through pain.
So when I, at one point I'm going to screw shade pain emotionally.
I was barely sober.
I was definitely suicidal.
I was out of my mind and a guy said, well, are you praying?
I said, what do you mean praying?
(12:15):
Like, you know, where's God here and everywhere?
I meditate and I'm like, no, what do you want me to do?
Just sit there quietly.
He's like, yeah, I do.
And I'm like, that's not going to work.
He's like, well, do you do it?
I'm like, no, but it's crazy.
I mean, how's that going to work?
It's just killing time.
When I started doing these things, so it was all just little suggestions.
Like there are different readings I'll do in the morning, like little spiritual
readings.
I'm not only religious, but I'm very spiritual.
(12:37):
I believe there's something out there when I went to a guy and they have a
hard time with the spirituality.
I take him up to the ocean and I said, listen, we're going to stand here.
That water is going to come in.
It's going to wash over your feet.
It's going to pull out the pain.
It's going to bring in some energy.
And if you can have that, you can just see that it comes in and it's
times the tide goes on, then it comes back in.
You have good days and bad days.
And you can use that energy, call whatever.
(12:58):
I mean, there's windmills is something to this something to this
universe with is something we can tap into.
Or if you watch like, you know, you'll see it.
Dock or seagull flies down and eat something.
There's a cycle to this world that's bigger than us.
And it's unique as we think we are, especially in the financial
sector, we think we're so important, bringing in millions of dollars.
This and that.
And we're not that unique.
I'm not that important.
(13:18):
I mean, I spoke at a conference last week.
I said, listen, I don't pronounce my hours.
I mumble.
I don't wear a tie.
And I'm always in the top three in the country.
And the funny part is it's the universe.
Yeah, I'm not that important.
You hear so many people who are so worried about dollars and stuff.
And like what they wear.
And I was like that.
I mean, I still have stupid cars.
I bought, I have watches.
(13:39):
I bought when I was younger.
And I think to myself, why?
Like we all want to look nice, but there's something when you're
tapped into me, for me, it's nature.
I should say I have a dog.
I love dogs.
Having a child with autism is learned.
She's helped me tap into that energy.
I didn't know I had because she's unique.
I mean, she's just different.
My daughter, it doesn't play like most kids, but once I learned to do
(13:59):
things according to what she needs and wants, she's a superstar.
And I think that's what it is.
I mean, so I know when you say people say, well, that's not going
to, when they dive into their calls and I fall off.
I tell people to take a spiritual battery.
I'm charged up.
I'm doing great.
The next day I do a little less.
The next day I don't make my bed.
The next day I don't meditate, but I do pray.
The next day I brush my teeth while texting.
Before you know it, I'm caught up in the now what's now.
(14:22):
What do I have now?
Who do I have to call?
You could slow it down, especially somebody like me who's
already a Taipei.
When I just.
Like the universe does for me, but I can't do for myself.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I love the way that you talked about it as a practice because
that's what I find too is that.
(14:43):
Doing a meditation practice or yoga practice or whatever your practice
is doesn't mean that you're perfect every single day.
It means that when you mess up, you restart, you restart and you
become a master at restarting without a doubt.
So true. I tell folks, some days I'm just checking the boxes and
some days I'm having home runs.
The thing I like with the gym, for example, I love this when I go to
(15:03):
the gym, some days I don't want to be there and walk in and ready.
Sometimes I have a great workout those days.
Another day I'm just going through it.
I'm like, am I done yet?
Yoga. I'm trying to get into. I'm not going to lie to you.
I struggle because I can't horrible the poses, but I believe it's
the fact that I show up and I'm willing to do it and I'm willing
to have the humility to do it.
I'm not going to lie to you.
I'm not going to lie to you.
I'm not going to lie to you.
I'm not going to lie to you.
(15:24):
I'm not buying to turn it this way. I'm not going to be, but I like
throwing the upper left or the middle right.
Having it, you can't really walk up and I'm willing to do it and I'm
willing to have the humility not to be great at it.
You know, it's easy to do what we do well.
And it's taking that time for ourselves.
It's away from the world.
Just breathing.
Just being present because this is not fast.
(15:44):
And me, if you look at it, if you watch the news, it's always negative
stuff. Politics their all boxing and each other.
And, and I think people will slow down and like, you know,
And I went up there because I just want to see what's like a 20 minute ride in when I got there as a world away
Once he was the fastest 20 minutes. He got me 100 miles away or a thousand miles away
I'm up there nature and this birds. He's got chickens. I'm like, where the hell I this is wonderful
(16:07):
And it was a fun from like back in the 1600s
We start talking about the families that owned it and how some of them were killed during the witch trials at like this and that and
All this unique story that came with it
And you know back then if you had a neighbor and you had chickens you bring some eggs over and they might have a cow
They use some milk. There's more community. I think we go so fast and we lose the community
(16:32):
Yeah
Yeah, I know that
What you said a little bit ago about
Sort of being authentic instead of playing the role like this is what a coach is supposed to look like
This is what a financial advisor supposed to look like this is what a successful person supposed to look like
And I know that's one thing that I really admire about Keith is that he's always keeping that awareness
(17:00):
Showing up in presence rather than in a constructed role of this is what it's supposed to look like
And that's how you sort of let the magic in right is through just being there and
Being present enough to see what's arising
Right from
(17:21):
Nature. Yeah, is he
For me in my job like certain aspects after we're more dressy clothes and others and
I think in myself like I'd rather be in more comfortable clothes
So clients they come in if they're gonna be clients, they get to know the real Ryan, you know, I don't want you
I don't want to stare when I was younger and I first got so right pronounced by ours
(17:42):
And I would there's nothing wrong with people would speak well
But if it's not me and it's not authentic and I'm trying to focus on that rather focusing it and no use an individual
My really being of service now if I'm a very well-spoken person, that's a great characteristic for people that have that
You know my strength is I'm usually pretty up in it. I can usually find a positive most things
That's my positive my strength and it's so hard though for people to be authentic in this day and age
(18:06):
Especially with social media. I mean, I don't do social media. My team runs it. I've never seen it
No, no, no, will I ever just now? I don't believe I just don't want to see now
I know it's important to be plugged in and all that. That's why they're great
But for me, I want to be with my feet are you know
Yeah
I'm curious if you'd be willing to share
What allowed you to get out of addiction because I think addiction is
(18:32):
Misunderstood in our culture. It's certainly misjudged in our culture, right?
And it is a really challenging road. So what was it that allowed you to come out of that?
So, you know, that's where the universe come in. I gotta be honest
I called God said a lot of say but I'm not thinking about religious God, but I think that they're I
(18:56):
Don't like the only thing to say is somebody took my hand a guy saw me broken
This guy when I first us guy means he looked like a bum
He'd be wearing these shorts are way too short right this beat up by his club
That's myself, but he spoke in the way he spoke this piece. He had I wanted to know my guys phone number
No, I said to that but when I went to jail this guy showed up turns out he was a director of some IT
(19:17):
The company showed up all dressed up. It was like, I think look a bomb. I go
I just so you were really spiritual and he was not a job. I just don't care what anyone thinks and he called my mother was in jail
Well, somebody's mother listens to cry with her jail. Nobody might tell me something jail and that changed everything
I saw something this guys, you know what? This is what it's about like this guy's elite because he doesn't care
(19:37):
He just can't we dress he dressed nice sometimes, but you know what? I mean that wasn't I was drawn to him because of who he was the character and
And this guy just taught me how to live you want the truth like I would call him I
Ask him like shy with blue socks and gray socks with a suit. I called him with a hundred questions
I called him when I first came back in business. I couldn't get crying. So I would call crying
(19:59):
Every decision I made I called this guy and he was the universe worked through him and
Next thing I knew he was he was taking him this meetings with 12 step means taking me through the book and like sponsor me
They teach me that hey, Brian, you know religions people are really afraid of going to help and your spirituality people have been there
No job is to connect somebody else to spirituality and then next thing I knew once they got in that system where I was kind of
(20:22):
I've been flow people would come into my life and I would help this person and it would help me more than I was helping them
I was slowly getting so far with prediction. Thank God gave me rewards. Don't go. I had relapses early on
I've had many seven 13 surgeries the last five seven years
So and every time you have surgeries they pump you full of opioids even if you're an addict
They're like we need these for the first day or two
(20:43):
The name makes it easy and now it is if I have a surgery not to fall back in is I have a four-year-old who was autism
She deserves better and yeah
Don't be wrong when people have kids in their attics once you're in it
Let's see you a treaty kid for a pillow. That's how it is
But when you're in the other side of you, I have a choice today
So if I know I have something come out the company in compromise position
(21:03):
I'm on the phone with five guys people coming with me the whole to the medicine
So I would say God within the universe working through people I
Really believe just one good person after an ally. What you're doing here
You're sharing good thoughts with other people you help people connect if people we learn from each other
I mean, I I don't have one going you said any original ideas. I have had me embarrassed to share, you know
(21:26):
Yeah, you know, it seems like when I ask people that question
It's a common response that there was someone in their life who was so filled with love so filled with joy
so, you know bright and made everybody else in the room feel better about themselves, right and
That is always what I try to remember for my goals is I want to be that person, right?
(21:51):
That walks into a room and makes everybody feel better that
Love emanating off of me, right because that's how you change people by who you are not what you do
And so I love the way that you describe that that you got lucky enough to have people who
Were doing that who were showing up as their full selves and just shining their light and
(22:14):
It hooked you this guy Billy
I wanted to be him because he fought like me he drank with me drug loving
What you walk in is he's a good shape you walk into me and shoulders back and then he would gently talk to a guy
Another guy say, how you doing? You're thinking me this rough duck. Hey, how you doing? You doing alright?
You look great. You or you look off you want to talk and he and I is so close now that um
(22:35):
They had choked up this guy changed my life changed everything in my life. This guy literally did 180 of my life
I want to be in a materialistic greedy
Person who didn't care about himself. I don't want anyone else
It's genuinely just not coming to deal about stuff, you know, and just trying to be a good guy and he taught me by his actions
I got here his words, but it was his actions and I
He just moved to Florida because he's semi-retired and his birthday is April 2nd
(22:59):
I just showed up on a flight to surprise like that's how close I am to his wife and
His wife and they're just amazing people. They've she had the patience to let him take time away from her to be with me
Yeah, I was a heavy lift. I'm bipolar. I have ADHD. Obviously
And I was a heroin act. I had a lot and I court case going on and trying to rebuild the business and
(23:20):
And she allowed not just allowed embraced it and I mean I would go through breakups and I would show up at the house crying
You know, I would remember once I bring it up with the gruff three years and showing up at their dinner together
I crashed in a date and just walked and I never felt guilty because I felt like it was okay
And it was okay. That was the love that they showed me. So it wasn't just Billy as Michelle as well
But the kindness and like pure selfless love that and the way he showed me how to live like
(23:44):
I remember saying one day, oh, I got a fight and I just get out and he's like, you don't do that anymore. You're your recovery man
You don't do that
We've been talking about like something about disrespect that girl basically like I was you know, I didn't I was dating a lot and I wasn't really
Treat women the way I'd want to be my daughter. He said, that's not how recovery man treats a girl
You know, you don't just like hook up with girls leave you have respect for women a topic one thing at a time before I knew it
(24:08):
Like, you know, I made sense
Yeah
I
I love such an amazing book called chasing the screen
Really?
Addiction. Yeah, I believe his name is
Yohan Bari he was a investigative journalist. He had a friend that unfortunately passed away from from an overdose and he wanted to get into and understand the nature of addiction and he found as he traces it back to like the opium crisis up in Canada when they were bringing in people from Asia and stuff to build the railroads
(24:49):
He traced it all the way back down to one thing and it was shame. Shame is the thing that that drives addiction and the way that you're describing, you know, like the guy who's like this IT guy but but comes up on a bike and looks like a bum.
There was no judgment. There was just empathy and love and then your friends, you know, the empathy, the love, the sometimes tough love like saying, No, this is not what we do. You know, but when you go into the system, when you're dealing with the police, when you're dealing with correctional officers, when you deal with probation officers, a lot of times, you can see, you can feel the judgment coming off of them, which just drives that
(25:27):
guilt and that shame that that I would believe like an adequate already feels naturally.
You just nailed you know what I'll say this you talk about where we're being in the right place right time so I ended up getting most of my legal issues were the town of Wolverine Pass.
Just so I have as a chief of probation, Wolverine, his name is Vin Perot, he had started an opioid crisis program back in 2003 because they knew they had a problem in their hands.
(25:58):
So they had an understanding of what it was and he understood he and I knew each other we were friends at one point and then obviously we had a he had a and now we're really good friends and we talk almost every day, because now I'm on the other side I speak for this state I go to prisons, you know, and the chief of police now
Wolverine was a detective and I caught it's detective and Bobby and I really close friends, because he got it. I remember what time he walked by myself he said I'm going to buy you lunch.
(26:21):
I said don't look at me I'm a junkie. So you nailed it the shame. He said don't look at me I said don't look at me I'm a junkie please look away.
He said you know what right. There's no be perfect people and if there was we probably put me on to cross he said it's not you. He said I'm gonna get your lunch.
And now he Bobby's one of my closest friends when he made chief he called me 1130 at night one night this is a guy who arrested me at least a dozen times. I had how about this I have 15 clients, fifth now 16 actually last week, 16 clients that are cops retired that are putting
(26:51):
a cop on me, that I managed their money I managed their life savings for them and their wives. So that'll tell you about the turnaround in the world, when that energy shares and I nailed it though it's the shame I was, we used to chasing the screen I did think it's like it's
like it chasing the ghost once you get high, you think it is how you're always chasing it it's elusive you never gonna get it.
You know, just you go all your money and leave you out there and bears the shame and the shame you just
(27:15):
How do you go to somebody and say like me for me? I grew up in a nice family
How do I go to my cousin's the state trooper? We grew up in the same house
He's a great guy and say he's got a guy needle my out
The funny part is when I was like when I was getting some I'm sober
I mean he reached out to me all time with a beautiful relationship, but how do you do that the shame?
I don't know how you buy it. I was very lucky. I go to therapy. I nailed it
(27:35):
I hit a home run. I landed exactly where you want to be if you're an addict
Yeah, I love that you I
Guess your life proves that change is always possible
There is never a situation that is so dark that you can't come back from it and
On the other side the people in your life
(27:56):
How valuable for us to let other people change and not hold them to their mistakes that they made a year ago or five years ago
That's a good point. I never thought of that because I did have a lot of people hold me and I tried to make things up
There's one guy I remember saying, you know, I'm sorry. Let you down. It's just something I can do and I'm tired of using
I'm sorry. There must be something I can do to make it right. He's you know, I'm glad you sober
(28:20):
I wish you would die. I was like, all right
That's for you. It's for you and your universe my friend. Nothing I can do now
I try to make it for most people pre-understand saying you know, I'm glad you doing right. Uh, hey, you know
Like there's one guy he lost 20 grand on a train. So I made a deal
I can't say it live on this because it legal what I did
But he got that 20 grand back because I said I owed him that you know
If I wanted to make sure that there was never time I'd have to cross the street out of shame because that's how you use
(28:46):
Yeah, yeah, I need for you guys to know that and not be in those
It's easy for me to get it because I've lived it but for you guys to know that, you know
For you to say that was pretty my ball playing out. It's impressive
and and I'm I
think I think it's it's such a
Good thing to see as well like when you describe your family, you know, you weren't you weren't describing
(29:10):
You know
This horrific childhood growing up. So that shame I think a lot of times society is built sort of on that materialistic
Bent that that shame kind of comes in naturally so you can have great parents
You know a great upbringing everything that you need all your needs applied for and that shame can still slowly creep in
(29:36):
You know where it then leads us down that path, you know to trouble
That's strange. I mean, don't be wrong when I was young my uncle before he had passed put cigarettes out of my office
He did some stuff though screwed up, but um, and he would say some nasty stuff, but
You know, he's gone by times in second grade, you know, and the therapy worked through that
But I think it is I think and for me my parents worked so hard to bring Catholic school because they wanted to give me a better chance
(30:01):
And what happens I'm in school with all these kids that are driving nice cars
Is that you always feel less than always, you know, and and I you know that I didn't realize how much that drove me until I
Kids so much more money later on when I was buying the Ferraris ever say you and all the BS
Because I was doing it because I was trying to feel some sort of void
Then I remember I would drive it I would feel less than embarrassed because I felt like a junkie driving around an I ain't got
(30:24):
I mean, well, I'm sober. I'm like thinking myself
Then one day I realized none of it matters either way. I'm not that unique. I'm not that important
If anybody's that you impressed or disgusted by what I drive like that
That's that's the other thing like and I think you have a child gave me that that blessing it really took me out of me
Cuz I because I was really I think the disease of the addiction to very self-centered disease
(30:46):
You're either pitying yourself or you're trying to fill your needs and you don't realize how many people you trample on the way
And even when you do realize it sometimes you have a choice. I hate saying that but
Yeah, I
Heard something yesterday
that I really loved and
Somebody said when you choose a path you also choose all of the hardships and lessons along that path
(31:12):
And I thought what a beautiful way to say it because most people say oh I choose this path
And then when the hardships come up they go oh what the hell I don't write there's some inversion to it and
When I hear you talking I really hear that philosophy you're like no I choose it every day
I choose to call my support system when I need help
I choose this and that you didn't shy away from any of the cleanup you had to do right any of the
(31:39):
You just said I chose this path to be clean and there's gonna be all these hardships
And I'm facing them with my head held high and my shoulders back
It's funny. I wanted to move when so when I was gonna get sober
I was in jail and I remember the I gotta get sober and I knew guys went to jail got sober
So I thought maybe this will work for me. Maybe Jail's what I did and it really was
So they were gonna release me on parole this lawyer. I had worked it out there
(32:03):
We don't let me out of jail like two months. I looked at the judges said your honor if you release me today
I'm gonna get high
If you want to get me treatment I'll stay in a cage to get between so I stay in a cage
Just in jail an extra month. I got treatment
then I then
Provision officer I had was the devil the actual probation not the chief of the police. He was the worst. He was the biggest piece of
Oh, and
(32:24):
So he kept and he would say to my mother he make her cry. He did like this. She was gonna hang where he's going now and
So the judge said mr. Skinny you don't want to stay in jail escape
And it will let you go home if we find you treatment. I said you let me go home not coming back. I'm gonna use
She said all right if you want to fight your lawyer, I'll do it. So I stand jail again me treatment. I go back
I have to go back for what they called it on a bottom line was a kid stabbed me
(32:46):
I stabbed them back with his own knife. It was a long story. It wasn't just self-defense, but I didn't look good, obviously I
Had that case open so after jail, I'm in a sober house and I go back
I still have that open and the district attorney's office wants to put me back in jail
The judge is like he's already been chilly sober now at that point nine months
So she says mr. Skinner when you take time served this yeah, I would
(33:07):
So sorry, we're gonna reconvene in the downstairs courtroom
It go down I walked by probation my old my probation. I was sitting there now
I was told to pray for other people when I was in jail. I prayed that I could get out
I could this is awesome. I'm embarrassing this that would kill him in his family would have missed it
Then that I would kill him or I wouldn't kill him
He'd go die in the woods in his family will miss him then they wouldn't die
But he'd go live somewhere else and wouldn't bother me this same guy walk
(33:29):
I walk by his office. He says Ryan now. What are they gonna do or the housing case going? I said, oh, yeah
I said I'm a cheap time served. I don't go back to jail. He goes. Yeah, but I'm not sure it's good
I go no, no, don't ruin this for me. I'm thinking I said he's gonna put me back in jail
He walks in the courtroom. He says your honor. I've never seen a heroin ad come back this far at 30 years old
If we charge him with this he will never get his old job back
(33:51):
And then he's got no choice but to go to a bad life
Can we give him three years probation just wrap it up judge goodness to skin your lucky man hits the gavel
This guy was the devil and here he is. I mean he's a good friend of mine's a picture of in my office now
But at the time he was my nemesis, you know, you don't know who's in your life for a reason I
Will never get over that so I had three years probation. They call me and as behind on paying my probation fees. I had no money
(34:14):
I go to the court I was like, they gotta put me in jail probably at least hit me other fine and walk in and they clear the courtroom
Now the last time they did that they sentenced me like oh my god. I'm going to jail sweating
The judge is Mr. Skinner you're behind on 200 dollars of fines, whatever. I said, yeah, your honor. I have no money
I'll give you my shirt. I'll give you anything you need. I have nothing to give you all money
Who I said I want food stamps and I want mass health
(34:34):
And a shoulder comes up my arm like a hand comes on my shoulder and I look it's the judge's sentence
We gave me the three months probation who thought I was crazy not go back to jail before rather treatment or waiting for treatment
She says your honor. I'm coming in and she's in jeans. She says that it's my day off, but I heard what Brian was coming in
I want a voucher. Can you get can we wrap up his probation today? It was nine months into I saw two years in change
(34:58):
He's been he's been exempt. Oh, I'm forever. You whatever the word is up just tremendous and she said they wrapped it up
No fees nothing. They were it was done
The universe had lined things up that everything I thought was for my harm was there for my health
When I had a relapse I called that probation officer and that chief probation and I caught it's the guys that relapsed in
He helped these are guys who put me back in jail. I wasn't even on probation
(35:19):
But like I was these people have played such a role in my life
The man I am today is a father
I'm going through divorce of the chief of probation got through a really messy divorce
He's coach me through it. Actually all three of them went through divorces
But uh, it like they teach me how to get through things with like dignity and like pride and without going off the deep end
I don't understand how it all works, but there's some sort of system to life
(35:41):
And I think you do have to take the high road if you take the easy path that doesn't work
Yeah
That's a beautiful description of how life weaves into the world
Such a beautiful description of how life weaves in ways that we can never comprehend right the magic of it
So true and I think you know the attitude you don't get to get it can go either way I feel like you can always go either way
(36:06):
And your attitude you just the way you choose to see it is the way it's going to go
I mean every time I've looked at things for a positive when I found out my daughter was autistic I broke down as negative as high broken I was
And it was awful and a month after I said, you know what maybe it's just a beautiful path. Maybe some positive it says maybe
Although at that point she was non-verbal. Maybe it'll work itself out and I have the way it work comes acclimatized
(36:30):
She had chief of child psychology at Children's Hospital gets her into a treatment thing now she speaks great. She doesn't stop talking. She yep
She yeah, she's perfect and all these little things happened for me and I
I really do I don't think anything happens to us. I think it happens for us and I think if we're willing to go through it
But that's why I believe in coaching so much. I believe in what you guys do because here's the reality
If you don't have somebody who would kind of shine some light in your life for me was Billy for somebody it's you
(36:56):
You don't have that person you're not gonna see it always the glasses and always have full
Yeah, yeah, absolutely
So tell us a little bit about your podcast because I want to hear about how long you've been doing your podcast what you talk about on the show
And let's let's switch gears a little bit and hear about what you're doing
(37:17):
So the podcast was when I was starting to do coaching they said you should have a podcast
So I don't want to talk about finance kids what I do all day and it's not that interesting
I don't you know and I said and I don't want to talk about me interesting to me some a geek but other people
And I didn't want to talk about all the coaching stuff because it's not one size fits all so I was not given advice
If somebody might try to do and again, I don't I always say if somebody signs up for me to do coaching
(37:40):
I'll get it with the material flip them to the spiritual you look at what I have and the shiny crap and then one day
I'll tell them they'll learn it's not important
And so the podcast was something I they said you have to have a podcast. It's alright, but I'm going rogue with this
I'm doing what I want. They said fine
So the podcast is usually guests of one of three things one an addict or alcohol who come he came back
(38:01):
To we have a lot of Laura a lot of officials chiefs of police chiefs of probation
They talk about from the other side of things like what they're seeing how they try to make a difference how they're overwhelmed
To be honest with you
Three they often I'll have a lot of athletes on it
We'll talk about like that all that down when you go from like my buddy colonized with them last week
He was I go from being on the field with the lights on me to be in and out that board
(38:21):
You know and then like what that's like that let down like how do you get through that?
How do you find these up as an individual after going through being a playing a role?
You are you know, he was a safety of the Carolina Panthers, but now he's not he's a finance guy
And he's just normal, you know
My other buddy went from being a football player and first line and then he was janitor, you know
(38:42):
How do you find yourself at all that?
And I think that's what we're all trying to do
I think and the longer it takes us to realize stuff isn't important the longer it takes you to really get fulfillment in life
So the podcast I interview people I want to know their traits
I want to pick out characteristics traits things that they have or they've cultivated
That allowed them to get through life take the bumps and bruises come on. Okay, because we all have a
(39:03):
Persons right I mean think about you you've got stuff in your life and when you're coaching you're on your podcast
You can't really run through but there's stuff in your life to hurt obviously that's why you want to help people
Yep
Yeah, I I think your philosophy about coaching is completely in alignment with ours that it's
Individual and nuanced to every single person there is no oh do these ten steps and you're gonna be happy and everything's gonna go
(39:28):
Right, right? That's just a fantasy
And so really it's about the investigation right it's about finding the heart finding the soul and
letting that wisdom come up and so I love to hear other coaches that have that philosophy rather than
Are trying to teach a specific way that someone should be which I think sometimes can actually be more harmful than helpful
(39:53):
We have that we're selecting our beliefs of what we think will work on somebody else and now I did that early on
I won't lie to you I would tell people do this this or this and sometimes they would have success financially and they think it was
And I tell people that's the worst thing that can happen
The worst thing that happened for a drug act is if I use today now that happens cuz it's gonna get bad
Same thing if somebody I give advice to somebody just to help me make money and they make money because you're gonna realize
(40:17):
It's an hour. Okay. I've got money now. I'll give you an example two years ago. I'm pulling up to my house
I've got the house. I built it for me to dream house. I grew up my mom's a housekeeper
So for me, it's perfect and I know I don't avoiding money on you. I'm in a high-end sports car
And I got a beautiful daughter inside of my puppy all you
And a wife woman would go through the most of that time
But we were still at that point in decent terms, you know
(40:40):
Arabs sit outside crushing. Why do I want to die? Why do I want to die?
Sober I've got all these things in the outside the businesses of this to that
Why do I want to die and that's what led me to stop looking at this path?
That's what let me down to the coaching to be honest with you was there's gotta be more to life
I mean, yeah, we all want to have success but success is different for most people success for me
(41:01):
Is I know that my daughter no matter what goes on tomorrow if I die tomorrow
She'll be able to get the education the services she needs to be okay. That's it
It's not about like, you know, if she this or me going here
I mean, it's about I can make sure and that day-to-day I go to work and I can help people
Check their retirement or I can help guys learn how to do better at their job. If they're fine. It's easy
(41:22):
Some guys come to me. They're not fine. Some guys are athletes are retiring. They're like, how do I find my it?
Because we all have an it right?
There's that thing that you say if I could do anything this is what I would do and I guarantee you're doing it right now
Because coaching is not an easy journey into
I mean, God, it's a lot harder than I thought it was. I see I had an easy finance came super easy to me
I mean money everything went well coaching is poof one the money's not as good sometimes
(41:44):
And even what is as good the stress you care about if you care about the people like the your children
And
But it's also a hell of a lot more fulfilling than you've done, right? I mean think about the beauty of it. I mean, it's it's juices worth the squeeze
I say it every day
It's a lot but I'm gonna tell you is I give up Fridays at my financial firm to do this people think I'm crazy
(42:06):
You know, you're about hundreds of thousands a year. You know, I'm like, you're a man. I'm fulfilled. I'll make it more
You just don't see it's a different. It's a different payoff
Yeah
Yeah, and I think as our world begins to change
People finding value in something other than money or success or capitalism
(42:27):
I think that whole model needs to change right for us to sort of
Grow into the next level and it's possible because you know, we have so many resources and with a ILS people have to work
Right all this stuff sort of changing in our world and if we can find identity
And something different than making money and being successful at this capitalistic game game, right?
(42:52):
Yeah, I think that is a lot of a lot of people are facing that right now is saying, okay, I want to find the more
Because they realize anything when people's 401ks and IRAs are all-time high so they have money
A lot of people it's easier to make money now more than ever. I mean, I'm not that savvy technology, but it is
But that's what's making people realize like it's an empty. It's a ghost. I mean there is capitalism is
(43:15):
Listen, I understand we need businesses to run for countries to run or will be like depleted in all this stuff
I do I tell folks I'm socially liberal financially conservative like I think we have to have some control of money
But damn let people live how they want to live. Let them be the truth. Self who we didn't tell somebody what's right for them
You know, I don't believe in that at all and I will tell you
(43:36):
I think it's amazing that like how often I see people and the biggest thing they say to me is right like
I thought I was supposed to be happy. I thought I was supposed to be different.
Yeah
Yep, I hear that
Like like people wait for for happiness to be delivered like Amazon, you know, like there's
A box is going to show up on the porch. They're going to open me like I'm finally happy. Yeah, and I did that for 20 years until
(44:01):
Finally, I started looking inward and then that's where I found like oh
So yeah, happiness is a byproduct of that fulfillment. You know, it's not something that you're just going to get and hold on to and it's just going to be
Yeah, it's true. It's kind of crazy because it's
It's kind of like the yoga practice, right? We have to do it every day. We have to live it. It's a very hard thing to stay
(44:25):
We move from the you know, this world is it's a screwed up world. I mean good example watch our next election
We have seen Algon and crazy guy running against you. I don't know we like that
It's kind of a lose those situation you would think that hey, you know, there's got to be
I believe this most I like to believe most people good. I really believe that if you
You know interviewed most Republicans they'd probably find somebody who's a better character, right?
(44:46):
And I don't want to offend anybody but like somebody who's a better quality human being and maybe it's more liberal beliefs
Realize that the far right doesn't work. I believe you interview most left-wing people
I don't think I necessarily back I've been old, you know, but you can find some younger person who says hey, you know
I know that these are obelisks, but I gotta come together because it's a cut and think that most people could come together
But because it's profitable to keep you from being a good person, you know, you're not going to be a good person
(45:11):
But because it's profitable to keep people divided they do that
And this kind of runs on money and and the whole world runs the same way basically or this and it's based on just like setting these goals
Like you have a my daughter watches this movie out
Try to think of the name of it, but they talk about the guy you made you said it's a movie by
What's the guy Dr. Seuss and they make us needs have you ever heard of this movie and
(45:36):
And the Lorax the Lorax the Lorax. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, but it's a perfect example
The ones that were about the cutting down all the trees you make it's guys making scotch
I'll just call them a thief everybody needs a thief and they wear a hat a scotch
And they all buy this crap and then there's no trees left and then they miss the little animals ago
And that's the world we live in it's a chase for what I mean
(45:56):
I an X of mine used to have to have high-end handbags
At one point probably like 20 30 bags. I remember thinking myself this is like 50 rear of the bags this house
And we don't go out to dinner ever like I mean maybe look at the kids somewhere
At that. Jeez like what world are we living in like who we like you can't even impress the people that don't have to be impressed
(46:17):
And I and she didn't and she got it eventually because her mother committed suicide her brother overdosed it
She wasn't an actor so what she might have been for but not like like I was but
Everybody gets it at some point and whether it's too late, you know, I think some people in a death bed look back nobody ever says
They wish they won't money or save more
Well, I imagine if your neighbor was homeless you could have got them into treatment
(46:41):
Yeah
yeah
Beautiful I really loved this episode and thanks so much Ryan because I just feel like
Just let you said so many deep truths and
Thank you so much for
I really honestly I learned a lot just sitting here with you guys because it's nice to hear other people say
(47:01):
some of the stuff I think because
In my industry and stuff. It's so
Go maybe like last week I'm in a conference and I learned a lot. I shared where I could
But these people like I said they they go they just have paid attention because the material I talked about the spiritual
And then some paid attention I talked to I mean these people could actually change and have a good life and not care
(47:22):
And others would just ask me like so how do you get that extra client?
Like how do you manage a half billion dollars?
And I'm like you don't want to know because if I tell you you gotta think I'm a donkey and like if I tell you I
Give away 10% what I earned you gotta give insane and it's just um, it's nice to hear what you guys are doing because I think it's so necessary
Yeah, you guys are somebody's Billy and that means a lot to me. Yeah
(47:42):
Yeah, he's a lot man, and I'm I'm I love
Just how you are, you know, because I think me and Mindy were talking before
you know with with um the mental health industry which which is
There's a lot that's going on. That's good, but there's stuff that I don't like
You know and one of the things I don't like is you know when I was going in to use it like at the VA
(48:07):
Like my past and and their past we didn't align, you know
And I was immediately judging so we need people like you to talk to the people like us
To understand, you know what I mean, so I love that man
And I appreciate it's funny. Um very open my clients. They know I'm bipolar
(48:28):
They know I was an intermediate drug user. I have no shame in that part because I look at it this way
If I don't shoot with you like I've got four clients in the last 12 months. I've got the kids in to treat it
And the reason I got more involved like that was that one client who a year and a half ago
I knew her kid had a problem shoes. Tell me stuff. I think he's an alcohol problem
No, he's got an opioid problem and they found him dead and uh
I just think now if I can be more open and yeah, I might lose some clients. I mean, I one guy said me
(48:52):
He's like, listen, I respect what you're doing. I can't give four million dollars to a heroin. I get it
I'd feel the same way. I mean, I would who wouldn't
Um, but I also a lot of people say it's really cool. Great. What you doing? I'm happy to be a part of it. That's that's a blessing, you know
Yeah
Yeah
That's beautiful
Well, is there anything that either of you want to share with our listeners before we wrap it up for the day?
(49:17):
You're up boss. Do you get anything?
um, you know, man
The thing I love the most is that we need more
And I don't mean this in a bad way at all. We need more unprofessional dudes to stand up and talk to other guys
You know the way guys can talk to each other
So yeah, and and that's one of my biggest fights, you know
(49:40):
Um, is that I try to be a certain way, but I don't want to be a certain way
But I don't want I feel myself like oh, no one's gonna listen to me if I say what I'm really thinking
You know, or if I say it in the way that I want to say it, you know, but um
Knowing that you're out there too. Like just makes me like feel like I'm not as alone as I thought I was
(50:03):
Um, so yeah, I you you you you've impressed me a lot man. Um, I love what you're doing. I hope you're too impressed
I love how you're breaking that stigma and being honest and open and vulnerable with your clients and saying look
This is just what it is because we all have those skeletons in our closet. You know, um
So yeah, yeah, just more power to the unprofessionals
(50:28):
I love it. You know, I love it. I tell people all the time if you're looking for somebody like that
I just thought the guy
It was long I pretended to be that guy, you know, I want to go everything
I always say, you know what god play a joke universe, but a huge joke. I mean every god everything I prayed for and I wanted to die
So, uh, you know now now it's different vibe, you know
Well, I gotta tell you guys why
(50:49):
In closing you guys remind me of people I would love to connect you with a friend of mine as a podcast
He was a former purple ball player became a janitor now
He's a big coach motivational speaker is Marcus on again and he's a
Podcast called getting authentic and I was on it. That's how we became friends
You guys would be awesome for him. The only reason I was thinking about it. It's like, oh my god
These folks be so good because around a lot of people with that authentic and I really appreciate what you're doing because um
(51:12):
Especially you guys are somebody's billion and I get choked up saying it because that that means a lot more than, you know
Well, thank you so much and yeah, we would love to be connected. So we'll talk after
After the show we'll email
That's good guys. Thank you so much for having me. Yes. Thank you so much. Thank you listeners and we'll see you next week
(51:33):
Wow
Thank you for listening to the chasing thoughts podcast
Please support us by liking subscribing or leaving a review or comment
We would really appreciate it if you'd like to be a guest
We would love to explore life and what it means to be human with you
Please email us at chasing thoughts podcast at gmail.com
Welcome to the Chasing Thoughts podcast.
(00:03):
Listen in as Mindy, Keith and their guests
take a deep dive into their own minds and souls
to investigate the beauty of imperfection,
challenge their beliefs
and embrace the richness of living a truly authentic life.
Welcome to Chasing Thoughts.
(00:24):
Hello everybody and welcome to season two,
episode 19 of the Chasing Thoughts podcast.
Today we have special guest, Ryan Skinner,
who we are so excited to get to know.
Welcome, Ryan.
Thank you for having me.
So I'd love to start with you,
sort of just sharing an overview of sort of your life story
(00:47):
and what kind of makes you into the human
that is here with us today.
It's funny, most of who I became, I became through pain, right?
Like a lot of people I think.
You know, I had a fairly normal up brand like most kids.
You know, I was very lucky. I had two parents, two good parents.
I had an aunt and uncle to help raise me
because I was back and forth with both houses.
(01:08):
They were tremendous.
I had another relative who was abusive,
but he died when I was really young in second grade.
So I mean, yeah, at least a scar if you're abused,
but it's not anything you can't come back from.
It was a very shy, awkward, nervous kid all through high school.
You know, the best way I describe it,
because my friends don't believe me,
is I never asked a girl to a dance.
It was whoever asked me. I was just so shy.
And I was just painfully shy.
(01:30):
In college, something changed.
So in seventh grade, my teacher knew I couldn't read well,
because I had dyslexia, but she noticed I was gifted with numbers.
She taught me finance. I got into the stock market.
I was featured in a lot of things with Peter Lynch and women's romance.
There was a big feature called the Wizkill Wall Street.
And then I knew in seventh grade what I would do for a living.
And that was important to me because I grew up,
(01:51):
my mom was a housekeeper.
My dad had two blue collar jobs.
So for me, I knew I, now I could at least make money.
And I always felt less than because we didn't have money.
Fast forward, I had to be in college and I ended up falling the wrong crowd.
There's a kid who's like a cousin to me and I love him,
but he's a tough guy and I'm not a tough guy.
I always say I'm like an iron marshmallow.
I pretend to be tough.
(02:13):
And I followed him around and next thing you know,
it's like if you act a certain way long enough,
you kind of get that way.
And next year I knew I found myself involved in dealing drugs,
other things just shouldn't be doing.
And you know, I went to college.
I had a scholarship for finance, not finance because I was really smart
with numbers.
And it's like, and I've always landed that way because of my ability to use
numbers, but I always wanted to be anything but me.
(02:36):
You know, I remember coming to college and my friend who was a real tough guy
would say to me, I would give anything to be you.
You could make well until six things.
Honestly, like I'm involved in organized crime.
Why don't you want to be you and I'd be thinking myself,
I want to be anybody but me, you know,
I started drinking more.
I never really paid attention at a young age.
I didn't drink because the uncle that was abusive was an alcoholic.
(02:57):
So I never, I associate alcoholism with abusing kids.
And when I started drinking,
I started feeling more comfortable in my own skin, you know,
and then I got involved in steroids and I got really into the gym and
everything was taken off on the outside,
faster cars, faster girls.
And on the inside I was losing who I was meant to be.
My father found out I was selling steroids and he threw me out of the house
(03:18):
by junior college.
He said, we don't own a new car.
We don't own any conditioner.
But you're ruining lives.
Get out of my house.
And I remember saying, I'll come back tomorrow for the rest of my stuff.
And he laughed.
He said, you don't ever come back here again.
This is my house.
And the day before I graduated college,
I asked if I could move back because the one thing I knew about my dad was
he had integrity, both my parents, you know,
just, he was a solid person.
So he said, you want to come back.
I don't want you drinking now once not at all.
(03:40):
You have a 10 p.m.
curfew seven days a week and that BMW you bought goes in the driver.
You're not driving.
You're not driving.
A drug deals car.
Your mother has a Volkswagen with no, no bumper and a bungee court holder.
You drive that.
And you know what I did because I wanted to have that integrity yet.
So I live with my parents.
So I was about 22 and they helped me find that.
I bought a two family because I had my business was doing well.
(04:01):
And I moved in with me.
I was a bad roommate.
I started drinking more hanging out with older guys in the business.
They were going out for scotch.
I didn't even like scotch, but I would just again try to fit in.
And then, and I was like, I don't know.
I had a major issue with health and I bled out.
I was drinking too much and I ended up in a coma.
And when I came out of it about a month later,
when I got the hospital, I go back and they said, yeah,
(04:23):
we're glad you're feeling better,
but we found tumors with cancer.
And we're going to have to do some surgeries.
And then ended up,
I see.
And I tell folks, I wasn't a victimized volunteer.
But those tough guys, I knew they were oxycard and dealers.
People would trade Rolexes up.
They were going to trade in a lot of ways.
And I was like, I'm not going to get that.
I was like, I'm not going to get that.
I'm not going to get that.
I'm not going to get it.
oxycardin dailies, people would trade Rolexes off their wrists for one pill.
(04:43):
And I thought I'd be exempt.
I thought I was stronger and they will weak and all that.
Next thing I knew, um, oxycardin dailies, what did you do?
Nine months later, they told me, they'd take me off the medicine.
We were done with the surgeries.
At that point, you weren't taking me off.
So I bought them on the street and before you knew it over three years, I went
through probably three quarters of a million dollars of savings, investments,
(05:04):
four, one K gone, two houses gone.
And, uh, before I knew it, I'm on the streets of Australia.
I mean, there's heroin act and, uh, and I thought that was the bottom.
I thought I was over.
And I remember getting in trouble.
I was on probation for this and that.
I remember going to jail the day I went to the courthouse.
I said to my friend, who's the chief probation, you're never going to home.
He come on.
Don't be like that.
And he said, I said, you wouldn't screw me.
(05:26):
He said, screw you.
You can get arrested fighting, drinking on probation.
He said, I'm holding it.
And that they say it's not before it's dawn.
It is.
I went to jail.
I did a little time.
Not much.
I got out through the grace God.
I asked for treatment rather than go out, go out back up to the street.
And, uh, my life changed.
(05:47):
I won't tell you it's been a relapse.
I did have a couple of relapses early on, but it's been amazing.
You know, I've had people in my life that is just spectacular.
I live a life around.
I'm dead.
I wouldn't say I'm perfectly comfortable with my skin because I think
anybody with addiction or anything, you're kind of broken out.
I don't think you have a fully whole again.
But man, I'll tell you, I have something to share and help all the people.
And the business that I lost came back 10 fold.
(06:08):
I mean, that's great.
I have a coach.
He was right.
Mentor other businessmen that go through midlife crisis addiction.
Uh, they own a business.
They had to insecure on how do I run my business and stay grounded.
And I've been able to take all the blessing and get all the pain turned
into a blessing.
It's been a positive.
So pretty lucky.
Yeah.
(06:28):
It's a beautiful story.
And I love how you said in the beginning that a lot of what you
thought of what has formed you was the suffering because it's true.
Our suffering carves us out.
And I also just love how you described your life sort of as this pursuit
of authenticity, like trying to find yourself deeper and deeper and feel
(06:52):
comfortable in your own skin, which I think is sort of the human experience.
Yeah, it's true.
Yeah.
So I think it's very relatable.
And for some of us it's an easier path than for other people.
Yeah.
I always say, you know, I don't learn how much I learned really hot lessons.
(07:13):
The reason why you know, in my twenties, if you asked who I was, I'd
hear you in my business card.
I'd let you know what I made of this and that.
What I drove.
At 44 years old, you know what I want people to know me as I'm a dad.
You know, I want people to see that I'm a good dad.
I want people to see like, you know, I help homeless people, but guys
in prison like that, that is far more important to me.
I mean, we all like nice stuff and I'm not going to say I don't, but I will tell
(07:35):
you, I would trade the sports card to make sure my daughter has the right
education for her autism any day of the week.
You know, that's what comes down to.
Yeah.
So tell us a little bit more about how you became a coach, why you decided
on that path and sort of what that looks like for you now.
(07:56):
So it was strange.
I originally, I always loved coach guys.
I always like going to the jail and running programs, helping guys
rebuild their lives, that's that.
And, and my business, my financial business exploded.
I won't lie to you.
It did better than I ever dreamt.
I mean, it did 10 times worse in my twenties, but the money wasn't enough.
It wasn't what it was about this time.
Like I don't want my legacy.
If somebody remembers why I leave behind to my kids or to a charity, that's not
(08:19):
what I want.
It's like, I want to why I leave in my kids.
Like I want my kids to have a different character because of my paints.
They don't have to one go through it and two more point that they're
empathetic to those that do.
And so I thought, oh, you know, I love coaching like other, you know,
guys who are trying to build businesses and whatnot.
So I'll just do that.
And it's funny.
I have clients that pay me ridiculous money and I have clients don't pay me
(08:41):
because they can't afford it.
I say, don't, you know, I'm happy to do it.
I'll meet you where you're at.
I just love doing it.
I like checking it with them daily.
I like knowing how their lives are going.
I want, I was blessed to come back and I, and I believe that there are certain
spiritual traits that I got, I don't even want to see treats.
Certain things I learned to build spiritually because I good mentor.
(09:01):
Nothing, nothing I say is authentic.
I'll say right now, I even come up with one good idea.
Trust me, but I've learned to live to follow some good ideas because my
ideas aren't so bright.
And I took these spiritual principles that laid out my kid feeling a toolkit.
And I built a life that I love and I applied them to my business and I said,
geez, you know, these work for me.
The spiritual principles don't work for anybody.
(09:22):
It's like gravity.
If I drop a kid, you drop a kid, they both hit the floor.
So I started trying with other guys and I said, wow, this is amazing.
And the reason I do it with men is it's not a sexism thing.
It's just, I feel it's more appropriate because I can relate to what
guys go through more, right?
I don't know what it's like to be a woman or try to be a first time mother.
And I can't relate, but I know it's like to be a guy and have a child and find
out your daughter had to his autism and scary as all hell.
(09:45):
Like I can relate to that all day.
And so I said, how do I pay it forward?
And the money part, frankly, sometimes you make it.
Sometimes you make great money.
Sometimes you don't make anything.
And that's not, I'm very fortunate.
I haven't, now it's easy for me.
I have the financial businesses that do very well.
So I don't really have to chase the money.
For me now it's a passion project.
Yeah.
(10:06):
Yeah, it's funny because Keith and I are very similar.
We are both coaches, but we both see clients on a range, right?
Of free to expect, because, you know, the truth is, is that a hundred
dollars doesn't have the same value to every single person, right?
People are at different stages of their life and everybody needs healing.
(10:28):
So if you're, if we are in a position to offer healing without charging
an exerbated amount, I feel like that's in alignment with making
the world a better place.
Absolutely.
You know, and I believe the universe, I don't know if I call it, sometimes I
say it's God, cause that's the only word I knew growing up, but
spirit of the universe is some kind of energy out there.
Then when I'm living the right way, when I'm praying, when I'm meditating,
(10:49):
when I'm trying to be of service to others, somehow if I do the right
thing and don't worry about the money, like I'm provided for, I don't know
how it works.
I really don't, but I know what you guys are doing is unique and special.
And you touch lives and if you can measure by dollars and cents, man, you
might leave somebody out there dying that could really use your help.
And an hour of your time, yeah, it's valuable, but man, what a pay off
(11:10):
if that person doesn't die.
There's your reward, you know?
Yeah.
Yeah.
I'd love to hear more about sort of your spiritual toolkit that you mentioned
because I believe that whether you call it spirituality or you have a different
name for it, energy, you're God, you have to have access to something other
(11:34):
than just this world.
Yes.
In order to be fulfilled and successful.
And a lot of times I know when clients come to me, it's like they don't want
to believe in the power of that stuff.
Like, oh, no, I don't need to spend 10 minutes meditating.
Like, no, no, I'm just going to make all my phone calls and you're like, well,
wait a second.
(11:54):
Right.
So talk a little bit about like that spiritual toolkit and what you have
found is really valuable in that.
I, yeah.
So again, I find everything through pain.
So when I, at one point I'm going to screw shade pain emotionally.
I was barely sober.
I was definitely suicidal.
I was out of my mind and a guy said, well, are you praying?
I said, what do you mean praying?
(12:15):
Like, you know, where's God here and everywhere?
I meditate and I'm like, no, what do you want me to do?
Just sit there quietly.
He's like, yeah, I do.
And I'm like, that's not going to work.
He's like, well, do you do it?
I'm like, no, but it's crazy.
I mean, how's that going to work?
It's just killing time.
When I started doing these things, so it was all just little suggestions.
Like there are different readings I'll do in the morning, like little spiritual
readings.
I'm not only religious, but I'm very spiritual.
(12:37):
I believe there's something out there when I went to a guy and they have a
hard time with the spirituality.
I take him up to the ocean and I said, listen, we're going to stand here.
That water is going to come in.
It's going to wash over your feet.
It's going to pull out the pain.
It's going to bring in some energy.
And if you can have that, you can just see that it comes in and it's
times the tide goes on, then it comes back in.
You have good days and bad days.
And you can use that energy, call whatever.
(12:58):
I mean, there's windmills is something to this something to this
universe with is something we can tap into.
Or if you watch like, you know, you'll see it.
Dock or seagull flies down and eat something.
There's a cycle to this world that's bigger than us.
And it's unique as we think we are, especially in the financial
sector, we think we're so important, bringing in millions of dollars.
This and that.
And we're not that unique.
I'm not that important.
(13:18):
I mean, I spoke at a conference last week.
I said, listen, I don't pronounce my hours.
I mumble.
I don't wear a tie.
And I'm always in the top three in the country.
And the funny part is it's the universe.
Yeah, I'm not that important.
You hear so many people who are so worried about dollars and stuff.
And like what they wear.
And I was like that.
I mean, I still have stupid cars.
I bought, I have watches.
(13:39):
I bought when I was younger.
And I think to myself, why?
Like we all want to look nice, but there's something when you're
tapped into me, for me, it's nature.
I should say I have a dog.
I love dogs.
Having a child with autism is learned.
She's helped me tap into that energy.
I didn't know I had because she's unique.
I mean, she's just different.
My daughter, it doesn't play like most kids, but once I learned to do
(13:59):
things according to what she needs and wants, she's a superstar.
And I think that's what it is.
I mean, so I know when you say people say, well, that's not going
to, when they dive into their calls and I fall off.
I tell people to take a spiritual battery.
I'm charged up.
I'm doing great.
The next day I do a little less.
The next day I don't make my bed.
The next day I don't meditate, but I do pray.
The next day I brush my teeth while texting.
Before you know it, I'm caught up in the now what's now.
(14:22):
What do I have now?
Who do I have to call?
You could slow it down, especially somebody like me who's
already a Taipei.
When I just.
Like the universe does for me, but I can't do for myself.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I love the way that you talked about it as a practice because
that's what I find too is that.
(14:43):
Doing a meditation practice or yoga practice or whatever your practice
is doesn't mean that you're perfect every single day.
It means that when you mess up, you restart, you restart and you
become a master at restarting without a doubt.
So true. I tell folks, some days I'm just checking the boxes and
some days I'm having home runs.
The thing I like with the gym, for example, I love this when I go to
(15:03):
the gym, some days I don't want to be there and walk in and ready.
Sometimes I have a great workout those days.
Another day I'm just going through it.
I'm like, am I done yet?
Yoga. I'm trying to get into. I'm not going to lie to you.
I struggle because I can't horrible the poses, but I believe it's
the fact that I show up and I'm willing to do it and I'm willing
to have the humility to do it.
I'm not going to lie to you.
I'm not going to lie to you.
I'm not going to lie to you.
I'm not going to lie to you.
(15:24):
I'm not buying to turn it this way. I'm not going to be, but I like
throwing the upper left or the middle right.
Having it, you can't really walk up and I'm willing to do it and I'm
willing to have the humility not to be great at it.
You know, it's easy to do what we do well.
And it's taking that time for ourselves.
It's away from the world.
Just breathing.
Just being present because this is not fast.
(15:44):
And me, if you look at it, if you watch the news, it's always negative
stuff. Politics their all boxing and each other.
And, and I think people will slow down and like, you know,
And I went up there because I just want to see what's like a 20 minute ride in when I got there as a world away
Once he was the fastest 20 minutes. He got me 100 miles away or a thousand miles away
I'm up there nature and this birds. He's got chickens. I'm like, where the hell I this is wonderful
(16:07):
And it was a fun from like back in the 1600s
We start talking about the families that owned it and how some of them were killed during the witch trials at like this and that and
All this unique story that came with it
And you know back then if you had a neighbor and you had chickens you bring some eggs over and they might have a cow
They use some milk. There's more community. I think we go so fast and we lose the community
(16:32):
Yeah
Yeah, I know that
What you said a little bit ago about
Sort of being authentic instead of playing the role like this is what a coach is supposed to look like
This is what a financial advisor supposed to look like this is what a successful person supposed to look like
And I know that's one thing that I really admire about Keith is that he's always keeping that awareness
(17:00):
Showing up in presence rather than in a constructed role of this is what it's supposed to look like
And that's how you sort of let the magic in right is through just being there and
Being present enough to see what's arising
Right from
(17:21):
Nature. Yeah, is he
For me in my job like certain aspects after we're more dressy clothes and others and
I think in myself like I'd rather be in more comfortable clothes
So clients they come in if they're gonna be clients, they get to know the real Ryan, you know, I don't want you
I don't want to stare when I was younger and I first got so right pronounced by ours
(17:42):
And I would there's nothing wrong with people would speak well
But if it's not me and it's not authentic and I'm trying to focus on that rather focusing it and no use an individual
My really being of service now if I'm a very well-spoken person, that's a great characteristic for people that have that
You know my strength is I'm usually pretty up in it. I can usually find a positive most things
That's my positive my strength and it's so hard though for people to be authentic in this day and age
(18:06):
Especially with social media. I mean, I don't do social media. My team runs it. I've never seen it
No, no, no, will I ever just now? I don't believe I just don't want to see now
I know it's important to be plugged in and all that. That's why they're great
But for me, I want to be with my feet are you know
Yeah
I'm curious if you'd be willing to share
What allowed you to get out of addiction because I think addiction is
(18:32):
Misunderstood in our culture. It's certainly misjudged in our culture, right?
And it is a really challenging road. So what was it that allowed you to come out of that?
So, you know, that's where the universe come in. I gotta be honest
I called God said a lot of say but I'm not thinking about religious God, but I think that they're I
(18:56):
Don't like the only thing to say is somebody took my hand a guy saw me broken
This guy when I first us guy means he looked like a bum
He'd be wearing these shorts are way too short right this beat up by his club
That's myself, but he spoke in the way he spoke this piece. He had I wanted to know my guys phone number
No, I said to that but when I went to jail this guy showed up turns out he was a director of some IT
(19:17):
The company showed up all dressed up. It was like, I think look a bomb. I go
I just so you were really spiritual and he was not a job. I just don't care what anyone thinks and he called my mother was in jail
Well, somebody's mother listens to cry with her jail. Nobody might tell me something jail and that changed everything
I saw something this guys, you know what? This is what it's about like this guy's elite because he doesn't care
(19:37):
He just can't we dress he dressed nice sometimes, but you know what? I mean that wasn't I was drawn to him because of who he was the character and
And this guy just taught me how to live you want the truth like I would call him I
Ask him like shy with blue socks and gray socks with a suit. I called him with a hundred questions
I called him when I first came back in business. I couldn't get crying. So I would call crying
(19:59):
Every decision I made I called this guy and he was the universe worked through him and
Next thing I knew he was he was taking him this meetings with 12 step means taking me through the book and like sponsor me
They teach me that hey, Brian, you know religions people are really afraid of going to help and your spirituality people have been there
No job is to connect somebody else to spirituality and then next thing I knew once they got in that system where I was kind of
(20:22):
I've been flow people would come into my life and I would help this person and it would help me more than I was helping them
I was slowly getting so far with prediction. Thank God gave me rewards. Don't go. I had relapses early on
I've had many seven 13 surgeries the last five seven years
So and every time you have surgeries they pump you full of opioids even if you're an addict
They're like we need these for the first day or two
(20:43):
The name makes it easy and now it is if I have a surgery not to fall back in is I have a four-year-old who was autism
She deserves better and yeah
Don't be wrong when people have kids in their attics once you're in it
Let's see you a treaty kid for a pillow. That's how it is
But when you're in the other side of you, I have a choice today
So if I know I have something come out the company in compromise position
(21:03):
I'm on the phone with five guys people coming with me the whole to the medicine
So I would say God within the universe working through people I
Really believe just one good person after an ally. What you're doing here
You're sharing good thoughts with other people you help people connect if people we learn from each other
I mean, I I don't have one going you said any original ideas. I have had me embarrassed to share, you know
(21:26):
Yeah, you know, it seems like when I ask people that question
It's a common response that there was someone in their life who was so filled with love so filled with joy
so, you know bright and made everybody else in the room feel better about themselves, right and
That is always what I try to remember for my goals is I want to be that person, right?
(21:51):
That walks into a room and makes everybody feel better that
Love emanating off of me, right because that's how you change people by who you are not what you do
And so I love the way that you describe that that you got lucky enough to have people who
Were doing that who were showing up as their full selves and just shining their light and
(22:14):
It hooked you this guy Billy
I wanted to be him because he fought like me he drank with me drug loving
What you walk in is he's a good shape you walk into me and shoulders back and then he would gently talk to a guy
Another guy say, how you doing? You're thinking me this rough duck. Hey, how you doing? You doing alright?
You look great. You or you look off you want to talk and he and I is so close now that um
(22:35):
They had choked up this guy changed my life changed everything in my life. This guy literally did 180 of my life
I want to be in a materialistic greedy
Person who didn't care about himself. I don't want anyone else
It's genuinely just not coming to deal about stuff, you know, and just trying to be a good guy and he taught me by his actions
I got here his words, but it was his actions and I
He just moved to Florida because he's semi-retired and his birthday is April 2nd
(22:59):
I just showed up on a flight to surprise like that's how close I am to his wife and
His wife and they're just amazing people. They've she had the patience to let him take time away from her to be with me
Yeah, I was a heavy lift. I'm bipolar. I have ADHD. Obviously
And I was a heroin act. I had a lot and I court case going on and trying to rebuild the business and
(23:20):
And she allowed not just allowed embraced it and I mean I would go through breakups and I would show up at the house crying
You know, I would remember once I bring it up with the gruff three years and showing up at their dinner together
I crashed in a date and just walked and I never felt guilty because I felt like it was okay
And it was okay. That was the love that they showed me. So it wasn't just Billy as Michelle as well
But the kindness and like pure selfless love that and the way he showed me how to live like
(23:44):
I remember saying one day, oh, I got a fight and I just get out and he's like, you don't do that anymore. You're your recovery man
You don't do that
We've been talking about like something about disrespect that girl basically like I was you know, I didn't I was dating a lot and I wasn't really
Treat women the way I'd want to be my daughter. He said, that's not how recovery man treats a girl
You know, you don't just like hook up with girls leave you have respect for women a topic one thing at a time before I knew it
(24:08):
Like, you know, I made sense
Yeah
I
I love such an amazing book called chasing the screen
Really?
Addiction. Yeah, I believe his name is
Yohan Bari he was a investigative journalist. He had a friend that unfortunately passed away from from an overdose and he wanted to get into and understand the nature of addiction and he found as he traces it back to like the opium crisis up in Canada when they were bringing in people from Asia and stuff to build the railroads
(24:49):
He traced it all the way back down to one thing and it was shame. Shame is the thing that that drives addiction and the way that you're describing, you know, like the guy who's like this IT guy but but comes up on a bike and looks like a bum.
There was no judgment. There was just empathy and love and then your friends, you know, the empathy, the love, the sometimes tough love like saying, No, this is not what we do. You know, but when you go into the system, when you're dealing with the police, when you're dealing with correctional officers, when you deal with probation officers, a lot of times, you can see, you can feel the judgment coming off of them, which just drives that
(25:27):
guilt and that shame that that I would believe like an adequate already feels naturally.
You just nailed you know what I'll say this you talk about where we're being in the right place right time so I ended up getting most of my legal issues were the town of Wolverine Pass.
Just so I have as a chief of probation, Wolverine, his name is Vin Perot, he had started an opioid crisis program back in 2003 because they knew they had a problem in their hands.
(25:58):
So they had an understanding of what it was and he understood he and I knew each other we were friends at one point and then obviously we had a he had a and now we're really good friends and we talk almost every day, because now I'm on the other side I speak for this state I go to prisons, you know, and the chief of police now
Wolverine was a detective and I caught it's detective and Bobby and I really close friends, because he got it. I remember what time he walked by myself he said I'm going to buy you lunch.
(26:21):
I said don't look at me I'm a junkie. So you nailed it the shame. He said don't look at me I said don't look at me I'm a junkie please look away.
He said you know what right. There's no be perfect people and if there was we probably put me on to cross he said it's not you. He said I'm gonna get your lunch.
And now he Bobby's one of my closest friends when he made chief he called me 1130 at night one night this is a guy who arrested me at least a dozen times. I had how about this I have 15 clients, fifth now 16 actually last week, 16 clients that are cops retired that are putting
(26:51):
a cop on me, that I managed their money I managed their life savings for them and their wives. So that'll tell you about the turnaround in the world, when that energy shares and I nailed it though it's the shame I was, we used to chasing the screen I did think it's like it's
like it chasing the ghost once you get high, you think it is how you're always chasing it it's elusive you never gonna get it.
You know, just you go all your money and leave you out there and bears the shame and the shame you just
(27:15):
How do you go to somebody and say like me for me? I grew up in a nice family
How do I go to my cousin's the state trooper? We grew up in the same house
He's a great guy and say he's got a guy needle my out
The funny part is when I was like when I was getting some I'm sober
I mean he reached out to me all time with a beautiful relationship, but how do you do that the shame?
I don't know how you buy it. I was very lucky. I go to therapy. I nailed it
(27:35):
I hit a home run. I landed exactly where you want to be if you're an addict
Yeah, I love that you I
Guess your life proves that change is always possible
There is never a situation that is so dark that you can't come back from it and
On the other side the people in your life
(27:56):
How valuable for us to let other people change and not hold them to their mistakes that they made a year ago or five years ago
That's a good point. I never thought of that because I did have a lot of people hold me and I tried to make things up
There's one guy I remember saying, you know, I'm sorry. Let you down. It's just something I can do and I'm tired of using
I'm sorry. There must be something I can do to make it right. He's you know, I'm glad you sober
(28:20):
I wish you would die. I was like, all right
That's for you. It's for you and your universe my friend. Nothing I can do now
I try to make it for most people pre-understand saying you know, I'm glad you doing right. Uh, hey, you know
Like there's one guy he lost 20 grand on a train. So I made a deal
I can't say it live on this because it legal what I did
But he got that 20 grand back because I said I owed him that you know
If I wanted to make sure that there was never time I'd have to cross the street out of shame because that's how you use
(28:46):
Yeah, yeah, I need for you guys to know that and not be in those
It's easy for me to get it because I've lived it but for you guys to know that, you know
For you to say that was pretty my ball playing out. It's impressive
and and I'm I
think I think it's it's such a
Good thing to see as well like when you describe your family, you know, you weren't you weren't describing
(29:10):
You know
This horrific childhood growing up. So that shame I think a lot of times society is built sort of on that materialistic
Bent that that shame kind of comes in naturally so you can have great parents
You know a great upbringing everything that you need all your needs applied for and that shame can still slowly creep in
(29:36):
You know where it then leads us down that path, you know to trouble
That's strange. I mean, don't be wrong when I was young my uncle before he had passed put cigarettes out of my office
He did some stuff though screwed up, but um, and he would say some nasty stuff, but
You know, he's gone by times in second grade, you know, and the therapy worked through that
But I think it is I think and for me my parents worked so hard to bring Catholic school because they wanted to give me a better chance
(30:01):
And what happens I'm in school with all these kids that are driving nice cars
Is that you always feel less than always, you know, and and I you know that I didn't realize how much that drove me until I
Kids so much more money later on when I was buying the Ferraris ever say you and all the BS
Because I was doing it because I was trying to feel some sort of void
Then I remember I would drive it I would feel less than embarrassed because I felt like a junkie driving around an I ain't got
(30:24):
I mean, well, I'm sober. I'm like thinking myself
Then one day I realized none of it matters either way. I'm not that unique. I'm not that important
If anybody's that you impressed or disgusted by what I drive like that
That's that's the other thing like and I think you have a child gave me that that blessing it really took me out of me
Cuz I because I was really I think the disease of the addiction to very self-centered disease
(30:46):
You're either pitying yourself or you're trying to fill your needs and you don't realize how many people you trample on the way
And even when you do realize it sometimes you have a choice. I hate saying that but
Yeah, I
Heard something yesterday
that I really loved and
Somebody said when you choose a path you also choose all of the hardships and lessons along that path
(31:12):
And I thought what a beautiful way to say it because most people say oh I choose this path
And then when the hardships come up they go oh what the hell I don't write there's some inversion to it and
When I hear you talking I really hear that philosophy you're like no I choose it every day
I choose to call my support system when I need help
I choose this and that you didn't shy away from any of the cleanup you had to do right any of the
(31:39):
You just said I chose this path to be clean and there's gonna be all these hardships
And I'm facing them with my head held high and my shoulders back
It's funny. I wanted to move when so when I was gonna get sober
I was in jail and I remember the I gotta get sober and I knew guys went to jail got sober
So I thought maybe this will work for me. Maybe Jail's what I did and it really was
So they were gonna release me on parole this lawyer. I had worked it out there
(32:03):
We don't let me out of jail like two months. I looked at the judges said your honor if you release me today
I'm gonna get high
If you want to get me treatment I'll stay in a cage to get between so I stay in a cage
Just in jail an extra month. I got treatment
then I then
Provision officer I had was the devil the actual probation not the chief of the police. He was the worst. He was the biggest piece of
Oh, and
(32:24):
So he kept and he would say to my mother he make her cry. He did like this. She was gonna hang where he's going now and
So the judge said mr. Skinny you don't want to stay in jail escape
And it will let you go home if we find you treatment. I said you let me go home not coming back. I'm gonna use
She said all right if you want to fight your lawyer, I'll do it. So I stand jail again me treatment. I go back
I have to go back for what they called it on a bottom line was a kid stabbed me
(32:46):
I stabbed them back with his own knife. It was a long story. It wasn't just self-defense, but I didn't look good, obviously I
Had that case open so after jail, I'm in a sober house and I go back
I still have that open and the district attorney's office wants to put me back in jail
The judge is like he's already been chilly sober now at that point nine months
So she says mr. Skinner when you take time served this yeah, I would
(33:07):
So sorry, we're gonna reconvene in the downstairs courtroom
It go down I walked by probation my old my probation. I was sitting there now
I was told to pray for other people when I was in jail. I prayed that I could get out
I could this is awesome. I'm embarrassing this that would kill him in his family would have missed it
Then that I would kill him or I wouldn't kill him
He'd go die in the woods in his family will miss him then they wouldn't die
But he'd go live somewhere else and wouldn't bother me this same guy walk
(33:29):
I walk by his office. He says Ryan now. What are they gonna do or the housing case going? I said, oh, yeah
I said I'm a cheap time served. I don't go back to jail. He goes. Yeah, but I'm not sure it's good
I go no, no, don't ruin this for me. I'm thinking I said he's gonna put me back in jail
He walks in the courtroom. He says your honor. I've never seen a heroin ad come back this far at 30 years old
If we charge him with this he will never get his old job back
(33:51):
And then he's got no choice but to go to a bad life
Can we give him three years probation just wrap it up judge goodness to skin your lucky man hits the gavel
This guy was the devil and here he is. I mean he's a good friend of mine's a picture of in my office now
But at the time he was my nemesis, you know, you don't know who's in your life for a reason I
Will never get over that so I had three years probation. They call me and as behind on paying my probation fees. I had no money
(34:14):
I go to the court I was like, they gotta put me in jail probably at least hit me other fine and walk in and they clear the courtroom
Now the last time they did that they sentenced me like oh my god. I'm going to jail sweating
The judge is Mr. Skinner you're behind on 200 dollars of fines, whatever. I said, yeah, your honor. I have no money
I'll give you my shirt. I'll give you anything you need. I have nothing to give you all money
Who I said I want food stamps and I want mass health
(34:34):
And a shoulder comes up my arm like a hand comes on my shoulder and I look it's the judge's sentence
We gave me the three months probation who thought I was crazy not go back to jail before rather treatment or waiting for treatment
She says your honor. I'm coming in and she's in jeans. She says that it's my day off, but I heard what Brian was coming in
I want a voucher. Can you get can we wrap up his probation today? It was nine months into I saw two years in change
(34:58):
He's been he's been exempt. Oh, I'm forever. You whatever the word is up just tremendous and she said they wrapped it up
No fees nothing. They were it was done
The universe had lined things up that everything I thought was for my harm was there for my health
When I had a relapse I called that probation officer and that chief probation and I caught it's the guys that relapsed in
He helped these are guys who put me back in jail. I wasn't even on probation
(35:19):
But like I was these people have played such a role in my life
The man I am today is a father
I'm going through divorce of the chief of probation got through a really messy divorce
He's coach me through it. Actually all three of them went through divorces
But uh, it like they teach me how to get through things with like dignity and like pride and without going off the deep end
I don't understand how it all works, but there's some sort of system to life
(35:41):
And I think you do have to take the high road if you take the easy path that doesn't work
Yeah
That's a beautiful description of how life weaves into the world
Such a beautiful description of how life weaves in ways that we can never comprehend right the magic of it
So true and I think you know the attitude you don't get to get it can go either way I feel like you can always go either way
(36:06):
And your attitude you just the way you choose to see it is the way it's going to go
I mean every time I've looked at things for a positive when I found out my daughter was autistic I broke down as negative as high broken I was
And it was awful and a month after I said, you know what maybe it's just a beautiful path. Maybe some positive it says maybe
Although at that point she was non-verbal. Maybe it'll work itself out and I have the way it work comes acclimatized
(36:30):
She had chief of child psychology at Children's Hospital gets her into a treatment thing now she speaks great. She doesn't stop talking. She yep
She yeah, she's perfect and all these little things happened for me and I
I really do I don't think anything happens to us. I think it happens for us and I think if we're willing to go through it
But that's why I believe in coaching so much. I believe in what you guys do because here's the reality
If you don't have somebody who would kind of shine some light in your life for me was Billy for somebody it's you
(36:56):
You don't have that person you're not gonna see it always the glasses and always have full
Yeah, yeah, absolutely
So tell us a little bit about your podcast because I want to hear about how long you've been doing your podcast what you talk about on the show
And let's let's switch gears a little bit and hear about what you're doing
(37:17):
So the podcast was when I was starting to do coaching they said you should have a podcast
So I don't want to talk about finance kids what I do all day and it's not that interesting
I don't you know and I said and I don't want to talk about me interesting to me some a geek but other people
And I didn't want to talk about all the coaching stuff because it's not one size fits all so I was not given advice
If somebody might try to do and again, I don't I always say if somebody signs up for me to do coaching
(37:40):
I'll get it with the material flip them to the spiritual you look at what I have and the shiny crap and then one day
I'll tell them they'll learn it's not important
And so the podcast was something I they said you have to have a podcast. It's alright, but I'm going rogue with this
I'm doing what I want. They said fine
So the podcast is usually guests of one of three things one an addict or alcohol who come he came back
(38:01):
To we have a lot of Laura a lot of officials chiefs of police chiefs of probation
They talk about from the other side of things like what they're seeing how they try to make a difference how they're overwhelmed
To be honest with you
Three they often I'll have a lot of athletes on it
We'll talk about like that all that down when you go from like my buddy colonized with them last week
He was I go from being on the field with the lights on me to be in and out that board
(38:21):
You know and then like what that's like that let down like how do you get through that?
How do you find these up as an individual after going through being a playing a role?
You are you know, he was a safety of the Carolina Panthers, but now he's not he's a finance guy
And he's just normal, you know
My other buddy went from being a football player and first line and then he was janitor, you know
(38:42):
How do you find yourself at all that?
And I think that's what we're all trying to do
I think and the longer it takes us to realize stuff isn't important the longer it takes you to really get fulfillment in life
So the podcast I interview people I want to know their traits
I want to pick out characteristics traits things that they have or they've cultivated
That allowed them to get through life take the bumps and bruises come on. Okay, because we all have a
(39:03):
Persons right I mean think about you you've got stuff in your life and when you're coaching you're on your podcast
You can't really run through but there's stuff in your life to hurt obviously that's why you want to help people
Yep
Yeah, I I think your philosophy about coaching is completely in alignment with ours that it's
Individual and nuanced to every single person there is no oh do these ten steps and you're gonna be happy and everything's gonna go
(39:28):
Right, right? That's just a fantasy
And so really it's about the investigation right it's about finding the heart finding the soul and
letting that wisdom come up and so I love to hear other coaches that have that philosophy rather than
Are trying to teach a specific way that someone should be which I think sometimes can actually be more harmful than helpful
(39:53):
We have that we're selecting our beliefs of what we think will work on somebody else and now I did that early on
I won't lie to you I would tell people do this this or this and sometimes they would have success financially and they think it was
And I tell people that's the worst thing that can happen
The worst thing that happened for a drug act is if I use today now that happens cuz it's gonna get bad
Same thing if somebody I give advice to somebody just to help me make money and they make money because you're gonna realize
(40:17):
It's an hour. Okay. I've got money now. I'll give you an example two years ago. I'm pulling up to my house
I've got the house. I built it for me to dream house. I grew up my mom's a housekeeper
So for me, it's perfect and I know I don't avoiding money on you. I'm in a high-end sports car
And I got a beautiful daughter inside of my puppy all you
And a wife woman would go through the most of that time
But we were still at that point in decent terms, you know
(40:40):
Arabs sit outside crushing. Why do I want to die? Why do I want to die?
Sober I've got all these things in the outside the businesses of this to that
Why do I want to die and that's what led me to stop looking at this path?
That's what let me down to the coaching to be honest with you was there's gotta be more to life
I mean, yeah, we all want to have success but success is different for most people success for me
(41:01):
Is I know that my daughter no matter what goes on tomorrow if I die tomorrow
She'll be able to get the education the services she needs to be okay. That's it
It's not about like, you know, if she this or me going here
I mean, it's about I can make sure and that day-to-day I go to work and I can help people
Check their retirement or I can help guys learn how to do better at their job. If they're fine. It's easy
(41:22):
Some guys come to me. They're not fine. Some guys are athletes are retiring. They're like, how do I find my it?
Because we all have an it right?
There's that thing that you say if I could do anything this is what I would do and I guarantee you're doing it right now
Because coaching is not an easy journey into
I mean, God, it's a lot harder than I thought it was. I see I had an easy finance came super easy to me
I mean money everything went well coaching is poof one the money's not as good sometimes
(41:44):
And even what is as good the stress you care about if you care about the people like the your children
And
But it's also a hell of a lot more fulfilling than you've done, right? I mean think about the beauty of it. I mean, it's it's juices worth the squeeze
I say it every day
It's a lot but I'm gonna tell you is I give up Fridays at my financial firm to do this people think I'm crazy
(42:06):
You know, you're about hundreds of thousands a year. You know, I'm like, you're a man. I'm fulfilled. I'll make it more
You just don't see it's a different. It's a different payoff
Yeah
Yeah, and I think as our world begins to change
People finding value in something other than money or success or capitalism
(42:27):
I think that whole model needs to change right for us to sort of
Grow into the next level and it's possible because you know, we have so many resources and with a ILS people have to work
Right all this stuff sort of changing in our world and if we can find identity
And something different than making money and being successful at this capitalistic game game, right?
(42:52):
Yeah, I think that is a lot of a lot of people are facing that right now is saying, okay, I want to find the more
Because they realize anything when people's 401ks and IRAs are all-time high so they have money
A lot of people it's easier to make money now more than ever. I mean, I'm not that savvy technology, but it is
But that's what's making people realize like it's an empty. It's a ghost. I mean there is capitalism is
(43:15):
Listen, I understand we need businesses to run for countries to run or will be like depleted in all this stuff
I do I tell folks I'm socially liberal financially conservative like I think we have to have some control of money
But damn let people live how they want to live. Let them be the truth. Self who we didn't tell somebody what's right for them
You know, I don't believe in that at all and I will tell you
(43:36):
I think it's amazing that like how often I see people and the biggest thing they say to me is right like
I thought I was supposed to be happy. I thought I was supposed to be different.
Yeah
Yep, I hear that
Like like people wait for for happiness to be delivered like Amazon, you know, like there's
A box is going to show up on the porch. They're going to open me like I'm finally happy. Yeah, and I did that for 20 years until
(44:01):
Finally, I started looking inward and then that's where I found like oh
So yeah, happiness is a byproduct of that fulfillment. You know, it's not something that you're just going to get and hold on to and it's just going to be
Yeah, it's true. It's kind of crazy because it's
It's kind of like the yoga practice, right? We have to do it every day. We have to live it. It's a very hard thing to stay
(44:25):
We move from the you know, this world is it's a screwed up world. I mean good example watch our next election
We have seen Algon and crazy guy running against you. I don't know we like that
It's kind of a lose those situation you would think that hey, you know, there's got to be
I believe this most I like to believe most people good. I really believe that if you
You know interviewed most Republicans they'd probably find somebody who's a better character, right?
(44:46):
And I don't want to offend anybody but like somebody who's a better quality human being and maybe it's more liberal beliefs
Realize that the far right doesn't work. I believe you interview most left-wing people
I don't think I necessarily back I've been old, you know, but you can find some younger person who says hey, you know
I know that these are obelisks, but I gotta come together because it's a cut and think that most people could come together
But because it's profitable to keep you from being a good person, you know, you're not going to be a good person
(45:11):
But because it's profitable to keep people divided they do that
And this kind of runs on money and and the whole world runs the same way basically or this and it's based on just like setting these goals
Like you have a my daughter watches this movie out
Try to think of the name of it, but they talk about the guy you made you said it's a movie by
What's the guy Dr. Seuss and they make us needs have you ever heard of this movie and
(45:36):
And the Lorax the Lorax the Lorax. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, but it's a perfect example
The ones that were about the cutting down all the trees you make it's guys making scotch
I'll just call them a thief everybody needs a thief and they wear a hat a scotch
And they all buy this crap and then there's no trees left and then they miss the little animals ago
And that's the world we live in it's a chase for what I mean
(45:56):
I an X of mine used to have to have high-end handbags
At one point probably like 20 30 bags. I remember thinking myself this is like 50 rear of the bags this house
And we don't go out to dinner ever like I mean maybe look at the kids somewhere
At that. Jeez like what world are we living in like who we like you can't even impress the people that don't have to be impressed
(46:17):
And I and she didn't and she got it eventually because her mother committed suicide her brother overdosed it
She wasn't an actor so what she might have been for but not like like I was but
Everybody gets it at some point and whether it's too late, you know, I think some people in a death bed look back nobody ever says
They wish they won't money or save more
Well, I imagine if your neighbor was homeless you could have got them into treatment
(46:41):
Yeah
yeah
Beautiful I really loved this episode and thanks so much Ryan because I just feel like
Just let you said so many deep truths and
Thank you so much for
I really honestly I learned a lot just sitting here with you guys because it's nice to hear other people say
(47:01):
some of the stuff I think because
In my industry and stuff. It's so
Go maybe like last week I'm in a conference and I learned a lot. I shared where I could
But these people like I said they they go they just have paid attention because the material I talked about the spiritual
And then some paid attention I talked to I mean these people could actually change and have a good life and not care
(47:22):
And others would just ask me like so how do you get that extra client?
Like how do you manage a half billion dollars?
And I'm like you don't want to know because if I tell you you gotta think I'm a donkey and like if I tell you I
Give away 10% what I earned you gotta give insane and it's just um, it's nice to hear what you guys are doing because I think it's so necessary
Yeah, you guys are somebody's Billy and that means a lot to me. Yeah
(47:42):
Yeah, he's a lot man, and I'm I'm I love
Just how you are, you know, because I think me and Mindy were talking before
you know with with um the mental health industry which which is
There's a lot that's going on. That's good, but there's stuff that I don't like
You know and one of the things I don't like is you know when I was going in to use it like at the VA
(48:07):
Like my past and and their past we didn't align, you know
And I was immediately judging so we need people like you to talk to the people like us
To understand, you know what I mean, so I love that man
And I appreciate it's funny. Um very open my clients. They know I'm bipolar
(48:28):
They know I was an intermediate drug user. I have no shame in that part because I look at it this way
If I don't shoot with you like I've got four clients in the last 12 months. I've got the kids in to treat it
And the reason I got more involved like that was that one client who a year and a half ago
I knew her kid had a problem shoes. Tell me stuff. I think he's an alcohol problem
No, he's got an opioid problem and they found him dead and uh
I just think now if I can be more open and yeah, I might lose some clients. I mean, I one guy said me
(48:52):
He's like, listen, I respect what you're doing. I can't give four million dollars to a heroin. I get it
I'd feel the same way. I mean, I would who wouldn't
Um, but I also a lot of people say it's really cool. Great. What you doing? I'm happy to be a part of it. That's that's a blessing, you know
Yeah
Yeah
That's beautiful
Well, is there anything that either of you want to share with our listeners before we wrap it up for the day?
(49:17):
You're up boss. Do you get anything?
um, you know, man
The thing I love the most is that we need more
And I don't mean this in a bad way at all. We need more unprofessional dudes to stand up and talk to other guys
You know the way guys can talk to each other
So yeah, and and that's one of my biggest fights, you know
(49:40):
Um, is that I try to be a certain way, but I don't want to be a certain way
But I don't want I feel myself like oh, no one's gonna listen to me if I say what I'm really thinking
You know, or if I say it in the way that I want to say it, you know, but um
Knowing that you're out there too. Like just makes me like feel like I'm not as alone as I thought I was
(50:03):
Um, so yeah, I you you you you've impressed me a lot man. Um, I love what you're doing. I hope you're too impressed
I love how you're breaking that stigma and being honest and open and vulnerable with your clients and saying look
This is just what it is because we all have those skeletons in our closet. You know, um
So yeah, yeah, just more power to the unprofessionals
(50:28):
I love it. You know, I love it. I tell people all the time if you're looking for somebody like that
I just thought the guy
It was long I pretended to be that guy, you know, I want to go everything
I always say, you know what god play a joke universe, but a huge joke. I mean every god everything I prayed for and I wanted to die
So, uh, you know now now it's different vibe, you know
Well, I gotta tell you guys why
(50:49):
In closing you guys remind me of people I would love to connect you with a friend of mine as a podcast
He was a former purple ball player became a janitor now
He's a big coach motivational speaker is Marcus on again and he's a
Podcast called getting authentic and I was on it. That's how we became friends
You guys would be awesome for him. The only reason I was thinking about it. It's like, oh my god
These folks be so good because around a lot of people with that authentic and I really appreciate what you're doing because um
(51:12):
Especially you guys are somebody's billion and I get choked up saying it because that that means a lot more than, you know
Well, thank you so much and yeah, we would love to be connected. So we'll talk after
After the show we'll email
That's good guys. Thank you so much for having me. Yes. Thank you so much. Thank you listeners and we'll see you next week
(51:33):
Wow
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