Are you having trouble sleeping and staying asleep? In this enlightening episode, certified Sleep Science Coach Morgan Adams shares her personal journey from prescription sleep medication dependency and breast cancer survival to becoming a women's health advocate. Morgan reveals the profound connection between quality sleep and healing, offering practical, evidence-based strategies to help women reclaim their natural sleep patterns without medication.
So many women in midlife struggle with sleep issues and Morgan provides actionable advice on optimizing your circadian rhythm through proper light exposure, mindfulness practices, and lifestyle adjustments. Learn about the critical role of morning sunlight, the importance of consistent sleep schedules, and why that 3AM wake-up might actually be normal.
Whether you're battling insomnia, experiencing hormonal sleep disruptions, or simply looking to improve your sleep quality, Morgan's holistic approach addresses the root causes of sleep problems rather than merely treating symptoms. Discover how quality sleep serves as a cornerstone of disease prevention and vibrant health.
Morgan Adams is a holistic sleep coach who empowers women to conquer their battle with sleepless nights without reliance on sleep medications. With her powerful sleep toolkit, Morgan not only ensures that women experience a profound enhancement in their sleep quality, but she also guides them in rekindling their relationship with sleep, paving the way for less stressful and more fulfilling days.
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Rose Wippich bridges ancient wisdom and modern life, teaching people how to tap into their natural healing abilities. Through her work as a Qigong and Yoga instructor, Reiki Master Teacher, and Energy Alchemist, she guides others toward vibrant health and authentic self-discovery. She's passionate about helping women rewrite society's limiting narratives around aging and step into their sovereign power.
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extraordinary journey offeminine healing, energy, work
(01:05):
and total well-being.
Welcome, morgan.
Thank you, rose.
It's great to be here with you.
I've been looking forward tothis conversation for a while Me
too, so tell us about yourselfand how you got to where you are
helping others address theirown sleep issues.
Morgan (01:24):
Yeah well, the story
goes back close to 20 years.
I had pretty bad insomnia for along period of time and it was
kicked off by a relationshipissue and basically I had a
really hard time getting tosleep and I would lie in bed one
to two hours most nights,tossing and turning waiting for
sleep to come.
(01:44):
And after a couple months ofthis frustration I decided to go
to my family doctor and he gaveme Ambien, which is a very
popular prescription sleepmedication.
At the time I was actually apharmaceutical sales rep, so the
idea of taking a medication wasjust no big deal to me, you
know, because drugs were part ofmy currency pretty much.
(02:06):
So took the Ambien.
It worked as advertising,getting me to sleep a little
more quickly.
But I paid on the back end witha lot of residual side effects
the next day, grogginess, brainfog, just really trouble
concentrating, and I ended uptaking them for quite a while
you know eight years in total.
(02:27):
And what really got me to thepoint where I questioned taking
them and made the decision tostop was in a brand new
relationship that I was in,dating a new guy who is actually
now my husband.
He said to me Morgan, when youtake these pills to sleep, you
kind of act like a zombie and itfreaks me out.
(02:49):
And I was like, oh yeah, you'reright.
So I did what I do notrecommend others to do, and that
is go off your pills, coldturkey.
You really, if you're listeningand you're on a sleeping
medication or any medication,really go with the guidance of
the prescribing provider to helpyou get off those pills.
(03:09):
But because I've got a lot ofgrit, I was able to muster
through, got through that phaseof getting off the pills and
slept pretty decently for manyyears.
And then there was a plot twistwhich we collectively
experienced in 2020, the firstcouple months of the pandemic,
when nobody knew what was goingon.
My sleep started to sufferagain and I got really concerned
(03:33):
because I did not want to goback to that full-blown insomnia
I had previously experienced.
So I got pretty proactive, gotmyself an Oura ring, started
researching sleep and in prettyshort order I was able to get my
sleep back on track.
And in this process, I startedjust posting about it on
Facebook, about what I was doing, organically, just like you
(03:55):
post about a movie you saw thatyou were excited about, and I
came to find out during thistime that quite a few other
people in my circle werestruggling with their sleep as
well.
And, just as a sort of abacktrack, in 2018, I got my
first breast cancer diagnosis,and that was an incredibly
pivotal moment for me in termsof changing the trajectory of my
(04:19):
health and also reallysolidifying my life's mission,
and I felt at that point in 2018, moving forward, my life's
mission was to help other womenwith their health.
However, at that time, I justwasn't sure how I would do that.
And then, when I found thisfascination with sleep, it was
like everything came togetherand I was like, okay, here's
(04:41):
what you got to do.
You got to help other womenwith their sleep.
And I was like, okay, here'swhat you got to do.
You got to help other womenwith their sleep.
So that was like late in 2020when I made that decision.
I spent about a year studyingsleep, getting certified as a
health coach, a sleep coach, anddelving into all of the
studying part, and then launchedthe sleep coaching practice in
2021.
So it was a long, circuitousstory of how I got here, but I
(05:06):
love what I do and it's justreally a joy to be able to help
other women upgrade their sleepand upgrade their health as a
result suffer from sleepdeprivation and sleep is such a
(05:27):
luxury.
Rose (05:27):
It seems like a luxury for
some people because they don't
have quality sleep and, besides,relate.
You said you were going throughrelationship issues which
contributed to that.
But there's other things thatcan happen that create sleep
issues, right so like healthissues, like stress from work,
even like alcohol, like peoplethat drink alcohol, or maybe
late at night or eat late atnight.
(05:48):
So there's a lot of factorsthat can contribute.
Morgan (05:51):
Yeah, so there are many,
many factors that play into
insomnia, but in my practice,some of the main ones that I see
are stress and anxiety and justreally people not having the
skills to mitigate thoseproperly.
There's also behavioral issuesthat come along with insomnia
(06:13):
and sleep problems in general,and that can be like what you
alluded to substances likecaffeine and alcohol, even food
at the inappropriate times, andthen really I think also that's
(06:34):
playing into this crisis ofsleep so deeply is so many of us
are circadianly misaligned,right, and so what I mean by
that mainly is we have our lightand dark cycles sort of messed
up and we can delve a little bitmore into how to get that
corrected.
But those seem to be the mainthreads that I'm seeing with
people and their risk ofinsomnia in my work.
(06:57):
What about menopause?
Yeah, menopause is a big one.
So what we're finding inmenopause is that our female
hormones, mainly estrogen andprogesterone, are declining and
that is really really wreakinghavoc on our sleep.
You know, the hot flashes, thenight sweats, the 3am wake ups,
(07:20):
those can be really, reallydisruptive to a woman's sleep,
and you know there are certainstrategies we can employ.
Some of them include, you know,hormone replacement therapy.
That's somewhat of a loadedtopic, but it's something that
can help a lot of women.
But it's obviously you knowsomething to.
You know chat about with yourhealthcare provider and you know
(07:41):
then strategies designed aroundreally protecting our circadian
rhythm and mitigating ourstress, because as women in
midlife, we have so much on uswe're dealing with.
Quite often, the typical50-year-old in midlife could
(08:02):
actually have kids at home,right.
That they're responsible forRight.
I did.
Rose (08:07):
I was in my fifties and
had young kids.
Morgan (08:10):
Yeah, and then on the
other end you could have aging
parents who you're responsiblefor helping out, and on top of
that you're likely sort of atthe top of your career game if
you have a career, and so I callthis kind of the sandwich
generation right.
We have so many competingthings in our lives that demand
(08:32):
our attention that sometimes wedon't prioritize our self care,
and that can often translateinto not prioritizing you know,
our evening wind down routine,not prioritizing our, our
morning intentions.
You know our evening wind downroutine, not prioritizing our
morning intentions, you know,for starting the day off right.
So it can be a real uphillbattle for a lot of women in
(08:54):
midlife and sleep.
Rose (08:56):
Yeah, wow, yes, like it
relates to a lot of things that
you were saying.
And the thing with the estrogenI know that people like I'm a
breast cancer survivor as wellas are you, and estrogen was one
of the indicators or one of thereasons the high estrogen
created the breast cancer.
So that's like I know I can'tdo that, so I like to resort to
(09:17):
more natural sleep.
You know rituals, winding downto things which I know we're
going to talk about.
So talk about why sleep is soimportant and what are the
benefits of having like a reallyyummy good night's sleep, but
not just one night, right, manynights, right, yeah, sleep is
just so critical.
Morgan (09:36):
You know we often talk
about nutrition and movement.
Those tend to be the pillars ofhealth, along with sleep.
That are, you know, the threepillars, and the nutrition and
the movement really have gottenthe highlights, the main
attraction, for so many years,and I've often called sleep the
redheaded stepchild right, it'sjust hasn't gotten its due, and
(09:59):
I really consider myself to be,you know, kind of a PR agent for
sleep, because if you thinkabout it, without proper sleep,
we're not going to be, you know,kind of a PR agent for sleep,
because, if you think about it,without proper sleep, we're not
going to be able to have theability to make nutritious
choices for ourselves, we're notgoing to have the motivation
and energy to do those workouts.
So it's really the foundationupon which the other pillars are
(10:21):
built.
And so you know some of thesome of the you know more
specific benefits of sleep arethe brain cleanse, the brain
cleansing opportunities we havewhen we are in our deep sleep.
We have something called ourlymphatic system and that is
basically the lymphatic systemfor your brain, so you can
imagine your brain while you'resleeping, and deep sleep there's
(10:43):
this sort of like car washingprocess that's going on.
All of these toxins are gettingwrung out as we're sleeping and
it's like a natural braincleansing overnight and that's
really key.
We also know that Really goodquality, restorative sleep is
really helpful for ourcardiovascular health, our
(11:03):
hormonal health and also ourability to have, you know, to
emotionally regulate.
I think that's something that wesometimes leave off of the
conversation.
We know that people who are notgetting enough sleep are less
likely to donate to a nonprofit.
(11:24):
They're less likely to help outa stranger.
So really, you know, if you'relike I come at things really
from sort of a sleep lens,obviously, but if you're driving
along the highway and somebodycuts you off, maybe they didn't
get enough good sleep.
You know, maybe if yourcoworker snaps at you or your
boss, you know, kind of growlsat you, maybe they didn't get
(11:47):
enough sleep and like thinkabout, just if everyone was
getting better sleep, how muchmore harmoniously we'd be
getting along.
That's something that I thinkabout a lot.
Rose (11:57):
Yeah, good sleep, happy
life.
Why do you think so many womenare suffering from poor sleep?
Morgan (12:05):
Yeah, well, we kind of
touched on a couple already,
number one being the hormonalshifts that are taking place,
the lower progesterone andestrogen.
We touched on the fact thatwe're like the sandwich
generation we have thesecompeting demands and it's often
really hard to mitigate that,the stress and anxiety that goes
along with it, and then youknow, really, the other reason
(12:26):
that I see is that with midlifewomen, we're more prone to
having anxiety and depressionand those leave us more
vulnerable to insomnia and sleepdisruptions.
So if you think about all threeof those factors, you can see
how like each one can reallycompound on the other and create
this sort of set the stagereally for bad sleep or insomnia
(12:48):
.
Rose (12:50):
Yeah, I think women have a
lot on their plate and they
really have a hard time shuttingdown at night.
So it's not just you knowyou're going and you're going
and you're not really processinganything during the day.
Going and you're going andyou're not really processing
anything during the day.
And once you I know, because II'm talking about me once my
head hits the pillow I'mthinking I'm going to sleep
because I'm so tired, but thenall of a sudden, like the switch
turns on and you start thinkingabout things.
Morgan (13:12):
Yeah, you're so right,
and one of the one of the things
that I work with my clients onis really developing a protocol
to do these things that I callmindfulness snacks.
Right, I think everyone's heardof exercise snacks.
I think I might have coined theterm mindfulness snack, but if
anyone's out there who claimsotherwise please let me know if
(13:33):
I stole it.
Rose (13:33):
You can take that.
Morgan (13:34):
I'm going to claim it.
Rose (13:36):
Because you talk about the
sandwich generation, which I've
heard recently, but themindfulness snacks you take that
one.
Morgan (13:42):
Yeah, I'll take it.
So, basically, what themindfulness snacks are?
It's like carving out maybe 10minutes three times a day where
you're basically doing nothing,you're not consuming any
information, you're not.
You know, I think a lot of usare just like so wired to like
read or listen to a podcast orwhatever.
It's like taking that 10minutes to go for a walk in
(14:04):
nature without listening to apodcast or a book, just enjoying
nature.
It could be 10 minutes ofsitting there doing nothing, 10
minutes of meditation or breathwork and giving yourself that
white space, that time duringthe day to kind of do nothing,
process anything that might begoing on internally.
(14:25):
Because you're right, like, ifwe don't take the time to do
that during the day, what'sgoing to inevitably happen is
our head hits the pillow and allof a sudden those unprocessed
things come up to the surface.
Or at 3 am we wake up and allof those things come out like
(14:46):
kind of like kernels of popcorn,just popping up here and there.
So I think it's really, reallycritical that we stop and give
ourselves intentional breaksthroughout our day to avoid, you
know, that busy brain once ourhead hits the pillow you know
that busy brain once our headhits the pillow.
Rose (15:10):
Yeah, no, I agree what I
find lately I just am so tired
not all the time, but there'stimes when I'm really tired
during the day.
I'll just sit and shut my eyesso that I'm not looking at a
book or scrolling or thinkingabout something I need to do.
I just try to just close myeyes, and even for 10 minutes,
and I actually did that thisafternoon and felt so refreshed.
In Italy they take an afternoonnap.
Yeah, they know how to live.
Morgan (15:32):
I know it's so
interesting because they're
actually working with theircircadian rhythm.
So we have this circadian dip inthe early afternoon.
It's just part of our circadiansystem and they're doing it
right because they're workingwith their circadian rhythm and
capitalizing on that dip to taketheir nap, whereas some of us
(15:53):
in the States we just powerthrough that circadian dip.
That usually happens around oneto three and unfortunately, how
a lot of people power through itis they grab themselves a
coffee and then that kind ofsets off this cascade where if
you're having coffee too late inthe afternoon it is going to
(16:14):
still be in your body by thetime you get to sleep and you
may not fall asleep as quicklyor you may not sleep as deeply
because you've still got thatcaffeine in your system.
So I'm a big advocate of reallykind of putting the brakes on
caffeine around lunchtime,around noon for most people,
because there are people whoclear caffeine quickly and there
(16:34):
are people who clear caffeinemore slowly and it's a genetic
component, you know.
So you would have to have yourgenetics done to ascertain what
you have.
But I kind of go under theassumption that we all might
have slow clearance, you know,if we don't know why don't we
assume we do and be moreproactive about it and just kind
(16:56):
of keep that caffeine curfewaround noon-ish is a safe bet?
Rose (17:01):
Yeah, have a glass of
water, because you know I've
heard that drinking water andbeing hydrated that way is
better for you.
So I encourage people to,instead of grabbing a cup of
coffee.
That you're hydrating yourbrain, you're hydrating your
body and that's a way to helpyou get through.
You know feeling that tired,especially if you can't just
(17:23):
pause and take a nap.
Right, absolutely.
So you talked about thecircadian rhythms.
Is there any?
Or misaligned circadian?
Is there anything else youwanted to add about that?
Morgan (17:33):
This is a topic that
I've become very interested in,
passionate about, over the pastyear and so really kind of where
I'll start with this is we havegotten our light and dark
cycles really mismatched in themodern world.
Because, if you think about ourancestors, before the invention
of the modern light bulb, wewere living our days in really
(17:58):
bright surroundings, we wereoutside a lot, we had that
natural light all day, and thenthe sunset we were in darkness.
There was no blue light, therewas no LED light, and we've kind
of gotten things backwards alittle bit Like we're not during
the day, we're not gettingtypically enough natural
daylight exposure, and then atnight we're getting blasted with
(18:21):
lights that are too bright.
So like, if you take nothingaway from this conversation,
think bright days, dark nights,okay, but like let's drill down
a little bit more granularlyinto what that means.
So how we can kind of managethis is by getting natural light
exposure in the morning as soonas we wake up.
(18:42):
So if we are able to gettingoutside within, you know, a few
minutes of the sunrise, and thesunrise is a moving target
throughout the year, dependingon where you live, those factors
, but I'm a huge fan of an appcalled of an app called my
(19:06):
Circadian App.
It's a relatively new app.
I got involved in promoting itwhen it first came out and it's
a free app that you can use.
There is a paid version whereyou get more features and if you
use the code Morgan, you canget your first month for free.
But essentially I use thisevery day to kind of inform me
of where of when the sunrise is,and right where I'm living
(19:32):
right now it's rising at 7.19am,you know, and it'll start
rising a little bit later as wemove toward the spring months,
start rising a little bit lateras we move toward the spring
months.
But the sunrise light is reallyreally critical in terms of
helping our circadian rhythm getentrained.
It's a way for the body toreceive those messages that it
(19:55):
is daytime, it's time to startdoing the daytime processes.
So it's going to shut down anyresidual melatonin from the
night before.
It's going to naturally boostyour cortisol levels to a good
spot.
And then a lot of people knowthis already about the sunrise.
But what's really also veryimportant and I think even more
(20:18):
important is something calledUVA rise, and that is when the
sun is at a 10 to 30 degreeangle and the UVA rise.
You can see the times of thathappening within the app, but
essentially it's like a two hourperiod roughly, and again that
depends on where you are, whattime of the year it is.
But during the UVA rise we havethese aromatic amino acids in
(20:44):
our eyes that capture thephotons of UV light and there's
this really interesting cascadeof neurotransmitters and
hormones.
So, for example, we have aneurotransmitter called tyrosine
and that gets converted intodopamine for motivation and
norepinephrine for energy.
We have a neurotransmittercalled tryptophan and that gets
(21:07):
converted to serotonin for thehappiness, and then serotonin
gets converted into melatonin.
So essentially you're preparingyour body's melatonin for that
night and you can help.
It can work to help regulateyour thyroid hormone, sex
hormone, your fat burninghormone.
It's almost like taking a bunchof multivitamins and natural
(21:30):
pharmaceuticals in the morningjust by getting this light.
So I recommend for my clientsto get outside and try to book
out 10 minutes minutes twice ifpossible during that UVA rise,
so 20 minutes total during thattime.
And it may take you know, itmay take some getting creative
(21:52):
with your schedule, you know.
So if you are working in anoffice you may want to kind of
book in your breaks and theearly part of the day and step
outside for 10 minutes here and10 minutes there.
But really, like, I haveexperienced the benefits of this
myself by really putting itinto practice and my clients are
like, wow, this feels amazingBecause it is like it does feel
(22:15):
like sort of like a naturalantidepressant, mood lifting.
Okay, so then we've covered themorning.
Then at night, what we reallywant to focus on is, around
sunset, starting to dim yourliving environment lights.
So a lot of modern homes havethese led lights above us that
are very bright.
So either turning those off, ifpossible, and instead turning
(22:38):
on a table lamp, maybe lighting,and then, if you are using any
devices at night, considerdimming the screen and adding
blue blocking glasses to yourroutine.
So blue blocking glasses, theones that you want to use at
night, have amber kind of orangefilter or lenses.
(23:00):
So you want to make sure you'vegot those, and quite often I'm
seeing people order like thecheap pairs, the clear ones, on
Amazon.
And you have to be reallycareful about the brands you use
, because there are a lot ofbrands that don't do the testing
of the, of the what they saythey're going to do in terms of
blocking out the blue light.
They say they're going to do interms of blocking out the blue
(23:22):
light, right?
So just you know, buy fromreputable retailers.
And they've actually donestudies using blue light
blockers with people who haveinsomnia and they gave people
with insomnia blue lightblockers, had them use them for
two hours before bed for a weekand the people who had insomnia
were reporting subjectivelybetter sleep.
(23:44):
And if they had objectivelybetter sleep scores, so they can
be incredibly effective toolfor and they're an accessible
tool for most people as well.
So what we're basically tryingto do in the evening is preserve
our natural melatonin, becauseyou know, just to kind of get
down to the basics, that bluelight and the bright light will
(24:06):
decrease our production of ournatural melatonin, which we need
in order to initiate sleep andstay asleep.
So we're all, just, we're allabout protecting that melatonin.
Rose (24:16):
Yeah, yeah.
You know people say, takemelatonin at night, but it
really doesn't work.
It's really your natural onethat's going to work.
From what in the camp where I'mfor it?
And let me just kind of deflecta myth here.
Morgan (24:48):
One of the things that I
hear in the camp of people that
say melatonin is bad is that ifyou take melatonin you won't
produce your own, and that'sactually not true.
We have no evidence at all thatthat happens.
So there have been reports ofpeople who've taken, you know,
hundreds of milligrams ofmelatonin abruptly discontinued
(25:09):
it, and their body still wasable to produce the melatonin.
But where I see the best usecase for melatonin is for people
who are older.
So in our 50s and beyond, weactually are producing less
melatonin, and there's a reallynice graph that I sometimes pull
(25:30):
out in presentations that showthat natural decline on your way
down post 50.
So I do feel like for a lot ofpeople post 50, there is a use
case for just a sort of a microdose of melatonin to supplement
what they may have lost.
But we do still.
I mean we can't.
I guess my point is we can'tcompletely have these habits
(25:54):
that will trash our melatonin.
We have to work on preservingit, because that's like the most
important melatonin, but if wefeel like we need to supplement,
I don't see any harm in doingthat.
I would suggest, though, thatpeople be careful about the
melatonin that they buy.
So what they have found is thatthere's melatonin brands out
(26:19):
there that are not actuallycorrect in how they're
advertising what's in the bottle.
So they did a study where theypulled melatonin off the shelves
and then tested it and theyfound that some melatonin brands
had less melatonin in them andsome melatonin brands had like
478% more melatonin than wasadvertised on the bottle.
(26:41):
So, not to mention, there'slike 13 synthetic additives that
can be added to melatoninsupplements that are not healthy
.
So you just want to be careful,you know.
Buy a pharmaceutical grademelatonin.
Stay away from, like, the bigbox brands.
Those probably don't have thequality standards.
Those probably don't have thequality standards.
Rose (27:01):
I drink a tea that
combines valerian root and
melatonin and chamomile.
Morgan (27:07):
Yeah, a lot of people do
that.
That seems like a really greatsolution.
Rose (27:12):
For me it's a ritual.
I have a ritual at night whereI do turn the lights off if I'm
watching TV and then I'll havemy tea, and the only thing I
still do is still bring my iPadto bed, which I always said.
There's no TV in the bedroom,but iPads are like your portable
TV.
So trying to move away fromthat, some of these habits are
hard to break.
Morgan (27:32):
Yeah, oh, they sure are.
I mean, you know I'm going toout my husband right now, but he
actually still sleeps with aphone in the bed, right, he
likes to listen to podcasts ashe's falling asleep and he, you
know he needs his phone for thepodcast and I've gotten on his
(27:52):
case a few times.
Right for doing that.
And the compromise that we'vecome to agree on is he will put
his phone in a Faraday bag.
A Faraday bag, you know, blocksthe EMFs.
So there's compromises andthere's smaller things you can
do, but these habits are hard tobreak because it's kind of like
your security blanket, right,yeah, Like you want the iPad.
Rose (28:15):
Listening to a guided yoga
nidra meditation or a
meditation of some sort prior togoing to sleep.
I know you talked about yourhusband having the phone nearby
and probably falling asleep withthe phone, and it's you know.
Everything is here.
Morgan (28:29):
Yeah, I think those can
be really helpful.
I think that you know, if youwant, if you kind of rely on
those from an outside source,like from a YouTube video or
whatnot, my solution to that ishaving a Bluetooth speaker in
your bedroom.
So you're setting your you're,you're, you know, playing it on
your phone, but your phone is inanother room but you can hear
(28:49):
the, the, whatever it is, onyour Bluetooth speaker.
I would just say, keep theBluetooth speaker like six to
eight feet away from you,because you still have the EMFs
from the Bluetooth.
Yeah, but I think it's a.
It's a good compromise.
I actually um listen to um aneight hour sleep track called
(29:09):
deep sleep.
It's um, it's a.
It's a neuroacoustic softwarecalled new calm.
That I that I bought a fewmonths ago, and they've really
done a lot of research with the.
What they're trying to do isget your brain into these
certain waves so that it's moreconducive to sleep.
So what I do is I just put thatBluetooth speaker across the
room and have it playing allnight, you know.
(29:32):
So it's like not ideal that Ihave a Bluetooth speaker in my
room but yet it's also prettyfar away from my bed.
Rose (29:39):
Yeah, I know, you know I
don't want to go down the EMF
topic because that could be awhole nother topic, but I'm
guilty of you know, because Iwas going to ask you what about
sleep trackers?
What about your iWatch People?
I wear it once in a while totrack my sleep.
Yeah, and it's not good here.
I have it right up, you know,by my head.
Morgan (30:03):
Right.
Well, yeah, I hear what you'resaying about that.
I use I use actually four sleeptrackers, I'm embarrassed to
say, but I use a whoop around mywrist, I wear an aura ring, so
here's sort of the stance that Itake on sleep trackers and EMFs
.
Most of them emit a very smallamount.
I mean, I don't know about theApple Watch, that might be a
(30:24):
little bit more intense with theEMFs, but it's sort of a
cost-benefit analysis, like ifyou feel like you're getting
some really good data from yoursleep tracker and it's helping
you modify some of yourbehaviors, then perhaps the
benefit is worth the risk of theslight EMF, right.
(30:44):
So it's kind of a trade-off.
I kind of look at that's kindof how I look at toxins as a
whole in my life.
It's like you've got this kindof toxic load, a bucket, if you
will, and you kind of pick andchoose where you're going to put
that, put in that bucket, right, like what's really important
to you, um, so it's it's kind ofa personal decision.
(31:06):
I am willing to take the hit ofthe small emfs and and and
trade for getting that sleepdata, which to me is helpful and
I also notice, um, you know,maybe we could talk about Like I
know that if I go to bed at, ifI'm asleep by 10 or in bed by
10 and sleep by 11, I really getthe best sleep.
(31:28):
I notice the pattern is thebest sleep.
Yeah, you probably have
like an intermediate chronotype,
right I would say, and I thinkthat's really great that you've
become aware of that, thinkthat's.
I think that's really greatthat you've you've become aware
of that and like yourconsistency is obviously helping
(31:49):
you feel better and what weknow about consistency is that's
like a really key factor in oursleeping habits.
A lot of people are talking somuch about getting eight hours.
Getting eight hours.
The real, the real thing thatwe want to be talking about is
how consistent is yoursleep-wake cycle?
Yeah, they did a study about ayear ago thousands and thousands
of people where they showedthat people who had a consistent
(32:09):
sleep schedule had a lowerall-cause mortality risk versus
people who had eight hours withan inconsistent schedule, right.
So these people who aresleeping six hours a night on a
regular basis were faring betterwith mortality rates than the
eight-hour sleepers who werejust kind of like you know,
(32:31):
having a lot of wake-ups orhaving some inconsistency in
their sleep period.
So if we're looking to reallybuild that consistent sleep-wake
cycle, we want to start reallywith our wake time.
That's sort of the anchor thatreally helps us a lot in getting
us to the place where we becomesleepy around the same time
(32:52):
each night, right?
Because we have this chemicalin our brain called adenosine
and after about 17 hours of usbeing awake that adenesis needs
to be released in the form ofsleep.
So getting that consistency inour daytime is really going to
kind of help our bedtime becomemore regular, because we're
(33:13):
going to start becoming sleepyaround the same time each night.
So there's a lot to be said inconsistency.
That's like the main thing thatI'm helping my clients with is
getting on a more consistentschedule, because when they do
that, like you just reflected on, you feel so much better.
Rose (33:30):
So you talked about the
eight hours of sleep, that
there's a misconception, that weneed eight hours of sleep
because you may not right, yeah,yeah.
Morgan (33:36):
So the National Sleep
Foundation recommends seven to
nine hours for adults.
But when you look at the fineprint of their recommendations
it says between six and 10 hoursmay be appropriate for some
people.
So there are people who, youknow, do just great with six,
six and a half hours.
But there is like probably onein a thousand people who are
(33:57):
actually what we call shortsleepers.
Genetically they have aspecific gene that gives them
like the ability to only needlike less than six hours.
But that's one in 1000, roughlyright.
And I have come across so manypeople who say, oh, I only need
five hours or whatever.
But the reality is theirproblem they probably don't have
(34:18):
that gene.
They're probably kind offorcing themselves to live that
lifestyle.
But it's kind of like I look atthe sleep hours needed as sort
of like a shoe size, likethere's sort of this range of
normal, of expected, but wedon't always have the same shoe
size.
We have different shoe sizes.
You and I, I'm sure we probablyneed different calorie
(34:41):
requirements.
We have different calorierequirements.
You and I, I'm sure we probablyneed different calorie
requirements.
We have different calorierequirements.
So same thing with sleep hours,the complaint that I hear most
often from people in general andmy clients is the 3 am wake-ups
right and people have thisnotion in their head and I think
it's sort of perpetuated bysociety that we should be
(35:02):
sleeping throughout the nightwithout any breaks.
But it's very normal forhealthy adults to have brief
awakenings throughout the night.
In fact, after we complete eachsleep cycle it's normal to have
a brief awakening, and it'sreally from an evolutionary
perspective because it's asafety check.
So think about many, many yearsago we were sleeping out in the
(35:24):
wilderness.
We didn't have these homes andsecurity systems.
We were vulnerable to prey andso it served us well to have a
brief awakening to scan forsafety.
And a lot of evolutionarybiologists say that we have kept
this pattern in modern daytimes, so that we're waking up
after the sleep cycle, we'rescanning our surrounding for
(35:46):
safety, we're scanning our roomand then we go back to sleep.
So if you're awake for like lessthan two or three minutes,
you're not going to rememberthat you are awake.
You may see in your sleep datathat you had a small awakening.
But the problem is when peoplefreak out about the fact that
they're awake, they start toruminate like, get worried about
(36:08):
the next day, or they are.
They're worrying about the factthat they're awake, and what I
always like to tell people islike your nighttime brain is not
the same as your daytime brain.
So in the middle of the nightthere's this this new research
that's been out recently calledthe mind after midnight, and
basically what they're talkingabout is your brain is operating
(36:28):
from your amygdala in themiddle of the night.
It's not operating from theprefrontal cortex, the rational
part of your brain.
So if you wake up at 3 am andyou all of a sudden notice that
you've got these like reallycatastrophic thoughts, your
brain is doing what it'ssupposed to be doing, right.
So so what I tell people isdon't believe anything.
(36:49):
You're you're.
You tell yourself at 3amdiscard it, come back to it in
the morning.
It's going to feel lessthreatening, less significant in
the morning when you're in yourright, the rights in your
normal brain, right.
I have actually written a freeguide all about 3 am Wake ups,
(37:11):
called Awake Again at 3 am, yourguide to why you're waking up
and what to do about it.
It is a free resource on mywebsite that goes through the
whole what I just shared.
Resource on my website thatgoes through the whole what I
just shared, plus reviews, someof the common reasons people
wake up and strategies aboutwhat to do if you're waking up.
So it's something to look at.
If what is plaguing you ismiddle of the night wakenings,
(37:33):
I'd definitely check it out.
Rose (37:34):
Yeah, we're going to put
the link because I think
everybody needs to read that.
Morgan (37:38):
Yeah, I think it's a
resource that could serve a lot
of people.
Rose (37:42):
Yeah, absolutely One of
the things that I stopped
drinking alcohol over a year anda half ago and my immediate
benefit was that I sleep waybetter Because I, you know, my
body's not processing alcohol inthe middle of the night.
I'm actually sleeping better.
I don't wake up as often and Inoticed from my sleep tracker
that I sleep that deep sleepbetter and I feel better when I
don't wake up as often and Inoticed from my sleep tracker
that I sleep that deep sleepbetter and I feel better when I
(38:05):
wake up.
Yeah, that's amazing.
Yeah, that's amazing, yeah.
I tell people that all the timebecause, like I say, well, if
you're going to complain aboutsleep and you can't sleep, well,
try maybe not to drink after acertain time at night.
Morgan (38:17):
Right, yeah, I'm a big
believer in a couple of things
with alcohol.
It's like decreasing thequantity and also moving the
time period back a little bit.
So think happy hour versusnightcap.
A drink at 5 pm is going toland a lot differently than a
drink at 8 or 9 pm.
And ask me how I know this?
(38:39):
I've experimented with myselfand my Oura Ring data does not
lie.
Rose (38:45):
Yeah.
Morgan (38:46):
But yeah, I think, as
we're in midlife and beyond,
alcohol really just doesn'tserve us overall for our general
health and it definitely we'rea lot more sensitive to it for
our sleep.
So limiting it is definitelyserving us well in midlife,
morgan.
Rose (39:02):
let's talk about some of
the top tips and strategies that
you have some takeaways thatpeople can use to help sleep
better.
Morgan (39:11):
Yeah, we've kind of
reviewed a couple of them.
I'd start again with reviewingthe consistent wake-up time is a
really, really key factor instrengthening our circadian
rhythm, getting us more regularsleep.
The morning light is reallyimportant in terms of regulating
our circadian rhythm, gettingthose neurotransmitters and
(39:34):
hormones in balance.
And then really, exercise issomething that we didn't really
touch on, but exercise is areally key component in getting
better sleep quality, gettingourselves to sleep more quickly,
and deep sleep.
We have like a meta analysis ofabout 13 different studies
showing that exercise helps withour deep sleep, especially in
(39:56):
midlife.
So I would recommend 30 minutesof moderate exercise most days
of the week for better sleep,because it's going to help build
your sleep drive, it's going tohelp regulate your circadian
rhythm and it's going to helpreduce your cortisol.
So it's a really reallyattainable way to get better
sleep, because we don'tnecessarily need to go to a gym
(40:18):
to get this.
We can just walk outside or dosomething at home if we need to.
Rose (40:23):
Yeah, yeah, and it doesn't
matter what time of day.
Morgan (40:27):
To an extent.
Yes, I would say it's best notto do something right before bed
, like in the hour.
Probably one to two hoursbefore bed is probably when I'd
say cut it off, because it'sgoing to raise your body
temperature and you need acooler core body temperature to
initiate sleep.
I think that mornings can be areally great time of the day to
(40:50):
work out for most people.
Most people find that it kindof will encourage their system
to want to go to sleep a littlebit earlier.
A lot of people want to go tosleep a little bit earlier.
A lot of people want to go tosleep a little bit earlier, and
I think it keeps our system inthat nice routine.
If we're getting our morningexercise, I think it's also just
a really great way to startyour day for mood boosting,
(41:13):
brain boosting.
But I suggest that people playaround with the time of day that
they're working out and figureout what works best for their
own schedule.
Rose (41:23):
Yeah, and speaking as a
yoga instructor and Qigong
instructor, just some gentlestretching at night is a nice
way, or some restorative yogapose is also a nice way to just
relax and use some, you know,maybe some crystals or some
meditation, just unplugging, Ithink right.
(41:44):
Yeah, we need to unplug as asociety, especially if we want
to.
You know we have to put theiPad in the other room before
going to sleep, if you can.
Is there anything else?
Let's talk about your offeringsor what you offer your clients.
Let's talk about that.
Morgan (42:00):
Yeah, so I work with
clients in a one-to-one coaching
container where I'm helpingpeople who are struggling with
insomnia or want to optimizetheir sleep, and I also, like we
mentioned, have the freeoffering for the 3 am wake-up
guide if anybody is interestedin getting that, and also
(42:21):
there's a free offering for aconsultation with me.
So if you're kind of likethinking I really would like to
improve my sleep and you're likewhat would it be like to work
with a coach, definitely reachout to get a consultation with
me and we can chat about what'sgoing on.
If I'm not the right fit foryou, or if you have like a sleep
issue that is out of my scope,then I can refer you to another
(42:42):
provider.
Rose (42:43):
Yeah, I love the concept
of a sleep coach.
I think it's great because whydo we have to struggle all by
ourselves to try to have abetter habit around sleep?
Morgan (42:55):
Right, yeah, well, I
mean, I think there's such a
beautiful, you know aspect ofcoaching and that it gives you
an extra set of eyes on yourissue.
Right, because we.
I think that it's hard for mostpeople to fully become aware of
what's going on in theenvironment, like they're just
too close to it.
So getting that outside pair ofeyes can be really helpful.
(43:16):
And then also having somebodyto be accountable to, right,
because there's something calledthe Hawthorne effect and
basically it's like when you'rebeing watched, observed, you're
going to perform better.
And not that there's any kindof gray I'm not going to grave
anyone but it's sort of likewhen you pay somebody to help
(43:36):
you on a path, you're morelikely to follow their
recommendations than you mightbe if you just read a blog post
about sleep or whatever.
Well, you know, I would just say, you know, final words is that
sleep is better, sleep isattainable for everybody.
And quite often I think we gettempted to jump to like the sexy
(43:57):
hacks and gadgets and devices,and those are.
I mean, those are great, don'tget me wrong, I love my devices.
But if you're starting thissleep optimization journey,
really start with the basicsfirst, like kind of the things
that we went over and masterthose before you graduate.
To the things that you can buy,because it doesn't have to cost
(44:19):
a gazillion dollars.
There's a lot of things you cando for free.
Rose (44:23):
Yeah, it's a great point.
Thank you, this has been awonderful conversation and I
appreciate you being here,taking the time to be here on
the show today.
Morgan (44:32):
Thank you, of course.
Thank you for asking.
Rose (44:36):
Thank you for joining me
Chat Off The Mat.
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