August 19, 2023 • 34 mins
In the second half of the show, we discuss the efforts put forth by Jacob/Roqy from his position at the ACLU that allows public filming of police while on duty. He shares how he was able to protect our rights and how this can be replicated in communities across the country.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
And now Pat show my mic back like that. We
can strike.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
From head borders behind in the border.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
Just tuning in the civic cipher. I'm your host, Ramsey's job.
Big shout out to my man key Ward, who is
all the way in Italy. He's probably in like Venice
or Rome or some some other and I know there's
a ton of Italy. I can think of it. What
is it, Pisa? I'm sure they anyway. But we do
(00:35):
have a special guest in the studio with us today,
Jacob Rayford aka Rocky Tirade, a good friend of mine
and a very politically engaged individual activist MC a person
that we're very proud of here on this show and
a person who's really making uh some changes and showing
folks how to do it. So we're excited to continue
our conversation in just a little bit. Uh, stay tuned.
(00:56):
We still have our way Black History fact, which is
about how black people were denied Manila ice cream until
the fourth of July. I didn't know this, and so
now I do and you're going to know it too.
That and so much more to stick around for. But
first and foremost, yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
That's just definally eat vanilla yeah, but right now we're
going to discuss Baba becoming a better ally.
Speaker 1 (01:20):
Baba and Today's Baba is sponsored by Unknown Union, the
fashion how situated at the intersection of meaning, innovation and culture.
From our info check Unknown Union dot com and Today's
Baba is reclaiming the term woke. I want to read
a little bit. This is from wu SF News. Civil
(01:41):
rights advocates are pushing back against Governor Ronda Santus' war
on woke ideology, and part of that struggle is reclaiming
the word quote. A lot of people are using the
term stay woke because a lot of people fell asleep
during the last election. This comes from Reverend Donal, an
associate pastor at Dothel Missionary Baptist Church in Tallahassee. The
(02:04):
Stay Woke protest, which is a fifteen city bus tour
across Florida, wrapped up recently. The tour kicked off on
Juneteenth in North Florida, who stops in Jacksonville and Tallahassee,
where a planned rally and press conference outside the state
capital was moved to Bethel. About fifty out of state
activist with the Transformative Justice Coalition and nonprofit that advocates
(02:27):
for Racial Justice traveled on a bus across the state
recently to meet with local community organizers and speak out
against recent policies affecting education, healthcare, and voting. Quote, isn't
it amazing that they're telling y'all to don't be woke?
Aren't you glad the Lord woke you up this morning?
Don't you know we serve a woke lord? Reverend RB
Homes of the Bethel Missionary Baptist Church told organizers gathered
(02:51):
downstairs in a fellowship hall. Goes on to say, the
opposite of woke is sleep, and once you start sleeping,
you will give into these policies. I think that's a
fantastic way of framing that position. I also want to
shout out the NAACP who has recently affirmed the use
of woke and is actively reclaiming it and not allowing
it to fall into the hands of the opposition. And
(03:13):
so well, can't stay woke, y'all can't even define well?
Thank you? Rod. All right, So back to the man
of the our Rocky tirade aka Jacob Rayford. We were
talking about being politically engaged, and we were using kind
of your story as an example, you mentioned uh, the
(03:34):
a c O you and working with the a c
O you, so I definitely want to lean into that first.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
I want to talk about if you don't mind, ye,
please go ahead. I do want to say real quick
before before we stray away from the politics stuff. It
is important if you can just take some time to
google after watching this episode what a precint committee person is.
That will be the pathway to you being involved in
political activities within your community.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
If you are upset, if you are tired of.
Speaker 3 (03:59):
Things going on in a way that you feel don't
represent your community, if you're looking for a way to
express yourself and you're still kind of, you know, not
necessarily intimidated, but like you know, self conscious about being
involved in political spaces, Google that and google your immediate
legislative district. If you don't know that, just google what
is my legislative district. You will pull up that information.
Just google your legislative district, Google PC you will be
(04:21):
directed to your legislative district. Email those people, tell them
who you are, the community that you come from, how
long you've lived there, and that you'd like to be involved.
And I can guarantee you for whatever rich reason. They
are going to reach out and they're going to bring
you into that fold, and you are going to be
politically empowered and be able to represent your communities in
this upcoming election and beyond. So before we go into
(04:41):
any other things, I do want to express that.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
So Okay, well, the man knows what he's talking about,
and I think that's a great segue into where I
was going next. So, as a result of your engagement,
you have recent been appointed by the governor or the
governor to the Commission for Appellate Court.
Speaker 3 (05:08):
So yeah, yeah, yeah, the Commission on the Appellate Court Appointments.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
So that's for like pelate sorry, no of learning.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
Yeah, So what I'm first spout out to do the
same thing because again there's certain types of information that
that is outside of you know, just our day to
day lives. I mean, who is going to be involved
in the judicial process, Like we all have schools and
you know, family and work and various day to day
tasks that takes away from this. But yeah, I was
appointed to the Commission on Appellate Court Appointments. So basically
(05:37):
what that is is this is the body and because
different states have different systems for appointing their judges and whatnot.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
But this is for the state of Arizona.
Speaker 3 (05:46):
What they do is for most of their judges, they
have a commission that that's those who are candidates for
judges for say the Court of Appeals.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
For what I'm a part of the Court of Appeals,
the Supreme Court.
Speaker 3 (05:59):
We through the the merit selection process that these these
people their backgrounds and determine if they are good enough
to be presented to the governor. And through this very
small select few, uh, the governor will decide which one
will you know, if this person will be appointed a
judge to say the Supreme Court of of of Arizona,
(06:21):
which is our highest core system in our state. So
for state law, that is really one of the most
impactful like bodies that you can be a part of.
And I'm saying I am an MC from Phoenix, Arizona.
I am a rapper. I'm in this space. It is
possible to do these things. So I like listening to
(06:43):
you tah, keeping.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Like okay, well the uh, these these positions and these
titles again for a person like me, Uh, you have
made it a lot more accessible. I again I mentioned
earlier that I know some people who have run campaigns,
people who've been elected, people have lost elections. I know
(07:07):
people who have really wanted to make changes, and on
both sides, believe it or not. You know, I have
some friends that a friend that ran for it was
attorney general and yeah, he's a friend of mine. It's
crazy he didn't make it. And he is a conservative
in the conservative individual. Yeah, but he ran with a
(07:27):
million dollar campaign, million plus dollar campaign. And so I
know that there's oftentimes the bigger operations, but in terms
of people who have been effective, you know, these people
get the little flash. You know, there's six or eight
people running for a position, and they all, you know,
end up with a debate at a library or something
(07:48):
like that, and then one person gets elected to do
the job, and then the other four or five people,
you know, just return to their private sector lives or whatever.
They go back to being, you know, whatever it is.
They hopefully they stay politically engaged. Hopefully, hopefully, what I'm
suggesting is that for folks who a don't want to
run a huge campaign like that, or b maybe they're
(08:11):
interested in doing something like that, but you know, there's
nothing comes of it. Those sorts of people could look
to you and see not only are you politically engaged,
but you're actually making some changes, and your political footprint
is growing to the degree or it's growing in such
a way that you're actually to affect changes, not unlike
(08:34):
a person who's run one of those huge campaigns. Your
name is big like that, not that people do this
for their own name. You know, who knows why people
do what they do. All I'm concerned with is are
you a good person? Or are you trying to create
policies and outcomes for people that are equitable for all communities.
But I do believe that there's more paths toward change
(08:58):
and successful political arena than just the traditional one that
monster that I write outlined in the in the first
part of the show. Now excuse me. The next thing
I want to touch on is you mentioned the a
c o U. Yeah, so let's lean into this a bit.
(09:19):
Jacob Brayford aka Rocky Tyrant. You are the VP of
the a c l U of Arizona and you are
on the board for the a c l U National
Committee in New York. So first off, let's start here.
What does that mean?
Speaker 3 (09:35):
So I'm for the a c o U, the American
Civil Liberty Liberties Union, which is an a hundred year
old organization that uh uh, through litigation work, through through
legal work, fights on behalf of those who civil rights have.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
Been violated throughout history. And and this, by the way,
this counts as far as I'm concerned as political engagement
as well. Yeah, yeah, I would say we I want
to stress before I get we are definitely in politically
impartial a political organization. It's just how things have developed
over the past you know, few or so odd years,
(10:12):
things have been kind of politicized inadvertently when it comes
to civil rights. You know, when you think of like
reproductive rights, reproductive justice, abortion rights, things that you know,
First Amendment rights. When it comes to like being able
to film the police and things of that nature, those
have become politicized. So if you want to look at
it from.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
That stance, Yeah, but we operate as a non political
party party. But you know, the a c o U
American Civil Liberties Union does. It's a historic organization that
has shown up throughout history and advocacy for civil liberty
and fighting for people's civil liberty and throughout the United States.
(10:51):
There is various affiliates and Arizona is no different. We
have a very effective, very powerful affiliate and we are
rate as our own organization, though we are in orbit
of the national ACLU. But you know, there's things that
are specific to our community. So we have an American
Civil Liberties Union of Arizona, of which I'm the vice
president of.
Speaker 1 (11:12):
Yeah. Man, So listen, you know we're talking earlier about
how you are international with the bars, you know what
I'm saying, and national and regional with the bars, but
also you know, VP of you know, the ACLU Arizona
board and then obviously on the board for the are
(11:34):
a messaying this right, VP of the ACLU of Arizona,
and on the board for the ACOL you National committee
in New York, right, Yeah, so I'm on the national board.
So you know what I'm saying. You're doing all and
everything else that we've outlined in today's show, and your platform,
your brand, your presence has been elevated, and your effectiveness
(11:59):
and sort of creating change and offering alternative paths toward
a more equitable society. You've been very effective toward that end.
And so I want to take a moment and talk
about one such incident. So I'm going to do another reading,
if I may. Let's talk about filming the police. You
(12:22):
mentioned a bition. Talk about that for a bit, all right,
I'm going to read from the Associated Press. This is
based in Phoenix, Arizona, but obviously the implications spread well
beyond date Arizona, even to your state. But it just
happened to take place here. And a person at the
helm of that was the person to my left here
in the studio. All right, the Associated Press. A federal
(12:44):
judge has ruled that an Arizona law limiting how close
people can get to recording law enforcement is unconstitutional. Well done, sir,
Well done, Rocky. I appreciate this. We talked about this
when they passed this law on the show, like, oh
my god, Arizona's trippin'. You can't stand more than things
like eight feet or something like that. Police fell, the police,
(13:07):
and they were trying to use it to engage police
to be able to arrest more people who were filming
them in their wrongdoing. And so I want to finish
reading this because I do want your full response. I mean,
I got to be mindful of the clock here, so
let me hearry you, all right, all right, the recording
law and oh sorry recording law enforcements on cars okay,
(13:29):
citing infringement against a clearly established right to film the
police doing their jobs. The ruling from US District Judge
John J. Tucci permanently blocks enforcement of the law that
he suspended last year. All right. The Republican backed law
was signed by former Republican Governor Doug Doucy in July
(13:50):
twenty twenty two, but enthusiasm for the restrictions faded and
legislators refused an opportunity to defend the law during an
initial court suspension. Republic Can State Senator John Cavanaugh, who
sponsored the measure, has said he was unable to find
an outside group to defend the legislation. The law would
have made it illegal to knowingly film police officers at
(14:12):
eight feet two and a half meters like I mentioned,
or closer if the officer tells the person to stop,
and on private profity sorry and on private property. An
officer who decides that someone is interfering or that the
area is unsafe could have ordered that person to stop filming,
even if the recording was being made with the owner's permission.
(14:33):
The law oh sorry quote law prohibits or chills a
substantial amount of First Amendment protected activity and is unnecessary
to prevent interference with police officers given other Arizona laws. Effect,
Tucci ruled a coalition of media groups and the ACLU
successfully sued to block the law. So, as the vice
(14:56):
president of the ACLU give us your thoughts verse.
Speaker 3 (15:00):
I want to say thank you very much to are
not only the the legal team here in Arizona, but
the legal team nationally, so big big shout out to
Ben Rundahl, Jery Keenan kan Bell and and you know,
even in terms of not only this but other cases
that they're currently involved in as well, such as the
(15:22):
uh one around the Fund for Empowerment, the the mistreatment
of the in house community. So that involves national legal
legal counsels such as Scout com Kadovic and Leah Watson
from ACOLU National. But this just really speaks to the
importance of engagement from our organizations around these issues that
(15:43):
impact our abilities to exercise our First Amendment right, you know,
our civil liberties. And so when it comes to this
specific case, I want to first extend my appreciation for
our legal team that was able to facilitate this and
the trust that we have between our board at the
ACEU of Arizona and our legal staff, because that allowed
(16:04):
me the comfort of being able to put everything down
in writing in terms of I'm starting to get emotional,
like the declaration which recounts everything that we experienced in
twenty twenty, and because of that that was then weaponized
against this heinous attempt at undermining our civil liberty and
(16:24):
you know, there's no choice but to move forward. Me
I was the person who put my experiences down as
the declaration in really the person outside of the ACOU
and the media conglomerates that we're pushing against this heinous
action and whatnot.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
So I mean that all of.
Speaker 3 (16:43):
Us working in concert resulted in just an amazing victory.
And as we see, this is not something that's so
absurd that it can't happen, because there's so many crazy
things that are taking place now, and to be completely honest,
we had all not collaborated, that probably would have gone
through because there's so many insane things that are taking place.
We have somebody running for president who is being hit
(17:06):
left and right like with indictments and collecting all the
indictments from different states like Thanos's rings and stuff like that.
Speaker 1 (17:13):
It is totally possible.
Speaker 3 (17:14):
And I feel that with us working a concert, we
secure that victory.
Speaker 1 (17:18):
Listen, man, I think that, and I know that there
are more victories and more stories here. But I think
that the conversation that we've had today, where we start
at the beginning, at least of our story. We know
each other being on the radio together, having you come
up on the show, drop some bars to obviously twenty twenty,
(17:42):
when we're you know, out in the streets with the
bullhorns and organized marching together or my sons are out
there with us. You know, it's just out of love,
and you know, showing love in front of all those people,
you know Finnish, showing solidarity in front of all those people,
because often enough you and I were you know, toward
the front lines or really at the front lines of
those things, not unintentional, you know for me at least,
(18:03):
and to now where you're holding these positions, you're creating
these changes. And one such change that we can point
to today which has implications, national implications, and establishes a
bit of like case precedent. And you know, I think
(18:24):
that you know, you mentioned, the ACLU argued that, you know,
this is a violation of civil liberties. These are, you know,
public servants. They are performing their duties using public funds
and seeing our money. Yeah, exactly, and on and on
and I you know, the way that the case was
made is very easy to make the case in other
places if there are attempts to prevent people from filming
(18:47):
the police. And you got to imagine, well.
Speaker 3 (18:49):
I'sna say as a direct response to the process that
we did. So we were so effective that the you know,
somebody's conservative lawmakers are like, okay, well we're going to
write a law that says you guys can't film police,
and you want to talk about what we're doing to
the community. So like that's a direct result of the
actions that That's exactly what I was going to say.
Speaker 1 (19:06):
So I don't imagine that police would push back against
something like that unless there was something to fear. I
don't imagine police would push back against something like that
unless they opposed consequences, unless they opposed reform, unless they
opposed the facts. Somehow, Opposing facts, I guess is a
(19:33):
thing people can do. But the facts are that you know,
black and brown bodies are mistreated at the hands of
police at a disproportionate rate, and our white brothers and
sisters not to say that they don't suffer at the
hands of the police as well. Police misconduct is a
very real concern for people that look like you, me,
and our children and future children. And that if we
(19:57):
are going to be compelled to pay taxes, and we
are going to be compelled to participate in a society
with UH which grants police so much power and gives
them a device to carry on their purpose on their
person whose only purpose is to end the life. I'm
(20:17):
talking about a gun that that device, the only that
is to end the life. You don't carve wood with it,
you don't make dinner.
Speaker 3 (20:27):
With the one that's on their dominant side of the
trained instinctively go for instead of their taser.
Speaker 1 (20:30):
Yeah, yeah, that's to end the life, that one. So,
if we're going to give these folks this type of power,
to ask for a modicum of count accountability, to ask
for a bit of UH leeway to capture the events
to help us tell our stories and substantiate our claims
(20:51):
is not unreasonable. However, when you see the pushback, you
recognize that the resistance to what is absolutely logical. That
resistance is real, and it is people who hold elected office.
(21:12):
It's people who are politically engaged. It's people who are
active in the political arena, or in their communities, or
however you want to say this. It's those people that
are the real thin black line. We'll call it in
our case specifically, but you know, our brown, Indigenous lgbt
Q I A plus aap I, you know, on and
(21:34):
on and on Native, you know, all of us who
will call it the Rainbow coalition. And indeed, our white
brothers and sisters are Caucasian brothers and sisters who have
been affected by some of these systemic issues. Political engagement
of good people who recognize that there is a more
(21:58):
equitable world on the other side of that political engagement.
Those are the people that really make the change. And
so to that end, I appreciate you popping in being
a living, breathing example of that. And of course this
particular instance because as I mentioned, when this when the
news broke, you know, Q and I were like, oh
my god, you can't film the police, you know, and
(22:20):
we talked about on this show. We've talked about these
maneuvers that police will do. You know, Okay, a person
is getting arrested or apprehended or being questioned or something
like that, and there's a couple of police there, and
then the police will drive their vehicle, you know, those
(22:40):
big suv police SUVs. They'll drive the vehicle in between
the person filming and the person being detained. They will
block them with their bodies. You know, Hey, you guys
can't be here. You know, I'm trying to film. Well,
you can't be here, you know, and they'll just stand
in the way and you just seeing them.
Speaker 3 (22:56):
It's accountability and intimidation. So it's a case in point,
like when we one that case. Not too long after that,
I started receiving you know, harassment calls from private numbers
and sure death threats and exact nature.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (23:08):
So I mean, and these are things that I totally
forgot about because we haven't had that experience in twenty twenty,
you know, in all sorts of nonsense that came from that.
But you know, it's various levels of intimidation factors that
in ways to obstruct us from impede us from being
able to exercise our right and hold people accountable.
Speaker 1 (23:24):
That we pay for with our tax dollars. Yeah, and
I think that that, above all else is the best
way to look at it. You know, we're paying with
tax dollars, and so it's up to us to hold
these people accountable and to define what their outcomes should
be and what their objectives should be. This is they
(23:45):
don't participate in free market capitalism. So there is no
alternative to policing that will win out because it gets
you know, more patronage. This is it. We're paying with
it with tax dollars, and this is kind of the
best that we This is the best way to engage
in the process.
Speaker 3 (24:03):
I do want to say that I know we're running
out of time, but a good alternative is what's being
exercised with our Advocation Advocacy movement with the Alternative to
Police program called the Neighborhood Organized Crisis Assistance Program, which
is for constructing a first responder department that houses behavioral health,
substance abusey in the house, community victimist, non violent dispatches.
That's something we have been pushing since around the end
(24:24):
of twenty twenty and actually the City of Tempe is
incorporating some of these ideas into their Care seven and
Hope program right now. So a good alternative is to
create a new first responder apartment. It is completely possible
to do it. There are myriad types of dispatches that
your law enforcement agency just doesn't want to take and
(24:44):
doesn't have the capacity when it comes to work culture
to be able to engage within the first place.
Speaker 1 (24:48):
So a good alternative is that, and we can always
talk about that another time. Okay, where can folks get information?
So you can google something?
Speaker 3 (24:56):
Yeah, google no CAP, Neighborhood Organized Crisis Assistance Program, Google CAHOOTS,
Whitebird Clinic. That's probably the best route because that is
where some of these ideas came from in the first place.
Take that center that around what your community needs and
create a first responder system through those processes. So I think, yeah, all.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
Right, perfect. So with that in mind, it is pastime
for the Way Black History Fact. We're going to get
into this real quick, so stay with me. Today's Way
Black History Fact is sponsored by a underground beach club
from the streets to the beach. For the latest in
beachwere visit Underground Beachclub dot com. All right, black people
were denied vanilla ice cream and the Jim Crow South
except on Independence Day. Michael T. Twitty wrote this, and
(25:37):
this comes from The Guardian. By custom rather than by law,
black folks were best off if they weren't caught eating
vanilla ice cream in public, and the Jim Crow South
except the narrative always stipulates on the fourth of July.
I heard it from my father growing up myself, and
the memory of that all but unspoken rule seems to
be unique to the generation born between World War One
and World War Two. But if my Angelo had said
(26:00):
it in our classic autobiography, I know why the cage
bird sings, I doubt anybody would believe it. Today. People
in Stamps used to say that the whites in our
town were so prejudiced that a Negro couldn't buy vanilla
ice cream except on the fourth Other days he had
to be satisfied with chocolate vanilla ice cream flavored with
a Nautole spice indigenous Mexico, the cultivation of which was
(26:22):
improved by an enslaved black man named Edmund Albius on
the colonized Reunion Island in the Indian Ocean, now predominantly
grown on the largest island of the African continent in
Madagascar and served wrapped in the conical invention of a
Middle Eastern immigrant, was the symbol of the American dream.
That is, pure white sweetness was then routinely denied to
(26:48):
the grandchildren of the enslaved. Was a dream deferred. Indeed,
what makes the vanilla ice cream story less spoke memory
and more truth is that the terror and shame of
living in the purgatory between the Civil War and the
Civil Rights movement was often communicated in ways that reinforced
the children what the rules of life were and what
was in store for them if they broke them. My
(27:09):
father again, this is Michael T. Twitty reading this. He says,
my father, for instance, first learned the rules when he
first visited South Carolina with my grandfather in the nineteen forties.
In our family's home county of Lancaster, Daddy asked the
general store owner if he could buy some candy and
ice cream, referring to the white man as sir. The
store owner promptly grabbed my father by the collar and
(27:29):
yelled at him in the presence of my grandfather then
informed the elder man, you better teach this little in
word to say ya sa boy. Surre ain't good enough.
My grandfather grabbed his son and sped off. The late
poet Audrey Lord had a similar narrative to Angelo's in
her own autobiography, Sammy A new spelling of my name.
(27:50):
She visited Washington, d C. With her family as a
child around Independence Day and her parents wanted to treat
her to vanilla ice cream at a soda shop. They
were buffed by the waitress and refused service. She expressed
disappointment at her family and sisters for not decrying the
act as anything but anti American. She summed up the event.
(28:11):
The waitress was white, the counter was white, and the
ice cream I never ate in Washington, DC that summer
I left childhood was white. And the white heat and
the white pavement, and the white pavement and white stone
monuments of my first Washington summer made me sick to
my stomach for the rest of the trip. Why were
black people allowed vanilla ice cream on the fourth of July?
(28:34):
Why then? After all? In eighteen fifty two, Frederick Douglas
Rallied against the idea of celebrating American's independence when blacks
did not have their full God given freedom quote, what
do what to the American slave. Is your fourth of July?
Asked Douglas of his audience, when invited to speak in
commemoration of the day. I answer, A day that reveals
to him, more than all other days in the year,
(28:56):
the gross injustice and cruelty, to which is a constant victim.
To him, your celebration is a sham. Your boasted liberty
and unholy licensed, your national greatness swelling vanity. Your sounds rejoicing,
sounds of rejoicing, sorry, are empty and heartless. Your denunciations
of tyrants brass fronted impudence. Your shouts of liberty and
(29:17):
equality hollow mockery. Your prayers empty and you and heartless.
Your sermons and thanksgivings, with all your religious parade and solemnity,
are to him more bombast, fraud, deception, and piety and hypocrisy.
It then failed to cover up crimes which would disgrace
(29:37):
the nation of savages. Was that, somehow the purpose of
allowing the denied ice cream cone. What is a pacifier?
Speaker 3 (29:44):
Was it a.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
Message that to us, as long as we obeyed the rules,
we could still be occasionally rewarded with just enough to
keep us patriotic and loyal but perhaps it's pointless to
ask for more context. The period during which African Americans
were not allowed to epnilla ice cream tells us a
lot about where this this memory is located in time,
a period of great progress driven by Black Americans themselves.
(30:05):
It was a time when our forefathers fought for this country,
and when our four mothers organized marches to protest lynching,
when the mass migration from the South to the North
took place, and when labor organizations became vehicles for early
pressures the civil rights for black life in America. The
period from being born at the end of reconstruction through
(30:26):
the full entrenchment of jen Crow was firmly on its
way out. That period of time also represented a closing
up the gates of emigration from Europe, the slow rise
of the United States as a world power, and the
increasing unification of the idea and principles of whiteness. In
nineteen ten, for instance, white did not even did not
mean Italian, Jewish, Greek, Polish, or any variety of other
(30:46):
ethnicities we now unequivocally associate with privilege. It was instead,
still a term largely reserved for the Old Americans, those
of northwest western European stock, but that changed, at least
for some of the Europeans who wound up on America's shores.
In the south, in particular, a new ethnic white quickly
did all they could to assimilate and then affirm their whiteness.
To not do so was death, as demonstrated by the
(31:08):
lynchings of Sicilians in Louisiana and the lynchings of the
lynching of Leo Frank who was Jewish in Georgia. In
the pre war decades, little things took on outside meanings,
and each was another way to differentiate between those who
belonged and those who were barely tolerated. Perhaps the memory
of being denied vanilla ice cream is not a literal
memory for most, MIMI is just commentary. There is fantastic
(31:31):
power in this fascinating memory of Jim Crow life because
it calls our attention to the deeper psychological consequences of
legalized racism in American life. The racism of the time
period was not just about dignity and self esteem. It
was embodied and mythologized in physical terms. So in a way,
the denial of vanilla and its symbolic promise was not
(31:54):
so bad after all. Indeed, satisfaction with chocolate is now
emblematic of people of color being supported by and being
self sufficient in their own communities. Without this exact satisfaction
in our own sense of beauty, worth, mind, and purpose,
without having learned to live without Manila, we would have
never thought to change the world. And that is going
(32:16):
to do us do it for us here on Civic Cypress.
Once again, I'd like to thank you, thank for tuning
in once again. I'm your host rams this jah big
shout out to q Ward, who will be back next
week fresh off of his flight from Italy to get
down and dirty with this warm again, I'd like to
thank you, of course, Rocky Hja Jacob Rayford for checking
(32:37):
in with us. I'm doing a favorite drop your social
media's and any music or any tours or anything like that.
Speaker 3 (32:42):
Yeah, I mean I just got off tour. I've just
been in the Space Coast Events tour over in Europe.
So I just got back maybe about a week and
a half ago, so that was great. But yeah, more
upcoming music right around the corner. Stay tuned for that.
But Rocky Ta raid r o q y t y
R aid on all social media platforms for those wanting
more things it around political and advocacy work.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
That is mister j A C O B R A
I F O R D all right on Twitter and
until next week, y'all peas.
Speaker 2 (33:11):
Y'all like yo, we handle live these brothers a fabulous
our lady showing you where bomb travel live SPI tones
from sunlight to move, busting on stage like then fights
and move roll my mic back. You're like that journalist
with journalists too. We can strike back all borders with
waters from headquarters behind in, the beline sides up and
(33:33):
the borders, the press passing.
Speaker 1 (33:34):
We bring it to you as it happens.
Speaker 2 (33:36):
The streets love popping from music, you're wrapping the street
compand the slash pe xpando. You're gonna fight the stand
up with the proper propaganda.
Speaker 1 (33:44):
What's happening. It's how you've got any questions and ask
if Deduce is just a TV show you're passing?
Speaker 2 (33:49):
And this from a white wartime journalist headlines, wait, y'all
prehis and recess like this like what like this like
And now Pat show my mic back like that. We
can strike.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
From head borders behind in the border.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
Just tuning in the civic cipher. I'm your host, Ramsey's job.
Big shout out to my man key Ward, who is
all the way in Italy. He's probably in like Venice
or Rome or some some other and I know there's
a ton of Italy. I can think of it. What
is it, Pisa? I'm sure they anyway. But we do
(00:35):
have a special guest in the studio with us today,
Jacob Rayford aka Rocky Tirade, a good friend of mine
and a very politically engaged individual activist MC a person
that we're very proud of here on this show and
a person who's really making uh some changes and showing
folks how to do it. So we're excited to continue
our conversation in just a little bit. Uh, stay tuned.
(00:56):
We still have our way Black History fact, which is
about how black people were denied Manila ice cream until
the fourth of July. I didn't know this, and so
now I do and you're going to know it too.
That and so much more to stick around for. But
first and foremost, yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
That's just definally eat vanilla yeah, but right now we're
going to discuss Baba becoming a better ally.
Speaker 1 (01:20):
Baba and Today's Baba is sponsored by Unknown Union, the
fashion how situated at the intersection of meaning, innovation and culture.
From our info check Unknown Union dot com and Today's
Baba is reclaiming the term woke. I want to read
a little bit. This is from wu SF News. Civil
(01:41):
rights advocates are pushing back against Governor Ronda Santus' war
on woke ideology, and part of that struggle is reclaiming
the word quote. A lot of people are using the
term stay woke because a lot of people fell asleep
during the last election. This comes from Reverend Donal, an
associate pastor at Dothel Missionary Baptist Church in Tallahassee. The
(02:04):
Stay Woke protest, which is a fifteen city bus tour
across Florida, wrapped up recently. The tour kicked off on
Juneteenth in North Florida, who stops in Jacksonville and Tallahassee,
where a planned rally and press conference outside the state
capital was moved to Bethel. About fifty out of state
activist with the Transformative Justice Coalition and nonprofit that advocates
(02:27):
for Racial Justice traveled on a bus across the state
recently to meet with local community organizers and speak out
against recent policies affecting education, healthcare, and voting. Quote, isn't
it amazing that they're telling y'all to don't be woke?
Aren't you glad the Lord woke you up this morning?
Don't you know we serve a woke lord? Reverend RB
Homes of the Bethel Missionary Baptist Church told organizers gathered
(02:51):
downstairs in a fellowship hall. Goes on to say, the
opposite of woke is sleep, and once you start sleeping,
you will give into these policies. I think that's a
fantastic way of framing that position. I also want to
shout out the NAACP who has recently affirmed the use
of woke and is actively reclaiming it and not allowing
it to fall into the hands of the opposition. And
(03:13):
so well, can't stay woke, y'all can't even define well?
Thank you? Rod. All right, So back to the man
of the our Rocky tirade aka Jacob Rayford. We were
talking about being politically engaged, and we were using kind
of your story as an example, you mentioned uh, the
(03:34):
a c O you and working with the a c
O you, so I definitely want to lean into that first.
Speaker 3 (03:39):
I want to talk about if you don't mind, ye,
please go ahead. I do want to say real quick
before before we stray away from the politics stuff. It
is important if you can just take some time to
google after watching this episode what a precint committee person is.
That will be the pathway to you being involved in
political activities within your community.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
If you are upset, if you are tired of.
Speaker 3 (03:59):
Things going on in a way that you feel don't
represent your community, if you're looking for a way to
express yourself and you're still kind of, you know, not
necessarily intimidated, but like you know, self conscious about being
involved in political spaces, Google that and google your immediate
legislative district. If you don't know that, just google what
is my legislative district. You will pull up that information.
Just google your legislative district, Google PC you will be
(04:21):
directed to your legislative district. Email those people, tell them
who you are, the community that you come from, how
long you've lived there, and that you'd like to be involved.
And I can guarantee you for whatever rich reason. They
are going to reach out and they're going to bring
you into that fold, and you are going to be
politically empowered and be able to represent your communities in
this upcoming election and beyond. So before we go into
(04:41):
any other things, I do want to express that.
Speaker 1 (04:43):
So Okay, well, the man knows what he's talking about,
and I think that's a great segue into where I
was going next. So, as a result of your engagement,
you have recent been appointed by the governor or the
governor to the Commission for Appellate Court.
Speaker 3 (05:08):
So yeah, yeah, yeah, the Commission on the Appellate Court Appointments.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
So that's for like pelate sorry, no of learning.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
Yeah, So what I'm first spout out to do the
same thing because again there's certain types of information that
that is outside of you know, just our day to
day lives. I mean, who is going to be involved
in the judicial process, Like we all have schools and
you know, family and work and various day to day
tasks that takes away from this. But yeah, I was
appointed to the Commission on Appellate Court Appointments. So basically
(05:37):
what that is is this is the body and because
different states have different systems for appointing their judges and whatnot.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
But this is for the state of Arizona.
Speaker 3 (05:46):
What they do is for most of their judges, they
have a commission that that's those who are candidates for
judges for say the Court of Appeals.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
For what I'm a part of the Court of Appeals,
the Supreme Court.
Speaker 3 (05:59):
We through the the merit selection process that these these
people their backgrounds and determine if they are good enough
to be presented to the governor. And through this very
small select few, uh, the governor will decide which one
will you know, if this person will be appointed a
judge to say the Supreme Court of of of Arizona,
(06:21):
which is our highest core system in our state. So
for state law, that is really one of the most
impactful like bodies that you can be a part of.
And I'm saying I am an MC from Phoenix, Arizona.
I am a rapper. I'm in this space. It is
possible to do these things. So I like listening to
(06:43):
you tah, keeping.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Like okay, well the uh, these these positions and these
titles again for a person like me, Uh, you have
made it a lot more accessible. I again I mentioned
earlier that I know some people who have run campaigns,
people who've been elected, people have lost elections. I know
(07:07):
people who have really wanted to make changes, and on
both sides, believe it or not. You know, I have
some friends that a friend that ran for it was
attorney general and yeah, he's a friend of mine. It's
crazy he didn't make it. And he is a conservative
in the conservative individual. Yeah, but he ran with a
(07:27):
million dollar campaign, million plus dollar campaign. And so I
know that there's oftentimes the bigger operations, but in terms
of people who have been effective, you know, these people
get the little flash. You know, there's six or eight
people running for a position, and they all, you know,
end up with a debate at a library or something
(07:48):
like that, and then one person gets elected to do
the job, and then the other four or five people,
you know, just return to their private sector lives or whatever.
They go back to being, you know, whatever it is.
They hopefully they stay politically engaged. Hopefully, hopefully, what I'm
suggesting is that for folks who a don't want to
run a huge campaign like that, or b maybe they're
(08:11):
interested in doing something like that, but you know, there's
nothing comes of it. Those sorts of people could look
to you and see not only are you politically engaged,
but you're actually making some changes, and your political footprint
is growing to the degree or it's growing in such
a way that you're actually to affect changes, not unlike
(08:34):
a person who's run one of those huge campaigns. Your
name is big like that, not that people do this
for their own name. You know, who knows why people
do what they do. All I'm concerned with is are
you a good person? Or are you trying to create
policies and outcomes for people that are equitable for all communities.
But I do believe that there's more paths toward change
(08:58):
and successful political arena than just the traditional one that
monster that I write outlined in the in the first
part of the show. Now excuse me. The next thing
I want to touch on is you mentioned the a
c o U. Yeah, so let's lean into this a bit.
(09:19):
Jacob Brayford aka Rocky Tyrant. You are the VP of
the a c l U of Arizona and you are
on the board for the a c l U National
Committee in New York. So first off, let's start here.
What does that mean?
Speaker 3 (09:35):
So I'm for the a c o U, the American
Civil Liberty Liberties Union, which is an a hundred year
old organization that uh uh, through litigation work, through through
legal work, fights on behalf of those who civil rights have.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
Been violated throughout history. And and this, by the way,
this counts as far as I'm concerned as political engagement
as well. Yeah, yeah, I would say we I want
to stress before I get we are definitely in politically
impartial a political organization. It's just how things have developed
over the past you know, few or so odd years,
(10:12):
things have been kind of politicized inadvertently when it comes
to civil rights. You know, when you think of like
reproductive rights, reproductive justice, abortion rights, things that you know,
First Amendment rights. When it comes to like being able
to film the police and things of that nature, those
have become politicized. So if you want to look at
it from.
Speaker 3 (10:30):
That stance, Yeah, but we operate as a non political
party party. But you know, the a c o U
American Civil Liberties Union does. It's a historic organization that
has shown up throughout history and advocacy for civil liberty
and fighting for people's civil liberty and throughout the United States.
(10:51):
There is various affiliates and Arizona is no different. We
have a very effective, very powerful affiliate and we are
rate as our own organization, though we are in orbit
of the national ACLU. But you know, there's things that
are specific to our community. So we have an American
Civil Liberties Union of Arizona, of which I'm the vice
president of.
Speaker 1 (11:12):
Yeah. Man, So listen, you know we're talking earlier about
how you are international with the bars, you know what
I'm saying, and national and regional with the bars, but
also you know, VP of you know, the ACLU Arizona
board and then obviously on the board for the are
(11:34):
a messaying this right, VP of the ACLU of Arizona,
and on the board for the ACOL you National committee
in New York, right, Yeah, so I'm on the national board.
So you know what I'm saying. You're doing all and
everything else that we've outlined in today's show, and your platform,
your brand, your presence has been elevated, and your effectiveness
(11:59):
and sort of creating change and offering alternative paths toward
a more equitable society. You've been very effective toward that end.
And so I want to take a moment and talk
about one such incident. So I'm going to do another reading,
if I may. Let's talk about filming the police. You
(12:22):
mentioned a bition. Talk about that for a bit, all right,
I'm going to read from the Associated Press. This is
based in Phoenix, Arizona, but obviously the implications spread well
beyond date Arizona, even to your state. But it just
happened to take place here. And a person at the
helm of that was the person to my left here
in the studio. All right, the Associated Press. A federal
(12:44):
judge has ruled that an Arizona law limiting how close
people can get to recording law enforcement is unconstitutional. Well done, sir,
Well done, Rocky. I appreciate this. We talked about this
when they passed this law on the show, like, oh
my god, Arizona's trippin'. You can't stand more than things
like eight feet or something like that. Police fell, the police,
(13:07):
and they were trying to use it to engage police
to be able to arrest more people who were filming
them in their wrongdoing. And so I want to finish
reading this because I do want your full response. I mean,
I got to be mindful of the clock here, so
let me hearry you, all right, all right, the recording
law and oh sorry recording law enforcements on cars okay,
(13:29):
citing infringement against a clearly established right to film the
police doing their jobs. The ruling from US District Judge
John J. Tucci permanently blocks enforcement of the law that
he suspended last year. All right. The Republican backed law
was signed by former Republican Governor Doug Doucy in July
(13:50):
twenty twenty two, but enthusiasm for the restrictions faded and
legislators refused an opportunity to defend the law during an
initial court suspension. Republic Can State Senator John Cavanaugh, who
sponsored the measure, has said he was unable to find
an outside group to defend the legislation. The law would
have made it illegal to knowingly film police officers at
(14:12):
eight feet two and a half meters like I mentioned,
or closer if the officer tells the person to stop,
and on private profity sorry and on private property. An
officer who decides that someone is interfering or that the
area is unsafe could have ordered that person to stop filming,
even if the recording was being made with the owner's permission.
(14:33):
The law oh sorry quote law prohibits or chills a
substantial amount of First Amendment protected activity and is unnecessary
to prevent interference with police officers given other Arizona laws. Effect,
Tucci ruled a coalition of media groups and the ACLU
successfully sued to block the law. So, as the vice
(14:56):
president of the ACLU give us your thoughts verse.
Speaker 3 (15:00):
I want to say thank you very much to are
not only the the legal team here in Arizona, but
the legal team nationally, so big big shout out to
Ben Rundahl, Jery Keenan kan Bell and and you know,
even in terms of not only this but other cases
that they're currently involved in as well, such as the
(15:22):
uh one around the Fund for Empowerment, the the mistreatment
of the in house community. So that involves national legal
legal counsels such as Scout com Kadovic and Leah Watson
from ACOLU National. But this just really speaks to the
importance of engagement from our organizations around these issues that
(15:43):
impact our abilities to exercise our First Amendment right, you know,
our civil liberties. And so when it comes to this
specific case, I want to first extend my appreciation for
our legal team that was able to facilitate this and
the trust that we have between our board at the
ACEU of Arizona and our legal staff, because that allowed
(16:04):
me the comfort of being able to put everything down
in writing in terms of I'm starting to get emotional,
like the declaration which recounts everything that we experienced in
twenty twenty, and because of that that was then weaponized
against this heinous attempt at undermining our civil liberty and
(16:24):
you know, there's no choice but to move forward. Me
I was the person who put my experiences down as
the declaration in really the person outside of the ACOU
and the media conglomerates that we're pushing against this heinous
action and whatnot.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
So I mean that all of.
Speaker 3 (16:43):
Us working in concert resulted in just an amazing victory.
And as we see, this is not something that's so
absurd that it can't happen, because there's so many crazy
things that are taking place now, and to be completely honest,
we had all not collaborated, that probably would have gone
through because there's so many insane things that are taking place.
We have somebody running for president who is being hit
(17:06):
left and right like with indictments and collecting all the
indictments from different states like Thanos's rings and stuff like that.
Speaker 1 (17:13):
It is totally possible.
Speaker 3 (17:14):
And I feel that with us working a concert, we
secure that victory.
Speaker 1 (17:18):
Listen, man, I think that, and I know that there
are more victories and more stories here. But I think
that the conversation that we've had today, where we start
at the beginning, at least of our story. We know
each other being on the radio together, having you come
up on the show, drop some bars to obviously twenty twenty,
(17:42):
when we're you know, out in the streets with the
bullhorns and organized marching together or my sons are out
there with us. You know, it's just out of love,
and you know, showing love in front of all those people,
you know Finnish, showing solidarity in front of all those people,
because often enough you and I were you know, toward
the front lines or really at the front lines of
those things, not unintentional, you know for me at least,
(18:03):
and to now where you're holding these positions, you're creating
these changes. And one such change that we can point
to today which has implications, national implications, and establishes a
bit of like case precedent. And you know, I think
(18:24):
that you know, you mentioned, the ACLU argued that, you know,
this is a violation of civil liberties. These are, you know,
public servants. They are performing their duties using public funds
and seeing our money. Yeah, exactly, and on and on
and I you know, the way that the case was
made is very easy to make the case in other
places if there are attempts to prevent people from filming
(18:47):
the police. And you got to imagine, well.
Speaker 3 (18:49):
I'sna say as a direct response to the process that
we did. So we were so effective that the you know,
somebody's conservative lawmakers are like, okay, well we're going to
write a law that says you guys can't film police,
and you want to talk about what we're doing to
the community. So like that's a direct result of the
actions that That's exactly what I was going to say.
Speaker 1 (19:06):
So I don't imagine that police would push back against
something like that unless there was something to fear. I
don't imagine police would push back against something like that
unless they opposed consequences, unless they opposed reform, unless they
opposed the facts. Somehow, Opposing facts, I guess is a
(19:33):
thing people can do. But the facts are that you know,
black and brown bodies are mistreated at the hands of
police at a disproportionate rate, and our white brothers and
sisters not to say that they don't suffer at the
hands of the police as well. Police misconduct is a
very real concern for people that look like you, me,
and our children and future children. And that if we
(19:57):
are going to be compelled to pay taxes, and we
are going to be compelled to participate in a society
with UH which grants police so much power and gives
them a device to carry on their purpose on their
person whose only purpose is to end the life. I'm
(20:17):
talking about a gun that that device, the only that
is to end the life. You don't carve wood with it,
you don't make dinner.
Speaker 3 (20:27):
With the one that's on their dominant side of the
trained instinctively go for instead of their taser.
Speaker 1 (20:30):
Yeah, yeah, that's to end the life, that one. So,
if we're going to give these folks this type of power,
to ask for a modicum of count accountability, to ask
for a bit of UH leeway to capture the events
to help us tell our stories and substantiate our claims
(20:51):
is not unreasonable. However, when you see the pushback, you
recognize that the resistance to what is absolutely logical. That
resistance is real, and it is people who hold elected office.
(21:12):
It's people who are politically engaged. It's people who are
active in the political arena, or in their communities, or
however you want to say this. It's those people that
are the real thin black line. We'll call it in
our case specifically, but you know, our brown, Indigenous lgbt
Q I A plus aap I, you know, on and
(21:34):
on and on Native, you know, all of us who
will call it the Rainbow coalition. And indeed, our white
brothers and sisters are Caucasian brothers and sisters who have
been affected by some of these systemic issues. Political engagement
of good people who recognize that there is a more
(21:58):
equitable world on the other side of that political engagement.
Those are the people that really make the change. And
so to that end, I appreciate you popping in being
a living, breathing example of that. And of course this
particular instance because as I mentioned, when this when the
news broke, you know, Q and I were like, oh
my god, you can't film the police, you know, and
(22:20):
we talked about on this show. We've talked about these
maneuvers that police will do. You know, Okay, a person
is getting arrested or apprehended or being questioned or something
like that, and there's a couple of police there, and
then the police will drive their vehicle, you know, those
(22:40):
big suv police SUVs. They'll drive the vehicle in between
the person filming and the person being detained. They will
block them with their bodies. You know, Hey, you guys
can't be here. You know, I'm trying to film. Well,
you can't be here, you know, and they'll just stand
in the way and you just seeing them.
Speaker 3 (22:56):
It's accountability and intimidation. So it's a case in point,
like when we one that case. Not too long after that,
I started receiving you know, harassment calls from private numbers
and sure death threats and exact nature.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (23:08):
So I mean, and these are things that I totally
forgot about because we haven't had that experience in twenty twenty,
you know, in all sorts of nonsense that came from that.
But you know, it's various levels of intimidation factors that
in ways to obstruct us from impede us from being
able to exercise our right and hold people accountable.
Speaker 1 (23:24):
That we pay for with our tax dollars. Yeah, and
I think that that, above all else is the best
way to look at it. You know, we're paying with
tax dollars, and so it's up to us to hold
these people accountable and to define what their outcomes should
be and what their objectives should be. This is they
(23:45):
don't participate in free market capitalism. So there is no
alternative to policing that will win out because it gets
you know, more patronage. This is it. We're paying with
it with tax dollars, and this is kind of the
best that we This is the best way to engage
in the process.
Speaker 3 (24:03):
I do want to say that I know we're running
out of time, but a good alternative is what's being
exercised with our Advocation Advocacy movement with the Alternative to
Police program called the Neighborhood Organized Crisis Assistance Program, which
is for constructing a first responder department that houses behavioral health,
substance abusey in the house, community victimist, non violent dispatches.
That's something we have been pushing since around the end
(24:24):
of twenty twenty and actually the City of Tempe is
incorporating some of these ideas into their Care seven and
Hope program right now. So a good alternative is to
create a new first responder apartment. It is completely possible
to do it. There are myriad types of dispatches that
your law enforcement agency just doesn't want to take and
(24:44):
doesn't have the capacity when it comes to work culture
to be able to engage within the first place.
Speaker 1 (24:48):
So a good alternative is that, and we can always
talk about that another time. Okay, where can folks get information?
So you can google something?
Speaker 3 (24:56):
Yeah, google no CAP, Neighborhood Organized Crisis Assistance Program, Google CAHOOTS,
Whitebird Clinic. That's probably the best route because that is
where some of these ideas came from in the first place.
Take that center that around what your community needs and
create a first responder system through those processes. So I think, yeah, all.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
Right, perfect. So with that in mind, it is pastime
for the Way Black History Fact. We're going to get
into this real quick, so stay with me. Today's Way
Black History Fact is sponsored by a underground beach club
from the streets to the beach. For the latest in
beachwere visit Underground Beachclub dot com. All right, black people
were denied vanilla ice cream and the Jim Crow South
except on Independence Day. Michael T. Twitty wrote this, and
(25:37):
this comes from The Guardian. By custom rather than by law,
black folks were best off if they weren't caught eating
vanilla ice cream in public, and the Jim Crow South
except the narrative always stipulates on the fourth of July.
I heard it from my father growing up myself, and
the memory of that all but unspoken rule seems to
be unique to the generation born between World War One
and World War Two. But if my Angelo had said
(26:00):
it in our classic autobiography, I know why the cage
bird sings, I doubt anybody would believe it. Today. People
in Stamps used to say that the whites in our
town were so prejudiced that a Negro couldn't buy vanilla
ice cream except on the fourth Other days he had
to be satisfied with chocolate vanilla ice cream flavored with
a Nautole spice indigenous Mexico, the cultivation of which was
(26:22):
improved by an enslaved black man named Edmund Albius on
the colonized Reunion Island in the Indian Ocean, now predominantly
grown on the largest island of the African continent in
Madagascar and served wrapped in the conical invention of a
Middle Eastern immigrant, was the symbol of the American dream.
That is, pure white sweetness was then routinely denied to
(26:48):
the grandchildren of the enslaved. Was a dream deferred. Indeed,
what makes the vanilla ice cream story less spoke memory
and more truth is that the terror and shame of
living in the purgatory between the Civil War and the
Civil Rights movement was often communicated in ways that reinforced
the children what the rules of life were and what
was in store for them if they broke them. My
(27:09):
father again, this is Michael T. Twitty reading this. He says,
my father, for instance, first learned the rules when he
first visited South Carolina with my grandfather in the nineteen forties.
In our family's home county of Lancaster, Daddy asked the
general store owner if he could buy some candy and
ice cream, referring to the white man as sir. The
store owner promptly grabbed my father by the collar and
(27:29):
yelled at him in the presence of my grandfather then
informed the elder man, you better teach this little in
word to say ya sa boy. Surre ain't good enough.
My grandfather grabbed his son and sped off. The late
poet Audrey Lord had a similar narrative to Angelo's in
her own autobiography, Sammy A new spelling of my name.
(27:50):
She visited Washington, d C. With her family as a
child around Independence Day and her parents wanted to treat
her to vanilla ice cream at a soda shop. They
were buffed by the waitress and refused service. She expressed
disappointment at her family and sisters for not decrying the
act as anything but anti American. She summed up the event.
(28:11):
The waitress was white, the counter was white, and the
ice cream I never ate in Washington, DC that summer
I left childhood was white. And the white heat and
the white pavement, and the white pavement and white stone
monuments of my first Washington summer made me sick to
my stomach for the rest of the trip. Why were
black people allowed vanilla ice cream on the fourth of July?
(28:34):
Why then? After all? In eighteen fifty two, Frederick Douglas
Rallied against the idea of celebrating American's independence when blacks
did not have their full God given freedom quote, what
do what to the American slave. Is your fourth of July?
Asked Douglas of his audience, when invited to speak in
commemoration of the day. I answer, A day that reveals
to him, more than all other days in the year,
(28:56):
the gross injustice and cruelty, to which is a constant victim.
To him, your celebration is a sham. Your boasted liberty
and unholy licensed, your national greatness swelling vanity. Your sounds rejoicing,
sounds of rejoicing, sorry, are empty and heartless. Your denunciations
of tyrants brass fronted impudence. Your shouts of liberty and
(29:17):
equality hollow mockery. Your prayers empty and you and heartless.
Your sermons and thanksgivings, with all your religious parade and solemnity,
are to him more bombast, fraud, deception, and piety and hypocrisy.
It then failed to cover up crimes which would disgrace
(29:37):
the nation of savages. Was that, somehow the purpose of
allowing the denied ice cream cone. What is a pacifier?
Speaker 3 (29:44):
Was it a.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
Message that to us, as long as we obeyed the rules,
we could still be occasionally rewarded with just enough to
keep us patriotic and loyal but perhaps it's pointless to
ask for more context. The period during which African Americans
were not allowed to epnilla ice cream tells us a
lot about where this this memory is located in time,
a period of great progress driven by Black Americans themselves.
(30:05):
It was a time when our forefathers fought for this country,
and when our four mothers organized marches to protest lynching,
when the mass migration from the South to the North
took place, and when labor organizations became vehicles for early
pressures the civil rights for black life in America. The
period from being born at the end of reconstruction through
(30:26):
the full entrenchment of jen Crow was firmly on its
way out. That period of time also represented a closing
up the gates of emigration from Europe, the slow rise
of the United States as a world power, and the
increasing unification of the idea and principles of whiteness. In
nineteen ten, for instance, white did not even did not
mean Italian, Jewish, Greek, Polish, or any variety of other
(30:46):
ethnicities we now unequivocally associate with privilege. It was instead,
still a term largely reserved for the Old Americans, those
of northwest western European stock, but that changed, at least
for some of the Europeans who wound up on America's shores.
In the south, in particular, a new ethnic white quickly
did all they could to assimilate and then affirm their whiteness.
To not do so was death, as demonstrated by the
(31:08):
lynchings of Sicilians in Louisiana and the lynchings of the
lynching of Leo Frank who was Jewish in Georgia. In
the pre war decades, little things took on outside meanings,
and each was another way to differentiate between those who
belonged and those who were barely tolerated. Perhaps the memory
of being denied vanilla ice cream is not a literal
memory for most, MIMI is just commentary. There is fantastic
(31:31):
power in this fascinating memory of Jim Crow life because
it calls our attention to the deeper psychological consequences of
legalized racism in American life. The racism of the time
period was not just about dignity and self esteem. It
was embodied and mythologized in physical terms. So in a way,
the denial of vanilla and its symbolic promise was not
(31:54):
so bad after all. Indeed, satisfaction with chocolate is now
emblematic of people of color being supported by and being
self sufficient in their own communities. Without this exact satisfaction
in our own sense of beauty, worth, mind, and purpose,
without having learned to live without Manila, we would have
never thought to change the world. And that is going
(32:16):
to do us do it for us here on Civic Cypress.
Once again, I'd like to thank you, thank for tuning
in once again. I'm your host rams this jah big
shout out to q Ward, who will be back next
week fresh off of his flight from Italy to get
down and dirty with this warm again, I'd like to
thank you, of course, Rocky Hja Jacob Rayford for checking
(32:37):
in with us. I'm doing a favorite drop your social
media's and any music or any tours or anything like that.
Speaker 3 (32:42):
Yeah, I mean I just got off tour. I've just
been in the Space Coast Events tour over in Europe.
So I just got back maybe about a week and
a half ago, so that was great. But yeah, more
upcoming music right around the corner. Stay tuned for that.
But Rocky Ta raid r o q y t y
R aid on all social media platforms for those wanting
more things it around political and advocacy work.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
That is mister j A C O B R A
I F O R D all right on Twitter and
until next week, y'all peas.
Speaker 2 (33:11):
Y'all like yo, we handle live these brothers a fabulous
our lady showing you where bomb travel live SPI tones
from sunlight to move, busting on stage like then fights
and move roll my mic back. You're like that journalist
with journalists too. We can strike back all borders with
waters from headquarters behind in, the beline sides up and
(33:33):
the borders, the press passing.
Speaker 1 (33:34):
We bring it to you as it happens.
Speaker 2 (33:36):
The streets love popping from music, you're wrapping the street
compand the slash pe xpando. You're gonna fight the stand
up with the proper propaganda.
Speaker 1 (33:44):
What's happening. It's how you've got any questions and ask
if Deduce is just a TV show you're passing?
Speaker 2 (33:49):
And this from a white wartime journalist headlines, wait, y'all
prehis and recess like this like what like this like
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