February 25, 2023 • 33 mins
The first and second halves of today’s show are a recap of our recent visit to Washington D.C. to the National Museum of African American History and Culture. In short, it was incredible! Also, discussed is our visit to Norfolk State University, and a spotlight of Benjamin Banneker on our Way Black History Fact!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
And now.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
Go my mic back like that, Jime, we just strike
borders with waters from headquarters behind him and the border.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
If you're just tuning in to civic cipher, I'm your host,
Ramsy's Jah.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
He is ramses Jah, I am q Ward. You are
once again tuning into civic.
Speaker 1 (00:21):
Cypher, indeed, and we are taking you through our uh
experience at the National Museum of African American History and Culture.
We will continue that in just a bit, uh, so
stay tuned for that as well as the way Black
History Fact. Today we were talking about Benjamin Banneker, the
(00:43):
individual who was charged with designing Washington, d C. And
us having spent some time in d C seeing how
it's laying out, seeing the building, the old buildings, and
knowing that there was black hands that built those buildings,
there's definitely something we're excited to shore with you on
today's episode as well. But like we always do it,
(01:05):
this time, let's discuss becoming a Better Ally. Babbab Today
is BOBA sponsored by Major Threads for the finest in
men's athletic were check majorthreads dot com and for today's
become a Better Ally blah blah, we would like for
you to take a virtual tour. As much as we
can talk about this, we recognize that radio is very
(01:31):
different from other media, and we can't show you pictures
but you can't see them online. We can't show you videos,
but you can't see them online. And of course there's
nothing that will talk actually being there and feeling, you know,
the weight, and having a change and move through you.
But I wanted to recommend a few museums that we know,
(01:55):
we work with, and I think they're wonderful for you
to visit. So first up course is the one we're
talking about today, the National Museum of African American History
and Culture. Of course you can find that online, but
if you have a pan or otherwise able to write
it down, it's n M A HC dot SI dot edu.
I know it's a bit wordy, but Google will get
(02:17):
you there. M's National Museum of African American History and Culture,
SI of Courses, Smithsonian Institute and Edu, so if you
need to remember it that side. The other is the
National Civil Rights Museum. I want to send a big
shout out to doctor Russell Wigington, who's a friend of ours,
friend of the show. He's the curator of that museum,
(02:38):
and that is the Lorraine Motel in Memphis, Tennessee, where
doctor King was shot and killed, and you can do
a virtual tour there at Civil Rights Museum dot org.
So I would love for you to check that one
out too. We think that you can become a better
ally by doing that. And of course the National Museum
(02:58):
of African American Music, Henry Hicks is a curator. They
are another good friend of the show, and you can
find out more at NAAM dot org. So please educate yourselves.
All right, So back to the National Museum of African
American History and Culture. So we were discussing the paradox
(03:18):
of liberty, and that's a strange point in the journey, right,
Slavery is still happening again, the museum is laid down
in chronological order, so slavery is still happening. But now
there's a declaration of independence for this country. This country
is now not the thirteen original colonies, nowadays a separate nation.
(03:42):
And as they write this declaration of independence, and as
indeed they write their constitution, they meaning the founding fathers,
who all have statues on this exhibit that we're standing
in front of, are being extremely hypocritical. Again, it's the
(04:05):
paradox of liberty, that's what it's called. They are explaining
exactly what it is that is inalienable, exactly what it
is that they want, what they refuse to tolerate, so
forth and so on. But they'll turn right around later
in the day and impose their will on other human beings.
(04:34):
And of course at this point now it's race based
slavery in the United States. It's not slavery just for
the sake of slavery. No, all the black people are
slaves or subject to slavery. None of the white people, right,
indentured servitude, you know, that sort of thing is fine,
(04:55):
But you cannot be a slave if you're white, not
in the way that black people are. No one's going
to buy you and sell you. That's not you know,
you have rights. Still. So we spent some time there
at that exhibit, and I know that one was kind
of a big deal to you.
Speaker 3 (05:17):
The thing that stood out most to me about this
entire moment we spent in the museum is that even
those participating in this moment in history couldn't help but
to point out the hypocrisy themselves. This didn't stop them
(05:40):
from perpetuating it. But even they noticed this is kind
of weird, But it goes back to commodifying us. No,
this stuff that we're talking about us for men. Yeah,
these rights and freedoms, this is for men. Those aren't men,
(06:03):
those aren't people. That's our property. This is strengthening our
right to our property. It's freedoms that all men are
promised are helping us boaster the subjugation of our commodities
over here. It's necessary for us to do this to
protect ourselves and our property, not their homes. And I
(06:30):
was going to say not their cattle, but I think
they very very much considered us very similar yea to
their cattle. And again we make note of the speed
or lack thereof with regard to progress in this country.
(06:52):
We can't pretend we haven't made any that's right, but
we can be insulted by It's like it's stopped at
some point. Yeah, got to a point where things were
just good enough, and that passion to fight for more.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
Seemingly dissipated. We're not around here, all right, So we
move on, and you you know, it continues telling the story.
Now obviously it's it's its own country. It's the United
States of America, now, you know. And then slaves. Of course,
(07:28):
it's illegal to teach people who are black to read
and write. That didn't stop black people from learning and
leaving behind stories, and so some of these stories are
in the museum, and so you get a glimpse into
what life is like as a slave. I remember there's
like an audio recording of a woman who was recalling
(07:53):
what it feels like to be at a slave auction,
and she's like, you know, I'm standing there naked and
these white, strange white men they come up to me
and they grab on my naked body and they feel
on me, and then they grab my head and then
they roll my eyes up so they can see the
(08:14):
whites of my eyes, and then they pull my lips
down to look at my teeth, and then they turn
my head side to side and they examine, you know,
my body, and then they bid on me. And everyone
is watching while this is happening. And there's another quote
(08:38):
exerpt from a writer. Her name is Elizabeth Freeman, and
this is very powerful when you see it, you know,
when you see how they've presented it to the to
the visitor of the museum, then you kind of get
a little bit more of the weight of it. But
it says, if one minute's freedom had been offered to me,
(08:59):
and I had been told I must die at the
end of that minute, I would have taken it. So
that gives you a sense of exactly what these human
beings were dealing with. One minute of freedom and I
had to die at the end of it, I would
have taken it. There's a lot to be said about her,
(09:24):
but actually, you know what, I'll share a story she
deserves for you to know about her. Elizabeth Freeman, known
as Mum Bette, was born into slavery and was one
of the first people to successfully sue for her freedom
in the New Nation. Freeman was a Revolutionary war widow
enslaved by John Ashley, a powerful Massachusetts attorney. When she
(09:46):
overheard a discussion about the Massachusetts Constitution, she seized on
its guarantee of liberty to bring her lawsuit. Her claim
to freedom changed her life and helped en slavery in Massachusetts.
So that's who who said that if she had lived
one minute free and then died at the individual would
(10:07):
take it. Then. Other popular names to those of us
who have been able to learn a little bit about
our history. We learned a little bit about Nat Turner.
If you don't know about Nat Turner, he's a person
who's perhaps mostly known for a slaver volte and you
(10:32):
take it by force, you know, And it's important to
know his name. You know, a lot of non black
people will look at him and be like, well, he
was killing white folks, and I don't know that that
was his mission as much as it was killing the enslavers.
But Nat Turner is not a bad guy. He's a person.
(10:54):
He's a human being who sought his customary freedom, as
any creature or endowed with consciousness may seek to do.
One of the things that was really special that we
got to see is Harriet Tubman's handkerchief and her hymnal.
(11:18):
I have no idea how the museum has this, but
it's there and it tells, you know, the story about
Harriet Tubman and to be that close to that type
of history, you know, and you might not think that's
that special handkerchief, you know what I mean, that's what
(11:39):
is that? A hymnal? That what is that? But think
about you know, these are human beings that weren't allowed
to own anything, you know what I'm saying. So anything
they left behind, anything that these echoes of the past
means so much to us. You know, they they matter,
and they don't have a there's no worth to it.
It's it's priceless to us us to not touch it,
(12:02):
not own it. To stand next to Harriet Tubman's handkerchief,
that felt very special to me. And again, I hope
that one day you will go and visit and learn
about your people if you're black, or your brothers and
(12:22):
sisters if you're not.
Speaker 3 (12:25):
There's probably very few experiences in your life that would
be worth your time more.
Speaker 1 (12:31):
Than this one than this one. Yeah, and it doesn't matter.
I remember I saw a man there. He was a
older white man. This was right around the Harriet Tubman
thing where shoot or handkerchief was And I saw him
there and he didn't know me. I didn't know him,
but we were kind of in the same traveling group.
(12:52):
We had just gone through the slavery exhibit, and you know,
so now it's just like, look, man, we're all in
this together, right, that feeling is there. I saw he
was really taking it in and I and I and
I didn't grab him, but I kind of like touched
him and I was like, hey man, And remember he's old,
gray hair. He looked like like a like a politician, lawmaker, whatever,
(13:16):
you know, one of those type of people, right, And
I'm like, hey man, I just want to say thank
you for coming to this. And he's like, you're thanking
me for coming to this And I was like, yes, man,
I don't suppose that you have to be here. I
don't suppose suppose that if you don't want any of
(13:38):
this stuff to mean anything to you, then it won't.
Speaker 3 (13:41):
Do you think he was American because when he started
talking back to you, he seemed to have a bit
of an accent maybe maybe, and he also seemed gracious.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:53):
Yeah, I caught off guard initially because he said it
out loud, you're thanking me yet, But I think as
he started to understand the gravity of why you were
expressing that, that it hit him in a way too.
And that was one of many interactions that stood out
on that day.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
So, I mean, it means a lot to me, Like
I'm not what is it a thing? I'm not a woman,
but I do my best to be a supportive of
women's issues as I can be. It just so happens
to be the case that I'm black. But if I
was not black, I would be very supportive of black
(14:34):
people because I recognize that there's forces that artificially suppress
what would otherwise be the trajectory of black life, culture
experiences in this country, you know what I mean. And
so anybody who steps outside of their comfort zone to
(14:55):
help someone else, I love that because I think that
I'm that type of person, and so it's really easy
for me to thank folks who are not black in
the Black History Museum. Okay, So moving on, I wanted, Oh,
there's a wall there with it like a quote etched
(15:19):
into it. It's from Maya Angelo. It says, bringing the
gifts that my ancestors gave, I am the dream and
the hope of the slave. So now we're kind of
moving away from slavery, past the Civil War, and there's
(15:46):
where another etch on the wall. There another phrase etched
into the wall, and it's what we call it the
Black National Anthem, but it's lift every voice and sing.
And something special happened because we walked past it and
there was a group of people who had just walked
up to it, and so we're we're on a different level,
(16:09):
but it's in kind of an open area, so we're
not with them at all, but we heard them singing
it down there. It's a group of maybe three four
women and it's a museum, mind you, very quiet in there.
But the blackest thing ever happened, right they started to
(16:32):
sing The lyrics are on the wall. They started to
sing it, right, And so we're up at the top,
me and Q and we had our partner, Crystal Us.
He was filming, so we're up there, so we're they
needed some bass they need yeah, so we started We
started to join in and sing, lift every voice and
(16:54):
sing with them. It's there's no music, there's nothing, it's
just it. If you this is such a difficult show
for me to do. Man, I'm doing my best. You guys,
thank you for listening. I normally have it, but this
is a lot. They started singing, so we started singing,
and then other people started singing. And in this giant
(17:17):
open space where people are having this experience, the acoustics
were fantastic. Yes, and we're just singing this song and
people are joining in and nobody's shushing us. It was
very very black experience. I'm grateful that that happened in
my life.
Speaker 3 (17:34):
I just noticed the last part that you said, no
one had a problem with us singing, and it's very sacred,
very quiet, very revered space. Not only did no one
have a problem with it, but it helps it. Yeah,
you know, more and more people would stop and lend
their voice to us.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
It was I would guess that that wasn't the first
time that's ever happened, and I would guess that's not
the last time that's going to happen. You know, this
history that we talk about is very difficult, but I
wouldn't trade it for the world is beautiful. I'm so
(18:16):
proud of these people that had short lives. So anyway,
now we're talking about segregation. So you know, there's all
these signs. They actually have the signs, you know, the
waiting rooms for whites only by order of the police department.
(18:41):
You know, we went into a train. There's an actual
train that was a segregated a train car train car,
so you get a chance to see what the white
part of the train section look like, in the white bathrooms,
and where the white people put their luggage and how
their seats are set up and then the black part
of the train car and how it's very different and
(19:03):
very small. Course it's not equal, and I'm sure you
would assume that, but we had a chance to go
through a period I don't want to say period. Correct,
it's like the literal train car that was restored, and
so we had a chance to check that out as well.
(19:24):
And then right after that came the Emmett Till exhibit,
because this was the precursor to the Civil rights movement
for those that don't know when Emmett Til died, that
kind of supercharged the civil rights movement and that that
came in the sixties in the United States. And that
(19:46):
one was very difficult. So c why don't you take
this one? Because I'm running out of steam here. That's
why there's two of us on this show. I don't
want to be crying in front of y'all.
Speaker 3 (20:01):
Very recently, the sequel to Black Panther came out, and
I actually got invited to a private screening for that film,
and afterwards I was talking to a journalist about what
I thought the director's intentions were with how we should
feel when we saw that movie. Because the reviews were mixed,
some people were disappointed, some people were upset. Some people
(20:23):
were even angry for reasons that didn't make much sense
to me, but you know, people have their reasons. There
is a scene in that movie, however, when the daughter
of the queen is taken on a mission, and the
queen really insisted that she not be taken, insisted that
(20:45):
she not go because the worst possible outcomes she knew
she would not be able to bear. And somehow that
moment in watching that film reminded me of him. It
tills story and his mother not wanting him to go
(21:07):
and visit his relatives in the South because it was
not a mystery how black people were treated all over
the country, but more specifically.
Speaker 1 (21:19):
In the South.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
And I'm going to intentionally avoid the details of how
immit Till was murdered. Google im Mittel, read his story,
say his name. Look at the face of a child
that never got to be older than the picture that
you're going to see when you google him. He's probably
(21:42):
fourteen years old on that picture that you're going to see.
Speaker 1 (21:48):
But his mother is such capital gene. His mother.
Speaker 3 (21:58):
Admitted some things that she never really had to right,
that she was dismissive, almost of the trouble of black
people in the South, like that's their problem, it's not
ours kind of thing, And she admitted after losing her
son that she'd taken a very callous and kind of
(22:22):
selfish approach to the plight of the Southern blacks. That
she had a much different experience in Chicago where she lived,
But she made the heroic, selfless decision for in its
funeral to be open casket so that people could see
(22:45):
the gruesome, disgusting and terrifying way this child was murdered
and that they would all have to feel and reconcile
with not just the injustice, but the inhumane treatment of
people that looked like us in this country at the time.
(23:07):
And we walked into to this exhibit where there were
no photos allowed, and saw this small casket intended for
a child, and really collectively had to figure out how
to emotionally reconcile and continue through the museum, because I
don't think we were prepared when we turned that corner
(23:28):
for there to be.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
A casket in there. What we're going to see And
if you walked up close enough, you can see him.
Speaker 3 (23:36):
You could see the photograph of his face, and that
I personally was not prepared for. And that's all that
we have time for today. But suffice to say, the
museum goes on. There's lots of joyous, wonderful things there
as well, lots of more history, and our hope is
(24:00):
that you'd make the time, you take the trip and
you learn, so please do.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
But now it's time for the Way Black History Fact.
Today's Way Black History Effect is sponsored by the Black
Information Network Daily Podcast, and today's reading comes from white
Househistory dot Org. As promised, we're talking about Benjamin Banneker,
so I will read. Benjamin Banneker, a free African American
(24:30):
man living in a slave state in the eighteenth century,
never knew the weight of iron shackles or the crack
of an overseer's whip. A native of Baltimore County, Maryland,
his experience everged from those of most African Americans living
in the early United States. Received a formal education during
his youth, maintained his property and farm as an adult,
and parlayed his intellectual gifts into national prestige. Despite his
(24:53):
many accomplishments, however, Banneker was forced to navigate the same
racial prejudices that African Americans often faced in both slave
and free states. In many ways, history is a historical anomaly.
He assisted with the initial survey of Washington, d c,
published abolitionist material south of the Mason Dixon line, and
engaged with some of the country's founders in a way
(25:14):
no black man had before. However, Banneker's life also reflects
the defining paradox of the early United States. It's that
word again, paradox, a land of freedom and opportunity with
insurmountable racial qualifiers which the nation's capital would come to embody.
Born on November ninth, seventeen thirty one, Banneker grew up
on a one hundred acre tobacco farmed owned by his parents,
(25:36):
a formerly enslaved man and the daughter of a mixed
race couple, along the Patapsco River in the area now
known as Oela. As African American homesteaders, the family experienced
not just freedom, but also a quintessentially American vision of
independence and economic self determination that was rarely possible for
non whites. Still, the color of their skin alienated them
(25:57):
from the community of nearby farmers. Amid a rising tide
of sentiment against free blacks in the colonies, Bannaker's family
had to tread lightly in their own neighborhood. Nevertheless, Benjamin
received in education it was uncommon, not just for his race,
before his geographic location, where literacy was relatively low. His grandmother,
an Irish born former indentured servant, taught him how to
(26:17):
read and write, and Benjamin continued his studies alongside both
white and black classmates at a one room school nearby.
His hunger for knowledge went beyond the classroom. In his
early twenties, Bannikers gained local admiration by hand carving wooden
clock that kept perfect time. He had studied the gears
of a pocket watch to master the mechanics. There would
not have been many clocks in rural Maryland in the
(26:39):
mid eighteenth century, and Bannickers was later referred to as
one of the curiosities of the wild region. Though Bannaker
hosted many visitors who came to see the clock, it
took him years to find an intellectual community. In seventeen
seventy one, the Ellicotts, a Quaker family from Pennsylvania, moved
to Baltimore County and established a gristmill just a few
miles down the road from Banner's tobacco farm. Perhaps owing
(27:01):
to his reputation as a man of letters or due
to his curiosity about construction of the mill, Bannacker soon
connected with his new neighbors, in particular George Ellicott, a
land surveyor with a passion for astronomy, who loaned Bannaker
technical books and lunar tables. Bannicer had already sold off
some of his land to finance his retirement, and since
he was spending less time on the farm, he quickly
mastered the discipline. In seventeen eighty nine, the year he
(27:25):
turned fifty eight, he forecast his first eclipse. Meanwhile, the
stars were aligning for Banneker on Earth. On July sixteenth,
seventeen ninety, Congress passed the Residents Act, establishing a new
Federal City city to be constructed along the Potomac River.
President George Washington appointed three commissioners to oversee its construction,
(27:45):
and Andrew Ellicott, George's cousin, was brought on as practical engineer,
Needing assistance on the project, and with his unusual associates
otherwise occupied, sorry with his usual associates otherwise occupied, Andrew
invited Banneker to join him in out the future seat
of the federal government. It was the first time in
his life Banneker ventured more than ten miles from his own.
(28:06):
Letters from Elicott show that in February seventeen ninety one,
he set out with Banneker and several field laborers for
Jones Point, Virginia to applot the boundary lines of the
nascent federal city. Because of his age, health and the
harsh winter climate, Banneker's primary responsibilities were in the observatory tent,
where he maintained the regulator clock using a series of
thermometers and a transit altitude instrument. Each day, Elicott would
(28:30):
use the regular clock to set his own time piece,
which he would use to determine latitude. At night, Bannaker
would record astronomical observe observations. He was paid two dollars
a day for his work, less than Ellicott's five dollars,
but commiserate with salary for an assistant surveyor. At that time,
President Washington and Secretary of State Thomas Jefferson, whose seventeen
(28:53):
eighty five book Notes on the State of Virginia stated
that people of African descent were intellectually inferior to whites.
We're oh sorry, We're aware of Banneker's participation. Meanwhile, an
article about the survey in the Georgetown Weekly Ledger praised
Banneker's abilities. Ellicott is attended by Benjamin Banneker and Ethiopian,
(29:13):
whose abilities as surveyor and an astrono armer clearly proved
that mister Jefferson's concluding that race of men were void
of mental endowments was without foundation. And that's a quote
from the Georgetown Weekly Ledger. On April fifteen, seventeen ninety one,
the Commissioners, Ellicott, and spectators took part in a ceremony
(29:36):
at Jones Point to install the first of four stone
markers that would mark the corners of the Federal District.
While Banneker was not mentioned in any of the reports
from that day, he undoubtedly would have attended. In April
seventeen ninety two, about a year after Banneker returned to
his farm, Washington's appointed Commissioners initiated the practice of renting
enslaved laborers from their owners for capitol building projects, mostly
(29:58):
to cut labor costs work of enslaved people thus underguided
the construction of the capital, whose territory Banneker had helped survey,
from the clearing and paving of roads, to the quarrying
and transporting of stone, to the building of the White
House and the Capitol building. A free black man who
(30:20):
was self made, who was surveying the future capital would
seem to align with the American ideals of individual individualism
and equal opportunity. But the epic construction projects for which
Banneker helped paint, plant the first stake were carried out
heavily on the backs of enslaved laborers people of common
descent who were explicit explicitly denied those ideals. In this sense,
(30:44):
Banneker lived at the center of conflicting stories about the
founding of the United States, a contradiction that Washington, DC epitomized. Moreover,
his interactions with whites, from abolitionists like Rittenhouse to a
slave owner like Jefferson, showed that even free blacks never
escaped the finds of race. While he was right. While
he has rightfully been held up as an example of
(31:05):
African American excellence, Bannicker's presence at this ideological crossroad and
its persistence through it also makes his story definitively American,
with no qualifiers warranted, and so we thought that that
was also important to share. And of course the Museum,
(31:29):
or sorry, the National Museum of African American History and Culture,
has quite a bit to say about him as well,
because it's based in DC, which of course is where
Banneker is now most known for making an impact on
his country, and that among many other reasons. You know,
(31:50):
the exhibit on the red Tails, the exhibit on the
Civil Rights movement, the BLM movement, the music, the food,
the fashion, all of it is there and the contributions
are immense, and I really do hope that you get
a chance to see it. But that's going to do
it for us here on Civic Cipher. So once again
(32:10):
i'm your host. Rams's joh he is joh I am
q Ward. Thank you to the Smithsonian for having us.
We can't wait to go back because the few hours
we spent there just wasn't enough, not at all.
Speaker 3 (32:24):
So we're looking forward to visiting again in the very
very near future.
Speaker 1 (32:28):
Yeah, and you know, they told us that it takes
two days to see everything. They said that you won't
get out of there in less than five hours and
they were right on both accounts. So for those of
you who feel like you have that there's something missing
or maybe you want to know more. Either way, check
(32:49):
it out. And with that said, I think comment website
civicipher dot com follows on all social media at civic
side for download, listening previous episode and until next week.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
Y'all y'all like yo, we had to live these brothers
a fabulous our lady showing you where Rob travel li
w spe tones from sunlight to mold, busting on stage
like gonna fights the mole row my mic back. You're
like that journalist with journalists too, we can strike back
called borders with waters from head borders behind in, the
(33:27):
beline sides up and the borders the press passing. We
bring it to you as it happens, the streets love
popping from music and wrapping the street compand the slash
peak expando. You're gonna fight the slander with the proper propaganda.
What's happenings? How you got any questions to ask in
the news? Its just a TV show you're passing? And
this from a white wartime journalist headlines, Wait got prepis
(33:50):
and recess like this like what like this, like
And now.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
Go my mic back like that, Jime, we just strike
borders with waters from headquarters behind him and the border.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
If you're just tuning in to civic cipher, I'm your host,
Ramsy's Jah.
Speaker 3 (00:16):
He is ramses Jah, I am q Ward. You are
once again tuning into civic.
Speaker 1 (00:21):
Cypher, indeed, and we are taking you through our uh
experience at the National Museum of African American History and Culture.
We will continue that in just a bit, uh, so
stay tuned for that as well as the way Black
History Fact. Today we were talking about Benjamin Banneker, the
(00:43):
individual who was charged with designing Washington, d C. And
us having spent some time in d C seeing how
it's laying out, seeing the building, the old buildings, and
knowing that there was black hands that built those buildings,
there's definitely something we're excited to shore with you on
today's episode as well. But like we always do it,
(01:05):
this time, let's discuss becoming a Better Ally. Babbab Today
is BOBA sponsored by Major Threads for the finest in
men's athletic were check majorthreads dot com and for today's
become a Better Ally blah blah, we would like for
you to take a virtual tour. As much as we
can talk about this, we recognize that radio is very
(01:31):
different from other media, and we can't show you pictures
but you can't see them online. We can't show you videos,
but you can't see them online. And of course there's
nothing that will talk actually being there and feeling, you know,
the weight, and having a change and move through you.
But I wanted to recommend a few museums that we know,
(01:55):
we work with, and I think they're wonderful for you
to visit. So first up course is the one we're
talking about today, the National Museum of African American History
and Culture. Of course you can find that online, but
if you have a pan or otherwise able to write
it down, it's n M A HC dot SI dot edu.
I know it's a bit wordy, but Google will get
(02:17):
you there. M's National Museum of African American History and Culture,
SI of Courses, Smithsonian Institute and Edu, so if you
need to remember it that side. The other is the
National Civil Rights Museum. I want to send a big
shout out to doctor Russell Wigington, who's a friend of ours,
friend of the show. He's the curator of that museum,
(02:38):
and that is the Lorraine Motel in Memphis, Tennessee, where
doctor King was shot and killed, and you can do
a virtual tour there at Civil Rights Museum dot org.
So I would love for you to check that one
out too. We think that you can become a better
ally by doing that. And of course the National Museum
(02:58):
of African American Music, Henry Hicks is a curator. They
are another good friend of the show, and you can
find out more at NAAM dot org. So please educate yourselves.
All right, So back to the National Museum of African
American History and Culture. So we were discussing the paradox
(03:18):
of liberty, and that's a strange point in the journey, right,
Slavery is still happening again, the museum is laid down
in chronological order, so slavery is still happening. But now
there's a declaration of independence for this country. This country
is now not the thirteen original colonies, nowadays a separate nation.
(03:42):
And as they write this declaration of independence, and as
indeed they write their constitution, they meaning the founding fathers,
who all have statues on this exhibit that we're standing
in front of, are being extremely hypocritical. Again, it's the
(04:05):
paradox of liberty, that's what it's called. They are explaining
exactly what it is that is inalienable, exactly what it
is that they want, what they refuse to tolerate, so
forth and so on. But they'll turn right around later
in the day and impose their will on other human beings.
(04:34):
And of course at this point now it's race based
slavery in the United States. It's not slavery just for
the sake of slavery. No, all the black people are
slaves or subject to slavery. None of the white people, right,
indentured servitude, you know, that sort of thing is fine,
(04:55):
But you cannot be a slave if you're white, not
in the way that black people are. No one's going
to buy you and sell you. That's not you know,
you have rights. Still. So we spent some time there
at that exhibit, and I know that one was kind
of a big deal to you.
Speaker 3 (05:17):
The thing that stood out most to me about this
entire moment we spent in the museum is that even
those participating in this moment in history couldn't help but
to point out the hypocrisy themselves. This didn't stop them
(05:40):
from perpetuating it. But even they noticed this is kind
of weird, But it goes back to commodifying us. No,
this stuff that we're talking about us for men. Yeah,
these rights and freedoms, this is for men. Those aren't men,
(06:03):
those aren't people. That's our property. This is strengthening our
right to our property. It's freedoms that all men are
promised are helping us boaster the subjugation of our commodities
over here. It's necessary for us to do this to
protect ourselves and our property, not their homes. And I
(06:30):
was going to say not their cattle, but I think
they very very much considered us very similar yea to
their cattle. And again we make note of the speed
or lack thereof with regard to progress in this country.
(06:52):
We can't pretend we haven't made any that's right, but
we can be insulted by It's like it's stopped at
some point. Yeah, got to a point where things were
just good enough, and that passion to fight for more.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
Seemingly dissipated. We're not around here, all right, So we
move on, and you you know, it continues telling the story.
Now obviously it's it's its own country. It's the United
States of America, now, you know. And then slaves. Of course,
(07:28):
it's illegal to teach people who are black to read
and write. That didn't stop black people from learning and
leaving behind stories, and so some of these stories are
in the museum, and so you get a glimpse into
what life is like as a slave. I remember there's
like an audio recording of a woman who was recalling
(07:53):
what it feels like to be at a slave auction,
and she's like, you know, I'm standing there naked and
these white, strange white men they come up to me
and they grab on my naked body and they feel
on me, and then they grab my head and then
they roll my eyes up so they can see the
(08:14):
whites of my eyes, and then they pull my lips
down to look at my teeth, and then they turn
my head side to side and they examine, you know,
my body, and then they bid on me. And everyone
is watching while this is happening. And there's another quote
(08:38):
exerpt from a writer. Her name is Elizabeth Freeman, and
this is very powerful when you see it, you know,
when you see how they've presented it to the to
the visitor of the museum, then you kind of get
a little bit more of the weight of it. But
it says, if one minute's freedom had been offered to me,
(08:59):
and I had been told I must die at the
end of that minute, I would have taken it. So
that gives you a sense of exactly what these human
beings were dealing with. One minute of freedom and I
had to die at the end of it, I would
have taken it. There's a lot to be said about her,
(09:24):
but actually, you know what, I'll share a story she
deserves for you to know about her. Elizabeth Freeman, known
as Mum Bette, was born into slavery and was one
of the first people to successfully sue for her freedom
in the New Nation. Freeman was a Revolutionary war widow
enslaved by John Ashley, a powerful Massachusetts attorney. When she
(09:46):
overheard a discussion about the Massachusetts Constitution, she seized on
its guarantee of liberty to bring her lawsuit. Her claim
to freedom changed her life and helped en slavery in Massachusetts.
So that's who who said that if she had lived
one minute free and then died at the individual would
(10:07):
take it. Then. Other popular names to those of us
who have been able to learn a little bit about
our history. We learned a little bit about Nat Turner.
If you don't know about Nat Turner, he's a person
who's perhaps mostly known for a slaver volte and you
(10:32):
take it by force, you know, And it's important to
know his name. You know, a lot of non black
people will look at him and be like, well, he
was killing white folks, and I don't know that that
was his mission as much as it was killing the enslavers.
But Nat Turner is not a bad guy. He's a person.
(10:54):
He's a human being who sought his customary freedom, as
any creature or endowed with consciousness may seek to do.
One of the things that was really special that we
got to see is Harriet Tubman's handkerchief and her hymnal.
(11:18):
I have no idea how the museum has this, but
it's there and it tells, you know, the story about
Harriet Tubman and to be that close to that type
of history, you know, and you might not think that's
that special handkerchief, you know what I mean, that's what
(11:39):
is that? A hymnal? That what is that? But think
about you know, these are human beings that weren't allowed
to own anything, you know what I'm saying. So anything
they left behind, anything that these echoes of the past
means so much to us. You know, they they matter,
and they don't have a there's no worth to it.
It's it's priceless to us us to not touch it,
(12:02):
not own it. To stand next to Harriet Tubman's handkerchief,
that felt very special to me. And again, I hope
that one day you will go and visit and learn
about your people if you're black, or your brothers and
(12:22):
sisters if you're not.
Speaker 3 (12:25):
There's probably very few experiences in your life that would
be worth your time more.
Speaker 1 (12:31):
Than this one than this one. Yeah, and it doesn't matter.
I remember I saw a man there. He was a
older white man. This was right around the Harriet Tubman
thing where shoot or handkerchief was And I saw him
there and he didn't know me. I didn't know him,
but we were kind of in the same traveling group.
(12:52):
We had just gone through the slavery exhibit, and you know,
so now it's just like, look, man, we're all in
this together, right, that feeling is there. I saw he
was really taking it in and I and I and
I didn't grab him, but I kind of like touched
him and I was like, hey man, And remember he's old,
gray hair. He looked like like a like a politician, lawmaker, whatever,
(13:16):
you know, one of those type of people, right, And
I'm like, hey man, I just want to say thank
you for coming to this. And he's like, you're thanking
me for coming to this And I was like, yes, man,
I don't suppose that you have to be here. I
don't suppose suppose that if you don't want any of
(13:38):
this stuff to mean anything to you, then it won't.
Speaker 3 (13:41):
Do you think he was American because when he started
talking back to you, he seemed to have a bit
of an accent maybe maybe, and he also seemed gracious.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:53):
Yeah, I caught off guard initially because he said it
out loud, you're thanking me yet, But I think as
he started to understand the gravity of why you were
expressing that, that it hit him in a way too.
And that was one of many interactions that stood out
on that day.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
So, I mean, it means a lot to me, Like
I'm not what is it a thing? I'm not a woman,
but I do my best to be a supportive of
women's issues as I can be. It just so happens
to be the case that I'm black. But if I
was not black, I would be very supportive of black
(14:34):
people because I recognize that there's forces that artificially suppress
what would otherwise be the trajectory of black life, culture
experiences in this country, you know what I mean. And
so anybody who steps outside of their comfort zone to
(14:55):
help someone else, I love that because I think that
I'm that type of person, and so it's really easy
for me to thank folks who are not black in
the Black History Museum. Okay, So moving on, I wanted, Oh,
there's a wall there with it like a quote etched
(15:19):
into it. It's from Maya Angelo. It says, bringing the
gifts that my ancestors gave, I am the dream and
the hope of the slave. So now we're kind of
moving away from slavery, past the Civil War, and there's
(15:46):
where another etch on the wall. There another phrase etched
into the wall, and it's what we call it the
Black National Anthem, but it's lift every voice and sing.
And something special happened because we walked past it and
there was a group of people who had just walked
up to it, and so we're we're on a different level,
(16:09):
but it's in kind of an open area, so we're
not with them at all, but we heard them singing
it down there. It's a group of maybe three four
women and it's a museum, mind you, very quiet in there.
But the blackest thing ever happened, right they started to
(16:32):
sing The lyrics are on the wall. They started to
sing it, right, And so we're up at the top,
me and Q and we had our partner, Crystal Us.
He was filming, so we're up there, so we're they
needed some bass they need yeah, so we started We
started to join in and sing, lift every voice and
(16:54):
sing with them. It's there's no music, there's nothing, it's
just it. If you this is such a difficult show
for me to do. Man, I'm doing my best. You guys,
thank you for listening. I normally have it, but this
is a lot. They started singing, so we started singing,
and then other people started singing. And in this giant
(17:17):
open space where people are having this experience, the acoustics
were fantastic. Yes, and we're just singing this song and
people are joining in and nobody's shushing us. It was
very very black experience. I'm grateful that that happened in
my life.
Speaker 3 (17:34):
I just noticed the last part that you said, no
one had a problem with us singing, and it's very sacred,
very quiet, very revered space. Not only did no one
have a problem with it, but it helps it. Yeah,
you know, more and more people would stop and lend
their voice to us.
Speaker 1 (17:55):
It was I would guess that that wasn't the first
time that's ever happened, and I would guess that's not
the last time that's going to happen. You know, this
history that we talk about is very difficult, but I
wouldn't trade it for the world is beautiful. I'm so
(18:16):
proud of these people that had short lives. So anyway,
now we're talking about segregation. So you know, there's all
these signs. They actually have the signs, you know, the
waiting rooms for whites only by order of the police department.
(18:41):
You know, we went into a train. There's an actual
train that was a segregated a train car train car,
so you get a chance to see what the white
part of the train section look like, in the white bathrooms,
and where the white people put their luggage and how
their seats are set up and then the black part
of the train car and how it's very different and
(19:03):
very small. Course it's not equal, and I'm sure you
would assume that, but we had a chance to go
through a period I don't want to say period. Correct,
it's like the literal train car that was restored, and
so we had a chance to check that out as well.
(19:24):
And then right after that came the Emmett Till exhibit,
because this was the precursor to the Civil rights movement
for those that don't know when Emmett Til died, that
kind of supercharged the civil rights movement and that that
came in the sixties in the United States. And that
(19:46):
one was very difficult. So c why don't you take
this one? Because I'm running out of steam here. That's
why there's two of us on this show. I don't
want to be crying in front of y'all.
Speaker 3 (20:01):
Very recently, the sequel to Black Panther came out, and
I actually got invited to a private screening for that film,
and afterwards I was talking to a journalist about what
I thought the director's intentions were with how we should
feel when we saw that movie. Because the reviews were mixed,
some people were disappointed, some people were upset. Some people
(20:23):
were even angry for reasons that didn't make much sense
to me, but you know, people have their reasons. There
is a scene in that movie, however, when the daughter
of the queen is taken on a mission, and the
queen really insisted that she not be taken, insisted that
(20:45):
she not go because the worst possible outcomes she knew
she would not be able to bear. And somehow that
moment in watching that film reminded me of him. It
tills story and his mother not wanting him to go
(21:07):
and visit his relatives in the South because it was
not a mystery how black people were treated all over
the country, but more specifically.
Speaker 1 (21:19):
In the South.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
And I'm going to intentionally avoid the details of how
immit Till was murdered. Google im Mittel, read his story,
say his name. Look at the face of a child
that never got to be older than the picture that
you're going to see when you google him. He's probably
(21:42):
fourteen years old on that picture that you're going to see.
Speaker 1 (21:48):
But his mother is such capital gene. His mother.
Speaker 3 (21:58):
Admitted some things that she never really had to right,
that she was dismissive, almost of the trouble of black
people in the South, like that's their problem, it's not
ours kind of thing, And she admitted after losing her
son that she'd taken a very callous and kind of
(22:22):
selfish approach to the plight of the Southern blacks. That
she had a much different experience in Chicago where she lived,
But she made the heroic, selfless decision for in its
funeral to be open casket so that people could see
(22:45):
the gruesome, disgusting and terrifying way this child was murdered
and that they would all have to feel and reconcile
with not just the injustice, but the inhumane treatment of
people that looked like us in this country at the time.
(23:07):
And we walked into to this exhibit where there were
no photos allowed, and saw this small casket intended for
a child, and really collectively had to figure out how
to emotionally reconcile and continue through the museum, because I
don't think we were prepared when we turned that corner
(23:28):
for there to be.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
A casket in there. What we're going to see And
if you walked up close enough, you can see him.
Speaker 3 (23:36):
You could see the photograph of his face, and that
I personally was not prepared for. And that's all that
we have time for today. But suffice to say, the
museum goes on. There's lots of joyous, wonderful things there
as well, lots of more history, and our hope is
(24:00):
that you'd make the time, you take the trip and
you learn, so please do.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
But now it's time for the Way Black History Fact.
Today's Way Black History Effect is sponsored by the Black
Information Network Daily Podcast, and today's reading comes from white
Househistory dot Org. As promised, we're talking about Benjamin Banneker,
so I will read. Benjamin Banneker, a free African American
(24:30):
man living in a slave state in the eighteenth century,
never knew the weight of iron shackles or the crack
of an overseer's whip. A native of Baltimore County, Maryland,
his experience everged from those of most African Americans living
in the early United States. Received a formal education during
his youth, maintained his property and farm as an adult,
and parlayed his intellectual gifts into national prestige. Despite his
(24:53):
many accomplishments, however, Banneker was forced to navigate the same
racial prejudices that African Americans often faced in both slave
and free states. In many ways, history is a historical anomaly.
He assisted with the initial survey of Washington, d c,
published abolitionist material south of the Mason Dixon line, and
engaged with some of the country's founders in a way
(25:14):
no black man had before. However, Banneker's life also reflects
the defining paradox of the early United States. It's that
word again, paradox, a land of freedom and opportunity with
insurmountable racial qualifiers which the nation's capital would come to embody.
Born on November ninth, seventeen thirty one, Banneker grew up
on a one hundred acre tobacco farmed owned by his parents,
(25:36):
a formerly enslaved man and the daughter of a mixed
race couple, along the Patapsco River in the area now
known as Oela. As African American homesteaders, the family experienced
not just freedom, but also a quintessentially American vision of
independence and economic self determination that was rarely possible for
non whites. Still, the color of their skin alienated them
(25:57):
from the community of nearby farmers. Amid a rising tide
of sentiment against free blacks in the colonies, Bannaker's family
had to tread lightly in their own neighborhood. Nevertheless, Benjamin
received in education it was uncommon, not just for his race,
before his geographic location, where literacy was relatively low. His grandmother,
an Irish born former indentured servant, taught him how to
(26:17):
read and write, and Benjamin continued his studies alongside both
white and black classmates at a one room school nearby.
His hunger for knowledge went beyond the classroom. In his
early twenties, Bannikers gained local admiration by hand carving wooden
clock that kept perfect time. He had studied the gears
of a pocket watch to master the mechanics. There would
not have been many clocks in rural Maryland in the
(26:39):
mid eighteenth century, and Bannickers was later referred to as
one of the curiosities of the wild region. Though Bannaker
hosted many visitors who came to see the clock, it
took him years to find an intellectual community. In seventeen
seventy one, the Ellicotts, a Quaker family from Pennsylvania, moved
to Baltimore County and established a gristmill just a few
miles down the road from Banner's tobacco farm. Perhaps owing
(27:01):
to his reputation as a man of letters or due
to his curiosity about construction of the mill, Bannacker soon
connected with his new neighbors, in particular George Ellicott, a
land surveyor with a passion for astronomy, who loaned Bannaker
technical books and lunar tables. Bannicer had already sold off
some of his land to finance his retirement, and since
he was spending less time on the farm, he quickly
mastered the discipline. In seventeen eighty nine, the year he
(27:25):
turned fifty eight, he forecast his first eclipse. Meanwhile, the
stars were aligning for Banneker on Earth. On July sixteenth,
seventeen ninety, Congress passed the Residents Act, establishing a new
Federal City city to be constructed along the Potomac River.
President George Washington appointed three commissioners to oversee its construction,
(27:45):
and Andrew Ellicott, George's cousin, was brought on as practical engineer,
Needing assistance on the project, and with his unusual associates
otherwise occupied, sorry with his usual associates otherwise occupied, Andrew
invited Banneker to join him in out the future seat
of the federal government. It was the first time in
his life Banneker ventured more than ten miles from his own.
(28:06):
Letters from Elicott show that in February seventeen ninety one,
he set out with Banneker and several field laborers for
Jones Point, Virginia to applot the boundary lines of the
nascent federal city. Because of his age, health and the
harsh winter climate, Banneker's primary responsibilities were in the observatory tent,
where he maintained the regulator clock using a series of
thermometers and a transit altitude instrument. Each day, Elicott would
(28:30):
use the regular clock to set his own time piece,
which he would use to determine latitude. At night, Bannaker
would record astronomical observe observations. He was paid two dollars
a day for his work, less than Ellicott's five dollars,
but commiserate with salary for an assistant surveyor. At that time,
President Washington and Secretary of State Thomas Jefferson, whose seventeen
(28:53):
eighty five book Notes on the State of Virginia stated
that people of African descent were intellectually inferior to whites.
We're oh sorry, We're aware of Banneker's participation. Meanwhile, an
article about the survey in the Georgetown Weekly Ledger praised
Banneker's abilities. Ellicott is attended by Benjamin Banneker and Ethiopian,
(29:13):
whose abilities as surveyor and an astrono armer clearly proved
that mister Jefferson's concluding that race of men were void
of mental endowments was without foundation. And that's a quote
from the Georgetown Weekly Ledger. On April fifteen, seventeen ninety one,
the Commissioners, Ellicott, and spectators took part in a ceremony
(29:36):
at Jones Point to install the first of four stone
markers that would mark the corners of the Federal District.
While Banneker was not mentioned in any of the reports
from that day, he undoubtedly would have attended. In April
seventeen ninety two, about a year after Banneker returned to
his farm, Washington's appointed Commissioners initiated the practice of renting
enslaved laborers from their owners for capitol building projects, mostly
(29:58):
to cut labor costs work of enslaved people thus underguided
the construction of the capital, whose territory Banneker had helped survey,
from the clearing and paving of roads, to the quarrying
and transporting of stone, to the building of the White
House and the Capitol building. A free black man who
(30:20):
was self made, who was surveying the future capital would
seem to align with the American ideals of individual individualism
and equal opportunity. But the epic construction projects for which
Banneker helped paint, plant the first stake were carried out
heavily on the backs of enslaved laborers people of common
descent who were explicit explicitly denied those ideals. In this sense,
(30:44):
Banneker lived at the center of conflicting stories about the
founding of the United States, a contradiction that Washington, DC epitomized. Moreover,
his interactions with whites, from abolitionists like Rittenhouse to a
slave owner like Jefferson, showed that even free blacks never
escaped the finds of race. While he was right. While
he has rightfully been held up as an example of
(31:05):
African American excellence, Bannicker's presence at this ideological crossroad and
its persistence through it also makes his story definitively American,
with no qualifiers warranted, and so we thought that that
was also important to share. And of course the Museum,
(31:29):
or sorry, the National Museum of African American History and Culture,
has quite a bit to say about him as well,
because it's based in DC, which of course is where
Banneker is now most known for making an impact on
his country, and that among many other reasons. You know,
(31:50):
the exhibit on the red Tails, the exhibit on the
Civil Rights movement, the BLM movement, the music, the food,
the fashion, all of it is there and the contributions
are immense, and I really do hope that you get
a chance to see it. But that's going to do
it for us here on Civic Cipher. So once again
(32:10):
i'm your host. Rams's joh he is joh I am
q Ward. Thank you to the Smithsonian for having us.
We can't wait to go back because the few hours
we spent there just wasn't enough, not at all.
Speaker 3 (32:24):
So we're looking forward to visiting again in the very
very near future.
Speaker 1 (32:28):
Yeah, and you know, they told us that it takes
two days to see everything. They said that you won't
get out of there in less than five hours and
they were right on both accounts. So for those of
you who feel like you have that there's something missing
or maybe you want to know more. Either way, check
(32:49):
it out. And with that said, I think comment website
civicipher dot com follows on all social media at civic
side for download, listening previous episode and until next week.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
Y'all y'all like yo, we had to live these brothers
a fabulous our lady showing you where Rob travel li
w spe tones from sunlight to mold, busting on stage
like gonna fights the mole row my mic back. You're
like that journalist with journalists too, we can strike back
called borders with waters from head borders behind in, the
(33:27):
beline sides up and the borders the press passing. We
bring it to you as it happens, the streets love
popping from music and wrapping the street compand the slash
peak expando. You're gonna fight the slander with the proper propaganda.
What's happenings? How you got any questions to ask in
the news? Its just a TV show you're passing? And
this from a white wartime journalist headlines, Wait got prepis
(33:50):
and recess like this like what like this, like
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Therapy Gecko
An unlicensed lizard psychologist travels the universe talking to strangers about absolutely nothing. TO CALL THE GECKO: follow me on https://www.twitch.tv/lyleforever to get a notification for when I am taking calls. I am usually live Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays but lately a lot of other times too. I am a gecko.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.