January 8, 2024 • 60 mins
Triumph in the athletic world is often an iceberg, with the peak of success visible to the public, yet the submerged mass—comprising unseen struggles and relentless effort—remains concealed. In this episode, Tina and client-guest host Kara, peel back the glossy veneer of before and after pictures and question the portrayal of women in the media, all while challenging the authenticity that diet culture claims to offer.
We share the behind-the-scenes reality of success, revealing the silent battles and the invisible toll of intense competition prep on athletes. This conversation is a stark reminder of the emotional and physical sacrifices that underpin the glossy images of perfection, and it highlights the strength of character required to navigate these demanding paths.
We unpack the fallacy of balance within the extreme realms of competitive sports and the unvarnished truth of off-season struggles, the importance of coaching, and the liberating power of body acceptance .
Don't get weird, use your head, it'll all be OK!
Looking for a coach to help you be YOUR best self? Let's get in touch!
www.centerstagethleticscoaching.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Hello, hello, welcome , welcome.
This is coaching and cocktails,the podcast.
This is Tina, and today I havea new guest host and she's
actually a client of mine andI'm going to let her introduce
herself.
But we started working togethera couple of years ago.
She's a pretty incredibleathlete, super cool, chick, and
(00:23):
she came up with an idea ofsomething she wanted to talk
about.
She was apparently veryfrustrated over something she
saw on the internet or socialmedia.
Actually, you're never even onsocial media, so I don't know
where.
I don't even know where thiscame from, but anyway.
So we're going to have aconversation today, but I'm
going to let Kara introduceherself first.
All right, so my name is KaraRussell.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
I'm a bikini competitor and a triathlete, and
I met Tina a couple of yearsago and I'm going to talk about
her.
She's a triathlete and I metTina a couple of years ago
looking for a posing coach.
She was just that good thatthat poach, that posing session,
ended up turning into a fullcoaching relationship.
So I ditched my firstlackluster coach and got Tina
(01:10):
and it's all been beautifulsince then.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
Yeah, and last year you so our first season together
.
You accomplished earning yourmaster's bikini pro card with
the B-Series, and now we'retaking some time not only to
bulk I hate that word.
We're not bulking, we aregrowing.
We're growing, we're improvingand giving you so we're, we're
(01:37):
balancing our strength training,with you now wanting to do
triathlons instead of justbiathlons, because why?
not add more to it.
I think that's really cool.
But yeah, it's really cool toto see Kiara do her endurance
training and be able to competein, you know, physique
competitions, because reallyeverybody knows that you know,
(02:01):
endurance training andbodybuilding are not the best
bed fellows, because all thatcalorie expenditure going into
cardiovascular exercise versusstrength training and it's
something that's hard to balance.
But I think that honestly, Ithink you have a true genetic
gift in that and I know youalways.
(02:22):
You always complain aboutyou're the big girl, which is a
good thing because you have alot of muscle and your body can
actually withstand it.
So, anyway, it's been reallycool to be able to have an
athlete of your, I think, at theend of the year that's always
come down to you sort ofbalancing my macros.
Speaker 2 (02:43):
So I'm eating correctly.
Everybody told me getting intoit.
This was basically the dumbestthought I had had, that I
couldn't be great at both of thethings, so I was basically
going to sacrifice both of themand I just kind of refused to
accept that as an answer.
So you keep feeding the muscle,I'll keep growing it, and then,
(03:03):
yep, that's what.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
Yeah and yeah.
And you're a great coachable.
You're a true athlete in everysense of the word.
That's what makes it so cool toget to work with you, because
you are coachable and we workedthrough some Not eating
disorders necessarily, butdisordered eating and thought
patterns around food, and Ithink some of that was childhood
(03:26):
based and how you were raisedand some of it was the previous
competition prep and just goingfrom sort of a bro diet to I'm
sure you said you felt guilty onthis last one because you never
suffered and I'm not I mean,but comparably speaking, you're
not suffering, would probablyhave been somebody else's dead
(03:49):
on the side of road.
Speaker 2 (03:51):
Anybody could have done what I just did.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
Yeah, that is true, if they want to do it bad enough
, so speaking of yes.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
What?
What's your question, Henry?
Do you typically do resolutions?
Do you even a New Year'sresolution?
Speaker 1 (04:06):
I don't personally do New Year's resolutions.
One of my clients, slashfriends.
She kind of came up with thisconcept years ago where she just
kind of like has a word, soit's not, it's just like you
know where it might be growth orit might be, and I have Erin
and I talked about this on thepodcast the last couple of times
(04:27):
.
She kind of adopted that tooand what her word of the year is
.
So I don't do resolutions.
I'm sure I did like a millionyears ago, but I don't stick to
them.
So what's the point?
I mean, whatever works for you,I personally am always just
trying to be better than I wasand that's just a daily thing.
(04:49):
But I will say there's thisword, a word has been coming
into my head for no particularreason and I can't get it out of
my head, and so this is theword I'm going with, because I
think this is that's just how itcomes right.
It's just like that's how stuffcomes to us and it's clarity.
I don't.
I do not yet know why.
Clarity I have some ideas, butyeah, so that seems to be the
(05:14):
word that's popping into my headthis January.
How about you?
Speaker 2 (05:19):
So my problem maybe people will relate to this my
problem is everything for me hasto happen on a Monday or the
first, or like.
So New Year's is great becauseI'm going to get real crazy with
something.
Man, that's the ultimate startdate, and New Year's was on a
Monday this year.
I know I have to have Monday.
If you tell me to change yourdiet and it's a Tuesday, I'm
(05:41):
like, okay, on Monday I can't doit today, fair enough.
So I do think that the idea ofNew Year's is like taking that
half to start on Monday andreally amping it up.
So that's what.
That's what I'd gotten thisemail and it was discussing
before and after pictures, andit just sent me down this rabbit
(06:03):
hole of being so angry at whatI feel like women get fed via
media, not just social media,but all media through our lives,
and I really specifically thinkabout if you remember, in the
late 90s, early 2000s, man, wewere eating a fedrant like it
was candy, I mean diet fuel ripfuel, raise his hand.
(06:28):
Oh my gosh girl, I think I washaving, like it was something
crazy like 12 tablets a day, Imean that's all you were doing.
Speaker 1 (06:34):
I literally do not know how I survived taking that
kind of speed on a regular basis.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
We were so jittery so I was in the military at the
time and you want to talk aboutcrazy, have your weight factor
in that, if you're allowed to doyour job right, like you have
to be in this weight standard orwe don't really want you.
So we were like not eating andjust throw in diet fuel and rip
fuel like Ripped fuel.
(07:01):
That's the solution.
Oh, I remember rip fuel sovividly Right.
So you just sit and jitter likea crazy person.
And so then, if you rememberjust a little further into the
early 2000s, there was just alot of hardcore marketing around
(07:21):
diet pills for women, Like itwas ramping up because it was
just such a big business andthey would have these before and
after pictures which Ipersonally was convinced that
they just took fit people andthen had them, like reverse,
diet out and then took thepicture as the before, which is
my conspiracy theory.
(07:41):
But so I got so mad because Ithought all of these women still
are getting these pictures ofpeople like our stage photos.
I don't look like that the dayafter I'm on stage.
I didn't look like that a weekbefore I was on stage.
Those pictures are for stage.
But if all you get is day oneof my prep months earlier and
(08:05):
the day I'm on stage, man, isn'tthat an ideal?
I look at my stage pictures andI'm like, oh man, I'd love to
look like that.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
If only I could go from the left to the right
without doing all the stuff inthe middle, which is kind of the
point of this conversation.
And look and I'm equally asguilty marketing that I've
posted your beginning of preppictures and your on stage
pictures.
That's what everybody does,because it is good marketing,
(08:35):
right?
As a coach, it's like look whatI can do.
I help her go from this to this, and so, although I also like
to post pictures along the way,but most people are not going,
oh well, she looked like this atlike 12 weeks out, and then she
looked like this at like this.
You know what I mean?
Everybody just wants to see thepretty like.
(08:57):
Here you were six months agoand here you were on stage.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
I just it kills me.
There's a commercial out rightnow I won't I won't name the
product, but it's a commercial.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
We're not paying for any.
I'm not.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
I won't tell you.
Won't tell you what the currentproduct is, but there's one,
and the testimonial in thecommercial is the woman said I
had lap band surgery that didn'twork for me.
Then I started taking this.
Oh yeah, and and everybody'sdoing that now.
Yes, I got to tell you, man, ifsurgery didn't work for you.
I don't think an over thecounter pill is the magical
(09:32):
solution?
Speaker 1 (09:32):
Well, sure it is.
If you're going to take it forthe rest of your life, yeah, and
prescription though, and so Iknow we won't talk about that
Other stuff.
Yeah no, I got you, but sowhat's bugging you about this?
That people aren't seeing thework that actually goes into the
(09:53):
before and after?
Speaker 2 (09:55):
Yeah, so I think so.
Let's just say, if somebodyreally followed you, if they saw
the pictures you posted andlooked into you, there are the
stories from everybody of whatthey did and you'll consult with
them and tell them what a planloosely looks like.
If you're marketing women athymaster or rip fuel and we are
(10:20):
going back, Girl, I'm doingsomething, by the way, I really
wish.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
I actually really wish I had kept my thymaster.
Do you know?
That was actually a brilliant.
I mean, it's great, it wasfunctional, right.
I mean, it doesn't need to dolike their inner thighs.
I mean, if you don't have amachine.
It really was fairly effective.
Speaker 2 (10:39):
It's as much as a band would be right, sure,
anyway.
But so my problem is, if youmarket that this thing, this
thing, is the key to getting tothe after, that's just a fib
Like nobody has gone in and justeaten low carb and gotten cut.
(11:00):
That's not how that works.
You don't just lift weights andeat trash and get cut.
That's not how that works.
But I think people get soexcited at the thought of
getting to their after.
They skip thinking through didthis make sense?
Does it make sense that I coulddo this for 10 minutes and
(11:21):
you're not doing anything for 10minutes a day and getting
dramatic results?
Speaker 1 (11:26):
Right, and hence why you know, in any advertisement
you see on TV or what have you,it's like results may vary or
result are typical, right?
So when you look at the fineprint, right, and that's what
everybody likes to skip over,right?
There's all these.
I know you're not on socialmedia but I'm big on like memes
(11:47):
and stuff.
Like I love that shit all overmy house.
I like saying the memes andthings.
But there's one, actuallythere's two, that always, always
really like resonate with me.
There's one that's like youknow, it shows like somebody
who's successful and somebodywho's just starting out just
anything could be career orotherwise and it kind of shows
(12:09):
like all this like it's like aiceberg, it's like the tip of
the iceberg above the water, butnobody sees all that shit
that's underneath of the water.
They just see like oh you, justlike you went from all the way
over here to like the tip oficeberg and they'll see all the
shit that happened in betweenand the drowning and the
failures and all these things.
And then there's the other one,my other favorite one, just
(12:29):
cause I have lupus, it's likeyou know, nobody sees.
They just see what you looklike on the outside and nobody
sees like what is going on, likeliterally the day to day
struggle that people with likechronic diseases and autoimmune
diseases and things like thatdeal with.
And it's the same thing withwhether you're you're trying to
(12:49):
be a bodybuilder or a marathonor an endurance athlete like you
are.
It's easy to see, it's easy tothink that like this picture of
like perfection is where youwant to be, without ever fully
understanding, having not doneit before, what it really takes
to get there right.
(13:10):
And no matter how much I tellclients when I have consults
with them or anything like, youknow the spiel.
I mean you were alreadycompeting when I met you, but
anybody who's like brand newthat comes to me.
I started off saying my jobduring this consult is to
actually get a job during thisconsult, is to actually talk you
out of doing this, because infact, I talk more people out of
(13:34):
it probably than I do into it,because only the right kind of
person is going to still want todo it once I tell them
everything that's actuallyevolved.
And even then and the smartestof people that I've consulted
with you know get into thethroes of it and they're like
like I just couldn't haveimagined, right, it's, it's
(13:55):
cause you don't know.
You just don't know what youdon't know.
Yet you can be like, oh yeah,I'm tough.
Oh yeah, I used to be anathlete in college.
Oh yeah, I know what it's liketo do X, y and Z, but until
you're in the middle of the, youknow the suck of the of a prep,
or you know race training orwhatever you don't know.
And then that's where you knowand to me, like that really is
(14:19):
where athletes are, are made orbroken, right.
It's in those moments whereyou're like, well, this was more
than I thought it was going tobe and we're either going to
keep going forward or we'regoing to not.
But nobody sees that, nobodywants to see that.
Speaker 2 (14:33):
Well, the second marathon I ran, I passed a woman
holding a sign and the signsaid if you train for this
marathon and you're stillmarried, you didn't train hard
enough.
And that is sort of.
When I first got into multisport cause I was so I was doing
two Athalons, which is a runbike run instead of a swim bike
run, which is what triathlonsare I had a coach who said to me
(14:56):
you have to make sure yourmarriage is in a good place,
because a marriage just can'thandle the amount of training
required for the sport.
And it was such a weird thingand I really had a whole
conversation with my husbandlike are you on board, before I
get into this, that it's goingto be kind of a time suck, and
(15:17):
you know I might complain.
And it's the same thing withbodybuilding.
We jokingly always say that thebetter I look, the worse I feel
, because like the day I'mgetting on stage, that's the
best I'm going to look for atleast a year.
But you know, for a while and Ijust feel like garbage.
And so people see that that'sthe picture they want, that's
(15:40):
the thing that they're like ohmy gosh.
And I'm like oh, I felt socrummy, like I just wanted a
donut.
I did not care about any of itthat day.
I cared about it every singleday until then.
But you just come so fatiguedwith the process, and so people
see your pictures they lovestage pictures but they have no
(16:00):
idea what that day looks like,what that prep looks like.
So I say the same thing.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
In fact, I invite clients to bring their spouses,
family members, with them to aconsult, or even, you know,
further down the road, orwhether.
Let me help explain, like, whatthis is all about.
Like, I really encourage all ofmy clients to make sure they
have support, because it's avery selfish sport, so having
the support of your family,whoever lives in the household
(16:30):
with you, your kids, evengetting them on boards, because
there's a lot of sacrifice thatgoes into any extreme sport,
whether it's endurance, racingor bodybuilding or whatever it
is that you do right, that youtake to an extreme and you want
to do very well at it.
There is no balance.
It's just not a thing.
Right Like I don't.
Balance would imply that I cangive equal amounts of attention
(16:54):
and energy to all the things inmy life.
I can balance my work, and Ican balance my home, and I can
balance my athletic pursuits.
No, you cannot right Likesomething is going to give at
any given time.
So the key, though, is thenmaking sure that you're not.
Yes, one does have to get moreattention, but you also cannot
let the other things fall apartin the process, so that's really
(17:16):
the only way to balance them.
They are just not balanced, ifthat makes sense.
So I think that that is areally key thing, and I would
argue pretty strongly that themajority of my clients who have
very supportive spouses, theirspouses actually prefer how they
look when they're not competing100%.
(17:38):
Every day, my husband and Icompeted together and Eric is
like I neither of us like lovedthe other.
I mean, the pictures are great,right, we're so sexy, like it's
all very sexy and whatever, butlike underneath it all, like
neither one, neither of us, hada sex drive, so we fucking cared
what we looked like, cause likewe were touching each other,
cause it was like your sexhormones go out the door, you're
(18:01):
like welcome to competing, havefun with that.
But like neither of us werelike yeah, you look good now,
but like I'm not interested intouching all that hard stuff,
like I would just want we likeeach other softer.
Speaker 2 (18:15):
Yeah Well, I've always said I'd take a dad bod
over a gym bod.
Any day I love a good dad bod,but my husband definitely likes
me heavier.
He was so excited when I got onbulk.
Speaker 1 (18:30):
It's not a bulk.
Stop saying that word.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
So cause he joked all through prep that he was going
to start putting butter in mymouth at night because he was
just like you're just getting soand he kept saying thin.
And I'd say, not thin, lean.
Like I'm not really gettingthin, I'm getting lean.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
Yeah, we do need to coach our family and friends to
not call us skinny and to notcall us thin.
Well, that's what I always saidit's a weakness.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
I said because I'm keeping all my muscle, I don't
want to look thin, I want tolook lean, cause I want to have
muscle.
And so he was just so thrilledwhen I started gaining weight
again and of course I'm like, Imean, it feels kind of fast.
And he's like, no, no, no, letit come on.
Speaker 1 (19:19):
And yet we beat ourselves up because we are,
because, speaking of before andafters, right, we compare
ourselves to our own ourselves,our afters, our after afters,
right.
So it's like when our after isnow the before, right, so the
after stage pictures, that theprogress goes in the other
direction.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
If you looked at your friends pictures, your friends
said, well, this is in highschool and this is after I had
five kids 20 years later.
You wouldn't be like.
Why do they not look the same?
You'd be like.
Obviously they're not going tobe the same, but somehow your
own you're like.
But that was me.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
Why don't I look like I did when I was 17?
Right Now that I'm 50.
I don't know.
That doesn't make any sense,mm-mm.
Speaker 2 (20:09):
No.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
So the key point here that you want to, that what's
kind of like the key thing thatlike is was really driving you
wanting to have thisconversation today.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Well, I think it's.
You know it's great if you havesome imagery that focuses you
or that motivates you to getstarted.
But I think this fixation onextrinsic motivation, the idea
that how you look, should be thething you're aiming for.
If that gets you started, letit get you started.
(20:42):
But I am never happier thanwhen I see somebody really
overweight at the gym that isjust killing themselves to walk
on the treadmill.
Because I'm like you got inhere and did this.
It is so intimidating to gointo a gym and to come in unfit.
To me that's the greatest badgeof honor.
Like I want to tell everyonehow proud I am when I see that
(21:04):
happen.
So for me, you know, sing thepraises of the work people are
doing, but how they look is justmeaningless.
And especially if you're seeinghow they look on social media,
what filter you're getting ifthey took 35 pictures to get one
that they liked, like you, justdon't know.
Speaker 1 (21:24):
Who are with me, took the fucking picture right.
Like I mean, there are timesthat I don't, you know, I might,
I don't know like, oh, I havethis picture from competing, or
a photo shoot that I did, youknow, 10 years ago and, yeah,
I'll share it, or whatever.
And people are like, oh, youlook so great and I'm like,
that's not me.
You literally just saw apicture of me yesterday, like on
(21:45):
flex Friday or whatever.
Like there, you know, that'snot what I look like.
This was like 15 years ago,right, but having you know,
having you and I were talkingbefore we hopped on here, some
social media literacy, like you,you just have to look at
everything and not just socialmedia media, especially now with
(22:08):
AI, because between filterswere, so I don't know how to use
filters, so I can promise you,everything that I post is me.
I mean, unless it was a, unlessit was a photo shoot that I did,
the photographer did somethingto the picture, but I mean I
don't.
I don't know how to use filters, so I don't use them.
Ai I have not used AI yet forto enhance a photo of me or turn
(22:34):
me into a model or a cartooncharacter or any of those things
.
But but we have to look ateverything and and be really
discerning about what it is thatwe're looking at.
It's no different than fakenews, right?
So we need to look at everypicture on the fucking interweb
as fake news until provenotherwise.
Speaker 2 (22:53):
Well, and it was endorsing people, because how
many times do people say this isthe answer there, and then you
come to find out they weren'teven using it.
They were just paid to saysomething's great.
Speaker 1 (23:03):
Exactly Right.
I mean, there is no afterpicture without a lot of work in
the middle, regardless, right?
Whether people are also have tobe concerned about, like, what
did they do, right?
Did they do something extremethat wasn't healthy?
Were they taking, you know,metformin and we go V and like
(23:24):
whatever the fuck elseeverybody's taking now?
Were they, you know, doing anynumber?
Were they taking cocaine?
Were they taking performanceenhancing drugs?
That's probably my biggest petpeeve right now.
Like dramatic weight losses, Ithink most people can look at
that and easily chalk it up tolike, oh well, she probably took
(23:44):
, you know, one of the newweight loss drugs or you know
like you know, like KellyClarkson and Oprah Winfrey now
have you know finally admitted.
Yeah, nobody, nobody goes from250 pounds to 150 pounds in like
eight weeks without doingsomething right.
This is not a thing.
But in the sport ofbodybuilding, I think what
drives me batshit crazy and hasforever, is you know people who
(24:09):
are like look at the progress Imade in one year.
I see this all the time.
It really drives me nutsbecause there's so many natural
athletes that went to the darkside and started taking
performance enhancing drugs andyou see the growth on some women
I'm talking about women inparticular that they make in
(24:30):
these very short periods of timeright.
And then I have clients thatare like well, you told me I
can't grow that much in a mirror.
Well, you can't, you fuckingcannot, without taking drugs.
It's just not a thing.
But nobody puts that disclaimeron their pictures ever.
Maybe if performance enhancingdrugs were so great and lots of
people take them right, whyisn't anybody proudly stamping
(24:52):
their photo saying this physiquebrought to you by?
Yes, they work hard.
I am not going to deny that.
In fact, most people takingperformance enhancing drugs.
The truth is they work harderthan natural athletes.
Why?
Because they fucking can.
Because they're takingperformance enhancing drugs
right.
You can train seven days a weekand eat 50,000 calories if
you're, you know if you'retaking the shit.
(25:12):
So they are actually probablyworking harder than we are.
It's not cheating, it's none ofthose things, but it's.
You know.
If it's so great and wonderfuland we're not embarrassed that
we're doing them, why not slap alabel on it and say this
physique brought to you by awhole lot of hard work and also
growth hormone and this and this, and X and Y and Z, you know be
(25:34):
one?
Well, one because it's illegaland two that's probably mostly
illegal.
But it drives me nuts because itthat is where, especially in
the body sort of bodybuilding,where everybody is getting so
wrapped around the fucking axlethinking that this is true that
(25:54):
I can go from A to Z in a yeareven and put on 20 pounds of
muscle and natural athletesimply cannot do that.
And so, but nobody, you knowpeople look at it and they hire
XYZ coach because XYZ coach,could you know meet these people
(26:14):
?
Look this way.
Or you know, got them this procard or what have you, never
knowing until they're knee deepin it.
Or you know, thousands ofdollars into it, what it really
took to get between those.
There's no honesty in the sportwhen it comes to that.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
So my favorite are the number of articles online
that talk about how youshouldn't gain more than 10
pounds in your off season, andthat you can gain muscle but
never gain more than 10 pounds.
I gotta tell you the truth 10pounds is pretty easy to come by
when you're reversing.
Speaker 1 (26:48):
I think 10 pounds over the night.
Right, I thought it to you.
Speaker 2 (26:52):
So you see these, these NPC girls who I mean look,
look, phenomenal.
I'm in no way saying they don'tlook incredible, but you cannot
tell me that you are remainingthat lean, adding any muscle,
adding any muscle and gainingless than 10 pounds in an off
season.
Speaker 1 (27:10):
naturally, Right Now, so unlikely that they're doing
it naturally.
So that's the first.
We will call it lying.
We'll call it what is it lyingby omission, right?
We'll just call it omittingfacts, right.
Speaker 2 (27:24):
We'll just call it.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
I'm just not telling you what I'm doing, right,
that's all, and you know, andthat's their business.
They can do that.
But to the naked eye, right,the inexperienced eye, the
inexperienced person, it's likeoh, it just gives this false
sense of what is actuallypossible in that period of time.
And even for natural athletes,right Like that, aren't gaining
(27:44):
any weight or aren't evenactually taking bulking seasons
God damn, that word Aren'ttaking, you know, growth seasons
.
I see it all the.
I see pro athletes and peoplelook up to these and again,
specifically, women and men,people look up to these.
Women.
They're like, we'll even saynatural athletes, because I see
it all the time and they justcompete and they compete and
(28:07):
they compete and they take.
Listen, if you competed lastyear, in 2023, right, or in 2024
now, if you competed at anypoint in 2023 and you're getting
back on stage in spring of 2024, you didn't take a fucking off
season.
It's not a thing.
You took a couple of months toput on a shit ton of weight.
(28:29):
You sat at that shit ton ofweight for like two months and
now you're gonna, now you'regonna start dieting it off again
, right?
So if you did, if you, if youdid anything in a 12 month
period, you didn't give yourselftime to put on muscle, and then
you're, you're leading, youknow, the untrained individual
to think well, that's what youdo, right, I just compete and
(28:50):
compete and compete and that'sit again.
So go ahead and get it back tolike nobody sees what's
happening between the before andafter and all the other afters,
and then what happens when youhave shut down your entire you
know, you've shut down yourhormones and you've shut down
your gut and you've shut downany chance of living a nice,
long, happy life, because thisis what you decided to do, like
(29:13):
over and over and over againthroughout this sport.
And nobody, nobody sees that.
And I think it's irresponsiblefor a lot of these pro athletes,
pro natural athletes I'llprobably get shit for this to
compete all year, every year.
Speaker 2 (29:29):
Well.
So we talked about this becausewhen I came to, I'd finished up
a show and we were reversingand I said to you, I really feel
like I need a show on the booksfor this next year to stay
motivated to keep going, cause Ijust have so much on my plate.
And you said, okay, well thengo the very end of the year,
cause this was in June.
You're like, go very end, so weat least have almost a year and
(29:52):
a half.
And you said I really wouldn'tdo that, but if you need that,
that's at least push it all theway to the end of the year.
So that's what we did.
So this prep I actually got somuch leaner than I got on my
first prep and so much easier,but that's side note got a lot
leaner.
And the very tail end of prep,like the last two weeks, was the
(30:16):
first place where I startedrealizing that my body was maybe
over, like I'm over prep.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
This is it.
Speaker 2 (30:24):
And it clicked so hard for me that you can't do it
year after year, like you can'tdo it 22, 23, 24, because the
amount of time it takes toreverse and normalize, just
normalize.
You have to do that before youbegin growing, and if you ain't
(30:44):
growing, all you're doing is theexact same package year after
year.
Speaker 1 (30:48):
You had probably a worse package.
Right, because you're sodepleted Because you never gave
your body, your mind, yourfinances, your life, your family
time off.
Right, like it's not just aboutmuscle growth either.
Right, like it is aboutrecovering every aspect of your
body.
It is mentally taxing, it isphysically taxing, right, it's
(31:10):
like we talk all the time abouthormones and like it just you
know every, every, every aspectof it.
So, and yet you see people doit all the time.
And then I have clients thatare just like I, have clients
leave because I'm like I justdon't support doing that over
and over and over again, becauseI can't help you be your best.
If we're just running you intothe ground and then we got to
(31:32):
diet harder, we got to do morecardio, we're just going to lose
more muscle.
You're just going to end uplooking worse.
And look, I can tell you fromexperience because this is
exactly what I did when Icompeted, because nobody told me
not to, right.
So I competed in fall of 2005,spring of 2006, fall of 2006.
And then I tore my bicep and Itore my shoulder why Might you
(32:01):
ask, over?
Because I was depleted andover-changed Right, and my body
was like hello, can you fuck offand just take a beat for a
minute, and of course then wedon't listen and we do all kinds
of shit.
But that it's just a recipe forwhat not to do.
And I see it.
Look, I've been in this sportfor almost 20 years.
I have seen athletes get onstage over and over and over
(32:27):
again.
I can tell you the athletes thetop natural athletes will take
two to three years off betweenshows, right, right.
And I see more men be smartabout this than women, and I
think a lot of it with women isbecause one we start, this whole
thing becomes part of ouridentity, that it becomes this
(32:50):
like I don't want to be fat inmy off season, so as soon as I
gain the weight I'm going todiet it back off.
It's just like.
So it's all the things that gointo this.
So I do see more.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
I just want to note that you air quoted that because
nobody else saw that happen.
Air quote yeah, she didn'tactually need that.
Thank you for that, Air Quotes.
I didn't mean that.
Speaker 1 (33:04):
So I always forget that.
People can't seem to be goingair quotes In air quotes.
You got fat in your off seasonI see more men do this but
really, really top level naturalmale bodybuilders take two,
three years off, right, Like andit's just.
I think the social media hasdone really great things for the
(33:28):
sport of natural bodybuildingand I think social media has
done really harmful things tothe sport of natural
bodybuilding specifically, notthe sport, but the people right,
Because I think too many peoplesee people competing over and
over again and think that's whatthey should be doing, or they
just don't have the rightguidance, right, so their
(33:49):
coaches are encouraging them todo silly shit, or you have
something to say.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
Yeah.
So what I wonder is if part ofit too is that you know, what we
see is that every year there'san Olympia, every year there's
an Arnold Classic, like thereare these enormous shows that
happen annually.
And I mean, I followed malebodybuilding long before I was
considering competing, and soyou'd see Ronnie Coleman.
(34:16):
Every year at the Olympia,you'd see Jay Cutler every year.
Speaker 1 (34:20):
Have you seen Ronnie Coleman now?
Speaker 2 (34:22):
I oh my honey.
Have you seen the documentary?
Speaker 1 (34:27):
The documentary is so good, it's so crushing.
Speaker 2 (34:29):
Have you seen it?
It's heartbreaking it isheartbreaking.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
In fact, that's actually exactly what I think
everybody listening to thispodcast needs to do Go watch it.
As soon as you're donelistening to this, you need to
go watch.
I actually forget what it'scalled, but I think it's on
Netflix.
I think so too, and if youreally wanna see what
over-trading and over-druggingand this constant need to be
(34:55):
competing looks like, that'swhat it looks like, in a male
form.
Speaker 2 (35:01):
As an older man, I think.
If I remember he was squatting800 pounds.
If I remember correctly, Likebending the bar 800 pounds, pure
insanity.
If anybody is not familiar forany reason with Ronnie Coleman,
he was a superhero in real life.
I mean well over six feet tall,like 300, I think 325 pounds
(35:21):
when he compete.
Just this mass.
And they were putting on nowheavy drug use but they were
putting on 20 pounds of muscle ayear.
Speaker 1 (35:28):
Yeah, and they could compete every year at the
Olympia and they could compete,they competed all year long.
Speaker 2 (35:34):
But see, I think that's why people think it's an
annual thing, because these guyswere doing big shows that were
heavily covered year after yearMonica Brandt, Kelly Ryan, those
girls were doing Olympia and Imean the Arnold every year.
So I think people reallythought, just like the 12 week
(35:56):
prep is a steroid cycle really.
I mean, the reason people thinkyou can prep in 12 weeks is
because of testosterone use.
I think that's the same reasonpeople think they can do an
annual show is because we sawthese pro athletes for so long.
Speaker 1 (36:12):
Well, we see it now.
We see it in naturalbodybuilding If you watch the
Jorton Cup every year, the OCDJorton Cup, which, like or WNBF
worlds or any of the really bigshows, every pro is gunning for
that show every year.
I'm already seeing people whocompeted in last years end of
(36:32):
season kind of pro circuitstarting to get ready for this
year.
Which means, like we just said,there was no off season taken.
There was no recovery happening.
You do not recover in a monthor two months or three months or
four months.
I mean three to six months.
The studies are out there andthere's not a lot done on women,
unfortunately.
But you can look at studies onmen and see how long it takes
(36:52):
for their hormonal profiles torecover, right.
It's not even just a matter oflike, oh well, I gained my 20
pounds back and right.
It doesn't even work that way.
There's this really, reallygreat study that a group of
natural bodybuilders did.
I think it was Andrew Parduewho did it, I think, but he did
his own prep and he did bloodwork before and he did blood
(37:14):
work after and then like.
So the goal was to kind of seewell, are your hormones
recovered when you get to acertain body fat percentage, or
rather where they were at thatbody fat percentage before you
started cutting, right, so, andthe results were no right.
(37:35):
So if you were 20% body fatbefore you started cutting and
your hormones were like, oh,it's great, your hormone profile
is perfect, you're a 22 yearold male and this is fantastic.
And then afterwards back up to20% body fat or whatever it was,
oh no, the hormones were stilltanked, and this was like three
and six months afterwards, right, or you know they're starting
(37:55):
to recover, but you know more orless not where they should be,
so it really doesn't have to.
I think a lot of people thinkthat, right, and you know,
there's just so much more thatgoes into it.
And a lot of people don't getblood work done, and you know,
so there's, you know, reallyunderstanding what's going on
with them, and a lot of peoplewon't know until the damage is
(38:15):
already done.
Right, so until I mean, Isuffer from it now, right, like,
do I have regrets?
Do I wish I had gone back anddone things differently?
Yes and no.
I mean it wasn't going to be athing.
So there's no reason to feelregretful over any decisions I
made about how I competed backin the day, cause you know when
you know better, you do better.
We didn't know.
I'm not gonna blame myself fordoing something I didn't.
(38:38):
You know, I smoked when I was13 to 32 because cigarettes were
not bad for you Right, and seatbelts were unnecessary.
Speaker 2 (38:48):
It's just government conspiracy, right I?
Speaker 1 (38:50):
mean who needs seat belts Right.
Well so, and cigarettes arefine.
Speaker 2 (38:55):
I watched a Bikini show, so I think the one I say
was before my very first show.
I had watched this show thatwas being broadcast and they had
a pro competitor that washelping with commentary and she
said I love a 20 week prepbecause I can really just take
out candy the first week.
And she was saying these crazythings.
(39:17):
This girl like lookedphenomenal.
I was like 20 weeks, geez, ohPete, cause I did a 16 week prep
and I was like this is forever.
And now I can honestly say I'drather do 20 or 24 weeks and
just slow roll it because shewas dead.
Right, yeah, just take awaycandy.
Speaker 1 (39:33):
The first, the best prep I ever did was by from the
start of my cutting to my firstshow.
I think was about 20.
I think it's 20, maybe 23, 24weeks and then I did two more
shows that season, like a weekor two after.
I think the whole prep wasclose to 30 weeks and it was the
(39:54):
best I ever looked.
It was the best I ever felt.
I never felt deprived.
I didn't have a single bingeepisode because there wasn't a
single prep.
I ever did that.
I didn't.
I had binge eating disorder.
So there, you know, it wassomething that happened because
I was so fucking deprived,because I was doing 12 week
preps and I posted a sample.
I found my 2010 diet.
(40:17):
You had to get on social mediaso you can see the thing that I
posted and it was terrifying andpeople were posted like I would
have died on it.
It was like literally everythird day I would get like a
bowl of rice and like someoatmeal and a banana.
I only got carbs every threedays, right, and it was so it
(40:37):
was insane, but I could eatsomething like 40 almonds.
You better believe I ate thebiggest fucking.
You know some almonds are likethese little cause you were even
weighing them then you werejust counting them.
Speaker 2 (40:48):
Oh no, oh no, it was like 40 fucking almonds, I'm
gonna eat the whole fuckingalmond tray.
Speaker 1 (40:52):
It's like the biggest almonds, right, I could get,
but anyway, I don't even knowwhere I was going.
Oh, I used to do, we did the 12week preps and I know for a
fact you can see my pictures Iwas always lean, I always did
well, but was I really wellconditioned?
No, not, until I did a 20 plusweek prep, and it depends on the
(41:15):
person.
I have a client right now.
She's got over 30 pounds tolose.
Guess what we're doing?
A minimum of a 35 week prep.
Right, I didn't tell you togain 30 pounds, right?
That's just.
That's just what we have to do.
And if we're lucky, we lose apound a week.
I have to give it at least aprep, especially for a new
athlete.
Now for sure, I will caveatthat and say I have athletes I
(41:35):
have worked with athletes who Ican do a 12 week prep with
because I know their body.
We actually know they do betterwith a hard and fast than a
slow burn.
And so, again, everybody isdifferent, which is why we
cannot say everybody can do itin 12.
Any more than we can sayeverybody can do it in 20.
(41:56):
Right, it really is very, very,very dependent.
So again, it's just one morething that nobody sees between
the before and the after picture, but so that's also on the
timeline though.
Speaker 2 (42:08):
So we have to reverse diet and normalize, then we
have to do growth, then you haveto leave all that period of
time to cut.
So if you're talking six monthsof cutting, that's half a year.
Which means if it took you halfa year just to get to where
you're building and half a yearof cutting, that's a full year.
So just to try to gain threepounds of muscle can take an
(42:32):
entire year of a perfecttraining and diet.
Speaker 1 (42:37):
But that's the key, right.
Yeah, an entire year, we'retalking, I would say 12 months
of being in a calorie excess, orthe average female, not the
genetically gifted or theectomer if that's a harder time
putting on muscle, right.
Three to five pounds of muscleIf you're lucky.
12 months in a calorie excess,not 12 months between shows,
(43:01):
right.
When I see people say I don'tknow off season and it's like
three months, I was like whatthe fuck are you talking about
that?
Is not an off season.
Speaker 2 (43:09):
That's not even reverse.
Speaker 1 (43:11):
I mean no.
I mean technically, you shouldbe fully reversed in like six
weeks, but then it's justbuilding up to maintenance and
growth.
But I just, I don't know, itmakes me crazy.
And then people either listento me or they don't, and I do my
(43:31):
best, at least with my clientsand my athletes, to say, ok,
well, you know, I didn't sugarcoat it.
I'm like, well, yeah, but weare losing out on being able to
grow, we're losing out on beingable to do any number of things.
So if that's really what youwant to do, we'll give it a shot
.
Speaker 2 (43:49):
But I make the promises right.
But so this big timeline sothat's the other thing is when
you get somebody that says insix weeks I went from 200 pounds
to 110.
They're just standing therewith their, you know, standing
in a single leg of a pair ofpants.
If you do things like thatreally quickly, if you do things
(44:09):
like that to me on your own ishazardous Because, like in
medicine, we don't treat familymembers because you just can't
make clear decisions whenemotions evolve.
Man, get a coach.
You know I have an endurancecoach, I have you for strength
and nutrition.
I'm a big believer that anoutside observer can give you
(44:30):
objective data to utilize andfunction better than you're ever
going to figure out on your own.
Speaker 1 (44:37):
I never competed without a coach.
I've always had a coach.
Speaker 2 (44:40):
I think I could put it all together honestly, Like I
have the knowledge for it.
I could.
Speaker 1 (44:43):
I don't want to.
Speaker 2 (44:44):
I don't have the emotional bandwidth to control
myself.
I need somebody else to help.
Speaker 1 (44:50):
Yeah, 100%.
Well, I think we've got ourpoint across.
We've been talking for about 45minutes or so now, so what's
the main point you want to getacross to people?
If people take nothing awayfrom this conversation, it was
the main thing you wanteverybody to leave here and
(45:10):
really think about, or know.
Speaker 2 (45:13):
I would say if you're going to use any of the stuff
that's being thrown at you forthe new year as we're all
getting motivated and into thisnext year, use that stuff as a
jumping off point to bemotivated to start.
Do not compare yourself againstanybody else's progress,
against your own old pictures orhopeful pictures.
(45:34):
Use all of that stuff just as amotivator to get into the gym.
But then start goal settingbased on measurable things and
not weight goals, speed goals,power goals, things that are
real accomplishments that don'tinvolve the scale or the size
pants you're wearing, buthealth-related.
Speaker 1 (45:58):
If you focus on that, everything else does come.
If you focus on eating for yourhealth or eating for
performance and training foryour health and training for
performance whether it'sstrength performance or
endurance performance orwhatever your performance goal
is the other stuff will come andthe physical appearance will
(46:21):
come from that.
Speaker 2 (46:24):
The great irony is I always thought the one hole in
my life was I didn't look how Iwanted to look.
I mean, from age eight Ithought, man, if I would just be
thinner, my whole life wouldcome together and I really
believed everything in my lifewould fall into place.
And then what I found was themore I looked exactly how I
(46:45):
wanted to look, the more it sortof bothered me that people
cared about how I looked.
Like when people would say,especially if a man says you're
hot and I'm like, this isliterally the dumbest thing you
could say to me.
You didn't say I was funny orinteresting or you look strong,
yeah, I mean, it's just You'refast.
So all of these things Ithought were going to be the
(47:08):
thing I really wanted.
As I actually approachedreaching that goal, I realized
none of that mattered at all,and all of this time it was just
that it was an unobtainablegoal, and so I could perpetually
put the fault on that.
As long as I couldn't be that,I could say that was why I
wasn't happy, that was why Iwasn't successful, that was why
(47:30):
whatever, you weren't goodenough at X Right, and then you
reach it and you're like, oh, itnever even mattered.
But you won't know that untilyou get there, but it really
doesn't matter.
Speaker 1 (47:41):
No, it's what the scale says.
I mean, it's a very useful toolfor weight loss, it's a useful
tool for measuring differenttypes of things, but not nothing
, nothing else Significantoutside of bodybuilding and you
need to lose some body fat oryour obese and you need to
(48:02):
reduce some body fat.
But really we should be lookingat health markers and strength
and things like that.
That's why I encourage so manyof my athletes I mean, I'm glad
you already have other sports,but I have a lot that get into
powerlifting in their growthseasons.
It gives them a reason to eatand just focus on strength,
(48:26):
which also has an added benefitof gaining more muscle.
So why not?
We have a client that did do amarathon in between shows.
It gave her something else tofocus on.
Like you can balance all ofthese things.
But we have to get away fromeverything being so obsessive
about aesthetics, even thoughthis particular sport is about
(48:47):
aesthetics.
It's only about aesthetics onthat one day, one day or however
many shows you're doing thatmany stages.
That's the only time it mattersand it has nothing to do with
who you are as a person or howgreat you are.
I have a client who she sent mea check-in once and she's
(49:08):
getting more and morecomfortable again.
Like you know, she's like thisis the best I've ever felt and I
never thought it'd feel thisgood and await this heavy Right.
Because we associate how wefeel with what the scale says,
like I'm somehow going to feeldifferent when it says this
versus this, these false goalsthat we set.
And she's like well, I want todo a mini cut and you know,
we've been in her growth seasonfor a while and I mean she eats
(49:33):
a ton of food, so I was like wecould do a little mini cut and
suck our whole thing.
And then she got down to likeshe sits around like 133, 134,
and she got down to like 128.
And she's like I don't think Ineed to do this again.
She said, you know, she said Iachieved that goal, right.
She said, and it was amazing, Iwalked into work and nobody
celebrated me for it.
(49:54):
Nope, she said there was nofanfare, nobody treated me
different, my life didn't changebecause I was 128 versus 133 or
135.
She's like so it was this huge,like epiphany for her that she
realized.
She was like I'm really kind oflike being at like 133, 135.
(50:15):
Better, get to eat more.
I feel stronger, I'm sleepingbetter, like you know, whatever
the case may be.
Plus, nobody gives a fuck ifI'm 122 pounds.
Nobody celebrated me for it,right, because nobody fucking
cares, right?
It just isn't, and it just it'sthese false like ideals that we
put on ourselves, because thisis just how we were born and
bred, right, like it's just.
There is a.
(50:35):
There is a bazillion dollarindustry out there that does not
want here.
If you hear nothing else I sayon this podcast, I've said it a
million times there is abazillion dollar industry out
there that goes broke the minute.
Women feel like they're enough,wherever they are.
Yep, that is some powerful shit.
(50:57):
If you feel good about who youare, what you're doing, what you
, what you look like, whateverthe case may be, the system is
not set up for that, becausethere's a whole, there's some
real rich fucking people goingto get real fucking poor if
women suddenly believe they'reenough.
Do you have.
(51:17):
Wouldn't you say the same?
Speaker 2 (51:19):
Yeah I say I don't think you need to love where you
are necessarily.
You just need to be okay withthe thought that you're moving
yourself towards where you wantto be.
Speaker 1 (51:27):
Absolutely, you don't have to.
I do not love how I look allthe time, right I mean.
But I'm okay with where I amRight.
Speaker 2 (51:35):
Well, so I just think that this idea of when we talk
about people being okay is notto say you have to love
everything as it is.
Nope, you have to accept whereit is.
So my husband got me watchingStar Trek, which was never, ever
, ever the kind of show Ithought I would watch.
(51:57):
So this is new Star Trek, andso this whole Vulcan thought of
using logic versus emotion itjust started to really sink in
with me in this way where Ibegan looking at things like
let's remove all of the emotionabout this decision, or how I
feel about it, and how would Ilook at it if it was somebody
(52:20):
else telling me and there'ssomething about removing this
level of emotion where you canjust go yeah, I mean, that's
what I told you, right, it isscale weight is a data point, so
we're just going to look at itas a data point and I'm refusing
to let it determine my dailyworth because it doesn't matter,
because, because it doesn't,Right, right.
Speaker 1 (52:43):
And the fact of the matter is it doesn't and take I
love that you said that, becauseit's you know, I tell clients
this all the time is like takingthe emotion out of food.
Right, food doesn't have morals.
Your body doesn't have morals.
It's not good when it's thisway and bad when it this way.
You're not a bad person becauseyou're this way and are a good
(53:04):
person because you're whateverright Like we.
I love that.
I think that is brilliant.
So if we all have to startadopting the Vulcan way of
thinking, man, you should gowatch the show.
I don't know, it's not my kindof show at all.
No, it's not my name, but thethought process is yeah, right,
like, stop taking the take theemotion out of it.
(53:26):
It just is what it is, rightand and it's just like, do I
have a little more belly fatthan I used to?
Yup, and that's it, right,right, and there's no other,
there's no other thing that hasto go with that, right, I, I, so
it's.
(53:46):
You know, it's like radicalacceptance, right?
So we use the term radicalacceptance or just acceptance in
general.
It really does.
When it's kind of like takingall the exacerbated emotions out
of everything, again, youreally have to get on social
media.
This was very poignant, becauseI posted it just yesterday I
just yesterday I'll send it toyou because you'll like it and
it was like here's, this is whatacceptance looks like.
(54:07):
And on the left hand side itwas like it's right as like a
little cloud and it was raining,and under the cloud is raining.
I hate the rain.
I really wish it wasn't raining.
When it's raining, I feel thisand I, and raining makes me sad,
and rain it's just like allthese like about the rain.
And on the right hand side itsays it's raining.
It just said yup, right.
So again it.
You know that it's just a.
(54:28):
This is about rain.
It wasn't about our bodies, butit's the same thing, right?
I don't let sitting in trafficbother me anymore.
I used to.
I used to lose my shit Right.
So I believe that the fact thatI'm just like a much more
mindful person and I'm just sofocused on again, just like this
Cause, you can't control it, Ican't do anything about the fact
(54:51):
that somebody just had a wreckup here in front of me and there
days a whole lot shittier thanmine, and here I am sitting in
traffic and I'm going to be late.
Oh well, right, I'm sitting intraffic.
Yup, right, I'm going to getthere.
Yup, it's the same thing I'vebeen trying to adopt.
Everybody lasted me, becauseeverybody who's followed me for
years knows I hate the fuckingcold, right.
(55:11):
So?
But the more you focus emotionon something like that, the more
I say I hate the cold, the moreI am miserable about the cold.
The more that I think about howmiserable I am about the cold,
the colder I am and the moremiserable I am.
If I'm just like it's cold out,yup, you know what I mean.
(55:33):
Like it's cold, I stand outsidefor hours, three, four hours at
a time, in the cold, in therain, with these horses Right,
it's something I love to do.
It's sometimes physicallymiserable, absolutely.
But if all I do is think abouthow physically miserable I am,
I'm missing out on a whole lotof other shit that's going on in
this environment and I'm justmiserable.
(55:54):
So, yeah, I'm cold, we justokay, I just accept that, I
embrace it.
Right, like we kind of embracesome of these things Just like
okay.
This is just where we are.
Speaker 2 (56:02):
So I feel like there's some rooting in
gratitude for physicality aswell.
There have been so many timesI've been running and I will, in
my brain, thank my legs forbeing able to run, because I
think of how many people wouldkill just to be able to walk.
And here I am, using my legs torun and I am so thankful to my
(56:26):
body that it lets me work.
People who've ever been injuredcan really appreciate that you
didn't recognize how good thingswere until you broke something
Absolutely.
Or you get the flu and you'relaid up and you're like gosh, I
didn't realize how healthy I wasuntil I got really sick, yep.
So I do think there's gratitudeeven in the things that are the
(56:49):
suck.
Speaker 1 (56:50):
I mean, I even the things we don't love, right,
like the same thing with, like acompetition prep.
Yeah, you can be miserable onthe diet the whole time, right,
or?
Speaker 2 (56:59):
you can choose to.
Speaker 1 (57:00):
Just you know you chose to do it right.
You don't have to it.
Just it just is right, like wedon't have to focus on how much
it sucks all the time, becausewe focus how much it sucks all
the time and how hungry you are,guess what it's going to suck
and you're going to be hungryright, oh, you get so much
hungrier.
Right and just be grateful thatyou can right.
Yeah, have gratitude that youhave the ability to make a
(57:24):
choice to starve yourself.
Speaker 2 (57:27):
Right, yeah, I get to the truth.
It's the most expensive versionof dieting.
Speaker 1 (57:32):
you could do it is Right, but I mean, think about
it.
You think about it in thoseterms that you, we're blessed
enough to sit here and talkabout purposely reducing our
calories, to look a certain way,right, where in?
Yes, there are starving peopleall over the world, right, who
would really love to just haveenough food to eat, let alone be
(57:52):
able to choose, right, and I amnow going to purposely make
myself hungry, right?
Yeah, sounds pretty fuckingridiculous, doesn't it?
And so when we, when we adoptthe gratitude and we adopt this
sort of radical acceptance ofthings and we also look at
everything we're on social mediaand media and otherwise, you
(58:13):
know, as fake news until provenotherwise, right, really like
having some literacy about thewhole thing.
Yeah, it just changes yourperception on, I mean, really
you can use this in any way, inany, any part of your life, not
just bodybuilding or endurance,sports or, you know, scenic
traffic or being in the cold.
Some people would kill to be inthe cold right now because
(58:36):
they're in the desert, I'm sure.
Speaker 2 (58:38):
Right.
Speaker 1 (58:39):
Somebody out there loves the cold, all right.
Well, this was a really funconversation.
Do you want to join me foranother podcast sometime?
This was fun Anytime, I think,because, since you know, brandi
is so busy with her kids andstuff right now, like we just
haven't had time for her and Ito sit down and do podcasting.
So I'm just going to keepinviting.
So I'll put it out there, likeif I have other clients or
(59:01):
people I don't know and you wantto introduce me and you have a
topic you want to talk aboutStranger.
Yeah, stranger danger?
There's no stranger than me.
So if anybody wants to, isthere something like a burning
topic they want to talk about?
I think it would be really coolto you know, have some
different co-hosts on.
So if you have another topicyou want to talk about, let me
(59:22):
know and hopefully we'll getsome feedback on this and I
think people will like it.
I think people will.
I think it'll resonate with alot of people.
So do you know our sign off?
Speaker 2 (59:33):
Okay, I'm trying to think which of the lines that
start use your head is first.
Nope, don't get weird, don'tget weirds first.
Speaker 1 (59:40):
Okay, then use your head, use your head, it'll all
be okay, right, and think like aVulcan, yeah, logic over
emotion, because that's reallywhat our close off is Don't get
weird Right, get it allemotional, use your head, think
logically and it'll all be okay.
We are Vulcans, yeah, we are.
Oh, they can't see me doingthat.
(01:00:00):
I don't know how to do it.
Oh, I can't.
I have a sit.
Speaker 2 (01:00:04):
Nobody can see us doing gazzar hand gestures.
Okay.
Speaker 1 (01:00:10):
And just like that we'll go bye, Bye.
Hello, hello, welcome , welcome.
This is coaching and cocktails,the podcast.
This is Tina, and today I havea new guest host and she's
actually a client of mine andI'm going to let her introduce
herself.
But we started working togethera couple of years ago.
She's a pretty incredibleathlete, super cool, chick, and
(00:23):
she came up with an idea ofsomething she wanted to talk
about.
She was apparently veryfrustrated over something she
saw on the internet or socialmedia.
Actually, you're never even onsocial media, so I don't know
where.
I don't even know where thiscame from, but anyway.
So we're going to have aconversation today, but I'm
going to let Kara introduceherself first.
All right, so my name is KaraRussell.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
I'm a bikini competitor and a triathlete, and
I met Tina a couple of yearsago and I'm going to talk about
her.
She's a triathlete and I metTina a couple of years ago
looking for a posing coach.
She was just that good thatthat poach, that posing session,
ended up turning into a fullcoaching relationship.
So I ditched my firstlackluster coach and got Tina
(01:10):
and it's all been beautifulsince then.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
Yeah, and last year you so our first season together
.
You accomplished earning yourmaster's bikini pro card with
the B-Series, and now we'retaking some time not only to
bulk I hate that word.
We're not bulking, we aregrowing.
We're growing, we're improvingand giving you so we're, we're
(01:37):
balancing our strength training,with you now wanting to do
triathlons instead of justbiathlons, because why?
not add more to it.
I think that's really cool.
But yeah, it's really cool toto see Kiara do her endurance
training and be able to competein, you know, physique
competitions, because reallyeverybody knows that you know,
(02:01):
endurance training andbodybuilding are not the best
bed fellows, because all thatcalorie expenditure going into
cardiovascular exercise versusstrength training and it's
something that's hard to balance.
But I think that honestly, Ithink you have a true genetic
gift in that and I know youalways.
(02:22):
You always complain aboutyou're the big girl, which is a
good thing because you have alot of muscle and your body can
actually withstand it.
So, anyway, it's been reallycool to be able to have an
athlete of your, I think, at theend of the year that's always
come down to you sort ofbalancing my macros.
Speaker 2 (02:43):
So I'm eating correctly.
Everybody told me getting intoit.
This was basically the dumbestthought I had had, that I
couldn't be great at both of thethings, so I was basically
going to sacrifice both of themand I just kind of refused to
accept that as an answer.
So you keep feeding the muscle,I'll keep growing it, and then,
(03:03):
yep, that's what.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
Yeah and yeah.
And you're a great coachable.
You're a true athlete in everysense of the word.
That's what makes it so cool toget to work with you, because
you are coachable and we workedthrough some Not eating
disorders necessarily, butdisordered eating and thought
patterns around food, and Ithink some of that was childhood
(03:26):
based and how you were raisedand some of it was the previous
competition prep and just goingfrom sort of a bro diet to I'm
sure you said you felt guilty onthis last one because you never
suffered and I'm not I mean,but comparably speaking, you're
not suffering, would probablyhave been somebody else's dead
(03:49):
on the side of road.
Speaker 2 (03:51):
Anybody could have done what I just did.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
Yeah, that is true, if they want to do it bad enough
, so speaking of yes.
Speaker 2 (03:58):
What?
What's your question, Henry?
Do you typically do resolutions?
Do you even a New Year'sresolution?
Speaker 1 (04:06):
I don't personally do New Year's resolutions.
One of my clients, slashfriends.
She kind of came up with thisconcept years ago where she just
kind of like has a word, soit's not, it's just like you
know where it might be growth orit might be, and I have Erin
and I talked about this on thepodcast the last couple of times
(04:27):
.
She kind of adopted that tooand what her word of the year is
.
So I don't do resolutions.
I'm sure I did like a millionyears ago, but I don't stick to
them.
So what's the point?
I mean, whatever works for you,I personally am always just
trying to be better than I wasand that's just a daily thing.
(04:49):
But I will say there's thisword, a word has been coming
into my head for no particularreason and I can't get it out of
my head, and so this is theword I'm going with, because I
think this is that's just how itcomes right.
It's just like that's how stuffcomes to us and it's clarity.
I don't.
I do not yet know why.
Clarity I have some ideas, butyeah, so that seems to be the
(05:14):
word that's popping into my headthis January.
How about you?
Speaker 2 (05:19):
So my problem maybe people will relate to this my
problem is everything for me hasto happen on a Monday or the
first, or like.
So New Year's is great becauseI'm going to get real crazy with
something.
Man, that's the ultimate startdate, and New Year's was on a
Monday this year.
I know I have to have Monday.
If you tell me to change yourdiet and it's a Tuesday, I'm
(05:41):
like, okay, on Monday I can't doit today, fair enough.
So I do think that the idea ofNew Year's is like taking that
half to start on Monday andreally amping it up.
So that's what.
That's what I'd gotten thisemail and it was discussing
before and after pictures, andit just sent me down this rabbit
(06:03):
hole of being so angry at whatI feel like women get fed via
media, not just social media,but all media through our lives,
and I really specifically thinkabout if you remember, in the
late 90s, early 2000s, man, wewere eating a fedrant like it
was candy, I mean diet fuel ripfuel, raise his hand.
(06:28):
Oh my gosh girl, I think I washaving, like it was something
crazy like 12 tablets a day, Imean that's all you were doing.
Speaker 1 (06:34):
I literally do not know how I survived taking that
kind of speed on a regular basis.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
We were so jittery so I was in the military at the
time and you want to talk aboutcrazy, have your weight factor
in that, if you're allowed to doyour job right, like you have
to be in this weight standard orwe don't really want you.
So we were like not eating andjust throw in diet fuel and rip
fuel like Ripped fuel.
(07:01):
That's the solution.
Oh, I remember rip fuel sovividly Right.
So you just sit and jitter likea crazy person.
And so then, if you rememberjust a little further into the
early 2000s, there was just alot of hardcore marketing around
(07:21):
diet pills for women, Like itwas ramping up because it was
just such a big business andthey would have these before and
after pictures which Ipersonally was convinced that
they just took fit people andthen had them, like reverse,
diet out and then took thepicture as the before, which is
my conspiracy theory.
(07:41):
But so I got so mad because Ithought all of these women still
are getting these pictures ofpeople like our stage photos.
I don't look like that the dayafter I'm on stage.
I didn't look like that a weekbefore I was on stage.
Those pictures are for stage.
But if all you get is day oneof my prep months earlier and
(08:05):
the day I'm on stage, man, isn'tthat an ideal?
I look at my stage pictures andI'm like, oh man, I'd love to
look like that.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
If only I could go from the left to the right
without doing all the stuff inthe middle, which is kind of the
point of this conversation.
And look and I'm equally asguilty marketing that I've
posted your beginning of preppictures and your on stage
pictures.
That's what everybody does,because it is good marketing,
(08:35):
right?
As a coach, it's like look whatI can do.
I help her go from this to this, and so, although I also like
to post pictures along the way,but most people are not going,
oh well, she looked like this atlike 12 weeks out, and then she
looked like this at like this.
You know what I mean?
Everybody just wants to see thepretty like.
(08:57):
Here you were six months agoand here you were on stage.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
I just it kills me.
There's a commercial out rightnow I won't I won't name the
product, but it's a commercial.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
We're not paying for any.
I'm not.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
I won't tell you.
Won't tell you what the currentproduct is, but there's one,
and the testimonial in thecommercial is the woman said I
had lap band surgery that didn'twork for me.
Then I started taking this.
Oh yeah, and and everybody'sdoing that now.
Yes, I got to tell you, man, ifsurgery didn't work for you.
I don't think an over thecounter pill is the magical
(09:32):
solution?
Speaker 1 (09:32):
Well, sure it is.
If you're going to take it forthe rest of your life, yeah, and
prescription though, and so Iknow we won't talk about that
Other stuff.
Yeah no, I got you, but sowhat's bugging you about this?
That people aren't seeing thework that actually goes into the
(09:53):
before and after?
Speaker 2 (09:55):
Yeah, so I think so.
Let's just say, if somebodyreally followed you, if they saw
the pictures you posted andlooked into you, there are the
stories from everybody of whatthey did and you'll consult with
them and tell them what a planloosely looks like.
If you're marketing women athymaster or rip fuel and we are
(10:20):
going back, Girl, I'm doingsomething, by the way, I really
wish.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
I actually really wish I had kept my thymaster.
Do you know?
That was actually a brilliant.
I mean, it's great, it wasfunctional, right.
I mean, it doesn't need to dolike their inner thighs.
I mean, if you don't have amachine.
It really was fairly effective.
Speaker 2 (10:39):
It's as much as a band would be right, sure,
anyway.
But so my problem is, if youmarket that this thing, this
thing, is the key to getting tothe after, that's just a fib
Like nobody has gone in and justeaten low carb and gotten cut.
(11:00):
That's not how that works.
You don't just lift weights andeat trash and get cut.
That's not how that works.
But I think people get soexcited at the thought of
getting to their after.
They skip thinking through didthis make sense?
Does it make sense that I coulddo this for 10 minutes and
(11:21):
you're not doing anything for 10minutes a day and getting
dramatic results?
Speaker 1 (11:26):
Right, and hence why you know, in any advertisement
you see on TV or what have you,it's like results may vary or
result are typical, right?
So when you look at the fineprint, right, and that's what
everybody likes to skip over,right?
There's all these.
I know you're not on socialmedia but I'm big on like memes
(11:47):
and stuff.
Like I love that shit all overmy house.
I like saying the memes andthings.
But there's one, actuallythere's two, that always, always
really like resonate with me.
There's one that's like youknow, it shows like somebody
who's successful and somebodywho's just starting out just
anything could be career orotherwise and it kind of shows
(12:09):
like all this like it's like aiceberg, it's like the tip of
the iceberg above the water, butnobody sees all that shit
that's underneath of the water.
They just see like oh you, justlike you went from all the way
over here to like the tip oficeberg and they'll see all the
shit that happened in betweenand the drowning and the
failures and all these things.
And then there's the other one,my other favorite one, just
(12:29):
cause I have lupus, it's likeyou know, nobody sees.
They just see what you looklike on the outside and nobody
sees like what is going on, likeliterally the day to day
struggle that people with likechronic diseases and autoimmune
diseases and things like thatdeal with.
And it's the same thing withwhether you're you're trying to
(12:49):
be a bodybuilder or a marathonor an endurance athlete like you
are.
It's easy to see, it's easy tothink that like this picture of
like perfection is where youwant to be, without ever fully
understanding, having not doneit before, what it really takes
to get there right.
(13:10):
And no matter how much I tellclients when I have consults
with them or anything like, youknow the spiel.
I mean you were alreadycompeting when I met you, but
anybody who's like brand newthat comes to me.
I started off saying my jobduring this consult is to
actually get a job during thisconsult, is to actually talk you
out of doing this, because infact, I talk more people out of
(13:34):
it probably than I do into it,because only the right kind of
person is going to still want todo it once I tell them
everything that's actuallyevolved.
And even then and the smartestof people that I've consulted
with you know get into thethroes of it and they're like
like I just couldn't haveimagined, right, it's, it's
(13:55):
cause you don't know.
You just don't know what youdon't know.
Yet you can be like, oh yeah,I'm tough.
Oh yeah, I used to be anathlete in college.
Oh yeah, I know what it's liketo do X, y and Z, but until
you're in the middle of the, youknow the suck of the of a prep,
or you know race training orwhatever you don't know.
And then that's where you knowand to me, like that really is
(14:19):
where athletes are, are made orbroken, right.
It's in those moments whereyou're like, well, this was more
than I thought it was going tobe and we're either going to
keep going forward or we'regoing to not.
But nobody sees that, nobodywants to see that.
Speaker 2 (14:33):
Well, the second marathon I ran, I passed a woman
holding a sign and the signsaid if you train for this
marathon and you're stillmarried, you didn't train hard
enough.
And that is sort of.
When I first got into multisport cause I was so I was doing
two Athalons, which is a runbike run instead of a swim bike
run, which is what triathlonsare I had a coach who said to me
(14:56):
you have to make sure yourmarriage is in a good place,
because a marriage just can'thandle the amount of training
required for the sport.
And it was such a weird thingand I really had a whole
conversation with my husbandlike are you on board, before I
get into this, that it's goingto be kind of a time suck, and
(15:17):
you know I might complain.
And it's the same thing withbodybuilding.
We jokingly always say that thebetter I look, the worse I feel
, because like the day I'mgetting on stage, that's the
best I'm going to look for atleast a year.
But you know, for a while and Ijust feel like garbage.
And so people see that that'sthe picture they want, that's
(15:40):
the thing that they're like ohmy gosh.
And I'm like oh, I felt socrummy, like I just wanted a
donut.
I did not care about any of itthat day.
I cared about it every singleday until then.
But you just come so fatiguedwith the process, and so people
see your pictures they lovestage pictures but they have no
(16:00):
idea what that day looks like,what that prep looks like.
So I say the same thing.
Speaker 1 (16:07):
In fact, I invite clients to bring their spouses,
family members, with them to aconsult, or even, you know,
further down the road, orwhether.
Let me help explain, like, whatthis is all about.
Like, I really encourage all ofmy clients to make sure they
have support, because it's avery selfish sport, so having
the support of your family,whoever lives in the household
(16:30):
with you, your kids, evengetting them on boards, because
there's a lot of sacrifice thatgoes into any extreme sport,
whether it's endurance, racingor bodybuilding or whatever it
is that you do right, that youtake to an extreme and you want
to do very well at it.
There is no balance.
It's just not a thing.
Right Like I don't.
Balance would imply that I cangive equal amounts of attention
(16:54):
and energy to all the things inmy life.
I can balance my work, and Ican balance my home, and I can
balance my athletic pursuits.
No, you cannot right Likesomething is going to give at
any given time.
So the key, though, is thenmaking sure that you're not.
Yes, one does have to get moreattention, but you also cannot
let the other things fall apartin the process, so that's really
(17:16):
the only way to balance them.
They are just not balanced, ifthat makes sense.
So I think that that is areally key thing, and I would
argue pretty strongly that themajority of my clients who have
very supportive spouses, theirspouses actually prefer how they
look when they're not competing100%.
(17:38):
Every day, my husband and Icompeted together and Eric is
like I neither of us like lovedthe other.
I mean, the pictures are great,right, we're so sexy, like it's
all very sexy and whatever, butlike underneath it all, like
neither one, neither of us, hada sex drive, so we fucking cared
what we looked like, cause likewe were touching each other,
cause it was like your sexhormones go out the door, you're
(18:01):
like welcome to competing, havefun with that.
But like neither of us werelike yeah, you look good now,
but like I'm not interested intouching all that hard stuff,
like I would just want we likeeach other softer.
Speaker 2 (18:15):
Yeah Well, I've always said I'd take a dad bod
over a gym bod.
Any day I love a good dad bod,but my husband definitely likes
me heavier.
He was so excited when I got onbulk.
Speaker 1 (18:30):
It's not a bulk.
Stop saying that word.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
So cause he joked all through prep that he was going
to start putting butter in mymouth at night because he was
just like you're just getting soand he kept saying thin.
And I'd say, not thin, lean.
Like I'm not really gettingthin, I'm getting lean.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
Yeah, we do need to coach our family and friends to
not call us skinny and to notcall us thin.
Well, that's what I always saidit's a weakness.
Speaker 2 (18:58):
I said because I'm keeping all my muscle, I don't
want to look thin, I want tolook lean, cause I want to have
muscle.
And so he was just so thrilledwhen I started gaining weight
again and of course I'm like, Imean, it feels kind of fast.
And he's like, no, no, no, letit come on.
Speaker 1 (19:19):
And yet we beat ourselves up because we are,
because, speaking of before andafters, right, we compare
ourselves to our own ourselves,our afters, our after afters,
right.
So it's like when our after isnow the before, right, so the
after stage pictures, that theprogress goes in the other
direction.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
If you looked at your friends pictures, your friends
said, well, this is in highschool and this is after I had
five kids 20 years later.
You wouldn't be like.
Why do they not look the same?
You'd be like.
Obviously they're not going tobe the same, but somehow your
own you're like.
But that was me.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
Why don't I look like I did when I was 17?
Right Now that I'm 50.
I don't know.
That doesn't make any sense,mm-mm.
Speaker 2 (20:09):
No.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
So the key point here that you want to, that what's
kind of like the key thing thatlike is was really driving you
wanting to have thisconversation today.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Well, I think it's.
You know it's great if you havesome imagery that focuses you
or that motivates you to getstarted.
But I think this fixation onextrinsic motivation, the idea
that how you look, should be thething you're aiming for.
If that gets you started, letit get you started.
(20:42):
But I am never happier thanwhen I see somebody really
overweight at the gym that isjust killing themselves to walk
on the treadmill.
Because I'm like you got inhere and did this.
It is so intimidating to gointo a gym and to come in unfit.
To me that's the greatest badgeof honor.
Like I want to tell everyonehow proud I am when I see that
(21:04):
happen.
So for me, you know, sing thepraises of the work people are
doing, but how they look is justmeaningless.
And especially if you're seeinghow they look on social media,
what filter you're getting ifthey took 35 pictures to get one
that they liked, like you, justdon't know.
Speaker 1 (21:24):
Who are with me, took the fucking picture right.
Like I mean, there are timesthat I don't, you know, I might,
I don't know like, oh, I havethis picture from competing, or
a photo shoot that I did, youknow, 10 years ago and, yeah,
I'll share it, or whatever.
And people are like, oh, youlook so great and I'm like,
that's not me.
You literally just saw apicture of me yesterday, like on
(21:45):
flex Friday or whatever.
Like there, you know, that'snot what I look like.
This was like 15 years ago,right, but having you know,
having you and I were talkingbefore we hopped on here, some
social media literacy, like you,you just have to look at
everything and not just socialmedia media, especially now with
(22:08):
AI, because between filterswere, so I don't know how to use
filters, so I can promise you,everything that I post is me.
I mean, unless it was a, unlessit was a photo shoot that I did,
the photographer did somethingto the picture, but I mean I
don't.
I don't know how to use filters, so I don't use them.
Ai I have not used AI yet forto enhance a photo of me or turn
(22:34):
me into a model or a cartooncharacter or any of those things
.
But but we have to look ateverything and and be really
discerning about what it is thatwe're looking at.
It's no different than fakenews, right?
So we need to look at everypicture on the fucking interweb
as fake news until provenotherwise.
Speaker 2 (22:53):
Well, and it was endorsing people, because how
many times do people say this isthe answer there, and then you
come to find out they weren'teven using it.
They were just paid to saysomething's great.
Speaker 1 (23:03):
Exactly Right.
I mean, there is no afterpicture without a lot of work in
the middle, regardless, right?
Whether people are also have tobe concerned about, like, what
did they do, right?
Did they do something extremethat wasn't healthy?
Were they taking, you know,metformin and we go V and like
(23:24):
whatever the fuck elseeverybody's taking now?
Were they, you know, doing anynumber?
Were they taking cocaine?
Were they taking performanceenhancing drugs?
That's probably my biggest petpeeve right now.
Like dramatic weight losses, Ithink most people can look at
that and easily chalk it up tolike, oh well, she probably took
(23:44):
, you know, one of the newweight loss drugs or you know
like you know, like KellyClarkson and Oprah Winfrey now
have you know finally admitted.
Yeah, nobody, nobody goes from250 pounds to 150 pounds in like
eight weeks without doingsomething right.
This is not a thing.
But in the sport ofbodybuilding, I think what
drives me batshit crazy and hasforever, is you know people who
(24:09):
are like look at the progress Imade in one year.
I see this all the time.
It really drives me nutsbecause there's so many natural
athletes that went to the darkside and started taking
performance enhancing drugs andyou see the growth on some women
I'm talking about women inparticular that they make in
(24:30):
these very short periods of timeright.
And then I have clients thatare like well, you told me I
can't grow that much in a mirror.
Well, you can't, you fuckingcannot, without taking drugs.
It's just not a thing.
But nobody puts that disclaimeron their pictures ever.
Maybe if performance enhancingdrugs were so great and lots of
people take them right, whyisn't anybody proudly stamping
(24:52):
their photo saying this physiquebrought to you by?
Yes, they work hard.
I am not going to deny that.
In fact, most people takingperformance enhancing drugs.
The truth is they work harderthan natural athletes.
Why?
Because they fucking can.
Because they're takingperformance enhancing drugs
right.
You can train seven days a weekand eat 50,000 calories if
you're, you know if you'retaking the shit.
(25:12):
So they are actually probablyworking harder than we are.
It's not cheating, it's none ofthose things, but it's.
You know.
If it's so great and wonderfuland we're not embarrassed that
we're doing them, why not slap alabel on it and say this
physique brought to you by awhole lot of hard work and also
growth hormone and this and this, and X and Y and Z, you know be
(25:34):
one?
Well, one because it's illegaland two that's probably mostly
illegal.
But it drives me nuts because itthat is where, especially in
the body sort of bodybuilding,where everybody is getting so
wrapped around the fucking axlethinking that this is true that
(25:54):
I can go from A to Z in a yeareven and put on 20 pounds of
muscle and natural athletesimply cannot do that.
And so, but nobody, you knowpeople look at it and they hire
XYZ coach because XYZ coach,could you know meet these people
(26:14):
?
Look this way.
Or you know, got them this procard or what have you, never
knowing until they're knee deepin it.
Or you know, thousands ofdollars into it, what it really
took to get between those.
There's no honesty in the sportwhen it comes to that.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
So my favorite are the number of articles online
that talk about how youshouldn't gain more than 10
pounds in your off season, andthat you can gain muscle but
never gain more than 10 pounds.
I gotta tell you the truth 10pounds is pretty easy to come by
when you're reversing.
Speaker 1 (26:48):
I think 10 pounds over the night.
Right, I thought it to you.
Speaker 2 (26:52):
So you see these, these NPC girls who I mean look,
look, phenomenal.
I'm in no way saying they don'tlook incredible, but you cannot
tell me that you are remainingthat lean, adding any muscle,
adding any muscle and gainingless than 10 pounds in an off
season.
Speaker 1 (27:10):
naturally, Right Now, so unlikely that they're doing
it naturally.
So that's the first.
We will call it lying.
We'll call it what is it lyingby omission, right?
We'll just call it omittingfacts, right.
Speaker 2 (27:24):
We'll just call it.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
I'm just not telling you what I'm doing, right,
that's all, and you know, andthat's their business.
They can do that.
But to the naked eye, right,the inexperienced eye, the
inexperienced person, it's likeoh, it just gives this false
sense of what is actuallypossible in that period of time.
And even for natural athletes,right Like that, aren't gaining
(27:44):
any weight or aren't evenactually taking bulking seasons
God damn, that word Aren'ttaking, you know, growth seasons
.
I see it all the.
I see pro athletes and peoplelook up to these and again,
specifically, women and men,people look up to these.
Women.
They're like, we'll even saynatural athletes, because I see
it all the time and they justcompete and they compete and
(28:07):
they compete and they take.
Listen, if you competed lastyear, in 2023, right, or in 2024
now, if you competed at anypoint in 2023 and you're getting
back on stage in spring of 2024, you didn't take a fucking off
season.
It's not a thing.
You took a couple of months toput on a shit ton of weight.
(28:29):
You sat at that shit ton ofweight for like two months and
now you're gonna, now you'regonna start dieting it off again
, right?
So if you did, if you, if youdid anything in a 12 month
period, you didn't give yourselftime to put on muscle, and then
you're, you're leading, youknow, the untrained individual
to think well, that's what youdo, right, I just compete and
(28:50):
compete and compete and that'sit again.
So go ahead and get it back tolike nobody sees what's
happening between the before andafter and all the other afters,
and then what happens when youhave shut down your entire you
know, you've shut down yourhormones and you've shut down
your gut and you've shut downany chance of living a nice,
long, happy life, because thisis what you decided to do, like
(29:13):
over and over and over againthroughout this sport.
And nobody, nobody sees that.
And I think it's irresponsiblefor a lot of these pro athletes,
pro natural athletes I'llprobably get shit for this to
compete all year, every year.
Speaker 2 (29:29):
Well.
So we talked about this becausewhen I came to, I'd finished up
a show and we were reversingand I said to you, I really feel
like I need a show on the booksfor this next year to stay
motivated to keep going, cause Ijust have so much on my plate.
And you said, okay, well thengo the very end of the year,
cause this was in June.
You're like, go very end, so weat least have almost a year and
(29:52):
a half.
And you said I really wouldn'tdo that, but if you need that,
that's at least push it all theway to the end of the year.
So that's what we did.
So this prep I actually got somuch leaner than I got on my
first prep and so much easier,but that's side note got a lot
leaner.
And the very tail end of prep,like the last two weeks, was the
(30:16):
first place where I startedrealizing that my body was maybe
over, like I'm over prep.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
This is it.
Speaker 2 (30:24):
And it clicked so hard for me that you can't do it
year after year, like you can'tdo it 22, 23, 24, because the
amount of time it takes toreverse and normalize, just
normalize.
You have to do that before youbegin growing, and if you ain't
(30:44):
growing, all you're doing is theexact same package year after
year.
Speaker 1 (30:48):
You had probably a worse package.
Right, because you're sodepleted Because you never gave
your body, your mind, yourfinances, your life, your family
time off.
Right, like it's not just aboutmuscle growth either.
Right, like it is aboutrecovering every aspect of your
body.
It is mentally taxing, it isphysically taxing, right, it's
(31:10):
like we talk all the time abouthormones and like it just you
know every, every, every aspectof it.
So, and yet you see people doit all the time.
And then I have clients thatare just like I, have clients
leave because I'm like I justdon't support doing that over
and over and over again, becauseI can't help you be your best.
If we're just running you intothe ground and then we got to
(31:32):
diet harder, we got to do morecardio, we're just going to lose
more muscle.
You're just going to end uplooking worse.
And look, I can tell you fromexperience because this is
exactly what I did when Icompeted, because nobody told me
not to, right.
So I competed in fall of 2005,spring of 2006, fall of 2006.
And then I tore my bicep and Itore my shoulder why Might you
(32:01):
ask, over?
Because I was depleted andover-changed Right, and my body
was like hello, can you fuck offand just take a beat for a
minute, and of course then wedon't listen and we do all kinds
of shit.
But that it's just a recipe forwhat not to do.
And I see it.
Look, I've been in this sportfor almost 20 years.
I have seen athletes get onstage over and over and over
(32:27):
again.
I can tell you the athletes thetop natural athletes will take
two to three years off betweenshows, right, right.
And I see more men be smartabout this than women, and I
think a lot of it with women isbecause one we start, this whole
thing becomes part of ouridentity, that it becomes this
(32:50):
like I don't want to be fat inmy off season, so as soon as I
gain the weight I'm going todiet it back off.
It's just like.
So it's all the things that gointo this.
So I do see more.
Speaker 2 (32:58):
I just want to note that you air quoted that because
nobody else saw that happen.
Air quote yeah, she didn'tactually need that.
Thank you for that, Air Quotes.
I didn't mean that.
Speaker 1 (33:04):
So I always forget that.
People can't seem to be goingair quotes In air quotes.
You got fat in your off seasonI see more men do this but
really, really top level naturalmale bodybuilders take two,
three years off, right, Like andit's just.
I think the social media hasdone really great things for the
(33:28):
sport of natural bodybuildingand I think social media has
done really harmful things tothe sport of natural
bodybuilding specifically, notthe sport, but the people right,
Because I think too many peoplesee people competing over and
over again and think that's whatthey should be doing, or they
just don't have the rightguidance, right, so their
(33:49):
coaches are encouraging them todo silly shit, or you have
something to say.
Speaker 2 (33:53):
Yeah.
So what I wonder is if part ofit too is that you know, what we
see is that every year there'san Olympia, every year there's
an Arnold Classic, like thereare these enormous shows that
happen annually.
And I mean, I followed malebodybuilding long before I was
considering competing, and soyou'd see Ronnie Coleman.
(34:16):
Every year at the Olympia,you'd see Jay Cutler every year.
Speaker 1 (34:20):
Have you seen Ronnie Coleman now?
Speaker 2 (34:22):
I oh my honey.
Have you seen the documentary?
Speaker 1 (34:27):
The documentary is so good, it's so crushing.
Speaker 2 (34:29):
Have you seen it?
It's heartbreaking it isheartbreaking.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
In fact, that's actually exactly what I think
everybody listening to thispodcast needs to do Go watch it.
As soon as you're donelistening to this, you need to
go watch.
I actually forget what it'scalled, but I think it's on
Netflix.
I think so too, and if youreally wanna see what
over-trading and over-druggingand this constant need to be
(34:55):
competing looks like, that'swhat it looks like, in a male
form.
Speaker 2 (35:01):
As an older man, I think.
If I remember he was squatting800 pounds.
If I remember correctly, Likebending the bar 800 pounds, pure
insanity.
If anybody is not familiar forany reason with Ronnie Coleman,
he was a superhero in real life.
I mean well over six feet tall,like 300, I think 325 pounds
(35:21):
when he compete.
Just this mass.
And they were putting on nowheavy drug use but they were
putting on 20 pounds of muscle ayear.
Speaker 1 (35:28):
Yeah, and they could compete every year at the
Olympia and they could compete,they competed all year long.
Speaker 2 (35:34):
But see, I think that's why people think it's an
annual thing, because these guyswere doing big shows that were
heavily covered year after yearMonica Brandt, Kelly Ryan, those
girls were doing Olympia and Imean the Arnold every year.
So I think people reallythought, just like the 12 week
(35:56):
prep is a steroid cycle really.
I mean, the reason people thinkyou can prep in 12 weeks is
because of testosterone use.
I think that's the same reasonpeople think they can do an
annual show is because we sawthese pro athletes for so long.
Speaker 1 (36:12):
Well, we see it now.
We see it in naturalbodybuilding If you watch the
Jorton Cup every year, the OCDJorton Cup, which, like or WNBF
worlds or any of the really bigshows, every pro is gunning for
that show every year.
I'm already seeing people whocompeted in last years end of
(36:32):
season kind of pro circuitstarting to get ready for this
year.
Which means, like we just said,there was no off season taken.
There was no recovery happening.
You do not recover in a monthor two months or three months or
four months.
I mean three to six months.
The studies are out there andthere's not a lot done on women,
unfortunately.
But you can look at studies onmen and see how long it takes
(36:52):
for their hormonal profiles torecover, right.
It's not even just a matter oflike, oh well, I gained my 20
pounds back and right.
It doesn't even work that way.
There's this really, reallygreat study that a group of
natural bodybuilders did.
I think it was Andrew Parduewho did it, I think, but he did
his own prep and he did bloodwork before and he did blood
(37:14):
work after and then like.
So the goal was to kind of seewell, are your hormones
recovered when you get to acertain body fat percentage, or
rather where they were at thatbody fat percentage before you
started cutting, right, so, andthe results were no right.
(37:35):
So if you were 20% body fatbefore you started cutting and
your hormones were like, oh,it's great, your hormone profile
is perfect, you're a 22 yearold male and this is fantastic.
And then afterwards back up to20% body fat or whatever it was,
oh no, the hormones were stilltanked, and this was like three
and six months afterwards, right, or you know they're starting
(37:55):
to recover, but you know more orless not where they should be,
so it really doesn't have to.
I think a lot of people thinkthat, right, and you know,
there's just so much more thatgoes into it.
And a lot of people don't getblood work done, and you know,
so there's, you know, reallyunderstanding what's going on
with them, and a lot of peoplewon't know until the damage is
(38:15):
already done.
Right, so until I mean, Isuffer from it now, right, like,
do I have regrets?
Do I wish I had gone back anddone things differently?
Yes and no.
I mean it wasn't going to be athing.
So there's no reason to feelregretful over any decisions I
made about how I competed backin the day, cause you know when
you know better, you do better.
We didn't know.
I'm not gonna blame myself fordoing something I didn't.
(38:38):
You know, I smoked when I was13 to 32 because cigarettes were
not bad for you Right, and seatbelts were unnecessary.
Speaker 2 (38:48):
It's just government conspiracy, right I?
Speaker 1 (38:50):
mean who needs seat belts Right.
Well so, and cigarettes arefine.
Speaker 2 (38:55):
I watched a Bikini show, so I think the one I say
was before my very first show.
I had watched this show thatwas being broadcast and they had
a pro competitor that washelping with commentary and she
said I love a 20 week prepbecause I can really just take
out candy the first week.
And she was saying these crazythings.
(39:17):
This girl like lookedphenomenal.
I was like 20 weeks, geez, ohPete, cause I did a 16 week prep
and I was like this is forever.
And now I can honestly say I'drather do 20 or 24 weeks and
just slow roll it because shewas dead.
Right, yeah, just take awaycandy.
Speaker 1 (39:33):
The first, the best prep I ever did was by from the
start of my cutting to my firstshow.
I think was about 20.
I think it's 20, maybe 23, 24weeks and then I did two more
shows that season, like a weekor two after.
I think the whole prep wasclose to 30 weeks and it was the
(39:54):
best I ever looked.
It was the best I ever felt.
I never felt deprived.
I didn't have a single bingeepisode because there wasn't a
single prep.
I ever did that.
I didn't.
I had binge eating disorder.
So there, you know, it wassomething that happened because
I was so fucking deprived,because I was doing 12 week
preps and I posted a sample.
I found my 2010 diet.
(40:17):
You had to get on social mediaso you can see the thing that I
posted and it was terrifying andpeople were posted like I would
have died on it.
It was like literally everythird day I would get like a
bowl of rice and like someoatmeal and a banana.
I only got carbs every threedays, right, and it was so it
(40:37):
was insane, but I could eatsomething like 40 almonds.
You better believe I ate thebiggest fucking.
You know some almonds are likethese little cause you were even
weighing them then you werejust counting them.
Speaker 2 (40:48):
Oh no, oh no, it was like 40 fucking almonds, I'm
gonna eat the whole fuckingalmond tray.
Speaker 1 (40:52):
It's like the biggest almonds, right, I could get,
but anyway, I don't even knowwhere I was going.
Oh, I used to do, we did the 12week preps and I know for a
fact you can see my pictures Iwas always lean, I always did
well, but was I really wellconditioned?
No, not, until I did a 20 plusweek prep, and it depends on the
(41:15):
person.
I have a client right now.
She's got over 30 pounds tolose.
Guess what we're doing?
A minimum of a 35 week prep.
Right, I didn't tell you togain 30 pounds, right?
That's just.
That's just what we have to do.
And if we're lucky, we lose apound a week.
I have to give it at least aprep, especially for a new
athlete.
Now for sure, I will caveatthat and say I have athletes I
(41:35):
have worked with athletes who Ican do a 12 week prep with
because I know their body.
We actually know they do betterwith a hard and fast than a
slow burn.
And so, again, everybody isdifferent, which is why we
cannot say everybody can do itin 12.
Any more than we can sayeverybody can do it in 20.
(41:56):
Right, it really is very, very,very dependent.
So again, it's just one morething that nobody sees between
the before and the after picture, but so that's also on the
timeline though.
Speaker 2 (42:08):
So we have to reverse diet and normalize, then we
have to do growth, then you haveto leave all that period of
time to cut.
So if you're talking six monthsof cutting, that's half a year.
Which means if it took you halfa year just to get to where
you're building and half a yearof cutting, that's a full year.
So just to try to gain threepounds of muscle can take an
(42:32):
entire year of a perfecttraining and diet.
Speaker 1 (42:37):
But that's the key, right.
Yeah, an entire year, we'retalking, I would say 12 months
of being in a calorie excess, orthe average female, not the
genetically gifted or theectomer if that's a harder time
putting on muscle, right.
Three to five pounds of muscleIf you're lucky.
12 months in a calorie excess,not 12 months between shows,
(43:01):
right.
When I see people say I don'tknow off season and it's like
three months, I was like whatthe fuck are you talking about
that?
Is not an off season.
Speaker 2 (43:09):
That's not even reverse.
Speaker 1 (43:11):
I mean no.
I mean technically, you shouldbe fully reversed in like six
weeks, but then it's justbuilding up to maintenance and
growth.
But I just, I don't know, itmakes me crazy.
And then people either listento me or they don't, and I do my
(43:31):
best, at least with my clientsand my athletes, to say, ok,
well, you know, I didn't sugarcoat it.
I'm like, well, yeah, but weare losing out on being able to
grow, we're losing out on beingable to do any number of things.
So if that's really what youwant to do, we'll give it a shot
.
Speaker 2 (43:49):
But I make the promises right.
But so this big timeline sothat's the other thing is when
you get somebody that says insix weeks I went from 200 pounds
to 110.
They're just standing therewith their, you know, standing
in a single leg of a pair ofpants.
If you do things like thatreally quickly, if you do things
(44:09):
like that to me on your own ishazardous Because, like in
medicine, we don't treat familymembers because you just can't
make clear decisions whenemotions evolve.
Man, get a coach.
You know I have an endurancecoach, I have you for strength
and nutrition.
I'm a big believer that anoutside observer can give you
(44:30):
objective data to utilize andfunction better than you're ever
going to figure out on your own.
Speaker 1 (44:37):
I never competed without a coach.
I've always had a coach.
Speaker 2 (44:40):
I think I could put it all together honestly, Like I
have the knowledge for it.
I could.
Speaker 1 (44:43):
I don't want to.
Speaker 2 (44:44):
I don't have the emotional bandwidth to control
myself.
I need somebody else to help.
Speaker 1 (44:50):
Yeah, 100%.
Well, I think we've got ourpoint across.
We've been talking for about 45minutes or so now, so what's
the main point you want to getacross to people?
If people take nothing awayfrom this conversation, it was
the main thing you wanteverybody to leave here and
(45:10):
really think about, or know.
Speaker 2 (45:13):
I would say if you're going to use any of the stuff
that's being thrown at you forthe new year as we're all
getting motivated and into thisnext year, use that stuff as a
jumping off point to bemotivated to start.
Do not compare yourself againstanybody else's progress,
against your own old pictures orhopeful pictures.
(45:34):
Use all of that stuff just as amotivator to get into the gym.
But then start goal settingbased on measurable things and
not weight goals, speed goals,power goals, things that are
real accomplishments that don'tinvolve the scale or the size
pants you're wearing, buthealth-related.
Speaker 1 (45:58):
If you focus on that, everything else does come.
If you focus on eating for yourhealth or eating for
performance and training foryour health and training for
performance whether it'sstrength performance or
endurance performance orwhatever your performance goal
is the other stuff will come andthe physical appearance will
(46:21):
come from that.
Speaker 2 (46:24):
The great irony is I always thought the one hole in
my life was I didn't look how Iwanted to look.
I mean, from age eight Ithought, man, if I would just be
thinner, my whole life wouldcome together and I really
believed everything in my lifewould fall into place.
And then what I found was themore I looked exactly how I
(46:45):
wanted to look, the more it sortof bothered me that people
cared about how I looked.
Like when people would say,especially if a man says you're
hot and I'm like, this isliterally the dumbest thing you
could say to me.
You didn't say I was funny orinteresting or you look strong,
yeah, I mean, it's just You'refast.
So all of these things Ithought were going to be the
(47:08):
thing I really wanted.
As I actually approachedreaching that goal, I realized
none of that mattered at all,and all of this time it was just
that it was an unobtainablegoal, and so I could perpetually
put the fault on that.
As long as I couldn't be that,I could say that was why I
wasn't happy, that was why Iwasn't successful, that was why
(47:30):
whatever, you weren't goodenough at X Right, and then you
reach it and you're like, oh, itnever even mattered.
But you won't know that untilyou get there, but it really
doesn't matter.
Speaker 1 (47:41):
No, it's what the scale says.
I mean, it's a very useful toolfor weight loss, it's a useful
tool for measuring differenttypes of things, but not nothing
, nothing else Significantoutside of bodybuilding and you
need to lose some body fat oryour obese and you need to
(48:02):
reduce some body fat.
But really we should be lookingat health markers and strength
and things like that.
That's why I encourage so manyof my athletes I mean, I'm glad
you already have other sports,but I have a lot that get into
powerlifting in their growthseasons.
It gives them a reason to eatand just focus on strength,
(48:26):
which also has an added benefitof gaining more muscle.
So why not?
We have a client that did do amarathon in between shows.
It gave her something else tofocus on.
Like you can balance all ofthese things.
But we have to get away fromeverything being so obsessive
about aesthetics, even thoughthis particular sport is about
(48:47):
aesthetics.
It's only about aesthetics onthat one day, one day or however
many shows you're doing thatmany stages.
That's the only time it mattersand it has nothing to do with
who you are as a person or howgreat you are.
I have a client who she sent mea check-in once and she's
(49:08):
getting more and morecomfortable again.
Like you know, she's like thisis the best I've ever felt and I
never thought it'd feel thisgood and await this heavy Right.
Because we associate how wefeel with what the scale says,
like I'm somehow going to feeldifferent when it says this
versus this, these false goalsthat we set.
And she's like well, I want todo a mini cut and you know,
we've been in her growth seasonfor a while and I mean she eats
(49:33):
a ton of food, so I was like wecould do a little mini cut and
suck our whole thing.
And then she got down to likeshe sits around like 133, 134,
and she got down to like 128.
And she's like I don't think Ineed to do this again.
She said, you know, she said Iachieved that goal, right.
She said, and it was amazing, Iwalked into work and nobody
celebrated me for it.
(49:54):
Nope, she said there was nofanfare, nobody treated me
different, my life didn't changebecause I was 128 versus 133 or
135.
She's like so it was this huge,like epiphany for her that she
realized.
She was like I'm really kind oflike being at like 133, 135.
(50:15):
Better, get to eat more.
I feel stronger, I'm sleepingbetter, like you know, whatever
the case may be.
Plus, nobody gives a fuck ifI'm 122 pounds.
Nobody celebrated me for it,right, because nobody fucking
cares, right?
It just isn't, and it just it'sthese false like ideals that we
put on ourselves, because thisis just how we were born and
bred, right, like it's just.
There is a.
(50:35):
There is a bazillion dollarindustry out there that does not
want here.
If you hear nothing else I sayon this podcast, I've said it a
million times there is abazillion dollar industry out
there that goes broke the minute.
Women feel like they're enough,wherever they are.
Yep, that is some powerful shit.
(50:57):
If you feel good about who youare, what you're doing, what you
, what you look like, whateverthe case may be, the system is
not set up for that, becausethere's a whole, there's some
real rich fucking people goingto get real fucking poor if
women suddenly believe they'reenough.
Do you have.
(51:17):
Wouldn't you say the same?
Speaker 2 (51:19):
Yeah I say I don't think you need to love where you
are necessarily.
You just need to be okay withthe thought that you're moving
yourself towards where you wantto be.
Speaker 1 (51:27):
Absolutely, you don't have to.
I do not love how I look allthe time, right I mean.
But I'm okay with where I amRight.
Speaker 2 (51:35):
Well, so I just think that this idea of when we talk
about people being okay is notto say you have to love
everything as it is.
Nope, you have to accept whereit is.
So my husband got me watchingStar Trek, which was never, ever
, ever the kind of show Ithought I would watch.
(51:57):
So this is new Star Trek, andso this whole Vulcan thought of
using logic versus emotion itjust started to really sink in
with me in this way where Ibegan looking at things like
let's remove all of the emotionabout this decision, or how I
feel about it, and how would Ilook at it if it was somebody
(52:20):
else telling me and there'ssomething about removing this
level of emotion where you canjust go yeah, I mean, that's
what I told you, right, it isscale weight is a data point, so
we're just going to look at itas a data point and I'm refusing
to let it determine my dailyworth because it doesn't matter,
because, because it doesn't,Right, right.
Speaker 1 (52:43):
And the fact of the matter is it doesn't and take I
love that you said that, becauseit's you know, I tell clients
this all the time is like takingthe emotion out of food.
Right, food doesn't have morals.
Your body doesn't have morals.
It's not good when it's thisway and bad when it this way.
You're not a bad person becauseyou're this way and are a good
(53:04):
person because you're whateverright Like we.
I love that.
I think that is brilliant.
So if we all have to startadopting the Vulcan way of
thinking, man, you should gowatch the show.
I don't know, it's not my kindof show at all.
No, it's not my name, but thethought process is yeah, right,
like, stop taking the take theemotion out of it.
(53:26):
It just is what it is, rightand and it's just like, do I
have a little more belly fatthan I used to?
Yup, and that's it, right,right, and there's no other,
there's no other thing that hasto go with that, right, I, I, so
it's.
(53:46):
You know, it's like radicalacceptance, right?
So we use the term radicalacceptance or just acceptance in
general.
It really does.
When it's kind of like takingall the exacerbated emotions out
of everything, again, youreally have to get on social
media.
This was very poignant, becauseI posted it just yesterday I
just yesterday I'll send it toyou because you'll like it and
it was like here's, this is whatacceptance looks like.
(54:07):
And on the left hand side itwas like it's right as like a
little cloud and it was raining,and under the cloud is raining.
I hate the rain.
I really wish it wasn't raining.
When it's raining, I feel thisand I, and raining makes me sad,
and rain it's just like allthese like about the rain.
And on the right hand side itsays it's raining.
It just said yup, right.
So again it.
You know that it's just a.
(54:28):
This is about rain.
It wasn't about our bodies, butit's the same thing, right?
I don't let sitting in trafficbother me anymore.
I used to.
I used to lose my shit Right.
So I believe that the fact thatI'm just like a much more
mindful person and I'm just sofocused on again, just like this
Cause, you can't control it, Ican't do anything about the fact
(54:51):
that somebody just had a wreckup here in front of me and there
days a whole lot shittier thanmine, and here I am sitting in
traffic and I'm going to be late.
Oh well, right, I'm sitting intraffic.
Yup, right, I'm going to getthere.
Yup, it's the same thing I'vebeen trying to adopt.
Everybody lasted me, becauseeverybody who's followed me for
years knows I hate the fuckingcold, right.
(55:11):
So?
But the more you focus emotionon something like that, the more
I say I hate the cold, the moreI am miserable about the cold.
The more that I think about howmiserable I am about the cold,
the colder I am and the moremiserable I am.
If I'm just like it's cold out,yup, you know what I mean.
(55:33):
Like it's cold, I stand outsidefor hours, three, four hours at
a time, in the cold, in therain, with these horses Right,
it's something I love to do.
It's sometimes physicallymiserable, absolutely.
But if all I do is think abouthow physically miserable I am,
I'm missing out on a whole lotof other shit that's going on in
this environment and I'm justmiserable.
(55:54):
So, yeah, I'm cold, we justokay, I just accept that, I
embrace it.
Right, like we kind of embracesome of these things Just like
okay.
This is just where we are.
Speaker 2 (56:02):
So I feel like there's some rooting in
gratitude for physicality aswell.
There have been so many timesI've been running and I will, in
my brain, thank my legs forbeing able to run, because I
think of how many people wouldkill just to be able to walk.
And here I am, using my legs torun and I am so thankful to my
(56:26):
body that it lets me work.
People who've ever been injuredcan really appreciate that you
didn't recognize how good thingswere until you broke something
Absolutely.
Or you get the flu and you'relaid up and you're like gosh, I
didn't realize how healthy I wasuntil I got really sick, yep.
So I do think there's gratitudeeven in the things that are the
(56:49):
suck.
Speaker 1 (56:50):
I mean, I even the things we don't love, right,
like the same thing with, like acompetition prep.
Yeah, you can be miserable onthe diet the whole time, right,
or?
Speaker 2 (56:59):
you can choose to.
Speaker 1 (57:00):
Just you know you chose to do it right.
You don't have to it.
Just it just is right, like wedon't have to focus on how much
it sucks all the time, becausewe focus how much it sucks all
the time and how hungry you are,guess what it's going to suck
and you're going to be hungryright, oh, you get so much
hungrier.
Right and just be grateful thatyou can right.
Yeah, have gratitude that youhave the ability to make a
(57:24):
choice to starve yourself.
Speaker 2 (57:27):
Right, yeah, I get to the truth.
It's the most expensive versionof dieting.
Speaker 1 (57:32):
you could do it is Right, but I mean, think about
it.
You think about it in thoseterms that you, we're blessed
enough to sit here and talkabout purposely reducing our
calories, to look a certain way,right, where in?
Yes, there are starving peopleall over the world, right, who
would really love to just haveenough food to eat, let alone be
(57:52):
able to choose, right, and I amnow going to purposely make
myself hungry, right?
Yeah, sounds pretty fuckingridiculous, doesn't it?
And so when we, when we adoptthe gratitude and we adopt this
sort of radical acceptance ofthings and we also look at
everything we're on social mediaand media and otherwise, you
(58:13):
know, as fake news until provenotherwise, right, really like
having some literacy about thewhole thing.
Yeah, it just changes yourperception on, I mean, really
you can use this in any way, inany, any part of your life, not
just bodybuilding or endurance,sports or, you know, scenic
traffic or being in the cold.
Some people would kill to be inthe cold right now because
(58:36):
they're in the desert, I'm sure.
Speaker 2 (58:38):
Right.
Speaker 1 (58:39):
Somebody out there loves the cold, all right.
Well, this was a really funconversation.
Do you want to join me foranother podcast sometime?
This was fun Anytime, I think,because, since you know, brandi
is so busy with her kids andstuff right now, like we just
haven't had time for her and Ito sit down and do podcasting.
So I'm just going to keepinviting.
So I'll put it out there, likeif I have other clients or
(59:01):
people I don't know and you wantto introduce me and you have a
topic you want to talk aboutStranger.
Yeah, stranger danger?
There's no stranger than me.
So if anybody wants to, isthere something like a burning
topic they want to talk about?
I think it would be really coolto you know, have some
different co-hosts on.
So if you have another topicyou want to talk about, let me
(59:22):
know and hopefully we'll getsome feedback on this and I
think people will like it.
I think people will.
I think it'll resonate with alot of people.
So do you know our sign off?
Speaker 2 (59:33):
Okay, I'm trying to think which of the lines that
start use your head is first.
Nope, don't get weird, don'tget weirds first.
Speaker 1 (59:40):
Okay, then use your head, use your head, it'll all
be okay, right, and think like aVulcan, yeah, logic over
emotion, because that's reallywhat our close off is Don't get
weird Right, get it allemotional, use your head, think
logically and it'll all be okay.
We are Vulcans, yeah, we are.
Oh, they can't see me doingthat.
(01:00:00):
I don't know how to do it.
Oh, I can't.
I have a sit.
Speaker 2 (01:00:04):
Nobody can see us doing gazzar hand gestures.
Okay.
Speaker 1 (01:00:10):
And just like that we'll go bye, Bye.
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