May 15, 2025 • 30 mins
This week on Cocktails, Tangents & Answers, we’re asking what's the worst marketing advice we’ve ever heard, and why is it so bad?
Cocktail: Lemon Drop
Ingredients
• 2 ounces vodka
• 1/2 ounce triple sec
• 1 ounce lemon juice, freshly squeezed
• 1 ounce simple syrup
• Garnish: sugar rim
Directions
1. Coat the rim of a cocktail glass with sugar and set aside (do this a few minutes ahead so the sugar can dry and adhere well to the glass).
2. Add the vodka, triple sec, lemon juice and simple syrup to a shaker with ice and shake until well-chilled.
3. Strain into the prepared glass.
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Hosts: Rich Mackey & Catelin Drey
Producer: Zac Hazen
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
all right, another episode of cocktails, tangents
and answers coming your way, heyzach hello.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
This time we're recording in the morning, so
we're getting.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
We're getting our coffee as opposed to our
cocktail I why don't you have abranded cup?
Do you not have a branded mugat home?
Speaker 2 (00:24):
I do.
I just grabbed the first mug Isaw when I got my coffee before
this episode.
Merch Merch, I like the.
Yetis, they're really good.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
I love these.
So I got these because we hadan order that I needed to add to
, because everybody generally,just for the record, everyone
generally gets one with theirname on it.
I think I've missed a couple ofpeople, but, um, I had I
ordered like it was one or twoand I needed like five for the
free shipping, and so instead ofjust being like, oh, I'll pay
for shipping, I'm like no, let'sget like three more mugs.
(00:54):
So I got these little ones andI love them.
I love this orange color it wasa limited edition color, um, and
the the stainless steel logo,anyway, um, so who?
Uh?
Yeah, I was trying to think ofa transition and I can't do it.
Um, apparently I need caitlinhere for my transitions.
Um, we're gonna talk about badmarketing advice.
(01:15):
I was something like.
Yeti does good marketing.
They wouldn't do this badmarketing device I don't know.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
There's something there, we just didn't find it
yeah, I, I'm all over the place.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
Maybe we're learning that morning isn't a good time
for these.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
We're not fully awake yet?
No, and this is not just badmarketing advice.
This is bad marketing advicethat we've heard as a team.
So I pulled some of the teamtogether in Slack asked for some
bad marketing advice and Iwould say all of these are
horrible and all of these arehorrible and all of these are
things that our team have heard,so it was really nice to pull
them into it or experienced Likeexperienced directly.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
Like it's insane.
Okay, so I mean it may be.
My problem is I have a lemondrop in my Yeti.
I don't it's coffee.
There you go, you can see thecoffee Like I'll just blow on it
.
You won't know.
It's alcohol.
All right, Zach, how did theLemon Drop come about?
Because that's our drink fortoday.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
So the Lemon Drop is a really classic cocktail.
Well, not classic.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
I mean I guess it was born in the 1970s, so it's not
that old.
I mean that's 50 years.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
There's definitely more classic.
We've definitely had oldercocktails on.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Yes, we have from the 1800s, but I mean it is half a
century old.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
So yes, yeah, so it's definitely older, but it's a
san francisco original.
So, thanks to vietnam veteranand out of work uh saloon owner,
norman j hobday, uh, they madethis very quickly, became a
classic.
Uh, it's often mistaken for amartini and it it's roots traced
(02:51):
back to 1850s, so maybe it's alittle older than I thought, but
, yeah, a little bit the night.
The saloon owner is creditedwith the original recipe.
Now, personally, I've only everseen this as a shot, and maybe
maybe that's just because inSioux City when I was in college
, they were everywhere as shots.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
You did a lot of shots.
Well, it's also an easy shotbecause it's a little bit sweet.
It's got the sugar in it.
It's not like doing a shot ofvodka or whiskey or any of those
.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
No, it's really what's it called.
Approachable any of those, um,it's really, it's, it's really,
uh, what's it called?
Approachable, much moreapproachable than than the
fucking champ that we had theother day.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Yeah, that was oh, that was wild, um.
I think the interesting thingwith this, though, is you.
You point out like it is not alemon drop martini.
The lemon drop itself is adrink.
That would, honestly, it wouldbe served, because this is kind
of like a rocks glass.
You could serve it in that, um,or you can do it as a drink
that would, honestly, it wouldbe served, because this is kind
of like a rocks glass.
You could serve it in that.
Or you can do it as a shot.
It would not have been in amartini glass originally, but
(03:53):
you see it now Almost every barhas a lemon drop martini, which
is basically the same thing,probably a little bit more booze
.
Two, three, four.
Well, maybe not.
This is four and a half ouncesof liquid, so maybe not, but
yeah, they, um, they'redifferent, all right.
So, to make it, um, you grabtwo ounces of your favorite
(04:16):
vodka, uh, a half ounce oftriple sec.
Uh, one ounce of lemon juice,freshly squeezed, of course, um,
an ounce of simple syrup.
So you get the triple sec forsweet, you get the simple syrup
for sweet, and then you garnishit with a sugar rim.
If you really want to becreative, you can zest your
lemon and mix that zest in withyour sugar.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
I was actually going to bring that up because
somebody recommended doing that,because this is our speech from
.
Speaker 1 (04:41):
Bloombergcom.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
And in the comments to get the sugar to to stick,
because, as you'll see, in thedirections they kind of just say
make a sugar rim.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
But yeah, yeah, um yeah, you're supposed to coat
the rim of a cocktail glass withsugar.
So if you've never likeactually ribbed a glass, it has
to have some sort of liquid onit to stick the sugar.
So typically what you would dois you would zest your lemon,
cut it in half, juice it andthen you would use one of those
like squeezed up juicy lemonsaround the top of your glass to
(05:14):
give it a little bit of liquid.
But yeah, I would put the zestand the sugar together in a
little thing and stick thatthing in there.
So you put that on there.
You can do it a little bitahead of time.
So the sugar dries and it's alldelicious Vodka, triple sec,
lemon juice, simple syrupEverything goes into a shaker
with ice.
Shake that thing until your handis freezing, unless you have
the Yeti thermal shaker and thenit blows my mind because I
(05:40):
shake too long, because my handnever gets cold, because it's
insulated, anyway, then straightit into the prepared glass and
this can be a shot glass thatholds four or five ounces.
So I know they have little likesix ounce shot glasses, the
tall ones or the wide ones.
You can put it in almost anyglass if you want to put it in a
martini glass, you can put itin a martini glass, but honestly
that's one of the hardestglasses to drink out of.
If you're moving around rightup there with margarita glass,
(06:03):
like nine times out of ten, thisis the glass we put all of our
drinks in.
It's like martini goes in here,margarita goes in here, wine
goes in there, everything.
So, yeah, that's your lemondrop.
And if you are having a party,you can absolutely quadruple
this recipe, 10x this recipe,and just pour everybody a shot.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Everyone gets a lemon drop.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
I know what a great morning cocktail.
We'll just do lemon drop shotsat nine in the morning.
Well, 10 for you.
Speaker 2 (06:37):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
All right, so worst marketing advice we've ever
heard Emphasis, as you noted,zach, on the herd, because this
is all stuff that's really thisis stuff.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
This is stuff that we researched, this is stuff that
we've heard, so let's get rightinto it all right, we're back,
we are zach oh it rhymes, we'reback.
We are back.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
Oh it rhymes, we're back, zach.
All right, so let's just getinto these terrible, terrible
marketing ideas Like, yeah, it'slike the what's the?
No good, horrible, very bad day, all right.
So, zach, I think that this oneis obvious Buying followers and
(07:23):
backlinks is a horrible,horrible, horrible idea.
People do it, but let's talkabout why it's so bad, so that
if anybody out there is like, oh, I'm going to buy some
followers, no, don't, it's bad.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
Well, just off the top of my head, right.
So if you buy followers, 90 to100% of them are going to be
bots.
That don't engage or interactwith your content.
Speaker 1 (07:47):
Yep 100%.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
That is not going to help you grow your social media
accounts.
On paper, yes, you're going tohave a larger following, but
it's not going to be a realfollowing when people see that
you have 100,000 or an obsceneamount of followers and your
posts are getting zero.
One, two, three likes and nocomments, it's gonna be really
(08:10):
easy to tell that somethingfishy is happening and your
target audience is not going torespond well to that, or at all,
because you don't know yeah,any kind of real audience.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
So and I think the other thing is, like people know
, like we're not stupid, likethis was really really popular
in the 90s and late 90s, early2000s, especially with twitter,
and then I think instagramreally like it took off there
when instagram was stillindependent, not owned by meta,
and people were just like, oh, Ihave to have like a hundred
thousand followers for people tobe able to like, follow me and
(08:43):
think that I'm legit.
Um, yeah, having more followersdoes make you look legit.
But to zack's point, if youlook at the engagement rate so,
which is kind of the likes,shares, whatever engagement
you're getting, um, as a ratioof your followers, the smaller
that number, the worse it is.
Um, and if you're doing itright and you have a really
(09:05):
authentic audience, your numbercan go over.
So, like, you could have 1,200followers but you could get
1,500, 2,000, 2,500 engagementson something that means that
your people liked it so muchthey re-shared it.
And that's what you want.
You want those real people whowant to follow you.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
There are better ways to grow your followers and
following quickly If you'rereally in a time crunch.
You can run giveaways those arealways really enticing to your
target audience.
There's a lot of differentstrategies you can do.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
Well, you can even just promote your page, your
profile, whatever it is.
Yeah, spend that budget doingit.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Exactly.
Linkedin has follower ads thatyou can run to help grow your
following.
There's other things you can do.
Don't buy followers.
It's not going to work the wayyou think it is and it's really
kind of scummy and I don't knowunderhanded a little bit,
because you're not growing areal authentic audience, which
is what social media should be.
You want to create an engagedaudience that actually wants to
(10:12):
view your content and interactwith your content, and I feel
like you know, in buyingfollowers like to be clear,
running ads is not buyingfollowers.
Speaker 1 (10:19):
We're talking about like somebody sends you a DM,
says I can get you 10,000followers for $100.
You pay them $100 throughPayPal or Bitcoin or whatever.
About like somebody sends you adm says I can get you 10 000
followers for a hundred dollars,you pay them a hundred dollars
through paypal or bitcoin orwhatever and boom, you've got
the extra like 10 000 followersor whatever the next day and
they're like they're creatingthem overnight as bots.
So it's right up there with thephone scam on your grandma
(10:41):
trying to get her bankinformation.
Like it is that level of scummyand and it's the same with
backlinks too.
Speaker 2 (10:50):
I mean, if you buy backlinks, it's not going to
help your site the way you think.
Speaker 1 (10:53):
It is honestly more damage exactly yep, anytime
you're messing with google andbuying things, you're in trouble
like they're they're going tofigure it out.
Speaker 2 (11:03):
Google will penalize you.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
Mm-hmm Penalty box.
All right, so what's our nextone?
Speaker 2 (11:15):
So this is kind of a collection of a few different
ones, but anything that'soutdated, things that may have
worked in the past for marketingbut are definitely not going to
work now.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
Zach, my newspaper ads worked great in 1982.
Well, they definitely not goingto work now.
Zach, my newspaper ads workedgreat in 1982.
Well, they're not going to workin 2025.
Speaker 2 (11:32):
I mean, there's still a little bit of a place for
newspaper ads for maybe likevery specific and local things,
but Coupons right.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Yeah, like people get coupons, but even those now,
like my Baker's app pops up orHy-Vee or whatever, and it just
tells me, like you have digitalcoupons to redeem and I can
redeem them in there, and thenwhen I go to the checkout I just
scan it and it will loopeverything if I bought it in my
cart.
They still mail me coupons too,which is weird to me, and
they're still in the paper.
Speaker 2 (12:00):
And honestly.
I'll just point out thespecific advice that was given
to one of our team members.
They were told don't useLinkedIn, don't put it on the
internet, put it in thenewspaper, and that is probably
some of the worst advice thatI've personally ever heard,
(12:21):
especially in 2025.
No-transcript like that wouldmake sense to do because, uh,
(12:51):
what would you put on linkedin?
Speaker 1 (12:53):
that would work in the newspaper we could advertise
our web, our upcoming webinar,uh, in the newspaper.
Maybe it's wild, I mean, andmost newspapers aren't even
printing every day, likeespecially the smaller ones and
even some fairly large ones um,everything is online and they're
updating online constantly.
(13:14):
But, like I know, um, I thinkin sioux city isn't it only like
three days a week that thenewspaper actually prints and
delivers a physical newspaper?
It's not every day anymore.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
Well, and I don't even know what newspaper is in
my area, or like it's just,we're past getting leads and
marketing in newspapers yeah, Idon't even know the name of the
newspaper there.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
I used to be really good at that, like knowing like
names of stations and newspapersbecause I was doing media stuff
all over the country.
But yeah, I don't anymore.
I think the other one and Ijoked about this at the
beginning, but it's absolutelytrue is your example of the best
campaign ever is from 1996 or1992, or your ad strategy is
(13:57):
something that you executed, youknow, in your first job like
way back when, and I love someof that and we've talked about
some of the things that I'vedone, you know, especially on my
spotlight, which was great, butlike those magazine ads we did,
we wouldn't do those today thesame way probably.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
They would honestly be.
Well, there's definitely thingsyou can learn from them.
There's definitely some goodprinciples in there, but it's
not going to work the same exactway it worked back then, for
sure no.
Speaker 1 (14:30):
And like, I just had a conversation with somebody
about Connected TV and I thinkwe did a podcast on it.
We've done a couple onConnected TV, I think, and I
think we did one recently.
They all blur together at somepoint and just kind of mush in
my head.
But I was talking with somebodyabout it and they're like yeah,
like why would I do that?
Like oh, I can you know, I canget my ad on TV and nobody can
(14:52):
watch it and everybody can fastforward and it's like well,
first of all, a lot of them arenon-skippable.
Um so no, it is different.
And second, like, broadcast TVis great for that huge message
that has to go everywhere inyour area or nationally or
whatever.
But you pay for it.
You pay for all those and youcan narrow down to your right
(15:13):
audience.
So, targeting with video ortargeting with TV as a tactic,
yes, was great in the 70s, greatin the 80s, great in the 90s,
great in the 2000s, it's greattoday.
You just do it differently,like you know, you don't call
your local station, get rates.
They send you a bunch of stuff.
You pick your shows and off yougo.
(15:36):
You can do it all online and befar more refined with it.
Speaker 2 (15:39):
And people are always changing.
You know, like what we caredabout back then isn't what we
care about now.
And I mean, funnily enough,that video you sent of the we
built Sioux City, like the factthat I was like thinking about
this for this episode.
I was like the fact that thatwent viral back then, like I
(16:00):
don't think it would go viralnow if they posted it the exact
same way I don't think it wouldgo viral now if they posted it
the exact same way.
No, and I did love the commentthat you shared from.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Koreaboo5204.
It's one of the reasons I movedout of Iowa.
That video was so bad and I hadnever seen that video.
You've never seen it, never, oh.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
God, and so when I saw that I was like what in the
heck, how does this have so manyviews like it was fun.
I get back then like I think Imean that's when I was reading
the article about it.
Youtube was only five years oldso stuff like that.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
That was mildly creative got a lot of clutter
right.
Like you could.
You could get more views onsomething, um, but yeah, like,
oh my gosh, every time I see itI just kind of cringe.
Um, but you know, all good, allright.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
Um on to the next one yes, it was from jesse, and
this is word for word what hesaid.
My insert vague family memberor acquaintance designed my logo
and it works just fine.
So for me it depends who yourfamily member is.
Maybe if they're a graphicdesigner and have a lot of
(17:16):
experience and all power to you.
Speaker 1 (17:22):
Even then, if you're getting your logo for free, it's
probably not great If you'renot briefing or talking to them
or they don't understand yourbrand.
We go through a whole bunch ofstuff before we ever look at
designing a new logo for anybody.
It's like, I think, in thesecond or third week of the
process that we actually startdoing design, because we have to
(17:45):
know so much about you likeyour logo has to say something
about who your brand is, whoyour audience is, what you offer
.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
And I think you cover this pretty well in your team
spotlight too, where what's themarketing?
You will die on, is that yourbrand matters and your logo is a
part of your brand, so itdefinitely matters.
I mean is a part of your brand,so it definitely matters.
I mean, everyone's going to beseeing it as what your business
is.
So if your logo sucks and it'sjust oh, I don't really care
(18:15):
about my logo, it just kind ofexists and it gets the job done,
then it's kind of like you saidin your team spotlight like
it's, it's not good yeah, and Ithink it's right up there with.
Speaker 1 (18:26):
I think you can do this with almost everything.
You know a um, you know my kidtook all the photos of my
products with their iphone.
Okay, like, maybe your kid isthis budding photographer genius
, I don't know um, and takingyour product photos with an
iphone is not necessarily bad,but you have to know what you're
doing.
(18:46):
You have to know how they'regoing to look, how they're going
to shape up, and it's verysmall things can do that.
So I think this whole I gotthis for free or had a family
member do it or an acquaintanceand, honestly, if you've got an
acquaintance or a friend doingyour stuff for free or for dirt
cheap, you're ripping them off.
Like, if they are a graphicdesigner, they deserve to be
(19:07):
paid for the work.
And professional logos, when youlook at them, when you analyze
them, are so different thansomething that's thrown together
.
I think one of the bestexamples of this is anytime a
city because it always seems tobe a city does a logo contest
and they just want everybody tosubmit logos and our favorite
(19:31):
thing to do is to jump on Canvaand find the template they used,
because that's what most ofthem are.
It's just they're terrible andthey've got gaps and their color
is off.
Like you don't reallyunderstand what goes into a logo
until you've had oneprofessionally done, and I think
once you have, you never goback.
Like no one's going to want todo a thrown together logo.
Speaker 2 (19:53):
And people can tell when it's a thrown together logo
.
I mean, if you're a newbusiness or small business just
starting up and your logo lookslike it was just sewn together
in five, ten minutes, thenpeople aren't going to take your
business or your brandseriously.
Speaker 1 (20:07):
And you really need to.
Speaker 2 (20:09):
I mean, it could be expensive getting a good logo,
but it's worth the time andeffort.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
It should be a part of your business plan and
establishing yourself as a brandthe other thing you need is,
when you do it professionally,you get all the right versions.
So, like if somebody's doing iton their computer and they just
give you a jpeg and you wannaoh, hey, misa, uh, you wanna do
a larger, um, uh, like you wantto put it on a billboard, you
(20:37):
want to put it on the side of avehicle, you want to have a
really big one.
It's going to look like crapbecause you don't have the
vector art, and if you don'tknow what vector art is,
definitely hire somebody to doyour logo.
The other thing is you know ourend package.
You get not only the vectorfiles.
You get a black one, you get awhite one, you get colors one,
you get colors.
You get a two color, likewhatever the specs are on your
(21:00):
logo.
So you have all of those.
I mean our logo folder for us.
We've got our 71 excuse me andour full logo in all three of
our like, our primary, twoprimary colors, the navy and the
orange, and then in the green,which which is a secondary, and
black and white.
So we have five different onesso we can use those anywhere.
(21:21):
You also get them as PNGs andJPEGs and EPS files.
Speaker 2 (21:25):
So yeah, just go for the professional please Put some
time and effort into it, or paysomeone to put the time and
effort into it.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
I did have this discussion with a local business
in Sioux City because they cameto us wanting branding and a
logo and whatever, and I thinkthe logo quote was like six
grand or something like that,which is pretty average for a
logo, and they just freaked out.
They're like I thought it wouldbe like $500.
And it's like okay this meetingis almost $500.
But what got me is where theirlocation was.
(21:58):
I know for a fact their rent is$3,000 or $4,000 a month
because of the location theyhave, and so it's like if you
won't put one month's rent intoyour identity, rethink your
business plan, definitely.
Yeah, all right, I think thisnext one, uh, which is our last
(22:21):
for the day we're actually doingokay in time too.
Um, this one drives me crazy.
You don't need a website.
Facebook is your website.
Let facebook be your website sowhat kills me is?
people will buy a domain liketheir brand name and all they do
is redirect it to theirFacebook page.
So I'm like in a Google forrestaurants.
Do this all the time.
(22:42):
All the time I'm in, googleDrives me nuts I search and I
click on Google says website,and I click on the link and boom
, it's Facebook.
And I'm like first of all, I'mannoyed because now it's opening
in Facebook on my browser on myphone.
It's not's opening in Facebookon my browser on my phone.
It's not even opening inFacebook.
So now it's going to make melog in because Facebook isn't
smart like that.
It doesn't know I'm alreadylogged in on the app.
Annoys the crap out of me.
(23:03):
It's also like just it's harderto navigate, so that's terrible
.
Also, the functionality is justnot there.
Speaker 2 (23:13):
You can't have a menu .
It's like, especially with arestaurant.
This is the way I think of itif I click on the website link
on like yelp for a restaurantand it takes me to their
facebook page.
Same thing with the google, mybusiness.
Uh, it takes me straight totheir facebook page like 10, 9
times out of 10 I'm looking fortheir menu or I'm looking for
(23:33):
their hours and it's a lotharder to find that stuff on
facebook because usually theydon't have the menu on Facebook.
Speaker 1 (23:40):
They have like if they don't have a website.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
Their Facebook probably isn't that great either
.
So I'm not really finding theinformation I'm looking for.
Speaker 1 (23:49):
Or they'll have a JPEG of the menu that they
posted a year ago and you've gotto dig to find it in all of
their photos and the prices areprobably different.
Speaker 2 (23:59):
The quality is bad defined it in all of their
photos and the prices areprobably different and the
quality maybe the menu is notthe same.
Speaker 1 (24:02):
Yeah, it's, and it is not hard to have a functional
website, like something thatactually works.
Excuse me, um, I think the onlything.
So I will abandon a restaurant.
If I go and like, if I clickand it goes to facebook, unless
they've posted like in the lastday, because if you're a
restaurant you should be postingevery day like.
Speaker 2 (24:23):
Your food pictures should be everywhere um and the
pictures look amazing like ithas to be really good food
pictures, or like their menuspinned on the top, something
yeah, if the pictures look kindof meh, I'm just gonna be.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
no, I don't want to go there Because you obviously
didn't put any effort into yourwebsite, so you should put a lot
of effort into your photos thatgo out on your social media
then Well, and you can maybe getaway with it as a restaurant,
kind of like we just said, ifthere's good pictures, but still
you shouldn't do it under anycircumstances.
Well, I think there's alsoanother big, big, big problem
(25:00):
with this, and it's if you know,zach, you own a piece of land
and I just go build myrestaurant on it and I don't
read any of your agreements withhow I'm able to use that land
and you come back and say, oh,in this clause that you never
read down here, it says thatafter six months I own your
restaurant, You're building onsomebody else's property.
(25:23):
Facebook owns.
Well, meta owns Facebook.
They are looking out for Meta,not you.
They will adjust the algorithm.
They'll change what people cansee.
They can change their terms.
They can delete your account.
Um, there, you can get, youknow, taken over.
You can get hacked, you can get.
Yeah, there's a lot that canhappen.
(25:45):
If your sole place to be isfacebook or or instagram or any
third-party property, um, andwhile your website is hosted
somewhere else, generally thecontent on there is yours and
that is protected, um, but youknow that's the other thing is
(26:06):
the content rights that facebookor meta or anybody have when
you put stuff on social media.
Do you?
Do you understand those?
Have you read those?
Do you know what they can dowith those?
It's rough.
So, just I mean, build a onepager Totally fine, like build a
one page website that has likean intro.
Your menu is easy to find onthere and it's got a couple of
(26:29):
little sections on how tocontact you, how to make a
reservation, whatever.
I don't know why we got hookedon restaurants.
I think because we love to eat.
Speaker 2 (26:36):
I mean, I think that's the biggest example of
that actually happening that wecould think of, because if
you're a legit B2B business andyour only website, or anything
close to a website, is Facebook,that's really bad.
Speaker 1 (26:52):
Yeah, I think that's.
Another good point is B2C canget away with this more than B2B
.
If you're targeting otherbusinesses, Facebook's probably
not the best place for you.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
You're not generating leads organically from Facebook
?
Speaker 1 (27:10):
probably If that's the only place you're sending
people.
Speaker 2 (27:15):
There's no way.
Speaker 1 (27:17):
Yeah, and I think that's right up there with like
Googling a business and thefirst result is Facebook and you
scroll the whole first page andyou don't see a website
anywhere.
It's like oh no.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
Yeah, all right.
Speaker 1 (27:30):
So I think, to sum it up, buying followers or
backlinks if it feels shady, ifit looks shady, if somebody's
told you it's shady, it's shady,please don't do it, thinking
that something that worked 30 or40 years ago you can just
replicate exactly today.
No, you've got to take thosenuggets and those lessons and
maybe the overarching strategy,but your tactics are definitely
(27:51):
going to be very different and,honestly, your strategy should
probably be adjusted for today.
Having just somebody random ora family member do your logo, do
your website, do whatever like,do it on the cheap.
Professional is always going tobe better.
You will pay for it, of course,but they'll also take the time
(28:11):
to make sure you have everythingyou need.
And then you know, buildingyour house on somebody else's
property without reading theterms and conditions.
You do need a website, even ifyou're a random small restaurant
.
Just pop up a one-pager.
You can do that for like sixbucks a month places.
Seriously, it's not hard.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
And I think an even easier way to think about this
don't take the easy way out andalways can like grow and adapt
to the changing industry andlike basically the way of the
world, because, yeah, thingsagain, things that worked back
then, aren't going to work now,and I think a lot of these kind
of just relate back to nottaking the easy way out.
Speaker 1 (28:51):
So yeah, I think if it feels like a shortcut, it is
a shortcut and it will look likea shortcut and it'll have
negative consequences.
Speaker 2 (28:58):
100 percent.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
Uh, all right.
So we do have an upcomingepisode, but I have no idea what
it is.
Speaker 2 (29:06):
It's gonna be it's gonna be website redesign or not
.
Website redesign.
It's gonna be web design trendsthat need to die with jesse oh,
web design trends that need todie with.
Speaker 1 (29:17):
Jesse will be the next one, so that'll be kind of
good.
So we're doing a couple ofnegatives in a row.
Hopefully we got a positive,happy sunshine episode coming up
too, so as always.
Speaker 2 (29:28):
thank you for listening, and you can find our
agency at antidote, underscoreseven one.
If you have a question you'dlike to send our way, head to
ctapodcastlive, to shoot us anemail or, even better, leave us
a voice message on our hotlineat 402-718-9971.
Your question will make it intoa future episode of the podcast
.
Speaker 1 (29:55):
So I have to tell you before we end.
Every time you say the phonenumber and nobody calls, it just
reminds me of trying to makefetch happen.
So Lacey Charbet's child toldher Mom everybody at school says
you invented fetch, what'sfetch?
And her kid is like seven oreight, I think.
And so the article I read saidoh my God, she made fetch happen
.
Makes me laugh.
(30:16):
So anyway, just had to sharethat.
But seriously call the damnnumber, ask us a question, it'd
be fun.
We'd love to have it I have abox of books here that I'm ready
to give out, but nobody wantsthem.
They're really great, though Ilove the cocktail book I've been
using it.
Alright with that.
No more tangents.
We'll see you next week.
Speaker 2 (30:37):
See ya.
all right, another episode of cocktails, tangents
and answers coming your way, heyzach hello.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
This time we're recording in the morning, so
we're getting.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
We're getting our coffee as opposed to our
cocktail I why don't you have abranded cup?
Do you not have a branded mugat home?
Speaker 2 (00:24):
I do.
I just grabbed the first mug Isaw when I got my coffee before
this episode.
Merch Merch, I like the.
Yetis, they're really good.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
I love these.
So I got these because we hadan order that I needed to add to
, because everybody generally,just for the record, everyone
generally gets one with theirname on it.
I think I've missed a couple ofpeople, but, um, I had I
ordered like it was one or twoand I needed like five for the
free shipping, and so instead ofjust being like, oh, I'll pay
for shipping, I'm like no, let'sget like three more mugs.
(00:54):
So I got these little ones andI love them.
I love this orange color it wasa limited edition color, um, and
the the stainless steel logo,anyway, um, so who?
Uh?
Yeah, I was trying to think ofa transition and I can't do it.
Um, apparently I need caitlinhere for my transitions.
Um, we're gonna talk about badmarketing advice.
(01:15):
I was something like.
Yeti does good marketing.
They wouldn't do this badmarketing device I don't know.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
There's something there, we just didn't find it
yeah, I, I'm all over the place.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
Maybe we're learning that morning isn't a good time
for these.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
We're not fully awake yet?
No, and this is not just badmarketing advice.
This is bad marketing advicethat we've heard as a team.
So I pulled some of the teamtogether in Slack asked for some
bad marketing advice and Iwould say all of these are
horrible and all of these arehorrible and all of these are
things that our team have heard,so it was really nice to pull
them into it or experienced Likeexperienced directly.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
Like it's insane.
Okay, so I mean it may be.
My problem is I have a lemondrop in my Yeti.
I don't it's coffee.
There you go, you can see thecoffee Like I'll just blow on it
.
You won't know.
It's alcohol.
All right, Zach, how did theLemon Drop come about?
Because that's our drink fortoday.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
So the Lemon Drop is a really classic cocktail.
Well, not classic.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
I mean I guess it was born in the 1970s, so it's not
that old.
I mean that's 50 years.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
There's definitely more classic.
We've definitely had oldercocktails on.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Yes, we have from the 1800s, but I mean it is half a
century old.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
So yes, yeah, so it's definitely older, but it's a
san francisco original.
So, thanks to vietnam veteranand out of work uh saloon owner,
norman j hobday, uh, they madethis very quickly, became a
classic.
Uh, it's often mistaken for amartini and it it's roots traced
(02:51):
back to 1850s, so maybe it's alittle older than I thought, but
, yeah, a little bit the night.
The saloon owner is creditedwith the original recipe.
Now, personally, I've only everseen this as a shot, and maybe
maybe that's just because inSioux City when I was in college
, they were everywhere as shots.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
You did a lot of shots.
Well, it's also an easy shotbecause it's a little bit sweet.
It's got the sugar in it.
It's not like doing a shot ofvodka or whiskey or any of those
.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
No, it's really what's it called.
Approachable any of those, um,it's really, it's, it's really,
uh, what's it called?
Approachable, much moreapproachable than than the
fucking champ that we had theother day.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Yeah, that was oh, that was wild, um.
I think the interesting thingwith this, though, is you.
You point out like it is not alemon drop martini.
The lemon drop itself is adrink.
That would, honestly, it wouldbe served, because this is kind
of like a rocks glass.
You could serve it in that, um,or you can do it as a drink
that would, honestly, it wouldbe served, because this is kind
of like a rocks glass.
You could serve it in that.
Or you can do it as a shot.
It would not have been in amartini glass originally, but
(03:53):
you see it now Almost every barhas a lemon drop martini, which
is basically the same thing,probably a little bit more booze
.
Two, three, four.
Well, maybe not.
This is four and a half ouncesof liquid, so maybe not, but
yeah, they, um, they'redifferent, all right.
So, to make it, um, you grabtwo ounces of your favorite
(04:16):
vodka, uh, a half ounce oftriple sec.
Uh, one ounce of lemon juice,freshly squeezed, of course, um,
an ounce of simple syrup.
So you get the triple sec forsweet, you get the simple syrup
for sweet, and then you garnishit with a sugar rim.
If you really want to becreative, you can zest your
lemon and mix that zest in withyour sugar.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
I was actually going to bring that up because
somebody recommended doing that,because this is our speech from
.
Speaker 1 (04:41):
Bloombergcom.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
And in the comments to get the sugar to to stick,
because, as you'll see, in thedirections they kind of just say
make a sugar rim.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
But yeah, yeah, um yeah, you're supposed to coat
the rim of a cocktail glass withsugar.
So if you've never likeactually ribbed a glass, it has
to have some sort of liquid onit to stick the sugar.
So typically what you would dois you would zest your lemon,
cut it in half, juice it andthen you would use one of those
like squeezed up juicy lemonsaround the top of your glass to
(05:14):
give it a little bit of liquid.
But yeah, I would put the zestand the sugar together in a
little thing and stick thatthing in there.
So you put that on there.
You can do it a little bitahead of time.
So the sugar dries and it's alldelicious Vodka, triple sec,
lemon juice, simple syrupEverything goes into a shaker
with ice.
Shake that thing until your handis freezing, unless you have
the Yeti thermal shaker and thenit blows my mind because I
(05:40):
shake too long, because my handnever gets cold, because it's
insulated, anyway, then straightit into the prepared glass and
this can be a shot glass thatholds four or five ounces.
So I know they have little likesix ounce shot glasses, the
tall ones or the wide ones.
You can put it in almost anyglass if you want to put it in a
martini glass, you can put itin a martini glass, but honestly
that's one of the hardestglasses to drink out of.
If you're moving around rightup there with margarita glass,
(06:03):
like nine times out of ten, thisis the glass we put all of our
drinks in.
It's like martini goes in here,margarita goes in here, wine
goes in there, everything.
So, yeah, that's your lemondrop.
And if you are having a party,you can absolutely quadruple
this recipe, 10x this recipe,and just pour everybody a shot.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Everyone gets a lemon drop.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
I know what a great morning cocktail.
We'll just do lemon drop shotsat nine in the morning.
Well, 10 for you.
Speaker 2 (06:37):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
All right, so worst marketing advice we've ever
heard Emphasis, as you noted,zach, on the herd, because this
is all stuff that's really thisis stuff.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
This is stuff that we researched, this is stuff that
we've heard, so let's get rightinto it all right, we're back,
we are zach oh it rhymes, we'reback.
We are back.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
Oh it rhymes, we're back, zach.
All right, so let's just getinto these terrible, terrible
marketing ideas Like, yeah, it'slike the what's the?
No good, horrible, very bad day, all right.
So, zach, I think that this oneis obvious Buying followers and
(07:23):
backlinks is a horrible,horrible, horrible idea.
People do it, but let's talkabout why it's so bad, so that
if anybody out there is like, oh, I'm going to buy some
followers, no, don't, it's bad.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
Well, just off the top of my head, right.
So if you buy followers, 90 to100% of them are going to be
bots.
That don't engage or interactwith your content.
Speaker 1 (07:47):
Yep 100%.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
That is not going to help you grow your social media
accounts.
On paper, yes, you're going tohave a larger following, but
it's not going to be a realfollowing when people see that
you have 100,000 or an obsceneamount of followers and your
posts are getting zero.
One, two, three likes and nocomments, it's gonna be really
(08:10):
easy to tell that somethingfishy is happening and your
target audience is not going torespond well to that, or at all,
because you don't know yeah,any kind of real audience.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
So and I think the other thing is, like people know
, like we're not stupid, likethis was really really popular
in the 90s and late 90s, early2000s, especially with twitter,
and then I think instagramreally like it took off there
when instagram was stillindependent, not owned by meta,
and people were just like, oh, Ihave to have like a hundred
thousand followers for people tobe able to like, follow me and
(08:43):
think that I'm legit.
Um, yeah, having more followersdoes make you look legit.
But to zack's point, if youlook at the engagement rate so,
which is kind of the likes,shares, whatever engagement
you're getting, um, as a ratioof your followers, the smaller
that number, the worse it is.
Um, and if you're doing itright and you have a really
(09:05):
authentic audience, your numbercan go over.
So, like, you could have 1,200followers but you could get
1,500, 2,000, 2,500 engagementson something that means that
your people liked it so muchthey re-shared it.
And that's what you want.
You want those real people whowant to follow you.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
There are better ways to grow your followers and
following quickly If you'rereally in a time crunch.
You can run giveaways those arealways really enticing to your
target audience.
There's a lot of differentstrategies you can do.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
Well, you can even just promote your page, your
profile, whatever it is.
Yeah, spend that budget doingit.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Exactly.
Linkedin has follower ads thatyou can run to help grow your
following.
There's other things you can do.
Don't buy followers.
It's not going to work the wayyou think it is and it's really
kind of scummy and I don't knowunderhanded a little bit,
because you're not growing areal authentic audience, which
is what social media should be.
You want to create an engagedaudience that actually wants to
(10:12):
view your content and interactwith your content, and I feel
like you know, in buyingfollowers like to be clear,
running ads is not buyingfollowers.
Speaker 1 (10:19):
We're talking about like somebody sends you a DM,
says I can get you 10,000followers for $100.
You pay them $100 throughPayPal or Bitcoin or whatever.
About like somebody sends you adm says I can get you 10 000
followers for a hundred dollars,you pay them a hundred dollars
through paypal or bitcoin orwhatever and boom, you've got
the extra like 10 000 followersor whatever the next day and
they're like they're creatingthem overnight as bots.
So it's right up there with thephone scam on your grandma
(10:41):
trying to get her bankinformation.
Like it is that level of scummyand and it's the same with
backlinks too.
Speaker 2 (10:50):
I mean, if you buy backlinks, it's not going to
help your site the way you think.
Speaker 1 (10:53):
It is honestly more damage exactly yep, anytime
you're messing with google andbuying things, you're in trouble
like they're they're going tofigure it out.
Speaker 2 (11:03):
Google will penalize you.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
Mm-hmm Penalty box.
All right, so what's our nextone?
Speaker 2 (11:15):
So this is kind of a collection of a few different
ones, but anything that'soutdated, things that may have
worked in the past for marketingbut are definitely not going to
work now.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
Zach, my newspaper ads worked great in 1982.
Well, they definitely not goingto work now.
Zach, my newspaper ads workedgreat in 1982.
Well, they're not going to workin 2025.
Speaker 2 (11:32):
I mean, there's still a little bit of a place for
newspaper ads for maybe likevery specific and local things,
but Coupons right.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Yeah, like people get coupons, but even those now,
like my Baker's app pops up orHy-Vee or whatever, and it just
tells me, like you have digitalcoupons to redeem and I can
redeem them in there, and thenwhen I go to the checkout I just
scan it and it will loopeverything if I bought it in my
cart.
They still mail me coupons too,which is weird to me, and
they're still in the paper.
Speaker 2 (12:00):
And honestly.
I'll just point out thespecific advice that was given
to one of our team members.
They were told don't useLinkedIn, don't put it on the
internet, put it in thenewspaper, and that is probably
some of the worst advice thatI've personally ever heard,
(12:21):
especially in 2025.
No-transcript like that wouldmake sense to do because, uh,
(12:51):
what would you put on linkedin?
Speaker 1 (12:53):
that would work in the newspaper we could advertise
our web, our upcoming webinar,uh, in the newspaper.
Maybe it's wild, I mean, andmost newspapers aren't even
printing every day, likeespecially the smaller ones and
even some fairly large ones um,everything is online and they're
updating online constantly.
(13:14):
But, like I know, um, I thinkin sioux city isn't it only like
three days a week that thenewspaper actually prints and
delivers a physical newspaper?
It's not every day anymore.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
Well, and I don't even know what newspaper is in
my area, or like it's just,we're past getting leads and
marketing in newspapers yeah, Idon't even know the name of the
newspaper there.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
I used to be really good at that, like knowing like
names of stations and newspapersbecause I was doing media stuff
all over the country.
But yeah, I don't anymore.
I think the other one and Ijoked about this at the
beginning, but it's absolutelytrue is your example of the best
campaign ever is from 1996 or1992, or your ad strategy is
(13:57):
something that you executed, youknow, in your first job like
way back when, and I love someof that and we've talked about
some of the things that I'vedone, you know, especially on my
spotlight, which was great, butlike those magazine ads we did,
we wouldn't do those today thesame way probably.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
They would honestly be.
Well, there's definitely thingsyou can learn from them.
There's definitely some goodprinciples in there, but it's
not going to work the same exactway it worked back then, for
sure no.
Speaker 1 (14:30):
And like, I just had a conversation with somebody
about Connected TV and I thinkwe did a podcast on it.
We've done a couple onConnected TV, I think, and I
think we did one recently.
They all blur together at somepoint and just kind of mush in
my head.
But I was talking with somebodyabout it and they're like yeah,
like why would I do that?
Like oh, I can you know, I canget my ad on TV and nobody can
(14:52):
watch it and everybody can fastforward and it's like well,
first of all, a lot of them arenon-skippable.
Um so no, it is different.
And second, like, broadcast TVis great for that huge message
that has to go everywhere inyour area or nationally or
whatever.
But you pay for it.
You pay for all those and youcan narrow down to your right
(15:13):
audience.
So, targeting with video ortargeting with TV as a tactic,
yes, was great in the 70s, greatin the 80s, great in the 90s,
great in the 2000s, it's greattoday.
You just do it differently,like you know, you don't call
your local station, get rates.
They send you a bunch of stuff.
You pick your shows and off yougo.
(15:36):
You can do it all online and befar more refined with it.
Speaker 2 (15:39):
And people are always changing.
You know, like what we caredabout back then isn't what we
care about now.
And I mean, funnily enough,that video you sent of the we
built Sioux City, like the factthat I was like thinking about
this for this episode.
I was like the fact that thatwent viral back then, like I
(16:00):
don't think it would go viralnow if they posted it the exact
same way I don't think it wouldgo viral now if they posted it
the exact same way.
No, and I did love the commentthat you shared from.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
Koreaboo5204.
It's one of the reasons I movedout of Iowa.
That video was so bad and I hadnever seen that video.
You've never seen it, never, oh.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
God, and so when I saw that I was like what in the
heck, how does this have so manyviews like it was fun.
I get back then like I think Imean that's when I was reading
the article about it.
Youtube was only five years oldso stuff like that.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
That was mildly creative got a lot of clutter
right.
Like you could.
You could get more views onsomething, um, but yeah, like,
oh my gosh, every time I see itI just kind of cringe.
Um, but you know, all good, allright.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
Um on to the next one yes, it was from jesse, and
this is word for word what hesaid.
My insert vague family memberor acquaintance designed my logo
and it works just fine.
So for me it depends who yourfamily member is.
Maybe if they're a graphicdesigner and have a lot of
(17:16):
experience and all power to you.
Speaker 1 (17:22):
Even then, if you're getting your logo for free, it's
probably not great If you'renot briefing or talking to them
or they don't understand yourbrand.
We go through a whole bunch ofstuff before we ever look at
designing a new logo for anybody.
It's like, I think, in thesecond or third week of the
process that we actually startdoing design, because we have to
(17:45):
know so much about you likeyour logo has to say something
about who your brand is, whoyour audience is, what you offer
.
Speaker 2 (17:53):
And I think you cover this pretty well in your team
spotlight too, where what's themarketing?
You will die on, is that yourbrand matters and your logo is a
part of your brand, so itdefinitely matters.
I mean is a part of your brand,so it definitely matters.
I mean, everyone's going to beseeing it as what your business
is.
So if your logo sucks and it'sjust oh, I don't really care
(18:15):
about my logo, it just kind ofexists and it gets the job done,
then it's kind of like you saidin your team spotlight like
it's, it's not good yeah, and Ithink it's right up there with.
Speaker 1 (18:26):
I think you can do this with almost everything.
You know a um, you know my kidtook all the photos of my
products with their iphone.
Okay, like, maybe your kid isthis budding photographer genius
, I don't know um, and takingyour product photos with an
iphone is not necessarily bad,but you have to know what you're
doing.
(18:46):
You have to know how they'regoing to look, how they're going
to shape up, and it's verysmall things can do that.
So I think this whole I gotthis for free or had a family
member do it or an acquaintanceand, honestly, if you've got an
acquaintance or a friend doingyour stuff for free or for dirt
cheap, you're ripping them off.
Like, if they are a graphicdesigner, they deserve to be
(19:07):
paid for the work.
And professional logos, when youlook at them, when you analyze
them, are so different thansomething that's thrown together
.
I think one of the bestexamples of this is anytime a
city because it always seems tobe a city does a logo contest
and they just want everybody tosubmit logos and our favorite
(19:31):
thing to do is to jump on Canvaand find the template they used,
because that's what most ofthem are.
It's just they're terrible andthey've got gaps and their color
is off.
Like you don't reallyunderstand what goes into a logo
until you've had oneprofessionally done, and I think
once you have, you never goback.
Like no one's going to want todo a thrown together logo.
Speaker 2 (19:53):
And people can tell when it's a thrown together logo
.
I mean, if you're a newbusiness or small business just
starting up and your logo lookslike it was just sewn together
in five, ten minutes, thenpeople aren't going to take your
business or your brandseriously.
Speaker 1 (20:07):
And you really need to.
Speaker 2 (20:09):
I mean, it could be expensive getting a good logo,
but it's worth the time andeffort.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
It should be a part of your business plan and
establishing yourself as a brandthe other thing you need is,
when you do it professionally,you get all the right versions.
So, like if somebody's doing iton their computer and they just
give you a jpeg and you wannaoh, hey, misa, uh, you wanna do
a larger, um, uh, like you wantto put it on a billboard, you
(20:37):
want to put it on the side of avehicle, you want to have a
really big one.
It's going to look like crapbecause you don't have the
vector art, and if you don'tknow what vector art is,
definitely hire somebody to doyour logo.
The other thing is you know ourend package.
You get not only the vectorfiles.
You get a black one, you get awhite one, you get colors one,
you get colors.
You get a two color, likewhatever the specs are on your
(21:00):
logo.
So you have all of those.
I mean our logo folder for us.
We've got our 71 excuse me andour full logo in all three of
our like, our primary, twoprimary colors, the navy and the
orange, and then in the green,which which is a secondary, and
black and white.
So we have five different onesso we can use those anywhere.
(21:21):
You also get them as PNGs andJPEGs and EPS files.
Speaker 2 (21:25):
So yeah, just go for the professional please Put some
time and effort into it, or paysomeone to put the time and
effort into it.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
I did have this discussion with a local business
in Sioux City because they cameto us wanting branding and a
logo and whatever, and I thinkthe logo quote was like six
grand or something like that,which is pretty average for a
logo, and they just freaked out.
They're like I thought it wouldbe like $500.
And it's like okay this meetingis almost $500.
But what got me is where theirlocation was.
(21:58):
I know for a fact their rent is$3,000 or $4,000 a month
because of the location theyhave, and so it's like if you
won't put one month's rent intoyour identity, rethink your
business plan, definitely.
Yeah, all right, I think thisnext one, uh, which is our last
(22:21):
for the day we're actually doingokay in time too.
Um, this one drives me crazy.
You don't need a website.
Facebook is your website.
Let facebook be your website sowhat kills me is?
people will buy a domain liketheir brand name and all they do
is redirect it to theirFacebook page.
So I'm like in a Google forrestaurants.
Do this all the time.
(22:42):
All the time I'm in, googleDrives me nuts I search and I
click on Google says website,and I click on the link and boom
, it's Facebook.
And I'm like first of all, I'mannoyed because now it's opening
in Facebook on my browser on myphone.
It's not's opening in Facebookon my browser on my phone.
It's not even opening inFacebook.
So now it's going to make melog in because Facebook isn't
smart like that.
It doesn't know I'm alreadylogged in on the app.
Annoys the crap out of me.
(23:03):
It's also like just it's harderto navigate, so that's terrible
.
Also, the functionality is justnot there.
Speaker 2 (23:13):
You can't have a menu .
It's like, especially with arestaurant.
This is the way I think of itif I click on the website link
on like yelp for a restaurantand it takes me to their
facebook page.
Same thing with the google, mybusiness.
Uh, it takes me straight totheir facebook page like 10, 9
times out of 10 I'm looking fortheir menu or I'm looking for
(23:33):
their hours and it's a lotharder to find that stuff on
facebook because usually theydon't have the menu on Facebook.
Speaker 1 (23:40):
They have like if they don't have a website.
Speaker 2 (23:43):
Their Facebook probably isn't that great either
.
So I'm not really finding theinformation I'm looking for.
Speaker 1 (23:49):
Or they'll have a JPEG of the menu that they
posted a year ago and you've gotto dig to find it in all of
their photos and the prices areprobably different.
Speaker 2 (23:59):
The quality is bad defined it in all of their
photos and the prices areprobably different and the
quality maybe the menu is notthe same.
Speaker 1 (24:02):
Yeah, it's, and it is not hard to have a functional
website, like something thatactually works.
Excuse me, um, I think the onlything.
So I will abandon a restaurant.
If I go and like, if I clickand it goes to facebook, unless
they've posted like in the lastday, because if you're a
restaurant you should be postingevery day like.
Speaker 2 (24:23):
Your food pictures should be everywhere um and the
pictures look amazing like ithas to be really good food
pictures, or like their menuspinned on the top, something
yeah, if the pictures look kindof meh, I'm just gonna be.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
no, I don't want to go there Because you obviously
didn't put any effort into yourwebsite, so you should put a lot
of effort into your photos thatgo out on your social media
then Well, and you can maybe getaway with it as a restaurant,
kind of like we just said, ifthere's good pictures, but still
you shouldn't do it under anycircumstances.
Well, I think there's alsoanother big, big, big problem
(25:00):
with this, and it's if you know,zach, you own a piece of land
and I just go build myrestaurant on it and I don't
read any of your agreements withhow I'm able to use that land
and you come back and say, oh,in this clause that you never
read down here, it says thatafter six months I own your
restaurant, You're building onsomebody else's property.
(25:23):
Facebook owns.
Well, meta owns Facebook.
They are looking out for Meta,not you.
They will adjust the algorithm.
They'll change what people cansee.
They can change their terms.
They can delete your account.
Um, there, you can get, youknow, taken over.
You can get hacked, you can get.
Yeah, there's a lot that canhappen.
(25:45):
If your sole place to be isfacebook or or instagram or any
third-party property, um, andwhile your website is hosted
somewhere else, generally thecontent on there is yours and
that is protected, um, but youknow that's the other thing is
(26:06):
the content rights that facebookor meta or anybody have when
you put stuff on social media.
Do you?
Do you understand those?
Have you read those?
Do you know what they can dowith those?
It's rough.
So, just I mean, build a onepager Totally fine, like build a
one page website that has likean intro.
Your menu is easy to find onthere and it's got a couple of
(26:29):
little sections on how tocontact you, how to make a
reservation, whatever.
I don't know why we got hookedon restaurants.
I think because we love to eat.
Speaker 2 (26:36):
I mean, I think that's the biggest example of
that actually happening that wecould think of, because if
you're a legit B2B business andyour only website, or anything
close to a website, is Facebook,that's really bad.
Speaker 1 (26:52):
Yeah, I think that's.
Another good point is B2C canget away with this more than B2B
.
If you're targeting otherbusinesses, Facebook's probably
not the best place for you.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
You're not generating leads organically from Facebook
?
Speaker 1 (27:10):
probably If that's the only place you're sending
people.
Speaker 2 (27:15):
There's no way.
Speaker 1 (27:17):
Yeah, and I think that's right up there with like
Googling a business and thefirst result is Facebook and you
scroll the whole first page andyou don't see a website
anywhere.
It's like oh no.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
Yeah, all right.
Speaker 1 (27:30):
So I think, to sum it up, buying followers or
backlinks if it feels shady, ifit looks shady, if somebody's
told you it's shady, it's shady,please don't do it, thinking
that something that worked 30 or40 years ago you can just
replicate exactly today.
No, you've got to take thosenuggets and those lessons and
maybe the overarching strategy,but your tactics are definitely
(27:51):
going to be very different and,honestly, your strategy should
probably be adjusted for today.
Having just somebody random ora family member do your logo, do
your website, do whatever like,do it on the cheap.
Professional is always going tobe better.
You will pay for it, of course,but they'll also take the time
(28:11):
to make sure you have everythingyou need.
And then you know, buildingyour house on somebody else's
property without reading theterms and conditions.
You do need a website, even ifyou're a random small restaurant
.
Just pop up a one-pager.
You can do that for like sixbucks a month places.
Seriously, it's not hard.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
And I think an even easier way to think about this
don't take the easy way out andalways can like grow and adapt
to the changing industry andlike basically the way of the
world, because, yeah, thingsagain, things that worked back
then, aren't going to work now,and I think a lot of these kind
of just relate back to nottaking the easy way out.
Speaker 1 (28:51):
So yeah, I think if it feels like a shortcut, it is
a shortcut and it will look likea shortcut and it'll have
negative consequences.
Speaker 2 (28:58):
100 percent.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
Uh, all right.
So we do have an upcomingepisode, but I have no idea what
it is.
Speaker 2 (29:06):
It's gonna be it's gonna be website redesign or not
.
Website redesign.
It's gonna be web design trendsthat need to die with jesse oh,
web design trends that need todie with.
Speaker 1 (29:17):
Jesse will be the next one, so that'll be kind of
good.
So we're doing a couple ofnegatives in a row.
Hopefully we got a positive,happy sunshine episode coming up
too, so as always.
Speaker 2 (29:28):
thank you for listening, and you can find our
agency at antidote, underscoreseven one.
If you have a question you'dlike to send our way, head to
ctapodcastlive, to shoot us anemail or, even better, leave us
a voice message on our hotlineat 402-718-9971.
Your question will make it intoa future episode of the podcast
.
Speaker 1 (29:55):
So I have to tell you before we end.
Every time you say the phonenumber and nobody calls, it just
reminds me of trying to makefetch happen.
So Lacey Charbet's child toldher Mom everybody at school says
you invented fetch, what'sfetch?
And her kid is like seven oreight, I think.
And so the article I read saidoh my God, she made fetch happen
.
Makes me laugh.
(30:16):
So anyway, just had to sharethat.
But seriously call the damnnumber, ask us a question, it'd
be fun.
We'd love to have it I have abox of books here that I'm ready
to give out, but nobody wantsthem.
They're really great, though Ilove the cocktail book I've been
using it.
Alright with that.
No more tangents.
We'll see you next week.
Speaker 2 (30:37):
See ya.
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