November 11, 2024 • 50 mins
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Can hypnosis unlock the potential to transform your financial mindset? We bring you an intriguing conversation with The Profit Coach, Brian Rump, a certified consulting hypnotist and money business coach, who combines his expertise from banking and hypnosis to redefine our relationship with money. Brian delves into the psychological barriers we face with money and how preconceived beliefs can hold us back from achieving a fulfilling life. Through his journey, he illustrates how hypnosis can serve as a powerful tool in reshaping these narratives, allowing us to see money as a tool rather than a measure of self-worth.
Explore the profound impact of core money scripts on our lives, from cultural teachings that lead to money avoidance to the pitfalls of equating wealth with happiness. We dissect social norms that bind earning to relentless hard work and discuss how embracing entrepreneurship and focusing on unique skills can be liberating. Reflecting on the historical evolution to hourly wages, we question the stress it imposes and highlight the value of community and collaboration in reshaping financial experiences.
Join us as we challenge the constructs of property and money, revealing their dependence on societal systems and the emotional turmoil they can cause. Through historical anecdotes and real-life stories, we question the significance of wealth in extreme scenarios and underscore the critical role of human connection. By addressing ingrained money beliefs and embracing investment in ourselves, we can work toward more meaningful and collaborative lives. Brian's insights are sure to inspire you to rethink your financial narrative and prioritize creativity and community.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Welcome and thank you for joining us for Coffee with
Hilary and Les.
Brought to you by State of MindHypnosis and Training Center,
located in the heart of theKawartha Lakes, this is our
almost daily community podcastabout the mind and how you might
change it in the most simpleand helpful ways.
Every day, we sit staring atthe lake and sipping our coffee,
(00:29):
having a chat about hypnosisand how to make those meaningful
adjustments to our state ofmind, because nothing is more
important than your state ofmind.
Okay, we're on the line.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
We're on the line.
We're in the office today.
We're not out by the lake.
We're in the office todaybecause we have a guest, brian
Rump.
Brian Rump is here to talkabout money because we think
that we've got a good littletrilogy in mind to talk about
money, because money is one ofthose things that messes with us
.
It's filled with preconceivedideas and biases and limiting
(01:07):
beliefs and all kinds of things.
So we thought it would be goodto get Brian in here.
He's done some studying on this.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Yeah, so Brian is a hypnotist, one of our graduates,
and also a money business coach, and his business is called
Profit Coach.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Awesome, thank you for having me.
I love talking about money.
I think I am a money guy whohas.
Who's not a typical money guy?
So one of the things mybusiness name is Profit Coach,
and I'm thinking of changing itbecause when I say the word
(01:45):
profit, people get a little bitscared and noticing.
That is kind of what brought meback into being a money guy.
I worked for the bank for a longtime.
I was a bit of a fine printnerd.
I've overcome my own challengesto understand, like financial
(02:06):
statements, how money works andas I just keep diving into that,
that world, I get more and morecurious how we make decisions.
I've become a certifiedconsulting hypnotist with the
help of you folks here, and thathas just added a tool that I
(02:28):
think is so critical toaddressing our money stuff.
I completed a program calledTrauma of Money, which blew my
mind in terms of like even howwe look at money.
Everybody has a money story.
One of my core, I think ethos,is who I am in my future and my
(02:55):
business is helping peoplerewrite their money story.
We all have a money story forthose, especially in business,
want to, you know, generatewealth long term the money story
that got us to where we areisn't the one that's going to
get us where we need to go.
So we have to take some stepsto dig into that a little bit,
(03:20):
uncover what that story is, dosome rewriting, and you know my
quick conclusion is hypnosis canhelp all of that go faster
right, yeah, changing your mindyeah, yeah, it's all in our mind
.
Um, you know, to get super woowoo money is a made-up thing.
(03:40):
That's not real yet we havecollectively accepted it as a
story for thousands of years, soit's not going away anytime
soon.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
We even made it the rules to the game, didn't we?
Yeah, right, like if I made upa game and I said you know, um,
the person who wins this game isthe one who's wearing a green
sweatshirt.
Oh, look at me, I win.
Right, I see money that way.
Speaker 3 (04:05):
Somebody has said I want, I want to win, and the way
we win is a scorecard of moneyyeah, and we've accepted that as
a truth, and then we've got allsorts of stuff that then holds
us back from really living andenjoying a fulfilled life, and
(04:26):
that's one of the things thatyou want to kind of help unpack,
or help people at least reallyunderstand their own version of
what that is, so they can livethe life that they want to live,
because it's not all aboutmoney.
Money is simply a tool.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
Yeah, we put it up on a pedestal, it seems right and
then we look at it and becauseit's in our mind, above us, we
get overwhelmed and underwhelmedand scared yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:08):
We automatically look at somebody who appears to have
a lot of money.
We just automatically look atthem as being kind of a better
person.
I used to ask that when I teachclass I said does money make
you better?
Are better people the peoplewith money?
Does having money make you abetter person?
And the look on every like youguys are doing it.
Right now you give me that looklike.
Maybe I think that I don't likethe sound of that.
(05:29):
Maybe I've fought that before,but I don't like the sound of
that.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
yeah, see I where I go and, having um been in
banking and seen a lot of bankaccounts, I remember some early
reality checks for me was Iwould have this person come in
who's you know well-known aroundtown and you think, oh, this
person just has money.
And I kind of been conditionedto think, oh, these people have
(05:55):
it made and things are so easy.
And then they start givingtheir net worth statement or
telling me what they need toborrow money from, and I think
this is not good.
They, they don't have money.
Everyone thinks they have money, but that's not necessarily
true.
And then you, on the othercontrast, I meet people with
(06:17):
hardly any money at all who arethe kindest, most compassionate.
You know, the hat one of thehappiest people person I ever
met never made more than minimumwage, lived in a small house.
Um, him and his wife likecamped a lot together and just
didn't seem to want to run thatrace.
(06:37):
And when I would kind ofcompare net worths with that
person and someone who lookedlike they had everything, it's
like guess which one actuallyhad, you know, a better setup
for themselves.
And I think that's a kind of acommon thread for everyone.
And when we can figure whatthat mixes out for ourselves, it
(07:00):
just helps solve so many otherproblems there was an old saying
for lawyers.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
They always said you go to a banker and you ask a
banker about lawyers, and thebanker would say lawyers make a
lot of money but they never haveany.
Unfortunately, I thought thatwas too true, but what I learned
as a lawyer is that the averageperson is basically three
(07:25):
months away from living on thestreet.
Yeah, you cut them off forthree months from an income and
that's it, they're done.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
And that is so back.
You know, when I loop back tokind of some of the core
fundamentals that really make mepassionate about this is as we
are designed to collaborate.
We need connection or we willdie.
Yet we all pursue money so thatwe can be more and more
(07:54):
independent.
You talk to so many people andtheir dream is well, I want to
live on a homestead where Idon't have to see people, right,
and there's even schools ofmoney thought where people that
go all in on trying to makeenough money so they don't have
to see people again.
Yet it's not really possible.
(08:14):
You know we need to buy things,we need to trade.
Everybody has a job to do insociety.
So we go back thousands of yearsand there's people who make
food, there's people whotransport the food, there's
people who do other tasks, andto me, money is a way to kind of
(08:35):
account for some of thatcollaboration.
And there's really no quickescape route where you can just
make so much money that younever have to work or
collaborate again.
And I also think when we arerelaxed and regulated, you know
(08:55):
our general human, higher selveswant to create and we want to
collaborate like I know peoplewho their happiest thing is like
they love like being abartender at the right place,
because they they like to talkto people, they like to serve,
they like to work with theirhands.
Um, yet when they do that somuch they burn out or in the
(09:17):
wrong environment.
You know it causes all thisother other stress.
But you know we want tocollaborate and do some
different jobs.
Yet you know money can be thattool where if we get operating
from the wrong script or story,it can really lead us away from
where we really want to be whatkind of things you add to a
(09:41):
money story.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
Like what kind of headlines do you add to a money
story?
Like what kind of headlines doyou fill out?
Speaker 3 (09:47):
Yeah.
So I think money story to me isso similar to hypnosis.
We kind of have thesesuggestions we've accepted and
you know your money story andkind of the part of healing
starts with what is my moneynarrative?
What is my money story?
(10:09):
What were the things I heard asa child about money?
You know what money argumentsdid I overhear from my parents?
What advice did they give methat has now being related to,
to money.
There's kind of four corescripts that are um used and
(10:34):
this is, uh, the work of clones.
I forget their first names, butuh, you know there's people who
avoid money.
So that's the.
You know, if you grew upCatholic, you know money is the
root of all evil.
You probably got, you know, aheadline of some money avoidance
in you or richer bad peopleyeah, people who are rich or bad
people.
(10:54):
I feel undeserving of money, Ifeel guilty for desiring money.
I avoid thinking and talkingabout money.
So there's a core script forthat and there's many things we
can hear that kind of write thatinto our programming and, no
(11:15):
matter how much we try to thinkour way out of it or, you know,
say, oh, I'll just not believethat anymore.
You know, especially if we getinto our own business, as soon
as we start doing these thingsfor ourselves, the script is
like coming right up and like we.
We have to face it.
There's people who worshipmoney.
(11:36):
So you talked about puttingmoney on a pedestal.
Some people.
To them, money is freedom andhappiness and fulfillment for
them is in buying things.
So you know, when they havemoney, they're out buying things
.
I had a client once who grew upwhere it was all about money and
(11:58):
consumption and every fridaynight was lobster dinner with
like the extended family andjust grew up with so much wealth
and then that all kind of wentaway when they were in midlife
and they had to completely, youknow, readapt to how they were.
They were doing things.
(12:18):
These people can overspend.
It could be workaholics whereit's like money.
Is this freedom and happiness?
So I'm just going to work allthe time?
So when you talk about lawyerswho have no money, some of them
are the ones who are justworking and spending all the
time.
And that was again.
I think I was fortunate to seethe behind the scenes of some
(12:43):
people like that, where you knowyou think, oh, I need to be
like that person.
And then when you look at theirnet worth and when they're
coming in to you know, do aconsolidation loan and are just
on this never-ending treadmillof credit card spending, and
when you kind of account for itall, you think I don't want that
(13:03):
.
Like you know, they just try towork their way out of it, but
not making traction.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
That's one of those big ideas that I fall prey to.
I'm working on it now.
I mean, I've come to theconclusion that one of my
significant limiting beliefs isthat money comes from work,
money comes from work and if I'mnot working I don't deserve any
money, and that it is if I wantmoney.
(13:35):
I got to go to work and I thinkfor a lot of people the
unfortunate thing is they thinkworking means working for
somebody else.
I'm lucky enough to have brokenout of that one working um for
yourself as a viable option.
For me, it's one of thosethings.
I believe it's what you know, Itaught for years and years.
I love the idea for people toembrace that there's a lot of
(14:00):
freedom in running your ownbusiness, but yeah, for me that
was a big, big idea.
Was money and work are the same?
Speaker 3 (14:10):
yeah, yeah, and you have like that script if you
have to go out and earn it orwork for someone else or toil
right.
I had a coaching colleague ofmine who's an nLP practitioner
and I was talking about havingto do the hard work of something
and she was like Brian, takethe word hard out of there.
(14:33):
And this idea of, yeah, workingfor someone else or doing
something we don't want to do isthe only way to get money.
So when I do some of my own workand I think about that idea of
collaboration, I also followsome Adam Smith and his
philosophies, and one that hitsme is one of the best things we
(14:55):
can do for society is just bereally good at what we're good
at and kind of not worry abouteverything else.
So we are all born with like aunique skill set, so that looks
different for someone.
So if it is, you know, workingfor yourself in your own
business, serving a certainthing, it shouldn't feel like
(15:19):
quote-unquote hard work andmaybe works the wrong way, but
you know it is a way to kind ofearn an exchange because you're
collaborating with someone to,you know, do the thing you're
good at and someone else in thecommunity does the thing that
they're good at and kind of getstraded around back and forth
(15:42):
I've heard recently somethingthat, um, I found interesting
because when we were opening thebusiness, we were thinking
about an eight-hour workday andhow much to break even and how
much on top of that to pay forthe business hours.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
And I heard something recently that kind of, in a
sense, blew my mind.
I guess is letting go of thehow much I should make per hour,
right, how much you want tomake?
Let go of the hours in the day,who cares?
Speaker 3 (16:19):
right, that's another script.
So time is a whole.
Maybe not a script, but it'slines in the story and it's
relatively new since theindustrial revolution.
But even the whole concept ofpay per hour exists because we
tried to turn everything intofactories and make clocks.
(16:39):
These machines called clocks tolike clock, everything and all
of these structures, I think,just add stress to us.
You know, society workedthousands of years without
clocks.
There would be calendars.
You know there's times to dowork, there's times to do other
(16:59):
things.
You know the.
The option isn't sit and donothing forever and get served.
That is not what we're meant todo.
We're meant to live lifeexperience.
We're meant to move, we'remeant to be creative.
But you have these ideas of payper hour and some personalities
(17:31):
really accept that suggestionand can't get out of it.
Lawyers, even like they spendso much time.
You ever see a bill from alawyer that's eight pages long,
of every little six minuteincrement they worked with you,
documented.
It's crazy.
I used to produce those, yeah,and some people find other
models and some people don't.
Um, and part of uh, you know,part of the trauma of money
(17:54):
process is actually rethinkingcapitalism as we see it.
As to how do you want tostructure things.
Your business is a greatexample.
Like it's your business?
Like, yeah, you approach it aslike eight hour, 40 hours a week
, and how do we structure withinthat?
But the canvas is really blank.
(18:16):
Like you, there's a lot offreedom.
You have to be able to choosewhat you do and how you do it
and what model works for you,and part of unpacking our you
know money scripts is giving usthe opportunity to then decide
(18:36):
what we want to rewrite forourselves I find that you know
what I'm listening to you twotalk and I'm going immediately
to the idea of worth.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
Right.
What is your time worth?
You go by the hour.
I charge an hourly rate as alawyer.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
It was fractions of an hour dedicated to a file.
Speaker 1 (18:57):
The hours accumulate, you charge per hour, you know,
and that's what is that worth?
But you know, I also like thewordplay.
Right, the wordplay is worthy.
Right, there's worth.
But am I worthy?
I can charge you $350 an hourfor my work as a lawyer.
Is it worth $350 an hour?
(19:21):
And as a lawyer, do I think I'mworthy of that, or worthy of
that and more, or worthy of muchless than that?
I mean, that's going to definewhat you decide to charge as an
hourly rate.
Speaker 3 (19:34):
Really, that self-perception of my worth yeah
, that's another money statusscript which, um, self-worth is
net worth this idea of, yeah,what am I worth?
I get frustrated because somuch of like hesitate to call
(19:55):
myself a business coachsometimes, because so many
business coaches are like, well,charge what you're worth and
you know, double your price andadd 20 to it and it's not
necessarily wrong.
But yeah, it's this story andsuggestion we've accepted as to
our worth and it goes right toour heart of like, yeah, am I
(20:19):
worthy of having this stuff?
And I think one way throughthat is realizing you know, yes,
I am worthy of these things.
I'm worthy of being myself andworthy of identifying what my
skills are and how I am able tocontribute and then building a
(20:41):
business around that value.
Like there are going to bepeople who are worth massive
amounts of money per hourbecause they can help deliver
that service to you know,through their skill set, and
it's not doesn't make them abetter person or not.
Speaker 1 (20:59):
It could just be what the model is currently and
that's probably going to change,as things have always changed
throughout humanity yeah, likefor me, like I think about that,
that, that tension that existsbetween when we started this
business you know, we had somany discussions.
Hillary at that time had such ahard time thinking that her,
(21:23):
her work was going to be wortheven $100 an hour and that it
was resistance, really to youknow, am I good enough?
Do I know what I'm doing?
Can people afford this?
Is this fair to take this muchmoney away from people?
You know, so many people liveon a minimum wage mentality.
(21:44):
They've been working at minimumwage for so long in their life
that that's the program.
The program is minimum wage iswhat people are generally worth,
and to ask for more than thatis to suggest that you are more
than that.
And then self-image kicks in andyou start questioning yourself
and doubting yourself, right?
(22:04):
And then you reverse that andyou say, well, what is this
worth to them?
Right?
Like for me, one of thediscussions we had was we were
setting up our practice was well, what's it worth to the client?
I mean, I've never had a clientthat didn't finish with me,
that didn't say you know, mylife has completely changed,
(22:25):
right?
It's just what happens whenthey go through these
transitions and so their life iscompletely changed.
Right, it's just.
It's just what happens whenthey go through these
transitions, and so their lifeis completely well.
What's that worth?
Right.
Speaker 3 (22:33):
Every minute for the rest of your life is going to be
different as a result of skillsI have yeah, yeah, and I think
it's uh, um, it's fun to thinkabout because part of it is the
price has to be something thatpeople say yes to, right, and
it's hard to say yes when youdon't know what it feels like to
(22:54):
be on the other side.
And it is about.
You know, we get so caught upin yeah, these hourly rates and
what we compare things to up in,yeah, these hourly rates and
what we compare things to.
And I'll give you another.
A similar example is I have afriend right now who is a chef,
who worked in michelin starrestaurants, and he has a
(23:15):
coaching program that teachesyou how to make a michelin star
level meal for your friends andfamily at home.
And I've never eaten in amichin star restaurant I don't
know if you have, but I've toldit costs two people going out,
probably almost $2,000 American,like for some of these best
(23:37):
restaurants.
Um, that the type of places heworked at that he's trying to
teach you.
Um, so his program is $2,000 toteach you, and so his program
is two thousand dollars to teachyou these things.
And some people are like, well,that's crazy, it's expensive, I
can't afford that, and it's so.
Then you think, well, if youthen don't go out to one and
(24:00):
make it at home instead, you'vejust broken even on the price.
The people who are his targetsare a lot of executives, people
who went to Harvard, people whoprobably spend $50,000 a year on
golf.
They probably bought a $150,000kitchen so they could have
(24:22):
their dream chef's kitchen.
They probably spent a fortuneon knives and pots and the
cookware, yet all of a suddenthe training to get the skill
which culinary school is 50,000.
But I could learn the things Ineed to be able to do.
This thing is two, and you knowjust so much to unpack there of
(24:47):
even how we compare things andit's similar to hypnosis.
Great example someone comes andquits smoking.
Well, what's the present valueof not buying cigarettes every
day for the rest of your life?
Right, like that's a crazyinvestment.
So in a lot of ways I think totalk about hypnosis, no price
(25:21):
high enough is really going toreflect the actual value if it's
experienced, and that's maybe areason to not tie the price to
that as much.
It has to be really designedaround what your capacity is and
what your lifestyle is.
And then finding the clientswho fit into what you want to do
with that and will kind of paythe price that you you know need
(25:45):
to charge to.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
You know kind of create your life well, and then
and then you get the clientsthat don't think they're worthy.
Right like here.
I'm going to enter into aprogram.
It's going to cost me hundredsof dollars, but my goal is to
dramatically change how I'mliving.
Um, but geez, you know I can't.
I can't spend that kind ofmoney on myself, all that money
(26:08):
in one place on myself.
Speaker 3 (26:10):
You know, their personal worth starts to kick in
and their willingness to spendthe money yeah, and I think that
for money scripts as well,there's kind of two that show up
and what we haven't mentionedyet is like moneyance, which is
money should be saved Handoutsare bad and I don't buy anything
(26:30):
on credit Anxiety over money,which is often people who don't
spend anything on themselves,and then the avoidance people
don't spend anything onthemselves either, yet what they
really need is to make thisinvestment in themselves.
So we almost need to, like, dosome hypnosis work to overcome
(26:52):
the money stuff.
So we understand that, yeah, Iam worthy of that investment and
I am worthy of, you know,tackling these things to be able
to, you know, solve the, theproblems, the everyday problems
that I have, that I want tosolve the stories we tell
(27:14):
ourselves right yeah, it's allabout story, like I
fundamentally believe that youknow, our minds, bodies were.
We're hardwired for stories andwe just tell ourselves stories.
We accept stories from othersand not all of them are helpful,
(27:34):
or they're helpful to get us toa certain point and keep us
alive so long, but then theydon't become helpful anymore.
It's hard to see money outsideof a story.
Yeah, and that's kind of what'scool.
(27:56):
I learned like when I signed upfor Trauma of Money.
My original intent was, oh,I'll be able to take this and
learn it and help others, andwhat I didn't realize was it was
exactly what I needed at thetime for me and it was like
really almost rough to gothrough.
But almost all of ourexperiences money is right there
(28:20):
, it's like sitting in thecorner and it's just in every
story like just one of thesesticky things that's kind of
part of yeah, looming everywherein every story.
It's maybe the greatest storywe've ever.
Maybe it's the only story we'vecollectively all accepted.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
Yeah, this is kind of fun, fun to think about really
hard to see our, especially our,western world, because that's
what I know very, very well.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
You know, it's really hard to see our western world
as not completely defined bymoney yeah, it's wild when you
think of it and that shiftslittle bits and pieces, um, but
we accept that and I even thinkabout.
(29:15):
You know, not to talk specificpolitics, but every political
party at every election arealways going to talk about
getting the economy going again.
Right, and no one knows whatthat means and no one knows if
it hasn't been going.
But it's all for you know, thiseconomy and exchange and it
(29:39):
just dominates everything wethink about and I'm amazed at
how many people will unknowinglywant to sacrifice things for
themselves, thinking it's forthe greater good of the
quote-unquote economy yeah, theeconomy.
Speaker 1 (30:01):
Like what the heck does that term really mean?
Right, we're just observingmoney changing hands.
Speaker 3 (30:07):
Yeah, it's just the.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
It's just a measurement of commerce, yeah.
We call it the economy.
Speaker 3 (30:11):
Yeah, the production, consumption and transfer of
wealth.
Speaker 1 (30:20):
I think about.
It's funny.
What comes to my mind comes tomy mind is the old Beatles song
I Me Mine.
The Beatles had this, as thestory goes.
You can watch this on thedocumentary.
Funny.
What comes to my mind comes tomy mind is the old Beatles song
I mean mine, the.
The Beatles had this as thestory goes.
You can watch this on thedocumentary.
That's on Disney now.
No promotion for Disney, butthe Beatles were recording
(30:41):
albums and what had come down towas that every album was going
to have this one Ringo song, twoGeorge Harrison songs and six
Lennon McCartney songs, and theywould write the songs together
(31:02):
but they would have thisallocation of who gets what and
then how much space they go onthe album, sort of the I me,
mine, um, and they wrote a whole.
George harrison wrote a songabout it which just came to mind
um, yeah, property.
What would the world look likeif there was no such thing as
(31:24):
property?
Speaker 3 (31:27):
Yeah, that's a really good question.
What do you think?
Speaker 2 (31:35):
Hillary, well, I suppose I need the definition of
property.
Speaker 1 (31:45):
Well, that's the neat thing I used to yeah, I taught
law and I taught law.
I taught law and I'd say,define property, and people
would say things and I'd say,well, no, sometimes it's an idea
, not a thing.
And people would say I'd say,define property, and they'd say,
well, something that's mine.
And I'm saying, well, that'sjust circular, it's mine,
because it's mine, because it'smine, that doesn't explain it,
right?
Um, and we would go around andaround, like sometimes I'd just
(32:07):
enjoy watching the discussionlast 20 minutes with a complete
inability to define whatproperty was, and then I keep it
(32:32):
from you.
Right, that's how I createvalue.
I wrote a song and you can'tlisten to it unless you pay me,
unless you pay me.
I made a cake.
You can't taste it unless youpay me.
I made a coat and you can'twear it unless you pay me.
And in fact, if you pay me,I'll let the coat be yours and
(32:57):
then you won't let other peoplewear it unless they pay you, and
cars and everything is likethat.
So property is a concept, it'snot a thing, and it's a thing,
that's.
It's a concept that says I cantake that back, I can demand
that it's mine and that nobodyelse can have it, and that's how
(33:19):
we make money.
We make money because we havestuff that nobody else can have
unless they pay.
It's the core of business.
So it's yeah.
To me, the magic is realizing.
It's a concept, it's not athing, and the concept is one
that relies on the legal systemto enforce it.
(33:40):
Without the legal system, youdon't really have property,
unless you had a gun.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
Yeah, what's a?
What I like about that is it isadjacent to money, right Like.
Money's not real unlesssomebody else, like when I was
in the US last week and I had myCanadian bills in my pocket,
they weren't really worthanything to somebody in that
moment.
But if I had the green coloredones I could have a lot more
(34:11):
ability to use that at themoment.
Ability to use that at themoment and with property, um,
you know, money is the way tokind of exchange, that it's kind
of like the laws to enforce it.
Yet I'm not stealing your shirtright now because the law right
, it's like these humancollaborations and, and you know
(34:35):
, when you go way back before,there was some of these laws.
It was, you know, communityproperty and people you know
used and took what they need,and just the concept of you know
, we see that where we liveright now, you know, go back a
couple hundred years and theconcept that somebody could own
(34:56):
land was laughable.
Like you didn't own it, it waslike the community ran it, it
wasn't yours, it was thecreator's.
Speaker 1 (35:07):
Yeah, it's been here for 6 billion years.
You're going to be here for 60years maybe.
How can you own it?
It owns you.
Speaker 3 (35:15):
Yet the you know, quote unquote economy is founded
on, you know, one of the keyconcepts is establishing
property rights so that you cankind of trade it and then people
pay, play these like littlerent-seeking games of like who
can imagination trade all theseproducts back and forth?
(35:36):
Yet if we look closely at itit's mostly unnecessary.
And then I think where couldthat creativity be put to better
use if we weren't trading thosethings around?
And all of this can cause, justyou know, our minds to go and
(35:59):
then stress and stress responsesand I think to kind of bring a
bow back to our money stories,like people lose so much energy,
time, thought, emotion, justthinking about money and what
could happen.
And you know sometimes, if youjust accept that, hey, I'm three
(36:19):
months away from being on thestreet and I'm never going to be
further than that away.
So that's just a reminder tokind of enjoy life and focus and
like create what you want andknow that that time and things
will probably work itself out Ithink too, we've tied money to
(36:40):
our survival, our basic, basicemotions yeah right, if we don't
have money, then we die.
Speaker 2 (36:50):
basically, that's the perception, isn't it?
Speaker 3 (36:53):
And it connects this to you know we're using money as
that currency of connection andI remember thinking about just
the Christian idea of tithingand I remember thinking, well,
if money is not real like maybeit's an idea of, like you know
(37:19):
real, like maybe it's an idea oflike you know one in ten of
your like trust and energy tothe community, knowing that we
have to work together, so yeah,we've tied money to survival,
because that's our currencyreally, like we have to tie
connection to survival becausewe're not going to survive
without that human connection.
And to me there's been a lot ofmental freedom and just kind of
(37:41):
understanding that or knowingthat you know, even money's
money could go away, like thingscould change.
You might think you're richtoday but that doesn't mean
anything if the apocalypsehappens, because, yeah, the
money system could go away andthen you still got to work with
(38:01):
your neighbor next door to growsome food.
That's right.
And yeah, we've tied it to thisbig idea of survival.
I'm thinking of the you knowinterwar germany and the
inflation that happened andyou'd have, you know, families
who their entire life savings.
They actually converted it tostamps and the bank sent you.
(38:25):
You know, here's your lifesavings and you know a few
postage stamps.
It's like that's all it's worthnow and yeah, so we can't put
all of our trusted status inthis thing.
That could go away or change.
Speaker 1 (38:44):
I don't know that it makes me feel any more confident
.
On the one hand, I think it'sinsightful to look at money and
say, hey, it's just a system.
It's a system that was createdby people to deal in a concept
that was created by people thatis really built to try to.
Um, originally you thought itwas there to facilitate the
(39:08):
exchange of worth, the exchangeof value.
You know, right now I don'tneed any apples, you make apples
, but you need um.
You know a new wagon wheel andI make wagon wheels, and so, um,
I don't need any apples, youmake apples, but you need um.
You know a new wagon wheel andI make wagon wheels, and so, um,
I don't need apples, but here'sa wagon wheel.
I want you to go over toHillary and get you know she's
got eggs, I could use some eggsand maybe she could use some
(39:28):
apples, and then you take theapples to Hillary and Hillary
would give you the eggs, andthen you'd bring the eggs to me,
and then we all got what wewanted and everything was good,
right, because you needed applesor whatever.
So I think of it as the systemthat helps facilitate the
exchange of value.
But it is all so incrediblyconcocted, right.
(39:48):
And when you are in a community, when you are a community,
right like it's.
Imagine that scenario when welive in a little village and you
know when you need a new wagonwheel, I'm the guy you come to,
of course, right, because I'mthe guy who makes wagon wheels.
And when I need apples and weall need apples and maybe some
cider and you know a little bitof mead and stuff you know we
(40:10):
want pies, we want booze, wewant all this stuff, we come and
see you.
And when we want eggs or wewant chickens, you know down the
road there's Hillary, and wejust take care of each other
because we don't see it so muchas a scorecard as we see it as a
cooperative way of survival.
(40:31):
And then money becomes an end initself.
And then what makes it hard isthat some people hoard it.
Some people get a lot of it.
Some people are really good atasking for it and getting it.
Some people are really unafraidof it.
Some people really feeldeserving of it and worthy of it
(40:52):
and worthy of amassing largeamounts of it and demanding
large amounts of it, and worthyof amassing large amounts of it
and demanding large amounts ofit.
And all of a sudden it's gonefrom a way that we actually care
for each other to be a way thatwe literally take advantage of
(41:13):
each other.
Right, because in themarketplace you buy low, you
sell high, right?
Can I trick somebody intothinking?
I'll give an example.
I knew a guy.
He dealt in coins.
He was a coin dealer, and he'dsay to me, without any
hesitation, I make all my moneywhen I buy, because if I can buy
(41:38):
for a low price, I know whatit's really worth.
If I can buy for a low price,then I'm going to sell at a high
price and that's where I makemy money.
And it just makes meuncomfortable, right, it makes
me uncomfortable at the ideathat my success is tricking you
(41:59):
into thinking that what you haveisn't worth what it's worth.
Speaker 3 (42:03):
Yeah, and where my mind goes, I wonder what that
guy's doing now and how wellthat worked out.
There's a great concept whichis there's no economic profit in
the long run and the market hasa way to kind of balance itself
out.
And if we link that to just thehuman experience, I think, yeah
(42:25):
, in the long run we all getkind of forced back to
collaborating with each otherand being reasonable.
And then the other cool partabout this in the mind is we've
collectively gone through allthese iterations of things that
happen with our mind that we canprobably change it to whatever
(42:49):
we want to do in the future yeah, I think that's huge.
Speaker 1 (42:55):
You know, I think for a lot of people that that's a
startling shift on um limitingbeliefs.
Right, anything that has beencreated can be recreated.
Yeah, anything, it just takesan open mind to it.
And it's really our fixed ideasabout money.
Yeah, like money, there'snothing good or bad about it.
(43:18):
Inherently it's it'smeaningless it's a tool.
Speaker 3 (43:22):
It's a way to trade your wagon wheel for eggs when
someone that needs the wheelonly has apples.
Right, like that's really whatit is.
Speaker 1 (43:34):
Yeah, Yet we have all these thoughts and beliefs
about it and the people who haveit we have strong thoughts
about them.
And the people who don't haveit we have strong thoughts about
them.
Speaker 3 (43:50):
And then we have strong thoughts about ourselves,
based on the situation we findourselves in, and almost
everyone has the strong thoughts, thoughts about ourselves based
on the situation we findourselves in, and almost
everyone has the strong thoughts.
So even the people who have themoney usually have one of these
scripts that makes them feellike they don't have enough
money, and that's just anotherlayer that I think endlessly is,
(44:15):
uh, interesting, but it's alsothe reason, you know, to kind of
do some of this work andunderstand your own narrative
and maybe dull the sharpening ofit.
So, you know, I was recentlyspeaking to someone who I would
call mega rich, and that personhad a health incident that was
(44:38):
telling me about.
All of their thoughts wereabout money and their family and
how they didn't leave enoughyet there was more than you know
they could possibly spend.
Right, it was more about themultiple generations down the
road, and so, even though wemight look at these, you know
(45:02):
people like everyone still has,like, has it made and easy, and
of course, you should be relaxednow they still have a money
story that's like linked totheir survival, just quickly
summarize those stories again.
Yeah, so quickly there's kind offour scripts and I think having
(45:23):
these scripts, especially whenwe talk about businesses,
sometimes it's what gets you toa certain point.
But I think everyone's going tohave a mix of some of them and
you know, kind of looking atthem and dealing with them is
going to be helpful.
But they are money avoidance.
To people who avoid it, moneyequals greed and corruption.
(45:44):
We have money worship wheremoney is freedom and happiness
and we buy lots.
We are risky, we're workaholics.
Money status is our net worth,is our self-worth prone to, you
know, gambling big risks liesabout money, overspending,
unhappy, anxious, and moneyvigilance is, you know people.
(46:08):
Money should be saved.
Handouts are bad.
They don't buy on credit.
Anxiety over money, probablysitting on a huge pile of it,
but never feel like they'reenough.
You know, in business they alsomay never pay someone else to
do things they could do.
So all of them have, you know,ways they help, but a lot of
(46:30):
ways that hold us back from kindof living our true selves.
Speaker 2 (46:37):
I'm getting into this in the next one tomorrow.
But can you be poor and stillworship money?
Speaker 3 (46:45):
Oh, yeah, I think, definitely.
I think sometimes that couldkeep people poor.
You get people who earn a bitof money and then spend it all,
and then they don't have any andthen they can't get ahead of
themselves, and every time moneycomes in, you know, um, instead
(47:05):
of maybe looking after yourfuture, you kind of live in that
presence and buy, buy somethingfrom it.
So yeah, just checking our timehere and wrapping a bow on this
, I've got a few stories thatkind of we could save for next
time.
Speaker 2 (47:25):
Yeah, sounds good, cool All right.
Speaker 1 (47:29):
Well, I hope this is provocative to people Because I
think this is just such an issuefor most of us and I know it is
for me.
I know I have tons of limitingbeliefs around money.
I know that I'm constantlybattling myself as to my own
worth and how I should spend mytime and what I should offer to
(47:51):
the marketplace.
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, I think it's.
I don't like the word.
I was going to say an epidemic.
I think that it's everywhere.
I think it's hard to live inthis world and not have issues
with money, mm-hmm.
Speaker 3 (48:14):
And it's why I think it's a great gateway into the
great work we do in hypnosis,because you know part of when we
, when we tackle our money stuff, we're really tackling all of
the things that are going tohelp us everywhere and it helps
us realize we all have moneystuff.
Not everyone recognizes some oftheir other things, but they
(48:36):
recognize the money.
Yeah, if you're listening tothis, thinking, oh, I don't have
any of those scripts and I feelperfectly balanced and I have
enough money and I get to dowhat I love every day, I'd be
surprised if you're listening tothis and I want to talk to you.
Tell me what that's like.
Speaker 2 (48:58):
Yeah, exactly, all right.
Well, see you later.
Speaker 1 (49:04):
We hope you enjoyed today's podcast and that maybe
it helped even a little.
If you have any questions, wewould love you to send them
along in an email to info atpsalmhypnosiscom.
Thank you for being part of theState of Mind community.
For more information abouthypnosis and the various online
or in-person services we provide, please visit our website,
(49:27):
wwwpsalmhypnosiscom.
The link is in the notes below.
While you're there, why don'tyou book a free one-hour journey
, meeting with Hillary or Les,to learn more about what
hypnosis is and how you mightuse it to make your life what
you want it to be?
Bye for now.
Speaker 2 (49:55):
Talk to you tomorrow, thank you.
Welcome and thank you for joining us for Coffee with
Hilary and Les.
Brought to you by State of MindHypnosis and Training Center,
located in the heart of theKawartha Lakes, this is our
almost daily community podcastabout the mind and how you might
change it in the most simpleand helpful ways.
Every day, we sit staring atthe lake and sipping our coffee,
(00:29):
having a chat about hypnosisand how to make those meaningful
adjustments to our state ofmind, because nothing is more
important than your state ofmind.
Okay, we're on the line.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
We're on the line.
We're in the office today.
We're not out by the lake.
We're in the office todaybecause we have a guest, brian
Rump.
Brian Rump is here to talkabout money because we think
that we've got a good littletrilogy in mind to talk about
money, because money is one ofthose things that messes with us
.
It's filled with preconceivedideas and biases and limiting
(01:07):
beliefs and all kinds of things.
So we thought it would be goodto get Brian in here.
He's done some studying on this.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Yeah, so Brian is a hypnotist, one of our graduates,
and also a money business coach, and his business is called
Profit Coach.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Awesome, thank you for having me.
I love talking about money.
I think I am a money guy whohas.
Who's not a typical money guy?
So one of the things mybusiness name is Profit Coach,
and I'm thinking of changing itbecause when I say the word
(01:45):
profit, people get a little bitscared and noticing.
That is kind of what brought meback into being a money guy.
I worked for the bank for a longtime.
I was a bit of a fine printnerd.
I've overcome my own challengesto understand, like financial
(02:06):
statements, how money works andas I just keep diving into that,
that world, I get more and morecurious how we make decisions.
I've become a certifiedconsulting hypnotist with the
help of you folks here, and thathas just added a tool that I
(02:28):
think is so critical toaddressing our money stuff.
I completed a program calledTrauma of Money, which blew my
mind in terms of like even howwe look at money.
Everybody has a money story.
One of my core, I think ethos,is who I am in my future and my
(02:55):
business is helping peoplerewrite their money story.
We all have a money story forthose, especially in business,
want to, you know, generatewealth long term the money story
that got us to where we areisn't the one that's going to
get us where we need to go.
So we have to take some stepsto dig into that a little bit,
(03:20):
uncover what that story is, dosome rewriting, and you know my
quick conclusion is hypnosis canhelp all of that go faster
right, yeah, changing your mindyeah, yeah, it's all in our mind
.
Um, you know, to get super woowoo money is a made-up thing.
(03:40):
That's not real yet we havecollectively accepted it as a
story for thousands of years, soit's not going away anytime
soon.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
We even made it the rules to the game, didn't we?
Yeah, right, like if I made upa game and I said you know, um,
the person who wins this game isthe one who's wearing a green
sweatshirt.
Oh, look at me, I win.
Right, I see money that way.
Speaker 3 (04:05):
Somebody has said I want, I want to win, and the way
we win is a scorecard of moneyyeah, and we've accepted that as
a truth, and then we've got allsorts of stuff that then holds
us back from really living andenjoying a fulfilled life, and
(04:26):
that's one of the things thatyou want to kind of help unpack,
or help people at least reallyunderstand their own version of
what that is, so they can livethe life that they want to live,
because it's not all aboutmoney.
Money is simply a tool.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
Yeah, we put it up on a pedestal, it seems right and
then we look at it and becauseit's in our mind, above us, we
get overwhelmed and underwhelmedand scared yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:08):
We automatically look at somebody who appears to have
a lot of money.
We just automatically look atthem as being kind of a better
person.
I used to ask that when I teachclass I said does money make
you better?
Are better people the peoplewith money?
Does having money make you abetter person?
And the look on every like youguys are doing it.
Right now you give me that looklike.
Maybe I think that I don't likethe sound of that.
(05:29):
Maybe I've fought that before,but I don't like the sound of
that.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
yeah, see I where I go and, having um been in
banking and seen a lot of bankaccounts, I remember some early
reality checks for me was Iwould have this person come in
who's you know well-known aroundtown and you think, oh, this
person just has money.
And I kind of been conditionedto think, oh, these people have
(05:55):
it made and things are so easy.
And then they start givingtheir net worth statement or
telling me what they need toborrow money from, and I think
this is not good.
They, they don't have money.
Everyone thinks they have money, but that's not necessarily
true.
And then you, on the othercontrast, I meet people with
(06:17):
hardly any money at all who arethe kindest, most compassionate.
You know, the hat one of thehappiest people person I ever
met never made more than minimumwage, lived in a small house.
Um, him and his wife likecamped a lot together and just
didn't seem to want to run thatrace.
(06:37):
And when I would kind ofcompare net worths with that
person and someone who lookedlike they had everything, it's
like guess which one actuallyhad, you know, a better setup
for themselves.
And I think that's a kind of acommon thread for everyone.
And when we can figure whatthat mixes out for ourselves, it
(07:00):
just helps solve so many otherproblems there was an old saying
for lawyers.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
They always said you go to a banker and you ask a
banker about lawyers, and thebanker would say lawyers make a
lot of money but they never haveany.
Unfortunately, I thought thatwas too true, but what I learned
as a lawyer is that the averageperson is basically three
(07:25):
months away from living on thestreet.
Yeah, you cut them off forthree months from an income and
that's it, they're done.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
And that is so back.
You know, when I loop back tokind of some of the core
fundamentals that really make mepassionate about this is as we
are designed to collaborate.
We need connection or we willdie.
Yet we all pursue money so thatwe can be more and more
(07:54):
independent.
You talk to so many people andtheir dream is well, I want to
live on a homestead where Idon't have to see people, right,
and there's even schools ofmoney thought where people that
go all in on trying to makeenough money so they don't have
to see people again.
Yet it's not really possible.
(08:14):
You know we need to buy things,we need to trade.
Everybody has a job to do insociety.
So we go back thousands of yearsand there's people who make
food, there's people whotransport the food, there's
people who do other tasks, andto me, money is a way to kind of
(08:35):
account for some of thatcollaboration.
And there's really no quickescape route where you can just
make so much money that younever have to work or
collaborate again.
And I also think when we arerelaxed and regulated, you know
(08:55):
our general human, higher selveswant to create and we want to
collaborate like I know peoplewho their happiest thing is like
they love like being abartender at the right place,
because they they like to talkto people, they like to serve,
they like to work with theirhands.
Um, yet when they do that somuch they burn out or in the
(09:17):
wrong environment.
You know it causes all thisother other stress.
But you know we want tocollaborate and do some
different jobs.
Yet you know money can be thattool where if we get operating
from the wrong script or story,it can really lead us away from
where we really want to be whatkind of things you add to a
(09:41):
money story.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
Like what kind of headlines do you add to a money
story?
Like what kind of headlines doyou fill out?
Speaker 3 (09:47):
Yeah.
So I think money story to me isso similar to hypnosis.
We kind of have thesesuggestions we've accepted and
you know your money story andkind of the part of healing
starts with what is my moneynarrative?
What is my money story?
(10:09):
What were the things I heard asa child about money?
You know what money argumentsdid I overhear from my parents?
What advice did they give methat has now being related to,
to money.
There's kind of four corescripts that are um used and
(10:34):
this is, uh, the work of clones.
I forget their first names, butuh, you know there's people who
avoid money.
So that's the.
You know, if you grew upCatholic, you know money is the
root of all evil.
You probably got, you know, aheadline of some money avoidance
in you or richer bad peopleyeah, people who are rich or bad
people.
(10:54):
I feel undeserving of money, Ifeel guilty for desiring money.
I avoid thinking and talkingabout money.
So there's a core script forthat and there's many things we
can hear that kind of write thatinto our programming and, no
(11:15):
matter how much we try to thinkour way out of it or, you know,
say, oh, I'll just not believethat anymore.
You know, especially if we getinto our own business, as soon
as we start doing these thingsfor ourselves, the script is
like coming right up and like we.
We have to face it.
There's people who worshipmoney.
(11:36):
So you talked about puttingmoney on a pedestal.
Some people.
To them, money is freedom andhappiness and fulfillment for
them is in buying things.
So you know, when they havemoney, they're out buying things
.
I had a client once who grew upwhere it was all about money and
(11:58):
consumption and every fridaynight was lobster dinner with
like the extended family andjust grew up with so much wealth
and then that all kind of wentaway when they were in midlife
and they had to completely, youknow, readapt to how they were.
They were doing things.
(12:18):
These people can overspend.
It could be workaholics whereit's like money.
Is this freedom and happiness?
So I'm just going to work allthe time?
So when you talk about lawyerswho have no money, some of them
are the ones who are justworking and spending all the
time.
And that was again.
I think I was fortunate to seethe behind the scenes of some
(12:43):
people like that, where you knowyou think, oh, I need to be
like that person.
And then when you look at theirnet worth and when they're
coming in to you know, do aconsolidation loan and are just
on this never-ending treadmillof credit card spending, and
when you kind of account for itall, you think I don't want that
(13:03):
.
Like you know, they just try towork their way out of it, but
not making traction.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
That's one of those big ideas that I fall prey to.
I'm working on it now.
I mean, I've come to theconclusion that one of my
significant limiting beliefs isthat money comes from work,
money comes from work and if I'mnot working I don't deserve any
money, and that it is if I wantmoney.
(13:35):
I got to go to work and I thinkfor a lot of people the
unfortunate thing is they thinkworking means working for
somebody else.
I'm lucky enough to have brokenout of that one working um for
yourself as a viable option.
For me, it's one of thosethings.
I believe it's what you know, Itaught for years and years.
I love the idea for people toembrace that there's a lot of
(14:00):
freedom in running your ownbusiness, but yeah, for me that
was a big, big idea.
Was money and work are the same?
Speaker 3 (14:10):
yeah, yeah, and you have like that script if you
have to go out and earn it orwork for someone else or toil
right.
I had a coaching colleague ofmine who's an nLP practitioner
and I was talking about havingto do the hard work of something
and she was like Brian, takethe word hard out of there.
(14:33):
And this idea of, yeah, workingfor someone else or doing
something we don't want to do isthe only way to get money.
So when I do some of my own workand I think about that idea of
collaboration, I also followsome Adam Smith and his
philosophies, and one that hitsme is one of the best things we
(14:55):
can do for society is just bereally good at what we're good
at and kind of not worry abouteverything else.
So we are all born with like aunique skill set, so that looks
different for someone.
So if it is, you know, workingfor yourself in your own
business, serving a certainthing, it shouldn't feel like
(15:19):
quote-unquote hard work andmaybe works the wrong way, but
you know it is a way to kind ofearn an exchange because you're
collaborating with someone to,you know, do the thing you're
good at and someone else in thecommunity does the thing that
they're good at and kind of getstraded around back and forth
(15:42):
I've heard recently somethingthat, um, I found interesting
because when we were opening thebusiness, we were thinking
about an eight-hour workday andhow much to break even and how
much on top of that to pay forthe business hours.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
And I heard something recently that kind of, in a
sense, blew my mind.
I guess is letting go of thehow much I should make per hour,
right, how much you want tomake?
Let go of the hours in the day,who cares?
Speaker 3 (16:19):
right, that's another script.
So time is a whole.
Maybe not a script, but it'slines in the story and it's
relatively new since theindustrial revolution.
But even the whole concept ofpay per hour exists because we
tried to turn everything intofactories and make clocks.
(16:39):
These machines called clocks tolike clock, everything and all
of these structures, I think,just add stress to us.
You know, society workedthousands of years without
clocks.
There would be calendars.
You know there's times to dowork, there's times to do other
(16:59):
things.
You know the.
The option isn't sit and donothing forever and get served.
That is not what we're meant todo.
We're meant to live lifeexperience.
We're meant to move, we'remeant to be creative.
But you have these ideas of payper hour and some personalities
(17:31):
really accept that suggestionand can't get out of it.
Lawyers, even like they spendso much time.
You ever see a bill from alawyer that's eight pages long,
of every little six minuteincrement they worked with you,
documented.
It's crazy.
I used to produce those, yeah,and some people find other
models and some people don't.
Um, and part of uh, you know,part of the trauma of money
(17:54):
process is actually rethinkingcapitalism as we see it.
As to how do you want tostructure things.
Your business is a greatexample.
Like it's your business?
Like, yeah, you approach it aslike eight hour, 40 hours a week
, and how do we structure withinthat?
But the canvas is really blank.
(18:16):
Like you, there's a lot offreedom.
You have to be able to choosewhat you do and how you do it
and what model works for you,and part of unpacking our you
know money scripts is giving usthe opportunity to then decide
(18:36):
what we want to rewrite forourselves I find that you know
what I'm listening to you twotalk and I'm going immediately
to the idea of worth.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:48):
Right.
What is your time worth?
You go by the hour.
I charge an hourly rate as alawyer.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
It was fractions of an hour dedicated to a file.
Speaker 1 (18:57):
The hours accumulate, you charge per hour, you know,
and that's what is that worth?
But you know, I also like thewordplay.
Right, the wordplay is worthy.
Right, there's worth.
But am I worthy?
I can charge you $350 an hourfor my work as a lawyer.
Is it worth $350 an hour?
(19:21):
And as a lawyer, do I think I'mworthy of that, or worthy of
that and more, or worthy of muchless than that?
I mean, that's going to definewhat you decide to charge as an
hourly rate.
Speaker 3 (19:34):
Really, that self-perception of my worth yeah
, that's another money statusscript which, um, self-worth is
net worth this idea of, yeah,what am I worth?
I get frustrated because somuch of like hesitate to call
(19:55):
myself a business coachsometimes, because so many
business coaches are like, well,charge what you're worth and
you know, double your price andadd 20 to it and it's not
necessarily wrong.
But yeah, it's this story andsuggestion we've accepted as to
our worth and it goes right toour heart of like, yeah, am I
(20:19):
worthy of having this stuff?
And I think one way throughthat is realizing you know, yes,
I am worthy of these things.
I'm worthy of being myself andworthy of identifying what my
skills are and how I am able tocontribute and then building a
(20:41):
business around that value.
Like there are going to bepeople who are worth massive
amounts of money per hourbecause they can help deliver
that service to you know,through their skill set, and
it's not doesn't make them abetter person or not.
Speaker 1 (20:59):
It could just be what the model is currently and
that's probably going to change,as things have always changed
throughout humanity yeah, likefor me, like I think about that,
that, that tension that existsbetween when we started this
business you know, we had somany discussions.
Hillary at that time had such ahard time thinking that her,
(21:23):
her work was going to be wortheven $100 an hour and that it
was resistance, really to youknow, am I good enough?
Do I know what I'm doing?
Can people afford this?
Is this fair to take this muchmoney away from people?
You know, so many people liveon a minimum wage mentality.
(21:44):
They've been working at minimumwage for so long in their life
that that's the program.
The program is minimum wage iswhat people are generally worth,
and to ask for more than thatis to suggest that you are more
than that.
And then self-image kicks in andyou start questioning yourself
and doubting yourself, right?
(22:04):
And then you reverse that andyou say, well, what is this
worth to them?
Right?
Like for me, one of thediscussions we had was we were
setting up our practice was well, what's it worth to the client?
I mean, I've never had a clientthat didn't finish with me,
that didn't say you know, mylife has completely changed,
(22:25):
right?
It's just what happens whenthey go through these
transitions and so their life iscompletely changed.
Right, it's just.
It's just what happens whenthey go through these
transitions, and so their lifeis completely well.
What's that worth?
Right.
Speaker 3 (22:33):
Every minute for the rest of your life is going to be
different as a result of skillsI have yeah, yeah, and I think
it's uh, um, it's fun to thinkabout because part of it is the
price has to be something thatpeople say yes to, right, and
it's hard to say yes when youdon't know what it feels like to
(22:54):
be on the other side.
And it is about.
You know, we get so caught upin yeah, these hourly rates and
what we compare things to up in,yeah, these hourly rates and
what we compare things to.
And I'll give you another.
A similar example is I have afriend right now who is a chef,
who worked in michelin starrestaurants, and he has a
(23:15):
coaching program that teachesyou how to make a michelin star
level meal for your friends andfamily at home.
And I've never eaten in amichin star restaurant I don't
know if you have, but I've toldit costs two people going out,
probably almost $2,000 American,like for some of these best
(23:37):
restaurants.
Um, that the type of places heworked at that he's trying to
teach you.
Um, so his program is $2,000 toteach you, and so his program
is two thousand dollars to teachyou these things.
And some people are like, well,that's crazy, it's expensive, I
can't afford that, and it's so.
Then you think, well, if youthen don't go out to one and
(24:00):
make it at home instead, you'vejust broken even on the price.
The people who are his targetsare a lot of executives, people
who went to Harvard, people whoprobably spend $50,000 a year on
golf.
They probably bought a $150,000kitchen so they could have
(24:22):
their dream chef's kitchen.
They probably spent a fortuneon knives and pots and the
cookware, yet all of a suddenthe training to get the skill
which culinary school is 50,000.
But I could learn the things Ineed to be able to do.
This thing is two, and you knowjust so much to unpack there of
(24:47):
even how we compare things andit's similar to hypnosis.
Great example someone comes andquits smoking.
Well, what's the present valueof not buying cigarettes every
day for the rest of your life?
Right, like that's a crazyinvestment.
So in a lot of ways I think totalk about hypnosis, no price
(25:21):
high enough is really going toreflect the actual value if it's
experienced, and that's maybe areason to not tie the price to
that as much.
It has to be really designedaround what your capacity is and
what your lifestyle is.
And then finding the clientswho fit into what you want to do
with that and will kind of paythe price that you you know need
(25:45):
to charge to.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
You know kind of create your life well, and then
and then you get the clientsthat don't think they're worthy.
Right like here.
I'm going to enter into aprogram.
It's going to cost me hundredsof dollars, but my goal is to
dramatically change how I'mliving.
Um, but geez, you know I can't.
I can't spend that kind ofmoney on myself, all that money
(26:08):
in one place on myself.
Speaker 3 (26:10):
You know, their personal worth starts to kick in
and their willingness to spendthe money yeah, and I think that
for money scripts as well,there's kind of two that show up
and what we haven't mentionedyet is like moneyance, which is
money should be saved Handoutsare bad and I don't buy anything
(26:30):
on credit Anxiety over money,which is often people who don't
spend anything on themselves,and then the avoidance people
don't spend anything onthemselves either, yet what they
really need is to make thisinvestment in themselves.
So we almost need to, like, dosome hypnosis work to overcome
(26:52):
the money stuff.
So we understand that, yeah, Iam worthy of that investment and
I am worthy of, you know,tackling these things to be able
to, you know, solve the, theproblems, the everyday problems
that I have, that I want tosolve the stories we tell
(27:14):
ourselves right yeah, it's allabout story, like I
fundamentally believe that youknow, our minds, bodies were.
We're hardwired for stories andwe just tell ourselves stories.
We accept stories from othersand not all of them are helpful,
(27:34):
or they're helpful to get us toa certain point and keep us
alive so long, but then theydon't become helpful anymore.
It's hard to see money outsideof a story.
Yeah, and that's kind of what'scool.
(27:56):
I learned like when I signed upfor Trauma of Money.
My original intent was, oh,I'll be able to take this and
learn it and help others, andwhat I didn't realize was it was
exactly what I needed at thetime for me and it was like
really almost rough to gothrough.
But almost all of ourexperiences money is right there
(28:20):
, it's like sitting in thecorner and it's just in every
story like just one of thesesticky things that's kind of
part of yeah, looming everywherein every story.
It's maybe the greatest storywe've ever.
Maybe it's the only story we'vecollectively all accepted.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
Yeah, this is kind of fun, fun to think about really
hard to see our, especially our,western world, because that's
what I know very, very well.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
You know, it's really hard to see our western world
as not completely defined bymoney yeah, it's wild when you
think of it and that shiftslittle bits and pieces, um, but
we accept that and I even thinkabout.
(29:15):
You know, not to talk specificpolitics, but every political
party at every election arealways going to talk about
getting the economy going again.
Right, and no one knows whatthat means and no one knows if
it hasn't been going.
But it's all for you know, thiseconomy and exchange and it
(29:39):
just dominates everything wethink about and I'm amazed at
how many people will unknowinglywant to sacrifice things for
themselves, thinking it's forthe greater good of the
quote-unquote economy yeah, theeconomy.
Speaker 1 (30:01):
Like what the heck does that term really mean?
Right, we're just observingmoney changing hands.
Speaker 3 (30:07):
Yeah, it's just the.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
It's just a measurement of commerce, yeah.
We call it the economy.
Speaker 3 (30:11):
Yeah, the production, consumption and transfer of
wealth.
Speaker 1 (30:20):
I think about.
It's funny.
What comes to my mind comes tomy mind is the old Beatles song
I Me Mine.
The Beatles had this, as thestory goes.
You can watch this on thedocumentary.
Funny.
What comes to my mind comes tomy mind is the old Beatles song
I mean mine, the.
The Beatles had this as thestory goes.
You can watch this on thedocumentary.
That's on Disney now.
No promotion for Disney, butthe Beatles were recording
(30:41):
albums and what had come down towas that every album was going
to have this one Ringo song, twoGeorge Harrison songs and six
Lennon McCartney songs, and theywould write the songs together
(31:02):
but they would have thisallocation of who gets what and
then how much space they go onthe album, sort of the I me,
mine, um, and they wrote a whole.
George harrison wrote a songabout it which just came to mind
um, yeah, property.
What would the world look likeif there was no such thing as
(31:24):
property?
Speaker 3 (31:27):
Yeah, that's a really good question.
What do you think?
Speaker 2 (31:35):
Hillary, well, I suppose I need the definition of
property.
Speaker 1 (31:45):
Well, that's the neat thing I used to yeah, I taught
law and I taught law.
I taught law and I'd say,define property, and people
would say things and I'd say,well, no, sometimes it's an idea
, not a thing.
And people would say I'd say,define property, and they'd say,
well, something that's mine.
And I'm saying, well, that'sjust circular, it's mine,
because it's mine, because it'smine, that doesn't explain it,
right?
Um, and we would go around andaround, like sometimes I'd just
(32:07):
enjoy watching the discussionlast 20 minutes with a complete
inability to define whatproperty was, and then I keep it
(32:32):
from you.
Right, that's how I createvalue.
I wrote a song and you can'tlisten to it unless you pay me,
unless you pay me.
I made a cake.
You can't taste it unless youpay me.
I made a coat and you can'twear it unless you pay me.
And in fact, if you pay me,I'll let the coat be yours and
(32:57):
then you won't let other peoplewear it unless they pay you, and
cars and everything is likethat.
So property is a concept, it'snot a thing, and it's a thing,
that's.
It's a concept that says I cantake that back, I can demand
that it's mine and that nobodyelse can have it, and that's how
(33:19):
we make money.
We make money because we havestuff that nobody else can have
unless they pay.
It's the core of business.
So it's yeah.
To me, the magic is realizing.
It's a concept, it's not athing, and the concept is one
that relies on the legal systemto enforce it.
(33:40):
Without the legal system, youdon't really have property,
unless you had a gun.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
Yeah, what's a?
What I like about that is it isadjacent to money, right Like.
Money's not real unlesssomebody else, like when I was
in the US last week and I had myCanadian bills in my pocket,
they weren't really worthanything to somebody in that
moment.
But if I had the green coloredones I could have a lot more
(34:11):
ability to use that at themoment.
Ability to use that at themoment and with property, um,
you know, money is the way tokind of exchange, that it's kind
of like the laws to enforce it.
Yet I'm not stealing your shirtright now because the law right
, it's like these humancollaborations and, and you know
(34:35):
, when you go way back before,there was some of these laws.
It was, you know, communityproperty and people you know
used and took what they need,and just the concept of you know
, we see that where we liveright now, you know, go back a
couple hundred years and theconcept that somebody could own
(34:56):
land was laughable.
Like you didn't own it, it waslike the community ran it, it
wasn't yours, it was thecreator's.
Speaker 1 (35:07):
Yeah, it's been here for 6 billion years.
You're going to be here for 60years maybe.
How can you own it?
It owns you.
Speaker 3 (35:15):
Yet the you know, quote unquote economy is founded
on, you know, one of the keyconcepts is establishing
property rights so that you cankind of trade it and then people
pay, play these like littlerent-seeking games of like who
can imagination trade all theseproducts back and forth?
(35:36):
Yet if we look closely at itit's mostly unnecessary.
And then I think where couldthat creativity be put to better
use if we weren't trading thosethings around?
And all of this can cause, justyou know, our minds to go and
(35:59):
then stress and stress responsesand I think to kind of bring a
bow back to our money stories,like people lose so much energy,
time, thought, emotion, justthinking about money and what
could happen.
And you know sometimes, if youjust accept that, hey, I'm three
(36:19):
months away from being on thestreet and I'm never going to be
further than that away.
So that's just a reminder tokind of enjoy life and focus and
like create what you want andknow that that time and things
will probably work itself out Ithink too, we've tied money to
(36:40):
our survival, our basic, basicemotions yeah right, if we don't
have money, then we die.
Speaker 2 (36:50):
basically, that's the perception, isn't it?
Speaker 3 (36:53):
And it connects this to you know we're using money as
that currency of connection andI remember thinking about just
the Christian idea of tithingand I remember thinking, well,
if money is not real like maybeit's an idea of, like you know
(37:19):
real, like maybe it's an idea oflike you know one in ten of
your like trust and energy tothe community, knowing that we
have to work together, so yeah,we've tied money to survival,
because that's our currencyreally, like we have to tie
connection to survival becausewe're not going to survive
without that human connection.
And to me there's been a lot ofmental freedom and just kind of
(37:41):
understanding that or knowingthat you know, even money's
money could go away, like thingscould change.
You might think you're richtoday but that doesn't mean
anything if the apocalypsehappens, because, yeah, the
money system could go away andthen you still got to work with
(38:01):
your neighbor next door to growsome food.
That's right.
And yeah, we've tied it to thisbig idea of survival.
I'm thinking of the you knowinterwar germany and the
inflation that happened andyou'd have, you know, families
who their entire life savings.
They actually converted it tostamps and the bank sent you.
(38:25):
You know, here's your lifesavings and you know a few
postage stamps.
It's like that's all it's worthnow and yeah, so we can't put
all of our trusted status inthis thing.
That could go away or change.
Speaker 1 (38:44):
I don't know that it makes me feel any more confident
.
On the one hand, I think it'sinsightful to look at money and
say, hey, it's just a system.
It's a system that was createdby people to deal in a concept
that was created by people thatis really built to try to.
Um, originally you thought itwas there to facilitate the
(39:08):
exchange of worth, the exchangeof value.
You know, right now I don'tneed any apples, you make apples
, but you need um.
You know a new wagon wheel andI make wagon wheels, and so, um,
I don't need any apples, youmake apples, but you need um.
You know a new wagon wheel andI make wagon wheels, and so, um,
I don't need apples, but here'sa wagon wheel.
I want you to go over toHillary and get you know she's
got eggs, I could use some eggsand maybe she could use some
(39:28):
apples, and then you take theapples to Hillary and Hillary
would give you the eggs, andthen you'd bring the eggs to me,
and then we all got what wewanted and everything was good,
right, because you needed applesor whatever.
So I think of it as the systemthat helps facilitate the
exchange of value.
But it is all so incrediblyconcocted, right.
(39:48):
And when you are in a community, when you are a community,
right like it's.
Imagine that scenario when welive in a little village and you
know when you need a new wagonwheel, I'm the guy you come to,
of course, right, because I'mthe guy who makes wagon wheels.
And when I need apples and weall need apples and maybe some
cider and you know a little bitof mead and stuff you know we
(40:10):
want pies, we want booze, wewant all this stuff, we come and
see you.
And when we want eggs or wewant chickens, you know down the
road there's Hillary, and wejust take care of each other
because we don't see it so muchas a scorecard as we see it as a
cooperative way of survival.
(40:31):
And then money becomes an end initself.
And then what makes it hard isthat some people hoard it.
Some people get a lot of it.
Some people are really good atasking for it and getting it.
Some people are really unafraidof it.
Some people really feeldeserving of it and worthy of it
(40:52):
and worthy of amassing largeamounts of it and demanding
large amounts of it, and worthyof amassing large amounts of it
and demanding large amounts ofit.
And all of a sudden it's gonefrom a way that we actually care
for each other to be a way thatwe literally take advantage of
(41:13):
each other.
Right, because in themarketplace you buy low, you
sell high, right?
Can I trick somebody intothinking?
I'll give an example.
I knew a guy.
He dealt in coins.
He was a coin dealer, and he'dsay to me, without any
hesitation, I make all my moneywhen I buy, because if I can buy
(41:38):
for a low price, I know whatit's really worth.
If I can buy for a low price,then I'm going to sell at a high
price and that's where I makemy money.
And it just makes meuncomfortable, right, it makes
me uncomfortable at the ideathat my success is tricking you
(41:59):
into thinking that what you haveisn't worth what it's worth.
Speaker 3 (42:03):
Yeah, and where my mind goes, I wonder what that
guy's doing now and how wellthat worked out.
There's a great concept whichis there's no economic profit in
the long run and the market hasa way to kind of balance itself
out.
And if we link that to just thehuman experience, I think, yeah
(42:25):
, in the long run we all getkind of forced back to
collaborating with each otherand being reasonable.
And then the other cool partabout this in the mind is we've
collectively gone through allthese iterations of things that
happen with our mind that we canprobably change it to whatever
(42:49):
we want to do in the future yeah, I think that's huge.
Speaker 1 (42:55):
You know, I think for a lot of people that that's a
startling shift on um limitingbeliefs.
Right, anything that has beencreated can be recreated.
Yeah, anything, it just takesan open mind to it.
And it's really our fixed ideasabout money.
Yeah, like money, there'snothing good or bad about it.
(43:18):
Inherently it's it'smeaningless it's a tool.
Speaker 3 (43:22):
It's a way to trade your wagon wheel for eggs when
someone that needs the wheelonly has apples.
Right, like that's really whatit is.
Speaker 1 (43:34):
Yeah, Yet we have all these thoughts and beliefs
about it and the people who haveit we have strong thoughts
about them.
And the people who don't haveit we have strong thoughts about
them.
Speaker 3 (43:50):
And then we have strong thoughts about ourselves,
based on the situation we findourselves in, and almost
everyone has the strong thoughts, thoughts about ourselves based
on the situation we findourselves in, and almost
everyone has the strong thoughts.
So even the people who have themoney usually have one of these
scripts that makes them feellike they don't have enough
money, and that's just anotherlayer that I think endlessly is,
(44:15):
uh, interesting, but it's alsothe reason, you know, to kind of
do some of this work andunderstand your own narrative
and maybe dull the sharpening ofit.
So, you know, I was recentlyspeaking to someone who I would
call mega rich, and that personhad a health incident that was
(44:38):
telling me about.
All of their thoughts wereabout money and their family and
how they didn't leave enoughyet there was more than you know
they could possibly spend.
Right, it was more about themultiple generations down the
road, and so, even though wemight look at these, you know
(45:02):
people like everyone still has,like, has it made and easy, and
of course, you should be relaxednow they still have a money
story that's like linked totheir survival, just quickly
summarize those stories again.
Yeah, so quickly there's kind offour scripts and I think having
(45:23):
these scripts, especially whenwe talk about businesses,
sometimes it's what gets you toa certain point.
But I think everyone's going tohave a mix of some of them and
you know, kind of looking atthem and dealing with them is
going to be helpful.
But they are money avoidance.
To people who avoid it, moneyequals greed and corruption.
(45:44):
We have money worship wheremoney is freedom and happiness
and we buy lots.
We are risky, we're workaholics.
Money status is our net worth,is our self-worth prone to, you
know, gambling big risks liesabout money, overspending,
unhappy, anxious, and moneyvigilance is, you know people.
(46:08):
Money should be saved.
Handouts are bad.
They don't buy on credit.
Anxiety over money, probablysitting on a huge pile of it,
but never feel like they'reenough.
You know, in business they alsomay never pay someone else to
do things they could do.
So all of them have, you know,ways they help, but a lot of
(46:30):
ways that hold us back from kindof living our true selves.
Speaker 2 (46:37):
I'm getting into this in the next one tomorrow.
But can you be poor and stillworship money?
Speaker 3 (46:45):
Oh, yeah, I think, definitely.
I think sometimes that couldkeep people poor.
You get people who earn a bitof money and then spend it all,
and then they don't have any andthen they can't get ahead of
themselves, and every time moneycomes in, you know, um, instead
(47:05):
of maybe looking after yourfuture, you kind of live in that
presence and buy, buy somethingfrom it.
So yeah, just checking our timehere and wrapping a bow on this
, I've got a few stories thatkind of we could save for next
time.
Speaker 2 (47:25):
Yeah, sounds good, cool All right.
Speaker 1 (47:29):
Well, I hope this is provocative to people Because I
think this is just such an issuefor most of us and I know it is
for me.
I know I have tons of limitingbeliefs around money.
I know that I'm constantlybattling myself as to my own
worth and how I should spend mytime and what I should offer to
(47:51):
the marketplace.
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, I think it's.
I don't like the word.
I was going to say an epidemic.
I think that it's everywhere.
I think it's hard to live inthis world and not have issues
with money, mm-hmm.
Speaker 3 (48:14):
And it's why I think it's a great gateway into the
great work we do in hypnosis,because you know part of when we
, when we tackle our money stuff, we're really tackling all of
the things that are going tohelp us everywhere and it helps
us realize we all have moneystuff.
Not everyone recognizes some oftheir other things, but they
(48:36):
recognize the money.
Yeah, if you're listening tothis, thinking, oh, I don't have
any of those scripts and I feelperfectly balanced and I have
enough money and I get to dowhat I love every day, I'd be
surprised if you're listening tothis and I want to talk to you.
Tell me what that's like.
Speaker 2 (48:58):
Yeah, exactly, all right.
Well, see you later.
Speaker 1 (49:04):
We hope you enjoyed today's podcast and that maybe
it helped even a little.
If you have any questions, wewould love you to send them
along in an email to info atpsalmhypnosiscom.
Thank you for being part of theState of Mind community.
For more information abouthypnosis and the various online
or in-person services we provide, please visit our website,
(49:27):
wwwpsalmhypnosiscom.
The link is in the notes below.
While you're there, why don'tyou book a free one-hour journey
, meeting with Hillary or Les,to learn more about what
hypnosis is and how you mightuse it to make your life what
you want it to be?
Bye for now.
Speaker 2 (49:55):
Talk to you tomorrow, thank you.
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