Building xrecruiter: The Inside Story | Confessions of a Recruiter #114

Ever wonder what happens behind closed doors when recruitment entrepreneurs hit rock bottom? This episode pulls back the curtain on the raw, unfiltered journey Blake and Declan took from cold-calling consultants to the founders of a nationwide recruitment community.

The brutally honest conversation reveals pivotal moments that shaped their path—like the chance meeting in a park where Declan first learned about recruitment after seeing Blake's Mercedes, or Blake's first day making random cold calls without training simply because everyone else was busy on the phone. These authentic stories illuminate how two regular guys built something extraordinary through sheer determination.

Their transparency extends to truly harrowing business crises—predatory vendors demanding triple fees with four days' notice, critically ill children at home, and a devastating $300,000 loss when a client went insolvent—all happening simultaneously. Yet it's precisely these moments that revealed their superpower: community. When traditional businesses would have collapsed, their partners rallied together to help solve problems collectively.

Whether you're contemplating starting your own recruitment business or simply fascinated by entrepreneurial journeys, this conversation offers profound insights about the true measures of success. As Blake notes, "I think the longer I'm in business, the more I realize it's the journey that matters, not the destination." But perhaps Declan delivers the most actionable insight: "Osmosis. You're 15 or 30% better when you're around people." 

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· Our Website is: xrecruiter.io

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome back to another episode of Confessions
of a Recruiter.
This is the most raw,vulnerable and honest
conversation me and Blake haveever had together.
We talk about how we got intorecruitment, how we built our
little agencies and then how wescaled XRecruiter.
There's something in it foreveryone.
Hope you enjoy.
Welcome back to another episodeof Confessions of a Recruiter,

(00:24):
and this is going to be a tripdown memory lane, BT.
Absolutely, we're going back.
One of our best performingepisodes was that little one
where we were hunched over.
It was our first ever episode,but I think you know a lot's
happened in the last two and ahalf years, so I think it's
sometimes even we can forgetwhere we've come from, what
we've done, with the rate inwhich everything's happening

(00:44):
these days.
So I thought it'd be good justto get you and I in a room and
chat about what life was likebefore recruitment, how we got
into recruitment and how we wentfrom being consultants to small
business owners to now doingwhat we do with XRecruiter and
helping many recruiters do thesame thing.
What do you reckon?

Speaker 2 (00:59):
Absolutely Sounds like a good idea.
Take it away, dec.
Tell me about the history.
You always go straight to me.
Yeah, it's because I like tojust follow the energy mate and
you always set the good energy.

Speaker 1 (01:14):
All right, mate.
So going back, I think thefirst part is that memorable
afternoon in the park where Ifirst found out what recruitment
is.
I'm kicking the ball with SeanStewart.
All of a sudden this a or cseries mercedes rocks up.

Speaker 2 (01:27):
I think it was like a little, um, like a little c200
something like that yeah, it'sjust I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:34):
It's the coolest car I'd ever seen at a 23 year old,
but um you get out of the carand I'm like, what's this guy
doing with josh?
How does how are 23 year oldsrolling around in a mercedes?
I'd never seen that before.
And um, and he's a kick in thefooty and I'm like, what are you
doing?
I mean I don't think we'd seeneach other in a couple of years.
And you're like, yeah, we're inrecruitment.

(01:54):
I'm like, what's recruitment?
You're like I don't know, wefind people jobs, and that was
my first introduction to everhear about the industry.

Speaker 2 (02:08):
So, and then from there, I think I was in the seat
maybe four weeks later.
Yeah, I think so.
So we were kicking the footydown in Wilston, wilston Park,
new Farm Park.
I don't think it was New FarmPark, I think it was Wilston,
wasn't it?
New Farm, are you sure?
Yeah, okay, well, that's to bedebated, and yeah, and then at
Rock, I was already working inrecruitment.

(02:28):
I'd only been there what 12months.

Speaker 1 (02:31):
Yes, less, yeah, six, seven months.

Speaker 2 (02:33):
Yep, and we were looking for more recruiters.
You know, as you do when you'rerunning a small agency.
Our boss at the time was likehey, do you guys know anyone?
We need more people in blahblah blah and I just fired out a
bunch of random.

Speaker 1 (02:46):
How many messages did you send out?

Speaker 2 (02:48):
Oh, maybe, I don't know, maybe five, five or 10.
Oh so pretty good strike rateyeah.

Speaker 1 (02:54):
You're going to get two, yeah yeah and then.

Speaker 2 (02:57):
Yeah, where were you working at the time?
Car sales at.

Speaker 1 (03:00):
Norris Motor Group.

Speaker 2 (03:02):
What were you selling Hyundai's Hyundai?

Speaker 1 (03:03):
i30s Santa.

Speaker 2 (03:04):
Fe's.

Speaker 1 (03:12):
Nice, and what attracted you to recruitment to
begin with?
Oh, how did a 23 year old havea Mercedes?
That was the most curious thingto me.
And then it just made sense.
I just sort of understood thatthis sounds good, the boys are
doing it, so if they're doing it, it's better than doing what
I'm doing and selling cars.
At the time I think it was a 10grand pay rise straight away.

(03:34):
So I was like beauty, I wentfrom 37K to 46K just from
getting into recruitment.
So I'm like I've got nothing tolose.
I don't have to work Saturdaysand I don't have to be on the
yard till six o'clock everynight, and so I was like this is
sweet.

Speaker 2 (03:47):
Love that and then you got into recruitment.
How was your first initiationinto recruitment?
Tell us about it.

Speaker 1 (03:54):
Yeah, the first week was ultra intense, even the
interview process.
Like.
I didn't even understand what Iwas.
I had to do a 90 day actionplan.
I think.
I just looked up statistics.
How many placements the averagerecruiter makes is two.
And then everything else didn'treally matter.
That I wrote down.
But I put all of that in a planand and and got the job.
I said, look, I'm only going tobe here for six months.
I'm probably going to join theNavy, so I'll do what I can

(04:14):
while I'm here.
And he's like okay, mate, likethanks for your honesty.
And then I just really gotreally lucky in my first month.
I think one of the only leadswe ever saw come in was with
Fluid Connecto and then it washanded over to me.
I filled two roles at 13% and15%, did 29K in my first month.

Speaker 2 (04:38):
What year was this?

Speaker 1 (04:39):
2016.

Speaker 2 (04:40):
2016.
That's a long time ago.
That's nine years.
Doesn't feel like that long agomate.
You can see it on our faces youlook at a video from 12 months
ago to now, we look like we'veaged 10 years.
So what were your biggestlessons?
Uh, I know we both had a shortstint there, relatively speaking
, um, but I think it was areally good training ground to

(05:01):
set us up for the next stage ofgrowth.
What did you find the biggestlessons were when you started
that agency?
Tell us about it.

Speaker 1 (05:11):
Being really, really proactive and having to generate
all your business yourself Likethere was no besides that one
lead I got.
There was no other leads that Iever got given again.
Being being ultra proactivebuilding your own hit list the
night before.
Understanding during the daysis billable hours, so you've got
to be doing proactive shit.
Don't waste time on stuffthat's not going to make you

(05:32):
money.
Doing your job ads at night.
We'd come in on Saturdays,sundays, prep our hit list.
I remember I'd sit therefalling asleep next to Deanna
when we just started dating.
I was probably like eightmonths, nine months into the job
and I'm full on asleep writinga hit list.
And she's like mate, where doyou work?
This is not normal that it'snine 30 at night and you're
trying to get this hit.
You're so stressed aboutgetting a hit list together so
you've got people to call thenext day.

(05:53):
I was like it just has tohappen this way.
Um, so yeah, that was probablythe two biggest things is just
like how did?

Speaker 2 (06:00):
you feel buzzed?

Speaker 1 (06:01):
you were buzzed.
Yeah, I did not.
I wasn't like upset about it.
Yeah, I was so excited like Iremember.
We were chatting aboutpotentially opening a sydney
office and, um, it was just likewe were all 23, 24.
Everyone was ripping it.
You were doing really well andleading the charge and we're all
just following suit yeah, yeah,fun don't you reckon yeah, I, I

(06:23):
, I enjoyed my time there.

Speaker 2 (06:25):
Um, you know, I, I remember and I you know I don't
know how much to disclose, but Iremember I started.
That was me, josh and richo,and there was just three of us
in a little serviced office andit was probably when you're at
corporate corby christycorporate house or something
yeah, yeah, christy christycases yeah, something like that.

(06:46):
And um, how big was the office?
Oh it was, it was probably.
I think you could fit like fourdesks, four or five desks, yeah
, and um, and I remember myfirst day, so intense interview
process.
I got asked to pitch twocandidates for an interview and

(07:08):
so the only person that I knewthat was in recruitment at the
time was Desh.
And I called Desh and I'm like,hey, mate, I'm meant to like
pitch two resumes for aninterview.
I don't even know how thatworks.
And he's like, yeah, you know,just make up some resumes, blah,
blah, blah.
So I made up two fake people.
I also made up a fake businesscard and put the rock logo on it

(07:30):
so it looked like I was alreadyworking there and I think I did
an okay job.
Mate that's thinking outside thebox.
Yeah, yeah.
So I gave him a business cardwith my name on it.
I'm like here you go, mate, andhe's like what the fuck?
And then I pitched the twopeople and you know, I think it
was obviously a decent interview.
And I remember my first day, myfirst day I walked to the

(07:53):
office.
I was Richard was there.
He was on the phone, thoughRichard was like always on the
phone, like that's one thingthat I really looked up to and
admired, like he was always onthe phone, like that's one thing
that I really looked up to andadmired, like he was always on
the phone talking to people andlike there was barely any time
that he was not on the phone.
And so I get there and I'msitting there for five, ten

(08:14):
minutes, he's still on the phone.
I'm like what do I do?
So I just started fuckingcalling people and I think I
made 15 calls who do just anyonein my contact list.
I just went through my contactlist and I was like, oh, I'll
call my old sales manager, callmy old GM, call my old boss at
here.
I'll call this guy.

(08:34):
He's left my last job and nowhe's a sales manager there.
So I think I made yeah,probably 10 to 15 phone calls.
Did you get any jobs on?
No, but I remember Richardlooking at me like this fucking
guy's on the phone already andI'm just like, hey, mate.
I think my first phone call wasto a guy called Chris.
He was the fleet manager of theHolden dealership at the

(08:58):
Marooka Mile.
I'm like, hey, chris, how areyou, mate?
What do you do to hire people?
I'm just in recruitment.
I'm 10 minutes in.
I need to fucking get someclients, mate.
Every time we sit down there'salways a story I've never heard.
Yeah, yeah.
So I started calling him.
I called my old boss at CSG.
Now Fuji Film Got a job on fromhim.

(09:20):
But you know we already spokeabout getting a job on, as I, as
he gave me the reference and Ifelt like it was almost too fun
and too easy, especially comingfrom photocopiers, which you
know we can talk about after.
But that was a really goodtraining ground as well.

Speaker 1 (09:38):
What did you?
What did you do?
Cause I know there's a lot ofrecruiters, I wouldn't even
think like that to just startpicking up the phone Cause I saw
my boss on the phone.
There'd be so much hesitationand thought processes, why not
to do it?
What, what was?
Could you explain to people howyou think that way?
Say that again.
So it'd be like I would neverthink like that to roll into a
brand new job and just pick upthe phone and start talking to
people.

(09:58):
I think 99% of people couldagree with me that that's not
normal.
So like, how would you explainto people that being that
proactive, like that's a reasonwhy you've achieved what you've
achieved?
So like, more people need tolearn from that.

Speaker 2 (10:11):
Yeah, I think it's just like understanding the
fundamental of what you're thereto do and then just like trying
to do it.
What is the fundamental?

Speaker 1 (10:23):
of being a recruiter.

Speaker 2 (10:23):
Well, you're there to place people and get clients to
want to work with you.
Like, obviously I'd never beenthrough training, but I
understood that well, we need acompany that wants to use our
services of recruitment to findthem staff.
That's literally all I knew.
So I just thought, okay, well,I'm just going to start calling
anyone that I know who has ahiring responsibility.

(10:46):
They might go hey, no, we don'tuse recruiters or whatever.
But I just need to startlearning and figuring out what
people's perception is, what theconversations are like.
And it was pretty easy because Ihad 15 old people that I've
either worked for in the past,worked with in the past, had a
good relationship with.
So I just called like 10 or 15people I already knew and just

(11:06):
started asking if they've everused a recruiter.
Did they have a role?
And just started like gettinginto it.
And then, obviously you know,when he got off the phone, he's
like mate, what have you beendoing?
And because I remember at thetime it took me a while to
figure out how to actually dialout, because you've got to press
zero first and then and I'mlike trying to call and I'm

(11:28):
fucking stuck and I'm like it'snot dialing out.
And then I finally worked outyou're gonna press zero first
and then dial the number andthen do the outbound calls.
If, man, what were you doing?
Like I don't know, I was justcalling people seeing if they
need recruitment.
He's like, yeah, okay, man,we're gonna do some training
first.
Uh, but I think that was areally good, like funny, like
moment that I look back on nowand I go, fuck, I did.

(11:49):
I was actually being a bit of ahustler, uh at the time.
Uh, but it was yeah, it wassuper fun and it was far easier
than selling photocopiers.
Um, so I felt like similar toyou, going photococopies, comm
only to.
I had a 55K salary was mystarting salary and I thought
that always icked me, that I gotjibbed.
I'm surprised you only got 45,mate, but I got 55 and I thought

(12:14):
, wow, I'm rich, I don't evenneed to earn comms.
Yeah, yeah same, I'm fuckinggetting a sick salary, and so,
like I wasn't even in a spotwhere I was desperate for
commissions, I was like, well,I'm already earning great money,
I can just focus on learningand being the best recruiter, I
can be.

(12:34):
And I think that's what helpedme just try to dial into my
craft is because I felt like Iwas already well ahead of the
curb financially with a 55Ksalary, and then commissions was
just like a nice little bonus,yep, so okay.
So that was your time when youfirst got into recruitment.
Walk us through, like thethought process on starting
Blended, because you startedBlended pretty quickly after you

(12:59):
got into recruitment.
Walk us through that.

Speaker 1 (13:02):
So yeah, it was two months or two years like July
3rd is pretty much almost twoyears to the date in which I
started, blended to which Istarted in recruitment.
So it was, I was at cross, Iwas at a, I was about to be made
a manager divisional managerand we're going through the
recruitment process.
And then one of my familyfriends was like.
I went to him how can be abetter manager?

(13:24):
How I can do this?
You know how I can.
Linkedin was getting a littlebit popular.
I'd post a couple of photos,got like 10, 11,000 impressions.
I'm like we need to be postingmore on LinkedIn, and just of us
in the office.
And so then from there, I thencaught up with Scroggs and he's
like mate, why don't you just doit for yourself?
I had zero recruitmentexperience before I started
Chefs on the Run and I'm like,yeah, but, mate, you're a bit

(13:47):
different to me, like I'm aboutto get another juicy pay rise
and manage people.
And I didn't think so.
He's like no, mate, I'll giveyou the guidance and help you do
it.
I'm like, yeah, well, I guessBlake's done it, so can't be
that hard.
And it was a bit of a like, alike what your mom did to you
pretty much strokes did to meand he's like no mate.

(14:08):
And I was like all right, well,it's going to take a while for
me to work all this stuff out umget prepared.
So that was in february, andthen I didn't go go live until
july, um when I actuallyresigned okay, so five months it
took to get your house in orderto do it.

Speaker 2 (14:24):
What was the mindset going through that five months?
How did you feel, knowingyou're setting up an agency in
your spare time?
Did it demotivate you?
Did it motivate you?
Did you feel awkward at work?

Speaker 1 (14:40):
Yeah, it felt awkward because you're not being truly
honest, but then you're also.
Yeah, it's a little bit hard.
You're sort of torn between tworoads because you're trying to.
You always want to be true toyourself and be honest with
people but then you can't be toohonest.
So it was a tricky five months.
I was still doing all right andthen, like, moved in with
Deanna pretty quick as well, Ithink, like the July before.

(15:03):
So, yeah, we'd been livingtogether for six months.
Um, they're like, yeah, we'restarting a business, and then
the advice at the time was like,cut all costs, you got to move
back home.
So, like you know, we were inHawaii in December, having
Hawaii and Tasmania in theChristmas holidays, and then by
February we're bunking down,getting everything ready, um,
not renewing the lease.
I used to live in an awesomelittle apartment near the Breaky

(15:25):
Creek and then scale back lifepretty quick no more cocktail
nights and traveling around.

Speaker 2 (15:30):
Was that good advice?
No, why.

Speaker 1 (15:34):
Because I think it kept me thinking small, like I
didn't.
It then trickled like I keptthinking like how much do I save
?
How can I save more, more, more, instead of having like more of
an abundance mindset where I'mlike I've got to make more.
So there is, like you know, wewere talking to the laughing the
other day about opportunitycosts.
You can only push so far untilyou actually run out of money

(15:54):
before you've outsourcedeverything.
So, this was probably thecomplete opposite to that, where
I'm trying to save absolutelyevery penny and do it the
cheapest way possible.
So that's probably what Iwouldn't suggest.

Speaker 2 (16:12):
I'd find a happy median, so I'd be interested to
learn like what were the biggeststruggles at Blended.
Now we've got hindsight Amazing, we can reflect back and go.
This was a really interestingmoment.
I wish I did this a little bitbetter.
If I had my time again, this ishow I would do things
differently.
Can you walk us through yourreflections on blended and what
was interesting, what you'dchange?

Speaker 1 (16:34):
Yeah, so I started in a six by three square meter
office.
It was completely glass in acorporate house serviced office.
It's not like funky WeWork,it's like this old corporate
setting.
I think they've updated it now,but back in 2018, that's what
it was.
So I'd have this tiny littleoffice.
Scroggs is like all right,you've got to put a map of

(16:54):
Australia up on the wall becauseyou're going to put this
country all around Australia.
I'm like, am I?
I feel like I'm just trying toget to my first placement, let
alone worrying about building anational business.
But I had it up there andthat's what I was trying to tell
myself.
And then it was just so lonelyLike I'd have him sit out the
front of my office, we'd havethe door etched open and he'd
sit there in a chair and I'djust be cold calling, cold

(17:16):
calling, getting rejected allday.
And then it was just no one wasaround, like it was the most
lonely thing ever.
I'd find myself calling.
I'd call Deanna, I'd callDallas Mattioli and just confide
in them as to how they're doingwhat they're doing, just to
avoid picking up the phonebecause I'm just going to get
rejected like 70 times beforesomeone says something Because I
kept the advice at the time wastell them you're a recruiter
and you've got great candidatesand I'm like time.

(17:51):
I valued that more than what Ihad been doing.
Um, and then it wasn't untillike a year after that we're
actually changed the script,started doing a traditional
recruitment where I startedgetting way better results.
Um focused a lot of energy onsocial media, like I think in my
first year of business I gotlike 2 million impressions on
LinkedIn, which was huge.
Got in Courier Mail, channel 7,sky News, abc Radio, like all

(18:17):
that stuff was set, which is thefun stuff we do now.
But we weren't focused on thatwhen we started XRecruiter so
like, but I focused that heavily.
I remember Ephraim and Manisha.
We would record our impressionseach week as opposed to
recording our sendings.

Speaker 2 (18:29):
Really.

Speaker 1 (18:29):
That's how much scrolls like yeah, this is the
way, this is the way I'm, like,mate.
And then my fees was so small Iwas charging like my first fee
was two grand, my next fee wasfour grand, my next fee was four
grand, my next fee got up toseven.
I hovered around seven for awhile and this guy called me
purple bricks and said, hey,like you're so cheap, you'll be
out of business soon.

(18:50):
So yeah, probably being lonelyundercutting the market was
really bad, focusing on media,personal branding, marketing way
too much and not focusing onhaving a core business.

Speaker 2 (19:06):
They're probably the four areas which I reflect on
which really let me down.
Okay, so let's say Declan'shaving another crack blended 2.0
.
How do you solve the loneliness?
What would you have donedifferently to not feel so
lonely?
Because I'm sure there'srecruiters out there that are
running their business right nowthat feel lonely.
So Declan as he is today, likehow is he going to solve being

(19:26):
lonely?
Starting his business fromscratch?

Speaker 1 (19:28):
So I would find people that are one to two years
ahead of me and then I wouldreach out and go, hey, this is
where I'm feeling, becauselikely they felt the same thing
when they started, but they gotthrough it.
So I'd reach out to them and go, hey, I've just started in
business.
I'm three, four months in.
I'm finding this really lonely.
It's really boring in thisoffice.
There's no one else around me.
Could I come work out of youroffice for one day a?

Speaker 2 (19:51):
week.

Speaker 1 (19:51):
How about we just catch up for a coffee and build
a relationship and I only do itwith like two or three people, I
wouldn't waste too much energyon it.
Whoever said yes, I'll just goon LinkedIn, go.
You know who's a businessdirector of a small agency.

Speaker 2 (20:02):
Yeah, how would you figure out who to?
Is there some sort of criteria?
Like what or is it just like ohyou know what, someone that
looks good just reach out tothem and-.

Speaker 1 (20:10):
I'd go on LinkedIn recruiter, put in a Boolean
search small business or anagency director, zero to two
staff, or whatever the minimumis, or zero staff.
And then I'd reach out to themminimum two years in business.
And then I'd go hey, I'mfeeling really lonely, can we
catch up for a coffee?
Love to pick your brain?
Yeah, like what you did withSean, but I'll just scale it all

(20:32):
the way back so I'd find themmore relatable.
Yeah to me.
That's how I'd fix theloneliness yeah okay, what was
the second thing?
the personal branding over doingthat yeah talk to us about that
.

Speaker 2 (20:43):
So it was why would you, why would you change that?

Speaker 1 (20:49):
I don't think you.
Let me explain how.
How focused we were on it.
It was like we were writingletters every day, we were
posting every day, we were doingvideos, multiple videos a day.
Like all of that is is it opensamazing opportunities, but it
wasn't targeted, it wasn'tfocused on the right demographic
, it was just spray and prayputting it out there.
It was an awesome message,fighting for small business and

(21:10):
all this stuff, but a lot ofpeople were confused by what I
was talking about.
So if you can do a targetedapproach, focus on your core
niche and market to them asopposed to trying to market to
everyone, then it would bebetter.

Speaker 2 (21:23):
So how much time per day was getting consumed by
trying to do this marketingstuff.

Speaker 1 (21:29):
I think actual time of delivery would be between one
hour.
But like mental planning, thethought of it, always checking
LinkedIn, looking at impressions, like yeah, you could take up
three hours a day just on doingthat, getting replies, going to
meetings, going to smallbusiness stuff.
So what would you dodifferently?
I would just focus on mappingmy market, focus on, like the

(21:51):
80-20 rule, finding the top 20businesses within my niche and
focus on directly marketing tothem and then focus everything
on building my actual business,like the metrics that matter,
outcomes that matter, gettingreally dialed in on what are my
jobs on, what are my clientmeetings, what are my jobs on,
what interviews are with infront of clients and what deals
am I doing.
That's really all that matters,those four things.

(22:12):
And then I'll just post dailyand say you know, just one post,
whether it be a status, a photoor a video, keep it really
simple.

Speaker 2 (22:20):
Yeah.
So I guess, just to kind oflike tie a bow on this, what
would be like the overarchingadvice for recruiters who are
either currently a recruiterthinking about going on their
own, or they've just started.
Like what's the one piece ofadvice that you think would
either help them thinkdifferently or focus on what
matters?

Speaker 1 (22:40):
Osmosis.
You're 15 or 30% better whenyou're around people, so get
around other recruiters, be inthe same room.
There's a reason why we did sowell because we're all together.
There's a reason why I did sobad when I went out on my own
because I was just me.
It's like the analogy of beingin a boxer Everyone's got a
cornerman and then also justreally focus on the outcomes
that matter.

(23:00):
Don't get caught up in socialmedia.

Speaker 2 (23:03):
It's just not worth it, love that, and so now
Geordie is looking after BlendedYep and your sole focus now is
100% into X Recruiter.
X Recruiter has been going twoand a half years.
Tell me about that.
What's the last two and a halfyears been like?

Speaker 1 (23:26):
for you.
Yeah, it's been crazy.
It's um been a hectic ride.
You've been there from thebeginning, um, and I felt like
we were planning it nine monthsbefore it even, yeah, went live
as well, so, yeah, I don't knowhow to sum it up.

Speaker 2 (23:42):
It's been everything the highs, the lows walk us
through maybe one of the mostmemorable moments of
ex-recruiter for you the mostmemorable moments of
ex-recruiter would be the legacyawards.

Speaker 1 (23:59):
why?
Um well, the most exciting part, I think, why we all get out of
bed is the success of thepartners.
So to have everyone there, theemotion in the room, the
speeches, what it all meant toeveryone, it was just like
insane, don't?

Speaker 2 (24:16):
you reckon.

Speaker 1 (24:17):
Yeah, 100% Like.
It doesn't like the media andthe AFR and the photo shoots.
That's all cream on top.
But like that night night,matt's speech about legacy um,
that was probably the mostmoving night I think we've all
had in business together yeah,yeah, 100.

Speaker 2 (24:33):
What about you, I'd have to say legacy awards as
well?
That was when it felt likesuper real.
Um, obviously everything feelsreal, but like when everyone's
in the room and they're allcelebrating the success, as you
say, all together it's wow.
Look at what we've been able tocreate as a community, which is
, I think, super, super special.
I've said this a couple oftimes on, like LinkedIn posts,

(24:56):
but I genuinely feel the mostsuccessful businesses moving
forward small, medium or large,they will be successful as a
foundation because of community.
Businesses that push communitywill be the next big, exciting,
sticky, successful businesses ifyou don't have a community,

(25:20):
you're not pushing yourcommunity, you're not creating
or participating in a community,then I think you're kind of
missing a trick for the next 10,20, 30 years, as technology
evolves and people get less andless, less and less close, and
like you're an example you knowyou're talking to like chat GPT

(25:42):
and trying to get ideas.
Like you're not talking to otherpeople as much about your ideas
because you're talking to CatchEPT.
And so I saw this like thiscrazy stat the other day that
there's like 13 and 14-year-oldsthat now are having an AI bot
as their best friend and they'vegot more and 32-year-olds and

(26:05):
32-year-olds.
And there's like this epidemicright now where there's like
this child ai bot like chat gptfor kids that are 13 and 14
years old that gets more trafficand more prompts than chat gpt
at the moment and it's just kidstalking to it about their day
and asking how they are and thentelling them how they are as

(26:26):
well and like building genuinerelationships with ai.
And it's almost.
As this continues, therelationships we all have will
be less and less with each otherand more and more with the
computer, and the biggestdifference that I think we will
be able to make in the future ofbusiness is ensuring community

(26:47):
what about, what about?
challenges.
What are the?
What are some of the biggestchallenges you've had, like at
blended?
You know, you've got hindsight.
You wish you were around otherpeople that were high performers
, you wish you focused on themetrics that matter, and there's
some things that you would havechanged.
What?
What about the last two years?
Tell us about the challengesover the last two years.

(27:08):
With Execruder it's a wholedifferent beast.
It's completely different toyou know Run and Blended.
You know seven years ago or sixyears ago.
So what were the challengesover the last two years,
reflecting back, and what didyou learn from them?

Speaker 1 (27:23):
Hey, where do we begin?
I think everyone looks at ourhighlight reel and thinks this
has been easy.
This has been probably thehardest time I've ever had in
business.
Never felt so out of my depth,probably up until eight months
ago.
But yeah, there's challengesall the time.
I think if we actually spokeabout them, no one would
probably believe us.
Give us one how we kept going.
Hey, give us one.

(27:49):
Probably the biggest one waswhen I went to tasha's launch
party and then I just wasn'tfeeling myself.
I felt so out of place and I'vealready spoken about this, so I
feel comfortable sharing it.
Um, but yeah, I felt so out ofplace.
I was like you know, matt's,here, he's, this guy's a big dog
, he's running the show.
I'm like fuck, I don't knowwhat I'm doing.
It used to be just have a fewsales and hang out with partners

(28:11):
and now, like this guy's a ceoof a 45 person recruitment
agency, these partners arebuilding bigger businesses than
me and blake ever built.
Like what the hell's going onhere?
I don't deserve to be here, um,and I was just like I would
wake up with like heartpalpitations through the night,
going like fuck, is this wholething going to implode?
Are people going to find outthat I'm not that good at

(28:31):
business?
And, um, I don't know how tomanage anyone.
I'm not managing people.
Well, you know the the wholedelivery of all the projects
didn't go to plan.
Um, we're working across splitoffices.
Um, getting into a crappyfinancial position, didn't get a
salary for 18 months, put allour money in.
You know, I was living a prettygood life before extra credit

(28:53):
came about.
We just bought a house sell ourfucking house.
So, yeah, it was probably abacklog of all that stuff never
going to anyone, never talkingto anyone, probably not even
being truly honest to you, justsort of bundling it all up.
And then, um, and then Brodycalled me out on it.
He's like, dude, you're notyourself, what's what's doing?

(29:14):
Like that, you're not theDeclan that I know and we
obviously got to build a prettygood relationship through doing
the coaching and stuff with him.
And he's like you need tofucking man the fuck up and be
honest and get help.
And I'm like, holy shit, okay.
And then I just randomly gotonto Audible and found Michael

(29:34):
Anderson's book.
And then I think I came intothe office and I was like on a
Saturday with you and I think Iburst into tears.
I was like, mate, this is theproblem I've worked out.
And you're like, yeah, I'vebeen trying to tell you that for
a while.
So that was probably thebiggest inflection point.

Speaker 2 (29:54):
You know when you say something and no one listens to
you, then they hear it fromsomeone else.
They finally hear it.

Speaker 1 (30:02):
So yeah, I was literally the martyr in the
office.
Even if you just look up thesummary of the book, it was me
to a T.
Michael's story is that he hadthe same inflection point he got
punched in the face by hisbusiness partner.
So lucky that's never happenedto us.
Um, so yeah, and then it wasjust like everything added up.
I'm like, wow, I'm thisstressed, yeah, my getting more
and more gray hairs.

(30:22):
I wasn't training, wasn'tlooking after myself and it was
just a complete wig out.
So, yeah, from that, that wasprobably the most hectic moment.
There's obviously a way of alot more chaotic shit that
happened building up to that forthat mushroom.
And then now, looking back,like you just got to get to
problems while they're a littleproblem, not when they're a big
problem, and yeah, like, oh fuck, here we go.

(30:43):
And then took blake's adviceagain and got a coach for all
the areas of life and I thinkI'm slowly getting better.

Speaker 2 (30:49):
Love that what about you?
What about me?

Speaker 1 (30:52):
yeah, what's your biggest?

Speaker 2 (30:53):
over what?

Speaker 1 (30:54):
ex-recruiter.
Yeah, or do vendito.
We didn't speak about it.
What's your biggest takeawayfrom vendito?
And then?

Speaker 2 (31:01):
we can go to exRecruiter.
So I started Vendito eight yearsago and I had 13, 14 months
recruitment experience.
I was super grateful that mymom just gave me the same line
why don't you just do this foryourself?
And I never actually consideredstarting a recruitment agency
before.
But when she said that I kindof just thought I don't think

(31:23):
I'm capable to do that.
What do you, how do you evenlike get started?
And so thankfully my mom's asmall business owner and she
kind of got the, got thebuilding box together for me and
then I just cracked on.
But so that was eight years ago.
I scaled up to a team of like10 within the first like six to
12 months.

Speaker 1 (31:44):
That means you're in like the top 8% of businesses
for size.

Speaker 2 (31:48):
Once you get over five staff.
I didn't stay there, so I thinkI hired like four people in my
third month, so I started aroundNovember.

Speaker 1 (31:59):
It was your first day in business.
Go through your phone, startcalling people to see if they
want to work for you.
I called four of the boys.

Speaker 2 (32:04):
I called Josh Scott Lehman.
Jimmy, your phone start callingpeople to see if they want to
work for you.
I called four of the boys.
I called josh scott lehman, umjimmy and um michael and um
horgan, lockie horgan, and theywere all on com only fantastic
five.
Put them together.
I was like boys, come only 10k,cost a seat and 50 comms after

(32:27):
10k.
And how did you come up withthat?
I just kind of made it up Ididn't know what I was doing.
But it was great because I had a50k threshold for the month
before paying out any columns,so, like, my net profit for the
month was always at least 50kand, um, it ended up being
really good but not sustainable.

(32:47):
You know, everyone was partying.
You know we're 23, 24, partying, being ratbags, not being our
best selves.
It certainly wasn't asustainable culture and
lifestyle, and so half of thedifficulty of getting everyone
to be like more reined in wasthat they were comm only, so

(33:09):
they could just basically dowhatever they want, and I didn't
know how to overcome.
Well, yeah, I guess I'm notpaying you, so you can kind of
come and go as you please.
You can do whatever you like.
It's ultimately up to you.
So it was really difficult toget a handle on the culture.
But that was a reallyinteresting moment of my life
where I was adding people.

(33:30):
I was trying to change fromcomm only to salaries.
I think I put everyone on a 45Kplus super salary and then I
hired a few more people, threeor four more people on top of
that, and I was essentially, atone point, the only person
billing paying for everyone'ssalaries, and I was essentially,
at one point, the only personbilling, paying for everyone's
salaries, and I was stressed tothe max because maybe Josh would

(33:53):
do a good month, I would do agood month.
There'd be a couple of donuts.
You had like 30 grand in wages.
Oh, it was crazy.
Yeah, it was super stressfuland I was running off pure
instinct and there was nosystems, there was no processes,
there was no.
This is how we do things.
It was essentially me, myinstincts and my best guess, and

(34:19):
so that went okay, but itwasn't a fun moment in life, I
think my first 12 months inbusiness was surprisingly quite
good because for six to eightmonths of it was comm only
recruiters.
I was making a bit before I hadto pay out comms.
And then my second year inbusiness was probably the

(34:39):
hardest because I had heaps ofsalaries, I'd grown too quickly,
I had heaps of costs that werecoming through and I was going
backwards seriously fast and Icouldn't work out why.
Because I had all these staffsand I thought having like 10
staff meant I was supersuccessful and it looked it.

(35:00):
Oh yeah, it looked it, but itwas super stressful it wasn't a
good time.

Speaker 1 (35:08):
What made it stressful knowing that you
weren't as successful as youlooked.

Speaker 2 (35:13):
Not particularly.
I think it was just trying tomanage people for the first time
.

Speaker 1 (35:21):
That, oh, you'd never managed anyone either.
No, you'd never been a captainof a football team.
No Same, first time in business.

Speaker 2 (35:26):
Uh, that, oh, you'd never managed anyone either.
You'd never been a captain of afootball team.
Same First time in business.
I had four months offrecruitment because I resigned
and went into work for myparents for three months and
hated it.
So you can imagine having likefour months off work kind of
like.
Kind of like not driving a carfor three months.
You drive a car again, you're alittle bit awkward and you
don't know how to drive properly.
It feels a bit uncomfortable.
So I started back inrecruitment again and hadn't

(35:49):
like picked up the phone.
In four months I had nevermanaged anyone.
I've never run a businessbefore and there were so many
things I was trying to figureout for the first time.

Speaker 1 (36:00):
I've never thought about any of those things.
I just used to look at you andgo how the fuck is this guy
doing it?

Speaker 2 (36:04):
Yeah it was hard.
He's got it all worked out.
Yeah, yeah, it was really hard,and I think you know, looking
back, one of the things that Iprobably would have changed is I
would have taken my processesand systems more seriously,
because I was running reallyhard but I wasn't running in any
sort of direction, and so thething that I'm realizing now,

(36:29):
you know, seven, eight years on,is you can have a small
business and scale just asquickly as long as you have the
systems and processes in place,and it can be more predictable,
it can be less chaotic, it canbe less scary, and if I had my
time again, I would really startthinking about okay, what's my

(36:51):
onboarding plan, what's?

Speaker 1 (36:53):
my training plan what ?

Speaker 2 (36:54):
does success look like in three months?
What does success look like in12 months?
Not just for my staff, but forme as a business owner, because
the only measurement of successI had was how much money we made
at the end of the month, andthat was it.
So it was really quick, reallyquickly.
I found myself in this spotafter two or three years of like

(37:15):
.
Is this?
I'm just cranking massive days,working my ass off.
Is this kind of it Like?
At what point can I take afucking break?
And I couldn't, because therewas no structure.
I didn't get anyone to be amanager, I didn't.
It was just like recruitersreporting to me, billing and it
was the hardest time to run abusiness like that.

(37:39):
So I guess, if I could have mytime again, I would think about
what the business goals arequarterly.
I'd have a system, I'd have aprocess, I'd have an operational
rhythm and framework that wouldhelp me grow sustainably,
without the stress that comeswith trying to build a business?

Speaker 1 (37:55):
Yeah, and it's fortunate that we're in a
position we can do that now.
But, like, what would yousuggest to a recruiter?
Who would you go to?
How would you get thisinformation If you take a
recruiter out of the picture andyou're back there and you need
that advice.

Speaker 2 (38:10):
How do you actually get it without, I think, the
only well, I don't, I I don'tknow, like I don't know where
you would get it from, which iswhy you never got it well yeah,
it's why I never got it and whyyou know we're so passionate
about ex-recruiter because wehave that for our partners who
have a one to two personbusiness but they have the
operational excellence of a bigagency and they can hire more

(38:32):
confidently, they can traintheir staff and onboard their
staff more confidently, they canreduce their turnover, they can
know when to hire.
Is it, you know, when you have50 grand in the bank account or
is it when you have a certainamount of clients?
Like, all of this stuff is likeyou're just shooting in the
dark.
When you're running a businessfor the first time and you go, I
think I need to hire someone,I'm not sure.

(38:53):
I don't know who to hire.
I don't know if, like, I've gotthe money to hire someone.
I don't know how myresponsibilities change when I
do hire someone for the firsttime.
I don't know why anyone wouldwant to join my business,
because it's just me and there'sall these like really really
hard points that you've got tothink about and overcome.

(39:15):
That was a struggle and it is astruggle and I think that's why
so many recruiters or smallagency owners specifically, they
try and scale up to five peopleand then it's two, and then
it's six, and then it's two, orit's just stuck at one or two,
and it's because they don't havethis framework.
So that would be.

(39:35):
My biggest lesson is, if I wasto start again, I would take it
easy.
I would appreciate the journeyand not be so fixated on the
goal and vanity metrics.
Yeah, don't consider headcountas your measurement of success.
I would appreciate the journeyand not be so fixated on the
goal and vanity metrics.
Yeah, don't consider headcountas your measurement of success.
I would consider productivityper person.
I think that's the biggestmeasurement of success for a

(40:00):
recruitment agency is howproductive on average, how?

Speaker 1 (40:02):
do you work out productivity?

Speaker 2 (40:04):
Well, you, just your total revenue divided by head
count okay so if you've gotthree, if you, if you're, if
you're doing a million dollars,you've got three staff
productivity per person's 333grand but what happens if a
director is bringing in 700?
Same thing okay yeah, you justdivide it by you just divide it
by staff.
Maybe you wouldn't put yourbillings in, depending on

(40:26):
circumstances.
But, um, you know, if you'vegot two people and you do a 1.5
mil, you've got a really highlyproductive small team Amazing.

Speaker 1 (40:34):
But if you've got like it's also a massive risk,
like if you have two peoplebilling 1.5, one person's
responsible for 750K and 50% ofthe revenue if they leave or
maybe.

Speaker 2 (40:45):
Well, it is a huge risk, but I guess the
measurement of success throughany point of scaling is how
productive per person is my teamand you could have 10 people
and you're bringing in $2million and your average person
productivity is 200 grand.
It's like, oh, hang on.
So I've got to pay him 90, plussuper, plus work cover, plus

(41:06):
insurance, like all this.

Speaker 1 (41:08):
Maybe we can make a calculator for that.
A hundred percent, that'd be apretty good tool.

Speaker 2 (41:13):
Yeah, so that's what I would focus on, and I wouldn't
focus on bums on seats and getmy calculator out and go.
Well, if they technically built25 grand, I'd make all this
money.
So let's give them a crack, andthat's essentially what the
mindset was Okay.

Speaker 1 (41:26):
So as long as you don't focus on likes and
impressions on LinkedIn andvanity metrics, you're going to
be much more successful thanjust Declan and Blake, exactly.

Speaker 2 (41:36):
And then what's?

Speaker 1 (41:37):
the biggest yeah, what's the most meaningful
moment for you?
And the biggest, scariestmoment that's ever happened at
XRecruiter.

Speaker 2 (41:45):
I think the most meaningful moment was definitely
legacy awards, and I don't wantto say the same thing and have
a bit of a cop out.
Um, you know, we know you don'tdo that.
Yeah, taking taking corners,cut corners here.
But legacy awards was reallyreally good.
Um, you know there's a hundredpeople there.
Um, heaps of new businessowners, heaps of successful new
business owners.
Um, putting a face to a name,celebrating their wins, like it

(42:09):
was amazing giving out awardsLike who would have thought that
we're given the recruitmentagencies awards for doing an
amazing job?
So I think that was like areally nice moment where I I
felt like what I'm doing here ismaking such a positive impact.
I've always I've I valued andmeasured myself on the impact

(42:31):
that I can make on others, and alot of that is trying to take
someone from one socioeconomiclevel to the next.
I think that's really powerful.
Someone's got this mindset andthis lifestyle, that's this big
and that's all they know, andshowing them that, hey, look at
this big mindset and lifestyle,this is possible for you.

(42:52):
And they go wow, I didn't knowI was capable of this, I didn't
know this was possible.
I think that's probably the mostspecial, impactful thing that I
can do, and that's what we doevery day at Extra.
Crew yeah, it's crazy.

Speaker 1 (43:06):
Do you see Maddie's post Summon Up February.
Oh, what the hell that happensin a month, 28 days 28 days.

Speaker 2 (43:15):
That's what's happened.
So I would have to say LegacyAwards, because it made it all
real.
What was the scariest moment?
I think one of the mostchallenging moments was our back
office drama.

(43:35):
Yeah, I think that took yearsoff my life and I know I didn't
show it, um, but um, so forcontext, um, we used to use an
outsource team for our um,payrolling and kind of financial
services.
Um, because we weren't at thesize where we could afford to
bring in an in-house team yet.

(43:56):
So we're outsourcing.
I think we're paying $25,000 amonth retainer for these
services and it was going well.
One day the owner sat us downand said hey, the price is going
up to $79,000 a month.
You guys are doing really welland you've essentially got four

(44:18):
days to sign this agreement orwe're stopping all services.
And at the time I thought, holyshit, I didn't realize how
predatory people can be,especially when you think you've
got a good relationship.
Shit, I didn't realize howpredatory people can be,
especially when you think you'vegot a good relationship.
And so, um, this was at a timewhere, um, I think tommy was

(44:42):
maybe six, six months old, so Ihad I had to figure out how we
can build an internal payrolland finance team, basically
overnight, um to avoiddisrupting the services for our
partners.

Speaker 1 (44:56):
They were pretty heavily disrupted, though.

Speaker 2 (44:58):
Oh, huge, huge, and it was really really stressful
and at that time my daughter gotreally sick, my son got really
sick, and we're not talking,just normal sick.

Speaker 1 (45:14):
We're talking really sick.
My son got really sick andwe're not talking just normal
sick, we're talking really sick.
We're talking super sick.

Speaker 2 (45:17):
Hospital multiple times, four viruses in hospital
for a week.
Shortly after I had ananaphylactic response.
My daughter was extremely sicktoo Like.
I've got photos on my phonewhere, like Tommy, can't even
open his eyes, his eyes areessentially like shut.
He had, uh, he had rhinovirus.
Um, he had conjunctivitis, hehad pneumonia, he had um,

(45:44):
influenza c and all at the sametime.
Six months old, so he wasabsolutely cooked, um, couldn't
eat, had to keep shoving stuffdown his nose and try and feed
him because he wouldn't swallow.
Six months old, so he wasabsolutely cooked, couldn't eat,
had to keep shoving stuff downhis nose and try and feed him
because he wouldn't swallow, buthis nose was so blocked that
they couldn't do it.
So they tried like four times.
A little six-month-old justscreaming as they're just trying

(46:05):
to shove stuff down his throatis not a vibe.
So I had my son's really sick,my daughter's really sick, my
miss is really sick.
I had this son's really sick,my daughter's really sick, my
missus is really sick.
I had this like missioncritical moment at Extra Crew.

Speaker 1 (46:17):
Was it the?

Speaker 2 (46:17):
Armageddon moment and we were getting investigated
for labour and like I had likeit almost felt like every part
of my life.

Speaker 1 (46:29):
And I was just running around wigging out.
Yeah, it felt like every partof my life and I'm just running
around wigging out.

Speaker 2 (46:33):
Yeah, it felt like every part of my life was like
challenging me and I'm callingArnie and I just remember
calling Arnie and going.
Arnie, mate, I have got painsin my chest right now and I
don't know how to like see,clearly, and you know, I used to
have to have calls with Arniebecause he's such just like a

(46:56):
calm man, like as soon as youspeak to him you feel like
everything's okay, and so thatwas really really challenging
for me.
It was like a six to eight weekperiod, but it's always darkest
before dawn and that ended upbeing one, an amazing moment for
me, where I felt like I earnedmy role at X Recruiter because

(47:19):
everything felt like beforehandit went pretty well, I had good
momentum signing people up.
Yeah, there was a fewchallenges here and there, but
like there's no challenge wecan't overcome, but this was
probably one of the mostsignificant because of so many
things happening all at the sametime, where I thought, okay,

(47:39):
blake, this is an opportunitywhere you can test out your
perseverance and your resilience.
Just you would go home.
Home was a fucking shit show.
Couldn't sleep trying to lookafter your son, emotionally
drained, because your're, likeyour kids and your partner's,
really, really sick.
I don't know how I didn't getsick.
I think I was, but I justdidn't.
Perhaps you didn't register toit.

(48:01):
I couldn't bear getting sick,and so I think that was probably
one of the most challenging,but in hindsight it was probably
an experience that money can'tbuy, that I'm actually really
grateful for.

Speaker 1 (48:16):
And mate like at the end of that, remember the huge
loss as well.

Speaker 2 (48:20):
Oh, that's right, and we lost $300,000.
We had a client put on 30, 40contractors and go insolvent the
next day when we asked them topay their bill and, yeah, lost
300 grand.
So, yeah, I mean, lost 300grand under investigation.
Obviously, that's all good nowbecause of some nasty people

(48:43):
trying to throw rocks at us and,yeah, having to build a payroll
team trying to make sure thatthere's no disruption to our
service.
Kids sick it was yeah, it was alot were not happy, partners
were not happy, and I'm sograteful they didn't give up on
us.
Yeah, like that's.
That's the one thing that Ithink is our superpower is

(49:04):
community, because we're runninga business that no one's ever
run before, for the first timeever, and we're just trying to
trying to do our best, and soare our partners.
So our partners are running abusiness that's never done
before.
They're just trying to do theirbest as well, and I think
what's so special is we're allin the same boat together.

(49:26):
So I'm super grateful for ourpartners that turned around and-
.

Speaker 1 (49:31):
Rally together.

Speaker 2 (49:31):
Yeah, they're like all right, it's mission critical
moment at the moment.
Let's all get together, figureout how we're going to solve
this.
We need to make sure x recruitis all good.
We need to make sure we're allgood and we all got together and
solve, solve the problem.
Um, and I don't know of anyscenarios of other businesses
where they've gone to theirclients hey, this is our, and
all the clients have gottentogether and fixed the issue.

(49:54):
I've only had one with Onnit,joe Rogan's supplement company.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (49:59):
Yeah, they had hundreds of thousands of dollars
to pay and they didn't gettheir shipment in time.
So they went to their customersand their customers paid for
all their products and then saidwe'll deliver them later.
Yeah, but that's like thatcompany sold to Unilever.
Pretty special guys if JoeRogan's involved, right yeah.
But, yeah, that wasn't fun,having a face story every day at
CrossFit, being like, hey, mate, how you going?

(50:21):
And we're working through it.
But yeah, that was a hecticcouple of months.
Yeah, so where are we at now,mate?
I think the sun is shining.
It's a really exciting timewe've we've actually got a full
team now.
All services are completelyin-house.
They have been for months, um,and then now we've you know,

(50:41):
we've got 90 of the team isthere for partner support.
Like it's just me and head insales.
Everyone else is there toensure the success of all
partners.
We're bringing literally thebest people in the country
together.
Like.
Like every time we hire,everyone gets better.
Just that, you can tell, theenvironment in 2025 in the
office is way different toDeclan's baseball caps, sneakers

(51:06):
and shorts and T-shirts.
I feel like we're going to awhole new level together as a
team.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (51:12):
I feel like we're going to a whole new level
together as a team.
Yeah, it's exciting whenpartners that joined us a year
and a half, two years ago say tous like I think we've had maybe
five or six people have reachedout to me in the last couple of
weeks saying I cannot believehow much Execruder has leveled
up since we first joined,Because Execruder two years ago

(51:34):
it was like it was a bit of athought.
We were stumbling around tryingto figure shit out.
We didn't have our shit down onlock, we didn't even know what
our responsibilities were asleaders.
We were severely understaffedand Running out of money yeah,
zero dollars, bootstrappedpped,just trying to figure it all out

(51:55):
.
And we had like I don't knowwhat it was specifically, but we
had like a decent amount ofrecruiters just totally put
their faith in us.
Um, and it's a.
It's a funny throwaway linethat you know we joke about with
h people around just trust us.
Like I hate.
I sometimes don't like it whenyou say that to me.

(52:16):
I'm like, bro, of course Itrust you, but don't use that as
as a point to like overcomelike an objection.
But H people being our firstlike labor hire recruiters to
join us and we had no idea aboutlabor hire, and it was like
they're like oh, are you sure,guys, we're gonna be okay?
Like yeah, boys, just trust us.

(52:37):
And that was that was literally.
That was literally how hesigned them up.
And they say to us all the timethey're like just trust us look
at where we are now.
Hey, just trust us.
And it's just so nice to beable to build those
relationships with recruitersand help them on their journey

(52:57):
and they help us on ours, andwe're all working together.
It's crazy.
All right, the full 180.
I'm not sure what that means.
Double down.
Who are you thankful for you?

Speaker 1 (53:15):
Thank you, mate.
Serge Ryan, you guys are in theroom so you come straight to
mind.
But, mate, like Matty, everyoneis like, I think, like we were
still getting our shit togetherwhen we.
I remember meeting Matt Cossonsin the, that the cafe, like the

(53:36):
bottom part of this expensiveapartment he was staying at, and
I'm sitting there and I'm likedownplaying X Recruiter and I
think he got into it and did thefirst few sessions.
He's like oh, mate, this ispretty good, Love the partners,
blah, blah, blah.
And I think the biggest tippingpoint to X Recruiter was him
putting his balls on the lineand you speak to a lot of
recruiters about him when he'snot around and they've got a lot

(53:58):
of really good shit to say andfor him to put his whole career
essentially on the line.
In regards to me and you, itwas a pretty bold move on his
part.
Like you, look at the teambefore he came on board.
I think it was Ryan, it was,wasn't it you, me and Logan and

(54:18):
maybe who else was there Tarynand Chloe and Sammy yeah, I
remember even some meetings withyou.
Know, shout out to Sammy toolike sticking through it for the
first couple of years.
I remember sitting in there andthey're like so, boys, you need
to put more money in.
You're probably going to lose135 grand this month.

(54:38):
And I'm like holy fuck, what dowe need to do?
You need to improve partnerperformance and get more signups
.
And I'm like, oh shit, so likegoing through that, that was
like crazy times.
And Sammy's like, yeah, youjust got to keep going.
Boys, I'm like that's easy foryou to say.
This is like everything's onthe line here and and then so,

(54:59):
but yeah, fortunately enough,like we just kept cracking on.
So yeah, they was.
You know, those founding peoplethat believed in us when we had
nothing.
I think, how'd you get the job,ryan?
You were.
Blake hit you up on LinkedIn.

Speaker 2 (55:10):
Yeah, linkedin approach.

Speaker 1 (55:11):
Yeah, yeah, on LinkedIn.
Blake hit you up on LinkedIn.
Yeah, linkedin approach.
Yeah, yeah, approach you onLinkedIn.
You're working for your mom.
And then you brought twoamazing mates to the team in
Tyler and Xavier, and Serge ison board and like the creative
team that like we market betterthan you know, in our little
backlog of analytics we go upagainst acquisitioncom and
SirHent Ryan.
Sirhent, like that's who wewant to compete with in

(55:32):
marketing.
So to be able to do thosethings is and it's the whole
team mate.
I wish I had a list of everyonehere, but I think also our
Deanna and Kat as well.
I don't know, I'm not easy tobe around.
So the fact Deanna's put upwith this the whole time and
said, yeah, let's do it, maybesometimes I can overshare, and

(55:53):
stresses her out.
So maybe learning that off you.
But yeah, that'd be heaps ofpeople mate, like arnie, michael
, ryan tuckwood, um, the ogpartners, jimmy crystal yeah,
heaps love that carwell boyswell I think that's a really
good tie off.
What about?

Speaker 2 (56:10):
you.
What about me?
Yeah, yeah, I'm grateful foryou, I'm grateful for our team.
I'm grateful for and I don'ttalk about him too much but I'm
grateful for Amy and Lexi.
Amy and Lexi have really mannedup at Venditto, become partners
, are responsible for the P&L,responsible for growing a team.

(56:31):
And you're right when we're atthis moment where it's like, oh,
you lost 100 grand this month.
Oh, you lost 200 grand thismonth.
Oh, you lost another 150 grandthis month.
And we're sitting therescratching our heads thinking,
fucking hell, we lost 500 grandin the last three months.
Like, what do we need to do toturn this around?
And a really big lever to pullwas Vendito.

(56:55):
And the girl is just doing sowell and, um, and just sucking
every dollar out of Vendito tokeep X recruiter going, um, was,
uh, was amazing, because I hada good team at Vendito that I
could rely on, even though Iwasn't billing myself.
So I, if it wasn't for amy andlexi performing at vendito, I

(57:16):
think things might be yeah, Ithink things would be a little
bit different, um, especially inthe first kind of like year,
year and a half um.
So I'm super grateful for amyand lexi, um, grateful for my
family too.
My family's always an awesomesounding board to keep me
balanced and sane and simple andto keep my perspective right.

(57:38):
Obviously, dee you know Dee'sbeen a big supporter of you and
I think you two work really welltogether.
She's decked out our office and, like everyone's impressed with
the office, she got kicked outof her own office.

Speaker 1 (57:50):
She got kicked out of her own office.

Speaker 2 (57:51):
She got kicked out of her own office.
Yep, obviously the team andyou're right about Matt Cossons
like Matt Cossons joinedExrecruiter when we didn't
really have that many runs onthe board, I think we had four
billing partners.

Speaker 1 (58:09):
Really, yeah, we had like we had 400.

Speaker 2 (58:12):
Yeah, I know, I think we had four to five billing
partners, I think.
And when we were talking toMatt in, I don't know, I think
it was like February, februarylast year roughly, and he's
talking to us about his salaryand how much he earns.

Speaker 1 (58:26):
I didn't realize we could get paid that much as a
base man.

Speaker 2 (58:29):
I sat there and I was like, oh, this is not happening
.
And, yeah, shout out to MattCossens, because not only has he
leveled up ex-recruitersignificantly since he's joined,
from both an authority, acredibility and just a
professionalism standpoint, buthe brought a lot of really good

(58:51):
people in.
He knows a lot of really goodpeople in.
He knows a lot of really goodpeople.
But he did put his ownreputation on the line to join X
Recruiter.
If we were just ratbags andweren't living up to the values
and ethics that Matt has, itwould be not career destroying,

(59:12):
but it would be prettydisappointing.
Um, and so he's really taken abig punt on us.
So for Matt, I'm super grateful.
Um, because, he brings so muchvalue that, um, we wouldn't have
had otherwise, and I feel likeMatt joining has snowballed to,
to then Taryn, to the nextperson and then to Ed and um,
and so I think that was a reallybig game changer for us.

(59:34):
So I'm super grateful for that,Um, and I'm just grateful for
the journey.
I think the longer I'm inbusiness it's been eight years
now and I'm still learning everysingle day I think the longer
I'm in business, the more Irealize it's the journey that
matters, not the destination.

Speaker 1 (59:49):
Yeah, you can't understand that.
I bet you know when I'd seeGary Vee say that he's like
enjoy the journey.
I'm like, mate, I'm fuckingbroke.
I'm not seeing any of myfriends.
I don't see my kids.
This journey fucking sucks yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:00:01):
You're right.
You're right, it's really hardto see.

Speaker 1 (01:00:05):
I can say it now because I'm like this is the
best journey ever the impact,the development, development.
But yeah, when you're in thereand you're getting that advice
and that's why obviously youonly get advice at different
times it means different things,okay.

Speaker 2 (01:00:18):
So you need to get to a threshold where the journey
becomes enjoyable.
And it's really reallydifficult in the first couple of
years because it's not aboutthe journey, it's about survival
, and so you can't sit there andbe like, oh, this is a great
journey when you're trying tosurvive.
So once you get out of survivalmode and you have your
processes in place, you haveyour operational rhythm, you

(01:00:41):
have your tech sorted, you'vegot clarity on where the
business is going beyond, justhow much money a month are we
making, and there's a sensibleplan and kind of roadmap, that's
when the journey gets reallygood.
When you start a recruitmentagency, there is no journey.
It's like bill, bill, bill, gohome, bill, go on holiday, bill,

(01:01:04):
buy a new car, bill a bit more,maybe hire some staff, maybe
bill a bit more, and it's likeit's not fun, like it's okay and
it's a better quality of lifethan most others.
But the big missing link withrecruitment agencies is there's
no actual plan.
There's no plan to like be abetter business, market better

(01:01:26):
upskill, onboard better, trainbetter.
Well, at least I know for mostrecruitment agencies I've ever
spoken to, which is why it'sreally hard to get from like
zero to five, eight, zero tofive recruiters, then to 10 to
20 recruiters, and then to 20 to100 recruiters.
It's really difficult becausethere's no plan.
It's just like you're starting,you're billing and then that's.
You know, that's your life.

(01:01:46):
So I think the journey, thereally key part, is that's true?
the journey is about having hopeat the like, what you're
building towards, what you'regoing towards, and not just
living month by month.
And you can't enjoy thatjourney until you've got a plan.
So, um, I love the fact thatwe've got a plan at execruta
because the journey is enjoyable.

(01:02:07):
We're like oh, this is thejourney that we're going on.
Let's design our life aroundthis journey and figure out how
to get that balance right.
But when you've got no plan, nojourney, no future perception,
everything that happens in themoment you're hypersensitive to
because there's no biggerpicture.

(01:02:28):
So maybe that's a key takeawayGet a plan together so you can
enjoy your journey and not justbe scarcity and wigging out all
the time.
Great, well, I think this hasbeen a really good episode.
I hope everyone has enjoyedthat A bit of a trip down memory
lane, declan and I just talkingabout our journey and what
we've learned over the lastcouple of years.
I think it's nice to sit downand just reflect.

(01:02:50):
Talk about this stuff, if notfor anyone, but for ourselves.
Yeah, good therapy session,great therapy session.
So look, if you're a recruiterand you're wanting to take the
next step in your career and youdon't know what that step is.
It might be worth reaching outto Declan or Ed.
They can talk to you about asensible plan.
Whether that's introduce you toa really high performing agency

(01:03:12):
that you'll get lots of growthout of.
Whether that's introduce you toa really high performing agency
that you'll get lots of growthout of.
Whether that's starting yourown business there's nothing off
the table like we're here tohelp.
Whether that's increasing yourbillings, whatever that is,
we're super motivated andcommitted to to trying to add
value to the industry and changethe industry statistics from
typically what is a really hardindustry to be a part of.

(01:03:38):
So if this has resonated withyou, drop us a message on
LinkedIn.
Declan is very active onInstagram these days so he'll
definitely hit you up.
If you follow his Instagramprofile, we'd love to chat to
you and help make it happen.
If you follow his Instagramprofile, we'd love to chat to
you and help make it happen,yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:03:53):
And also like shout out to another couple of people,
chris Bryden and Lisa Angland,part of the OG crew as well.
So look what they've done inbusiness.
They're 12 months in, so it'san exciting journey and always,
you know, thanks my sister andmy mom for being there and being
a sounding board a lot of thetimes too.

Speaker 2 (01:04:13):
Good sesh.
Thanks, blake, love it.
Thanks, dec.
Thanks for tuning in to anotherConfessions of a Recruiter
podcast with Blake and Declan.
We hope you enjoyed and got alot of value and insights out of
this episode.
If you do have any questions oryou would like to recommend
someone to come on theConfessions podcast, we would
love any introductions andremember the rule of the podcast
like share and recommend it toa friend.

(01:04:35):
Until next time.