March 21, 2025 • 22 mins
This episode explores how employees can become powerful brand ambassadors, influencing public perception and enhancing brand communication.
Abbie and Adrian discuss findings from a PR Week/Cision study showing that today's audiences increasingly trust employees' voices over paid celebrity endorsements.
This change marks a notable shift in consumer behavior and brand strategy, showcasing the critical role trust plays in modern marketing.
Read the transcript and notes for this episode on our website.
Key Takeaways
- Celebrity endorsements were once the gold standard for advertising, but times have changed significantly.
- Surprisingly, employees are now seen as the most trustworthy and influential representatives of a brand.
- Brands can harness the power of their employees to amplify messages and build trust among consumers.
- The shift in trust from celebrities to everyday employees highlights a major change in consumer behavior and perceptions.
- It's essential for companies to empower employees to share authentic experiences and perspectives on social media.
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Credits
Copper State of Mind, hosted by Abbie Fink and Dr. Adrian McIntyre, is a project of HMA Public Relations, a full-service public relations and marketing communications firm in Phoenix.
The show is recorded and produced by the team at Speed of Story, a B2B communications firm, and distributed by PHX.fm, the leading independent B2B podcast network in Arizona.
If you enjoyed this episode, you might also like the PRGN Presents podcast, hosted by Abbie Fink, featuring conversations about PR, marketing, and communications with members of the Public Relations Global Network, "the world’s local public relations agency.”
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:04):
There was a time in "the goodold days" of advertising when the
best way to sell a product orpromote a brand was to get a really
famous person to endorse it.Whether it was toothpaste or cigarettes--maybe
the good old days weren't allthat good--celebrity endorsements
have carried a lot of weightwith the general public. That's no
(00:24):
longer true. And there's somesurprising insights as to who is,
in fact, a more influentialvoice of brands for today's audiences.
Abbie, what's on your mind?
Maybe not so surprising aboutthe who, but that the brands are
now recognizing that thisentity that they have at their disposal
(00:46):
is actually a powerful voice.And that's your own employees, right?
These are your brandambassadors. The people in-house
are carrying more weight increating influence and sharing brand
messaging than those otherpaid endorsements. We now call them
influencers. But we've beentalking about this PR Week / Cision
(01:12):
study in our last episode, andthey also looked at what is influence
and who is becoming animportant influencer. And for the
first time in the eight yearsthat this study has been done, employees
are topping the list. Now,those of us that are in this space,
it's not really thatsurprising to me. We've been talking
(01:34):
about the idea of brandambassadors for a long time, but
really from a survey mechanismand actually putting some data behind
it. And what I find mostfascinating about this is really
the shift in trusting youremployees to be that brand voice.
(01:54):
And it is not just left tothose that are paid to create the
content and share on theirsocial channels, but really empowering
your workforce and asking themshould they be so inclined to share
content and share their viewof the business of the brand in a
(02:16):
more public way. And I thinkthat's a pretty amazing statement
and a really powerful way toactivate your employees on behalf
of your organization.
Now, dohavetosaythatthisisalittle a little bit counterintuitive.
I mean, maybe for peopleonthese kindofcampaigns,thewriting'sbeenonthewallforalongtime.Buttothinkthat,youknow,the.The
(02:39):
kid in themailroom or, know,the kid in the mailroom or a line
employeeMichaelJordanorOprahorwhoeveritreallyis. Even
Wayne or Michael Jordan orOprah or whoever, it really is...
Even if it's been slowly,slowly, slowly, now suddenly it really
(03:03):
is a seismic shift in who thepublic believes. And I really, like,
Abbie, andclientstrusttorepresentthebrand? Andthen who
doesthecompanytrust tobeitsspokespeople.That'saninterestingdoublepairing. ?
Well and I think of this inthe employee as your brand ambassador
(03:27):
may not be an officialresponsibility, right? Where you
know, if I'm the social mediamanager or I am a paid influencer,
I have a very specific jobdescription that says I will talk
about brand X on social, Iwill be the spokesperson. I think
where this is gaining tractionis that it is the non responsible,
(03:52):
if that's the right way to putit, non responsible employee that's
being given and empowered todo so. And what it comes back to
for me is this idea ofinfluence and who as a consumer are
we most influenced by? Who dowe trust? Who do we go to to help
make decisions? There's onething when we see a celebrity endorsing
(04:15):
a particular brand of shampooor new lipstick or shoes and we say
okay, well they've been paidto do so, that's what they're supposed
to do. But if my buddy saysI've just tried, I work for, I think
this, it changes the way weview. And I remember my early days
(04:37):
of talking about social media,trying to teach the concept of social
media to non communicators.And I said think about it in a normal
conversation. Hey Adrian, I amlooking for a dry cleaner. Who do
you recommend? And you say Igo to Bill's Dry Cleaning on the
corner. Fantastic. I'm goingto take Bill'sdrycleaning. Dry Cleaning.
(04:59):
Adrian likes them, he truststhem. I'm going to trust gave us
aplatformtoputthatinformationoutthere in abiggercontext.I'mnotsosurethatit's
quitethesameanymore.It'sbecomemuchmoreofa strategic
elementbutthere'sstillalotofI'mgoingto betraveling.Anybody
haverecommendations for of,"'mgoingWhere be traveling. Anybody
(05:21):
have recommendations forrestaurants?" "Where can I go to
..." fill intheformalsense.ButIwilltakearecommendationfromsomebodythathasexperienceditworksthere,visitedthererecently,good,badorotherwiseinadifferentwaythanIwillapaidinfluencer.There'splaceinthecommunicationstrategyforthatindividual.Butwherethisstudyhasfoundandwhatit is,itisIthinktryingtogetthoseofusthatmanagethistypeofthingtocapitalizeoniswehavethisarmyofindividualsthereinourdisposalthatifweempowerthemwithgoodinformation,thatwe
(06:04):
encouragethat,thatitstillhastobepartofyouknowastrategyandmanaged, butgivingthemalittlebitoffreereinto
havethatconversation.We'restartingtoseeitmove theneedlealittlebit.Andthat
requiresthoseofusthatareresponsibleforittosay,okay,we'regoingtoletthis happen.Westillhavetopayattentiontoit.Wecan'tjustletthemrunoffwillynillyanddoingthings.Butwedohavethisopportunitytoletothershelpshareourvoice.Andyouknow,Ithinktherearecertainindustriesthatmightfindthismorebeneficialorfindittobealittleeasiertoletithappen.Maybethosethataremorehighlyregulatedorganizations
(06:49):
may off willy-nilly and doingthings. But we do have this opportunity
to let others help share ourvoice. And you know, I think there
are certain industries thatmight find this more myteamthatarecomfortableinthe
socialspace,thatenjoydoingit,thathavethewherewithalto besmartaboutit,whywouldn'tIwanttocapitalizeontheirwillingnesstodoit?
(07:14):
Now, there's some interestingpatterns that emerge when you really
dig into the data in this PRWeek / Cision report and I think
we should call them outbecause the story is not uniform
across industries. But the bigpicture story is, as we've been saying,
this shift towards employees,also everyday consumers and interestingly
(07:41):
enough, corporate executives.Those are the top three categories
of influencer who the publicsays they believe the most. The least
influential are celebrities ingeneral, then micro influencers--that's
influencers with a smallfollowing, a thousand to a hundred
thousand followers onsocial--macro influencers, those
(08:02):
big accounts with a hundredthousand or more followers, and then
niche influencers who focus ona very specific topic or field. Now
the one place that thisdoesn't apply is in the arts, entertainment
and media industry wherecelebrities are still in the top
three because of course theytheir domain expertise. They actually
(08:22):
are in a way employees if youthink about it, of quote unquote
Hollywood. Although as anyonewho's ever been there knows the phenomenon
"Hollywood" and the City ofHollywood are not samething.
Correct. Topic for another time.
Another time, another time.And there's a great Denny's on Boulevard.Ifyou'rethereat2:00inthemorning,as
Ioftenwasincollege,youcanseeawholeslice of.
hu man i tyAny way.. .
(08:45):
Whole lot of influence goingon there.
Whole other thing. Everywhereelse it's employees and everyday
consumers who tend to dominatein terms of their trustworthiness,
their influence. Here's what Ithink is fascinating. So takeaway
number one. If you look attheir graph in the study, it's almost
(09:07):
an inverse of audience size.In other words, celebrities are the
most well known, have the mostfollowers, if you will, and then
all the way down to employees,probably have no meaningful audience
of their own. Everydayconsumers, they also haven't gone
out trying to build afollowing online. Corporate executives,
(09:28):
despite their PR firms andinternal comms people trying to get
them to do this more, theyreally haven't in any significant
way. There are exceptions.Journalists and niche influencers
are kind of the same thingthese days, but are right in the
middle. So what does thatmean? We trustpeoplewhoaren't intheaudience
business,whoaren'ttryingtomonetizetheir fameortheir
(09:52):
reach.That'sfascinating.
Well, and makes a whole lot ofsense. I mean, again, it goes back
to this concept of trust,right? I mean, I read the gossip
magazines and I follow the,you know, the celebrities that I
enjoy and you know, okay,maybe to some extent, if they say
they like something, I mightat least click on it and take a look.
(10:14):
Do I go buy it? Because theysaid so? Maybe not. And I, and I
may not be your averageconsumer, given what I do for a living,
but again, if it's, if it isthe common person, the everyday consumer
that says, I've tried thisproduct, I've been to this organization,
I've been to this restaurant.This is what I observed, this is
(10:36):
what I liked. I know and likeand trust that person's opinion.
It elevates their, theirviewpoint in a different way. And
you know, there's, there'sroom in all of this, you know, for
all of these things to besuccessful. But I, I, I hadn't looked
at it quite the same way thatyou did and that the, the more influence
(10:58):
comes from a group ofindividuals with less of an audience.
But if, if we, I've harped onthis before, numbers aren't everything.
I would rather have 50 veryengaged followers that take action
than 5,000 that do absolutelynothing with the information that
(11:19):
I'm giving them. And maybethis is where this is coming, right?
So my circle of influence withmy couple hundred people that pay
attention to what I have tosay is more significant and takes
action and actually doessomething with the information that
I'm sharing versus the largerindividuals with multiple followings
(11:41):
that we tend to scroll throughand just acknowledge. The area, though,
that I do think is somethingfor all of us to pay attention to
is this idea of the Nicheinfluencer. And those are individuals
that are taking on a veryspecific topic or industry to be
(12:03):
influential within. They'renot just out there taking on everything
and anything that comes theirway. And to some extent, you might
call an employee a nicheinfluencer as well. But the idea
that these folks have maybetaken the time to really understand
it, researched it, made somelogical viewpoint about it, and that's
(12:26):
why they're going out thereand talking about it. All of this,
to me is really talking aboutthe importance of influence. When
you are creating a strategy,where do you put that information?
What is the best vehicle toget that out? This doesn't completely
discount other forms ofcommunication. You started at the
(12:48):
top of the podcast aboutadvertising and celebrity endorsements.
And we certainly have a lot ofother earned media and other things
that help shape publicopinion. And it really is, where
do we create thesepartnerships? Who's going to have
the most persuasive voice interms of action we want someone to
(13:08):
take? And how do we capitalizeon all those opportunities to move
our audiences to action,whatever that action is intended
to be?
We've talked a number of timeson this podcast about the issue of
trust in general and thedeclining trust that people around
the world, not just in theUnited States, have in government,
(13:31):
in the media, in nonprofits,in healthcare systems, in all these
institutions. So there's amuch bigger issue at play here. And
one of the things that Icontinually find interesting is who
we still say we trust, right?Suspicion and cynicism are the norm,
(13:54):
but who do we believe? Youwould think, I think, that the most
believable person would besomebody who has no vested interest
in the thing, just happens tolove the product. The everyday consumer
type person, you know, theperson on the street who says, oh,
I just can't wait to getanother, you know, frozen yogurt
(14:15):
or whatever. Whatever theproduct is. However, it's interesting
to me that in most of theseindustries, it's employees and corporate
executives who are now, andthis is recent, they have now taken
the lead. These people workfor the company that sells the service
or the product, usuallyproducts that that's being promoted.
(14:37):
And yet we still believe themmore especially the everyday employee
folks. There are a number ofexamples in the report, which you
can look up for yourself. Butpeople acompanyandwhocanbe showninasocialmediacampaignora
videoseries forYouTubeorstilloverthe airordirectOTTdirectcommercialsfortelevisionorforstreaming,thatdoesreally
(15:05):
wellandIthinkit'sbecausewerelatetothesepeople.Thesearepeoplewho,whohaveajob.Theyjusthappentolovetheirjob. Theyhappentolove
theproduct.They bringsomejoyorsomezestorsome whateverto the,
totheirwork,to us.Thathasthering ofauthenticity.Thathas
thering,youknow,theydon'thaveto befeaturedinthisYouTube series.
(15:27):
They couldhavesaidno.Butthey'rerelatable.We trust them.Itseemstobeauthentic.Even
thoughthoseofus whoworkontheother side said no. But they're
relatable. We constructedand,youknow,scriptedandlighting andanglesand
everything.Right.Soit'sstillaproduction,butthisis farmorebelievabletousthanacelebrity
(15:48):
whowillsayanythingfora$10millioncheck.
And maybe it's because we seeourselves in that we can picture,
you know, the us in theimagery or in the conversation that's
happening. And, you know, Ithink to some extent, some of the
what this survey is finding ismaybe more of the organic efforts.
(16:13):
It's not so much. I mean,there are certainly, you know, these
are actual employees in thiscommercial who say these things,
but they've been pickedbecause they represent or cross representation
of the organization, etcetera. But I think where this becomes
important is in that organic,unplanned sort of way, in that they
(16:37):
are just naturallyenthusiastic about what they're working
on, where they're working.They're excited about a particular
new product or an investmentin an organization or that we volunteered
or whatever it might be. And Idon't necessarily, you know, I see
this as I'm really excited mycompany volunteered. We helped do
(17:00):
such and such. I'm so excitedabout my company's commitment to
giving back that kind of apost. And then I see that and I go,
oh, wow, that's reallyamazing. They're super supportive
of this nonprofit. That's anorganization that means something
to me. I need to purchase anew widget. hatcompanyis is a widget
(17:21):
seller. I'm going to atthemthebenefitofthe,youknow,takinga lookattheirproduct
becausetheysupportsomethingandtheiremployeesareexcitedaboutdoingit.Soit,tomeiswhere this,
thisinfluenceiscomingfrom.It's, it'snotgooutonlineandtalkabout
howamazingthewidgetis.It'smoreabouthow amazingthe
companyisandthe investmentintheemployeesandthecommunityandwhateverit isthatI
(17:44):
usetoevaluate whereI'mgoingtospend myhardearneddollarsasa consumerbecomespart
oftheway Imake mydecisions,ifIseethatthey'reagoodcommunity partner,or
again,whateveritisthatisrelevanttomeasI'mmaking mydecisions.Yeah.
As we wrap up thisconversation, let's do a couple of
practical takeaways. I mean, Icould see a couple in here, and I'd
(18:06):
love to hear your thoughts aswell. The first is look to your people
for some genuine, authenticvoices who you might feature in any
number of communications orcampaigns, because people really
respond well to that. Thesecond is look to your executives.
Remind them that people saythey trust corporate leaders more
(18:28):
than almost every othercategory, even as trust for everyone
is declining, and encouragethem to find a voice and find a way
to share. And then the thirdthing is what you said, Abbie, a
minute ago, is really think ofyour employees not just as the people
you might feature, but alsothe people who can help amplify your
(18:50):
content. Create an employeeadvocacy program where people can
actually share the post thecomms team and the agency partners
are creating so that it reallydoes reach out.
And it's important, I think,to demonstrate your trust in them
to do that for you. You know,it's one thing, you know, the corporate
executive that says, you know,we encourage you to do these types
(19:14):
of things. They need to seethe corporate executive doing those
things that he. He or she alsoneeds to be sharing and reposting
and commenting and things likethat, and embrace the idea that.
That other voices in theconversation are going to be relevant
and, and pay attention to whatthose voices are doing and how they're
using the information. Youknow, we will often say, you know,
(19:36):
if you've identified yourselfas working for this company on your
LinkedIn profile or on yourFacebook profile, you've become in,
you know, without evenattempting to, you have become a
spokesperson for theorganization. Capitalize on that
and give the employees in yourcompany, whether you're a small organization
or a large entity, the trustand the wherewithal to be able to
(19:59):
do this and encourage that tohappen. And leave the very official
kinds of conversations andshareable content to the individuals
that are responsible for it.But encourage others to be an active
voice on your behalf. And Ithink you'll notice and you'll start
(20:19):
to see how that influence,that influence of your employees
and, and defined by that, yourleadership as well, start to actually
make a difference in how youare perceived and how people interact
with your brand and how peoplesupport your organization because
they are supporting yourorganization because of the individuals
that make it work. Everysingle day, and let's put some of
(20:43):
that power into their handsand watch how that voice becomes
stronger and amplifies theimportant business that you're doing.
Thanks for listening to thisepisode of Copper State of Mind.
If you enjoyed theconversation, please share it with
a colleague who might alsofind this podcast valuable. It's
(21:05):
easy to do, just click the"Share" button in the app you're
listening to now to pass italong. You can also follow Copper
State of Mind in ApplePodcasts, Spotify, or any other podcast
app. We publish new episodesevery other Friday. Copper State
of Mind is brought to you byHMA Public Relations, the oldest
(21:25):
continuously operating PR firmin Arizona. The show is recorded
and produced by the team atSpeed of Story, a B2B communications
firm in Phoenix, anddistributed by PHX.fm, the leading
independent B2B podcastnetwork in Arizona. For all us us
here at Speed of Story andPHX.fm, I'm Adrian McIntyre. Thanks
(21:47):
for sharingtheshowwithothers.Ifyouchooseto others if you choose
to do so. We hope you'll joinus again for
There was a time in "the goodold days" of advertising when the
best way to sell a product orpromote a brand was to get a really
famous person to endorse it.Whether it was toothpaste or cigarettes--maybe
the good old days weren't allthat good--celebrity endorsements
have carried a lot of weightwith the general public. That's no
(00:24):
longer true. And there's somesurprising insights as to who is,
in fact, a more influentialvoice of brands for today's audiences.
Abbie, what's on your mind?
Maybe not so surprising aboutthe who, but that the brands are
now recognizing that thisentity that they have at their disposal
(00:46):
is actually a powerful voice.And that's your own employees, right?
These are your brandambassadors. The people in-house
are carrying more weight increating influence and sharing brand
messaging than those otherpaid endorsements. We now call them
influencers. But we've beentalking about this PR Week / Cision
(01:12):
study in our last episode, andthey also looked at what is influence
and who is becoming animportant influencer. And for the
first time in the eight yearsthat this study has been done, employees
are topping the list. Now,those of us that are in this space,
it's not really thatsurprising to me. We've been talking
(01:34):
about the idea of brandambassadors for a long time, but
really from a survey mechanismand actually putting some data behind
it. And what I find mostfascinating about this is really
the shift in trusting youremployees to be that brand voice.
(01:54):
And it is not just left tothose that are paid to create the
content and share on theirsocial channels, but really empowering
your workforce and asking themshould they be so inclined to share
content and share their viewof the business of the brand in a
(02:16):
more public way. And I thinkthat's a pretty amazing statement
and a really powerful way toactivate your employees on behalf
of your organization.
Now, dohavetosaythatthisisalittle a little bit counterintuitive.
I mean, maybe for peopleonthese kindofcampaigns,thewriting'sbeenonthewallforalongtime.Buttothinkthat,youknow,the.The
(02:39):
kid in themailroom or, know,the kid in the mailroom or a line
employeeMichaelJordanorOprahorwhoeveritreallyis. Even
Wayne or Michael Jordan orOprah or whoever, it really is...
Even if it's been slowly,slowly, slowly, now suddenly it really
(03:03):
is a seismic shift in who thepublic believes. And I really, like,
Abbie, andclientstrusttorepresentthebrand? Andthen who
doesthecompanytrust tobeitsspokespeople.That'saninterestingdoublepairing. ?
Well and I think of this inthe employee as your brand ambassador
(03:27):
may not be an officialresponsibility, right? Where you
know, if I'm the social mediamanager or I am a paid influencer,
I have a very specific jobdescription that says I will talk
about brand X on social, Iwill be the spokesperson. I think
where this is gaining tractionis that it is the non responsible,
(03:52):
if that's the right way to putit, non responsible employee that's
being given and empowered todo so. And what it comes back to
for me is this idea ofinfluence and who as a consumer are
we most influenced by? Who dowe trust? Who do we go to to help
make decisions? There's onething when we see a celebrity endorsing
(04:15):
a particular brand of shampooor new lipstick or shoes and we say
okay, well they've been paidto do so, that's what they're supposed
to do. But if my buddy saysI've just tried, I work for, I think
this, it changes the way weview. And I remember my early days
(04:37):
of talking about social media,trying to teach the concept of social
media to non communicators.And I said think about it in a normal
conversation. Hey Adrian, I amlooking for a dry cleaner. Who do
you recommend? And you say Igo to Bill's Dry Cleaning on the
corner. Fantastic. I'm goingto take Bill'sdrycleaning. Dry Cleaning.
(04:59):
Adrian likes them, he truststhem. I'm going to trust gave us
aplatformtoputthatinformationoutthere in abiggercontext.I'mnotsosurethatit's
quitethesameanymore.It'sbecomemuchmoreofa strategic
elementbutthere'sstillalotofI'mgoingto betraveling.Anybody
haverecommendations for of,"'mgoingWhere be traveling. Anybody
(05:21):
have recommendations forrestaurants?" "Where can I go to
..." fill intheformalsense.ButIwilltakearecommendationfromsomebodythathasexperienceditworksthere,visitedthererecently,good,badorotherwiseinadifferentwaythanIwillapaidinfluencer.There'splaceinthecommunicationstrategyforthatindividual.Butwherethisstudyhasfoundandwhatit is,itisIthinktryingtogetthoseofusthatmanagethistypeofthingtocapitalizeoniswehavethisarmyofindividualsthereinourdisposalthatifweempowerthemwithgoodinformation,thatwe
(06:04):
encouragethat,thatitstillhastobepartofyouknowastrategyandmanaged, butgivingthemalittlebitoffreereinto
havethatconversation.We'restartingtoseeitmove theneedlealittlebit.Andthat
requiresthoseofusthatareresponsibleforittosay,okay,we'regoingtoletthis happen.Westillhavetopayattentiontoit.Wecan'tjustletthemrunoffwillynillyanddoingthings.Butwedohavethisopportunitytoletothershelpshareourvoice.Andyouknow,Ithinktherearecertainindustriesthatmightfindthismorebeneficialorfindittobealittleeasiertoletithappen.Maybethosethataremorehighlyregulatedorganizations
(06:49):
may off willy-nilly and doingthings. But we do have this opportunity
to let others help share ourvoice. And you know, I think there
are certain industries thatmight find this more myteamthatarecomfortableinthe
socialspace,thatenjoydoingit,thathavethewherewithalto besmartaboutit,whywouldn'tIwanttocapitalizeontheirwillingnesstodoit?
(07:14):
Now, there's some interestingpatterns that emerge when you really
dig into the data in this PRWeek / Cision report and I think
we should call them outbecause the story is not uniform
across industries. But the bigpicture story is, as we've been saying,
this shift towards employees,also everyday consumers and interestingly
(07:41):
enough, corporate executives.Those are the top three categories
of influencer who the publicsays they believe the most. The least
influential are celebrities ingeneral, then micro influencers--that's
influencers with a smallfollowing, a thousand to a hundred
thousand followers onsocial--macro influencers, those
(08:02):
big accounts with a hundredthousand or more followers, and then
niche influencers who focus ona very specific topic or field. Now
the one place that thisdoesn't apply is in the arts, entertainment
and media industry wherecelebrities are still in the top
three because of course theytheir domain expertise. They actually
(08:22):
are in a way employees if youthink about it, of quote unquote
Hollywood. Although as anyonewho's ever been there knows the phenomenon
"Hollywood" and the City ofHollywood are not samething.
Correct. Topic for another time.
Another time, another time.And there's a great Denny's on Boulevard.Ifyou'rethereat2:00inthemorning,as
Ioftenwasincollege,youcanseeawholeslice of.
hu man i tyAny way.. .
(08:45):
Whole lot of influence goingon there.
Whole other thing. Everywhereelse it's employees and everyday
consumers who tend to dominatein terms of their trustworthiness,
their influence. Here's what Ithink is fascinating. So takeaway
number one. If you look attheir graph in the study, it's almost
(09:07):
an inverse of audience size.In other words, celebrities are the
most well known, have the mostfollowers, if you will, and then
all the way down to employees,probably have no meaningful audience
of their own. Everydayconsumers, they also haven't gone
out trying to build afollowing online. Corporate executives,
(09:28):
despite their PR firms andinternal comms people trying to get
them to do this more, theyreally haven't in any significant
way. There are exceptions.Journalists and niche influencers
are kind of the same thingthese days, but are right in the
middle. So what does thatmean? We trustpeoplewhoaren't intheaudience
business,whoaren'ttryingtomonetizetheir fameortheir
(09:52):
reach.That'sfascinating.
Well, and makes a whole lot ofsense. I mean, again, it goes back
to this concept of trust,right? I mean, I read the gossip
magazines and I follow the,you know, the celebrities that I
enjoy and you know, okay,maybe to some extent, if they say
they like something, I mightat least click on it and take a look.
(10:14):
Do I go buy it? Because theysaid so? Maybe not. And I, and I
may not be your averageconsumer, given what I do for a living,
but again, if it's, if it isthe common person, the everyday consumer
that says, I've tried thisproduct, I've been to this organization,
I've been to this restaurant.This is what I observed, this is
(10:36):
what I liked. I know and likeand trust that person's opinion.
It elevates their, theirviewpoint in a different way. And
you know, there's, there'sroom in all of this, you know, for
all of these things to besuccessful. But I, I, I hadn't looked
at it quite the same way thatyou did and that the, the more influence
(10:58):
comes from a group ofindividuals with less of an audience.
But if, if we, I've harped onthis before, numbers aren't everything.
I would rather have 50 veryengaged followers that take action
than 5,000 that do absolutelynothing with the information that
(11:19):
I'm giving them. And maybethis is where this is coming, right?
So my circle of influence withmy couple hundred people that pay
attention to what I have tosay is more significant and takes
action and actually doessomething with the information that
I'm sharing versus the largerindividuals with multiple followings
(11:41):
that we tend to scroll throughand just acknowledge. The area, though,
that I do think is somethingfor all of us to pay attention to
is this idea of the Nicheinfluencer. And those are individuals
that are taking on a veryspecific topic or industry to be
(12:03):
influential within. They'renot just out there taking on everything
and anything that comes theirway. And to some extent, you might
call an employee a nicheinfluencer as well. But the idea
that these folks have maybetaken the time to really understand
it, researched it, made somelogical viewpoint about it, and that's
(12:26):
why they're going out thereand talking about it. All of this,
to me is really talking aboutthe importance of influence. When
you are creating a strategy,where do you put that information?
What is the best vehicle toget that out? This doesn't completely
discount other forms ofcommunication. You started at the
(12:48):
top of the podcast aboutadvertising and celebrity endorsements.
And we certainly have a lot ofother earned media and other things
that help shape publicopinion. And it really is, where
do we create thesepartnerships? Who's going to have
the most persuasive voice interms of action we want someone to
(13:08):
take? And how do we capitalizeon all those opportunities to move
our audiences to action,whatever that action is intended
to be?
We've talked a number of timeson this podcast about the issue of
trust in general and thedeclining trust that people around
the world, not just in theUnited States, have in government,
(13:31):
in the media, in nonprofits,in healthcare systems, in all these
institutions. So there's amuch bigger issue at play here. And
one of the things that Icontinually find interesting is who
we still say we trust, right?Suspicion and cynicism are the norm,
(13:54):
but who do we believe? Youwould think, I think, that the most
believable person would besomebody who has no vested interest
in the thing, just happens tolove the product. The everyday consumer
type person, you know, theperson on the street who says, oh,
I just can't wait to getanother, you know, frozen yogurt
(14:15):
or whatever. Whatever theproduct is. However, it's interesting
to me that in most of theseindustries, it's employees and corporate
executives who are now, andthis is recent, they have now taken
the lead. These people workfor the company that sells the service
or the product, usuallyproducts that that's being promoted.
(14:37):
And yet we still believe themmore especially the everyday employee
folks. There are a number ofexamples in the report, which you
can look up for yourself. Butpeople acompanyandwhocanbe showninasocialmediacampaignora
videoseries forYouTubeorstilloverthe airordirectOTTdirectcommercialsfortelevisionorforstreaming,thatdoesreally
(15:05):
wellandIthinkit'sbecausewerelatetothesepeople.Thesearepeoplewho,whohaveajob.Theyjusthappentolovetheirjob. Theyhappentolove
theproduct.They bringsomejoyorsomezestorsome whateverto the,
totheirwork,to us.Thathasthering ofauthenticity.Thathas
thering,youknow,theydon'thaveto befeaturedinthisYouTube series.
(15:27):
They couldhavesaidno.Butthey'rerelatable.We trust them.Itseemstobeauthentic.Even
thoughthoseofus whoworkontheother side said no. But they're
relatable. We constructedand,youknow,scriptedandlighting andanglesand
everything.Right.Soit'sstillaproduction,butthisis farmorebelievabletousthanacelebrity
(15:48):
whowillsayanythingfora$10millioncheck.
And maybe it's because we seeourselves in that we can picture,
you know, the us in theimagery or in the conversation that's
happening. And, you know, Ithink to some extent, some of the
what this survey is finding ismaybe more of the organic efforts.
(16:13):
It's not so much. I mean,there are certainly, you know, these
are actual employees in thiscommercial who say these things,
but they've been pickedbecause they represent or cross representation
of the organization, etcetera. But I think where this becomes
important is in that organic,unplanned sort of way, in that they
(16:37):
are just naturallyenthusiastic about what they're working
on, where they're working.They're excited about a particular
new product or an investmentin an organization or that we volunteered
or whatever it might be. And Idon't necessarily, you know, I see
this as I'm really excited mycompany volunteered. We helped do
(17:00):
such and such. I'm so excitedabout my company's commitment to
giving back that kind of apost. And then I see that and I go,
oh, wow, that's reallyamazing. They're super supportive
of this nonprofit. That's anorganization that means something
to me. I need to purchase anew widget. hatcompanyis is a widget
(17:21):
seller. I'm going to atthemthebenefitofthe,youknow,takinga lookattheirproduct
becausetheysupportsomethingandtheiremployeesareexcitedaboutdoingit.Soit,tomeiswhere this,
thisinfluenceiscomingfrom.It's, it'snotgooutonlineandtalkabout
howamazingthewidgetis.It'smoreabouthow amazingthe
companyisandthe investmentintheemployeesandthecommunityandwhateverit isthatI
(17:44):
usetoevaluate whereI'mgoingtospend myhardearneddollarsasa consumerbecomespart
oftheway Imake mydecisions,ifIseethatthey'reagoodcommunity partner,or
again,whateveritisthatisrelevanttomeasI'mmaking mydecisions.Yeah.
As we wrap up thisconversation, let's do a couple of
practical takeaways. I mean, Icould see a couple in here, and I'd
(18:06):
love to hear your thoughts aswell. The first is look to your people
for some genuine, authenticvoices who you might feature in any
number of communications orcampaigns, because people really
respond well to that. Thesecond is look to your executives.
Remind them that people saythey trust corporate leaders more
(18:28):
than almost every othercategory, even as trust for everyone
is declining, and encouragethem to find a voice and find a way
to share. And then the thirdthing is what you said, Abbie, a
minute ago, is really think ofyour employees not just as the people
you might feature, but alsothe people who can help amplify your
(18:50):
content. Create an employeeadvocacy program where people can
actually share the post thecomms team and the agency partners
are creating so that it reallydoes reach out.
And it's important, I think,to demonstrate your trust in them
to do that for you. You know,it's one thing, you know, the corporate
executive that says, you know,we encourage you to do these types
(19:14):
of things. They need to seethe corporate executive doing those
things that he. He or she alsoneeds to be sharing and reposting
and commenting and things likethat, and embrace the idea that.
That other voices in theconversation are going to be relevant
and, and pay attention to whatthose voices are doing and how they're
using the information. Youknow, we will often say, you know,
(19:36):
if you've identified yourselfas working for this company on your
LinkedIn profile or on yourFacebook profile, you've become in,
you know, without evenattempting to, you have become a
spokesperson for theorganization. Capitalize on that
and give the employees in yourcompany, whether you're a small organization
or a large entity, the trustand the wherewithal to be able to
(19:59):
do this and encourage that tohappen. And leave the very official
kinds of conversations andshareable content to the individuals
that are responsible for it.But encourage others to be an active
voice on your behalf. And Ithink you'll notice and you'll start
(20:19):
to see how that influence,that influence of your employees
and, and defined by that, yourleadership as well, start to actually
make a difference in how youare perceived and how people interact
with your brand and how peoplesupport your organization because
they are supporting yourorganization because of the individuals
that make it work. Everysingle day, and let's put some of
(20:43):
that power into their handsand watch how that voice becomes
stronger and amplifies theimportant business that you're doing.
Thanks for listening to thisepisode of Copper State of Mind.
If you enjoyed theconversation, please share it with
a colleague who might alsofind this podcast valuable. It's
(21:05):
easy to do, just click the"Share" button in the app you're
listening to now to pass italong. You can also follow Copper
State of Mind in ApplePodcasts, Spotify, or any other podcast
app. We publish new episodesevery other Friday. Copper State
of Mind is brought to you byHMA Public Relations, the oldest
(21:25):
continuously operating PR firmin Arizona. The show is recorded
and produced by the team atSpeed of Story, a B2B communications
firm in Phoenix, anddistributed by PHX.fm, the leading
independent B2B podcastnetwork in Arizona. For all us us
here at Speed of Story andPHX.fm, I'm Adrian McIntyre. Thanks
(21:47):
for sharingtheshowwithothers.Ifyouchooseto others if you choose
to do so. We hope you'll joinus again for
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