Hit Man

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Remi (00:08):
Welcome to Criminal Adaptations, the show where we
take a look at some of yourfavorite movies and the true
crime stories that inspired them.
I'm Remy.
I spent over a decade workingin the film and television
industry in Los Angeles,California.

Ashley (00:21):
And I'm Ashley.
I'm a clinical psychologist andforensic evaluator in the state
of Oregon.

Remi (00:27):
Welcome back everyone and thank you so much for joining us
here again today.
We are happy to be here and weare happy to be bringing you
another true crime story.
Ashley, how are you doing today?

Ashley (00:41):
I am doing great.
It is another beautiful springday in Portland, so no
complaints on my end.
How about you?

Remi (00:48):
Doing pretty well.
Just brought our dog to thepark and she may have hurt her
little paw, so she is taking iteasy right next to us over here.
Other than that, doing verywell, hoping that the dog makes
a full recovery and enjoying theweather.
But what are we here to talkabout today, ashley?
It's not the weather.
It is not the weather.
But what are we here to talkabout today, ashley?
It's not the weather.

Ashley (01:07):
It is not the weather.
We are here to talk aboutRichard Linklater's Hitman, a
comedy movie, and you told meit's actually a rom-com.

Remi (01:19):
It is a romantic comedy.
It is probably the onlyromantic comedy we will ever
cover on this show.
There are not a lot of truecrime romantic comedies that I
can think of off the top of myhead, but this was a really
unique story and I remember whenwe first watched it and found
out that it was based on a truestory I immediately was like we

(01:43):
need to add this to next season.
I am vetoing one of the otherentries because I just need to
know how much of this is true,because the movie is pretty
unbelievable and from all theresearch that I did, it turns
out not a ton of it was true,but we'll get into the nitty
gritty of all that in a minute.

(02:03):
This is also our second timediscussing Mr Skip Hollinsworth,
a writer from Texas Monthly whohad previously helped Richard
Linklater write the script forBernie, which was based on one
of his articles from TexasMonthly.
Skip and Linklater are closefriends, so we know a little bit
about them.
But what about Gary Johnson,the quote-unquote hitman in

(02:25):
question?
Had you ever heard of thisstory or this guy before the
movie?

Ashley (02:32):
Absolutely not.
I even remember very, very,very little about this movie.
I think you were paying moreattention to it.
I was doing other things so Ihad no memory of even the
romantic aspect of it.
So I went into this pretty muchcompletely blind.
Other than remembering that itwas a guy who said he was a
hitman and he really wasn't.

(02:53):
I don't even think I rememberedthat he worked for the police.

Remi (02:56):
I had also never heard of Gary Johnson or this undercover
hitman story in the past.
It was all new to me, which iswhy I was so excited to add it
to the list.
It's rare that something comesout of the blue like this and is
a brand new film we can discuss, and I don't know it was
something unique, a romanticcomedy.
You don't really get that a lotin our line of work, quite

(03:19):
frankly.
But what are your feelingsabout the film's star, mr Glenn
Powell?
He is sort of a new A-listactor that's broken onto the
scene recently.
I know he was in that Top GunMaverick movie that came out a
couple of years ago.
But how do you feel about MrPowell?

Ashley (03:37):
He's someone that I really don't want to like, but
everything I've seen him in he'spretty charming.
He was good in that Twistersreboot and he was also good in
that movie we watched I can'tremember what it's called.
I think Anywhere, but you orsomething like that with Sidney
Sweeney.

Remi (03:54):
Anyone but you.

Ashley (03:56):
And we went into that thinking that it was just going
to be a dumb romantic comedywith really little substance,
but we both actually really,really enjoyed it.

Remi (04:05):
I remember when he first began appearing in things he
always came off to me like agenerically good-looking dude
who was like manufactured in aHollywood factory somewhere to
be a leading man and I alwaysthought he should be playing
parts like the douchebagboyfriend, like Glenn Guglia
from the Wedding Singer or SacLodge from Wedding Crashers.

(04:27):
But I do have to admit he isvery charming and I enjoy him in
all the films I've seen him in.
I'm not like head over heelsabout the movies themselves.
They're all entertaining.
But yeah, he's found this weirdbalance of being a good looking
, charming guy where you stilllike him and are rooting for him
for some reason in these films.

Ashley (04:48):
I think it's his smile.
He's got a good smile and smirkto him.

Remi (04:54):
And he is funny.
I will say that he made melaugh out loud during several
scenes in this movie.
The character in the filmhonestly seems like it's more
suited to an actor like SamRockwell, because Glenn Powell,
just honestly, is so handsomeand charismatic.
But it works for this type ofromantic comedy and, honestly,

(05:14):
I'm looking forward to the nextthing he writes, because he
actually has a co-writing crediton this film.

Ashley (05:20):
Well, with that, let's learn more about the background
behind Hitman.
I stumbled across a tiny tinybit when I was doing my research
for it, but other than that Idon't really know much.

Remi (05:31):
Well, I'll give it a shot.

Hit Man scene (05:34):
No, no, no, I don't buy it what You're not?
A Hitman, you can't be.

Remi (05:40):
Hitman is a 2023 romantic comedy produced and directed by
Richard Linklater, with ascreenplay co-written by
Linklater and Glenn Powell, whoalso stars in the film,
alongside Adria, aroha, austin,emilio and Retta from Parks and
Rec, which I never reallyrealized she only went by one
name until doing research forthis film.

Ashley (06:01):
Isn't she in another movie we have on our list, Queen
Pins, about the coupon scam?

Remi (06:06):
I'm pretty sure she is in that one.

Ashley (06:08):
She pops up in a lot of things from time to time and she
is a brilliant opera singer.

Remi (06:12):
for anyone who wants to YouTube that Now for those of
you who haven't listened to ourBernie episode from season two,
this isn't Linklater's firstrodeo with Skip Hollinsworth and
Texas Monthly with Linklater,having previously adapted
Hollinsworth's 1998 articleMidnight in the Garden of East
Texas for the 2011 film.

(06:34):
Bernie.
Similarly, the film Hitman alsooriginated from a piece written
by Hollinsworth back in 2001about a man named Gary Johnson
who went undercover bypretending to be a variety of
hitmen during several stingoperations with the police.
Linklater found Gary's story tobe an utterly fascinating read,
opening up a bizarrely chillingworld where everyday people

(06:57):
were attempting to hire contractkillers in an effort to
eliminate their problems.

Ashley (07:02):
The one thing I read is that Skip Hollinsworth brought
this article to Linklater inlike 2005 and he liked it but
just didn't see how he couldadapt it to the screen, so it
kind of sat around for years andyears.

Remi (07:17):
According to Linklater, he read this as soon as it came
out in 2001 and he immediatelywanted to make it into a film.
Linklater is a bit of a truecrime buff, apparently.
By his own admission, he evengoes to trials happening around
town just to sit and watch.
He's, like, really into thissort of thing.
Linklater went on to have a fewexploratory meetings regarding

(07:38):
the project over the years, butthings never really quite
clicked into place until thepandemic hit.
That's when actor Glenn Powellwho's a personal friend of
Linklater's since they are bothTexas boys and rang him up out
of the blue and said I just readthis wild article about a
hitman.
In the original article, garyJohnson let a young woman go

(08:00):
without pressing charges, butPowell and Linklater were more
interested in exploring wherethe story could have gone from
there if she had called himafterwards, and they began a
romantic relationship In the end.
The general setup, along withGary's character, were both very
much inspired by the true story, but the entire romantic arc

(08:20):
was purely a work of fictioncreated by Powell and Linklater.

Richard Linklater (08:25):
I like movies about occupations, jobs.
That movies do that really welland this is the weirdest job
you could ever imagine.
So it was great to think ofthat as the bedrock of a movie.
But then to actually make amovie that's compelling, that
will take you on a ride what ifshe invited him to something?
Socially?
It's like oh, then he's trappedin this hitman persona, which
he happens to like more.

(08:46):
It becomes kind of a bodyswitch comedy about identity and
self and can you change and whoare we?
It gets very interesting and itkicks us into some.
What before was strictly acharacter piece becomes kind of
a film noir.
I started to sense the genre Iwas operating in kind of a film
noir and when we made the bigdecision like, ok, she's not a

(09:07):
black widow We've seen that inall these other movies what if
they're really meant for eachother?
It's kind of I thought it waskind of a great love story.
So it's like oh, then it's likea screwball comedy.

Remi (09:17):
In this new version of the story, they imagined Gary
researching the woman's file andunexpectedly finding her rather
attractive in the process.
As a result, Gary tweaks hisundercover persona to be someone
far cooler and more charismatic, inevitably leading to a sexual
relationship between him andthe woman, where Gary is stuck

(09:37):
pretending to be the characterhe had originally invented for
the initial sting.
Another factual element whichwas included in the story was
that the real Gary Johnson wasalso a psychology professor,
which allowed the film to delvedeeper into questions of
identity, performance andself-construction, on top of the
added comedy and romance.

Ashley (09:58):
So many layers here.

Remi (10:00):
This project also marked Glenn Powell's fourth
collaboration with Linklater,following Fast Food Nation in
2006, Everybody Wants Some in2016, and Apollo 10 1⁄2, A Space
Age Childhood in 2022.
I've only seen Apollo 10 1⁄2,which I do highly recommend.
It's a fun children's film.

Ashley (10:21):
Are those all movies?
I have not seen or heard of anyof them.

Remi (10:25):
Yes, they are all movies, and I have heard of Fast Food
Nation, but I have never heardof Everybody Wants Some.
Linklater makes a lot of filmsand some of them go under the
radar and some of them are bighits.
He just likes making movies.
As far as casting, the role ofGary's co-worker, jasper, was

(10:45):
written specifically for AustinEmilio, whom some of our
audience may remember forplaying Dwight in later seasons
of the Walking Dead.
I do not remember him becausethis is post-Negan Glenn episode
, which I will not spoil foranyone who, for some reason, is
making their way through theseason currently.
But yeah, I have not seen himin the Walking Dead.

(11:06):
To immerse himself in thecharacter, emilio hit Bourbon
Street in New Orleans and hungout with the sketchiest guy he
could find as research for therole.
It's pretty daring of him.
Emilio even handpicked his ownwardrobe for his character,
which was basically the exactsame outfit worn by the sketchy
guy he had met on Bourbon Street.
Glenn Powell's first scheduledmeeting with Adria Arona for the

(11:29):
role of Madison was initiallymeant to last only an hour, but
the red-hot chemistry betweenPowell and Arona was so
instantaneously electric that itended up lasting five hours
instead.
That is quite the job interview.

Ashley (11:46):
Yeah, what were they doing during that time?
Just chit-chatting.

Remi (11:48):
I guess.
So they really hit it off.
After landing the role, adriawas beyond excited for the
opportunity to work withLinklater, since School of Rock
is her all-time favorite film.

Ashley (12:00):
It's so good Every time in interviews when they tease
anything about a sequel.
It just gets me so excited andhopeful.

Remi (12:21):
Apparently, the screenwriter for the film is the
creator of April 25, 1992, asMadison Figueroa, the character
she plays in the film, which isbriefly visible on screen when
Gary is reviewing Madison's file.
Glenn Powell's parents, glennSr and Cindy Powell, regularly
make cameo appearances in manyof their son's films and

(12:42):
similarly appear briefly inHitman as background extras.
This is something that if I wasever a famous director or actor
, I would absolutely throw myparents in there in any way that
I could from time to time.

Ashley (12:55):
It's like Matthew McConaughey's Mom and Bernie.

Remi (12:58):
Exactly.
Originally, the story was goingto be set in Houston, texas,
which is where the real GaryJohnson operated, but after
comparing financial logisticsbetween the Texas tax credit,
which provides 5-20% rebates toproduction companies for
anything spent in the state,they chose instead to pivot to

(13:18):
New Orleans, since Louisiana'sMotion Picture Production Tax
Credit Program provides up to40% in tax credits on total
in-state production expenditures.
The team spent two weeks inrehearsals, which is rare
nowadays, with both Powell andArona working closely with the
film's intimacy coordinator.
For the numerous romanticscenes scenes, the actors were

(13:42):
each given an equal say in howthose moments were written and
filmed, which is something that,thankfully, has become standard
in today's modern film industry.

Ashley (13:58):
This is a side note here , but I was really surprised in
interviews about Anora, theAcademy Award winning film from
this past year, and how therewas no intimacy coordinator on
set, which is very surprisingbecause there is a lot of sexual
scenarios in that movie.

Remi (14:09):
For that film.
I am fairly sure that thedirector and his wife would
physically act out what theywanted the actors to do before
the scene Not naked and all ofthat but they would show them
the positioning and all of thatstuff and the actors would copy
it while they were filming.
And finally, on a more sombernote, the real Gary Johnson

(14:32):
passed away early in the film'sproduction in 2022, before ever
seeing the project brought tolife, and the film includes a
dedication to him just beforethe closing credits roll.

Ashley (14:43):
Did you see anything about if Glenn Powell met him?

Remi (14:47):
According to my research, Linklater never even met the
real Gary Johnson in person.
He only ever spoke to him overthe phone a handful of times
before he passed away.
So I don't think Glenn Powellever met the real Gary Johnson.
But with that, are you ready toget into the film version of
Gary Johnson?

Ashley (15:07):
Yeah, take it away, Remy .

Remi (15:17):
Our story begins with a title card stating what you're
about to see is a somewhat truestory inspired by the life of
Gary Johnson.
We then cut to mild-manneredcollege professor Gary Johnson,
played by Glenn Powell, giving alecture on the philosophy and
psychology of Frederick Niki toa class of mildly interested

(15:37):
college students at theUniversity of New Orleans.
After work, gary heads home totend to his house plants and
feed his cats, then sits down ata tiny kitchen table to eat his
modest microwave dinner allalone.
Through voiceover, gary admitsthat on the surface it may look
like he leads a pretty mundaneexistence, but he is

(15:59):
nevertheless still happy withhis simple little life.
However, gary's life isn'tquite as boring as you may
expect, since Gary alsosupplements his income by
working with the New OrleansPolice Department on various
undercover sting operations.
By his own admission, gary hadalways been skilled with
electronics.
So, after going through someinitial police training, gary

(16:22):
began assisting with theinstallation of hidden cameras
and microphones in police stings, which primarily consisted of
murder-for-hire cases.
All this changes when Garyreceives an unanticipated
promotion one day after beingasked to step in on an impending
sting and go undercoverpersonally under the guise of a
hitman, after learning that theinitial undercover officer has

(16:45):
been unexpectedly suspended fromduty.
Though Gary is understandablynervous about taking on this
sort of role, after a bit ofconvincing from Officer Phil,
played by Sanjay Rao, andOfficer Claudette, played by
Retta, gary does reluctantlyagree to the assignment, even
though internally, he is 100%positive that he is most likely

(17:07):
going to die while doing so.
Moments later, the recentlysuspended officer Jasper, played
by Austin Emilio, arrives onthe scene to hand over his
undercover equipment for theoperation.
Though Jasper admittedly findsthe idea of Gary acting in his
place to be a truly hilariousconcept, he still offers a few

(17:28):
parting words of advice bytelling Gary to relax, always be
believable and never show anyweakness.

Ashley (17:35):
Simple right.

Remi (17:36):
Yeah, piece of cake.
Despite brimming with anxiety,gary gets into character, then
heads into his first assignmentas an undercover hitman.

Gary gets into character then heads into his
first assignment as anundercover hitman ready as he'll
ever be.
And just so you know, I'massessing you too.
Are you full of shit, Some bigtalker who's not serious?

(18:09):
And if you are serious now, areyou one day going to find Jesus
and be so overburdened by guiltand remorse and confess your
sins?
Are you going to crack Underpressure?
Crack and you're going to pointa fucking finger at me?
Never.
Fuck man never Fact.
I got it, never Fact.
I got it all worked out already.

(18:29):
Okay, let's hear it.
I work a 7-7.
So starting this coming Tuesday, which is crew change day out
of Houma, every second of mywhereabouts is documented and
accounted for that way anythingbad were to happen no one could

(18:56):
think I did it right.

Ashley (18:59):
In my opinion, oil rig worker Craig looks more like a
hitman than Glen Powell does.
He's wearing like a polo shirt.
Well, he wasn't expecting tolike a hitman than Glen Powell
does.
He's wearing like a polo shirt.

Remi (19:06):
Well, he wasn't expecting to be a hitman on this operation
.
He was expecting to just be inthe van working on the sound.
But because Jasper wassuspended, he had to step in and
he was wearing a polo shirt inthe van and they didn't have new
clothing for him.
Wait, they did have pants forhim because he was originally
wearing shorts and they saidthat hitmen never wear shorts,

(19:27):
especially not to a firstmeeting.
It gives off the wrongimpression and I would agree
with that.
I wouldn't hire a guy in shorts.
Well, as you just listened to,it turns out old Gary is
surprisingly great at improv andafter being handed a paper bag
containing a $2,500 down paymentfor the job, Gary gets the
exact audio needed to prosecuteand the target is quickly

(19:49):
apprehended in the parking lotby a swarm of police officers.
Shortly after, Gary iscongratulated for a job well
done by the other officers, whonow intend on continuing to use
Gary as their undercover hitmanin future sting operations,
since Jasper will still be undersuspension for the next four
months.
Through voiceover, Gary opinesthat hitmen are simply a pop

(20:12):
culture creation and that thereare no actual hitmen who truly
exist in the world, but stillfinds the psychology of playing
a hitman to be ratherfascinating.
As a result, Gary takes hisinspiration from numerous
fictional murderers from moviesand television, while creating
his various Hitman personas touse while undercover.

(20:32):
What do you think, Ashley?
Do you think Hitman actuallyexists, or is it just something
created for movies and TV shows?

Ashley (20:40):
I think the whole idea of being able to find a contract
killer where that's theircareer is definitely a construct
.
I don't want to say it doesn'texist, but I don't think your
average Joe could just find ahitman that has done this before
.
I think that the person youwould find that would be willing
to do something like this wouldbe someone who was very

(21:01):
desperate for cash.
However, I do believe thatthere's criminal organizations
like the cartel and old schoolmobsters that do have these
hitmen on hire.
What do you think?

Remi (21:13):
I 100% agree with you and actually what you just said
works right into Gary's furtherexplanation coming up.
You see, gary, he continuesexplaining that because hitmen
do not exist, whenever someonegoes around searching for one,
the police will almost alwaysinevitably be tipped off by
someone in the process.

(21:34):
So it's exactly what you saidMost people don't know a hitman,
so they're just going aroundasking for people and sooner or
later they will probably asksomeone who is going to inform
the authorities.

Ashley (21:46):
There was actually this really interesting podcast that
I was listening to recentlycalled Kill List, and it was
about this.
It was people turning to thedark web to try to find a hitman
and this person who ran thiswebsite was taking money Bitcoin
from people to do these hitsand just never did.
And they investigated thesedifferent hits and were trying

(22:09):
to find the person who ran thiswebsite and they eventually did
and they communicated with himonline and he was just like of
course, I'm not a hitman and Idon't feel bad about taking
these people's money becausethey want someone dead.

Remi (22:22):
It is hard to sympathize with people trying to pay for
someone to be murdered on theirbehalf.
After the police are tipped off.
This is when Gary the hitman isbrought in to close the deal
and ensure there is enoughevidence to prosecute Gary's
client to the fullest extent ofthe law.
We then watch a montage of Garymeeting with several clients

(22:43):
disguised as a variety of hitmen, specifically tailored for each
client.
These include a no-nonsensestreet hustler, a
crooked-toothed pool man, atattooed video game-style
anti-hero, a Russian assassinand, of course, patrick Bateman
from American Psycho.

I like suicide.
That seems clean, doesn't it?
That's the dream.
But a left-handed persondoesn't shoot themselves with
the right hand.
A person with phobia forheights doesn't jump.
A well-tied noose requiresstudying.
Suicidal people want to leavethis world quickly.

(23:24):
They don't want to explainthemselves, neither do I.

Ashley (23:29):
I must say, I really do love a good montage scene.

Remi (23:33):
Even though they have recently announced that Austin
Butler will be playing PatrickBateman in the remake of
American Psycho.
I think that Mr Powell couldhave actually done a decent job.
He was doing a pretty goodChristian Bale Patrick Bateman
impersonation in that scene, andGary really seems to be having
a lot of fun here with this newgig.

(23:53):
Anyway, this all goes on forsome time until Jasper's
suspension has inevitably endedand he begins lobbying for a
return to his previous positionas an undercover hitman.
Unfortunately, the captainwould rather keep Gary on the
assignment, since Gary hasgarnered a much higher arrest
record than Jasper ever had.

(24:13):
It is also revealed that Jasperhad been originally suspended
after a video of him beating upsome teenagers was posted online
and went viral Because of this.
the captain would prefer to keepJasper's face hidden from the
public for the time being, sinceit could potentially jeopardize
any undercover mission Jasperis involved in.

(24:34):
For his next assignment, garybegins researching a woman named
Madison Figueroa Masters,played by Adria Arona, who has
no arrest record and isconventionally attractive by
modern-day standards.
For the ensuing sting, garymeets Madison at a small
restaurant where he has taken onthe persona of a confidently

(24:55):
charismatic and laid-back hitmannamed Ron, who seems strikingly
similar to actor Glenn Powell'sreal-life demeanor.
Initially, madison seemsvisibly nervous about explaining
her situation to an anonymouscontract killer, so asks for a
bite of Gary's pie, then getsdistracted by an adorable little
dog sitting in a nearby booth,veering the conversation into a

(25:19):
decisively more playful tone,which is also completely
off-topic.

Oh, he's cute.
More playful tone, which isalso completely off-topic,
really.
Yeah, all those stories, whatstories?
oh, it was about, like jealouscats, mother and baby that comes
up, whoa um.
Do you know someone who's lost achild to a murderous jealous
cat?
I'm just trying to do my factchecking here not like.
Not like personally, okay, butI've heard it from like a lot of
people.
Well, there you go.
We've got to get to the bottomof this.

(26:09):
I agree, detective.
Did we pull any paw prints offthe victim?
No, sir, but we're hurtingsuspects now.
No small challenge, as we know.
Utter catastrophe, ah, uttercatastrophe, oh boy.

Ashley (26:31):
This conversation really drills home the point of how
different he is portrayinghimself, obviously not only
because he's saying he's ahitman when he's not, but he is
a cat person.
He has two cats and he loveshis two cats.

Remi (26:45):
And they do have a nice little back and forth flirtation
going on there and this partwasn't in the clip that I just
played for you all but at theend of that conversation she's
actually completely forgottenwhy she's meeting with Gary.
Like she got so off topic andthinking about dogs and flirting
with this handsome, charismaticguy that it completely slipped

(27:09):
her mind that, oh yeah, I'msupposed to be paying this guy
to murder somebody.
Anyway, returning to the taskat hand, madison confides in
Gary that she is terrified ofher controlling husband, and
Gary soon realizes that Madisonis just a desperate woman
trapped in an abusiverelationship, fearing for her
life and in dire need of anescape.

(27:29):
Somehow, sympathizing withMadison and the difficult
situation she's found herself in, gary advises her to keep the
cash she had intended on givinghim as a down payment for the
hit and instead use the money toleave town and start a new life
far away from the watchful eyesof her cruel husband.
Just before parting ways, garyreassures Madison that she can

(27:52):
always call him back toreschedule if she ever
reconsiders in the future.
Always good to keep youroptions open there, I guess.
Though the police are annoyed byGary's choice of acting more
like a life coach than a hitman.
There is honestly reallynothing more that they can do
about it at this point, so thediscussion is dropped.
We then cut to the trial of theman who was Gary's first

(28:15):
official bust as a fake hitman,and Gary is directly referenced
by the defense team in court asa dishonest, manipulative,
fraudulent undercover ghoul wholacks any humanity and preys on
the weak.
Luckily, this sort of thing isjust business as usual for Gary,
who over time has gotten usedto being used as a scapegoat by

(28:37):
defense attorneys in the face ofirrefutable evidence against
their client.

Ashley (28:42):
They're just doing their job evidence against their
client.

Remi (28:48):
They're just doing their job.
This tactic rarely works,except on the few occasions when
there is somehow areconciliation between the
defendant and their loved onewhom they had tried to have
killed.
Would you forgive me if I triedto have you assassinated,
Ashley?
Would you get me off if theywere trying to prosecute me?
And it was all just a bigmisunderstanding.

Ashley (29:06):
I think it would take a very, very, very specific
situation for me to have it inmy heart to overlook that minor
fact.

Remi (29:15):
One night, while Gary is at home chilling with his cats,
he receives a text message outof the blue from Madison
inviting Ron to a puppy adoptionevent in the park that she will
be volunteering at.
Though Gary is aware thataccepting Madison's invitation
would be crossing over both anethical and professional line of
some sort, he neverthelessstill agrees to Madison's

(29:37):
proposed rendezvous At theadoption event.
Madison discovers Gary as Ron,looking casually cool while
simultaneously playing with anadorable little puppy dog.
And here's a little fun factfor all of our single friends
out there Statistically speaking, men are more likely to be
matched on dating apps if theyhave a picture of themselves

(29:58):
holding a cute puppy in one oftheir profile pics.

Ashley (30:01):
I believe it.
That's because the women wantto meet the puppy.

Remi (30:05):
While strolling through the park and catching up, gary
learns that Madison has movedinto a small place of her own
since their last meeting and isnow in the midst of a divorce.
After successfully leaving herabusive husband.
Now a free woman, madison isloving life again and wanted to
thank Ron personally forinspiring her to make the change

(30:25):
.
After the event, madison andGary head over to a bar and have
a few drinks, which only addsmore nuclear fusion to the
pair's already abundant sexualchemistry.
Soon enough, the two find theirway back to Madison's apartment
and proceed to get down anddirty till the break of dawn.

Ashley (30:44):
I mean seriously they have a lot of sex.

Remi (30:51):
Gary, Gary, Gary.
This is unacceptable.
While still lying in bedtogether the following morning,
Madison confesses that Ron isthe only other man she's ever
been with besides her husband.
Gary momentarily contemplatesthe morality of sleeping with a
woman under such false pretenses, but after the amazing evening
he just had, Gary admits that hedoes rather enjoy being Ron, so
decides to maintain the facadefor the time being, leading to

(31:14):
another quickie with Madisonbefore starting his day.

Ashley (31:17):
Because relationships built entirely on lies are
definitely successful.

Remi (31:22):
In romantic comedies they usually are, I gotta say.
From that point forward, garyleads a double life, continuing
his work as a college professorand undercover hitman by day,
while passionately making loveto Madison as Ron during the
evenings Around.
This time, madison alsopurchases herself a gun for
protection, so one afternoonGary takes her to a shooting

(31:45):
range to get a little practicein before heading out to the
club later.
Gary never really struck me asa club guy, but all right, I'll
roll with it.
That evening, outside of ClubVirgo, gary and Madison are
making out and walking homeafter a fun-filled night on the
town when they happen to runinto Madison's ex-husband, ray,
played by Evan Holtzman.

(32:06):
The situation quickly devolvesinto a hostile altercation due
to Ray's confrontationalattitude, leading Gary to pull a
gun on Ray in order to keep himin line.
To soothe their nervesafterwards, the couple stops for
some delicious ice cream ontheir way home, which only
further complicates matters forGary after being spotted by

(32:27):
Jasper at the same location.
While buying his own frozentreat from inside, jasper
introduces himself to Madisonand swears that he recognizes
her from somewhere, but takeshis leave before blowing Gary's
cover.
Sometime later, gary is calledin for a last-minute undercover
operation at a breakfast buffetwhere he is given no time for
research and little to noinformation on his client's

(32:50):
identity.
As it turns out, gary's clientthat day is none other than
Madison's ex-husband, ray, butGary sneakily avoids being seen
during their encounter bysitting directly in the booth
behind Ray to have theirconversation anonymously.
We also saw something similarto this in the film Masterminds.

Ashley (33:09):
That is some quick thinking on his part.

Remi (33:12):
He's good on his toes.
Ray then reveals that he wantsto have Madison killed after
seeing her with another man theother night.
And Gary soon realizes thatMadison and Ray have yet to
finalize their divorce.
And Gary soon realizes thatMadison and Ray have yet to
finalize their divorce.
Additionally, ray is alsowilling to pay extra to have
Madison's mystery man taken outin the process, which triggers

(33:35):
Gary into turning around andrevealing his face to Ray,
causing Ray to flee from therestaurant, overcome with fear
and disbelief at such anastounding coincidence.

Ashley (33:41):
He let his emotions get the best of him there.

Remi (33:44):
He certainly did.
And the few times Gary lets hisemotions get the best of him
there?
He certainly did.
And the few times Gary lets hisemotions get the best of him,
it really comes back to bite himin the ass.
After the unsuccessful sting,gary goes directly to Madison's
to warn her about what had justoccurred with Ray, but Madison
doesn't seem to take the threatvery seriously, seeing how she's
banging the hitman Ray tried tohire.
Days later, during a briefingwith the police chief down at

(34:07):
the station, gary learns thatRay was found dead in an alley
with a single gunshot wound tothe head from a suspected drug
deal gone wrong.
Much to Gary's dismay, however,as soon as he hears what kind
of gun was used in the shooting,he instantly knows exactly who
the true perpetrator really was.

Ashley (34:27):
Madison.

Remi (34:28):
Bingo.
The police are also aware thatMadison had a confrontation with
Ray outside of a nightclubrecently, where she was with a
man who threatened Ray with afirearm, but they have yet to
identify that specificindividual.
Jasper is tasked with searchingthe exterior of the night club
where the altercation took placeand takes Gary along to assist

(34:50):
in the investigation.
When they arrive, Jasperreveals that he has figured out
who Madison is and that Gary hadbeen the mystery man
accompanying her on the night inquestion.
Jasper is also aware that Raywas the last minute client Gary
had met with during theunsuccessful sting operation,
but assures Gary that he stillplans on keeping this
information all to himself forthe time being.

(35:12):
After parting ways, Gary goesdirectly to Madison's house to
confront her about Ray's murder,which she initially denies
before eventually confessing.

You killed him.
Yeah.
Why would you do that?
You told me yourself he wasgoing to come and kill me.
So he was attacking you.
It was like self-defense,technically, technically, what.
What was he doing?
He was either passed out orasleep and you killed him.

(35:49):
Yeah, I made a story andthey're believing it.
Oh my God.
Oh my God, oh my God.
Why are you getting so worked upabout this?
You do this shit all the time.
I don't do this all the time.
I've never done this.
I've never killed anyone.
What are you talking about?

(36:10):
I'm a fake hitman.
That's why I didn't put youaway.
I didn't have you arrestedbecause I was working undercover
.
You're a cop, no I.
I teach at a college.
This hitman thing's just like apart-time gig, just gotten out

(36:32):
of hand.
So you've been lying to me thiswhole time.
I was stuck.
I didn't want to lose you andyou met Ron first and you liked
Ron, I liked Ron, so I didn'twant to show you Gary.
Who the fuck is Gary.

Ashley (36:54):
Wait, so question.
In that clip he said he teachesat a college college and the
hitman is a part-time gig.
So what's his full-time job?

Remi (37:02):
Teaching at the college.

Ashley (37:04):
Interesting Okay.

Remi (37:06):
As Madison takes in this shocking revelation, Gary is
suddenly called back to thepolice station to discuss a new
development in Madison's case.
As soon as he arrives, thepolice chief updates Gary on
their latest discovery that Rayhad increased his life insurance
policy by a million dollarsjust six months ago, with
Madison listed as the solebeneficiary, making her the

(37:29):
number one suspect in Ray'smurder.

Ashley (37:31):
Things are not looking good for Madison.

Remi (37:34):
That is a pretty big red flag, I must say.

Ashley (37:37):
It would cast doubt on her claim that she wanted him
killed because he was abusive.

Remi (37:44):
In order to garner a confession, Jasper suggests that
Gary go undercover as Ron again, since he had left such a
positive impression on Madisonduring their first encounter.
Under the guise of a randomcheck-in, Gary agrees to wear a
wire and go undercover as Ron,despite Madison now being fully
aware of Gary's true identity.

(38:05):
Once at Madison's, Gary staysin character while covertly
showing her text messages on hiscell phone, cluing her in on

(38:32):
the actual situation at hand melook I know you did it.

It's fucking obvious and I don't blame I
didn't kill him.
Wait, who's who's accusing me ofthis?
This is bullshit and you, outof all people, should know that
I was incapable of this okay,then, who did what the hell?
Happened.
I just know what they've toldme, which is what he got shot
buying drug guy was an addict.
Okay, so you say you didn'tkill him.

(38:56):
Guy was an addict.
Okay, so you say you didn'tkill him.
When was the last time you sawhim?
Not that long ago at Virgo's.
The club.
Yes, the club.
I was walking out of Virgo'swith this guy that I met on the
dance floor and boom, I run intoRay.
Ray loses his shit when he seesme with this other guy, starts

(39:17):
running his mouth, gets allthreatening fucking, grabs me.
And then this other guy, tryingto protect me, he pulls out a
gun out of nowhere and sticks itin Ray's face.
Ray freaks out, he leaves.
I run away.
And that was the last time Isaw him.

Ashley (39:27):
For those of you listening at home while they're
having this conversation, he isshowing her notes.
He wrote on his iPhone app toalert her and steer the
conversation in the way he wantsit to go.

Remi (39:41):
And, just for reference, Gary's messages that he was
showing Madison stated Policeare listening.
Follow my lead.
We're on the same team.
I'm still Ron.
We're not dating.
You're innocent.
Deny, deny, deny.
They know about the gun outside.

Ashley (39:58):
Virgo's Can't be me and I must say she is thinking real
fast on her feet and giving realconvincing lies here.

Remi (40:11):
They both missed out on a pretty brilliant career in
improv, I must say.
Madison follows Gary's lead bybasically claiming ignorance
across the board, which seems towork out well for them, since
the police believe their storyand no longer consider Madison
or the man outside of thenightclub to be a viable suspect
.
That evening Gary returns toMadison's only to find Jasper

(40:34):
already there nursing a beer,eagerly awaiting an anticipation
of his arrival.
Jasper tells Gary that hecurrently has enough evidence to
put Madison away for life andcharged Gary as an accomplice to
murder, but is willing to keepquiet for a majority percentage
of Ray's insurance money.
Out of nowhere.

(40:55):
Jasper then staggers to theground and passes out
mid-sentence from anoverabundance of drugs.
Madison had slipped into hisdrink while he wasn't looking.
They also didn't show this inthe film.
It was kind of like what thefuck just happened.
He just passed out whileexplaining what he wanted them
to do for the blackmail.

Ashley (41:13):
Madison is turning into quite the little serial killer.

Remi (41:16):
Fearing that the situation may be hopeless now if Jasper
ever regains consciousness.
Madison starts freaking thefuck out, while Gary casually
grabs a plastic bag from underthe sink then ties it around
Jasper's head in an act ofunwavering commitment to a life
with Madison.
Isn't that romantic?
They can't break up now.
They're both accomplices tomurder.

(41:38):
Luckily, jasper had always hada reputation around town for
being a dirty cop and, with thecacophony of drugs currently
swirling around his system, itshould be relatively easy for
Gary to transport Jasper's bodyto a remote location and make it
look like a suicide.
Gary and Madison then share aromantic kiss just as Jasper

(42:00):
breathes his final breath.
We then cut to years later,where we see that Gary is still
teaching but seems far moreconfident and self-assured than
ever before.
After class, we see that Garyand Madison now share a home
together, along with two newdogs and two small children.
During dinner, their youngerdaughter asks her mommy and

(42:22):
daddy the story of how theyfirst met, leading to the couple
staring at each other awkwardlyfor several moments, not
knowing how to respond.
The film ends with the titlecard dedicated to Gary Johnson
1947 to 2022, followed byseveral photographs of the real
Gary in character as his varioushitman personas, and that was

(42:43):
Richard Linklater's Hitman.
Any initial thoughts, ashley?

Ashley (42:48):
I am just so surprised of how little of this movie I
remembered I must have beenpaying negative attention while
we watched this, and I know youwere watching it closely, so I
don't know what I was doing.

Remi (43:01):
I enjoy Richard Linklater's films almost all of
them so it was fun to addanother one to the list after
Bernie.
Compared to Bernie, which onewould you say is better?
From your memory, I know youdon't remember much about Hitman
, but from what you can remember, which one would you recommend
of the two?

Ashley (43:19):
It would take a hell of a movie to beat Bernie.
In my eyes, glenn Powell to meis no Jack Black.

Remi (43:27):
Very much agree with that.
I would actually not haveminded seeing a younger Jack
Black try and tackle this sortof role, but it would have been
a very, very different film.

Ashley (43:43):
On rewatch.
Did this movie make you likeGlenn Powell a little bit more?
Because I know we've hadconversations where you've
brought up different actors whoHollywood is just shoving down
our throats.
Austin Butler is one of them,and you had put Glenn Powell in
that category at one point.

Remi (43:55):
And I'm going to take him out of that category.
Actually, he co-wrote thismovie, in my eyes to be almost
an acting reel, because he playsso many different random
characters as hitmen.
I think he's using this as away to show Hollywood.
Hey, I can do more than justkind of this generically
handsome guy roles and Iactually would like to see him

(44:18):
branch out and do some otherstuff.
And they always say inHollywood that if they're not
really giving you theopportunities that you want,
make your own.
And he did that with his friendRichard Linklater and this
movie.

Ashley (44:31):
I bet we're going to see more collaborations between him
and Linklater.

Remi (44:35):
Now let's get into the release of this film.
Hitman had its world premiereat the 80th Venice International
Film Festival on September 5th2023, followed by its North
American premiere at the 2023Toronto International Film
Festival, or TIFF, on September11th, where Netflix acquired the

(44:55):
film's distribution rights fora costly $20 million making it
both the largest film deal ofthe festival and of 2023 overall
.

Ashley (45:06):
That is impressive, and I do want to add if you're
interested in watching thismovie, it is, of course, on
Netflix.

Remi (45:12):
Hitman was later released in select theaters in the US on
May 24th 2024, before streamingon Netflix beginning on June 7
of that same year.
I always think it's weird whenNetflix movies get a theatrical
release for some reason.
I know some of our friends havegone to them, but I don't know
man.
I never can imagine going to atheater to see a Netflix film.

Ashley (45:33):
And isn't that just because they have to release it
in theaters if they want it tobe eligible for any sort of
awards?
Because I know there wereseveral movies that came out on
Amazon, and maybe Netflix too,where they were in theaters for
like a week, but in like five orsix theaters and that's it.

Remi (45:51):
That was what all of the streaming movies were doing.
They were basically releasingit in a handful of theaters
mainly LA and maybe New York formaybe a week or two and then
just dumping them on streaming,purely so that the film could be
considered for awards.
So I think the people runningthe awards show got kind of wise

(46:12):
to it and are starting to belike you know, let's just let
them in.
Why force them to put this filmin a theater for like one week
and make $500?
The film currently has a 95%approval rating on Rotten
Tomatoes, with a criticalconsensus that reads a
deceptively dark thriller that'salso loaded with laughs.

(46:33):
Hitman is an outstandingshowcase for leading man Glenn
Powell and one of the mostpurely entertaining films of
Richard Linklater's career.

Ashley (46:42):
That is a crazy high percentage.
It's kind of a feel-good movie.

Remi (46:48):
It's a fun movie.
You don't really take it tooseriously.
There's not a lot of super darkthings that happen, and even
the dark stuff that's happenedit's kind of glossed over pretty
quickly.
So I can understand why criticsand audiences really enjoyed
this film and why it was soldfor $20 million.
This seems like something whereyou could really market this to
a really wide audience, becauseit's harmless really.

(47:12):
Glenn Powell went on to benominated for Best Actor in a
Motion Picture, musical orComedy at the 2025 Golden Globe
Awards, and the film itself wasnominated for Best Comedy at the
Critics' Choice Awards.
Additionally, richard Linklaterand Glenn Powell were both
nominated for Best AdaptedScreenplay at the Writers Guild
of America Awards, butultimately lost out to Rommel

(47:35):
Ross and Jocelyn Barnes fortheir adaptation of the book
Nickel Boys by Colson Whitehead.

Ashley (47:41):
Very different movie.

Remi (47:43):
That's why I threw it in there, just to show how big of a
difference the film that wonwas compared to this one.
But that was RichardLinklater's Hitman, a fun,
entertaining romantic comedy ofwhich I know none of the true
story.
But that is about to change.
Ashley, are you ready to takeit away?

Ashley (48:04):
Yes, the moment you have been waiting for since you saw
this movie for the first timeRemy has finally arrived.
Gary Johnson was born in 1947.
Since there was virtually noinformation about his childhood,

(48:25):
I assume it was rather ordinary.
What I do know is he was raisedon a farm in rural Louisiana.
His dad was a carpenter and hismom a housewife.
After he graduated high schoolin a class of 12, he spent a
year in Vietnam working as amilitary policeman overseeing
convoys.

Remi (48:44):
Class of 12?
.
How big was this school?

Ashley (48:47):
It was a very small town in Louisiana.
I'll say After that he returnedto Louisiana, working as a
sheriff's deputy and transferredto the Port Arthur Police
Department in the mid-70s.
While there, he did someundercover work on drug busts.
Despite his law enforcementbackground, johnson never wanted
to make it a lifelong career.

(49:08):
What he really wanted to do wasbe a psychology professor,
since he was fascinated by humanbehavior from an academic
perspective.
While still employed in thepolice force, he took night
classes at McNeese StateUniversity and earned a master's
degree in psychology.
He moved to Houston in 1981with hopes of enrolling in

(49:29):
University of Houston's doctoralpsychology program.
When he sadly wasn't accepted,he took a job as an investigator
at the Harris County DistrictAttorney's Office.
His primary role involvedgathering evidence and finding
witnesses to testify for theprosecution.
Except for one instance, whenhe was shot in the leg and foot,

(49:49):
causing him to miss a week fromwork, his career was pretty
uneventful until an opportunitythat would shape the next 30
years of his career fell in hislap in 1989.
One day, 37-year-old labtechnician Kathy Scott contacted
a bail bondsman she knew fromhigh school.
She told him all about thecollapse of her four-month

(50:10):
marriage and her estrangedhusband's assets.
She thought she deserved a$50,000 life insurance policy.
She thought she deserved A$50,000 life insurance policy,
$47,000 in retirement benefitsand two real estate investments
worth $175,000.
If her husband died, all of itwould be hers.
She just needed someone to dothe dirty work for her.

(50:35):
Unfortunately for Scott, thebail bondsman called the police,
who contacted the SpecialCrimes Division of the District
Attorney's Office to see if theyhad anyone on staff who
specialized in murder-for-hirecases.
They thought Gary Johnson justmight be the man for the job.
He was given full liberty tocraft his persona and came up
with the name Mike Kane, a bikerwho dressed in faded jeans and
old t-shirts adorned with asilver skull chain necklace.

(50:57):
With the help of the bailbondsman, he arranged a meeting
with Scott at a Houston bowlingalley where she played on a
company team.
Johnson realized he could dropthe tough guy act while talking
to her in the car.
During their conversation, shegave him a picture of her
husband, talked about how hemistreated her and described how
it would be perfect for him todie while driving through a

(51:19):
shady neighborhood on his wayhome from work.

Remi (51:22):
I just want to say that I do find it funny that it seems
like whenever people are hiringhitmen, they already have a
bunch of ideas of how they wouldlike it to happen, but they're
ready to pitch.

Ashley (51:33):
Yeah, just leave it up to the professionals.
When Johnson told her about hisfee of $2,500 with a 50% down
payment, she told him she onlyhad $100 on her but would put
the rest in the yellow pages ina public phone booth.

Remi (51:48):
His total fee was $2,500?
.

Ashley (51:51):
Yes, because this was in 1989.

Remi (51:53):
Which is about $6,500 today when adjusted for
inflation, which is still prettyreasonable, I must say.

Ashley (52:02):
Johnson gave her an out, but she confirmed that she
wanted her husband dead and wasarrested moments later.
At her trial, her lawyer triedto argue that Scott didn't
really want her husband murderedand just got caught up in the
excitement of it all as theundercover officer encouraged
her to go through with the plan.
This strategy was unsuccessfuland she was sentenced to 80

(52:23):
years in prison.

Remi (52:25):
Wow, the judge threw the book at that lady.
That's quite the sentence.

Ashley (52:31):
This is one of the heftiest sentences that his
targets received, for sure.

Remi (52:36):
There are people who actually committed murder who
have gotten lighter sentencesthan that.

Ashley (52:41):
One of Johnson's next cases involved 31-year-old oil
rig worker Robert Holliday.
He told a topless dancerthinking she might have
connections to some shady folksthat he wanted full custody of
his children and the only wayfor that to happen was to have
his ex-wife, who left him foranother man, killed.
Just like the bail bondsman,the woman called the cops.

(53:03):
Johnson dusted off his MikeKing costume and met Holiday at
a motel room where he was givena photograph of the ex-wife and
a hand-drawn map to her house.
Turns out this wasn't Holiday'sfirst attempt to get custody of
the kids.
Just a few weeks earlier hesuccessfully got her committed
to a psychiatric unit by sayingshe was suicidal.

(53:23):
But she was quickly releasedonce doctors realized nothing
was wrong with her.
I don't know how he did this.
He just said she was suicidaland that was enough to commit
her.
I guess in 1989, that would nothappen.
Today it takes a lot to getsomeone involuntarily committed,
but back in the day I guess itwasn't as challenging.
After she was released, holidaylanded on a new plan.

(53:46):
If the hitman could slit herwrist to make her death look
like a suicide, holiday wouldnot only get custody of his kids
and his ex-wife's $10,000 lifeinsurance policy.
But then he could also sue thedoctors for malpractice for
failing to treat her.

Remi (54:02):
I thought life insurance policies didn't pay on suicides.

Ashley (54:07):
That's a good point.
That's what you usually hear,but I'm not really sure what the
ins and outs of it all are.

Remi (54:12):
Yeah, we haven't filled out our life insurance policies
just yet.

Ashley (54:16):
I have a life insurance policy through my work.

Remi (54:18):
I should probably get one because I'm older than you.

Ashley (54:22):
The catch was that Holiday needed the job done
within the week, since he wasabout to start an offshore oil
rig job, which would be theperfect alibi.

Remi (54:31):
So this was his first client in the film.

Ashley (54:34):
Yes, this is Craig in the movie.
Once Johnson asked for a $100down payment on his $2,500 fee,
police busted through the doorsto make their arrest $100 down
payment.
I'm assuming he said thatbecause that's what Scott gave
him on the last one.

Remi (54:53):
In the film he said he could accept basically anything
as a form of down payment and itwould still hold up in court,
like if someone offered a car ora boat or something like that
still counts.
So I guess the amount of moneythat exchanges hands is really
irrelevant.

Ashley (55:10):
Poor Holiday immediately asked Mike Kane what he should
do as he didn't realize his newfriend was involved in the sting
.
I tried to find out what thisguy was sentenced to, but I
could not find it.

Remi (55:23):
Unfortunately, there wasn't a lot of research you
could do for this one.

Ashley (55:28):
Yeah, I should point out that pretty much all the
information out there about GaryJohnson is from that 2001 Skip
Hollinsworth article in TexasMonthly.
There was another infamoussting that put Johnson in high
demand, not only in Houston butsurrounding areas as well.
This one did not involveJohnson Remy.

(55:51):
It is a case we have covered.
Can you think of anothercontract murder for hire plot
that we went over not too longago that took place in Texas?

Remi (56:01):
Does this have anything to do with an alleged Texas
cheerleader murdering mom?

Ashley (56:06):
It sure does.

Remi (56:08):
Our episode with by far the longest title.

Ashley (56:12):
After the prosecution's case against the pom-pom mom
almost fell apart in 1991because the undercover hitman
didn't get her on tapeexplicitly asking for Verna
Heath to be killed, more policedepartments started requesting
Johnson's services, since wordgot out that he knew how to get
his targets talking.

Remi (56:31):
You need to have them saying something pretty direct
if you're going to prosecute.
From my understanding, likethey basically need to say I am
paying you to kill so-and-so.

Ashley (56:41):
Yes, and that's because simply saying you want someone
killed isn't a crime, but theact of putting a plan into
motion is, and so that's theevidence that Gary Johnson was
supposed to get from his targets.
That leads us to one of hisnext cases, 32-year-old
Catherine Beazle, who startedlooking for a hitman after being

(57:01):
rejected by her married lover.
During their first meeting,beazle said she didn't want the
man killed anymore, but shewondered if Johnson could maybe
trash his office or break hislegs, knowing it wouldn't look
good in court if Johnson pushedher.
He suggested she give him acall if she changed her mind,
since simple assault andvandalism were below his pay

(57:22):
grade.
Sure enough, she reached out afew weeks later saying her
married lover deserved to bepunished for not leaving his
wife.
She was convicted, but was onlygiven a 10-year suspended
sentence.
And a suspended sentence issentence and a suspended
sentence is she's basically onprobation for, I think, that
amount of time and if sheviolates probation then it's

(57:43):
immediately revoked and she hasto serve the rest of her time in
prison.

Remi (57:46):
Wow, that is an astonishingly better sentence
than that person who got 80years.

Ashley (57:52):
Johnson was suddenly Houston's rising undercover star
.

Remi (57:56):
Is that a good thing or a bad thing?
I feel like that could blowyour cover.

Ashley (58:01):
From his first case in 1989 to the time Skip
Hollinsworth published theHitman article in Texas Monthly
in October 2001,.
He was involved in some 300murder-for-hire investigations,
most of which ended up beingunfounded.
Think someone at a bar sayingthey wanted another person
killed but didn't intend toactually do anything.

(58:22):
But the police would stillinvestigate it when they got the
tip.
However, about 60 people didtry to hire him, not knowing he
was actually an investigator forthe Harris County DA's office
who was working with the police.
His clients included scornedlovers, former spouses, company
partners, broke businessmen,teenagers mad at their parents,

(58:46):
employees wanting to kill theirbosses, bosses wanting to kill
their employees and inmatesclaiming they were unfairly
arrested and just needed to havea witness executed to gain
their freedom.

Remi (58:57):
Many of these people were shown in the montage in the film
.

Ashley (59:01):
Most of the people who tried to hire him didn't have
criminal histories.
They were desperate, searchingfor a quick fix and didn't think
they had any other option.
So how did people come to crosspaths with Gary Johnson?
Well, it went like this After aTexas police department
received a tip about someonesearching for a professional
hitman, they contacted theHarris County DA's office to see

(59:25):
if it was something he couldhandle.
Once assigned a case, johnsonwas given information about the
target and tasked withdeveloping the perfect service
he thought would be mostattractive to the client.
With a fake residentialburglary being his go-to.
He devised his alter ego, oftengoing by the names Mike Kane,
jody Eagle or Chris Buck.

Remi (59:46):
Great names.

Ashley (59:48):
He also developed backstories for his characters,
sometimes saying he worked forthe mob or was a retired
marksman for the armed serviceswho never lost his taste for
adventure.
He even developed subtleaccents and vocal changes.

Remi (01:00:01):
Gary's having fun with it.

Ashley (01:00:03):
Next, the initial informant introduced Johnson to
the person looking for acontract killer.
Johnson wore a wire duringthese meetings, since he needed
to get the person on tape sayingwhat they wanted and agreeing
to pay.
Whenever someone asked Johnsonif he was sure he could handle
the job, he assured them hewould study his target and make
his move when the time was right.
Johnson got better and betterwith each passing case.

(01:00:26):
In law enforcement circles hebecame known as the best
undercover hitman because of hisacting skills.
He could play the role of asleek, skilled assassin who
wouldn't take a job for lessthan six figures, or someone
willing to do the kill forwhatever he could get.

Remi (01:00:43):
Do you know if he took any acting classes or improv
classes or anything like that,or was he just getting better
through practice?

Ashley (01:00:52):
I don't think he took any sort of acting.
I think his interest inpsychology is what helped him
here.
He really got into the minds ofthe people he was targeting and
really tried to think aboutwhat would best suit their needs
and wants.
And no matter the role, henever seemed to get flustered or
say the wrong thing.
As the years passed, referralskept coming, even after the

(01:01:15):
Houston Chronicle startedregularly running stories about
him, complete with his name andan occasional quote.
In the mid-90s, for example,there was a bookkeeper who
plotted to blow up the house ofa former employer and offer
Johnson a luxury boat as a downpayment.

Remi (01:01:31):
This was in the film.

Ashley (01:01:33):
And a chemical plant worker who wanted to kill his
ex-wife's new husband because hethought the man was mistreating
his daughter.
There was at least one casewhen his cover was blown, but
not because of anything Johnsondid.
Rather, an informant startedfeeling guilty about giving his
friend up and told the man whoJohnson really was.
Furious Johnson paid the targeta visit and said he better not

(01:01:56):
go looking for another contractkiller, leaving the man to
question if Johnson really wascapable of murder.
Now that we know how Johnsonpulled off being a fake hitman
for decades, do you want to hearabout some of his high profile
and most interesting cases?
Yes, I would.
First up is 61-year-old PatsyHaggard.
She hated her husband of 18years so much that she once

(01:02:19):
tried to burn down their kitchenjust to irritate him.

Remi (01:02:23):
That's a bit excessive.

Ashley (01:02:24):
Yeah, what an inconvenience it would be to you
as well.
In 1996, she asked a youngwoman in her neighborhood who
had a few run-ins with the lawover drugs if she knew a hitman.
Johnson met with Haggardseveral times in the parking lot
of a barbecue restaurant, whichis funny because that's also
where Wanda Holloway, thepom-pom mom, also met with her

(01:02:48):
brother-in-law.
When trying to kill herex-husband, haggard searched him
for a wire each time butsomehow never found it.
After a few meetings she becameso infatuated with him that she
propositioned him for sex onthe hood of her car.
Always the gentleman.
Johnson politely declined butagreed to shoot her husband in

(01:03:11):
exchange for a $300 down payment.
She was arrested and sentencedto 12 years in prison.
That same year William Peoples,a well-respected 11-year veteran
of the Houston PoliceDepartment, decided he wanted to
kill his wife because he waspaying too much money in child
support.
He asked a cop, buddy, whocoincidentally also wanted to

(01:03:31):
kill his ex-wife, to help himfind a hitman.
Together they hired a felon onparole to do the job, but he got
cold feet and started searchingfor a subcontractor, which led
him to Johnson.
And this case is especiallyimpressive because Peoples
worked for the Houston PoliceDepartment, the same police

(01:03:51):
department that routinely usedJohnson for these
murder-for-hire investigationsuse Johnson for these
murder-for-hire investigations.
In the end, peoples wassentenced to 10 years in prison
for solicitation of capitalmurder.

Remi (01:04:04):
The second cop was never convicted 10 years seems to be
the standard here.
That 80-year one is stillblowing my mind.

Ashley (01:04:12):
Well, this one will also blow your mind.
I think this one is thecraziest case of them all.
Next up is 31-year-old BobbyWigley, a drugstore employee
obsessed with becoming a privatedetective, who traveled the
world solving crimes.
Like Carmen Sandiego policy andfreedom to start his new career,

(01:04:40):
he wanted Johnson to cut thebrake line of his 28 year old
wife's car so she would die in afiery crash with their nine
month old baby inside.
After the first meeting withJohnson to which he brought his
infant to, I might add he pawnedhis gun for $250 and was
arrested as soon as he handedover the down payment.
Johnson even asked him why doyou want to kill your baby?

(01:05:05):
And Wigley said he couldn't bea traveling private investigator
with a kid.
Justice was served with thisone when he was sentenced to
life without the possibility ofparole in 2003.

Remi (01:05:19):
This one is a bit more rightfully so.
This guy was pretty heartlesswith what he was attempting to
do.

Ashley (01:05:26):
Johnson's most famous case involved 38-year-old Lynn
Kilroy, the wife of Billy Kilroy, who was the sole heir to a
vast oil fortune.
Although the couple had onlybeen married for 13 months, lynn
resented how much time andeffort she spent caring for her
husband, who had cerebral palsy.
During an evening walk with aneighbor in 2000, she began

(01:05:51):
talking about how much shedisliked Billy and thought she
had about covering his floorwith baby oil so he would slip
and crack his head open whilecoming out of the shower.
She didn't view divorce as anoption since she claimed she was
worried Billy would use hisfamily's influence to gain
custody of their six-month-olddaughter.
Also, if she divorced him, shewouldn't have any access to his

(01:06:13):
family's wealth if the marriageended.
Worried that Lynn would soonkill Billy, the neighbor
contacted his mother, who hiredDerek Hartsfield, an actual
police officer, to spy on her.
Derek took his job perhaps tooseriously and started having an
affair with Lynn.
After just two days of knowinghim, she asked if he knew a

(01:06:35):
hitman.
Two days after that, lynn metJohnson in a hotel room and gave
him $200,000 worth of jewelryas a down payment.
The plan was for him to killBilly later in the week while
she and Derek were on vacationin Brazil, she was arrested for
a solicitation of capital murderthe next day.
At her trial, the defense arguedshe never intended to hire

(01:06:58):
someone to kill her husband andwas instead enticed into it by
Johnson.
Her lawyer painted her as anemotionally distraught woman
whose fear of losing her childprevented her from thinking
straight.
She ended up pleading nocontest and was sentenced to
five years of probation.
This legal strategy was oneoften employed by attorneys

(01:07:18):
representing Johnson's targets.
In almost every case, it wasargued, the defendants were just
blowing off steam and neverwould have followed through with
the murder plots if aprofessional hitman hadn't shown
up.
Some tried to claim Johnsonmanipulated them through
intimidation, leaving them noopportunity to back out for fear
of retribution.

(01:07:39):
This strategy always failed,since the confessions were taped
, allowing the jurors to hearhow Johnson gave the defendants
the opportunity to reconsider byrepeatedly offering them the
chance to leave.
While there were some casesthat resulted in hefty prison
sentences, many more weresentenced to probation.
Like 17-year-old Sean Quinn, hegave Johnson seven Atari

(01:08:04):
computer games.
Do you know what those are?

Remi (01:08:07):
It's an old video game system, pre-Nintendo, so long
before your time.

Ashley (01:08:11):
In addition to those games, he also gave Johnson
$5.30 to kill a classmate whowas courting the same girl he
liked.
He was sentenced to 10 years ofprobation.
In other cases, probation wasgranted when victims testified
in court that they forgave thedefendants.
For example, the entire familyof a young woman who hired

(01:08:33):
Johnson to kill her brotherbecause he got a bigger
inheritance successfully pleadedfor a lenient sentence.
Before we wrap things up aboutJohnson's careers and undercover
hitman, I have two more cases Iwant to discuss, both involving
scenarios when he deviated fromhis typical routine.
The first involves a60-year-old used car salesman

(01:08:56):
who was not happy that his wifegot half of their property
assets in their divorcesettlement.
He confided in a neighbor whowent looking for a hitman and
came across Johnson, Realizingthe danger.
The woman was in Johnson andthe Harris County Police
Department visited her at thebeauty shop she owned and told
her about the $20,000 contracton her life.

(01:09:17):
They persuaded her to stage herdeath by posing for photographs
where she appeared dead on atarp.
They even poured ketchup overthe back of her head and bound
her hands and feet with ducttape to make it look more real.
The man tried to back out ofpaying, but was soon arrested
after an altercation with theneighbor tasked with
orchestrating the hit.

(01:09:37):
The last case I'm going to talkabout involves a woman who
asked a Starbucks barista if sheknew anyone who could kill her
cruel boyfriend.

Remi (01:09:48):
Wow, that's really just putting it out there.
I mean grabbing your latte and,by the way, do you know any
contract killers?

Ashley (01:09:56):
And this is, of course, Madison.
As usual, Johnson did hisresearch before contacting the
woman.
He discovered she wasfrequently abused by her
boyfriend and too afraid toleave him for fear of what he
would do to her if he found hergoing through with the sting

(01:10:19):
operation.
He decided to help her bycontacting social service
agencies and a therapist, whomade sure she received the
resources she needed to leaveher boyfriend safely.

Remi (01:10:24):
So they never met.

Ashley (01:10:26):
I don't think so.
I think he arranged socialservices and psychology
professionals to contact herwith the help of the police
department.
They could have met once, butit didn't sound like they did in
the article.
When Johnson wasn't out onsting operations he spent his

(01:10:49):
days in a little room at theHarris County DA's office that
was filled with audio and videoequipment used to duplicate and
enhance tapes the prosecutionused at trials.
He was married and divorcedthree times but remained close
with his second wife, whodescribed him as friendly but a
bit of a loner.

Remi (01:11:02):
She is.
In the film there is a verybrief scene where he has lunch
with one of his ex-wives, who hehas stayed in contact with and
is still friendly with.

Ashley (01:11:13):
During the interview with Skip Hollinsworth he
admitted that he had trustissues and didn't let people get
too close to him.
An interpersonal style herecognized came from his career.

Remi (01:11:24):
He had stopped doing the undercover operations by the
time the article came out right.

Ashley (01:11:29):
I'm not sure.
I couldn't find anything aboutany cases after that, but he was
a really private person so hemight have kept doing it.
It's unclear.
Whenever anyone asked what hedid for a living, he always said
he worked for human resourcesat a company in downtown Houston
In 2001, he lived alone withtwo cats named Id and Ego, which

(01:11:52):
are the names of the real catsin the film.
It's written on their foodbowls.
I saw a picture of it.

Remi (01:11:57):
I did not notice that Good catch.

Ashley (01:11:59):
And these terms were developed by the founder of
psychoanalysis, sigmund Freud,and used to represent his view
of the adult personalitystructure.
Johnson also kept goldfish in asmall backyard pond and enjoyed
gardening, reading, meditationand opera.
At night, he occasionally wentto a sports bar and taught human

(01:12:20):
sexuality and generalpsychology classes two nights a
week at Lone Star College'sKingwood campus.
I actually easily found GaryJohnson on RateMyProfessorcom.
There were 28 reviews, with thelast being published in
December 2020.
They were overwhelminglypositive, with many students

(01:12:41):
saying he was nice, caring,funny, helpful, interesting,
engaging and approachable.
It was clear he was loved bystudents and colleagues alike.
He died in December 2022, justbefore filming for the movie
began, at the age of 75.
The cause of death was notreported, and that is the true

(01:13:02):
story of Richard Linklater'sHitman Remy.
I'm curious what your thoughtsare about Gary Johnson as a
person and about his career.

Remi (01:13:18):
Gary Johnson as a person and about his career.
He honestly seems like a prettynormal guy who found himself in
a unusually interesting career,which also became an outlet for
him to delve into psychology,which was something that was
interesting to him, and he seemslike he was a good dude who led
a pretty normal life besidesthis extra thing he did at work.

Ashley (01:13:38):
One thing that stuck out to me that I wish was explored
more in either the movie or inthe Texas Monthly article is the
psychological impact that thiscareer had on him.
Really, all that was said isthat he does have trust issues,

(01:14:00):
which makes total sense to me.
His whole job is to meet withpeople who are planning to kill
individuals that at one point intime were close to them.

Remi (01:14:04):
The scene in the film which, again, I don't talk about
in my description, because itreally has nothing to do with.
the plot is the one where hemeets with his ex-wife and they
talk about relationships and hetalks about how he has become
jaded after seeing all of thesepeople who were once in love now
planning to have that personmurdered.

(01:14:25):
And it, of course, would affectyou.
You're seeing people that aretrying to have someone that they
used to want to have an entirelife with, trying to end that,
that they used to want to havean entire life with, trying to
end that other person's life.
I would imagine it woulddefinitely complicate your
feelings on relationships ingeneral.
Another thought I had was how doyou feel ethically about what

(01:14:45):
Gary was doing Ashley?
Do you think this sort of thingwas entrapment?
Do you think this sort of thingis justifiable going undercover
under all these identities andgetting information on tape
about all of these potentialcrimes that haven't technically
even happened yet?
I mean the argument could bemade that because hitmen don't
really exist, many of thesepeople would not ever be able to

(01:15:08):
find one and this conversationof exchanging money for the job
would never have even occurred.
How do you feel about that?

Ashley (01:15:16):
It is tough because these people probably would have
had difficulty finding someone,but it doesn't mean they
wouldn't be able to locatesomeone who is very desperate
and strapped for cash, or thatthey would take drastic matters
into their own hands.
I think what Johnson did, orthe Harris County District
Attorney's Office did well, isthat Johnson repeatedly gave

(01:15:40):
people the opportunity to leave,with no repercussions.
He would ask them are you sureyou want to go through with this
?
Do you understand how seriousthis is?
This is your last chance towalk away.
And each time of the cases hesuccessfully prosecuted, they
went through with it andactually did take the step to
paying Johnson something.

(01:16:01):
So they weren't just saying, oh, I promise I'll get money to
you.
They actually did give himsomething as a show of good
faith that he would go throughit.
So I think incorporating thosetwo aspects giving the person
repeated chances to leave andtaking something from them shows
how serious these people areabout going through with these
plans.
So it's no longer talks anymore.

(01:16:22):
They really want this done.

Remi (01:16:25):
And I think that is key giving them many outs during the
conversation and not coercingthem into it.
I think that's a key thing.
You should not be talking thesepeople into doing it, but if
you catch them by their own willtrying to do this sort of thing
, I do think it's correct.
I think that's perfectlyjustifiable.

(01:16:45):
It's when the police start toreally trick people and get them
to say things that theyabsolutely wouldn't say where I
start to object.

Ashley (01:16:54):
And one more question that popped into my mind while
we were comparing the movie andthe story is the article really
focuses most on Johnson'svarious cases that was probably
50% of what I spoke aboutActually, that was probably 80%
of what I spoke about Whereasthe movie the sole focus is on

(01:17:17):
Gary's relationship with Madison.
Would you have preferred to seea film that focused more on
other cases, or did you like thelove aspect?
That was the heavy focus.

Remi (01:17:29):
After watching Bernie Linklater's other true crime
film, which we both, I believe,gave a not guilty verdict to it
was very accurate, all thingsconsidered, that I think he
wanted to do that originally.
I think his original plan whenhe read this back in 2001 and
was thinking about it for over adecade was to follow it more

(01:17:51):
closely to what the real storywas.
And I think that when GlennPowell came into the picture is
when it took on this otherromantic comedy life and
honestly I think Linklater had adifficult time crafting a full
story narrative out of thisguy's profession.
Like we said, he was a prettynormal dude.

(01:18:11):
There wasn't a ton ofcontroversy.
The cases are interesting, butfor that to be the entire film
you would need something morepersonal happening with the main
character, and he is notdirectly personally involved in
any of these cases other thanworking undercover.
So I understand why the changeswere made, but I think that

(01:18:32):
they should have found a betterbalance between the two and I
think that there were ways thatmaybe the story could have not
completely gone as different asit did, while maintaining a lot
of the aspects of the true story.
But I can understand why thechanges were made.
Glenn Powell is a charismaticromantic comedy leading man.

(01:18:54):
Gary Johnson is not.
Like I said at the beginning,in my mind I saw Sam Rockwell as
Gary Johnson.
Sam Rockwell is a magnificentactor, but he's not someone
who's the dashing, good-looking,charismatic lead of these types
of movies.
So in my mind I feel like GlennPowell saw this as an
opportunity to kind of do anacting reel where he could play

(01:19:17):
multiple characters on screenthat could show a variety of his
abilities and would alsopossibly in the future give him
more acting opportunities inroles that are outside of this
bubble of, you know, generic,charismatic, good-looking dude.
So I understand why all thechanges were made, and that's
just my theory.
I do not know that for a fact,but I feel like Linklater was

(01:19:40):
going to keep it close to theoriginal story.
No studio would buy that andGlenn Powell came in adding his
Glenn Powell-ness to the storyand it seems like everyone loved
it.
It has great reviews.
It was a success on Netflix.
He even got nominated for anacting award at the Golden
Globes.
So the changes were successfuland I understand why they were

(01:20:00):
made, but I do wish that theyhad kept the story maybe 50-50
rather than like 15 to 85percent.

Ashley (01:20:09):
Well, that is dipping into our verdict.
But before we get to that,let's get to our objection of
the week.

Remi (01:20:16):
Your Honor, I object.
And why is that, Mr Reed?

Richard Linklater (01:20:19):
Because it's devastating to my case.

Remi (01:20:21):
Overruled.

Hit Man scene (01:20:22):
Good call.

Ashley (01:20:24):
And I will kick us off with the objection of the week
this time.
I have a few here and I thinkthe one I'm going to go with is
that during the first hit, whenhe met with oil rig worker Craig
, he wasn't dressed as a biker,he was just dressed as a normal
dude.
I think it would have been wayfunnier to have him dressed as a

(01:20:45):
biker with how he was describedin the article, especially
wearing that silver skull chainnecklace.

Remi (01:20:51):
He plays that biker character in the montage, but
not in that initial sting,Because in the movie it's
happening by surprise, so he'snot expecting to go in and he
doesn't have the full costumeand wardrobe available.
Mine this week is the fact thathis main job was that he was a
cop.
He wasn't a teacher.

(01:21:12):
It sounds like he taught acouple of classes later on in
life.
So while in the movie his maincareer is teaching and the
police work is part-time, inreal life his main career was
police work and the teachingthing was part-time, and I don't
know why they decided to makethat switch Maybe because it
would be easier for him to runaway with her at the end if he

(01:21:35):
wasn't a police officer, and I'mnot sure but that was a change
that I thought was completelyunnecessary.
Honestly, you could haveomitted all of the teaching
scenes and it wouldn't haveaffected the story at all.

Ashley (01:21:46):
I had that one written down too, and I think that was
going to be my runner up, so I'mgoing to go with that one.

Remi (01:21:51):
All right Back on the board.
Baby, that was going to be myrunner up, so I'm going to go
with that one.
All right Back on the boardbaby.

Narrator (01:22:01):
So let's get into our verdict now.
At the conclusion of eachepisode, our hosts will deliver
a verdict based on the film'saccuracy.
If the film is an honestportrayal of the events, then it
will earn a not guilty verdict.
If the adaptation is mostlyfactual but creative liberties
were taken for the sake ofentertainment, the film will be
declared a mistrial.
But if the film ultimatelystrays too far from the truth,
then it will be condemned asguilty and sentenced to a life

(01:22:24):
behind bars.

Remi (01:22:27):
I will start things this week, since you did our
objection of the week momentsago.
This film is getting a guiltyverdict from me.
I did enjoy the film and thetrue story is a very interesting
one, but it's pretty clear thatmost of this movie was
completely made up.
They took the idea of Gary andjust ran with it in a completely

(01:22:52):
different direction that wasmore catered towards Glenn
Powell's acting abilities andhis appeal on screen.
Most of the stuff that was truewas kind of just glossed over
in montages and, of course, thewhole Madison thing they never
even met in real life.
It's impossible to give thisthing anything else but a guilty

(01:23:13):
verdict in my mind.
What about you, Ashley?
Do you feel differently or doyou feel the same?

Ashley (01:23:19):
It's obvious that this movie is guilty.
The other points I had writtendown here that really deviate so
far from the truth is the wholeJasper character, the fact that
he goes through with murderinganother undercover hitman.
They also moved the timeline ofthis completely.
It's starting at a time whereJasper gets suspended because a

(01:23:42):
video went viral.
There's no viral videos in 1989.

Remi (01:23:46):
They definitely updated it for modern times.

Ashley (01:23:49):
And obviously the biggest reason he gets a guilty
is because of the whole rom-comlove aspect involved, but with
the caveat that it is again oneof those movies that illustrates
how a guilty verdict doesn'tnecessarily mean a bad movie.
A lot of the movies that wegive guilty verdicts to are ones
that we actually enjoy andwould recommend, and I assume

(01:24:10):
that this is one of those.

Remi (01:24:11):
Yes, even though you have seen it and don't remember it,
we do recommend this movie.
It is a fun, lightheartedrom-com romp, but our film two
weeks from now is anything butthat.
Ashley, would you like to tellthe audience a little bit about
what our next episode will befocusing on?

Ashley (01:24:35):
bit about what our next episode will be focusing on.
Yes, we threw Hitman in herefor you guys as a bit of a
reprieve from two prior heavyepisodes, and we are getting
right back into it with a moviecalled Bully, which I have not
seen, but it is about a brutalmurder orchestrated by a group
of teenage friends in Floridafrom 1993.

Remi (01:24:58):
I have seen this movie.
I saw it back when I was ateenager.
It is from the director of thefilm Kids, If anyone is familiar
with that.
It is a very controversial filmdealing with teenagers.
Controversial film dealing withteenagers.
And this film is also anextremely controversial film

(01:25:19):
dealing with teenagers and it isgoing to be a heavy discussion.
There is a lot of behind thescenes things that happened with
many of the actors involvedwith the film and the director,
and there's a lot not to mention.
The entire true story is prettydark in general, but don't let
me scare you off.
It is going to be a fascinatingepisode and I do look forward

(01:25:39):
to discussing it with you nexttime, Ashley.

Ashley (01:25:42):
And before we sign off, with a little taste of what's to
come with the trailer bully, wewant to again thank all of you
for listening and please don'tforget to rate, review and
subscribe.
And until then, Court isadjourned.

Remi (01:26:01):
I don't understand what the hell is going on with you?
You guys don't work, you don'tgo to school, you don't do
anything.

All you do is lay around and drive your cars.
You know how that makes me feel.
Mad.
Y'all want to go to a party?
Sure Welcome to the party.

Ashley (01:26:26):
I got a new boyfriend, mom, what kind.

A hug.

You might as well get hot.
Oh, baby, you know what I like.

Bobby and I have been friends since we were like
almost born.

Remi (01:26:46):
Brave Dally Treats everyone like shit.

So what are you gonna do, Lisa?

He's a source of everybody's troubles.
Are we really gonna do Lisa?
He's the source of everybody'stroubles.

Are we really gonna do this?

This guy deserves to die.
Dead, dead, dead, dead, dead,dead, dead.
Turn those goddamn lights off.
Is he dead, yet Getting there?

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