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August 29, 2025 53 mins

Think drinking lots of water means you're well-hydrated? Think again. In this eye-opening episode, we dive into why you might actually be dehydrated despite chugging water all day long, and reveal what your body really needs to stay properly hydrated. Plus, tune in to our two new segments that we have added to the beginning and end of the podcast! Chrissy’s very first Random Revelation might send your head spinning! 

In This Episode:

  • Our Daily Drink Routine: From morning lemon water with cayenne pepper to electrolyte strategies
  • The Hydration Truth Bomb: Why water alone doesn't hydrate you (it's all about the minerals!)
  • Beyond Gatorade: The problems with conventional sports drinks and better alternatives
  • DIY vs. Store-Bought: When to invest in quality electrolytes and when to make your own
  • The Spiritual-Physical Connection: How caring for our bodies honors God


Chapters:

00:00 Welcome to Crunchy Stewardship
00:43 Introducing Random Revelations
01:24 Chrissy's Revelation on Digestion
02:29 Favorite Podcasts and Books
06:05 Spiritual and Physical Health Connection
11:39 Today's Topic: Beverages and Drinks
24:59 Choosing the Right Salt for Hydration
26:55 Making Your Own Electrolytes
28:24 Cost and Strategy of Electrolytes
30:04 The Importance of Minerals in Hydration
37:33 Electrolytes and Processed Foods
42:13 Natural vs. Processed Foods
46:56 Homemade Electrolyte Alternatives
48:47 Upcoming Episode Sneak Peek
50:14 Community Conversations
53:39 Final Thoughts and Sign Off


Links & Resources Mentioned:

Podcasts We Love:

  • Culture Apothecary with Alex Clark
  • The Dr. Josh Axe Show 
  • Modern Ancestral Mamas

Books Recommended:

  • "Eat Dirt" by Josh Axe https://amzn.to/4my8RHj
  • "Feeding You Lies" by Vani Hari (Food Babe) https://amzn.to/3VmaDzd

Quality Electrolytes:

Mineral-Rich Salts:

  • Baja Gold Mineral Salt https://amzn.to/4oZgsA6
  • Redmond Real Salt https://amzn.to/3HVYXjG

Where to Shop:



Connect With Us:

  • Leave us a review and rating
  • Email us your crunchy discoveries
  • Share your hydration wins in our Facebook group

Remember: Your body is the temple God gave you to glorify Him. Let's steward it well, one sip at a time.




Connect With Us:

Join Our Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/crunchychristianmama

Follow us on Instagram @crunchystewardship

FREE How to Afford Non-Toxic Living Workbook: https://crunchystewardship.com/how-to-afford-non-toxic-living

Mark as Played
Transcript

Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Chrissy (00:00):
Hello and welcome to Crunchy Stewardship.
My name is Chrissy Rombach.

Katie (00:05):
Hi, my name is Katie Fiola Jones.
We are both two cousins who arepassionate about learning and
sharing knowledge to equipothers to steward their
spiritual, mental, emotional,financial, and physical health
in order to honor God in everyaspect of their lives.

Chrissy (00:20):
In our podcast, we take deep dives into what it means to
steward our lives as Godoriginally intended for us with
the resources that God has givenus.
We look at topics like food,medicine, finances, mental
health, and tons more through anatural lens and with a biblical
foundation.

Katie (00:39):
Today We're actually going to change it up a little
bit and introduce a new segmentthat we are going to regularly
incorporate into our episodes,and that is random Revelations.
So in this segment of ourpodcast, one of us is going to
share something that we'velearned maybe in the last week

(01:01):
or so about being crunchy.
So anything crunchy, somethingthat we learned on a podcast or
heard from a friend.
Um, and yeah, so Chrissy's goingto kick it off today.
So Chrissy, why don't you sharewith us a Random Revelation that
you learned this past week.

Chrissy (01:20):
Yeah, the Random Revelation in that I learned
this week is that you areactually constipated if you are
not pooping every single timeyou eat, which is about three
times a day.
And that was kind of surprisingto me because, you know,
actually it's kind ofinteresting.
In nursing school we learnedabout the process of digestion

(01:43):
and the hormones that arereleased during digestion and in
our anatomy textbook, we learnedabout how the act of chewing
actually starts the release ofhormones, which ends with a mass
movement peristalsis through thelarge intestine and should
inevitably result with a bowelmovement.

(02:05):
And I remember learning that andbeing like, Hmm, that's weird.
I don't go to the bathroom everysingle time I eat.
Um, but now I have learned thatactually you are indeed supposed
to have a bowel movement everytime you eat about three times a
day.
So there you go.

Katie (02:21):
It's, there you go.
It is such a funny thing.
I actually, so we listened tothat same episode, and for those
who are curious, when we talkabout like, these episodes that
we listen to, some of ourfavorite podcasts, one of the
ones that both Chrissy and Ilistened to.
Um, the main one is, CultureApothecary with Alex Clark.
So if you're, if looking for newpodcasts that is one of the

(02:41):
number one podcasts we listento.
We also both like, um, JoshAxe's show is his, is his
podcast just Josh Axe.
I actually can't remember rightnow.

Chrissy (02:50):
I, I really do think if you search up Josh Axe, it comes
up

Katie (02:54):
I also, I wanna recommend another show.
I don't know if you listen tothis one, Chrissy, but it's
Modern Ancestral Mamas.
I really like that one.
They have a show very similar toours where it's just like two
friends chatting about thingsthat they're learning and stuff.
Um, they've been around a lotlonger than you and I have, and,
but I really like theirs.

(03:14):
But anyway, on that episode fromCulture Apothecary that you and
I both listened to about havingbowel movements, they mentioned
that you typically should bechewing your food about 30 times
before you swallow it.
And then so since that episode,I have been counting the number
of chews and I'm like, I do notmake it to 30.

(03:36):
I barely make it to 20.
But I wonder if it's also likebased on the food that you're
eating.
'cause I don't remember what Iwas eating.
It was cereal I think.
And the cereal was somewhatsoggy already.
So I'm like, I don't really needto chew it or else it's like
literally.
A hundred percent mush, and it'slike a smoothie in my mouth, so,
ugh.

Chrissy (03:54):
I just think of eating oatmeal, are you going to chew
oatmeal 30 times?

Katie (03:56):
30 times?
So I'm sure that it has to dolike the, with the, the
different foods, but

Chrissy (04:02):
You know who actually does chew their food 30 times
before they swallow?

Katie (04:07):
Does Max do that?

Chrissy (04:08):
My mother

Katie (04:08):
oh, I was like, does Max, your mom.

Chrissy (04:10):
will put something in her mouth and be chewing it and
like walk you around the houseand putting things away.
And then she sits down.
I'm like, mom, you're stillchewing that piece of meat.
She goes, yeah, you gotta chewit 30 times.
I'm like, oh my gosh,

Katie (04:24):
I bet Josh, because she really likes Josh Axe also, and
so I bet he mentions itsomewhere in his books.
I am Chrissy.
I just started listening to hisbook, um, Eat Dirt

Chrissy (04:36):
I love that book!

Katie (04:37):
Finally, I just started it.
And it is so good.
Like I, it's already, heactually has a lot of resources
in that book, like a lot oflinks that he mentions.
And so I'm only listening tothis book and it's usually while
I'm in the car and I'm like, Iwanna write it down, but I'm
like driving and it's reallyawkward to like try and take
notes and stuff.
So I, I already know that it's abook that I need to potentially

(04:59):
get physically so I can see allthis stuff in there too.
But, um, anyway, so good.
That's another book, um, that Iwould add to your lists.

Chrissy (3) (05:09):
That's the book that encouraged me to start
eating organic

Katie (05:12):
Really?
Oh,

Chrissy (05:14):
Mm-hmm.

Katie (05:15):
the book that really pushed me over the edge was
Feeding You Lies by Vani Hari,who is um, known as the Food
Babe.
And that was, I think that wasreally the book that propelled
me into my crunchy journey.
I was already on that andobviously I picked that book up
because I was really curiousabout it.
So I was going that direction.

(05:37):
But that book was the one thattipped me over the edge and then
I forced Wess to read it aswell.
And then he was like, okay, Iget it.
You learn all the things andjust don't make me read another
book like this.
And I was like, okay, I'll justteach you all this stuff.

Chrissy (05:52):
You know what's one

Chrissy (2) (05:52):
thing that

Chrissy (05:53):
I have actually been thinking about a lot recently is
the connection between spiritualhealth and physical health.

Katie (06:02):
Yeah.

Chrissy (06:02):
Of like God created humanity in his image and we
have our physical bodies that hehas given us.
And our job as humans is to useour physical bodies in order to
glorify God spiritually.
And it just kind of makes mewonder of like how in the world

(06:26):
can a physical body that isunhealthy and sick possibly
glorify God to its maximumpossibility.
You know?
It's just one of those thingsthat I'm like, it actually kind
of hurts my heart when I see aChristian who's obese and who

(06:47):
has all these chronic illnesses.
I'm like, you are You aremissing out on such an important
part of glorifying God byfailing to take care of your
body, which is the vessel thatthe Lord has given you to
glorify him.
And yeah, it's just, it's one ofthose things that I just see and

(07:07):
I'm like, wow, This is, I thinkhonestly, a space that the
church doesn't talk about nearlyas much the church doesn't talk
about physical health at all.
Yeah.
They kind of just gloss over itAnd.
It it just makes me wonder, mewonder, I'm like we should, talk
about physical health more so inthe church as a means to glorify

(07:29):
God.
He created us to be able-bodiedhumans who are capable of
carrying his gospel to thenations.

Katie (07:36):
Yeah.

Chrissy (07:36):
And

Chrissy (2) (07:37):
you can't

Chrissy (07:37):
Do that if you're too sick to do that.
So

Katie (07:41):
Yeah.

Chrissy (07:42):
that is another

Chrissy (2) (07:43):
thing that's

Chrissy (07:44):
Been on my mind recently and just like the
spiritual physical connectionthat it's all connected, like
health is not just physicalhealth.
Is spiritual it is emotionalhealth.
It's mental health.
It's financial health too.
And that.

Katie (07:59):
Yeah.

Chrissy (08:00):
Plays a big into your physical and emotional and
mental health and spiritualhealth.
So it's all connected.

Katie (08:05):
Yeah.

Chrissy (08:06):
And the more I learn about physical I more I feel
spiritually healthy, I amthankful for the things and the
body that God has given me, you

Katie (08:15):
totally.
Yeah.
Well, it is nice though, I mean,because so many of us have been
duped by the system and by whatother quote unquote experts are
telling us or what we need to doin order to be healthy, or even
just the lies that perpetuatethroughout our society about
like, you can be your best selfif you still, if you eat like

(08:38):
this, or if you live a sedentarylifestyle.
And, and so we hear all these.
Lies from everybody else thatyeah, it's okay to be unhealthy
like this.
And, and so I think in thosemoments, like if you are someone
who isn't in their kind of peakhealth, that God still has so
much grace and you can stillglorify God in an unhealthy

(09:03):
body.
I mean, it should be the goal,like we should be.
Working towards kind ofsanctification and redemption in
all areas of our lives, and Godis working on that through us.
And so if you're listening tothis and you're like, yeah,
you're right.
So get on that path towardsbeing more healthy with your
bodies and the way that you'reeating and the, the activities

(09:25):
that you're doing physically.
And so it's not to say that youcan't glorify God and that you
aren't glorifying God throughthe way that you're living, but
it's just like, now that you'vekind of woken up to that
reality, do somethingdifferently about it.
Um, I, I get, monthly fooddeliveries from a company called

(09:47):
Azure Standard.
It's A-Z-U-R-E standard.
They're kind of like a.
I like to think of them as likean online Costco of organic
foods.
And so you can buy bulk oforganic foods.
It's really great.
Um, and so I, when when you getyour shipment each month, um,
they send you a magazine andusually it's like they have all

(10:08):
their products in there anddifferent, the sales that are
going on.
But I love reading the owner,um, I can't think of his name
right now, but he usually writeslike an article in the beginning
of the magazine each month.
And this month's, article thathe wrote was kind of about the
three pegs of the stool that hebelieves are kind of like

(10:29):
health.
And one of the pegs is like foodand nutrition and like what
you're feeding yourself.
The other one is like physicalmovement and exercise.
And then the third one isactually like spiritual and
emotional health.
And so he's a Christian and hetalks a lot about like your
faith and your, and how those,these all kind of come together
to kind of create this stool.

(10:51):
Like you think of a three-leggedstool, not stool like poop like
we were talking about before,but that is what kind of like
those three pegs need to be.
Aligned in order to have likekind of your ultimate health.
And so yeah, I think that'sreally cool that you mentioned
that Chrissy and I just readthat article yesterday of his

Chrissy (11:10):
There you go.
The Lord works in amazing ways

Katie (11:13):
in

Chrissy (11:13):
giving us

Katie (11:13):
such mysterious ways

Chrissy (11:14):
similar revelations at the same time.
Well let's actually about aregoing to talk about on this
episode.
Um, so today's episode is aboutbeverages and drinks and our
go-to, what do we drinkthroughout the day, but before
we actually get get startedthat, on if you haven't already,

(11:36):
we would love it if you could gosubscribe to our episode and
leave us a five star rating.
This definitely helps otherpeople find our show in the
future, makes it more searchableon Spotify and YouTube and all
the things alike.
Um, and also, if you haven'tsigned up for our weekly
newsletter go ahead and take amoment to do that by clicking on

(11:56):
that link in the show notes.
Okay.
Now we're actually gonna starton the episode that we said we
are going to today talking aboutdrinks.
Katie is your go-to drinkthroughout the day?

Katie (12:10):
Yeah, good question.
Um, I definitely start my dayout with coffee.
I've been doing like a coffeewith some.
Milk, usually my raw milk in itor some heavy whipping cream in
it.
And then some protein powder.
I've been doing, um, someprotein powder in my, coffee in
the morning, but during the day,I really like, I have, some

(12:32):
electrolytes that I have beenenjoying, um, from Just
Ingredients, the company, JustIngredients.
We've been doing that.
And so I usually have like a cupof coffee in the morning.
Um, and then I have likeelectrolytes during the day and
then I love tea in the evenings.
I guess actually even before mycoffee in the morning.

(12:53):
My first drink is typically a,lemon water.
I do lemon water, so water witha, a bunch of lemon juice in it,
and then some cayenne pepper.
And that just kind of helpsstimulate your, uh, immune
system.

Chrissy (13:07):
Do you squeeze your own lemons or Do you have
store-bought lemon juice?

Katie (13:10):
Oh, good question.
Uh, I like squeezing my ownlemons when we have them, but we
often go through them so quicklythat I just keep an organic
lemon juice thing in my fridge.
We, we actually got this really,I think it was maybe from Azure
Standard, that I ordered thisgiant thing in a glass jar.

(13:31):
Which is really great that itdidn't come in plastic.
But it's primarily from there,just because one time when I did
buy bulk lemons that like halfof them ended up going bad
before I ended up using them.
So it was like one of thosethings that I'm like, okay, 40
lemons is probably not the rightamount of lemons for us.
But then buying themindividually, like by the week,

(13:53):
it's just.
That's a lot of thinking for me.
That's why I like buying bulk,honestly, is just so I don't
have to think so much every timeI go to the grocery store, like,
what all do I need?
I hate grocery shoppingactually, so that's a fun tidbit
for me.
Anyway, that's kind of it in anutshell.
What are you, what are yourgo-to drinks?
Chrissy?

Chrissy (14:11):
My go-to drinks.
First thing, when I wake up,before I get outta bed, full
glass of water.
I don't do anything until I havehad a full glass of water

Katie (14:23):
do you do like a lemon water or any kind of water?
Just water.

Chrissy (14:28):
Just regular water.
I have it sitting on my bedsidetable before I go to bed and my
lovely husband, oh, he's soawesome.
Actually, he fills up my waterevery single night for me before
we go to bed.
But I've gotten him on thistrend also of first thing, wake
up full glass of water,rehydrate, you know, haven't had
anything to drink for the lasteight hours I've been sleeping.

(14:50):
Um, and then usually with mybreakfast, I will have a cup of
coffee.
And in my coffee I, so I havenot yet gotten onto the raw milk
trend, but I have found A2 A2minimally pasteurized milk,
which is kind of your next best

Katie (15:12):
Yeah.

Chrissy (15:13):
It's pasteurized at a low temperature, and so it's not
as quote unquote sterile asultra pressurized milk

Katie (15:19):
Mm-hmm.

Chrissy (15:20):
and it comes in a glass jug, which I really love, and we
kind of just exchange the glassjugs every time we go get
another gallon of milk.

Katie (15:27):
That's great.

Chrissy (15:28):
So I've been putting that and honey in my coffee, I
think I mentioned this on aprevious episode of I started
the milk and honey thing in mycoffee when I was like, oh,
well, God brings people to thepromised land, the land flowing
with milk and honey, let's justput milk and honey in my coffee
instead of cream and sugar,because why not?
And it's actually really yummyand I think it's superior.

(15:51):
But yep, I have that.
And then the rest of the day,honestly, I just drink lemon
water.
I, we do buy a three pound bagof organic lemons every single
week.
And I go through the threepounds of lemons

Katie (16:04):
Nice.

Chrissy (16:04):
every week and I usually, I have my.
Well, it's the equivalent to aStanley, but it's not a Stanley
because I'm cheap.
I got it for free from work, butI have my jug and I put half a
lemon in it.
That's cut into slices and Ijust keep refilling that with
water throughout the day.
And then the lemon slowly butsurely gets the water and lemon

(16:26):
in your water.
It has a, it does release someelectrolytes into the water
'cause it's got vitamins andminerals in the lemon,

Katie (16:35):
Mm-hmm.

Chrissy (16:36):
So there's some electrolytes there, and also it
acts as, um, like a cleanser ofyour intestines.
I don't know exactly how itworks, but it's one of those
things my mom told me a lotgrowing up of like, you should
put water in your lemon.
It cleanses your intestines.
And so,

Katie (16:51):
Chrissy, you just said you should put water in your
lemon.
That was so funny.

Chrissy (16:55):
You don't put water in a syringe and then squirt it
into your lemons?

Katie (16:59):
Oh, is that how we're supposed to do it?

Chrissy (17:01):
Sorry, you put lemon in your water.

Katie (17:03):
Well, so that's why I so it, again, this book Feeding You
Lies Vanni Hari.
I actually, it may or may nothave been in that book.
I have read two of her otherlike cookbook slash educational
books.
And in some one of her books,she was the one who talked about
starting your day with a lemonwater, with like a dash of

(17:25):
cayenne pepper because it'ssupposed to stimulate your,
digestive system, and then alsosupposed to help boost your
immune system and supposed tohelp you, feel more like full
and satisfied when you eat foodthroughout the day.
And it's supposed, so again, itkind of then helps you with like
weight loss and, and all sortsof stuff.

(17:47):
It's supposed to be really goodfor your system.
She was the one who recommendedstarting your day with this
lemon water, cayenne pepper mix.
And so if, if we're travelingthough, and I don't have it, I
usually just do water and sheactually recommends doing like
a, when you do it, make sure thewater is room temperature or

(18:07):
slightly warm.
Um, and apparently that'ssupposed to help.
In general too.
I don't know if you knowanything about that, but I don't
know.

Chrissy (18:14):
I do know.
That your body is actually ableto process room temperature
water better than cold waterbecause it's one of those things
that like if you're working outoutside and it's really hot out,
you think that cold water wouldactually cool you down more so,
but the body uses more energy towarm up that cool water, which

(18:39):
then means it doesn't actuallycool you down all that much
because it's like using moreenergy.
So putting off more heat inorder to warm up the cold water
that you just put into yourbody.
So if you drink room temperaturewater your body doesn't have to
work as hard to warm it back upto room temperature essentially.
Um,

Katie (18:59):
yeah.

Chrissy (18:59):
So it can use the water quicker.

Katie (19:02):
That kind of makes sense.

Chrissy (19:03):
But, question about the cayenne pepper.
How does that taste in the wa?
Do you just do like a dash?

Katie (19:08):
I do a very small amount so you're also supposed to drink
this with a straw because whenyou do so much lemon in your
water, the acidic ness of thelemon can erode the enamel on
your teeth.
So you're supposed to drink itwith a straw so it doesn't like,
so it goes past your teeth andkind of more directly down your
throat.
So if it settles.

Chrissy (19:28):
Straws are more fun to drink from anyways

Katie (19:31):
You're so right.
You're so right.
And so we use straws foreverything.
I have my silicone straws thatwe love, but if it settles at
the bottom and you get like abig like swig of it at that
moment, then you kind of tasteand it's a little spicy.
But since it's such a smallamount, I mean she even says
just do a small dash of it andit's, it's supposed to again,

(19:52):
kind of help to stimulate your.
Everything, all, all sorts ofstuff.
There's apparently a lot ofbenefits to it.
Sometimes I do it mo most days Ido it now.
We grew a lot of cayennepeppers.
The like last, last year when wehad a garden in Colorado and we
had so much of it that I driedout a bunch of them, like I
baked them and dried them outand then ground them up into

(20:15):
just cayenne pepper, you know,into a cayenne pepper shaker
kind of thing.
And, and so we have so much ofthis cayenne pepper that I'm
like, I'll just use it all inthat

Chrissy (20:25):
I remember when you did that and you posted on
Instagram, like the colordifference

Katie (20:30):
yes

Chrissy (20:30):
between your home grown cayenne.
Pepper and the store-boughtcayenne pepper.
It was a completely differentcolor too.

Katie (20:36):
Yeah.

Chrissy (20:37):
Did it have a different flavor profile also?

Katie (20:39):
Yeah.
I mean, it was just strongertasting.
I mean, you think about, again,like my, my classic example are
eggs.
When you have pasture raisedeggs and the, and the chickens
are feeding on all the goodstuff in your yard, and they
have lots of nutrients in thoseeggs.
The color profile of the eggsare just so much brighter.
Same thing with like grass fedpasture raised cows uh, when you

(21:03):
make butter out of that milk,the milk is vibrant yellow
versus the like muted white kindof yellow that we get in the
store.
And so same thing with your liketomatoes and vegetables that you
grow in your own garden.
The cayenne pepper was just thisreally deep, beautiful red, and
it's just, it's much moreflavorful.
And I would even say it's, it isspicier, but it's also like you

(21:26):
could just taste like kind ofthe the richness to it versus
like just the spice.
'cause I feel like thestore-bought stuff that we've
had is just, to me it's justspicy and there's not a lot of
flavor to it.
So I don't know.
I've, I've grown to like it

Chrissy (21:39):
It has more depth to its flavoring.

Katie (21:41):
It's very deep and emotional.

Chrissy (21:43):
There's a lotta layers to the flavor.
If we're gonna sound like fancychef people.

Katie (21:48):
So one of the things that's interesting too, about
like the lemons and then thecayenne pepper, is that what
I've learned too is not onlydoes it help stimulate your body
to get moving in like for theday, but also it helps to
hydrate you better.
And I think that that is one ofthe really interesting things
that I've been learning latelyis that.

(22:08):
Uh, so many quote unquoteexperts out there tell us like,
oh, you need so much waterthroughout the day in order to
stay hydrated.
But what I've been learning isthat our water actually isn't
hydrating us.
In fact, water itself is notnecessarily the agent that
hydrates us.
It's the minerals in inside ofour water that do the hydrating.

(22:29):
And so if your water is depletedof these natural minerals and
trace minerals and things, thenyou actually aren't being
hydrated, and so you couldtechnically be dehydrated even
if you're like chugging tons ofwater.
And going back to our like firstconversation of the day and
having bowel movements, I, Ilearned in an episode somewhere,

(22:51):
if you are.
Peeing like a lot throughout theday.
Like if you drink water andyou're just like, you always
have to pee, it might actuallybe a sign that you are severely
dehydrated because the water isnot like actually being taken
into your body and like beingabsorbed.
It's just kind of being flushedstraight out because there's no
benefit to that water.
It doesn't have the minerals andstuff in it.

(23:12):
So that was something for methat I learned that I'm like.
Oh my gosh.
I could be drinking all thiswater throughout the day, but it
might not actually be beneficialin actually hydrating me.
So that's when we kind ofstarted getting more into the
electrolytes that are puttingthose minerals and things back
into your water.
So yeah.

Chrissy (23:32):
You know what also helps with improving the
electrolytes and actuallygetting your water to stick into
your cells is, eating a pickle.
If you eat a pickle before youdrink a full glass of water, all
of those minerals, you know,pickles are salty, all the
sodium, the potassium, thecalcium, the phosphorus, like
it's all in the pickle.

(23:53):
And so you eat the pickle first.
That gets into your cells, andthen your cells are like, Ooh,
I'm extra salty now.
I need some water to dilute thesalt.
And so then you drink the water.
And your cells are like, allright, let's hold onto this
water.
Um, so I think also another waythat you can like improve the

(24:14):
hydration level of your water iseven just putting some salt in
it.
but it has to be like a certainkind of salt, I'm pretty sure.

Katie (24:22):
Yes.
Yeah, so I did write that downbecause, um, so actually, uh,
Modern Ancestral Mamas, thatpodcast that I kind of mentioned
before.
Um, I forgot that I wrote thisdown from one of their episodes.
They actually did an episode ondrinks and things like that, and
so they talked about.
A lot of times when they havetheir like Stanley water bottle

(24:43):
or something, like they're justtheir water bottle throughout
the day, they will add a smallpinch of their, their go-to is
called Baja Gold Mineral Salt,and so.
Even if you see mineral salt orsea salt, you have to really be
careful about like theprocessing that that salt goes
through, because it's actuallythe processing that eliminates a
lot of the trace minerals, likemagnesium, um, potassium, I

(25:09):
think calcium.
So a lot of times, like yourregular table salt will not have
any of that.
In it because of the processingit goes through.
So you have to find somethingthat has not been processed
severely.
Um, and so Baja Gold MineralSalt is the one that they
recommend.
But the other good one that I'veheard is the Redmond Red Sea

(25:29):
Salt.
And we'll add links to these.
So if you're curious and wannacheck those out, um, you can go
and look at those.
And so those salts do have theminerals in it in order to keep
the hydration of the water.
And so we've been buying certainelectrolytes, um, primarily from

(25:50):
Just Ingredients.
There's another brand out therethat is highly recommended
called Taylor Duke's Wellness.
Um, I really like those becausethey often flavor them with all
sorts of yummy things.
And so you can, like my favoriteone is like their mango lemonade
one, and I, I just love that oneand it's so good and it makes me
feel like I get like a littletreat in the day versus just

(26:12):
having water with some salt init.
But you can make your ownelectrolytes.
In fact, as I was kind of doingsome research for this episode a
while ago.
Um, I found a very simpleelectrolyte, uh, like recipe
that you can, that you can makeyourself.
I posted it in our Facebookgroup like a week or two ago, so
we'll link to that in the shownotes if you wanna go find it.

(26:34):
But you do have to be a part ofour Facebook group to actually
see it.
So, um, we'll link to it, butyou can ask to join our group.
We'd love to have you.
Um, and one of the main thingsthough, that electrolytes have
in it.
One of the main ingredients thatit has in order to actually be,
uh, like hydrating is magnesium.

(26:55):
And so in order to make your ownelectrolytes, you do need like a
magnesium powder to put inthere.
But from my understanding isthat a lot of us are very
magnesium deficient in general,and so we.
Most of us could benefit fromhaving more magnesium in our
diet.
So I think after we finish someof these electrolytes that we

(27:17):
have at home, I might end upbuying some of the ingredients
to just make our own, um,because.
It's probably more costeffective to do that.
And you know, it's just nice tohave the fancy stuff sometimes
to have like a fun drink.
Especially like when we go tothe beach or something.
It's fun to have like my yummydrink and be like, it's so

(27:38):
refreshing and yummy anddelicious and I don't know.

Chrissy (27:42):
Our Strategy with like putting electrolytes in our
water.
'Cause, you know, buying thoseelectrolyte packets, especially
if you're getting the goodquality stuff can be so
expensive! So we've gotten theFlav City brand, and the only
reason we got those is we weregoing on a hiking trip and it
was like the day before and hiswas the only ones that were sold
on Amazon and we could get oneweek, one day delivery.

(28:04):
so we bought them, but it wasstill like$40.
And Taylor Duke's Wellness andJust Ingredients, they are
fantastic, but they're a chunkof change.

Katie (28:12):
They're expensive.

Chrissy (28:13):
And so, our strategy with, okay, so we do want these
electrolytes, but also like youdon't really need them

Katie (28:22):
Mm-hmm.

Chrissy (28:22):
water you know if you are eating a balanced diet and
you're making sure that you'regetting all of these vitamins
and minerals in your dietthrough your food, then you
shouldn't actually need allthese extra electrolytes in your
water to hydrate you becausethat's the job of your food, to
give you those vitamins andminerals so that your water

(28:45):
actually stays in your cells.

Katie (28:47):
Mm-hmm.

Chrissy (28:48):
so we tend to use our electrolytes merely just for
hiking trips or beach trips orif it's really hot in the
summertime, we're gonna bewalking around downtown Chicago
or something for the entire day.
We'll put electrolytes in ourwater just because those are the
instances where you really dotend

Katie (29:07):
Mm-hmm

Chrissy (29:07):
get super dehydrated super fast.
Like they say hydrate ordydrate, you know?
It's those days where it's like,okay, I'm going to be drinking
water all day long and I mightonly eat three times in the day,
but, I'm gonna be sweating somuch and when you sweat, your
body releases a lot of thoseminerals that hold on to the

(29:28):
water.
And so that's like after yousweat, your skin is always a
little bit sticky.

Katie (29:32):
And salty!

Chrissy (29:33):
Yeah.
It's that salt that is supposedto be inside your cells that
holds onto the hydration and thewater.
But when your body's hot, itneeds to cool off.
So it releases all of it becausesalt and water follow each
other.
So if the body needs to releasethe water, it's going to release
the salt also.

(29:55):
And so merely just by drinkingmore water, you're not going to
replenish that hydration levelbecause your body has released
the salt.
So you need, you kind of needboth.
You need the minerals and youneed the liquid.
And so, yeah, just eating,making sure your food has
adequate vitamins and minerals.

(30:16):
So that's when it goes back tolike eating high quality food,
you know organic things thatare, or fresh picked, you know,
like picking your food straightoff the vine, it's going to have
more of those rich vitamins andminerals.
It's gonna have that magnesium,the sodium, the potassium, the
calcium in, it, rather thanafter, it's been sitting on the
shelf at the grocery store for aweek or two.

(30:38):
You never know how long it'sbeen sitting there.
Um, so that's just some of thosethings like if you're not
sweating working out like acrazy person all the time, then
you really should be able tomanage your electrolyte levels
and your hydration levels with,just the food that you're eating
you know?
They have some good, salty,nutty crackers out there that

(30:59):
have all of the things.
So eat a cracker and then drinkyour water or eat a pickle and
then drink your water and

Katie (31:05):
I do, I mean, I like where you were going with the,
like needing to have verymineral nutrient, vitamin dense
food because I mean, I, I talkabout this a lot too.
Each episode like this, like youreally should heavily consider
switching to organic localproduce and meats and things
like that because that is goingto be the most nutrient dense

(31:29):
because like you said, Chrissy,if your diet is balanced, you
really don't need theelectrolytes.
But the reality is that so manyof us are living more in that
like standard American diet.
And even if you are.
Eating primarily whole foods,like just whole veggies and
whole fruits and and meatsversus the processed stuff.

(31:52):
Even if you're focusing more onthat, the fruits and veggies
that you are eating might nothave all of those minerals that
you need in order to stayhydrated.
And so my point is kind of likeyou may actually need.
The electrolytes in order tostay hydrated because you're not
getting all of those minerals,especially the trace minerals,

(32:15):
because the way that our produceis grown, the soil is so
depleted of these minerals thatit's just not in your fruits and
veggies.
I mean, I think I heard theother day that one orange back
in the, I think it was maybe thefifties or something, is about

(32:36):
the equivalent to eating eightoranges today.
Like you need eight orangestoday in order to get the same
amount of vitamins, minerals,and nutrients that one orange
had.
Like a, just a few decades ago,because of the way that we have
depleted our soil so much thatit's like our food is just not
the same.
Like nothing is the same that weeat unless you're trying to

(32:58):
focus on organic regenerativefarming, you know, having really
good, uh, soil in order to fillthose foods up with the minerals
and nutrients that you need.
So.
If you are kind of eating thatmore standard diet, if you're
not yet doing kind of the localproduce and organic stuff, which
we've done episodes on how tofind that kind of stuff.

(33:20):
So go check that out.
Um, in.
Like on Spotify or whereveryou're listening to this
podcast, right?
So go find those episodes, onhow to find that stuff.
But if you're not doing thatalready, you, you likely will
need to do electrolytes, um, orat least the bare minimum, like
find, like get this, these goodsalts just to add to your

(33:41):
drinks.
In fact, that's, that's one ofour next steps when when we
deplete the rest of our regulartable salts and things that we
have.
I do want to switch over tothese mineral salts because
then.
Even if we're flavoring ourfoods, like that mineral dense
salt is getting into our food,then getting into our systems,
and then we can add littlepinches of it to our water and

(34:04):
things like that.
Because we had an episode awhile ago talking specifically
about water and how bad ourwater is these days.
I think we talked aboutfiltration systems, and one of
the interesting things I didlearn is that.
Uh, the water filtration systemthat we plan to get in our home
one day, which is, it's calledreverse osmosis.

(34:25):
It takes out literally all thebad stuff from your water, um,
but it also takes out all of thegood stuff from your water.
So it takes out all of theminerals from it.
And so in essence.
That water from a reverseosmosis system.
While it is not toxic, it alsois not hydrating at all.

(34:46):
And I was just shocked by thisbecause I'm like, that's what I
really wanna get in our home sowe can get out all of the
terrible stuff like the fluorideand the pesticide chemicals and
the pharmaceuticals from thewater supply and all this stuff.
Like I want to get rid of allthat, but it's just getting rid
of all the good stuff.

(35:06):
So I need to figure out then howto replenish our water so that
it's actually hydrating, becauseI kind of heard that it's, it's
almost like doing the oppositefor your body where it's like
pulling the minerals orsomething from it.
And so anyway, I don't, I don'tknow that for sure, but
basically the whole point wasthat that water's not hydrating

(35:28):
if you're just taking outeverything good from it.
So Yeah,

Chrissy (35:32):
yeah.
I don't know about it likedehydrating you per se, but
essentially the idea is that ifyou don't have the minerals for
the water to stick to, then.
The water just stays in what'scalled the intercellular space,
so like the space in betweenyour cells and then just gets
flushed right outta your body,or it stays within your

(35:54):
bloodstream and doesn't actuallygo into your red blood cells and
then just gets flushed outtayour body.
Whereas when you have thoseminerals in your body, the, the
cells absorb the minerals andthen they look to absorb water
to dilute those minerals to keep

Katie (36:12):
Hmm

Chrissy (36:12):
to keep an even balance of it so.
Um, that's where the mineralsin, the water play, they kind
of, the water follows theminerals so to say.
So if you have minerals incells, the water's gonna follow
into the cells.
If you don't have minerals inyour cells, the water's not
gonna follow into your cells,and it's just gonna get flushed
right out.
And then there's no benefit toit.

(36:35):
But

Katie (36:35):
Interesting.
And I think I wanna touch alittle bit on,'cause like, you
know.
Years ago when we were kids, andeven, even today now, like as
kids, one of the products outthere that is typically the
go-to when we're talking aboutlike sports and electrolytes and
things like that.

(36:57):
Are our products like Gatoradeor Propel or, gosh, I don't even
know.
Some of the other ones.
I, I can think of them, but Ican't think of the names.

Chrissy (37:06):
Gator Light, there's Pedialyte, there's liquid iv.

Katie (37:10):
All these, yeah, there's, there's a lot of them these
days, but Gatorade was kind ofthat first one.
I feel like, you know, back inthe maybe nineties, early two
thousands I feel like is when itjust really got super popular
and was like the drink to drink.
If you were an athlete and youneeded to get hydrated and, and

(37:31):
they kind of.
Promoted it as this primaryelectrolyte drink.
And the reality is that thingslike Gatorade and even Propel,
which is clear, um, most of themhave added sugars or artificial
sugars.
They have dyes in them.
Um, and even if they don't havedyes and maybe added sugars,

(37:55):
like I'm, I'm pretty sure propel'cause we did Propel for a while
earlier.
Um, actually just a, like acouple years ago, we were doing
a lot of Propel'cause I waslike, there's no added sugars.
There's no dyes in it.
But the main thing that Istarted to learn was that it has
the natural flavors in it.
And so then you're like, okay,well really what is in this
drink now?
And so the problem is that theyhave all of these other not

(38:19):
great things and they mightactually, I think I did learn
that Gatorade does haveelectrolytes and it does
actually hydrate you in theshort term, but then it's also.
Quite toxic because it has allthese other terrible things in
it.
And so it's, it's promoted asthis thing that for kids, it is
actually really hydratingbecause they actually drink it

(38:41):
versus water, which they mightnot drink because it's boring or
something like that.
So they're like, here, just give'em this like blue Gatorade
that's full of all this notgreat stuff, and it's actually
harming them in the long term.
And so.
When, when we're talking aboutgetting electrolytes and things
like that, you really want tostay away from all these ones

(39:02):
that have added sugars.
Even a lot of the brands thatyou can find that have the
packets or the powders orwhatever they, they might have
electrolytes in them, but theyalso might have a lot of not
great stuff.
So you just really wanna becareful of the ingredients and
just reading the ingredientlabel to make sure that it is
just what you need and not allthis added stuff.

(39:25):
Because yeah, Gatorade does havethe things you need, but it also
has a lot of stuff that youreally, really don't need.
And they're just, they're sosugary and I mean, I can
literally feel it, like when I'mlike drinking it, I'm like, I
can feel these sugars and, andit's just not good.
Um, yeah, it's, it's not good.

Chrissy (39:43):
I even feel that way with Propel.
I feel like Propel kind ofleaves a flavor on the of your
tongue like little.
I don't even know what thatflavor is called, but I've
actually, I have learned thatthat flavor, that drinks like
this leave on the back of yourtongue.
It's actually a marketingtechnique that companies in

Katie (40:05):
Oh.

Chrissy (40:06):
order to make you want to drink that drink again,
because.
It tastes really good, and thenonce you're finished with it,
you have that like lingeringflavor on the back of your
tongue that just isn't as good,but still kind of makes you want
that drink more.
And so that's actually one ofthose flavors that has been

(40:29):
chemically created in a lab.
In order to help companies withtheir marketing to create a
consumer who is actually likeaddicted to their product
because of that little flavorkind of just lingers in the back
of their mouth,

Katie (40:47):
I totally got that with Propel.
I, I mean, I would drink myPropel and I felt like I needed
it every day.
When I, when we were getting itregularly, I would, it would be
in our garage fridge, and as Iwould like leave for the day to
drive the girls like our fosterdaughters somewhere, I would
grab one and we'd go for theday, and it was just like, I

(41:07):
always, I like, I felt like Ineeded it, and so I totally
understand what you're saying.

Chrissy (41:12):
Right.
And, and that's another way thatyou can kind of identify of
like, is this food more naturalor is this food more processed?
Is, does it leave a flavor inyour mouth like.
Yeah, eating your mouth shouldnot feel gross.
You also shouldn't have adifferent breath after eating,

(41:35):
unless you're eating and that'sa special situation.
But like, the vast majority ofnatural foods when you eat them
they don't really leave any sortof lingering flavor or coating
inside your mouth.
But on the flip note, the vastmajority of ultra processed
foods leave like a little filminside your mouth or like a

(41:58):
lingering flavor for a while, orit leaves your breath smelling a
certain way.
And those are like the littlethings that these companies use
to make you want to eat theirproducts more and more.

Katie (42:10):
Or I would even say like, does the food or drink leave you
satisfied or does it leave youwanting more of it?
Because there is definitelysomething different when I
drink, like my electrolyte drinkthat I have now from just
ingredients, I feel a little bitmore satisfied when I am
finished drinking it versus whenI'd have Propel or something I

(42:33):
wanted more.
Like I literally was like, Ihave not gotten enough and I
would want to drink another one,but there are expensive, so I
would tell myself I only get onea day and so I'd have to like
hold myself to that so that Iwasn't just going bankrupt,
buying Propel.
But there's definitely somethingwhen I'm eating certain snacks
or certain foods that I feellike I need more of it or it

(42:53):
hasn't satisfied me, and it'sbecause they're, they're, so
again, it's coming back to thatlike nutrient density of it.
It's not filling your body.
It's probably loaded with thingslike MSG, which are just
creating this addiction in youof needing and wanting more.
So it's, it's leaving youunsatisfied and like you need to

(43:14):
kind of keep replenishing.
And so if your food is evermaking you feel like that, it
likely.
It.
That's not the way food issupposed.
It's supposed to satisfy you andeventually you're supposed to
feel hungry when you needanother boost of all that stuff.
But it's like it shouldn't, youshouldn't eat like a chicken
wing and then feel like you need20 more because you're like

(43:35):
unsatisfied.
Because, anyway, it's going backto that, just getting your,
getting all the good stuff fromyour food that is nutrient dense
versus needing to buy lots morePropel or Gatorade.

Chrissy (43:48):
That's the truth.
I find myself sometimes when I'mlike really kind of just having
a meh day and I'm like, man, Ireally want some Chick-fil-A
right now.
And I go through the wholeconversation in my head of, oh.
I want Chick-fil-A.
Well then I'm gonna have astomach ache and then I'm gonna
feel horrible and I'm gonna haveno energy tomorrow and I'm just
gonna feel like a drag.
And then I'm gonna feel morelike a drag because I already

(44:10):
feel like a drag, which ismaking me want the Chick-fil-A.
And then I have, I go throughlike this whole spiral and then
eventually I'm just like, okay,fine.
I won't get the Chick-fil-A.
It's not even worth it for thenext 24 hours of like how I'm
gonna feel.
But that's so true of like thefood and the drink that you put
into your body, it, it fuelsyou, and so give yourself good

(44:32):
fuel.
Like you put regular gasolineinto a diesel engine truck.
It's not gonna work.
And so kinda do that toourselves sometimes too.
It's like we put things that Goddid not create as food to be
pretend fuel for us, and it justdoesn't work.

Katie (44:52):
And beyond, like fueling you.
I, I think we always have thisfocus of like, yes, you, the,
the food and the drinks that youput in your body give you the
energy for the day and they,they are that fuel, they are
that gasoline to make yourengine go.
But even more than that.
Like, you literally become whatyou eat.
Like your food turns into thecells in your body.

(45:12):
And so you think about eatinglike a Big Mac or something and
like, do you want that to beyour body?
Like your cells regenerate, youknow, you shed your cells and
like you think about like yourskin, like you lose skin, you
lose hair.
All these things are sheddingconstantly and so your body like
literally regenerates itself outof whatever you are putting in

(45:33):
your body.
And so.
Do you want to be a Big Mac ordo you want to be a pasture
raised chicken?
I wanna be a chicken.

Chrissy (45:42):
A chicken.
Everything's a chicken.
And baby chickens.
Human chickens.
Kitten chickens, doggo chickens.

Katie (45:49):
Um, I wrote this down and I have to share this for the
mamas out there who are lookingfor ideas of like, if you have
kiddos who they've been drinkingGatorade or Propel or the fun,
fancy drinks at sporting eventsand stuff, and like all their
friends are doing it, if yourkiddos need some kind of
replacement for that fancydrink, a great substitute or

(46:13):
alternative to that is getting.
An electrolyte from a companythat does kind of like the
flavors they are used to andenjoy.
Uh, Just ingredients.
The company that we get ourelectrolytes from, they make a
Blue Hawaiian flavor out of allof the good stuff.
Um, no dyes, no added sugars andstuff.

(46:34):
And so you can actually use thatin order to make kind of like
your homemade.
Like your own version of blueGatorade for your kiddos.
So that's a great way to do it.
Again, it, the electrolytes area little bit more expensive.
I'm sure.
Maybe you could find like ahomemade recipe, like just
Google it.
Or actually, uh, here's a protip.
I've been using, AI like eitherGoogle Gemini or Chat GPT lately

(46:58):
to help me make.
Alternative ingredient recipes,like actual, like healthy
recipes.
In fact, I've been using it forice cream recipes lately to
like, how can I naturallysweeten this instead of using
tons of boatloads of sugar?
Like, how can I do this withoutsugar?
Um, and how can I make it yummyand all this stuff?
So you could even ask an AIengine to make some good

(47:23):
electrolyte alternatives foryou.
I'd be curious to know what itcomes up with.
So if you try that, let us know.
But yeah.
Do you have any other thoughtson hydration?
Chrissy?

Chrissy (47:33):
I don't think so.
I think we kind of covered it.
I just wanna give a little sneakpeek into our next episode.
Um, this next episode, afterthis one next week, we are going
to continue the conversationabout beverages and drinks and
hydration.
Except next week's episode isgoing to be focused more on
coffee, tea, and alcohol, whichare very hot topics.

(47:58):
So, um.
make sure you subscribe and getthose notifications so that you
can tune into next week'sepisode because it's gonna be a
good one.
We're gonna be talking aboutwhat a lot of professionals say
about coffee, tea, and alcohol,Not everybody agrees on the
severity of these items.

(48:20):
So, um, I'm very interested innext week's episode, so Yeah.
Make sure subscribe so you canhear about it.
And yeah.

Katie (48:29):
If, you have been enjoying our show lately and you
want to support us, you're,you're just like, we wanna hear
more of this.
Honestly, guys, the best way todo that is by leaving us.
A rating, a comment, um, areview, something like that.
We really do enjoy hearing fromyou and we really do actually

(48:49):
read everything that you sendus, whether it is through emails
or comments on our Facebookgroup, or comments on our
podcast.
Um, and speaking of comments.
I want to also introduce anothernew segment that we are going to
be introducing to our show,which is called Community
Conversations.

(49:10):
So this is going to be a shortsegment here at the very end of
our show where we're going tohighlight something from you,
our audience.
And now this could be anythingfrom a review that you've left
us a comment on, um, apodcasting platform.
It could be a bit of aconversation that we had from
you.
Like, if you are a friend orfamily member who's texted us
and said something about ourpodcast, or you've messaged us

(49:32):
on Facebook or on our Instagram,we, we wanna share, like, the
conversations that we are havingbecause we actually are having
them.
And it's been really fun.
Um, so we wanna kind of continuethat conversation as a group.
And so today's shout out isactually from, the account is
called Victory Garden.
Homestead who left us a commenton our Spotify on the Farm to

(49:55):
Table episode that we had now.
Victory Garden Homestead said.
That"you've mentioned about thegamble you take with organic
food in the grocery store, andyou're totally right.
Not only that, you have to worryabout certain coatings and
chemicals that are now labeledas quote unquote organic being
sprayed on our foods, and thatis beyond disgusting and

(50:17):
ridiculous!" Now, hey, victorygarden Homestead, we completely
agree.
Um, we feel the same way aboutthis and I've been doing a lot
more research re recently on thetopic or like the, this APEEL,
or A-P-E-E-L, um, appeal is acoating that is going on a lot

(50:37):
of fruits and vegetables latelyon a lot of our produce, it is
created by Bill Gates and hisfoundation.
Um, and unfortunately it haskind of passed the, organic
certification stuff so it can goon foods that are considered
organic and, and these foods cancontinue to keep their organic

(50:59):
certification.
Um, there's a lot of crazinessgoing on about it because it's
still chemicals.
That's, that's the whole point,is that it's still not natural.
Um, and it's supposed to helpkeep the crispness of the food
and all this stuff.
So some people are like, it'sreally great, but then a lot of
us are kind of like, well, it'sstill a chemical.
I don't want to eat it.

(51:19):
If you are trying to avoid thiscoating on your food, I've been
doing a little bit of researchfrom places that are avoiding
it.
Costco, actually right now, isone of those places that has
agreed not to use APEEL coatedproduce, um, Azure Standard,
which I have mentioned in thepast.
I actually think I talked aboutit today.
Yeah.

(51:40):
Um, they also are not usingappeal.
I actually learned that ourlocal Meyer store, I called
them, I literally called them.
If you're curious, you can callyour grocery store and ask them.
They should know whether or notthey're doing it.
But, um, the, the guy who runstheir produce section, he said
that, they are not using it attheir store, but he doesn't know
about Meyers, um, like acrossthe country and stuff.

(52:02):
So you can call your localstore, but that, I just wanted
to.
You know, share that littletidbit for you guys if you're
curious about that wholeconversation.
Um, that's what I've beenlearning about it.
But anyway, we don't want to letthis conversation necessarily
end here.
This, this conversation aboutappeal coated produce, as well

(52:23):
as beverages and hydration.
Um, so this whole crunchyjourney that we are on is.
Honestly, it's so much betterthan when we are having these
conversations and we arelearning together.
So, um, we know that you haveyour own stories, whether it is
about, hydration or things like,you know, like last week we were

(52:44):
talking about.
Hunting for, or I guess not lastweek, I would think it was like
two weeks ago.
But we were talking about likehunting for goat cheese and
Chrissy's cold plunge disaster.
And um, yeah, just all thesediscoveries that we're making,
we want to hear your own storiesand your own experiences, so.
Please feel free to write us anemail, leave a comment on this

(53:07):
episode today, or come join usin our Facebook group, Crunchy
Christian Mamas on a budgetwhere we are continuing these
conversations all week long.
And with that, I think we'rejust gonna sign off for the day.
My name is Katie Jones,

Chrissy (53:22):
And my name is Chrissy Rombach.
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