Brandon Lloyd

As the youngest of 7, Brandon Lloyd had a lot to live up to with successful older siblings and knew from a very young age he wanted to make a name for himself. The recognition started in high school as a stellar football and track athlete. Sure, he was a little on the smaller size, but he made up for size with explosive speed. That got the colleges calling.

He chose the University of Illinois mostly because of the degree he would receive. The NFL wasn’t on his radar, and he had his sights set on a degree in broadcast journalism. After being first team All-Big 10 his sophomore and junior years, his focus changed and he left school early for the NFL draft.

The 49’ers chose him in the 4th round of the 2003 draft and from there Brandon started a career that would span a dozen years and involve many teams including the Denver Broncos. During the 2010 season in Denver, Brandon led the league in receiving yards, was an All-Pro and a Pro Bowler.

After football, Brandon finished his undergraduate degree and took it a step further with an MBA in 2022. He’s currently working in the insurance industry and being dad to two teenage boys.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Lovey Smith says to me, yougot money, right, So yeah,
it says good. So you're notcoming here for any money. So we're
going to sign you to a veteranminimum. So if you cause us any
inkling of trouble, we'll cut you. It will be no sweat off our
back. So you're gonna come here, You're gonna be a model teammate and

(00:21):
consummate professional, and you're going toexecute and play ball right sick, you
got it. Welcome to cut,Traded, Fired, Retired. This is
a podcast featuring conversations with professional athletesand coaches who have been gracious enough to
tell their stories of changes, setbacks, and moving forward. I'm your host,
Susie Wargen. It's common perception thatthe youngest child in a family is

(00:45):
a little spoiled. Brandon Lloyd willbe the first to tell you that was
true for him growing up in Missouri, as he was the youngest of seven.
However, it also meant he hadsome big expectations to fulfill because of
some successful older siblings. Let's justsay he heard why aren't you more like
Mark a few times. Brandon playednearly every down of high school football and
was also a stellar track athlete,he took his skills to the University of

(01:08):
Illinois, where eventually he settled intothe wide receiver position and was first team
All Big Ten his sophomore and junioryears. In two thousand and three,
he left school early for the NFLDraft and was taken in the fourth round
by the forty nine ers. Hewent through trades and cuts with a couple
of teams before being traded to theBroncos, where in twenty ten he led
the NFL in receiving yards and hadan All Pro and Pro Bowl year.

(01:33):
There were more trades and releases beforeBrandon retired in twenty fifteen, and since
then he's finished his degree, gothis MBA, and currently works in the
insurance industry while also being dad totwo teenage boys. He's got some great
tell it like it is stories,ladies and gentlemen. Brandon Lloyd Cut,
Traded, Fired, Retired podcast withSusie Wargin. Hello Brandon Lloyd, Hello,

(01:57):
how are you good? Good?It's so good, I know it
is. I saw you as anhonorary Coin Toss captain a few weeks ago
at a Broncos game, and itwas great to see you out there.
It's been a long time. Yeah, and you're like, you still here?
Do you live here? I know, I have no idea, so
I'm like, well, if you'rehere, you gotta be on the podcast,
right. Well, this is somuch fun. It's good to have

(02:21):
you here, it's good to kindof know what you're doing now. And
we'll get into that, but asyou know, we always start at the
beginning of where you grew up.You were born in Kansas City, Missouri,
that's right, and grew up there, went to Blue Springs High School,
Blue Springs High School? What wasgrowing up like for you? You
are the last of seven kids,so you were the baby. Did you
play a lot of sports? Whatdid you do growing up? All sports

(02:44):
all the time? You know.I grew up in a quintessential suburban neighborhood
outside of Kansas City, Missouri.So it was football, baseball, basketball,
the kids are wrestling, soccer.You know, it was big time
sports neighborhood. And I played footballstarting in third grade. That was flag
football. I was too small toplay tackle football, and fourth and fifth

(03:07):
and sixth grade so I played baseball, and then back in seventh grade,
I rejoined Pop Warner and pop Warner. I was able to weigh in with
all my pads on, and thenI put two two and a half pound
weights in my in my tent topit in order to get on the field.
I was getting too anti and no, I was getting too anti,
you know, in school, becausethat, you know, I was so

(03:27):
rambunctious when I was younger that mydad was like, man, you need
to do something. You either needto box, so you need to play
football. And I was like,all right, I'll play football and into
a whole seventh grader though you addedweights to your pants, you could weigh
more. How'd you think of that? That was the coach's idea. I
mean it was incredibly dangerous, butyou know, it kind of goes in
line with, you know, mylife as a risk taker and myself in

(03:50):
uncomfortable positions exactly. Yeah, Ohmy gosh, that's crazy. Now did
you always play a wide receiver position? dB? Is that kind of where
you were? Well? I havea brother that was, for you,
years older than me, and hewas always quarterback and that's who we grew
up watching. We always liked WarrenMoon, Ranald Cunningham. We grew up
watching Joe Montana you know. Ieven taught myself how to throw left handed

(04:11):
so I could throw like Steve Youngand Boomerasias. And I loved the quarterback
position and the playmaking and being inthe mix. You know, with a
little league football, it's so boring, right, being anything other than the
quarterback. So with my attention span, I needed to be the quarterback because
I need to be in every play. And so I started off as quarterback,
and then that later changed when Igot to high school. Okay,
so when you played baseball, wereyou the catcher had to be exactly because

(04:34):
the catcher is on every single play. I mean, you know, they
want to put the fast kids inthe in the outfield, but I would
check out and so Swat flies outthere. Yeah. And so I had
a great arm. I was athleticwith catching the ball, even though I
wasn't big. They liked the bigburly kids back there to be the back
stop to stop the ball. ButI had really great reflexes at a really
good arm, and I could bein the mix. I like putting on

(04:56):
all the catcher's gear. Oh sure, you know, so I was between
pitcher and catcher. Those from mytwo positions in baseball. Oh that's funny.
Okay, So your older brother thatplayed quarterback. What's the breakdown sibling
wise, male and female? Didyou have other sports siblings that you kind
of looked up to. There's fourboys and three girls. Our dad is
our athletic pride and joy, eventhough he started his family in high school,
so he wasn't able to continue onand play. But the boys were

(05:19):
incredibly athletic people that I looked upto. They're just so, you know,
just had like really good bodies andthey made things look effortless in sports.
And that's who I really looked upto. And so I had a
brother that was four years older thanme who was incredibly academic. His name's
Mark. He's incredibly academic, he'sincredibly well liked. He was a great

(05:40):
leader on the team. And andas you can imagine, to poll their
opposite. But I grew up supposedto be mar brother. That's like a
flashback. It sounds like I heardthat a lot. Aren't you, March
Brother? What happened to you?Right? How funny? So, but
you know what, everybody is different. I mean, you can grow up
in the same house and you havekids. Now you have two boys that

(06:01):
are in high school, and I'mguessing even though they're what a year or
two apart from each other, they'retotally different, completely different. Yeah,
that's right. It's weird. Imean, I've got boy and girl and
they're just different in of that.But I mean they're so different. And
sometimes my husband I look at eachother and we're like, did we do
something different with her that we didn'tdo with him? Because it's wow,
Yes, it is wild, allright. So as you go along then

(06:24):
in your football career brand and yougo into high school, is that when
you switch over to then that widereceiver spot. That's right. So I
was following in my brother's footsteps andbeing a quarterback at Blue Springs High School.
He was one. He was thesecond black quarterback at Blue Springs High
School. He was the first blackhomecoming king and football player and quarterback at
the high school. Wow, that'sa lot to live up too. I

(06:45):
mean, it was awesome. Hewas the first sibling in the family to
get athletic scholarship and so he gota Division two scholarship to Missouri Southern,
and so I was like, dang, if he can go Division two,
man I can go Division one,like, how far can I I go?
Right? And I was kind ofhow I was looking at that.
I was a freshman C team quarterback. I was still incredibly little, you

(07:08):
know. I was probably five tosix five seven. My sophomore year,
I had a growth spurt to aboutfive ten, and I'm the varsity quarterback.
I'm the starting varsity quarterback. Iknow, starting varsity quarterback. I
fell in for a quarterback with makingsome errors off the field and errors on
the field, and I get thrustin have an incredible thirty six point come

(07:28):
back in a football game against ourcrosstown rival. Oh. It was incredible.
We finished the season losing the firstround the playoffs, which we typically
would do, and then going intothat next off season, the head coach,
Bob Batty, hall of fame highschool coach in Louisville, Kentucky,
my father would come after he gotoff in the second job. He'd sit
in the parking lot and watch footballpractice. So Bob Baty whistles my dad

(07:51):
over, come over, mister Lloyd. After practice. My dad walks up.
Bob says to my dad, misterLloyd, I'm sure you can understand
what I'm about to say, thesuperintendent Sun's moving in town. I want
to keep my job, so I'mgoing to start him at quarterback. He
looked at me and he says,Brandon, you have a couple options.

(08:13):
You can back him up, oryou can change positions. So my dad's
looking at me with his eyebrows raised, like what you're going to do?
Boy? I said, all right, my favorite athlete is Deon Sanders.
I got posters all over my wall. So I'm like, all right,
how about cornerback? He says,you got it? I said, well,
Deon Sanders played both ways. Isaid, how about wide receiver.

(08:33):
Everyone made the football team at BlueSprings High School? No cuts, no
cuts, So we had a fullplatoon offense defense. And that's the way
the tradition had been at Blue Springs. So I was about to become the
first two way athlete at Blue Springs. Oh wow, with that request,
he didn't even flinch. You gotit. We also ran the run and
shoot, and so in that wehad a deceptive play where the quarterback was

(08:54):
also the punter, so we couldalso run a play or punt the ball,
catch the defense, and so offguard. So I said, can
I still be the punter, hesays, yep. And I was also
a kicker because I like Nick Lowrywhen I was when I was growing up,
So I was like, can Ialso be the kicker? He says,
you got it? So you playedin all three phases. Wow.

(09:16):
And so that's how I switched positions. So I was a defensive back.
When I was going through high school, I played both ways as wide receiver,
and I was a kicker and apunter. So when I was recruited
to college, I was recruited asa defensive back. Interesting talked about being
recruited and you went to the Universityof Illinois. Did you get a lot
of especially if you're a two wayplayer, I can imagine you garnered some
attention a lot. Yeah. Well, And I was also a seven foot

(09:37):
three high jumper. Oh geez.I was a twenty five to two long
jumper. I was a thirteen toseven high hurdleer one ten high hurdles,
and so it was really explosive,especially for being such a small guy.
Yeah that I was. You know, it was probably one hundred and forty
pounds, you know, five footten, five foot eleven, one hundred

(09:58):
and forty pounds explosive Yeah, andnow all these explosive abilities, so you
name it. And it was awesome. I mean they were rolling in from
every single conference everywhere. My Dad'slooking at all the letters like, yeah,
I think you need to go toWest Point, boy, you need
some discipline to dark on West Point. No, you know, my parents

(10:22):
stayed out of it. Really,it's your decision. You know. My
parents were really good at that.You know, by the time I came
along, they were expert parents.Absolutely, do you have a baby book
right after the first one we stopped? Yeah, yeah, you know,
they were experienced. And I alwaysjoking. In my most formidable years going
through high school, I was prettymuch an only child, and you know,

(10:43):
I had the whole house to myself. So I was incredibly spoilt growing
up because my sisters are were adultswhen I was. Yes, so they
come home from college or visiting homefrom their work jobs and be like,
hey, here's twenty dollars. Youwant to watch my you know, here's
twenty dollars, Come on my lawn. You want to go see an R

(11:03):
rated movie? You want to drivestick? You know, wow, you
got all the benefit. Yeah,so that's a lot of decision making then
to be put on you if you'retrying to figure out where to go.
And it wasn't because this is itwas exactly what I envisioned. You know.
I studied sports illustrated when I wasyoungster. You know, I had
those scholastic memberships when you're in elementarysquad. Yeah, all the sports illustrated.

(11:26):
I read all the stories. Istudied. Being a professional athlete.
I recorded the San Francisco forty nineers and Atlanta Falcons. I was following
Deon Sanders when I was young andI read his autobiography and when I was
in seventh grade, Money Power,Sex, How fame almost ruined my life.
So I got that at the BlackExpo. One of my sisters took

(11:48):
me to the Black Expo in KansasCity and we found the book in the
album. My eyes were wide open. She's looking at it. You want
it. I'm like, yeah,I want that. So she bought it
for me, and so it reallyshowed me one how to market myself as
a young person, how to differentiatemyself as an athlete. That's why I
wanted to excel in so many sports. I was like, dang, I
was like Deionna Sanders played baseball,he played football, and he ran track

(12:11):
at Florida State Division One. Allright, I'm going to do it,
Debt. So I became a twosport athlete. All the schools that recruit
me were agreeing to me playing footballand running track and field, But when
it came down to that college selection, I was always hamming it up.
When I was young, I wasan entertainer. Anytime the camp quarter was
out, I could give you amonologue on Martin Luther King are any sports

(12:33):
happenings that were going on? Ihad an opinion about everything, or I
was singing and dancing. I wason the student run journalism program ever since
middle school. I was in choirever since elementary school all the way up
to my junior year in high school. So I knew I wanted to be
an entertainment So I selected journalism becauseI always looked up to Brian Gumbole and

(12:54):
a Moderate Shod and James Brown.I really just loved how they really did.
Particularly loved a mad Rashot. Howyou know, he was a former
player and then he had this relationshipswith the players and the stories are really
positive, and so I admired that. So I was like, all right,
I'm gonna go to journalism. Soit eliminated about ninety nine percent of
the schools who were looking at me. So schools will call me from the

(13:16):
SEC. I know we don't havea journalism program, but will you consider
coming here? No? Sorry,thank you. And so it really whittled
down my selection process. Interesting tom you at Northwestern University of Illinois UCLA,
And that was pretty much how Iwhittled it down. And the process
was just so much fun. Youknow, this is around the time where

(13:37):
Blue Chips came out the movie andhe got game. So I said,
that's how I want my college recruitingexperience to go, minus the money.
I don't want to get in trouble. I don't want money, but I
want to have a ton of funwith this. And it did, you
know. So I had had areally great time, took my trips,
brought mom and dad, had alot of fun, and you know,

(13:58):
the experiences with the teams materialize themselves. University of Illinois offered me a scholarship
my junior year after a seven onseven tournament up there. I was playing
defensive back. I had all thethings on. I looked like Dion Sanders.
Look I was behaving like Dion Sanders. The active players at Illinois were

(14:18):
on their golf carts around the field. Every field we were on, the
players were on, and the coacheswere on, and they were hooting me
up and hyping me up fun andreally it was a really neat experience.
Same thing happened with Kansas State.Same thing happened at the University of Missouri.
So it's kind of like everywhere Iwent my junior year, it was

(14:39):
there, it was happening. Iwas in the publications, and it was
really building up. I red itwas. So what was the final decision
then? To go to University ofIllinois. The final decision was on the
four trips I went on. TheUniversity of Illinois was the only trip where
I didn't have a racist encounter.Interesting, as you can imagine, in
order to avoid that, what teamswould do is they segregate the host and

(15:03):
the recruit. So a black hostwould host a black recruit, and a
white active team member would host awhite recruit. I went to the University
of Missouri. Man, we don'tdeal with them white expletives like that.
I went to Kansas state man,we don't deal with them. Insert whatever
racial slur you want to enter inthat Oklahoma same thing. What was going

(15:26):
through my mind was that when Iwas going through the recruiting process in high
school, I would get called intothe athletic director's office and an athletic director
would say, Coach McMahon from theUniversity of Illinois is asking to talk to
mister Barnhardt, your elementary school teacher. He's asking to talk to several other
teachers administrators. And so I'm like, dang, Illinois is really doing their

(15:48):
homework on you. And so ifthese other schools were doing their homework on
me, they know I'm not likethis. So I went to Blue Springs
High School. It's predominantly white.So if anybody is recruiting me and knows
anything about me, they know Idon't have a problem with white people,
and white people have never had aproblem with me. So and when it
came down to us, I waslooking at the due diligence Illinois was doing.

(16:11):
Greg McMahon would travel down to watchmy track practices in the spring.
He'd sit up in the stands sohe wouldn't break any n Cuba rules.
He'd sit up there and then Iwalk off the track. He'd whistle down,
Hey, tell your mother and fathersaid hello. I'd wait say goodbye,
he said keep your grades up.He getting his car and drive all
the way back to Champagne. Holyhow far away that it's seven over seven

(16:33):
hour drive. So you know,it was just like that type of serials
to touch points. Yes, itreally showed that they cared. They wanted
me there, they thought highly ofme, and they wanted me to succeed,
not only in sports, but mostlyThey had the broadcast journalism program to
deliver what I was expecting. Soall the chips really just fell into place.

(16:56):
Yeah. And then on my recruitingtrip, my host Mohammad Abdullah from
Barnegat, New Jersey, we hungout with offensive lineman Kenny Boyle. He
was a tight end from Springfield,Illinois. He and my parents hit it
off. I was like, man, I'm going to hang out with Kenny.
He's like, yeah, we'll catchup with them in a minute.
Boom, We hung out with Kenny, those white players. Yeah, we

(17:17):
went to the bars and then wewent to the black fraternity set in after
hours. Illinois had the largest Greeksystem in the nation at the time.
So it was every single black fraternityand sorority on the campus. The whole
mix was there. Wow for me, and I felt welcome that I can
spend time with the white players,the black players, the white part of

(17:40):
the student body, the black partof the student Nobody was going to raise
an eyebrow with whoever you hung outwith, exactly. Yeah, So you
go to University of Illinois, youhave a good freshman year, sophomore year,
you break your femur, yes,and you're out the whole year,
but you come back and then thatnext year is when you guys go to
the Sugar Bowl, right right?Did you keep doing track though? As
well? I did track my freshmanyear, got third in the indoors and

(18:03):
high jump and third and the sixtymeter hurdles. We won the Big Ten
and track and field that year.I was Newcomer of the Year at the
University of Illinois. Gosh for academicsand athletics. The football coach and the
head track coach by my side,you know for the banquet. It was
an incredible start. That's really coolto my freshman year, I bet all

(18:23):
right, So after so your sophomoreyear which is your third year there.
Right, you go to the SugarBowl and that year your first team all
Big ten. Right, your sophomoreyear, Yeah, and then after your
junior year you declare for the NFLdraft. Yeah. The after the the
Sugar Bowl year, Ron Turner callsme in his office and he says,

(18:44):
I heard you going to the NFL. I was shocked. I was like,
hell, no, I would neverdo that. My parents would kill
me. I would never do that. He's like, oh, I was
just checking because the scouts were sayingthat you had an agent. I was
like, I do not have anagent. I would never do that.
I'm finishing school. He's like,all right, just checking, going to

(19:07):
class. But I left the office. I go, oh, snap,
I'm good enough. I had neverthought. Yeah. I hadn't thought about
it till that. I was justgoing to school, getting get grades,
being a student athlete, having thetime in my life. I wasn't thinking
about that. You know. It'slike I went to school for school.

(19:29):
I could have went to the SECschool, to the ACC schools and went
to school to become a professional athlete. That wasn't my goal. No,
it's why you picked the journalism major. At University Illinois. I was like,
man, I'm gonna get a nice, reputable education, to get a
degree that can hold some weight inthe industry, and I can't go enter
that. You know. It's theconversation my oldest sister had with me when
I was selecting colleges. It wasan eleventh hour and I hadn't made a

(19:51):
decision because I was still like,man, dog, maybe I'll go out
to UCLA. I mean, thecoach was just spending long nights on the
phone with me. The track programis awesome, The footbow program is awesome.
The journalism program nothing better than beingin Hollywood. It was right up
my alley, but a little toofar from me. My sister, oldest
sister says to me, college isa use you situation, Brandon. They're

(20:15):
gonna use you and make millions ofdollars off of your athletic performance, and
in turn, you're gonna use themfor a college degree. That was like
my true light bulb moment where Iwas like, Illinois, it is because
I can go here. They foundJerry Rice at an HBCU Southern Mississippi Valley.
If I'm good enough, they canfind me at Illinois one Power five.

(20:40):
Yes, Big ten school. Yeah, the team was one in ten
the year before I went there,But that didn't matter to me. If
I'm good enough, they'll find me. And so when I left Coach Turner's
office, I was like, I'mgoing pro. So I had it in
my mind going into that next season. That next offseason, had an internship
at Fox Sports Saint Louis. That'spart of my agreement to come to Illinois.

(21:03):
I was going to get a majorinternship. And so like your junior
year, if your grades are adequate, you can go. So I go
down there. I have internship withFox Sports and at Saint Louis, I'm
covering the Saint Louis rams. I'mout there in practice and all of a
sudden, I get a whistle.Hey, it's Tory Holton Isaac Bruce waving
at me, and they're like,come over. I'm looking at my handler.

(21:25):
I'm like he's looking at me,like, dude, you got a
media credential. Those guys are callingyou over there, you better go,
And I'm like all right. SoI walk on the field and Isaac Bruce
and Tory Holt asked me to lunch. So they say, hey, why
don't you come into the training roomover lunch. We want to talk to
you. I sat in there atlunch with Tory Holt and Isaac Bruce,

(21:47):
and they laid it out for me. You need to elevate your game.
You need to do these set ofdrills. You need to put the gloves
on, because I was wearing atape on my fingers because you know,
the glove technology wasn't good back then, and I like Tim Brown, so
I was wearing tape on my fingers, Like, man, you need to
put the gloves on because every dropis going to cost you money, all
right, And they just kind ofput a mentality in my head about you

(22:11):
need to be thinking like you needseventy five to eighty yards a game that'll
put you over a thousand. Youneed to think about your touchdowns. You
need to think about taking care ofthe ball. So they put this mentality
in my head. And so Icame back from the internship, which was
amazing, covering the Cardinals, coveredthe Rams, had a little NHL in
there. I mean, it wasan incredible experience, splicing up beta tapes,

(22:36):
making highlight reels, you know,covering the little the football talk programs,
the weekly program. It was awesomeexperience, got independent study credits for
it. But I came back withthese drills and the other players are looking
at me like what are you doing? I was like, Tory holding Isaac
Bruce told me to do these drills, and they're like, all right,
we're doing let's go. What aI mean? And how random that you

(22:59):
end up going and then they recognizeyou and have you hey, come aside
and have lunch with us? Oh? Random? Exactly what I did?
And how did these guys even knowme? I mean, obviously it made
enough of an impression and they knewwho you were. I'm always amazed at
the networking and how you never knowwhen that door's going to open. And
had you not been in that placeat that time, who knows where your
path would have gone. Yeah.Had I not taken care of my business

(23:21):
in the classroom, you know,even when I fractured my femur, the
university stepped up. Usually you can'ttake journalism classes until your third year on
campus. They let me take onmy second year. Oh, because you
were injured. That was injured.Nice and I didn't have to show up
to practice. I went I stayedin school until three pm. I went
straight to rehab and then I madeit back from Carlisle Hospital to the stadium

(23:44):
in time for study hall. Andso it's like I had a like a
whole college experience, a student experiencethat I that's cool. I never thought
I was going to have, yeah, and that I couldn't have as a
student athlete. But I embraced that. It wasn't such a down part because
I was like, you know,I'm not here for this anyway. It
stinks that that happened to me,but I'm gonna make the most of this.
He turned it into a positive.Had to Yeah. Okay. So

(24:07):
then after your junior year, thenyou do declare for the draft. You
end up getting drafted in the fourthround two thousand and three by the forty
nine ers. What was it likegoing through combine and everything else and all
the phone calls you get, Anddid you think it was going to be
the forty nine ers or did youthink it was going to be somebody else.
The only person happy in the NFLdraft is the first overall pick.
Everyone else thinks they should have beendrafted higher. Of course, yes,

(24:30):
And I was scheduled to be afirst day pick. Oh so, if
you can imagine how upset I wasabout going into the middle of the fourth
round, I was incredibly upset.I was ticked off going through the combine
experience was it was just taxing onme. I was just I was just
malnourished in college. I wasn't readyquite to enter the NFL draft, just

(24:56):
with my mindset of going to school. I was, I was going to
school. I wasn't really I wasn'treally thinking about it. Honestly, That's
why we say the NFL happened tome. I wasn't seeking that out,
and so I tried to make themost of it through the training I flew
to from California to Indianapolis. Igot the fluid during the combine. Oh

(25:18):
no, so I was just notup to performing and I ran incredibly slow.
I ran four seven forty. Ididn't weigh in very heavy. You
know. I wasn't my usually poppy, explosive self. It wasn't a great
experience. I was again probably showingup there maybe one hundred and eighty pounds.
Andre Johnson was in that draft classand Kwan Bolden, Taylor Jacobs,

(25:44):
Charles Johnson out of Michigan State.I mean these cattle was beasts. Oh
yeah, And here I am outthere does not performing hot. Yeah,
And so I redeemed myself at theat my college workout, I turned around
and ran a four four four,which was right there where I was poppy,

(26:04):
explosive, lighting it up in thecatching drills, and it was nice.
Well, that's good you had thatopportunity, because the combine can just
be such a downer. I mean, one thing happens and then you're hosed.
So if you don't get that proday at your college, you're really
screwed. Yeah. And walking aroundthe meat market, I just what it
represents is it's a total meat market. I know. Yeah. And so

(26:26):
now the next morning I wake upand just completely dismissed it. And I
went to the Blue Springs High Schoolbecause I was home to the track meet.
And then my agent called like,hey, the forty nine ers are
going to pick you up. On'tyour head on home? So I came
home and Dennis Ericson called and EricYarbor called me, and Eric Yarbery was
just I can't believe it. Ican't believe you fell this far. But

(26:47):
it's not good for you, butfor us they felt the happy Yeah,
we're so happy. It just feltgood to be wanted. But I was
mad. I was going into campwith a chip on my shoulder. What
was helpful was the forty nine Ersin two thousand and three with Greg Nappa
running the exact same offense word forword as Ron Turner was running at the

(27:10):
University of Illinois. Word for word, word, Oh, my for word.
Wow. We ran the pro WestCoast offense at the University of Illinois
and coming right into quintessential Pro footballWest Coast offense with the San Francisco there's
a gift because that can be sucha learning curve. I mean, you're
very bright, you would have caughton. But to be able to go

(27:30):
from college to pro and have theexact same vernacular, I didn't have to
study. So what I was thinkingabout was little details. I was watching
Tara Loans. I was watching TyStreets that had this really shifty neat receiver
out in the University of Tennessee,Cedric Wilson. He was a four year
guy. I was watching the wayhe sunk his hips and shifted his body

(27:52):
weight when he was going in andout of routes. I was watching how
Ty Streets set corners up at thetop of the routes. I was watching
how Terrell Owens was working out afterpractice and eating right, and I was
like, all right, I canbuild a player out of this, you
know, Like again, I didn'tgo to school for to become a professional
athlete. I'm just here. Andso I started to build my own player

(28:14):
off of what was in the receiverroom. And I knew the plays right.
That was easy, and so itreally gave me a leg up.
Obviously. I was just dealing withthe issues of the workload on my body.
I was pulling muscles, you know, rolling ankles, and just I
was just so little out there.Oh yeah, but you got away your
very first game, you block apunt, you catch your first touchdown pass

(28:37):
November of your rookie season, sothey put you in right away. Oh
yeah. And it was it wasone thing, you know, being a
fourth round draft pick and understand thatI was going to have to play special
teams to make the team. Iwasn't going to play over t O,
I wasn't going to play over TaStreets. I could probably I could.
I could probably battle it out withCedric, but he was so so crafty

(29:00):
and good and he played special teams. So it was tough. But what
was really helpful was that Dennis Ericksonbelieved in me. That's what happens when
when you're drafted to a team,these coaches are so invested in your success.
Dennis Erickson came out after the firstpreseason game in Kansas City, and
I scored a touchdown in my hometownand my first preseason game. Cool completely

(29:22):
lit it up. The game wasso much fun I had. I was
just kicking butt. Dinnist Eraction saysin the San Francisco newspaper, Brandon Lloyd's
making this team. He's doing allthe right things. This see, this
is unheard of. I got somuch says that no coach. I got
so much crap for it in thelocker room. I bet wow. But
it was like that confidence, youknow, and it was the pressure of

(29:45):
saying, all right, this coachbelieves in me. Am I gonna let
him down? Or am I goingto live up to it. That was
a healthy start for me in theNFL. And you stay there for three
years, yes, stayed there fortwo thousand and six, and then they
trade you to the then Washington Redskins. Yeah, Dennis got fired and they
brought Mike Nolan in. That's whenthings change for players, is when the
new coach comes in. They havea completely different vision. They have a

(30:08):
completely different set of player types,body types, personality types, offenses that
they want to run. And MikeNolan cleaned house. I mean he released
the start quarterback tim Or Tay andin the middle of the offensive meeting to
start Alex Smith. Wow. Andit was just chaotic. It was chaotic.

(30:30):
We'd have team meetings and it wasalmost like that's what the environment he
wanted. We had team meets withBrian Young, the Hall of Famer.
He's in tears. Guys, yougotta believe in this. We don't know
when this your last day. AndI'm sitting in this meeting room like damn.
He's got him worried about, youknow, his future on this team.
He was the only unhealthy I think, thank you, very unhealthy.

(30:51):
That's not how you lead. Andwe see it over and over again.
You see the coaches that know howto connect with players. You don't have
to be their best friend, butyou have to be to connect with them.
They love you they'll run through awall for you, but they also
respect you. But if you don'tsee that from the other side, and
if a coach's tactic and you alsoplayed here with Josh McDaniels being here,

(31:11):
when a tactic is scaring and makingeverybody fear for everything, you're not going
to get anywhere. You won't getanybody to play right for you. It's
so toxic. I don't know whyanybody thinks that actually works. Agreed,
which led into my first trade.So I finished my third season well over
seven hundred yards. I mean,it was a pretty big buzz in the

(31:33):
NFL around what was going on withme with the forty nine ers. This
was the last year of restricted freeagency in the National Football League, so
going into restricted free agency, theteam could match the contract, so they
put a low tender on me,so a team would have to give up
a fourth round pick in order toget me. So the forty nine Ers
put that tinder on me. Sothat's why I always say that when the

(31:57):
Washington Football team, when I'm madethat move, I was traded four not
traded. They gave up two twourthround picks in order to get me on
that team. And I got ablockbuster contract. I was traded four.
That team actually saw something on thefilm and they wanted me on that team.
It wasn't the forty nine ers justgetting rid of you. It was

(32:19):
the other team wanting you. Soit is a positive. That's how I
look at it. Good. That'sgood. And then when you go there,
Joe Gibbs is your coach and thetwo of you didn't see ida.
It was miserable what happened there.The development of players just wasn't there.
The coaching staff is inadequate. AlSaanders came from the Saint Louis Rams and
he positioned himself in coach Gibbs eyesas the architect to the greatest show on

(32:44):
turf. He was just the receivercoach. He was not Mike Martins,
but he had positioned himself as thatand he really struggled to install that playbook
with the team. And we hadsome really talented players. Santana Moss,
myself, Antoine Randelel, James Thrashwas on that team. He was a

(33:05):
special teams player. But we hadsome solid players and Chris Cooley. How
could I forget him at tight end? I mean, he's just incredible players.
When you say he couldn't install theplaybook, what do you mean by
that? He put in It waslike a badge of honor when he'd say,
we have two hundred plays going intothis game, and we literally would
have that many plays, and it'sjust like, come on, we cut

(33:27):
on the film and these teams areplaying with ten route combinations. If that,
why do we need two hundred andwe have literally one hundred and fifty
plays going in the same ones.They weren't even tailored to the defense that
we were going against. It wasjust what he wanted, what he thought
he was going to get away with. He benched Smart Brunell, who was

(33:49):
up in age, but he wasa gunslinger and he wanted to throw the
ball around and spread it around forJason Campbell, who was a rookie and
he just wasn't bright enough to bean n F quarterback. And it was
just challenging. So a lot ofthe flat came on to me because I
was new and I'm incredibly flashy onthe team, and so I was getting
a lot of flak. What Iwould tell coach Gibbs is why aren't you

(34:12):
standing up for me? I'm astarting wide receiver. I've only gotten thirteen
looks. You've only thrown the bottome thirteen times, six games into the
season. Whose fault is that?You know? And what Joe Gibbs will
say to me is just shut upand take the money, Just take the
money, Just be quiet, juststop causing so much trouble. And I

(34:34):
was saying to him, f youno, because I have a whole future
that I see for myself and itdoesn't matter about the money. I have
a whole future. I have prideon the work and the craft that I'm
out here to do, and Iwant to do it, and I want
to be coached to do it frommy receiving coach, and I want to

(34:54):
excel for this team. And ifyou don't appreciate that or see that,
then few it was really contentious relationship. Every fan would hope that you are
playing for the game and not justfor your paycheck, because that's what they
go They go there to see agame. They don't just go there to
see guys playing for their paychecks.And the media will rip you apart if

(35:14):
something like that would have come out. You're like, I'm just showing up
to get my weekly paycheck. Andthat was just under the hood of the
dysfunction that just unearthed about what wasgoing on in Washington under Daniel Snyder.
We'd be at practice. He flieshelicopter over the practice land on the hit
the helicopter pad on the practice score. Of course he did. He'd pop
out puffing a Cuban cigar, comesdown on practice. Really cool guy,

(35:37):
but toxic. It was a toxicenvironment. It was like that in the
locker room. And I was fightingthat, and I was resistant to that.
I was standing up against that andstanding up for myself. And that
second year on the team, Ifractured my collar bone in practice, that's
right. And then that was whenI was cut. They cut me two
years into a seven year contract.That was a seven year contract. Yep,

(36:00):
hoefully had something good on the frontside that was guaranteed good. Okay,
that's good. Yeah, Wow,what happened when they cut you?
Did you have a meeting with JoeGibbs or anybody. No, I didn't.
When I fractured my collar bone,says you know, hey, you're
practicing really well. Things are lookingup. We'll just tee it up next
year. Once I got my collarbone to like a decent level. I

(36:21):
wasn't even fully healed because I wasjust trying to get the hell out of
there. They approved me to becleared from the injury report, you know,
a couple of weeks into the offseason, and then agent called me.
It's like, they're gonna cut you. It was like, all right,
and you were ready for it,weren't you? Did you want it
to happen because it was so miserable, you know, And that's what I
was telling my agent when we weregoing there. He was like, you're

(36:44):
gonna hate it here, but youhave to take the money. You're a
fourth round draft pick. They havethe money to do these kind of deals.
They do them, you have totake it. I could have stayed
in San Francisco and try to workwith Alex Smith, who was not a
good thrower by any means, ortake my chances on you know, some
other teams that were in the mix. But to get a blockbuster deal,

(37:07):
I had to go. I toldmy agent, David Dunn, I was
like, hey, I've never hada bad relationship with any of my coaches.
Coaches love me. He's like,yeah, explain what happened with Mike
Nolan. He hates your guts.Wow. So you get cut then by
Washington at that time. That happensin February of eight. The next month

(37:30):
you sign on with Chicago. Yeah. So Ron Turner calls me, he's
offensive coordinator for the Bears. Hesays, hey, Brandon, you know
I can't vouch for anything that hashappened over these last two years in Washington.
We've all read about it. Butwhat I told Lovey is I've known
him since he was sixteen years old, and I know his mom and dad.

(37:51):
That's a good kid. And soLovey brought me out for a workout.
Lit it up. He sits mein the office. Lovey Smith says
to me, you got money,right, said yeah, he says,
good. So you're not coming herefor any money. So we're gonna sign
you to a veteran minimum, whichwas eight like eight ninety five at the
time. Sign you to veteran minimum. So if you cause us any inkling

(38:16):
of trouble, we'll cut you.It will be no sweat off our back.
So you're gonna come here. You'regonna be a model teammate and consummate
professional, and you're going to executeand play ball, right, say you
got it. Wow, that justmade me nervous. Damn okay, and

(38:39):
were you yeah? I did fine? You know he got along with ok
oh yeah, I mean lovey isprobably at that time he was the most
disciplined coach that I'd seen, becausehe said the same things in the public
that he said to the team.Interesting, the message never changed, and
while he played favorites, he didn'tpublicly align himself with Erlacker, who that

(39:02):
year had a domestic violence or LanceBriggs. I mean, these were just
mega, mega stars, and henever publicly aligned his career with these athletes.
And then Lance ran into some offto field issues and so he was
really good with that, but hewas just he kind of fell down on
the x's and o's. He wasa great motivator, but he fed on

(39:23):
the x's and o's just popped onthe team at the wrong time. Year
before they made it all the wayto the Super Bowl, they lost a
ton of players in free agency,Rexah Grossman, and the quarterback was just
you know, yeah, Orton Kylecame in and we had a little bit
of a connection, but they endedup tearing my PCL a few games into
the season on Sunday Night football againstthe Eagles, and so I set out

(39:47):
Levy didn't put me on IR becausethat would have guaranteed my contract. He
comes up to me and says,I'm not putting you on IR. You're
gonna work through this, come backwhenever you're ready. When you're ready,
you're ready. So you stayed onthe active roster, sit on the active
roster. I worked out pool workouts, strengthening myself. In the meantime,
the media is piling on me.Brandon Lloyd's not tough, he's not that

(40:10):
injured. He's not willing to playthrough pain, this and that, and
Lovey's not sticking up for me.It'd be all in the newspaper. I
could be in there eating lunch oreating breakfast. He'll come in. Keep
your head up, just keep training, This is what he'd say to me.
So I came back late, late, late in the season, scored
a touchdown against the Texans, andfinished the season on a torn PCL.

(40:31):
I can't believe he kept you onthe active roster all that time. Yeap,
oh man, because that's those lookbad because it makes everybody question,
well, obviously he's not that hurt. If you haven't put him on IR
yet, but it's all about themoney. Yeah, welcome to the business.
Yeah. And so at the endof that year, the general manager
says, how do you really thinkthat went? I thought. I thought

(40:54):
I was being a good team player, you know, not standing up for
myself like I normally would do wellin the media's pilem on me like that.
I typically would stand up for myself. But so I didn't I was
being a good team player. Theysaid, well, we're not going to
try to sign you to a newcontract. So I played that one out
and that was it, and thatwas it. Yeah, And then I

(41:15):
was in this weird, weird shapethat offseason. My dentist was an amateur
triathlete, big Russian Jewish guy,big old button legs, and so I
was doing lower body workouts with himand his trainer, powerlifting with him.
My neighbors in Lake Forest. Oneof them converted the nannies quarters into a

(41:37):
rock climbing puzzle. So I wasrock climbing with these chefs, eating securitary
plates and drinking wine. And Iwas hooping on the South side of Chicago
with the hip hop community for acardio. So I was just this is
just what I was doing. Iwas. I ordered my transcripts from Illinois.
I was going to go back finishmy degree. I was right there.
So I was like, I wassetting up with the Big ten network.

(41:59):
I was. I was like,man, let me just finish up.
I was done. So you thoughtyou were done with football? Yeah?
Oh yeah, the Big ten network. The producer says to me,
all right, we got a slotfor you, but we're gonna wait till
September. I said, what doyou mean you may get signed? I
said, Doc, I'm not gettingsigned. I'm done. I'm getting no
calls. David Down calls me,there's no calls for you. I think

(42:21):
it's over all right, So Isaid to the producers it's over. My
agent said it's over. I'm readyto go, and they said, we'll
wait. We'll hold off until September. We'll hold a slot for you,
but we'll hold off in July.Kyle Orton calls, Hey, man,
we'll kind of shape you in.Uh. I don't know. He's like,

(42:45):
man, I think we could useyou out here. Can I have
Josh call you because now he's inDenver. Yeah, And so Josh calls,
we'll kind of shape you in.I'm like, uh. He's like,
can you come out and do aworkout? And I'm like yeah,
yeah, And so I fly outto Denver. Josh runs through a workout

(43:06):
with you know, the third stringquarterback, Todd Brandstatter, and lit it
up. I was in a streakof shape and touched the football. It
was doing all the crazy catches andall the fun stuff. Josh said to
me after the workout, he says, do you remember that I ran your
pro day at Illinois? And Isaid no. He said, yeah,
the Patriots we ran your pro dayat Illinois. I was trying to get

(43:27):
Bill to draft you. Oh,and he didn't want you. Now I
got you. He said, ifyou can play anywhere remotely close to the
way you could play when you're incollege, coming out in your first three
years in the NFL, you'll goall pro here. That's exactly what you
did. Yeah. Wow, there'sthe first positive Josh McDaniel story I think

(43:47):
I've ever heard brand new I havethe only positive ones. Yeah, because
he wanted you right, Oh mygosh, that's crazy. Yeah, that's
super cool. Because then you docome here and in twenty you're a pro
Bowler and second team All Pro.You have this great year, you lead
the league and receiving yards. Imean, it was just unbelievable. Yeah

(44:08):
wow, and he called it yeahyeah. You know, it's just the
cerebral type of offense that I've alwayswanted to play in. I've always playing
this really mundane, antiquated offenses.The West Coast offense was antiquated. It
was probably still in vogue in threefour five, It was probably still in
vogue. It was way out inO six it was played out. So

(44:30):
this type of offense was just socerebral, with the checks at the line
of scrimmage, the quarterback and thereceiver seeing the same thing, and just
that relationship. And then I playedwith Klin Chicago, and so we were
building something there and he really trustedmy ability to just go up and make
plays. And he wasn't hindered bythe organization to throw me the ball a

(44:53):
lot, and so he chose tothrow to me and were rewarded for that.
And so it was just a neatrelationship. And so that's what I
always say about that. It wasthe intersection of effort and opportunity. I've
always considered myself a high effort guy. I've always given a lot of effort
and I was always just kind ofwaiting for an opportunity, you know.
Once Dennis Erickson was fired, thenI was like, man, let me

(45:15):
just try to one get some moneyand then let me try to just get
on winning teams. So I waslike going to Chicago's like, ooh,
this was just in a Super Bowl. Maybe I can get one there.
Denver was just a job basically,just try to get back in the game,
and I was able to be theathlete everybody knew that I could be.
That had to be a fun year. Oh was it the best of

(45:37):
your career? Do you think byfar? I mean at any level playing
with Josh, particularly because after thatyear when Elway took over, he didn't
want to renegotiate a contract even thoughI was only All Pro player. Champ
was a reserve that year. Washe really Yeah? I was the only
Pro Bowl All Pro player on theteam. So going into that twenty eleven

(45:58):
season, They're like, oh,well, we're going to play Tebow and
that was the whole stink. AndI was the only one in the on
the team that would come out andsay there is no quarterback competition. T
Bow can't do the things Orton cando. Orton can't do the things t
Bow can do. So the organizationneeds to make a decision and then let's
roll with it. But let's notmix up the practices up in training camp.
It's too late for that. Thatwas my argument. It's too late

(46:22):
for that. We need to bedefined in what we're going to do going
into the season. They wouldn't defineit. And so going into that season,
Fox had taken over because you know, Josh got fired for the recording
scandal. And what Fox was sayingto me is like, oh, I
didn't know they weren't in contract negotiations. I thought they were negotiating with you.
I said, no, they're not. In two thousand and nine,

(46:44):
when I was on the team,Brandon Marshall protested not getting a new contract
by kicking the balls re memory waspunting the balls in the practice, and
so I was like, all right, so I'm a protest, but I'm
not going to do that. Andso what I did was I wouldn't do
team breakdown. So I said thepractice are like, all right, this
team on three one two three team, So I would walk off the field.

(47:05):
While that would happen, how'd thatgo over? I got hit with
conduct detrimental, which is the maximumfine you and get a whole game check.
And so we went to protest thatwith the league office, and so
the agreement was, don't go tothe league office over this and we'll do
the trade. So I sent withJohn Fox and he says to me,
man, why are you wide receiversthe same? So what do you mean?

(47:30):
He says, you're all such primadonnas, and I said, I
resent that. I resent that commentbecause as a wide receiver, I'm the
last man on the assembly line.Ten other players have to execute their job
to near perfection before I even getan opportunity to make the play. That's
a lot of pressure. So thehighs or highs and the lows are low.

(47:52):
I resent you saying that I'm anywhereremotely near who you coached, Steve
Smith. You don't have any issueswith me in the locker room. I've
never had issues in the locker roomor off the field, So how do
you say that? He sat backand thought about that and was like,
you're right, give me a couplehours. So later on that night he
called me late at night, andwas like, you got it, You're
getting the trade. When I wascoming out of college, I always said

(48:15):
to myself, I want a superagent. I don't want a homeboy,
my homeboy to be the agent.I want a super agent. Why Because
I want leverage. And it materializedin twenty eleven. I went on waivers
and the lowest three teams could havescooped me up. Absolutely. My agent
says, I got your left tackle. You go after Brennan. I'll make

(48:35):
your life hell. Second team comesup, I represent the general manager,
I represent you. What are youthinking? Third team comes up, I
got your starting quarterback. I'll makeyour life hell. His next contract insert
Saint Louis Rams. They were thefourth team. So David Dunn had somebody
on all those three teams. Wow, that was very smart. Yeah,
very fortuitous of you to do that. Yeah, so first day there,

(48:58):
you know, Steve Spagnolo was justin incredible coach, just a neat man,
man like Ammand's man. Inspiring,just brought inspirational talk talkers into the
team. I mean the team wascrappy. Saint Louis Rounds are crappy.
Players were hurt. But Stephen Jacksonon that team and Chris Long. When
I got there, Stephen Jackson waslike, man, he's so well put

(49:20):
together. His wardrobe everything was tailor, fresh to death. His meals was
catered in Dreds. Was perfect everyday. First man in, last man
out, took the rock all theway to the end zone. It was
like that incredibly serious. I meanhe's talking to the players as if this
is a playoff team. There's abunch of losers. He's serious. He's

(49:40):
playing for different reasons. See,this was the first time I seen this.
Oh he's not playing for the money, power and respect like the rest
of us. This guy's playing forthe Hall of Fame. Oh I see.
And so it kind of reinvigorated me, gave me a new least on
life for the NFL where I waskind of over it. It was just
like, man, that was hectic. I put finally get the opportunity,

(50:04):
I deliver, and I don't getback to you know, to where I
feel I should be, you know, in the market. But seeing Steven
get after it, it was justlike it ran vicer. I was so
revitalized that I'm of the Saint Louisteam and being I'm back at home.
You know, I played all mylittle leagues. Illinois was right there,
so my friends would call me SaintLouis is a hell hole. How you
holding up out there? I'd belike, Hey, I'm like Jeter out

(50:27):
here right right. Oh my gosh, that's funny. You're with the Rams.
Then in that twenty eleven season,twenty twelve you go to the Patriots,
and there you are reunited with Joshbecause at that point he's been fired
from the Broncos as we talked about, and he's back with Bill Belichick there.
I met Tom at the Kentucky Derbyin two thousand and ten after the
All Pro Pro Bowl season. Iwas on a victory lap, which I

(50:51):
typically do after every year. Ihit Sundance Film Festival, I hit the
Super Bowl, get my appearances income Back, and hit the sb's pop
out, hit Cooke. Why wouldn'tYou're an entertainer, you know, you
know, I had a whole loop. But for a gift, David Done
gives me he and his wife's twotickets to Millionaire's row at the Kentucky Dert
Wow in the Turf Club. I'llpop out there, you know, doing

(51:14):
my thing with my date, havinga good old time. One of the
receivers for the Patriots comes up tome and says, Tom wants to talk
to you, all right, Sothey escort me out past the bodyguards and
over to Tom with the Goldman sacksbuddies. He's got a sear sucker suit
on with the fedor. This islong haired Tom. It's flickering in the
sunlight. I mean, I mean, it's just incredible, right, And

(51:37):
he says, man, how youdoing. We're good? Can we talk?
Of course, you need to getout of the contract. If you
get out of the contract, we'llget you. Bill won't trade for you.
So this was leading up into thetwenty eleven season. It's all right,
it's like I would like to playwith you. I would like to

(51:58):
play with you, Tom Brady.Yeah, is that it? That's it?
All right? Hung out with himfor the rest of the weekend.
So when I became a free agentstraight to New England, what we did
there was it was a three yearcontract, but it was three years with
team options. So it's actually aseries of one year contracts. The first
year fully guaranteed, four million guaranteed, and so got There is a huge

(52:22):
cultural adjustment being on that team,and especially with the way how loose things
were with Josh and Denver. Youknow, it was like the first summer
practice and Bill's like, you practicehard, We're gonna give you the day
off and I was like yes,and Josh hit me. I was standing
next to Josh. He punched meon the shoulders like oh, and he

(52:43):
shook his head like, don't dothat. Don't speak. Yeah, don't
because usually it's like a treat forplayers to have that and said you kind
of rejoice and thanks coach, andyou know, some false enthusiasm. Rah,
Yeah, we're gonna We're gonna comeback out tomorrow. Really get after
it. No, not there.So it was kind of like, oh,
all right, I get it.And so played the season the twenty

(53:05):
twelve season and we end up losingto Baltimore in the AFC Championship. And
wait, you said Josh was loosehere right, like just for you or
is everybody else I've talked to?He was a total hard ass. Yeah,
he was a hard ass, butthose guys were behaving like they would
on another team. So the lockerroom was loose. That's where he struggled.

(53:25):
Gotcha. You know, he didn'thave the credentials that Bill has to
run a tight ship on all ends. And then what Bill had was he
had Tom Brady, not Tom Bradythe player, but Tom Brady the salary
capper, the salary capper. Right, yeah, So Tom never took what
he should have taken in the market. He should have been the first five

(53:46):
hundred million dollar quarterback eight years ago. Oh yeah, he never took the
money. So Bill had never everhad to juggle roster. If you come
to the Patriots, no one makesmore than Tom. Makes things easy.
There's never been holdouts, there's neverbeen contract disputes. You know, guys
come, guys go. Guys come, guys go. It makes things a

(54:07):
lot easier. But when you're ona team, a normal team, you
have to deal with ballers. Ohyeah, ballers get paid, yes they
do. And ballers have personalities,and ballers don't follow the rules because they're
going to try to make plays.Bills never had to deal with that.
That's what Josh had to deal with. And he didn't have credentials to keep
guys in line, and he didn'thave the weight of hey we'll cut you.

(54:30):
You can't play anywhere else, Soyou have to do what I say.
Guys wouldn't have believed him. Soafter a year in New England,
you get released there, you takea year off, right, and then
you're back with the forty nine ers, and then in twenty fifteen you retire
crazy few years there, So again, did you think you were just done
that year that you had off beforeyou went back to San Francisco. I

(54:52):
definitely needed a year off of mentalhealth. When I got onto the Patriots,
I walked into the locker room.Wels Walker walks up to me like
you've seen a ghost. His eyesare wide open. He's like, your
locker is in between Gronk and Hernandez. Now. And that was the year
he was murdering people. Yes,and all the nonsense was happening in the

(55:15):
locker room. It was. Itwas a complete joke. It was It
was not the New England Patriots thatI heard about, but it was that
exactly the New England patriss that Iheard about. Industry talk. Everyone's disgruntled
there, Yeah, everyone's incredibly unhappythere, but there to win a championship,
which is why I was there.So when Bill called to renegotiate the

(55:36):
contract, I told him, no, I'm signing for exactly what the contract
has, another year of four milliondollars guaranteed. No, let me drop
you down to one point eighty five. How about I bump up your incentives.
You did so well this year.I'll bump up your incentives so you
can still make the four and incentives. But I'm gonna drop you down.

(55:59):
See, he was trying to getme into that Patriot there's a Patriot lifeer
kind of circle that would be aroundthat team where he would manipulate the NFL
roster cuts. He'd bring a playerin, they'd play on Sunday, he'd
cut them on Monday, bring himback that next Tuesday. I told him,
I won't play under those conditions.I prefer the job security. I

(56:21):
can't play with that. You know, I need confidence when I'm playing.
Not playing under those conditions, andyou're not curing brain cancer. This is
what was going on in my mindright. This is not the end all
be all to me. So I'llplay under this circumstances. But if you're
gonna renig that, I won't playfor you. And so that's you know
how that negotiation went. Josh wascalling me, come on, Tom called

(56:45):
come on you gotta come back.I was like, no, I'm not
coming back under those conditions. Andso, just with everything that was going
on in that locker room, justthe way that it ended, I was
like, you know what, letme take some time off. I was
pretty disturbed. I booked a oneway ticket to Europe. I stayed out
there for about three weeks wow.And I traveled around and just took some

(57:08):
time, connected with an elementary schoolfriend who was out in Sweden, connected
with some friends who were just travelingthrough Italy and Netherlands, and finished up
in Sweden. And I came back. I was like, all right,
I'm good. Ever since two thousandand nine, I'd been working in the
off season, ever since the lockout. I had a close friend of mine

(57:30):
here in Denver who said to me, hey, man, since you're going
to be unemployed, why don't youcome work for me and I'll give you
a leave of app since to playin the NFL. I was like all
right, So I said yes.And so this was the first business proposition
where someone was going to pay me, someone was giving me money and not
asking for money. And so sincetwo thousand and nine, I'd been working
in aerospace sales in the off season. So we've been doing composite tooling for

(57:52):
Boeing Airbus, Ombreer Spirit Aerosystems,and so I've been doing that in the
off seasons, and so I returnedback to that job, took my position
full time and was working that.And you know, I have a hip
hop catalog. So my music managercalls me and says, hey, man,
I just ran into Trent Balki,the GM of the forty nine ers.

(58:14):
I just ran into Trent Balki hada shin dig last night. You
gotta forgive me. I brought youup. You could really use you.
The team could really use you.And he says, all right, have
him call me. So I calledTrent. He's like, what kind of
shape you in? And I'm like, uh, spent a year. Well,

(58:37):
I've been playing tennis, picked uptennis at the country club and I've
been still been running. And He'slike, all right, come out for
a workout, all right. SoHarball calls me. Jim Harbaugh gives me
the full court press. I mean, he's an incredible recruiter. His wife
is from Leaf Summit, Missouri,which is right next to the Blue Springs,
Missouri. He knew everything about BlueSprings, Missouri, and then he

(58:59):
gives me this talk about more ismore. He says, Brandon, anyone
who says less is more is lyingto you. There's only one more,
and that's more. You come signwith us. We're the New England Patriots
of the NFC West. We goto the Super Bowl every year. So

(59:20):
you come back, You're gonna getmore wins. You come on this team,
You're gonna make the team. Sothat's a veteran minimum. You're gonna
get a million more dollars. See, you got a business out there.
I see you working the corporate world. You can come back here. You're
gonna get some more wins. You'regonna be associated with winners. That's not
only gonna help you more in yoursecond career. More is more, Brandon,

(59:44):
All right, where do I sign? Right? That's exactly what?
Oh my gosh. And then howwas it out there? Did you do
well? No? I still hadthe juice. And I'll posterize some players
from the chie I mean I hadto juice. It was just that,
you know, am I eleventh year? Now, I wasn't in the mood

(01:00:06):
to pretend like there is a competitionanymore, and four million dollars playing in
an NFL, it's not safe.I had three million dollars. That's as
low as I could go. It'sno longer safe. When I was twenty
one drafted, Oh, I playfor anything. That's what you call when
someone says, man, I'll doanything for this. I'll run through a

(01:00:27):
brick wall. They were literally runningthrough brick walls for three hundred thousand dollars.
I think I was making three seventyfive my rookie year. I'll do
anything to make it in this league. That's what that classifies as. And
so as I was older, establishhave money, and you had some big
hits. You were part of thathelmet to helmet that year that they really
kind of started to crack down onhow receivers were getting hit. That's right.

(01:00:51):
Yeah, And even though I neverlost consciousness, you know, it
was just a repeat it the blockingyeap. That didn't bother me. I
was okay with the hits. Itwas just the interaction with the organizations that
it was just like you getting mefor a vet minimum. This is a
slamming deal. I still got it, but it's no longer safe for me
and it's no longer something I'm willingto do and back up players that I

(01:01:14):
know that I'm better than and bein a teaching role for that little money.
See my second year when they tradedToo and Ty Streets away from San
Francisco, they brought in Curtis Conwayto mentor me, but they paid him
a lot of money. Then theybrought in Johnny Morton my third year to
continue to mentor me, but theypaid him a lot of money. And
they wanted to bring you in andnot pay you a lot of money.

(01:01:35):
So it's kind of like, youknow, you get tired of playing the
game, right, not a littletired. I was tired of it.
Yeah, And there was a lotof issues with hardball not holding a Colin
Kaepernick accountable for his performance. Hewas not performing well, and Jim had
hyped up so many players on thatteam for contracts, and then when it
all came to roost, he decidedto give Colin Kaepernick a large contract,

(01:01:59):
and it's sour at the locker room. The players were just like, we
see this dude, we know he'snot that player, and yet you're paying
him this, and it really sourthings. And then Harball left in towards
the end of the season for theforty million dollar contract to go to Michigan,
and it was like he gave uslike the double middle finger, like

(01:02:20):
hope y'all do all right? Seeyou fun oh man. That's who he
is. That's who he is.You can only fool people for so long.
That's who he is. And youheard my comment about what he thought
about San Francisco when he was coachingthem. He thought they were the New
England Patriots of the NFC West.Therefore he's going to engage in those tactics.
And the difference is what Josh raninto here and what was going on

(01:02:43):
in San Francisco was that in NewEngland, it's a different organization. The
owner pays the fine. Owner,I got your back, Yeah, yeah,
do what you gotta do. Youwant to take a first round draft
pick, take it. We don'tuse it anyway, what's the fine?
Pay it? Get off his back. And so these things I swept under
the rug with that type of ownership. Okay, So in October of twenty

(01:03:05):
fifteen, you retire. So that'sbeen about eight years now as of this
recording, and now you are stillhere in Denver. You've got two teenage
boys, You're on a couple ofboard of trustees. You went back finished
your degree major mom happy at MetroState University, and then got your NBA
from DU last year. That's impressive, and now you have a great gig.

(01:03:27):
Explain what you do with group insurance, Yeah, health and benefits consulting
at Mercer, so large group insuranceprograms for large employers, and then being
a dad and watching your kids whoare in high school. Right, that's
right. I'm just following whatever myeffort leads me. And I know that
being in on the corporate side.While I was an NFL player, I
realized how much my maturity of wasstunned being in the locker room. And

(01:03:50):
so there's always something that I knewI needed to develop, and I needed
to have the foresight to start itearly. And so that's why I started
working my last four years in theNFL in order to start building that type
of ability sure to transfer the skillsthat I learned as an athlete at all
levels into the corporate environment and applythat effort and seek those opportunities and be

(01:04:12):
ready to take advantage of them.That's awesome, all right, So as
we wrap this up, you've toldsome great stories about your whole career today,
but I want to know what youtell people, and especially now that
you've got boys who play sports andyou have all these experiences of the ups
and downs, what you tell peopleto do with their lives to keep moving
forward when things kind of go sideways, keep it moving. Living in the

(01:04:35):
past is lame, good or bad, regardless of what it is, move
on and continue to apply effort andseek out those opportunities because no one sees
how much work we put in.They just turn on the TV and see
it on Sunday and be like,oh, these guys just roll out a

(01:04:56):
bit like that. They don't seeall the work that goes into that.
Or they'll pop up a news articleand see me six years from now,
COO of a company. Oh he'sbeen that all along. Now I have
to start back over. I haveto relearn and reapply myself and continue to
put in an effort in order toachieve in life. And so I think
those are the probably the best gymsthat I can pass on to folks from

(01:05:20):
my life experience. Would that beyour goal, Coo at some point in
six years? Yeah, why not, right right, Brandon, this has
been awesome. Thank you for allof the stories and going back through everything.
You weren't here for very long,but of course you were spectacular when
you were here and we enjoyed it. And I love the fact that you're
still here in Denver and you gotkids here and it's awesome, and it's

(01:05:43):
great to see that you're back involvedwith the Broncos too as an alumni.
That's right, Thanks Brandon Bach.Thank you, Brandon. Well, if
you're hearing this, you've listened tothe entire episode, first of all,
thank you. Secondly, if youenjoyed this episode, please rate and review
on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Newepisode Have, Cut, Traded, Fired,
Retired come out every Tuesday on nearlyevery podcast platform. Get social with

(01:06:05):
the podcast on Twitter and Instagram atctfur podcast, and check out the website
ctfurpodcast dot com. I'm your host, Susie Worgen. To learn more about
me, visit susiewargin dot com.Thanks so much for listening, and until
next time, please be careful,be safe, and be kind. Take care