Land Investing and Sales with Jeff Tumbarello #DDRE39

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Aaron Norris (00:06):
Welcome back to the Data Driven Real Estate
podcast, the podcast for realestate professionals dedicated
to driving business using data.
I'm Aaron Norris along with SeanO'Toole with PropertyRadar and
this is episode 39. This week wehave Jeff Tumbarello. He is the
broker owner of SteelbridgeRealty LLC. He's a data driven
real estate expert out of theSouthwest Florida market and
even runs the local SouthwestFlorida Real Estate Investors
Association. He's been througheverything from massive

(00:28):
hurricanes to a huge foreclosurecrisis and somehow has landed on
the data driven world of land.
You will not want to miss thisweek. Welcome back to the Data
Driven Real Estate podcast weare really excited today have
Jeff Tumbarello with aSteelbridge Realty LLC and he's
been a longtime real estateinvestor out of Southwest

(00:49):
Florida who survived hurricanesforeclosure crisis, we're gonna
get into a lot of differentthings today. So, Jeff, welcome
to the show.

Jeff Tumbarello (00:56):
Yeah, it's the Southwest Florida Real Estate
Investors Association. I can'timagine trying to herd 10,000
real estate agents around.

You know what, that is actually a really great
place to start, I would like tosay that I know you're a data
driven, you really like data.
And I've found Florida to be avery difficult place to collect
data specifically in the realestate, the realtor space,
because somehow the state andthe, and the different MLS has
just haven't worked togetherover the year, and it's- over
the years, and it's been reallydifficult to get long-term
trends is that am I seeing thatcorrectly?

For now, I sat on a stats committee. That was
fun. And the board of realtors,silly committee I've ever sat
on, you know, because I justdon't, I just, I'm not inspired
by 'let me go volunteer at atrade organization', if that
makes any sense. But the, it wasa good, it was a good committee.
There's some smart people on it.
And far has started the FloridaAssociation of Realtors now can

(01:51):
kind of conglomerate your, can-can- can- gramma. I can't even
say it.
Conglomerate.
Everything together and they'recoming up with their own
numbers. And while I can'tvalidate their numbers for the
whole state, my database for LeeCounty's pretty amazing. I have
a really nice spreadsheet Ibuilt. I dumped from Excel from
the MLS into that and that's howI generate my reports and views

(02:15):
and everything. And I mean,there's some minor, very, very
minor differences, but I mayhave an error they there's
always going to be some kind ofnobody's ever going to be
perfect on it, maybe there maybeme. It's probably both. But---

Sean O'Toole (02:29):
Yeah, what is the sale? Right? Like, sometimes
even that stuff, and you know,the MLS is typically only have
the listed sales, not the publicrecord sales. So, yeah, there's
a lot of differences.

Yeah. Well, far they're putting out some
statewide numbers that arepretty good, but for the most
part, it's county by county. So,yeah, it's irony, public records
here is pretty amazing to getat. It's a very easy place to
get data. But it's, it you know,the hard part is actually doing
something with the data.

Making it actionable.

Yeah.

Well, let's talk a little bit about the niche.
Let's go forward to what you'redoing today and maybe figure out
how even landed in Florida andhow it's changed?

Florida is interesting. I've been investing
since, god 90? 98? I was in themortgage business and I was
doing loans for an investor. AndI realized that his proceeds on
the HUD were a lot more than my,my broker commission. So, I kind
of really liked, I really likedhis part of the HUD not mine. I

(03:35):
felt like I did more than hedid, trying to get these people
approved with all these crazysubprime loans and as opposed to
just yelling at the handyman tomake sure he painted everything.
And so, I, in one day, I boughtfive flips with hard money. And
I started on the lease...

That was your first day? You did five
properties?

Yes, sir. I bought five in one day with hard
money. So, and the easiest rehabwas the first because we you
know, needed to turn something.
So, started from there. And thatentity I think I did like 60.

Okay.

And, you know, and had rentals and did all
that. But '04 I think we foundedthe Southwest Florida REIA. We
were going to the Broward andDade clubs, because it was just
fun. And we wanted to have themeetings here. And we actually,
I never forget, it was Woody'sbarbecue had a private room and
we had to commit to 25 Chickendinners. So, everybody kind of

(04:33):
had to order food. So, there wasfour of us doing it. So, I'm
like worst case scenario. Weeach have to buy six chicken
dinners and nobody shows up.
It's not the end of the world.
You know, 'Hey, kids are goingto eat chicken for two days'.
So, but we actually have about60 people that came to the first
meeting we had Bob Hunter whofounded the Dade REIA, came over

(04:53):
and just talked about investingand we've been going with that
ever since. Currently, I mean, Iown a retail brokerage. I invest
in some stuff personally, I'mreal big on notes and defaulted
notes and originating notes onseller held stuff. And we have a
business called the Florida LandTeam right now, where I think
we've done, I think last year inthe pandemic, we did probably

(05:16):
170 lots. And it's really takenoff like a rocket now. And I
think we've got three virtualassistants and six or seven
people in the states all workingremotely either closers or
transaction coordinators, orit's become like it started out
as a, we planned it hung overNew Year's Day, last year. We

(05:42):
met at my office and everybodywas basically needing a Bloody
Mary. And we kind of said, let'stry this. And we tried it. And
then we actually did some thingsand made some money. And we've
just kept scaling it. And everytime we scale it, it's just
react.

Gets better.
That's great. I want to jumpinto that stuff a lot. But let's
close out. We mentioned REIA afew times. I don't know that
everybody listening knows what aREIA is, and Real Estate
Investors Association. And so,it's a local group of investors.
And a lot of times these are runlike meetups, right? People come
and meet monthly?

We meet twice a month we have the nighttime
meeting, is the third Wednesday,the daytime meeting, we meet for
lunch the first Wednesday, wedon't do information, product
sales. For the most, I mean,it's just we mainly it's just
real world stuff. Our lastmeeting was an attorney
discussing, you know, specificperformance, what to do when

(06:40):
your seller refuses to close.
And we kind of just do a lot oftopics like that. It's a lot of
fun actually, I think ourmembership is about 260 members.
And collectively, they probablyown, because we actually tracked
this metric in Lee County. And Ithink it's like, oh, like 4000
properties, believe it or not,it's pretty...

Wow.

Yeah.

So, you got a very, you got a very seasoned
group. I know a lot of the REIAsattract newbies and people who
want to learn and that kind ofstuff, and a handful of
experienced folks, but a lot ofit is new folks. But it sounds
like you have a very seasonedgroup.

I would love to have more newbies at the
meetings, because then I canpull them in on my land
wholesaling, because I needtalent terribly.

Yeah, right. Yeah.
Yeah, for sure. Well, we alwaystell right, the new folks that
show up that one of the thingsthey should do is go find a
mentor. And there's two placeswe recommend doing that. One is
the REIAs and the other, a lotof you're foreclosure sales are
online, our foreclosure salesare all still at the courthouse
steps. We're like, go down tothe foreclosure sales, because
you'll meet the guys that paidcash buy without title

(07:45):
insurance, you know, buy thehouse, you know, they they know
how to do the whole deal. Likego meet and talk to those guys
see if you can't get one of themto mentor you. But the REIAs are
the other great place.

I missed the foreclosure sales with the
courthouse. Those are so muchfun.

Yeah.

You'd bid up somebody and then they'd come
stand next to you and try andstep on your foot. And I
honestly think that gamesmanshipis why our county push so hard
to get them online.

Yeah, yeah. No, I've seen people throw shoes at
people. And...

It got to the point where you just all say,
All right, everybody would nod,we'll partner up the three of us
stop. I'd rather make a third ofthe money than no money just to,
just to Yeah.

And some of the sales people were bringing cell
phones. So, then guys startedbringing illegal cell phone
jammers to keep people fromgetting the bids. Yeah, no, it
got, it got pretty nuts.

I always warn people, that's one of the
hardest strategies, but I havenot heard that little tidbit.
Wow.

No, it's like a...

I got to the point. If I liked the house, I
would find this typically, if aneighbor had a little kid, I
would tell the little kid, ifyou write down like what they
look like when people came, I'llgive you $5 and I would have,
nowadays would be even betterwith the cell phones. You know,
I'll give you $5 to take apicture of their car and who is
walking around the house so youcan see who your competition is.

(09:10):
I mean, we even went so far whenthe game cameras came off for
hunting, we're thinking aboutfinding somewhere to put a
hunting game camera on thereally hot foreclosure coming up
so that you can go grab the dataand see who you're going to be
bidding against.

Yeah, yeah. That's funny. That is definitely the
toughest way to invest. But it'sall online down there.
Anyways...

A lot of risk, too.

Lot of risk.

So much risk in that.

Yeah, no, no, it's a I think it attracts some of
the folks that drax because it'slike legal gambling, right. And
it has all the high stakes pokerkind of stuff going on with it.
But back to the REIA, just youwrote a pretty good one in
Southwest Florida. We'll getinformation about that for folks
at the end so that they can findyou and you can get more newbies

(09:54):
showing up.

Hopefully.

Let's jump back to you know. Sounds like you're
scaling and really making ithappen. How many deals are you
guys do in a year?

We're looking at this year, we are probably,
if we continue at the currentpace, we'll be 300.

What's a typical, tell me what a typical deal
looks like walk us through that.

It's changed a lot, because the markets
changing a lot. Last year, wewere doing a lot of, because we
have our own funds. So, we closeon some, we assign some. And we
would, we would, last year, wewere tight margins, the market
was pretty well defined marketsreally doing kind of what I call
some open field running rightnow. And so, we're at the point

(10:43):
where I'm closing on almosteverything, because the margins
are just that much better thanand then the time it takes to
close the margins are going upeven more. Case example, we had
a five pack a lot and they kindof get problematic, because
you'll have like three lots of adeveloper says hey, assigned to
me, and then there's always theother two, and it's kind of
like, you know, you know, thetwo people that nobody wants to

(11:05):
dance with at the club, then,you know, somebody does a dance
with them and nobody dances sowe, we always end up closing on
them. And this is how much ourmarket has come up. We were
$5200, no $5,750 was the way itcame out each lot. I had I'm
comped that we were going tolist them at $10k. So, we were

(11:25):
really happy with just on thetwo bad lots of the five lot
package to just make a couplegrand after cost in and out. We
were thrilled. I just put onepending for $18,900.

Wow.

So, I've got another one listed at $19,900
and we'll probably end upgetting $17,000 for it. So,
we're at the point where we'veshifted to where I'm now closing
on almost everything because themarket is so good. And the time
it takes the title agent totrack down the correct deed, the
lots went out three grand. Well,that is a kind of a red flag a

(12:01):
little bit not a bad thing, butjust the thing. You know, the
markets got a lot of momentumright now. So, we're shifting to
where we're realizing every lotwe didn't close on we probably
left two to $5,000 on the table.

Yeah.

Jeff-

Oh sorry. I'm just gonna ask what the mix of land,
single family residential...

It's all land... All we do is land.

Okay, great.

And I've done pretty much everything there is
to do in real estate. And onceyou have worked in land, you
will never want to touch animproved property again. Because
you know, there's no plumbing,there's no, it's, you know,
yeah, you've got environmentalconcerns, you got vegetation,
you got elevation. But you know,I've never ripped out a bush and
had the repipe a lot. Every timeI tear out a piece of drywall,

(12:53):
I'm fixing something else. Youknow, it's just the way the way
houses are. I got big rehabgoing right now on the property.

Peeling the onion, and there's always something
else underneath. Yeah.

Yeah. So, that land is, I call it print and
$10,000 bills, once you find itright, the key is you've got to
have the exit. So, it's likeeverything else. You know, you
got to buy it, right. But youbetter have a predefined exit,
whatever you're doing.

So, you're cultivating relationships with
your end buyer. So, you've got alist of buyers going after this
stuff?

We'll literally, three buyers.

Wow.

....One guy who flips them to somebody else, but
he makes my life easy. So, Iknow, we're probably leaving a
little on the table with thisguy. But he buys everything we
put in front of him and hecloses and you know, he gets to
make a little money too. Andthat's great, so...

Yeah. That was one thing I found, you know,
flipping was, you know, sooneror later too, you just run out
of capital at times, right? Andso, having a good, a good list
of folks that you can like handstuff off to. And this is one
thing I think a lot of folksmiss, right? So, just keep the
math simple. You buy a lot for$10,000. You sell it for 20. And

(14:07):
let's just assume there's nocost, right? If you make $10
grand, so really good return oninvestment. But if that takes
you a year, right, it's a verydifferent investment. It's, it's
actually a lower return than ifyou make $1,000 in one day.

Yep.

We probably are still assigning some. And I've
got some markets that they're Imean, we're working. I'm in Lee
County, which is Fort Myers. Andwe're working Palm Bay. We're
working Northport. We've evendoing some stuff in Ocala. We're
actually getting ready to getTad's just got a task that we're
going to go to three otherstates and start getting for a

(14:48):
couple other clients. Yeah,we're gonna have to set up some
more land teams. I guess we'regoing to be the main land team
or something that set up somenew companies but our platforms
early robust were really a techplatform. That gets pointed at
land is really what we are. Butyou are, the assignments or, are
your bread and butter in thisgame but the key is, is you know

(15:11):
you need real people to closeand honestly the hardest part
lately is keeping the sellers inthe game.

Right.

They've got a million...

..they start seeing value go up and.

Yeah, we're actually filing a specific
performance lawsuit from a guythat refused to close and
normally I would not do that.
But this was just so egregiousand there's a pretty big spread
in the lot that we're actually,we just wrote the attorney the
check and go get him, dude.

There's a lot of nuance in the market. I mean,
the areas that you're talkingabout that's that's huge. And
there's so many environmentalthings that you have to know and
some of these lots have beenpassed down from generation to
generation that's, that's somegood use of some public records.
Can you talk a little bit abouthow difficult...

You want to talk about the coolest we just
picked up in Cape Coral and theydeveloped it they had they call
them skinnies because it's an 80by 125 lot to build and for God
knows what reason they sold abunch of 40 by 125s. So, you
have people that bought theselots that aren't buildable
because every time you see aCape Coral lot, it'll be lots
five and six. Well there's somethat are just last five, and you

(16:19):
get people out of state thatdon't know any better and they
don't realize they're not buyinga buildable lot because it's not
wide enough. Nobody has a 20foot wide floor plan that the
city will approve to go on itsomeday maybe even not yet. We
actually data mine the skinnylots. And we found two side by
side. We're about to sellthey'll offer 35 grand we're in

(16:40):
it for 15 because it took us 10days to match the two up
together.

Yeah, so neither person had a buildable lot but
get the two and you're good.

And then the funny there was skinnies on
either side of these and it oncewe combined ours they're,
they're done, 'cause you knowthey're, unless one of the lots
on the either side was to buy anabsorb it in but they'll never
build on them and one had somany liens. It couldn't, we
couldn't buy it. And the otherone was the I-know-what-I-got
seller. So, when we're like'Ma'am, once we combine these

(17:13):
lots you're done.' You know,you're never going to build on
this lot. But you know, maybe wecould do something here. It's a
win-win for everybody. And itwas the I know what I got you a
you know, okay, you win. So, wecombine the lots and now she's
got this skinny lot she'll neverbuild on so at some point,
whoever builds on that lot. Andhonestly, you have kind of a
free 40 foot parking lot nextdoor that no one's ever going to

(17:34):
build on. Not that legally youcan park on their land, you
know, but when you have a poolparty on Saturday, you can
probably stick a couple cars onit.

Place to keep the boat. I actually I had a lot
next door to me that I tried foryears to acquire and couldn't
but it was just it was vacant.
And but I would I actuallyplanted seeds. I put seeds for
grass and watered it becauseit's all weeds and terrible that
made it like a big extra lawn.

Yeah, I have a, I live on the water and across
the street from me as a halfacre lot. That's just a lot
that's wooded up and I call itmy parking lot. And I actually
keep the trees knocked down andmow it and because when you know
when we have a pool party, I'llput four or five cars on there
for I feel like I shouldn't belike sending them a bill for my
services, but I'm trying to buyit but...

Or jet for rent.

Yeah, they paid 90 grand for and like '04 and
it's worth 25 today. I'll buyit.

I definitely want to go back. You said you started
the club in 2004. And hurricaneCharley happened in 2004.
Correct?

Yeah. Yeah, I actually think it was November
of '03 was our first meeting,believe it or not.
Okay. So...
You were like eight, I think?

I would love to cover that really quick because
when a hurricane happened,something very unusual happened
in that market. Can you talk alittle bit about what you
experienced after that happened?
It was a category four and ithit the market directly, right?

Yeah. Well, it was a really weird storm. Here's
an interesting thing. If youbecome friends with a lot of
firemen and you move to Florida,they all get called in when
there's a storm coming. So, Ihad a house full of Firemen's
wives and kids. And this wassupposed to go up the coast
seems like fun but really wasn'tbeing the only guy in this mix.

(19:21):
It really wasn't I was mixing alot of margaritas because we
actually had quite the partygoing on because they're
supposed to go straight up thecoast and not hit us and then it
shifted and came right down theriver and my house took a direct
hit. But so, I went from, we hadprojectors going with kids
playing video games andmargarita's and people on the

(19:41):
pool it wasn't, it wasn't aterrible day until we got the
call that hey, it's coming upthe river you need to, you need
to take shelter because it'spretty nasty storm and
intensified from a 2 to a 4 andshifted right.

You're on a river so probably no basement?

Nah. No, no, there's no basements but it's
the hurricane really. It'spretty rare to destroy your
home, but it'll rip the roof offis the problem like the
shingles, and then you get waterin your house. But you know, you
take the you know, the eyewallis just a small thing, give me
example, go off topic, I helpedthe guy portfolio build in 2010.

(20:16):
And I purposely had him in threemarkets, each one of those
markets would have only takenthe eye wall from a hurricane.
So, we split up the house buyingso that if an eye wall hit
Lehigh, his cape portfolio wasfine, because the eye wall is
generally not that big. So, yourwhole portfolio is a newt. You
know, it's kind of something tothink about in Florida with

(20:37):
hurricanes. If you're in oneconcentrated area, one eyewall
can take out most of yourportfolio, and then you got
insurance claims. And you know,it's, it's not fun. But it had
an interesting corollary, wewere already pretty hot. By
then, I mean, the middle of '04was really a growth phase. And
it was, that's when the No Docloans hit. And so, we were

(21:00):
starting to go from what I calla boom to a mania. But then the
most interesting thing happened,that hurricane hit, it dumped
about a billion dollars ofinsurance money in the market,
it brought in all theseconstruction crews. So, we took
a little inventory out, we threwa bunch of capital in
inflationary. And then we had ahuge rental demand of all these,

(21:23):
all these construction workersthat need somewhere to live
while they're working. So, itkind of threw gas on a really
hot fire and then couple thatwith the No Doc loans and
everything that was going on it,it turned into a mania
overnight, third quarter of, '04our average price and a quarter
went up 30%.

Wow.

At that point, I'm at the REIA meeting, and I
can't remember people pitchingme, pitching me $330,000 houses
that rented for 1200 a month.
And I'm telling my buddy, that'snot an investment. That's an act
of lunacy. That's not you knowwhat I mean? That's not, don't,
please don't do this. And thenlater '07, I'm having coffee
with the same people giving thema good attorneys phone number

(22:05):
two, you know, get out of thesethings.

And a therapist.

You know, on top of that, the prices went up
so high so fast, and the rentsdid not keep up at like today,
the prices are going up, but therents are keeping up. So,
where's the you had a pointwhere everybody was negative
cash flow the moment they boughtit. And then, and then, you
know, the market crashes, rentswent down 25% taxes and
insurance went up. And it wasthat's why the beginning of our

(22:32):
foreclosure crisis was 70% nonhomesteaded.

I wanted to bring that up, because you just
mentioned some of these peoplewere buying land with loans,
just does nothing but hold theearth together. For as long as
you own it. For 90 to 100 grandthat you're, you're now the
market has improved at thebottom of the market. What was
that $90,000 lots selling for?

I was picking up Lehigh lots for 1500 bucks
that were selling for 55,000 6years earlier.

That is painful.

It all depends on your timing. It's really
amazing if you're on the rightside of the trade.

Painful for them, not for you.

But the it was, give you an example we started
the REIA, me and one of theother principals. One of our
tricks was we would acquire alot. We put it in a land trust,
and we just sell the beneficialinterest in the Land Trust. So,
it's less closing costs, lessbrain damage, you know, here's
the title commitment, where webought it, have your guide, do a
gap run, you know, and it wasjust quicker and easier. Well,

(23:32):
we sold a lot and Lehigh we gotit for like, six sold it for 14.
We're high fiving each other.
And then a year later, it'srunning around the room, my land
trust, I know it because I madeup the land trust. And it was 50
and somebody bought it. And I'dlooked at the, the other guy,
I'm like, we should have justpaid the taxes for a year. So
um, like at the time we werebrilliant. And you know, year

(23:56):
later, we were the dumbestpeople I met because we didn't
pay the taxes for $300. And justwait for a year.

Everybody was flipping from nine to whatever
2013, wishes they kepteverything they flipped.

Yeah, it was just it got to where it was just
purely a mania. I mean, rightnow we're in a boom market. The
whole country is. There's adifference between you know, the
tulip bulbs, the SoutheastTrading Company, the dot-com
stocks from 2000 and, and just abull run. You know, there's a,
there's a delineation when itjust completely leaves intrinsic

(24:31):
value. But right now, I thinkwhat's saving us is the fact
that we, everything still tiedto wages, the mortgages are so
as long as they keep that we'reokay. I mean, I definitely, like
I ran numbers, and I'm big onmath. I mean, Aaron and I just
completely geeked out overbreakfast recently over doing
some math but like our cashpercentage for this February

(24:53):
versus last February, itactually went up. So, you know,
there's people trying to screamthat it's 2005, when the cash
percentage was almost 36% of thesales were all cash. And above a
half a million there for theyear, it's significantly higher.
So, you really have just such.
And it's something when you lookat Southwest Florida, like maybe

(25:14):
5% of the sales on '05 or cash.
By the time the marketcorrection, say '09, at least
75% of the sales were cash. So,we went from being probably one
of the most over leveragedmarkets in the country with us,
Arizona and say, Scottsdale,we're probably the most over
leveraged markets in thecountry, to when we washed out

(25:37):
all of that unsustainability. Itwas replaced with equity. So,
we've went to becoming one ofthe more free and clear markets
in the country now as far asequity wise.

Man. Well, okay, so we, I wanted to cover that
because land is a veryinteresting asset class, you
know, it's it. I don't know,some would consider it really
risky unless you build on it. Soyou're not? Are you land banking
at all? Are you sitting on a lotof stuff?

There's two reasons you buy land there,
you're either for speculation orto use it. You know, and I
always say, we teach us at theREIA, the one thing we, I watch
in this market is the cape landmarket, because land represents
hope. You know, what that lotwas 1500. because there wasn't
much hope. You know, that lotwas $65,000. Because it was just

(26:23):
insane euphoria. So, and therereally wasn't any difference,
the land hadn't changed. Justthe people changed. So, land
represents hope. And there's tworeasons you buy it. Well,
there's other reasons, you know,you can buy things and just a
store of value. I have aninvestor friend who only buys
land with his, basically, hemakes a lot of money, he buys

(26:45):
land with, you know, after hisreserves, because he doesn't,
his tax situation, depreciatingrental would be bad for him. So,
he has a very semi unique life.
So, for him, the depreciationdoesn't work for him, according
to his accountant. So, he buysland as a store of value. So, he
doesn't have to depreciate it.

(27:06):
And then his joke is he buysland wherever he vacations. So,
he calls it all business trips.

Yeah. What about, you know, the hard part with
land banking land, obviously, isthat you have expense without
income. You know, so that you'vegot, you know, you know, a lot
of people like complain aboutgold, because gold doesn't have
any income, right? And so,you're kind of constantly losing
value versus if you have a storeof value that has some return on

(27:34):
investment. So, there's noreturn on investment on land.
So, how do you how do you answerthat?

Well, it's ultimately it's not an, it's, I
don't consider things aninvestment when you're working
off games. For me, the way Iwork, I put $1 here, I get seven
cents a year. I call thatinvestment. If I put $1 down,
and my hope is to get $1.25someday. That's a trade. So,

(28:03):
land for the most part unlessyou're putting it to use and
there are ways to actually makemoney on land. I'm a member of
fraternal organization, and wejust got approached to put a
cellular tower next to ourLodge. Actually, that's an
investment. There are other waysyou can do that. I have a...

Bill boards, cell towers, cattle grazing, you know
there are quite a few.

Oh, you also have these uh, fireworks and
Christmas tree guys.

Yeah.

If you buy a good corner, particularly you
put a saw pole on it, you knowfor temporary power. And I have
a friend who talk about a dealhe stole it '09 and then he sold
20 feet off the front of the DOTfor a stupid number. It's a
decent corner in Lehigh. And nowhe's about to sell 20 feet off
the left hand side to the DOTfor a rather stupid number. And

(28:53):
he still got enough to developbut he's got the fireworks guys
that are there for what NewYear's Eve, Fourth of July. He's
got the Christmas tree, he got,he actually makes a pretty
decent little return. And on topof that he gets a free Christmas
tree.

He's doing pumpkins this fall, he's
got...OK.

Trucks, there's food truck guy and the job, I
called him on, like so how mucha taco guy given he just like,
lunch.

Lunch.

He parks and know him, but you know that
there are utilities to land butyou, lands generally more of a
trade, but like you brought upgold. That's a really good
analogy, but no sane personwould have 100% of their
portfolio in gold or land.

Or land.

You know, it's a, it's a nice it's a good
little insurance edge.

Yeah,

It's a cyclical market-based insurance hedge,
but it's a good little insuranceedge.

Yeah.

In public records.
In public records. Can you sharemaybe a little bit of insight
into the leads that you reallylike? Is it somebody who's owned
a piece of land for 60 years atsomebody licking their wounds
from 2006 who bought it for $90grand like, what gets you
excited?

I used to only do out-of-state people and I've
come to the conclusion I'm just,I just send everybody something.

Okay.

Believe it or not Yeah, I call it vintage
based marketing too like you getthis people that bought in these
years and that year, butlandowners are probably the most
interesting sellers on theplanet because there's so many
people that owning a piece ofland for them as part of their
almost our makeup, you know,they go to cocktail parties and
they're like yeah, I have thislot in Florida and it's just

(30:32):
kind of part of their makeup Itreally is. And they get
separation anxiety about sellingtheir lot in Florida that
they'll never build on some havenever seen but it's just kind of
part of 'Hey, I got land inFlorida I got something going
for me' and believe you're notthere's a lot of them. And, and
then on top of that, it's allthe right timing. Timing is

(30:53):
everything and really time rightyou need to be on scale for
people you just need to betouching. We used to do very
particular vintages. I'm nowhitting just basically 33976 and
Lehigh everybody in it.

Do you, do you time your marketing like for
like when the property tax billhits? Because that's when people
go, 'Oh, God, do I really wantthis anymore?' I think that's
one thing that I've found workswell for land.

See, I look at it differently for us. Our
approach is we market constantly24/7 every day, we have a
metrics in our dashboard of howmany leads came in today. And if
it's under 25, it's in the red.
So, life is about building adatabase. That's really your
entire business. We're at thepoint I think we've got 10,000

(31:39):
people in the areas we work thathave responded and we've talked
to. So we're you know, we, myplan is someday to have that be
every piece of land on planetEarth. So, when we're the, and
I'm then going to talk to Elonabout hitting Mars once we you
know once we totally get thatgoing, but you know, it's all
about the database we do betterwhen the tax bills come out. We

(32:02):
do better right after the firstof the year. But there's people
that are ready to sell land forany transmission drops out of
their car. Their daughter justinformed them she said yes to
that young man on his knee.
There's a lot of reasons thatpeople suddenly need some
capital and get in front of themand talking to them you know the

(32:23):
old time yeah you mail here,mail there. It's the most
efficient, but we live in a 24/7interconnected world and it's so
easy to market now. That there'sno reason not to never you know,
I always say always be closing.
It's really cheap. ABM always bemarketing. Always be marketing.

So, on that direct mail, I assume as part of it.
Cold Calling?

Yeah, it's not the funnest.

Yeah, email?

No.

No, you're not doing...

Once they opt in and they talk to us. We email
them. But cold email? No.

No cold email.
Custom audience?

Yeah, some?
Yes. No, I'm really good withthe social media stuff. So, I'm
not going to give on a whole lotof that. But yes, we do that. In
theory, we might do that. Yes.

Any that I missed?

Oh, SMS is, they're really about to make
that go away.

Yeah.

They are really working on SMS to go away.
Voicemail not. Mail paysprobably the biggest dividends
because while it's moreexpensive, it is a physical
piece of the world that theystick in a drawer.

What I always say is like when you think about
impressions, right? Think aboutthe number of ads scrolling by
in your browser and stuff everyday. Right? And everybody's
like, well, people just throwaway direct mail. But think
about that for a minute. Howlong does it take you, you got
to get that piece of mail out ofthe mailbox where you might see
it, you got to sort it whereyou're gonna see it, you've got

(33:54):
to decide you're going to put itin the trash can where you're
feeling it picking up and you'reputting it in the trash can.
That's way more of an impressionthan any online ad, even if it's
just on the way to the trashcan.

Well, a lot of a lot owners are older too. So,
they read their mail. I thinkwhen the millennials and younger
are the biggest general biggestpercentage of lot owners. Direct
Mail will probably be useless.

I will tell you, I disagree. Because having a 17
and 18 year old they'refascinated by mail.

Really?

Yeah, they'd like to pick, my son is like oh yeah,
I'll pick up the bell. He'slike, oh, Dad, you got up. You
know, whatever a card off.

You let your kids have a phone though is the
question.

They do.

Now that the mail like, I own a brokerage
too, and when we mail inpredominantly 55 and up areas,
we get double the response rate.
Generally I find it in any assetclass that has like an older
demographic that owns it, yourdirect mail just trends better.
But direct mail in and of itselfis useless. You know, it needs
to be multiple touches,accompanied by every bit of

(35:06):
electronic anything you can doto back it up and get in front
of them. It's, you know, I thinkabout how easy we had it in 2004
for marketing, because all youdid was mail some postcards, or
maybe do a newspaper ad or ashopper ad. And at that point,
you know, there was some onlineads, but they weren't really as
prevalent, it was kind of likean arcane art too. But when I

(35:28):
really look at marketing today,it is, it is complex. Like the
ad sets that I use are three tofive, deep down. It's really
complex, you know, and they'vetaken away a lot of the ability
like that whole hack theelection with Facebook thing
actually cost me a lot of moneybecause I lost the ability to

(35:51):
upload some custom audiences. Imean, we at one point in figured
out a way to when I would getsomething in a neighborhood, I
add a custom audience frompublic records of just the
people in that neighborhood.

Yeah.

So, I would spend like $8 to fully expose an
asset to the people that aremost likely to know somebody to
want to buy it. You know, and,you know, biggest thing I'm mad
about the whole thing, I'm notto get into any kind of partisan
politics, but the aftermath ofthat raise my, my advertising
cost online about 300%, becauseI went from, I went from very

(36:26):
targeted laser things to broad,broad based everything.

Now, because you're in land, you're not
feeling probably at the impactsof something like Sundae, and I
don't think Sundae's in yourmarket. But there are basically
the Opendoor of, on the investorside or, you know, Zillow Offers
or those Offerpad, that kind ofthing. And we're seeing the same
thing where they're coming intoa market and they'd have so much

(36:52):
money, you know, capital thatthey've raised the spend, it's
pushing up the advertising costdramatically for our customers,
you probably aren't feeling thatyet from any kind of
institutional players?

There's a whole lot of us, there's two other
groups that are exactly what wedo in town. Some members that
are in the REIA, too.

So, you're pushing up each other's costs?

Yeah, no, it's the, some people respond to it.
Ultimately, what this all boilsdown to, and why I'm never
worried about iBuyers oranything, it's all about your
level of talent, your level offocus. And the most important
thing is for a human being toeither sit in front of another
human being or have a phoneconversation, that, that is
relevant, and that you have somecognizance about it. Because,

(37:40):
you know, I did a, we did awonderful attempt at having VAs
close people.

Yeah.

Did not work.

Yeah.

You know, and it was a good experiment. But it
just, it's not even the talent.
The one the one, one lady,particularly is very talented.
But there's just such adifference barrier of not
understanding what Publix meansfor a Cape Coral lot that she'll
probably never know, even if weexplained it to her, it doesn't
correlate well. So, well, allthe technology platforms and all

(38:10):
that in the world. Myexperiences they can't close
well.

Share with us...

That's what the game is. A lot of people blame
Zillow and blame iBuyers. Andthey really, the only
competition you have is you.

We always like to say changes, the only constant
and changes we're allopportunity comes from. And so,
you know, if you can't roll withthat change and deal with that
change, you're just shuttingyourself down to opportunity.
So, it sounds like you're prettygood on the change.

In Palm Bay, we hit that market, we got amazing
response rates. And somebodycame in at the time lots were
retail 12 to 15. Some groupmailed everybody an offer for
15- $25,000. And with theintent, I think to retrade them.

(39:01):
But in the meantime, it killedour marketing because we're
writing offers and they're goingHey, and he sent us some of the
letters that were an offer. Butwhat we did is we we jumped in
and we waited for that 30 dayswhen we knew they were never
going to close. And then guesswhat? Yeah, you know, and one of
our guys on the phone hispitches 'Look I'm easy girl at

(39:24):
prom, I'm a sure thing.' So,it's literally what he says to
people and but then they signthey love it. They think it's
the funniest thing on theplanet. You know, it's all about
how you say it, but we got touse the 'we're the', 'we're
the,' you know, 'we're the easyprom date, we're sure thing.'
So, you know, you want to keepdreaming or do you want to have
a fun prom? And that wasliterally and we got a bunch of

(39:47):
deals out of that by justbacking off. We kind of shut
down the marketing. We let thattake place because you know,
math means things if a lot is$10,000 unless there is
BlackRock know something wedon't and is gobbling up a whole
market. And this was obviouslynot BlackRock and its marketing

(40:08):
that somebody sold this thesepeople, of course, that said,
you know, retrade them, and thenyou'll you know, that kind of
thing. And the beauty is theyput out a lot of mail. And while
it disrupted our initial run in30 days, we were slammed.

That's great.

It is great.

Well walk us through, you know, you're
scaling up, you're addingpeople, Like, what, what is your
team look like? What are the keypeople that you need to help you
scale?

That's really hard, because we've got probably
the most eclectic group of humanbeings on the planet. So, I
mean, it really there is nomodel.

Their titles are there, like people who are just
focused on closing and other...

We have, we have people that kind of do the
workup. Then we have closers. Wehave one lady that all she does,
she is extremely OCD. And allshe does is manage our
transactions. And she willfigure out if the title company
misspelled something in email,because that's her level of OCD,

(41:10):
which is exactly who you wantmanaging your transactions...

Absolutely.

...reviewing your HUDs we've got some VA's
that actually work just our CRM,you know, we kind of have a
little bit of everything, it's apretty big scaled up with very
specific role players. And, andhonestly, as we identify
friction points, we add peopleto fix the friction.

Yeah.

Because the biggest thing, you know, you're
scaling when there's friction.
Because nobody scales. And, and,and, and, you know, have it's
not wine and roses scaling,it's, you know, things come up,
you get overwhelmed, it's justa, it's business. You know, if
you haven't had an argument withyour partner, you're busy,
you're probably not busy enough.

(41:57):
Just the way it is. It's justthe way business is done. You
know what I mean? And you gethuman beings and you're, you're
talking to each other a lot. Andit's just the way it is. But
yeah, we basically have roleplayers we kind of have a
schematic of our, of ourprocess. And we have people and
then the hardest thing for us issales people because sales
people are such a rare breedlike real closers. I mean, I'm

(42:20):
not talking to somebody to readfrom a script a real life
closer, and like, we have onegirl who's amazing. And she'll
call me and she talks for like,30 minutes, about like, what do
you think this lot Lehigh isworth? And it dawned on me and
the other one of the calls I'mlike, that's why she's so
amazing, because I'm on thephone and we're talking about
her kids and my kids and thisand that music video and, and

(42:44):
but by the end of it, you knowwhat I mean? You're completely
at ease. And you know, she'sjust really good at it. And she
actually enjoys talking topeople and you know that, that
is probably our hardest thingbecause we have another guy who
only does really high volumedeals. But his, he could
probably do a lot more businessif he wasn't so curt about

(43:05):
everything you don't I mean, I'malmost ready to somehow have a
grading system in our leads. Youknow, Edie Kathy's go to this
one...

Lead scoring.

...go to this guy...

Busy professional probably prefers the curt fast
to the point guy. Right? And,you know, Grandma, who hasn't
talked to anybody in two months,you know, or kids aren't calling
she's probably loves his othergal.

Yeah, now she'll talk. She likes to talk
and she slays it we've done,she's picked up like a 13 pack a
lot from a guy that was just ahuge rainmaker.

Wow. That's cool.

And the and the VAs, you're just having the
background you said working onCRM stuff. And research?

They do everything, data cleaning the
VAs are. VA 's are like we havea VA with the REIA, I have VA's
with my brokerage I have VA's onevery business, there are
certain things that VA isactually do better than us.

I will have to tell you, I'm on your marketing
for your club and you do a greatjob, I get your voicemail drops,
I get your emails, you've reallygot it dialed in. So, your team
does a really good job.

VA is super interesting to all of our folks.
Give us a list of things thatyou think we these are
exceptional, whether what youthink they're even better than
you know, what you're able tofind talent locally for?

Well, VA's don't believe it or not make as
many mistakes as people inAmerica, right? You tell them to
do A, B and C they will do a Band C as opposed to try and
innovate. You know what I mean?
If they have a better way to doit, they will but you know, it's
very bad... So, I kind ofrespect by the books.

Yeah. And the Americans we're not good rule
followers.

Yeah, they don't and that's the amazing
part is of 'Hey, I need you toclick this button 65 times',
your average American is goingto grown, and complain and whine
the entire time they click thebutton 65 times, where, first of
all, they're in another country.
So, you don't know that'sanother thing I love about VA is
that if they're having a badday, you really don't know,
because you're not they're inthe Philippines. They're in

(45:13):
India, they don't really youknow what I mean? That, if she's
having a really bad day, as longas all the tasks, click, that's
fine. And, you know, it's it,they do a lot of but VA should
be doing things that, that youbasically what makes you money?
And what makes you money, youshouldn't be doing the actual
what I call moments of truth,everything else should be set

(45:36):
up. So, in my opinion.

Okay. Is there any opportunity in, I know the area
just had FEMA go through andupdate all the flood zone maps?
Would you take on that point ofdata and your marketing and say,
'Hey, your, you know, flood zonejust changed. You might have a
challenge with selling' or Idon't know.

Well, let me share something with you in
downtown Fort Myers, there was apretty well esteem building that
was for sale. And they changedthe FEMA map so that a little
sliver of the building came intoa flood zone and it killed a
really good deal. So, you know,that, that the FEMA maps can be

(46:21):
in either direction, andgenerally the FEMA maps are just
more of a negative event, in myopinion here in Florida than
they are anything else. We donotice them. Almost every
builder wants flood zone acts,you know, it's no dead, they
just don't, because the problemwhen you get into the other
flood zones, you're bringing inmore fill, more fill is a much
bigger cost. You know, on lotsit's elevation and vegetation

(46:44):
are your two biggest things topay attention to. Because when
you're building a home, the lotclearing and the filtered are
two variables. That can be touh. And if you're ever going to
o land, you need to get prety good at figuring that out
But when you're doing when youre doing that kind of stuff. Yea
. If something suddenly becme flood zone x, that'd be all

(47:05):
over that.

Yes, it's usually not going that way. Is it?

Yeah, generally goes the opposite direction.

Right. Because all of Florida is sinking, right?

Yeah, if you listen, but you know. You know
the scary part, there really arepeople that believe all this
stuff on the internet, like theworld is flat. I mean, it's not
a joke.

Yeah, it probably is not something...

We had a seller who was a flat earther. And we
used to just listen to thecalls, because he would just
continually bring stuff up likethat, and I almost wanted to
call him and that's not reallywhat I do. You know, and I
almost wanted the calling justto hear it.

Yeah.

Have a couple glasses of wine and call this
guy and just hear what he has tosay.

Now, you mentioned CRM, do you have a favorite one
that you recommend?

No. No, we're always trying to find the next
better one.

Okay. Any other...

I mean, we use a, we used multiple CRMs for
different things, some formarketing, some for follow up
some for this, but we are alwayslooking for a better product, I
was almost ready to buy my ownor build our own. And so, I
talked to one of my mentors, andhe brought up a point he goes
when you build your ownplatform, when it breaks, no,

(48:21):
there's nobody to fix it, butyou. It really is a pretty,
pretty wow moment. And thenyou're, you're also married
mentally to this thing youbuilt. It's now kind of part of
you. And it'll prevent you frompivoting. So yeah, we're very
agnostic when it comes to CRMswhatever works the best. If they

(48:43):
have, you know, works the bestand cost relation, there's some
great CRMs. But the spend, youknow, $4,000 a month to use a
CRM is insane. And there's someout there that once you add the
users that hit that level.

Oh, for sure.

Is there any other technology stack that you are
really enjoying this year?

Well, skip tracing has a lot of fun because
they seem to just flip back andforth. Some days are good, some
days they're bad. Really, it'sjust more integrations. I mean,
the greatest gift to the worldsince the Gutenberg printing
press is Zapier. So, I mean,there's few things that bind the

(49:26):
world together better thanZapier.

We've got a lot of customers that are, that love
the fact that they can now feedtheir CRM and marketing
automation tools with publicrecords directly from our
systems through Zapier, andwe're the only ones to do that.

Yeah, it's Zapier is. There's some other
clones that are out there thatwe haven't tried yet. But I
mean, without Zapier, this wouldbe a lot tougher to do.

Yeah.

I mean, I was the other day the REIA's like
the Southwest Florida REIA we dosome marketing. It's very
rudimentary. It's not nearly onthe level of what we do and like
I'll have a video and then youknow retarget with another
video. And then there's a leadad. But then I was just looking
at what happens on the lead ad,you know, Zapier takes it from
Facebook. The REIA uses Podio.
So, that takes it into Podiothen adds it to MailChimp, then

(50:14):
adds it to another service I usefor some additional retargeting.
It's pretty amazing. And itcosts I think we do $20 a month.
Yeah, I honestly want to callhim up and say, I don't know,
you guys are kind of showingyourselves a little short guys.

Oh, don't!

We can help you spend more money with them.

Yeah, no, I'm, we're always I would love to
talk to you guys about that I,we're always looking for a
better way to do it. I had lunchwith a guy who did what I did
before. And he's now worth a lotof money as a result of what
we're doing. And I came out ofit. Well, you know, because
there's nothing like the insightof having done something.

Right.

Because at the time, you know, what appears to
you isn't what really is,generally in business. In
hindsight, well, we should havedid this. Like, in hindsight,
you asked about the targetedlist. And hindsight I should
have been hitting every person,should have just taken zip codes
and worked every zip codeinstead of trying to pull out
the special people that...

Did it occur to y u to use, you still have a t
rgeted list? Right? Because yu're not you're hitting lots, y
u're not hitting every poperty, right. You're not...

I'm at the point, if you have land in the
market, we want you're getting,you're getting marketing.

Right.

There's no reason not to.

Commercial as well as residential?

No. Commercials tough.

You say you're targeting?

You're targeting!

When you say target, I'm thinking from
Minnesota who bought five to 10years ago.

Yeah, I do think though that, you know, to some
degree like, so yeah, I thinkyou, you're targeting to get
down to the product you want andthen mailing to everybody, which
is great. But I do think thatthis is just becomes a time,
amount of time that you have,like, the person who bought a
year ago versus the person whohad it for 10 years, right? The

(52:06):
person is 70 versus the personwho's 30. Like, those people
have different wants and needs,and you could probably improve
your messaging and get better,you could probably improve your
response rates by...
Or it's a lot easier, to buy alot for 7000 that they bought
for four, than to buy a lot for7000 that they bought for 85.
Yeah. So, that, you know,understanding those things do

(52:29):
right, which we've got, youknow, we'd like to talk about
that as segmenting. So, youstart with that big list. And
then you segment it into thesesmaller things so that you know,
the guy who is 85 you know, it'slike, hey, you're lot's probably
never going back to 85 it's adifferent message than the guy
who bought it for four, and he'sgonna get a double.

Yeah. Well, the lot for 85 are fun. And the
interesting thing is, isprobates on land don't seem to
be just as viable. I just don't,like I did well, with improved
properties with probates. Theprobate, we tried it, it's just
not it's for some reason, not asviable.

We're about out of time. What are you excited about
in 2021. You're in the middle ofa hot market, it's scalding hot
in Florida overall. Some peopleare worried and you know, you
see the headlines, you know,it's gonna bust. How are you
feeling about the market?

Um, I drill deep into the market, like for
the cape land market, I have aspreadsheet that does year over
year closed sales, and thenblends in what's pending, and
then blends in what's activebased on pricing. And I call it
momentum, momentum. Basically,it's probably trend lines
carrying stuff forward of whereit's gonna end up. But we're,

(53:50):
I'm watching all of the marketswhat, you'll know when I shut
down the Florida land team willbe probably when we not I,
there's few of us doing it. Wel, when we pivot out of the Flo
ida land team is probablone you'll know, because
we've got probably the best daa sets around. I'm not saying
'm the best or but we probablhave the best data sets and we
ave two of us in this that arextremely analytical. So, it'

(54:12):
not just me there. There'sat least two opinions on everyth
ng. But I we're not, we're nt there yet. And this is a diffe
ent driver like you've got fro2000 to 2025. A lot of retiree
coming here. And then on topf that, I'm seeing a modalit
that I've never seen beforen my brokerage, I have a retail

(54:32):
rokerage, and we're sellingto 40-year-olds that are going t
Snowbird because they can nowremotely work here which that I'
e never seen in mass. I've doe three of those. Our company
sold three of those now, recentl, and then I'm also seeing
he biggest consumers in Americaby, by a percentage of Gen Z.
nd they like the millennals were late bloomers because

(54:57):
they kind of grew up with ths backdrop of a bad economy
Gen Z's never seen a bad timthat they really remembe
. So, they're, they're a littleore, they're a lot more bullish
Like I kind of, you look ata generation and you know, t
ey either grew up in a bull ora bear back- backdrop, like Ge
X, we grew up in kind of a ber backdrop. So, we're, we're k
nda a little always got a bearih lens to things because

(55:19):
you know...

My son's Gen Z, and he called me to pitch me on
GameStop. So yes, bearish...

You know what though? I made money on Gen, on
GameStop 60% on what I put init.

I love it. Well...

What's cool about GameStop? Is a whole
younger generation realize thatyou can actually make money on
your phone and not just playthings and watch things. through
both of my boys are my son for22 and 24. And in college, and
all we talk about is Robin Hoodnow.

Yeah.

Every day they call to tell me what stock they
bought. So, I mean, as a father,I'm excited that they're, you
know, that they're, you know,they go to college, they have
jobs, but they're also spendingsome of their spare time and
trying to figure out how to makemoney.

It's crazy how big this is in the college scene
like Robin like, yeah, it's alittle scary, though with that,
with the with some of the what'sthe word? The funding.

Crowdfunding?

No, no, no. When they let you trade the

Margin?

Oh margin.

Thank you. Yeah.
If you did margin stuff, youknow, I don't know that you
should be given 20 year old kidsin college margin to be trading
GameStop.

Yeah, I don't know. There's all crush it and
then you'll hear about the badones. But when you look at our
market, Gen Z is coming onstrong. So, I see two primary
drivers right now. There's Gen Zand some of the millennials
buying their first homes. Andthen you've got wealthy to do
baby boomers coming down here.
And between the two, excuse me,they're driving both ends of the

(57:00):
market. You've got the entrylevel housing market is insane.
Good luck finding a cheap home.

Yeah,.

But also good luck finding value on a $700,000
waterfront home too, you're notstealing that either.

Right. Right, right. This is fun.

You guys out of California. I talked to a guy
today, following me about a$700,000 California house. As
compared to, I'm like, he wastelling me about a $700,000
California house that is a 1500square foot three, two with a
pool. I'm like, well, that herewould be 4000 square feet with a

(57:41):
water view and a pool. And...

Yeah.

That'd be a lot. And it was pretty, pretty
basic. Like you need to go toHome Depot and buy some new
cabinet kind of finishes. And,you know, you don't have to do
much to move into this house andstart enjoying life. So, it's a
matter so much capital comingfrom the west coast to this area
right now that it's insane.

Well, Jeff, if people wanted to get in touch
with you, how is, what's thebest way to follow you?

Ah, that's a really good question, actually.

Let's start with the REIA, how do they find the
REIA?

REIA's website is swflreia.com. There's also a
Facebook page for the SouthwestFlorida REIA I think well, about
30,000 followers, believe it ornot, for me personally,
honestly, give me a call. Mynumber is 339-671-8248. I'm down

(58:35):
to talk to anybody if you have aquestion. I started out in this
business, and I really had noclue what I was doing. And I'm
only alive because I had someamazing mentors who drew no
value from helping. So, I don't,I mean, I don't understand why
one guy has spent so much timesaving me from myself, my

(58:55):
mentors, so I feel kind of dutybound to repay that. With that
said, I'm probably not going tobe your full time mentor. But if
you got questions, if you needsome help with something wants
somebody to bounce something offof give me a call.

Thanks Jeff.

Before you call him to ask for mentoring. Go
online, and do a little researchon how to ask for a mentor, what
to expect from a mentor, howlike, you know, there is, there
is, there's stuff on you whenyou ask people to mentor you.
And you should understand whatthat is because otherwise you're

(59:29):
you know, Jeff's probably goingto stop returning your calls.
So, do some research. Before youcall Jeff, please.

Thanks, Jeff.
Thank you for listening to theData Driven Real Estate Podcast,
you can find show notes andlinks to some of the resources
mentioned in the show atdatadrivenrealestate.com. Click
that join the community, andyou'll be forwarded to the
PropertyRadar community whereyou can ask questions about the
current show and even seeupcoming guests and ask
questions there. We'd love toengage with you in the

(59:56):
community. So check it out.
Please don't forget to like,favorite, subscribe and share on
your favorite platform whereyou're listening to the show. It
helps us out a great deal.
Thanks for listening, and we'llsee you next week.

All Episodes

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

On Purpose with Jay Shetty

Crime Junkie

Ridiculous History

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Land Investing and Sales with Jeff Tumbarello #DDRE39

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

.css-r6mb8g{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:1;overflow:hidden;}On Purpose with Jay Shetty

Crime Junkie

Ridiculous History

All Episodes

Land Investing and Sales with Jeff Tumbarello #DDRE39

On Purpose with Jay Shetty