July 1, 2024 • 31 mins
In this episode of the Defiant Health podcast, I bring together a number of strategies I’ve discussed piecemeal in past that have enormous potential to improve skin: reduce wrinkle depth, increase dermal collagen, increase dermal moisture, accelerate healing, reduce existing sun damage and prevent future sun damage. Recall that we don’t achieve this with topical application, but with oral consumption.
It’s the dermal layer of skin, after all, beneath the largely impenetrable epidermis, that is the seat of skin health and appearance. If the dermis cannot be effectively accessed through the exterior epidermis, how do you achieve improvements in the dermal layer? Orally, of course. For instance, hyaluronic acid consumed orally exerts dermal benefits body-wide. So let’s discuss strategies that you can adopt that provide smooth, healthy, more youthful skin, but all achieved orally.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
In this episode of the Defiant Health Podcast, I
bring together a number ofstrategies I've discussed
piecemeal in past that haveenormous potential to improve
skin reduce wrinkle depth,increase dermal collagen,
increase dermal moisture,accelerate healing, reduce
existing sun damage and preventfuture sun damage.
(00:27):
Recall that we don't achievethis with topical application,
but with oral consumption.
It's the dermal layer of skin,after all, beneath the largely
impenetrable epidermis, that isthe seat of skin health and
appearance.
If the dermis cannot beeffectively accessed through the
exterior epidermis, how do youachieve improvements in the
(00:50):
dermal layer?
Orally, of course, for instance, hyaluronic acid consumed
orally exerts dermal benefitsbody-wide.
So let's discuss strategiesthat you can adopt that provide
smooth, healthy, more youthfulskin, but achieved orally.
And later in the podcast let'stalk about Defiant Health's
(01:11):
sponsors Paleo Valley, ourpreferred provider for many
excellent organic and grass-fedfood products, and BioDequest,
my number one choice forprobiotics that are
scientifically formulated,unlike most of the other
commercial probiotic productsavailable today.
I'm frequently impressed when Ihear just how much most ladies
(01:35):
and it's mostly ladies who knowthese things know about topical
application of various productsgive the appearance of improved
skin health, so they mightconceal blemishes, for instance,
or use lighteners or applyretinoic acid that increases
dermal collagen, or they mightapply hyaluronic acid serums
that smooth skin wrinkles atleast transiently.
(01:57):
Others, including manyestheticians and dermatologists,
resort to such strategies asapplying red light or
microneedling or sauna or othermethods that presumptively
increase the deposition ofdermal collagen.
So these are all topical orlocal effects, sometimes
involving some injections intothe dermal layer, but they're
(02:18):
all applied externally throughthe epidermis.
But I'd like to encourage youto think a little differently.
So it's perfectly fine to doall these external strategies,
but I want to persuade you thatif you obtain better skin
appearance and health internallythat is, from the dermis, from
the gastrointestinal tract tothe dermis, and outwardly,
you'll get better results withall those external strategies.
(02:41):
In other words, it would belike applying, say, cover-ups or
lighteners or hyaluronic acidserum to a 75-year-old's facial
skin or someone who's 30 yearsold, which will obtain better
results.
Of course those strategiesapply to a 30-year-old's skin.
What if we could turn back theclock in skin health and
appearance from, say, age 75 or65 back 10 or 20 years?
(03:05):
You're going to get even betterresults with all those other
external strategies.
There's a list of reasons whyoral strategies, that is, things
you ingest orally, work.
This is because that most of ushave lost microbes from our
gastrointestinal microbiomes fora variety of reasons
Overexposed antibiotics,chlorinated drinking water,
(03:28):
preservatives in food that haveantibacterial properties, the
herbicide glyphosate that killsweeds, yes, but also kills
microbes.
It's an antibiotic.
Emulsifying agents in foods,stomach acid blocking drugs and
a number of other factors haveall conspired to introduce
massive change into thegastrointestinal microbiome but
most of all, have led to theloss of hundreds of species,
(03:51):
some of which exerted positiveeffects on your skin, the
so-called gut skin axis.
There's also distortions ofdiet, the modern diet, because
we've been told, for instance,to reduce our intake of
saturated fat and cholesterol,for which there was no good
evidence in the first place toshow that a reduced intake of
saturated fat and cholesterolreduced cardiovascular risk.
(04:14):
But that awful advice widelyembraced by most Americans over
the last 50 years, led toabandonment of a number of
important factors that playroles in your facial skin
appearance, actually body-wideskin appearance.
Specifically, the advice to cutfat and cholesterol caused most
modern people to abandon theconsumption of organ meats such
(04:38):
as brain and heart and tongue,and stomach and intestine, and
those were sources of importantnutrients that have skin
benefits.
There's also been a trendtowards massive over-reliance on
processed and ultra-processedfood.
You recognize these things.
These are snack foods,encephaline wrappers, food
(04:58):
served to you through adrive-thru window, things that
have multiple additives,synthetic additives, and have
been highly processed.
One of the things lacking whenyou rely on processed or
ultra-processed foods arecarotenoids.
Carotenoids are a class ofnutrients.
There's about 600 to 800different carotenoids that are
lacking in the modern diet ofprocessed and ultra-processed
(05:20):
foods, and carotenoids have verypowerful roles on skin health
and appearance, as well asoverall body composition and
inflammation.
So let's talk about all thefactors that you can restore
that are missing.
So these are natural factorsthat you should have had all
along that, when lost, causedeterioration of your skin
health and appearance and, whenreplaced, exert outsized
(05:44):
beneficial effects in smoothingyour skin, reducing wrinkles,
increasing moisture.
Also, bear in mind thathealthier skin means a healthier
body.
In other words, regard the skinas an outward reflection of
internal health, especially ofthe gastrointestinal system.
As you improve gastrointestinaland overall health, you improve
(06:04):
skin health and appearance.
So not only will you feelbetter and look better, you will
be healthier and enjoyhealthier, smoother skin.
So what are the factors lackingin modern life that you can
restore?
Well, the most important amongthem is the microbe
Lactobacillus reuteri.
So Lactobacillus reuteri was amicrobe discovered in 1962 in
(06:28):
the breast milk of a nursingmother in Germany, discovered by
a German microbiologist namedDr Gerhard Reuter, and he found
it easy.
In 1962, he found it easy torecover this microbe in breast
milk, in stool and other sources.
Over the course of his 40-yearacademic career in Germany he
found it more and more difficultto find this microbe, such that
(06:50):
by the end of his 40-yearcareer he found it nearly
impossible to find it.
And that's been borne out byseveral subsequent studies that
nearly all modern people havelost this very important microbe
, lactobacillus reuteri.
Among the reasons why that hashappened is because reuteri is
very susceptible to commonantibiotics.
So perhaps you took amoxicillin10 years ago, 20 years ago for
(07:14):
an upper respiratory infectionor other reason, and it wiped
out all your lactobacillusreuteri.
So almost nobody has thismicrobe anymore, despite the
fact that wild mammals like deer, raccoons and moose they all
have rhodorite Hunter-gathererhumans, unexposed antibiotics
and these other factors all havelactobacillus rhodorite.
(07:34):
It's us who have the problembecause we've lost lactobacillus
rhodorite.
Why is that important?
Well, two reasons.
One reason is thatlactobacillus reuteritis, very
unique as a microbe in thegastrointestinal tract, in that
it sends a signal up through thevagus nerve, up through your
chest neck, into your brain,tells your brain, specifically
(07:55):
the hypothalamus, to release thehormone oxytocin.
And oxytocin has tremendouseffects in stimulating the
expansion of collagen in thedermal layer.
So I know of nothing that is aspowerful or potent as oxytocin
to increase dermal collagen.
Oxytocin also increased theproduction of sebum, the oily
(08:20):
material that provides moisturein your skin.
It also reduces abdominal fatand thereby reduces inflammation
.
It also reduces cortisol thatadds to inflammation and
expansion of abdominal fat.
So oxytocin reduces thosefactors via cortisol so that you
have less inflammationbody-wide, less inflammation in
the skin, less abdominal fatdriving inflammation.
(08:43):
But there's another aspect oflactobacillus roteri's
characteristics, beyond theability to provoke release of
oxytocin from the brain, andthat is its very unique capacity
to be able to colonize thesmall intestine.
In other words, most microbescolonize the colon, the large
bowel, while lactobacillusroteri can colonize both the 24
(09:05):
feet of small intestine as wellas the colon.
Well, that's important becauselactobacillus roteri not only
colonize the small intestine, italso, upon taking up residence,
produces what are calledbacteriocins.
These are natural antibioticseffective against fecal microbes
, that is, proteobacteria.
That's important because modernpeople at least 50% of the US
(09:29):
population due to ouroverexposures to things like
antibiotics and other factors,have allowed beneficial species
to disappear or be reduced innumbers and that phenomenon
allowed the overproliferation offecal microbes.
These are microbes like E coliand salmonella and campylobacter
.
So these fecal microbesoverproliferated in the colon
(09:51):
and then, remarkably, ascendedinto the small intestine.
The small intestine is, bydesign, very permeable because
that's where we absorb nutrientslike vitamins and minerals and
fatty acids and amino acids.
But it's not equipped the smallintestine is not equipped to
handle an invasion of trillionsof fecal microbes.
When that happens, this is aprocess we call small intestinal
(10:15):
bacterial overgrowth, sibo orSIBO.
That's when invading fecalmicrobes live and die rapidly.
They only live for a few hoursand when they die they shed
their toxic components,specifically something called
lipopolysaccharide endotoxin,into the intestine.
That then makes its way acrossthe intestinal wall and into the
(10:36):
bloodstream.
And when endotoxin enters thebloodstream, that's called
endotoxemia and that has majoreffects on degrading skin
appearance and health.
It accelerates skin aging, itcauses inflammation, it adds to
numerous forms of rashes,including rosacea and psoriasis,
(10:56):
as well as acne and dry skinand blemishes.
So restoring rooterite, inaddition to its ability to
provoke oxytocin and therebydermal collagen and other
beneficial effects, alsocolonized the small intestine,
thereby reducing endotoxemia.
And so that you can appreciatethis two-pronged effect of
(11:16):
restoring this lost microbe,lactobacillus roteri, when
combined, exerts very importantand powerful effects on
smoothing your skin and riddingyourself of blemishes and rashes
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Now let's get back to ourdiscussion.
Two other factors that havelargely disappeared from the
modern dietary experience arecollagen, peptides and
hyaluronic acid.
Now, your great-grandma hadlots of collagen and hyaluronic
acid in her diet because sheincluded such things as brain,
(14:37):
heart, tongue, intestines andstomach in her diet.
But the modern device to cutsaturated fat and cholesterol
has made most modern people sosqueamish in consuming organ
meats that we get very littlecollagen and hyaluronic acid.
But each of those thingsindependently adds to your skin,
health and appearance.
For example, ingesting collagenorally increases dermal
(15:02):
collagen quite significantly.
It's not uncommon to have a 7%increase in the thickness of
your dermis over 90 days ofconsuming collagen peptides.
And by the way, taking collagenorally provides other benefits
outside of the skin.
For instance, it increases thecollagen content of your joint
cartilage and therefore prevents, may even reverse, at least in
(15:24):
its earlier stages,osteoarthritis as you rebuild
collagen.
Collagen also adds to shape andbody composition benefits in
that it modestly reduces waistcircumference and increases
muscle.
Having a restoration ofyouthful muscle gives you great
control over metabolic rate,which thereby makes it easier to
lose weight, especially fromabdominal fat.
(15:46):
Likewise, hyaluronic acidrichest in brain and skin and
tongue and some other organslargely absent from the modern
diet and I see people doing suchthings as eating boneless,
skinless chicken breasts, whichis the worst thing you could do.
We want hyaluronic acid.
So if you're too squeamish toadd back organ meats, you can
take both collagen andhyaluronic acid as supplements.
(16:07):
When ingested orally,hyaluronic acid not only
improves the skin around youreyes, where you might apply
hyaluronic acid serums, butimprove skin appearance
body-wide because it increasesdermal thickness, just like
collagen body-wide.
So it increases the thicknessof the dermis around your eyes,
your entire face, your neck,your abdomen, your thighs, your
(16:29):
butt, everywhere, so you havesmoother skin.
Hyaluronic acid works byfurther stimulating production
of collagen in the dermal layerof skin.
It also increases moisturebecause hyaluronic acid is very
good at retaining water, not inan edema type of way, but in
increasing moisture andthickness of the dermis way.
(16:49):
And hyaluronic acid has numerousother health benefits, such as
acting as a fiber, even thoughit's sourced from animals.
Such as acting as a fiber eventhough it's sourced from animals
, specifically organs.
It is a fiber Very unusual inthat nearly all other fibers
come from plants, but hyaluronicacid is a unique fiber in that
it comes from animals and itstimulates proliferation of
(17:09):
healthy bacterial species inyour gastrointestinal microbiome
, so excess of fiber, causingproliferation of healthy species
in your gastrointestinalmicrobiome that in turn produce
a very important fatty acidcalled butyric acid.
And that butyric acid can go toyour skin and acidify the skin,
because healthy skin is acidic,typically having a pH of 4.5.
(17:34):
Unhealthy skin that is, skinwith acne or rosacea or eczema
or psoriasis is less acidic,typically tenfold less acidic,
with a pH of about 5.5.
Recall that the pH scale islogarithmic, so the difference
between a pH of 4.5 and 5.5 istenfold.
(17:55):
Getting butyric acid that goesto the skin because you bloomed
healthy species by consuminghyaluronic acid means that you
discourage skin rashes andblemishes and you encourage the
proliferation of healthy andprotective bacterial species
such as Staphylococcusepidermidis.
So hyaluronic acid is massivelyhelpful, not only for skin
(18:17):
health and appearance, butoverall health and appearance,
including exerting beneficialeffects on your gastrointestinal
microbiome, further adding tothe benefits of the gut-skin
axis.
(18:40):
Carotenoids are a large class ofnutrients that include such
compounds as lycopene orbeta-carotene or cryptoxanthin
that are largely lacking, as Imentioned in the opening
comments, because the moderndiet has become over-reliant on
processed and ultra-processedfoods, largely made with cheap
fillers, chemical additives,excessive sugars, but lack
carotenoids, and that's aproblem for skin health, because
carotenoids are among the mostimportant nutrients in
(19:02):
determining your skin health andappearance, especially
astaxanthin.
Astaxanthin is a carotenoidthat is more potent than all
other carotenoids that istypically sourced from eating
things like salmon or shrimp, orcrab or lobster.
This is the orange color thatthese creatures display and that
carotenoid, astaxanthin, exertshuge effects on skin health and
(19:24):
appearance.
Specifically, both reducesexisting sun damage, but even
more potently prevents futuresun damage.
It makes you less liable toburn, for instance, upon
exposure to ultravioletradiation, as you would with a
sunburn.
It doesn't make you impervious,so be careful, but it takes
longer.
It takes more sun exposure toget a sunburn and thereby sun
(19:47):
damage.
Recall that when you areexposed to excessive sun, it
dissolves or breaks down thecollagen, causes cross-linking
and fragmentation of thecollagen in the dermal layer of
skin that is then resorbed,reabsorbed by an enzyme called
metalloproteinase, and so whenyou're overexposed to sun,
there's degradation ordeterioration in the collagen
(20:09):
layer of your dermis, which isthen reabsorbed, and it thins
your skin.
That's why people who've hadtoo much sun exposure have that
thinned, crepey skin that lookslike they've aged 10 or 20 years
just by getting a sunburn orgetting excessive sun.
Astaxanthin and othercarotenoids such as lycopene,
rich in tomatoes and other redor orange colored foods,
(20:30):
contribute to preserving skinhealth, reducing skin damage,
reducing existing sun damage andpreventing future sun damage.
It's also very potentanti-inflammatory.
So part of the deteriorationskin health and appearance is
inflammation, and astaxanthin isexceptionally effective at
minimizing or reducinginflammation.
(20:50):
Now, each of the factors Imentioned lactobacillus roteri,
collagen peptides, hyaluronicacid and astaxanthin all exert
independent effects on thedermal layer of skin as well as
other body parts all beneficialeffects.
Now if you were to take, forinstance, collagen peptides
alone let's say 20 grams ofbovine collagen per day or if
(21:12):
you were to take hyaluronic acidalone, 120 milligrams orally
per day, you would typically seeabout a six to seven percent
increase in the thickness of thedermal layer.
That's from the expansion ofcollagen mostly.
But if you combine these fourstrategies, restore
lactobacillus rotera that you'velost.
(21:33):
Supplement collagen peptidesbecause most people don't want
to eat organ meats anymore, weuse collagen supplements, such
as bovine collagen 20 grams perday, supplement hyaluronic acid
120 milligrams per day, andsupplement astaxanthin.
The most common dose is fourmilligrams.
The only caveat withastaxanthin is it must be
consumed in the presence of oilsor fats, because astaxanthin is
(21:55):
oil soluble and absorption ismuch enhanced when you consume
it in the presence of oils orfats, because astaxanthin is
oil-soluble and absorption ismuch enhanced when you consume
it in the presence of oils orfats, such like butter or olive
oil, or a fatty cut of meat.
Astaxanthin absorption isenhanced.
So put those four thingstogether lactobacillus roteri,
collagen, peptides, hyaluronicacid, astaxanthin all factors
lacking in the modern dietaryexperience and you have a
(22:19):
synergistic effect, what Ibelieve is a synergistic effect.
So, whereas those components bythemselves can increase dermal
thickness by about six to sevenpercent, when you put them all
together in our clinical trialhuman clinical trial we obtained
15 percent increased dermalthickness over 90 days.
Now what happens longer than 90days?
We don't know.
We didn't have the budget to gobeyond 90 days, but it likely
(22:41):
gets even better.
But more than twice as muchdermal thickness, meaning more
than twice as much overallbenefit in skin health and
appearance.
By combining those fourcompounds Now you can go even
further by managing your dietand following a diet that does
not cause insulin resistance,inflammation and skin rashes.
(23:04):
Sadly, conventional dietaryadvice not only does not reduce
cardiovascular risk by tellingyou to reduce saturated fat and
cholesterol.
It also causes deteriorationand skin health.
We could also argue that moderndiet causes acceleration of
skin aging.
So a diet that's low in fat andcholesterol and weighed more
heavily in favor of grains theysay healthy whole grains or
(23:27):
everything in moderation,including diet drinks and fruit
juices that kind of diet causesan accelerated deterioration of
skin for a variety of reasons,but one of the main reasons is
the increase in what's calledglycation, that is, glucose
modification of proteins such ascollagen.
Collagen is exceptionallysusceptible to glycations Every
(23:49):
time your blood glucose goesabove 100 milligrams.
So let's say you had a bowl ofoatmeal stone ground, organic
oatmeal no added sugar.
Let's say your blood glucoseprior to the oatmeal was 90
milligrams per deciliter.
You consume that bowl ofoatmeal because you were told it
was heart healthy and yourblood glucose is 155 milligrams,
(24:09):
which is very typical in anon-diabetic much higher if
you're pre-diabetic or a type 2diabetic about uncommonly 300
milligrams.
Every time that blood glucoseexceeds 100, you glycate
collagen and you make it brittleand you cause the enzymes in
the dermal layer of skin toreabsorb the collagen the
(24:31):
enzymes in the dermal layer ofskin to reabsorb the collagen,
causing acceleration of skin,thinning and a crepey appearance
to your skin.
So one wet thing we can do isnever allow blood glucose to
exceed 100 milligrams perdeciliter, thereby turning off
glycation and preserving thecollagen.
This adds further becauseyou're not damaging your
collagen while you're doingthings like restoring
lactobacillus roteri, collagen,peptides, hyaluronic acid,
(24:54):
astaxanthin and rebuildingcollagen that may have been
damaged or lost in previousyears.
So what is the diet thatminimizes glycation,
inflammation, insulin resistanceand stops adding to your
tendency to have skin rashes,dryness and blemishes.
It's a diet that includes nowheat, no grains, no sugars and
(25:16):
we never limit fat and we neverlimit calories.
Very different approach.
People say, oh that if we don'tlimit fat it's going to give us
cardiovascular disease, heartdisease.
It does not.
That's a conversation foranother day.
But the whole house of cards ofcut your saturated fat and
cholesterol that never had goodevidence in the first place.
We don't have to adhere thatsilly advice that impairs health
(25:38):
and led us down the path ofnumerous destructive practices
in health.
We're going to revert back tothe diet that humans have
followed for the first 99.6% ofour species time on this planet
in which humans did not consumethe seeds of grasses, wheat and
grains.
That's what wheat and grainsare, and sugars excessive sugars
and we never limit fat.
(26:00):
If you're a human living in awild setting, you won't throw
away the fat.
You don't throw away the heartor the tongue or the pancreas or
the stomach you consume them.
Or the tongue or the pancreasor the stomach, you consume them
.
Whoever hunted that animalworked hard to get that to kill
that animal, and you consumeeverything, including saving the
ligaments, tendons and bones,to make soups and broths.
By the way, don't fall for thetrap of making bone broths.
(26:22):
We now know that bone brothsthat is, boiling bones for
extended periods, like 36 hours,in the presence of vinegar to
extract minerals Also extractstoxic levels of lead, heavy
metal, lead so we don't do that.
It's fine to make a broth orsoup, but don't use it.
Prolonged boiling, don't addvinegar.
Add meats, tendons, organs,bones, leftover meats or
(26:45):
whatever you have and make soupsor what I call carcass broth.
It doesn't sound veryappetizing, but that's a much
healthier, safer way to get suchthings as collagen and
hyaluronic acid from foods.
Or, of course, you cansupplement them.
But in the background of thisdiet no wheat, no grains, no
added sugars, never limiting fat, never limiting calories
(27:05):
amplifies the benefits youobtain from those four
synergistic factors I discussedearlier.
We also go a step further inaddressing other common nutrient
deficiencies that are unique tomodern life.
For instance, you likely liveindoors, you wear clothes in
public, you may be over the ageof 40, and you don't eat organ
meats that contain some vitaminD.
(27:26):
We therefore supplement vitaminD Ideally enough vitamin D to
achieve a 25-hydroxy vitamin Dblood level.
Therefore, supplement vitamin DIdeally enough vitamin D to
achieve a 25 hydroxy vitamin Dblood level of 60 to 70, the
ideal range.
We supplement magnesium becausewe used to obtain magnesium
from drinking water that passedover rocks and minerals and
streams and rivers Can't do thatanymore.
Right, it's got sewage andother contaminants.
(27:48):
So we filter our drinking waterand water filtration is very
effective, removing allmagnesium.
And modern produce likevegetables and fruit have almost
no magnesium due to modernfarming methods.
So we supplement magnesiumIodine because people don't eat
enough seafood or we can't,because seafood is contaminated
by mercury, shelf iscontaminated by cadmium all from
(28:11):
industrialization.
We need to get our iodine fromsomeplace, so we get it from
kelp tablets or iodine drops.
We get 350 to 400 or somicrograms per day so that your
thyroid gland can operatenormally and produce thyroid
hormones at normal or optimalamounts.
And lastly, we add omega-3fatty acids normal or optimal
(28:33):
amounts.
And lastly, we add omega-3fatty acids, epa and DHA,
because we can't eat all thefish we want, right, because of
mercury, and so we supplementthe EPA and DHA at a dose of
3,000 to 3,600 milligramscombined per day, typically
divided in two.
That can only be obtained fromfish oil.
You cannot obtain it from krillor from sources of linoleic
acids such as flaxseed or chia.
It's something different that islargely unrelated to the EPA
(28:55):
and DHA.
That provides all kinds ofbenefits, including preservation
of brain health and helpingimprove skin health and
appearance.
Now put those four thingstogether Restoration of vitamin
D, magnesium, iodine andomega-3s.
Once again you have asynergistic combination that,
when together, minimizeinflammation, minimize glycation
(29:17):
, minimize insulin resistance,the factors that lead to
deterioration or skin aging.
Now put this all together, younow have a very powerful,
comprehensive oral collection ofstrategies that restores and
maintains beautiful and youthfulskin.
You know, I talk to my membersof my drdavisinfinitehealthcom
(29:37):
inner circle typically once aweek for a couple of hours, and
if you look at these peopleparticipating in my programs who
are doing all the things I'vediscussed today and you'll
notice that with each passingweek, with each passing two-way
Zoom meetup we have typically 90people or so show up.
They look younger and youngerwith each passing week.
We see their crow's feetdissipating.
(29:59):
We see the smile lines beingreduced.
We see the nasolabial foldalong the sides of the nose and
mouth and the forehead wrinklesdiminishing.
We see redness and blotchinessdisappearing.
We see around the eye puffinessreceding.
In other words, I believe it'snot a stretch to say that we see
people looking as if they're 10or 20 years younger.
(30:20):
All by increasing dermalcollagen, all by increasing
dermal moisture, by increasingskin moisture in general, by
reducing inflammation andnormalizing other aspects of
metabolism through thesupplements we add.
So know that you have enormouscontrol over skin health and
appearance obtained orally.
That will amplify, that willincrease the benefits of
(30:43):
whatever you do topically.
Now, if you want more detail onhow this all works, the exact
dosages, best ways to supplementthese things, where to obtain
them, I invite you to join myconversations in my
drdavisinfanthealthcom innercircle.
Now, if you learned somethingfrom this episode of the Defiant
Health Podcast, I invite you tosubscribe through your favorite
(31:04):
podcast directory.
Post a review.
Post a comment.
Join the movement to empoweryourself in health.
Thanks for listening.
In this episode of the Defiant Health Podcast, I
bring together a number ofstrategies I've discussed
piecemeal in past that haveenormous potential to improve
skin reduce wrinkle depth,increase dermal collagen,
increase dermal moisture,accelerate healing, reduce
existing sun damage and preventfuture sun damage.
(00:27):
Recall that we don't achievethis with topical application,
but with oral consumption.
It's the dermal layer of skin,after all, beneath the largely
impenetrable epidermis, that isthe seat of skin health and
appearance.
If the dermis cannot beeffectively accessed through the
exterior epidermis, how do youachieve improvements in the
(00:50):
dermal layer?
Orally, of course, for instance, hyaluronic acid consumed
orally exerts dermal benefitsbody-wide.
So let's discuss strategiesthat you can adopt that provide
smooth, healthy, more youthfulskin, but achieved orally.
And later in the podcast let'stalk about Defiant Health's
(01:11):
sponsors Paleo Valley, ourpreferred provider for many
excellent organic and grass-fedfood products, and BioDequest,
my number one choice forprobiotics that are
scientifically formulated,unlike most of the other
commercial probiotic productsavailable today.
I'm frequently impressed when Ihear just how much most ladies
(01:35):
and it's mostly ladies who knowthese things know about topical
application of various productsgive the appearance of improved
skin health, so they mightconceal blemishes, for instance,
or use lighteners or applyretinoic acid that increases
dermal collagen, or they mightapply hyaluronic acid serums
that smooth skin wrinkles atleast transiently.
(01:57):
Others, including manyestheticians and dermatologists,
resort to such strategies asapplying red light or
microneedling or sauna or othermethods that presumptively
increase the deposition ofdermal collagen.
So these are all topical orlocal effects, sometimes
involving some injections intothe dermal layer, but they're
(02:18):
all applied externally throughthe epidermis.
But I'd like to encourage youto think a little differently.
So it's perfectly fine to doall these external strategies,
but I want to persuade you thatif you obtain better skin
appearance and health internallythat is, from the dermis, from
the gastrointestinal tract tothe dermis, and outwardly,
you'll get better results withall those external strategies.
(02:41):
In other words, it would belike applying, say, cover-ups or
lighteners or hyaluronic acidserum to a 75-year-old's facial
skin or someone who's 30 yearsold, which will obtain better
results.
Of course those strategiesapply to a 30-year-old's skin.
What if we could turn back theclock in skin health and
appearance from, say, age 75 or65 back 10 or 20 years?
(03:05):
You're going to get even betterresults with all those other
external strategies.
There's a list of reasons whyoral strategies, that is, things
you ingest orally, work.
This is because that most of ushave lost microbes from our
gastrointestinal microbiomes fora variety of reasons
Overexposed antibiotics,chlorinated drinking water,
(03:28):
preservatives in food that haveantibacterial properties, the
herbicide glyphosate that killsweeds, yes, but also kills
microbes.
It's an antibiotic.
Emulsifying agents in foods,stomach acid blocking drugs and
a number of other factors haveall conspired to introduce
massive change into thegastrointestinal microbiome but
most of all, have led to theloss of hundreds of species,
(03:51):
some of which exerted positiveeffects on your skin, the
so-called gut skin axis.
There's also distortions ofdiet, the modern diet, because
we've been told, for instance,to reduce our intake of
saturated fat and cholesterol,for which there was no good
evidence in the first place toshow that a reduced intake of
saturated fat and cholesterolreduced cardiovascular risk.
(04:14):
But that awful advice widelyembraced by most Americans over
the last 50 years, led toabandonment of a number of
important factors that playroles in your facial skin
appearance, actually body-wideskin appearance.
Specifically, the advice to cutfat and cholesterol caused most
modern people to abandon theconsumption of organ meats such
(04:38):
as brain and heart and tongue,and stomach and intestine, and
those were sources of importantnutrients that have skin
benefits.
There's also been a trendtowards massive over-reliance on
processed and ultra-processedfood.
You recognize these things.
These are snack foods,encephaline wrappers, food
(04:58):
served to you through adrive-thru window, things that
have multiple additives,synthetic additives, and have
been highly processed.
One of the things lacking whenyou rely on processed or
ultra-processed foods arecarotenoids.
Carotenoids are a class ofnutrients.
There's about 600 to 800different carotenoids that are
lacking in the modern diet ofprocessed and ultra-processed
(05:20):
foods, and carotenoids have verypowerful roles on skin health
and appearance, as well asoverall body composition and
inflammation.
So let's talk about all thefactors that you can restore
that are missing.
So these are natural factorsthat you should have had all
along that, when lost, causedeterioration of your skin
health and appearance and, whenreplaced, exert outsized
(05:44):
beneficial effects in smoothingyour skin, reducing wrinkles,
increasing moisture.
Also, bear in mind thathealthier skin means a healthier
body.
In other words, regard the skinas an outward reflection of
internal health, especially ofthe gastrointestinal system.
As you improve gastrointestinaland overall health, you improve
(06:04):
skin health and appearance.
So not only will you feelbetter and look better, you will
be healthier and enjoyhealthier, smoother skin.
So what are the factors lackingin modern life that you can
restore?
Well, the most important amongthem is the microbe
Lactobacillus reuteri.
So Lactobacillus reuteri was amicrobe discovered in 1962 in
(06:28):
the breast milk of a nursingmother in Germany, discovered by
a German microbiologist namedDr Gerhard Reuter, and he found
it easy.
In 1962, he found it easy torecover this microbe in breast
milk, in stool and other sources.
Over the course of his 40-yearacademic career in Germany he
found it more and more difficultto find this microbe, such that
(06:50):
by the end of his 40-yearcareer he found it nearly
impossible to find it.
And that's been borne out byseveral subsequent studies that
nearly all modern people havelost this very important microbe
, lactobacillus reuteri.
Among the reasons why that hashappened is because reuteri is
very susceptible to commonantibiotics.
So perhaps you took amoxicillin10 years ago, 20 years ago for
(07:14):
an upper respiratory infectionor other reason, and it wiped
out all your lactobacillusreuteri.
So almost nobody has thismicrobe anymore, despite the
fact that wild mammals like deer, raccoons and moose they all
have rhodorite Hunter-gathererhumans, unexposed antibiotics
and these other factors all havelactobacillus rhodorite.
(07:34):
It's us who have the problembecause we've lost lactobacillus
rhodorite.
Why is that important?
Well, two reasons.
One reason is thatlactobacillus reuteritis, very
unique as a microbe in thegastrointestinal tract, in that
it sends a signal up through thevagus nerve, up through your
chest neck, into your brain,tells your brain, specifically
(07:55):
the hypothalamus, to release thehormone oxytocin.
And oxytocin has tremendouseffects in stimulating the
expansion of collagen in thedermal layer.
So I know of nothing that is aspowerful or potent as oxytocin
to increase dermal collagen.
Oxytocin also increased theproduction of sebum, the oily
(08:20):
material that provides moisturein your skin.
It also reduces abdominal fatand thereby reduces inflammation
.
It also reduces cortisol thatadds to inflammation and
expansion of abdominal fat.
So oxytocin reduces thosefactors via cortisol so that you
have less inflammationbody-wide, less inflammation in
the skin, less abdominal fatdriving inflammation.
(08:43):
But there's another aspect oflactobacillus roteri's
characteristics, beyond theability to provoke release of
oxytocin from the brain, andthat is its very unique capacity
to be able to colonize thesmall intestine.
In other words, most microbescolonize the colon, the large
bowel, while lactobacillusroteri can colonize both the 24
(09:05):
feet of small intestine as wellas the colon.
Well, that's important becauselactobacillus roteri not only
colonize the small intestine, italso, upon taking up residence,
produces what are calledbacteriocins.
These are natural antibioticseffective against fecal microbes
, that is, proteobacteria.
That's important because modernpeople at least 50% of the US
(09:29):
population due to ouroverexposures to things like
antibiotics and other factors,have allowed beneficial species
to disappear or be reduced innumbers and that phenomenon
allowed the overproliferation offecal microbes.
These are microbes like E coliand salmonella and campylobacter
.
So these fecal microbesoverproliferated in the colon
(09:51):
and then, remarkably, ascendedinto the small intestine.
The small intestine is, bydesign, very permeable because
that's where we absorb nutrientslike vitamins and minerals and
fatty acids and amino acids.
But it's not equipped the smallintestine is not equipped to
handle an invasion of trillionsof fecal microbes.
When that happens, this is aprocess we call small intestinal
(10:15):
bacterial overgrowth, sibo orSIBO.
That's when invading fecalmicrobes live and die rapidly.
They only live for a few hoursand when they die they shed
their toxic components,specifically something called
lipopolysaccharide endotoxin,into the intestine.
That then makes its way acrossthe intestinal wall and into the
(10:36):
bloodstream.
And when endotoxin enters thebloodstream, that's called
endotoxemia and that has majoreffects on degrading skin
appearance and health.
It accelerates skin aging, itcauses inflammation, it adds to
numerous forms of rashes,including rosacea and psoriasis,
(10:56):
as well as acne and dry skinand blemishes.
So restoring rooterite, inaddition to its ability to
provoke oxytocin and therebydermal collagen and other
beneficial effects, alsocolonized the small intestine,
thereby reducing endotoxemia.
And so that you can appreciatethis two-pronged effect of
(11:16):
restoring this lost microbe,lactobacillus roteri, when
combined, exerts very importantand powerful effects on
smoothing your skin and riddingyourself of blemishes and rashes
.
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Two other factors that havelargely disappeared from the
modern dietary experience arecollagen, peptides and
hyaluronic acid.
Now, your great-grandma hadlots of collagen and hyaluronic
acid in her diet because sheincluded such things as brain,
(14:37):
heart, tongue, intestines andstomach in her diet.
But the modern device to cutsaturated fat and cholesterol
has made most modern people sosqueamish in consuming organ
meats that we get very littlecollagen and hyaluronic acid.
But each of those thingsindependently adds to your skin,
health and appearance.
For example, ingesting collagenorally increases dermal
(15:02):
collagen quite significantly.
It's not uncommon to have a 7%increase in the thickness of
your dermis over 90 days ofconsuming collagen peptides.
And by the way, taking collagenorally provides other benefits
outside of the skin.
For instance, it increases thecollagen content of your joint
cartilage and therefore prevents, may even reverse, at least in
(15:24):
its earlier stages,osteoarthritis as you rebuild
collagen.
Collagen also adds to shape andbody composition benefits in
that it modestly reduces waistcircumference and increases
muscle.
Having a restoration ofyouthful muscle gives you great
control over metabolic rate,which thereby makes it easier to
lose weight, especially fromabdominal fat.
(15:46):
Likewise, hyaluronic acidrichest in brain and skin and
tongue and some other organslargely absent from the modern
diet and I see people doing suchthings as eating boneless,
skinless chicken breasts, whichis the worst thing you could do.
We want hyaluronic acid.
So if you're too squeamish toadd back organ meats, you can
take both collagen andhyaluronic acid as supplements.
(16:07):
When ingested orally,hyaluronic acid not only
improves the skin around youreyes, where you might apply
hyaluronic acid serums, butimprove skin appearance
body-wide because it increasesdermal thickness, just like
collagen body-wide.
So it increases the thicknessof the dermis around your eyes,
your entire face, your neck,your abdomen, your thighs, your
(16:29):
butt, everywhere, so you havesmoother skin.
Hyaluronic acid works byfurther stimulating production
of collagen in the dermal layerof skin.
It also increases moisturebecause hyaluronic acid is very
good at retaining water, not inan edema type of way, but in
increasing moisture andthickness of the dermis way.
(16:49):
And hyaluronic acid has numerousother health benefits, such as
acting as a fiber, even thoughit's sourced from animals.
Such as acting as a fiber eventhough it's sourced from animals
, specifically organs.
It is a fiber Very unusual inthat nearly all other fibers
come from plants, but hyaluronicacid is a unique fiber in that
it comes from animals and itstimulates proliferation of
(17:09):
healthy bacterial species inyour gastrointestinal microbiome
, so excess of fiber, causingproliferation of healthy species
in your gastrointestinalmicrobiome that in turn produce
a very important fatty acidcalled butyric acid.
And that butyric acid can go toyour skin and acidify the skin,
because healthy skin is acidic,typically having a pH of 4.5.
(17:34):
Unhealthy skin that is, skinwith acne or rosacea or eczema
or psoriasis is less acidic,typically tenfold less acidic,
with a pH of about 5.5.
Recall that the pH scale islogarithmic, so the difference
between a pH of 4.5 and 5.5 istenfold.
(17:55):
Getting butyric acid that goesto the skin because you bloomed
healthy species by consuminghyaluronic acid means that you
discourage skin rashes andblemishes and you encourage the
proliferation of healthy andprotective bacterial species
such as Staphylococcusepidermidis.
So hyaluronic acid is massivelyhelpful, not only for skin
(18:17):
health and appearance, butoverall health and appearance,
including exerting beneficialeffects on your gastrointestinal
microbiome, further adding tothe benefits of the gut-skin
axis.
(18:40):
Carotenoids are a large class ofnutrients that include such
compounds as lycopene orbeta-carotene or cryptoxanthin
that are largely lacking, as Imentioned in the opening
comments, because the moderndiet has become over-reliant on
processed and ultra-processedfoods, largely made with cheap
fillers, chemical additives,excessive sugars, but lack
carotenoids, and that's aproblem for skin health, because
carotenoids are among the mostimportant nutrients in
(19:02):
determining your skin health andappearance, especially
astaxanthin.
Astaxanthin is a carotenoidthat is more potent than all
other carotenoids that istypically sourced from eating
things like salmon or shrimp, orcrab or lobster.
This is the orange color thatthese creatures display and that
carotenoid, astaxanthin, exertshuge effects on skin health and
(19:24):
appearance.
Specifically, both reducesexisting sun damage, but even
more potently prevents futuresun damage.
It makes you less liable toburn, for instance, upon
exposure to ultravioletradiation, as you would with a
sunburn.
It doesn't make you impervious,so be careful, but it takes
longer.
It takes more sun exposure toget a sunburn and thereby sun
(19:47):
damage.
Recall that when you areexposed to excessive sun, it
dissolves or breaks down thecollagen, causes cross-linking
and fragmentation of thecollagen in the dermal layer of
skin that is then resorbed,reabsorbed by an enzyme called
metalloproteinase, and so whenyou're overexposed to sun,
there's degradation ordeterioration in the collagen
(20:09):
layer of your dermis, which isthen reabsorbed, and it thins
your skin.
That's why people who've hadtoo much sun exposure have that
thinned, crepey skin that lookslike they've aged 10 or 20 years
just by getting a sunburn orgetting excessive sun.
Astaxanthin and othercarotenoids such as lycopene,
rich in tomatoes and other redor orange colored foods,
(20:30):
contribute to preserving skinhealth, reducing skin damage,
reducing existing sun damage andpreventing future sun damage.
It's also very potentanti-inflammatory.
So part of the deteriorationskin health and appearance is
inflammation, and astaxanthin isexceptionally effective at
minimizing or reducinginflammation.
(20:50):
Now, each of the factors Imentioned lactobacillus roteri,
collagen peptides, hyaluronicacid and astaxanthin all exert
independent effects on thedermal layer of skin as well as
other body parts all beneficialeffects.
Now if you were to take, forinstance, collagen peptides
alone let's say 20 grams ofbovine collagen per day or if
(21:12):
you were to take hyaluronic acidalone, 120 milligrams orally
per day, you would typically seeabout a six to seven percent
increase in the thickness of thedermal layer.
That's from the expansion ofcollagen mostly.
But if you combine these fourstrategies, restore
lactobacillus rotera that you'velost.
(21:33):
Supplement collagen peptidesbecause most people don't want
to eat organ meats anymore, weuse collagen supplements, such
as bovine collagen 20 grams perday, supplement hyaluronic acid
120 milligrams per day, andsupplement astaxanthin.
The most common dose is fourmilligrams.
The only caveat withastaxanthin is it must be
consumed in the presence of oilsor fats, because astaxanthin is
(21:55):
oil soluble and absorption ismuch enhanced when you consume
it in the presence of oils orfats, because astaxanthin is
oil-soluble and absorption ismuch enhanced when you consume
it in the presence of oils orfats, such like butter or olive
oil, or a fatty cut of meat.
Astaxanthin absorption isenhanced.
So put those four thingstogether lactobacillus roteri,
collagen, peptides, hyaluronicacid, astaxanthin all factors
lacking in the modern dietaryexperience and you have a
(22:19):
synergistic effect, what Ibelieve is a synergistic effect.
So, whereas those components bythemselves can increase dermal
thickness by about six to sevenpercent, when you put them all
together in our clinical trialhuman clinical trial we obtained
15 percent increased dermalthickness over 90 days.
Now what happens longer than 90days?
We don't know.
We didn't have the budget to gobeyond 90 days, but it likely
(22:41):
gets even better.
But more than twice as muchdermal thickness, meaning more
than twice as much overallbenefit in skin health and
appearance.
By combining those fourcompounds Now you can go even
further by managing your dietand following a diet that does
not cause insulin resistance,inflammation and skin rashes.
(23:04):
Sadly, conventional dietaryadvice not only does not reduce
cardiovascular risk by tellingyou to reduce saturated fat and
cholesterol.
It also causes deteriorationand skin health.
We could also argue that moderndiet causes acceleration of
skin aging.
So a diet that's low in fat andcholesterol and weighed more
heavily in favor of grains theysay healthy whole grains or
(23:27):
everything in moderation,including diet drinks and fruit
juices that kind of diet causesan accelerated deterioration of
skin for a variety of reasons,but one of the main reasons is
the increase in what's calledglycation, that is, glucose
modification of proteins such ascollagen.
Collagen is exceptionallysusceptible to glycations Every
(23:49):
time your blood glucose goesabove 100 milligrams.
So let's say you had a bowl ofoatmeal stone ground, organic
oatmeal no added sugar.
Let's say your blood glucoseprior to the oatmeal was 90
milligrams per deciliter.
You consume that bowl ofoatmeal because you were told it
was heart healthy and yourblood glucose is 155 milligrams,
(24:09):
which is very typical in anon-diabetic much higher if
you're pre-diabetic or a type 2diabetic about uncommonly 300
milligrams.
Every time that blood glucoseexceeds 100, you glycate
collagen and you make it brittleand you cause the enzymes in
the dermal layer of skin toreabsorb the collagen the
(24:31):
enzymes in the dermal layer ofskin to reabsorb the collagen,
causing acceleration of skin,thinning and a crepey appearance
to your skin.
So one wet thing we can do isnever allow blood glucose to
exceed 100 milligrams perdeciliter, thereby turning off
glycation and preserving thecollagen.
This adds further becauseyou're not damaging your
collagen while you're doingthings like restoring
lactobacillus roteri, collagen,peptides, hyaluronic acid,
(24:54):
astaxanthin and rebuildingcollagen that may have been
damaged or lost in previousyears.
So what is the diet thatminimizes glycation,
inflammation, insulin resistanceand stops adding to your
tendency to have skin rashes,dryness and blemishes.
It's a diet that includes nowheat, no grains, no sugars and
(25:16):
we never limit fat and we neverlimit calories.
Very different approach.
People say, oh that if we don'tlimit fat it's going to give us
cardiovascular disease, heartdisease.
It does not.
That's a conversation foranother day.
But the whole house of cards ofcut your saturated fat and
cholesterol that never had goodevidence in the first place.
We don't have to adhere thatsilly advice that impairs health
(25:38):
and led us down the path ofnumerous destructive practices
in health.
We're going to revert back tothe diet that humans have
followed for the first 99.6% ofour species time on this planet
in which humans did not consumethe seeds of grasses, wheat and
grains.
That's what wheat and grainsare, and sugars excessive sugars
and we never limit fat.
(26:00):
If you're a human living in awild setting, you won't throw
away the fat.
You don't throw away the heartor the tongue or the pancreas or
the stomach you consume them.
Or the tongue or the pancreasor the stomach, you consume them
.
Whoever hunted that animalworked hard to get that to kill
that animal, and you consumeeverything, including saving the
ligaments, tendons and bones,to make soups and broths.
By the way, don't fall for thetrap of making bone broths.
(26:22):
We now know that bone brothsthat is, boiling bones for
extended periods, like 36 hours,in the presence of vinegar to
extract minerals Also extractstoxic levels of lead, heavy
metal, lead so we don't do that.
It's fine to make a broth orsoup, but don't use it.
Prolonged boiling, don't addvinegar.
Add meats, tendons, organs,bones, leftover meats or
(26:45):
whatever you have and make soupsor what I call carcass broth.
It doesn't sound veryappetizing, but that's a much
healthier, safer way to get suchthings as collagen and
hyaluronic acid from foods.
Or, of course, you cansupplement them.
But in the background of thisdiet no wheat, no grains, no
added sugars, never limiting fat, never limiting calories
(27:05):
amplifies the benefits youobtain from those four
synergistic factors I discussedearlier.
We also go a step further inaddressing other common nutrient
deficiencies that are unique tomodern life.
For instance, you likely liveindoors, you wear clothes in
public, you may be over the ageof 40, and you don't eat organ
meats that contain some vitaminD.
(27:26):
We therefore supplement vitaminD Ideally enough vitamin D to
achieve a 25-hydroxy vitamin Dblood level.
Therefore, supplement vitamin DIdeally enough vitamin D to
achieve a 25 hydroxy vitamin Dblood level of 60 to 70, the
ideal range.
We supplement magnesium becausewe used to obtain magnesium
from drinking water that passedover rocks and minerals and
streams and rivers Can't do thatanymore.
Right, it's got sewage andother contaminants.
(27:48):
So we filter our drinking waterand water filtration is very
effective, removing allmagnesium.
And modern produce likevegetables and fruit have almost
no magnesium due to modernfarming methods.
So we supplement magnesiumIodine because people don't eat
enough seafood or we can't,because seafood is contaminated
by mercury, shelf iscontaminated by cadmium all from
(28:11):
industrialization.
We need to get our iodine fromsomeplace, so we get it from
kelp tablets or iodine drops.
We get 350 to 400 or somicrograms per day so that your
thyroid gland can operatenormally and produce thyroid
hormones at normal or optimalamounts.
And lastly, we add omega-3fatty acids normal or optimal
(28:33):
amounts.
And lastly, we add omega-3fatty acids, epa and DHA,
because we can't eat all thefish we want, right, because of
mercury, and so we supplementthe EPA and DHA at a dose of
3,000 to 3,600 milligramscombined per day, typically
divided in two.
That can only be obtained fromfish oil.
You cannot obtain it from krillor from sources of linoleic
acids such as flaxseed or chia.
It's something different that islargely unrelated to the EPA
(28:55):
and DHA.
That provides all kinds ofbenefits, including preservation
of brain health and helpingimprove skin health and
appearance.
Now put those four thingstogether Restoration of vitamin
D, magnesium, iodine andomega-3s.
Once again you have asynergistic combination that,
when together, minimizeinflammation, minimize glycation
(29:17):
, minimize insulin resistance,the factors that lead to
deterioration or skin aging.
Now put this all together, younow have a very powerful,
comprehensive oral collection ofstrategies that restores and
maintains beautiful and youthfulskin.
You know, I talk to my membersof my drdavisinfinitehealthcom
(29:37):
inner circle typically once aweek for a couple of hours, and
if you look at these peopleparticipating in my programs who
are doing all the things I'vediscussed today and you'll
notice that with each passingweek, with each passing two-way
Zoom meetup we have typically 90people or so show up.
They look younger and youngerwith each passing week.
We see their crow's feetdissipating.
(29:59):
We see the smile lines beingreduced.
We see the nasolabial foldalong the sides of the nose and
mouth and the forehead wrinklesdiminishing.
We see redness and blotchinessdisappearing.
We see around the eye puffinessreceding.
In other words, I believe it'snot a stretch to say that we see
people looking as if they're 10or 20 years younger.
(30:20):
All by increasing dermalcollagen, all by increasing
dermal moisture, by increasingskin moisture in general, by
reducing inflammation andnormalizing other aspects of
metabolism through thesupplements we add.
So know that you have enormouscontrol over skin health and
appearance obtained orally.
That will amplify, that willincrease the benefits of
(30:43):
whatever you do topically.
Now, if you want more detail onhow this all works, the exact
dosages, best ways to supplementthese things, where to obtain
them, I invite you to join myconversations in my
drdavisinfanthealthcom innercircle.
Now, if you learned somethingfrom this episode of the Defiant
Health Podcast, I invite you tosubscribe through your favorite
(31:04):
podcast directory.
Post a review.
Post a comment.
Join the movement to empoweryourself in health.
Thanks for listening.
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