September 12, 2021 • 38 mins
Monday 13th September 2021
Dietetics Digest
What it is like being a Paediatric Dietitian? feat Chloe Elliott RD (Episode 9)
Chloe Elliott has spent her dietetic career specialising in paediatrics. She worked at Bristol Royal Hospital for Children before moving to London for a role in an international centre of excellence in child healthcare, Great Ormond Street Hospital. Chloe has expertise in the management of neurological conditions and rehabilitation in addition to gastroenterology, including food allergies.
Chloe Elliott (Twitter/ Instagram)
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Chloe Elliot (00:00):
There's there's no love, like a parent's love
(00:02):
for their child. So thatdoes make it difficult but
equally very rewardingbecause I think that parents
are so unbelievably grateful forwhat you've done for their
child, whether it's just putthem on a milk free diet, and
it means they're not constipatedanymore. You know, like just
the tiniest thing to youknow, putting a child on
parental nutrition lookasidegutters damaged from
chemotherapy, you know, it'slike different, different
(00:22):
degrees of what you've done.
But actually, at the end ofit, you've generally got a
very grateful parents that'slike, oh, thank you so much for
what you've done for mychild, which is heartwarming.
Aaron Boysen (00:33):
Welcome to the dietetics digest podcast,
a podcast that helps youunderstand more about the
different areas of dieteticsand nutrition and what others
are doing within them. Wedo this by talking to
inspiring and influentialindividuals that are advancing
practice in some way, shapeand form. Our mission is to
create a resource that helpsdietitians to build row and
(00:56):
share ideas with each otherto help advance their practice,
and the practice of others. I amyour host, Aaron Boysen.
This episode is going to be alittle bit different. It's
our first episode on thetopic of paediatrics now
I didn't plan to do anepisode on paediatrics
when this guest first messagedme on instagram couldn't turn
down the opportunity tohave such an esteemed guest
(01:17):
on the podcast.
Now I originally knewabout her from the work she
does with Great Ormond StreetHospital and the educational
electrician produced butoverall she is one of the most
enthusiastic and passionatepaediatric dietitians out
there. Now our guest ontoday's episode is Chloe Elliot
Bowyer spent her entiredietetic career specialising in
(01:37):
paediatrics.
She has previously worked atBristol Royal Hospital for
Children before moving toLondon for her role. In an
International Centre ofExcellence you may have heard
of called Great Ormond StreetHospital Chloe has expertise
in the management ofneurological conditions and
rehabilitation.
In addition to gastroenterologyincluding food allergies, this
episode is perfect forthose that are kind of
(01:58):
interested in paediatricswant to know what it's about
and trust me if you're notinterested in paediatrics,
Chloe will change yourmind. Thank you for joining me
today on the podcast. Ithink when I first got your
message about interest in thepodcast it it sort of was
perfect timing because Irecently had some experiences
with transition of care ofpatients and it made me really
(02:19):
interested in this area. AndI definitely as a as a student
had an experience onsay placement where I got my
placement through. I realised mysupervisor was a it said
specialist paediatric. Iremember exactly what it
said but it's a specialistpaediatric dietitian of
some area and I said to mylecturer, shall I be all
paediatric?
Chloe Elliot (02:39):
That was a good thing.
Aaron Boysen (02:41):
paediatric isn't you know, probably you'll
get to see other areastoo. It's just just your
supervisor. But it wasn't itwas all paediatrics, and I
absolutely loved my firsta placement.
And then for my first fourweeks of B placement, I was in
paediatrics as well. So Inever actually didn't
nutritional assessment myadult until I reached think
Week Five of placements sobut clearly what first
(03:02):
generated your interest inpaediatrics?
Did you? Did you always wantto go into paediatrics or
Chloe Elliot (03:07):
I can't remember when I had the exact moment.
But initially, when I was inschool, I thought I would
be a primary school teacher,like always thought I want
to work with children andthings. And obviously
school holidays were an addedbonus of being a teacher. And
then I watched supersizeversus super skinny as your
day and I'll see a dietitianon there. And I've actually
know that sounds reallyinteresting.
I'd quite like to get involvedin that. So from then onwards, I
(03:29):
thought I would just work withadult wasn't really quite
sure how the whole paediatricelement would be involved
with it. And then when Iwent to do my placement too,
which is awesome. The 12week one the first six weeks
at Bristol Children'sHospital. And as a bit like
you I was a bit like, oh, likeI'm doing like that's quite
intense. That's quitespecialist, many of the
placement students andthen on I think my first
morning on the ward, we wereon the renal unit. And then
(03:51):
someone was talking about alike a three month old baby
that needed a kidneytransplant. And I actually
ended up fainting on thefloor. And then I was like, I
don't think I want to dopaediatrics. I can't like remain
conscious during allthese difficult discussions.
And but no after that.
After the six weeks, I waslike I actually love
paediatrics.
It's so rewarding. You feel soimportant. Even when I was a
(04:12):
student, I felt so importantand really valued by
everyone. And then obviouslyI went to the Royal Infirmary,
which is kind of the adultversion at Bristol. And I
did that for six weeks. Andalthough Don't get me wrong, I
did. I did enjoy that aswell. Even though I'd only
done the first six weeks inpaediatrics. I felt like I'd
actually grown so many skillsfrom that I think people
worry what if I do all mytraining in paediatrics, I
(04:35):
won't be able to apply it toadults. When actually I felt
like I had i'd picked up allthe basic skills of kind
of assessing and inpatientwhether it was paediatrics or
add those and it was all verytransferable.
But for me being atBristol for the six weeks, I
was like, No, I definitely wantto go into paediatrics at
some point or kind of theearliest opportunity but
I think when you're at uni,you're always kind of taught
(04:55):
Okay, so you do a band five jobin adults and then you do
that for a couple ofyears. And then You go to get
your band six door, whetherthat's in paediatrics,
or, you know, some sort ofspecialist area in adults. So I
thought I would have to do thatkind of my stint in adult
as it were. And then I yeah,just as I was writing my
dissertation, I had a couple ofweeks left, before I had to
(05:16):
hand in. And that was like,the final bit of my degree,
really a band by a paediatricjob came up, it's kind of
like a band of five or six,you know, you could it was a
progression paced sort ofthing. And it said, you know,
not suitable for nearlyqualified dietitian. So I
was a bit like, you know, I'vegot so much other stuff
going on, can I really gothrough the application
process and potentially aninterview? And my tutor was
(05:37):
like, No, you can and youshould. So I ended up
applying for it and actuallygot it, which was just crazy.
And it kind of all startedfrom there.
Really, you know, I amwhere I am today, because
I went to that fanfightpaediatric post. And I did
that for a year in a hilldistrict General Hospital in
Somerset. So really smallteam, you know, quite busy. But
they gave me all the timethat I needed to learn
(05:59):
really, and kind ofprogressed. And then yeah, went
on to restore terms hospitalsfor just over a year. And then
I've been that got for almostthe last four years. So I've
been qualified six years,which is crazy.
Got me. That's all happened inthe past six years. I've
just been paediatrics.
And I've just loved it. It'sbeen so fantastic. I've
been really lucky actually.
So taking that initial jumpinto an area where us almond
(06:23):
and are in about whetheryou actually qualify for
this role.
Whether you whether youshould take this role,
actually, sort of you'd saylaunched your career into
paediatrics.
Yeah, absolutely. Ithink when you it's, it's all
crazy. Because, you know, whenyou're in pediat, when
you want to go into paediatrics,you have to start somewhere. So,
you know, when you have yourfirst paediatric job,
you would have come fromadults or come from being a
(06:45):
student. And you literallyare starting from ground
zero, you know, you'veliterally got no knowledge in
and apart from what youpotentially might have
learned on placement or what youpotentially might have been
learning University. SoI remember being now on
like, my first day in thatband, five jobs just thinking
like, I have literally noidea what I'm doing. And
that's so scary. That'sso scary to put yourself in a
(07:05):
position where you just thinkI have no idea what I'm doing.
But yeah, no, they were, as Isaid, the team was so lovely.
They were like, you know, I'mone of those people that to
learn, I just want to crackon and do it.
And then I'll ask if kind ofI need some help and support or
whatever. So they completelywere like, you know, we'll let
you learn how you learn bestsort of thing.
So they were just supersupportive. And I think when
(07:26):
you are you know, I wouldsay to anyone who wants to go
for a job in paediatricsregardless how unqualified
they think they are, justabsolutely go for it. Because
you've, you've got nothing tolose. You know, even in the
application writing processand the potential interview
process, you'll still gained somuch from that and the
feedback you get from it isso important.
(07:47):
So I am very much like don'tshy away from any of those
sorts of opportunities.
Because you think you'reunder qualified because you
just never know
Aaron Boysen (07:55):
when people say paediatrics is really
specialist. Is it? You'veobviously mentioned about
how that shouldn't putanyone off it should make
people want to go for theroles and as long as there's
a support structure inplace and the team support
that they can grow andenhance their skills well
enough. Is it?
Is it more specialiststhan adults?
Would you say?
Chloe Elliot (08:13):
I think I mean, there's a lot of crossover.
Like, if you have a child that'sfaltering growth, and
they need to put on weight.
It's the exact same as if youhad like a carer, the
elderly patient that also needsto put on weight, they
need to eat more, and youneed to so it's like food
fortification advice.
Potential supplements arelike every supplement they
have in adults, they probablyhave a paediatric
(08:33):
version for it.
So that is that is the same,you know, it doesn't matter
whether you need to put onweight and eat more as an
adult or a child it youknow, those principles
remain the same. And inadults, you see things like,
you know, milk free diets, orlactose free diets and
gluten free diets equallyin paediatrics, if you have a
child that needs to avoidmilk, the advice remains
(08:55):
the same as if you were seeingan adult that needs to avoid
dairy sort of things. Sothere is there is a lot of
crossover, obviously youhave more, you know, in terms
of like infant formulas, thosesort of specialist infant
formulas, you know, that'ssomething completely new
and unique to paediatricsthat you don't have in the
adult world.
But you learn those things,you know, you pick them up on
the job, you know, everypatient you see you get better
(09:16):
assuming that milk allergyyou do better that that
weaning advice sort of thing.
So, you know, like, if youwant to learn, and you have
that motivation to do it, likeyou'll get there, like
you'll get there by justdoing it to basically as
opposed to you know, readingall those books about it and
going on all those webinarsor whatever, like you learn
(09:37):
the most by actually justcracking on and going for it.
Aaron Boysen (09:40):
Yeah, I mean, the principles are the same but
some of the some of thetools you might use a slightly
different so you might estimaterequirements slightly
differently.
And obviously, the you mightnot just look at weight
trends, you might look at agrowth trend or growth on a
growth chart and it's just aslightly different way
of framing it but I'll tellyou what, I was scared going
from paediatrics to adults onplacement. I thought oh, now
(10:00):
My supervisors gonna think I'museless. I can't do
anything with adults. I don'tknow when the last time I use
the Henry equation was Idon't know how to.
Chloe Elliot (10:07):
Yeah, I mean, maybe pens. I don't
know where my pen dreads. Iassume I still got it. I don't
remember actively throwing itaway, but I certainly have
a list of my pens in a verylong time.
Aaron Boysen (10:16):
Yeah, so it's got a few. I think
that the principles arethe same, but the tools might
be slightly different. Sowhen it comes to newly qualified
dieticians or even dieteticstudents, what, where do you
think they start off withthis? Do they just go through
the course there's anything theycan do to sort of maybe get a
head start? If if there's morebecause I have seen more sort
of band five roles inpaediatrics and early starting
(10:38):
roles in paediatrics, so
Chloe Elliot (10:40):
absolutely anything they
Aaron Boysen (10:41):
can do to? How would you suggest they
started off? Or you coulddescribe it as getting a leg
up on the competition?
But sort of how would you justthey start off their interest
and develop their knowledgein this area?
Chloe Elliot (10:52):
I think if you think that you're interested in
paediatrics, I think it's alittle bit difficult in
COVID times like I thinkshadowing a dietician for a
morning or a day or anafternoon or whatever has a
lot of value.
Because I do think you cantake from that you can either
go there and be like, that wasabsolutely awful. Staring
at sick children all day isabsolutely not for me that at
(11:12):
least you know, at least not atthat time in your career
where you're ready to kindof investigate the paediatric
side of things.
But I think shadowing oreven just speaking to a
dietitian, but one of thereasons that I messaged you to
do about this podcast,because for me doing all the
student studies and things, Iget a lot of emails from
students to say, Can I justcan I just have like 10 minutes
of your time to ask you a fewquestions and like, pretty
(11:34):
much like the ones you wereasking me like, like, what can
I do? How did you get intoit? What do you suggest I do
sort of thing.
So just like having aconversation with someone,
just to kind of ask questionsabout it, I think is really
valuable, I think, if youwill, on placement and didn't
necessarily have that muchpaediatrics as part of your
timetable, just highlighting itto your supervisor. Oh,
(11:54):
by the way, I find it reallyinteresting to go to like the
neonatal unit for themorning, if that will
possible, you know, because Ido think as you know, someone
that has students, it'snice to hear what they're
interested in.
And it's nice to be able togive them that as opposed to,
you know, making a timetable forthem that you think they'll
get a lot out of, but actuallyhearing from them, what
they'd like to get out of itis really valuable. And I
(12:16):
think you know, if you're atthat point, you know, I started
doing students study days intopaediatrics. I think it was in
2019. Because Yeah,definitely pre pandemics. We
were all in a room togetherwith no socially distance or
mass. So that was definitelypre 2020. And then yes, it
did once a student thendid one for qualified
dieticians, because peoplestarted asking me to do it.
(12:36):
But then and then we movevirtual. And then from the
feedback that I get from peoplethat come to those study
days is I really wasn'tsure about paediatrics.
But you know, you and yourteam have made it sound so
interesting.
I'd really like to explore it alittle bit further. And
equally, I haven't necessarilyseen this on a feedback form.
But I'm sure some peopleprobably think I was
interested in it, but I'mprobably not now from from
(12:59):
what you've said about it.
So I think that that might be away of a little bit of an eye
opener because I tried to makethe programme as as general
as possible.
Like this is what you cansee this is the basics. He's
the little specialistareas, although to fit it all
into kind of a seven hour daysso difficult to because there's
so much I could spend probablythree weeks doing a study
about it, but trying to kindof pick those like key
(13:20):
elements so people can workout for themselves. Is
it something they're going to beinterested in?
Or is it something thatnot? And then No, I agree
like the amount of like bandfive slash band six paediatric
jobs that I see are everincreasing. And I think that's
because people people generallystruggle to recruit into
paediatrics I there is anational shortage of paediatric
dieticians. So I'd like tothink that I'm trying to do my
(13:42):
best to kind of refresh theworkforce and kind of get
people more interested intopaediatric, but I would say if
you have you know, if yousee a band five job, you know
that you're kind ofinterested in going into it,
then absolutely apply and hopethat you're experiencing in
shadowing or going to studydays or you know, or things
like that are all going towork in your favour for
(14:04):
those points, obviously,paediatrics.
Aaron Boysen (14:06):
We've talked about some of the similarities,
but what are some of thedifferences between
paediatrics and maybe areas youwould see in paediatrics, or
commonly, that you might notsee in sort of, maybe, with
adult patients or?
Chloe Elliot (14:16):
Yeah, I think I mean, the main one
being neonatal, you obviouslywouldn't see that in any of
the adult world. But Ialso, could you
Aaron Boysen (14:26):
describe what neonatal actually is,
because I don't have a lot ofthem.
Chloe Elliot (14:31):
Okay, so neonatal I by that I mean,
neonatal intensive careunit. So the babies that are
born either incrediblypreterm or are born with
something or some sort ofcondition. That means that they
are very sick from birth andneed support and treatment
to be able to, to get them toward level and then home. So
it's more kind of those thingslike I used to work in
(14:54):
surgery, so you'd getthings like diaphragmatic
hernias or gastroschisisor when they got his baby
typically there's a holein their abdominal wall.
So they got end up ends updeveloping outside of
their body in the womb thatthey they'll be born. So they'll
probably initially haveto have surgery to try and pop
everything back in again, whichcan be a timely process. So
(15:14):
that was kind of more whatwhat I describe in the neonatal
term. So see, that's somethingyou've never seen in the
adult world.
And what makes paediatrics, soincredibly different to adults,
regardless of the specialityis you have to deal with
parents. So although you'redealing with that sick child
and infant, your actualmain source of wealth, you're
(15:35):
probably your main source ofinformation and discussion and
difficult conversations with theparents, the ones that
aren't even safe areprobably fit and work, but
are so emotionally like driven,you know, is is difficult, like
it's incredibly difficult, andthey can be angry, they can
be sad, probably noteven that you it just the
(15:56):
whole situation that you're inthere, and you're kind of
dealing with it. And that'sdifficult. And I think that
even now, I think now sixyears down the line, I can I
think I'm quite good at copingwith the angry parents and all
of these situations, andbut they're still difficult
and they take experience,that's not something you
can learn in a book, it takesyou, you know, being yelled at
(16:18):
by parents a million timesto finally know what to do and
how to kind of cope with itreally, and I'm sure in the
adult world, you know, youget carers and, and all that
sort of thing as part of it.
But there's, you know, like,there's, there's no love, like a
parent's love for theirchild, you know, so that
does make it difficult, butequally, very rewarding,
because I think that parentsare so unbelievably grateful for
(16:39):
what you've done for theirchild, whether it's just put
them on a milk free diet, andit means they're not constipated
anymore. You know, like justthe tiniest thing to you
know, putting a child onparental nutrition lookaside
gutters damaged fromchemotherapy, you know, it's
like different, differentdegrees of what you've done.
But actually, at the end ofit, you've generally got a
very grateful parents that'slike, oh, thank you so much for
what you've done for mychild, which is, you know,
(17:01):
heartwarming.
Aaron Boysen (17:02):
I mean, my own experiences on placement. I
didn't experience anysort of angry or frustrated
parents, understandably,as they as they would be going
through a lot of thoseperiods. But maybe my supervisor
chose certain parents for me.
Chloe Elliot (17:17):
When you've got a student, you have to go to
the nicest families.
Aaron Boysen (17:21):
Yeah.
And I mean, obviously, there's,there's families that
are nice, but under thosesorts of circumstances,
understandably, they would bequite frustrated and angry. But
yeah, I mean, there'sdefinitely an even I've seen
send it with parents onplacement as a student, there's
definitely an advocacy fornutrition from the parents,
which sort of bringsnutrition to the forefront
(17:41):
because they're thinking aboutit. And they want to know
how they're going to gettheir child fed, what's
going to happen with their
Chloe Elliot (17:46):
nutrition.
And I think it's a partthat they think that they
couldn't control andbeing involved in, you know,
like, with everything elsethat can be going on with a
child medically, thatthat parent might only be
able to feed their childlike, so they want to be
involved with it as much aspossible. So for the
children that are, you know,like, like losing weight,
or whatever, at the same timeas having chemotherapy,
(18:08):
like, they can't change thechemotherapy, like they can't
change that element of it.
But when it comes tofeeding them, they want to
try and like, try doing thisor try doing that. And you
know, it can be so anxietyprovoking, particularly for the
patients that I see undergoingtransplant, they'll be with
us for two months minimum,and that's if they've done
well, you know, they could bewith us for six months, eight
months, etc.
(18:28):
And all these parents have istime, you know, time to sit in
that room, children aren'tallowed to leave that
room, parents can leave it ifthey want to, but they
generally want to be withtheir child the whole time.
This is all they have tothink about.
It's all they have to thinkabout that they only drank 100
mils of water that morning,you know, like, so it's, it can
be really anxiety provoking forthem, and it's really
(18:49):
challenging, but equally,you know, you become their
best friend.
It's just like, going intosaving. I think there are some
patients over the past yearthat I think I've seen more
than my friends and familybecause I just have to go and
talk to them every single day.
Aaron Boysen (19:01):
So I mean, that sounds like the paediatric
dieticians are really a valuedmember of the MDT. And I
think that's a lot due to theimportance the parents put on
nutrition for the children.
Yeah, I can also imaginedue to the importance put
on nutrition, that that alsocreates a lot more stress
within the role of a paediatricdietitian. Due to the parental
(19:22):
anxiety.
Chloe Elliot (19:23):
Yeah, no, we have Ward rounds twice a week,
sit down, and it's like, ifI'm not there, or the
dietitians not there, youknow, like, you'll be
handed until you go therebecause you're so key, you
know, to the parents, butalso like the doctors and
nurses like they want youropinion they want they want
you to be involved because theyjust value like our input so
much, which is so lovely. Youknow, I love being handed down.
Aaron Boysen (19:45):
So any dietitian that sort of out there and
maybe says they don't feelappreciated enough or they
want they feel like they'resometimes overlooked.
Chloe Elliot (19:52):
Come on work with me.
Aaron Boysen (19:55):
Well, there might be an area where
you could possibly explore thisarea and Maybe shadow a
paediatric dietitian to reallyexperience that unique area. So
neonates isn't a unique areais any other unique areas to
paediatrics?
Chloe Elliot (20:08):
I mean, I guess like, for example, if you
look at cardiac, obviously, inadults, some of what you see
might be healthy eatingrelated advice.
Like so people like post heartattack and that sort of thing,
or maybe have heart diseaseas kind of a consequence of
their own lifestyle sortof thing. So that's probably
quite adult specific but inin paediatrics, you will forget
(20:30):
the infants that are bornwith congenital heart disease
and things like that. Soalthough the specialties are
the same, you know, in adultsin paediatrics, you have people
that their hearts don'twork properly, the the
consequence of it and kind ofthe cause, you know, how it's
come about is very differentsort of thing.
I think I've never actuallydone metabolics but obviously,
you get the, the childrenthat are born with PKU and
(20:52):
trying to think of any othermetabolic dietitian off
the top of my head, maplesyrup, urine disorder,
something along those lines,and all of those. Yeah,
there we go.
There we go.
Obviously, they're alldiagnosed in kind of the newborn
screening sort of thing. Sothe dieticians as part of that
are working with thefamilies who have literally
had this life changingdiagnosis for their child.
(21:14):
Not only that, it's sodietetic heavy, you know, low
protein diets and those sortof things as a real key part
of the medical management ofit, although you can see the
you know, the adult with theseconditions is very different,
like your involvement aspart of that isn't quite the
initial stages where they werejust diagnosed very emotive
(21:34):
parents, obviouslydistraught that their child has
this diagnosis that they'venever probably never heard of
before. There's somethingthere's anything else I
think, I mean, generally, thespecialties are the same apart
from honestly, there's nogeriatrics and there's neonatal.
Instead, everything remains thesame. It's just as I said, the
consequence of how they've gotthat condition is probably
different.
Aaron Boysen (21:54):
Yeah, I never thought about that the
way the patient got the diseaseis very different. And
that probably does play intothe way they respond to
medical care how you supportthem as an MDT.
And I think this comes backto what we discussed previously,
similar principles, butdifferent tools are used. Could
you tell us more about thedifferences in renal dietetics,
(22:17):
respiratory dietetics paediatricintensive care?
Maybe we could start with renal.
Chloe Elliot (22:25):
So I guess with Rena, as you know,
everything that you see inrenal is probably something that
that child has been born with,like congenital nephrotic
syndrome and things likethat. And what what is, I guess
challenging and all specialityof paediatrics, where there's
something really severehas happened either congenital
nephrotic syndrome orheart disease, not only do you
(22:46):
have to manage that, from anutrition point of view, you've
actually got to get them togrow as well.
So if they've got reallyawful vomiting, or work of
breathing, or any of thesethings, you've got to manage
all those symptoms. Butyou've also got to make sure
they've had enoughnutrition that they're
actually going to grow as welland develop because it's so
important, you know, as firstthree years of life to make
(23:08):
sure that that child haseverything they need, but
actually if they're on aventilator, really fluid
restricted, that is that issuch a barrier to those things
moving forward.
But equally if you've got aventilated, paediatric
patient and events, theydid have a patient You
know, they're still going tohave much lower requirements
because they're not breedingfor themselves and things like
that. So yeah, there are thereare similarities between the
(23:30):
specialties, but growth isso is so important, you
know, an adult if they've notgained weight for a year,
that's probably a good thing tobe honest, but in paediatrics
is so key that you know, itwill affect them for the
rest of the life if youdon't get the nutrition,
right. So yeah, no pressure forus.
Aaron Boysen (23:47):
Of course, no pressure, no pressure at
all. It's very stress freeroll, I imagine. But I think our
discussion so far has done areally good job at describing
the rewarding and challengingjob of being a paediatric
dietitian. And I know you do alot of these open evenings
and educational events forstudent dieticians and
newly qualified dieticiansabout how to get into
(24:07):
paediatrics.
What are some of the most commonquestions they ask you at
these events?
Chloe Elliot (24:12):
I think I mean, one thing that I hear a lot
from, I mean, I don't evennecessarily suit dieticians
but just general peoplein life is that when when they
hear that I work at GreatOrmond Street or that on
paediatric dietitian, andthey always say and this is
students as well. Oh, Icouldn't see sick kids every
day. And I couldn't doit'd be too sad. I really
loved children.
I couldn't see them like thatevery day. But I think when I
(24:33):
really love children, and Ireally love working with
them, hence why I'm doing itand you could not work in
paediatrics. If you dislikechildren, I think you'd be
pretty bad at your jobessentially.
But I don't think I don'tnecessarily see them. I mean,
one when you walk around theward, you're not necessarily
looking at a child on specand from death each time. I
mean, and also, although youcould argue that if a child's in
(24:55):
hospital, they are sick, theyare probably sick to a different
degree as opposed to youknow They're not all just
about to die, you know, someof them might just be there
for a leg operation orwhatever. And I think I don't
know, I just I just don't seeit, the sad side of it, how
other people might see it.
And I think it's, I thinkthe reward from the job and
working with the childrenand families and doing your
(25:16):
bit to improve their qualityof life totally outweighs the
fact that you might have dayswhere you actually feel a
bit sad because someone's died,which you do have, you know,
children, unfortunately,will die in this kind of
role of care.
But I just find it rewarding. Iwouldn't want someone to
think, Oh, I'm not getting intopaediatrics.
I'm going to be dying kidsevery day. So it's not like
that at all.
(25:36):
And also, if you wanted todo paediatrics, that you
weren't sure about the acutesetting, there are obviously
community paediatric jobswhere they may need to see
children in like a clinicsetting, they might have
faltering growth or allergy orsomething like that. So it
might be that if you're ifyou find the acute setting a
little bit too overwhelmingand a little bit of motive,
but you wanted in paediatrics,you could do something like
(25:57):
that, where you work in thecommunity with you know, well
looking children as it were.
Aaron Boysen (26:01):
Yeah, I mean, I definitely on on placement,
my supervisor, experienced oneof those moments where
it was, it was very emotivefor the parent, because the
child had, possibly, Ican't remember the exact
details. And it's probablygood that I can't, but the
child wasn't doing great.
And the parent was veryemotional. And the dietician
(26:24):
right at the time, not criedlike a sort of wailing cry,
but there was tears sort offalling down her face, it's,
I think it's um, but the waythe dietician sort of
explained it to me in say, whenwe were reviewing it
and things like that, becausesome people may say, Ah, is
that really professional tocry and that kind of thing.
And she said, I wouldn'tnormally it just the
(26:45):
situation and we've all gotemotions, but the way she
said she understands itwas Yes, is very sick to
see what that is verysaddening to see what these
children go through, butthat that sort of drives her
and motivates her more andhelps her to cope with a lot
of the tricky situations andpushes her a little bit
further. And I do actuallythink most people in the
(27:06):
healthcare field, whetherthey be doctors, nurses,
therapists, dieticians, aredriven by a lot of that,
because no one likes to seepatients pass away, or
patients who are really,really ill, whether they be
a child, or whether they bea 3040 year old, 60 year
old, 70 year old adult,however, I think we are
all driven by that sort ofpush to really help them.
(27:28):
Yeah, exactly.
do better.
Chloe Elliot (27:29):
No, absolutely. And I think that,
you know, the patients that Isee that parents have
been there for, you know,three, maybe four months,
particularly during COVID,they've not seen their
partner, you know, their child'scertainly not seeing their
dad, they've not seen anysiblings, they might not have
seen their other children.
And they all they are veryemotional. And I probably have
a parent cry to me at leastonce a week.
(27:50):
And you do have moments whereyou leave and you're like,
oh, my goodness, that was reallyoverwhelming.
But to have given thatparent the space to cry to
you for 15 minutes, butjust for them to have like,
let it out, it's actuallyquite a privilege that
they felt that they were ableto be like, I'm just having a
really bad time. And Iwant to tell you about it.
Especially I'm not one tostand there and cry with them.
But it is quite, youknow, it's a privilege that
(28:12):
they're able to open up to you.
And it's nice that they havethat space to, to let that
out. You know, I'd much ratherthe client for 15 minutes as
opposed to said guess everythingfine. And then I left the room
and then they were justfeeling really overwhelmed by
themselves. So but yeah,admittedly, we've all had
patients die.
And we've gone to the corridorroom for just a little moment
to us. As we all would askhumans, because you know, we're
(28:35):
not total robots that are
Aaron Boysen (28:38):
often overlooked piece that we aren't total
robots. Our only purpose isnot to conduct nutritional
assessments and providenutritional care plans, but
we do feel for our patients.
And I would just, as a sidenote, encourage anyone who's
experienced anything overthe past year that they reach
out and seek help fromsomeone when needed. So
(28:58):
Chloe, are there any mythsthat come up on these courses
or things that are goingaround the rumour mill
that people think areneeded, but maybe aren't?
Chloe Elliot (29:07):
I was just gonna say about.
Generally students thinkyou need to do the paediatric
masters at Plymouth beforeyou get into paediatrics,
and I. I didn't do obviously Iwent to paediatrics as soon as I
qualified for my undergraduatedegree. And I know some
people do go on to do and thepaediatric masters whether
full time or do it part timealongside their current role.
(29:28):
But I think people feelthat pressure of I won't go into
paediatrics because I don'twant to have to do the masters
and it might be too stressful.
It might be too much for me.
And so I would say that youknow that's not true. You don't
have to do the Masters to beable to go on to do further.
Obviously if you've got thatkind of motivation and
passion for research andthat's kind of your thing then
then absolutely. ButI think that no one should feel
(29:50):
that pressure.
You know, like we just spent ayear not being able to see any
of our friends and family anddoing a Masters is intense. You
do lose a lot of your freetime to doing to doing this
Buddy, I think no one shouldfeel pressured to give up time
with their friends andfamily where we've literally
not been able to do for awhole year.
Aaron Boysen (30:07):
Is there anything that they you would suggest
to students or dieticians, ifthey're interested in
paediatrics that they should dobefore going for a job
interview? Or it looked goodon when you're reviewing the
job application where you go,Oh, that's a really good
thing for that.
For people to have.
Chloe Elliot (30:23):
Yeah, I think it's, um, I think
having just done some, someband six interviews, I
think that you should go on acourse to further your
knowledge and help you answerthe interview questions
better, as opposed to forit to look good on your
application, because I thinkthat you could say that you've
attended x, y and Zed, butactually, if you've not
taken anything from it, thenthat is sort of worthless from
(30:45):
from my point of view. Thatbeing said, I do have seen it
do Saturdays for people sothat they'd get the opportunity
to experience it. There'sdieticians network, which
is a fantastic CPD network, asit were, that do fantastic
courses. And we've justgotten that isn't that
work? I've just done thiscollaboration, where we're
doing this four week course,with having two topics every
(31:07):
week being released withlive q&a is and it's basically
aimed at people that are maybeadult dietitian, maybe students
maybe just got into paediatrics.
It's just kind of learn moreabout specialist areas. So
there's talks on enter onparental nutrition, renal,
respiratory, cardiac, ICU,neonatal analogy, like
it's like the, I mean,obviously, there are more
(31:30):
and you can include for the20 talks in paediatrics,
but I was just trying tocondense it down to ones I
think I thought would be reallyvaluable for people. So you
know, that could besomething that someone might
want to do if they're justreally interested and
have such a thirst forknowledge of paediatrics
that they can obviously getinvolved and sign up to
that. And I'm hoping that inend of July time, I'll do
(31:51):
some sort of other studyday. At some point, I'll see
that we're all virtual. Imean, the one benefit of
COVID is that you can dothese things.
It's kind of opened up theplatform for virtual
learning now, which we justdidn't have before. But
it's funny to see you thinkwhy didn't we have that? Why
did we not go on zoom beforebut it seems that COVID has
made us do that, which isa good thing. I think it
Aaron Boysen (32:10):
definitely increases accessibility
for those students ornewly qualified dieticians and
a dietitian working inadults, it makes it easier
for them to say attended,because obviously if
you're working at adults,there's no cut imagine you'd
get funded to do a paediatriccourse on less threat, the
ability to go on zoom andhave more of the net other
platforms are available andare used quite often to have
(32:32):
one of those educationalsessions on sort of a digital
platform allows to increaseaccessibility and often it
lowers the price of thattickets and makes it more
accessible to other peopleand they can pay for out
their own funds and they canactually learn something that
wouldn't be helpful intheir in their daily job role.
But what actually sortof satisfy that thirst for
paediatric CPD?
Chloe Elliot (32:53):
Yeah, and no like, you know, train tickets to
London. They like extortionateprices like that, you know,
who will who will ever getlike that sort of funding for
travel? I don't know ever again.
Aaron Boysen (33:02):
No, definitely not.
So you said so on a jobapplication.
You're not looking forlike a list of study days or a
list of courses they've done?
You're really looking fortheir knowledge in their their
sort of interest and passion forpaediatric dietetics. Is
there any sorts of areas whereyou think students should
focus their attention onwould you suggest to go
and read all aboutmetabolics and tyrosinemia?
And
Chloe Elliot (33:22):
I probably wouldn't recommend. I
just feel a little intensefor that. I think, you
know, if I've done courses,put it on their application,
because we're, you know, everyperson that does shortlisting
for jobs will have differentviews on it, but you know,
absolutely write it down.
But I think it's good thatwhen you're writing actual
supporting information,you're saying how, why that's
benefited you?
(33:42):
You know, I went on thiscourse. And I've learned
about this and the other andI've applied it by doing this,
that and the other shattering ofmy trust, you know, that sort
of thing
Aaron Boysen (33:51):
about what areas they should maybe
brush up on been becauseobviously, before an
interview, any interview thatI've taped, you do a reading,
reading around the topic, almostpreparation for that interview.
So is there any areas that youwould suggest for paediatric
interviews?
Chloe Elliot (34:03):
Yeah, so I guess, depending on what sort of
job you're going for, likeif you're going for a specialist
metabolic job, I would look upsome metabolic conditions. But
I think if you're justgoing for like a general
paediatric dietetic post,whether that's like a six
rotational post at a tertiarycentre, or you know, advancing
a district General, youhave to know the basics of
(34:25):
cow's milk, protein allergy,faltering growth, maybe a
little bit about weightmanagement, you know, those key
topics, which shows that youare that you have a good
grounding in paediatrics,because if you're a paediatric
dietitian that only knowsabout metabolic and paediatrics.
That's fantastic. Butif you ever needed to
recover another area, youprobably wouldn't be
that good at it. Becauseyou've never learned anything
(34:47):
outside of metabolic so Iwould say I would recommend
everyone just gets a goodgrounding and paediatric
before they go to a specialistjob and read up on the basics
of paediatrics as I said, Noecology and things and then
there's always the classicIt's like, you know, what's
your experience in order oneabout like how you've dealt
with conflict and the MDT oneabout trust values and why
(35:09):
you meets the trust valuessort of thing are the are the
absolute basics? Butyeah, if you were going for
a specialist job in inneonates or something like
that, you would definitely needto read up on that area
because they aren't going toask you a question about it.
Aaron Boysen (35:23):
And would you say that any experience of
having adults as you'reasking those questions and
experience in adults wouldstill be applicable in
paediatrics?
Absolutely.
Yeah.
Chloe Elliot (35:31):
I mean, obviously, when it comes to,
you know, MDT working, andall those, all those key
skills of being a dietitian, asopposed to just being a
paediatric dietitian, are reallyimportant. So if you worked
in adults, and had done anaudit, because you you saw
that there was this problem,and you've investigated
it, and this is what the resultwas, then you've done
this, that and the other andthis is what you're going to
do moving forward. Thatis so valuable, and that earns
(35:54):
you real interview point. So itdoesn't matter that you did in
adults and as a paediatric job,it's having that initiative
to have seen this andfollowed it through. That
is really important. Youknow, it doesn't always
have to just be aboutpaediatrics because those
basic dietetic skills are justas valuable.
Aaron Boysen (36:10):
Definitely translatable as well. Think
about the first interview weever we ever had, say as
dietitians, we might have usedexperiences from placement
experiences from university, butalso use experience outside of
placement outside ofUniversity of where we've
used a lot of these skills,when they would be directly
applicable to the job role ofthe dietitian.
Chloe Elliot (36:28):
Yeah, so even if you don't, you've
never worked in paediatric,you've just been an avid
dietitian, but actually,you've done something outside of
your, you know, some voluntarywork with some children, you
know, outside of the acutesetting, or you know, that all
very much builds a picture ofOkay, they have good
communication skills withchildren, even if it's not
from being a paediatricdietitian, yet, you know, like
(36:49):
us all of the skills you canthink of, and all of your
experiences to translate aboutwhy that is the perfect skill
to be a paediatric dietitian.
Aaron Boysen (36:58):
I think that's really useful advice for
people going for interviews.
And I'm sure that a lot ofpeople listening to
this might be considering it.
That's fantastic. And all theresources discussed in
this podcast will beavailable in the show notes.
Chloe Elliot (37:11):
Thank you for having me. It's been
lovely.
Aaron Boysen (37:13):
Thank you so much for your time, I
think it will be invaluable.
I know I found it quiteinformative for myself. And all
the information will be in theshow notes as well as links
to the various differenteducational sessions that clemmy
mentioned.
Thank you for listening.
Chloe Elliot (37:27):
Thank you very much.
Aaron Boysen (37:30):
Thanks for joining me this week on
dietetics digest, makesure to visit my website a
dietetics digest commwhere you can listen to the
podcast, or why not considersubscribing on Apple podcasts
Stitcher, smart radio, Spotify,or basically just ask Alexa,
and you'll never miss ashow. And while you're at it,
if you found this showvaluable, you could do one of
(37:51):
two things.
Firstly, you could leave areview on the podcast that
you're listening to the Applepodcast or Stitcher smart
radio. And as you can tell afriend about the podcast.
That'll be really helpfulto help grow the podcast
more. Thank you so much for thesupport and have a lovely
week day wherever you are.
There's there's no love, like a parent's love
(00:02):
for their child. So thatdoes make it difficult but
equally very rewardingbecause I think that parents
are so unbelievably grateful forwhat you've done for their
child, whether it's just putthem on a milk free diet, and
it means they're not constipatedanymore. You know, like just
the tiniest thing to youknow, putting a child on
parental nutrition lookasidegutters damaged from
chemotherapy, you know, it'slike different, different
(00:22):
degrees of what you've done.
But actually, at the end ofit, you've generally got a
very grateful parents that'slike, oh, thank you so much for
what you've done for mychild, which is heartwarming.
Aaron Boysen (00:33):
Welcome to the dietetics digest podcast,
a podcast that helps youunderstand more about the
different areas of dieteticsand nutrition and what others
are doing within them. Wedo this by talking to
inspiring and influentialindividuals that are advancing
practice in some way, shapeand form. Our mission is to
create a resource that helpsdietitians to build row and
(00:56):
share ideas with each otherto help advance their practice,
and the practice of others. I amyour host, Aaron Boysen.
This episode is going to be alittle bit different. It's
our first episode on thetopic of paediatrics now
I didn't plan to do anepisode on paediatrics
when this guest first messagedme on instagram couldn't turn
down the opportunity tohave such an esteemed guest
(01:17):
on the podcast.
Now I originally knewabout her from the work she
does with Great Ormond StreetHospital and the educational
electrician produced butoverall she is one of the most
enthusiastic and passionatepaediatric dietitians out
there. Now our guest ontoday's episode is Chloe Elliot
Bowyer spent her entiredietetic career specialising in
(01:37):
paediatrics.
She has previously worked atBristol Royal Hospital for
Children before moving toLondon for her role. In an
International Centre ofExcellence you may have heard
of called Great Ormond StreetHospital Chloe has expertise
in the management ofneurological conditions and
rehabilitation.
In addition to gastroenterologyincluding food allergies, this
episode is perfect forthose that are kind of
(01:58):
interested in paediatricswant to know what it's about
and trust me if you're notinterested in paediatrics,
Chloe will change yourmind. Thank you for joining me
today on the podcast. Ithink when I first got your
message about interest in thepodcast it it sort of was
perfect timing because Irecently had some experiences
with transition of care ofpatients and it made me really
(02:19):
interested in this area. AndI definitely as a as a student
had an experience onsay placement where I got my
placement through. I realised mysupervisor was a it said
specialist paediatric. Iremember exactly what it
said but it's a specialistpaediatric dietitian of
some area and I said to mylecturer, shall I be all
paediatric?
Chloe Elliot (02:39):
That was a good thing.
Aaron Boysen (02:41):
paediatric isn't you know, probably you'll
get to see other areastoo. It's just just your
supervisor. But it wasn't itwas all paediatrics, and I
absolutely loved my firsta placement.
And then for my first fourweeks of B placement, I was in
paediatrics as well. So Inever actually didn't
nutritional assessment myadult until I reached think
Week Five of placements sobut clearly what first
(03:02):
generated your interest inpaediatrics?
Did you? Did you always wantto go into paediatrics or
Chloe Elliot (03:07):
I can't remember when I had the exact moment.
But initially, when I was inschool, I thought I would
be a primary school teacher,like always thought I want
to work with children andthings. And obviously
school holidays were an addedbonus of being a teacher. And
then I watched supersizeversus super skinny as your
day and I'll see a dietitianon there. And I've actually
know that sounds reallyinteresting.
I'd quite like to get involvedin that. So from then onwards, I
(03:29):
thought I would just work withadult wasn't really quite
sure how the whole paediatricelement would be involved
with it. And then when Iwent to do my placement too,
which is awesome. The 12week one the first six weeks
at Bristol Children'sHospital. And as a bit like
you I was a bit like, oh, likeI'm doing like that's quite
intense. That's quitespecialist, many of the
placement students andthen on I think my first
morning on the ward, we wereon the renal unit. And then
(03:51):
someone was talking about alike a three month old baby
that needed a kidneytransplant. And I actually
ended up fainting on thefloor. And then I was like, I
don't think I want to dopaediatrics. I can't like remain
conscious during allthese difficult discussions.
And but no after that.
After the six weeks, I waslike I actually love
paediatrics.
It's so rewarding. You feel soimportant. Even when I was a
(04:12):
student, I felt so importantand really valued by
everyone. And then obviouslyI went to the Royal Infirmary,
which is kind of the adultversion at Bristol. And I
did that for six weeks. Andalthough Don't get me wrong, I
did. I did enjoy that aswell. Even though I'd only
done the first six weeks inpaediatrics. I felt like I'd
actually grown so many skillsfrom that I think people
worry what if I do all mytraining in paediatrics, I
(04:35):
won't be able to apply it toadults. When actually I felt
like I had i'd picked up allthe basic skills of kind
of assessing and inpatientwhether it was paediatrics or
add those and it was all verytransferable.
But for me being atBristol for the six weeks, I
was like, No, I definitely wantto go into paediatrics at
some point or kind of theearliest opportunity but
I think when you're at uni,you're always kind of taught
(04:55):
Okay, so you do a band five jobin adults and then you do
that for a couple ofyears. And then You go to get
your band six door, whetherthat's in paediatrics,
or, you know, some sort ofspecialist area in adults. So I
thought I would have to do thatkind of my stint in adult
as it were. And then I yeah,just as I was writing my
dissertation, I had a couple ofweeks left, before I had to
(05:16):
hand in. And that was like,the final bit of my degree,
really a band by a paediatricjob came up, it's kind of
like a band of five or six,you know, you could it was a
progression paced sort ofthing. And it said, you know,
not suitable for nearlyqualified dietitian. So I
was a bit like, you know, I'vegot so much other stuff
going on, can I really gothrough the application
process and potentially aninterview? And my tutor was
(05:37):
like, No, you can and youshould. So I ended up
applying for it and actuallygot it, which was just crazy.
And it kind of all startedfrom there.
Really, you know, I amwhere I am today, because
I went to that fanfightpaediatric post. And I did
that for a year in a hilldistrict General Hospital in
Somerset. So really smallteam, you know, quite busy. But
they gave me all the timethat I needed to learn
(05:59):
really, and kind ofprogressed. And then yeah, went
on to restore terms hospitalsfor just over a year. And then
I've been that got for almostthe last four years. So I've
been qualified six years,which is crazy.
Got me. That's all happened inthe past six years. I've
just been paediatrics.
And I've just loved it. It'sbeen so fantastic. I've
been really lucky actually.
So taking that initial jumpinto an area where us almond
(06:23):
and are in about whetheryou actually qualify for
this role.
Whether you whether youshould take this role,
actually, sort of you'd saylaunched your career into
paediatrics.
Yeah, absolutely. Ithink when you it's, it's all
crazy. Because, you know, whenyou're in pediat, when
you want to go into paediatrics,you have to start somewhere. So,
you know, when you have yourfirst paediatric job,
you would have come fromadults or come from being a
(06:45):
student. And you literallyare starting from ground
zero, you know, you'veliterally got no knowledge in
and apart from what youpotentially might have
learned on placement or what youpotentially might have been
learning University. SoI remember being now on
like, my first day in thatband, five jobs just thinking
like, I have literally noidea what I'm doing. And
that's so scary. That'sso scary to put yourself in a
(07:05):
position where you just thinkI have no idea what I'm doing.
But yeah, no, they were, as Isaid, the team was so lovely.
They were like, you know, I'mone of those people that to
learn, I just want to crackon and do it.
And then I'll ask if kind ofI need some help and support or
whatever. So they completelywere like, you know, we'll let
you learn how you learn bestsort of thing.
So they were just supersupportive. And I think when
(07:26):
you are you know, I wouldsay to anyone who wants to go
for a job in paediatricsregardless how unqualified
they think they are, justabsolutely go for it. Because
you've, you've got nothing tolose. You know, even in the
application writing processand the potential interview
process, you'll still gained somuch from that and the
feedback you get from it isso important.
(07:47):
So I am very much like don'tshy away from any of those
sorts of opportunities.
Because you think you'reunder qualified because you
just never know
Aaron Boysen (07:55):
when people say paediatrics is really
specialist. Is it? You'veobviously mentioned about
how that shouldn't putanyone off it should make
people want to go for theroles and as long as there's
a support structure inplace and the team support
that they can grow andenhance their skills well
enough. Is it?
Is it more specialiststhan adults?
Would you say?
Chloe Elliot (08:13):
I think I mean, there's a lot of crossover.
Like, if you have a child that'sfaltering growth, and
they need to put on weight.
It's the exact same as if youhad like a carer, the
elderly patient that also needsto put on weight, they
need to eat more, and youneed to so it's like food
fortification advice.
Potential supplements arelike every supplement they
have in adults, they probablyhave a paediatric
(08:33):
version for it.
So that is that is the same,you know, it doesn't matter
whether you need to put onweight and eat more as an
adult or a child it youknow, those principles
remain the same. And inadults, you see things like,
you know, milk free diets, orlactose free diets and
gluten free diets equallyin paediatrics, if you have a
child that needs to avoidmilk, the advice remains
(08:55):
the same as if you were seeingan adult that needs to avoid
dairy sort of things. Sothere is there is a lot of
crossover, obviously youhave more, you know, in terms
of like infant formulas, thosesort of specialist infant
formulas, you know, that'ssomething completely new
and unique to paediatricsthat you don't have in the
adult world.
But you learn those things,you know, you pick them up on
the job, you know, everypatient you see you get better
(09:16):
assuming that milk allergyyou do better that that
weaning advice sort of thing.
So, you know, like, if youwant to learn, and you have
that motivation to do it, likeyou'll get there, like
you'll get there by justdoing it to basically as
opposed to you know, readingall those books about it and
going on all those webinarsor whatever, like you learn
(09:37):
the most by actually justcracking on and going for it.
Aaron Boysen (09:40):
Yeah, I mean, the principles are the same but
some of the some of thetools you might use a slightly
different so you might estimaterequirements slightly
differently.
And obviously, the you mightnot just look at weight
trends, you might look at agrowth trend or growth on a
growth chart and it's just aslightly different way
of framing it but I'll tellyou what, I was scared going
from paediatrics to adults onplacement. I thought oh, now
(10:00):
My supervisors gonna think I'museless. I can't do
anything with adults. I don'tknow when the last time I use
the Henry equation was Idon't know how to.
Chloe Elliot (10:07):
Yeah, I mean, maybe pens. I don't
know where my pen dreads. Iassume I still got it. I don't
remember actively throwing itaway, but I certainly have
a list of my pens in a verylong time.
Aaron Boysen (10:16):
Yeah, so it's got a few. I think
that the principles arethe same, but the tools might
be slightly different. Sowhen it comes to newly qualified
dieticians or even dieteticstudents, what, where do you
think they start off withthis? Do they just go through
the course there's anything theycan do to sort of maybe get a
head start? If if there's morebecause I have seen more sort
of band five roles inpaediatrics and early starting
(10:38):
roles in paediatrics, so
Chloe Elliot (10:40):
absolutely anything they
Aaron Boysen (10:41):
can do to? How would you suggest they
started off? Or you coulddescribe it as getting a leg
up on the competition?
But sort of how would you justthey start off their interest
and develop their knowledgein this area?
Chloe Elliot (10:52):
I think if you think that you're interested in
paediatrics, I think it's alittle bit difficult in
COVID times like I thinkshadowing a dietician for a
morning or a day or anafternoon or whatever has a
lot of value.
Because I do think you cantake from that you can either
go there and be like, that wasabsolutely awful. Staring
at sick children all day isabsolutely not for me that at
(11:12):
least you know, at least not atthat time in your career
where you're ready to kindof investigate the paediatric
side of things.
But I think shadowing oreven just speaking to a
dietitian, but one of thereasons that I messaged you to
do about this podcast,because for me doing all the
student studies and things, Iget a lot of emails from
students to say, Can I justcan I just have like 10 minutes
of your time to ask you a fewquestions and like, pretty
(11:34):
much like the ones you wereasking me like, like, what can
I do? How did you get intoit? What do you suggest I do
sort of thing.
So just like having aconversation with someone,
just to kind of ask questionsabout it, I think is really
valuable, I think, if youwill, on placement and didn't
necessarily have that muchpaediatrics as part of your
timetable, just highlighting itto your supervisor. Oh,
(11:54):
by the way, I find it reallyinteresting to go to like the
neonatal unit for themorning, if that will
possible, you know, because Ido think as you know, someone
that has students, it'snice to hear what they're
interested in.
And it's nice to be able togive them that as opposed to,
you know, making a timetable forthem that you think they'll
get a lot out of, but actuallyhearing from them, what
they'd like to get out of itis really valuable. And I
(12:16):
think you know, if you're atthat point, you know, I started
doing students study days intopaediatrics. I think it was in
2019. Because Yeah,definitely pre pandemics. We
were all in a room togetherwith no socially distance or
mass. So that was definitelypre 2020. And then yes, it
did once a student thendid one for qualified
dieticians, because peoplestarted asking me to do it.
(12:36):
But then and then we movevirtual. And then from the
feedback that I get from peoplethat come to those study
days is I really wasn'tsure about paediatrics.
But you know, you and yourteam have made it sound so
interesting.
I'd really like to explore it alittle bit further. And
equally, I haven't necessarilyseen this on a feedback form.
But I'm sure some peopleprobably think I was
interested in it, but I'mprobably not now from from
(12:59):
what you've said about it.
So I think that that might be away of a little bit of an eye
opener because I tried to makethe programme as as general
as possible.
Like this is what you cansee this is the basics. He's
the little specialistareas, although to fit it all
into kind of a seven hour daysso difficult to because there's
so much I could spend probablythree weeks doing a study
about it, but trying to kindof pick those like key
(13:20):
elements so people can workout for themselves. Is
it something they're going to beinterested in?
Or is it something thatnot? And then No, I agree
like the amount of like bandfive slash band six paediatric
jobs that I see are everincreasing. And I think that's
because people people generallystruggle to recruit into
paediatrics I there is anational shortage of paediatric
dieticians. So I'd like tothink that I'm trying to do my
(13:42):
best to kind of refresh theworkforce and kind of get
people more interested intopaediatric, but I would say if
you have you know, if yousee a band five job, you know
that you're kind ofinterested in going into it,
then absolutely apply and hopethat you're experiencing in
shadowing or going to studydays or you know, or things
like that are all going towork in your favour for
(14:04):
those points, obviously,paediatrics.
Aaron Boysen (14:06):
We've talked about some of the similarities,
but what are some of thedifferences between
paediatrics and maybe areas youwould see in paediatrics, or
commonly, that you might notsee in sort of, maybe, with
adult patients or?
Chloe Elliot (14:16):
Yeah, I think I mean, the main one
being neonatal, you obviouslywouldn't see that in any of
the adult world. But Ialso, could you
Aaron Boysen (14:26):
describe what neonatal actually is,
because I don't have a lot ofthem.
Chloe Elliot (14:31):
Okay, so neonatal I by that I mean,
neonatal intensive careunit. So the babies that are
born either incrediblypreterm or are born with
something or some sort ofcondition. That means that they
are very sick from birth andneed support and treatment
to be able to, to get them toward level and then home. So
it's more kind of those thingslike I used to work in
(14:54):
surgery, so you'd getthings like diaphragmatic
hernias or gastroschisisor when they got his baby
typically there's a holein their abdominal wall.
So they got end up ends updeveloping outside of
their body in the womb thatthey they'll be born. So they'll
probably initially haveto have surgery to try and pop
everything back in again, whichcan be a timely process. So
(15:14):
that was kind of more whatwhat I describe in the neonatal
term. So see, that's somethingyou've never seen in the
adult world.
And what makes paediatrics, soincredibly different to adults,
regardless of the specialityis you have to deal with
parents. So although you'redealing with that sick child
and infant, your actualmain source of wealth, you're
(15:35):
probably your main source ofinformation and discussion and
difficult conversations with theparents, the ones that
aren't even safe areprobably fit and work, but
are so emotionally like driven,you know, is is difficult, like
it's incredibly difficult, andthey can be angry, they can
be sad, probably noteven that you it just the
(15:56):
whole situation that you're inthere, and you're kind of
dealing with it. And that'sdifficult. And I think that
even now, I think now sixyears down the line, I can I
think I'm quite good at copingwith the angry parents and all
of these situations, andbut they're still difficult
and they take experience,that's not something you
can learn in a book, it takesyou, you know, being yelled at
(16:18):
by parents a million timesto finally know what to do and
how to kind of cope with itreally, and I'm sure in the
adult world, you know, youget carers and, and all that
sort of thing as part of it.
But there's, you know, like,there's, there's no love, like a
parent's love for theirchild, you know, so that
does make it difficult, butequally, very rewarding,
because I think that parentsare so unbelievably grateful for
(16:39):
what you've done for theirchild, whether it's just put
them on a milk free diet, andit means they're not constipated
anymore. You know, like justthe tiniest thing to you
know, putting a child onparental nutrition lookaside
gutters damaged fromchemotherapy, you know, it's
like different, differentdegrees of what you've done.
But actually, at the end ofit, you've generally got a
very grateful parents that'slike, oh, thank you so much for
what you've done for mychild, which is, you know,
(17:01):
heartwarming.
Aaron Boysen (17:02):
I mean, my own experiences on placement. I
didn't experience anysort of angry or frustrated
parents, understandably,as they as they would be going
through a lot of thoseperiods. But maybe my supervisor
chose certain parents for me.
Chloe Elliot (17:17):
When you've got a student, you have to go to
the nicest families.
Aaron Boysen (17:21):
Yeah.
And I mean, obviously, there's,there's families that
are nice, but under thosesorts of circumstances,
understandably, they would bequite frustrated and angry. But
yeah, I mean, there'sdefinitely an even I've seen
send it with parents onplacement as a student, there's
definitely an advocacy fornutrition from the parents,
which sort of bringsnutrition to the forefront
(17:41):
because they're thinking aboutit. And they want to know
how they're going to gettheir child fed, what's
going to happen with their
Chloe Elliot (17:46):
nutrition.
And I think it's a partthat they think that they
couldn't control andbeing involved in, you know,
like, with everything elsethat can be going on with a
child medically, thatthat parent might only be
able to feed their childlike, so they want to be
involved with it as much aspossible. So for the
children that are, you know,like, like losing weight,
or whatever, at the same timeas having chemotherapy,
(18:08):
like, they can't change thechemotherapy, like they can't
change that element of it.
But when it comes tofeeding them, they want to
try and like, try doing thisor try doing that. And you
know, it can be so anxietyprovoking, particularly for the
patients that I see undergoingtransplant, they'll be with
us for two months minimum,and that's if they've done
well, you know, they could bewith us for six months, eight
months, etc.
(18:28):
And all these parents have istime, you know, time to sit in
that room, children aren'tallowed to leave that
room, parents can leave it ifthey want to, but they
generally want to be withtheir child the whole time.
This is all they have tothink about.
It's all they have to thinkabout that they only drank 100
mils of water that morning,you know, like, so it's, it can
be really anxiety provoking forthem, and it's really
(18:49):
challenging, but equally,you know, you become their
best friend.
It's just like, going intosaving. I think there are some
patients over the past yearthat I think I've seen more
than my friends and familybecause I just have to go and
talk to them every single day.
Aaron Boysen (19:01):
So I mean, that sounds like the paediatric
dieticians are really a valuedmember of the MDT. And I
think that's a lot due to theimportance the parents put on
nutrition for the children.
Yeah, I can also imaginedue to the importance put
on nutrition, that that alsocreates a lot more stress
within the role of a paediatricdietitian. Due to the parental
(19:22):
anxiety.
Chloe Elliot (19:23):
Yeah, no, we have Ward rounds twice a week,
sit down, and it's like, ifI'm not there, or the
dietitians not there, youknow, like, you'll be
handed until you go therebecause you're so key, you
know, to the parents, butalso like the doctors and
nurses like they want youropinion they want they want
you to be involved because theyjust value like our input so
much, which is so lovely. Youknow, I love being handed down.
Aaron Boysen (19:45):
So any dietitian that sort of out there and
maybe says they don't feelappreciated enough or they
want they feel like they'resometimes overlooked.
Chloe Elliot (19:52):
Come on work with me.
Aaron Boysen (19:55):
Well, there might be an area where
you could possibly explore thisarea and Maybe shadow a
paediatric dietitian to reallyexperience that unique area. So
neonates isn't a unique areais any other unique areas to
paediatrics?
Chloe Elliot (20:08):
I mean, I guess like, for example, if you
look at cardiac, obviously, inadults, some of what you see
might be healthy eatingrelated advice.
Like so people like post heartattack and that sort of thing,
or maybe have heart diseaseas kind of a consequence of
their own lifestyle sortof thing. So that's probably
quite adult specific but inin paediatrics, you will forget
(20:30):
the infants that are bornwith congenital heart disease
and things like that. Soalthough the specialties are
the same, you know, in adultsin paediatrics, you have people
that their hearts don'twork properly, the the
consequence of it and kind ofthe cause, you know, how it's
come about is very differentsort of thing.
I think I've never actuallydone metabolics but obviously,
you get the, the childrenthat are born with PKU and
(20:52):
trying to think of any othermetabolic dietitian off
the top of my head, maplesyrup, urine disorder,
something along those lines,and all of those. Yeah,
there we go.
There we go.
Obviously, they're alldiagnosed in kind of the newborn
screening sort of thing. Sothe dieticians as part of that
are working with thefamilies who have literally
had this life changingdiagnosis for their child.
(21:14):
Not only that, it's sodietetic heavy, you know, low
protein diets and those sortof things as a real key part
of the medical management ofit, although you can see the
you know, the adult with theseconditions is very different,
like your involvement aspart of that isn't quite the
initial stages where they werejust diagnosed very emotive
(21:34):
parents, obviouslydistraught that their child has
this diagnosis that they'venever probably never heard of
before. There's somethingthere's anything else I
think, I mean, generally, thespecialties are the same apart
from honestly, there's nogeriatrics and there's neonatal.
Instead, everything remains thesame. It's just as I said, the
consequence of how they've gotthat condition is probably
different.
Aaron Boysen (21:54):
Yeah, I never thought about that the
way the patient got the diseaseis very different. And
that probably does play intothe way they respond to
medical care how you supportthem as an MDT.
And I think this comes backto what we discussed previously,
similar principles, butdifferent tools are used. Could
you tell us more about thedifferences in renal dietetics,
(22:17):
respiratory dietetics paediatricintensive care?
Maybe we could start with renal.
Chloe Elliot (22:25):
So I guess with Rena, as you know,
everything that you see inrenal is probably something that
that child has been born with,like congenital nephrotic
syndrome and things likethat. And what what is, I guess
challenging and all specialityof paediatrics, where there's
something really severehas happened either congenital
nephrotic syndrome orheart disease, not only do you
(22:46):
have to manage that, from anutrition point of view, you've
actually got to get them togrow as well.
So if they've got reallyawful vomiting, or work of
breathing, or any of thesethings, you've got to manage
all those symptoms. Butyou've also got to make sure
they've had enoughnutrition that they're
actually going to grow as welland develop because it's so
important, you know, as firstthree years of life to make
(23:08):
sure that that child haseverything they need, but
actually if they're on aventilator, really fluid
restricted, that is that issuch a barrier to those things
moving forward.
But equally if you've got aventilated, paediatric
patient and events, theydid have a patient You
know, they're still going tohave much lower requirements
because they're not breedingfor themselves and things like
that. So yeah, there are thereare similarities between the
(23:30):
specialties, but growth isso is so important, you
know, an adult if they've notgained weight for a year,
that's probably a good thing tobe honest, but in paediatrics
is so key that you know, itwill affect them for the
rest of the life if youdon't get the nutrition,
right. So yeah, no pressure forus.
Aaron Boysen (23:47):
Of course, no pressure, no pressure at
all. It's very stress freeroll, I imagine. But I think our
discussion so far has done areally good job at describing
the rewarding and challengingjob of being a paediatric
dietitian. And I know you do alot of these open evenings
and educational events forstudent dieticians and
newly qualified dieticiansabout how to get into
(24:07):
paediatrics.
What are some of the most commonquestions they ask you at
these events?
Chloe Elliot (24:12):
I think I mean, one thing that I hear a lot
from, I mean, I don't evennecessarily suit dieticians
but just general peoplein life is that when when they
hear that I work at GreatOrmond Street or that on
paediatric dietitian, andthey always say and this is
students as well. Oh, Icouldn't see sick kids every
day. And I couldn't doit'd be too sad. I really
loved children.
I couldn't see them like thatevery day. But I think when I
(24:33):
really love children, and Ireally love working with
them, hence why I'm doing itand you could not work in
paediatrics. If you dislikechildren, I think you'd be
pretty bad at your jobessentially.
But I don't think I don'tnecessarily see them. I mean,
one when you walk around theward, you're not necessarily
looking at a child on specand from death each time. I
mean, and also, although youcould argue that if a child's in
(24:55):
hospital, they are sick, theyare probably sick to a different
degree as opposed to youknow They're not all just
about to die, you know, someof them might just be there
for a leg operation orwhatever. And I think I don't
know, I just I just don't seeit, the sad side of it, how
other people might see it.
And I think it's, I thinkthe reward from the job and
working with the childrenand families and doing your
(25:16):
bit to improve their qualityof life totally outweighs the
fact that you might have dayswhere you actually feel a
bit sad because someone's died,which you do have, you know,
children, unfortunately,will die in this kind of
role of care.
But I just find it rewarding. Iwouldn't want someone to
think, Oh, I'm not getting intopaediatrics.
I'm going to be dying kidsevery day. So it's not like
that at all.
(25:36):
And also, if you wanted todo paediatrics, that you
weren't sure about the acutesetting, there are obviously
community paediatric jobswhere they may need to see
children in like a clinicsetting, they might have
faltering growth or allergy orsomething like that. So it
might be that if you're ifyou find the acute setting a
little bit too overwhelmingand a little bit of motive,
but you wanted in paediatrics,you could do something like
(25:57):
that, where you work in thecommunity with you know, well
looking children as it were.
Aaron Boysen (26:01):
Yeah, I mean, I definitely on on placement,
my supervisor, experienced oneof those moments where
it was, it was very emotivefor the parent, because the
child had, possibly, Ican't remember the exact
details. And it's probablygood that I can't, but the
child wasn't doing great.
And the parent was veryemotional. And the dietician
(26:24):
right at the time, not criedlike a sort of wailing cry,
but there was tears sort offalling down her face, it's,
I think it's um, but the waythe dietician sort of
explained it to me in say, whenwe were reviewing it
and things like that, becausesome people may say, Ah, is
that really professional tocry and that kind of thing.
And she said, I wouldn'tnormally it just the
(26:45):
situation and we've all gotemotions, but the way she
said she understands itwas Yes, is very sick to
see what that is verysaddening to see what these
children go through, butthat that sort of drives her
and motivates her more andhelps her to cope with a lot
of the tricky situations andpushes her a little bit
further. And I do actuallythink most people in the
(27:06):
healthcare field, whetherthey be doctors, nurses,
therapists, dieticians, aredriven by a lot of that,
because no one likes to seepatients pass away, or
patients who are really,really ill, whether they be
a child, or whether they bea 3040 year old, 60 year
old, 70 year old adult,however, I think we are
all driven by that sort ofpush to really help them.
(27:28):
Yeah, exactly.
do better.
Chloe Elliot (27:29):
No, absolutely. And I think that,
you know, the patients that Isee that parents have
been there for, you know,three, maybe four months,
particularly during COVID,they've not seen their
partner, you know, their child'scertainly not seeing their
dad, they've not seen anysiblings, they might not have
seen their other children.
And they all they are veryemotional. And I probably have
a parent cry to me at leastonce a week.
(27:50):
And you do have moments whereyou leave and you're like,
oh, my goodness, that was reallyoverwhelming.
But to have given thatparent the space to cry to
you for 15 minutes, butjust for them to have like,
let it out, it's actuallyquite a privilege that
they felt that they were ableto be like, I'm just having a
really bad time. And Iwant to tell you about it.
Especially I'm not one tostand there and cry with them.
But it is quite, youknow, it's a privilege that
(28:12):
they're able to open up to you.
And it's nice that they havethat space to, to let that
out. You know, I'd much ratherthe client for 15 minutes as
opposed to said guess everythingfine. And then I left the room
and then they were justfeeling really overwhelmed by
themselves. So but yeah,admittedly, we've all had
patients die.
And we've gone to the corridorroom for just a little moment
to us. As we all would askhumans, because you know, we're
(28:35):
not total robots that are
Aaron Boysen (28:38):
often overlooked piece that we aren't total
robots. Our only purpose isnot to conduct nutritional
assessments and providenutritional care plans, but
we do feel for our patients.
And I would just, as a sidenote, encourage anyone who's
experienced anything overthe past year that they reach
out and seek help fromsomeone when needed. So
(28:58):
Chloe, are there any mythsthat come up on these courses
or things that are goingaround the rumour mill
that people think areneeded, but maybe aren't?
Chloe Elliot (29:07):
I was just gonna say about.
Generally students thinkyou need to do the paediatric
masters at Plymouth beforeyou get into paediatrics,
and I. I didn't do obviously Iwent to paediatrics as soon as I
qualified for my undergraduatedegree. And I know some
people do go on to do and thepaediatric masters whether
full time or do it part timealongside their current role.
(29:28):
But I think people feelthat pressure of I won't go into
paediatrics because I don'twant to have to do the masters
and it might be too stressful.
It might be too much for me.
And so I would say that youknow that's not true. You don't
have to do the Masters to beable to go on to do further.
Obviously if you've got thatkind of motivation and
passion for research andthat's kind of your thing then
then absolutely. ButI think that no one should feel
(29:50):
that pressure.
You know, like we just spent ayear not being able to see any
of our friends and family anddoing a Masters is intense. You
do lose a lot of your freetime to doing to doing this
Buddy, I think no one shouldfeel pressured to give up time
with their friends andfamily where we've literally
not been able to do for awhole year.
Aaron Boysen (30:07):
Is there anything that they you would suggest
to students or dieticians, ifthey're interested in
paediatrics that they should dobefore going for a job
interview? Or it looked goodon when you're reviewing the
job application where you go,Oh, that's a really good
thing for that.
For people to have.
Chloe Elliot (30:23):
Yeah, I think it's, um, I think
having just done some, someband six interviews, I
think that you should go on acourse to further your
knowledge and help you answerthe interview questions
better, as opposed to forit to look good on your
application, because I thinkthat you could say that you've
attended x, y and Zed, butactually, if you've not
taken anything from it, thenthat is sort of worthless from
(30:45):
from my point of view. Thatbeing said, I do have seen it
do Saturdays for people sothat they'd get the opportunity
to experience it. There'sdieticians network, which
is a fantastic CPD network, asit were, that do fantastic
courses. And we've justgotten that isn't that
work? I've just done thiscollaboration, where we're
doing this four week course,with having two topics every
(31:07):
week being released withlive q&a is and it's basically
aimed at people that are maybeadult dietitian, maybe students
maybe just got into paediatrics.
It's just kind of learn moreabout specialist areas. So
there's talks on enter onparental nutrition, renal,
respiratory, cardiac, ICU,neonatal analogy, like
it's like the, I mean,obviously, there are more
(31:30):
and you can include for the20 talks in paediatrics,
but I was just trying tocondense it down to ones I
think I thought would be reallyvaluable for people. So you
know, that could besomething that someone might
want to do if they're justreally interested and
have such a thirst forknowledge of paediatrics
that they can obviously getinvolved and sign up to
that. And I'm hoping that inend of July time, I'll do
(31:51):
some sort of other studyday. At some point, I'll see
that we're all virtual. Imean, the one benefit of
COVID is that you can dothese things.
It's kind of opened up theplatform for virtual
learning now, which we justdidn't have before. But
it's funny to see you thinkwhy didn't we have that? Why
did we not go on zoom beforebut it seems that COVID has
made us do that, which isa good thing. I think it
Aaron Boysen (32:10):
definitely increases accessibility
for those students ornewly qualified dieticians and
a dietitian working inadults, it makes it easier
for them to say attended,because obviously if
you're working at adults,there's no cut imagine you'd
get funded to do a paediatriccourse on less threat, the
ability to go on zoom andhave more of the net other
platforms are available andare used quite often to have
(32:32):
one of those educationalsessions on sort of a digital
platform allows to increaseaccessibility and often it
lowers the price of thattickets and makes it more
accessible to other peopleand they can pay for out
their own funds and they canactually learn something that
wouldn't be helpful intheir in their daily job role.
But what actually sortof satisfy that thirst for
paediatric CPD?
Chloe Elliot (32:53):
Yeah, and no like, you know, train tickets to
London. They like extortionateprices like that, you know,
who will who will ever getlike that sort of funding for
travel? I don't know ever again.
Aaron Boysen (33:02):
No, definitely not.
So you said so on a jobapplication.
You're not looking forlike a list of study days or a
list of courses they've done?
You're really looking fortheir knowledge in their their
sort of interest and passion forpaediatric dietetics. Is
there any sorts of areas whereyou think students should
focus their attention onwould you suggest to go
and read all aboutmetabolics and tyrosinemia?
And
Chloe Elliot (33:22):
I probably wouldn't recommend. I
just feel a little intensefor that. I think, you
know, if I've done courses,put it on their application,
because we're, you know, everyperson that does shortlisting
for jobs will have differentviews on it, but you know,
absolutely write it down.
But I think it's good thatwhen you're writing actual
supporting information,you're saying how, why that's
benefited you?
(33:42):
You know, I went on thiscourse. And I've learned
about this and the other andI've applied it by doing this,
that and the other shattering ofmy trust, you know, that sort
of thing
Aaron Boysen (33:51):
about what areas they should maybe
brush up on been becauseobviously, before an
interview, any interview thatI've taped, you do a reading,
reading around the topic, almostpreparation for that interview.
So is there any areas that youwould suggest for paediatric
interviews?
Chloe Elliot (34:03):
Yeah, so I guess, depending on what sort of
job you're going for, likeif you're going for a specialist
metabolic job, I would look upsome metabolic conditions. But
I think if you're justgoing for like a general
paediatric dietetic post,whether that's like a six
rotational post at a tertiarycentre, or you know, advancing
a district General, youhave to know the basics of
(34:25):
cow's milk, protein allergy,faltering growth, maybe a
little bit about weightmanagement, you know, those key
topics, which shows that youare that you have a good
grounding in paediatrics,because if you're a paediatric
dietitian that only knowsabout metabolic and paediatrics.
That's fantastic. Butif you ever needed to
recover another area, youprobably wouldn't be
that good at it. Becauseyou've never learned anything
(34:47):
outside of metabolic so Iwould say I would recommend
everyone just gets a goodgrounding and paediatric
before they go to a specialistjob and read up on the basics
of paediatrics as I said, Noecology and things and then
there's always the classicIt's like, you know, what's
your experience in order oneabout like how you've dealt
with conflict and the MDT oneabout trust values and why
(35:09):
you meets the trust valuessort of thing are the are the
absolute basics? Butyeah, if you were going for
a specialist job in inneonates or something like
that, you would definitely needto read up on that area
because they aren't going toask you a question about it.
Aaron Boysen (35:23):
And would you say that any experience of
having adults as you'reasking those questions and
experience in adults wouldstill be applicable in
paediatrics?
Absolutely.
Yeah.
Chloe Elliot (35:31):
I mean, obviously, when it comes to,
you know, MDT working, andall those, all those key
skills of being a dietitian, asopposed to just being a
paediatric dietitian, are reallyimportant. So if you worked
in adults, and had done anaudit, because you you saw
that there was this problem,and you've investigated
it, and this is what the resultwas, then you've done
this, that and the other andthis is what you're going to
do moving forward. Thatis so valuable, and that earns
(35:54):
you real interview point. So itdoesn't matter that you did in
adults and as a paediatric job,it's having that initiative
to have seen this andfollowed it through. That
is really important. Youknow, it doesn't always
have to just be aboutpaediatrics because those
basic dietetic skills are justas valuable.
Aaron Boysen (36:10):
Definitely translatable as well. Think
about the first interview weever we ever had, say as
dietitians, we might have usedexperiences from placement
experiences from university, butalso use experience outside of
placement outside ofUniversity of where we've
used a lot of these skills,when they would be directly
applicable to the job role ofthe dietitian.
Chloe Elliot (36:28):
Yeah, so even if you don't, you've
never worked in paediatric,you've just been an avid
dietitian, but actually,you've done something outside of
your, you know, some voluntarywork with some children, you
know, outside of the acutesetting, or you know, that all
very much builds a picture ofOkay, they have good
communication skills withchildren, even if it's not
from being a paediatricdietitian, yet, you know, like
(36:49):
us all of the skills you canthink of, and all of your
experiences to translate aboutwhy that is the perfect skill
to be a paediatric dietitian.
Aaron Boysen (36:58):
I think that's really useful advice for
people going for interviews.
And I'm sure that a lot ofpeople listening to
this might be considering it.
That's fantastic. And all theresources discussed in
this podcast will beavailable in the show notes.
Chloe Elliot (37:11):
Thank you for having me. It's been
lovely.
Aaron Boysen (37:13):
Thank you so much for your time, I
think it will be invaluable.
I know I found it quiteinformative for myself. And all
the information will be in theshow notes as well as links
to the various differenteducational sessions that clemmy
mentioned.
Thank you for listening.
Chloe Elliot (37:27):
Thank you very much.
Aaron Boysen (37:30):
Thanks for joining me this week on
dietetics digest, makesure to visit my website a
dietetics digest commwhere you can listen to the
podcast, or why not considersubscribing on Apple podcasts
Stitcher, smart radio, Spotify,or basically just ask Alexa,
and you'll never miss ashow. And while you're at it,
if you found this showvaluable, you could do one of
(37:51):
two things.
Firstly, you could leave areview on the podcast that
you're listening to the Applepodcast or Stitcher smart
radio. And as you can tell afriend about the podcast.
That'll be really helpfulto help grow the podcast
more. Thank you so much for thesupport and have a lovely
week day wherever you are.
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