November 13, 2025 • 49 mins
If you’re seeking clarity, longing for peace, or just curious about how people hear God, join Bob Parsons and me as we share our own stories, honest missteps, and real hope.
Enjoy!
Learn more about Carla:
Website: https:/www.carlareeves.com/
Connect on LI: https://www.linkedin.com/in/reevescarla/
Connect on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@differentlythepodcast
Go to https://carlareeves.com/free-class to get The Class schedule, sign up, and/or pass it on to a friend. Each month is a new topic. Come hang out and learn with us for FREE!
Book a Complimentary Strategy Call with Carla: https://bookme.name/carlareeves/strategycall
- If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to share it with a friend.
- A free way to support our show is by leaving a five-star rating and review on your favorite podcast player. It’s a chance to tell us what you love about the show and it helps others discover it, too.
Thank you for listening!
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:00):
A deep change in the way that we live requires a deep
change in the way that we think.
I'm Carla Reeves, and this isDifferently.
Welcome back to Differently.
Today I have Bob Parsons withme.
And if you you may have heardhim on the podcast before, he
(00:21):
was on November 9th, 23, andit's titled Choosing Freedom in
the Face of Fear.
And I invited Bob to come backtoday.
And we're going to talk aboutour faith journey.
This is something I that hasbeen on my heart to bring more
to the podcast.
And I haven't exactly known howto do that.
(00:43):
And Bob and I were talking theother day and thinking about
like what we want to do anotherpodcast together on.
And one of the strongestconnections that he and I have
had has been our faith.
Like every time we talk, we'resharing about how God is showing
up in our lives, our families.
And we're we've never actuallyshared like our God journey like
(01:06):
from the beginning.
And so I'm kind of excitedbecause I'm going to learn
something new about you, Bob,today.
And we just want to give you apeek inside.
Like maybe you have faith, maybeyou have Jesus, maybe you don't.
Maybe you're wondering.
I just see so many peoplestruggling right now and seeking
right now.
And I feel like religion is justscared people away.
(01:31):
And we're not talking aboutreligion today.
We're just sharing our ownexperience of God and how he has
shown up in our lives.
And so, Bob, welcome back.
SPEAKER_01 (01:42):
Thanks.
I'm excited.
I'm excited to be here.
And uh if you didn't like thefirst podcast, then I don't know
if you're gonna like the secondpodcast.
But if you like the first one, Ithink you'll really enjoy this
one.
SPEAKER_00 (01:55):
So, in case people haven't heard the first podcast,
give them a little sense of whoyou are and where you are and
what you do.
SPEAKER_01 (02:02):
Yes, I am.
I'll just tell you the stuffthat really means the most to
me.
Number one, though I've beenI've been a Christian since I
was 16, but then uh Lord'snumber one, and then my wife uh
will be married 43 years next.
No, this Wednesday will be 43years and my birthday.
So my I got married on mybirthday so that I would never
(02:24):
forget my anniversary.
SPEAKER_00 (02:26):
That's hilarious.
I didn't know that.
SPEAKER_01 (02:28):
And I haven't.
I've never I've never forgottenit.
So it's it's always been an easydeal.
SPEAKER_00 (02:33):
Oh, that's the best.
SPEAKER_01 (02:35):
I have three amazing kids, 38, 36, and 33.
I'm close to them.
I love them, they're just neatpeople to hang out with.
And um see, then I've been I'veworked in corporate for many,
many years, over uh almost 38years.
And now I've been on my own uhbecause uh I hired you.
(02:57):
You were my the fire that waslit under my butt to get going
on this and really helped memanage my mind traffic quite a
bit.
And so now I'm doing mainly I'dsay team and one-on-one
executive coaching, mid-leveland above uh for leaders.
And I just love my work.
SPEAKER_00 (03:14):
Oh, it's awesome.
It's been so fun to watch yourbusiness grow and just the
journey of it all.
It's so good.
Amazing.
Yeah.
So let's go way, way back, Bob.
Like when did God come into yourlife?
Like when did that door evenopen for you?
SPEAKER_01 (03:33):
Now, now you're gonna are you gonna answer some
of these questions too?
SPEAKER_00 (03:36):
Yeah, you can ask me anything you want.
SPEAKER_01 (03:38):
Because I hate talking, I really do.
I mean, some of you who knew mein high school, when I say I
really hate talking aboutmyself, we're probably going,
You're a liar, but I havechanged.
I have changed.
I'm you know, I'm in mymid-sixties now, so I have grown
quite a bit.
SPEAKER_00 (03:51):
Just like we're having coffee and sharing our
journey.
SPEAKER_01 (03:55):
Great.
So I'll just tell you that asfar back as I can remember,
probably around age five or six,I always felt a sense of God.
Never read the Bible, hadn'treally gone to church, but my my
mom and my and they would saythings and and ask and and do
things.
And I'm like, wait a minute,mom, uh, if if people just
(04:17):
obeyed the Bible, wouldn'teverything be okay?
Wouldn't we all be good?
And you know, to their I feelbad, but at that point they were
in a very different place.
My mom is a real strong believertoday.
My dad passed away um when hewas, you know, very young, 56.
But um but I've always had asense of God and I just didn't
(04:38):
know what to do and how to workwith it because I just didn't
have anybody in my family.
I am a first generationChristian, so until I was about
fast forward to about 13 or 14,I just was trying, I was a
little, I was in a searchingperiod, and so I wanted to go to
church.
So me and my buddies wanted togo to church, and I wanted to go
(04:59):
to camp, I wanted to go to Biblecamp.
So there was a church about sixblocks away from our house.
So me and my friends we wentevery Wednesday and Sundays.
Just us.
We just went because my parents,my dad wasn't into church, my
mom was hoping that my dad wouldget involved, but my dad never
got there.
And so, and that's where I firstheard a little bit about the
(05:20):
Bible and Jesus.
And then I went to camp and Iheard the gospel message.
And Kenny, I don't know ifyou're still around, but you
were the guy, you were the youthpastor at Redeemer Lutheran
Church in friendly, friendlyMinnesota, and you shared the
gospel at camp, and that justthat was the missing piece for
(05:42):
me.
And so I committed myself in thein a room with a whole bunch of
us listening to the gospel atthat point to uh to do.
SPEAKER_00 (05:50):
And how old were you then?
SPEAKER_01 (05:52):
16.
SPEAKER_00 (05:53):
16.
And when how old were you whenyour little group of friends
were going to church?
SPEAKER_01 (05:57):
We've probably been gone for a couple years now.
SPEAKER_00 (05:59):
Yeah, like 14, 13.
SPEAKER_01 (06:02):
Yeah, so I was about 14.
I'll just say I was 14, 15,somewhere in there.
Yeah, I know it was a coupleyears because I went to camp,
went to camp, and then it took acouple shots at camp before I
got it, right?
SPEAKER_00 (06:11):
Yeah, yeah.
That's so crazy.
So we've never talked aboutthis, but um I was like five
years old, and my parents didn'tgo to church either.
Nobody in my family, I think mygrandma went, but she lived out
of town.
(06:31):
Um, and I had a little neighborfriend who invited me to church
when I was in kindergarten.
And I just started going withher family and like went all
through grade school.
My mom was Catholic, but she hadlost her first husband in
Vietnam.
And I think, you know, withthree young children.
(06:54):
And I think she was at odds withGod for a while.
And my dad was Lutheran, but Idon't know why he wasn't going
to church.
I don't really know his storyabout that time.
And I just went and they wouldcome at Chris.
My parents would show up onChristmas and Easter, you know,
when I was in the little churchplay or whatever.
But I am so grateful for thatfamily because they really did
(07:19):
uh introduce me to God.
And I'll like I am forevergrateful for that.
SPEAKER_01 (07:28):
Wait, so you lot you said that you you your mom lost
her first husband in Vietnam.
SPEAKER_00 (07:35):
My mom lost her first husband in Vietnam.
Yep, he was a pilot and hisplane went down.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (07:42):
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (07:43):
And three young children.
SPEAKER_01 (07:44):
Yeah, you and I are gonna learn a lot about each
other, I think, today we didn'tknow, right?
SPEAKER_00 (07:48):
Yeah, for sure.
So, which kind of brings me tothe next question of just like
the path and the people, likebecause I think if we all look,
right, there's places where Godis showing up, whether you've
ever even acknowledged it as Godor not.
Yep.
SPEAKER_01 (08:07):
Yeah, I I really want, I'm gonna help you, and I
think you would you would agreewith this to help those who are
just you got this nudge.
And I remember the donut man.
You remember the donut man?
No, he he was a guy that wasprobably when I was growing up,
or maybe when I was firstmarried, but he did have a
Bible, you know, kind of a Biblekids' show.
He was called the Donut Man.
And what he said was there's ahole in everybody's heart, your
(08:31):
donut.
And you're never gonna find itin all the things of the world
until you fill it with Jesus,right?
And so he was the donut man.
That's why they called itbecause you it was you need to
fill the donut in the hole.
So so anyway, my path was I lovethat it was yeah, it's a great
one.
But 16, so I had no mentors likeyou, nobody filling in the gap,
(08:53):
nobody helping me understand,answer questions.
I just was really struggling.
So I'll just say I went throughall the typical stuff you would
go through as a high school,high schooler.
Um, my motives, I was I quitfootball because I couldn't have
my way.
So I got into theater and I knewI loved theater because it was
all about me.
And I could be on the stage andI got all the attention.
(09:13):
And I was, I uh I was I was theman, and I had like six or seven
different leads.
I I won Best Actor, my first,uh, I think it was my uh senior
year in high school.
I was in the RenaissanceFestival, I was in a show every
minute of my life from mysophomore year high school till
my second year of college.
(09:34):
And I just was reallystruggling.
And uh I was a very carnalChristian.
I believed and I wanted to, Iwanted to go deeper, but I just
hadn't know I didn't know how todo it until I met my wife.
My wife was the first believer Imet her in college in my second
year, and again, I was gonna goand make it big in in Hollywood,
and I was gonna go off and dowhatever I had to do to you know
(09:57):
get into the shows in thelimelight.
And then my wife was the firstreal Christian I met.
Now, isn't that kind of it'sgreat, but it's sad.
Someone who actually So what isthat?
SPEAKER_00 (10:08):
I was gonna say, what does that mean?
D?
Because I think Christian,Christian also just scares
people away, right?
SPEAKER_01 (10:16):
Jimmy Winship says it's a club, it's just the name
of another name of a gang.
Name of a gang, right?
And so that's exactly what itwas.
It it it meant the wordChristian meant a hundred
different things to a hundreddifferent people.
SPEAKER_00 (10:29):
Yes, it repels people.
SPEAKER_01 (10:32):
Oh, yeah, and because we all have this history
and we all have theseexperiences that turned us off.
And so we frankly we use that asan excuse to not get to know
Jesus.
SPEAKER_00 (10:41):
And it keeps us from like the thing that we're all
really wanting.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (10:46):
So I'll give you an example of what she was like.
So I told a lot of little whitelies.
I was a liar.
I was a liar, let's just say Itold a lot of fibs just to get
what I wanted.
And when I would be on a phonecall, and my and my girlfriend
Pam, she's my wife now, wassitting by me, and she'd hear me
say, Oh, I can't, I can't go outthere tonight.
I got this going on, and I'dhang up and she'd go, You just
(11:09):
lied.
I said, Well, what do you mean?
She goes, Well, you just toldthat person that you couldn't go
and you really could go becauseyou know you're you're going out
with me.
And I went, Why does no one hurttheir feelings?
And she goes, That's lying.
That's not being and she calledme on stuff like that.
SPEAKER_00 (11:28):
And I went, I love Pam.
SPEAKER_01 (11:31):
Everybody loves Pam, okay?
Everybody loves Pam.
Because that's she, I'm tellingyou, 40.
See, we dated for three years,married for we're gonna be 43
this week.
43, so we've known each other 46years.
She's my my first favoritecoach, okay?
She tells me the truth in anhonoring way.
She's just that way.
(11:52):
So she was the first time I'dever seen a real Christian in
the way she showed up.
Ah, like she live was livinghonest integrity, calling me on
stuff.
And so about three months afterI met her.
No, actually, when I met her, doyou want to hear that one?
This is a this everything is agod thing.
So I'm in theater, I'm in myfirst show, I get the lead in my
(12:12):
first show.
And so I'm riding back and forthto school with Pam's roommate.
And she keeps telling me, Yougotta meet my roommate.
I think you guys would getalong.
I tried and tried to call andtried to call.
She was never there.
So I finally said to her, Look,why don't you guys just come to
the show?
You know, uh, I was doingcarousel, I was Billy Bigelow,
(12:34):
and I said, Why don't you cometo the show?
And afterwards, underneath thestage is this really cool
reception room, and you guys cancome down there and I can meet
her.
As soon as I saw her, they come,they go to the reception, I see
her.
God, I'm not telling you, I knowyou're gonna have to answer ask
me this question.
God said, That's the girl you'regonna marry.
Now, you know me, I don't doanything small.
(12:55):
So I had three guys who were Iwas in a barbershop quartet with
and they were all on the show.
So I went over to him and Isaid, You guys, I just met the
girl I'm gonna marry.
Can you just come and do twosongs, just two songs with me
for her?
So we sang Coney Island Baby andJonah the Whale, and that hooked
her.
SPEAKER_00 (13:15):
Oh go hold on, pause for I want to hit pause or
rewind on God said this is thegirl you're gonna marry.
So how does that happen forsomeone who's wondering or
trying to hear God in theirlife?
Like, what did that how doesthat occur for you?
(13:36):
Because it's different foreverybody, right?
SPEAKER_01 (13:38):
So, you know when you tell somebody what does your
gut feel?
What did your gut say?
What is that little voice inyour head telling you that you
are ignoring?
I had been ignoring God's voicefor many years, and all of a
sudden, he I'm not kidding you,it wasn't audible, but it was
audible in my head.
It was like that strong spiritof God.
(14:01):
I got a like a 30-secondanointing that said, This is the
one.
And then you know what happened30 days later.
The Lord said, You're quittingtheater.
SPEAKER_00 (14:17):
How did that go?
This is the small voice.
SPEAKER_01 (14:19):
I thought, okay, I'm done.
I heard the voice I cried.
I cried, that was my dream.
That was I was on the stage, andhe said, You're on the stage for
the wrong reason.
I want you, I'll don't worryabout it.
I will use your gifts, I willuse your talents to to do what
you do best, which is how youconnect with people.
But right now, you're not goingto California, uh, you're not
(14:43):
gonna be a theater major.
So I had to change my my major.
Like, because I was so I changedit to speechcom, and that's that
was a whole nother God thing.
Um, but so we went to school,and that's kind of how I'd say,
you know, when people say, Well,I heard God's voice, well, I was
reading the Bible and you whenyou read the Bible, God speaks
(15:07):
to you through the scripture.
See, I wasn't reading the Bible,so I didn't I didn't know how to
discern anything.
But when I started reading theBible, man, I started like
seeing my sin.
I started seeing things I wasdoing wrong, or seeing even the
little lies.
I call them white lies.
They weren't white lies, they'reall lies.
SPEAKER_00 (15:25):
So self-protection, right?
Or like, yeah, it all it getsdisguised as protecting others
or protecting yourself orprotecting your image or yeah,
exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (15:35):
It's protect it's all pride, it's all about me.
Um, and the Lord says it's notabout you, it's about me.
So I'm gonna get rid of all theyou stuff, and I'm gonna this is
gonna be a journey for you.
So that was really the firsttime I really I mean, I heard
God all the way, but I justignored it.
(15:55):
And I knew what was right and Iknew what was wrong, but I just
ignored it.
And I said, I'm just gonna dowhat I want to do.
SPEAKER_00 (16:02):
So did you ignore it, or was it a process of
learning like that you werehearing from God?
Or a little bit of both?
SPEAKER_01 (16:12):
A little bit of both, I would say, because once
I got married, so I got married,now this was really wild.
My dad had a heart attack a weekbefore my wedding.
And I was in training and I wasgonna be married like on a
Friday, the 29th of October,1982, and then I was I was gonna
get shipped off to uh uh to anairline.
I always wanted to work for theairline.
(16:32):
I got a job, I was gonnagraduate on Friday, but I was
gonna have to be shipped toChicago.
We were gonna go move toChicago.
Well, my dad had a heart attack,and he had quadruple heart
bypass on the day of my wedding.
unknown (16:44):
Wow.
SPEAKER_01 (16:45):
So I dropped my mom off at the hospital on Friday
morning, I went and finished myschool, graduated, you know, got
got done with the training, wentand picked up my tux, went and
picked up my mom, went to thechurch and got married that
night.
Um, and I had to make adecision.
Here you go.
This is all kind of crammed inin a couple years.
I had to make a decision.
What am I gonna do?
My mom is a nervous wreck, mydad's gonna be in the hospital
(17:08):
for three months, and I gottaleave on Monday.
So Pam and I talked, we prayedtogether, we prayed over the
week and we said, Lord, I kindof knew the answer, but I didn't
want to do it.
He said, quit.
I went to I went to the airlineand I said, Look, my dad's in
surgery.
My dad's gonna be laid up.
(17:29):
Can I can you just can I stayhere in Minneapolis?
Nope.
You either go or you quit.
I said, Well, well, can you holdout to go to Chicago?
Like, can you give me a week ortwo and then then I'll go to
Chicago?
I just got married.
And they go, Nope.
So that's what I was saying.
We we we prayed over the weekendand we both came to the same
conclusion.
And by the way, for those of youwho are married, you know the
(17:51):
Lord's at work when you're bothusually on the same page about
the right thing to do.
And um, so I quit and I trustedthe Lord.
I had no job, my wife didn'thave a job, so we lived with my
parents for three months.
SPEAKER_00 (18:05):
Wow.
SPEAKER_01 (18:05):
Or my mom actually helping my mom out to kind of
help her till she could kind ofease back into life because she
was just kind of thrown for aloop on this one.
So, so yeah, and then that ledto then my wife and I we really
talked about okay, how do wewant to do, how do we want to be
married?
We want to be marrieddifferently.
We don't have any good mentors,you know.
(18:27):
Both of our parents now weredivorced after 25 years, and was
it was sad.
Um and we didn't, we were justwe had nobody.
So I started reading like acrazy man.
I started going to Biblestudies, I started my Pam and I
got involved.
Um you know who my mentors were?
(18:48):
Dr.
James Dobson, Dr.
Gary Smalley, uh writing thisdown, it was um Howard
Hendricks, right?
Um some of these guys, uh JackHayford, um amazing men of God
that I listened to on the radio.
I listened to on Focus on theFamily.
(19:09):
I listened to it, didn't havepodcasts back then.
I went to Dad the FamilyShepherd, for those of you who
remember that that that thingfrom way back.
I went to Promise Keeper stuff.
But yeah, I know.
Look, every some people mighthave different opinions about
some of these things, theseorganizations, but some of the
men there were some of the mostgodly men and they knew exactly
what they were talking aboutabout marriage and family.
(19:30):
So I listened and Pim and Isaid, We're gonna be
intentional.
And we did a family contract,and I got that idea from Dr.
Gary Smalley in a book calledKey to Your Child's Heart, which
is one of the best books I everread about family parenting and
marriage.
And uh those guys were mymentors.
And I just I did followed thebook with the scripture.
(19:50):
I read scripture, I was gettinginto the word.
Um, and by the way, some uh youknow, I've asked people, hey, so
how are you with Jesus?
Where are you with Jesus?
Well, you know, we're good.
I said, Well, what does goodmean?
What does good look like?
How often are you in the word?
You know, I pray and I Iworship.
Do you read the word?
Oh, you know.
(20:13):
Oh, one to two days of you know,for about five, ten minutes.
No.
It doesn't work.
So your worship and your prayeris infused by the word of God,
right?
And if you read the scriptures,it will reveal truth to you, and
then you'll start to hear Godspeaking to you through the
scriptures about what the rightthing is to do, about how to
(20:33):
trust him, how to take risks.
SPEAKER_00 (20:35):
Well, in my experience, it's been like you
you can confirm what you'rehearing with what's in the
scripture, right?
That's sometimes how I validate,like, oh, that is I am hearing
from God, and that is validatedin the word.
SPEAKER_01 (20:49):
And so it's a two-edged sword, right?
It's a two-edged sword.
And you know, by the way, whenGod so convicted me about lying
that um that was the heart thatwas the strongest punishment you
could get in our family if youviolated uh what you agreed to
in the family contract, then yougot the most severe punishment
(21:11):
for lying to us.
SPEAKER_00 (21:13):
Wow.
SPEAKER_01 (21:14):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (21:14):
So that's powerful.
SPEAKER_01 (21:18):
So that's the yeah.
What about you?
Well, because you said youdidn't have any, you didn't have
kind of like what I didn't have,right?
SPEAKER_00 (21:28):
Yeah, I didn't have the influences.
And it, you know, like allthrough grade school, I went to
church on my own.
And um, and then when I got tohigh school too, like I started,
you know, veering on thatself-path and and got distracted
from God.
And then after high school, Iwas I went to college and I was
(21:49):
married young, like 23, and notlike we we got married, and then
I like if I look back, I didthis Bible study um a lot of
years ago, but she had you goback through your life and make
a like a map of where God showedup all the years, like where
(22:13):
there were people that showed upin your life that reminded you,
like, or invited you to church.
And like I made that map and Iwas like floored that there was
I I often lived next to somebodythat like would invite me to
church or like two differentplaces I lived.
I had people just neighbors whoinvited me to church, like just
(22:33):
those little reminders, likewherever I was, you know,
somebody I work with, or God wasalways trying to bring me back
in.
And I like in my 20s, I I kindof studied other things too.
You know, I looked at otherreligions and um, you know, kind
of did some exploring.
And I think that is all reallynatural, right?
(22:55):
Like for us to grapple with it.
And I I struggled so much withso many Christian things and
church things and religionthings that just didn't sit
right with me.
But what I could never ever everever deny was my experience of
God.
Like I just I've had experiencesover and over and over and over
(23:16):
again.
And like you were saying, as youstart to find the way that God,
and I think He He intimatelyspeaks to each of us um so
precisely in a way that we willhear or we will see or we will
resonate, you know?
And um like as as as you payattention to that, it just gets
(23:40):
more vivid, right?
Um, and then reading the Bible.
You were talking about readingthe Bible, like I'd never read
the Bible, like all those yearsthat I went to church and I
didn't read the Bible till umgosh, I was in my late 40s
probably.
Um, and I that was at a time inmy life where a coach had called
(24:02):
me out.
I said I wanted to create thisgreat marriage, and he had me
track my time, and I realizedthat my husband was getting the
breadcrumbs of my time, and sowas God.
And I made a pivot in my life tostart every day first with God
and then with my husband, evenif it's just a few minutes.
(24:23):
And I started reading the Bible,and I I didn't understand the
first time I went through theBible, I didn't understand what
I was reading, but God startedworking more powerfully in my
life.
Like that's when my life reallystarted to change.
SPEAKER_01 (24:38):
Um key what kind of what motivated you to get into
the word, you think?
SPEAKER_00 (24:46):
I don't know if I remember.
I just it was that like I wannaI want to put God first and I'm
gonna start my day every daywith God.
And so I just I started with theBible.
I don't really remember why,like if there was a nudge around
that or why, but I just thought,oh, I do know why.
Because Quentin, my husband, hadread the Bible and he wasn't a
(25:08):
believer when we got married,and I was worried about that.
But at one some point, like wetook the boys to church in
vacation Bible school, and atsome point he, you know, he
changed his life.
And um he started reading beforeyou did.
He started he read he read theBible before I did, and that
(25:28):
inspired me.
I'm like, yeah, I need to dothat.
Like it's so crazy that we canbe believers and have never read
the Bible.
SPEAKER_01 (25:36):
Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (25:36):
And that that has changed everything for me
because all those those missinglinks with Christian and
Christianity and religion thatwere rubbing me wrong, the Bible
is not what I thought it was.
Like what the message Jesusbrought is what we're all
seeking, but it's all distortedby religion and Christianity in
(25:59):
in many places.
SPEAKER_01 (26:01):
The religion versus be having a personal
relationship.
That's the one thing I learnedis the whole difference between
Christianity and all the otherfaiths.
I will say is that the HolySpirit, I mean, it's amazing.
I can't even get my head wrappedaround this whole Trinity thing
sometimes.
I still struggle with that, butI get it that the Holy Spirit,
(26:22):
the creator of the universe,lives inside of us.
Yes, squelch it all the time.
And then the Bible justunleashes it and and un it shows
truth, and it's for correctionand reproof and right and
training.
SPEAKER_00 (26:36):
So very cool.
Yes, and it's like everything iseverything is upside down and
what we've been told and taught.
And I I think it's intentionalto keep us away from the truth
and the the kingdom, right?
Like I never knew the kingdomwas for now that we can live in
this kingdom now and feel allexperience all of that now and
(26:58):
for eternity.
Like I never understood that.
SPEAKER_01 (27:01):
Yeah, but that's really, really cool.
So then you so then he startedreading, you started reading,
you guys started going tochurch, and then did he become
then did he give his life beforeyou then?
SPEAKER_00 (27:13):
No, no, no.
I I gave my life back when I wasat Bible camp, like you.
Okay, like we had Bible study,and I took my Bible by the
river, and like I asked Jesusinto my heart, but then I had to
do it over and over again.
SPEAKER_01 (27:27):
Get a refresh.
SPEAKER_00 (27:29):
We both had a refresh straight away.
SPEAKER_01 (27:31):
Praise God for that, right?
A lot of grace and mercy along.
SPEAKER_00 (27:34):
Oh my gosh, yes.
This is a journey and a process,and it's okay to grapple, and
yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (27:41):
Wow, amazing.
You and I got married at 23.
We got married at 23 too.
So a lot of similarities.
Our whole story is kind ofaligned.
SPEAKER_00 (27:49):
Well, but my story broke.
I got married and then divorcedand then found my husband today.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (27:56):
So how long have you guys been married now?
SPEAKER_00 (27:59):
Almost 25.
SPEAKER_01 (28:00):
Wow, congratulations.
SPEAKER_00 (28:02):
Nothing said, that's awesome.
43 and 25.
Yes.
So good.
Um, so was there a low point inyour faith where God showed up?
Lots of low points, right?
SPEAKER_01 (28:17):
Yeah, a lot of low points, but this is the cool two
steps forward, one step back,right?
I mean, that's what God, if youthink about the disciples, I
love this story about how JamieWinship paints, he was always
leveling them up.
What do I mean by that?
Right?
SPEAKER_00 (28:32):
Yeah, I was just gonna say Jamie Winship wrote
the book uh Living Fearless,which Bob and I have both read
and deeply adore.
So just wanted to share that.
SPEAKER_01 (28:40):
Yep, no royalties being painted to these two
people on the podcast.
Uh here, just telling mestraight up some
recommendations.
You want to go deep with theLord, and it's all pretty much
based in fear, and that's what'sgetting in your way.
Read his book.
He's helped me a ton.
But I love how when he talksabout, he just didn't go from
(29:01):
you know, over three years like,hey, I'm Jesus, okay, I'm dying.
No, I'm gonna be on the cross.
I know you're not gonna get it,it's gonna take you a while.
He was training, sharing theword, uh, speaking the word,
serving, healing, performingmiracles.
It was the whole three-yearjourney.
They were constantly growing,one one or two steps forward,
(29:22):
one step back, right?
Because they'd all screw up.
They were all just men and womenlike us.
And so Jesus is always levelingus up, and we may not see the
big picture for 10, 15, 20 yearsaround why he's doing what he's
doing right now in us, and wehave to go through some of that
stuff.
So true.
SPEAKER_00 (29:38):
It's so true.
SPEAKER_01 (29:39):
A lot of refining and process and anger and I
would character building and youknow, pouting and c and anger
towards him, and justfrustrated.
I um I would say that there wasone spot, one place in my life
when Pam and I were firstmarried, and I didn't get what I
(29:59):
wanted.
And I kind of told a f ahalf-truth, which is a lie, to
get me where I wanted to be.
And the n probably not followedthe scripture on that one.
Somebody gave up their positionso I could go in their stead and
(30:21):
and get back to where I reallywanted to be, and that's why I
was trying to fudge a little bitto get there.
And then I just cried like ababy because he humbled me and
said he just would have waited24 hours, told the truth, and
just stuck it with me.
But I wanted the plan, I wantedit all laid out, and Jesus
doesn't work that way.
(30:42):
You know, look what he said toJacob.
Jacob, get up, go.
Um, yes, you're right in leavingLaban, but I'm not telling you
exactly what's going on.
He didn't know he had Esau, hehad to face.
He didn't know that Laban wasgonna follow him, and now he's
got you know enemies behind himand potential enemies in the
front of him, and he's like,what am I gonna do here?
He just trusted the Lord and hehad faith and he knew that he
(31:04):
trusted Jesus.
He had been on this long journeytoo.
If you look back at his history,he lied to his father, he lied
to his brother, he connived, hemanipulated to get his way.
But then he grew along this wayon this journey to the place
where he he did follow the Lordand and take the step that the
that God had confirmed in him toleave and go forward, and he
(31:24):
healed both of thoserelationships.
SPEAKER_00 (31:28):
So you know, something that I have been like
sitting with is like, you know,we have more self-help stuff,
you know, the bookshelves arefull of books, like we have more
resources at our hands than everbefore.
And I've just been like, thisquestion has been on my heart is
like, is self-help helping?
(31:50):
And it's not.
Like if you look at the state ofmental health, yeah, and as
you're talking about the Bibleright now, like I think the what
the Bible has shown me is thatthe world says we need
self-help.
The Bible tells us we needself-discipline and actually
teaches you like what that isand what that looks like.
(32:13):
And I feel like that's whatpeople are hungry for.
SPEAKER_01 (32:17):
Oh hungry, you know, lonely, depressed.
They've tried everything, youknow.
I think Tom Brady said, he said,is this all there is?
SPEAKER_00 (32:25):
I know.
I have so many people around methat I feel like are in that
place.
SPEAKER_01 (32:30):
Yeah, is this all there is to life?
This is the pinnacle, then Idon't doesn't, if it is, it's
like doesn't feel so good.
SPEAKER_00 (32:35):
That's just the essence of what he said.
SPEAKER_01 (32:37):
You know, and we've got you know friends who've said
the same thing to us.
SPEAKER_00 (32:41):
Yeah, and the other thing that popped in my head as
you were talking was um, youknow, hearing God and like
learning to hear God.
Because I I know that noteverybody hears God or
recognizes that they're hearingGod more accurately.
But one of the ways that I hearGod is like it's it is that that
(33:05):
it is like a voice, it's notaudible, but it it feels like
you hear it in your head, orsometimes it can be like words,
but it's it's not what I wouldthink.
It's not what how I would speak.
And when you are in the word,you it often does show up like
the word, right?
But it's it's different, itstands out.
(33:27):
And if you start payingattention, or it calls you to
show up in a way that you scaresthe daylights out of you, but
you know is right, right?
SPEAKER_01 (33:37):
Yeah, it's like Rob Ketterling at our one of the
churches we've attended in thepast.
He said, follow the prompt.
We have so many prompts weignore.
SPEAKER_00 (33:45):
Prompts.
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (33:46):
I was in a, you know, I you know me, I've always
had a strong grip on money.
And so I've been working on thatfor a very long time.
And so we were in a coffee shopa couple days ago.
Uh I was with a meeting with afriend, and uh, there's a older
um uh couple of ladies, and onepaid for her thing and she moved
(34:06):
on, and then the woman in frontof me, she went to pay and they
don't take cash, and she didn'thave, you know, she didn't have
her credit card.
And immediately, you know, itreally wasn't out of guilt.
It was like, you have a creditcard, you pay for it.
And no, I don't went at first.
I went, yeah.
Now, even three or four monthsago, three or four years ago, I
(34:26):
would have said, why?
But I followed the prompt.
I didn't even have to hey, letme take care of this person's
bill.
She goes, No, you don't.
I said, I want to.
Don't worry about it.
I I I had a prompt.
I need it, I need to pay for youand take care of it.
Now you can go and enjoy yourtime with your friend.
SPEAKER_00 (34:47):
That's the best.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (34:49):
So yesterday she said, she said, she goes, Don't
worry, I'll pay it for it.
I said, I'm not worried.
I'm not worried at all.
SPEAKER_00 (34:56):
So I love that.
Yes.
Follow the prompts.
Listen for the prompts, justexperiment with them.
SPEAKER_01 (35:04):
That's right.
That's right.
Yeah.
It's just amazing.
Like you said, Carla, I love it.
The word, being in the word, youknow, um, one of my life verses
here, I'll just say, is uh Acts15, 19, which is therefore it is
my judgment that we should nottrouble those of the Gentiles
who are turning to God.
We, me, I should never be animpediment to someone coming to
(35:28):
faith.
Because when I say I'm abeliever, they're watching me.
We are now under a microscope.
They're watching everything.
It's just like leadership.
By the way, you know, that's whyyou and I do leadership
development.
Is it's a it's a Jesusprinciple.
Love the Lord your God and thenlove others.
I mean, that's what servantleadership is all about.
(35:49):
Love others, you know.
We read that book, um, the goal,the the goal giver and um some
other ones that just talk aboutserve your your butt off is
pretty much what it is.
Go love people.
Jesus said, Love me and lovepeople, and that's the bottom
line, pretty much.
SPEAKER_00 (36:04):
And you'll be so blessed by it.
SPEAKER_01 (36:07):
Yeah, be blessed by it, because and blessed doesn't
mean you're gonna get moremoney.
There's there's so manydifferent meanings of blessing,
blessing in your spirit, comfortand peace in your soul.
We just are in a world right nowwhere there's just very little
or no peace anywhere.
Yeah, and Jesus does thatfreely.
SPEAKER_00 (36:27):
So yeah, it's so powerful.
Prompts and in prayer.
Like when you were saying that,I had the coolest thing happen.
So we are you okay on time, Bob?
SPEAKER_01 (36:36):
Um, good.
SPEAKER_00 (36:37):
We go okay.
SPEAKER_01 (36:38):
You know, you and we can talk about Jesus forever,
but I know we don't try boringeverybody else to death, but
we're having a blast.
SPEAKER_00 (36:45):
Um, I I have this little coffee shop that I can
walk to from my house.
And I've been going for a numberof months now, and there's a
girl there that works there thatis just an absolute joy and
delight.
And she is a believer.
She and I have talked about it,and they host young people there
on Friday nights and all ofthat.
So I built this friendship withher, just going in and getting
(37:08):
coffee.
And all of a sudden she wasn'tthere and she wasn't there and
she wasn't there.
And I went at different times ofthe day to find her, and like it
was just on my heart, likesomething had happened,
something was wrong.
And I kept coming home to myhusband, like, Brennan's still
not there.
And um one day I came back and Ishared that with my husband, and
(37:28):
then I prayed, and I don't knowwhy I prayed this, but I said,
God help me find Brennan,because I don't know.
I just felt like I needed tofind her.
And literally the very nextmorning, I walk into my Pilates
class, which is also across thestreet, that I've been going to
for six months.
I've never seen her there ever.
(37:48):
I walk in and I didn't even seeher during class.
At the end of class, the teacherwent up and was talking to
somebody, and I just kind ofglanced over and I and I was
like, is that her?
Like she didn't even lookherself.
She didn't have her light, shejust didn't have the joy that
she normally has.
And I walked up and I'm like,Brenna, and I just embraced her
in a hug.
(38:08):
And I'm like, I literally prayedto God that I would find who
would help me find you.
And here you are, first thing inthe morning, right there.
So long story short, we went andmade it coffee date and um have
just been talking about Godtogether and like reuniting, and
we're connected for some reasonthat I don't understand, right?
(38:29):
But that's how you and Iconnected too, Bob.
SPEAKER_01 (38:33):
Like look, when you're when you read the word,
you know that these things youcan't explain some of these
things that go on wanting to getyour attention.
Do you want me to do you want meto share the story of the
colour?
SPEAKER_00 (38:45):
Yeah, sure.
So we can close full circlehere.
SPEAKER_01 (38:49):
So I was in the thralls of trying to figure out
where I go next in my life, andI kind of knew that I was gonna
probably be ending my term at mycurrent employer, but I didn't
know what to do.
It really scared me.
So I started getting on somecalls and some webinars and
things like that.
So I was on this webinar and Iheard this young lady ask
amazing questions.
(39:10):
I'm like, those are she must bea really good coach.
Anyone who asks those questionsis a really good coach.
So I think I I reached out toyou and I said, Hey, I'd love to
just kind of connect with youand just kind of get a sense.
I'm looking for a coach.
And I heard you on the on thewebinar.
Would you be willing to get toconnect?
(39:31):
And you said yes.
And then we got to go.
But you referenced, but youreferenced okay, you're gonna
show you that.
I really love the questions thatyou were asking on the pot on
the uh webinar.
And you said, Oh Bob, those arereally good questions, but I
don't think that was me.
SPEAKER_00 (39:48):
I said, but we carried on anyway.
SPEAKER_01 (39:51):
Let's get together anyway, is what we did.
So there you go.
That's how God works inmysterious ways, he works in
unbelievable ways, but he neversaid he was gonna lay out the
plan for every little problemthat we have.
SPEAKER_00 (40:03):
I know.
SPEAKER_01 (40:04):
He never told anybody in the scripture.
You find it where he said, hejust said, Go, go, follow me,
trust me, I'll provide for you,I'll give you the manna, you
know, I'll give you, I'll feedit, feed you through the birds,
and and you just trust me daily,day by day.
SPEAKER_00 (40:17):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (40:18):
Seek me first in his kingdom, and then all these
things will be added unto you,right?
SPEAKER_00 (40:23):
So good.
Okay, last question.
Okay kudos to Susie Larson Livebecause she asks this question
on her podcast that you and Iboth Thank you Susie, I listen
to you too.
SPEAKER_01 (40:34):
We love you.
SPEAKER_00 (40:36):
Um, what's God been impressing on your heart lately,
Bob?
SPEAKER_01 (40:41):
This is such a good one.
SPEAKER_00 (40:42):
I know.
Um and this is for you too,listener.
Like, what's God been impressingon your heart?
Just take a look around.
SPEAKER_01 (40:50):
You know, you know what, you would never just buy a
car and just run it for 10 yearswithout doing anything to it.
You need to refresh it.
You need to change the oil, youneed to check the tires, you
need to get a tune-up.
I needed a tune-up, and I Ineeded it in a bad way, and I
was just kind of in a heavyplace recently.
(41:11):
And Pam and I went on a mission,a marriage mission, our like our
vision retreat we do now.
We've been doing like for fouryears or five years now.
We just talk about our marriage.
What's missing, what's working,what's not, what do we need to
be doing, where do we want togo?
What's kind of our vision?
What's God calling us to do?
And on this one, you know whathe said?
I want you to remember why youwhat you committed to me when
(41:32):
you first got married.
SPEAKER_00 (41:33):
Oh and he said who who was gonna be at the center
of your life?
SPEAKER_01 (41:40):
Well, you were Lord.
And what was gonna be yourministry?
My family and my friends.
Okay, great.
I want you to go, I want you topull back from some leadership
roles you've been taking on thathave been frankly pulling you
away from that ministry.
And so I did.
And I said no to a couple thingsthat I had been involved with
(42:00):
for a very long time, and bothPam and I were on the same page
and we're going, remember.
This is like look, look up theword remember in the Bible how
many times the Lord says,Remember what I did for you.
Go back and look for I'veprovided for you.
I have never, I've neverforsaken you.
I've loved you the whole time.
And you will be, you will beblessed.
Doesn't mean financially, butyou will be blessed.
And so I stepped back, and Pamand I have just recommitted
(42:24):
ourselves to ministering to ourkids, our grandkids, the friends
around us.
Um, I was not a generous person,by the way.
I'll just quote it here.
When I met my wife, she was waythere's another thing she taught
me.
She would give everything awayif she could.
She would overgive.
And I'm like, no, that's ours.
(42:44):
That's mine.
I worked hard for that.
And slowly but surely, God hasreally changed me in terms of
giving more, being a giver,being a servant, you know, me
helping other person succeed inmy in my business here.
And the one way she knew that Iwas really generous was I um
this weekend, now normally whenshe's gone for four days, I kind
(43:07):
of take me time.
But this time I took, I thoughtabout who, who, Lord, who can I
just who do I need?
Who do you who needs ourrelationship?
I spent time with a couple offriends who are just they're
looking.
I had a guy friend who said, Idon't have any guy friends, Bob,
and I really like this guy.
I said, How could you not haveany guy friends?
And so, and then another guy whojust I just love him to death.
(43:30):
We spent some time.
We went out, I know maybe thisisn't good, but we went to the
shooting range.
It was really a blast.
We hadn't really went through atough time.
And then um, my wife said, Itreally came home to me.
All the stuff you did, I cleanedthe house, I did the shower, I
made some bread so she didn'thave to cook for my birthday uh
when she got home from beingwith our grandkids in
homeschooling.
(43:51):
Um, I said, uh uh I'm trying tothink, what could I do?
What could I do that wouldreally help her out when she
gets home?
So I just I worked.
She's her her love language isworks, you know.
Um, and so I scrubbed the showerlike four times and I was
couldn't get it clean, and Ijust kept at it.
Um I baked the pie because sheknows I love pumpkin pie and I
(44:14):
was gonna have that for mybirthday.
So I baked it so she didn't haveto do it when she came home
because I knew she was gonna betired.
Um and so I just did some and Ijust wanted to do it.
And I wasn't trying to getaccolades, I just wanted to do
it because she's taught me howto think differently now, and
the Lord's used her to teach mehow to be more generous.
SPEAKER_00 (44:32):
So cool.
And you literally experienceheart change.
SPEAKER_01 (44:35):
Yep, yep, heart change, big time.
And then this was the I'm sorry,now the other one I was gonna
share is I love, you know, Ilove our time together.
And so we watch our grandson oneday a week.
And so, but I protect our timebecause it's really important
for our marriage.
And so this time, I know mydaughter had to get up early,
and Saint, our grandboy, he's 14months, was gonna be at church
(44:56):
for like six or seven hours.
Well, she's in ministry, soshe's at the church and her
husband's at the church andthey're in ministry.
And I just I didn't even thinktwice.
I said, honey, hey, uh, I'mgoing to pick up my mom.
I'm going to pick up momtomorrow at the airport at 7:30.
What if I just come out and pickup Saint and we'll just take him
until you guys get home at like1 or 1.30?
Dad, that would be awesome.
(45:18):
Well, that made my wife's heartsink.
Right?
She said, I gotta tell you, Igotta tell you, when you said
that and you didn't even flinch,I just loved that so much.
If you offered that and didn'teven like complain or whine
about it, you just did it.
And that's how Jesus transformsus.
(45:39):
He changes um whatever is true,whatever is noble, whatever is
right, whatever is pure,whatever is lovely, whatever is
admirable.
If anything is like these, thinkabout these things, right?
If anything's excellent forJesus are thinking, just changes
and transforms, transforms ourmind.
So that's that's how I wouldanswer that question is God has
changed me, but through the wordand through others, through you,
(46:01):
and through my experience andthrough my journey, and that's
how he's a personal Lord.
SPEAKER_00 (46:05):
Yeah, it is so personal, so personal.
How about you?
SPEAKER_01 (46:09):
How about you?
SPEAKER_00 (46:10):
Yeah, well, I mean, this will just kind of you know
represent that, like howpersonal it is.
So, what God has been impressingon my heart lately is I
literally woke up one night andjust kind of that same kind of
hearing, right?
He said, When you are rested andrelaxed, I can move mountains.
(46:32):
And like that one is just hejust keeps reminding me.
And so I've just been working atbeing a good steward of my time
and sleep and energy so that Ican be a vessel for whatever it
is he's calling me to do today.
So that's really cool.
SPEAKER_01 (46:50):
That's really cool.
SPEAKER_00 (46:51):
So good, Bob.
Thank you for just having thisconversation.
I want to have more of thesebecause I just can't um I
realize like I just can't notshare it anymore because people
are seeking it and need it, andit's just such a huge part of my
life.
SPEAKER_01 (47:12):
Yeah, maybe our third one will be how do we live
that out in our work?
Right?
Yeah.
And I think you did.
We were gonna, did you want toshare a tool with somebody here?
SPEAKER_00 (47:21):
With the Oh, yeah, share that tool because that
kind of inspired thisconversation actually.
SPEAKER_01 (47:26):
It did.
Um, we've used a really cooltool.
It's for great for small groups,great for each other, great for
marriage mentoring, great formarriages, period.
You guys can do this as coaches.
SPEAKER_00 (47:34):
Great for deep conversations, deep
conversations, family andfriends.
SPEAKER_01 (47:37):
We're gonna share with you the life map worksheet.
And it's divvied up by heritage,heroes, high points of God, hard
times, and the hand of God.
And you just in very narrow,very short space to fill it in
because you got to be concise.
SPEAKER_00 (47:55):
Nobody wants to hear, like, you know, three
hours all the story at the sametime.
SPEAKER_01 (47:59):
Maybe they want to hear three hours, but not just
at the same time.
So it's kind of a great way tokind of even write this out, map
it out, and share it with eachother.
SPEAKER_00 (48:09):
Especially as comments.
SPEAKER_01 (48:13):
Yep, yep.
We've used this many, manytimes.
Um, and you you've askedquestions on the podcast that
are around some of thesequestions.
You did it today.
And I just think it's a greatway to go beneath the surface
with with others, because that'swhat God asking us to do is
stop, stop staying on thesurface.
Go go deep with the Lord.
SPEAKER_00 (48:30):
Yeah, let's talk about the real, real things that
we're all seeking.
That's yeah, so much bigger thanthis, just this physical
experience that we're having.
You know, we're I we were justreading this.
It's like we are not um, oh, howdoes it go?
We are not human beings having aspiritual experience, we're
(48:52):
spiritual beings having a humanexperience.
SPEAKER_01 (48:54):
Oh my gosh, that's so good.
That's so good.
You're gonna have to put thatquote in your in your note
because everybody's gonna wantthat one.
SPEAKER_00 (49:01):
So good.
Thank you, Bob.
Thank you for theseconversations.
I just value these so much.
SPEAKER_01 (49:07):
Me too.
Thanks a lot.
SPEAKER_00 (49:09):
Okay, have an amazing day, everybody.
SPEAKER_01 (49:12):
Bye.
SPEAKER_00 (49:16):
Hey, thanks for listening all the way to the
end.
Before you move on with yourday, pause and capture one
thought or takeaway that stoodout to you.
Write it down so it doesn't getlost in the noise.
And if you're ready to godeeper, come join me in my free
monthly class, conversation, andguided writing to help you see
(49:38):
things differently and moveforward with clarity.
Save your spot Carlareeves.comforward slash free class.
A deep change in the way that we live requires a deep
change in the way that we think.
I'm Carla Reeves, and this isDifferently.
Welcome back to Differently.
Today I have Bob Parsons withme.
And if you you may have heardhim on the podcast before, he
(00:21):
was on November 9th, 23, andit's titled Choosing Freedom in
the Face of Fear.
And I invited Bob to come backtoday.
And we're going to talk aboutour faith journey.
This is something I that hasbeen on my heart to bring more
to the podcast.
And I haven't exactly known howto do that.
(00:43):
And Bob and I were talking theother day and thinking about
like what we want to do anotherpodcast together on.
And one of the strongestconnections that he and I have
had has been our faith.
Like every time we talk, we'resharing about how God is showing
up in our lives, our families.
And we're we've never actuallyshared like our God journey like
(01:06):
from the beginning.
And so I'm kind of excitedbecause I'm going to learn
something new about you, Bob,today.
And we just want to give you apeek inside.
Like maybe you have faith, maybeyou have Jesus, maybe you don't.
Maybe you're wondering.
I just see so many peoplestruggling right now and seeking
right now.
And I feel like religion is justscared people away.
(01:31):
And we're not talking aboutreligion today.
We're just sharing our ownexperience of God and how he has
shown up in our lives.
And so, Bob, welcome back.
SPEAKER_01 (01:42):
Thanks.
I'm excited.
I'm excited to be here.
And uh if you didn't like thefirst podcast, then I don't know
if you're gonna like the secondpodcast.
But if you like the first one, Ithink you'll really enjoy this
one.
SPEAKER_00 (01:55):
So, in case people haven't heard the first podcast,
give them a little sense of whoyou are and where you are and
what you do.
SPEAKER_01 (02:02):
Yes, I am.
I'll just tell you the stuffthat really means the most to
me.
Number one, though I've beenI've been a Christian since I
was 16, but then uh Lord'snumber one, and then my wife uh
will be married 43 years next.
No, this Wednesday will be 43years and my birthday.
So my I got married on mybirthday so that I would never
(02:24):
forget my anniversary.
SPEAKER_00 (02:26):
That's hilarious.
I didn't know that.
SPEAKER_01 (02:28):
And I haven't.
I've never I've never forgottenit.
So it's it's always been an easydeal.
SPEAKER_00 (02:33):
Oh, that's the best.
SPEAKER_01 (02:35):
I have three amazing kids, 38, 36, and 33.
I'm close to them.
I love them, they're just neatpeople to hang out with.
And um see, then I've been I'veworked in corporate for many,
many years, over uh almost 38years.
And now I've been on my own uhbecause uh I hired you.
(02:57):
You were my the fire that waslit under my butt to get going
on this and really helped memanage my mind traffic quite a
bit.
And so now I'm doing mainly I'dsay team and one-on-one
executive coaching, mid-leveland above uh for leaders.
And I just love my work.
SPEAKER_00 (03:14):
Oh, it's awesome.
It's been so fun to watch yourbusiness grow and just the
journey of it all.
It's so good.
Amazing.
Yeah.
So let's go way, way back, Bob.
Like when did God come into yourlife?
Like when did that door evenopen for you?
SPEAKER_01 (03:33):
Now, now you're gonna are you gonna answer some
of these questions too?
SPEAKER_00 (03:36):
Yeah, you can ask me anything you want.
SPEAKER_01 (03:38):
Because I hate talking, I really do.
I mean, some of you who knew mein high school, when I say I
really hate talking aboutmyself, we're probably going,
You're a liar, but I havechanged.
I have changed.
I'm you know, I'm in mymid-sixties now, so I have grown
quite a bit.
SPEAKER_00 (03:51):
Just like we're having coffee and sharing our
journey.
SPEAKER_01 (03:55):
Great.
So I'll just tell you that asfar back as I can remember,
probably around age five or six,I always felt a sense of God.
Never read the Bible, hadn'treally gone to church, but my my
mom and my and they would saythings and and ask and and do
things.
And I'm like, wait a minute,mom, uh, if if people just
(04:17):
obeyed the Bible, wouldn'teverything be okay?
Wouldn't we all be good?
And you know, to their I feelbad, but at that point they were
in a very different place.
My mom is a real strong believertoday.
My dad passed away um when hewas, you know, very young, 56.
But um but I've always had asense of God and I just didn't
(04:38):
know what to do and how to workwith it because I just didn't
have anybody in my family.
I am a first generationChristian, so until I was about
fast forward to about 13 or 14,I just was trying, I was a
little, I was in a searchingperiod, and so I wanted to go to
church.
So me and my buddies wanted togo to church, and I wanted to go
(04:59):
to camp, I wanted to go to Biblecamp.
So there was a church about sixblocks away from our house.
So me and my friends we wentevery Wednesday and Sundays.
Just us.
We just went because my parents,my dad wasn't into church, my
mom was hoping that my dad wouldget involved, but my dad never
got there.
And so, and that's where I firstheard a little bit about the
(05:20):
Bible and Jesus.
And then I went to camp and Iheard the gospel message.
And Kenny, I don't know ifyou're still around, but you
were the guy, you were the youthpastor at Redeemer Lutheran
Church in friendly, friendlyMinnesota, and you shared the
gospel at camp, and that justthat was the missing piece for
(05:42):
me.
And so I committed myself in thein a room with a whole bunch of
us listening to the gospel atthat point to uh to do.
SPEAKER_00 (05:50):
And how old were you then?
SPEAKER_01 (05:52):
16.
SPEAKER_00 (05:53):
16.
And when how old were you whenyour little group of friends
were going to church?
SPEAKER_01 (05:57):
We've probably been gone for a couple years now.
SPEAKER_00 (05:59):
Yeah, like 14, 13.
SPEAKER_01 (06:02):
Yeah, so I was about 14.
I'll just say I was 14, 15,somewhere in there.
Yeah, I know it was a coupleyears because I went to camp,
went to camp, and then it took acouple shots at camp before I
got it, right?
SPEAKER_00 (06:11):
Yeah, yeah.
That's so crazy.
So we've never talked aboutthis, but um I was like five
years old, and my parents didn'tgo to church either.
Nobody in my family, I think mygrandma went, but she lived out
of town.
(06:31):
Um, and I had a little neighborfriend who invited me to church
when I was in kindergarten.
And I just started going withher family and like went all
through grade school.
My mom was Catholic, but she hadlost her first husband in
Vietnam.
And I think, you know, withthree young children.
(06:54):
And I think she was at odds withGod for a while.
And my dad was Lutheran, but Idon't know why he wasn't going
to church.
I don't really know his storyabout that time.
And I just went and they wouldcome at Chris.
My parents would show up onChristmas and Easter, you know,
when I was in the little churchplay or whatever.
But I am so grateful for thatfamily because they really did
(07:19):
uh introduce me to God.
And I'll like I am forevergrateful for that.
SPEAKER_01 (07:28):
Wait, so you lot you said that you you your mom lost
her first husband in Vietnam.
SPEAKER_00 (07:35):
My mom lost her first husband in Vietnam.
Yep, he was a pilot and hisplane went down.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (07:42):
Wow.
SPEAKER_00 (07:43):
And three young children.
SPEAKER_01 (07:44):
Yeah, you and I are gonna learn a lot about each
other, I think, today we didn'tknow, right?
SPEAKER_00 (07:48):
Yeah, for sure.
So, which kind of brings me tothe next question of just like
the path and the people, likebecause I think if we all look,
right, there's places where Godis showing up, whether you've
ever even acknowledged it as Godor not.
Yep.
SPEAKER_01 (08:07):
Yeah, I I really want, I'm gonna help you, and I
think you would you would agreewith this to help those who are
just you got this nudge.
And I remember the donut man.
You remember the donut man?
No, he he was a guy that wasprobably when I was growing up,
or maybe when I was firstmarried, but he did have a
Bible, you know, kind of a Biblekids' show.
He was called the Donut Man.
And what he said was there's ahole in everybody's heart, your
(08:31):
donut.
And you're never gonna find itin all the things of the world
until you fill it with Jesus,right?
And so he was the donut man.
That's why they called itbecause you it was you need to
fill the donut in the hole.
So so anyway, my path was I lovethat it was yeah, it's a great
one.
But 16, so I had no mentors likeyou, nobody filling in the gap,
(08:53):
nobody helping me understand,answer questions.
I just was really struggling.
So I'll just say I went throughall the typical stuff you would
go through as a high school,high schooler.
Um, my motives, I was I quitfootball because I couldn't have
my way.
So I got into theater and I knewI loved theater because it was
all about me.
And I could be on the stage andI got all the attention.
(09:13):
And I was, I uh I was I was theman, and I had like six or seven
different leads.
I I won Best Actor, my first,uh, I think it was my uh senior
year in high school.
I was in the RenaissanceFestival, I was in a show every
minute of my life from mysophomore year high school till
my second year of college.
(09:34):
And I just was reallystruggling.
And uh I was a very carnalChristian.
I believed and I wanted to, Iwanted to go deeper, but I just
hadn't know I didn't know how todo it until I met my wife.
My wife was the first believer Imet her in college in my second
year, and again, I was gonna goand make it big in in Hollywood,
and I was gonna go off and dowhatever I had to do to you know
(09:57):
get into the shows in thelimelight.
And then my wife was the firstreal Christian I met.
Now, isn't that kind of it'sgreat, but it's sad.
Someone who actually So what isthat?
SPEAKER_00 (10:08):
I was gonna say, what does that mean?
D?
Because I think Christian,Christian also just scares
people away, right?
SPEAKER_01 (10:16):
Jimmy Winship says it's a club, it's just the name
of another name of a gang.
Name of a gang, right?
And so that's exactly what itwas.
It it it meant the wordChristian meant a hundred
different things to a hundreddifferent people.
SPEAKER_00 (10:29):
Yes, it repels people.
SPEAKER_01 (10:32):
Oh, yeah, and because we all have this history
and we all have theseexperiences that turned us off.
And so we frankly we use that asan excuse to not get to know
Jesus.
SPEAKER_00 (10:41):
And it keeps us from like the thing that we're all
really wanting.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (10:46):
So I'll give you an example of what she was like.
So I told a lot of little whitelies.
I was a liar.
I was a liar, let's just say Itold a lot of fibs just to get
what I wanted.
And when I would be on a phonecall, and my and my girlfriend
Pam, she's my wife now, wassitting by me, and she'd hear me
say, Oh, I can't, I can't go outthere tonight.
I got this going on, and I'dhang up and she'd go, You just
(11:09):
lied.
I said, Well, what do you mean?
She goes, Well, you just toldthat person that you couldn't go
and you really could go becauseyou know you're you're going out
with me.
And I went, Why does no one hurttheir feelings?
And she goes, That's lying.
That's not being and she calledme on stuff like that.
SPEAKER_00 (11:28):
And I went, I love Pam.
SPEAKER_01 (11:31):
Everybody loves Pam, okay?
Everybody loves Pam.
Because that's she, I'm tellingyou, 40.
See, we dated for three years,married for we're gonna be 43
this week.
43, so we've known each other 46years.
She's my my first favoritecoach, okay?
She tells me the truth in anhonoring way.
She's just that way.
(11:52):
So she was the first time I'dever seen a real Christian in
the way she showed up.
Ah, like she live was livinghonest integrity, calling me on
stuff.
And so about three months afterI met her.
No, actually, when I met her, doyou want to hear that one?
This is a this everything is agod thing.
So I'm in theater, I'm in myfirst show, I get the lead in my
(12:12):
first show.
And so I'm riding back and forthto school with Pam's roommate.
And she keeps telling me, Yougotta meet my roommate.
I think you guys would getalong.
I tried and tried to call andtried to call.
She was never there.
So I finally said to her, Look,why don't you guys just come to
the show?
You know, uh, I was doingcarousel, I was Billy Bigelow,
(12:34):
and I said, Why don't you cometo the show?
And afterwards, underneath thestage is this really cool
reception room, and you guys cancome down there and I can meet
her.
As soon as I saw her, they come,they go to the reception, I see
her.
God, I'm not telling you, I knowyou're gonna have to answer ask
me this question.
God said, That's the girl you'regonna marry.
Now, you know me, I don't doanything small.
(12:55):
So I had three guys who were Iwas in a barbershop quartet with
and they were all on the show.
So I went over to him and Isaid, You guys, I just met the
girl I'm gonna marry.
Can you just come and do twosongs, just two songs with me
for her?
So we sang Coney Island Baby andJonah the Whale, and that hooked
her.
SPEAKER_00 (13:15):
Oh go hold on, pause for I want to hit pause or
rewind on God said this is thegirl you're gonna marry.
So how does that happen forsomeone who's wondering or
trying to hear God in theirlife?
Like, what did that how doesthat occur for you?
(13:36):
Because it's different foreverybody, right?
SPEAKER_01 (13:38):
So, you know when you tell somebody what does your
gut feel?
What did your gut say?
What is that little voice inyour head telling you that you
are ignoring?
I had been ignoring God's voicefor many years, and all of a
sudden, he I'm not kidding you,it wasn't audible, but it was
audible in my head.
It was like that strong spiritof God.
(14:01):
I got a like a 30-secondanointing that said, This is the
one.
And then you know what happened30 days later.
The Lord said, You're quittingtheater.
SPEAKER_00 (14:17):
How did that go?
This is the small voice.
SPEAKER_01 (14:19):
I thought, okay, I'm done.
I heard the voice I cried.
I cried, that was my dream.
That was I was on the stage, andhe said, You're on the stage for
the wrong reason.
I want you, I'll don't worryabout it.
I will use your gifts, I willuse your talents to to do what
you do best, which is how youconnect with people.
But right now, you're not goingto California, uh, you're not
(14:43):
gonna be a theater major.
So I had to change my my major.
Like, because I was so I changedit to speechcom, and that's that
was a whole nother God thing.
Um, but so we went to school,and that's kind of how I'd say,
you know, when people say, Well,I heard God's voice, well, I was
reading the Bible and you whenyou read the Bible, God speaks
(15:07):
to you through the scripture.
See, I wasn't reading the Bible,so I didn't I didn't know how to
discern anything.
But when I started reading theBible, man, I started like
seeing my sin.
I started seeing things I wasdoing wrong, or seeing even the
little lies.
I call them white lies.
They weren't white lies, they'reall lies.
SPEAKER_00 (15:25):
So self-protection, right?
Or like, yeah, it all it getsdisguised as protecting others
or protecting yourself orprotecting your image or yeah,
exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (15:35):
It's protect it's all pride, it's all about me.
Um, and the Lord says it's notabout you, it's about me.
So I'm gonna get rid of all theyou stuff, and I'm gonna this is
gonna be a journey for you.
So that was really the firsttime I really I mean, I heard
God all the way, but I justignored it.
(15:55):
And I knew what was right and Iknew what was wrong, but I just
ignored it.
And I said, I'm just gonna dowhat I want to do.
SPEAKER_00 (16:02):
So did you ignore it, or was it a process of
learning like that you werehearing from God?
Or a little bit of both?
SPEAKER_01 (16:12):
A little bit of both, I would say, because once
I got married, so I got married,now this was really wild.
My dad had a heart attack a weekbefore my wedding.
And I was in training and I wasgonna be married like on a
Friday, the 29th of October,1982, and then I was I was gonna
get shipped off to uh uh to anairline.
I always wanted to work for theairline.
(16:32):
I got a job, I was gonnagraduate on Friday, but I was
gonna have to be shipped toChicago.
We were gonna go move toChicago.
Well, my dad had a heart attack,and he had quadruple heart
bypass on the day of my wedding.
unknown (16:44):
Wow.
SPEAKER_01 (16:45):
So I dropped my mom off at the hospital on Friday
morning, I went and finished myschool, graduated, you know, got
got done with the training, wentand picked up my tux, went and
picked up my mom, went to thechurch and got married that
night.
Um, and I had to make adecision.
Here you go.
This is all kind of crammed inin a couple years.
I had to make a decision.
What am I gonna do?
My mom is a nervous wreck, mydad's gonna be in the hospital
(17:08):
for three months, and I gottaleave on Monday.
So Pam and I talked, we prayedtogether, we prayed over the
week and we said, Lord, I kindof knew the answer, but I didn't
want to do it.
He said, quit.
I went to I went to the airlineand I said, Look, my dad's in
surgery.
My dad's gonna be laid up.
(17:29):
Can I can you just can I stayhere in Minneapolis?
Nope.
You either go or you quit.
I said, Well, well, can you holdout to go to Chicago?
Like, can you give me a week ortwo and then then I'll go to
Chicago?
I just got married.
And they go, Nope.
So that's what I was saying.
We we we prayed over the weekendand we both came to the same
conclusion.
And by the way, for those of youwho are married, you know the
(17:51):
Lord's at work when you're bothusually on the same page about
the right thing to do.
And um, so I quit and I trustedthe Lord.
I had no job, my wife didn'thave a job, so we lived with my
parents for three months.
SPEAKER_00 (18:05):
Wow.
SPEAKER_01 (18:05):
Or my mom actually helping my mom out to kind of
help her till she could kind ofease back into life because she
was just kind of thrown for aloop on this one.
So, so yeah, and then that ledto then my wife and I we really
talked about okay, how do wewant to do, how do we want to be
married?
We want to be marrieddifferently.
We don't have any good mentors,you know.
(18:27):
Both of our parents now weredivorced after 25 years, and was
it was sad.
Um and we didn't, we were justwe had nobody.
So I started reading like acrazy man.
I started going to Biblestudies, I started my Pam and I
got involved.
Um you know who my mentors were?
(18:48):
Dr.
James Dobson, Dr.
Gary Smalley, uh writing thisdown, it was um Howard
Hendricks, right?
Um some of these guys, uh JackHayford, um amazing men of God
that I listened to on the radio.
I listened to on Focus on theFamily.
(19:09):
I listened to it, didn't havepodcasts back then.
I went to Dad the FamilyShepherd, for those of you who
remember that that that thingfrom way back.
I went to Promise Keeper stuff.
But yeah, I know.
Look, every some people mighthave different opinions about
some of these things, theseorganizations, but some of the
men there were some of the mostgodly men and they knew exactly
what they were talking aboutabout marriage and family.
(19:30):
So I listened and Pim and Isaid, We're gonna be
intentional.
And we did a family contract,and I got that idea from Dr.
Gary Smalley in a book calledKey to Your Child's Heart, which
is one of the best books I everread about family parenting and
marriage.
And uh those guys were mymentors.
And I just I did followed thebook with the scripture.
(19:50):
I read scripture, I was gettinginto the word.
Um, and by the way, some uh youknow, I've asked people, hey, so
how are you with Jesus?
Where are you with Jesus?
Well, you know, we're good.
I said, Well, what does goodmean?
What does good look like?
How often are you in the word?
You know, I pray and I Iworship.
Do you read the word?
Oh, you know.
(20:13):
Oh, one to two days of you know,for about five, ten minutes.
No.
It doesn't work.
So your worship and your prayeris infused by the word of God,
right?
And if you read the scriptures,it will reveal truth to you, and
then you'll start to hear Godspeaking to you through the
scriptures about what the rightthing is to do, about how to
(20:33):
trust him, how to take risks.
SPEAKER_00 (20:35):
Well, in my experience, it's been like you
you can confirm what you'rehearing with what's in the
scripture, right?
That's sometimes how I validate,like, oh, that is I am hearing
from God, and that is validatedin the word.
SPEAKER_01 (20:49):
And so it's a two-edged sword, right?
It's a two-edged sword.
And you know, by the way, whenGod so convicted me about lying
that um that was the heart thatwas the strongest punishment you
could get in our family if youviolated uh what you agreed to
in the family contract, then yougot the most severe punishment
(21:11):
for lying to us.
SPEAKER_00 (21:13):
Wow.
SPEAKER_01 (21:14):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (21:14):
So that's powerful.
SPEAKER_01 (21:18):
So that's the yeah.
What about you?
Well, because you said youdidn't have any, you didn't have
kind of like what I didn't have,right?
SPEAKER_00 (21:28):
Yeah, I didn't have the influences.
And it, you know, like allthrough grade school, I went to
church on my own.
And um, and then when I got tohigh school too, like I started,
you know, veering on thatself-path and and got distracted
from God.
And then after high school, Iwas I went to college and I was
(21:49):
married young, like 23, and notlike we we got married, and then
I like if I look back, I didthis Bible study um a lot of
years ago, but she had you goback through your life and make
a like a map of where God showedup all the years, like where
(22:13):
there were people that showed upin your life that reminded you,
like, or invited you to church.
And like I made that map and Iwas like floored that there was
I I often lived next to somebodythat like would invite me to
church or like two differentplaces I lived.
I had people just neighbors whoinvited me to church, like just
(22:33):
those little reminders, likewherever I was, you know,
somebody I work with, or God wasalways trying to bring me back
in.
And I like in my 20s, I I kindof studied other things too.
You know, I looked at otherreligions and um, you know, kind
of did some exploring.
And I think that is all reallynatural, right?
(22:55):
Like for us to grapple with it.
And I I struggled so much withso many Christian things and
church things and religionthings that just didn't sit
right with me.
But what I could never ever everever deny was my experience of
God.
Like I just I've had experiencesover and over and over and over
(23:16):
again.
And like you were saying, as youstart to find the way that God,
and I think He He intimatelyspeaks to each of us um so
precisely in a way that we willhear or we will see or we will
resonate, you know?
And um like as as as you payattention to that, it just gets
(23:40):
more vivid, right?
Um, and then reading the Bible.
You were talking about readingthe Bible, like I'd never read
the Bible, like all those yearsthat I went to church and I
didn't read the Bible till umgosh, I was in my late 40s
probably.
Um, and I that was at a time inmy life where a coach had called
(24:02):
me out.
I said I wanted to create thisgreat marriage, and he had me
track my time, and I realizedthat my husband was getting the
breadcrumbs of my time, and sowas God.
And I made a pivot in my life tostart every day first with God
and then with my husband, evenif it's just a few minutes.
(24:23):
And I started reading the Bible,and I I didn't understand the
first time I went through theBible, I didn't understand what
I was reading, but God startedworking more powerfully in my
life.
Like that's when my life reallystarted to change.
SPEAKER_01 (24:38):
Um key what kind of what motivated you to get into
the word, you think?
SPEAKER_00 (24:46):
I don't know if I remember.
I just it was that like I wannaI want to put God first and I'm
gonna start my day every daywith God.
And so I just I started with theBible.
I don't really remember why,like if there was a nudge around
that or why, but I just thought,oh, I do know why.
Because Quentin, my husband, hadread the Bible and he wasn't a
(25:08):
believer when we got married,and I was worried about that.
But at one some point, like wetook the boys to church in
vacation Bible school, and atsome point he, you know, he
changed his life.
And um he started reading beforeyou did.
He started he read he read theBible before I did, and that
(25:28):
inspired me.
I'm like, yeah, I need to dothat.
Like it's so crazy that we canbe believers and have never read
the Bible.
SPEAKER_01 (25:36):
Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (25:36):
And that that has changed everything for me
because all those those missinglinks with Christian and
Christianity and religion thatwere rubbing me wrong, the Bible
is not what I thought it was.
Like what the message Jesusbrought is what we're all
seeking, but it's all distortedby religion and Christianity in
(25:59):
in many places.
SPEAKER_01 (26:01):
The religion versus be having a personal
relationship.
That's the one thing I learnedis the whole difference between
Christianity and all the otherfaiths.
I will say is that the HolySpirit, I mean, it's amazing.
I can't even get my head wrappedaround this whole Trinity thing
sometimes.
I still struggle with that, butI get it that the Holy Spirit,
(26:22):
the creator of the universe,lives inside of us.
Yes, squelch it all the time.
And then the Bible justunleashes it and and un it shows
truth, and it's for correctionand reproof and right and
training.
SPEAKER_00 (26:36):
So very cool.
Yes, and it's like everything iseverything is upside down and
what we've been told and taught.
And I I think it's intentionalto keep us away from the truth
and the the kingdom, right?
Like I never knew the kingdomwas for now that we can live in
this kingdom now and feel allexperience all of that now and
(26:58):
for eternity.
Like I never understood that.
SPEAKER_01 (27:01):
Yeah, but that's really, really cool.
So then you so then he startedreading, you started reading,
you guys started going tochurch, and then did he become
then did he give his life beforeyou then?
SPEAKER_00 (27:13):
No, no, no.
I I gave my life back when I wasat Bible camp, like you.
Okay, like we had Bible study,and I took my Bible by the
river, and like I asked Jesusinto my heart, but then I had to
do it over and over again.
SPEAKER_01 (27:27):
Get a refresh.
SPEAKER_00 (27:29):
We both had a refresh straight away.
SPEAKER_01 (27:31):
Praise God for that, right?
A lot of grace and mercy along.
SPEAKER_00 (27:34):
Oh my gosh, yes.
This is a journey and a process,and it's okay to grapple, and
yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (27:41):
Wow, amazing.
You and I got married at 23.
We got married at 23 too.
So a lot of similarities.
Our whole story is kind ofaligned.
SPEAKER_00 (27:49):
Well, but my story broke.
I got married and then divorcedand then found my husband today.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (27:56):
So how long have you guys been married now?
SPEAKER_00 (27:59):
Almost 25.
SPEAKER_01 (28:00):
Wow, congratulations.
SPEAKER_00 (28:02):
Nothing said, that's awesome.
43 and 25.
Yes.
So good.
Um, so was there a low point inyour faith where God showed up?
Lots of low points, right?
SPEAKER_01 (28:17):
Yeah, a lot of low points, but this is the cool two
steps forward, one step back,right?
I mean, that's what God, if youthink about the disciples, I
love this story about how JamieWinship paints, he was always
leveling them up.
What do I mean by that?
Right?
SPEAKER_00 (28:32):
Yeah, I was just gonna say Jamie Winship wrote
the book uh Living Fearless,which Bob and I have both read
and deeply adore.
So just wanted to share that.
SPEAKER_01 (28:40):
Yep, no royalties being painted to these two
people on the podcast.
Uh here, just telling mestraight up some
recommendations.
You want to go deep with theLord, and it's all pretty much
based in fear, and that's what'sgetting in your way.
Read his book.
He's helped me a ton.
But I love how when he talksabout, he just didn't go from
(29:01):
you know, over three years like,hey, I'm Jesus, okay, I'm dying.
No, I'm gonna be on the cross.
I know you're not gonna get it,it's gonna take you a while.
He was training, sharing theword, uh, speaking the word,
serving, healing, performingmiracles.
It was the whole three-yearjourney.
They were constantly growing,one one or two steps forward,
(29:22):
one step back, right?
Because they'd all screw up.
They were all just men and womenlike us.
And so Jesus is always levelingus up, and we may not see the
big picture for 10, 15, 20 yearsaround why he's doing what he's
doing right now in us, and wehave to go through some of that
stuff.
So true.
SPEAKER_00 (29:38):
It's so true.
SPEAKER_01 (29:39):
A lot of refining and process and anger and I
would character building and youknow, pouting and c and anger
towards him, and justfrustrated.
I um I would say that there wasone spot, one place in my life
when Pam and I were firstmarried, and I didn't get what I
(29:59):
wanted.
And I kind of told a f ahalf-truth, which is a lie, to
get me where I wanted to be.
And the n probably not followedthe scripture on that one.
Somebody gave up their positionso I could go in their stead and
(30:21):
and get back to where I reallywanted to be, and that's why I
was trying to fudge a little bitto get there.
And then I just cried like ababy because he humbled me and
said he just would have waited24 hours, told the truth, and
just stuck it with me.
But I wanted the plan, I wantedit all laid out, and Jesus
doesn't work that way.
(30:42):
You know, look what he said toJacob.
Jacob, get up, go.
Um, yes, you're right in leavingLaban, but I'm not telling you
exactly what's going on.
He didn't know he had Esau, hehad to face.
He didn't know that Laban wasgonna follow him, and now he's
got you know enemies behind himand potential enemies in the
front of him, and he's like,what am I gonna do here?
He just trusted the Lord and hehad faith and he knew that he
(31:04):
trusted Jesus.
He had been on this long journeytoo.
If you look back at his history,he lied to his father, he lied
to his brother, he connived, hemanipulated to get his way.
But then he grew along this wayon this journey to the place
where he he did follow the Lordand and take the step that the
that God had confirmed in him toleave and go forward, and he
(31:24):
healed both of thoserelationships.
SPEAKER_00 (31:28):
So you know, something that I have been like
sitting with is like, you know,we have more self-help stuff,
you know, the bookshelves arefull of books, like we have more
resources at our hands than everbefore.
And I've just been like, thisquestion has been on my heart is
like, is self-help helping?
(31:50):
And it's not.
Like if you look at the state ofmental health, yeah, and as
you're talking about the Bibleright now, like I think the what
the Bible has shown me is thatthe world says we need
self-help.
The Bible tells us we needself-discipline and actually
teaches you like what that isand what that looks like.
(32:13):
And I feel like that's whatpeople are hungry for.
SPEAKER_01 (32:17):
Oh hungry, you know, lonely, depressed.
They've tried everything, youknow.
I think Tom Brady said, he said,is this all there is?
SPEAKER_00 (32:25):
I know.
I have so many people around methat I feel like are in that
place.
SPEAKER_01 (32:30):
Yeah, is this all there is to life?
This is the pinnacle, then Idon't doesn't, if it is, it's
like doesn't feel so good.
SPEAKER_00 (32:35):
That's just the essence of what he said.
SPEAKER_01 (32:37):
You know, and we've got you know friends who've said
the same thing to us.
SPEAKER_00 (32:41):
Yeah, and the other thing that popped in my head as
you were talking was um, youknow, hearing God and like
learning to hear God.
Because I I know that noteverybody hears God or
recognizes that they're hearingGod more accurately.
But one of the ways that I hearGod is like it's it is that that
(33:05):
it is like a voice, it's notaudible, but it it feels like
you hear it in your head, orsometimes it can be like words,
but it's it's not what I wouldthink.
It's not what how I would speak.
And when you are in the word,you it often does show up like
the word, right?
But it's it's different, itstands out.
(33:27):
And if you start payingattention, or it calls you to
show up in a way that you scaresthe daylights out of you, but
you know is right, right?
SPEAKER_01 (33:37):
Yeah, it's like Rob Ketterling at our one of the
churches we've attended in thepast.
He said, follow the prompt.
We have so many prompts weignore.
SPEAKER_00 (33:45):
Prompts.
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (33:46):
I was in a, you know, I you know me, I've always
had a strong grip on money.
And so I've been working on thatfor a very long time.
And so we were in a coffee shopa couple days ago.
Uh I was with a meeting with afriend, and uh, there's a older
um uh couple of ladies, and onepaid for her thing and she moved
(34:06):
on, and then the woman in frontof me, she went to pay and they
don't take cash, and she didn'thave, you know, she didn't have
her credit card.
And immediately, you know, itreally wasn't out of guilt.
It was like, you have a creditcard, you pay for it.
And no, I don't went at first.
I went, yeah.
Now, even three or four monthsago, three or four years ago, I
(34:26):
would have said, why?
But I followed the prompt.
I didn't even have to hey, letme take care of this person's
bill.
She goes, No, you don't.
I said, I want to.
Don't worry about it.
I I I had a prompt.
I need it, I need to pay for youand take care of it.
Now you can go and enjoy yourtime with your friend.
SPEAKER_00 (34:47):
That's the best.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (34:49):
So yesterday she said, she said, she goes, Don't
worry, I'll pay it for it.
I said, I'm not worried.
I'm not worried at all.
SPEAKER_00 (34:56):
So I love that.
Yes.
Follow the prompts.
Listen for the prompts, justexperiment with them.
SPEAKER_01 (35:04):
That's right.
That's right.
Yeah.
It's just amazing.
Like you said, Carla, I love it.
The word, being in the word, youknow, um, one of my life verses
here, I'll just say, is uh Acts15, 19, which is therefore it is
my judgment that we should nottrouble those of the Gentiles
who are turning to God.
We, me, I should never be animpediment to someone coming to
(35:28):
faith.
Because when I say I'm abeliever, they're watching me.
We are now under a microscope.
They're watching everything.
It's just like leadership.
By the way, you know, that's whyyou and I do leadership
development.
Is it's a it's a Jesusprinciple.
Love the Lord your God and thenlove others.
I mean, that's what servantleadership is all about.
(35:49):
Love others, you know.
We read that book, um, the goal,the the goal giver and um some
other ones that just talk aboutserve your your butt off is
pretty much what it is.
Go love people.
Jesus said, Love me and lovepeople, and that's the bottom
line, pretty much.
SPEAKER_00 (36:04):
And you'll be so blessed by it.
SPEAKER_01 (36:07):
Yeah, be blessed by it, because and blessed doesn't
mean you're gonna get moremoney.
There's there's so manydifferent meanings of blessing,
blessing in your spirit, comfortand peace in your soul.
We just are in a world right nowwhere there's just very little
or no peace anywhere.
Yeah, and Jesus does thatfreely.
SPEAKER_00 (36:27):
So yeah, it's so powerful.
Prompts and in prayer.
Like when you were saying that,I had the coolest thing happen.
So we are you okay on time, Bob?
SPEAKER_01 (36:36):
Um, good.
SPEAKER_00 (36:37):
We go okay.
SPEAKER_01 (36:38):
You know, you and we can talk about Jesus forever,
but I know we don't try boringeverybody else to death, but
we're having a blast.
SPEAKER_00 (36:45):
Um, I I have this little coffee shop that I can
walk to from my house.
And I've been going for a numberof months now, and there's a
girl there that works there thatis just an absolute joy and
delight.
And she is a believer.
She and I have talked about it,and they host young people there
on Friday nights and all ofthat.
So I built this friendship withher, just going in and getting
(37:08):
coffee.
And all of a sudden she wasn'tthere and she wasn't there and
she wasn't there.
And I went at different times ofthe day to find her, and like it
was just on my heart, likesomething had happened,
something was wrong.
And I kept coming home to myhusband, like, Brennan's still
not there.
And um one day I came back and Ishared that with my husband, and
(37:28):
then I prayed, and I don't knowwhy I prayed this, but I said,
God help me find Brennan,because I don't know.
I just felt like I needed tofind her.
And literally the very nextmorning, I walk into my Pilates
class, which is also across thestreet, that I've been going to
for six months.
I've never seen her there ever.
(37:48):
I walk in and I didn't even seeher during class.
At the end of class, the teacherwent up and was talking to
somebody, and I just kind ofglanced over and I and I was
like, is that her?
Like she didn't even lookherself.
She didn't have her light, shejust didn't have the joy that
she normally has.
And I walked up and I'm like,Brenna, and I just embraced her
in a hug.
(38:08):
And I'm like, I literally prayedto God that I would find who
would help me find you.
And here you are, first thing inthe morning, right there.
So long story short, we went andmade it coffee date and um have
just been talking about Godtogether and like reuniting, and
we're connected for some reasonthat I don't understand, right?
(38:29):
But that's how you and Iconnected too, Bob.
SPEAKER_01 (38:33):
Like look, when you're when you read the word,
you know that these things youcan't explain some of these
things that go on wanting to getyour attention.
Do you want me to do you want meto share the story of the
colour?
SPEAKER_00 (38:45):
Yeah, sure.
So we can close full circlehere.
SPEAKER_01 (38:49):
So I was in the thralls of trying to figure out
where I go next in my life, andI kind of knew that I was gonna
probably be ending my term at mycurrent employer, but I didn't
know what to do.
It really scared me.
So I started getting on somecalls and some webinars and
things like that.
So I was on this webinar and Iheard this young lady ask
amazing questions.
(39:10):
I'm like, those are she must bea really good coach.
Anyone who asks those questionsis a really good coach.
So I think I I reached out toyou and I said, Hey, I'd love to
just kind of connect with youand just kind of get a sense.
I'm looking for a coach.
And I heard you on the on thewebinar.
Would you be willing to get toconnect?
(39:31):
And you said yes.
And then we got to go.
But you referenced, but youreferenced okay, you're gonna
show you that.
I really love the questions thatyou were asking on the pot on
the uh webinar.
And you said, Oh Bob, those arereally good questions, but I
don't think that was me.
SPEAKER_00 (39:48):
I said, but we carried on anyway.
SPEAKER_01 (39:51):
Let's get together anyway, is what we did.
So there you go.
That's how God works inmysterious ways, he works in
unbelievable ways, but he neversaid he was gonna lay out the
plan for every little problemthat we have.
SPEAKER_00 (40:03):
I know.
SPEAKER_01 (40:04):
He never told anybody in the scripture.
You find it where he said, hejust said, Go, go, follow me,
trust me, I'll provide for you,I'll give you the manna, you
know, I'll give you, I'll feedit, feed you through the birds,
and and you just trust me daily,day by day.
SPEAKER_00 (40:17):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (40:18):
Seek me first in his kingdom, and then all these
things will be added unto you,right?
SPEAKER_00 (40:23):
So good.
Okay, last question.
Okay kudos to Susie Larson Livebecause she asks this question
on her podcast that you and Iboth Thank you Susie, I listen
to you too.
SPEAKER_01 (40:34):
We love you.
SPEAKER_00 (40:36):
Um, what's God been impressing on your heart lately,
Bob?
SPEAKER_01 (40:41):
This is such a good one.
SPEAKER_00 (40:42):
I know.
Um and this is for you too,listener.
Like, what's God been impressingon your heart?
Just take a look around.
SPEAKER_01 (40:50):
You know, you know what, you would never just buy a
car and just run it for 10 yearswithout doing anything to it.
You need to refresh it.
You need to change the oil, youneed to check the tires, you
need to get a tune-up.
I needed a tune-up, and I Ineeded it in a bad way, and I
was just kind of in a heavyplace recently.
(41:11):
And Pam and I went on a mission,a marriage mission, our like our
vision retreat we do now.
We've been doing like for fouryears or five years now.
We just talk about our marriage.
What's missing, what's working,what's not, what do we need to
be doing, where do we want togo?
What's kind of our vision?
What's God calling us to do?
And on this one, you know whathe said?
I want you to remember why youwhat you committed to me when
(41:32):
you first got married.
SPEAKER_00 (41:33):
Oh and he said who who was gonna be at the center
of your life?
SPEAKER_01 (41:40):
Well, you were Lord.
And what was gonna be yourministry?
My family and my friends.
Okay, great.
I want you to go, I want you topull back from some leadership
roles you've been taking on thathave been frankly pulling you
away from that ministry.
And so I did.
And I said no to a couple thingsthat I had been involved with
(42:00):
for a very long time, and bothPam and I were on the same page
and we're going, remember.
This is like look, look up theword remember in the Bible how
many times the Lord says,Remember what I did for you.
Go back and look for I'veprovided for you.
I have never, I've neverforsaken you.
I've loved you the whole time.
And you will be, you will beblessed.
Doesn't mean financially, butyou will be blessed.
And so I stepped back, and Pamand I have just recommitted
(42:24):
ourselves to ministering to ourkids, our grandkids, the friends
around us.
Um, I was not a generous person,by the way.
I'll just quote it here.
When I met my wife, she was waythere's another thing she taught
me.
She would give everything awayif she could.
She would overgive.
And I'm like, no, that's ours.
(42:44):
That's mine.
I worked hard for that.
And slowly but surely, God hasreally changed me in terms of
giving more, being a giver,being a servant, you know, me
helping other person succeed inmy in my business here.
And the one way she knew that Iwas really generous was I um
this weekend, now normally whenshe's gone for four days, I kind
(43:07):
of take me time.
But this time I took, I thoughtabout who, who, Lord, who can I
just who do I need?
Who do you who needs ourrelationship?
I spent time with a couple offriends who are just they're
looking.
I had a guy friend who said, Idon't have any guy friends, Bob,
and I really like this guy.
I said, How could you not haveany guy friends?
And so, and then another guy whojust I just love him to death.
(43:30):
We spent some time.
We went out, I know maybe thisisn't good, but we went to the
shooting range.
It was really a blast.
We hadn't really went through atough time.
And then um, my wife said, Itreally came home to me.
All the stuff you did, I cleanedthe house, I did the shower, I
made some bread so she didn'thave to cook for my birthday uh
when she got home from beingwith our grandkids in
homeschooling.
(43:51):
Um, I said, uh uh I'm trying tothink, what could I do?
What could I do that wouldreally help her out when she
gets home?
So I just I worked.
She's her her love language isworks, you know.
Um, and so I scrubbed the showerlike four times and I was
couldn't get it clean, and Ijust kept at it.
Um I baked the pie because sheknows I love pumpkin pie and I
(44:14):
was gonna have that for mybirthday.
So I baked it so she didn't haveto do it when she came home
because I knew she was gonna betired.
Um and so I just did some and Ijust wanted to do it.
And I wasn't trying to getaccolades, I just wanted to do
it because she's taught me howto think differently now, and
the Lord's used her to teach mehow to be more generous.
SPEAKER_00 (44:32):
So cool.
And you literally experienceheart change.
SPEAKER_01 (44:35):
Yep, yep, heart change, big time.
And then this was the I'm sorry,now the other one I was gonna
share is I love, you know, Ilove our time together.
And so we watch our grandson oneday a week.
And so, but I protect our timebecause it's really important
for our marriage.
And so this time, I know mydaughter had to get up early,
and Saint, our grandboy, he's 14months, was gonna be at church
(44:56):
for like six or seven hours.
Well, she's in ministry, soshe's at the church and her
husband's at the church andthey're in ministry.
And I just I didn't even thinktwice.
I said, honey, hey, uh, I'mgoing to pick up my mom.
I'm going to pick up momtomorrow at the airport at 7:30.
What if I just come out and pickup Saint and we'll just take him
until you guys get home at like1 or 1.30?
Dad, that would be awesome.
(45:18):
Well, that made my wife's heartsink.
Right?
She said, I gotta tell you, Igotta tell you, when you said
that and you didn't even flinch,I just loved that so much.
If you offered that and didn'teven like complain or whine
about it, you just did it.
And that's how Jesus transformsus.
(45:39):
He changes um whatever is true,whatever is noble, whatever is
right, whatever is pure,whatever is lovely, whatever is
admirable.
If anything is like these, thinkabout these things, right?
If anything's excellent forJesus are thinking, just changes
and transforms, transforms ourmind.
So that's that's how I wouldanswer that question is God has
changed me, but through the wordand through others, through you,
(46:01):
and through my experience andthrough my journey, and that's
how he's a personal Lord.
SPEAKER_00 (46:05):
Yeah, it is so personal, so personal.
How about you?
SPEAKER_01 (46:09):
How about you?
SPEAKER_00 (46:10):
Yeah, well, I mean, this will just kind of you know
represent that, like howpersonal it is.
So, what God has been impressingon my heart lately is I
literally woke up one night andjust kind of that same kind of
hearing, right?
He said, When you are rested andrelaxed, I can move mountains.
(46:32):
And like that one is just hejust keeps reminding me.
And so I've just been working atbeing a good steward of my time
and sleep and energy so that Ican be a vessel for whatever it
is he's calling me to do today.
So that's really cool.
SPEAKER_01 (46:50):
That's really cool.
SPEAKER_00 (46:51):
So good, Bob.
Thank you for just having thisconversation.
I want to have more of thesebecause I just can't um I
realize like I just can't notshare it anymore because people
are seeking it and need it, andit's just such a huge part of my
life.
SPEAKER_01 (47:12):
Yeah, maybe our third one will be how do we live
that out in our work?
Right?
Yeah.
And I think you did.
We were gonna, did you want toshare a tool with somebody here?
SPEAKER_00 (47:21):
With the Oh, yeah, share that tool because that
kind of inspired thisconversation actually.
SPEAKER_01 (47:26):
It did.
Um, we've used a really cooltool.
It's for great for small groups,great for each other, great for
marriage mentoring, great formarriages, period.
You guys can do this as coaches.
SPEAKER_00 (47:34):
Great for deep conversations, deep
conversations, family andfriends.
SPEAKER_01 (47:37):
We're gonna share with you the life map worksheet.
And it's divvied up by heritage,heroes, high points of God, hard
times, and the hand of God.
And you just in very narrow,very short space to fill it in
because you got to be concise.
SPEAKER_00 (47:55):
Nobody wants to hear, like, you know, three
hours all the story at the sametime.
SPEAKER_01 (47:59):
Maybe they want to hear three hours, but not just
at the same time.
So it's kind of a great way tokind of even write this out, map
it out, and share it with eachother.
SPEAKER_00 (48:09):
Especially as comments.
SPEAKER_01 (48:13):
Yep, yep.
We've used this many, manytimes.
Um, and you you've askedquestions on the podcast that
are around some of thesequestions.
You did it today.
And I just think it's a greatway to go beneath the surface
with with others, because that'swhat God asking us to do is
stop, stop staying on thesurface.
Go go deep with the Lord.
SPEAKER_00 (48:30):
Yeah, let's talk about the real, real things that
we're all seeking.
That's yeah, so much bigger thanthis, just this physical
experience that we're having.
You know, we're I we were justreading this.
It's like we are not um, oh, howdoes it go?
We are not human beings having aspiritual experience, we're
(48:52):
spiritual beings having a humanexperience.
SPEAKER_01 (48:54):
Oh my gosh, that's so good.
That's so good.
You're gonna have to put thatquote in your in your note
because everybody's gonna wantthat one.
SPEAKER_00 (49:01):
So good.
Thank you, Bob.
Thank you for theseconversations.
I just value these so much.
SPEAKER_01 (49:07):
Me too.
Thanks a lot.
SPEAKER_00 (49:09):
Okay, have an amazing day, everybody.
SPEAKER_01 (49:12):
Bye.
SPEAKER_00 (49:16):
Hey, thanks for listening all the way to the
end.
Before you move on with yourday, pause and capture one
thought or takeaway that stoodout to you.
Write it down so it doesn't getlost in the noise.
And if you're ready to godeeper, come join me in my free
monthly class, conversation, andguided writing to help you see
(49:38):
things differently and moveforward with clarity.
Save your spot Carlareeves.comforward slash free class.
Popular Podcasts
Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang
Ding dong! Join your culture consultants, Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang, on an unforgettable journey into the beating heart of CULTURE. Alongside sizzling special guests, they GET INTO the hottest pop-culture moments of the day and the formative cultural experiences that turned them into Culturistas. Produced by the Big Money Players Network and iHeartRadio.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.