December 24, 2024 • 51 mins
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Join us with our guest Pastors Bill and Lynne Themelaras as we center on the critical topic of strife in relationships, especially during the holiday season. It unpacks how managing conflict is essential for cultivating joy and harmony, urging listeners to shift their focus from blaming others to fostering personal growth and understanding.
• The holiday season often intensifies pre-existing stress and conflicts
• Strife acts as a blessing blocker, hindering personal and relational growth
• Effective communication is the cornerstone of healthy relationships
• Recognizing one's role in conflicts can lead to significant personal change
• Early morning quiet time can help maintain focus and peace
• Seeking counsel from impartial individuals can aid in navigating strife
• Transitioning from praying about your partner to praying for them is vital for relationship health
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
What's up everybody?
It's Pastors Jay and Tiffanyhere.
Welcome to the latest episodeof Dimensions.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (00:15):
We're so glad to be with y'all.
We got an exciting show foreach and every one of y'all
today.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
It is exciting.
But I have one thing you know,this is my thing that I do with
you.
Every time we're on TV or we dothis, I just want to know
where's your, where's yourChristmas stuff.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
Well, jesus, on the main line it's on what you want.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Where's your Christmas stuff?
Where's your Christmas gear?
You?
Speaker 1 (00:37):
know I just rock what I rock.
You know I wear white in theChristmas time, in the
wintertime.
I don't go by the color scheme,y'all, I do it all year round.
I do me.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
I do me boo.
Speaker 1 (00:47):
I do me boo.
That's how we roll y'all.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Okay.
Well, I'm excited to be here.
I'm jumping back in.
Speaker 1 (00:55):
Yes, you are.
We're so excited.
It's been a while, but we'regoing to be back with y'all
every we have a whole lot ofguests coming up.
We want to talk about thingsthat are important to you guys,
and we know that today we've gotsome great guests.
We're talking aboutrelationships and how to
navigate.
You know a lot of stress can behappening throughout the
holidays.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
It's stress, anger, bitterness, all that stuff.
You know, I heard it this waySomebody said that anger is one
or danger is one.
Letter away From anger, fromanger.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
Yeah, wow.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
Because when you get anger, I mean that stuff can get
dangerous.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Yeah, it can.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
Very quick.
I mean you go down a slipperyslope very quick with that.
Speaker 1 (01:33):
That's what I talk about.
Listen my wife.
I tell her she's cute, she'spetite, Don't get it twisted.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
Don't do it, don't get it twisted.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
She got a blade under that jacket.
Y'all she's packing heat.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
She's packing heat, y'all You're not supposed to let
that out of the bag.
No one's supposed to know that.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
But see, we're going to talk about all this now
because we're talking aboutrelationships and we'll probably
talk about it later.
You know how we do, but no, onthe real though, we want to talk
to you guys about relationshipmatters.
We've got a couple here thathas been just outstanding, just
really loves the Lord.
They've got two great churchesI don't even know everything
that they do, I mean, man, Idon't know how they keep up the
schedule that they got andthey're just great, a great man,
(02:13):
a great woman of God.
They pastor Oasis City Churchalong with Covenant Church of
Pittsburgh.
They've been with us onCornerstone talking about
relationships and we said listen, we need to do something on a
podcast as well, but listen,before I mention them, don't
forget to take a minute to like,subscribe, follow share stay
with us.
We're on iHeartRadio, Everywhereyou can get a podcast, I think
that we're available iTunes andyou'll be able to, if you like,
(02:35):
subscribe, follow and share.
You'll be able to keep up andbecome the latest family member
of the Dimensions family.
So we want you to join with us.
We've got a whole lot of guests.
We've got guests from all overthe world literally that are
going to be coming on and justdoing different types of
discussions and things, so we'rereal excited.
So, with no further ado, yougot something to mention.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
Well, I wanted to mention, first of all, I've
known this couple for a longtime.
Yes, For about 20, maybe 20something.
Something here I don't know, wecan they can correct me if I'm
wrong but they are an awesomecouple and I love you know, what
I love about them is not onlyare they authentic, but they are
unified.
Speaker 1 (03:11):
I love that, the unity that's between them, I
mean as a matter of fact, one ofthe really unique story the
first Sunday that when you and Iwere dating that I came to
covenant, they were being prayedout to launch the church Oasis
City Church in Columbus, ohio.
So they were leaving the exactsame.
What people don't realize, Iwent to Bible college in
Columbus Ohio.
So it was kind of like justneat how it all kind of got set
(03:33):
up, so remember they were upthere and you said this is Bill
and Lynn, they're getting ready.
They're like a son and daughterof the house and dah, dah, dah.
So I just would meet everybody.
I was just completely liketerrified to be there, cause I
was.
I'm trying to put on a goodfront.
You know what I mean, and makesure I'm holding it down and
make sure I'm looking good foryou, and uh, and then they were
being prayed out.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
They were being prayed out.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
So what was it?
Maybe 10 years later finallygot a chance to meet them, done
many things with them oncornerstone television, and then
they got the opportunity tocome back to Covenant in order
to pastor it.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
So talk about full circle.
Yeah right, yeah, so, and, butyeah, go do your thing.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
No, no, it's all good , it's all good.
So I'm going to bring to theplatform here Pastors Bill and
Lynn Thumalaris.
They're with us today.
Pastors Bill and Lynn, I'mgoing to bring you up here.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
So glad to have you guys.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
Yeah, we're really excited and honored again to be
with you, so it's great.
Well, I hope we gave you guys aformal introduction.
I know y'all wear manydifferent hats.
I know you do thereconciliation ministry as well.
You got a lot going on.
Is there anything I left?
Speaker 3 (04:35):
out.
Oh man, we do have three kids,yeah, and two dogs.
So that's, our kids are grownthough, young adults, all in
their young twenties.
But yeah, tiffany, it's, thisis our 20th year.
It was 20 years ago that we metCause.
This is our 20th year from whenwe met Sounds right.
Yeah, crazy, how much timeflies.
Speaker 4 (04:57):
And you don't look any different.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
You know what, see, that's why I love you, and you
know what I can can I cangenuinely say the same about
your.
Passion is not age you know,that is true I mean seriously,
she does, she just wouldn't sayanything there's some wrinkles,
(05:21):
there are they're there, they'rejust.
They're just season marks.
That's all.
That's what we call them.
That's all seasoning.
That's some wrinkles there are.
They're there.
They're just season marks.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
That's all.
That's what we call them.
That's all seasoning.
That's all seasoning.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
You just wrinkled some seasoning in there.
That's it, yes.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
Go ahead Pastor Bill.
Speaker 4 (05:36):
No, I'm just saying this.
No, he's getting ready to beinappropriate.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
This is dimensions.
Y'all, let's go, let's go.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
You know what will start pastor bill then he's
gonna start?
No, do we want to go down thatroad of inappropriateness?
Speaker 1 (05:53):
all right, probably too early for that listen,
there's the unfiltered me andthen there's a filtered me.
So be careful what you wish for, you just might get it.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
this isn is an after hours this is the nightcap.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
So yeah well listen, we're so glad to have you guys
and we figured no better coupleto bring on you guys.
I mean you guys have a lot ofstuff that you guys have walked
through, you've been through andyou're doing ministry together.
I don't think people understandthe warfare and things that
come along with what you'redoing.
So there's some things wereally want to get into with you
guys and want to ask you guys.
(06:29):
One of the things is dealingwith strife.
You know we're in the holidaysdealing with marriage, so many
different things that happen.
What do you guys do to keepstrife out of your home?
Because I believe that strifeis a killer.
It's a blessing blocker infamilies.
I believe there's a lot offamilies that aren't seeing what
they want to see happen becausethey don't keep the home life
(06:49):
apart from strife.
And I think there's adifference between strife and a
disagreement.
You can have disagreementsgoing on and working through
something, but not fall intostrife.
I feel strife is where not onlydo you have a disagreement, but
now you've opened the door towhere now I'm not reconciliatory
, I'm not looking to try toreach out, I'm not looking to
try to bridge the gap, I'm juststaying in my fence, and then
(07:11):
you just create this frictionand tension in your home.
That just, I believe, blocksthe blessing.
And what we've noticed is,whenever the devil tries to
bring strife into our world,there's a blessing on the other
side of it strife into our world, there's a blessing on the
other side of it, and so we havelearned to not only identify it
, put things in place and keepthat out of our life, and when
we do see it if we do happen tosee it to kill it immediately,
(07:34):
because there are blessings thatcome along with it.
So you guys feel free to speakto that.
But what do you guys do to dealwith strife when it hits your
world?
Speaker 4 (07:43):
Well, one of the first things, I'm going to jump
in here because you know I don'twant the preacher to start
preaching.
And then you know that's right,I get up earlier than everyone
else and I make sure that Ispend my quality time with
myself, right?
And get centered and ready forthe day, because life, I tell
(08:08):
people all the time life keepslifing all the time and I'm
already starting my morningrushed and hurried and anxious
to get things done.
I'm already putting myself in aposition to be easily irritated,
easily frustrated.
But if I get up early and I canhave that slow morning, I call
(08:31):
it my coffee date with Jesus.
Just take time before all thehustle and bustle begins.
I actually position myself toalready be protected against the
strife that the enemy does onceduring the day.
Speaker 3 (08:50):
Yeah, I think we set ourselves up for strife when we
allow the randomness of the dayto affect us in a negative
manner.
So when things are outside ofour control and something
happens, well then there's anopportunity to respond.
Okay, am I going to respondwith peace and patience and
(09:11):
prayer?
Okay, holy Spirit, I did notexpect this, but guess what?
He knew it was going to happen.
Surprise the Lord that thishappened today, or this
relationship situation happened,or this work thing happened, or
this kid thing happened, orthis financial thing happened.
But when we try to control asituation you know emotionally
(09:37):
and we kind of get all riled upin our even, in our spirit and
we're not at peace with havingthe mind of Christ like, okay, I
can get through this hurdle,this storm, this struggle, it's
an open door for strife, andit's not just in your marriage,
it's strife with your coworkers.
I mean something happens.
I mean those teenage years areno joke man, they are no joke.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
We didn't get there yet, so we're going to call you
two.
We're on the brink.
Speaker 4 (10:05):
I have a five-part episode on this.
Speaker 3 (10:09):
Well, we should do seven, one for every year, you
know.
But you have a relationship,you know you and your kids could
be doing so well.
I mean, you're talking,relationships are good, and then
something happens.
Speaker 4 (10:22):
The boyfriend shows up, yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:23):
The girlfriend, the great, the grade, they didn't go
to school that day.
They, you know, they lied,whatever it is, and you're like,
why did you do that?
Automatically, something'soutside of your control, and so
the way you respond candetermine if you're going to let
strife come into thatrelationship, because it's
really good.
And all of a sudden, oneincident could change the course
(10:47):
, because you have maybe at thispoint as a parent, you have
fallen into allowing strife tobe of the situation.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
That's so true.
You know you mentioned prayer,and prayer is important.
I remember I have to share this.
I have a question for you too,but I have to.
I want to share this.
I don't know for you too, but Iwant to share this.
I don't know if you rememberthis.
We were newly married, maybetwo, three years, and we were in
our new house that we got andwe just were not.
I mean, we were hitting and youwent upstairs because we were
(11:20):
talking.
You went upstairs and I saidwhat are you going upstairs for?
He was like well, I'm going togo pray.
I said who are you praying foryou?
And then he kept going how doyou respond?
Because I'm glad he's prayingfor me, but get back here.
Do you remember?
Speaker 1 (11:36):
I do not.
Yeah, you went upstairs, atleast everybody knows.
Now you've got a praying man.
Now you got a praying man.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
Yeah, I guess so.
But you know, one of the thingsI think that we've hit is a
heavy at times is a cyclicaleffect of strife.
It's like we get out of it.
And, matter of fact, bishopGaten, I'm going to give you a
shout out because you were theone who told us.
He told us that you know, thedevil, the enemy, really wants
(12:02):
to abort what you guys aretrying to accomplish, what God
has called you to accomplish.
And so, in a practical sense,how would you two, because I
think that's it's hard, it'slike it's like a season of that
cyclical strife.
I don't know if you've ever beenin there where it's like, okay,
you get out, and then you getback in and you get out, and
it's like the season of justpressure, the season of
(12:26):
challenge to see, and it's likea season of it.
You know, how do youpractically like, what do you do
, even practically to toencourage people to like, okay,
this is how you get out of this.
You know, because it's reallymeant, the devil means it for
evil, but God's trying toproduce.
It seems like, you know, whenwe, whenever we hit, that it's
like the enemy, the Lord'strying to produce something out
(12:47):
of it?
How do you encourage people?
What do you do Like?
What is something that you doto help people?
Okay, this is how you get outof this.
Speaker 4 (12:55):
I think one of the first things you have to realize
is that you can't change theother person, you can only.
And so oftentimes, when you'rein that battle of strife, you're
thinking about how can youchange your husband, how can you
change him, how can you changeyour wife?
But what you have to do is howdo I change me?
(13:16):
And one of the biggest thingsis communication styles.
Stripe is like this littleburning fire right, that's just
this little campfire that'sburning there and I have to
choose.
Am I going to put water on thatGasoline?
Right, that's on me.
(13:37):
So how I respond to whateverhas triggered me is either water
or gasoline.
And when you start thinkingabout that, I'll even say to
myself sometimes, when somethingis said or done and I want to
just jump, I'll say water orgasoline.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
That's good, that's good.
Speaker 4 (13:58):
And I'll pick what I'm going to.
Then I'll really think throughhow am I going to respond to
this Right, right.
Speaker 3 (14:06):
Yeah, that's great baby, Because I'm glad that
you've picked this up all thetime.
Speaker 4 (14:15):
And, ladies and gentlemen, this is why I stay in
my prayer closet.
That's right.
Speaker 3 (14:20):
Years ago I learned a lesson, but it was by the Holy
Spirit that I learned it.
I was in ministry we're at asmaller church.
So years ago I learned a lesson, but it was by the Holy Spirit
that I learned it.
In ministry we're at a smallerchurch.
I was a youth pastor and aworship pastor at this church
and I went through a season,like you were saying, tiffany,
of difficulty with people.
So every time I turned aroundit seemed like I was having
(14:42):
trouble with this person on theworship team.
I was having trouble with thisperson on the worship team.
I was having trouble with thisperson in the youth group.
I was having trouble with thisparent of the teen in the youth
group.
I was having trouble with thiscollege student in our young
adult ministry.
Me and Len were having conflictat home.
We had little babies and such,and I just kept thinking to the
(15:04):
Lord.
I mean, it was a season.
I kept praying God, man, allthese people have all this stuff
.
And the Holy Spirit spoke to meand he said what's the common
denominator?
Right, more or less, was who isthe common denominator here?
I was in trouble with all ofthese people.
All of these people were havingtrouble with me.
(15:27):
On some level, I was actuallythe common denominator.
They messed up and they saidthat wrong, and she didn't do
that right, and he didn't showup for work and and me and Lynn,
whatever.
But the issue was I'm wascentral to all of these issues,
and so here I am, spending mytime praying for these other
(15:48):
people to get it right.
Speaker 4 (15:51):
Wow, wow.
Speaker 3 (15:53):
Get their crap in order so that we can work.
Speaker 4 (15:57):
Yeah, you're good.
Speaker 3 (16:00):
The Lord is pointing the finger right at me, saying
bill, you're the commondenominator here, so what are
you going to do about you?
And that goes along with what Iwas just saying.
So I had to take ownership, Ihad to repent, even though, uh,
you know there's a the, thepassage in um proverbs uh, then
(16:20):
the passage in translation saysevery man is in love with his
own opinion.
It's the passage where manmakes his plans, but God
establishes his ways.
Well, in the passage it saysevery man is in love with his
own opinion.
And I'm thinking, wow, itwouldn't be an opinion if we
didn't love it.
I wouldn't have that opinion.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Wow, wow.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
Right.
If I really wasn't in love withthe way I thought about it, I
wouldn't have that opinion, andwhat I was allowing was my
opinions to dominate a situationbecause I felt you should have
acted this way.
I feel like you should haveacted this way, and whether I
was right or wrong wasn't eventhe issue.
It was the condition of myheart.
(17:02):
I was allowing strife in myrelationship.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Pastor Bill.
With that, though, what did Goddo in you during that process?
So, like I hear you saying,like all right, I was a common
denominator, I was hitting thosedifferent things.
What was the adjustment in yourthinking that had to take place
in order for you to shift thatscenario to where you wanted it
to be?
Speaker 3 (17:22):
Yeah, that's a great question, and I don't even know
if it was one thing per se.
First of all, it was merecognizing.
Speaker 4 (17:31):
Fairness is the first key.
Speaker 3 (17:36):
And I remember coming home and telling Lynn that I
think she was probably relievedbecause she was like oh, you're
finally getting it.
You got it.
The first thing was awarenessand the second thing is I
repented, because I believequick repentance.
Man there's no reason to letthis thing linger.
I'm a fool for trying to thinkI could solve it myself or sew
(18:00):
it back together again.
Be quick to repent.
And when I repented, I rememberwhat did happen in my heart was
that I began to look at otherpeople in a different way.
So I didn't look at them withthe problem that they brought to
me constantly.
(18:21):
That annoyed me.
I began to look at them like,well, maybe their situation they
just don't know.
Maybe they're just ignorant.
Maybe they're not aware thatGod really cares about that
circumstance.
Maybe they're ignorant of thesolution.
Maybe I can be a voice in theirlife, a godly voice in their
life, to help them with this,because the way they're reacting
(18:41):
was not the source of theirproblem.
It was just.
You know, the way they wereacting was just a reaction.
And so I began to learn how toteach myself and others how to
respond to things rather thanreact to things.
Speaker 2 (18:59):
Wow, well, and I think a lot of it, you know,
even as you both are talking, isreally laying it down, giving
it to the Lord and saying, lord,have your way, have your way in
that person, have your way inthe situation and have your way
in me.
You know, I share this story.
It's funny.
You know, pastor Bill, you weretalking about the common
denominator and I had that same.
(19:20):
It was like that same cyclewith people and I was sitting in
standing in Giant Eagle, I wasgetting my groceries, the store
was packed and this was afterjust kind of test after test
after test, of the Lord wassaying, okay, how are you going
to handle this situation?
(19:40):
How are you going to handlethis situation?
How are you going to respond tothis situation?
I had my oldest son with me.
We were in the store and therewas this long line.
So I got in line and a womanand I'm trying to get out of
there, I'm not trying to stay inthe store all day and a woman
came right in front of me andjust brought her big old cart
(20:02):
with all of her stuff in thereand the guy in front of me said,
hey, she went there, he went toher and he said listen, she was
in line before you.
Her response was I don't care,we all have to check out.
So I said okay, well, lynn,what did Pastor Lynn?
What did you say?
(20:22):
You said either water or what?
Gasoline, gasoline.
So that's what I'm going tothink about when I'm moving
forward.
I'm going to either say wateror gasoline, and so I could have
put water or gasoline on that.
And I said you know what?
I'm going to choose the waterin that situation.
I'm not going to say anything,I'm going to choose the water.
In that situation, I'm notgoing to say anything, I'm going
to let her come through.
And it was interesting becauseit was actually a giving to God
(20:46):
full situation.
And the guy said to me he saidlisten.
He said come on.
He said come on up.
And he said put on.
And I said what?
And he put.
He said put all your grocerieson there.
And I said are you serious?
He said I'm going to pay forall of your groceries today.
Yes, isn't that amazing.
He said all right, lord, I getit, I'm going to give it to you
(21:08):
all the time, you know, and thatit's just.
it's so important to really giveit to God and ask the Lord okay
, what do you like?
What do I need to do in thissituation?
A lot of times, like you saidbefore, it's like okay, they
need to change.
Even if you're justified, lord,what are you trying to grow in
me and pour out of me in thissituation?
(21:31):
And the thing about that it'snot always easy.
In fact, a lot of the timesit's very difficult.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
It is, you know, pastor Bill and Lynn.
You know, one of the things Ithink about is sometimes what I
have learned to do in my life,whether it's ministry, people,
anything that goes on in myworld.
I always ask God what is themind of Christ in every
circumstance, because you knowwhat if we're not careful?
I can look at my wife.
I can look at my kids and theycan be wrong and I can go to
(22:01):
them and say but they're wrong.
They're wrong.
But God said that's not whatI'm after in this season.
I may be after something in you.
Maybe I'm trying to make youmore patient, Maybe I'm trying
to make you more loving, MaybeI'm making you more kind or
whatever.
Maybe he's trying to get youjust to simply die to things.
But that's something that Ihave learned.
In any situation, I don't careif my car breaks down, if my
money is funny and my change isstrange, it don't matter what it
(22:23):
is.
I'm always asking God what areyou doing?
Because I feel like the quickerI can get to the mind of Christ
, the quicker I can move on fromwhatever circumstance, and
usually if I repent even as yousaid, Pastor Bill, he said
repent that times of refreshingmay come from the Prince of the
Lord.
So what are your thoughts ongetting the mind of Christ in
(22:44):
circumstances that hit yourrelationship?
Speaker 4 (22:47):
I think everything that we go through there's a
lesson that can be learned ifwe're going to start a lesson,
and so I will ask myself thatexact question Okay, what can I
learn from this?
Because I don't want to takethis test again.
Speaker 2 (23:01):
Exactly, that is so true.
Speaker 4 (23:04):
Every thing I go through, I'm going to learn
something, and if I don't learnit, then I have to retake and go
back around that mountain andladies who are watching this
listen to this.
We're not getting any skinniergoing around the same mountain
over and over.
Let's just get to the mountain,learn what we need to learn and
(23:24):
not keep repeating the samethings over and over again.
If you really dive deep, it'sthe same issue, different person
causing it.
So what have I not learned?
That I can get through thisquicker and not have to retake.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
that's right amen amen pastor bill yeah, I mean,
you know we're, we're Ephesianstells us that we have the mind
of Christ.
You know, we're promised themind of Christ.
We're seated um with Christ inheavenly places.
So so in our reality as a we,we are human beings, but we're
also spirit beings, and so thereality is I call it like we
(24:05):
have dual citizenship.
We have citizenship where, youknow, as my passport I have a
United States passport, but myother citizenship is in heavenly
places places.
So I can choose to be thinkingjust in the ways of the world or
I can be thinking in the mindof Christ, which we are freely
(24:27):
given as born-again believers.
I mean, it's not something thatwe strive to attain.
We have the mind of Christ, ourposition is in Christ.
So we just tend to, I think, asChristians, we just tend to go
throughout our day seeing,looking at the visual of just
(24:47):
what's happening in realityright around us, and we're not
even seeing a heavenlyperspective of what's God saying
in this situation.
Why could God be allowing thissituation?
What is the mind of Christ forthe situation?
So if we ask for wisdom, he saysI'm giving it every time.
I'm giving it every timeBecause there are things we ask
(25:11):
for, but we ask amiss, so wedon't get it.
And we spend so much timethinking about what's not being
answered, rather than if we askfor wisdom.
Every time, there's wisdom, andso the Lord will deposit wisdom
when we don't know what to do,because we've all been in
relationships where it's like Ido not even know.
The next thing I say is goingto be wrong regardless.
(25:32):
We've been in that situation.
Things are so tense, sodifficult, it's like I don't
even know what to say.
Well, that's when you need themind of Christ.
That's when you need the wisdomof the Lord on what to say and
when to say it.
I was just looking at ascripture here.
I was reminded of a scripture.
I got to put my glasses on toread it, but in Genesis, it
(25:53):
might be the first time stripesmentioned.
I haven't done a word study onit but in verse, in Genesis,
chapter 13, verse 8, it saysthen Abram so stripes have been
around a long time.
It's said to Lot let there beno strife between you and me,
between your herdsmen or myherdsmen, for we are kinsmen, Is
(26:16):
it not the whole land that'sbefore you and I'm like, wow, I
mean even back in the day.
We're talking about familysituations and they're dividing
up their wealth, their riches,their herds, their families.
We want to remain family.
We know we got to go in twodifferent directions here for
(26:37):
our families to prosper allsorts of situations.
But the prayer that Abram saidis let there be no strife among
us, and not just among me andyou, but our herdsmen, our
families.
Let there be no strife amongany.
That's a powerful prayer whenyou're talking about thousands
of people.
When you're talking about, youknow, thousands of people, yeah.
Speaker 4 (27:01):
Because that reminds me that the strife that we have
is affecting more than just meand him.
Yes, wow, just you and yourhusband.
It's affecting your kids, it'saffecting your friendships, it's
affecting everything.
We tend to feel like we're inthis little bubble, wow,
everything.
We tend to feel like we're inthis little bubble, wow.
What I feel is just about me,but it actually really is about
(27:25):
everyone that you're connectingwith.
They're going to feel.
You've walked into someone'shome and you're like, oh,
something's not right,something's up.
And one of the things that Iknow that the Lord has helped me
to do is that I had to learnthe difference between praying
(27:47):
about my husband and praying formy husband, praying about my
kid.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
That's good though.
Yeah, that is good.
Speaker 4 (27:59):
Praying about your spouse or your kids, you're just
focusing on what's happeningright now, how it's making you
feel, how it's affecting youremotions, but when you pray for,
you're carving the gold out ofthat person and you're seeking
the mind of Christ for thatperson.
(28:20):
What do you see in my husbandthat I need to see?
What do you say about my kidsthat I need to start saying?
You say about my kids that Ineed to start saying it's about
really looking deep into theperson and who that person is in
relative to their relationshipwith the Lord, versus what that
(28:42):
person is doing in relationshipwith yourself.
If we can begin to do that whenwe're in strife with our spouse
or anyone, lord, let me see howyou see this person, because if
I can have your eyes towardsthis person, then I can have
your thoughts towards thisperson.
(29:03):
I can see them the way you seethem and then I can begin to
hear what they're meaning, notnecessarily what they're saying
it changes you.
Speaker 1 (29:16):
Yeah, you know, and with that I'm going to kind of
tie what you guys sharedtogether, because I think many
times, when strife can hit too,it can be a plan of the enemy to
once again to blessing block.
Speaker 2 (29:27):
You know, Pastor.
Speaker 1 (29:27):
Bill, the scripture you mentioned.
That's such a powerfulscripture.
I've preached it several timesand the revelation I got from
that what was really unique iswhen you hit strife, you have to
prefer the other one.
Uh, you got yourself.
Abraham said hey, lot, what youwant, I'll take leftovers.
And he said so obviously, andI'm going to read it just so
everybody kind of catches it.
(29:47):
And he says here in verse 10 alot lifted up his eyes and saw
all the plain of Jordan, that itwas well watered everywhere
before the Lord destroyed Sodomand Gomorrah, like the garden of
the Lord, like the land ofEgypt, as you go towards Zorah.
Then Lot chose for himself.
Notice that Abraham said hey,listen, you go ahead, take
whatever you want.
Lot said I want for me, I wantthis, I want this.
And, as we know the story, lotended up choosing a place that
(30:09):
was going to be destroyed.
But this is what I think isreally unique and why we need
the mind of Christ, even insituations I have learned many
times.
Even in a marriage, she couldbe frustrated about something, I
could be frustrated aboutsomething, but neither one of us
are wrong and we're both notwrong and we're both not all the
way right, you can both have apiece of the puzzle, and what I
(30:30):
mean by that is many times Godis doing something even greater
than you could have imagined.
So God allowed that strife tobe between Abraham and Lot
because once Abraham preferredLot and said hey, you go ahead,
do whatever it is that you'regoing to do.
I think what's really amazinghere is that the Bible says Lot
lifted up his eyes and he sawSodom and Gomorrah and he went
over that way.
But then, after they separatedand got the strife out, then the
(30:52):
Lord said to Abraham, after Lotseparated from him, lift up
your eyes now, look from theplace where you are northward,
southward, eastward and westward, for all the land which you see
, I give to you and yourdescendants forever.
And I could go through the restof it there.
But I think it's really uniquethat once they got the strife
out, lot got a differentperspective.
(31:13):
Then God gave Abraham aperspective and got the promised
land.
So as long as the strife wasthere, the promised land
couldn't come.
And once they got the strifeout, something happened.
Speaker 3 (31:25):
That is so good man.
Speaker 1 (31:27):
I'm going to have to get that sermon.
But I think that's the reasonwhy many times I've learned in
our relationship.
Whenever we start seeing strife, my thing is just like let's
get it out.
Let's get out God.
What are you doing in me,getting the mind of Christ
asking Lord to purge anythingout of my life that needs to be
purged out.
God, what are you doing in herBack to what you said Pastor
Lynn doing in her back to whatyou said, pastor Lynn?
(31:48):
We can't change ourselves, butI've changed the other person,
but we can change ourselves, andthat's the only person we have
power over and that's the onlyperson I believe that God is
looking at, is asking me to lookat me, and when we do that,
something happens.
But I want to transition tosomething real quickly here.
What do you guys do?
Because strife can hit.
Speaker 2 (32:04):
You know this is not all sounds good on paper but
what do you guys do when you getstuck, have you?
Speaker 1 (32:11):
ever gotten stuck?
And what do you do when, likeall right, we're talking, she's
trying to tell me something, I'mtrying to tell her something,
nothing's getting through.
One day's gone by, two daysgone by, three days gone by?
How do you, what do you guys dowhen you get stuck?
If y'all ever get stuck, causey'all look like you may not do
that, so maybe you can help usout, Maybe you can help us out,
get help.
Speaker 4 (32:30):
I think one of the things that we as especially
those of us who've grown up inthe church like literally, like
born on Saturday and church onSunday we have this perspective
that if there's any problems inmy life, I must not have enough
Jesus.
So I got to hide it and pretendlike everything's okay and all
(32:52):
that's doing is, as Bill wouldsay, just kicking the can down
the road rather than justdealing with what's going on and
it's okay.
It's actually beneficial tohave someone in your life that
you know loves your husband justas much as loves me, and that's
(33:12):
the key.
Speaker 1 (33:13):
That's huge.
Speaker 4 (33:14):
Someone in your relationship that you both know
that they love you equally.
I'm not going to go to my momand say all the stuff that Bill
has done, because I will forgiveBill but my money will be
validated for the story that'sright, that's a great point,
pastor Lynn.
(33:34):
We're going to go to someonethat loves us both equally and
say, okay, this is what's goingon and we just need someone to
help us talk through this.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
Yeah, that's so great .
I mean, that's a key.
And we've been blessed withhaving several people in our
lives over different seasons.
I mean, we've been married 28years now, and so in 28 years
we've had different people inour lives that we could go to,
which has been really, really,really helpful.
And then God's blessed us withbeing able to be that for other
(34:11):
people too, you know, and thefunny thing is, sometimes when
we're counseling other couples,people, whatnot, you end up
giving them advice and HolySpirit's thinking to you like,
why don't you do this?
Yeah, that's so good.
I mean, why are you even trythis one?
Put this suit on and it's goingto work.
(34:33):
And we'll laugh at each otherand be like, wow, we're telling
them to do all this.
They'll leave and we'll go, andso we need to do that.
We need to do that in our life.
Speaker 2 (34:44):
Did you ever call somebody and you guys were going
at it and you stuck and then,when they answered the phone
call or got to you, your problemwas over.
Speaker 3 (34:56):
That's good.
It probably has happened.
Nothing comes to mind.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
I've had that several times.
I'll know the problem was over,but we definitely kicked that
can down the road and said, okay, I want to interject in that
because actually in my own world, even as a pastor before I was
married, I went through a realdifficult time early, two
thousands and whatever and Ireally wasn't submitted to
(35:26):
authority the way that I shouldhave been and didn't recognize
it, didn't know it wasn't just Iwas rebellious, just didn't
quite recognize.
I pastoringoring to a leadpastor of a church and I was
just young, anointed to preachbut had no type of understanding
on a lot of things and kind ofgot thrusted in a situation.
So I had this major crash and Iremember all I did.
I understood I need to listen,more, need to listen.
So I got to a point where Ididn't make any decisions
(35:48):
without consulting my authorityand I got to a point where all
of a sudden I was so humbled byit that I would call up my
pastor and be like, hey, listen,I want to do X, y, z, I'm going
through this.
I leave a voicemail and thenall of a sudden, three or four
days would go by, he'd finallyget back to me and like, right,
when he'd get back to me.
God gave me the answer like twohours before, and what the Lord
was showing me in that time,that, even though you need to be
(36:10):
submitted, you're not stuck.
You need to go to the thronebefore you go to the phone, and
so I had to learn that processin my life.
So even in marriagerelationships, sometimes if you
are at a point where you'regetting help from somebody, you
can go to them, go to them, goto them.
But many times we're just notworking.
What?
God said and if we work what Godshows us, it will work.
(36:32):
But sometimes what we do is wewant to go to somebody and fix
our spouse or whatever it mightbe.
But I just wanted to mentionthat because I know several
times in my life where I've seenthat happen.
And then all of a sudden, thebreakthrough hits and I think
what God is showing us is hey,listen, you've got your answers
within you.
You don't always work what yougot.
Work what you got, that's sogood.
Speaker 2 (36:50):
I'm just curious, since we're talking about all
the strife stuff do you rememberyour first argument when you
first got married?
Do you remember what that was?
Speaker 3 (37:00):
Oh, my goodness, see, these are what need the
pre-questions.
Speaker 4 (37:03):
Right.
Speaker 2 (37:05):
You've been married for 20 years.
Yeah, the reason I'm askingthat.
It's interesting how, when youfirst get married, you need all
this and you need him to respondthis way, or you need her to
respond this way, and then it'slike, oh, I don't need that
anymore because you've grown.
But I just think it's sointeresting to find out what one
of the first arguments were.
Speaker 3 (37:27):
Well, it wasn't our first.
I can tell you our firstChristmas argument.
Speaker 2 (37:32):
Oh, okay, I see that, look on her.
I see the look.
Speaker 4 (37:38):
This one I'm still dealing with a little bit.
This was like six months.
Speaker 3 (37:41):
That's why the look yeah, we had been married about
six months and we lived in thisapartment.
And her parents said, hey, hey,what do you guys want for
christmas?
And and um, I said, well, youknow what we really need.
Now I'm telling them this not,lynn, right?
What we really need is a vacuumcleaner, a vacuum cleaner.
(38:05):
And they were like, oh yeah, Igot it.
And I'm thinking, yeah, causethis apartment filled with
carpets everywhere and ourvacuum cleaner is like garbage
and you know, if we just had avacuum cleaner.
So, so we go to Lynn's parents'house for Christmas and they've
got, you know, all these boxesfor me and I'm opening them up
and there's new shirts and tiesand stuff for me to preach in.
(38:28):
You know all this stuff, nicetrench coat, yeah, like I mean
they really it's our firstChristmas, they did really good.
Speaker 4 (38:34):
And then Lynn and I opened my gift and it's a vacuum
cleaner Now oh, did you put agift in it?
I'm not going to know In theconversation about needing a
vacuum cleaner.
Speaker 2 (38:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (38:49):
I get the vacuum cleaner, um and so, yeah, this
every christmas, this is ourconversation.
We'll say, okay, just remember,I like shiny, bright, nice
things yeah right, right, right,right no applying.
Speaker 3 (39:03):
I'll buy that myself you know, and in one year.
So we had a.
We had conflict over that, forsure.
She's like I mean, you're, youknow I don't get nothing for
myself, but I got the housevacuum and then you expect me to
vacuum, so exactly, that'sright.
Um, yeah, and so one year evenit wasn't too many years.
(39:26):
After that, uh, I bought lynn areally, a really nice uh mixer
like you know, a mixer to makebread and all this stuff oh my
goodness, wait, wait who is thisfor?
I said, you know, and it was.
I remember it was.
No, it was kaufman's and it wasnice.
Speaker 4 (39:48):
Well, I thought you'd like to bake like your mom.
Speaker 2 (39:51):
But did everybody hear that she said she didn't
bake.
Right, right, right.
Speaker 3 (39:56):
I wanted her to bake.
So, instead of me buying my ownmixer and learning to bake
myself, I bought her a mixer,expecting her to learn to bake
and put a bow on it.
And then that's when I finallyrealized, okay, there's going to
be, unless she mentions it.
That's when I finally realized,okay, there's going to be,
unless she mentions it there areno appliances for Christmas, so
I got 26 of 20, 28.
(40:17):
Right, it only took twoChristmas she asked for.
She asked for something likeman, I would really like this.
I'll take note and buy that andthat's it.
Well, he buys that.
Speaker 4 (40:29):
And something else.
Speaker 3 (40:30):
But I wanted.
I wanted her to make bread, soI bought her a mixer.
Speaker 2 (40:34):
But I'm buying some of the iron yeah, so they can
iron your clothes, yeah rightright so you know, now that
we're, you know we're.
We're approaching the christmas, we're in the Christmas season.
I would love to know what wasyour best gifts, like most
memorable gifts that you gave toone another.
Speaker 4 (40:57):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (41:00):
I know I'm putting you on the spot, yeah, and it
can be just one of them.
Maybe you have a ton of them,but maybe just one, yeah you
know, the funny thing is with us.
Speaker 4 (41:14):
I think we do more memorable type things for our
anniversary okay, okay then,yeah, we spend most of.
Speaker 3 (41:25):
We buy each other a lot of gifts for christmas,
don't you?
But our, our memory stuff isalways around our anniversary um
, okay yeah.
Yeah.
So if we just want to say gifts, yes, let's do that, yeah, but.
I mean you know there was.
I mean, obviously, every yearChristmas is like these great
(41:49):
you know surprise gifts.
We try to.
We make gifts to make eachother laugh and have a good time
and uh, and then we have someyou know serious gifts that we
need, but the um, you know onewe take a trip every year for
our anniversary and so we'vedone that since year one, so
we've done a lot of them and thekey is that we uh, I mean we
(42:13):
have done.
We have been poor and we'vebeen not so poor, so we've done
a lot.
You know more elaborate tripsor we've done.
Speaker 4 (42:20):
Camping in cabins that you couldn't pay me to be
in.
Speaker 2 (42:23):
Oh, didn't we talk about camping.
Speaker 4 (42:25):
Yeah, we did we talked about camping.
Speaker 2 (42:28):
I wish we had more time because I'd love to go into
that a little bit more.
Okay, no, camping no camping.
Speaker 3 (42:34):
So I've surprised Lynn with several.
Speaker 4 (42:38):
I guess my favorite.
My favorite gift was it was our25th anniversary and he had
gotten me an anniversary ringwith the diamond for every five
years.
Wow, Wow I love that.
And it's on my hand.
(42:59):
Yes, that's probably been mymost like.
I was the most shocked becauseI just didn't expect it and so,
yeah, because we already had a25th anniversary.
Speaker 3 (43:12):
Well, we had a 20th anniversary, a big trip that we
did to europe, uh, which was,which was wonderful.
And then the 25th, lynn waslike hey, don't go overboard on
this one, let's, yeah, plan abig thing for our 30th, let's
25th, let's do.
But I surprised you with thathe surprised me so yeah, it was
really good.
(43:33):
And, um, lyn Lynn bought me forChristmas one year.
Lynn bought me a gold necklacethat you know it wasn't even
about.
You know, I like jewelry and soI wear a lot of jewelry church.
(43:56):
Um that, unbeknownst to me,went to lynn and or she went to
him and she said, hey, I wouldreally like to buy bill this.
But I think at that time we allshe, we only had like 300
dollars or something like thatto be able to spend.
We were young and and um, andshe was like what can you give
me?
And he ends up with her like um, a 1200 necklace for like five
years and just said, don't worryabout it, just bless your
husband.
And so she was able to bless mewith something that I mean she
(44:20):
saved for, sacrificed for, andit was way beyond anything that
I was giving her that year.
And so I still have thatnecklace, I still wear it and it
means something.
So it's not even aboutnecessarily the value of it, but
it was just about thethoughtfulness of her being able
to say, hey, I only got this,what can I get, you know?
And he ended up, you know,blessing our family.
Speaker 1 (44:44):
Wow, that's so cool.
Well, you know it's funny.
We're so glad to have you guysand thank you for taking time to
come and hang out with us andjust to share.
You know I'm getting to knowyou Obviously.
You know I'm getting to knowyou Obviously, you know you guys
a lot more.
And then, like when I came toPittsburgh, you guys were gone
and then we've kind ofreconnected.
But the more I listen to youtalk, the more that I listen to
you guys, your stories, numberone I know you guys have been
(45:05):
through the fire, you've beenrefined, you've been processed.
I understand why God has you.
With the platforms that youhave, you don't have the wisdom
that you guys have unless youhave been processed.
And I so appreciate what youguys share, what you bring to
the table.
Covenant Church of Pittsburgh,along with OA City, is blessed
to have you guys as pastors andI believe you guys are just
(45:27):
hitting the tip of the icebergof what God's going to do in
your life.
And so thank you guys so muchfor your time and for your
wisdom and I'm sure we're goingto probably hit you up somewhere
in 25 to have you guys comeback on again.
We so appreciate you guys, welove you guys and we pray God's
best upon everything that youguys do.
Speaker 3 (45:45):
Thank you so much.
We are very honored.
Hit us up anytime.
We would just love to serve youin any type of capacity that we
can, and you have a greataudience, and so hopefully they
keep cheering you on.
Amen, amen, god bless you guys.
All right, see you.
Speaker 1 (46:05):
So closing thoughts.
Speaker 2 (46:06):
Well, that was so good.
Well, while they were bothtalking, I was taking my own
notes and I think you know it'sinteresting with this strife
thing.
You know you have to be careful.
I know we've talked about thiswhere those special moments the
enemy wants to rob.
So you know you're fightingover things that really don't
(46:27):
matter.
A lot of them really don'tmatter, and at the end of the
day we always talk about this atthe end of the day you're
thinking, once you get throughit, what did I talk about?
So I let all these specialmoments go because of what?
Speaker 1 (46:40):
Nothing really significant, and we have to
remember too the enemy comes tosteal, to kill and to destroy
Thrive is a tactic of the enemyto steal what is valuable, to
kill what's living and destroywhat God is building in your
life, and when you can begin torecognize that you are not each
other's enemy.
Many of you are fighting yourspouse right now and you think
(47:02):
the spouse is the issue, butsometime, as I heard it said
years ago, it's the enemy enemy.
And so sometimes God's tryingto kill that area of your life
that he's trying to get to, sothen it doesn't give place to
the enemy.
You understand that you have togive place to Satan.
There are some things that areattacks and there's sometimes we
give place because of the ownjunk in our own trunk.
(47:23):
Matter of fact, if I had timeI'd go into that on how, when
you're dating, before you gomile high, everybody goes
through baggage check.
The purpose behind dating isbaggage check.
You got to go through TSA.
You got to go through the metaldetect.
You got to hold your hands up.
If they see anything, they'rewinding it, making sure Is there
anything in there?
Why?
Because once we're on the plane, everybody that's on the plane
is in jeopardy, based upon whatyou bring in your baggage.
(47:46):
So it's important that werecognize our own stuff,
otherwise we'll be blaming eachother.
I'll be blaming you for stuffin my past.
You'll be blaming me for stuffin your past.
Speaker 2 (47:53):
We won't get anywhere .
We won't get nowhere, we won'tget anywhere.
And I thought another key thingthat Pastor Lynn said, and I
just want to encourage everybodyas it encouraged- me, we need
to go from a point of prayingabout our spouse to praying for
more.
That is so good.
You know, and I'm sure all ofus, when we go into our prayer
closets we've kind of gone backand forth but some of us get
(48:15):
stuck in the praying about andwe just get stuck there.
Let's go from praying about toreally praying for and
interceding for one another,praying for that spouse to get
that wisdom that he or she needs, to get that strength, to get
that peace, whatever it may be.
Making sure that we are inthere and, ladies, being that,
(48:36):
help me that God has called usto be for our husbands.
Speaker 1 (48:40):
Amen, amen.
So listen, if y'all haveenjoyed this episode, like,
subscribe, follow, share, go toiHeartRadio, go to iTunes,
wherever you get your podcasts,and make sure you follow us,
because we've got a whole lotmore coming.
It's been such a great time.
We wish you guys a wonderfulMerry Christmas.
Keep strife out of yourrelationship.
That's right.
(49:03):
I believe there's peoplewatching even right now that as
you take heed to what you'velearned today you didn't tune in
by happenstance or by accidentbut as you take heed to these
things, there are blessingscoming for you in 25.
There are breakthroughs, thereare open doors.
There are things right now thatare being held up because of
the strife that is in your life.
As you allow strife out, openup the front door, a back door,
every window you got.
Kick strife out.
(49:24):
You are going to welcome theblessing of the Lord into your
life.
I believe that there's healingin relationships that are going
to take place.
Your family members I believethere's somebody listening and
watching right now that thereare family members that God has
called to be saved and theycan't get saved because of the
strife that is in your life.
If you will begin to defeatstrife, take a hold of your
(49:44):
spouse, your boyfriend, yourgirlfriend and say you know what
?
We're not going to fightanymore, even while you're
dating, you're engaged andyou're fighting about what color
flowers you're going to haveand everything else.
Just keep the strife out and asyou do that, god is going to
bless you in a supernatural way.
So we want to pray for you andthen we're going to let you go.
Today, father, in the name ofJesus, we thank you for every
person that has listened, thathas watched, that's tuned in.
Father, we bind the spirit ofstrife.
(50:07):
Father, god, we break it today.
In the name of Jesus, and andLord, we ask right now that your
Holy Spirit would just come inand give wisdom, that we would
not try to change one another,but, lord, we would allow you to
be the author and the finisherof our faith.
Oh God, you started it.
Lord, you'll finish it.
Father, help us to know themind of Christ in every single
(50:28):
circumstance.
And, father, I just pray forhealing, that times of
refreshing would come.
And, lord, that, even as theword was given about Abraham and
Lot, that, lord, god, you wouldcause us to lift up our eyes
and see the inheritance that youhave for our life.
And Father, we thank you.
We give you praise, honor andglory In Jesus' name.
We pray Amen, amen, amen.
Well, god bless you all.
We thank you so much for tuninginto Dimensions, and we'll see
(50:51):
you next time here, where we'retaking you from one level of
glory to the next, in Jesus name.
What's up everybody?
It's Pastors Jay and Tiffanyhere.
Welcome to the latest episodeof Dimensions.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (00:15):
We're so glad to be with y'all.
We got an exciting show foreach and every one of y'all
today.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
It is exciting.
But I have one thing you know,this is my thing that I do with
you.
Every time we're on TV or we dothis, I just want to know
where's your, where's yourChristmas stuff.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
Well, jesus, on the main line it's on what you want.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Where's your Christmas stuff?
Where's your Christmas gear?
You?
Speaker 1 (00:37):
know I just rock what I rock.
You know I wear white in theChristmas time, in the
wintertime.
I don't go by the color scheme,y'all, I do it all year round.
I do me.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
I do me boo.
Speaker 1 (00:47):
I do me boo.
That's how we roll y'all.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Okay.
Well, I'm excited to be here.
I'm jumping back in.
Speaker 1 (00:55):
Yes, you are.
We're so excited.
It's been a while, but we'regoing to be back with y'all
every we have a whole lot ofguests coming up.
We want to talk about thingsthat are important to you guys,
and we know that today we've gotsome great guests.
We're talking aboutrelationships and how to
navigate.
You know a lot of stress can behappening throughout the
holidays.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
It's stress, anger, bitterness, all that stuff.
You know, I heard it this waySomebody said that anger is one
or danger is one.
Letter away From anger, fromanger.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
Yeah, wow.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
Because when you get anger, I mean that stuff can get
dangerous.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Yeah, it can.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
Very quick.
I mean you go down a slipperyslope very quick with that.
Speaker 1 (01:33):
That's what I talk about.
Listen my wife.
I tell her she's cute, she'spetite, Don't get it twisted.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
Don't do it, don't get it twisted.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
She got a blade under that jacket.
Y'all she's packing heat.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
She's packing heat, y'all You're not supposed to let
that out of the bag.
No one's supposed to know that.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
But see, we're going to talk about all this now
because we're talking aboutrelationships and we'll probably
talk about it later.
You know how we do, but no, onthe real though, we want to talk
to you guys about relationshipmatters.
We've got a couple here thathas been just outstanding, just
really loves the Lord.
They've got two great churchesI don't even know everything
that they do, I mean, man, Idon't know how they keep up the
schedule that they got andthey're just great, a great man,
(02:13):
a great woman of God.
They pastor Oasis City Churchalong with Covenant Church of
Pittsburgh.
They've been with us onCornerstone talking about
relationships and we said listen, we need to do something on a
podcast as well, but listen,before I mention them, don't
forget to take a minute to like,subscribe, follow share stay
with us.
We're on iHeartRadio, Everywhereyou can get a podcast, I think
that we're available iTunes andyou'll be able to, if you like,
(02:35):
subscribe, follow and share.
You'll be able to keep up andbecome the latest family member
of the Dimensions family.
So we want you to join with us.
We've got a whole lot of guests.
We've got guests from all overthe world literally that are
going to be coming on and justdoing different types of
discussions and things, so we'rereal excited.
So, with no further ado, yougot something to mention.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
Well, I wanted to mention, first of all, I've
known this couple for a longtime.
Yes, For about 20, maybe 20something.
Something here I don't know, wecan they can correct me if I'm
wrong but they are an awesomecouple and I love you know, what
I love about them is not onlyare they authentic, but they are
unified.
Speaker 1 (03:11):
I love that, the unity that's between them, I
mean as a matter of fact, one ofthe really unique story the
first Sunday that when you and Iwere dating that I came to
covenant, they were being prayedout to launch the church Oasis
City Church in Columbus, ohio.
So they were leaving the exactsame.
What people don't realize, Iwent to Bible college in
Columbus Ohio.
So it was kind of like justneat how it all kind of got set
(03:33):
up, so remember they were upthere and you said this is Bill
and Lynn, they're getting ready.
They're like a son and daughterof the house and dah, dah, dah.
So I just would meet everybody.
I was just completely liketerrified to be there, cause I
was.
I'm trying to put on a goodfront.
You know what I mean, and makesure I'm holding it down and
make sure I'm looking good foryou, and uh, and then they were
being prayed out.
Speaker 2 (03:53):
They were being prayed out.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
So what was it?
Maybe 10 years later finallygot a chance to meet them, done
many things with them oncornerstone television, and then
they got the opportunity tocome back to Covenant in order
to pastor it.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
So talk about full circle.
Yeah right, yeah, so, and, butyeah, go do your thing.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
No, no, it's all good , it's all good.
So I'm going to bring to theplatform here Pastors Bill and
Lynn Thumalaris.
They're with us today.
Pastors Bill and Lynn, I'mgoing to bring you up here.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
So glad to have you guys.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
Yeah, we're really excited and honored again to be
with you, so it's great.
Well, I hope we gave you guys aformal introduction.
I know y'all wear manydifferent hats.
I know you do thereconciliation ministry as well.
You got a lot going on.
Is there anything I left?
Speaker 3 (04:35):
out.
Oh man, we do have three kids,yeah, and two dogs.
So that's, our kids are grownthough, young adults, all in
their young twenties.
But yeah, tiffany, it's, thisis our 20th year.
It was 20 years ago that we metCause.
This is our 20th year from whenwe met Sounds right.
Yeah, crazy, how much timeflies.
Speaker 4 (04:57):
And you don't look any different.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
You know what, see, that's why I love you, and you
know what I can can I cangenuinely say the same about
your.
Passion is not age you know,that is true I mean seriously,
she does, she just wouldn't sayanything there's some wrinkles,
(05:21):
there are they're there, they'rejust.
They're just season marks.
That's all.
That's what we call them.
That's all seasoning.
That's some wrinkles there are.
They're there.
They're just season marks.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
That's all.
That's what we call them.
That's all seasoning.
That's all seasoning.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
You just wrinkled some seasoning in there.
That's it, yes.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
Go ahead Pastor Bill.
Speaker 4 (05:36):
No, I'm just saying this.
No, he's getting ready to beinappropriate.
Speaker 1 (05:41):
This is dimensions.
Y'all, let's go, let's go.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
You know what will start pastor bill then he's
gonna start?
No, do we want to go down thatroad of inappropriateness?
Speaker 1 (05:53):
all right, probably too early for that listen,
there's the unfiltered me andthen there's a filtered me.
So be careful what you wish for, you just might get it.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
this isn is an after hours this is the nightcap.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
So yeah well listen, we're so glad to have you guys
and we figured no better coupleto bring on you guys.
I mean you guys have a lot ofstuff that you guys have walked
through, you've been through andyou're doing ministry together.
I don't think people understandthe warfare and things that
come along with what you'redoing.
So there's some things wereally want to get into with you
guys and want to ask you guys.
(06:29):
One of the things is dealingwith strife.
You know we're in the holidaysdealing with marriage, so many
different things that happen.
What do you guys do to keepstrife out of your home?
Because I believe that strifeis a killer.
It's a blessing blocker infamilies.
I believe there's a lot offamilies that aren't seeing what
they want to see happen becausethey don't keep the home life
(06:49):
apart from strife.
And I think there's adifference between strife and a
disagreement.
You can have disagreementsgoing on and working through
something, but not fall intostrife.
I feel strife is where not onlydo you have a disagreement, but
now you've opened the door towhere now I'm not reconciliatory
, I'm not looking to try toreach out, I'm not looking to
try to bridge the gap, I'm juststaying in my fence, and then
(07:11):
you just create this frictionand tension in your home.
That just, I believe, blocksthe blessing.
And what we've noticed is,whenever the devil tries to
bring strife into our world,there's a blessing on the other
side of it strife into our world, there's a blessing on the
other side of it, and so we havelearned to not only identify it
, put things in place and keepthat out of our life, and when
we do see it if we do happen tosee it to kill it immediately,
(07:34):
because there are blessings thatcome along with it.
So you guys feel free to speakto that.
But what do you guys do to dealwith strife when it hits your
world?
Speaker 4 (07:43):
Well, one of the first things, I'm going to jump
in here because you know I don'twant the preacher to start
preaching.
And then you know that's right,I get up earlier than everyone
else and I make sure that Ispend my quality time with
myself, right?
And get centered and ready forthe day, because life, I tell
(08:08):
people all the time life keepslifing all the time and I'm
already starting my morningrushed and hurried and anxious
to get things done.
I'm already putting myself in aposition to be easily irritated,
easily frustrated.
But if I get up early and I canhave that slow morning, I call
(08:31):
it my coffee date with Jesus.
Just take time before all thehustle and bustle begins.
I actually position myself toalready be protected against the
strife that the enemy does onceduring the day.
Speaker 3 (08:50):
Yeah, I think we set ourselves up for strife when we
allow the randomness of the dayto affect us in a negative
manner.
So when things are outside ofour control and something
happens, well then there's anopportunity to respond.
Okay, am I going to respondwith peace and patience and
(09:11):
prayer?
Okay, holy Spirit, I did notexpect this, but guess what?
He knew it was going to happen.
Surprise the Lord that thishappened today, or this
relationship situation happened,or this work thing happened, or
this kid thing happened, orthis financial thing happened.
But when we try to control asituation you know emotionally
(09:37):
and we kind of get all riled upin our even, in our spirit and
we're not at peace with havingthe mind of Christ like, okay, I
can get through this hurdle,this storm, this struggle, it's
an open door for strife, andit's not just in your marriage,
it's strife with your coworkers.
I mean something happens.
I mean those teenage years areno joke man, they are no joke.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
We didn't get there yet, so we're going to call you
two.
We're on the brink.
Speaker 4 (10:05):
I have a five-part episode on this.
Speaker 3 (10:09):
Well, we should do seven, one for every year, you
know.
But you have a relationship,you know you and your kids could
be doing so well.
I mean, you're talking,relationships are good, and then
something happens.
Speaker 4 (10:22):
The boyfriend shows up, yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:23):
The girlfriend, the great, the grade, they didn't go
to school that day.
They, you know, they lied,whatever it is, and you're like,
why did you do that?
Automatically, something'soutside of your control, and so
the way you respond candetermine if you're going to let
strife come into thatrelationship, because it's
really good.
And all of a sudden, oneincident could change the course
(10:47):
, because you have maybe at thispoint as a parent, you have
fallen into allowing strife tobe of the situation.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
That's so true.
You know you mentioned prayer,and prayer is important.
I remember I have to share this.
I have a question for you too,but I have to.
I want to share this.
I don't know for you too, but Iwant to share this.
I don't know if you rememberthis.
We were newly married, maybetwo, three years, and we were in
our new house that we got andwe just were not.
I mean, we were hitting and youwent upstairs because we were
(11:20):
talking.
You went upstairs and I saidwhat are you going upstairs for?
He was like well, I'm going togo pray.
I said who are you praying foryou?
And then he kept going how doyou respond?
Because I'm glad he's prayingfor me, but get back here.
Do you remember?
Speaker 1 (11:36):
I do not.
Yeah, you went upstairs, atleast everybody knows.
Now you've got a praying man.
Now you got a praying man.
Speaker 2 (11:41):
Yeah, I guess so.
But you know, one of the thingsI think that we've hit is a
heavy at times is a cyclicaleffect of strife.
It's like we get out of it.
And, matter of fact, bishopGaten, I'm going to give you a
shout out because you were theone who told us.
He told us that you know, thedevil, the enemy, really wants
(12:02):
to abort what you guys aretrying to accomplish, what God
has called you to accomplish.
And so, in a practical sense,how would you two, because I
think that's it's hard, it'slike it's like a season of that
cyclical strife.
I don't know if you've ever beenin there where it's like, okay,
you get out, and then you getback in and you get out, and
it's like the season of justpressure, the season of
(12:26):
challenge to see, and it's likea season of it.
You know, how do youpractically like, what do you do
, even practically to toencourage people to like, okay,
this is how you get out of this.
You know, because it's reallymeant, the devil means it for
evil, but God's trying toproduce.
It seems like, you know, whenwe, whenever we hit, that it's
like the enemy, the Lord'strying to produce something out
(12:47):
of it?
How do you encourage people?
What do you do Like?
What is something that you doto help people?
Okay, this is how you get outof this.
Speaker 4 (12:55):
I think one of the first things you have to realize
is that you can't change theother person, you can only.
And so oftentimes, when you'rein that battle of strife, you're
thinking about how can youchange your husband, how can you
change him, how can you changeyour wife?
But what you have to do is howdo I change me?
(13:16):
And one of the biggest thingsis communication styles.
Stripe is like this littleburning fire right, that's just
this little campfire that'sburning there and I have to
choose.
Am I going to put water on thatGasoline?
Right, that's on me.
(13:37):
So how I respond to whateverhas triggered me is either water
or gasoline.
And when you start thinkingabout that, I'll even say to
myself sometimes, when somethingis said or done and I want to
just jump, I'll say water orgasoline.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
That's good, that's good.
Speaker 4 (13:58):
And I'll pick what I'm going to.
Then I'll really think throughhow am I going to respond to
this Right, right.
Speaker 3 (14:06):
Yeah, that's great baby, Because I'm glad that
you've picked this up all thetime.
Speaker 4 (14:15):
And, ladies and gentlemen, this is why I stay in
my prayer closet.
That's right.
Speaker 3 (14:20):
Years ago I learned a lesson, but it was by the Holy
Spirit that I learned it.
I was in ministry we're at asmaller church.
So years ago I learned a lesson, but it was by the Holy Spirit
that I learned it.
In ministry we're at a smallerchurch.
I was a youth pastor and aworship pastor at this church
and I went through a season,like you were saying, tiffany,
of difficulty with people.
So every time I turned aroundit seemed like I was having
(14:42):
trouble with this person on theworship team.
I was having trouble with thisperson on the worship team.
I was having trouble with thisperson in the youth group.
I was having trouble with thisparent of the teen in the youth
group.
I was having trouble with thiscollege student in our young
adult ministry.
Me and Len were having conflictat home.
We had little babies and such,and I just kept thinking to the
(15:04):
Lord.
I mean, it was a season.
I kept praying God, man, allthese people have all this stuff
.
And the Holy Spirit spoke to meand he said what's the common
denominator?
Right, more or less, was who isthe common denominator here?
I was in trouble with all ofthese people.
All of these people were havingtrouble with me.
(15:27):
On some level, I was actuallythe common denominator.
They messed up and they saidthat wrong, and she didn't do
that right, and he didn't showup for work and and me and Lynn,
whatever.
But the issue was I'm wascentral to all of these issues,
and so here I am, spending mytime praying for these other
(15:48):
people to get it right.
Speaker 4 (15:51):
Wow, wow.
Speaker 3 (15:53):
Get their crap in order so that we can work.
Speaker 4 (15:57):
Yeah, you're good.
Speaker 3 (16:00):
The Lord is pointing the finger right at me, saying
bill, you're the commondenominator here, so what are
you going to do about you?
And that goes along with what Iwas just saying.
So I had to take ownership, Ihad to repent, even though, uh,
you know there's a the, thepassage in um proverbs uh, then
(16:20):
the passage in translation saysevery man is in love with his
own opinion.
It's the passage where manmakes his plans, but God
establishes his ways.
Well, in the passage it saysevery man is in love with his
own opinion.
And I'm thinking, wow, itwouldn't be an opinion if we
didn't love it.
I wouldn't have that opinion.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Wow, wow.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
Right.
If I really wasn't in love withthe way I thought about it, I
wouldn't have that opinion, andwhat I was allowing was my
opinions to dominate a situationbecause I felt you should have
acted this way.
I feel like you should haveacted this way, and whether I
was right or wrong wasn't eventhe issue.
It was the condition of myheart.
(17:02):
I was allowing strife in myrelationship.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Pastor Bill.
With that, though, what did Goddo in you during that process?
So, like I hear you saying,like all right, I was a common
denominator, I was hitting thosedifferent things.
What was the adjustment in yourthinking that had to take place
in order for you to shift thatscenario to where you wanted it
to be?
Speaker 3 (17:22):
Yeah, that's a great question, and I don't even know
if it was one thing per se.
First of all, it was merecognizing.
Speaker 4 (17:31):
Fairness is the first key.
Speaker 3 (17:36):
And I remember coming home and telling Lynn that I
think she was probably relievedbecause she was like oh, you're
finally getting it.
You got it.
The first thing was awarenessand the second thing is I
repented, because I believequick repentance.
Man there's no reason to letthis thing linger.
I'm a fool for trying to thinkI could solve it myself or sew
(18:00):
it back together again.
Be quick to repent.
And when I repented, I rememberwhat did happen in my heart was
that I began to look at otherpeople in a different way.
So I didn't look at them withthe problem that they brought to
me constantly.
(18:21):
That annoyed me.
I began to look at them like,well, maybe their situation they
just don't know.
Maybe they're just ignorant.
Maybe they're not aware thatGod really cares about that
circumstance.
Maybe they're ignorant of thesolution.
Maybe I can be a voice in theirlife, a godly voice in their
life, to help them with this,because the way they're reacting
(18:41):
was not the source of theirproblem.
It was just.
You know, the way they wereacting was just a reaction.
And so I began to learn how toteach myself and others how to
respond to things rather thanreact to things.
Speaker 2 (18:59):
Wow, well, and I think a lot of it, you know,
even as you both are talking, isreally laying it down, giving
it to the Lord and saying, lord,have your way, have your way in
that person, have your way inthe situation and have your way
in me.
You know, I share this story.
It's funny.
You know, pastor Bill, you weretalking about the common
denominator and I had that same.
(19:20):
It was like that same cyclewith people and I was sitting in
standing in Giant Eagle, I wasgetting my groceries, the store
was packed and this was afterjust kind of test after test
after test, of the Lord wassaying, okay, how are you going
to handle this situation?
(19:40):
How are you going to handlethis situation?
How are you going to respond tothis situation?
I had my oldest son with me.
We were in the store and therewas this long line.
So I got in line and a womanand I'm trying to get out of
there, I'm not trying to stay inthe store all day and a woman
came right in front of me andjust brought her big old cart
(20:02):
with all of her stuff in thereand the guy in front of me said,
hey, she went there, he went toher and he said listen, she was
in line before you.
Her response was I don't care,we all have to check out.
So I said okay, well, lynn,what did Pastor Lynn?
What did you say?
(20:22):
You said either water or what?
Gasoline, gasoline.
So that's what I'm going tothink about when I'm moving
forward.
I'm going to either say wateror gasoline, and so I could have
put water or gasoline on that.
And I said you know what?
I'm going to choose the waterin that situation.
I'm not going to say anything,I'm going to choose the water.
In that situation, I'm notgoing to say anything, I'm going
to let her come through.
And it was interesting becauseit was actually a giving to God
(20:46):
full situation.
And the guy said to me he saidlisten.
He said come on.
He said come on up.
And he said put on.
And I said what?
And he put.
He said put all your grocerieson there.
And I said are you serious?
He said I'm going to pay forall of your groceries today.
Yes, isn't that amazing.
He said all right, lord, I getit, I'm going to give it to you
(21:08):
all the time, you know, and thatit's just.
it's so important to really giveit to God and ask the Lord okay
, what do you like?
What do I need to do in thissituation?
A lot of times, like you saidbefore, it's like okay, they
need to change.
Even if you're justified, lord,what are you trying to grow in
me and pour out of me in thissituation?
(21:31):
And the thing about that it'snot always easy.
In fact, a lot of the timesit's very difficult.
Speaker 1 (21:39):
It is, you know, pastor Bill and Lynn.
You know, one of the things Ithink about is sometimes what I
have learned to do in my life,whether it's ministry, people,
anything that goes on in myworld.
I always ask God what is themind of Christ in every
circumstance, because you knowwhat if we're not careful?
I can look at my wife.
I can look at my kids and theycan be wrong and I can go to
(22:01):
them and say but they're wrong.
They're wrong.
But God said that's not whatI'm after in this season.
I may be after something in you.
Maybe I'm trying to make youmore patient, Maybe I'm trying
to make you more loving, MaybeI'm making you more kind or
whatever.
Maybe he's trying to get youjust to simply die to things.
But that's something that Ihave learned.
In any situation, I don't careif my car breaks down, if my
money is funny and my change isstrange, it don't matter what it
(22:23):
is.
I'm always asking God what areyou doing?
Because I feel like the quickerI can get to the mind of Christ
, the quicker I can move on fromwhatever circumstance, and
usually if I repent even as yousaid, Pastor Bill, he said
repent that times of refreshingmay come from the Prince of the
Lord.
So what are your thoughts ongetting the mind of Christ in
(22:44):
circumstances that hit yourrelationship?
Speaker 4 (22:47):
I think everything that we go through there's a
lesson that can be learned ifwe're going to start a lesson,
and so I will ask myself thatexact question Okay, what can I
learn from this?
Because I don't want to takethis test again.
Speaker 2 (23:01):
Exactly, that is so true.
Speaker 4 (23:04):
Every thing I go through, I'm going to learn
something, and if I don't learnit, then I have to retake and go
back around that mountain andladies who are watching this
listen to this.
We're not getting any skinniergoing around the same mountain
over and over.
Let's just get to the mountain,learn what we need to learn and
(23:24):
not keep repeating the samethings over and over again.
If you really dive deep, it'sthe same issue, different person
causing it.
So what have I not learned?
That I can get through thisquicker and not have to retake.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
that's right amen amen pastor bill yeah, I mean,
you know we're, we're Ephesianstells us that we have the mind
of Christ.
You know, we're promised themind of Christ.
We're seated um with Christ inheavenly places.
So so in our reality as a we,we are human beings, but we're
also spirit beings, and so thereality is I call it like we
(24:05):
have dual citizenship.
We have citizenship where, youknow, as my passport I have a
United States passport, but myother citizenship is in heavenly
places places.
So I can choose to be thinkingjust in the ways of the world or
I can be thinking in the mindof Christ, which we are freely
(24:27):
given as born-again believers.
I mean, it's not something thatwe strive to attain.
We have the mind of Christ, ourposition is in Christ.
So we just tend to, I think, asChristians, we just tend to go
throughout our day seeing,looking at the visual of just
(24:47):
what's happening in realityright around us, and we're not
even seeing a heavenlyperspective of what's God saying
in this situation.
Why could God be allowing thissituation?
What is the mind of Christ forthe situation?
So if we ask for wisdom, he saysI'm giving it every time.
I'm giving it every timeBecause there are things we ask
(25:11):
for, but we ask amiss, so wedon't get it.
And we spend so much timethinking about what's not being
answered, rather than if we askfor wisdom.
Every time, there's wisdom, andso the Lord will deposit wisdom
when we don't know what to do,because we've all been in
relationships where it's like Ido not even know.
The next thing I say is goingto be wrong regardless.
(25:32):
We've been in that situation.
Things are so tense, sodifficult, it's like I don't
even know what to say.
Well, that's when you need themind of Christ.
That's when you need the wisdomof the Lord on what to say and
when to say it.
I was just looking at ascripture here.
I was reminded of a scripture.
I got to put my glasses on toread it, but in Genesis, it
(25:53):
might be the first time stripesmentioned.
I haven't done a word study onit but in verse, in Genesis,
chapter 13, verse 8, it saysthen Abram so stripes have been
around a long time.
It's said to Lot let there beno strife between you and me,
between your herdsmen or myherdsmen, for we are kinsmen, Is
(26:16):
it not the whole land that'sbefore you and I'm like, wow, I
mean even back in the day.
We're talking about familysituations and they're dividing
up their wealth, their riches,their herds, their families.
We want to remain family.
We know we got to go in twodifferent directions here for
(26:37):
our families to prosper allsorts of situations.
But the prayer that Abram saidis let there be no strife among
us, and not just among me andyou, but our herdsmen, our
families.
Let there be no strife amongany.
That's a powerful prayer whenyou're talking about thousands
of people.
When you're talking about, youknow, thousands of people, yeah.
Speaker 4 (27:01):
Because that reminds me that the strife that we have
is affecting more than just meand him.
Yes, wow, just you and yourhusband.
It's affecting your kids, it'saffecting your friendships, it's
affecting everything.
We tend to feel like we're inthis little bubble, wow,
everything.
We tend to feel like we're inthis little bubble, wow.
What I feel is just about me,but it actually really is about
(27:25):
everyone that you're connectingwith.
They're going to feel.
You've walked into someone'shome and you're like, oh,
something's not right,something's up.
And one of the things that Iknow that the Lord has helped me
to do is that I had to learnthe difference between praying
(27:47):
about my husband and praying formy husband, praying about my
kid.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
That's good though.
Yeah, that is good.
Speaker 4 (27:59):
Praying about your spouse or your kids, you're just
focusing on what's happeningright now, how it's making you
feel, how it's affecting youremotions, but when you pray for,
you're carving the gold out ofthat person and you're seeking
the mind of Christ for thatperson.
(28:20):
What do you see in my husbandthat I need to see?
What do you say about my kidsthat I need to start saying?
You say about my kids that Ineed to start saying it's about
really looking deep into theperson and who that person is in
relative to their relationshipwith the Lord, versus what that
(28:42):
person is doing in relationshipwith yourself.
If we can begin to do that whenwe're in strife with our spouse
or anyone, lord, let me see howyou see this person, because if
I can have your eyes towardsthis person, then I can have
your thoughts towards thisperson.
(29:03):
I can see them the way you seethem and then I can begin to
hear what they're meaning, notnecessarily what they're saying
it changes you.
Speaker 1 (29:16):
Yeah, you know, and with that I'm going to kind of
tie what you guys sharedtogether, because I think many
times, when strife can hit too,it can be a plan of the enemy to
once again to blessing block.
Speaker 2 (29:27):
You know, Pastor.
Speaker 1 (29:27):
Bill, the scripture you mentioned.
That's such a powerfulscripture.
I've preached it several timesand the revelation I got from
that what was really unique iswhen you hit strife, you have to
prefer the other one.
Uh, you got yourself.
Abraham said hey, lot, what youwant, I'll take leftovers.
And he said so obviously, andI'm going to read it just so
everybody kind of catches it.
(29:47):
And he says here in verse 10 alot lifted up his eyes and saw
all the plain of Jordan, that itwas well watered everywhere
before the Lord destroyed Sodomand Gomorrah, like the garden of
the Lord, like the land ofEgypt, as you go towards Zorah.
Then Lot chose for himself.
Notice that Abraham said hey,listen, you go ahead, take
whatever you want.
Lot said I want for me, I wantthis, I want this.
And, as we know the story, lotended up choosing a place that
(30:09):
was going to be destroyed.
But this is what I think isreally unique and why we need
the mind of Christ, even insituations I have learned many
times.
Even in a marriage, she couldbe frustrated about something, I
could be frustrated aboutsomething, but neither one of us
are wrong and we're both notwrong and we're both not all the
way right, you can both have apiece of the puzzle, and what I
(30:30):
mean by that is many times Godis doing something even greater
than you could have imagined.
So God allowed that strife tobe between Abraham and Lot
because once Abraham preferredLot and said hey, you go ahead,
do whatever it is that you'regoing to do.
I think what's really amazinghere is that the Bible says Lot
lifted up his eyes and he sawSodom and Gomorrah and he went
over that way.
But then, after they separatedand got the strife out, then the
(30:52):
Lord said to Abraham, after Lotseparated from him, lift up
your eyes now, look from theplace where you are northward,
southward, eastward and westward, for all the land which you see
, I give to you and yourdescendants forever.
And I could go through the restof it there.
But I think it's really uniquethat once they got the strife
out, lot got a differentperspective.
(31:13):
Then God gave Abraham aperspective and got the promised
land.
So as long as the strife wasthere, the promised land
couldn't come.
And once they got the strifeout, something happened.
Speaker 3 (31:25):
That is so good man.
Speaker 1 (31:27):
I'm going to have to get that sermon.
But I think that's the reasonwhy many times I've learned in
our relationship.
Whenever we start seeing strife, my thing is just like let's
get it out.
Let's get out God.
What are you doing in me,getting the mind of Christ
asking Lord to purge anythingout of my life that needs to be
purged out.
God, what are you doing in herBack to what you said Pastor
Lynn doing in her back to whatyou said, pastor Lynn?
(31:48):
We can't change ourselves, butI've changed the other person,
but we can change ourselves, andthat's the only person we have
power over and that's the onlyperson I believe that God is
looking at, is asking me to lookat me, and when we do that,
something happens.
But I want to transition tosomething real quickly here.
What do you guys do?
Because strife can hit.
Speaker 2 (32:04):
You know this is not all sounds good on paper but
what do you guys do when you getstuck, have you?
Speaker 1 (32:11):
ever gotten stuck?
And what do you do when, likeall right, we're talking, she's
trying to tell me something, I'mtrying to tell her something,
nothing's getting through.
One day's gone by, two daysgone by, three days gone by?
How do you, what do you guys dowhen you get stuck?
If y'all ever get stuck, causey'all look like you may not do
that, so maybe you can help usout, Maybe you can help us out,
get help.
Speaker 4 (32:30):
I think one of the things that we as especially
those of us who've grown up inthe church like literally, like
born on Saturday and church onSunday we have this perspective
that if there's any problems inmy life, I must not have enough
Jesus.
So I got to hide it and pretendlike everything's okay and all
(32:52):
that's doing is, as Bill wouldsay, just kicking the can down
the road rather than justdealing with what's going on and
it's okay.
It's actually beneficial tohave someone in your life that
you know loves your husband justas much as loves me, and that's
(33:12):
the key.
Speaker 1 (33:13):
That's huge.
Speaker 4 (33:14):
Someone in your relationship that you both know
that they love you equally.
I'm not going to go to my momand say all the stuff that Bill
has done, because I will forgiveBill but my money will be
validated for the story that'sright, that's a great point,
pastor Lynn.
(33:34):
We're going to go to someonethat loves us both equally and
say, okay, this is what's goingon and we just need someone to
help us talk through this.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
Yeah, that's so great .
I mean, that's a key.
And we've been blessed withhaving several people in our
lives over different seasons.
I mean, we've been married 28years now, and so in 28 years
we've had different people inour lives that we could go to,
which has been really, really,really helpful.
And then God's blessed us withbeing able to be that for other
(34:11):
people too, you know, and thefunny thing is, sometimes when
we're counseling other couples,people, whatnot, you end up
giving them advice and HolySpirit's thinking to you like,
why don't you do this?
Yeah, that's so good.
I mean, why are you even trythis one?
Put this suit on and it's goingto work.
(34:33):
And we'll laugh at each otherand be like, wow, we're telling
them to do all this.
They'll leave and we'll go, andso we need to do that.
We need to do that in our life.
Speaker 2 (34:44):
Did you ever call somebody and you guys were going
at it and you stuck and then,when they answered the phone
call or got to you, your problemwas over.
Speaker 3 (34:56):
That's good.
It probably has happened.
Nothing comes to mind.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
I've had that several times.
I'll know the problem was over,but we definitely kicked that
can down the road and said, okay, I want to interject in that
because actually in my own world, even as a pastor before I was
married, I went through a realdifficult time early, two
thousands and whatever and Ireally wasn't submitted to
(35:26):
authority the way that I shouldhave been and didn't recognize
it, didn't know it wasn't just Iwas rebellious, just didn't
quite recognize.
I pastoringoring to a leadpastor of a church and I was
just young, anointed to preachbut had no type of understanding
on a lot of things and kind ofgot thrusted in a situation.
So I had this major crash and Iremember all I did.
I understood I need to listen,more, need to listen.
So I got to a point where Ididn't make any decisions
(35:48):
without consulting my authorityand I got to a point where all
of a sudden I was so humbled byit that I would call up my
pastor and be like, hey, listen,I want to do X, y, z, I'm going
through this.
I leave a voicemail and thenall of a sudden, three or four
days would go by, he'd finallyget back to me and like, right,
when he'd get back to me.
God gave me the answer like twohours before, and what the Lord
was showing me in that time,that, even though you need to be
(36:10):
submitted, you're not stuck.
You need to go to the thronebefore you go to the phone, and
so I had to learn that processin my life.
So even in marriagerelationships, sometimes if you
are at a point where you'regetting help from somebody, you
can go to them, go to them, goto them.
But many times we're just notworking.
What?
God said and if we work what Godshows us, it will work.
(36:32):
But sometimes what we do is wewant to go to somebody and fix
our spouse or whatever it mightbe.
But I just wanted to mentionthat because I know several
times in my life where I've seenthat happen.
And then all of a sudden, thebreakthrough hits and I think
what God is showing us is hey,listen, you've got your answers
within you.
You don't always work what yougot.
Work what you got, that's sogood.
Speaker 2 (36:50):
I'm just curious, since we're talking about all
the strife stuff do you rememberyour first argument when you
first got married?
Do you remember what that was?
Speaker 3 (37:00):
Oh, my goodness, see, these are what need the
pre-questions.
Speaker 4 (37:03):
Right.
Speaker 2 (37:05):
You've been married for 20 years.
Yeah, the reason I'm askingthat.
It's interesting how, when youfirst get married, you need all
this and you need him to respondthis way, or you need her to
respond this way, and then it'slike, oh, I don't need that
anymore because you've grown.
But I just think it's sointeresting to find out what one
of the first arguments were.
Speaker 3 (37:27):
Well, it wasn't our first.
I can tell you our firstChristmas argument.
Speaker 2 (37:32):
Oh, okay, I see that, look on her.
I see the look.
Speaker 4 (37:38):
This one I'm still dealing with a little bit.
This was like six months.
Speaker 3 (37:41):
That's why the look yeah, we had been married about
six months and we lived in thisapartment.
And her parents said, hey, hey,what do you guys want for
christmas?
And and um, I said, well, youknow what we really need.
Now I'm telling them this not,lynn, right?
What we really need is a vacuumcleaner, a vacuum cleaner.
(38:05):
And they were like, oh yeah, Igot it.
And I'm thinking, yeah, causethis apartment filled with
carpets everywhere and ourvacuum cleaner is like garbage
and you know, if we just had avacuum cleaner.
So, so we go to Lynn's parents'house for Christmas and they've
got, you know, all these boxesfor me and I'm opening them up
and there's new shirts and tiesand stuff for me to preach in.
(38:28):
You know all this stuff, nicetrench coat, yeah, like I mean
they really it's our firstChristmas, they did really good.
Speaker 4 (38:34):
And then Lynn and I opened my gift and it's a vacuum
cleaner Now oh, did you put agift in it?
I'm not going to know In theconversation about needing a
vacuum cleaner.
Speaker 2 (38:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (38:49):
I get the vacuum cleaner, um and so, yeah, this
every christmas, this is ourconversation.
We'll say, okay, just remember,I like shiny, bright, nice
things yeah right, right, right,right no applying.
Speaker 3 (39:03):
I'll buy that myself you know, and in one year.
So we had a.
We had conflict over that, forsure.
She's like I mean, you're, youknow I don't get nothing for
myself, but I got the housevacuum and then you expect me to
vacuum, so exactly, that'sright.
Um, yeah, and so one year evenit wasn't too many years.
(39:26):
After that, uh, I bought lynn areally, a really nice uh mixer
like you know, a mixer to makebread and all this stuff oh my
goodness, wait, wait who is thisfor?
I said, you know, and it was.
I remember it was.
No, it was kaufman's and it wasnice.
Speaker 4 (39:48):
Well, I thought you'd like to bake like your mom.
Speaker 2 (39:51):
But did everybody hear that she said she didn't
bake.
Right, right, right.
Speaker 3 (39:56):
I wanted her to bake.
So, instead of me buying my ownmixer and learning to bake
myself, I bought her a mixer,expecting her to learn to bake
and put a bow on it.
And then that's when I finallyrealized, okay, there's going to
be, unless she mentions it.
That's when I finally realized,okay, there's going to be,
unless she mentions it there areno appliances for Christmas, so
I got 26 of 20, 28.
(40:17):
Right, it only took twoChristmas she asked for.
She asked for something likeman, I would really like this.
I'll take note and buy that andthat's it.
Well, he buys that.
Speaker 4 (40:29):
And something else.
Speaker 3 (40:30):
But I wanted.
I wanted her to make bread, soI bought her a mixer.
Speaker 2 (40:34):
But I'm buying some of the iron yeah, so they can
iron your clothes, yeah rightright so you know, now that
we're, you know we're.
We're approaching the christmas, we're in the Christmas season.
I would love to know what wasyour best gifts, like most
memorable gifts that you gave toone another.
Speaker 4 (40:57):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (41:00):
I know I'm putting you on the spot, yeah, and it
can be just one of them.
Maybe you have a ton of them,but maybe just one, yeah you
know, the funny thing is with us.
Speaker 4 (41:14):
I think we do more memorable type things for our
anniversary okay, okay then,yeah, we spend most of.
Speaker 3 (41:25):
We buy each other a lot of gifts for christmas,
don't you?
But our, our memory stuff isalways around our anniversary um
, okay yeah.
Yeah.
So if we just want to say gifts, yes, let's do that, yeah, but.
I mean you know there was.
I mean, obviously, every yearChristmas is like these great
(41:49):
you know surprise gifts.
We try to.
We make gifts to make eachother laugh and have a good time
and uh, and then we have someyou know serious gifts that we
need, but the um, you know onewe take a trip every year for
our anniversary and so we'vedone that since year one, so
we've done a lot of them and thekey is that we uh, I mean we
(42:13):
have done.
We have been poor and we'vebeen not so poor, so we've done
a lot.
You know more elaborate tripsor we've done.
Speaker 4 (42:20):
Camping in cabins that you couldn't pay me to be
in.
Speaker 2 (42:23):
Oh, didn't we talk about camping.
Speaker 4 (42:25):
Yeah, we did we talked about camping.
Speaker 2 (42:28):
I wish we had more time because I'd love to go into
that a little bit more.
Okay, no, camping no camping.
Speaker 3 (42:34):
So I've surprised Lynn with several.
Speaker 4 (42:38):
I guess my favorite.
My favorite gift was it was our25th anniversary and he had
gotten me an anniversary ringwith the diamond for every five
years.
Wow, Wow I love that.
And it's on my hand.
(42:59):
Yes, that's probably been mymost like.
I was the most shocked becauseI just didn't expect it and so,
yeah, because we already had a25th anniversary.
Speaker 3 (43:12):
Well, we had a 20th anniversary, a big trip that we
did to europe, uh, which was,which was wonderful.
And then the 25th, lynn waslike hey, don't go overboard on
this one, let's, yeah, plan abig thing for our 30th, let's
25th, let's do.
But I surprised you with thathe surprised me so yeah, it was
really good.
(43:33):
And, um, lyn Lynn bought me forChristmas one year.
Lynn bought me a gold necklacethat you know it wasn't even
about.
You know, I like jewelry and soI wear a lot of jewelry church.
(43:56):
Um that, unbeknownst to me,went to lynn and or she went to
him and she said, hey, I wouldreally like to buy bill this.
But I think at that time we allshe, we only had like 300
dollars or something like thatto be able to spend.
We were young and and um, andshe was like what can you give
me?
And he ends up with her like um, a 1200 necklace for like five
years and just said, don't worryabout it, just bless your
husband.
And so she was able to bless mewith something that I mean she
(44:20):
saved for, sacrificed for, andit was way beyond anything that
I was giving her that year.
And so I still have thatnecklace, I still wear it and it
means something.
So it's not even aboutnecessarily the value of it, but
it was just about thethoughtfulness of her being able
to say, hey, I only got this,what can I get, you know?
And he ended up, you know,blessing our family.
Speaker 1 (44:44):
Wow, that's so cool.
Well, you know it's funny.
We're so glad to have you guysand thank you for taking time to
come and hang out with us andjust to share.
You know I'm getting to knowyou Obviously.
You know I'm getting to knowyou Obviously, you know you guys
a lot more.
And then, like when I came toPittsburgh, you guys were gone
and then we've kind ofreconnected.
But the more I listen to youtalk, the more that I listen to
you guys, your stories, numberone I know you guys have been
(45:05):
through the fire, you've beenrefined, you've been processed.
I understand why God has you.
With the platforms that youhave, you don't have the wisdom
that you guys have unless youhave been processed.
And I so appreciate what youguys share, what you bring to
the table.
Covenant Church of Pittsburgh,along with OA City, is blessed
to have you guys as pastors andI believe you guys are just
(45:27):
hitting the tip of the icebergof what God's going to do in
your life.
And so thank you guys so muchfor your time and for your
wisdom and I'm sure we're goingto probably hit you up somewhere
in 25 to have you guys comeback on again.
We so appreciate you guys, welove you guys and we pray God's
best upon everything that youguys do.
Speaker 3 (45:45):
Thank you so much.
We are very honored.
Hit us up anytime.
We would just love to serve youin any type of capacity that we
can, and you have a greataudience, and so hopefully they
keep cheering you on.
Amen, amen, god bless you guys.
All right, see you.
Speaker 1 (46:05):
So closing thoughts.
Speaker 2 (46:06):
Well, that was so good.
Well, while they were bothtalking, I was taking my own
notes and I think you know it'sinteresting with this strife
thing.
You know you have to be careful.
I know we've talked about thiswhere those special moments the
enemy wants to rob.
So you know you're fightingover things that really don't
(46:27):
matter.
A lot of them really don'tmatter, and at the end of the
day we always talk about this atthe end of the day you're
thinking, once you get throughit, what did I talk about?
So I let all these specialmoments go because of what?
Speaker 1 (46:40):
Nothing really significant, and we have to
remember too the enemy comes tosteal, to kill and to destroy
Thrive is a tactic of the enemyto steal what is valuable, to
kill what's living and destroywhat God is building in your
life, and when you can begin torecognize that you are not each
other's enemy.
Many of you are fighting yourspouse right now and you think
(47:02):
the spouse is the issue, butsometime, as I heard it said
years ago, it's the enemy enemy.
And so sometimes God's tryingto kill that area of your life
that he's trying to get to, sothen it doesn't give place to
the enemy.
You understand that you have togive place to Satan.
There are some things that areattacks and there's sometimes we
give place because of the ownjunk in our own trunk.
(47:23):
Matter of fact, if I had timeI'd go into that on how, when
you're dating, before you gomile high, everybody goes
through baggage check.
The purpose behind dating isbaggage check.
You got to go through TSA.
You got to go through the metaldetect.
You got to hold your hands up.
If they see anything, they'rewinding it, making sure Is there
anything in there?
Why?
Because once we're on the plane, everybody that's on the plane
is in jeopardy, based upon whatyou bring in your baggage.
(47:46):
So it's important that werecognize our own stuff,
otherwise we'll be blaming eachother.
I'll be blaming you for stuffin my past.
You'll be blaming me for stuffin your past.
Speaker 2 (47:53):
We won't get anywhere .
We won't get nowhere, we won'tget anywhere.
And I thought another key thingthat Pastor Lynn said, and I
just want to encourage everybodyas it encouraged- me, we need
to go from a point of prayingabout our spouse to praying for
more.
That is so good.
You know, and I'm sure all ofus, when we go into our prayer
closets we've kind of gone backand forth but some of us get
(48:15):
stuck in the praying about andwe just get stuck there.
Let's go from praying about toreally praying for and
interceding for one another,praying for that spouse to get
that wisdom that he or she needs, to get that strength, to get
that peace, whatever it may be.
Making sure that we are inthere and, ladies, being that,
(48:36):
help me that God has called usto be for our husbands.
Speaker 1 (48:40):
Amen, amen.
So listen, if y'all haveenjoyed this episode, like,
subscribe, follow, share, go toiHeartRadio, go to iTunes,
wherever you get your podcasts,and make sure you follow us,
because we've got a whole lotmore coming.
It's been such a great time.
We wish you guys a wonderfulMerry Christmas.
Keep strife out of yourrelationship.
That's right.
(49:03):
I believe there's peoplewatching even right now that as
you take heed to what you'velearned today you didn't tune in
by happenstance or by accidentbut as you take heed to these
things, there are blessingscoming for you in 25.
There are breakthroughs, thereare open doors.
There are things right now thatare being held up because of
the strife that is in your life.
As you allow strife out, openup the front door, a back door,
every window you got.
Kick strife out.
(49:24):
You are going to welcome theblessing of the Lord into your
life.
I believe that there's healingin relationships that are going
to take place.
Your family members I believethere's somebody listening and
watching right now that thereare family members that God has
called to be saved and theycan't get saved because of the
strife that is in your life.
If you will begin to defeatstrife, take a hold of your
(49:44):
spouse, your boyfriend, yourgirlfriend and say you know what
?
We're not going to fightanymore, even while you're
dating, you're engaged andyou're fighting about what color
flowers you're going to haveand everything else.
Just keep the strife out and asyou do that, god is going to
bless you in a supernatural way.
So we want to pray for you andthen we're going to let you go.
Today, father, in the name ofJesus, we thank you for every
person that has listened, thathas watched, that's tuned in.
Father, we bind the spirit ofstrife.
(50:07):
Father, god, we break it today.
In the name of Jesus, and andLord, we ask right now that your
Holy Spirit would just come inand give wisdom, that we would
not try to change one another,but, lord, we would allow you to
be the author and the finisherof our faith.
Oh God, you started it.
Lord, you'll finish it.
Father, help us to know themind of Christ in every single
(50:28):
circumstance.
And, father, I just pray forhealing, that times of
refreshing would come.
And, lord, that, even as theword was given about Abraham and
Lot, that, lord, god, you wouldcause us to lift up our eyes
and see the inheritance that youhave for our life.
And Father, we thank you.
We give you praise, honor andglory In Jesus' name.
We pray Amen, amen, amen.
Well, god bless you all.
We thank you so much for tuninginto Dimensions, and we'll see
(50:51):
you next time here, where we'retaking you from one level of
glory to the next, in Jesus name.
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I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
Ridiculous History
History is beautiful, brutal and, often, ridiculous. Join Ben Bowlin and Noel Brown as they dive into some of the weirdest stories from across the span of human civilization in Ridiculous History, a podcast by iHeartRadio.