June 11, 2025 • 50 mins
What happens when the expectations placed on schools extend far beyond reading, writing, and arithmetic? Dr. Shelley Jones-Holt discovered the answer through her journey from teacher to superintendent, witnessing firsthand how family dynamics shape educational outcomes. Now, as the architect of a revolutionary framework for family leadership, she's empowering parents to reclaim their crucial role in raising successful, well-adjusted children.
At the heart of Dr. Shelley's approach are the Five Pillars of Courageous Family Leadership: personal leadership (knowing yourself), relational leadership (interacting effectively with others), financial leadership (managing money beyond just spending), home leadership (organizing your household), and professional career leadership (the only pillar where schools should bear primary responsibility). This comprehensive framework provides families with a clear roadmap for intentional parenting that many have never encountered before.
What makes her perspective particularly powerful is her unapologetic focus on serving Black families. Using the "curb cut effect" principle—designing solutions for those facing the greatest challenges creates benefits for everyone—Dr. Shelley developed a framework that's universally applicable while addressing specific needs in communities that have experienced generational difficulties. The mother of eight shares practical wisdom about scheduling individual "dates" with each child, creating family organizational systems, and finding liberation in your forties by releasing perfectionism and prioritizing what truly matters.
Throughout this candid conversation, Dr. Shelley balances profound insights with refreshing humor, especially when discussing the changes women face in their forties ("When—not if—you start to lose your mind during menopause, you're going to want that schedule!"). Her approach to family leadership is both structured and deeply compassionate, recognizing that while none of us received formal training in parenting or self-actualization, we can still excel at both with the right guidance.
Ready to transform your family leadership journey? Visit familylegacy5.com to join Dr. Shelley's upcoming webinar and discover how intentional family leadership can change everything from household harmony to your children's future success.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Hi, I'm Carlene and this is Diva.
Tonight I have a special guestwith me.
She is wow, she has many titlesDr Shelley Jones-Halt.
She's a doctor in education.
She's a leadership speaker.
She also has a family business,which is something I think we
(00:26):
definitely have to dig into,which is your leadership legacy
consulting, I guess, agency.
In a way, like you helpfamilies right With what you do.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Carleen, it's an honor to be here and I'm glad
you found me and that we couldbe on the Divas show.
So what I do is I started outas a teacher I know we were just
talking in the preamble showaround being teachers and having
that gift of wanting to giveback and recognizing that I had
(00:57):
a special talent in being ableto help people other than myself
understand information.
I could take very complexinformation and make it so that
people can learn it andunderstand it, which is
essentially the role of ateacher.
And then I elevated intoleadership and as I traveled
that leadership journey fromteacher to assistant principal,
(01:17):
principal director, all the wayto superintendent, as I traveled
that journey, what I learned isa lot about myself and my own
leadership capacities andcapabilities and what I did and
did not like to do.
But I also learned a lot aboutfamilies, and not only in
starting my own, but in you knowthe result of your family.
Leadership shows up at theschoolhouse every day how you
(01:38):
run your household.
As much as you might think youkeep it at home, trust and
believe it comes to school withyour kids every single day.
And what I found over the yearsis that, not that my family is
perfect.
Please do not think that I'msaying this.
I always have to give thatdisclaimer.
People come and look at myfamily and be like you got your
issues.
Yes, I do, I promise you I do.
(02:00):
But what I noticed is there werea lot of people that did not
have the right priorities forparenting or didn't understand
what their role was as a familyleader and where their role
stopped and the school's rolestarted, or vice versa.
Right, there was almost thismentality like I gave birth to
this human being and then,between the ages of zero and
about four and a half, I did mypart, like they lived, and now
(02:23):
I'm going to turn them over toyou for all of the cultivation
and nurturing that they needuntil they hit 18.
And it's like no, no, no, no,don't work that way.
You know, yes, schools havegotten from just the ABCs and
the one, two, threes to nowfeeding the kids, social,
emotional support after schoolcare, before school care,
clothing, like there's so manydifferent things that we're
(02:44):
asking the schools to do.
And what I realized aftertalking to parents is that they
weren't sure about their job andit became so clear to me and I
was like this is a place where Ican help in the nicest way
possible to say.
Let's be clear about what therole of a family leader is and
how that plays out, and a lot ofthat I learned and was able to
bring to the table because of myrole in educational leadership.
(03:06):
So that's why I have thenonprofit, which focuses on
family leadership andapprenticeship, and
entrepreneurship andhomeownership and all of these
different pieces that make yourfamily run.
That many folks in thecommunities I was working with
didn't understand Right.
And then you also have thispart of my business, which is
being the executive leadershipcoach.
I have served as the CEO ofseveral organizations, so I do
(03:29):
know how that works, and some ofthe tips and tricks of the
trade, but also some of thecharacteristics and growth model
work to coach others to do thesame.
So that's who I am, it's what Ilove to do and I do what I do
in honor and in service of Blackwomen, unapologetically.
I am Blackity, blackity, black,black, black, and I always will
(03:51):
be, and that's, you know who Iam.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
I think that is one thing that differentiates women
in America versus Canada.
We define ourselves as Black,but we're not going to call it
out like that.
I think that's a verystrong-minded Black female woman
that you are and the way youpresent yourself.
You know what I mean, which isimportant because I'm Black
(04:17):
myself and I think the one thingthat a lot of families struggle
with is how they run thehousehold.
And, as someone who lived in ahousehold that was very
dysfunctional, coming out fromthat, it's like I had to learn
to parent myself because Ididn't have, like, the best
(04:41):
parents, and I thought about itthe other day, like how long
it's taken me to get here and tolike get over all the
dysfunction, the trauma andeverything that was happening as
I was growing up and it's notjust me.
It's like how my mother wasprobably raised and then her
mother.
And, like you said, with, whatyou do with your community is
(05:06):
helping families, because itstarts in the home, right, and
they say it takes a village toraise a child, and I believe it
Like if you don't have a strongvillage to help you, it
struggles, like you know, and inmany different facets.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
You're right, it does .
And and I would argue that justas important as having the
village is having a roadmap,because here's the thing you got
a whole lot of people going inthe wrong direction, houston you
now you just got a bigger, morepeople in the problem because
you still have a problem.
You know what I mean and, and Iagree with you, the difference.
I used to live in Michigan,which is right next, obviously
(05:44):
right next to Canada, and thereis a very distinct difference,
especially being from where I'mfrom and why I am so closely
attuned with my identity.
Part of our work in familyleadership is encouraging others
to do the same.
I want my folks to talk aboutand be proud of their heritage,
because that's part of theleadership journey and the
(06:05):
leadership responsibilities offamilies is to teach their
children what is their heritage,where did we come from, what
are our values?
Right, but if you are not evengetting that at home, at least
if you knew that.
Hey, this is what personalleadership is.
At least if my parents, I cango figure it out myself.
And that's where having astructure to what family
(06:27):
leadership is can help even ouryoung people who are in
situations that you kind ofreferenced, where you had no
control over that, you weren'tgoing to be able to do anything
about that, and it may not haveelevated to the level where the
authorities quote unquote needto get involved.
And so you're in this strangeposition where you're not
necessarily getting what youneed emotionally, spiritually,
(06:50):
you know, possibly sometimesphysically, but it's not to such
an extent where you haveoptions of where you can go.
And so what other recourse do wehave other than the power of
the, not just the village, buteducation, and an educated
village that knows this is whatshe's going to get at school,
and I can be assured that thisis what's going to happen, and
(07:13):
this is what I am responsiblefor at home.
And you know, I saw somethingtoday I haven't fact-checked it,
because I saw it literally as Iwas at a stoplight a little bit
before we had this meeting noway, oh my gosh.
But I saw an executive orderfrom our amazing, you know, new
administration that say nowthey're going to give people
(07:34):
permission to whoop the kids inschool again.
Wow, and which kind of made mego again.
I have not fact checked this,please don't get on there.
I'm telling you right now Ihappen to see it at a stoplight.
We're on a call and it'sbringing this to mind, but the
reason it's bringing it to mindis if you still believe that the
school's job is to teach yourchild how to behave and to deal
(07:57):
with whatever behaviors thatyour child brings.
I mean, they're trying to tellus in the strongest way possible
that's not the school's job,and if that thing is real that I
saw today at the stoplight whatit basically means is there's a
whole body of work that we asfamilies need to do, and our
children need to know what thatwork is.
And so that's what we talkabout is the five parts to
(08:21):
family leadership.
Everybody has to do their partin our five.
That's personal leadership,knowing who you are.
Relational leadership Everybodyhas to do their part in our
five.
That's personal leadership,knowing who you are.
Relational leadership, knowinghow to deal with others right,
because that's important.
You also have financialleadership.
You need to know how to dosomething with that money
besides spending.
Spending is one part of thefour-part equation of spend,
(08:42):
budget, invest and save right.
And then you have homeleadership how to turn a house
into a home.
That's an actual skill, likehaving chore charts and you know
knowing when to turn, you knowchange the air filters and who's
going to do the dishes andwho's cooking, like those are
all things you need to organizeand have some leadership of.
And then, finally, there isschool, which is the
(09:04):
professional career leadership.
That's the only thing theschool is supposed to help you
with.
Yet, you know, if I were to putthat on my thumb, people are
trying to hitchhike their waythrough life on school, what the
school is supposed to do.
But it's like, wait a minute.
All these other four are theresponsibilities of the home and
we're, at a certain extent, asan administrator in the schools.
(09:26):
I would hear our teachers andtheir frustration and I feel
them.
And, on the one hand, there's awell, you shouldn't think like
that because that's considered,you know, you don't understand
what they're going through andour job is to teach and that is
one.
Yes, that is true.
But there is also a side of thiswhere it's like, well, is there
some merit to what they'resaying, in that they can only do
(09:47):
their jobs best when theseother pieces that are the
responsibility of the home aretaken care of?
And if nobody's talking aboutwhat that is if no one's sharing
with our families and we can'teven agree on what those things
are in a general sense, because,notice, I didn't say what
religion you had to be in.
I didn't say you know what yoursexuality?
(10:08):
I didn't say anything aboutthat race, nothing.
This is just basics of running,of being a human being right
and being able to lead yourself.
If nobody is talking about that,then no wonder we're so
confused, no wonder there's somuch, so many challenges and, as
the div, we really got to thinkabout how are we going to take
this bull by the horns and goahead and whip it into shape,
(10:31):
because otherwise we're going tokeep losing our kids, losing
our households, and doing what?
Waiting on the government tofix it.
Good luck, right?
Oh, you wait for superman orsuperwoman?
Well, okay, let me know howthat works out.
It's you boo.
Speaker 1 (10:44):
You've got to do it, yeah, yeah, it's that thing
where you got to take care ofyou first before anybody else
like, and even if it's yourfamily and we're talking about
family how to run a householdproperly and education how I
guess they run hand in hand, butI think you obviously have to
educate your children at home.
(11:05):
But before we get any furtherwith that, I am talking to you,
so I think we need to figure outmore about you and what you do
and how you got here.
Right, there's more to Shellythan the organization.
I mean, obviously, kudos to youfor creating this environment.
(11:28):
This is amazing, I think it'sso.
It's so, it's organized.
You are very passionate abouthelping others and making sure
that things are done in acertain way to help.
(11:51):
You know, like you said, blackwomen, black families, and we
always need more help in thatway Cause, like every, a lot of
minority groups struggle, but we, I think, we struggle a lot
more even yes, we do so.
Speaker 2 (12:06):
And let me be clear about why I made, I formulated
this whole ideology around blackfamilies.
And there's a concept known asthe curb cut effect, and what
the curb cut effect is.
It's this idea that if you'retrying to solve a problem, you
want to begin to createsolutions for where the problem
(12:29):
is at its worst, right.
So here's the idea where thewhere it came from is.
Back in the 70s Many folksdon't know that here in the
United States we did not haveyou know how you walk down the
sidewalk and you have those curb, those cuts in the curb, that
where you can like, where carscan come in, or you know, even
on the sidewalk, if you'rewalking and it goes down like.
(12:50):
That wasn't always the case.
That was actually somethingthat had to be fought for.
Um, it came up as uh, throughthe americans with disabilities
act, where people withwheelchairs were saying, hey, we
can't even go down like walkand I and I'm using air quotes
down the street because there'snowhere for us to keep going.
We have to go around and do allthis stuff.
(13:10):
And so the city of Berkeley was, like you know what that sounds
like a huge problem.
Let's consider we're asking foryou to cut the curbs in such a
way where we can walkwheelchairs up, and it was a
huge issue, most likely relatedto most of it related to funding
, because now they were going tohave to, like, cut all these
curbs and you know that wasgoing to cost taxpayers money.
(13:31):
But here's the idea behind thecurb cut effect.
Yes, it was designed andcreated for people with
wheelchairs, but by designing itand creating it for people with
wheelchairs, there are several,many other groups that
benefited.
Imagine people that werewalking with baby strollers,
(13:51):
anybody that's deliveringgroceries or supplies, or
delivery trucks that have topick those dollies up.
You have people that were blindthat now could tell where
things ended, and now they havethe bumps on them where they've
added that on.
And so you have all of thesedifferent tangential impacts
that were really good from that,from the cutting the curb.
But cutting the curb wasdesigned for people with
(14:14):
wheelchairs.
So where am I going with this?
Come back to the issue of why Idesigned my program around
African-Americans andAfrican-American families.
Well, I had the choice oflooking at, possibly, japanese
families, based on the Japaneseinternment camps and what had
happened over the years and howthe Japanese community had to
revive itself.
From there I'm looking atvarious other immigrant groups,
(14:37):
from, you know, jewish groups toAfghan groups, to Armenian
groups.
Like I had all these differentgroups that I could have looked
at, and what it came down to waslooking at how much and how
long the families of a certaingroup had been impacted, and
where did we see the worstimpacts.
(14:58):
And no matter what I looked atas far as the research and I
know I get really nerdy, this ispart of me, is a nerdy research
woman, right, but part of whatI wanted to do, I mean, there
was a part of me that I had thisgut you know, cardiac
assessment, if you will that Ithink Black American families
are going to be the ones I needto focus on the most.
(15:19):
But let me go look and makesure because I don't want to,
you know, inadvertently imply orapply the curb cut effect where
it doesn't work or where it'snot best applied.
There is no other group thathas suffered more direct impact,
more direct targeting fornegative consequences, if you
will, for negativity, thanAfrican-Americans in this
country.
And so it just made sense.
(15:57):
So we just started looking at,well, what are some of the areas
where we have the biggestissues?
So we put all of that out thereand then I wanted to see all
the air like just big categories, because, in order to make
something applicable to all, yes, you focus on that group as the
one with the issues and youwant to point out all the issues
.
Then we categorize them so thatwe can basically talk about
(16:18):
these larger categories, and thelarger categories are
applicable to most, whereas theindividual things are only
applicable to that group.
And so, using the curb cuteffect as the basis, I was able
to look and say, all right,let's pick the group that has
the most impact on theirfamilies and their family
dynamics and have had the mostnegative consequences as a
(16:38):
result, and they're in the worstposition, if you will, as a
result of all this.
And African-Americans came up.
And then, when I looked at thisinternationally whether it was
Germany, canada, mexico therewas definitely a.
If you look at wealth numbersby hue of ethnicity, and so you
(17:02):
notice that the darker the hue,the lower the amount of wealth
for that group, and so that'swhere I was able to do it for
countries like Italy or England,or places where it's a little
bit bigger and it's a little bitmore homogeneous.
And so when I looked at all thatand came up with it, I realized
(17:22):
that you know what my wholegoal in life from my upbringing,
from my parents, from anythingelse has always been wanting to
help and to serve and to dosomething, create something that
can help people be betterpeople.
Can we people better, please,and is there any way I can do to
help?
And when I realized that allthis learning that I've been
(17:44):
doing all these years and I loveto learn, I love like it's just
, it feeds me.
I love to learn and so all thislearning I could now you know
degrees from some veryprestigious universities around
leadership, and now I can applythat to something that was very
near and dear to my heart, likethe family and whoa, like that
just we talked earlier in thepre-show about like finally
(18:06):
feeling like I have somethingthat gives me purpose because,
even though I've ledorganizations, even though I'm a
mom of eight, um, I have a wifeof eight.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
Wow, I mean, I knew you had quite a big family from
what I read, but I didn't.
Oh my goodness.
Wow, how are you here right now?
How is she here?
Speaker 2 (18:26):
and yeah, oh my gosh, they are literally over in the
house waiting on, they'reliterally waiting to be finished
.
Yeah, so they're like oh, mom,you're making meatloaf, right?
So?
Yes, go squish the meatloaf,then I'll be back over here to
do smart work right.
Speaker 1 (18:43):
So the show, this series that I'm working on is
called this, is 40.
And I'm talking to women intheir 40s.
Are you in that wheelhouse?
You know, girl?
Yes, I am, I sure am All right.
Awesome, awesome, that's great.
And you have eight.
How do you do it?
Speaker 2 (19:03):
First of all, we have to be organized, and this is
where the leadership comes in.
My husband and I are partnersand I hate to say it and I keep
harping on it.
We do write things out Likehoney.
I can't figure out who has thisand who has that, who's picking
up who, and we have to havethings mapped out.
And so many families it's likeyou do this at work, Even if
(19:27):
people like the local plumberhas a calendar and a schedule.
I just want y'all to know.
The electrician has a schedule,right.
Whatever blue collar job youcould think of where you're not
thinking that pencil and paperor computers are involved.
I promise you they have thosethings.
Yet somehow, some way, webelieve we can run our family
(19:47):
without having a schedule orsomething, and so that's how we
do it and that's what made meturn a lot of this into a family
work.
Speaker 3 (19:56):
Diva Tonight Glamour for your ears.
This is 40, A FemalePerspective.
Speaker 1 (20:03):
I'm Carlene and this is Diva Tonight, so we were
talking about your family andhow, in order to run a household
, you have to be organized.
You know even the plumber whocomes to fix your faucet.
You know what I mean.
He has a schedule of whichhouses he's going to go to that
day, which is true, you know.
I started watching.
(20:24):
What's her name?
She's like the clutter bug lady.
She's so cool.
Marie.
Kondo?
Yeah, I think so, because shedoes everything based on, like,
the way she organizes people'shomes or she helps organize.
She's on YouTube and she's theclutter bug Because she calls
people yeah.
So pretty much there'sdifferent.
There's the bee the clutter bug, like there's different
(20:47):
personalities.
Yeah, yeah, I know there'sdifferent.
There's the bee the clutter bug, like there's different
personalities.
Yeah, oh, you know.
Yeah, so I mean even her, likeall these things organizing your
pantry.
So I'm learning from her too,because, like, I'm organized but
I'm scatterbrained, so I haveto do certain things too and,
like you said, writing thingsdown is crucial, you know like
with memory, yeah, having a plan, like you know, one of the
(21:11):
things that people ask me, likehaving eight kids, how do you do
it?
Speaker 2 (21:14):
And I said, well, one of the things that we do is we
schedule three dates a year, ifyou will, that are individual
dates that we have with our kids, each of our kids.
So, you know, three times ayear.
We know that.
They know that they're going toget like just us time, and so
it'll be a day maybe we'llsurprise them and go pick them
up.
My husband and I would gettogether and we're like, okay,
well, this is AJ's day, allright, great, and we'll grab
(21:36):
them and we'll go do go-kartsand eat ice cream, and you know,
and then we but the hope, thepurpose of the, but also to have
a conversation with them wherewe're asking them about their
hopes and their dreams and theirgoals and the things that they
feel like they're doing well in,and where we can help them and
(21:59):
support them and do better asparents.
And it's really a beautifulconversation that over time now
we've tried through the programto like codify it so that we can
give people like a list ofquestions and starters to open
up that these kinds ofconversations and make sure that
you plan these moments withyour young people so that you
know who they are, you know howthey've shifted and changed,
(22:21):
like my daughter has wanted tobe a veterinarian.
She's wanted to be.
I think she wants to be allthese things.
She wants to be a chef, apastry chef of some sort, a
veterinarian.
What else did she tell merecently?
Oh yeah, she's going to makecrocks.
You know those decorativecrocks that people have, with
(22:42):
all the bells and whistles andbeads and stuff.
I mean, she has all of thesedreams of what she wants to do,
right, but how.
I wouldn't know that if I reallydidn't take the time to sit and
listen to her and I actuallywrite this stuff down.
And then when we're looking at,all right, where are we going
to do?
What lessons are you going todo?
What sports are you going toplay?
(23:03):
What are you interested in?
What are you interested intheater?
You went like We've got to talkthis out, because if you want to
do drama and this kid wants todo tennis and this kid wants, I
want everybody to be able to dowhat they want to do.
But I need to be able to know,so I can schedule all of this
out and make sure you all getthe experiences that you want.
(23:23):
And also, if you're intosomething, I can look it up.
But we don't really take thatkind of time and I would ask the
audience like, think about itin the last month, how much time
have you taken with any one ofyour kids individually to get to
know where they are, howthey're feeling, what are their
hopes, what are their dreams,what's changed, what are they
(23:43):
excited about for the summer?
And those are the kinds ofthings that I think help us make
the house run, because not onlydo we have a plan and we have
schedules and such, but we alsospend intentional time with each
of our kids and each other tokeep, you know, these leadership
tenets at the forefront.
Speaker 1 (24:03):
Right.
And so with your organizationobviously your household you
organize it as best as you can.
I'm sure you have a planner andeveryone has their set chores
and that kind of thing just tokeep everything going.
But how do you help families?
Do you have workshops?
(24:23):
Because what I see here is thatyou know, when you were talking
earlier about how everythingruns together, like parenting
and how you work on yourfinances, and like how
everything all in one you knowwhat I mean, like your personal
life, your, your financial life,your, your your mental health,
(24:44):
like you know they all kind ofrun together.
So I think, yeah, and so itseems like with your
organization, you help otherfamilies structure their life in
an organized way.
Pretty much right.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
That's pretty much it .
So we do.
I've done several one dayseminars.
So I'll have like church groupsthat'll bring me out, or local
city councils will want to dolike a family day or a family
leadership day for theircommunity, and so they'll bring
me out and I'll do my one-dayworkshop.
And what ends up happening is Iintroduce the concept of family
leadership and then they get alittle booklet to begin to set
(25:22):
goals for their family.
And for some people they're likewell, what is this?
You know, they're kind of likeI'm not sure.
But for many others it's likeoh my gosh, I've never thought
about this, I've never sat hereand said, like what are the
personal leadership goals that Ihave for myself, for my own
health and well-being?
Like we are in our 40s.
(25:43):
If somebody's not going throughmenopause, well, let me tell
you a little.
We can do a whole another showabout what that's going to bring
, but all of us are going to gothrough it.
And let me tell you when youwhen, not if you start to lose
your mind during menopause orpre-menopause you're going to
want that schedule, becauseyou're not going to want to talk
about it.
(26:03):
You're going to want folks toknow what the expectations are.
You're going to want folks tobe able to almost be on
autopilot sometimes becauseyou're dealing with your own
personal summer or your ownpersonal whatever is going on,
because the hormonal changes arehuge and part of the reason I'm
talking about this on this showis because it shows up for us,
(26:24):
especially as women in our 40s,in a very different way when
it's not together and then wewant to look at everybody else,
get upset with everybody elseand not always want to look and
say, well, did I set this upright?
Did I even give people the idea?
Did I even introduce theconversation about?
Did I even set the expectation?
But that's real hard to do whenyour hormones are absolutely
(26:48):
insane and you may not havegotten, you know, your medicine
or whatever it is you need.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
Oh, my goodness, wow, girl, dr Shelly, I'm like blown
away.
I think there was a reason weconnected because I think, like
you said, we are definitelygoing to have more than one
conversation.
Even if it's like we aredefinitely going to have more
than one conversation, even ifit's like like families, for
sure, like it's important tohelp families, but I think, even
like single moms, like how tostructure your household on your
(27:16):
own, you know what I meanBecause, as a black woman, a lot
of black women, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
Yeah, I mean, and that's tough.
I love what you're bringing upbecause you know whether like
that's so.
That's what I do is.
I do workshops with groups thatwant to bring me out.
I also have.
We are just launching ouronline program because I've been
really hesitant about doingthis stuff online, because I do
like that personal connectionwith folks, especially as you
(27:43):
talk about something as intimateand personal as their family.
But we are launching our firstwebinar later this month.
Our next month, and I believeMay 30th, is the.
It's going to be 30th or May31st I'd have to ask my
assistant to the date but we'regoing to launch our first
webinar, to do this in an onlinecourse and so that anybody can
come together and we bringtogether family leaders and when
(28:06):
I tell you it is so beautifulto see folks that go, oh my God,
I thought I was the only oneand you have.
You know a couple in Alabamatalking to a couple in
Washington State, talking to acouple in DC talking to a couple
in Michigan, and you know one'sAsian, one's a lesbian couple,
one's a gay male couple.
Some have kids, some don't.
(28:27):
And we're all talking about howto be better humans.
We're all talking about how tobe better family leaders.
We're all talking about thelove and the struggles and the
challenges, not only to love oneanother, but also sometimes to
love ourselves.
That is powerful, yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
Wow, you are.
You're like answering some ofmy questions.
I mean, like, what roles doescommunity play in your life?
Obviously, it plays many rolesbecause you're bringing many
communities together with yourwith your workshops.
Speaker 2 (28:57):
Right, yeah, that you know, I've always been longing
for in being in America.
It's that being able to have acommunity that really does.
If it can't look like me, atleast it is unapologetically for
me, right.
(29:18):
And if you have both, that's,you know, absolutely fantastic.
And in some of the places andspaces I was in as a leader, I
saw beautiful communities.
Like we don't talk much aboutthe Armenian community, and let
me just tell you, theKardashians are not the Armenian
community, like let's get thatout of our hands, right.
But you know, some of ourRussian, ukrainian communities I
(29:40):
know, right now, that's, youknow a thing, but remember,
there are people who areactually of Russian and
Ukrainian descent.
We don't even talk about, youknow, those kind of, those folks
who have come here, but thecommunity they have with one
another is beautiful, and soI've always longed to be able to
create something for families,to be able to have real
conversations with one anotherand really get to know one
(30:02):
another, and so it plays a hugerole in how I can bring people
together, but also in how Icreate community for my kids.
I want them to see that peoplefrom all walks of life really do
just want what's best for theirfamilies.
We're all going throughsomething and let's not let the
outside tell us who we shouldand should not relate to, love,
(30:25):
connect with.
I think that we need to keepother you know other people out
that business and we decide thatfor ourselves.
So, yeah, I think community ishuge and I would also say, like
being in education, when you'rein a community with people and
their children.
I think there is a lot that youknow we have to appreciate and
love about that, because forsomeone to allow you into their
(30:46):
child's life is one of thegreatest honors, and so I've
always considered it, you know,an honor and a privilege that
parents and community membershave considered me, you know,
worthy to be able to supporttheir kids as their principal or
superintendent, but even now asa family leadership coach and
an executive coach and a supportfor people outside of those
(31:07):
spaces.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Wow yeah, community is so important and and you know
, you know, now that you're inyour forties and you have gotten
to this place in your life, howdo you feel in your life right
now?
Like, I mean, we were talkingabout perimenopause and all
those things, but how do youfeel at this stage in your life?
Speaker 2 (31:28):
I would say, right now I feel a different kind of
freedom and I'm on my way toliberation, and what I mean by
that is I've taken, I'vereleased the need to fix the
things that I now realize I'mnot going to fix.
And maybe it was never my thingto fix Right, Like when I was in
(31:50):
education, like there was apart of me that wholeheartedly
believed that I could almostsingle-handedly, you know, fix
the fact that kids aren'tlearning at high levels in some
of our neediest communities.
Like it nearly killed mebecause that was, I believed in
it so deeply.
And then I had to realize,Sheva, you can't save the world
(32:14):
as much as you would like toLike that's not where God has
called you to be.
And so let's figure out how wecan make this a little bit more
manageable.
And that led to a lot of stress, trying to be perfect, trying
to be this, trying to be that,trying to be the perfect mom,
the perfect wife.
And I think now, in my forties,I've given up any concept of
perfection and I'm like I'm atthe it is what it is stage of my
(32:34):
life.
Right, yeah yeah, honey, I willsay you know I don't want to
curse, but I will.
Man, I'm in my.
You know what it face of liferight now and it's so freeing.
That's what I mean by thefreedom part.
I feel like huh, who releasedthat burden.
I don't know why I put that onin the first place.
(32:56):
That was stupid.
Why did I even do that?
So there's a certain freedom oftrying to release things I
can't control.
And I'm on my way to liberationbecause, now that I've really
wrapped my mind around thethings I can control, I'm now
working on being able to be in aplace of financial and mental
(33:16):
freedom to be able to dowhatever the heck I want, when I
want, how I want to do it, withwho I want to do it with.
And for me, that's mydefinition of liberation, where
I don't have to worry aboutmoney.
I don't have to worry aboutmoney I don't have to worry
about you know time I don't haveto worry about.
If I want to do it, I'll do it.
If I don't want to do it, Iwon't do it, right, that kind of
thing.
And I'm on my way to thatbecause you know what, what only
(33:40):
thing that allows us to do thatis having the finances to be
able to take care of ourlifestyle other than that Right.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
Yeah, it's so true.
One of my mentors told me thatfinancial freedom, you know
that's that's the thing that'sso important.
You know it.
It helps in a lot of ways.
So you know that, saying it'slike with money, we always
people have a hard time talkingabout money.
But yeah, but it is, it isimportant.
You know like you need it toretire, you need it to travel,
(34:15):
and if you, if you don't knowhow to manage it which is like
an ongoing thing for evenpeople- in our community because
we weren't taught that.
I wasn't taught at home aboutfinances.
But the getting back to youroriginal statement of being
liberated, I can feel theliberation in your voice, like
I'm not in the same room withyou but I can hear it.
You know what I mean.
You can hear when that energycomes across and like, even when
(34:36):
you're probably having a badday, you're still going to try
and see the positive side ofthings.
Like you know, we'll try.
We'll try, right.
Speaker 2 (34:45):
Yeah, I love what you just said around, you know,
having the financial literacy tobe able to do that and it not
being something that we share.
But I would also argue that, aswomen at our age, we need to
stop not being comfortabletalking about money Like sister
to sister, woman to woman, youknow, female to female.
(35:06):
We need to recognize that weare not going to get better at
something we're afraid to talkabout.
We're not going to understandthe rules of the game if we're
not even willing to talk aboutthe game.
We're not, and so you know Iget.
I feel you deeply when you saidyou know, we were not always
taught and we don't talk aboutit.
And so how are we ever supposedto learn, how are we ever
(35:28):
supposed to grow, if not only dowe not talk about it, but for
some reason we've made it taboo,almost insulting and
embarrassing to talk about whatyou don't know.
And nothing could be furthernot liberating and I would say
that's one of the pieces of myliberation is that I'm at an age
now where, when I tell you Icould care less, I don't care if
(35:50):
you think the question isstupid, the other person, I
don't know what I'm going to askand I'm going to keep asking
until I figure out what it isyou're talking about, right and
you know, whereas before I mighthave been.
Oh well, they might feel I'mstupid.
Well, hell you stupid forthinking I'm stupid.
Go and think that stupid.
I'm gonna ask my question,right, and you know, I feel like
(36:14):
at this age we're like man,whatever, whereas before we
might've been more concernedAbout what people think.
Speaker 1 (36:21):
Yeah, yeah, it's true , it's so true.
Yes, it is yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
I found out about, especially around the stock
market.
I just started asking peoplewho I thought looked smart
questions about.
I know it sounds insane, likeI'd be at a restaurant somewhere
.
I'm like, hey, you look likeyou invest in the stock market,
do you?
And they'd be like, yeah, I do.
As a matter of fact, I realizedthat Tell me something that I
(36:48):
don't know.
And they would start talkingand I'm like mom, why are you
doing that?
Looks like you got informationthat I could use.
Why wouldn't I?
But I guess that's for me.
Speaker 1 (36:56):
You know what it's so true, I think now I think less
about what people think, likeI've done it too, where I'm in a
line, I'm at the Tim Hortons,and I remember this day like it
was yesterday.
You just made me think of thisother person I met when I was
out too, and I said I'm likeyour daughter's hair is so nice.
And then you know that startedthe, started the conversation,
and I think so I ordered mycoffee, then she went, and then
(37:19):
I ran into her again and she'slike oh, come and meet my mom,
and it turned into this wholeother thing just because I said
something to her when I waswaiting in line at the Tim
Hortons.
Speaker 2 (37:28):
Like I'm telling you so, like and, yeah, you did, you
did good at your people in thatday.
Yeah, I did right, so Right, sodid you.
So did you?
I'm a big daughter of a lot ofpeople, yeah, but yesterday my
husband and I are in Lowe's andwe're with my daughter and I'm
picking out paint colors.
But obviously I'm knee-deep inpaint colors and if any of you
(37:49):
have ever picked a paint color,you know Like we black, right,
and they're all say black ofsome sort, right?
Or you know, take differentshades of white, but I want
whitey, whitey, white, white.
I got ultra white.
Anyway, I'm standing therelooking at you know the purples
at the time and I my husband isstanding right next to me so he
(38:12):
can see behind me, but I can't,and so I'm staying steadily
standing.
I nobody's, saying anything,I'm in my own little world.
Finally, my husband looks over.
He says, hey, you can use yourwords.
Looking at him, like, who areyou talking to?
Apparently a lady had beenstanding there trying to get by.
She says, excuse me okay andthen my husband goes yes, we can
(38:33):
.
All people today we're gonnalearn to people.
Oh my gosh, yeah, you know agood minute.
You know just waiting for.
I was like, and he's like, Iwanted to tell you she gonna be
here a while.
You see, I'm just marinatinglike it's gonna take her a
minute to choose from the 12different purples that y'all
(38:54):
have given her.
So you can stand there if youwant to and not say excuse me,
or you can use your words.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
Oh my gosh, I am actually just envisioning that,
because anyone who's listeningcan relate to that, because
we've all been there when, evenyesterday, when I went to
Walmart and I was packing mystuff and clearly not fast
enough and then the girl likethe next two girls, they were
packing up their stuff and it'slike I wasn't even there.
(39:21):
I'm like do you not see me?
Sometimes I wouldn't even sayanything, but I'm like do you
not see me here, like I'm notdone packing up my stuff, but
you're clearly like doing it asif I'm not even there, right,
and it's like the whole mannersthing, like I'm not even there,
right, and it's like the wholemanners thing.
Speaker 2 (39:37):
Like you can't see me .
Yes, yes, I'm going to need youto quit acting like you or like
you're so scared to justregular people.
Like, let's not let all thisdivisiveness and crap that's
going on in our world Keep usfrom being regular people.
That the hellos.
Goodbyes.
Thank you, excuse me, hi, howare you have a great day?
(39:59):
Like, those things still worky'all, and they're universal
across all identities.
Y'all can't see me saying that,but just know I said that with
my whole chest.
So, like I'm just saying thesethings still work and I think
when we get in our 40s is whenwe finally look around and go I
need y'all, I'm gonna need y'allto stop.
(40:20):
Maybe, and maybe that's theauntie age, like, maybe we've.
It is where we looking ateverybody ready to whoop
everybody, kids, even the grownones, even looking at the grown
man, like boy, don't make me,uh-uh, don't make me take off my
chancla and go.
Don't play with me.
Not today, my friend, andtomorrow don't look good either.
I'm going to need you to peoplebetter.
(40:42):
Excuse me is the word you werelooking for.
Speaker 1 (40:45):
I love that you have to coin the phrase I'm going to
need you to people better.
If only we could say that youknow You're going to have to use
your people skills that yourparents taught you.
Did they teach you you know?
Speaker 2 (40:59):
yeah, it's the soft skills and softies.
I mean we got them.
Come on, I mean maybe it's tothe point where we just need to
make it a gesture, like we justwiggle our fingers together and
be like, okay, soft skills, andwe all know like it's just.
It becomes like the head nod.
Speaker 1 (41:12):
I know what the head nod mean or just that, look you
know, yeah, I'm trying to getthrough.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, try to getthrough.
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (41:27):
Oh my gosh, she's funny.
Speaker 1 (41:28):
Oh, I love it.
I love it.
This is amazing.
Yes, definitely love thisconversation and what you bring
to the table.
So you said you're launchingthe webinar in May, at the end
of next month.
So I mean that'll be exciting.
I think I will.
Depending on what comes withthat whole webinar, I might have
to consider it.
You know, save up my my notpennies anymore, my nickels.
(41:51):
You know what I mean so I canjoin in.
Speaker 2 (41:53):
Yeah, well, hopefully , yes, I mean, that's my goal
(42:19):
and let me just tell you andeverybody else for this first
time it's impact and leaving alegacy, and so this is what I
want to really refine and beable to leave as my gift to the
world, if you will.
It's like here's a frameworkfor how to think about this
thing called family leadershipand if you want and it's just
five very clear pillars that youget to define how you want to
(42:42):
for your family, but I need youto understand that all of them
need to be taken care of and youcannot expect the school, you
cannot default any of theseresponsibilities to the school.
If we want to see, you know,real change happen, if we want
to see real change happen, if wewant to be very proud of what
we have produced Because what Ioften tell people is raising our
(43:04):
families and being our bestself is the one job that we all
have.
It's the most important job,yet it's the job we have the
least training in, it's the jobwe have the least support, the
least amount of guidance to do.
No one taught me how to be meand no one taught me how to
raise these kids, which,honestly, are the two biggest
(43:27):
things in my life and I think,coming to this age and for us to
realize that there is nobodythat can do you better than you,
and there is nobody that Godgave those kids to other than
you and gave that, you know,husband or wife or spouse or
whoever it is that's in yourfamily leadership community,
that's yours, you are an expertin that and so as much as we can
(43:50):
do to be our best at that, youknow, it's definitely going to
be something that I think allpeople it's going to be free to
attend the webinar.
Please, by all means, come heara little bit more about it.
But, most importantly, I wouldencourage you that if you want
to be your best, you, if you'restill struggling with some of
these things, if you're in yourforties and like, look, maybe I
(44:11):
haven't gone through menopauseor I'm starting to, but what she
said about being organized whenyou get in this bad boy, that
hit home in a different way.
And I'm hoping to see you therebecause I'm going to tell you
it does hit in a different way.
And had I not had some of thesestructures in place in my
family as of right now, enteringthis honey, I got my vitamin.
My bag of vitamins is righthere.
(44:32):
Yeah, yeah, I'm a shake.
Speaker 1 (44:33):
Oh my gosh, the whole bag of vitamins thing.
Have you seen, like tia, fromwhat?
There's this thing on instagramfor a while back where she was
like in her 20s she was likedrinking alcohol doing the whole
thing, and now in your 40s it'slike, okay, you have a fruit
table and then all your vitamins, your vitamin d, like.
(44:54):
You see her just like yeah,this is for you.
Speaker 2 (45:00):
With all your vitamins.
Hold on, let me get you here.
That's my best of vitamins thatI have that I have to keep with
me and take every day, and it'severything from the iron to the
B12 to the once a day to thelike you got to.
Yeah, you're right.
You know we start out, we drinkanything.
What's that in that cup?
I don't care, I'll drink it.
(45:20):
Now we're like hold on, is thatorganic?
Is that alkaline water?
Is it what the heck happened tous.
Speaker 1 (45:28):
Oh my gosh, dr Shelly , you make me laugh.
I love it.
That's awesome, awesome.
It's an alkaline water.
Oh my goodness, how much sugaris in that.
Speaker 2 (45:42):
Is it real sugar or is it some of that aspartame
stuff?
Right, like we now got allthese damn questions.
Honey, we drank strawberry hill.
I'm a DJ to act like thatmoonshine.
I'm a DJ, y'all to act likethat moonshine.
Thank you so much.
Y'all was drinking.
There's no beer, toilet water,like if any of y'all went to
(46:04):
them Omega parties back in theday and you joined the Omega
party.
Speaker 1 (46:07):
What is an Omega party?
Oh my goodness so.
Speaker 2 (46:10):
Omega, psi Phi is one of the fraternities that we
have here.
It's actually international now, okay.
So the Omegas when you're incollege you go to these Omegas
and any frat party, like any ofy'all that went to a frat party,
it's a fraternity and they hadtheir special juice, and then
the Sigmas had their juice, andthen you had the PWI
(46:32):
fraternities and sororitieswould have their things.
So my point is any of y'all whowent to college and drank
anything in any of these places,I'm going to need y'all to hush
, because right now we'resitting up here talking about,
is it alkaline, filtered water?
We drink Fiji water.
Oh, that has a little too much.
I'm watching my thighs, I don'tknow.
(46:53):
Look at that.
Y'all serious right now?
But yes, we are.
Speaker 1 (46:59):
We have all the vitamins, the hormones, the oils
, ointments yeah, I mean likenow it's true, though, because
it's like I have to takemagnesium to help me sleep, all
these things are crazy.
Speaker 2 (47:10):
I just you had to start with the biofreeze, or in
the old day they used to call itthe big game.
Like but I wake up and put somebio freeze on it because it
hurts so bad, like nobody tellsus these things.
So no, when I wake up and myback hurts, I don't want to
think about who's cookingbreakfast.
(47:32):
That needs to be on theschedule, because if it is not
my day, I'm not getting up.
That needs to be on theschedule, because if it is not
my day, I'm not getting up.
Speaker 1 (47:39):
Hey, at least now, like you said, maybe you don't,
you, you don't have to get upthat day.
Right, it's on the schedule.
I have to say that I feel likeit's one of those moments where
you said if it's not on theschedule, it's not happening.
Speaker 2 (47:58):
It's not happening.
Girl, that is my coin, and soyou literally will have kids.
My 17-year-old is the worst atit.
He'll go put something on theschedule like 10 minutes before
it is.
So I had to get him one day.
I was taking screenshots of theschedule because he's like mom,
I put it on the schedule, likeno, you didn't.
It was like this is the kind offun you get to have when you
(48:20):
have a tight schedule.
Is now it's like oh, so youthink they're still going to be
teenagers, they're still goingto do stupid stuff it's just now
not going to be unscheduledwhich is so great.
Speaker 1 (48:32):
Oh my gosh, this conversation has been amazing.
But, yes, we will definitelyhave you on the show again to
talk about closer to the dateyeah, like even the webinar, and
then we'll definitely have totalk about menopause, for sure.
There's so much to talk about.
You are definitely what do theysay?
A force to be reckoned with.
There we go right.
Speaker 2 (48:53):
Yes, well, thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (48:59):
It's been a, a girl.
This has been an awesomeconversation.
This has definitely been aconversation I will not forget
and so remind us again.
So the name of the organizationwhere you help other families
get organized is through theleadership nonprofit is um W.
Speaker 2 (49:17):
It's a wwwfamilylegacy5.com.
That is our website,familylegacy5.com, and that's
for the five pillars ofcourageous family leadership,
which is the name of ourintroductory online course, and
it's just an intro to familyleadership, and so if you want
to join us for the webinar,please by all means go to the
(49:40):
website register.
You can also find me onFacebook, on LinkedIn, I believe
, we are also on Twitter, notTwitter, instagram and if all
else fails, just come on over tothe website, send me a message
and yes, you may just get mereplying to come and have a
conversation about how we canbest serve you, your
(50:01):
organization, your community andhelp just help us all be more
intentional about our familyleadership, where we live, where
we learn.
Speaker 1 (50:10):
Definitely.
Thank you again, Dr ShellyJones-Holt.
Speaker 3 (50:15):
Diva Tonight with Carlene will be back.
Send us a message on Instagramat diva underscore tonight.
Hi, I'm Carlene and this is Diva.
Tonight I have a special guestwith me.
She is wow, she has many titlesDr Shelley Jones-Halt.
She's a doctor in education.
She's a leadership speaker.
She also has a family business,which is something I think we
(00:26):
definitely have to dig into,which is your leadership legacy
consulting, I guess, agency.
In a way, like you helpfamilies right With what you do.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Carleen, it's an honor to be here and I'm glad
you found me and that we couldbe on the Divas show.
So what I do is I started outas a teacher I know we were just
talking in the preamble showaround being teachers and having
that gift of wanting to giveback and recognizing that I had
(00:57):
a special talent in being ableto help people other than myself
understand information.
I could take very complexinformation and make it so that
people can learn it andunderstand it, which is
essentially the role of ateacher.
And then I elevated intoleadership and as I traveled
that leadership journey fromteacher to assistant principal,
(01:17):
principal director, all the wayto superintendent, as I traveled
that journey, what I learned isa lot about myself and my own
leadership capacities andcapabilities and what I did and
did not like to do.
But I also learned a lot aboutfamilies, and not only in
starting my own, but in you knowthe result of your family.
Leadership shows up at theschoolhouse every day how you
(01:38):
run your household.
As much as you might think youkeep it at home, trust and
believe it comes to school withyour kids every single day.
And what I found over the yearsis that, not that my family is
perfect.
Please do not think that I'msaying this.
I always have to give thatdisclaimer.
People come and look at myfamily and be like you got your
issues.
Yes, I do, I promise you I do.
(02:00):
But what I noticed is there werea lot of people that did not
have the right priorities forparenting or didn't understand
what their role was as a familyleader and where their role
stopped and the school's rolestarted, or vice versa.
Right, there was almost thismentality like I gave birth to
this human being and then,between the ages of zero and
about four and a half, I did mypart, like they lived, and now
(02:23):
I'm going to turn them over toyou for all of the cultivation
and nurturing that they needuntil they hit 18.
And it's like no, no, no, no,don't work that way.
You know, yes, schools havegotten from just the ABCs and
the one, two, threes to nowfeeding the kids, social,
emotional support after schoolcare, before school care,
clothing, like there's so manydifferent things that we're
(02:44):
asking the schools to do.
And what I realized aftertalking to parents is that they
weren't sure about their job andit became so clear to me and I
was like this is a place where Ican help in the nicest way
possible to say.
Let's be clear about what therole of a family leader is and
how that plays out, and a lot ofthat I learned and was able to
bring to the table because of myrole in educational leadership.
(03:06):
So that's why I have thenonprofit, which focuses on
family leadership andapprenticeship, and
entrepreneurship andhomeownership and all of these
different pieces that make yourfamily run.
That many folks in thecommunities I was working with
didn't understand Right.
And then you also have thispart of my business, which is
being the executive leadershipcoach.
I have served as the CEO ofseveral organizations, so I do
(03:29):
know how that works, and some ofthe tips and tricks of the
trade, but also some of thecharacteristics and growth model
work to coach others to do thesame.
So that's who I am, it's what Ilove to do and I do what I do
in honor and in service of Blackwomen, unapologetically.
I am Blackity, blackity, black,black, black, and I always will
(03:51):
be, and that's, you know who Iam.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
I think that is one thing that differentiates women
in America versus Canada.
We define ourselves as Black,but we're not going to call it
out like that.
I think that's a verystrong-minded Black female woman
that you are and the way youpresent yourself.
You know what I mean, which isimportant because I'm Black
(04:17):
myself and I think the one thingthat a lot of families struggle
with is how they run thehousehold.
And, as someone who lived in ahousehold that was very
dysfunctional, coming out fromthat, it's like I had to learn
to parent myself because Ididn't have, like, the best
(04:41):
parents, and I thought about itthe other day, like how long
it's taken me to get here and tolike get over all the
dysfunction, the trauma andeverything that was happening as
I was growing up and it's notjust me.
It's like how my mother wasprobably raised and then her
mother.
And, like you said, with, whatyou do with your community is
(05:06):
helping families, because itstarts in the home, right, and
they say it takes a village toraise a child, and I believe it
Like if you don't have a strongvillage to help you, it
struggles, like you know, and inmany different facets.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
You're right, it does .
And and I would argue that justas important as having the
village is having a roadmap,because here's the thing you got
a whole lot of people going inthe wrong direction, houston you
now you just got a bigger, morepeople in the problem because
you still have a problem.
You know what I mean and, and Iagree with you, the difference.
I used to live in Michigan,which is right next, obviously
(05:44):
right next to Canada, and thereis a very distinct difference,
especially being from where I'mfrom and why I am so closely
attuned with my identity.
Part of our work in familyleadership is encouraging others
to do the same.
I want my folks to talk aboutand be proud of their heritage,
because that's part of theleadership journey and the
(06:05):
leadership responsibilities offamilies is to teach their
children what is their heritage,where did we come from, what
are our values?
Right, but if you are not evengetting that at home, at least
if you knew that.
Hey, this is what personalleadership is.
At least if my parents, I cango figure it out myself.
And that's where having astructure to what family
(06:27):
leadership is can help even ouryoung people who are in
situations that you kind ofreferenced, where you had no
control over that, you weren'tgoing to be able to do anything
about that, and it may not haveelevated to the level where the
authorities quote unquote needto get involved.
And so you're in this strangeposition where you're not
necessarily getting what youneed emotionally, spiritually,
(06:50):
you know, possibly sometimesphysically, but it's not to such
an extent where you haveoptions of where you can go.
And so what other recourse do wehave other than the power of
the, not just the village, buteducation, and an educated
village that knows this is whatshe's going to get at school,
and I can be assured that thisis what's going to happen, and
(07:13):
this is what I am responsiblefor at home.
And you know, I saw somethingtoday I haven't fact-checked it,
because I saw it literally as Iwas at a stoplight a little bit
before we had this meeting noway, oh my gosh.
But I saw an executive orderfrom our amazing, you know, new
administration that say nowthey're going to give people
(07:34):
permission to whoop the kids inschool again.
Wow, and which kind of made mego again.
I have not fact checked this,please don't get on there.
I'm telling you right now Ihappen to see it at a stoplight.
We're on a call and it'sbringing this to mind, but the
reason it's bringing it to mindis if you still believe that the
school's job is to teach yourchild how to behave and to deal
(07:57):
with whatever behaviors thatyour child brings.
I mean, they're trying to tellus in the strongest way possible
that's not the school's job,and if that thing is real that I
saw today at the stoplight whatit basically means is there's a
whole body of work that we asfamilies need to do, and our
children need to know what thatwork is.
And so that's what we talkabout is the five parts to
(08:21):
family leadership.
Everybody has to do their partin our five.
That's personal leadership,knowing who you are.
Relational leadership Everybodyhas to do their part in our
five.
That's personal leadership,knowing who you are.
Relational leadership, knowinghow to deal with others right,
because that's important.
You also have financialleadership.
You need to know how to dosomething with that money
besides spending.
Spending is one part of thefour-part equation of spend,
(08:42):
budget, invest and save right.
And then you have homeleadership how to turn a house
into a home.
That's an actual skill, likehaving chore charts and you know
knowing when to turn, you knowchange the air filters and who's
going to do the dishes andwho's cooking, like those are
all things you need to organizeand have some leadership of.
And then, finally, there isschool, which is the
(09:04):
professional career leadership.
That's the only thing theschool is supposed to help you
with.
Yet, you know, if I were to putthat on my thumb, people are
trying to hitchhike their waythrough life on school, what the
school is supposed to do.
But it's like, wait a minute.
All these other four are theresponsibilities of the home and
we're, at a certain extent, asan administrator in the schools.
(09:26):
I would hear our teachers andtheir frustration and I feel
them.
And, on the one hand, there's awell, you shouldn't think like
that because that's considered,you know, you don't understand
what they're going through andour job is to teach and that is
one.
Yes, that is true.
But there is also a side of thiswhere it's like, well, is there
some merit to what they'resaying, in that they can only do
(09:47):
their jobs best when theseother pieces that are the
responsibility of the home aretaken care of?
And if nobody's talking aboutwhat that is if no one's sharing
with our families and we can'teven agree on what those things
are in a general sense, because,notice, I didn't say what
religion you had to be in.
I didn't say you know what yoursexuality?
(10:08):
I didn't say anything aboutthat race, nothing.
This is just basics of running,of being a human being right
and being able to lead yourself.
If nobody is talking about that,then no wonder we're so
confused, no wonder there's somuch, so many challenges and, as
the div, we really got to thinkabout how are we going to take
this bull by the horns and goahead and whip it into shape,
(10:31):
because otherwise we're going tokeep losing our kids, losing
our households, and doing what?
Waiting on the government tofix it.
Good luck, right?
Oh, you wait for superman orsuperwoman?
Well, okay, let me know howthat works out.
It's you boo.
Speaker 1 (10:44):
You've got to do it, yeah, yeah, it's that thing
where you got to take care ofyou first before anybody else
like, and even if it's yourfamily and we're talking about
family how to run a householdproperly and education how I
guess they run hand in hand, butI think you obviously have to
educate your children at home.
(11:05):
But before we get any furtherwith that, I am talking to you,
so I think we need to figure outmore about you and what you do
and how you got here.
Right, there's more to Shellythan the organization.
I mean, obviously, kudos to youfor creating this environment.
(11:28):
This is amazing, I think it'sso.
It's so, it's organized.
You are very passionate abouthelping others and making sure
that things are done in acertain way to help.
(11:51):
You know, like you said, blackwomen, black families, and we
always need more help in thatway Cause, like every, a lot of
minority groups struggle, but we, I think, we struggle a lot
more even yes, we do so.
Speaker 2 (12:06):
And let me be clear about why I made, I formulated
this whole ideology around blackfamilies.
And there's a concept known asthe curb cut effect, and what
the curb cut effect is.
It's this idea that if you'retrying to solve a problem, you
want to begin to createsolutions for where the problem
(12:29):
is at its worst, right.
So here's the idea where thewhere it came from is.
Back in the 70s Many folksdon't know that here in the
United States we did not haveyou know how you walk down the
sidewalk and you have those curb, those cuts in the curb, that
where you can like, where carscan come in, or you know, even
on the sidewalk, if you'rewalking and it goes down like.
(12:50):
That wasn't always the case.
That was actually somethingthat had to be fought for.
Um, it came up as uh, throughthe americans with disabilities
act, where people withwheelchairs were saying, hey, we
can't even go down like walkand I and I'm using air quotes
down the street because there'snowhere for us to keep going.
We have to go around and do allthis stuff.
(13:10):
And so the city of Berkeley was, like you know what that sounds
like a huge problem.
Let's consider we're asking foryou to cut the curbs in such a
way where we can walkwheelchairs up, and it was a
huge issue, most likely relatedto most of it related to funding
, because now they were going tohave to, like, cut all these
curbs and you know that wasgoing to cost taxpayers money.
(13:31):
But here's the idea behind thecurb cut effect.
Yes, it was designed andcreated for people with
wheelchairs, but by designing itand creating it for people with
wheelchairs, there are several,many other groups that
benefited.
Imagine people that werewalking with baby strollers,
(13:51):
anybody that's deliveringgroceries or supplies, or
delivery trucks that have topick those dollies up.
You have people that were blindthat now could tell where
things ended, and now they havethe bumps on them where they've
added that on.
And so you have all of thesedifferent tangential impacts
that were really good from that,from the cutting the curb.
But cutting the curb wasdesigned for people with
(14:14):
wheelchairs.
So where am I going with this?
Come back to the issue of why Idesigned my program around
African-Americans andAfrican-American families.
Well, I had the choice oflooking at, possibly, japanese
families, based on the Japaneseinternment camps and what had
happened over the years and howthe Japanese community had to
revive itself.
From there I'm looking atvarious other immigrant groups,
(14:37):
from, you know, jewish groups toAfghan groups, to Armenian
groups.
Like I had all these differentgroups that I could have looked
at, and what it came down to waslooking at how much and how
long the families of a certaingroup had been impacted, and
where did we see the worstimpacts.
(14:58):
And no matter what I looked atas far as the research and I
know I get really nerdy, this ispart of me, is a nerdy research
woman, right, but part of whatI wanted to do, I mean, there
was a part of me that I had thisgut you know, cardiac
assessment, if you will that Ithink Black American families
are going to be the ones I needto focus on the most.
(15:19):
But let me go look and makesure because I don't want to,
you know, inadvertently imply orapply the curb cut effect where
it doesn't work or where it'snot best applied.
There is no other group thathas suffered more direct impact,
more direct targeting fornegative consequences, if you
will, for negativity, thanAfrican-Americans in this
country.
And so it just made sense.
(15:57):
So we just started looking at,well, what are some of the areas
where we have the biggestissues?
So we put all of that out thereand then I wanted to see all
the air like just big categories, because, in order to make
something applicable to all, yes, you focus on that group as the
one with the issues and youwant to point out all the issues
.
Then we categorize them so thatwe can basically talk about
(16:18):
these larger categories, and thelarger categories are
applicable to most, whereas theindividual things are only
applicable to that group.
And so, using the curb cuteffect as the basis, I was able
to look and say, all right,let's pick the group that has
the most impact on theirfamilies and their family
dynamics and have had the mostnegative consequences as a
(16:38):
result, and they're in the worstposition, if you will, as a
result of all this.
And African-Americans came up.
And then, when I looked at thisinternationally whether it was
Germany, canada, mexico therewas definitely a.
If you look at wealth numbersby hue of ethnicity, and so you
(17:02):
notice that the darker the hue,the lower the amount of wealth
for that group, and so that'swhere I was able to do it for
countries like Italy or England,or places where it's a little
bit bigger and it's a little bitmore homogeneous.
And so when I looked at all thatand came up with it, I realized
(17:22):
that you know what my wholegoal in life from my upbringing,
from my parents, from anythingelse has always been wanting to
help and to serve and to dosomething, create something that
can help people be betterpeople.
Can we people better, please,and is there any way I can do to
help?
And when I realized that allthis learning that I've been
(17:44):
doing all these years and I loveto learn, I love like it's just
, it feeds me.
I love to learn and so all thislearning I could now you know
degrees from some veryprestigious universities around
leadership, and now I can applythat to something that was very
near and dear to my heart, likethe family and whoa, like that
just we talked earlier in thepre-show about like finally
(18:06):
feeling like I have somethingthat gives me purpose because,
even though I've ledorganizations, even though I'm a
mom of eight, um, I have a wifeof eight.
Speaker 1 (18:14):
Wow, I mean, I knew you had quite a big family from
what I read, but I didn't.
Oh my goodness.
Wow, how are you here right now?
How is she here?
Speaker 2 (18:26):
and yeah, oh my gosh, they are literally over in the
house waiting on, they'reliterally waiting to be finished
.
Yeah, so they're like oh, mom,you're making meatloaf, right?
So?
Yes, go squish the meatloaf,then I'll be back over here to
do smart work right.
Speaker 1 (18:43):
So the show, this series that I'm working on is
called this, is 40.
And I'm talking to women intheir 40s.
Are you in that wheelhouse?
You know, girl?
Yes, I am, I sure am All right.
Awesome, awesome, that's great.
And you have eight.
How do you do it?
Speaker 2 (19:03):
First of all, we have to be organized, and this is
where the leadership comes in.
My husband and I are partnersand I hate to say it and I keep
harping on it.
We do write things out Likehoney.
I can't figure out who has thisand who has that, who's picking
up who, and we have to havethings mapped out.
And so many families it's likeyou do this at work, Even if
(19:27):
people like the local plumberhas a calendar and a schedule.
I just want y'all to know.
The electrician has a schedule,right.
Whatever blue collar job youcould think of where you're not
thinking that pencil and paperor computers are involved.
I promise you they have thosethings.
Yet somehow, some way, webelieve we can run our family
(19:47):
without having a schedule orsomething, and so that's how we
do it and that's what made meturn a lot of this into a family
work.
Speaker 3 (19:56):
Diva Tonight Glamour for your ears.
This is 40, A FemalePerspective.
Speaker 1 (20:03):
I'm Carlene and this is Diva Tonight, so we were
talking about your family andhow, in order to run a household
, you have to be organized.
You know even the plumber whocomes to fix your faucet.
You know what I mean.
He has a schedule of whichhouses he's going to go to that
day, which is true, you know.
I started watching.
(20:24):
What's her name?
She's like the clutter bug lady.
She's so cool.
Marie.
Kondo?
Yeah, I think so, because shedoes everything based on, like,
the way she organizes people'shomes or she helps organize.
She's on YouTube and she's theclutter bug Because she calls
people yeah.
So pretty much there'sdifferent.
There's the bee the clutter bug, like there's different
(20:47):
personalities.
Yeah, yeah, I know there'sdifferent.
There's the bee the clutter bug, like there's different
personalities.
Yeah, oh, you know.
Yeah, so I mean even her, likeall these things organizing your
pantry.
So I'm learning from her too,because, like, I'm organized but
I'm scatterbrained, so I haveto do certain things too and,
like you said, writing thingsdown is crucial, you know like
with memory, yeah, having a plan, like you know, one of the
(21:11):
things that people ask me, likehaving eight kids, how do you do
it?
Speaker 2 (21:14):
And I said, well, one of the things that we do is we
schedule three dates a year, ifyou will, that are individual
dates that we have with our kids, each of our kids.
So, you know, three times ayear.
We know that.
They know that they're going toget like just us time, and so
it'll be a day maybe we'llsurprise them and go pick them
up.
My husband and I would gettogether and we're like, okay,
well, this is AJ's day, allright, great, and we'll grab
(21:36):
them and we'll go do go-kartsand eat ice cream, and you know,
and then we but the hope, thepurpose of the, but also to have
a conversation with them wherewe're asking them about their
hopes and their dreams and theirgoals and the things that they
feel like they're doing well in,and where we can help them and
(21:59):
support them and do better asparents.
And it's really a beautifulconversation that over time now
we've tried through the programto like codify it so that we can
give people like a list ofquestions and starters to open
up that these kinds ofconversations and make sure that
you plan these moments withyour young people so that you
know who they are, you know howthey've shifted and changed,
(22:21):
like my daughter has wanted tobe a veterinarian.
She's wanted to be.
I think she wants to be allthese things.
She wants to be a chef, apastry chef of some sort, a
veterinarian.
What else did she tell merecently?
Oh yeah, she's going to makecrocks.
You know those decorativecrocks that people have, with
(22:42):
all the bells and whistles andbeads and stuff.
I mean, she has all of thesedreams of what she wants to do,
right, but how.
I wouldn't know that if I reallydidn't take the time to sit and
listen to her and I actuallywrite this stuff down.
And then when we're looking at,all right, where are we going
to do?
What lessons are you going todo?
What sports are you going toplay?
(23:03):
What are you interested in?
What are you interested intheater?
You went like We've got to talkthis out, because if you want to
do drama and this kid wants todo tennis and this kid wants, I
want everybody to be able to dowhat they want to do.
But I need to be able to know,so I can schedule all of this
out and make sure you all getthe experiences that you want.
(23:23):
And also, if you're intosomething, I can look it up.
But we don't really take thatkind of time and I would ask the
audience like, think about itin the last month, how much time
have you taken with any one ofyour kids individually to get to
know where they are, howthey're feeling, what are their
hopes, what are their dreams,what's changed, what are they
(23:43):
excited about for the summer?
And those are the kinds ofthings that I think help us make
the house run, because not onlydo we have a plan and we have
schedules and such, but we alsospend intentional time with each
of our kids and each other tokeep, you know, these leadership
tenets at the forefront.
Speaker 1 (24:03):
Right.
And so with your organizationobviously your household you
organize it as best as you can.
I'm sure you have a planner andeveryone has their set chores
and that kind of thing just tokeep everything going.
But how do you help families?
Do you have workshops?
(24:23):
Because what I see here is thatyou know, when you were talking
earlier about how everythingruns together, like parenting
and how you work on yourfinances, and like how
everything all in one you knowwhat I mean, like your personal
life, your, your financial life,your, your your mental health,
(24:44):
like you know they all kind ofrun together.
So I think, yeah, and so itseems like with your
organization, you help otherfamilies structure their life in
an organized way.
Pretty much right.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
That's pretty much it .
So we do.
I've done several one dayseminars.
So I'll have like church groupsthat'll bring me out, or local
city councils will want to dolike a family day or a family
leadership day for theircommunity, and so they'll bring
me out and I'll do my one-dayworkshop.
And what ends up happening is Iintroduce the concept of family
leadership and then they get alittle booklet to begin to set
(25:22):
goals for their family.
And for some people they're likewell, what is this?
You know, they're kind of likeI'm not sure.
But for many others it's likeoh my gosh, I've never thought
about this, I've never sat hereand said, like what are the
personal leadership goals that Ihave for myself, for my own
health and well-being?
Like we are in our 40s.
(25:43):
If somebody's not going throughmenopause, well, let me tell
you a little.
We can do a whole another showabout what that's going to bring
, but all of us are going to gothrough it.
And let me tell you when youwhen, not if you start to lose
your mind during menopause orpre-menopause you're going to
want that schedule, becauseyou're not going to want to talk
about it.
(26:03):
You're going to want folks toknow what the expectations are.
You're going to want folks tobe able to almost be on
autopilot sometimes becauseyou're dealing with your own
personal summer or your ownpersonal whatever is going on,
because the hormonal changes arehuge and part of the reason I'm
talking about this on this showis because it shows up for us,
(26:24):
especially as women in our 40s,in a very different way when
it's not together and then wewant to look at everybody else,
get upset with everybody elseand not always want to look and
say, well, did I set this upright?
Did I even give people the idea?
Did I even introduce theconversation about?
Did I even set the expectation?
But that's real hard to do whenyour hormones are absolutely
(26:48):
insane and you may not havegotten, you know, your medicine
or whatever it is you need.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
Oh, my goodness, wow, girl, dr Shelly, I'm like blown
away.
I think there was a reason weconnected because I think, like
you said, we are definitelygoing to have more than one
conversation.
Even if it's like we aredefinitely going to have more
than one conversation, even ifit's like like families, for
sure, like it's important tohelp families, but I think, even
like single moms, like how tostructure your household on your
(27:16):
own, you know what I meanBecause, as a black woman, a lot
of black women, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
Yeah, I mean, and that's tough.
I love what you're bringing upbecause you know whether like
that's so.
That's what I do is.
I do workshops with groups thatwant to bring me out.
I also have.
We are just launching ouronline program because I've been
really hesitant about doingthis stuff online, because I do
like that personal connectionwith folks, especially as you
(27:43):
talk about something as intimateand personal as their family.
But we are launching our firstwebinar later this month.
Our next month, and I believeMay 30th, is the.
It's going to be 30th or May31st I'd have to ask my
assistant to the date but we'regoing to launch our first
webinar, to do this in an onlinecourse and so that anybody can
come together and we bringtogether family leaders and when
(28:06):
I tell you it is so beautifulto see folks that go, oh my God,
I thought I was the only oneand you have.
You know a couple in Alabamatalking to a couple in
Washington State, talking to acouple in DC talking to a couple
in Michigan, and you know one'sAsian, one's a lesbian couple,
one's a gay male couple.
Some have kids, some don't.
(28:27):
And we're all talking about howto be better humans.
We're all talking about how tobe better family leaders.
We're all talking about thelove and the struggles and the
challenges, not only to love oneanother, but also sometimes to
love ourselves.
That is powerful, yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
Wow, you are.
You're like answering some ofmy questions.
I mean, like, what roles doescommunity play in your life?
Obviously, it plays many rolesbecause you're bringing many
communities together with yourwith your workshops.
Speaker 2 (28:57):
Right, yeah, that you know, I've always been longing
for in being in America.
It's that being able to have acommunity that really does.
If it can't look like me, atleast it is unapologetically for
me, right.
(29:18):
And if you have both, that's,you know, absolutely fantastic.
And in some of the places andspaces I was in as a leader, I
saw beautiful communities.
Like we don't talk much aboutthe Armenian community, and let
me just tell you, theKardashians are not the Armenian
community, like let's get thatout of our hands, right.
But you know, some of ourRussian, ukrainian communities I
(29:40):
know, right now, that's, youknow a thing, but remember,
there are people who areactually of Russian and
Ukrainian descent.
We don't even talk about, youknow, those kind of, those folks
who have come here, but thecommunity they have with one
another is beautiful, and soI've always longed to be able to
create something for families,to be able to have real
conversations with one anotherand really get to know one
(30:02):
another, and so it plays a hugerole in how I can bring people
together, but also in how Icreate community for my kids.
I want them to see that peoplefrom all walks of life really do
just want what's best for theirfamilies.
We're all going throughsomething and let's not let the
outside tell us who we shouldand should not relate to, love,
(30:25):
connect with.
I think that we need to keepother you know other people out
that business and we decide thatfor ourselves.
So, yeah, I think community ishuge and I would also say, like
being in education, when you'rein a community with people and
their children.
I think there is a lot that youknow we have to appreciate and
love about that, because forsomeone to allow you into their
(30:46):
child's life is one of thegreatest honors, and so I've
always considered it, you know,an honor and a privilege that
parents and community membershave considered me, you know,
worthy to be able to supporttheir kids as their principal or
superintendent, but even now asa family leadership coach and
an executive coach and a supportfor people outside of those
(31:07):
spaces.
Speaker 1 (31:15):
Wow yeah, community is so important and and you know
, you know, now that you're inyour forties and you have gotten
to this place in your life, howdo you feel in your life right
now?
Like, I mean, we were talkingabout perimenopause and all
those things, but how do youfeel at this stage in your life?
Speaker 2 (31:28):
I would say, right now I feel a different kind of
freedom and I'm on my way toliberation, and what I mean by
that is I've taken, I'vereleased the need to fix the
things that I now realize I'mnot going to fix.
And maybe it was never my thingto fix Right, Like when I was in
(31:50):
education, like there was apart of me that wholeheartedly
believed that I could almostsingle-handedly, you know, fix
the fact that kids aren'tlearning at high levels in some
of our neediest communities.
Like it nearly killed mebecause that was, I believed in
it so deeply.
And then I had to realize,Sheva, you can't save the world
(32:14):
as much as you would like toLike that's not where God has
called you to be.
And so let's figure out how wecan make this a little bit more
manageable.
And that led to a lot of stress, trying to be perfect, trying
to be this, trying to be that,trying to be the perfect mom,
the perfect wife.
And I think now, in my forties,I've given up any concept of
perfection and I'm like I'm atthe it is what it is stage of my
(32:34):
life.
Right, yeah yeah, honey, I willsay you know I don't want to
curse, but I will.
Man, I'm in my.
You know what it face of liferight now and it's so freeing.
That's what I mean by thefreedom part.
I feel like huh, who releasedthat burden.
I don't know why I put that onin the first place.
(32:56):
That was stupid.
Why did I even do that?
So there's a certain freedom oftrying to release things I
can't control.
And I'm on my way to liberationbecause, now that I've really
wrapped my mind around thethings I can control, I'm now
working on being able to be in aplace of financial and mental
(33:16):
freedom to be able to dowhatever the heck I want, when I
want, how I want to do it, withwho I want to do it with.
And for me, that's mydefinition of liberation, where
I don't have to worry aboutmoney.
I don't have to worry aboutmoney I don't have to worry
about you know time I don't haveto worry about.
If I want to do it, I'll do it.
If I don't want to do it, Iwon't do it, right, that kind of
thing.
And I'm on my way to thatbecause you know what, what only
(33:40):
thing that allows us to do thatis having the finances to be
able to take care of ourlifestyle other than that Right.
Speaker 1 (33:45):
Yeah, it's so true.
One of my mentors told me thatfinancial freedom, you know
that's that's the thing that'sso important.
You know it.
It helps in a lot of ways.
So you know that, saying it'slike with money, we always
people have a hard time talkingabout money.
But yeah, but it is, it isimportant.
You know like you need it toretire, you need it to travel,
(34:15):
and if you, if you don't knowhow to manage it which is like
an ongoing thing for evenpeople- in our community because
we weren't taught that.
I wasn't taught at home aboutfinances.
But the getting back to youroriginal statement of being
liberated, I can feel theliberation in your voice, like
I'm not in the same room withyou but I can hear it.
You know what I mean.
You can hear when that energycomes across and like, even when
(34:36):
you're probably having a badday, you're still going to try
and see the positive side ofthings.
Like you know, we'll try.
We'll try, right.
Speaker 2 (34:45):
Yeah, I love what you just said around, you know,
having the financial literacy tobe able to do that and it not
being something that we share.
But I would also argue that, aswomen at our age, we need to
stop not being comfortabletalking about money Like sister
to sister, woman to woman, youknow, female to female.
(35:06):
We need to recognize that weare not going to get better at
something we're afraid to talkabout.
We're not going to understandthe rules of the game if we're
not even willing to talk aboutthe game.
We're not, and so you know Iget.
I feel you deeply when you saidyou know, we were not always
taught and we don't talk aboutit.
And so how are we ever supposedto learn, how are we ever
(35:28):
supposed to grow, if not only dowe not talk about it, but for
some reason we've made it taboo,almost insulting and
embarrassing to talk about whatyou don't know.
And nothing could be furthernot liberating and I would say
that's one of the pieces of myliberation is that I'm at an age
now where, when I tell you Icould care less, I don't care if
(35:50):
you think the question isstupid, the other person, I
don't know what I'm going to askand I'm going to keep asking
until I figure out what it isyou're talking about, right and
you know, whereas before I mighthave been.
Oh well, they might feel I'mstupid.
Well, hell you stupid forthinking I'm stupid.
Go and think that stupid.
I'm gonna ask my question,right, and you know, I feel like
(36:14):
at this age we're like man,whatever, whereas before we
might've been more concernedAbout what people think.
Speaker 1 (36:21):
Yeah, yeah, it's true , it's so true.
Yes, it is yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:26):
I found out about, especially around the stock
market.
I just started asking peoplewho I thought looked smart
questions about.
I know it sounds insane, likeI'd be at a restaurant somewhere
.
I'm like, hey, you look likeyou invest in the stock market,
do you?
And they'd be like, yeah, I do.
As a matter of fact, I realizedthat Tell me something that I
(36:48):
don't know.
And they would start talkingand I'm like mom, why are you
doing that?
Looks like you got informationthat I could use.
Why wouldn't I?
But I guess that's for me.
Speaker 1 (36:56):
You know what it's so true, I think now I think less
about what people think, likeI've done it too, where I'm in a
line, I'm at the Tim Hortons,and I remember this day like it
was yesterday.
You just made me think of thisother person I met when I was
out too, and I said I'm likeyour daughter's hair is so nice.
And then you know that startedthe, started the conversation,
and I think so I ordered mycoffee, then she went, and then
(37:19):
I ran into her again and she'slike oh, come and meet my mom,
and it turned into this wholeother thing just because I said
something to her when I waswaiting in line at the Tim
Hortons.
Speaker 2 (37:28):
Like I'm telling you so, like and, yeah, you did, you
did good at your people in thatday.
Yeah, I did right, so Right, sodid you.
So did you?
I'm a big daughter of a lot ofpeople, yeah, but yesterday my
husband and I are in Lowe's andwe're with my daughter and I'm
picking out paint colors.
But obviously I'm knee-deep inpaint colors and if any of you
(37:49):
have ever picked a paint color,you know Like we black, right,
and they're all say black ofsome sort, right?
Or you know, take differentshades of white, but I want
whitey, whitey, white, white.
I got ultra white.
Anyway, I'm standing therelooking at you know the purples
at the time and I my husband isstanding right next to me so he
(38:12):
can see behind me, but I can't,and so I'm staying steadily
standing.
I nobody's, saying anything,I'm in my own little world.
Finally, my husband looks over.
He says, hey, you can use yourwords.
Looking at him, like, who areyou talking to?
Apparently a lady had beenstanding there trying to get by.
She says, excuse me okay andthen my husband goes yes, we can
(38:33):
.
All people today we're gonnalearn to people.
Oh my gosh, yeah, you know agood minute.
You know just waiting for.
I was like, and he's like, Iwanted to tell you she gonna be
here a while.
You see, I'm just marinatinglike it's gonna take her a
minute to choose from the 12different purples that y'all
(38:54):
have given her.
So you can stand there if youwant to and not say excuse me,
or you can use your words.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
Oh my gosh, I am actually just envisioning that,
because anyone who's listeningcan relate to that, because
we've all been there when, evenyesterday, when I went to
Walmart and I was packing mystuff and clearly not fast
enough and then the girl likethe next two girls, they were
packing up their stuff and it'slike I wasn't even there.
(39:21):
I'm like do you not see me?
Sometimes I wouldn't even sayanything, but I'm like do you
not see me here, like I'm notdone packing up my stuff, but
you're clearly like doing it asif I'm not even there, right,
and it's like the whole mannersthing, like I'm not even there,
right, and it's like the wholemanners thing.
Speaker 2 (39:37):
Like you can't see me .
Yes, yes, I'm going to need youto quit acting like you or like
you're so scared to justregular people.
Like, let's not let all thisdivisiveness and crap that's
going on in our world Keep usfrom being regular people.
That the hellos.
Goodbyes.
Thank you, excuse me, hi, howare you have a great day?
(39:59):
Like, those things still worky'all, and they're universal
across all identities.
Y'all can't see me saying that,but just know I said that with
my whole chest.
So, like I'm just saying thesethings still work and I think
when we get in our 40s is whenwe finally look around and go I
need y'all, I'm gonna need y'allto stop.
(40:20):
Maybe, and maybe that's theauntie age, like, maybe we've.
It is where we looking ateverybody ready to whoop
everybody, kids, even the grownones, even looking at the grown
man, like boy, don't make me,uh-uh, don't make me take off my
chancla and go.
Don't play with me.
Not today, my friend, andtomorrow don't look good either.
I'm going to need you to peoplebetter.
(40:42):
Excuse me is the word you werelooking for.
Speaker 1 (40:45):
I love that you have to coin the phrase I'm going to
need you to people better.
If only we could say that youknow You're going to have to use
your people skills that yourparents taught you.
Did they teach you you know?
Speaker 2 (40:59):
yeah, it's the soft skills and softies.
I mean we got them.
Come on, I mean maybe it's tothe point where we just need to
make it a gesture, like we justwiggle our fingers together and
be like, okay, soft skills, andwe all know like it's just.
It becomes like the head nod.
Speaker 1 (41:12):
I know what the head nod mean or just that, look you
know, yeah, I'm trying to getthrough.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, try to getthrough.
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (41:27):
Oh my gosh, she's funny.
Speaker 1 (41:28):
Oh, I love it.
I love it.
This is amazing.
Yes, definitely love thisconversation and what you bring
to the table.
So you said you're launchingthe webinar in May, at the end
of next month.
So I mean that'll be exciting.
I think I will.
Depending on what comes withthat whole webinar, I might have
to consider it.
You know, save up my my notpennies anymore, my nickels.
(41:51):
You know what I mean so I canjoin in.
Speaker 2 (41:53):
Yeah, well, hopefully , yes, I mean, that's my goal
(42:19):
and let me just tell you andeverybody else for this first
time it's impact and leaving alegacy, and so this is what I
want to really refine and beable to leave as my gift to the
world, if you will.
It's like here's a frameworkfor how to think about this
thing called family leadershipand if you want and it's just
five very clear pillars that youget to define how you want to
(42:42):
for your family, but I need youto understand that all of them
need to be taken care of and youcannot expect the school, you
cannot default any of theseresponsibilities to the school.
If we want to see, you know,real change happen, if we want
to see real change happen, if wewant to be very proud of what
we have produced Because what Ioften tell people is raising our
(43:04):
families and being our bestself is the one job that we all
have.
It's the most important job,yet it's the job we have the
least training in, it's the jobwe have the least support, the
least amount of guidance to do.
No one taught me how to be meand no one taught me how to
raise these kids, which,honestly, are the two biggest
(43:27):
things in my life and I think,coming to this age and for us to
realize that there is nobodythat can do you better than you,
and there is nobody that Godgave those kids to other than
you and gave that, you know,husband or wife or spouse or
whoever it is that's in yourfamily leadership community,
that's yours, you are an expertin that and so as much as we can
(43:50):
do to be our best at that, youknow, it's definitely going to
be something that I think allpeople it's going to be free to
attend the webinar.
Please, by all means, come heara little bit more about it.
But, most importantly, I wouldencourage you that if you want
to be your best, you, if you'restill struggling with some of
these things, if you're in yourforties and like, look, maybe I
(44:11):
haven't gone through menopauseor I'm starting to, but what she
said about being organized whenyou get in this bad boy, that
hit home in a different way.
And I'm hoping to see you therebecause I'm going to tell you
it does hit in a different way.
And had I not had some of thesestructures in place in my
family as of right now, enteringthis honey, I got my vitamin.
My bag of vitamins is righthere.
(44:32):
Yeah, yeah, I'm a shake.
Speaker 1 (44:33):
Oh my gosh, the whole bag of vitamins thing.
Have you seen, like tia, fromwhat?
There's this thing on instagramfor a while back where she was
like in her 20s she was likedrinking alcohol doing the whole
thing, and now in your 40s it'slike, okay, you have a fruit
table and then all your vitamins, your vitamin d, like.
(44:54):
You see her just like yeah,this is for you.
Speaker 2 (45:00):
With all your vitamins.
Hold on, let me get you here.
That's my best of vitamins thatI have that I have to keep with
me and take every day, and it'severything from the iron to the
B12 to the once a day to thelike you got to.
Yeah, you're right.
You know we start out, we drinkanything.
What's that in that cup?
I don't care, I'll drink it.
(45:20):
Now we're like hold on, is thatorganic?
Is that alkaline water?
Is it what the heck happened tous.
Speaker 1 (45:28):
Oh my gosh, dr Shelly , you make me laugh.
I love it.
That's awesome, awesome.
It's an alkaline water.
Oh my goodness, how much sugaris in that.
Speaker 2 (45:42):
Is it real sugar or is it some of that aspartame
stuff?
Right, like we now got allthese damn questions.
Honey, we drank strawberry hill.
I'm a DJ to act like thatmoonshine.
I'm a DJ, y'all to act likethat moonshine.
Thank you so much.
Y'all was drinking.
There's no beer, toilet water,like if any of y'all went to
(46:04):
them Omega parties back in theday and you joined the Omega
party.
Speaker 1 (46:07):
What is an Omega party?
Oh my goodness so.
Speaker 2 (46:10):
Omega, psi Phi is one of the fraternities that we
have here.
It's actually international now, okay.
So the Omegas when you're incollege you go to these Omegas
and any frat party, like any ofy'all that went to a frat party,
it's a fraternity and they hadtheir special juice, and then
the Sigmas had their juice, andthen you had the PWI
(46:32):
fraternities and sororitieswould have their things.
So my point is any of y'all whowent to college and drank
anything in any of these places,I'm going to need y'all to hush
, because right now we'resitting up here talking about,
is it alkaline, filtered water?
We drink Fiji water.
Oh, that has a little too much.
I'm watching my thighs, I don'tknow.
(46:53):
Look at that.
Y'all serious right now?
But yes, we are.
Speaker 1 (46:59):
We have all the vitamins, the hormones, the oils
, ointments yeah, I mean likenow it's true, though, because
it's like I have to takemagnesium to help me sleep, all
these things are crazy.
Speaker 2 (47:10):
I just you had to start with the biofreeze, or in
the old day they used to call itthe big game.
Like but I wake up and put somebio freeze on it because it
hurts so bad, like nobody tellsus these things.
So no, when I wake up and myback hurts, I don't want to
think about who's cookingbreakfast.
(47:32):
That needs to be on theschedule, because if it is not
my day, I'm not getting up.
That needs to be on theschedule, because if it is not
my day, I'm not getting up.
Speaker 1 (47:39):
Hey, at least now, like you said, maybe you don't,
you, you don't have to get upthat day.
Right, it's on the schedule.
I have to say that I feel likeit's one of those moments where
you said if it's not on theschedule, it's not happening.
Speaker 2 (47:58):
It's not happening.
Girl, that is my coin, and soyou literally will have kids.
My 17-year-old is the worst atit.
He'll go put something on theschedule like 10 minutes before
it is.
So I had to get him one day.
I was taking screenshots of theschedule because he's like mom,
I put it on the schedule, likeno, you didn't.
It was like this is the kind offun you get to have when you
(48:20):
have a tight schedule.
Is now it's like oh, so youthink they're still going to be
teenagers, they're still goingto do stupid stuff it's just now
not going to be unscheduledwhich is so great.
Speaker 1 (48:32):
Oh my gosh, this conversation has been amazing.
But, yes, we will definitelyhave you on the show again to
talk about closer to the dateyeah, like even the webinar, and
then we'll definitely have totalk about menopause, for sure.
There's so much to talk about.
You are definitely what do theysay?
A force to be reckoned with.
There we go right.
Speaker 2 (48:53):
Yes, well, thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (48:59):
It's been a, a girl.
This has been an awesomeconversation.
This has definitely been aconversation I will not forget
and so remind us again.
So the name of the organizationwhere you help other families
get organized is through theleadership nonprofit is um W.
Speaker 2 (49:17):
It's a wwwfamilylegacy5.com.
That is our website,familylegacy5.com, and that's
for the five pillars ofcourageous family leadership,
which is the name of ourintroductory online course, and
it's just an intro to familyleadership, and so if you want
to join us for the webinar,please by all means go to the
(49:40):
website register.
You can also find me onFacebook, on LinkedIn, I believe
, we are also on Twitter, notTwitter, instagram and if all
else fails, just come on over tothe website, send me a message
and yes, you may just get mereplying to come and have a
conversation about how we canbest serve you, your
(50:01):
organization, your community andhelp just help us all be more
intentional about our familyleadership, where we live, where
we learn.
Speaker 1 (50:10):
Definitely.
Thank you again, Dr ShellyJones-Holt.
Speaker 3 (50:15):
Diva Tonight with Carlene will be back.
Send us a message on Instagramat diva underscore tonight.
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