July 9, 2025 • 67 mins
Brian O'Connell, a fraudulent naturopath in Colorado, killed multiple patients through dangerous fake treatments and false claims of medical expertise. His case exposed a sprawling industry of unaccredited schools and mail-order credentials that enabled him to practice medicine without any legitimate qualifications.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Take two Amanda Jenna hey, how you doing?
Oh good, how are you Good?
Welcome to the second attemptat recording episode 23.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Yeah, some of you may have noticed that we didn't
upload an episode last week.
I know some of you noticedbecause you texted me Concerned.
We're alive, we're fine, thankyou.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
Yeah, some of us include well, most well me.
Basically, what happened was Iwent to this should be part of
the correction section but Ithought I saved my the dog ate
my homework.
Basically I thought I saved therecording on my end and
apparently my computer memorywas too full and it must have
(00:57):
given me an error of noticesomehow, but I don't recall
seeing it.
So my end was not saved andthen I tried to.
I'm boring everybody, but Itried to go in after the fact
and act like I could banter,like it was it's way harder than
you think like because I hadamanda's track.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
I was thinking about how she would do that and I was
like, how will she do that?
I figured out, obviously, youknow yeah no, because how would
you sometimes remember, like,what you were talking about?
That would prompt my commentary, you know.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Yeah, the banter was super hard.
I was like, well, just screwthe banter, we'll just do the
episode.
But even in the episode I thinkI kept interrupting, so it was
just a no-go, we're doing itagain.
Take two it's going to beawesome.
And I was telling Amanda, it'sbeen a week since we recorded
last and even though it's thesame material, I'm going to be
just as surprised as ourlisteners because my short term
(01:51):
memory is really bad, so yay.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
I'm looking forward to this.
I felt like at a couple ofparts I kind of just like
blabbed on and then it felt likea car crashing into a wall at
the end and it was like, okay,we're done.
And I was like, okay, we'redone.
And I was like I'm just gonnafix that.
So lucky for you guys.
Um, my story is two pagesshorter than it was before and,
uh, the ending is a littlesofter, with a like a parachute.
(02:15):
So, oh bless, I guess you knowwhat you're gonna let us down
gently?
it just.
It works out better foreverybody that I love that yeah
I really did and I did say lasttime like, wow, that was like a
car crashing into a brick wall,sorry, um.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
So yeah, it's a, it's a little nicer ending I didn't
feel that way last time, but I'mhappy to be gently deposited
this time around.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
Yeah, let's do that okay, so um, no really
disclaimers or trigger warnings.
My sources will be in the shownotes.
We already did correctionsection um.
You know what?
You guys were busy celebratingthe holiday anyway.
So here we are, um.
(02:57):
So that brings us to um.
Probably you had some beveragesover the holiday let's hope so
because I don't know it was.
America's birthday, so probablyyou did.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
I will say.
I will say, amanda, just in allfairness, the majority of our
listeners are US, but we have alarge percentage, comparatively,
that are from the UK, and Ijust want to say I'm so sorry,
but we did celebrate ourindependence from you guys.
You can come take us backanytime, okay.
(03:29):
No, oh, my gosh, that would beso fun.
Please come take us.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
Vacation, let's go, let's go.
Well, for those of us who didcelebrate with beverages, you
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Speaker 1 (04:36):
Oh yeah, we have to.
God, I keep making this.
A whole section Could be halfthe episode by the time I get
done with all Jenna's mistakes.
But Amanda was right.
The promo code for was it CozyEarth?
Well, basically the promo codefor anything that we've talked
about, cozy Earth and the coffeeand the shimmer wood and all of
(04:59):
that and the bras is staysuspicious.
And I had said just suspicious,yeah, and Amanda said is stay
suspicious.
And I had said just suspicious,yeah, and Amanda said it was
suspicious.
Amanda was like this issuspicious and I said no, I'm
absolutely 100% sure that it'sjust suspicious.
And she said it.
I was so confident If you'regoing to make a mistake, just do
it with you know cojones.
(05:21):
And Amanda said are you sure?
Because I thought and I waslike actually I'm not sure, and
then I went and looked and I wastotally wrong.
So so, yeah, thank you forbringing that up so anyway
that's actually part two, andwe're ready to.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Uh, we're ready to dive back in guys, all right.
So here we go.
Naturopathy is often painted inhues of peace and healing
gentle herbs, acupunctureneedles, the quiet wisdom of
ancient practices.
To many, including myself, it'san appealing compliment to
Western medicine.
(05:56):
It's less invasive and moreholistic.
But in 2003, in the suburbs ofColorado, naturopathy became the
backdrop for a tragedy soprofound that it would
ultimately challenge the linebetween alternative healing and
criminal fraud.
Sean Flanagan was the kind ofteenager that you could never
(06:16):
forget Vibrant, restless, alwayschasing the next adventure.
His mother, laura, remembershim as a light.
He was always smiling, alwaystrying new things, she said.
His dad, dave, described himsimply a great kid, strong and
active.
His sister, kelsey, remembershis connection to nature.
He loved the river.
(06:37):
When he kayaked it was like hewas one with the water.
But at just 16 years oldeverything changed.
Sean started to complain ofpain in his leg.
Then one afternoon he collapsedin the bathroom.
Laura found him curled up onthe floor, pale and gasping.
A frantic rush to the ERfollowed and then the
(06:59):
unthinkable a football-sizedtumor in his pelvic region.
He was diagnosed with Ewingsarcoma, a rare and aggressive
form of bone cancer.
The hospital became their secondhome.
He spent Christmas, surroundedby IV poles and blinking
machines, but never lost hisspirit.
I just want to go to Hawaii.
(07:19):
Sean once said lay in a hammock, fly over a volcano.
Sean once said lay in a hammock, fly over a volcano.
He smiled through the chemo,joked with the nurses and
dreamed big, even when the oddsgot smaller.
Doctors prepared the family forsurgery and in late 2003, the
doctors found the tumor had notshrunk.
However, they decided tooperate.
The surgery was complex anddangerous, but the Flanigans
(07:42):
were desperate for time.
When they opened Sean up, theydiscovered that the femoral
artery had been ravaged by thecancer.
To save his life, the surgeonshad to amputate his leg.
And even through all of this,sean still smiled and still
dreamt.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
Oh man.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
Shortly after surgery , sean's grandmother boarded a
flight back to Colorado.
Like fate pulling cruel strings, sean's grandmother met a
stranger on the plane.
Her eyes were swollen withgrief when the man seated next
to her leaned in to offersupport.
She shared Sean's story andthat's when he told her there's
someone in Wheat Ridge, a doctor.
He cured my friend's cancer.
(08:19):
He spoke with certainty andhope about this doctor.
He said that this doctor hadcured people that the hospitals
had given up on that.
This doctor knew how to removetumors naturally.
After landing, she called thefamily to share the news.
His name was Brian O'Connell, anaturopath.
The family had never even heardof the word naturopath before,
(08:41):
but they were desperate.
They looked up his websitewebsite and it seemed legitimate
.
There were testimonials,professional-looking photos and
diplomas hanging on the wall.
So they went.
When they pulled up to MountainArea Naturopathic Associates,
they were met with warmth andconfidence.
Brian O'Connell greeted thempersonally with a warm smile, a
(09:02):
firm handshake and friendly eyes.
He spoke to them ofphotoluminescence, a
groundbreaking treatment, heclaimed.
We draw blood from Sean, heexplained, run it through
ultraviolet light to superoxygenate it, then reintroduce
it into his system.
It cleanses the blood, destroysthe cancer.
I've seen it work, it will work.
(09:23):
He looked Laura and Dave in theeyes and said no Irish kid is
going to die on my watch.
It sounded revolutionary.
It sounded hopeful, like amiracle.
The Flanigans wrote a check for$7,400 on the spot and Sean's
first treatment was that sameday.
At first it didn't seem to domuch.
(09:45):
Sean didn't feel better, but hedidn't feel worse either, until
he did.
The next day, on December 12th,everything changed.
Sean was admitted to thehospital with a blood infection
known as septicemia, whichdeveloped into pneumonia, and he
remained hospitalized until the15th of December, at which time
he was discharged home on fiveliters of oxygen and an oxygen
(10:08):
monitoring device known as apulse oximeter, unknown at the
time.
The blood infection was causedby the unsterile
photoluminescence procedure hereceived on the 10th.
Speaker 1 (10:19):
Oh man, this is totally preventable then?
Speaker 2 (10:23):
Mm-hmm.
On December 16th and and againwe're in 2003 o'connell arrived
at the flanagan's home tocomplete another treatment.
He brought with him hisequipment and supplies for a
photoluminescence procedure.
The family gathered in theliving room for the procedure
and insisted that he usedsterile techniques, which he
(10:43):
complied.
O'connell inserted the IV lineand began the procedure.
Sean's pulse oximeter showedoxygen saturation levels
dropping from the normal range,which is over 90%, to levels in
the 60% range, which slowly thenreturned to normal.
He left the equipment at thehome for the family to do the
procedure again the followingday with the UV light and
(11:06):
hydrogen peroxide.
The family followed theinstructions and performed the
procedure and this time his SATsdropped into the 40% range.
The family contacted O'Connellwith great concern and he
assured them that he would finda fix for the problem.
I like also think I just paidyou $7,400.
Why am I completing the thirdtreatment Like?
(11:29):
exactly why aren't you doing it?
Speaker 1 (11:32):
Right.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
Okie dokie.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
And, sorry, the hydrogen peroxide.
Where's that going?
Speaker 2 (11:39):
Oh, don't worry.
So he draws the blood out andthen he mixes it with hydrogen
peroxide.
Speaker 1 (11:44):
Oh God, I'm going to be sick.
Okay, all right.
Oh man.
Speaker 2 (11:51):
On the 18th, o'connell returned to the
Flanagan's home to perform thesame procedure, but it included
a more rapid infusion of thehydrogen peroxide with the UV
light procedure.
As the procedure was completed,sean's SATs plummeted to below
20.
His skin turned gray and hecollapsed after begging.
Please, god, no more.
(12:11):
Panic filled the room.
O'connell stared at the pulseoximeter.
He had no idea what it was.
He stared at the numbers likethey were a foreign language.
He thought the device wasbroken.
But Sean's dad was afirefighter and an EMT and he
knew exactly what the device wasand what the plummeting numbers
meant.
He had to resuscitate his ownson.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
Sean, terrified, whispered no more, Pack your
stuff and go.
Sean had a really rough nightand unfortunately, the next
morning the family woke up tofind that his skin was yellow.
They knew that his liverfunction and kidney function
were shutting down.
Sean would pass away later thatday, surrounded by family.
After just four treatments inless than a week, he died.
(12:58):
The boy that they were toldmight have months left to live
was gone just 18 days aftermeeting Brian O'Connell.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
Oh god, it's devastating.
Speaker 2 (13:09):
Three months later, on March 25th 2004, sergeant
Jonathan Pickett of the WheatRidge Police Department was
called to the Lutheran MedicalCenter.
A 17 year old named CatherineCat she went by Brissina had
inexplicably gone into cardiacarrest.
Cat and her family had traveledfrom Wisconsin to receive
medical treatment from O'Connell.
(13:30):
During one session, heperformed photoluminescence and
gave the teenager an injectionof vitamin C and B12.
It was supposed to be a routinepreventative care session, but
after the vitamin injection, catvomited, gasped for breath and
lost consciousness.
While O'Connell attemptedmouth-to-mouth resuscitation,
(13:51):
paramedics raced to the sceneand delivered Kat to the medical
center.
According to paramedics, shewas in cardiac arrest for at
least 10 minutes and doctorsinitially weren't sure whether
she'd make a full recovery.
Her care team learned from thefamily that there had been a
doctor administering a bloodpurification treatment.
The name of this doctor BrianO'Connell.
(14:13):
An ER doctor called and spokewith O'Connell to try and
understand what the treatmentwas.
In an effort to save the girl'slife, o'connell explained to
them that this patient just hadan anxiety attack, but Dr Joanne
Edney was skeptical oh, yeah,come on Anxiety.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
Yeah, it doesn't give you a heart attack, anxiety.
Speaker 2 (14:36):
Sometimes it might feel like it is going to.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
I love that TikTok.
By the way, the dances OkayAnyway.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
She told Belize that she believed the young woman's
sudden problem was caused by Idon't know, an allergic reaction
, an air embolism, a bloodembolism or a contaminated
product, not by anxiety.
Speaker 1 (14:59):
Duh.
Speaker 2 (15:01):
The ER doctor noted that O'Connell didn't even sound
like a doctor he didn't useterms like a doctor and so they
looked him up, and then theyrealized he didn't really seem
to have the credentialsnecessary to be performing such
a treatment.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
But Amanda did.
He have no clothes on and atrailer.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
You know this guy was a little bit of a step up from
our old trailer McGee.
This guy has an office and asfar as I'm aware, he has his
clothes on.
He was never in the pornindustry.
If you don't know what we'retalking about, please go back to
episode what 21,?
I think no 20?
.
Speaker 1 (15:40):
What is this?
23 today?
So it's 22, 21, 20.
Episode 20.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Yeah, what a weirdo that episode will forever make
me laugh.
Same.
Within days another caseemerged rory galagos.
He was only 44 and had beendiagnosed with colon cancer that
had spread to his liver.
Rory felt that his medical teamhad given up hope, and that is
(16:06):
what he craved.
He then found Brian O'Connell,who offered him not only hope,
but a cure.
Anything that Rory wanted,brian O'Connell said he could
deliver.
O'connell had promised himhealing through a topical
treatment called black salve.
He told Rory that if he appliedthis to his skin it would draw
out the tumor.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
He guaranteed that it would work oh, come on, it's
not a zit, people, it's not azit, it's a tumor.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
It's a tumor black salve is an archaic, corrosive
ointment known to destroy tissuebecause it contains alkaloids
that attack and destroy anyliving tissue that it's applied
to.
It would be like applyingbattery acid on an open wound,
said Dr Terry Dubrow.
It was used in the early 1900sand has since been replaced with
(16:57):
safer and more effectivetreatments.
There is no evidence that ithas any correlation to aid in
cancer treatment and is actuallyconsidered illegal.
Now, though, it is still soldby unscrupulous practitioners.
According to Dubrow, roryfollowed O'Connell's
instructions of putting thesalve on, let's just say, a
sensitive part of his body.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
Oh no.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
He applied it daily and soon his skin was raw and
oozing.
The salve had begun to eat awayat his skin and the sore grew
bigger and bigger and bigger,until he was rushed by ambulance
to the hospital where he wouldsadly pass away within hours.
Rory's wife, janet, wasdevastated and said he told us
he could save Rory.
He said that he'd never lost acancer patient, but my husband
(17:41):
died in agony.
He was robbed of dignity.
But my husband died in agony.
He was robbed of dignity.
She went on to say he had allof these certificates.
He was a pharmacist.
He knew what he was doing, buthe wasn't.
He was fraudulently advertisingexpertise that he didn't have.
Investigators quickly discoveredthat photoluminescence wasn't
(18:03):
even medically recognized.
It was invasive and legallyrestricted to licensed
physicians.
While it wasn't illegal, itwasn't considered a legitimate
medical treatment.
It is invasive and should onlybe completed by a licensed
medical doctor.
O'connell was a naturopath, nota licensed medical doctor.
He wasn't even certified underlegitimate institutions, as far
(18:26):
as they could tell online.
On March 29th, investigatorsexecuted a search warrant and
raided O'Connell's clinic.
What they found was chilling.
His walls were covered in fakediplomas, including one from the
Colorado University ofNaturopathic Medicine, which is
a university that doesn't evenexist.
Oh, are you kidding?
no, they googled it and theywere like whoa, this place isn't
(18:50):
real the balls on this man Iknow, I just I can't okay it
appeared that all of hiscertificates had been purchased
from the internet of coursethere were boxes of potassium
chloride, which is used to stopheart strain surgery, along with
iv stands and hardware store uvlights.
(19:11):
Nothing was sterile, nothing wassafe and, worst of all, they
found 4 000 patient files,thousands that had paid for
weeks of treatments thatamounted to nothing but false
hope and harm.
And his photoluminescencemachine.
Yeah, it was just a loop oftubing under a heat lamp.
They were lights that youliterally could buy at a
(19:33):
hardware store, a light thatyou'd find like hanging in
someone's garage.
They were nothing special, notmedical-grade light bulbs that
would have any effect onsomeone's blood.
It was a trick and he was afraud.
Speaker 1 (19:45):
Oh, my God, I mean I did better with lights with our
terrarium for our lizard.
You know what I mean, like holycow.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Yeah, you may be wondering also how did he even
get his hands on some of thesethings outside of the hardware
lights?
Speaker 1 (20:05):
I was going to say you go to a pet store.
Really Well, you go to AceHardware and you just buy the
lights, obviously.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
But how about these things?
I don't know?
Drugs that stop a heart.
Why does he have that?
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Oh yeah, that's crazy .
Speaker 2 (20:18):
Even the DEA had been fooled by O'Connell.
Detective Pickett was able totrace back his application for
the controlled substance license.
The application stated that hewas going to be working under a
grant administered by theColorado State University in
Fort Collins to test controlledsubstances on patients.
He conned the DEA what heobtained a DEA license through a
(20:42):
lot of fraud and a lot of lies,which allowed him to outfit his
clinic with these things thatreally he wasn't allowed to have
, and with these things hetortured desperate people for
profit okay this is a big fatpuke.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Yeah, but isn't some of this on the DEA?
Because if he's claiming thathe has this degree from a
university that doesn't exist,did they even do the basic
discovery process?
Did they make him prove?
Like, how did they, how didthey approve it?
I mean, where's the grant?
Uh, approval as well?
Like surely you have to showthat I don't know.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
I think uh, definitely some holes in the
process.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
I don't know that's disgusting either way, but it
should not have been able to gothrough all those hoops, unless
he's like this genius.
Like what do you call it whensomebody copies signatures and
uh, yeah, um, why can't I thinkof that?
Forger, forger, forgery and allof this other stuff?
(21:44):
I don't know how the dea wouldhave.
He would have passed muster inany way.
We're not talking about the1800s here.
What the hell backed.
Speaker 2 (21:54):
Yeah, I know, this is the early 2000s.
I'm like thinking back to likemy irb applications for like
research and stuff.
Oh, oh my.
God, I don't know.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
You can't even put earphones in somebody without an
insanely rigorous process.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
And then you have to have like interviews with the
people.
Yeah, to approve yourapplication.
Speaker 1 (22:13):
Right.
Speaker 2 (22:14):
Step by step so.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Wow, somebody was sleeping through this process.
Speaker 2 (22:18):
With that.
I don't really know, like, howinterested they were in like who
I was, in my credentials, but Idon't know.
I also have never applied for agrant for research either.
But any puzzles.
Hopefully this uh rose a flag tohave an improvement in the
process let's hope so so also,while I was reading through
these materials, like I keptwondering how often is this
(22:41):
happening?
Like, are people just gettingfake licenses and fooling
agencies like the DEA?
But I did not have to wonderfor very long because the
Seattle Times investigatedO'Connell's wall of degrees and
uncovered much of the biggerstory about credentialing fraud
which, honestly, it could justbe an episode of its own.
But here is a very condensedversion, which is part two,
(23:05):
condensed from part one, soyou're welcome.
So this is what the SeattleTimes found.
O'connell was part of asprawling multimillion dollar
industry that sells fakelegitimacy through an
international web ofunaccredited schools and dubious
trade associations aninternational web of
unaccredited schools and dubioustrade associations.
(23:25):
They found that at least 104unaccredited schools issue
alternative medicine degrees notrecognized by the US Department
of Education.
Many operate solely online orby mail.
The largest, clayton College ofNatural Health, claims to have
issued over 25,000 degreesthrough a home study model.
Major credentialing bodies inthis space are controlled by
(23:46):
just two businessmen Wow,shocking.
One in Texas and the other inLas Vegas, who run mail order
factories issuing professionaltitles and accreditations to
over 100 schools.
Manufacturers of energy devicesoften run or sponsor training
programs that hand outcredentials which practitioners
(24:07):
then use to market themselves ashealthcare professionals.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
Oh my god, I think we could do an entire series on
this.
Are you kidding me In this dayand age?
Speaker 2 (24:17):
Are you?
It was like the Las Vegascredentialing mill.
I was like, ah, this is such arabbit hole.
Speaker 1 (24:22):
Are you effing kidding me right now?
Speaker 2 (24:26):
And those homies are just sitting at home making big
dollars.
Speaker 1 (24:29):
Oh, my God.
Speaker 2 (24:29):
Printing papers saying they have a degree, and
we had blood sweat and tears.
Speaker 1 (24:34):
To go to an accredited university to be able
to get into this so many tears,oh my God, this makes me so
angry.
I can't believe this ishappening now.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
Well, maybe you'll tell me it's not happening now,
20 years ago okay, I'm sorry,I'm old, so to me it's still
hard to believe that early 2000sis 20 years.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
I feel like it's yesterday yeah, yeah, maybe we
need to do an episode on whetheror not this is improved.
Anyway, sorry I keepinterrupting, but Giltonen of
Vassar University, one of onlyfive accredited naturopathic
(25:27):
colleges in the US.
Speaker 2 (25:30):
She added, to argue that you don't need any training
to diagnose or treat patientsis absurd, and I'm just going to
make a quick insert that, again, this was almost 20 years ago.
So there may be more than fiveaccredited naturopathic schools
in the U?
S at this time.
I don't know, so don't come forme, but at the time of this
article there were only five.
(25:50):
And the article goes on to saynaturopathy is a growing field
favoring natural remedies overpharmaceuticals.
In 14 States, includingWashington, it's a licensed
profession requiring a degreefrom an accredited four-year
college.
But in the other 36 states,like Colorado where O'Connell
operated, anyone could callthemselves a naturopathic doctor
(26:11):
with no training at all.
Speaker 1 (26:13):
Hmm, sounds to me like the difference between a
hearing maybe I shouldn't saythis, but hearing aid dispenser,
where you don't even have tohave a high school diploma, at
least in Minnesota andaudiologists, where the minimum
licensure requirement is adoctoral degree and they're both
fitting hearing aids Like.
(26:33):
I guess we're not the onlyprofession that's suffering from
this dichotomy.
Speaker 2 (26:36):
There's a lot of parallels actually.
Speaker 1 (26:40):
Oh wow, Unfortunately yeah.
Speaker 2 (26:42):
Yeah, mm-hmm parallels actually.
Oh, wow, unfortunately.
Yeah, yeah, one of thecertificates on o'connell's wall
came from the americannaturopathic medical association
, which sounds official but isbased out of las vegas, from a
po box.
Its founder, donald hayhurst,is known as the godfather of
mail order credentials.
Hey, hurst.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
Sorry, even his name is like hey Don.
Hey Hurst, give me a degree,dude.
Speaker 2 (27:10):
He's like okay, get out your checkbook.
He has issued thousands ofmemberships and they are or were
I don't know if they still are$350 to $500 apiece and
accredits various schools.
An ANMA board member defendingtheir legitimacy, saying some
people say we're fake.
I can't convince them.
(27:34):
Okay, I think that took outpart of the quote because I
shortened it, but it was like ifthey don't want to join us,
then so be it.
It's like okay.
Meanwhile, hayhurst declined tospeak with reporters, so
shocking, what a shock, yeah.
So by this point investigatorswere convinced that O'Connell
was a con man and not a doctor.
(27:55):
They believe they hadsufficient grounds to charge him
with criminal impersonationtheft by fraud theft by frogs
illegally obtaining controlledsubstances.
I think I said throd, thatwould be better.
Speaker 1 (28:13):
I know, but theft by frogs would be even better.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
Either way it was incorrect and multiple counts of
assault tied to injuriessustained by patients rory
galagos and cat brisina, whosecases had triggered the original
investigation.
But before we get more intothat, it's time for a chart note
.
Welcome to the chart notesegment, where we learn about
(28:41):
what's happening in medicine andhealthcare.
So there's a new technologythat could enable scientists to
better observe how tissuesamples change over time.
A nano needle breakthroughcould end painful cancer
biopsies.
Inserting a needle or scalpelto extract a sliver of tissue,
often from deep in the body, haslong been the most reliable way
to diagnose cancer, and thesetraditional biopsies are
(29:04):
invasive, frequently painful andnot without risk.
Now, researchers at King'sCollege in London believe they
have found a gentler and moreeffective alternative a patch
studded with millions ofmicroscopic nanoneedles capable
of extracting a wealth ofdiagnostic data without damaging
the tissue.
Nanoneedles capable ofextracting a wealth of
diagnostic data without damagingthe tissue.
(29:26):
To the naked eye, the deviceresembles a simple, flexible
plaster.
In fact, it is coated with adense force of silicone probes
each thousands of times thinnerthan a human hair.
When applied to a suspectedtumor, the needles are fine
enough to penetrate individualcells, gently drying out
biochemical data, includinglipids, proteins and fragments
of genetic material, all whileleaving the tissue intact.
(29:46):
The samples are analyzed usingmass spectrometry, a technique
that identifies the moleculespresent.
Artificial intelligence is thenused to interpret the findings.
In trials involving 23 humanbrain tumor samples, the
technique distinguished betweendifferent types of disease.
It returned results in aslittle as 20 minutes potentially
(30:07):
quick enough to inform thesurgeon's next move during an
operation, which is super cool.
The research published in thejournal Naturo no, I'm redoing
that sentence.
No, I'm redoing that sentence.
The research published in thejournal Natural.
(30:28):
Nanotechnology belongs to afast-growing field known as
spatial biology, where the aimis to understand disease by
mapping where differentmolecules sit in tissues.
Most methods require removingand killing the tissue, making
it impossible to observe how thestructure changes over time.
Killing the tissue making itimpossible to observe how the
structure changes over time.
The nanoneedle patch, bycontrast, should allow for
(30:49):
repeated, non-destructivesampling from the same site.
Dr Cairo Sciapini of King'sCollege London, who led the
research, said from a purelyscientific standpoint, this is
the biggest breakthrough.
We can get molecularinformation from the same tissue
as many times as we want.
Spatial biology as a field atthe moment is exploding.
It is revolutionizing the waythat we understand tissues and
(31:09):
how they function.
One of the biggest challengeswas that we couldn't monitor
them longitudinally over time,and now we can.
Manufactured using the samelithographic techniques as
computer chips, the nanoneedlescan be integrated into medical
instruments that could includethe devices used to place stents
in coronary arteries, allowingdoctors to monitor the fatty
(31:32):
deposits that causecardiovascular disease.
For conditions such assuspected mouth or throat cancer
, the patches could eliminatethe need for painful biopsies
altogether.
Chiappini said for somepatients, this could be the
beginning of the end for painfulbiopsies.
Our technology opens up newways to diagnose and monitor
disease safely, helping doctorsand patients make better, faster
(31:55):
decisions.
Speaker 1 (31:56):
This is amazing.
I love this for so many reasons.
Isn't it cool?
Yeah, I wonder do you have toactually make contact with the
actual tumor for it to be ableto do what you need to do?
Because then you know if it's atumor that's not at the surface
, does it have to be long enoughto like?
Speaker 2 (32:16):
Or it's like the different patches have different
lines, yeah.
Speaker 1 (32:18):
Or is it just that your lipids and your body
chemistry is going to bedifferent when it's fighting
cancer and they can track thatwithout having to go deeper?
I don't know, but either waythat's fantastic.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
Yeah, super cool, go guys in London, yeah.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
Yay, go London Go.
Speaker 2 (32:37):
London Woohoo, okay, back to the story, london Okay,
back to the story.
The investigation revealed thatO'Connell fraudulently
misrepresented his backgroundand qualifications through his
website handouts and prominentlydisplayed licenses,
certificates and awards.
He presented himself as adoctor, despite lacking any
(32:57):
legitimate education, trainingor experience.
Wearing a white coat and astethoscope to reinforce the
image, he falsely claimed to bethe medical doctor of Mountain
Area Naturopathic Associates,implying medical expertise.
His doctor of naturopathicmedicine title came from the
Herbal Healer Academy, which isan unlicensed, unaccredited
(33:20):
correspondence school fined fordeceptive practices.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
How surprising.
Speaker 2 (33:26):
Shocking.
He also claimed to be aregistered naturopath and to
hold board certifications fromnon-accredited entities, none
recognized by legitimateauthorities.
He falsely asserted he haddegrees in microbiology,
biochemistry and pharmacy fromaccredited institutions and
claimed experience in pharmacy,allopathic medicine, chemistry,
(33:50):
toxicology and forensics,despite, again, having little or
no training in any of thesefields.
He displayed fraudulently theDEA and Colorado Department of
Human Services licenses and,like going through these lists,
I'm like there's no way oneperson would do all these things
Right, like so you went toschool for 40 years.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
Yeah, come on, dude.
Speaker 2 (34:15):
No, you didn't, yeah.
And if you say you did, did andyou're only 45 years old, like
no you're not a specialist inall areas exactly.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
I mean, it takes like an extra how many.
So medical school is like anextra six years or whatever over
undergrad, and then, uh,fellowship is another two to
four, come on uh okano alsomisrepresented it, his
(34:48):
experience, abilities andprocedures.
Speaker 2 (34:49):
He claimed to have personally cured many cancer
patients, including those withaggressive cancers like sean's
metastatic e-wings sarcoma.
He showed families plasticbaggies containing objects that
he said were tumors that he hadremoved, which sick because most
medical nice touch, classy yeah, yeah, oh, we do ziplots for
(35:14):
sure we wave them in front offamilies and say, look I did
this.
He had told sean's family histreatments could and would cure
the cancer.
Using slides that he claimedwere of sean's blood, he pointed
out alleged toxins andimpurities to justify the
treatment.
He promoted black salve, uvlight therapy, hydrogen peroxide
infusions, vitamins, teas andsupplements as cures, claiming
(35:39):
sterile technique wasunnecessary because the UV light
would kill all the bacteria.
He concealed the lack ofscientific evidence, omitted
known risks and failed todisclose the controversy
surrounding these treatments.
On May 19th, brian O'Connellwas arrested but posted bail
quickly.
There were conditions, withBond posted that he would not
(36:00):
commit any other crimes.
The story had a lot of mediaattention, as you could maybe
imagine.
The Flanagan saw it on theevening news and Laura
immediately dialed the number atthe bottom of the screen to
share that their son was avictim of O'Connell.
When detectives arrived at theFlanagan home, the story that
(36:21):
they heard stopped them cold.
The Flanagan shared that theyhad taken their son, sean, to
see O'Connell, hopingnaturopathic treatments might
help.
O'connell recommended variousvitamins, teas and procedures,
including withdrawing Sean'sblood, exposing it to UV light
and then reinforcing it alongwith hydrogen peroxide directly
into his bloodstream.
They described the in-hometreatments and the scene that
(36:42):
they believed ultimately led toSean's death His oxygen levels
had dropped, but O'Connellfailed to recognize the signs.
They told them there was nobasic sanitation used, despite
Sean being severelyimmunocompromised.
The Flanagans came tounderstand that O'Connell's
negligence using steriletechniques, performing and
(37:02):
recommending risky, unprovenprocedures without proper
training, licensing orscientific basis and infusing
hydrogen peroxide into Sean'sbloodstream a dangerous act he
knew or should have known couldhave been fatal.
He never yeah.
Speaker 1 (37:20):
Sorry, amanda, yes.
Speaker 2 (37:21):
Did I say sterile they?
Speaker 1 (37:22):
were unsterile techniques correct yeah, she's
like.
You have a correction sectionlady I just wanted to point that
out.
Okay, yay, somebody else otherthan me, lol yes, everybody,
they are unsterile yeah didn'tdo anything correctly.
Speaker 2 (37:41):
Um, he never warned them of any risks and sean had
been told that he might have upto six months to live, but he
died just 18 days after meetingo'connell.
The flanagans believedwholeheartedly that o'connell
shortened sean's life andworsened his final weeks.
They felt robbed of precioustime with their son and sought
justice not only for his deathbut also for the financial
(38:02):
losses they incurred from thehospitalization, medical
treatment for the resultingblood infection and the cost of
McConnell's services.
After their meeting with theFlanigans, investigators began
to wonder if they were not onlydealing with a fraud case but
perhaps a homicide.
Could they prove that heaccelerated the death of Sean?
(38:25):
They went to the coroner'soffice, who ruled his death was
due to natural causes secondaryto a deadly and aggressive form
of cancer.
They shared the story of Sean'slast couple of weeks of life
and the coroner then thoughtmaybe this was not natural
causes.
Basic sterilization procedureswere not used during
photoluminescence treatments andalso not carried out by a
(38:46):
professional.
She thought the lack ofsterilization actually led to an
infection which could haveaccelerated his death, and then
she changed the deathcertificate from natural to
undetermined.
Wow, this would allowinvestigators to pursue criminal
charges for the death of Sean.
In the midst of all this, theDEA contacted authorities that
(39:08):
they were contacted by O'Connellyou guys, for tools to perform
a treatment, even after he wasnot supposed to.
An undercover sting was puttogether in an effort to later
prove to a jury that he wasoffering hope to the hopeless
and preying upon desperate.
The day of the sting, o'connellmet the undercover agents in
(39:28):
the lobby and greeted themwarmly.
He took them back to his officewhere he explained how the
black salve worked andproclaimed he could cure cancer.
He then asked if they wanted tosee pictures of tumors that his
other patients had, and whileshowing him pictures of the
tumors, he claimed this is goingto be an underline, underline,
underline, so pay attention.
He claimed that the AmericanCancer Society didn't want the
(39:52):
public to know about thistreatment because then they
would have to close their doors.
Oh my God, like the AmericanCancer Society is not
gatekeeping treatment guys?
Speaker 1 (40:06):
I can't even.
I'm speechless.
Speaker 2 (40:08):
He was then arrested again on charges of criminal
impersonation and practicingmedicine without a license.
He again made bail on thecondition that he would not
leave the state withoutpermission and that he would not
practice medicine, and as theywere preparing for the trial,
authorities were contacted thatO'Connell appeared to be
planning to leave the state.
Speaker 1 (40:27):
Shocking yeah.
Wow, come on, guys, of course.
Speaker 2 (40:32):
One of his neighbors called in and said that the
family was on the sidewalk withsuitcases and they appeared to
be waiting for a cab.
Hello, and when investigatorsarrived, they were already gone
oh but you know where they went?
They went to disneyland theydid not kidding me no, they
(40:52):
didn't.
No, oh my god, you can't makethis stuff up he was arrested
upon return from his excursion,but this just goes to show that
he thought he was above the lawand he just did whatever the
hell he wanted to oh my god um,I did find conflicting like data
(41:12):
through resources of like hedidn't get arrested until he got
back, but I did see one thatwas like um.
When authorities arrived he wason the sidewalk and he had the
tickets to disneyland in hispocket mickey mouse turned him
in go mickey, go mickey.
Speaker 1 (41:30):
Oh, whatever, I mean it's pathetic.
I thought he was gonna escape,but he's like so narcissistic
that he's like ah, they're notgonna find me, they're not gonna
out what I did, I'll just takemy kids on a vacay.
Speaker 2 (41:44):
And I didn't even do anything wrong.
Look at all these people Ihealed, I'm sure.
Speaker 1 (41:47):
Oh God Okay.
Speaker 2 (41:50):
Mm-hmm.
Securing charges for the deathof Sean would be complicated.
O'connell had the best defenseattorney in the state of
Colorado.
Authorities wanted to doeverything in their power to
strengthen the case.
State of Colorado Authoritieswanted to do everything in their
power to strengthen the case,so they kept on digging.
And this is when theydiscovered that not only did he
make false claims about hiscredentials and experiences,
they found that he had beenbragging to his patients and
(42:12):
even on his website that he hadbeen an expert witness in legal
cases.
They looked through trialtranscripts and there were
transcripts where he testifiedto having a master's degree in
microbiology from the Universityof Wisconsin-Milwaukee.
What Now, my friends?
There's a felony.
Yes, manslaughter would bedifficult to prove beyond a
(42:34):
reasonable doubt.
But if they could prove that hehad been falsely testifying
under oath as an expert witness,he could be charged with
perjury, and each perjury countcarries a two to six year
sentence.
So investigators believe thatwith this new information, they
could leverage O'Connell toplead guilty to manslaughter
without the risk of a trial.
Investigators then met withO'Connell and his attorney to
(42:58):
discuss the plea deal.
Investigators wanted him to beput away for a long time and to
own the responsibility for thedeath of Sean Flanagan.
O'connell's defense attorneyhad a difficult time getting him
to take responsibility for thedeath of Sean, but he basically
told him listen, buddy, you'vebeen exposed.
Take responsibility now, orit's only going to get worse.
Speaker 1 (43:20):
Good for him.
Speaker 2 (43:21):
Yes now or it's only going to get worse.
Good for him.
Yes.
On March 27th 2006, brianO'Connell was sentenced after
pleading guilty to chargesincluding criminally negligent
homicide, practicing medicinewithout a license, assault,
theft and perjury.
The courtroom was filled tocapacity.
On one side, supporters weremade up largely of former
(43:41):
patients who believed that hehad helped them and, on the
other side, grieving loved onesof the three patients who had
died under his care.
Before the sentencing,o'connell had told the court
that he was motivated by wantingto help people.
When someone passes away, Itake it very personally.
He said.
I didn't get into naturalhealing for money or prestige.
(44:02):
District court judge margieinquest told o'connell people
came to you in the mostdesperate situation and you took
advantage of them, ando'connell was sentenced to 13
years well, good for margie, butI just feel like 13 years is
nothing.
I know, know, and I'll like seethings online nowadays, like
(44:23):
current events and it's likeso-and-so got this much time for
whatever crime and I'm like areyou kidding?
That's more than like thesecases we cover where people kill
people.
Speaker 1 (44:32):
Yeah, I mean, if you're like distributing
marijuana, you can get life oryou could have gotten life.
And here he is 13 years forkilling people and fraudulently
treating people to make moneyconning the dea yeah, oh my god,
yeah among those who spoke werelaura and dave flanagan, sean's
parents.
Speaker 2 (44:53):
They stood to be the voice sean no longer had,
recalling how o'connell oncetold them no irish kid is going
to die.
On my watch, la Laura recountedSean's final days and faced
O'Connell directly.
He is not who he says he is.
He's a liar and a crook, shesaid.
Dave, remembering his son'ssuffering, shared his last words
(45:13):
as he crawled into bed no more,god, please, no more.
Speaker 1 (45:17):
Breaks my heart.
It just makes me want to vomitthat poor guy.
Speaker 2 (45:22):
Janet, the wife of Rory Gallagos, also addressed
the court.
She described Rory's final daysas filled with pain and robbed
of peace.
He didn't want to die.
She said he was taken too soonand denied the chance to say
goodbye.
She explained how O'Connell hadassured Rory's family that he
had never lost a cancer patient.
He led me to believe thatthings weren't true.
(45:43):
She said Rory was robbed ofdignity in his death.
There was one other gal.
I had said that three peopledied under his care.
There was one other gal who Icouldn't find a lot of
information on but um her.
They were older couple and thehusband took her to the clinic
to see if he could heal her.
He paid the amount of like$17,000 and she ended up passing
(46:06):
away shortly after.
That's a lot of money, but hewas quoted in court to say and I
don't have it written down, sothis is like a subtext of this
quote from my memory Somethinglike my wife was dying, I would
have paid any amount of money.
Speaker 1 (46:20):
Oh bless his heart, oh my.
Speaker 2 (46:21):
God, Like Jimmy Shoemaker.
Speaker 1 (46:23):
I believe his name was no they're just feeding off
a desperation, and to me that'sso much.
I mean, murder is evil nomatter what, and and defrauding
people and deceiving people isjust inconscionable.
But to to give this kind offalse hope, knowing you don't
know what the hell you're doing,and actually injuring people
(46:47):
and leading them to an untimelydeath, is just I.
I can't believe.
He only got 13 years and therewas only one case that they were
able to bring up.
Speaker 2 (46:57):
Yeah, I kind of wonder if that's why Rory's wife
was like.
He was also robbed a time.
He didn't want to die, hopinglike maybe someone would pick it
up as another case, or maybethey tried I don't know
alternative healing.
(47:17):
He was a caring person.
I really don't want him to getin trouble, said Kat's mother.
Kat stood firm in that shedidn't have ill feelings towards
O'Connell.
Speaker 1 (47:31):
She did, however, tell police that she probably
wouldn't go to him again unlessshe had a serious health problem
.
Okay, well, that's somewhattelling, but also, girl, come on
, wake up.
Speaker 2 (47:37):
It gets worse.
She does also agree withO'connell's assessment of why
she went into cardiac arrest.
Speaker 1 (47:44):
I could have spazzed, she told them, things happen is
this the one with the anxietyclaim on his part?
Oh well, she's.
Obviously.
He's charismatic, she wasbamboozled by him.
But yeah, I mean, anxietydoesn't doesn't do that, it does
a lot of things but doesn't dothat no, and therein lies the
(48:05):
crux of this issue.
Speaker 2 (48:07):
Are naturopaths actually doctors?
Brian o'connell certainlypresented himself as one.
His business card identifiedhimself as an n m, d or doctor
of naturopathic medicine.
He wore scrubs in a white labcoat embroidered with Dr
O'Connell.
His office walls displayed anarray of certificates and
diplomas that, at a glance, lentan air of legitimacy To the
(48:29):
average patient.
All of this might suggest thatO'Connell was a licensed
naturopathic physician, someonewho earned a pre-medical
undergraduate degree andgraduated from one of the four
accredited naturopathic schoolsin the US.
The programs that areaccredited offer training
modeled after conventionalmedical education.
That includes a whole bunch ofstuff that I deleted, except for
(48:51):
the word includes.
Trust me, we don't need to gothrough all of it, but it even
included 14 rigorous tests atthe end of their schooling.
So it was a lot.
In states that recognize andlicense the profession,
naturopathic physicians areconsidered primary care
providers with the authority todiagnose, prescribe medications,
perform minor surgeries andeven deliver babies.
Speaker 1 (49:14):
Okay, sorry.
So even family care physiciansdon't take it upon themselves to
treat cancer.
Even if they're full MDs oreven doctors of osteopathy, they
don't treat cancer as well.
You don't expect a rural doctorto go.
(49:34):
Oh well, I'm going to figureout what your cancer is and
treat it.
This is just beyond.
Yeah, it's bad.
Speaker 2 (49:39):
Bad news bears but your cancer isn't treated.
Oh, this is just beyond.
Yeah, it's bad.
Bad news bears.
Despite the appearance oflegitimacy, o'connell was not
one of them.
His degrees were from anuncredited correspondence school
, called again the herbal healerAcademy, and, in Colorado,
where O'Connell practice,naturopathic doctors were not at
the time licensed by the state.
(50:00):
Dr Rena bloom, a licensednaturopathic doctors, were not
at the time licensed by thestate.
Dr Rena Bloom, a licensednaturopathic physician, had
pushed for formal licensure inthe state for more than a decade
.
A quick Google search now showsthat naturopathic doctors are
now regulated in the state ofColorado.
Speaker 1 (50:17):
So we will take that as our silver lining for this
case.
Speaker 2 (50:18):
Ta-da Wonderful that there's been some progress there
um, and maybe even more sincesince then, this oh, for sure
six that this case ended 19years ago when that happened 19
years ago.
Speaker 1 (50:33):
Here's the thing, poor dr bloom, who is probably
like a wonderful person withlots of alternative,
non-traditional medicinetreatments that that will
benefit people, and here's thisasshole who's out there making
her look bad.
You know what I mean?
(50:54):
Pretending to do stuff, and howdare these particular
institutions just just say, hey,cool, I, you, you spend this
money, we'll give you somethingto put on your wall?
I mean, how is that?
Even there are a lot of evilplayers in this game.
I mean, obviously he was at thetop of the heap here, but like
(51:14):
he didn't get there without someissues and gaps in the system
on the way, whether they wereintentional or not, but it's
devastating either way.
Um, I do think we shouldprobably, because we've railed
on this now maybe look at afuture episode, maybe as a
medical chart note, to say, okay, this is where naturopathy is
(51:36):
now, because if it hasn'tprogressed to licensure in all
states, uh, I'm gonna have aproblem with that.
Um, yeah, but thank you so muchinto that.
Yeah, thank you so much forbringing this up, because, um, I
do think, obviously, westernmedicine isn't the only answer,
(51:57):
but, but, knowing that when yousee a diploma on the wall, it
doesn't necessarily mean it's.
Even if it's from anorganization that is who they
say they are doesn't meanthey're accredited.
You know there are very fewthat are accredited to provide a
rigorous education compared toothers.
Speaker 2 (52:20):
So and like, have you ever gone into a doctor's
office and like googled theirstuff on?
It was like no, I haven't, Ihaven't either.
Speaker 1 (52:30):
But I will say, like for audiology, there's only two
organizations, in the us atleast, that can accredit a
university program.
So someone can graduate from aprogram that will say you're an
audiologist and I can only speakto what I know because that's
what I am, but you can say youare one.
(52:51):
But if you're not from one ofan, they don't have to be
accredited to say you're anaudiologist, but you should be
accredited to earn licensure topractice.
And that's because thoseaccrediting bodies review those
universities programs and theirclinical placements, and all of
this to make sure that they'remeeting the rigorous standards
(53:13):
of, you know, minimum practicerequirements, that they're
actually covering all of thethings that need to be done to
be able to say that somebody'sminimally competent in whatever
field it is.
So for audiology those are twoprograms the acae and um ash's
body.
I forget caa, um and the c'syeah.
(53:37):
So this is crazy to me, thatthat it got this far, but damn
him for, like, ruining people'slives, giving them hope and and
basically killing people andtorturing them.
Because can I just say, okay,so I, I got bitten by a spider
last week and, uh, I wasconvinced it was a Brown recluse
(54:00):
, even though they're notindigenous to Minnesota.
But I was like that's it, I'mdying, um, I'm, I'm almost dead,
you know.
But also I'm too busy to go inbecause, you know, doctor, treat
thyself.
No, I'm not going anywhere, I'mjust going to diagnose myself as
almost dead, but I'm going tocarry on with my job and I don't
have time for that and I havetime to sit in a waiting room.
So two days later, after thespider bite, my, my foot was
(54:24):
looking gangrenous and I thought, okay, all right, I need to go
in.
So on my lunchtime I went up tothe emergency room and, yeah,
lo and behold, it was cellulitisand all this other stuff.
But thank God I went therebecause I could have lost my
foot and I remember I was goingwith this.
But I don't know how we got hereactually, but I'm glad that you
(54:51):
were seen.
So when I first got the spiderbite, I was like well, I have to
clean it out.
And I was at work.
All we had was hydrogenperoxide covered.
So I soaked my foot in a bucketwith hydrogen peroxide.
Speaker 2 (55:03):
Oh yeah, I forget about the story.
Speaker 1 (55:06):
Yeah.
So two days later I was likeall right, this is looking green
, like what's going on here.
And they were like you knowwhat Hydrogen peroxide actually
kills healthy tissue?
Speaker 2 (55:27):
So yeah, it cleans out the bad ones, but it kills
healthy tissue.
Speaker 1 (55:30):
So this guy was using this to inject into people's
bloodstreams to cure cancer andit kills healthy cells, and poor
Sean didn't have many of thoseanyway.
Yeah, so that's whatimmediately popped out to me.
So I felt like a dumbass that Iwas putting this on my spider
bite.
And then I was like, oh dumb meShouldn't have done that.
This guy was injecting people'sblood strains with stuff that
kills healthy cells.
So damn him.
Speaker 2 (55:52):
I am a hydrogen peroxide in the ear to like
clean the ear and I love thelike little skizzle it does in
the ear canal.
Speaker 1 (55:59):
You know it's like yeah well, that's great, because
it's not an open wound.
It's.
Speaker 2 (56:03):
I love it, but then I'm like that's what I'm saying
is like I'm like in my ear I canhear what it's doing in there,
and like he was putting this inpeople's bloodstreams.
Are you kidding me?
Speaker 1 (56:13):
Yeah, it was a soda fountain disaster in people's
pipes.
How dare he.
Speaker 2 (56:22):
And then to act like oh well, you're irish and I'm
helping you.
Speaker 1 (56:24):
No, you remember, I don't care if you're irish or
where you're from.
Also, how dare you?
Because even if you did have aspecial bond with people from
ireland, you were actuallykilling them.
He's disgusting um.
Speaker 2 (56:38):
And also, he only got 13 years, and so he's already
out of jail.
Speaker 1 (56:42):
Oh my god, everyone look out for this guy.
Hopefully you don't know ifhe's changed his name or
anything.
Speaker 2 (56:49):
I don't know.
No, I tried to like Google.
Where is he today?
Speaker 1 (56:51):
Oh yeah he's probably changed his name.
Hopefully he's laying low andWatch out.
Speaker 2 (56:55):
if you're in the Colorado area, if you're going
to Naturopath, no, they have tobe licensed.
Now, med state, um.
So that's good, but uh, anyway,last time, I think last time I
told you guys that I finally gotthose bras from handful sports
yeah, the brawls, nice lookinggood.
Speaker 1 (57:16):
Did you see all through the snap?
Speaker 2 (57:18):
I know, yep, thank you, thank you, um, so again,
they are a company calledhandful, which I thought was
super cute.
Um, handful sports bras foundat handfulcom combine comfort,
style and performance.
Created by fitness instructorand mom, mama.
(57:38):
They're designed to supportactive lifestyles with
moisture-wicking fabric,adjustable straps and removable
pads, which I don't, honestly,usually love removable pads
because they always come out inthe laundry and then you put the
frickers back in and whatever.
But these removable pads,because I know, because I have
them now, they're super cute.
Like they have a little picturefor you on there so you don't
(58:00):
have to be a dummy whichwondering which one goes where.
So it has, like where it's youknow, where you hold your hand
up in front of yourself to seelike which one's the l for the
right shirt they have that onthe inside, so you know which
one to put that's the door whichI was like that's cute.
Um, they also make leggings andtops, and they are made by women
(58:21):
, for women.
They've been featured in topfitness magazines and loved by
customers including myself.
Handful also gives back totheir survivor program, offering
free pads to breast cancersurvivors.
Move more confidently, like me,with active wear that empowers
Yeehaw.
Visit Handfulcom for 30% offwith our code stay suspicious
(58:42):
yay, thank you.
Speaker 1 (58:46):
I think it's time for a medical mishap so this email
came from someone who says wecan use our name and her name is
charlene and it it saysCharlene, charlene, charlene, oh
baby.
(59:07):
Anyway, she says hi ladies, myname is Charlene.
I've been a scrub nurse forwhat feels like eons, only eons,
because, wow, the culture ofthe youngsters coming through
these days admirable.
They don't take back talk fromthe surgeons and I am silently
here for that.
You go.
Girls, in my day we'd neverdream of talking back or telling
(59:28):
surgeons that they get to dosomething when they were done
with what they were doing first.
I love it.
I feel like there's a lot moreto that story, but, charlene,
you'll have to write back in andlet us know the down and dirty
of how these surgeons thinkthey're God.
But okay, hopefully they'rebetter now.
So to the story.
(59:49):
A patient came into the ER withabdominal pain.
Classic symptoms pointed toappendicitis.
The patient was rushed intosurgery and the appendix was out
.
Everything looked good,textbook, except two days later
the patient was still in severepain.
A repeat scan showed the realproblem a perforated ulcer.
(01:00:09):
The appendix had been fine,turns out.
The resident had made the callbased on a quick glance at the
CT report and didn't catch thepart about possible gastric
perforation, and the attendingsigned off in a hurry.
Everyone trusted the initialdiagnosis, so the patient went
back into surgery and recoveredjust fine, but the first surgery
(01:00:32):
scar was completely unnecessary.
Well, it's a good thing wedon't need our appendix.
And if you're from Minnesota,well, good thing we don't need
our appendix.
And if you're from minnesota,welp, good thing we.
Well, we don't need ourappendix.
A.
The lesson was burned intoevery intern who heard about it.
Read the whole report yourself,thanks, for I mean, that's good
(01:00:53):
advice, right?
Thanks for taking the time toread this.
Speaker 2 (01:00:56):
if you do take care, charlie thanks for sending and,
yeah, good thing they didn'tneed an appendix, because why be
pissed though?
Speaker 1 (01:01:05):
Oh, yeah, I know, because that's two surgeries
instead of just one.
But you know, hopefully thehospital paid for that.
Speaker 2 (01:01:14):
Oh, I'm sure they did .
Speaker 1 (01:01:16):
It'd be much cheaper than the lawsuit, which they
would just pay them off anyway,to keep the mouth shut, because
that's what hospitals do rightso yeah, I mean not speaking
from personal experiencespeaking about anywhere that I'm
working, which I haven't said,so they don't need to get mad,
okay yeah, all right.
Speaker 2 (01:01:35):
So, jenna, what can we expect to hear next week?
Speaker 1 (01:01:39):
Oh God, it's a pedophile people.
It's a self-proclaimedpedophile who's a surgeon a
gastric surgeon and it's thebiggest pedophilic case in
France of all time, and it hasjust recently.
(01:02:00):
In the last couple weeks he'sgone through trial and gotten
his sentencing.
So it's a doozy.
Yeah, sounds like it.
So, yeah, hopefully.
I think it's important to talkabout these things, but, yeah,
it's not going to belighthearted, that's for sure.
Speaker 2 (01:02:18):
Okay, well, we'll be there.
Yeah, you will.
Speaker 1 (01:02:23):
Well, at least you will.
You have to be.
Speaker 2 (01:02:24):
You know what uh, you know what?
For sure, guys, I'll be here,you're.
I was gonna say you're legallycontracted?
Speaker 1 (01:02:29):
no, you're not, but you're emotionally contracted
yes, I will be here if you'renot here, um, but meanwhile,
don't miss a beat.
Subscribe or follow doctoringthe truth wherever you enjoy
your podcast for stories thatshock, intrigueue and educate.
Trust, after all, is a delicatething.
You can text us directly on ourwebsite at
DoctoringTheTruthAtBuzzSpoutcom,or email us your story ideas
(01:02:52):
and comments atDoctoringTheTruth at gmail.
We definitely need medicalmishaps from you guys.
We read them out on air, wegive you credit.
If you want, you can stayanonymous, but we need more of
those.
Don't be shy.
Speaker 2 (01:03:07):
Don't be shy, and I've had a lot of you text me or
tell me in person.
Oh my God, this could be amedical mishap.
So it's like, and I've toldy'all you can be anonymous, you
can change the names.
It can be the same story butyou can change names.
But can be the same story butyou can change names.
But I cannot in my rightconscience share it on the pod
until you give me permission.
Speaker 1 (01:03:27):
So don't be scared.
Yeah, don't be scared.
And also write it out in yourown words we don't want to go,
oh so.
And so my friend told me thislike send it, we want your own
words because you have a voiceand you can, having been there,
tell it better than anybody.
Speaker 2 (01:03:40):
So deal with it.
If you feel like you suck atstorytelling it's probably not
true, but just like, write thebullet points down for ChatGPT
and it will make it breast upfor you.
Okay, guys, I mean, that's howpeople are getting through
college these days, I hear.
So just put it in there if youthink you can Damn.
Speaker 1 (01:03:55):
Where was that when we were?
Yeah, I don't know, but itmakes me feel really good like
we did it without.
Speaker 2 (01:04:03):
We're so smart, we're so smart?
Speaker 1 (01:04:07):
um, absolutely, and be sure to follow us on
instagram at doctoring the truthpodcast, on facebook at
doctoring the truth, and we'reon tiktok at doctoring the truth
and ed odd pod, which is edaud-D-A-U-D-P-O-D.
Don't forget to download,because we don't get credit for
you listening to us unless youactually download.
Isn't that crazy?
We don't get stats as listeners.
(01:04:29):
You're only considered alistener of our podcast if you
download it.
So download it please, even ifyou don't listen.
Please listen, we'd like both,but ideally, if you have to pick
one, at least download it andlisten later.
Rate and review, because thosecomments are priceless and, uh,
we want to bring you morecontent each week, so help keep
(01:04:49):
us motivated until then.
Stay safe and stay suspicious.
Speaker 2 (01:04:58):
We're even looking at each other.
I don't know why we're notdoing that together.
Suspicious bye.
Take two Amanda Jenna hey, how you doing?
Oh good, how are you Good?
Welcome to the second attemptat recording episode 23.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Yeah, some of you may have noticed that we didn't
upload an episode last week.
I know some of you noticedbecause you texted me Concerned.
We're alive, we're fine, thankyou.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
Yeah, some of us include well, most well me.
Basically, what happened was Iwent to this should be part of
the correction section but Ithought I saved my the dog ate
my homework.
Basically I thought I saved therecording on my end and
apparently my computer memorywas too full and it must have
(00:57):
given me an error of noticesomehow, but I don't recall
seeing it.
So my end was not saved andthen I tried to.
I'm boring everybody, but Itried to go in after the fact
and act like I could banter,like it was it's way harder than
you think like because I hadamanda's track.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
I was thinking about how she would do that and I was
like, how will she do that?
I figured out, obviously, youknow yeah no, because how would
you sometimes remember, like,what you were talking about?
That would prompt my commentary, you know.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Yeah, the banter was super hard.
I was like, well, just screwthe banter, we'll just do the
episode.
But even in the episode I thinkI kept interrupting, so it was
just a no-go, we're doing itagain.
Take two it's going to beawesome.
And I was telling Amanda, it'sbeen a week since we recorded
last and even though it's thesame material, I'm going to be
just as surprised as ourlisteners because my short term
(01:51):
memory is really bad, so yay.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
I'm looking forward to this.
I felt like at a couple ofparts I kind of just like
blabbed on and then it felt likea car crashing into a wall at
the end and it was like, okay,we're done.
And I was like, okay, we'redone.
And I was like I'm just gonnafix that.
So lucky for you guys.
Um, my story is two pagesshorter than it was before and,
uh, the ending is a littlesofter, with a like a parachute.
(02:15):
So, oh bless, I guess you knowwhat you're gonna let us down
gently?
it just.
It works out better foreverybody that I love that yeah
I really did and I did say lasttime like, wow, that was like a
car crashing into a brick wall,sorry, um.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
So yeah, it's a, it's a little nicer ending I didn't
feel that way last time, but I'mhappy to be gently deposited
this time around.
Speaker 2 (02:36):
Yeah, let's do that okay, so um, no really
disclaimers or trigger warnings.
My sources will be in the shownotes.
We already did correctionsection um.
You know what?
You guys were busy celebratingthe holiday anyway.
So here we are, um.
(02:57):
So that brings us to um.
Probably you had some beveragesover the holiday let's hope so
because I don't know it was.
America's birthday, so probablyyou did.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
I will say.
I will say, amanda, just in allfairness, the majority of our
listeners are US, but we have alarge percentage, comparatively,
that are from the UK, and Ijust want to say I'm so sorry,
but we did celebrate ourindependence from you guys.
You can come take us backanytime, okay.
(03:29):
No, oh, my gosh, that would beso fun.
Please come take us.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
Vacation, let's go, let's go.
Well, for those of us who didcelebrate with beverages, you
may have had a Shimmerwoodbeverage.
Shimmerwood beverages can befound at shimmerwoodcom.
They are craft CBD infusedseltzers using full spectrum CBD
(03:52):
for a calming, non-intoxicatingeffect.
Twice named the number one CBDdrink by Forbes.
These refreshing seltzerscombine main source fruit,
cocktail bitters and cleaningredients.
So no added sugars, caffeine orartificial flavors.
Available in bold flavors likeRaz, lime, chai, cherry, ginger,
orange and Just Hemp.
(04:13):
Shimmerwood offers a natural,flavorful alternative to alcohol
or sugary drinks, perfect forrelaxing anytime, straight or
mixed.
Visit wwwshimmerwoodcom for anexclusive 30% off with our
discount code STAYSUSPICIOUS,which, now that I'm reading that
, I think on take one, you didcorrect your coupon code.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
Oh yeah, we have to.
God, I keep making this.
A whole section Could be halfthe episode by the time I get
done with all Jenna's mistakes.
But Amanda was right.
The promo code for was it CozyEarth?
Well, basically the promo codefor anything that we've talked
about, cozy Earth and the coffeeand the shimmer wood and all of
(04:59):
that and the bras is staysuspicious.
And I had said just suspicious,yeah, and Amanda said is stay
suspicious.
And I had said just suspicious,yeah, and Amanda said it was
suspicious.
Amanda was like this issuspicious and I said no, I'm
absolutely 100% sure that it'sjust suspicious.
And she said it.
I was so confident If you'regoing to make a mistake, just do
it with you know cojones.
(05:21):
And Amanda said are you sure?
Because I thought and I waslike actually I'm not sure, and
then I went and looked and I wastotally wrong.
So so, yeah, thank you forbringing that up so anyway
that's actually part two, andwe're ready to.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Uh, we're ready to dive back in guys, all right.
So here we go.
Naturopathy is often painted inhues of peace and healing
gentle herbs, acupunctureneedles, the quiet wisdom of
ancient practices.
To many, including myself, it'san appealing compliment to
Western medicine.
(05:56):
It's less invasive and moreholistic.
But in 2003, in the suburbs ofColorado, naturopathy became the
backdrop for a tragedy soprofound that it would
ultimately challenge the linebetween alternative healing and
criminal fraud.
Sean Flanagan was the kind ofteenager that you could never
(06:16):
forget Vibrant, restless, alwayschasing the next adventure.
His mother, laura, remembershim as a light.
He was always smiling, alwaystrying new things, she said.
His dad, dave, described himsimply a great kid, strong and
active.
His sister, kelsey, remembershis connection to nature.
He loved the river.
(06:37):
When he kayaked it was like hewas one with the water.
But at just 16 years oldeverything changed.
Sean started to complain ofpain in his leg.
Then one afternoon he collapsedin the bathroom.
Laura found him curled up onthe floor, pale and gasping.
A frantic rush to the ERfollowed and then the
(06:59):
unthinkable a football-sizedtumor in his pelvic region.
He was diagnosed with Ewingsarcoma, a rare and aggressive
form of bone cancer.
The hospital became their secondhome.
He spent Christmas, surroundedby IV poles and blinking
machines, but never lost hisspirit.
I just want to go to Hawaii.
(07:19):
Sean once said lay in a hammock, fly over a volcano.
Sean once said lay in a hammock, fly over a volcano.
He smiled through the chemo,joked with the nurses and
dreamed big, even when the oddsgot smaller.
Doctors prepared the family forsurgery and in late 2003, the
doctors found the tumor had notshrunk.
However, they decided tooperate.
The surgery was complex anddangerous, but the Flanigans
(07:42):
were desperate for time.
When they opened Sean up, theydiscovered that the femoral
artery had been ravaged by thecancer.
To save his life, the surgeonshad to amputate his leg.
And even through all of this,sean still smiled and still
dreamt.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
Oh man.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
Shortly after surgery , sean's grandmother boarded a
flight back to Colorado.
Like fate pulling cruel strings, sean's grandmother met a
stranger on the plane.
Her eyes were swollen withgrief when the man seated next
to her leaned in to offersupport.
She shared Sean's story andthat's when he told her there's
someone in Wheat Ridge, a doctor.
He cured my friend's cancer.
(08:19):
He spoke with certainty andhope about this doctor.
He said that this doctor hadcured people that the hospitals
had given up on that.
This doctor knew how to removetumors naturally.
After landing, she called thefamily to share the news.
His name was Brian O'Connell, anaturopath.
The family had never even heardof the word naturopath before,
(08:41):
but they were desperate.
They looked up his websitewebsite and it seemed legitimate
.
There were testimonials,professional-looking photos and
diplomas hanging on the wall.
So they went.
When they pulled up to MountainArea Naturopathic Associates,
they were met with warmth andconfidence.
Brian O'Connell greeted thempersonally with a warm smile, a
(09:02):
firm handshake and friendly eyes.
He spoke to them ofphotoluminescence, a
groundbreaking treatment, heclaimed.
We draw blood from Sean, heexplained, run it through
ultraviolet light to superoxygenate it, then reintroduce
it into his system.
It cleanses the blood, destroysthe cancer.
I've seen it work, it will work.
(09:23):
He looked Laura and Dave in theeyes and said no Irish kid is
going to die on my watch.
It sounded revolutionary.
It sounded hopeful, like amiracle.
The Flanigans wrote a check for$7,400 on the spot and Sean's
first treatment was that sameday.
At first it didn't seem to domuch.
(09:45):
Sean didn't feel better, but hedidn't feel worse either, until
he did.
The next day, on December 12th,everything changed.
Sean was admitted to thehospital with a blood infection
known as septicemia, whichdeveloped into pneumonia, and he
remained hospitalized until the15th of December, at which time
he was discharged home on fiveliters of oxygen and an oxygen
(10:08):
monitoring device known as apulse oximeter, unknown at the
time.
The blood infection was causedby the unsterile
photoluminescence procedure hereceived on the 10th.
Speaker 1 (10:19):
Oh man, this is totally preventable then?
Speaker 2 (10:23):
Mm-hmm.
On December 16th and and againwe're in 2003 o'connell arrived
at the flanagan's home tocomplete another treatment.
He brought with him hisequipment and supplies for a
photoluminescence procedure.
The family gathered in theliving room for the procedure
and insisted that he usedsterile techniques, which he
(10:43):
complied.
O'connell inserted the IV lineand began the procedure.
Sean's pulse oximeter showedoxygen saturation levels
dropping from the normal range,which is over 90%, to levels in
the 60% range, which slowly thenreturned to normal.
He left the equipment at thehome for the family to do the
procedure again the followingday with the UV light and
(11:06):
hydrogen peroxide.
The family followed theinstructions and performed the
procedure and this time his SATsdropped into the 40% range.
The family contacted O'Connellwith great concern and he
assured them that he would finda fix for the problem.
I like also think I just paidyou $7,400.
Why am I completing the thirdtreatment Like?
(11:29):
exactly why aren't you doing it?
Speaker 1 (11:32):
Right.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
Okie dokie.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
And, sorry, the hydrogen peroxide.
Where's that going?
Speaker 2 (11:39):
Oh, don't worry.
So he draws the blood out andthen he mixes it with hydrogen
peroxide.
Speaker 1 (11:44):
Oh God, I'm going to be sick.
Okay, all right.
Oh man.
Speaker 2 (11:51):
On the 18th, o'connell returned to the
Flanagan's home to perform thesame procedure, but it included
a more rapid infusion of thehydrogen peroxide with the UV
light procedure.
As the procedure was completed,sean's SATs plummeted to below
20.
His skin turned gray and hecollapsed after begging.
Please, god, no more.
(12:11):
Panic filled the room.
O'connell stared at the pulseoximeter.
He had no idea what it was.
He stared at the numbers likethey were a foreign language.
He thought the device wasbroken.
But Sean's dad was afirefighter and an EMT and he
knew exactly what the device wasand what the plummeting numbers
meant.
He had to resuscitate his ownson.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
Sean, terrified, whispered no more, Pack your
stuff and go.
Sean had a really rough nightand unfortunately, the next
morning the family woke up tofind that his skin was yellow.
They knew that his liverfunction and kidney function
were shutting down.
Sean would pass away later thatday, surrounded by family.
After just four treatments inless than a week, he died.
(12:58):
The boy that they were toldmight have months left to live
was gone just 18 days aftermeeting Brian O'Connell.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
Oh god, it's devastating.
Speaker 2 (13:09):
Three months later, on March 25th 2004, sergeant
Jonathan Pickett of the WheatRidge Police Department was
called to the Lutheran MedicalCenter.
A 17 year old named CatherineCat she went by Brissina had
inexplicably gone into cardiacarrest.
Cat and her family had traveledfrom Wisconsin to receive
medical treatment from O'Connell.
(13:30):
During one session, heperformed photoluminescence and
gave the teenager an injectionof vitamin C and B12.
It was supposed to be a routinepreventative care session, but
after the vitamin injection, catvomited, gasped for breath and
lost consciousness.
While O'Connell attemptedmouth-to-mouth resuscitation,
(13:51):
paramedics raced to the sceneand delivered Kat to the medical
center.
According to paramedics, shewas in cardiac arrest for at
least 10 minutes and doctorsinitially weren't sure whether
she'd make a full recovery.
Her care team learned from thefamily that there had been a
doctor administering a bloodpurification treatment.
The name of this doctor BrianO'Connell.
(14:13):
An ER doctor called and spokewith O'Connell to try and
understand what the treatmentwas.
In an effort to save the girl'slife, o'connell explained to
them that this patient just hadan anxiety attack, but Dr Joanne
Edney was skeptical oh, yeah,come on Anxiety.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
Yeah, it doesn't give you a heart attack, anxiety.
Speaker 2 (14:36):
Sometimes it might feel like it is going to.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
I love that TikTok.
By the way, the dances OkayAnyway.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
She told Belize that she believed the young woman's
sudden problem was caused by Idon't know, an allergic reaction
, an air embolism, a bloodembolism or a contaminated
product, not by anxiety.
Speaker 1 (14:59):
Duh.
Speaker 2 (15:01):
The ER doctor noted that O'Connell didn't even sound
like a doctor he didn't useterms like a doctor and so they
looked him up, and then theyrealized he didn't really seem
to have the credentialsnecessary to be performing such
a treatment.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
But Amanda did.
He have no clothes on and atrailer.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
You know this guy was a little bit of a step up from
our old trailer McGee.
This guy has an office and asfar as I'm aware, he has his
clothes on.
He was never in the pornindustry.
If you don't know what we'retalking about, please go back to
episode what 21,?
I think no 20?
.
Speaker 1 (15:40):
What is this?
23 today?
So it's 22, 21, 20.
Episode 20.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Yeah, what a weirdo that episode will forever make
me laugh.
Same.
Within days another caseemerged rory galagos.
He was only 44 and had beendiagnosed with colon cancer that
had spread to his liver.
Rory felt that his medical teamhad given up hope, and that is
(16:06):
what he craved.
He then found Brian O'Connell,who offered him not only hope,
but a cure.
Anything that Rory wanted,brian O'Connell said he could
deliver.
O'connell had promised himhealing through a topical
treatment called black salve.
He told Rory that if he appliedthis to his skin it would draw
out the tumor.
Speaker 1 (16:27):
He guaranteed that it would work oh, come on, it's
not a zit, people, it's not azit, it's a tumor.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
It's a tumor black salve is an archaic, corrosive
ointment known to destroy tissuebecause it contains alkaloids
that attack and destroy anyliving tissue that it's applied
to.
It would be like applyingbattery acid on an open wound,
said Dr Terry Dubrow.
It was used in the early 1900sand has since been replaced with
(16:57):
safer and more effectivetreatments.
There is no evidence that ithas any correlation to aid in
cancer treatment and is actuallyconsidered illegal.
Now, though, it is still soldby unscrupulous practitioners.
According to Dubrow, roryfollowed O'Connell's
instructions of putting thesalve on, let's just say, a
sensitive part of his body.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
Oh no.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
He applied it daily and soon his skin was raw and
oozing.
The salve had begun to eat awayat his skin and the sore grew
bigger and bigger and bigger,until he was rushed by ambulance
to the hospital where he wouldsadly pass away within hours.
Rory's wife, janet, wasdevastated and said he told us
he could save Rory.
He said that he'd never lost acancer patient, but my husband
(17:41):
died in agony.
He was robbed of dignity.
But my husband died in agony.
He was robbed of dignity.
She went on to say he had allof these certificates.
He was a pharmacist.
He knew what he was doing, buthe wasn't.
He was fraudulently advertisingexpertise that he didn't have.
Investigators quickly discoveredthat photoluminescence wasn't
(18:03):
even medically recognized.
It was invasive and legallyrestricted to licensed
physicians.
While it wasn't illegal, itwasn't considered a legitimate
medical treatment.
It is invasive and should onlybe completed by a licensed
medical doctor.
O'connell was a naturopath, nota licensed medical doctor.
He wasn't even certified underlegitimate institutions, as far
(18:26):
as they could tell online.
On March 29th, investigatorsexecuted a search warrant and
raided O'Connell's clinic.
What they found was chilling.
His walls were covered in fakediplomas, including one from the
Colorado University ofNaturopathic Medicine, which is
a university that doesn't evenexist.
Oh, are you kidding?
no, they googled it and theywere like whoa, this place isn't
(18:50):
real the balls on this man Iknow, I just I can't okay it
appeared that all of hiscertificates had been purchased
from the internet of coursethere were boxes of potassium
chloride, which is used to stopheart strain surgery, along with
iv stands and hardware store uvlights.
(19:11):
Nothing was sterile, nothing wassafe and, worst of all, they
found 4 000 patient files,thousands that had paid for
weeks of treatments thatamounted to nothing but false
hope and harm.
And his photoluminescencemachine.
Yeah, it was just a loop oftubing under a heat lamp.
They were lights that youliterally could buy at a
(19:33):
hardware store, a light thatyou'd find like hanging in
someone's garage.
They were nothing special, notmedical-grade light bulbs that
would have any effect onsomeone's blood.
It was a trick and he was afraud.
Speaker 1 (19:45):
Oh, my God, I mean I did better with lights with our
terrarium for our lizard.
You know what I mean, like holycow.
Speaker 2 (19:57):
Yeah, you may be wondering also how did he even
get his hands on some of thesethings outside of the hardware
lights?
Speaker 1 (20:05):
I was going to say you go to a pet store.
Really Well, you go to AceHardware and you just buy the
lights, obviously.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
But how about these things?
I don't know?
Drugs that stop a heart.
Why does he have that?
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Oh yeah, that's crazy .
Speaker 2 (20:18):
Even the DEA had been fooled by O'Connell.
Detective Pickett was able totrace back his application for
the controlled substance license.
The application stated that hewas going to be working under a
grant administered by theColorado State University in
Fort Collins to test controlledsubstances on patients.
He conned the DEA what heobtained a DEA license through a
(20:42):
lot of fraud and a lot of lies,which allowed him to outfit his
clinic with these things thatreally he wasn't allowed to have
, and with these things hetortured desperate people for
profit okay this is a big fatpuke.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Yeah, but isn't some of this on the DEA?
Because if he's claiming thathe has this degree from a
university that doesn't exist,did they even do the basic
discovery process?
Did they make him prove?
Like, how did they, how didthey approve it?
I mean, where's the grant?
Uh, approval as well?
Like surely you have to showthat I don't know.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
I think uh, definitely some holes in the
process.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
I don't know that's disgusting either way, but it
should not have been able to gothrough all those hoops, unless
he's like this genius.
Like what do you call it whensomebody copies signatures and
uh, yeah, um, why can't I thinkof that?
Forger, forger, forgery and allof this other stuff?
(21:44):
I don't know how the dea wouldhave.
He would have passed muster inany way.
We're not talking about the1800s here.
What the hell backed.
Speaker 2 (21:54):
Yeah, I know, this is the early 2000s.
I'm like thinking back to likemy irb applications for like
research and stuff.
Oh, oh my.
God, I don't know.
Speaker 1 (22:01):
You can't even put earphones in somebody without an
insanely rigorous process.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
And then you have to have like interviews with the
people.
Yeah, to approve yourapplication.
Speaker 1 (22:13):
Right.
Speaker 2 (22:14):
Step by step so.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Wow, somebody was sleeping through this process.
Speaker 2 (22:18):
With that.
I don't really know, like, howinterested they were in like who
I was, in my credentials, but Idon't know.
I also have never applied for agrant for research either.
But any puzzles.
Hopefully this uh rose a flag tohave an improvement in the
process let's hope so so also,while I was reading through
these materials, like I keptwondering how often is this
(22:41):
happening?
Like, are people just gettingfake licenses and fooling
agencies like the DEA?
But I did not have to wonderfor very long because the
Seattle Times investigatedO'Connell's wall of degrees and
uncovered much of the biggerstory about credentialing fraud
which, honestly, it could justbe an episode of its own.
But here is a very condensedversion, which is part two,
(23:05):
condensed from part one, soyou're welcome.
So this is what the SeattleTimes found.
O'connell was part of asprawling multimillion dollar
industry that sells fakelegitimacy through an
international web ofunaccredited schools and dubious
trade associations aninternational web of
unaccredited schools and dubioustrade associations.
(23:25):
They found that at least 104unaccredited schools issue
alternative medicine degrees notrecognized by the US Department
of Education.
Many operate solely online orby mail.
The largest, clayton College ofNatural Health, claims to have
issued over 25,000 degreesthrough a home study model.
Major credentialing bodies inthis space are controlled by
(23:46):
just two businessmen Wow,shocking.
One in Texas and the other inLas Vegas, who run mail order
factories issuing professionaltitles and accreditations to
over 100 schools.
Manufacturers of energy devicesoften run or sponsor training
programs that hand outcredentials which practitioners
(24:07):
then use to market themselves ashealthcare professionals.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
Oh my god, I think we could do an entire series on
this.
Are you kidding me In this dayand age?
Speaker 2 (24:17):
Are you?
It was like the Las Vegascredentialing mill.
I was like, ah, this is such arabbit hole.
Speaker 1 (24:22):
Are you effing kidding me right now?
Speaker 2 (24:26):
And those homies are just sitting at home making big
dollars.
Speaker 1 (24:29):
Oh, my God.
Speaker 2 (24:29):
Printing papers saying they have a degree, and
we had blood sweat and tears.
Speaker 1 (24:34):
To go to an accredited university to be able
to get into this so many tears,oh my God, this makes me so
angry.
I can't believe this ishappening now.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
Well, maybe you'll tell me it's not happening now,
20 years ago okay, I'm sorry,I'm old, so to me it's still
hard to believe that early 2000sis 20 years.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
I feel like it's yesterday yeah, yeah, maybe we
need to do an episode on whetheror not this is improved.
Anyway, sorry I keepinterrupting, but Giltonen of
Vassar University, one of onlyfive accredited naturopathic
(25:27):
colleges in the US.
Speaker 2 (25:30):
She added, to argue that you don't need any training
to diagnose or treat patientsis absurd, and I'm just going to
make a quick insert that, again, this was almost 20 years ago.
So there may be more than fiveaccredited naturopathic schools
in the U?
S at this time.
I don't know, so don't come forme, but at the time of this
article there were only five.
(25:50):
And the article goes on to saynaturopathy is a growing field
favoring natural remedies overpharmaceuticals.
In 14 States, includingWashington, it's a licensed
profession requiring a degreefrom an accredited four-year
college.
But in the other 36 states,like Colorado where O'Connell
operated, anyone could callthemselves a naturopathic doctor
(26:11):
with no training at all.
Speaker 1 (26:13):
Hmm, sounds to me like the difference between a
hearing maybe I shouldn't saythis, but hearing aid dispenser,
where you don't even have tohave a high school diploma, at
least in Minnesota andaudiologists, where the minimum
licensure requirement is adoctoral degree and they're both
fitting hearing aids Like.
(26:33):
I guess we're not the onlyprofession that's suffering from
this dichotomy.
Speaker 2 (26:36):
There's a lot of parallels actually.
Speaker 1 (26:40):
Oh wow, Unfortunately yeah.
Speaker 2 (26:42):
Yeah, mm-hmm parallels actually.
Oh, wow, unfortunately.
Yeah, yeah, one of thecertificates on o'connell's wall
came from the americannaturopathic medical association
, which sounds official but isbased out of las vegas, from a
po box.
Its founder, donald hayhurst,is known as the godfather of
mail order credentials.
Hey, hurst.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
Sorry, even his name is like hey Don.
Hey Hurst, give me a degree,dude.
Speaker 2 (27:10):
He's like okay, get out your checkbook.
He has issued thousands ofmemberships and they are or were
I don't know if they still are$350 to $500 apiece and
accredits various schools.
An ANMA board member defendingtheir legitimacy, saying some
people say we're fake.
I can't convince them.
(27:34):
Okay, I think that took outpart of the quote because I
shortened it, but it was like ifthey don't want to join us,
then so be it.
It's like okay.
Meanwhile, hayhurst declined tospeak with reporters, so
shocking, what a shock, yeah.
So by this point investigatorswere convinced that O'Connell
was a con man and not a doctor.
(27:55):
They believe they hadsufficient grounds to charge him
with criminal impersonationtheft by fraud theft by frogs
illegally obtaining controlledsubstances.
I think I said throd, thatwould be better.
Speaker 1 (28:13):
I know, but theft by frogs would be even better.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
Either way it was incorrect and multiple counts of
assault tied to injuriessustained by patients rory
galagos and cat brisina, whosecases had triggered the original
investigation.
But before we get more intothat, it's time for a chart note
.
Welcome to the chart notesegment, where we learn about
(28:41):
what's happening in medicine andhealthcare.
So there's a new technologythat could enable scientists to
better observe how tissuesamples change over time.
A nano needle breakthroughcould end painful cancer
biopsies.
Inserting a needle or scalpelto extract a sliver of tissue,
often from deep in the body, haslong been the most reliable way
to diagnose cancer, and thesetraditional biopsies are
(29:04):
invasive, frequently painful andnot without risk.
Now, researchers at King'sCollege in London believe they
have found a gentler and moreeffective alternative a patch
studded with millions ofmicroscopic nanoneedles capable
of extracting a wealth ofdiagnostic data without damaging
the tissue.
Nanoneedles capable ofextracting a wealth of
diagnostic data without damagingthe tissue.
(29:26):
To the naked eye, the deviceresembles a simple, flexible
plaster.
In fact, it is coated with adense force of silicone probes
each thousands of times thinnerthan a human hair.
When applied to a suspectedtumor, the needles are fine
enough to penetrate individualcells, gently drying out
biochemical data, includinglipids, proteins and fragments
of genetic material, all whileleaving the tissue intact.
(29:46):
The samples are analyzed usingmass spectrometry, a technique
that identifies the moleculespresent.
Artificial intelligence is thenused to interpret the findings.
In trials involving 23 humanbrain tumor samples, the
technique distinguished betweendifferent types of disease.
It returned results in aslittle as 20 minutes potentially
(30:07):
quick enough to inform thesurgeon's next move during an
operation, which is super cool.
The research published in thejournal Naturo no, I'm redoing
that sentence.
No, I'm redoing that sentence.
The research published in thejournal Natural.
(30:28):
Nanotechnology belongs to afast-growing field known as
spatial biology, where the aimis to understand disease by
mapping where differentmolecules sit in tissues.
Most methods require removingand killing the tissue, making
it impossible to observe how thestructure changes over time.
Killing the tissue making itimpossible to observe how the
structure changes over time.
The nanoneedle patch, bycontrast, should allow for
(30:49):
repeated, non-destructivesampling from the same site.
Dr Cairo Sciapini of King'sCollege London, who led the
research, said from a purelyscientific standpoint, this is
the biggest breakthrough.
We can get molecularinformation from the same tissue
as many times as we want.
Spatial biology as a field atthe moment is exploding.
It is revolutionizing the waythat we understand tissues and
(31:09):
how they function.
One of the biggest challengeswas that we couldn't monitor
them longitudinally over time,and now we can.
Manufactured using the samelithographic techniques as
computer chips, the nanoneedlescan be integrated into medical
instruments that could includethe devices used to place stents
in coronary arteries, allowingdoctors to monitor the fatty
(31:32):
deposits that causecardiovascular disease.
For conditions such assuspected mouth or throat cancer
, the patches could eliminatethe need for painful biopsies
altogether.
Chiappini said for somepatients, this could be the
beginning of the end for painfulbiopsies.
Our technology opens up newways to diagnose and monitor
disease safely, helping doctorsand patients make better, faster
(31:55):
decisions.
Speaker 1 (31:56):
This is amazing.
I love this for so many reasons.
Isn't it cool?
Yeah, I wonder do you have toactually make contact with the
actual tumor for it to be ableto do what you need to do?
Because then you know if it's atumor that's not at the surface
, does it have to be long enoughto like?
Speaker 2 (32:16):
Or it's like the different patches have different
lines, yeah.
Speaker 1 (32:18):
Or is it just that your lipids and your body
chemistry is going to bedifferent when it's fighting
cancer and they can track thatwithout having to go deeper?
I don't know, but either waythat's fantastic.
Speaker 2 (32:30):
Yeah, super cool, go guys in London, yeah.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
Yay, go London Go.
Speaker 2 (32:37):
London Woohoo, okay, back to the story, london Okay,
back to the story.
The investigation revealed thatO'Connell fraudulently
misrepresented his backgroundand qualifications through his
website handouts and prominentlydisplayed licenses,
certificates and awards.
He presented himself as adoctor, despite lacking any
(32:57):
legitimate education, trainingor experience.
Wearing a white coat and astethoscope to reinforce the
image, he falsely claimed to bethe medical doctor of Mountain
Area Naturopathic Associates,implying medical expertise.
His doctor of naturopathicmedicine title came from the
Herbal Healer Academy, which isan unlicensed, unaccredited
(33:20):
correspondence school fined fordeceptive practices.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
How surprising.
Speaker 2 (33:26):
Shocking.
He also claimed to be aregistered naturopath and to
hold board certifications fromnon-accredited entities, none
recognized by legitimateauthorities.
He falsely asserted he haddegrees in microbiology,
biochemistry and pharmacy fromaccredited institutions and
claimed experience in pharmacy,allopathic medicine, chemistry,
(33:50):
toxicology and forensics,despite, again, having little or
no training in any of thesefields.
He displayed fraudulently theDEA and Colorado Department of
Human Services licenses and,like going through these lists,
I'm like there's no way oneperson would do all these things
Right, like so you went toschool for 40 years.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
Yeah, come on, dude.
Speaker 2 (34:15):
No, you didn't, yeah.
And if you say you did, did andyou're only 45 years old, like
no you're not a specialist inall areas exactly.
Speaker 1 (34:26):
I mean, it takes like an extra how many.
So medical school is like anextra six years or whatever over
undergrad, and then, uh,fellowship is another two to
four, come on uh okano alsomisrepresented it, his
(34:48):
experience, abilities andprocedures.
Speaker 2 (34:49):
He claimed to have personally cured many cancer
patients, including those withaggressive cancers like sean's
metastatic e-wings sarcoma.
He showed families plasticbaggies containing objects that
he said were tumors that he hadremoved, which sick because most
medical nice touch, classy yeah, yeah, oh, we do ziplots for
(35:14):
sure we wave them in front offamilies and say, look I did
this.
He had told sean's family histreatments could and would cure
the cancer.
Using slides that he claimedwere of sean's blood, he pointed
out alleged toxins andimpurities to justify the
treatment.
He promoted black salve, uvlight therapy, hydrogen peroxide
infusions, vitamins, teas andsupplements as cures, claiming
(35:39):
sterile technique wasunnecessary because the UV light
would kill all the bacteria.
He concealed the lack ofscientific evidence, omitted
known risks and failed todisclose the controversy
surrounding these treatments.
On May 19th, brian O'Connellwas arrested but posted bail
quickly.
There were conditions, withBond posted that he would not
(36:00):
commit any other crimes.
The story had a lot of mediaattention, as you could maybe
imagine.
The Flanagan saw it on theevening news and Laura
immediately dialed the number atthe bottom of the screen to
share that their son was avictim of O'Connell.
When detectives arrived at theFlanagan home, the story that
(36:21):
they heard stopped them cold.
The Flanagan shared that theyhad taken their son, sean, to
see O'Connell, hopingnaturopathic treatments might
help.
O'connell recommended variousvitamins, teas and procedures,
including withdrawing Sean'sblood, exposing it to UV light
and then reinforcing it alongwith hydrogen peroxide directly
into his bloodstream.
They described the in-hometreatments and the scene that
(36:42):
they believed ultimately led toSean's death His oxygen levels
had dropped, but O'Connellfailed to recognize the signs.
They told them there was nobasic sanitation used, despite
Sean being severelyimmunocompromised.
The Flanagans came tounderstand that O'Connell's
negligence using steriletechniques, performing and
(37:02):
recommending risky, unprovenprocedures without proper
training, licensing orscientific basis and infusing
hydrogen peroxide into Sean'sbloodstream a dangerous act he
knew or should have known couldhave been fatal.
He never yeah.
Speaker 1 (37:20):
Sorry, amanda, yes.
Speaker 2 (37:21):
Did I say sterile they?
Speaker 1 (37:22):
were unsterile techniques correct yeah, she's
like.
You have a correction sectionlady I just wanted to point that
out.
Okay, yay, somebody else otherthan me, lol yes, everybody,
they are unsterile yeah didn'tdo anything correctly.
Speaker 2 (37:41):
Um, he never warned them of any risks and sean had
been told that he might have upto six months to live, but he
died just 18 days after meetingo'connell.
The flanagans believedwholeheartedly that o'connell
shortened sean's life andworsened his final weeks.
They felt robbed of precioustime with their son and sought
justice not only for his deathbut also for the financial
(38:02):
losses they incurred from thehospitalization, medical
treatment for the resultingblood infection and the cost of
McConnell's services.
After their meeting with theFlanigans, investigators began
to wonder if they were not onlydealing with a fraud case but
perhaps a homicide.
Could they prove that heaccelerated the death of Sean?
(38:25):
They went to the coroner'soffice, who ruled his death was
due to natural causes secondaryto a deadly and aggressive form
of cancer.
They shared the story of Sean'slast couple of weeks of life
and the coroner then thoughtmaybe this was not natural
causes.
Basic sterilization procedureswere not used during
photoluminescence treatments andalso not carried out by a
(38:46):
professional.
She thought the lack ofsterilization actually led to an
infection which could haveaccelerated his death, and then
she changed the deathcertificate from natural to
undetermined.
Wow, this would allowinvestigators to pursue criminal
charges for the death of Sean.
In the midst of all this, theDEA contacted authorities that
(39:08):
they were contacted by O'Connellyou guys, for tools to perform
a treatment, even after he wasnot supposed to.
An undercover sting was puttogether in an effort to later
prove to a jury that he wasoffering hope to the hopeless
and preying upon desperate.
The day of the sting, o'connellmet the undercover agents in
(39:28):
the lobby and greeted themwarmly.
He took them back to his officewhere he explained how the
black salve worked andproclaimed he could cure cancer.
He then asked if they wanted tosee pictures of tumors that his
other patients had, and whileshowing him pictures of the
tumors, he claimed this is goingto be an underline, underline,
underline, so pay attention.
He claimed that the AmericanCancer Society didn't want the
(39:52):
public to know about thistreatment because then they
would have to close their doors.
Oh my God, like the AmericanCancer Society is not
gatekeeping treatment guys?
Speaker 1 (40:06):
I can't even.
I'm speechless.
Speaker 2 (40:08):
He was then arrested again on charges of criminal
impersonation and practicingmedicine without a license.
He again made bail on thecondition that he would not
leave the state withoutpermission and that he would not
practice medicine, and as theywere preparing for the trial,
authorities were contacted thatO'Connell appeared to be
planning to leave the state.
Speaker 1 (40:27):
Shocking yeah.
Wow, come on, guys, of course.
Speaker 2 (40:32):
One of his neighbors called in and said that the
family was on the sidewalk withsuitcases and they appeared to
be waiting for a cab.
Hello, and when investigatorsarrived, they were already gone
oh but you know where they went?
They went to disneyland theydid not kidding me no, they
(40:52):
didn't.
No, oh my god, you can't makethis stuff up he was arrested
upon return from his excursion,but this just goes to show that
he thought he was above the lawand he just did whatever the
hell he wanted to oh my god um,I did find conflicting like data
(41:12):
through resources of like hedidn't get arrested until he got
back, but I did see one thatwas like um.
When authorities arrived he wason the sidewalk and he had the
tickets to disneyland in hispocket mickey mouse turned him
in go mickey, go mickey.
Speaker 1 (41:30):
Oh, whatever, I mean it's pathetic.
I thought he was gonna escape,but he's like so narcissistic
that he's like ah, they're notgonna find me, they're not gonna
out what I did, I'll just takemy kids on a vacay.
Speaker 2 (41:44):
And I didn't even do anything wrong.
Look at all these people Ihealed, I'm sure.
Speaker 1 (41:47):
Oh God Okay.
Speaker 2 (41:50):
Mm-hmm.
Securing charges for the deathof Sean would be complicated.
O'connell had the best defenseattorney in the state of
Colorado.
Authorities wanted to doeverything in their power to
strengthen the case.
State of Colorado Authoritieswanted to do everything in their
power to strengthen the case,so they kept on digging.
And this is when theydiscovered that not only did he
make false claims about hiscredentials and experiences,
they found that he had beenbragging to his patients and
(42:12):
even on his website that he hadbeen an expert witness in legal
cases.
They looked through trialtranscripts and there were
transcripts where he testifiedto having a master's degree in
microbiology from the Universityof Wisconsin-Milwaukee.
What Now, my friends?
There's a felony.
Yes, manslaughter would bedifficult to prove beyond a
(42:34):
reasonable doubt.
But if they could prove that hehad been falsely testifying
under oath as an expert witness,he could be charged with
perjury, and each perjury countcarries a two to six year
sentence.
So investigators believe thatwith this new information, they
could leverage O'Connell toplead guilty to manslaughter
without the risk of a trial.
Investigators then met withO'Connell and his attorney to
(42:58):
discuss the plea deal.
Investigators wanted him to beput away for a long time and to
own the responsibility for thedeath of Sean Flanagan.
O'connell's defense attorneyhad a difficult time getting him
to take responsibility for thedeath of Sean, but he basically
told him listen, buddy, you'vebeen exposed.
Take responsibility now, orit's only going to get worse.
Speaker 1 (43:20):
Good for him.
Speaker 2 (43:21):
Yes now or it's only going to get worse.
Good for him.
Yes.
On March 27th 2006, brianO'Connell was sentenced after
pleading guilty to chargesincluding criminally negligent
homicide, practicing medicinewithout a license, assault,
theft and perjury.
The courtroom was filled tocapacity.
On one side, supporters weremade up largely of former
(43:41):
patients who believed that hehad helped them and, on the
other side, grieving loved onesof the three patients who had
died under his care.
Before the sentencing,o'connell had told the court
that he was motivated by wantingto help people.
When someone passes away, Itake it very personally.
He said.
I didn't get into naturalhealing for money or prestige.
(44:02):
District court judge margieinquest told o'connell people
came to you in the mostdesperate situation and you took
advantage of them, ando'connell was sentenced to 13
years well, good for margie, butI just feel like 13 years is
nothing.
I know, know, and I'll like seethings online nowadays, like
(44:23):
current events and it's likeso-and-so got this much time for
whatever crime and I'm like areyou kidding?
That's more than like thesecases we cover where people kill
people.
Speaker 1 (44:32):
Yeah, I mean, if you're like distributing
marijuana, you can get life oryou could have gotten life.
And here he is 13 years forkilling people and fraudulently
treating people to make moneyconning the dea yeah, oh my god,
yeah among those who spoke werelaura and dave flanagan, sean's
parents.
Speaker 2 (44:53):
They stood to be the voice sean no longer had,
recalling how o'connell oncetold them no irish kid is going
to die.
On my watch, la Laura recountedSean's final days and faced
O'Connell directly.
He is not who he says he is.
He's a liar and a crook, shesaid.
Dave, remembering his son'ssuffering, shared his last words
(45:13):
as he crawled into bed no more,god, please, no more.
Speaker 1 (45:17):
Breaks my heart.
It just makes me want to vomitthat poor guy.
Speaker 2 (45:22):
Janet, the wife of Rory Gallagos, also addressed
the court.
She described Rory's final daysas filled with pain and robbed
of peace.
He didn't want to die.
She said he was taken too soonand denied the chance to say
goodbye.
She explained how O'Connell hadassured Rory's family that he
had never lost a cancer patient.
He led me to believe thatthings weren't true.
(45:43):
She said Rory was robbed ofdignity in his death.
There was one other gal.
I had said that three peopledied under his care.
There was one other gal who Icouldn't find a lot of
information on but um her.
They were older couple and thehusband took her to the clinic
to see if he could heal her.
He paid the amount of like$17,000 and she ended up passing
(46:06):
away shortly after.
That's a lot of money, but hewas quoted in court to say and I
don't have it written down, sothis is like a subtext of this
quote from my memory Somethinglike my wife was dying, I would
have paid any amount of money.
Speaker 1 (46:20):
Oh bless his heart, oh my.
Speaker 2 (46:21):
God, Like Jimmy Shoemaker.
Speaker 1 (46:23):
I believe his name was no they're just feeding off
a desperation, and to me that'sso much.
I mean, murder is evil nomatter what, and and defrauding
people and deceiving people isjust inconscionable.
But to to give this kind offalse hope, knowing you don't
know what the hell you're doing,and actually injuring people
(46:47):
and leading them to an untimelydeath, is just I.
I can't believe.
He only got 13 years and therewas only one case that they were
able to bring up.
Speaker 2 (46:57):
Yeah, I kind of wonder if that's why Rory's wife
was like.
He was also robbed a time.
He didn't want to die, hopinglike maybe someone would pick it
up as another case, or maybethey tried I don't know
alternative healing.
(47:17):
He was a caring person.
I really don't want him to getin trouble, said Kat's mother.
Kat stood firm in that shedidn't have ill feelings towards
O'Connell.
Speaker 1 (47:31):
She did, however, tell police that she probably
wouldn't go to him again unlessshe had a serious health problem
.
Okay, well, that's somewhattelling, but also, girl, come on
, wake up.
Speaker 2 (47:37):
It gets worse.
She does also agree withO'connell's assessment of why
she went into cardiac arrest.
Speaker 1 (47:44):
I could have spazzed, she told them, things happen is
this the one with the anxietyclaim on his part?
Oh well, she's.
Obviously.
He's charismatic, she wasbamboozled by him.
But yeah, I mean, anxietydoesn't doesn't do that, it does
a lot of things but doesn't dothat no, and therein lies the
(48:05):
crux of this issue.
Speaker 2 (48:07):
Are naturopaths actually doctors?
Brian o'connell certainlypresented himself as one.
His business card identifiedhimself as an n m, d or doctor
of naturopathic medicine.
He wore scrubs in a white labcoat embroidered with Dr
O'Connell.
His office walls displayed anarray of certificates and
diplomas that, at a glance, lentan air of legitimacy To the
(48:29):
average patient.
All of this might suggest thatO'Connell was a licensed
naturopathic physician, someonewho earned a pre-medical
undergraduate degree andgraduated from one of the four
accredited naturopathic schoolsin the US.
The programs that areaccredited offer training
modeled after conventionalmedical education.
That includes a whole bunch ofstuff that I deleted, except for
(48:51):
the word includes.
Trust me, we don't need to gothrough all of it, but it even
included 14 rigorous tests atthe end of their schooling.
So it was a lot.
In states that recognize andlicense the profession,
naturopathic physicians areconsidered primary care
providers with the authority todiagnose, prescribe medications,
perform minor surgeries andeven deliver babies.
Speaker 1 (49:14):
Okay, sorry.
So even family care physiciansdon't take it upon themselves to
treat cancer.
Even if they're full MDs oreven doctors of osteopathy, they
don't treat cancer as well.
You don't expect a rural doctorto go.
(49:34):
Oh well, I'm going to figureout what your cancer is and
treat it.
This is just beyond.
Yeah, it's bad.
Speaker 2 (49:39):
Bad news bears but your cancer isn't treated.
Oh, this is just beyond.
Yeah, it's bad.
Bad news bears.
Despite the appearance oflegitimacy, o'connell was not
one of them.
His degrees were from anuncredited correspondence school
, called again the herbal healerAcademy, and, in Colorado,
where O'Connell practice,naturopathic doctors were not at
the time licensed by the state.
(50:00):
Dr Rena bloom, a licensednaturopathic doctors, were not
at the time licensed by thestate.
Dr Rena Bloom, a licensednaturopathic physician, had
pushed for formal licensure inthe state for more than a decade
.
A quick Google search now showsthat naturopathic doctors are
now regulated in the state ofColorado.
Speaker 1 (50:17):
So we will take that as our silver lining for this
case.
Speaker 2 (50:18):
Ta-da Wonderful that there's been some progress there
um, and maybe even more sincesince then, this oh, for sure
six that this case ended 19years ago when that happened 19
years ago.
Speaker 1 (50:33):
Here's the thing, poor dr bloom, who is probably
like a wonderful person withlots of alternative,
non-traditional medicinetreatments that that will
benefit people, and here's thisasshole who's out there making
her look bad.
You know what I mean?
(50:54):
Pretending to do stuff, and howdare these particular
institutions just just say, hey,cool, I, you, you spend this
money, we'll give you somethingto put on your wall?
I mean, how is that?
Even there are a lot of evilplayers in this game.
I mean, obviously he was at thetop of the heap here, but like
(51:14):
he didn't get there without someissues and gaps in the system
on the way, whether they wereintentional or not, but it's
devastating either way.
Um, I do think we shouldprobably, because we've railed
on this now maybe look at afuture episode, maybe as a
medical chart note, to say, okay, this is where naturopathy is
(51:36):
now, because if it hasn'tprogressed to licensure in all
states, uh, I'm gonna have aproblem with that.
Um, yeah, but thank you so muchinto that.
Yeah, thank you so much forbringing this up, because, um, I
do think, obviously, westernmedicine isn't the only answer,
(51:57):
but, but, knowing that when yousee a diploma on the wall, it
doesn't necessarily mean it's.
Even if it's from anorganization that is who they
say they are doesn't meanthey're accredited.
You know there are very fewthat are accredited to provide a
rigorous education compared toothers.
Speaker 2 (52:20):
So and like, have you ever gone into a doctor's
office and like googled theirstuff on?
It was like no, I haven't, Ihaven't either.
Speaker 1 (52:30):
But I will say, like for audiology, there's only two
organizations, in the us atleast, that can accredit a
university program.
So someone can graduate from aprogram that will say you're an
audiologist and I can only speakto what I know because that's
what I am, but you can say youare one.
(52:51):
But if you're not from one ofan, they don't have to be
accredited to say you're anaudiologist, but you should be
accredited to earn licensure topractice.
And that's because thoseaccrediting bodies review those
universities programs and theirclinical placements, and all of
this to make sure that they'remeeting the rigorous standards
(53:13):
of, you know, minimum practicerequirements, that they're
actually covering all of thethings that need to be done to
be able to say that somebody'sminimally competent in whatever
field it is.
So for audiology those are twoprograms the acae and um ash's
body.
I forget caa, um and the c'syeah.
(53:37):
So this is crazy to me, thatthat it got this far, but damn
him for, like, ruining people'slives, giving them hope and and
basically killing people andtorturing them.
Because can I just say, okay,so I, I got bitten by a spider
last week and, uh, I wasconvinced it was a Brown recluse
(54:00):
, even though they're notindigenous to Minnesota.
But I was like that's it, I'mdying, um, I'm, I'm almost dead,
you know.
But also I'm too busy to go inbecause, you know, doctor, treat
thyself.
No, I'm not going anywhere, I'mjust going to diagnose myself as
almost dead, but I'm going tocarry on with my job and I don't
have time for that and I havetime to sit in a waiting room.
So two days later, after thespider bite, my, my foot was
(54:24):
looking gangrenous and I thought, okay, all right, I need to go
in.
So on my lunchtime I went up tothe emergency room and, yeah,
lo and behold, it was cellulitisand all this other stuff.
But thank God I went therebecause I could have lost my
foot and I remember I was goingwith this.
But I don't know how we got hereactually, but I'm glad that you
(54:51):
were seen.
So when I first got the spiderbite, I was like well, I have to
clean it out.
And I was at work.
All we had was hydrogenperoxide covered.
So I soaked my foot in a bucketwith hydrogen peroxide.
Speaker 2 (55:03):
Oh yeah, I forget about the story.
Speaker 1 (55:06):
Yeah.
So two days later I was likeall right, this is looking green
, like what's going on here.
And they were like you knowwhat Hydrogen peroxide actually
kills healthy tissue?
Speaker 2 (55:27):
So yeah, it cleans out the bad ones, but it kills
healthy tissue.
Speaker 1 (55:30):
So this guy was using this to inject into people's
bloodstreams to cure cancer andit kills healthy cells, and poor
Sean didn't have many of thoseanyway.
Yeah, so that's whatimmediately popped out to me.
So I felt like a dumbass that Iwas putting this on my spider
bite.
And then I was like, oh dumb meShouldn't have done that.
This guy was injecting people'sblood strains with stuff that
kills healthy cells.
So damn him.
Speaker 2 (55:52):
I am a hydrogen peroxide in the ear to like
clean the ear and I love thelike little skizzle it does in
the ear canal.
Speaker 1 (55:59):
You know it's like yeah well, that's great, because
it's not an open wound.
It's.
Speaker 2 (56:03):
I love it, but then I'm like that's what I'm saying
is like I'm like in my ear I canhear what it's doing in there,
and like he was putting this inpeople's bloodstreams.
Are you kidding me?
Speaker 1 (56:13):
Yeah, it was a soda fountain disaster in people's
pipes.
How dare he.
Speaker 2 (56:22):
And then to act like oh well, you're irish and I'm
helping you.
Speaker 1 (56:24):
No, you remember, I don't care if you're irish or
where you're from.
Also, how dare you?
Because even if you did have aspecial bond with people from
ireland, you were actuallykilling them.
He's disgusting um.
Speaker 2 (56:38):
And also, he only got 13 years, and so he's already
out of jail.
Speaker 1 (56:42):
Oh my god, everyone look out for this guy.
Hopefully you don't know ifhe's changed his name or
anything.
Speaker 2 (56:49):
I don't know.
No, I tried to like Google.
Where is he today?
Speaker 1 (56:51):
Oh yeah he's probably changed his name.
Hopefully he's laying low andWatch out.
Speaker 2 (56:55):
if you're in the Colorado area, if you're going
to Naturopath, no, they have tobe licensed.
Now, med state, um.
So that's good, but uh, anyway,last time, I think last time I
told you guys that I finally gotthose bras from handful sports
yeah, the brawls, nice lookinggood.
Speaker 1 (57:16):
Did you see all through the snap?
Speaker 2 (57:18):
I know, yep, thank you, thank you, um, so again,
they are a company calledhandful, which I thought was
super cute.
Um, handful sports bras foundat handfulcom combine comfort,
style and performance.
Created by fitness instructorand mom, mama.
(57:38):
They're designed to supportactive lifestyles with
moisture-wicking fabric,adjustable straps and removable
pads, which I don't, honestly,usually love removable pads
because they always come out inthe laundry and then you put the
frickers back in and whatever.
But these removable pads,because I know, because I have
them now, they're super cute.
Like they have a little picturefor you on there so you don't
(58:00):
have to be a dummy whichwondering which one goes where.
So it has, like where it's youknow, where you hold your hand
up in front of yourself to seelike which one's the l for the
right shirt they have that onthe inside, so you know which
one to put that's the door whichI was like that's cute.
Um, they also make leggings andtops, and they are made by women
(58:21):
, for women.
They've been featured in topfitness magazines and loved by
customers including myself.
Handful also gives back totheir survivor program, offering
free pads to breast cancersurvivors.
Move more confidently, like me,with active wear that empowers
Yeehaw.
Visit Handfulcom for 30% offwith our code stay suspicious
(58:42):
yay, thank you.
Speaker 1 (58:46):
I think it's time for a medical mishap so this email
came from someone who says wecan use our name and her name is
charlene and it it saysCharlene, charlene, charlene, oh
baby.
(59:07):
Anyway, she says hi ladies, myname is Charlene.
I've been a scrub nurse forwhat feels like eons, only eons,
because, wow, the culture ofthe youngsters coming through
these days admirable.
They don't take back talk fromthe surgeons and I am silently
here for that.
You go.
Girls, in my day we'd neverdream of talking back or telling
(59:28):
surgeons that they get to dosomething when they were done
with what they were doing first.
I love it.
I feel like there's a lot moreto that story, but, charlene,
you'll have to write back in andlet us know the down and dirty
of how these surgeons thinkthey're God.
But okay, hopefully they'rebetter now.
So to the story.
(59:49):
A patient came into the ER withabdominal pain.
Classic symptoms pointed toappendicitis.
The patient was rushed intosurgery and the appendix was out
.
Everything looked good,textbook, except two days later
the patient was still in severepain.
A repeat scan showed the realproblem a perforated ulcer.
(01:00:09):
The appendix had been fine,turns out.
The resident had made the callbased on a quick glance at the
CT report and didn't catch thepart about possible gastric
perforation, and the attendingsigned off in a hurry.
Everyone trusted the initialdiagnosis, so the patient went
back into surgery and recoveredjust fine, but the first surgery
(01:00:32):
scar was completely unnecessary.
Well, it's a good thing wedon't need our appendix.
And if you're from Minnesota,well, good thing we don't need
our appendix.
And if you're from minnesota,welp, good thing we.
Well, we don't need ourappendix.
A.
The lesson was burned intoevery intern who heard about it.
Read the whole report yourself,thanks, for I mean, that's good
(01:00:53):
advice, right?
Thanks for taking the time toread this.
Speaker 2 (01:00:56):
if you do take care, charlie thanks for sending and,
yeah, good thing they didn'tneed an appendix, because why be
pissed though?
Speaker 1 (01:01:05):
Oh, yeah, I know, because that's two surgeries
instead of just one.
But you know, hopefully thehospital paid for that.
Speaker 2 (01:01:14):
Oh, I'm sure they did .
Speaker 1 (01:01:16):
It'd be much cheaper than the lawsuit, which they
would just pay them off anyway,to keep the mouth shut, because
that's what hospitals do rightso yeah, I mean not speaking
from personal experiencespeaking about anywhere that I'm
working, which I haven't said,so they don't need to get mad,
okay yeah, all right.
Speaker 2 (01:01:35):
So, jenna, what can we expect to hear next week?
Speaker 1 (01:01:39):
Oh God, it's a pedophile people.
It's a self-proclaimedpedophile who's a surgeon a
gastric surgeon and it's thebiggest pedophilic case in
France of all time, and it hasjust recently.
(01:02:00):
In the last couple weeks he'sgone through trial and gotten
his sentencing.
So it's a doozy.
Yeah, sounds like it.
So, yeah, hopefully.
I think it's important to talkabout these things, but, yeah,
it's not going to belighthearted, that's for sure.
Speaker 2 (01:02:18):
Okay, well, we'll be there.
Yeah, you will.
Speaker 1 (01:02:23):
Well, at least you will.
You have to be.
Speaker 2 (01:02:24):
You know what uh, you know what?
For sure, guys, I'll be here,you're.
I was gonna say you're legallycontracted?
Speaker 1 (01:02:29):
no, you're not, but you're emotionally contracted
yes, I will be here if you'renot here, um, but meanwhile,
don't miss a beat.
Subscribe or follow doctoringthe truth wherever you enjoy
your podcast for stories thatshock, intrigueue and educate.
Trust, after all, is a delicatething.
You can text us directly on ourwebsite at
DoctoringTheTruthAtBuzzSpoutcom,or email us your story ideas
(01:02:52):
and comments atDoctoringTheTruth at gmail.
We definitely need medicalmishaps from you guys.
We read them out on air, wegive you credit.
If you want, you can stayanonymous, but we need more of
those.
Don't be shy.
Speaker 2 (01:03:07):
Don't be shy, and I've had a lot of you text me or
tell me in person.
Oh my God, this could be amedical mishap.
So it's like, and I've toldy'all you can be anonymous, you
can change the names.
It can be the same story butyou can change names.
But can be the same story butyou can change names.
But I cannot in my rightconscience share it on the pod
until you give me permission.
Speaker 1 (01:03:27):
So don't be scared.
Yeah, don't be scared.
And also write it out in yourown words we don't want to go,
oh so.
And so my friend told me thislike send it, we want your own
words because you have a voiceand you can, having been there,
tell it better than anybody.
Speaker 2 (01:03:40):
So deal with it.
If you feel like you suck atstorytelling it's probably not
true, but just like, write thebullet points down for ChatGPT
and it will make it breast upfor you.
Okay, guys, I mean, that's howpeople are getting through
college these days, I hear.
So just put it in there if youthink you can Damn.
Speaker 1 (01:03:55):
Where was that when we were?
Yeah, I don't know, but itmakes me feel really good like
we did it without.
Speaker 2 (01:04:03):
We're so smart, we're so smart?
Speaker 1 (01:04:07):
um, absolutely, and be sure to follow us on
instagram at doctoring the truthpodcast, on facebook at
doctoring the truth, and we'reon tiktok at doctoring the truth
and ed odd pod, which is edaud-D-A-U-D-P-O-D.
Don't forget to download,because we don't get credit for
you listening to us unless youactually download.
Isn't that crazy?
We don't get stats as listeners.
(01:04:29):
You're only considered alistener of our podcast if you
download it.
So download it please, even ifyou don't listen.
Please listen, we'd like both,but ideally, if you have to pick
one, at least download it andlisten later.
Rate and review, because thosecomments are priceless and, uh,
we want to bring you morecontent each week, so help keep
(01:04:49):
us motivated until then.
Stay safe and stay suspicious.
Speaker 2 (01:04:58):
We're even looking at each other.
I don't know why we're notdoing that together.
Suspicious bye.
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