September 30, 2025 • 67 mins
A brake-slam on a country road sets the tone for an hour where trust, timing, and tiny choices change everything. We start with a heart-pounding near-miss and pivot into the disappearance of Gerald “Jerry” Rayborn—an 89-year-old father and WWII veteran whose caregiver, praised as an “angel,” quietly turned access into control and control into a financial and personal erasure.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:00):
Amanda! Jenna! Hey! How are you doing?
I'm doing good.
I'm laughing because it was myturn to count again.
And she was like, okay, are youready?
And I was like, Yeah.
And I'm staring at her, waitingto count.
I'm like, oh yeah, right, right,right, right, right, right.
Yeah, my turn.
Got it.
(00:21):
Yeah, so I'm doing good now.
Do you want to hear about howpart of my day was?
SPEAKER_01 (00:28):
Yeah, especially if it meant you weren't doing well
before.
What happened?
SPEAKER_00 (00:34):
So I almost died today.
SPEAKER_01 (00:36):
What?
SPEAKER_00 (00:37):
Like, no.
Not even being dramatic.
Like, oh my God.
Okay.
Tell me all.
So I was down in my southernplains region today.
And you know it's harvestingseason.
And so combines and tractors andthings are on the roads.
Yeah.
And I'm driving from one schoolto another.
(00:58):
And there was this combine, Ithink.
Is a combine?
I don't know.
Took up the whole lane plus theshoulder.
So like big.
And I was like looking ahead,like, oh, okay, I have time to
go around, but there is anoncoming car.
But like thinking about, okay,by the time we pass each other,
I thought we'd be in front ofthis uh, how do you say it?
(01:19):
Like a bypass lane on theoncoming side.
So I was like, oh, that'll beperfect.
So I had like first slowed downbecause I was like, maybe I'll
wait.
And then I was like, no, I havelike places to be.
I'm gonna go around this tractorbecause that's what we do.
We go around the tractor.
So I like speed back up to 55.
I start to go around thistractor, and this tractor starts
turning in front of me.
(01:41):
Like he did not signal, he didnot nothing.
Oh no, did not look for me.
And I had to slam on my brakesso hard that like my Jeep
started doing the best way I candescribe it is like you know,
when you're going down a skihill and you kind of like shift
the skis like side to side tostart slow down.
(02:03):
Yeah, like that is what my Jeepstarted doing.
And so there's marks on the roadfrom my tires, melting your
tires on the road, slowly to tryand stop.
I was like, oh my god, I'm notgonna stop in time.
Like, I'm gonna meet thiscombine.
Everything in my car flewforward and like underneath the
dash.
SPEAKER_01 (02:23):
Yeah, everything's shot forward, and that's scary,
and couldn't get under yourpedals as well.
That's so scary.
SPEAKER_00 (02:29):
And now, of course, I have like thousands of dollars
of equipment in my car.
Okay, it's all now under well,at the time.
I didn't care because I was likebreathing.
Well, first I was I was soshocked.
I told my husband, like, Icalled him immediately, and I
was like, oh my god, this justhappened.
Like, I feel like I just cheateddeath.
(02:50):
Like, I literally saw my Jeepsmashing into this combine, and
everything, and of course, I wasdrinking a frickin' protein
shake, so I had protein shakeall over my car.
I still have not dealt withthat.
It was all over like the boxesof the equipment, but at least
they were in boxes because youknow protein shake is sticky.
Yeah, oh my god, all the buttonson my dash, the screen on my
(03:14):
car.
SPEAKER_01 (03:14):
I'm like, did the guy even notice that he almost
caused your imminent death?
I don't know.
Well, I hope so.
SPEAKER_00 (03:22):
I was honking at him.
SPEAKER_01 (03:24):
Legally, they have to have a turnlight, like they
have to have a blinker, right?
On the back of their big assthing.
SPEAKER_00 (03:31):
I would assume so.
Dude, I was so mad I told myhusband, like, I wanted to stop
and go yell at him.
Like, you could have killed me.
SPEAKER_01 (03:40):
That is so scary.
Isn't it crazy how those slidingdoor moments where you're like,
this could have ended sodifferently and changed so many
lives.
SPEAKER_00 (03:50):
Yes.
And like I got home and like mydog was all happy to see me, and
I was like, oh my god.
SPEAKER_01 (03:56):
You almost didn't have a mama.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (03:58):
Would have just been waiting.
The last thing I would have saidto you is see you soon.
And then I told my husband, Iwas like, Oh my gosh, I just
ordered some different dressesfor our family pictures for the
fall, you know.
I was like, and two of themarrived today in the mailbox.
I told my husband, like, youwould have gone and got the mail
and saw my dresses I ordered,and you would have been so sad.
(04:19):
And then I started crying, so Iwas like, I can't talk about
this anymore.
But anyway, so I'm doing finenow.
But that was scary.
SPEAKER_01 (04:28):
Near death experience.
That's trauma.
That's so trauma.
Hope my well, my daughter, Idon't think she listens.
She on a much lesser scale, shewe almost met head-on with a
tractor when I was trying toteach her to drive.
And I mean, it was a stationarytractor with a sign on it.
And I had told her, let's pulloff this highway, you know,
(04:49):
because we'd inadvertently goneto a road that led to a highway
that was faster than she wascomfortable with.
And I was like, okay, well,let's find a there was a little
turn off into a gravel drivewayof this little farmstead where
they had a, you know, they wereselling eggs and pickles and
whatever.
So they were telling us thatthey're selling eggs and pickles
with this sign on a tractor atthe side of a culvert.
(05:11):
She, I said, slow down, slowdown, slow down! I'm trying to
be cool.
I'm trying to be your foot'slike going through the floor.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
I'm stomping on the floor.
She wheels that puppy in, I kidyou not, probably 15 miles an
hour.
And I'm staring at this greenJohn Deere right in front of me
who's holding the sign.
All the dust on the gravel roadis.
I don't know how she managed toturn that thing on a dime, but
(05:33):
she did.
We managed to do like a, youknow, three three-quarters of a
circular turn.
We look up when the dust clearsand we see this farmer and his
wife sitting on the step withour little toddler, like all
eyes like saucers staring at us.
I get out of the car and I'mlike, it's gonna put in work.
We get out and we're like, hey,you got any eggs?
unknown (05:54):
You know?
SPEAKER_00 (05:55):
Like, hey, I heard you had the best egg.
SPEAKER_01 (05:57):
They're like, Yeah, but what's the hurry?
You know, what's the rush?
Um, so but that was the onlythis tractor was stationary.
But I will say, my sister was onthe back of a motorcycle with
her boyfriend driving at thetime, and it wasn't, I I don't
know why that matters because itwasn't his fault.
But they did a similar thingwhere they were gonna pass and
(06:19):
they were behind a garbagetruck, and the garbage truck
turned without signaling, andthey collided, and she ended up
in traction, having to drop outof college, you know.
She her pelvis was splinteredand like all kinds of horrible
stuff.
So yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (06:38):
Use your signals, people.
I don't care if it's a tractor,a garbage truck, a freaking
cement truck, yeah, car, bike,anything.
SPEAKER_01 (06:47):
They know they're going slower than the speed
limit.
They know people are gonna wantto pass them.
So, you know, why are you gonnaturn left in front of them
without indicating?
SPEAKER_00 (06:58):
And there was a car uncoming too.
Like to where I'm like mappingout like, do I even have time to
go around?
So I'm like, I wonder, I Ididn't even think about this and
that, but I wonder that othercar probably just slam on their
brakes too.
SPEAKER_01 (07:10):
Yeah, and also at least with a garbage truck or a
car or a truck, you can there'sa license plate.
Are are there license plates onthese big combines?
SPEAKER_00 (07:18):
Can you guess I don't know, but that's why I
told Adam, I was like, hedoesn't even have a number on
the back of the tractor where Ican call and be like, You're
driving socks.
SPEAKER_01 (07:26):
Yeah, or call the call the local police station
and be like, you know what, havea chat with this dude because
that's yeah, he was in a greentractor.
SPEAKER_00 (07:33):
Go get him on these roads.
I don't know because I'm out inBump E.
And I don't know where I am.
I'm literally going where my cartells me to go.
SPEAKER_01 (07:42):
Oh I'm getting better, but uh that's scary.
I think lesson learned better tobe late than trust your farmer.
SPEAKER_00 (07:51):
Yeah.
Sorry, farmers, but yeah.
Or and Adam was like, Do youthink he heard you honking at
him?
Probably not, because he'sprobably an old farmer with
hearing loss and tractor.
Well, I think tractors are a lotlike quieter now than they used
to be, but they are, but alsoyou signal, you indicate when
you're gonna do it.
There was me and another car.
Ah okay, I'm over it.
(08:12):
Oh my gosh, okay.
Sorry, I just glanced to theleft to where my document is,
and I s I didn't put anything ina correction section, but now I
see a very interesting topic inthe correction section.
Please tell me more.
SPEAKER_01 (08:29):
All right, so as usual, as per usual, when it's
been my episode, I always have acorrection.
And as per usual, my windowblinds are open and there's a
squirrel frolicking literallylike two feet away from me, like
rolling around in the grass andhaving a joyous time.
That it's really distracting me.
Okay.
Um, so shout out to best friendof the podcast, Nicole Krieger,
(08:55):
for pointing out thiscorrection.
Last week, when we were, youknow, bantering about the
weather, I said, Yeah, you know,you want to get your stuff out,
you know, your thigh high boots.
She goes, Jenna, when have youever worn thigh high boots in
recent decades?
(09:15):
And I was like, girl, you'reright.
I meant I meant knee high.
I don't know.
So thanks, Nicole.
Thanks for bringing that up.
Fossy.
SPEAKER_00 (09:23):
Thigh high.
SPEAKER_01 (09:23):
We get that visual.
Yeah, we'll we'll get the visualof me and thigh high boots out
of everyone's mind's eye.
Sorry if that can't be wiped.
So I just thought it'd be funnyto say hey, thanks.
And also her mom, Denise, shelistens to our show.
Hi, Denise.
Hi, Denise.
SPEAKER_00 (09:41):
Shout out, ladies.
SPEAKER_01 (09:43):
Yeah.
Well, she's a lady, is she not?
SPEAKER_00 (09:45):
Well, I said only hi to Denise, so I wanted to also
say hi to Nicole.
SPEAKER_01 (09:50):
Oh, okay.
All right.
Anyway.
All right.
SPEAKER_00 (09:54):
So that's the one correction.
I was like, I get to say goodjob, no corrections.
There's always next time.
Uh so anyway, sorry about mylong tractor story, guys.
If you know me personally, youcan't tell the story without it
(10:15):
being long.
AF.
I mean, life would be a goodone.
Oh my god, because you knowwhat?
You could have been here and Idied today instead of listening
to me talk about a tractor.
So you're welcome.
I mean, I'm thankful.
SPEAKER_01 (10:28):
I am so thankful.
SPEAKER_00 (10:29):
And I guess if you don't want to hear it, they have
that awesome 30-second button onthe uh podcast.
SPEAKER_01 (10:37):
This is true.
Okay, so before we move, it'scalled the banter button.
SPEAKER_00 (10:40):
Yeah.
I do appreciate on morbidpodcasts that they have like
that little jingle before theycome back from their ads because
I always hit like did it itforward, forward, forward.
And then until I hear that like,and then I'm like, okay, they're
coming back.
SPEAKER_01 (10:58):
Yeah, I guess we're not that nice.
SPEAKER_00 (11:00):
We ain't fancy yet.
SPEAKER_01 (11:01):
They're on Sirius XM.
I mean Sirius XM, ladies.
Get it, girls.
Yeah, but looks like you madeit.
SPEAKER_00 (11:10):
Good job, baby girls.
Okay, well, without further ado,let me get to my sponsor.
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STAYSUSPIS.
SPEAKER_01 (12:20):
Nice.
SPEAKER_00 (12:20):
Oh my god.
What?
I just realized I'm not using mymicrophone.
But my thing is recording.
I'm gonna take a brief pausing.
SPEAKER_01 (12:38):
We have to start over.
No, we don't.
SPEAKER_00 (12:42):
Do we?
SPEAKER_01 (12:43):
You haven't been recording.
SPEAKER_00 (12:45):
It is recording.
SPEAKER_01 (12:46):
Okay, what's recording?
I don't know.
Just your computer mic?
Look at it's recording.
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (12:54):
I'll work with it.
I'll work with it.
And that like the speechenvelopes have looked as big as
they normally do, so I didn'teven think anything else.
SPEAKER_01 (13:02):
I know.
You always have nice speechenvelopes.
I I'm puny.
I can't even see them.
And it doesn't matter what I do.
I don't know how yours were sobig.
SPEAKER_00 (13:11):
Maybe it's a Mac.
Okay, friends, I have mymicrophone.
Welcome.
LOL, welcome to Urban.
Perhaps for the first time.
I don't know why I thought ofthat, but I was like, holy shit,
I don't have a microphone.
You're like, something'smissing.
My hands are too free to talkwith.
What's going on?
(13:31):
Okay.
All of the sources for today'sstory will be found in the show
notes.
There are no trigger warningsfor this story.
This is a tale that's it's alittle different.
I wasn't expecting it.
So any hoozles.
(13:53):
Shall we?
We shall.
Okay.
Gerald Eugene Rayborn was bornon March 20th, 1922.
He loved automobiles, theDodgers, and all things money
and investments.
He was a jovial man and everyoneenjoyed being around him.
(14:14):
He was very close with hisdaughter Mary and would often
call her to talk about twothings: vitamins that she should
buy and stocks that she shouldsell.
He and his second wife, Carolyn,whom the family adored, decided
to move from Kansas City,Missouri to San Diego,
California so that they couldlive a more active lifestyle
(14:35):
year-round.
They moved into a country clubtype atmosphere and were very,
very happy there until thesummer of 2010 when Carolyn was
diagnosed with lung cancer.
As a lifetime smoker, thisdiagnosis wasn't the biggest
shock, though still obviouslydevastating.
(14:57):
Carolyn's son Ralph went tovisit Jerry and her in
California.
And while there, he helped themset up home health care through
an agency.
They thought it would be helpfulto have someone who could come
in to the home a couple of daysa week, you know, help around
the house with cooking,cleaning, and getting groceries.
Because Carolyn kind of was theone that ran the household.
(15:20):
And Jerry took care of her, shetook care of him, but he was
more the money guy and she wasmore the like logistical things
of the household.
So the assistance of the homehealth aid would allow Jerry to
just focus on Carolyn.
Denise Edmund was assigned toher care.
(15:41):
Jerry and Carolyn adored her.
Jerry would call Mary, hisdaughter, and say Denise was
their angel.
And I know, so sweet.
Even though things were going aswell as they could be in
California, given theircircumstances, Jerry would
always remind Mary that, quote,you know, when Carolyn dies, I'm
(16:03):
coming to live with you, endquote.
Oh.
Just as they knew the day wouldinevitably come, Carolyn passed
away.
The family was sad to learn ofher passing, though excited that
Jerry would be moving closer tothem in Kansas City.
But one day, when talking toMary, things shifted.
(16:25):
She spoke of plans to come outand help arrange his move back
to KC, but he said he wasn'tmoving back yet.
He said that he would stay inSan Diego throughout the winter
months, and Denise offered tostay as his caregiver at no cost
during that time.
Subbound.
(16:45):
So he mentioned, you know,luckily for him, she also had a
fiduciary degree, so she couldhelp him with all of the
financial things that needed tobe done after Carolyn's passing.
Mary, yeah.
Red flags.
We're making all these noises.
Red flags be a flying.
Mary had called to check on herdad, and they had had a great
(17:08):
conversation filled with lots oflove.
And he assured her that he wouldmove back as soon as the winter
was over.
And they agreed that they wouldstay in touch every three to
four days in the meantime.
A month after Carolyn's passing,Mary's son and great Jerry's
grandson, Chris, got home fromwork and there was a message on
(17:30):
the answering machine.
And for those of you who don'tknow what an answering machine
is, back in the day when wedidn't have cell phones, we had
what's called a landline phone.
And so if someone called andthere was no one home to answer,
or if we didn't feel likeanswering, insert the new caller
ID.
The caller was able to leave amessage recording on an
(17:52):
answering machine.
So now you know.
The recording on Chris'sanswering machine said, quote,
my name is Carmen.
Jerry and I got married in LasVegas.
I'm asking that you give us sometime to ourselves and not keep
calling.
Don't expect to hear from usuntil after the holidays.
(18:15):
I'll write to you later with allof the information.
End quote.
SPEAKER_01 (18:18):
Oh my goodness.
What?
I wasn't expecting this.
Who the hell is Carmen?
Right.
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (18:24):
What?
Boy, questions.
Oh my gosh.
And that just reminded me.
Was that a game at one point?
Carmen and San Diego?
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (18:32):
Oh.
So they weren't even thatcreative.
SPEAKER_00 (18:38):
Oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_01 (18:40):
Oh man.
The smells of fishy fish.
SPEAKER_00 (18:44):
The smells fishy.
So Chris was obviously shockedat this unexpected message, and
he called his parents to informthem.
And his dad contacted Denise tosee if she knew anything about
this Carmen character.
Denise explained that Carmen andJerry had met at the grocery
store and that they were inlove.
SPEAKER_01 (19:07):
This was that's when it happens, the produce section
they always say.
This was over the parsley, it'slike, ooh, baby.
I know how to cook it.
SPEAKER_00 (19:22):
This was very interesting to the family
because it was only one monthafter Carolyn passed away.
SPEAKER_01 (19:29):
Oh.
SPEAKER_00 (19:30):
They were together for 30 years.
So suspicious.
But it would not be the firsttime that he had made a rash
decision in his life to tie theknot.
He and Carolyn tied the knotafter only knowing each other
for two weeks.
Wow.
It was a second marriage forboth of them after their spouses
(19:50):
had passed.
And they were just like, youknow what?
When you know, you know.
So they were like, this isweird, but also not
uncharacteristic.
SPEAKER_01 (19:59):
It's happened before.
SPEAKER_00 (20:00):
Yeah.
Mary was understandablyconcerned about the news, but
tried to reassure herself thathe was in fact traveling and
that he or she would at leasthear from him on her birthday.
Throughout her entire life, hewould always go to the store
himself and pick out herbirthday card, and he always put
$30 inside the card.
(20:21):
She said, no matter what, nomatter what age I turned,
nothing.
He he would always pick out thecard and there was always$30.
Like, oh, how wholesome.
But unfortunately, her birthdaycame and went, and there was no
card.
The family attempted to contacthim but had no luck.
So they tried to call Denise andalso hit a dead end.
(20:44):
Where the heck was Jerry?
It had been about five months atthis time since they had heard
from him.
And so in February 2011, Maryfiled a missing persons report
with the San Diego PoliceDepartment.
The police report said thatJerry had a new girlfriend and
that he didn't want to see hisfamily anymore.
(21:06):
Mary was adamant to policeofficers that something was
wrong and that this was out ofcharacter for her dad.
Detective Mo Mikinis Parga wasassigned to the case.
She contacted his caregiverDenise, who shared that Jerry
was in fact getting married tohis new girlfriend, Carmen, in
Vegas and that they planned togo to Mexico.
(21:26):
She also mentioned that Jerrymade her promise that she would
not tell his family hiswhereabouts because he didn't
want them to know.
He said that his family was,quote, too religious and he just
wanted to have fun, end quote.
Also, this guy's 89 at thispoint.
SPEAKER_01 (21:43):
So well, either good for him or this is a big fat
lie.
SPEAKER_00 (21:48):
Right.
Because I'm like, if I'm 89, Idon't think I give two flying
squirrels about what anyonethinks.
Right.
So Denise sounded as though shewas being truthful, you know,
the story was believable.
And so they thought maybe he'snot missing after all.
And Denise just isn't sure abouttheir exact location at the
(22:09):
time, but knew what their planswere.
Police became skeptical that hewas missing because an adult
that doesn't want their kids toknow where they are is not a
crime.
Detectives did share with thefamily that they had planned to
move to Mexico with his newwife, but again, red flag.
(22:30):
The family had said to police,he would never do that.
He hated Mexico because of allthe drug wars.
And like, who knows Jerry bestbesides his family?
SPEAKER_02 (22:40):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (22:40):
So the family stood firm in the fact that they knew
him and that this was out ofcharacter for him.
So doing their due diligence,detectives decided to trace his
finances.
And they found that he had usedhis debit card in Valley Center,
California.
And if this was true, how couldhe be in Vegas or Mexico?
(23:02):
Valley Center happened to alsobe where Denise lived.
So they thought, well, maybehe's just at her house.
So they went there.
When she answered the door, theyexplained that they were looking
for Jerry.
And she said, I told you he's inMexico.
She swore up and down.
That is when they brought up hisfinances.
(23:23):
If he was in Mexico, how did hisdebit card get used here?
They showed her the printedtransactions from the bank, and
she immediately got flusteredand said, quote, well, he told
me I could have$5,000 on hisdebit card for helping him at
his house, but you know, I feltbad spending that much, so I
only spent$3,000.
(23:45):
End quote.
SPEAKER_01 (23:48):
Oh my god.
Come on.
SPEAKER_00 (23:50):
How noble?
SPEAKER_01 (23:51):
Super noble.
unknown (23:52):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (23:53):
Squeaky clean.
The detectives, the detectiveswere like, oh, really?
So then can you explain thischeck written for$5,000?
Oops.
She goes, Oh, I mailed him acheck in Mexico.
Oh.
Really?
Really?
So their next question was thesame as mine.
So what's his address in Mexico?
(24:16):
She resisted sharing theinformation, saying that he did
not want his kids to know.
But after discussion and themprobably being like, We're the
police.
Hello.
Give it up.
He's missing.
Tell us the address.
She finally produced an address.
And detectives felt like theymay finally have a solid lead.
That is, if Denise was tellingthe truth.
(24:37):
Agents were sent to the addressin San Felipe, Mexico to search
the area.
Further investigation into hisfinances revealed a strange
pattern on Jerry and Carolyn'saccounts.
Money was moving out of them andinto a joint account between
Jerry and Denise.
She did, however, help him withhis finances, you know, things
like buying groceries.
(24:58):
So she did have access to themoney.
The family was aware of that,but they found two large checks
made out to Carolyn's son Ralph.
One check was for$13,000 and theother was for$15,000.
SPEAKER_01 (25:14):
That's more than groceries.
SPEAKER_00 (25:18):
Yeah, not groceries.
Also, Ralph's like back inKansas City.
So how old is Ralph?
Her son?
Is he an adult?
I don't know, adults.
Oh yeah.
They're all adult children.
Okay.
So this obviously made Ralph aperson of interest.
(25:39):
And Ralph shared withinvestigators that Carolyn had
investments and that he had goneout to San Diego after her
passing to handle herfinancials.
And when he went to the bank todiscuss her CDs, they told him
that the amount that was in theCD was transferred by phone on
September 29th from her accountto Jerry's.
Ralph told the banker that thiswas impossible because she was
(26:02):
in a coma on the 29th.
Yeah.
There is no way that she madethe call.
Yeah.
And the bank said, Oh, well,maybe her husband did it then.
And I'm like, what?
SPEAKER_01 (26:13):
Seriously, are we that casual people?
SPEAKER_00 (26:15):
Guys, do we not have her a record of this?
Like, am I just a record-keepingmaniac from working at the
hospital because this seemspretty, pretty important to
track.
I mean, details me tell, right?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Ralph further explained thatfrom the bank, he then went to
Denise's house to ask her if sheknew anything about the transfer
(26:37):
of money.
And she told him that shedidn't, but you know, she would
talk to Jerry to see if he knewand she'd be in touch.
So she called Ralph the next dayand said that, you know, she had
talked to Jerry and that shewould get him the money in two
different checks.
Ralph wanted to speak to Jerry,and Denise said, not possible.
He's in Mexico.
So this information from Ralphcleared him as a person of
(27:00):
interest.
SPEAKER_01 (27:01):
So are we is is he's in Mexico.
Is he in Mexico now a pseudonymfor he's dead?
I'm just saying.
Maybe sad.
Okay.
That makes me sad.
SPEAKER_00 (27:15):
I know.
And he's just like the cutestgrandbook ever.
So is that.
Damn it.
So Detective Mo continued to dosome financial digging.
She found that the house whereJerry and Carolyn had lived had
been changed into Denise's nameand sold immediately.
Mo called the realtor, whoproved to be nothing but
(27:36):
uncooperative and never returnedany phone calls.
So thanks, thanks, no thanks.
Mo found out that, oh, shocker.
She was a friend of Denise's.
But what was even more shockingwas that Jerry seemingly turned
everything he had over to astranger.
Mo checked in with the notarythat was on the documents.
(27:57):
And the notary couldn't help butnotice that her name was spelt
incorrectly, and that wasn't herhandwriting on the documents.
When shown a picture of Denise,she said, yep, recognize her,
and that she was there oftenwith a lot of paperwork.
And during those times,paperwork is typically strewn
about the table along with thenotary pad, so it could be
possible that she, Denise,signed it.
(28:20):
And when they showed a pictureof Jerry, whose signatures were
also on the documents, thenotary said that she had never
seen the man before.
Shocker.
Investigators now believe thatthey had a clear-cut case
against Denise Goodwin, the homehealth care worker.
But there was more to the storywhen they heard from
investigators in Mexico.
It appeared that Jerry had neverever been there.
(28:42):
They had the opportunity tospeak with a groundskeeper at
the property who had workedthere for 20 years.
And when shown photos of Deniseand Jerry, he said that he had
never seen either of thembefore.
At this point, it was now sixmonths since anyone had seen
him, and all of his money andhis wife's was transferred to
Denise.
(29:03):
The case began to look less likea missing person's case and more
like a nobody homicide case.
During this time, Mary got acall from her dad, and he said,
quote, Mary, sweetie pie and Iare traveling around the
country, and we just want you toleave us alone.
End quote.
Then the call ended.
Not only was this not her dad,it was not her dad's voice.
(29:25):
And a daughter knows her dad'svoice.
SPEAKER_01 (29:27):
Yeah, they do.
And no dad's gonna say, Leave mealone, I'm off with my sweetie
pie.
No, come on.
SPEAKER_00 (29:34):
Yeah.
I know you don't know Carmen,but she's real sweetie pie.
SPEAKER_02 (29:38):
No.
SPEAKER_00 (29:39):
Mary tried to call the number back, but it was
dead.
It appeared to be a kill phoneto be used once and never again.
A phone that criminals typicallyuse.
Mary called Detective Mo andtold her about the phone call.
Mo said, I'm so sorry to sharethis, but we have reason to
believe your father may be dead.
(30:00):
At this point, there was noproof of life.
No one had heard from him sinceOctober of the previous year.
And the Missing Persons caseofficially became a nobody
homicide case.
And Denise was the person ofinterest.
SPEAKER_01 (30:12):
Oh my God, that's so sad.
SPEAKER_00 (30:16):
Yeah, this is such a sad story.
But before we get more into it,it's time for a had to do a
little extra in the end theresince I'm alive today.
(30:36):
Okay.
So okay.
So what I will share with youtoday is a brine.
Nope.
Not a brine.
SPEAKER_01 (30:45):
I mean, it is honestly a combination of brain
and spine.
I think we could call it abrine.
Oh, I love that.
I know.
I should call them and say, I'vegot save some letters.
Let's save some time.
We're gonna call this brine.
SPEAKER_00 (31:03):
It's brine.
So my brain just combined brainand spine.
SPEAKER_01 (31:07):
I love it.
I love it so much.
SPEAKER_00 (31:10):
So it's a brain-spine digital bridge.
So today we are talking aboutthis medical breakthrough.
So researchers in Switzerlandhave developed what they call a
brain-spine interface, which isa digital bridge that allows
people with severe spinal cordinjuries to walk again.
Wow.
The results were published inNature in 2023.
(31:33):
And you can read the fullarticle yourself on PubMed where
I found it under walkingnaturally after spinal cord
injury.
Da-da-da-da-da.
I guess if you want the wholething, it is walking naturally
after spinal cord injury using abrain-spine interface.
But here's how it works (31:47):
when the spinal cord is damaged, the
brain signals can't get throughto the legs.
But in this study, scientistsimplanted a set of devices, one
that records brain activity andanother that stimulates the
spinal cord.
Using wireless technology, theyessentially bypass the injury.
The brain's intent to move ispicked up by the implant,
(32:09):
decoded in real time, and thentransmitted directly to the
spinal cord stimulator, allowingthe body to execute the motion.
Wow.
Isn't that freaking cool?
SPEAKER_01 (32:19):
And it makes so much sense.
That's amazing.
Right?
Oh my gosh, I love this.
SPEAKER_00 (32:24):
One of the study's most striking cases involved a
man who had been paralyzed formore than a decade.
With the implant system, he wasable to stand, walk, and even
climb the stairs without thehelp of crutches.
Can you imagine?
I can't.
Like you haven't walked in adecade.
SPEAKER_01 (32:40):
Life altering.
This is amazing.
SPEAKER_00 (32:43):
Amazing.
And here's where it gets evenmore extraordinary.
After months of training withthe device, he actually regained
some movement even when thesystem was switched off.
SPEAKER_02 (32:52):
Wow.
unknown (32:53):
Oh my god.
SPEAKER_00 (32:55):
I just got chills.
That suggests that his nervoussystem.
I know.
It's suggested that the nervoussystem was starting to rewire
itself.
Oh my god, I got chills.
That's amazing.
Wow.
Ah, yes.
So the brain can relearn how tocarry signals that have been
dormant for years.
(33:16):
Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (33:17):
And we knew that about the auditory system, but I
mean, it's everywhere.
Obviously, in the body.
This is crazy, crazy awesome.
SPEAKER_00 (33:26):
These implications are enormous.
We are talking about technologythat could one day restore
mobility for people living withparalysis.
Not in some distance sci-fifuture, but in trials that are
happening right now.
Right meow.
Of course, this is stillexperimental, limited to a very
small number of patients, and itwill take years and years of
refinement before it's widelyavailable.
(33:47):
But the proof of concept ishere.
A brain implant can literallyreconnect the brain and the
body.
So when we talk about the futureof medicine, it's not just about
new drugs or better imagingtools.
It's about systems like these.
This is so exciting, you guys.
SPEAKER_01 (34:02):
Ah I am so excited.
SPEAKER_00 (34:05):
So again, you can find the article.
There was actually a lot ofarticles, but I just am only
referencing one here.
It was on PubMed.
So yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (34:14):
I can't get rid of my goosebumps.
I'm so excited about this.
This is a this is crazy, but itmakes sense.
I mean, yes.
Thank you for bringing thispositive side to some of this
sci-fi appearing medicalexperimentation that's going on.
This is amazing.
Thank you.
You're welcome.
Before you bring us back down.
(34:36):
Okay, back to the story.
SPEAKER_00 (34:41):
So Detective Mo called William Bill Mitchell.
And Bill is a nobody caseexpert.
He's a prosecutor in San Diego,California, who has a reputation
her reputation for leaving nostone unturned.
The evidence that he collectedfor the case showed that Denise
(35:01):
created a persona to fit herneeds.
By the time Denise Goodwinreached her late 30s, her life
looked far different than shehad hoped.
Twice divorced, she was raisinga teenage son while still living
with her mother, Helen Locke, ina rural area of Northeast, rural
area northeast of San Diego.
She worked part-time at ananimal hospital and also
(35:24):
assisted her mother's fiduciaryservices business, where she
became familiar with probatelaws, wills, and trusts.
On Helen's property lived SewardNorris, an elderly man suffering
from dementia.
Denise sometimes acted as hiscaregiver, but in 2009 she
exploited him financially.
Seward sometimes paid Goodwinabout$7,000 per month for
(35:48):
caregiver services and expenses.
Holy smokes.
By late 2008, he suffered frommoderate to severe dementia.
And in 2009, November, Denisecontacted his life insurer and
requested a surrender of theaccount.
After she represented herself onthe telephone as either his
daughter or granddaughter, theinsurer mailed a$44,562.39 check
(36:15):
to Denise.
She deposited the check into hisbank account, but guys, of
course, only after adding herown name to the account.
She then used the money for herown benefit.
This scheme gave Denise a tastefor exploiting older men.
At 44, just months afterSeward's death, she posed as a
(36:38):
74-year-old widow on seniordating websites and even placed
an ad on SugarDaddyforme.com,claiming she wanted to find a
man between 72 and 88 who couldmeet her financial needs.
When her online deceptionsfailed, she turned to employment
as a caregiver.
(36:59):
In September of 2010, sheapplied for the position with
the Home Healthcare Agency,asking specifically to work with
hospice assignments.
Denise's mother had a greatrelationship with the agency, so
she was her reference, but ofcourse she didn't disclose their
relationship.
Her mother even made her fakecertificates saying she was a
caretaker and a fiduciary.
(37:24):
So that that's like what at thebeginning when I'm like, this
case is different because it'slike she's not actually medical,
she just lied about beingmedical.
But like her mom, her mom helpedher.
Probably with this.
Because Denise was like, heymama, look, I got all this
$44,000.
And then mom was probably like,shit.
(37:47):
So let's get some more.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (37:50):
So that's why she made her a diploma from the
university, right?
So that is that what you meant?
SPEAKER_00 (37:56):
Oh, I haven't got there yet.
But but yes.
Oh yeah.
So okay.
So she did make her acertificate that she was a
caretaker and a fiduciary.
So she made Denise a diplomafrom the California State
University, Fullerton, forcompletion of a certificate in
professional fiduciarymanagement for conservators.
She was not bonded.
She was not even trained incaregiving.
(38:18):
And this is how she earned herfirst placement into the home of
Carolyn and Gerald Rayborne.
SPEAKER_01 (38:24):
So mom's complicit.
Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (38:26):
Right?
SPEAKER_01 (38:27):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (38:27):
Okay.
And now that I'm thinking moreabout this, I'm like, I never
saw anything about the momgetting in trouble.
SPEAKER_01 (38:36):
Yeah, that's BS.
I mean.
Right?
This is crazy.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (38:43):
So not only was Bill Mitchell an expert in nobody
homicide cases, he was also afraud attorney.
So he knows how to look into allthe banking information and
financial paper trails.
When you follow the money infinancial crimes, financial
documents and paper don't lie,he said.
He had found the sale of Jerry'shouse resulted in nearly$351,000
(39:06):
of profit, which went into atrust fund account that Denise
had set up in her own name.
Denise then bought a house, twocondominiums, and some land.
Her realtor was questioned andthey learned that Denise shared
it was her plan to buy propertyto rent out while she lived in
Costa Rica.
One of her condominiums alreadyhad renters, Tony and Jennifer
(39:28):
Gonzalez.
They were offered the home andeven a car to use for super
cheap.
Investigators learned that Tonywas working for Denise and would
take care of the properties thatshe owned.
They believed that he must beinvolved somehow.
They just weren't sure how.
And so when they looked into hisphone records, it became
clearer.
The call that was originallyplaced to Chris from a Carmen
(39:51):
was placed near the Gonzalezresidence.
And he was now also a person ofinterest.
And so they got a search warrantfor his home.
In April 2011, investigatorswent to Tony's house with the
search warrant.
And he started sharingeverything that had that he was
doing with Denise Goodwin.
He said when they met they wereboth actually homeless and that
(40:13):
she was very nice.
And when he when Denise hadfound out that his wife was
disabled, she wanted to do stuffto help them.
And according to Denise, she hadbought some properties and she
needed someone to help her withinterviewing renters and general
care.
So, you know, she didn't have tobe bothered with that kind of
stuff.
Of course, with a wife and twokids, perfect rent, how could
(40:33):
someone turn this opportunitydown?
And Tony was blown away that hewas now being looked at for
potential involvement in murdercase.
He told authorities that upuntil that point, he had only
ever gotten a ticket in hislife.
SPEAKER_02 (40:46):
What?
SPEAKER_00 (40:47):
I know.
Tony was desperate to clear hisname, and he shared that Jerry
didn't run off and get marriedlike they were told, that the
phone call from the womanfabricated to be Carmen was
voiced by his wife Jennifer.
He shared with investigatorsthat Denise had told him that
Mr.
Rayborn and his new lady friendwere trying to establish a new
life together and that theywanted his kids to leave them
(41:09):
alone.
So he asked Denise, or I'msorry, so Denise asked them to
make the call because Deniseclaimed that Jerry was like, Can
you please call my kids and justpretend to be Carmen and leave
us alone?
And she was like, Well, no, yourkids will recognize my voice.
I can't do that.
So then she asked Tony, like,would Jennifer be willing to do
(41:32):
it?
Because they'll recognize myvoice.
Um, so they didn't really thinkanything of it at the time, but
looking back at Yikes red flag,because if Carmen was real, why
wouldn't Carmen just call?
SPEAKER_01 (41:46):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (41:47):
And so looking back, Tony was like, she clearly
didn't want her fingerprints onthe phone.
He told them that Denise was theone behind the call, and so his
name was cleared, and that'sthat's great.
But just red flags be a flyingeverywhere.
So investigators were like, weneed to start looking into phone
(42:09):
recordings, specifically nowrecording to the bank to
withdraw the money.
And in listening to the call,they found out that she wasn't
able to get past the securityquestions.
Jerry, who was grief-strickenand vulnerable after loss of
Carolyn, fell under herinfluence.
The records recorded callsrevealed that the day after
Carolyn's death, Jerry signed aquick claim deed giving Denise
(42:33):
ability to sell his house.
A week later, he made hersuccessor trustee of his estate,
granting her authority if hebecame incapacitated or died.
Through their joint account, shethen had access to his$3,000 a
month pension, and she alsoforged checks in his name.
Denise stole more than$600,000from Jerry.
(42:53):
Ugh.
An 89-year-old man who wasgrieving the loss of his wife.
While all of this is sick anddisgusting, it doesn't even
bring forth criminal charges,unfortunately.
It's crazy.
So investigators got a searchwarrant for Denise's home in
Valley Center.
(43:13):
I don't know if you guys couldtell.
I was kind of tripping up onwhat I was reading because I was
like, about the phone thing.
Because I'm I know, but I didn'twrite in here.
When Denise brought the burnerphone to Tony and Jennifer's
house, she clearly did not wantto touch the phone.
She brought with her anenvelope.
And after Jennifer was done withthe phone call, she just like
held the envelope open and hadJennifer slide the phone in
(43:37):
there.
So her fingerprints would noteven be on the phone.
And so Tony was like, Well,looking back, she didn't even
want to touch the phone, but atthe time I didn't think anything
of it.
So anyway, if you thought mybrain fell out, it didn't.
It was just working on twodifferent tracks, and now we're
back to one.
So investigators conductedinterviews and searched Denise's
(44:00):
property.
They noted that part of theground on her property had
recently been disturbed.
And she was like, Oh, I recentlyburied one of my horses that
passed away.
SPEAKER_01 (44:08):
Oh, a horse.
Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_00 (44:10):
Yeah.
She did have horses, but theywere like weird.
Authorities brought a backhoe tothe property and dug up that
spot only to find nothing.
No body, no horse, just nothing.
So I'm like, then why was therea hole dug here?
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (44:26):
Because she moved it after they came on to explain.
Yeah.
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (44:31):
No body, no crime, right?
Mm-hmm.
They found in her search historyon her computer that she looked
up overdosing on the painkillerDarvaset.
This medication was acombination of opioid analysis.
So sorry.
I like feel hiccups coming onyou guys, and I really hope that
does not happen because that'sgoing to be an editing nightmare
(44:52):
for Tilly's.
SPEAKER_01 (44:54):
Yeah.
Let's get through it.
Do you want me to scare you?
SPEAKER_00 (44:58):
I know I'm like.
SPEAKER_01 (44:59):
Do you want to record upside down?
SPEAKER_00 (45:00):
Like if I speak it into existence, maybe it won't
happen.
SPEAKER_01 (45:04):
We got an analgesic.
We got a hypocrisy and a seatemit of Finn.
SPEAKER_00 (45:09):
Yeah.
It was all recalled in 2010 dueto serious and potentially fatal
heart risks.
While at Denise's residence,Detective Mo received a call
from the financial detective whoalerted her that Denise had a
flight out of the countryscheduled for the next morning
with her son.
Hmm.
(45:32):
Oh weird.
Are they just going on vacation?
Sure.
They didn't yet have enoughevidence for the murder case,
but they thought they had enoughto charge her with stealing the
victim's car because Jerry's carwas found at her son's high
school.
So that would at the very leastprevent her from fleeing the
country.
And they decided to arrest heras she attempted to board the
(45:52):
flight, which I loved.
Like so dramatic.
I like that too.
It's like, haha, no, you're notgoing on your flight.
Give me your he.
Can you imagine you're like, oh,I've always got it.
And they're like, think again.
SPEAKER_01 (46:09):
Love that.
SPEAKER_00 (46:10):
On July 12, 2012, both Denise and Michael Goodwin
were arrested.
After a month in jail, she wassurprisingly moved to a maximum
security prison.
She was in the dark about anynew charges.
In a phone call to her husband,which when I read this, I was
like, now she has a husband.
Is it a third husband?
I don't know.
Whatever.
(46:30):
In a phone call to a personcalled her husband.
She was heard crying and sayingshe didn't know what was going
on.
And her husband said, Oh, youhaven't heard?
She was like, No, what's goingon?
And he told her, The chargeshave been filed, and they're
charging you with murder in thefirst degree with special
circumstances.
(46:50):
Oh my God, she cried.
Did they find him?
unknown (46:56):
Uh uh.
SPEAKER_00 (46:57):
What?
Hello.
SPEAKER_01 (47:00):
Hello, guilty lady.
SPEAKER_00 (47:06):
Searches were completed to try and find
Gerald's body, butunfortunately, they were never
able to locate his body.
There was no cause of death, nocrime scene, no coroner report,
and the stakes were high in anobody case.
Denise's trial began in lateAugust 2014 and stretched into
October.
All of the audio recordings wereused in court, including her,
(47:28):
did they find him?
in the phone call with herhusband.
Jerry's grown children andgrandchildren took turns giving
their impact statements to thecourt.
With his voice breaking, his sonclosed his statement by saying,
quote, My father did not deserveto be murdered, end quote.
Mary, his daughter, gripped thecourt with her eloquent speech.
(47:49):
She first humanized her father,making Judge Rogers smile as she
described her how her fatherloved to eat fish sandwiches,
took Jack Lalani, Jack Lalancare of his body.
I don't know, it must be verygood care of your body.
And that he was so compulsivethat he picked up leaves each
day by hand, taught her how tofloat on her back, and walked
(48:11):
her down the aisle on herwedding day.
Later, she turned to herfather's absence and said that
she knew her she knew her fatherwas dead when she did not
receive a birthday card fromhim.
She went on to describe thevisions that she had of her
father's last moments, whichhave tormented her and destroyed
her health.
She has nightmares of where herfather's body might be buried.
(48:33):
She detailed the beautifulburial their family should have
had, the music that would havelifted her body father's body to
heaven, and the military honorsher father would have been
given, and that he had hadearned as a World War II
veteran.
In a gesture of mercy, sheturned towards Denise Goodwin
and told her that she forgivesher, stating that this is,
(48:54):
quote, not beyond restorationfrom a loving God, end quote,
but that she must return themost sacred of things that she
has taken, her father's body.
In closing, she asked the courtnot to judge her father by the
few years remaining, but by the89 years he had lived in which
he was loved by his family.
After four days of jurydeliberation, which I'm like,
(49:16):
four days, guys?
I guess like it was mostlycircumstantial, but Denise was
found guilty of first-degreemurder with the special
circumstances of financial gain,along with caretaker theft from
an elder, fraudulentappropriation by a trustee,
grand theft, and forgery.
She was guilty on all 11 counts.
(49:37):
On January 30th, 2015, she wassentenced to life without
parole.
Deputy District Attorney BillMitchell called her a quote,
thief disguised as a churchgoerand a killer disguised as a
caregiver, end quote.
Though her defense admitted shecommitted fraud and theft, they
(50:00):
argued murder was beyond her andsought a reduction to second
degree murder, which was denied,luckily.
Before sentencing Denise, JudgeRogers said that there were some
moments that were not big enoughto hold everything that goes
into them, and that this was oneof those moments.
To the Rayborn family, heexpressed that he was profoundly
(50:20):
sorry that a human life wastaken for financial gain.
He then pronounced the sentenceto the family.
It was what they had asked forwas the life without the
possibility of parole.
And Mary had said, I don't thinkthat she knew how smart my dad
was with money.
I think that he confronted herand threatened to turn her into
the police.
She said, I've never had afuneral for my own father, and
(50:42):
it's hard to find closure whenthere's no body.
I still cry for him.
To this day, the circumstancesof Gerald Rayborn's death and
the location of his body remainunknown because Denise is a
fucking loser.
Rotting in prison, but will notgive that to the family.
SPEAKER_01 (51:03):
Wow.
I mean where does she have tolose?
She's already in there for life.
At least so obviously shedoesn't feel any remorse, or she
would at least do this one thingthat it doesn't it's not like it
gives them closure, but it givesthem some peace knowing that
their dad is buried and where togo to you know visit his grave
(51:31):
and like I don't know.
That's just so cruel.
It's so cruel in so many waysbecause you know, this is a true
crime in healthcare podcast.
I just feel like when people arehired to provide care, medical
care, they ought to be held toan even higher expectations than
(51:56):
you know, your painter or yourplumber, right?
So not only that, sheingratiated herself to the
extent where they were like welook, you know, before the mom
died, I forget what her namewas, but his wife died.
Yeah, they they were just likeso so what what was this her
(52:17):
plan all along, do you think?
To ingratiate herself?
SPEAKER_00 (52:21):
And what a sociopath because they were talking about
like trying to also try her forlike accelerating Caroline's
death.
SPEAKER_01 (52:30):
Can you imagine?
SPEAKER_00 (52:32):
And like she already has life without parole, and and
like maybe that would help thefamily find some sort of
closure.
I don't know if that would addinsult to injury.
SPEAKER_01 (52:39):
So she might have had something to do with
Carolyn's death as well.
That's good.
They were like, yeah.
I mean, she ingratiated herselfto the point where she could
mask her true personalitybecause let's face it, if you're
somebody who's, you know,masking yourself as a healthcare
provider with you know, ulteriormotive of taking your money,
you're not a you're not someonewho's an empath.
(53:01):
Um this is crazy to me.
It's so disgusting.
And it makes me wonder how canwe trust anybody?
How do you know?
And her poor children.
unknown (53:10):
I know.
SPEAKER_00 (53:12):
And now that this was brought up during me reading
this, and I never thought aboutit before, but why the heck did
her mom not get in trouble?
So her son did get charged withautomobile theft or like grand
theft auto or something.
But like Helen's got in troublefor making these fake
certificates.
What?
SPEAKER_01 (53:31):
She wouldn't have been able to get the job that
she did if she hadn't leveragedher mom's position and her mom
hadn't falsified records.
So I yeah, I feel like that's amissed opportunity right there,
too.
SPEAKER_00 (53:43):
I agree.
Ah so again, this wasn't likesuper medically, but she was
pretending to be medical and shewas just a scoundrel.
SPEAKER_01 (53:50):
Yeah, no, it's important.
It's important for our listenersto know uh not all healthcare
providers are believable or havealtruistic intentions, which is
scary as well.
SPEAKER_00 (54:04):
Which I guess we have talked about plenty of that
just have walls plastered withfake certificates and degrees.
SPEAKER_01 (54:11):
Yeah.
Check degrees.
I think it's a lot easier now tocheck credentials than it has
been in the past.
And I think that awareness isimportant for listeners,
especially when you're lookingat your loved ones and you want
to make sure that their careproviders, no matter how much
your loved one likes and getsalong with the care provider,
people can mask their trueintent.
(54:34):
So make sure you're checkingqualifications.
I mean, because that was onething, I guess, that they could
have put not no victim at all.
But that's the one thing thatshe didn't have was actual
qualification.
SPEAKER_00 (54:48):
So and I'm like, what if this had been like
again?
I'm sure she's thought aboutthis nine billion times, but
like, what if I just told him,like, no, I'm coming out to move
you home now?
Like, don't stay there thewinter.
Yeah.
But it made sense that likewinter in San Diego is gonna be
a lot nicer than winter inKansas City.
SPEAKER_01 (55:08):
So it's just the stuff that happened that was out
of character for him, especiallyI was probably too late by the
time she didn't get a birthdaycard, but like you know, you you
know your family, you know yourparent, and something was amiss.
And it's just tragic.
I can't believe that somehowthey couldn't offer life in
(55:33):
prison as the plea deal, interms of like, you can tell us
where he is, or you can have thedeath penalty.
Yeah, you know.
SPEAKER_00 (55:42):
But then she would probably just be like, fine,
give me the death penalty.
I don't want to live in jailforever, and I'm not telling
you.
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (55:48):
Well, I don't want to go there, but I don't know.
It's just absurd, like justgiving the family that.
Absolutely.
Well, thank you.
That was a fascinating case, andI appreciate you bringing it up.
Well done.
SPEAKER_00 (56:04):
Well done, Amanda.
So, our sponsor number two, Idefinitely did not need to
utilize them after my tractorsituation today.
You have a lot of adrenalinegoing, girl.
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nutritional boost to your dailyroutine.
SPEAKER_01 (57:11):
I use I'm sorry, I'm laughing.
Coffee, you obviously didn'thave any because you're yawning
your way through this ad.
SPEAKER_00 (57:23):
7 10 p.m.
Don't you guys go to bed at 8o'clock now?
SPEAKER_01 (57:31):
Well, you do if we have to get up at four or
something like you do.
Yes.
It's your bedtime.
Carry on, girl.
SPEAKER_00 (57:38):
Stay suspicious at strongcoffeecompany.com for 20%
off your order.
Yay! Oh gosh, I just saw ournames.
Oh, I was like, my eyes skippedto the medical mishap, and then
I saw our names, and I was like,oh gosh, what's happening?
SPEAKER_01 (57:56):
Medical mishap.
Who wants to read the medicalmishap?
Okay, because you hiccuping inyawning.
My body is doing so.
Oh girl, we're getting throughit.
All right, but this is good.
We're gonna end on a positivenote here.
Today's medical mishap comesfrom Sam, who writes, Dr.
(58:17):
Amanda and Dr.
Jenna.
I want you both to know that Ilove your podcast and your
friendship as well as your easybanter.
I feel like you are friends andwould love to have friends I
would love to have over forcoffee or margaritas.
SPEAKER_00 (58:32):
We love those things.
SPEAKER_01 (58:33):
I like the juxtaposition there.
It's like, yes.
SPEAKER_00 (58:37):
We'll start with coffee and end with margaritas,
okay?
SPEAKER_01 (58:40):
We're friends.
That's yeah.
We are friends.
Alrighty.
Okay, so Sam says, Most of all,I love I love the content that
raises awareness abouthealthcare issues, all with
compassion for the victims andan eye on educating us
listeners.
We appreciate you.
I know you've had a colonoscopymishap on the show before, but I
(59:00):
can't help but share mine.
I mean, never enough colonoscopymishaps, right?
So Sam goes on to say, I had myfirst colonoscopy scheduled.
Everyone warned me that the prepwas the worst part.
True.
They weren't kidding.
Two days of jello and clearbroth, followed by what I can
only describe as industrialstrength laxatives.
(59:24):
That seems extra stringent.
I think these days it's just oneday, but anyway, who knows?
By the time I got to the clinic,I felt like a balloon with all
the air let out.
My spouse drove me, and as wewalked in, they whispered,
remember, dignity is optional.
I love you, spouse.
They're like, I'm just gonnamess with you just a little
(59:46):
extra.
The nurse gave me one of thoseopen back gowns.
I tied it in three differentways before realizing there was
no way to avoid showing theworld my backside.
As I shuffled down the hall,clutching.
It shut.
I swear, I look like a Victorianghost haunting the GI ward.
Another patient saw mestruggling and said, First time
(01:00:08):
I nodded.
They winked and said, You'll befine.
Just don't moon theanesthesiologist.
SPEAKER_00 (01:00:14):
Well, not the frequent flyer giving commentary
down the hall.
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (01:00:19):
Thanks, dude.
So they wheeled me into theprocedure room.
The anesthesiologist said, Okay,count backwards from 10.
Instead of numbers, I decided torecite Beyonce lyrics.
According to the nurse, I got asfar as all the single ladies
before I passed out.
That's way more fun thancounting.
And when I woke, I exactly.
(01:00:42):
I'm gonna start.
Yeah.
So you want 10, 9, 8, 7, 6, 7.
I don't think so.
Right?
When I woke up in recovery, myspouse told me the entire staff
had been seen along.
So they probably took it beyondall the single ladies.
I felt great, maybe too great.
The sedation is no joke.
I sat up, pointed dramaticallyat my spouse, and declared, We
(01:01:05):
must go to Olive Gardenimmediately.
Unlimited breadsticks await.
No, I want those.
The nurse gently reminded methat maybe Fettuccine Alfredo
wasn't the best first meal postprocedure.
I counter argued that pasta isbasically clear liquid if you
squint hard enough.
(01:01:25):
Apparently, I lost that debate.
As we were leaving, I realized Istill had my hospital socks on,
the grippy ones.
I insisted they were a souvenirand refused to give them back.
My spouse said I started out ofthe clinic like a catwalk model,
holding up the socks like theywere a prize on the prices
right.
To this day, whenever I put on apair of fuzzy socks at home, my
(01:01:47):
spouse bows and says, And theaward for the best
post-colonoscopy performancegoes to I love your spouse.
Bam.
Oh my gosh, you guys are socute.
Was it embarrassing?
Sure.
But honestly, laughter made thewhole ordeal bearable.
Colonoscopies save lives.
And if my lasting memory isBeyonce lyrics and sock
(01:02:10):
modeling, love Sam.
Love, love, love.
Sam, we love you.
Oh my god.
That was amazing.
Such a great story.
SPEAKER_00 (01:02:18):
Thank you so much for sharing that.
And you're so good at writing,like I can picture that entire
story happening.
SPEAKER_01 (01:02:26):
I know.
I know.
It's like something on a sitcom.
I absolutely love it.
SPEAKER_00 (01:02:33):
All right, Jenna.
What can we expect to hear nextweek?
SPEAKER_01 (01:02:38):
Well, next week we're gonna cover Dr.
Conrad Murray and the death ofMichael Jackson.
Ever heard of him?
SPEAKER_00 (01:02:48):
No, who's that?
I'm kidding.
I'm kidding.
You don't know who I was, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (01:03:02):
Girl.
So until then, dumb is the beat.
Subscribe, subscribe or followDoctoring the Truth wherever you
enjoy your podcasts for storiesthat shock, intrigue, and
educate.
Trust, after all, is a delicatething.
You can text us directly on ourwebsite at doctoringthetruth at
(01:03:22):
buzzsprout.com or email us yourown medical mishaps at
Doctoringthe Truth at Gmail.
Be sure to follow us onInstagram at Doctoring the Truth
Podcast and on Facebook atDoctoring the Truth.
We are on TikTok for now atDoctoring the Truth and at
oddpot.
Well, I mean, you know, unlessTikTok is supposed to again.
(01:03:43):
I'm just saying.
Oh it might.
I never know what's going on.
There's apparently anotherround, another round of
wondering what's happening.
But honestly, you guys, wereally, really would love to
hear a comment from you.
You know, that would be a gift.
My birthday is coming up soon.
Can you just write somethingabout us positive?
(01:04:04):
If you don't have anything niceto say, don't.
But please, uh it would be sucha gift if you would rate and
review us so you know we canfeel good about ourselves and
what we're doing so that we canbring you more content next
week.
Until then, stay safe and staysuspicious.
Suspicious.
SPEAKER_00 (01:04:25):
Goodbye.
SPEAKER_01 (01:04:26):
Bye.
unknown (01:04:27):
Bye.
SPEAKER_00 (01:04:28):
I swear to god, I hope that audio from earlier
when I forgot my mic works.
Amanda! Jenna! Hey! How are you doing?
I'm doing good.
I'm laughing because it was myturn to count again.
And she was like, okay, are youready?
And I was like, Yeah.
And I'm staring at her, waitingto count.
I'm like, oh yeah, right, right,right, right, right, right.
Yeah, my turn.
Got it.
(00:21):
Yeah, so I'm doing good now.
Do you want to hear about howpart of my day was?
SPEAKER_01 (00:28):
Yeah, especially if it meant you weren't doing well
before.
What happened?
SPEAKER_00 (00:34):
So I almost died today.
SPEAKER_01 (00:36):
What?
SPEAKER_00 (00:37):
Like, no.
Not even being dramatic.
Like, oh my God.
Okay.
Tell me all.
So I was down in my southernplains region today.
And you know it's harvestingseason.
And so combines and tractors andthings are on the roads.
Yeah.
And I'm driving from one schoolto another.
(00:58):
And there was this combine, Ithink.
Is a combine?
I don't know.
Took up the whole lane plus theshoulder.
So like big.
And I was like looking ahead,like, oh, okay, I have time to
go around, but there is anoncoming car.
But like thinking about, okay,by the time we pass each other,
I thought we'd be in front ofthis uh, how do you say it?
(01:19):
Like a bypass lane on theoncoming side.
So I was like, oh, that'll beperfect.
So I had like first slowed downbecause I was like, maybe I'll
wait.
And then I was like, no, I havelike places to be.
I'm gonna go around this tractorbecause that's what we do.
We go around the tractor.
So I like speed back up to 55.
I start to go around thistractor, and this tractor starts
turning in front of me.
(01:41):
Like he did not signal, he didnot nothing.
Oh no, did not look for me.
And I had to slam on my brakesso hard that like my Jeep
started doing the best way I candescribe it is like you know,
when you're going down a skihill and you kind of like shift
the skis like side to side tostart slow down.
(02:03):
Yeah, like that is what my Jeepstarted doing.
And so there's marks on the roadfrom my tires, melting your
tires on the road, slowly to tryand stop.
I was like, oh my god, I'm notgonna stop in time.
Like, I'm gonna meet thiscombine.
Everything in my car flewforward and like underneath the
dash.
SPEAKER_01 (02:23):
Yeah, everything's shot forward, and that's scary,
and couldn't get under yourpedals as well.
That's so scary.
SPEAKER_00 (02:29):
And now, of course, I have like thousands of dollars
of equipment in my car.
Okay, it's all now under well,at the time.
I didn't care because I was likebreathing.
Well, first I was I was soshocked.
I told my husband, like, Icalled him immediately, and I
was like, oh my god, this justhappened.
Like, I feel like I just cheateddeath.
(02:50):
Like, I literally saw my Jeepsmashing into this combine, and
everything, and of course, I wasdrinking a frickin' protein
shake, so I had protein shakeall over my car.
I still have not dealt withthat.
It was all over like the boxesof the equipment, but at least
they were in boxes because youknow protein shake is sticky.
Yeah, oh my god, all the buttonson my dash, the screen on my
(03:14):
car.
SPEAKER_01 (03:14):
I'm like, did the guy even notice that he almost
caused your imminent death?
I don't know.
Well, I hope so.
SPEAKER_00 (03:22):
I was honking at him.
SPEAKER_01 (03:24):
Legally, they have to have a turnlight, like they
have to have a blinker, right?
On the back of their big assthing.
SPEAKER_00 (03:31):
I would assume so.
Dude, I was so mad I told myhusband, like, I wanted to stop
and go yell at him.
Like, you could have killed me.
SPEAKER_01 (03:40):
That is so scary.
Isn't it crazy how those slidingdoor moments where you're like,
this could have ended sodifferently and changed so many
lives.
SPEAKER_00 (03:50):
Yes.
And like I got home and like mydog was all happy to see me, and
I was like, oh my god.
SPEAKER_01 (03:56):
You almost didn't have a mama.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (03:58):
Would have just been waiting.
The last thing I would have saidto you is see you soon.
And then I told my husband, Iwas like, Oh my gosh, I just
ordered some different dressesfor our family pictures for the
fall, you know.
I was like, and two of themarrived today in the mailbox.
I told my husband, like, youwould have gone and got the mail
and saw my dresses I ordered,and you would have been so sad.
(04:19):
And then I started crying, so Iwas like, I can't talk about
this anymore.
But anyway, so I'm doing finenow.
But that was scary.
SPEAKER_01 (04:28):
Near death experience.
That's trauma.
That's so trauma.
Hope my well, my daughter, Idon't think she listens.
She on a much lesser scale, shewe almost met head-on with a
tractor when I was trying toteach her to drive.
And I mean, it was a stationarytractor with a sign on it.
And I had told her, let's pulloff this highway, you know,
(04:49):
because we'd inadvertently goneto a road that led to a highway
that was faster than she wascomfortable with.
And I was like, okay, well,let's find a there was a little
turn off into a gravel drivewayof this little farmstead where
they had a, you know, they wereselling eggs and pickles and
whatever.
So they were telling us thatthey're selling eggs and pickles
with this sign on a tractor atthe side of a culvert.
(05:11):
She, I said, slow down, slowdown, slow down! I'm trying to
be cool.
I'm trying to be your foot'slike going through the floor.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
I'm stomping on the floor.
She wheels that puppy in, I kidyou not, probably 15 miles an
hour.
And I'm staring at this greenJohn Deere right in front of me
who's holding the sign.
All the dust on the gravel roadis.
I don't know how she managed toturn that thing on a dime, but
(05:33):
she did.
We managed to do like a, youknow, three three-quarters of a
circular turn.
We look up when the dust clearsand we see this farmer and his
wife sitting on the step withour little toddler, like all
eyes like saucers staring at us.
I get out of the car and I'mlike, it's gonna put in work.
We get out and we're like, hey,you got any eggs?
unknown (05:54):
You know?
SPEAKER_00 (05:55):
Like, hey, I heard you had the best egg.
SPEAKER_01 (05:57):
They're like, Yeah, but what's the hurry?
You know, what's the rush?
Um, so but that was the onlythis tractor was stationary.
But I will say, my sister was onthe back of a motorcycle with
her boyfriend driving at thetime, and it wasn't, I I don't
know why that matters because itwasn't his fault.
But they did a similar thingwhere they were gonna pass and
(06:19):
they were behind a garbagetruck, and the garbage truck
turned without signaling, andthey collided, and she ended up
in traction, having to drop outof college, you know.
She her pelvis was splinteredand like all kinds of horrible
stuff.
So yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (06:38):
Use your signals, people.
I don't care if it's a tractor,a garbage truck, a freaking
cement truck, yeah, car, bike,anything.
SPEAKER_01 (06:47):
They know they're going slower than the speed
limit.
They know people are gonna wantto pass them.
So, you know, why are you gonnaturn left in front of them
without indicating?
SPEAKER_00 (06:58):
And there was a car uncoming too.
Like to where I'm like mappingout like, do I even have time to
go around?
So I'm like, I wonder, I Ididn't even think about this and
that, but I wonder that othercar probably just slam on their
brakes too.
SPEAKER_01 (07:10):
Yeah, and also at least with a garbage truck or a
car or a truck, you can there'sa license plate.
Are are there license plates onthese big combines?
SPEAKER_00 (07:18):
Can you guess I don't know, but that's why I
told Adam, I was like, hedoesn't even have a number on
the back of the tractor where Ican call and be like, You're
driving socks.
SPEAKER_01 (07:26):
Yeah, or call the call the local police station
and be like, you know what, havea chat with this dude because
that's yeah, he was in a greentractor.
SPEAKER_00 (07:33):
Go get him on these roads.
I don't know because I'm out inBump E.
And I don't know where I am.
I'm literally going where my cartells me to go.
SPEAKER_01 (07:42):
Oh I'm getting better, but uh that's scary.
I think lesson learned better tobe late than trust your farmer.
SPEAKER_00 (07:51):
Yeah.
Sorry, farmers, but yeah.
Or and Adam was like, Do youthink he heard you honking at
him?
Probably not, because he'sprobably an old farmer with
hearing loss and tractor.
Well, I think tractors are a lotlike quieter now than they used
to be, but they are, but alsoyou signal, you indicate when
you're gonna do it.
There was me and another car.
Ah okay, I'm over it.
(08:12):
Oh my gosh, okay.
Sorry, I just glanced to theleft to where my document is,
and I s I didn't put anything ina correction section, but now I
see a very interesting topic inthe correction section.
Please tell me more.
SPEAKER_01 (08:29):
All right, so as usual, as per usual, when it's
been my episode, I always have acorrection.
And as per usual, my windowblinds are open and there's a
squirrel frolicking literallylike two feet away from me, like
rolling around in the grass andhaving a joyous time.
That it's really distracting me.
Okay.
Um, so shout out to best friendof the podcast, Nicole Krieger,
(08:55):
for pointing out thiscorrection.
Last week, when we were, youknow, bantering about the
weather, I said, Yeah, you know,you want to get your stuff out,
you know, your thigh high boots.
She goes, Jenna, when have youever worn thigh high boots in
recent decades?
(09:15):
And I was like, girl, you'reright.
I meant I meant knee high.
I don't know.
So thanks, Nicole.
Thanks for bringing that up.
Fossy.
SPEAKER_00 (09:23):
Thigh high.
SPEAKER_01 (09:23):
We get that visual.
Yeah, we'll we'll get the visualof me and thigh high boots out
of everyone's mind's eye.
Sorry if that can't be wiped.
So I just thought it'd be funnyto say hey, thanks.
And also her mom, Denise, shelistens to our show.
Hi, Denise.
Hi, Denise.
SPEAKER_00 (09:41):
Shout out, ladies.
SPEAKER_01 (09:43):
Yeah.
Well, she's a lady, is she not?
SPEAKER_00 (09:45):
Well, I said only hi to Denise, so I wanted to also
say hi to Nicole.
SPEAKER_01 (09:50):
Oh, okay.
All right.
Anyway.
All right.
SPEAKER_00 (09:54):
So that's the one correction.
I was like, I get to say goodjob, no corrections.
There's always next time.
Uh so anyway, sorry about mylong tractor story, guys.
If you know me personally, youcan't tell the story without it
(10:15):
being long.
AF.
I mean, life would be a goodone.
Oh my god, because you knowwhat?
You could have been here and Idied today instead of listening
to me talk about a tractor.
So you're welcome.
I mean, I'm thankful.
SPEAKER_01 (10:28):
I am so thankful.
SPEAKER_00 (10:29):
And I guess if you don't want to hear it, they have
that awesome 30-second button onthe uh podcast.
SPEAKER_01 (10:37):
This is true.
Okay, so before we move, it'scalled the banter button.
SPEAKER_00 (10:40):
Yeah.
I do appreciate on morbidpodcasts that they have like
that little jingle before theycome back from their ads because
I always hit like did it itforward, forward, forward.
And then until I hear that like,and then I'm like, okay, they're
coming back.
SPEAKER_01 (10:58):
Yeah, I guess we're not that nice.
SPEAKER_00 (11:00):
We ain't fancy yet.
SPEAKER_01 (11:01):
They're on Sirius XM.
I mean Sirius XM, ladies.
Get it, girls.
Yeah, but looks like you madeit.
SPEAKER_00 (11:10):
Good job, baby girls.
Okay, well, without further ado,let me get to my sponsor.
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(12:16):
STAYSUSPIS.
SPEAKER_01 (12:20):
Nice.
SPEAKER_00 (12:20):
Oh my god.
What?
I just realized I'm not using mymicrophone.
But my thing is recording.
I'm gonna take a brief pausing.
SPEAKER_01 (12:38):
We have to start over.
No, we don't.
SPEAKER_00 (12:42):
Do we?
SPEAKER_01 (12:43):
You haven't been recording.
SPEAKER_00 (12:45):
It is recording.
SPEAKER_01 (12:46):
Okay, what's recording?
I don't know.
Just your computer mic?
Look at it's recording.
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (12:54):
I'll work with it.
I'll work with it.
And that like the speechenvelopes have looked as big as
they normally do, so I didn'teven think anything else.
SPEAKER_01 (13:02):
I know.
You always have nice speechenvelopes.
I I'm puny.
I can't even see them.
And it doesn't matter what I do.
I don't know how yours were sobig.
SPEAKER_00 (13:11):
Maybe it's a Mac.
Okay, friends, I have mymicrophone.
Welcome.
LOL, welcome to Urban.
Perhaps for the first time.
I don't know why I thought ofthat, but I was like, holy shit,
I don't have a microphone.
You're like, something'smissing.
My hands are too free to talkwith.
What's going on?
(13:31):
Okay.
All of the sources for today'sstory will be found in the show
notes.
There are no trigger warningsfor this story.
This is a tale that's it's alittle different.
I wasn't expecting it.
So any hoozles.
(13:53):
Shall we?
We shall.
Okay.
Gerald Eugene Rayborn was bornon March 20th, 1922.
He loved automobiles, theDodgers, and all things money
and investments.
He was a jovial man and everyoneenjoyed being around him.
(14:14):
He was very close with hisdaughter Mary and would often
call her to talk about twothings: vitamins that she should
buy and stocks that she shouldsell.
He and his second wife, Carolyn,whom the family adored, decided
to move from Kansas City,Missouri to San Diego,
California so that they couldlive a more active lifestyle
(14:35):
year-round.
They moved into a country clubtype atmosphere and were very,
very happy there until thesummer of 2010 when Carolyn was
diagnosed with lung cancer.
As a lifetime smoker, thisdiagnosis wasn't the biggest
shock, though still obviouslydevastating.
(14:57):
Carolyn's son Ralph went tovisit Jerry and her in
California.
And while there, he helped themset up home health care through
an agency.
They thought it would be helpfulto have someone who could come
in to the home a couple of daysa week, you know, help around
the house with cooking,cleaning, and getting groceries.
Because Carolyn kind of was theone that ran the household.
(15:20):
And Jerry took care of her, shetook care of him, but he was
more the money guy and she wasmore the like logistical things
of the household.
So the assistance of the homehealth aid would allow Jerry to
just focus on Carolyn.
Denise Edmund was assigned toher care.
(15:41):
Jerry and Carolyn adored her.
Jerry would call Mary, hisdaughter, and say Denise was
their angel.
And I know, so sweet.
Even though things were going aswell as they could be in
California, given theircircumstances, Jerry would
always remind Mary that, quote,you know, when Carolyn dies, I'm
(16:03):
coming to live with you, endquote.
Oh.
Just as they knew the day wouldinevitably come, Carolyn passed
away.
The family was sad to learn ofher passing, though excited that
Jerry would be moving closer tothem in Kansas City.
But one day, when talking toMary, things shifted.
(16:25):
She spoke of plans to come outand help arrange his move back
to KC, but he said he wasn'tmoving back yet.
He said that he would stay inSan Diego throughout the winter
months, and Denise offered tostay as his caregiver at no cost
during that time.
Subbound.
(16:45):
So he mentioned, you know,luckily for him, she also had a
fiduciary degree, so she couldhelp him with all of the
financial things that needed tobe done after Carolyn's passing.
Mary, yeah.
Red flags.
We're making all these noises.
Red flags be a flying.
Mary had called to check on herdad, and they had had a great
(17:08):
conversation filled with lots oflove.
And he assured her that he wouldmove back as soon as the winter
was over.
And they agreed that they wouldstay in touch every three to
four days in the meantime.
A month after Carolyn's passing,Mary's son and great Jerry's
grandson, Chris, got home fromwork and there was a message on
(17:30):
the answering machine.
And for those of you who don'tknow what an answering machine
is, back in the day when wedidn't have cell phones, we had
what's called a landline phone.
And so if someone called andthere was no one home to answer,
or if we didn't feel likeanswering, insert the new caller
ID.
The caller was able to leave amessage recording on an
(17:52):
answering machine.
So now you know.
The recording on Chris'sanswering machine said, quote,
my name is Carmen.
Jerry and I got married in LasVegas.
I'm asking that you give us sometime to ourselves and not keep
calling.
Don't expect to hear from usuntil after the holidays.
(18:15):
I'll write to you later with allof the information.
End quote.
SPEAKER_01 (18:18):
Oh my goodness.
What?
I wasn't expecting this.
Who the hell is Carmen?
Right.
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (18:24):
What?
Boy, questions.
Oh my gosh.
And that just reminded me.
Was that a game at one point?
Carmen and San Diego?
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (18:32):
Oh.
So they weren't even thatcreative.
SPEAKER_00 (18:38):
Oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_01 (18:40):
Oh man.
The smells of fishy fish.
SPEAKER_00 (18:44):
The smells fishy.
So Chris was obviously shockedat this unexpected message, and
he called his parents to informthem.
And his dad contacted Denise tosee if she knew anything about
this Carmen character.
Denise explained that Carmen andJerry had met at the grocery
store and that they were inlove.
SPEAKER_01 (19:07):
This was that's when it happens, the produce section
they always say.
This was over the parsley, it'slike, ooh, baby.
I know how to cook it.
SPEAKER_00 (19:22):
This was very interesting to the family
because it was only one monthafter Carolyn passed away.
SPEAKER_01 (19:29):
Oh.
SPEAKER_00 (19:30):
They were together for 30 years.
So suspicious.
But it would not be the firsttime that he had made a rash
decision in his life to tie theknot.
He and Carolyn tied the knotafter only knowing each other
for two weeks.
Wow.
It was a second marriage forboth of them after their spouses
(19:50):
had passed.
And they were just like, youknow what?
When you know, you know.
So they were like, this isweird, but also not
uncharacteristic.
SPEAKER_01 (19:59):
It's happened before.
SPEAKER_00 (20:00):
Yeah.
Mary was understandablyconcerned about the news, but
tried to reassure herself thathe was in fact traveling and
that he or she would at leasthear from him on her birthday.
Throughout her entire life, hewould always go to the store
himself and pick out herbirthday card, and he always put
$30 inside the card.
(20:21):
She said, no matter what, nomatter what age I turned,
nothing.
He he would always pick out thecard and there was always$30.
Like, oh, how wholesome.
But unfortunately, her birthdaycame and went, and there was no
card.
The family attempted to contacthim but had no luck.
So they tried to call Denise andalso hit a dead end.
(20:44):
Where the heck was Jerry?
It had been about five months atthis time since they had heard
from him.
And so in February 2011, Maryfiled a missing persons report
with the San Diego PoliceDepartment.
The police report said thatJerry had a new girlfriend and
that he didn't want to see hisfamily anymore.
(21:06):
Mary was adamant to policeofficers that something was
wrong and that this was out ofcharacter for her dad.
Detective Mo Mikinis Parga wasassigned to the case.
She contacted his caregiverDenise, who shared that Jerry
was in fact getting married tohis new girlfriend, Carmen, in
Vegas and that they planned togo to Mexico.
(21:26):
She also mentioned that Jerrymade her promise that she would
not tell his family hiswhereabouts because he didn't
want them to know.
He said that his family was,quote, too religious and he just
wanted to have fun, end quote.
Also, this guy's 89 at thispoint.
SPEAKER_01 (21:43):
So well, either good for him or this is a big fat
lie.
SPEAKER_00 (21:48):
Right.
Because I'm like, if I'm 89, Idon't think I give two flying
squirrels about what anyonethinks.
Right.
So Denise sounded as though shewas being truthful, you know,
the story was believable.
And so they thought maybe he'snot missing after all.
And Denise just isn't sure abouttheir exact location at the
(22:09):
time, but knew what their planswere.
Police became skeptical that hewas missing because an adult
that doesn't want their kids toknow where they are is not a
crime.
Detectives did share with thefamily that they had planned to
move to Mexico with his newwife, but again, red flag.
(22:30):
The family had said to police,he would never do that.
He hated Mexico because of allthe drug wars.
And like, who knows Jerry bestbesides his family?
SPEAKER_02 (22:40):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (22:40):
So the family stood firm in the fact that they knew
him and that this was out ofcharacter for him.
So doing their due diligence,detectives decided to trace his
finances.
And they found that he had usedhis debit card in Valley Center,
California.
And if this was true, how couldhe be in Vegas or Mexico?
(23:02):
Valley Center happened to alsobe where Denise lived.
So they thought, well, maybehe's just at her house.
So they went there.
When she answered the door, theyexplained that they were looking
for Jerry.
And she said, I told you he's inMexico.
She swore up and down.
That is when they brought up hisfinances.
(23:23):
If he was in Mexico, how did hisdebit card get used here?
They showed her the printedtransactions from the bank, and
she immediately got flusteredand said, quote, well, he told
me I could have$5,000 on hisdebit card for helping him at
his house, but you know, I feltbad spending that much, so I
only spent$3,000.
(23:45):
End quote.
SPEAKER_01 (23:48):
Oh my god.
Come on.
SPEAKER_00 (23:50):
How noble?
SPEAKER_01 (23:51):
Super noble.
unknown (23:52):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (23:53):
Squeaky clean.
The detectives, the detectiveswere like, oh, really?
So then can you explain thischeck written for$5,000?
Oops.
She goes, Oh, I mailed him acheck in Mexico.
Oh.
Really?
Really?
So their next question was thesame as mine.
So what's his address in Mexico?
(24:16):
She resisted sharing theinformation, saying that he did
not want his kids to know.
But after discussion and themprobably being like, We're the
police.
Hello.
Give it up.
He's missing.
Tell us the address.
She finally produced an address.
And detectives felt like theymay finally have a solid lead.
That is, if Denise was tellingthe truth.
(24:37):
Agents were sent to the addressin San Felipe, Mexico to search
the area.
Further investigation into hisfinances revealed a strange
pattern on Jerry and Carolyn'saccounts.
Money was moving out of them andinto a joint account between
Jerry and Denise.
She did, however, help him withhis finances, you know, things
like buying groceries.
(24:58):
So she did have access to themoney.
The family was aware of that,but they found two large checks
made out to Carolyn's son Ralph.
One check was for$13,000 and theother was for$15,000.
SPEAKER_01 (25:14):
That's more than groceries.
SPEAKER_00 (25:18):
Yeah, not groceries.
Also, Ralph's like back inKansas City.
So how old is Ralph?
Her son?
Is he an adult?
I don't know, adults.
Oh yeah.
They're all adult children.
Okay.
So this obviously made Ralph aperson of interest.
(25:39):
And Ralph shared withinvestigators that Carolyn had
investments and that he had goneout to San Diego after her
passing to handle herfinancials.
And when he went to the bank todiscuss her CDs, they told him
that the amount that was in theCD was transferred by phone on
September 29th from her accountto Jerry's.
Ralph told the banker that thiswas impossible because she was
(26:02):
in a coma on the 29th.
Yeah.
There is no way that she madethe call.
Yeah.
And the bank said, Oh, well,maybe her husband did it then.
And I'm like, what?
SPEAKER_01 (26:13):
Seriously, are we that casual people?
SPEAKER_00 (26:15):
Guys, do we not have her a record of this?
Like, am I just a record-keepingmaniac from working at the
hospital because this seemspretty, pretty important to
track.
I mean, details me tell, right?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Ralph further explained thatfrom the bank, he then went to
Denise's house to ask her if sheknew anything about the transfer
(26:37):
of money.
And she told him that shedidn't, but you know, she would
talk to Jerry to see if he knewand she'd be in touch.
So she called Ralph the next dayand said that, you know, she had
talked to Jerry and that shewould get him the money in two
different checks.
Ralph wanted to speak to Jerry,and Denise said, not possible.
He's in Mexico.
So this information from Ralphcleared him as a person of
(27:00):
interest.
SPEAKER_01 (27:01):
So are we is is he's in Mexico.
Is he in Mexico now a pseudonymfor he's dead?
I'm just saying.
Maybe sad.
Okay.
That makes me sad.
SPEAKER_00 (27:15):
I know.
And he's just like the cutestgrandbook ever.
So is that.
Damn it.
So Detective Mo continued to dosome financial digging.
She found that the house whereJerry and Carolyn had lived had
been changed into Denise's nameand sold immediately.
Mo called the realtor, whoproved to be nothing but
(27:36):
uncooperative and never returnedany phone calls.
So thanks, thanks, no thanks.
Mo found out that, oh, shocker.
She was a friend of Denise's.
But what was even more shockingwas that Jerry seemingly turned
everything he had over to astranger.
Mo checked in with the notarythat was on the documents.
(27:57):
And the notary couldn't help butnotice that her name was spelt
incorrectly, and that wasn't herhandwriting on the documents.
When shown a picture of Denise,she said, yep, recognize her,
and that she was there oftenwith a lot of paperwork.
And during those times,paperwork is typically strewn
about the table along with thenotary pad, so it could be
possible that she, Denise,signed it.
(28:20):
And when they showed a pictureof Jerry, whose signatures were
also on the documents, thenotary said that she had never
seen the man before.
Shocker.
Investigators now believe thatthey had a clear-cut case
against Denise Goodwin, the homehealth care worker.
But there was more to the storywhen they heard from
investigators in Mexico.
It appeared that Jerry had neverever been there.
(28:42):
They had the opportunity tospeak with a groundskeeper at
the property who had workedthere for 20 years.
And when shown photos of Deniseand Jerry, he said that he had
never seen either of thembefore.
At this point, it was now sixmonths since anyone had seen
him, and all of his money andhis wife's was transferred to
Denise.
(29:03):
The case began to look less likea missing person's case and more
like a nobody homicide case.
During this time, Mary got acall from her dad, and he said,
quote, Mary, sweetie pie and Iare traveling around the
country, and we just want you toleave us alone.
End quote.
Then the call ended.
Not only was this not her dad,it was not her dad's voice.
(29:25):
And a daughter knows her dad'svoice.
SPEAKER_01 (29:27):
Yeah, they do.
And no dad's gonna say, Leave mealone, I'm off with my sweetie
pie.
No, come on.
SPEAKER_00 (29:34):
Yeah.
I know you don't know Carmen,but she's real sweetie pie.
SPEAKER_02 (29:38):
No.
SPEAKER_00 (29:39):
Mary tried to call the number back, but it was
dead.
It appeared to be a kill phoneto be used once and never again.
A phone that criminals typicallyuse.
Mary called Detective Mo andtold her about the phone call.
Mo said, I'm so sorry to sharethis, but we have reason to
believe your father may be dead.
(30:00):
At this point, there was noproof of life.
No one had heard from him sinceOctober of the previous year.
And the Missing Persons caseofficially became a nobody
homicide case.
And Denise was the person ofinterest.
SPEAKER_01 (30:12):
Oh my God, that's so sad.
SPEAKER_00 (30:16):
Yeah, this is such a sad story.
But before we get more into it,it's time for a had to do a
little extra in the end theresince I'm alive today.
(30:36):
Okay.
So okay.
So what I will share with youtoday is a brine.
Nope.
Not a brine.
SPEAKER_01 (30:45):
I mean, it is honestly a combination of brain
and spine.
I think we could call it abrine.
Oh, I love that.
I know.
I should call them and say, I'vegot save some letters.
Let's save some time.
We're gonna call this brine.
SPEAKER_00 (31:03):
It's brine.
So my brain just combined brainand spine.
SPEAKER_01 (31:07):
I love it.
I love it so much.
SPEAKER_00 (31:10):
So it's a brain-spine digital bridge.
So today we are talking aboutthis medical breakthrough.
So researchers in Switzerlandhave developed what they call a
brain-spine interface, which isa digital bridge that allows
people with severe spinal cordinjuries to walk again.
Wow.
The results were published inNature in 2023.
(31:33):
And you can read the fullarticle yourself on PubMed where
I found it under walkingnaturally after spinal cord
injury.
Da-da-da-da-da.
I guess if you want the wholething, it is walking naturally
after spinal cord injury using abrain-spine interface.
But here's how it works (31:47):
when the spinal cord is damaged, the
brain signals can't get throughto the legs.
But in this study, scientistsimplanted a set of devices, one
that records brain activity andanother that stimulates the
spinal cord.
Using wireless technology, theyessentially bypass the injury.
The brain's intent to move ispicked up by the implant,
(32:09):
decoded in real time, and thentransmitted directly to the
spinal cord stimulator, allowingthe body to execute the motion.
Wow.
Isn't that freaking cool?
SPEAKER_01 (32:19):
And it makes so much sense.
That's amazing.
Right?
Oh my gosh, I love this.
SPEAKER_00 (32:24):
One of the study's most striking cases involved a
man who had been paralyzed formore than a decade.
With the implant system, he wasable to stand, walk, and even
climb the stairs without thehelp of crutches.
Can you imagine?
I can't.
Like you haven't walked in adecade.
SPEAKER_01 (32:40):
Life altering.
This is amazing.
SPEAKER_00 (32:43):
Amazing.
And here's where it gets evenmore extraordinary.
After months of training withthe device, he actually regained
some movement even when thesystem was switched off.
SPEAKER_02 (32:52):
Wow.
unknown (32:53):
Oh my god.
SPEAKER_00 (32:55):
I just got chills.
That suggests that his nervoussystem.
I know.
It's suggested that the nervoussystem was starting to rewire
itself.
Oh my god, I got chills.
That's amazing.
Wow.
Ah, yes.
So the brain can relearn how tocarry signals that have been
dormant for years.
(33:16):
Yes.
SPEAKER_01 (33:17):
And we knew that about the auditory system, but I
mean, it's everywhere.
Obviously, in the body.
This is crazy, crazy awesome.
SPEAKER_00 (33:26):
These implications are enormous.
We are talking about technologythat could one day restore
mobility for people living withparalysis.
Not in some distance sci-fifuture, but in trials that are
happening right now.
Right meow.
Of course, this is stillexperimental, limited to a very
small number of patients, and itwill take years and years of
refinement before it's widelyavailable.
(33:47):
But the proof of concept ishere.
A brain implant can literallyreconnect the brain and the
body.
So when we talk about the futureof medicine, it's not just about
new drugs or better imagingtools.
It's about systems like these.
This is so exciting, you guys.
SPEAKER_01 (34:02):
Ah I am so excited.
SPEAKER_00 (34:05):
So again, you can find the article.
There was actually a lot ofarticles, but I just am only
referencing one here.
It was on PubMed.
So yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (34:14):
I can't get rid of my goosebumps.
I'm so excited about this.
This is a this is crazy, but itmakes sense.
I mean, yes.
Thank you for bringing thispositive side to some of this
sci-fi appearing medicalexperimentation that's going on.
This is amazing.
Thank you.
You're welcome.
Before you bring us back down.
(34:36):
Okay, back to the story.
SPEAKER_00 (34:41):
So Detective Mo called William Bill Mitchell.
And Bill is a nobody caseexpert.
He's a prosecutor in San Diego,California, who has a reputation
her reputation for leaving nostone unturned.
The evidence that he collectedfor the case showed that Denise
(35:01):
created a persona to fit herneeds.
By the time Denise Goodwinreached her late 30s, her life
looked far different than shehad hoped.
Twice divorced, she was raisinga teenage son while still living
with her mother, Helen Locke, ina rural area of Northeast, rural
area northeast of San Diego.
She worked part-time at ananimal hospital and also
(35:24):
assisted her mother's fiduciaryservices business, where she
became familiar with probatelaws, wills, and trusts.
On Helen's property lived SewardNorris, an elderly man suffering
from dementia.
Denise sometimes acted as hiscaregiver, but in 2009 she
exploited him financially.
Seward sometimes paid Goodwinabout$7,000 per month for
(35:48):
caregiver services and expenses.
Holy smokes.
By late 2008, he suffered frommoderate to severe dementia.
And in 2009, November, Denisecontacted his life insurer and
requested a surrender of theaccount.
After she represented herself onthe telephone as either his
daughter or granddaughter, theinsurer mailed a$44,562.39 check
(36:15):
to Denise.
She deposited the check into hisbank account, but guys, of
course, only after adding herown name to the account.
She then used the money for herown benefit.
This scheme gave Denise a tastefor exploiting older men.
At 44, just months afterSeward's death, she posed as a
(36:38):
74-year-old widow on seniordating websites and even placed
an ad on SugarDaddyforme.com,claiming she wanted to find a
man between 72 and 88 who couldmeet her financial needs.
When her online deceptionsfailed, she turned to employment
as a caregiver.
(36:59):
In September of 2010, sheapplied for the position with
the Home Healthcare Agency,asking specifically to work with
hospice assignments.
Denise's mother had a greatrelationship with the agency, so
she was her reference, but ofcourse she didn't disclose their
relationship.
Her mother even made her fakecertificates saying she was a
caretaker and a fiduciary.
(37:24):
So that that's like what at thebeginning when I'm like, this
case is different because it'slike she's not actually medical,
she just lied about beingmedical.
But like her mom, her mom helpedher.
Probably with this.
Because Denise was like, heymama, look, I got all this
$44,000.
And then mom was probably like,shit.
(37:47):
So let's get some more.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (37:50):
So that's why she made her a diploma from the
university, right?
So that is that what you meant?
SPEAKER_00 (37:56):
Oh, I haven't got there yet.
But but yes.
Oh yeah.
So okay.
So she did make her acertificate that she was a
caretaker and a fiduciary.
So she made Denise a diplomafrom the California State
University, Fullerton, forcompletion of a certificate in
professional fiduciarymanagement for conservators.
She was not bonded.
She was not even trained incaregiving.
(38:18):
And this is how she earned herfirst placement into the home of
Carolyn and Gerald Rayborne.
SPEAKER_01 (38:24):
So mom's complicit.
Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (38:26):
Right?
SPEAKER_01 (38:27):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (38:27):
Okay.
And now that I'm thinking moreabout this, I'm like, I never
saw anything about the momgetting in trouble.
SPEAKER_01 (38:36):
Yeah, that's BS.
I mean.
Right?
This is crazy.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (38:43):
So not only was Bill Mitchell an expert in nobody
homicide cases, he was also afraud attorney.
So he knows how to look into allthe banking information and
financial paper trails.
When you follow the money infinancial crimes, financial
documents and paper don't lie,he said.
He had found the sale of Jerry'shouse resulted in nearly$351,000
(39:06):
of profit, which went into atrust fund account that Denise
had set up in her own name.
Denise then bought a house, twocondominiums, and some land.
Her realtor was questioned andthey learned that Denise shared
it was her plan to buy propertyto rent out while she lived in
Costa Rica.
One of her condominiums alreadyhad renters, Tony and Jennifer
(39:28):
Gonzalez.
They were offered the home andeven a car to use for super
cheap.
Investigators learned that Tonywas working for Denise and would
take care of the properties thatshe owned.
They believed that he must beinvolved somehow.
They just weren't sure how.
And so when they looked into hisphone records, it became
clearer.
The call that was originallyplaced to Chris from a Carmen
(39:51):
was placed near the Gonzalezresidence.
And he was now also a person ofinterest.
And so they got a search warrantfor his home.
In April 2011, investigatorswent to Tony's house with the
search warrant.
And he started sharingeverything that had that he was
doing with Denise Goodwin.
He said when they met they wereboth actually homeless and that
(40:13):
she was very nice.
And when he when Denise hadfound out that his wife was
disabled, she wanted to do stuffto help them.
And according to Denise, she hadbought some properties and she
needed someone to help her withinterviewing renters and general
care.
So, you know, she didn't have tobe bothered with that kind of
stuff.
Of course, with a wife and twokids, perfect rent, how could
(40:33):
someone turn this opportunitydown?
And Tony was blown away that hewas now being looked at for
potential involvement in murdercase.
He told authorities that upuntil that point, he had only
ever gotten a ticket in hislife.
SPEAKER_02 (40:46):
What?
SPEAKER_00 (40:47):
I know.
Tony was desperate to clear hisname, and he shared that Jerry
didn't run off and get marriedlike they were told, that the
phone call from the womanfabricated to be Carmen was
voiced by his wife Jennifer.
He shared with investigatorsthat Denise had told him that
Mr.
Rayborn and his new lady friendwere trying to establish a new
life together and that theywanted his kids to leave them
(41:09):
alone.
So he asked Denise, or I'msorry, so Denise asked them to
make the call because Deniseclaimed that Jerry was like, Can
you please call my kids and justpretend to be Carmen and leave
us alone?
And she was like, Well, no, yourkids will recognize my voice.
I can't do that.
So then she asked Tony, like,would Jennifer be willing to do
(41:32):
it?
Because they'll recognize myvoice.
Um, so they didn't really thinkanything of it at the time, but
looking back at Yikes red flag,because if Carmen was real, why
wouldn't Carmen just call?
SPEAKER_01 (41:46):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (41:47):
And so looking back, Tony was like, she clearly
didn't want her fingerprints onthe phone.
He told them that Denise was theone behind the call, and so his
name was cleared, and that'sthat's great.
But just red flags be a flyingeverywhere.
So investigators were like, weneed to start looking into phone
(42:09):
recordings, specifically nowrecording to the bank to
withdraw the money.
And in listening to the call,they found out that she wasn't
able to get past the securityquestions.
Jerry, who was grief-strickenand vulnerable after loss of
Carolyn, fell under herinfluence.
The records recorded callsrevealed that the day after
Carolyn's death, Jerry signed aquick claim deed giving Denise
(42:33):
ability to sell his house.
A week later, he made hersuccessor trustee of his estate,
granting her authority if hebecame incapacitated or died.
Through their joint account, shethen had access to his$3,000 a
month pension, and she alsoforged checks in his name.
Denise stole more than$600,000from Jerry.
(42:53):
Ugh.
An 89-year-old man who wasgrieving the loss of his wife.
While all of this is sick anddisgusting, it doesn't even
bring forth criminal charges,unfortunately.
It's crazy.
So investigators got a searchwarrant for Denise's home in
Valley Center.
(43:13):
I don't know if you guys couldtell.
I was kind of tripping up onwhat I was reading because I was
like, about the phone thing.
Because I'm I know, but I didn'twrite in here.
When Denise brought the burnerphone to Tony and Jennifer's
house, she clearly did not wantto touch the phone.
She brought with her anenvelope.
And after Jennifer was done withthe phone call, she just like
held the envelope open and hadJennifer slide the phone in
(43:37):
there.
So her fingerprints would noteven be on the phone.
And so Tony was like, Well,looking back, she didn't even
want to touch the phone, but atthe time I didn't think anything
of it.
So anyway, if you thought mybrain fell out, it didn't.
It was just working on twodifferent tracks, and now we're
back to one.
So investigators conductedinterviews and searched Denise's
(44:00):
property.
They noted that part of theground on her property had
recently been disturbed.
And she was like, Oh, I recentlyburied one of my horses that
passed away.
SPEAKER_01 (44:08):
Oh, a horse.
Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_00 (44:10):
Yeah.
She did have horses, but theywere like weird.
Authorities brought a backhoe tothe property and dug up that
spot only to find nothing.
No body, no horse, just nothing.
So I'm like, then why was therea hole dug here?
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (44:26):
Because she moved it after they came on to explain.
Yeah.
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (44:31):
No body, no crime, right?
Mm-hmm.
They found in her search historyon her computer that she looked
up overdosing on the painkillerDarvaset.
This medication was acombination of opioid analysis.
So sorry.
I like feel hiccups coming onyou guys, and I really hope that
does not happen because that'sgoing to be an editing nightmare
(44:52):
for Tilly's.
SPEAKER_01 (44:54):
Yeah.
Let's get through it.
Do you want me to scare you?
SPEAKER_00 (44:58):
I know I'm like.
SPEAKER_01 (44:59):
Do you want to record upside down?
SPEAKER_00 (45:00):
Like if I speak it into existence, maybe it won't
happen.
SPEAKER_01 (45:04):
We got an analgesic.
We got a hypocrisy and a seatemit of Finn.
SPEAKER_00 (45:09):
Yeah.
It was all recalled in 2010 dueto serious and potentially fatal
heart risks.
While at Denise's residence,Detective Mo received a call
from the financial detective whoalerted her that Denise had a
flight out of the countryscheduled for the next morning
with her son.
Hmm.
(45:32):
Oh weird.
Are they just going on vacation?
Sure.
They didn't yet have enoughevidence for the murder case,
but they thought they had enoughto charge her with stealing the
victim's car because Jerry's carwas found at her son's high
school.
So that would at the very leastprevent her from fleeing the
country.
And they decided to arrest heras she attempted to board the
(45:52):
flight, which I loved.
Like so dramatic.
I like that too.
It's like, haha, no, you're notgoing on your flight.
Give me your he.
Can you imagine you're like, oh,I've always got it.
And they're like, think again.
SPEAKER_01 (46:09):
Love that.
SPEAKER_00 (46:10):
On July 12, 2012, both Denise and Michael Goodwin
were arrested.
After a month in jail, she wassurprisingly moved to a maximum
security prison.
She was in the dark about anynew charges.
In a phone call to her husband,which when I read this, I was
like, now she has a husband.
Is it a third husband?
I don't know.
Whatever.
(46:30):
In a phone call to a personcalled her husband.
She was heard crying and sayingshe didn't know what was going
on.
And her husband said, Oh, youhaven't heard?
She was like, No, what's goingon?
And he told her, The chargeshave been filed, and they're
charging you with murder in thefirst degree with special
circumstances.
(46:50):
Oh my God, she cried.
Did they find him?
unknown (46:56):
Uh uh.
SPEAKER_00 (46:57):
What?
Hello.
SPEAKER_01 (47:00):
Hello, guilty lady.
SPEAKER_00 (47:06):
Searches were completed to try and find
Gerald's body, butunfortunately, they were never
able to locate his body.
There was no cause of death, nocrime scene, no coroner report,
and the stakes were high in anobody case.
Denise's trial began in lateAugust 2014 and stretched into
October.
All of the audio recordings wereused in court, including her,
(47:28):
did they find him?
in the phone call with herhusband.
Jerry's grown children andgrandchildren took turns giving
their impact statements to thecourt.
With his voice breaking, his sonclosed his statement by saying,
quote, My father did not deserveto be murdered, end quote.
Mary, his daughter, gripped thecourt with her eloquent speech.
(47:49):
She first humanized her father,making Judge Rogers smile as she
described her how her fatherloved to eat fish sandwiches,
took Jack Lalani, Jack Lalancare of his body.
I don't know, it must be verygood care of your body.
And that he was so compulsivethat he picked up leaves each
day by hand, taught her how tofloat on her back, and walked
(48:11):
her down the aisle on herwedding day.
Later, she turned to herfather's absence and said that
she knew her she knew her fatherwas dead when she did not
receive a birthday card fromhim.
She went on to describe thevisions that she had of her
father's last moments, whichhave tormented her and destroyed
her health.
She has nightmares of where herfather's body might be buried.
(48:33):
She detailed the beautifulburial their family should have
had, the music that would havelifted her body father's body to
heaven, and the military honorsher father would have been
given, and that he had hadearned as a World War II
veteran.
In a gesture of mercy, sheturned towards Denise Goodwin
and told her that she forgivesher, stating that this is,
(48:54):
quote, not beyond restorationfrom a loving God, end quote,
but that she must return themost sacred of things that she
has taken, her father's body.
In closing, she asked the courtnot to judge her father by the
few years remaining, but by the89 years he had lived in which
he was loved by his family.
After four days of jurydeliberation, which I'm like,
(49:16):
four days, guys?
I guess like it was mostlycircumstantial, but Denise was
found guilty of first-degreemurder with the special
circumstances of financial gain,along with caretaker theft from
an elder, fraudulentappropriation by a trustee,
grand theft, and forgery.
She was guilty on all 11 counts.
(49:37):
On January 30th, 2015, she wassentenced to life without
parole.
Deputy District Attorney BillMitchell called her a quote,
thief disguised as a churchgoerand a killer disguised as a
caregiver, end quote.
Though her defense admitted shecommitted fraud and theft, they
(50:00):
argued murder was beyond her andsought a reduction to second
degree murder, which was denied,luckily.
Before sentencing Denise, JudgeRogers said that there were some
moments that were not big enoughto hold everything that goes
into them, and that this was oneof those moments.
To the Rayborn family, heexpressed that he was profoundly
(50:20):
sorry that a human life wastaken for financial gain.
He then pronounced the sentenceto the family.
It was what they had asked forwas the life without the
possibility of parole.
And Mary had said, I don't thinkthat she knew how smart my dad
was with money.
I think that he confronted herand threatened to turn her into
the police.
She said, I've never had afuneral for my own father, and
(50:42):
it's hard to find closure whenthere's no body.
I still cry for him.
To this day, the circumstancesof Gerald Rayborn's death and
the location of his body remainunknown because Denise is a
fucking loser.
Rotting in prison, but will notgive that to the family.
SPEAKER_01 (51:03):
Wow.
I mean where does she have tolose?
She's already in there for life.
At least so obviously shedoesn't feel any remorse, or she
would at least do this one thingthat it doesn't it's not like it
gives them closure, but it givesthem some peace knowing that
their dad is buried and where togo to you know visit his grave
(51:31):
and like I don't know.
That's just so cruel.
It's so cruel in so many waysbecause you know, this is a true
crime in healthcare podcast.
I just feel like when people arehired to provide care, medical
care, they ought to be held toan even higher expectations than
(51:56):
you know, your painter or yourplumber, right?
So not only that, sheingratiated herself to the
extent where they were like welook, you know, before the mom
died, I forget what her namewas, but his wife died.
Yeah, they they were just likeso so what what was this her
(52:17):
plan all along, do you think?
To ingratiate herself?
SPEAKER_00 (52:21):
And what a sociopath because they were talking about
like trying to also try her forlike accelerating Caroline's
death.
SPEAKER_01 (52:30):
Can you imagine?
SPEAKER_00 (52:32):
And like she already has life without parole, and and
like maybe that would help thefamily find some sort of
closure.
I don't know if that would addinsult to injury.
SPEAKER_01 (52:39):
So she might have had something to do with
Carolyn's death as well.
That's good.
They were like, yeah.
I mean, she ingratiated herselfto the point where she could
mask her true personalitybecause let's face it, if you're
somebody who's, you know,masking yourself as a healthcare
provider with you know, ulteriormotive of taking your money,
you're not a you're not someonewho's an empath.
(53:01):
Um this is crazy to me.
It's so disgusting.
And it makes me wonder how canwe trust anybody?
How do you know?
And her poor children.
unknown (53:10):
I know.
SPEAKER_00 (53:12):
And now that this was brought up during me reading
this, and I never thought aboutit before, but why the heck did
her mom not get in trouble?
So her son did get charged withautomobile theft or like grand
theft auto or something.
But like Helen's got in troublefor making these fake
certificates.
What?
SPEAKER_01 (53:31):
She wouldn't have been able to get the job that
she did if she hadn't leveragedher mom's position and her mom
hadn't falsified records.
So I yeah, I feel like that's amissed opportunity right there,
too.
SPEAKER_00 (53:43):
I agree.
Ah so again, this wasn't likesuper medically, but she was
pretending to be medical and shewas just a scoundrel.
SPEAKER_01 (53:50):
Yeah, no, it's important.
It's important for our listenersto know uh not all healthcare
providers are believable or havealtruistic intentions, which is
scary as well.
SPEAKER_00 (54:04):
Which I guess we have talked about plenty of that
just have walls plastered withfake certificates and degrees.
SPEAKER_01 (54:11):
Yeah.
Check degrees.
I think it's a lot easier now tocheck credentials than it has
been in the past.
And I think that awareness isimportant for listeners,
especially when you're lookingat your loved ones and you want
to make sure that their careproviders, no matter how much
your loved one likes and getsalong with the care provider,
people can mask their trueintent.
(54:34):
So make sure you're checkingqualifications.
I mean, because that was onething, I guess, that they could
have put not no victim at all.
But that's the one thing thatshe didn't have was actual
qualification.
SPEAKER_00 (54:48):
So and I'm like, what if this had been like
again?
I'm sure she's thought aboutthis nine billion times, but
like, what if I just told him,like, no, I'm coming out to move
you home now?
Like, don't stay there thewinter.
Yeah.
But it made sense that likewinter in San Diego is gonna be
a lot nicer than winter inKansas City.
SPEAKER_01 (55:08):
So it's just the stuff that happened that was out
of character for him, especiallyI was probably too late by the
time she didn't get a birthdaycard, but like you know, you you
know your family, you know yourparent, and something was amiss.
And it's just tragic.
I can't believe that somehowthey couldn't offer life in
(55:33):
prison as the plea deal, interms of like, you can tell us
where he is, or you can have thedeath penalty.
Yeah, you know.
SPEAKER_00 (55:42):
But then she would probably just be like, fine,
give me the death penalty.
I don't want to live in jailforever, and I'm not telling
you.
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (55:48):
Well, I don't want to go there, but I don't know.
It's just absurd, like justgiving the family that.
Absolutely.
Well, thank you.
That was a fascinating case, andI appreciate you bringing it up.
Well done.
SPEAKER_00 (56:04):
Well done, Amanda.
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(57:08):
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SPEAKER_01 (57:11):
I use I'm sorry, I'm laughing.
Coffee, you obviously didn'thave any because you're yawning
your way through this ad.
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Don't you guys go to bed at 8o'clock now?
SPEAKER_01 (57:31):
Well, you do if we have to get up at four or
something like you do.
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Carry on, girl.
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Stay suspicious at strongcoffeecompany.com for 20%
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Yay! Oh gosh, I just saw ournames.
Oh, I was like, my eyes skippedto the medical mishap, and then
I saw our names, and I was like,oh gosh, what's happening?
SPEAKER_01 (57:56):
Medical mishap.
Who wants to read the medicalmishap?
Okay, because you hiccuping inyawning.
My body is doing so.
Oh girl, we're getting throughit.
All right, but this is good.
We're gonna end on a positivenote here.
Today's medical mishap comesfrom Sam, who writes, Dr.
(58:17):
Amanda and Dr.
Jenna.
I want you both to know that Ilove your podcast and your
friendship as well as your easybanter.
I feel like you are friends andwould love to have friends I
would love to have over forcoffee or margaritas.
SPEAKER_00 (58:32):
We love those things.
SPEAKER_01 (58:33):
I like the juxtaposition there.
It's like, yes.
SPEAKER_00 (58:37):
We'll start with coffee and end with margaritas,
okay?
SPEAKER_01 (58:40):
We're friends.
That's yeah.
We are friends.
Alrighty.
Okay, so Sam says, Most of all,I love I love the content that
raises awareness abouthealthcare issues, all with
compassion for the victims andan eye on educating us
listeners.
We appreciate you.
I know you've had a colonoscopymishap on the show before, but I
(59:00):
can't help but share mine.
I mean, never enough colonoscopymishaps, right?
So Sam goes on to say, I had myfirst colonoscopy scheduled.
Everyone warned me that the prepwas the worst part.
True.
They weren't kidding.
Two days of jello and clearbroth, followed by what I can
only describe as industrialstrength laxatives.
(59:24):
That seems extra stringent.
I think these days it's just oneday, but anyway, who knows?
By the time I got to the clinic,I felt like a balloon with all
the air let out.
My spouse drove me, and as wewalked in, they whispered,
remember, dignity is optional.
I love you, spouse.
They're like, I'm just gonnamess with you just a little
(59:46):
extra.
The nurse gave me one of thoseopen back gowns.
I tied it in three differentways before realizing there was
no way to avoid showing theworld my backside.
As I shuffled down the hall,clutching.
It shut.
I swear, I look like a Victorianghost haunting the GI ward.
Another patient saw mestruggling and said, First time
(01:00:08):
I nodded.
They winked and said, You'll befine.
Just don't moon theanesthesiologist.
SPEAKER_00 (01:00:14):
Well, not the frequent flyer giving commentary
down the hall.
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (01:00:19):
Thanks, dude.
So they wheeled me into theprocedure room.
The anesthesiologist said, Okay,count backwards from 10.
Instead of numbers, I decided torecite Beyonce lyrics.
According to the nurse, I got asfar as all the single ladies
before I passed out.
That's way more fun thancounting.
And when I woke, I exactly.
(01:00:42):
I'm gonna start.
Yeah.
So you want 10, 9, 8, 7, 6, 7.
I don't think so.
Right?
When I woke up in recovery, myspouse told me the entire staff
had been seen along.
So they probably took it beyondall the single ladies.
I felt great, maybe too great.
The sedation is no joke.
I sat up, pointed dramaticallyat my spouse, and declared, We
(01:01:05):
must go to Olive Gardenimmediately.
Unlimited breadsticks await.
No, I want those.
The nurse gently reminded methat maybe Fettuccine Alfredo
wasn't the best first meal postprocedure.
I counter argued that pasta isbasically clear liquid if you
squint hard enough.
(01:01:25):
Apparently, I lost that debate.
As we were leaving, I realized Istill had my hospital socks on,
the grippy ones.
I insisted they were a souvenirand refused to give them back.
My spouse said I started out ofthe clinic like a catwalk model,
holding up the socks like theywere a prize on the prices
right.
To this day, whenever I put on apair of fuzzy socks at home, my
(01:01:47):
spouse bows and says, And theaward for the best
post-colonoscopy performancegoes to I love your spouse.
Bam.
Oh my gosh, you guys are socute.
Was it embarrassing?
Sure.
But honestly, laughter made thewhole ordeal bearable.
Colonoscopies save lives.
And if my lasting memory isBeyonce lyrics and sock
(01:02:10):
modeling, love Sam.
Love, love, love.
Sam, we love you.
Oh my god.
That was amazing.
Such a great story.
SPEAKER_00 (01:02:18):
Thank you so much for sharing that.
And you're so good at writing,like I can picture that entire
story happening.
SPEAKER_01 (01:02:26):
I know.
I know.
It's like something on a sitcom.
I absolutely love it.
SPEAKER_00 (01:02:33):
All right, Jenna.
What can we expect to hear nextweek?
SPEAKER_01 (01:02:38):
Well, next week we're gonna cover Dr.
Conrad Murray and the death ofMichael Jackson.
Ever heard of him?
SPEAKER_00 (01:02:48):
No, who's that?
I'm kidding.
I'm kidding.
You don't know who I was, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (01:03:02):
Girl.
So until then, dumb is the beat.
Subscribe, subscribe or followDoctoring the Truth wherever you
enjoy your podcasts for storiesthat shock, intrigue, and
educate.
Trust, after all, is a delicatething.
You can text us directly on ourwebsite at doctoringthetruth at
(01:03:22):
buzzsprout.com or email us yourown medical mishaps at
Doctoringthe Truth at Gmail.
Be sure to follow us onInstagram at Doctoring the Truth
Podcast and on Facebook atDoctoring the Truth.
We are on TikTok for now atDoctoring the Truth and at
oddpot.
Well, I mean, you know, unlessTikTok is supposed to again.
(01:03:43):
I'm just saying.
Oh it might.
I never know what's going on.
There's apparently anotherround, another round of
wondering what's happening.
But honestly, you guys, wereally, really would love to
hear a comment from you.
You know, that would be a gift.
My birthday is coming up soon.
Can you just write somethingabout us positive?
(01:04:04):
If you don't have anything niceto say, don't.
But please, uh it would be sucha gift if you would rate and
review us so you know we canfeel good about ourselves and
what we're doing so that we canbring you more content next
week.
Until then, stay safe and staysuspicious.
Suspicious.
SPEAKER_00 (01:04:25):
Goodbye.
SPEAKER_01 (01:04:26):
Bye.
unknown (01:04:27):
Bye.
SPEAKER_00 (01:04:28):
I swear to god, I hope that audio from earlier
when I forgot my mic works.
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