July 21, 2024 • 20 mins
In this episode Leon from SHV talks about embedding a whole school approach to Relationships and Sexuality Education. SHV are working in partnership with a secondary school in Melbourne’s Northwestern growth corridor. Leon unpacks some of the challenges and learnings from working with a large, new, multicultural school.
Resources:
Some supporting policies to inform a Relationships and Sexuality Education program are: Child Safe Standards; Sexuality and Consent Education Policy; LGBTIQA+ support policy. See Strategic Partnerships Program. More information about SHV @ shvic.org.au.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
This podcast was created on Wurundjeri land.
It contains discussion about adult topics.
You can use your judgment if you want
young people to listen.
Welcome to Doing It.
This is a podcast made by Sexual Health
Victoria.
We run a whole lot of education programs
for communities and medical professionals across Victoria.
We also run sexual health clinics in the
(00:20):
city and Box Hill in Melbourne.
My name is Anne and I'm part of
the Sexual Health Victoria Schools and Community team.
We run classes for all year levels on
bodies, growing up, puberty, sex, reproduction, relationships.
This podcast is for parents and carers of
school aged children so we can share what
goes on in a relationships and sexuality education
class and help support these conversations at home.
(00:44):
Today I'll be talking to my colleague Leon
who is leading a project to embed relationships
and sexuality education at Elevation College.
Elevation is a new secondary school in Melbourne
in the Northwest Growth Corridor.
Elevation College is on Wurundjeri Woi Wurrung land.
(01:04):
There are over 900 students at Elevation and
they have a large multicultural cohort.
The Wellbeing and Leadership team has identified the
benefit of relationships and sexuality education program but
also recognize that there are some challenges to
get this started.
This episode will unpack some of the key
challenges as well as address some key topics
that we feel it is important for all
(01:25):
educators to be aware of in order to
have safe inclusive conversations within the classroom.
We thought that this might be helpful to
hear for any other school looking to embed
a whole school approach to relationships and sexuality
education and parents who might want to learn
more.
Thanks Leon for talking to me about this
(01:47):
project at Elevation College.
No worries, thanks for having me.
I would like to start by just unpacking
what are some of the challenges to building
a whole school approach to relationships and sexuality
education.
I think that the general challenges that we
face when doing a whole school approach for
RSC is getting everybody on board and in
(02:09):
the same kind of mindset and on the
same page.
So trying to get parent-carer community, the
school community and then the students themselves on
the same track is really difficult across every
topic but sometimes especially with relationships and sexuality
(02:29):
education.
Working on this specific project with Elevation College,
the added trick is that they have such
a diverse group of students there from linguistic,
cultural, religious backgrounds that you then are trying
to meet the needs of all these different
groups in a setting where they all come
(02:49):
together.
So it's really hard.
So having to communicate with all the groups,
communicating in a way that works best for
them and finding time for it all because
parents and so trying to get them all
at the right time to talk about it
is really tricky.
(03:10):
But yeah, communicating is the key.
Are there any particular topics that you've noticed
are barriers for this school in particular?
I feel like RSC has been taught there
for like since their inception and the RSC
curriculum they have in the HPE subject area
is really thorough and clear.
(03:31):
They teach a lot of the topics that
we teach which is great to see because
not a lot of schools are doing that.
I think that because of the diversity in
backgrounds, one of the topics they struggle with
at times are things like gender, sexuality, which
again are topics that we've noticed a lot
of schools struggling with across Victoria.
But I think just talking with some of
(03:53):
these young people about sex, about bodies, about
identity is a tricky point for them as
a school and for us going into the
school.
How can parents and carers be brought along
for this conversation and why is that important?
So in terms of how they can be
brought along, I mean with this project we
offered a parent information night, a parent carer
(04:14):
information night.
So that was a great opportunity to get
in the room with these people to talk
about their young people and what they might
be learning.
But it was like a lovely and rich
discussion of people agreeing that they all want
the same thing for these young people for
them to be safe, for them to be
happy, for them to be healthy.
So I think getting parents and carers in
(04:36):
the room is the first step.
But I also know that from the kind
of survey data we collected, a lot of
people sometimes prefer written data as well, sorry
written information as well, especially if they want
to translate it into their own language.
The reason it's important that we do this
is that, well number one, it's important that
people know what young people are learning about
so they can continue the conversations at home.
(04:57):
But specifically again for the young people we're
working with at Elevation, they are often first
generation in Australia, which would also make them
first generation getting educated in Australia.
And so they go to school and they
are surrounded by a culture that might be
different to what they're experiencing at home.
And it puts them into this kind of
position of having these two forces kind of
(05:20):
telling them what to think or what to
do or how to be.
And then they've got to work out where
they sit within that.
And so the term that we've spoken about
with Kano, who was on the podcast before,
is the third culture.
So they have got their home culture, their
school culture and they kind of work out,
well, where do I sit with all of
this?
And that's really a tricky spot for these
(05:41):
young people to be in.
And it's a really tricky spot to I
think kind of work with them through as
well.
I think when we did the parent session,
the teachers really chipped in because they were
noticing that young people really want to do
the right thing by their parents and carers
and want to fit into that culture and
(06:02):
observe that culture and do the right thing,
what they perceive is the right thing.
And that can be really confusing if they
think they're being presented conflicting information.
Helping young people address that bridge and helping
parents and carers understand that we're not replacing
what they're doing at home.
(06:22):
It's really important to young people.
It's important to the school, but bringing them
all along for discussions about safety and making
it safe for everyone.
I think that something that we have done
differently with this specific project is that we
have used a slide that we've traditionally used
when talking to parents and carers about the
fact that we're not there to replace values.
(06:43):
So we're making it very clear to the
young people and to the parent and carer
community and to the school community, we're not
there to replace values.
We're part of the picture of helping these
young people work out where they sit within
the world.
And we're just presenting them with facts and
information about the world around them.
And I think that's been helpful with the
conversations across the board.
We have identified a few key topics that
(07:05):
are really useful for all staff to be
across, even if the bulk of the delivery
of the content, like you said, is within
the health and PE curriculum.
So those few topics are LGBTIQA plus inclusion,
consent and online sexual content, which comes up
a lot across all areas of the school.
(07:26):
So let's have a talk about those three
things.
Fear of discussion around LGBTIQA inclusion is a
barrier.
So how can that be approached with elevation
or with any school?
So I think that what we have learnt
through, again, this specific project is taking it
slowly.
So spending time to talk about what values
(07:50):
or like kind of what are the core
beliefs we're looking for?
So things like respect, things like being accepting
of other people, things like celebrating diversity, some
core values that are across all areas of
life.
And then bringing that conversation back to that
includes LGBTIQA plus people.
(08:11):
And so it's about kind of saying here
are the values, we understand those, not usually
any argument there when you're talking about respect
or understanding of difference.
And then how can we tie that into
a community where sometimes people might struggle with
that concept of bringing that community into maybe
their culture or faith that doesn't necessarily have
clear acceptance of those people.
(08:34):
The other thing that I have realised through
the discussions and through working with the community
is that I think sometimes people think that
we're going into schools or that other organisations
like us are going into schools and saying
this is how you are a gay person
or this is how you are a lesbian,
which is not what we're doing.
We're not there to give the how-to.
We're there to say this is what is
(08:56):
in the world around you.
These are the people that are in the
world around you.
And so I think it helps when we're
really explicit with the community about what we're
talking about and how we talk about it.
Otherwise, I think fear takes over and they
assume the worst about what we might be
talking about or how we're going to talk
to young people about it.
(09:16):
But that was just an observation that I
kind of went, oh yeah, I can see
how it might seem like it's a how
-to when it's really just a, this is
what's in the world.
And all people need to be safe and
supported.
Another thing that came up when talking to
parents was sort of an agreement that yes,
this is a community that might need extra
support, the LGBTIQ community, but that doesn't exist
(09:41):
within our community.
So it's a really gentle discussion to say,
maybe it does.
And that's up to you as to how
you reconcile that, but this is in the
world.
Hmm.
Yeah.
And I think the difficulty is that some
of these discussions are probably happening for the
first time when we're standing there with them
or when it comes up at school.
(10:03):
And so it is a gentle and slow
approach, probably a lot slower than I initially
thought it was going to be.
So that has been a good learning moment,
but I think for other people that are
looking at starting a whole school approach, especially
in communities that might have difficulties with some
of the topics, it's about going slow and
(10:24):
coming back to the core values that are
there.
What should all staff understand about consent?
That it is not just about sexual activity.
Consent is in all areas of life.
So when we talk about consent with young
people, we're always talking about it in the
appropriate way for their age and stage, but
it covers all things.
(10:46):
Can I borrow your pen?
Can I touch your laptop?
Can I borrow your phone?
All these kinds of things are all consent
discussions of allowing someone or giving someone permission.
Because we're working with a high school, the
discussions around consent need to be more explicit
about sexual consent and consent within relationships as
well.
So I think it's important to come back
to what we talk about as an organization
(11:08):
about ethical and legal consent.
So legal consent is there.
The consent laws exist.
They're different per state.
Everyone should try to get across them as
best they can, even though they're confusing at
times.
But then the ethical consent is, are you
doing the right thing by this person?
Are they comfortable in this situation?
Do you have their best interests at heart?
And that should hopefully lead people down a
(11:31):
positive consensual path.
But I think that the important thing for
educators and parents and carers to know is
they should have an understanding of the legal
framework.
So 16 is the age of consent in
Victoria.
There are stipulations for young people between 12
and 16.
There are stipulations between 16 and 18.
And it's a different age of consent when
(11:52):
it comes to sharing sexual images.
But it's important that they're across it because
young people, they get stressed and they freak
out and they feel like they've done the
wrong thing and that the police are going
to come and take them away because they
don't understand the laws.
Yeah.
And they generally don't want to get in
trouble.
They don't want to get in legal trouble.
And they might think if consent is discussed
(12:13):
just within the age of consent context, that
that is maybe a guideline for what's culturally
acceptable.
And that's not the case or that that's
an expectation or what they should do.
And that's not the case either.
So having the legal framework of, yeah, we
(12:34):
need to follow the law, but you also
need to do what's right for you, which
for some people might be sex in marriage,
or for some people it might be only
sex in a love relationship.
But that's going to be different for everyone.
Yeah.
I think that numbers can be stressful.
So that's why we're going to talk about
what's right for you and what's right for
your family.
If that's part of the discussion as well,
(12:55):
like where does it all sit with you?
We know that issues around sexual content online
come up for teaching staff a lot.
What information does staff need to know about
this?
I think the first part is that sexual
content online is part of the way that
young people experience their sexuality.
It's a part of their lives.
(13:17):
And for them, we know from research that
there's not a clear delineation between real world
and online world.
For them, it's all one and the same
because that's where they spend their time.
Once you have that understanding, I think it
helps to know what kind of rules and
ideas apply to the online world because they're
the same as the real world.
So we still want people to be respectful.
We still want to avoid discrimination.
(13:39):
We still want people to be supportive of
each other there as well.
When it comes to things like sexual content
online, if we're talking about pornography or sharing
sexual images and stuff like that, as long
as they're again acting ethically and acting within
the confines of the law, that's going to
be okay.
And for young people, the message that I'm
often sharing with them is that the police
(14:02):
aren't going to come and kick down your
door if you've looked at pornography.
The law states it's illegal for them to
purchase it, but it's not illegal for them
to view it.
And I think young people need to know
that because the shame and the guilt that
they feel mean they can't talk to adults
about it.
And if they can't talk to adults about
it, then they can't have any support if
they need it.
And so we've got to try to break
down that barrier.
(14:22):
But I think there's ways to talk about
it with young people.
Yeah.
So it's a real barrier to help-seeking.
If those are perceived as bad, wrong, inappropriate,
which is usually the word they get, illegal,
then they can't get help.
I think most people on board with teaching
young people digital literacy skills, I think it's
(14:44):
really important that part of that digital literacy
framework is explicit conversations about sexual content online,
because we teach them about not bullying, not
discriminating, how to stay safe, don't share your
personal information.
But we don't often have those explicit discussions
of, if you access sexual content online, just
make sure you have these things in mind
about consent, about safety, and letting them know
(15:06):
that they can come and talk to their
trusted adult, their teacher, their educator about it
as well is a really important part, because
time and time again, it comes back to
shame and guilt around accessing sexual content online.
And it can make a liar out of
a parent or an educator if they're saying
it's illegal to share a picture.
And then a young person does share a
(15:28):
picture and the police don't come and arrest
them immediately.
They might dismiss any other information coming from
the parent or carer as untruthful or unrealistic.
So to be really truthful about what the
law does and what ethics are, and that
they can come and get help if they
need to.
I think that the online world is one
(15:49):
where people need to continue to feel comfortable
to say, I don't know, I need to
do some more research because it's changing so
quickly.
It's hard to keep up with things.
There's a lot going on with people already.
So I think it's okay to say, I
don't know, let's find out together.
Let's do a bit of research.
So what are some responses if there are
questions about starting off a program with relationships
(16:10):
and sexuality education at a school?
What are some positive responses and supports?
And who are the people at school that
really need to support the program?
In terms of the who, the biggest players
that need to be involved are the leadership
team.
So having a leadership team on board means
that the parents and carers know that that
(16:32):
is the direction that the school is going
to take because leadership are taking that direction.
But it also means that staff members feel
supported.
If they know that the person or people
at the top are going to be the
ones that are going to back them in
these discussions, then I think it makes them
feel a lot more comfortable having the discussions
in the first place.
In terms of other supports, there are lots
of policies that support the work that we
(16:55):
do because it's something that is mandated in
Victoria to be done.
And we can link those policies in the
show notes as well.
And what are some positive responses if there's
challenges to the content or questions around why
the content is in the school?
We know that from research that parents and
carers are in support of RSE being delivered
(17:16):
in schools.
We know that there's a desire for it.
Even though there's often a loud minority that
talks about not wanting it there, the majority
actually says they do want it there.
So that's one positive thing that the research
points to.
We also know that young people want to
learn about this stuff.
We have research that says very explicitly what
they want to learn and how they want
to learn about it.
(17:37):
And they often want to learn in more
detail than is probably provided to them.
They want to know the how and the
why and the what of these situations.
And so it's important that we can deliver
that to them.
And we just want to make sure that
we're, as we keep coming back to, keeping
young people safe.
And to be safe, they need to know
about everything that's going on for them.
(17:59):
And so if we can give them a
little bit of information, a bit of a
springboard, that's going to help them.
And I think that it's just like in
terms of keeping it positive, it's always coming
back to the common point.
What we want and what you may want,
this other person, is usually the same thing.
It's about safety for young people.
(18:19):
What's your advice for any school looking to
embed a whole school approach to RSE?
Take it slowly.
Take your time.
And really try to think about how you
can make it relevant to your school community.
So make it your own.
Because RSE, there are some things that are
applicable for all people and that we have
to teach and talk about.
(18:40):
But there are ways to make it a
bit more individualized for that school community.
And that will, I think, make sure it
stays embedded.
And I also think it's important to do
some of that slower work, like going through
all the policies, going through all the documentation,
talking to people across the school and across
(19:00):
the departments to find out what they think
and what they want.
Talking to the parent-carer community, talking to
the student community, to make sure that it
meets the needs of most people.
We're never going to meet the needs of
all people, but it'll meet the needs of
most.
But yeah, taking it slowly is the way
to go.
Awesome.
Thanks so much.
Thank you.
(19:20):
Thanks to Leon for that discussion.
And thanks so much to the leadership team
and the staff at Elevation College for inviting
us out and working with their community.
Here's some things that stood out to me
in that discussion.
Get the support of leadership to start relationships
and sexuality education.
Staff will feel supported to continue conversations as
(19:42):
they arise.
Include parents and carers in the conversation.
Relationships and sexuality education is generally supported, but
this can alleviate concerns.
Build skills around key topics such as consent,
inclusive language and sexual content online.
Find out from young people what they would
(20:04):
like to know more of to make it
meaningful.
I'm going to add some links in the
show notes to some policy which supports what
we do, including the Child Safe Standards, the
LGBTIQ Support Policy and the Consent and Sexuality
Education Policy.
For more information about Sexual Health Victoria, you
(20:24):
can go to shvic.org.au. You can
follow us on LinkedIn, Instagram, Facebook, TikTok.
Contact us directly at doingit.shvic.org.au.
Thanks so much for listening.
This podcast was created on Wurundjeri land.
It contains discussion about adult topics.
You can use your judgment if you want
young people to listen.
Welcome to Doing It.
This is a podcast made by Sexual Health
Victoria.
We run a whole lot of education programs
for communities and medical professionals across Victoria.
We also run sexual health clinics in the
(00:20):
city and Box Hill in Melbourne.
My name is Anne and I'm part of
the Sexual Health Victoria Schools and Community team.
We run classes for all year levels on
bodies, growing up, puberty, sex, reproduction, relationships.
This podcast is for parents and carers of
school aged children so we can share what
goes on in a relationships and sexuality education
class and help support these conversations at home.
(00:44):
Today I'll be talking to my colleague Leon
who is leading a project to embed relationships
and sexuality education at Elevation College.
Elevation is a new secondary school in Melbourne
in the Northwest Growth Corridor.
Elevation College is on Wurundjeri Woi Wurrung land.
(01:04):
There are over 900 students at Elevation and
they have a large multicultural cohort.
The Wellbeing and Leadership team has identified the
benefit of relationships and sexuality education program but
also recognize that there are some challenges to
get this started.
This episode will unpack some of the key
challenges as well as address some key topics
that we feel it is important for all
(01:25):
educators to be aware of in order to
have safe inclusive conversations within the classroom.
We thought that this might be helpful to
hear for any other school looking to embed
a whole school approach to relationships and sexuality
education and parents who might want to learn
more.
Thanks Leon for talking to me about this
(01:47):
project at Elevation College.
No worries, thanks for having me.
I would like to start by just unpacking
what are some of the challenges to building
a whole school approach to relationships and sexuality
education.
I think that the general challenges that we
face when doing a whole school approach for
RSC is getting everybody on board and in
(02:09):
the same kind of mindset and on the
same page.
So trying to get parent-carer community, the
school community and then the students themselves on
the same track is really difficult across every
topic but sometimes especially with relationships and sexuality
(02:29):
education.
Working on this specific project with Elevation College,
the added trick is that they have such
a diverse group of students there from linguistic,
cultural, religious backgrounds that you then are trying
to meet the needs of all these different
groups in a setting where they all come
(02:49):
together.
So it's really hard.
So having to communicate with all the groups,
communicating in a way that works best for
them and finding time for it all because
parents and so trying to get them all
at the right time to talk about it
is really tricky.
(03:10):
But yeah, communicating is the key.
Are there any particular topics that you've noticed
are barriers for this school in particular?
I feel like RSC has been taught there
for like since their inception and the RSC
curriculum they have in the HPE subject area
is really thorough and clear.
(03:31):
They teach a lot of the topics that
we teach which is great to see because
not a lot of schools are doing that.
I think that because of the diversity in
backgrounds, one of the topics they struggle with
at times are things like gender, sexuality, which
again are topics that we've noticed a lot
of schools struggling with across Victoria.
But I think just talking with some of
(03:53):
these young people about sex, about bodies, about
identity is a tricky point for them as
a school and for us going into the
school.
How can parents and carers be brought along
for this conversation and why is that important?
So in terms of how they can be
brought along, I mean with this project we
offered a parent information night, a parent carer
(04:14):
information night.
So that was a great opportunity to get
in the room with these people to talk
about their young people and what they might
be learning.
But it was like a lovely and rich
discussion of people agreeing that they all want
the same thing for these young people for
them to be safe, for them to be
happy, for them to be healthy.
So I think getting parents and carers in
(04:36):
the room is the first step.
But I also know that from the kind
of survey data we collected, a lot of
people sometimes prefer written data as well, sorry
written information as well, especially if they want
to translate it into their own language.
The reason it's important that we do this
is that, well number one, it's important that
people know what young people are learning about
so they can continue the conversations at home.
(04:57):
But specifically again for the young people we're
working with at Elevation, they are often first
generation in Australia, which would also make them
first generation getting educated in Australia.
And so they go to school and they
are surrounded by a culture that might be
different to what they're experiencing at home.
And it puts them into this kind of
position of having these two forces kind of
(05:20):
telling them what to think or what to
do or how to be.
And then they've got to work out where
they sit within that.
And so the term that we've spoken about
with Kano, who was on the podcast before,
is the third culture.
So they have got their home culture, their
school culture and they kind of work out,
well, where do I sit with all of
this?
And that's really a tricky spot for these
(05:41):
young people to be in.
And it's a really tricky spot to I
think kind of work with them through as
well.
I think when we did the parent session,
the teachers really chipped in because they were
noticing that young people really want to do
the right thing by their parents and carers
and want to fit into that culture and
(06:02):
observe that culture and do the right thing,
what they perceive is the right thing.
And that can be really confusing if they
think they're being presented conflicting information.
Helping young people address that bridge and helping
parents and carers understand that we're not replacing
what they're doing at home.
(06:22):
It's really important to young people.
It's important to the school, but bringing them
all along for discussions about safety and making
it safe for everyone.
I think that something that we have done
differently with this specific project is that we
have used a slide that we've traditionally used
when talking to parents and carers about the
fact that we're not there to replace values.
(06:43):
So we're making it very clear to the
young people and to the parent and carer
community and to the school community, we're not
there to replace values.
We're part of the picture of helping these
young people work out where they sit within
the world.
And we're just presenting them with facts and
information about the world around them.
And I think that's been helpful with the
conversations across the board.
We have identified a few key topics that
(07:05):
are really useful for all staff to be
across, even if the bulk of the delivery
of the content, like you said, is within
the health and PE curriculum.
So those few topics are LGBTIQA plus inclusion,
consent and online sexual content, which comes up
a lot across all areas of the school.
(07:26):
So let's have a talk about those three
things.
Fear of discussion around LGBTIQA inclusion is a
barrier.
So how can that be approached with elevation
or with any school?
So I think that what we have learnt
through, again, this specific project is taking it
slowly.
So spending time to talk about what values
(07:50):
or like kind of what are the core
beliefs we're looking for?
So things like respect, things like being accepting
of other people, things like celebrating diversity, some
core values that are across all areas of
life.
And then bringing that conversation back to that
includes LGBTIQA plus people.
(08:11):
And so it's about kind of saying here
are the values, we understand those, not usually
any argument there when you're talking about respect
or understanding of difference.
And then how can we tie that into
a community where sometimes people might struggle with
that concept of bringing that community into maybe
their culture or faith that doesn't necessarily have
clear acceptance of those people.
(08:34):
The other thing that I have realised through
the discussions and through working with the community
is that I think sometimes people think that
we're going into schools or that other organisations
like us are going into schools and saying
this is how you are a gay person
or this is how you are a lesbian,
which is not what we're doing.
We're not there to give the how-to.
We're there to say this is what is
(08:56):
in the world around you.
These are the people that are in the
world around you.
And so I think it helps when we're
really explicit with the community about what we're
talking about and how we talk about it.
Otherwise, I think fear takes over and they
assume the worst about what we might be
talking about or how we're going to talk
to young people about it.
(09:16):
But that was just an observation that I
kind of went, oh yeah, I can see
how it might seem like it's a how
-to when it's really just a, this is
what's in the world.
And all people need to be safe and
supported.
Another thing that came up when talking to
parents was sort of an agreement that yes,
this is a community that might need extra
support, the LGBTIQ community, but that doesn't exist
(09:41):
within our community.
So it's a really gentle discussion to say,
maybe it does.
And that's up to you as to how
you reconcile that, but this is in the
world.
Hmm.
Yeah.
And I think the difficulty is that some
of these discussions are probably happening for the
first time when we're standing there with them
or when it comes up at school.
(10:03):
And so it is a gentle and slow
approach, probably a lot slower than I initially
thought it was going to be.
So that has been a good learning moment,
but I think for other people that are
looking at starting a whole school approach, especially
in communities that might have difficulties with some
of the topics, it's about going slow and
(10:24):
coming back to the core values that are
there.
What should all staff understand about consent?
That it is not just about sexual activity.
Consent is in all areas of life.
So when we talk about consent with young
people, we're always talking about it in the
appropriate way for their age and stage, but
it covers all things.
(10:46):
Can I borrow your pen?
Can I touch your laptop?
Can I borrow your phone?
All these kinds of things are all consent
discussions of allowing someone or giving someone permission.
Because we're working with a high school, the
discussions around consent need to be more explicit
about sexual consent and consent within relationships as
well.
So I think it's important to come back
to what we talk about as an organization
(11:08):
about ethical and legal consent.
So legal consent is there.
The consent laws exist.
They're different per state.
Everyone should try to get across them as
best they can, even though they're confusing at
times.
But then the ethical consent is, are you
doing the right thing by this person?
Are they comfortable in this situation?
Do you have their best interests at heart?
And that should hopefully lead people down a
(11:31):
positive consensual path.
But I think that the important thing for
educators and parents and carers to know is
they should have an understanding of the legal
framework.
So 16 is the age of consent in
Victoria.
There are stipulations for young people between 12
and 16.
There are stipulations between 16 and 18.
And it's a different age of consent when
(11:52):
it comes to sharing sexual images.
But it's important that they're across it because
young people, they get stressed and they freak
out and they feel like they've done the
wrong thing and that the police are going
to come and take them away because they
don't understand the laws.
Yeah.
And they generally don't want to get in
trouble.
They don't want to get in legal trouble.
And they might think if consent is discussed
(12:13):
just within the age of consent context, that
that is maybe a guideline for what's culturally
acceptable.
And that's not the case or that that's
an expectation or what they should do.
And that's not the case either.
So having the legal framework of, yeah, we
(12:34):
need to follow the law, but you also
need to do what's right for you, which
for some people might be sex in marriage,
or for some people it might be only
sex in a love relationship.
But that's going to be different for everyone.
Yeah.
I think that numbers can be stressful.
So that's why we're going to talk about
what's right for you and what's right for
your family.
If that's part of the discussion as well,
(12:55):
like where does it all sit with you?
We know that issues around sexual content online
come up for teaching staff a lot.
What information does staff need to know about
this?
I think the first part is that sexual
content online is part of the way that
young people experience their sexuality.
It's a part of their lives.
(13:17):
And for them, we know from research that
there's not a clear delineation between real world
and online world.
For them, it's all one and the same
because that's where they spend their time.
Once you have that understanding, I think it
helps to know what kind of rules and
ideas apply to the online world because they're
the same as the real world.
So we still want people to be respectful.
We still want to avoid discrimination.
(13:39):
We still want people to be supportive of
each other there as well.
When it comes to things like sexual content
online, if we're talking about pornography or sharing
sexual images and stuff like that, as long
as they're again acting ethically and acting within
the confines of the law, that's going to
be okay.
And for young people, the message that I'm
often sharing with them is that the police
(14:02):
aren't going to come and kick down your
door if you've looked at pornography.
The law states it's illegal for them to
purchase it, but it's not illegal for them
to view it.
And I think young people need to know
that because the shame and the guilt that
they feel mean they can't talk to adults
about it.
And if they can't talk to adults about
it, then they can't have any support if
they need it.
And so we've got to try to break
down that barrier.
(14:22):
But I think there's ways to talk about
it with young people.
Yeah.
So it's a real barrier to help-seeking.
If those are perceived as bad, wrong, inappropriate,
which is usually the word they get, illegal,
then they can't get help.
I think most people on board with teaching
young people digital literacy skills, I think it's
(14:44):
really important that part of that digital literacy
framework is explicit conversations about sexual content online,
because we teach them about not bullying, not
discriminating, how to stay safe, don't share your
personal information.
But we don't often have those explicit discussions
of, if you access sexual content online, just
make sure you have these things in mind
about consent, about safety, and letting them know
(15:06):
that they can come and talk to their
trusted adult, their teacher, their educator about it
as well is a really important part, because
time and time again, it comes back to
shame and guilt around accessing sexual content online.
And it can make a liar out of
a parent or an educator if they're saying
it's illegal to share a picture.
And then a young person does share a
(15:28):
picture and the police don't come and arrest
them immediately.
They might dismiss any other information coming from
the parent or carer as untruthful or unrealistic.
So to be really truthful about what the
law does and what ethics are, and that
they can come and get help if they
need to.
I think that the online world is one
(15:49):
where people need to continue to feel comfortable
to say, I don't know, I need to
do some more research because it's changing so
quickly.
It's hard to keep up with things.
There's a lot going on with people already.
So I think it's okay to say, I
don't know, let's find out together.
Let's do a bit of research.
So what are some responses if there are
questions about starting off a program with relationships
(16:10):
and sexuality education at a school?
What are some positive responses and supports?
And who are the people at school that
really need to support the program?
In terms of the who, the biggest players
that need to be involved are the leadership
team.
So having a leadership team on board means
that the parents and carers know that that
(16:32):
is the direction that the school is going
to take because leadership are taking that direction.
But it also means that staff members feel
supported.
If they know that the person or people
at the top are going to be the
ones that are going to back them in
these discussions, then I think it makes them
feel a lot more comfortable having the discussions
in the first place.
In terms of other supports, there are lots
of policies that support the work that we
(16:55):
do because it's something that is mandated in
Victoria to be done.
And we can link those policies in the
show notes as well.
And what are some positive responses if there's
challenges to the content or questions around why
the content is in the school?
We know that from research that parents and
carers are in support of RSE being delivered
(17:16):
in schools.
We know that there's a desire for it.
Even though there's often a loud minority that
talks about not wanting it there, the majority
actually says they do want it there.
So that's one positive thing that the research
points to.
We also know that young people want to
learn about this stuff.
We have research that says very explicitly what
they want to learn and how they want
to learn about it.
(17:37):
And they often want to learn in more
detail than is probably provided to them.
They want to know the how and the
why and the what of these situations.
And so it's important that we can deliver
that to them.
And we just want to make sure that
we're, as we keep coming back to, keeping
young people safe.
And to be safe, they need to know
about everything that's going on for them.
(17:59):
And so if we can give them a
little bit of information, a bit of a
springboard, that's going to help them.
And I think that it's just like in
terms of keeping it positive, it's always coming
back to the common point.
What we want and what you may want,
this other person, is usually the same thing.
It's about safety for young people.
(18:19):
What's your advice for any school looking to
embed a whole school approach to RSE?
Take it slowly.
Take your time.
And really try to think about how you
can make it relevant to your school community.
So make it your own.
Because RSE, there are some things that are
applicable for all people and that we have
to teach and talk about.
(18:40):
But there are ways to make it a
bit more individualized for that school community.
And that will, I think, make sure it
stays embedded.
And I also think it's important to do
some of that slower work, like going through
all the policies, going through all the documentation,
talking to people across the school and across
(19:00):
the departments to find out what they think
and what they want.
Talking to the parent-carer community, talking to
the student community, to make sure that it
meets the needs of most people.
We're never going to meet the needs of
all people, but it'll meet the needs of
most.
But yeah, taking it slowly is the way
to go.
Awesome.
Thanks so much.
Thank you.
(19:20):
Thanks to Leon for that discussion.
And thanks so much to the leadership team
and the staff at Elevation College for inviting
us out and working with their community.
Here's some things that stood out to me
in that discussion.
Get the support of leadership to start relationships
and sexuality education.
Staff will feel supported to continue conversations as
(19:42):
they arise.
Include parents and carers in the conversation.
Relationships and sexuality education is generally supported, but
this can alleviate concerns.
Build skills around key topics such as consent,
inclusive language and sexual content online.
Find out from young people what they would
(20:04):
like to know more of to make it
meaningful.
I'm going to add some links in the
show notes to some policy which supports what
we do, including the Child Safe Standards, the
LGBTIQ Support Policy and the Consent and Sexuality
Education Policy.
For more information about Sexual Health Victoria, you
(20:24):
can go to shvic.org.au. You can
follow us on LinkedIn, Instagram, Facebook, TikTok.
Contact us directly at doingit.shvic.org.au.
Thanks so much for listening.
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