March 26, 2024 • 30 mins
In this episode we speak to the 2023 Australian Youth Representative to the United Nations, Imogen Kane. This role saw Imogen travel Australia to meet with young people to find out what was important to them. Hear what Imogen learned about the generational divide, sexuality and relationships and the importance of listening.
Resources:
See Imogen Kane and the UN listening tour. For help learning about the programs that YP are using see the eSafety guide. Youth Affairs Council Victoria has some great information about youth participation and co-design. Find Sexual Health Victoria at shvic.org.au.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Sexual health.
Victoria sits on the land of the Wurundjeri people and I pay my respect to elders past and present.
Our guest on this episode,
Imogen Kane will be discussing her travels across the country,
talking to young people.
I acknowledge the ownership of the lands and waterways.
We live work and play on belonging to first nations peoples across this land mass we call Australia.
(00:24):
We are all on unceded lands and I acknowledge the rich history of our first nations peoples of knowledge sharing and storytelling.
Welcome to Doing 'IT'.
This is a podcast made by the Everybody Education Team at Sexual Health Victoria.
My name is Chrissy and I'll be interviewing the amazing Imogen Kane for this episode.
(00:45):
Sexual Health.
Victoria runs a whole lot of education programs for communities and medical professionals across Victoria.
For young people.
We run classes for all year levels on bodies growing up puberty,
sex,
reproduction and relationships.
We also have sexual health clinics in the city and Box Hill in Melbourne.
(01:05):
This podcast is for parents and carers of school age Children.
So we can share what goes on in a relationships and sexuality education class and help support these sorts of conversations at home.
We've also heard from a number of people who work with young people that our podcast is a great resource for them too.
We appreciate everyone's ongoing support.
(01:26):
Thanks all for listening.
Today.
I will be talking to Imogen Kane,
the 2023 Australian Youth Representative to the United Nations.
As part of this role,
Imogen embarked on a listening tour across Australia to hear directly from young people about what issues and experiences were most relevant to them.
(01:46):
I'll be asking her what young people around the country had to say about topics related to sex,
sexuality and sexual health.
Welcome,
Imogen.
Thank you so much for being here.
Thank you for having me.
Now,
my first question,
I'd like to ask you,
could you share with me what you heard were the main things young people said regarding sexuality,
(02:10):
sex and sexual health,
of course.
So the one thing I mainly noticed when I was reflecting about the listening tour was that this topic typically came up when we talked about education.
So when the topic of education came up,
which was always coming up,
um you know,
they would talk about the fact that they wanted to learn life skills.
And so typically that manifested in financial literacy and sexual and reproductive health.
(02:33):
So young people were expecting it to be taught in their education institutions and felt they weren't getting that knowledge.
So ultimately,
what we sort of discovered was there was a lack of reliable and consistent information.
Um And it varied really greatly and this was between educators within a school,
between year levels and school years within a school.
And then of course,
(02:53):
between schools themselves and then between states and you would see these differences also manifest between public and private and inner city versus regional.
So across the board,
young people were really dissatisfied with the information they were getting and for many of them,
their school was the only place they were getting this information from.
Um And they didn't feel they had anywhere else to turn for this information.
(03:16):
So they were relying on their school to give it to them.
They felt they weren't getting it and they didn't know where else to go.
So a lack of a a central location or a go to place for sexual and reproductive health information and it wasn't just reproductive health,
but it was sexuality and it was relationships.
They wanted all of it in this discussion and they felt that was consistently lacking across the country.
(03:39):
But also uh as I sort of alluded to this concept of respectful relationships was something that consistently came up as well.
So under that,
there was obviously a gendered discussion that occurred.
So gender,
domestic violence,
sexual and gender based violence,
gender equality would kind of be an extension of this concept of consent and respectful relationships.
(03:59):
So what was interesting is the entire topic of sex health.
They wanted a really broad and deep discussion,
taking into account all of those sort of factors and metrics.
Um And they felt that they couldn't get that from anywhere other than education institutions which weren't covering it consistently.
Did any young people you speak to have relationships and sexuality education in their school or?
(04:24):
Yeah,
they did.
Um they typically talked about puberty education.
So,
you know,
um at the turn of end of primary school,
start of high school,
they would talk about,
you know,
how periods and things would start happening and it was all very the mechanics of the thing.
Um but not how that could affect you in life and,
and sort of what are the consequences of that.
And in particular,
(04:44):
quite a lot of young people were explaining how they were learning through news organizations that there were such things as endometriosis,
but none of them were being taught that when they were being taught their puberty education.
So they were being taught the mechanics of how a period worked.
But nothing beyond that.
Nothing that,
hey,
if you experience this,
you need to go seek this help.
Um So there wasn't any of that like linked to health care and how to actually manage their health.
(05:07):
They were just taught,
this is the science.
Um But how to actually live with that was another piece entirely.
And I will say many talked about um the lack of queer sort of sexuality education in schools as well.
Um And therefore,
there was these knowledge gaps when they were trying to understand themselves and also come out as themselves um between themselves and caregivers or friends.
(05:31):
There was a knowledge gap.
And so therefore,
a lot of assumptions and stereotypes would be coming out of those conversations.
So they often just wouldn't engage.
So it was interesting,
um when it came to school education,
it seems like the science of the matter was discussed but not actually like how to live in the world with these,
you know,
um conditions,
for example.
(05:51):
Um or even just,
that's what your body is like.
No one actually talked about how do you actually get healthcare for that?
Um And then it would actually branch into a wider discussion of the inaccessibility of healthcare as well.
So it all sort of tied together multiple issues.
It sounds like young people are much more aware of uh relationships and sexual health being a part of their life,
(06:13):
not just a one off lesson in class,
tick the box.
We're done.
That's the only conversation.
Exactly.
And many sort of explained how they would have this education when they were 12 or 13.
So at the beginning of high school,
but it obviously wouldn't be revisited.
And that's actually when they started experiencing these things and they wanted to understand them more because context helps.
So when they're actually going to parties and they're talking to people,
(06:36):
they're trying to go on dates or they're trying to connect with others or they're understanding more about themselves and what they like or want to do.
That's when they wanted that opportunity to revisit these topics because their questions would be better.
Um,
and they would know what they wanna find out whereas it was sort of revised once and then never revisited.
And so then they turned to friends,
particularly peer education was high or the internet.
(06:58):
Of course,
did any of the young people you spoke to feel comfortable or bring up conversations with their parents or carers about these topics in particular?
Um Whenever the concept of talking to caregivers or adults or educators came up,
it really came under this theme of a divide between generations.
This was a consistent theme across all issues across the country.
(07:20):
It was the one thing that actually united young people in Australia was the fact that they felt a disconnect with all other generations and even sometimes within their own.
So in particular,
they were more,
whenever their parents came up in conversation,
it was more,
oh,
I don't tell them this.
I have a secret phone account so I can keep things private.
They've actually never met my friends.
I don't want to introduce them to them.
(07:42):
I won't invite them over because my parents won't actually sit down with me and actually have a empathetic or compassionate discussion about my life or who I am or the people I hang out with.
So why would I introduce them to my life?
Um,
in particular,
a young person explained to me how one of their friends had changed pronouns and they couldn't introduce that friend to their parents,
(08:02):
despite the fact they were their best friend because they knew their parents wouldn't engage in that respectfully and they wouldn't acknowledge that new pronoun for example.
And,
and sort of considered it too woke.
So already that person was now living two different lives,
the life they lived at home with supervision and the one they had to sort of carve out for themselves that had agency and independence.
(08:24):
But also it meant they had no support.
They didn't have someone to turn to um when they're navigating who they are and their friendships and who they're becoming.
So it's quite um they felt very lonely.
Um And this is also in the midst of the fact that young people feel a lot of disconnect with friendships at the moment.
So there's this sort of friendship recession occurring while also a lack of connection with older generations.
(08:46):
So people are really navigating this by themselves or just with a few core people around them.
So I understand why it's difficult for them and why they would turn to the internet to get information and to create a community that phrase friendship recession is hitting home.
That,
that feels really,
yeah,
kind of post pandemic.
Um Yeah,
a lot of young people who maybe went through different stages of their lives with hormones going wild.
(09:10):
Maybe didn't get to socialize with some people or?
Yeah.
And now here we are and still not talking to them or giving them the tools they need it.
Particularly what I noticed was,
um,
a lack of agency in young people's lives.
Um,
and a lack of vernacular.
So young people were saying,
well,
think about where I hang out,
I go to school,
it's supervised,
(09:30):
I go to curricular activities.
It's also supervised and then I go home that's also supervised.
There's actually nowhere for me to just experiment,
be myself and hang out with friends.
And even when I do that at the park or something,
it's considered loitering.
Um it's considered,
you know,
antisocial behavior.
So they're trying to find places where they can just talk with their friends and,
and not be watched all the time.
(09:52):
Um,
and they don't have the ability to experiment and find out who they are like many did back in the day.
And they,
and they know that too.
So it's frustrating for them,
but also in particular,
they really want to have dinner table conversations,
they want to understand what does this term mean?
I hear it used a lot,
there's this kind of concept,
young people feel like older people are trying to shield them from information and therefore that's gonna protect them.
(10:16):
They're already exposed to it.
They will be exposed to it.
They actually wanna understand what they're being exposed to.
So they wanna understand.
Well,
I saw this video,
what are they talking about?
What does this word mean?
I don't understand it.
And that was all really heavily around mental health and also sexual health.
Those sort of two topics.
What did young people say is important to them?
But maybe that adults around them aren't listening to or maybe aren't valuing.
(10:41):
Yeah.
So to kind of expand more on what I said before,
um the phrase toxic masculinity came up a lot,
remember um youth rep in the year of Barbie and a lot of those things.
So pop culture references were also really talking about this and a bunch of young people said they saw Barbie and wanted to talk about it with their parents and their parents wouldn't go watch it.
So therefore,
again,
that conversation wasn't opened,
(11:03):
the concept that a lot of their um information is coming from an unregulated source,
which is online,
especially in sort of short form videos typically on Instagram and tiktok.
And a lot of this content is any person can buy a microphone and run a podcast and a lot of people a re creating this content based purely on their own opinions.
(11:24):
Um And they do it in a way to create Clickbait to create controversy so that they,
you know,
go viral,
so to speak.
So they're seeing a lot of this content which they framed as toxic masculinity or,
you know,
these sort of gender topics.
Um people talking about what is a slut and how women are sluts or what is slut shaming.
(11:44):
Um And what is a woman's role?
You know,
a lot of people saying they would prefer to go back to traditional values as they say,
which mean women have a lot less agency in their life.
And in particular,
for example,
it would take place in the format of going on the street asking couples to talk about how men,
what's your body count and things like that and then getting each other's reactions to that and swap phones and look at each other's Snapchat.
(12:09):
And you could see distrust being sown and you could see um this was becoming everything in regards to sexual health and relationships and trust and respect was now becoming controversial.
So it was inflammatory and that was the purpose of it.
And young people were talking about,
they're inundated with this content.
It is everywhere,
but they're using terms and phrases like body count for example.
(12:32):
And so they're learning what that means and then they're learning to adopt that and ask each other,
what is your body count?
Like it comes into normal discussion and discourse with their friendships.
It seemed that the older generations just prefer to try and cut out technology rather than actually helping them deal with what technology is presenting them.
Yeah.
And so these were little short videos maybe what,
(12:55):
1530 seconds on Instagram tiktok and showing any person with a microphone going up to strangers,
maybe strangers,
maybe staged.
Very possible.
Yeah.
Uh,
and asking these questions and then that's how they're learning.
Oh,
ok.
Body count must be important.
So it sounds like when we talk to young people about what they're seeing online,
(13:17):
we might think kind of jump to pornography for example.
But that these things they're seeing by and large are affecting their interpersonal relationships,
their expectations of relationships too.
100%.
I think it's,
it's much harder to sort of identify what's problematic with them.
Um But yeah,
the whole point is it's changing what normal conversation is in a relationship and how people should talk to each other in a respectful relationship to always be accusatory and inflammatory and controversial.
(13:49):
Um And it,
it's very much creates like an US versus them and,
and,
and it really saddles in with a lot of the concept of what it is to be a man or what it is to be a woman,
right?
So then you get these kind of warring parties and then naturally with algorithms,
you get into your echo chamber as well.
So then you just get saddled into your team,
whichever side of the internet you're on and then you hate everyone else.
Um And we're just sowing distrust within young people and they think this is the way that we communicate to each other and this is how we have relationships within community.
(14:18):
So it's no surprise that therefore,
we've got such divides with opinion.
So it,
yeah,
it's very interesting.
But also um hard to detect older people when they're thinking of child safety will immediately jump to nudity and things of that nature.
But that's,
that's not necessarily what they're being exposed to.
And so we're actually,
they're actually being taught to treat others or view others in a certain light which could have massive consequences.
(14:44):
Later on.
Did pornography or sharing sexual images come up,
we focus on them a lot.
As educators with sexual behavior,
online pornography didn't but sharing pitches did pornography did not.
No,
it really did not feature that much.
Um It was more sharing moods and things of that nature.
So when I was in Western Australia talking to some young people at a youth center,
(15:08):
they sort of just on the side remarked like,
oh,
did you hear about this person?
Yeah.
Her photo got leaked to this whole group chat with all these guys in it.
Yeah,
the boyfriend and now they've broken up and they were more excited about talking about the breakup than actually the fact that her sexually explicit images were out there and these people were all obviously under 18.
So and I was like,
(15:28):
oh,
does anyone like know about this?
Like,
have you told anyone they're like,
oh,
no,
like it's on our like,
Finster like,
it's on our other account.
Like mom doesn't know about that one.
I was like,
oh,
ok.
They're like,
yeah.
Yeah.
No,
they do phone checks.
So we have another account or we have another device.
So all of this is taking place and no caregivers have been told about this.
So it's all just happening.
But what was interesting was the focus point was not on the fact that the image was shared.
(15:51):
it was more the scandal of how it all went down and the fact that it broke up this relationship that everyone was invested in apparently.
Wow.
And um for listeners,
Finsta fake Instagram.
Yeah,
love that.
Um And what what other messages around sexual images were there did was there any discussions about expectations around it or people liking it or not liking it?
(16:13):
Stuff like that in terms of sort of,
yeah,
the content in particular,
it was all really tied close to like Instagram,
like um influences and things like that.
So it was more about like,
how do I make sure I meet sort of the trend and I look this certain way,
which often was quite revealing in,
in itself.
So it was this weird desire to as a 14 year old dress like a 25 year old.
(16:33):
Um and be sort of looking like this influencer who is yeah,
10 years older than them.
Um And that seemed totally normal because this person was had so followers brands were endorsing them.
And therefore,
you know,
they were getting all these like gifts or opportunities to travel with their,
you know,
business,
I suppose.
And so that was legitimate and that's a legitimate job.
So therefore that's someone I can aspire to be like,
(16:55):
and it's a role model,
right?
So I can match that and that's totally fine.
So just when they were talking about what they were gonna wear to parties and stuff,
it was all based on what influencers were wearing.
Despite the fact there was such an age gap,
such a a tie in with body image too.
And I feel like for maybe generations that didn't have the internet,
same,
same with magazines and the movie stars they would see and things like that.
(17:18):
It's just kind of taken on a new media.
Yeah,
body image was an interesting one because it affected everyone in very different ways.
And I really noticed specifically with young men or boys or,
or male identifying young people.
The going to the gym was huge and the need to have all the pre workout protein powders and stuff like that even though they're 16.
(17:41):
Um and they're still developing and this concept that they,
they must hit the gym and also the gym was also tied to relationships,
right?
So if you're dumped by a girl,
you go to the gym,
like there was this constant like connection being drawn that like to be your best self,
you have to be physically fit and actually to be physically fit,
you must be like superior and dominant and like be able to take out anybody and therefore somehow that earns you the right to be in a relationship with someone else.
(18:06):
It was really quite bizarre how everything kind of,
nothing was siloed,
everything really intermeshed with everything else.
So you actually can't talk about body image without talking about relationships without talking about consumption online.
It all fed into each other.
And and we looked at that even with energy drinks that even ended up getting tied in to body image because youtubers released an energy drink.
(18:30):
Was it last year,
Jacob Paul et cetera.
It was prime energy drink anyway.
Um And so to be fit and cool like them because he's a boxer like we have to go consume this and then therefore we're an alpha male and therefore then we can get the girl.
It just,
it didn't make sense.
But that is genuinely how the connections were made and they were being sold that through various different channels online was Andrew Tate mentioned at all,
(18:55):
not as much as I expected.
It's amazing how fast the world moves on when someone is denied the microphone and camera.
But there are many people taking his place.
There's just,
there's,
there's so many of them and then as I said,
it's completely unregulated,
right?
I've seen so many and they were showing me videos because I was just curious what their algorithms were showing them and I was just sitting on the beanbags,
(19:15):
they were just flicking through Instagram.
I was like,
that's interesting content and um especially with boys,
I noticed there was a lot of gaming was then also tied in with this um men with podcasts talking about masculinity and it was also tied with economics.
So it was a really interesting mix.
So it was like,
you can be a billionaire by 25 but also like you can be really good at playing Fortnite.
(19:39):
But also like we hate women was to get a little subtle messaging tied in there at the end.
Were there differences in what young people said regarding sex,
sexuality,
sexual health across the country?
So maybe differences in different age groups or geographic locations.
I noticed more in all issues.
It was geography that played the biggest role rather than age.
(20:01):
So in particular,
it was um inner city or suburban sort of schools and young people versus regional young people.
And then within those geographies as well,
private versus public.
So I really did notice um on many different issues,
the education system played a heavy role in determining sort of outcomes and what people cared about.
(20:21):
So in particular,
for inner city young people,
they had been exposed to concepts um and terminology before.
So they knew what trans meant,
right?
They understood that more or less.
Um And they understood that people had different pronouns and could identify differently.
Maybe they didn't quite understand why,
but they could kind of get behind it and go like,
oh,
well,
that's fine.
I'll just call this person this now and it was kind of like a non-issue.
(20:45):
Um,
and they were talking things like they would use words like depression or they would use words like,
um gender based violence,
like they would be able to use these terms and,
and more or less understand what they meant and actually use them appropriately.
Whereas when I went regional,
they didn't have the terminology behind them.
They were more kind of what I noticed was it was more symptomatic.
It was more like,
(21:05):
oh yeah,
this girl's photos got leaked or oh,
I can't talk to my mom about that.
She doesn't like believe in that stuff,
but we wouldn't be able to like pull it apart further and be like,
OK,
why is that like,
what particular bit or why is there such a gap?
And um so they were saying things were happening but,
and often themselves,
they were like,
oh,
you know,
(21:25):
I think my friend's something but we're not sure we don't really know what it means and we just let them do whatever they want,
leave them to it.
So,
yeah,
regionally,
I noticed it also only would come up in longer form consultations when I'd developed some real trust with the participants.
So if I'd been there two hours,
that's when they would actually start talking about this stuff and how they didn't feel like they belonged or they think they were gay,
(21:49):
but they didn't know how to deal with that concept and they couldn't talk about it with friends either that came up regionally.
Whereas in the city they were,
they were much more willing to talk about it upfront and,
and try and address it.
So there were differences.
Um,
but yeah,
overall,
they were all overwhelmed with content from online.
That was the same.
But how they could engage in conversations about it was different.
(22:10):
And would you say across the country,
they want to have more conversations in general around relationships,
sexuality,
sex,
100% because they're doing it within their peer friendships,
right?
They're talking about it right now.
They actually want role models and sort of um young adults to help them through that process,
navigate that process.
(22:31):
They want a adults to be talking about this using terminology,
explaining what that even means they want.
As they sort of said,
like an open dinner table conversation,
they want to be able to come home and say,
hey,
I heard this,
what does this mean?
Or hey,
someone said this is that right?
Like I felt uncomfortable about that.
They want their caregivers,
they want their educators to be able to be people and resources of information and trustworthy too.
(22:54):
Um They wanna know where they can go to do their own research,
they wanna be told where to go to find that they wanna continue the peer discussions,
but in particular,
they definitely want like older role models.
So um and that tied into health care as well.
So they said navigating the health care system,
they wanted to speak to someone who had just navigated it or is navigating it now to help them through that process because they didn't find the experts very helpful.
(23:17):
They actually wanted someone who could empathize with that.
So it sounds like a bit of a mix between giving them tangible skills,
sharing,
lived experience even and also opening up space for kind of navigating nuanced discussions.
That might not be,
this is what it's like to go to a clinic for example.
But how are these pressures making you feel?
(23:37):
How are these videos making you feel and things like that?
100%?
It,
it's a multifaceted issue.
There's so many different factors,
as I said,
coming into it because it's coming from all these different sources and different issues are also being dragged in.
Like health care,
accessibility,
mental health are all playing a role in this space.
So it requires a multifaceted solution.
What do you think is most important for parents and carers to know about what young people said regarding relationships and sexuality education from what you heard?
(24:04):
So I did think long and hard about this.
I really hope that what I said earlier actually struck a chord for parents and caregivers.
The fact that the one thing that united young people across the country was a divide between older generations and them.
That was the one uniting factor,
which is terrible and really awful because it means a lot of young people don't have a trusted older person to go to and,
(24:28):
and aren't honest with and can't help them navigate,
despite the fact that they have navigated it previously.
Right.
And they often live with them.
So they,
they know them and there's this secrecy that's being sewn into that relationship.
They're living double lives sometimes.
So I hope that shocked people and I hope coming out of that,
that parents and caregivers know the value of listening and creating an open dialogue and an open space where they're not actually the ones talking because that's often not what young people are actually asking.
(24:59):
They want their voice to be valued and the way they know it's valued and respected is by giving it the space and weight,
by being silent,
by opening it up.
And if that,
it remains silent for a while,
that's ok.
But as long as they know that when they say something go,
oh,
this happened at school,
it's like,
yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Ok.
Can you come down for dinner now?
Like it's not dismissing it as a,
(25:19):
a lack of value to what they're saying.
Like it's their whole world,
it matters to them and the amount of attention that you pay to,
it will ensure that that relationship has that trust.
And therefore hopefully when something does go wrong,
they come to you and get your advice.
But also it's ok to not understand everything they're saying.
A lot of young people were feeling like younger generations were going very fast with change,
(25:40):
demanding a lot of change of the world.
And you know,
it all tied into abortion rights and climate change and you name it.
They,
they just felt like they were itching to change the world and others were everyone else was really hesitant to embrace that change.
I know that parents and caregivers might not understand quite the issues that young people are fighting for.
(26:00):
But we just wanna be heard actually.
Um and not just heard,
but what we say is valued,
which is really important and this concept that respect goes both ways.
Um young people were really sick of being told that just for the sake of their age.
Therefore what they said didn't matter.
And they were too naive to comment on such issues and they didn't have enough life experience.
Well,
that's the point.
You know,
they can bring a really fresh perspective.
(26:22):
They can challenge the status quo because they haven't been here long enough to sort of be engulfed by it and assimilated into it so they can challenge it,
which might not make sense to you.
That's OK.
But like,
let's go abstract,
like let's open it up and let's see where we can find ourselves amazing.
Um What do you think is most important uh for adults who work with young people,
(26:43):
educators,
maybe youth and community workers?
Yeah.
So what struck me with this was um how much young people said they wanted peer to peer learning and they wanted role models.
So they understand experts are great and they've done their degrees and they're really good at what they do.
But they actually want someone to almost help translate it into a language they can understand.
(27:06):
So some of us actually about the concept of like a youth translator,
which is just someone who's a few years older to help actually make it make sense.
Um Because sometimes if you're in that space so much,
it's,
you're used to it,
you understand it,
you also understand the intricacies behind it.
But young people just kinda want to get to the point.
For example,
I used a word before Finster and I didn't even think to explain what that meant.
(27:27):
Um And we'll have lots of slang and it changes so much as well.
So to have sort of that role model person who's also a bit of an intermediary or a mediator almost to help navigate that discussion so that it's almost like age,
not age appropriate.
I hate that term,
but,
you know,
understandable for a young person and also opens up the space.
(27:48):
So a young person can kind of put their input in which kinda leads to young people ultimately,
which is demanding respect.
They just actually wanted to be valued to be in the space.
They didn't wanna be told you should be grateful that we're listening to you.
They wanted to be told.
Thank you so much for sharing and we're actually hearing you,
it just all came back to,
they felt undervalued,
unheard and they were told they were rude for saying.
(28:09):
So I think that's huge for a lot of us to sit with a parent care,
someone who works with a young person that it's not this top down,
we teach you only do what we say.
Don't do that,
do this.
Here's what you need to know nothing more.
It's really come to the table,
let's have a chat.
What's important to you.
(28:29):
How can we help guide?
And often they just want to understand your thinking behind it.
A lot of them were like,
well,
you know,
my teachers just said this is the way it is.
That's it.
They actually wanna understand why,
why,
what,
what was behind that decision making because again,
they're being exposed to information already.
They're being exposed to different ways of thinking.
So they will probably question it or not wanna play ball because they're like,
(28:50):
well,
actually,
I,
I'm not sure if that's quite right.
And if you're not involving them in the discussion,
there's no buy in.
It's not.
I,
I like to come back to the concept of cosign.
So if we want to create solutions for young people,
it has to be co-signed with young people.
And that does not mean only dragging in young people who are going to say what you want them to say so that it fits your predetermined policy agenda.
(29:11):
If you only bring in young people who would just say,
yeah,
that sounds good.
You tick the box and move on and then you wonder why young people haven't embraced it.
It's because you haven't actually co-signed it with them.
Wow,
this was amazing.
Thank you so much for your time.
Thank you for also listening to young people and being this,
I feel like you're kind of the youth translator right now in a way and sharing with us and figure helping us figure out what we need to do better and how we can improve.
(29:36):
Um So thank you so much for your time.
Thank you so much.
Key things which stood out in this discussion for me are young people identified.
Lgbti Q A plus topics and issues and discussions as a knowledge gap in their education.
(29:59):
Young people are getting messages about relationships,
gender roles and body image through content that adults might not see as explicit or impactful.
Young people spoke of a generational divide around the country and said that they feel like they're not being valued,
listened to or respected and that they want these dinner table conversations about relationships and sex and sexuality with their parents,
(30:26):
carers and trusted adults.
Thanks so much for tuning in for more information about sexual health Victoria.
You can visit us at Sh vic.org dot A U.
You can follow SHV on Instagram,
Facebook,
Twitter or tiktok,
contact us directly at doing it at Sh vic.org dot A U and subscribe to the podcast so you don't miss out.
Sexual health.
Victoria sits on the land of the Wurundjeri people and I pay my respect to elders past and present.
Our guest on this episode,
Imogen Kane will be discussing her travels across the country,
talking to young people.
I acknowledge the ownership of the lands and waterways.
We live work and play on belonging to first nations peoples across this land mass we call Australia.
(00:24):
We are all on unceded lands and I acknowledge the rich history of our first nations peoples of knowledge sharing and storytelling.
Welcome to Doing 'IT'.
This is a podcast made by the Everybody Education Team at Sexual Health Victoria.
My name is Chrissy and I'll be interviewing the amazing Imogen Kane for this episode.
(00:45):
Sexual Health.
Victoria runs a whole lot of education programs for communities and medical professionals across Victoria.
For young people.
We run classes for all year levels on bodies growing up puberty,
sex,
reproduction and relationships.
We also have sexual health clinics in the city and Box Hill in Melbourne.
(01:05):
This podcast is for parents and carers of school age Children.
So we can share what goes on in a relationships and sexuality education class and help support these sorts of conversations at home.
We've also heard from a number of people who work with young people that our podcast is a great resource for them too.
We appreciate everyone's ongoing support.
(01:26):
Thanks all for listening.
Today.
I will be talking to Imogen Kane,
the 2023 Australian Youth Representative to the United Nations.
As part of this role,
Imogen embarked on a listening tour across Australia to hear directly from young people about what issues and experiences were most relevant to them.
(01:46):
I'll be asking her what young people around the country had to say about topics related to sex,
sexuality and sexual health.
Welcome,
Imogen.
Thank you so much for being here.
Thank you for having me.
Now,
my first question,
I'd like to ask you,
could you share with me what you heard were the main things young people said regarding sexuality,
(02:10):
sex and sexual health,
of course.
So the one thing I mainly noticed when I was reflecting about the listening tour was that this topic typically came up when we talked about education.
So when the topic of education came up,
which was always coming up,
um you know,
they would talk about the fact that they wanted to learn life skills.
And so typically that manifested in financial literacy and sexual and reproductive health.
(02:33):
So young people were expecting it to be taught in their education institutions and felt they weren't getting that knowledge.
So ultimately,
what we sort of discovered was there was a lack of reliable and consistent information.
Um And it varied really greatly and this was between educators within a school,
between year levels and school years within a school.
And then of course,
(02:53):
between schools themselves and then between states and you would see these differences also manifest between public and private and inner city versus regional.
So across the board,
young people were really dissatisfied with the information they were getting and for many of them,
their school was the only place they were getting this information from.
Um And they didn't feel they had anywhere else to turn for this information.
(03:16):
So they were relying on their school to give it to them.
They felt they weren't getting it and they didn't know where else to go.
So a lack of a a central location or a go to place for sexual and reproductive health information and it wasn't just reproductive health,
but it was sexuality and it was relationships.
They wanted all of it in this discussion and they felt that was consistently lacking across the country.
(03:39):
But also uh as I sort of alluded to this concept of respectful relationships was something that consistently came up as well.
So under that,
there was obviously a gendered discussion that occurred.
So gender,
domestic violence,
sexual and gender based violence,
gender equality would kind of be an extension of this concept of consent and respectful relationships.
(03:59):
So what was interesting is the entire topic of sex health.
They wanted a really broad and deep discussion,
taking into account all of those sort of factors and metrics.
Um And they felt that they couldn't get that from anywhere other than education institutions which weren't covering it consistently.
Did any young people you speak to have relationships and sexuality education in their school or?
(04:24):
Yeah,
they did.
Um they typically talked about puberty education.
So,
you know,
um at the turn of end of primary school,
start of high school,
they would talk about,
you know,
how periods and things would start happening and it was all very the mechanics of the thing.
Um but not how that could affect you in life and,
and sort of what are the consequences of that.
And in particular,
(04:44):
quite a lot of young people were explaining how they were learning through news organizations that there were such things as endometriosis,
but none of them were being taught that when they were being taught their puberty education.
So they were being taught the mechanics of how a period worked.
But nothing beyond that.
Nothing that,
hey,
if you experience this,
you need to go seek this help.
Um So there wasn't any of that like linked to health care and how to actually manage their health.
(05:07):
They were just taught,
this is the science.
Um But how to actually live with that was another piece entirely.
And I will say many talked about um the lack of queer sort of sexuality education in schools as well.
Um And therefore,
there was these knowledge gaps when they were trying to understand themselves and also come out as themselves um between themselves and caregivers or friends.
(05:31):
There was a knowledge gap.
And so therefore,
a lot of assumptions and stereotypes would be coming out of those conversations.
So they often just wouldn't engage.
So it was interesting,
um when it came to school education,
it seems like the science of the matter was discussed but not actually like how to live in the world with these,
you know,
um conditions,
for example.
(05:51):
Um or even just,
that's what your body is like.
No one actually talked about how do you actually get healthcare for that?
Um And then it would actually branch into a wider discussion of the inaccessibility of healthcare as well.
So it all sort of tied together multiple issues.
It sounds like young people are much more aware of uh relationships and sexual health being a part of their life,
(06:13):
not just a one off lesson in class,
tick the box.
We're done.
That's the only conversation.
Exactly.
And many sort of explained how they would have this education when they were 12 or 13.
So at the beginning of high school,
but it obviously wouldn't be revisited.
And that's actually when they started experiencing these things and they wanted to understand them more because context helps.
So when they're actually going to parties and they're talking to people,
(06:36):
they're trying to go on dates or they're trying to connect with others or they're understanding more about themselves and what they like or want to do.
That's when they wanted that opportunity to revisit these topics because their questions would be better.
Um,
and they would know what they wanna find out whereas it was sort of revised once and then never revisited.
And so then they turned to friends,
particularly peer education was high or the internet.
(06:58):
Of course,
did any of the young people you spoke to feel comfortable or bring up conversations with their parents or carers about these topics in particular?
Um Whenever the concept of talking to caregivers or adults or educators came up,
it really came under this theme of a divide between generations.
This was a consistent theme across all issues across the country.
(07:20):
It was the one thing that actually united young people in Australia was the fact that they felt a disconnect with all other generations and even sometimes within their own.
So in particular,
they were more,
whenever their parents came up in conversation,
it was more,
oh,
I don't tell them this.
I have a secret phone account so I can keep things private.
They've actually never met my friends.
I don't want to introduce them to them.
(07:42):
I won't invite them over because my parents won't actually sit down with me and actually have a empathetic or compassionate discussion about my life or who I am or the people I hang out with.
So why would I introduce them to my life?
Um,
in particular,
a young person explained to me how one of their friends had changed pronouns and they couldn't introduce that friend to their parents,
(08:02):
despite the fact they were their best friend because they knew their parents wouldn't engage in that respectfully and they wouldn't acknowledge that new pronoun for example.
And,
and sort of considered it too woke.
So already that person was now living two different lives,
the life they lived at home with supervision and the one they had to sort of carve out for themselves that had agency and independence.
(08:24):
But also it meant they had no support.
They didn't have someone to turn to um when they're navigating who they are and their friendships and who they're becoming.
So it's quite um they felt very lonely.
Um And this is also in the midst of the fact that young people feel a lot of disconnect with friendships at the moment.
So there's this sort of friendship recession occurring while also a lack of connection with older generations.
(08:46):
So people are really navigating this by themselves or just with a few core people around them.
So I understand why it's difficult for them and why they would turn to the internet to get information and to create a community that phrase friendship recession is hitting home.
That,
that feels really,
yeah,
kind of post pandemic.
Um Yeah,
a lot of young people who maybe went through different stages of their lives with hormones going wild.
(09:10):
Maybe didn't get to socialize with some people or?
Yeah.
And now here we are and still not talking to them or giving them the tools they need it.
Particularly what I noticed was,
um,
a lack of agency in young people's lives.
Um,
and a lack of vernacular.
So young people were saying,
well,
think about where I hang out,
I go to school,
it's supervised,
(09:30):
I go to curricular activities.
It's also supervised and then I go home that's also supervised.
There's actually nowhere for me to just experiment,
be myself and hang out with friends.
And even when I do that at the park or something,
it's considered loitering.
Um it's considered,
you know,
antisocial behavior.
So they're trying to find places where they can just talk with their friends and,
and not be watched all the time.
(09:52):
Um,
and they don't have the ability to experiment and find out who they are like many did back in the day.
And they,
and they know that too.
So it's frustrating for them,
but also in particular,
they really want to have dinner table conversations,
they want to understand what does this term mean?
I hear it used a lot,
there's this kind of concept,
young people feel like older people are trying to shield them from information and therefore that's gonna protect them.
(10:16):
They're already exposed to it.
They will be exposed to it.
They actually wanna understand what they're being exposed to.
So they wanna understand.
Well,
I saw this video,
what are they talking about?
What does this word mean?
I don't understand it.
And that was all really heavily around mental health and also sexual health.
Those sort of two topics.
What did young people say is important to them?
But maybe that adults around them aren't listening to or maybe aren't valuing.
(10:41):
Yeah.
So to kind of expand more on what I said before,
um the phrase toxic masculinity came up a lot,
remember um youth rep in the year of Barbie and a lot of those things.
So pop culture references were also really talking about this and a bunch of young people said they saw Barbie and wanted to talk about it with their parents and their parents wouldn't go watch it.
So therefore,
again,
that conversation wasn't opened,
(11:03):
the concept that a lot of their um information is coming from an unregulated source,
which is online,
especially in sort of short form videos typically on Instagram and tiktok.
And a lot of this content is any person can buy a microphone and run a podcast and a lot of people a re creating this content based purely on their own opinions.
(11:24):
Um And they do it in a way to create Clickbait to create controversy so that they,
you know,
go viral,
so to speak.
So they're seeing a lot of this content which they framed as toxic masculinity or,
you know,
these sort of gender topics.
Um people talking about what is a slut and how women are sluts or what is slut shaming.
(11:44):
Um And what is a woman's role?
You know,
a lot of people saying they would prefer to go back to traditional values as they say,
which mean women have a lot less agency in their life.
And in particular,
for example,
it would take place in the format of going on the street asking couples to talk about how men,
what's your body count and things like that and then getting each other's reactions to that and swap phones and look at each other's Snapchat.
(12:09):
And you could see distrust being sown and you could see um this was becoming everything in regards to sexual health and relationships and trust and respect was now becoming controversial.
So it was inflammatory and that was the purpose of it.
And young people were talking about,
they're inundated with this content.
It is everywhere,
but they're using terms and phrases like body count for example.
(12:32):
And so they're learning what that means and then they're learning to adopt that and ask each other,
what is your body count?
Like it comes into normal discussion and discourse with their friendships.
It seemed that the older generations just prefer to try and cut out technology rather than actually helping them deal with what technology is presenting them.
Yeah.
And so these were little short videos maybe what,
(12:55):
1530 seconds on Instagram tiktok and showing any person with a microphone going up to strangers,
maybe strangers,
maybe staged.
Very possible.
Yeah.
Uh,
and asking these questions and then that's how they're learning.
Oh,
ok.
Body count must be important.
So it sounds like when we talk to young people about what they're seeing online,
(13:17):
we might think kind of jump to pornography for example.
But that these things they're seeing by and large are affecting their interpersonal relationships,
their expectations of relationships too.
100%.
I think it's,
it's much harder to sort of identify what's problematic with them.
Um But yeah,
the whole point is it's changing what normal conversation is in a relationship and how people should talk to each other in a respectful relationship to always be accusatory and inflammatory and controversial.
(13:49):
Um And it,
it's very much creates like an US versus them and,
and,
and it really saddles in with a lot of the concept of what it is to be a man or what it is to be a woman,
right?
So then you get these kind of warring parties and then naturally with algorithms,
you get into your echo chamber as well.
So then you just get saddled into your team,
whichever side of the internet you're on and then you hate everyone else.
Um And we're just sowing distrust within young people and they think this is the way that we communicate to each other and this is how we have relationships within community.
(14:18):
So it's no surprise that therefore,
we've got such divides with opinion.
So it,
yeah,
it's very interesting.
But also um hard to detect older people when they're thinking of child safety will immediately jump to nudity and things of that nature.
But that's,
that's not necessarily what they're being exposed to.
And so we're actually,
they're actually being taught to treat others or view others in a certain light which could have massive consequences.
(14:44):
Later on.
Did pornography or sharing sexual images come up,
we focus on them a lot.
As educators with sexual behavior,
online pornography didn't but sharing pitches did pornography did not.
No,
it really did not feature that much.
Um It was more sharing moods and things of that nature.
So when I was in Western Australia talking to some young people at a youth center,
(15:08):
they sort of just on the side remarked like,
oh,
did you hear about this person?
Yeah.
Her photo got leaked to this whole group chat with all these guys in it.
Yeah,
the boyfriend and now they've broken up and they were more excited about talking about the breakup than actually the fact that her sexually explicit images were out there and these people were all obviously under 18.
So and I was like,
(15:28):
oh,
does anyone like know about this?
Like,
have you told anyone they're like,
oh,
no,
like it's on our like,
Finster like,
it's on our other account.
Like mom doesn't know about that one.
I was like,
oh,
ok.
They're like,
yeah.
Yeah.
No,
they do phone checks.
So we have another account or we have another device.
So all of this is taking place and no caregivers have been told about this.
So it's all just happening.
But what was interesting was the focus point was not on the fact that the image was shared.
(15:51):
it was more the scandal of how it all went down and the fact that it broke up this relationship that everyone was invested in apparently.
Wow.
And um for listeners,
Finsta fake Instagram.
Yeah,
love that.
Um And what what other messages around sexual images were there did was there any discussions about expectations around it or people liking it or not liking it?
(16:13):
Stuff like that in terms of sort of,
yeah,
the content in particular,
it was all really tied close to like Instagram,
like um influences and things like that.
So it was more about like,
how do I make sure I meet sort of the trend and I look this certain way,
which often was quite revealing in,
in itself.
So it was this weird desire to as a 14 year old dress like a 25 year old.
(16:33):
Um and be sort of looking like this influencer who is yeah,
10 years older than them.
Um And that seemed totally normal because this person was had so followers brands were endorsing them.
And therefore,
you know,
they were getting all these like gifts or opportunities to travel with their,
you know,
business,
I suppose.
And so that was legitimate and that's a legitimate job.
So therefore that's someone I can aspire to be like,
(16:55):
and it's a role model,
right?
So I can match that and that's totally fine.
So just when they were talking about what they were gonna wear to parties and stuff,
it was all based on what influencers were wearing.
Despite the fact there was such an age gap,
such a a tie in with body image too.
And I feel like for maybe generations that didn't have the internet,
same,
same with magazines and the movie stars they would see and things like that.
(17:18):
It's just kind of taken on a new media.
Yeah,
body image was an interesting one because it affected everyone in very different ways.
And I really noticed specifically with young men or boys or,
or male identifying young people.
The going to the gym was huge and the need to have all the pre workout protein powders and stuff like that even though they're 16.
(17:41):
Um and they're still developing and this concept that they,
they must hit the gym and also the gym was also tied to relationships,
right?
So if you're dumped by a girl,
you go to the gym,
like there was this constant like connection being drawn that like to be your best self,
you have to be physically fit and actually to be physically fit,
you must be like superior and dominant and like be able to take out anybody and therefore somehow that earns you the right to be in a relationship with someone else.
(18:06):
It was really quite bizarre how everything kind of,
nothing was siloed,
everything really intermeshed with everything else.
So you actually can't talk about body image without talking about relationships without talking about consumption online.
It all fed into each other.
And and we looked at that even with energy drinks that even ended up getting tied in to body image because youtubers released an energy drink.
(18:30):
Was it last year,
Jacob Paul et cetera.
It was prime energy drink anyway.
Um And so to be fit and cool like them because he's a boxer like we have to go consume this and then therefore we're an alpha male and therefore then we can get the girl.
It just,
it didn't make sense.
But that is genuinely how the connections were made and they were being sold that through various different channels online was Andrew Tate mentioned at all,
(18:55):
not as much as I expected.
It's amazing how fast the world moves on when someone is denied the microphone and camera.
But there are many people taking his place.
There's just,
there's,
there's so many of them and then as I said,
it's completely unregulated,
right?
I've seen so many and they were showing me videos because I was just curious what their algorithms were showing them and I was just sitting on the beanbags,
(19:15):
they were just flicking through Instagram.
I was like,
that's interesting content and um especially with boys,
I noticed there was a lot of gaming was then also tied in with this um men with podcasts talking about masculinity and it was also tied with economics.
So it was a really interesting mix.
So it was like,
you can be a billionaire by 25 but also like you can be really good at playing Fortnite.
(19:39):
But also like we hate women was to get a little subtle messaging tied in there at the end.
Were there differences in what young people said regarding sex,
sexuality,
sexual health across the country?
So maybe differences in different age groups or geographic locations.
I noticed more in all issues.
It was geography that played the biggest role rather than age.
(20:01):
So in particular,
it was um inner city or suburban sort of schools and young people versus regional young people.
And then within those geographies as well,
private versus public.
So I really did notice um on many different issues,
the education system played a heavy role in determining sort of outcomes and what people cared about.
(20:21):
So in particular,
for inner city young people,
they had been exposed to concepts um and terminology before.
So they knew what trans meant,
right?
They understood that more or less.
Um And they understood that people had different pronouns and could identify differently.
Maybe they didn't quite understand why,
but they could kind of get behind it and go like,
oh,
well,
that's fine.
I'll just call this person this now and it was kind of like a non-issue.
(20:45):
Um,
and they were talking things like they would use words like depression or they would use words like,
um gender based violence,
like they would be able to use these terms and,
and more or less understand what they meant and actually use them appropriately.
Whereas when I went regional,
they didn't have the terminology behind them.
They were more kind of what I noticed was it was more symptomatic.
It was more like,
(21:05):
oh yeah,
this girl's photos got leaked or oh,
I can't talk to my mom about that.
She doesn't like believe in that stuff,
but we wouldn't be able to like pull it apart further and be like,
OK,
why is that like,
what particular bit or why is there such a gap?
And um so they were saying things were happening but,
and often themselves,
they were like,
oh,
you know,
(21:25):
I think my friend's something but we're not sure we don't really know what it means and we just let them do whatever they want,
leave them to it.
So,
yeah,
regionally,
I noticed it also only would come up in longer form consultations when I'd developed some real trust with the participants.
So if I'd been there two hours,
that's when they would actually start talking about this stuff and how they didn't feel like they belonged or they think they were gay,
(21:49):
but they didn't know how to deal with that concept and they couldn't talk about it with friends either that came up regionally.
Whereas in the city they were,
they were much more willing to talk about it upfront and,
and try and address it.
So there were differences.
Um,
but yeah,
overall,
they were all overwhelmed with content from online.
That was the same.
But how they could engage in conversations about it was different.
(22:10):
And would you say across the country,
they want to have more conversations in general around relationships,
sexuality,
sex,
100% because they're doing it within their peer friendships,
right?
They're talking about it right now.
They actually want role models and sort of um young adults to help them through that process,
navigate that process.
(22:31):
They want a adults to be talking about this using terminology,
explaining what that even means they want.
As they sort of said,
like an open dinner table conversation,
they want to be able to come home and say,
hey,
I heard this,
what does this mean?
Or hey,
someone said this is that right?
Like I felt uncomfortable about that.
They want their caregivers,
they want their educators to be able to be people and resources of information and trustworthy too.
(22:54):
Um They wanna know where they can go to do their own research,
they wanna be told where to go to find that they wanna continue the peer discussions,
but in particular,
they definitely want like older role models.
So um and that tied into health care as well.
So they said navigating the health care system,
they wanted to speak to someone who had just navigated it or is navigating it now to help them through that process because they didn't find the experts very helpful.
(23:17):
They actually wanted someone who could empathize with that.
So it sounds like a bit of a mix between giving them tangible skills,
sharing,
lived experience even and also opening up space for kind of navigating nuanced discussions.
That might not be,
this is what it's like to go to a clinic for example.
But how are these pressures making you feel?
(23:37):
How are these videos making you feel and things like that?
100%?
It,
it's a multifaceted issue.
There's so many different factors,
as I said,
coming into it because it's coming from all these different sources and different issues are also being dragged in.
Like health care,
accessibility,
mental health are all playing a role in this space.
So it requires a multifaceted solution.
What do you think is most important for parents and carers to know about what young people said regarding relationships and sexuality education from what you heard?
(24:04):
So I did think long and hard about this.
I really hope that what I said earlier actually struck a chord for parents and caregivers.
The fact that the one thing that united young people across the country was a divide between older generations and them.
That was the one uniting factor,
which is terrible and really awful because it means a lot of young people don't have a trusted older person to go to and,
(24:28):
and aren't honest with and can't help them navigate,
despite the fact that they have navigated it previously.
Right.
And they often live with them.
So they,
they know them and there's this secrecy that's being sewn into that relationship.
They're living double lives sometimes.
So I hope that shocked people and I hope coming out of that,
that parents and caregivers know the value of listening and creating an open dialogue and an open space where they're not actually the ones talking because that's often not what young people are actually asking.
(24:59):
They want their voice to be valued and the way they know it's valued and respected is by giving it the space and weight,
by being silent,
by opening it up.
And if that,
it remains silent for a while,
that's ok.
But as long as they know that when they say something go,
oh,
this happened at school,
it's like,
yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Ok.
Can you come down for dinner now?
Like it's not dismissing it as a,
(25:19):
a lack of value to what they're saying.
Like it's their whole world,
it matters to them and the amount of attention that you pay to,
it will ensure that that relationship has that trust.
And therefore hopefully when something does go wrong,
they come to you and get your advice.
But also it's ok to not understand everything they're saying.
A lot of young people were feeling like younger generations were going very fast with change,
(25:40):
demanding a lot of change of the world.
And you know,
it all tied into abortion rights and climate change and you name it.
They,
they just felt like they were itching to change the world and others were everyone else was really hesitant to embrace that change.
I know that parents and caregivers might not understand quite the issues that young people are fighting for.
(26:00):
But we just wanna be heard actually.
Um and not just heard,
but what we say is valued,
which is really important and this concept that respect goes both ways.
Um young people were really sick of being told that just for the sake of their age.
Therefore what they said didn't matter.
And they were too naive to comment on such issues and they didn't have enough life experience.
Well,
that's the point.
You know,
they can bring a really fresh perspective.
(26:22):
They can challenge the status quo because they haven't been here long enough to sort of be engulfed by it and assimilated into it so they can challenge it,
which might not make sense to you.
That's OK.
But like,
let's go abstract,
like let's open it up and let's see where we can find ourselves amazing.
Um What do you think is most important uh for adults who work with young people,
(26:43):
educators,
maybe youth and community workers?
Yeah.
So what struck me with this was um how much young people said they wanted peer to peer learning and they wanted role models.
So they understand experts are great and they've done their degrees and they're really good at what they do.
But they actually want someone to almost help translate it into a language they can understand.
(27:06):
So some of us actually about the concept of like a youth translator,
which is just someone who's a few years older to help actually make it make sense.
Um Because sometimes if you're in that space so much,
it's,
you're used to it,
you understand it,
you also understand the intricacies behind it.
But young people just kinda want to get to the point.
For example,
I used a word before Finster and I didn't even think to explain what that meant.
(27:27):
Um And we'll have lots of slang and it changes so much as well.
So to have sort of that role model person who's also a bit of an intermediary or a mediator almost to help navigate that discussion so that it's almost like age,
not age appropriate.
I hate that term,
but,
you know,
understandable for a young person and also opens up the space.
(27:48):
So a young person can kind of put their input in which kinda leads to young people ultimately,
which is demanding respect.
They just actually wanted to be valued to be in the space.
They didn't wanna be told you should be grateful that we're listening to you.
They wanted to be told.
Thank you so much for sharing and we're actually hearing you,
it just all came back to,
they felt undervalued,
unheard and they were told they were rude for saying.
(28:09):
So I think that's huge for a lot of us to sit with a parent care,
someone who works with a young person that it's not this top down,
we teach you only do what we say.
Don't do that,
do this.
Here's what you need to know nothing more.
It's really come to the table,
let's have a chat.
What's important to you.
(28:29):
How can we help guide?
And often they just want to understand your thinking behind it.
A lot of them were like,
well,
you know,
my teachers just said this is the way it is.
That's it.
They actually wanna understand why,
why,
what,
what was behind that decision making because again,
they're being exposed to information already.
They're being exposed to different ways of thinking.
So they will probably question it or not wanna play ball because they're like,
(28:50):
well,
actually,
I,
I'm not sure if that's quite right.
And if you're not involving them in the discussion,
there's no buy in.
It's not.
I,
I like to come back to the concept of cosign.
So if we want to create solutions for young people,
it has to be co-signed with young people.
And that does not mean only dragging in young people who are going to say what you want them to say so that it fits your predetermined policy agenda.
(29:11):
If you only bring in young people who would just say,
yeah,
that sounds good.
You tick the box and move on and then you wonder why young people haven't embraced it.
It's because you haven't actually co-signed it with them.
Wow,
this was amazing.
Thank you so much for your time.
Thank you for also listening to young people and being this,
I feel like you're kind of the youth translator right now in a way and sharing with us and figure helping us figure out what we need to do better and how we can improve.
(29:36):
Um So thank you so much for your time.
Thank you so much.
Key things which stood out in this discussion for me are young people identified.
Lgbti Q A plus topics and issues and discussions as a knowledge gap in their education.
(29:59):
Young people are getting messages about relationships,
gender roles and body image through content that adults might not see as explicit or impactful.
Young people spoke of a generational divide around the country and said that they feel like they're not being valued,
listened to or respected and that they want these dinner table conversations about relationships and sex and sexuality with their parents,
(30:26):
carers and trusted adults.
Thanks so much for tuning in for more information about sexual health Victoria.
You can visit us at Sh vic.org dot A U.
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