September 2, 2025 • 49 mins
Writer/Producer Mike Scully talks about being new in a writer’s room, Yakav Smirnoff, how he learned empathy from a non empathetic childhood, being a boss, taking over The Simpsons, how 5 daughters run his life, writing with his wife Julie, writing with his brother Brian, doing stand-up, Amy Pohler, Parks & Rec, how Jay ruined Bruce Sprinsteen being on The Simpsons, NRBQ, being a Masshole, getting fired, owing a lot to his mom, writing jokes for the Golden Globes, the WGA, and how Scully costs Jay millions when he unionized Fox Animation Domination.
Bio: MIKE SCULLY BIO 2025Emmy,Peabody,and Writers' Guild of America Award winning writer/producer Mike Scully has worked in all genres of TV comedy: animation, single-cam, multi-cam, hidden-cam, award and live performance shows.He joined "The Simpsons" writing staff since 1993 and was promoted to showrunner in 1997 for Seasons 9 through 12 and co-wrote and co-produced "The Simpsons Movie,”released in 2007. In 1998, he organized writing staffs of all the Fox animated shows to win Writers Guild of America union coverage for the writers,which had been underpaid and without healthcare and pension contributions for the first nine seasons of the series. He was a consulting producer on the show until 2021 and continues to write occasional episodes.Scully also served as writer/producer on the Emmy-winning "Everybody Loves Raymond," as well as"Parks & Recreation,” starring Amy Poehler. (He also appeared on the show four times as a disgruntled citizen of Pawnee asking stupid questions at town meetings.) He was a writer/producer on the critically acclaimed “The Carmichael Show” starring comedian Jerrod Carmichael.
He has written jokes for Poehler and Tina Fey when they hosted the Golden Globes and for their current liveshow,The Restless Leg Tour.He co-created (with wife Juie Thacker-Scully & Amy Poehler) the animated Fox/Hulu show"Duncanville”starring Poehler, Ty Burrell, and Rashida Jones,which ran three seasons. He also co-created some non-critically acclaimed and very quickly canceled shows such as "The Pitts”, “CompleteSavages", and an animated version of "Napoleon Dynamite.”In 2024, he and Julie produced the ABC pilot Shifting Gears starring Tim Allen and Kat Dennings.The Scullys parted ways with the show after it was ordered to series. He has five daughters who provide a never-ending financial reason to keep working.
Bio: MIKE SCULLY BIO 2025Emmy,Peabody,and Writers' Guild of America Award winning writer/producer Mike Scully has worked in all genres of TV comedy: animation, single-cam, multi-cam, hidden-cam, award and live performance shows.He joined "The Simpsons" writing staff since 1993 and was promoted to showrunner in 1997 for Seasons 9 through 12 and co-wrote and co-produced "The Simpsons Movie,”released in 2007. In 1998, he organized writing staffs of all the Fox animated shows to win Writers Guild of America union coverage for the writers,which had been underpaid and without healthcare and pension contributions for the first nine seasons of the series. He was a consulting producer on the show until 2021 and continues to write occasional episodes.Scully also served as writer/producer on the Emmy-winning "Everybody Loves Raymond," as well as"Parks & Recreation,” starring Amy Poehler. (He also appeared on the show four times as a disgruntled citizen of Pawnee asking stupid questions at town meetings.) He was a writer/producer on the critically acclaimed “The Carmichael Show” starring comedian Jerrod Carmichael.
He has written jokes for Poehler and Tina Fey when they hosted the Golden Globes and for their current liveshow,The Restless Leg Tour.He co-created (with wife Juie Thacker-Scully & Amy Poehler) the animated Fox/Hulu show"Duncanville”starring Poehler, Ty Burrell, and Rashida Jones,which ran three seasons. He also co-created some non-critically acclaimed and very quickly canceled shows such as "The Pitts”, “CompleteSavages", and an animated version of "Napoleon Dynamite.”In 2024, he and Julie produced the ABC pilot Shifting Gears starring Tim Allen and Kat Dennings.The Scullys parted ways with the show after it was ordered to series. He has five daughters who provide a never-ending financial reason to keep working.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Strawhut Media. Hi, I'm Mike Scully and I'm on don't
be along with Jake Cogan because I had a dental
appointment next door.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
Don't be alone with jj Cogan.
Speaker 3 (00:17):
Hello, Cogan Nation, Hello, don't be al owners. It's time
for don't be along with Ja Cogan. I am Jake
Cogan and you are you, and I love hearing from you.
So please write to me at dbawjk at gmail dot
com with all your suggestions, with all your comments or
your criticisms your listener mail. I love it, I want
it all and I really appreciate it. And if you
(00:39):
have the chance, you can press subscribe to this on
YouTube or like or whatever it is on whatever you're
listening to. You can write a nice review. I love
all the positive interaction, the kindness. We're just trying to
get all the algorithms to think the show is worthwhile.
And on the human side, if you actually think a
show is worthwhile for a human being, you can just
(01:00):
send it to a friend and just say, hey, listen
to this. This might be fun for you. I do
it all the time with many other podcasts, and people
are appreciative. They like it. But only if you think
it's good, but maybe do Anyway, today we have a
really great show for you. I guess today is Mike Scully,
who used to work on the Simpsons. I also used
to work on the Simpsons, but I didn't work with
(01:21):
Mike Scully. But after I left, Mike went on the
show and eventually became the showrunner. And what's remarkable about
Mike is that people love him. People embrace him. People
see him as a wise, pleasant, sweet showrunner figure. And
(01:44):
part of me is jealous because I want to be
perceived as that, but part of me is just impressed.
How does he do it? What's his trick, what's his secret?
Why do people like him so much? Why don't they
like me that much? We'll find out more about this crazy,
kooky guy from Massachusetts and what brought him to Los
Angeles and what makes him cool and wonderful.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
Right after this don't.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Be alone with JGG.
Speaker 3 (02:15):
Let's talk about getting from Springfield to Hollywood. So you
you started out doing stand up comedy.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
When I first got out here in eighty two. Yeah,
I was just doing like open mic nights at the
Improv and Comedy Store in various Do you go to France?
Speaker 3 (02:33):
From Massachusetts to New York first, did pit stop there?
Speaker 1 (02:36):
No, suppose do. That's actually one of my big regrets.
I've worked with so many people that have great stories
about their years in New York doing like SNL or
Letterman or Yeah Solar, Yeah exactly, and I never had
that in my career. I just came straight out here.
But I feel like I missed something with the New York.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
Here ironic that you grew up in a town called
Springfield and then spent much of your life writing about
a fictional Springfield.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Right, yeah. No. A lot of people have asked me,
is it based on this? And I said, well, I
didn't join the show until season five, so that would
be but impossible.
Speaker 3 (03:08):
The Simpsons is into predictions, so maybe no, that's true.
But so what made you think there was a career
here for you?
Speaker 1 (03:16):
God, I had just kind of hit a point. I
literally went to community college for a half a day,
Holy Community College in Massachusetts and thought, this isn't for me.
I knew better right right then.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
I just started it's a place for geniuses. Yes, yeah,
I get it.
Speaker 1 (03:38):
Yeah, I really didn't know. I just thought I'm just
going to work. Because you got to remember too. This
was like, you know, I graduated high school seventy four,
so you know, it was not that a hurd of
to not go to college. It wasn't automatically expected of
everyone the way it is now. So I just started
(04:00):
taking jobs, working various you know, flipping burgers and doing
retail and hospital janitor. And I was a driving instructor.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
That was the best of the shitty jobs.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Driving instructor, Okay, I there was a blast nerves of steel.
Uh yeah. But it was also I think because of
like the Bob Newhart album and I had that in
my head all the time. And and for some reason
there was a commercial I felfilliated. There was a commercial
in the sixties where the instructor also had a steering wheel, yes,
(04:32):
which wasn't true. Well you just have a break, okay,
but you have to reach over and grab the wheel
if you need to steer around something. But uh so
that that job was just fun because I was on
my own all day. You know. Did you teach your
kids to drive? Yes?
Speaker 3 (04:47):
I did?
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Yeah, right, yeah.
Speaker 3 (04:48):
Did you use your professional skills to do it or
do were you more of a dad saying scream at
your kids? No?
Speaker 1 (04:55):
No, I actually because it actually goes back to the
first time I went out my dad. He took me
out driving, literally, you know, the very first time I've
driven a car, because he would never let us touch
his car, and within the first couple of minutes he's
screaming at me like, can't you fucking drive, like like
at the top of his lungs anchor not that it
(05:17):
took a lot to get him there. So I always
kept that in mind, you know, whether it was teaching
other people's kids to drive or teaching my kids. I'm
incredibly patient.
Speaker 3 (05:29):
Me too too, But it does require a certain uh,
you have to commit going in that there may be
a car crash. You know, something stupid might happen. It's okay,
as long as nobody gets hurt. We're just gonna ride
this out and we're gonna do our best prevented.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
But it's okay.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
Yeah, So like you have to go in with that
to calm yourself down. Yeah, But I didn't. I never,
I didn't. I didn't tend to scream at any thing.
I just got to stop stop stop stop stops. Yeah,
you know we're going to stop. You can still stop
brake pedals right there, just put your foot.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
Yeah. No, I'm very good about knowing, like well in
advance of like letting people know what we're going to
do next with the no surprises and uh. I even
when I was teaching driving, I had a student, uh
that was deaf, and but he was a great lip
reader and uh but in order for him to know
(06:31):
what we were going to do next, he had to
keep looking at me. And then I it took me
a while to get like, oh, I got to get
these I gotta really be concise with you. But he
was actually a great driver because he had been taking
his parents' car for years without them knowing since he
was like thirteen.
Speaker 3 (06:51):
Most of us did, didn't you take your car your
dad's car? Never?
Speaker 1 (06:55):
Are you kidding me? Really? Just terrified in my day,
yea was Yeah, he was a kind of a rage machine.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
Yeah all right, yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
Didn't have that. Well, that's good, and my mom was
the complete opposite.
Speaker 3 (07:09):
This could explain why you're known to be one of
the great showrunners. This is you have a reputation. I
wouldn't know because one of the people at the table
has never hired me, so I wouldn't know whether or
not you're actually a good showrunner. But I've heard reputationally
that you're a very very good showrunner. And one of
(07:30):
those things is because you may be living in reaction
to a screaming, angry dad.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
Yes, that's probably a good part of it. And yeah,
I also I, you know, love my family, want to
go home at night. I had worked on shows where
that was wasn't always the case.
Speaker 3 (07:49):
But the qualities that are part of being a good
show is I want to get out of here, that's
for sure one of them. Patients is another one. But
respecting people's time, being aware of other people's time, not
just your own, expecting a schedule, like understanding that other
people are professional and have jobs to do, and like
you you and and the quality of the shows that
(08:12):
you have made are been very, very high.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
So yeah, I would say.
Speaker 3 (08:19):
Pretty good, pretty good, even shows that may not have
been the most successful shows, Like I was a big
fan of The Pits. I was a big fan Duncanville. Thanks,
these are great shows. I mean, I think when you
made Duncanville, I think I wrote you a fan letter
saying it was fantastic. Yeah, and it really was, because
we had been in a series of terrible cartoons being
(08:41):
made and suddenly like, oh, here's a good one.
Speaker 1 (08:44):
Thank you. Yeah, thanks Sank. Yeah, we know. We had
a blast too, and just fun staff, fun cast. It
was during COVID, so we were doing it all from
like the kitchen table and learning all that hard. It
was crazy. Yeah, well we didn't know what we were
capable of doing, or how do you do this? And
then how do you record the actors and that kind
(09:05):
of stuff. We had actors in their cloud. We co
created the show with the Amy Poehler and but the
cast was Amy and Ty Burrell and just just a
great fun cast. But then you're recording them in like
in their closets at home, and depending on their closet,
you were like, we're still getting some echo on that.
Can you put another coat over your head right? Adjusting
(09:27):
sound that way? And the actors had to learn to
become kind of sound engineer just basically yeah, so but no, thanks.
It was it was one of those things we wound
up being kind of the victim of financial We wound
up with three studios owning a piece of the show
because Fox was sold to Disney during that time, so
(09:48):
suddenly we had three studios owning the show and nobody
wanting to back off and be the you know major
If everyone took a little less, maybe we could all
keep this going. It just wouldn't happen.
Speaker 3 (10:01):
And you met any when you worked on Parks and Rec.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
Yes, yeah, yeah, fantastic. Yeah, it was a blast because
I mean, she's she's everything you want her to be
and more. She's so much fun and I think just
kind of that fellow mass whole thing clicked in like
right away, like we got along well. Whether she was
in the room or on set was it was like
one of those shows where you really a lot of
(10:26):
times writers don't want to go on set.
Speaker 3 (10:28):
Right Yeah, yeah, Why do you think that is?
Speaker 1 (10:31):
They can be turbulent places or the you know, depending
on who the cast.
Speaker 3 (10:36):
Is, and seemed like that's where the fun was.
Speaker 1 (10:38):
Depending on the show, I think, you.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
Know, so, I mean, I guess, I mean even on
the most grumpy of shows, the what's going on on
set seems more fun than what's going on in the writer.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
Well, Parks and Rec was a rare thing where both
places were equally fun. Like you didn't care if you
were in the room or you're on set, You're going
to have a good time, right, And Parks and Rec
was just a unique show. And I think it was
the tone set you know, from Mike Sure, you know
in the writer's room and Amy on set, and you
(11:13):
were going to have a good time no matter where
you were. And even as the years went on on
Parks and Rec, I still remember if you gave it
an actor, like a new joke on set, you know,
like sometimes the joke just wouldn't work or something like that,
so you're give an or toss in an extra joke
at the end of the scene. They can always cut
it if they want. And I remember like Nick Offerman
(11:36):
would come over and this was like I think season four,
and he came over after I had given him an
extra joke and we tried it. It seemed to work,
he can remember, and he shook my hand and goes,
thank you very much, sir. This season four. At that point,
you know, the actors are usually barely speaking, right, but
the thing, you know, they're working on their next thing.
Speaker 3 (11:56):
That's also some Nick weirdness too, just about the formality
and all that, But.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
That's who he is. I mean that that cast was
just u It was like I've been very lucky to
work with a lot of really you know, nice people
for the most part.
Speaker 3 (12:09):
That's that I find that most of show business is nice.
Speaker 1 (12:13):
It really is.
Speaker 3 (12:13):
There's like a five percent of hellions, yes for everybody else,
but most of is really really nice.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
Yeah, yeah, that's true. Yeah, there's like a handful of monsters,
and it's usually the same people you hear all the time.
Speaker 3 (12:27):
And you wrote jokes for Amy and Tina, did you
write some Golden Globe jokes or yes?
Speaker 1 (12:34):
The years when they hosted the show so funny. Uh,
they were terrific and it was a real learning experience
for me. I had never done like an award show
or anything before, and we were all kind of crammed
into this little area backstage. I was a nervous wreck.
I was because it was largely it was kind of
like SNL kind of New York people like Robert Carlock
(12:56):
and Seth Myers was there, and you know, so I
didn't really know the people. I only knew Amy really,
and I remember and then like Amy and Tina were
getting like fitted for wardrobe and hair's being done and
Tina's got a laptop, you know, interlap while they're doing
it right, and they're honing the script, like right down
to the last minute.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
I mean, that is the nature of those people. I
did a thing with Seth Myers and he was again
he's walking with his laptop typing, like getting it done.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
Like I think it's that SNL training that that kicks
in so automatically for them that it doesn't seem crazy
to work that way. But for me, you know, and
I'm more relaxed of like, oh, give us an hour
or two, we'll get a joke, right.
Speaker 3 (13:42):
I've never worked at SNL, but I always thought it
would be great fun And then everyone I've spoken to
has said, no, it's not fun. It's really horrible. It's
very difficult and unhappy.
Speaker 1 (13:53):
But I do feel yeah, and I have that same feeling,
but I wish I had done it for at least
like a week and then got fired. Let's talk about firing.
So have you ever had I thought, I thought you
were ending the podcast, You're.
Speaker 3 (14:09):
Doing great, You're doing great so far. Have you ever
had a fire or somebody?
Speaker 1 (14:15):
Yes, yes, And to this day I've there's no good
way to do it. You kind of like wish somebody
was just being such a jerk and like where it
could be easier. But and and the first time I
did it, I was I'm terrible at it. I'm just
(14:37):
awful at it. And I remember the first one. I
actually because in your head you kind of like prepare
what you're going to say. But there's nobody sitting across
from you. And suddenly you're looking at a fellow human
being and a person you actually like personally. And and
(15:00):
it's not that they did something egregiously wrong or like
and and I started to tear up. I write to
the point of where that person was consoling me.
Speaker 3 (15:13):
That's a great strategy, by the way, you break down
a panic and they say it's okay, man, it's I'll
find another job.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
It's just an awful, awful thing because you're you're you know,
you're putting somebody out of work. You're taking income out
of their pocket. They might have a family or what.
You know. It's it's horrible. It is horrible, because if
it ever gets easier for you, I think there might
be something wrong with you.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
Don't be alone.
Speaker 3 (15:59):
And have you ever been fired?
Speaker 1 (16:01):
Oh god, no, with the cut of mind, you exactly fantastic,
by the way, Yes I have been fired. Yes I've
been fired. A few times, all right, actually, yeah, uh,
and it sucks.
Speaker 3 (16:16):
Do you understand why you were fired or in the
in those occasions or do is it just like it
doesn't matter? It doesn't.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
Usually it's kind of a I think when it's it's
been kind of a clean sweep thing, like where they're
like firing everybody. But there was one time where it
was I thought it was a sweep and then found
out it was me.
Speaker 3 (16:35):
Oh no, it was just me.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
Bad.
Speaker 3 (16:38):
Yeah, so misery calls to other people saying, isn't it
bad that we all got fired, and they say, Mike, uh,
we're in the office right now.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, that that I remember being. I was
so you know, calm, you know, and handling it so
well when I just assumed it was the group, and
then it was like an hour or two later I
found out it was just me.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
That is a bummer that I've been fired as far
as I know once, only once, and it was shocked
to me.
Speaker 1 (17:10):
Yeah, and uh and I still don't know why. Oh really,
so I wasn't there was no warning, and it wasn't explained.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
No warning, and it was not explained. It was a
decision of a star on a TV show, and uh,
and I had uh worked on the pilot, and then
the pilot went and then and then and as we're
making the pilot and into the series, during that process,
I got my here's your.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
Hat, but the pilot went to serious. Yeah, so we
have a shared experience.
Speaker 3 (17:43):
Yeah, and I got I got paid. I got paid
contracts as you get paid. So but I still don't
and the show, I mean, of course I'm biased, but
the show wasn't better for my not being there. But
I was kind of relieved to not be there part
of the time.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
So I don't know.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
It was something there's good and bad about it.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
Yeah. Yeah, I mean in the moment, it sucks, you know,
and then because you don't know what the future is,
you know, But then you move on to the next thing.
Speaker 3 (18:10):
And I have not introduced you, by the way, it
has been forever. So you're Mike Scully right here, Mike Scully.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
Yeah, yes, all right, fantastic.
Speaker 3 (18:20):
We never worked together. I only know you sort of
tangentially through The Simpsons and the world of the Simpsons
and and all that kind But you first came to
my attention when you were running working on the Simpsons,
and at some point you helped orchestrate the Simpsons going
from a non WGA show to a WGA show, Right,
(18:42):
is that was that true?
Speaker 1 (18:43):
You're one of those people.
Speaker 3 (18:44):
So like, our contracts because of Sam Simon, were always
attached to the basic Minimum Agreement, So we got paid
what Writers Guild members got paid, but our pensions didn't.
We didn't get pension and health benefits for it.
Speaker 1 (18:58):
Right, or like the script fees were not.
Speaker 3 (19:02):
Our script fees when I was worked there were exactly
what the basic minimum agreement was, really, yes.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
Because when I got there in season five they were
not because it was a non union show. Right, So
the script fee was a third of what the w
g A script fee was, which dictated that your residual
right was based on that.
Speaker 3 (19:24):
Fox when we were working there, Fox got a break.
Fox was a fourth network, started fledgling fourth nent Oh, yes,
he had a break of what that price was.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
So we were, oh, yes that that they they tried
to ride that for years. Yeah, well but.
Speaker 3 (19:39):
Here's a thing you got them. You got the was
a family guy. I mean, who are the who are
the animated shows that were around Fox that became unionized.
Speaker 1 (19:51):
We organized with King of the Hill Family Guy Family Guy,
and to Seth Macfarland's credit, uh, the show hadn't even
aired yet. They were in production on their first episode,
and Seth signed on Futurama, a show called The PJS,
The Eddie Murphy, and then I think there was one
(20:13):
other was like five or six shows, and we basically
sent a letter to the studio saying, if we're not
covered by the WGA deal and treated equally to live
action writers, within two weeks, we're shutting down all these shows.
It was kind of a wildcat strike situation.
Speaker 3 (20:34):
Right, And.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
To the studio's credit, they tried to bribe their way
out of it, right, it didn't work, and we just
kind of hung together and they made they they saw
the sense of it, and there was part of me
that in talking to them, I think there was they
were kind of partially like because this is now season
like nine or so, and where they were like, what
(20:59):
took you guys so long? Right, you know, because you
know you're never going to be on a show that
had more leverage than The Simpsons did in the nineties, right,
So yeah, So we were able to get the show
covered because I didn't know my agent didn't tell me
when I was on the show. When I got the job,
she didn't tell me it was a non union show.
(21:22):
So I found out when I got my first script fee,
and I thought there was a mistake on the check
and it was explained to me, now that's what it pays.
And then I started to realize, wait a minute, I
don't have healthcare, and just I had because I had kids.
I was the only writer on staff I think at
the time that had kids, so it was a big
concern for me. So anyway, yeah, we we got the
(21:45):
show covered and a lot of you know.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
One of the things that went away in the negotiations
for that the agreement for the show to be w
g A is that character fees for the for the
show up until the point where it was negotiated to
be a union show wouldn't count, right, Okay, so you
(22:09):
know who that.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
Affects, Yes, me, Yeah, no, it's crazy that that. You know,
so many classic and if I could go back, just
actually for one second, because it's talking to you, is
reminding me when The Simpsons first came on, Yes, like
what I had seen the shorts on Tracy Allmon and
I thought it was like okay, you know, and then
(22:31):
when I heard they were going to do a show
like a half I remember my original you know, reaction
was a half half an hour of that every week
good Luck, right, And my wife Julie had been watching
this show and I refused. I thought, I was like,
above cartoon, I've aged not a cartoon. I'm not twelve
(22:53):
years old and I'm an adult. And she said, you've
got to watch this thing. You know, it's it's super smart,
it's really funny. She's just try one, she finally begged.
So she finally got me to sit down for one.
She like made me dinner and put me in front
of the TV. And the episode happened to be bart
the Daredevil. All right. It was the funniest thing and
(23:15):
and particularly you know the gorge sequence. I'm watching it
and going, this is the funniest thing I've ever seen
on television. I'm laughing so loud and hard, and it
just changed my mind, you know, well completely, and I
at that point had no possibility of working on the show.
(23:36):
It just made me a fan of the show.
Speaker 3 (23:38):
That's my favorite episode that we worked on was was
Barta the Daredevil.
Speaker 1 (23:42):
Yeah, very favorite episode.
Speaker 3 (23:43):
I love that that show and it still still holds up.
Speaker 1 (23:46):
Yes, and it's still like to this day that clip
if it pops up in it and I have to watch
it all the way through.
Speaker 3 (23:53):
It was a big fight as you No, I don't
know that Matt Groening didn't want Homer to fall down
the cliff. He says, that's two cartoony. That was that's
not what we do here. We're trying to be a
real show. These are real people. And somebody falls down
the cloth they die, and Sam Simon was like, well,
it will make it seem real. It's not gonna be
(24:14):
like bugs Bunny where he falls down. We don't then
puff a smoke. It's going to be painful and he'll
be injured and have to go to hospital. And you know,
people fall down cliffs and live. It's okay. But there's
a big fight back and forth, and at some point,
mysteriously the animation for that sequence did not get animated.
Speaker 1 (24:32):
Oh wow and fight.
Speaker 3 (24:33):
I thought, well, maybe it was from certain camps didn't
want to and then we had to reanimate it. And
then was finally there was big fighting between people. Eventually
mattuh said, yes, he came to you know, see the
value of it, and I've spoken to him right here,
and he says he now loves it. It's one of
(24:53):
his favorite.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
Things that happens on shows.
Speaker 3 (24:57):
Yeah, Like it was a big fight because it was
the first cartoony thing, yeah, cartoony ish thing we'd ever done,
which is somebody falling down the cliff. That is very
bugs bunny. Yeah. Yeah, But going back to the millions
of dollars I lost from this negotiation, who did the
negotiating of that, of all that stuff.
Speaker 1 (25:17):
It was actually pretty straightforward in that it was just
treat us like a live action show, right, just give
us those right terms, because we were, you know, the
show at that point was you know, was printing money
for Fox, right, and you know, and you would see
these other shows come and go, you know, these live
(25:38):
action shows and new you know, well that stuff. They're
getting healthcare, they're getting pension residuals, all that stuff. But
you know, the Simpsons is kind of keeping this place afloat.
So it all worked out. I mean, to this day,
the fight continues. If you sell an animated show.
Speaker 3 (25:54):
It does not automatically go into the Writer's Guild.
Speaker 1 (25:56):
Bracket, No, because animation is not under the guild MBA
it is not. You're always on your kind of on
your own to fight it with the advice of many
like myself and many other writers who have gone through
it now and can at least.
Speaker 3 (26:12):
Are there any shows on Fox that aren't WGA.
Speaker 1 (26:14):
Now right now? Yes? Which ones? Uh? Crapopolis, Oh, Grimsburg? Wow? Yes,
there's been a since the Disney purchase of twentieth, twentieth
has been great about WGA for animation. Fox Network now
(26:37):
has their own studio called Fox Entertainment, and they have
not been great about WJA coverage, and I continue to
hope that they change back to Wow.
Speaker 3 (26:47):
Yeah, but this show Don't Be Alone with Jake Hogan
is about people coming here to solve my problems. So
you're here to solve my your problem. So my problem
is this that I think you can solve, which is
you're perceived and I've hinted at this before, that you're
perceived as a very good show runner. But also amongst
(27:09):
the crew of The Simpsons and the people, you're perceived
as a good dad. Like when your show runner like
a good dad. I think people think that you have
good advice, that you're pleasant, that you're wise, all these
things that no one thinks about me when I'm running
a show. They're just like, I don't think they think
(27:30):
any of those things. I think they're just like, if
they have a problem, they look at me and then
find someone else.
Speaker 1 (27:34):
So what is it about? What are you projecting? You're
a bad dad?
Speaker 3 (27:38):
I don't. I'm a I'm an okay dad in real life.
But I mean, I don't know. Maybe I don't. I
don't have the gravitas. Do you get the belt out
in the I don't hint anybody, but I do the
snapping things. You know, but everybody says you know, Scully
asks Scully, Scully'll know?
Speaker 1 (27:55):
So people, do you?
Speaker 3 (27:56):
What is it about your advice that's so magical?
Speaker 1 (27:59):
I still remember vividly, like getting my first job on
a show, being like the new person in the room.
Like right before I started, there was a Vanity Fair
article and maybe you were. It was like the Simpsons
Writer's Room, the Dream Team of Comedy or something like that.
So I bought it and read it, thinking, oh, that
would be great to know who the people are and
(28:20):
know a little bit, and instead it freaked me out.
I didn't know the whole Harvard thing right, give me
like you know. So I'm realizing I'm going to be
in a room with like nineteen Harvard grads and I'm
going to be the village idiot with a half a
day community college and anybody who was there will will
back me up.
Speaker 3 (28:40):
I did not.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
Speak for like three months right in the room. Every day.
I was like going home to my wife like, we
can't buy anything. You know, we can't. I'm going to
be fired. And then you start putting that pressure on yourself.
I've got to talk tomorrow, I've got to say something,
I've got to pitch something. And it was really tough.
So I'm never kind of stuck remembering who that guy is.
(29:03):
So whenever I'm running a show and you always try
to bring in some new voices and something that but yes,
you know young plus I had heard you were such
a hot exactly very difficult to work with. Yeah, So
I always kind of picture when I see the new writers,
(29:26):
and inevitably I see like the quietest writer for some reason,
takes the seat farthest from the show runner because you
just don't want to. And I'll sometimes deliberately move people
around and say sit closer to me because I don't
want to miss what you're saying, right, Because there's people
like that, they're just they pitch great stuff, but they're
(29:47):
you know, on the quiet side.
Speaker 3 (29:48):
So I'm hearing empathy. Yes, I'm hearing deep empathy. And
that's a lovely quality that most Hollywood producers are known for.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (29:58):
Oh wait, no, I mean we're not known for that.
That's fantastic.
Speaker 1 (30:02):
Yeah, like I said, I never kind of there's a
part of it. Never stopped being that guy. And also, yeah,
you got to build up people's confidence in the room.
The stronger the room comes together and starts to really work,
the easier my life becomes, you know, and makes me
you know, and we go home earlier, which always is
(30:23):
the goal.
Speaker 2 (30:34):
Is question.
Speaker 3 (30:41):
Question from Alex Ortega, who writes what was one of
the biggest challenges of becoming the show? The shows? I
guess he means the Simpsons becoming the Simpsons showrunner.
Speaker 1 (30:50):
Oh, I'm sure everybody who's run the show would say
the exact same thing, is like, don't wreck it, you know,
And that's the constant fear of or that you were
going to run out of stories, right, that's on your shift.
I don't know, we just ran And there were times
(31:10):
there's always times I think, you know where you feel like, well,
I think we're running on fumes now, you know, And
then the next week somebody has a great idea for something.
You know.
Speaker 3 (31:19):
When I watched the Simpsons that I worked on, I
only see.
Speaker 1 (31:22):
The mistakes, Yeah, I only see the god yes.
Speaker 3 (31:25):
And when I and fortunately there's been forty years of
shows I didn't work on where it's fantastic, Yeah, the
shows are great.
Speaker 1 (31:31):
Or having a solution to something twenty years later, right, yeah,
I got three eight.
Speaker 3 (31:38):
I'm very happy to put that aside, very happy and
not thinking about it anymore. Selma k Rights. What's your
favorite and least favorite guest star during the episodes?
Speaker 1 (31:48):
Oh? God, favorite guest ours. There's so many. When people
come there, there's so much fun. They're usually excited to
be there. And a lot of them are doing it.
I'm sure you remember they were a lot of them
are doing it for the kids originally, like they know
it's the first thing maybe that their kids are gonna
see them in or you know, so God, I remember
(32:10):
like in the early years down there, remember once like
we were busy in the room and Michelle Pfeiffer was there.
We heard she was on stage recording, and so we
got the word like, oh, if you want to come down,
and you see Michelle Pfiffer, you know, like you have
come down, and we were like really busy, like trying
to get something script and it was like, whoever wants
(32:35):
to go okay, go ahead, not the way you think
because a few weeks later, like Werner Klimper was there
from Logan zero and never has the room run so fast. See,
we all wanted to see Colonel that's because you're seeing
your childhood. Oh my god, and I don't. It was
(33:00):
fun watching David Murkin. At one point we had him
doing like a Homer like the way he would say
and he had forgotten how to do it how he
used to say it on the show, and Murkan had
to kind of make reteacher.
Speaker 3 (33:12):
Yes, but no, you'd go more like this, that's so funny.
Speaker 1 (33:17):
Yeah, but we've had we've had great luck with the
guest stars. Everybody's fun and a lot of you know,
I'm a sucker for you know, we've had a lot
of great bands on the show over the years and
where they were like really fun to work with. God,
you know that you haven't micked and Keith. You know
that particular episode the Rock and Roll Fantasy Camp was
(33:39):
so much fun having those guys in you know YouTube,
and yeah, it goes on and on. You guys started
with you know, like McCartney.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
We got lucky. We didn't know at the time that
it would be a cavalcade of celebrities.
Speaker 1 (33:54):
Yeah it was. Yeah. You had Harrison Reo.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
We've had a lot of We had all the these
baseball stars. We had Dustin Hoffman, we had Michael Jackson.
We had like a bunch of great people. Denise and
Karma ask and they have they have they have a
Simpson Simpson Simpson Ology show. They asked, I ask him
if what his favorite Alf compositions are, Well, you know
Alf Clawson past recently.
Speaker 1 (34:19):
Yeah, and yeah.
Speaker 3 (34:20):
This is the first mention of it on this show.
And I had a big relationship with Alf. I was
in charge of music for the first five seasons of
the show. I didn't know and uh, and I got
Alf as the composer for this. We tried a few
different people, and so it was I had I loved
Alf and I thought Alf had the right tone and
(34:41):
style for the show for the longest time.
Speaker 1 (34:43):
And then yes, at some point they didn't, but I
enjoyed working with Alf. He did a lot of I mean,
I remember I had to write the song See My
Best for mister Burns, and and the reason it wasn't
intended to be that it had to be it was
(35:05):
actually like a George pitch was we were at the
part of the story we were basically doing, you know, lady,
you know, one hundred and one dollaration, so we're basically
stealing that story. And we were getting to the point
where Burns was going to explain his plan that he
was going to kill all these dogs to you know,
make clothes. And we were like, all right, how do
(35:26):
we say this and keep it funny at the same
time and not just have it sound you know, grizzly.
And George said, what if we like sang it as
a as a song, because it might automatically feel lighter
and more fun and that way. So that was my assignment.
And at the time, my kids had loved you know,
(35:48):
Beauty and the Beast. We'd seen it many times. So
I took you know, be my guests and made it
See my Best. But I was home writing it and
then Alf had the task of how do you do
it without doing it. But I think some of the
plagiarism rules were a little looser at the time about
doing a knockoff of a song.
Speaker 3 (36:08):
Well, since we were allowed to do parody.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
Yes, he could parody lyrics and then but at one
point musicians came up with, yeah, but you're not parrotying
the tune, So if the tune isn't parodied, it's not
true parody. And then you had to start changing notes
in songs and stuff like that. But Alf did such
an amazing job with that, you know, orchestration.
Speaker 3 (36:32):
He got capture, like like when we did the Capitol
City songs, supposed to be like a Frank Sinatra song,
the orchestrations of Jeff Martin wrote that song, but yeah,
he made it sound Alf made it sound like Nelson
Riddle or Quincy Jones had arranged that.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
Yeah, he was great in a variety of genres. But
he also there was like a sweet spot where he just,
to me, he really shone, you know, like wow this
You'd go down to the stage and watch him do
his thing, and it was amazing to hear.
Speaker 3 (36:59):
The best was the emotion that he added to emotional scenes. Yes,
like that was to do that well without overreaching and
overstepping and make you still feel that it's real and great.
That's magic to me. Yes, and he could do that
in a heartbeat.
Speaker 1 (37:13):
Yeah. No, that's why it was fun when they did
that show at the Hollywood Bowl and you got to
hear so much of the music back to back. You
know that that he composed.
Speaker 3 (37:22):
Mick writes, what's the dirtiest joke he ever wrote for
a Simpsons that aired? Oh shit, I don't think we
were trying to write dirty jokes, right.
Speaker 1 (37:32):
No, there's a Salmon episode where Homer in Marge, like
the whole third act is Homer and Marge or naked
running through town trying to get home. And it was
the first time ever I got a note. We used
to get, you know, standards notes from Fox, but where
I got one where they were asking you, kind of
(37:55):
in bold face, please don't do this episode. In general,
they were very uncomfortable with it, and we had to
assure then it would be okay. There is a segment
where I think Homer is naked standing behind one of
those kind of lawn ornament things that's like two guys
(38:16):
with like lumberjacks with a saw going like in front
of his cross or something, and there was just a
tremendous amount of just nudity that Fox was very very
nervous about. Homer is dragged naked across the ceiling of
the crystal cathedral and goes, oh my, stuff like that,
(38:41):
stuff like that.
Speaker 3 (38:42):
But it seems like in a cartoon, what are they
really worried about? We you have complete control over everything
that they get. You'd have to draw a penis and
then raise it like it seems insane.
Speaker 1 (38:53):
Yeah, be worried. Yeah, well, I mean we always wrote
the show, and you know, for adults, but with an
awareness that kids were watching.
Speaker 3 (39:01):
Yeah, we didn't at first, and then eventually we came
to that. We thought, this is just for adults, and
the people are saying it's a cartoon. Kids are watching.
Speaker 1 (39:10):
So we came to that.
Speaker 3 (39:11):
We got a note, censor notes, you brought it up,
a very strange note. At one point, Homer tells uh
Selma to take this license and shove it up your ass,
and they said, you can't say shove it up your ass.
And they said, all right, well.
Speaker 1 (39:28):
Can we say, uh.
Speaker 3 (39:31):
Shove it in your ass? Much good? Fix?
Speaker 1 (39:35):
I know that was there that was there, that was there.
Speaker 3 (39:39):
They suggested, you know, what would be better if they
shove it in in their ass, and we went all right,
like like we were sacrificing something. I don't I don't
know what they thought. What that went, That one was
better or worse?
Speaker 1 (39:51):
Yeah, I know that that happened sometimes where there was
a an episode might have been a Dan Granny episode
where we needed like a a joke version of like
a viagra type medication, and we the one that was
in the script was bon Estra. That's what we had
in there, and they said, unacceptable for broadcasts, Please submit alternate.
(40:15):
So we sent over as a joke for the standards person,
jam it in and it came back. Okay. So that's
what wound up in the show.
Speaker 3 (40:27):
God bless him. Billy's and writes, can we get Apu back?
Speaker 1 (40:33):
It's up to us, you could. It's not up to us.
Speaker 3 (40:36):
I mean's not coming back. I think as a bruise,
a Simpson's bruise, and they don't want to to sort
of aggravate the wound.
Speaker 1 (40:44):
Yeah, and you know I missed the character. I really do.
I will always say and and and and Hank's areas
defense now he needs defending. But I thought Hank brought
such a great humanity to the character, which is why
we started going to him so often and doing full episodes.
And one of the few characters to really evolve during
(41:06):
the series where he got married, he had kids, and.
Speaker 3 (41:09):
And and Hank will be the first admit that he
did not understand that people, uh you know, that that
people were being hurt by this portrayal and didn't feel
that people were being offended because it wasn't being portrayed
by somebody who's uh, you know, a South Asian person.
Speaker 1 (41:29):
So yes, no, it wasn't like the show was getting
you know, complaints, and that was just wasn't happening. So
you know, the character is missed in that, you know,
he was i'mur Fox once asking me if you could
spin off one character from the Simpsons, who would it be,
And without hesitating, I set up who right, I said,
because he looks at this country completely the opposite of home,
(41:52):
where he actually is the embodiment of the American dream.
He appreciates it, he doesn't take it for granted, and
I thought it was would have been a rich world
to explore. So the character is definitely missed.
Speaker 3 (42:05):
George Wrights during your tenure. What was the which regular
character was the most difficult to write for?
Speaker 1 (42:11):
Sometimes sometimes Marge stories were tough because we didn't want
her to come across as like the you know, the
you know, the the buzzkill or Preacher Naggy like that.
But I think we also found this so many great
you know, March stories. She Julie brings such a great
(42:34):
emotion to the character. And you and I believe Jim,
you know, had the the line of like somebody had asked, like,
why would anybody love, you know, an idiot like Homer
since and Jim's thing was and maybe said it when
you guys were first there, like the audience will love
Homer because Marge loves home, right, And that never goes away.
(42:56):
So in terms of like characters are hard to write for,
it don't really recall it. It's fun when a character
becomes a great surprise, a character you think is one
episode there's a character named Gil that done by Dan Castle,
and that are kind of based on Jack Lemon and
Glengarry Glenn Ross and Dan. We never asked Dan if
(43:16):
you could do Jack Lemon, but it was so funny
at the table, and it was just kind of he
slipped into the rotation of the show and still pops
up from time. So I love like finding.
Speaker 3 (43:27):
Those pretty nice to get character payments for Gill Oh
my god.
Speaker 1 (43:30):
Yeah, but yeah, I don't know if we you know,
Selman could probably answer better now today, It's been a
long time since I've been there on a regular basis.
Speaker 3 (43:39):
Me too. Now I'm back to listener mail.
Speaker 2 (43:42):
Now it's time for listener man.
Speaker 3 (43:49):
This is a question not meant for you, but I
think you may have a good answer for this. Dear
Jay and guest. What's the one great gift you can
give your kids?
Speaker 1 (44:00):
Car? Okay, great gifts and give my kids if you
ask them. My nickname is among the kids is the lecturer, right, Okay?
Because I was famous for giving these very kind of
dad like lectures about life, and one that apparently I
would say a lot is learn to laugh at yourself.
(44:24):
Do you believe that? Absolutely?
Speaker 3 (44:26):
Okay?
Speaker 1 (44:26):
Yeah, yeah, so so because again, everything like TRACE's about,
I'm talking so much about my dad. My mom was
the greatest mom ever. She was the absolute best, and
I would not have come out here without her support,
which at that time, you know, was hard to give
because you really were saying goodbye. There's no cell phones internets.
Speaker 2 (44:48):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (44:48):
And she was sick at the time.
Speaker 3 (44:50):
To travel by train.
Speaker 1 (44:53):
The other Yeah. But my dad had a great sense
of humor up about himself. And if, boy, if you
talked him, if he took like a shot at you,
big laugh and then you topped him, there was hell
to show. And uh, my brother Brian, I don't know
(45:14):
if you ever met Brian. He was a writer on
Simpsons Family Guy, Drew Carey like that. I was working
on this show called Dad's that was a Fox multicamper
Martin Mull, Peter Rieger. They were putting together an opening
segment and they wanted like old pictures of all They
asked all the writers a pick picture with your father
(45:38):
if so. I didn't really have anything. So I called
my brother Brian, and I said, you got any like old,
like any pictures, like like a good picture of me,
me and Dad together, And he goes, you mean something
where you're not flinching?
Speaker 3 (45:56):
All right, now it's time for the moment of joy.
Speaker 1 (45:59):
Oh job, I can tell you, you know obviously. And I
just mentioned that I hadn't talked about her enough memories
of my mom always, like during tough times and or
funny times, or like I'll get on the phone like
(46:20):
with my brothers and sometimes we'll just trade you know,
mos stories, you know, because she was such a you know,
in a different time, she would have been a comedy writer,
but she was not like she wasn't like the body
broad like who would do dirty job. She was so
like smart and subtle and dead pan and funny and
(46:45):
there's but she would also find herself in the these
funny circumstances. She was very married Tyler Moore. She actually
looked a lot like Mary Tyler Moore. Sometimes I'll see
the opening of an Old Mary there's a shot of
her coming up and escalator that Like, it'll get me
teary because it reminds me so much of her. But
(47:05):
she would, you know. So it's always like anything about
my mom because we just I was. I make it
sound like she died when I was five. I was
twenty eight, but it was it was still and you know,
we were so tight, and like I said, she encouraged
the idea of me coming out here while my dad
(47:27):
was yet right about it. And she died a year
before I got my first job, like she didn't get
to see herself be right, And I didn't realize how
sick she was when I left. And you know, so
I realized the sacrifice you tell her the greatest gift
you can give a child. I mean, I can't top that.
(47:50):
Pretty great. Yeah, so she my mom was as with
Beth her and her name was Geraldine Scully and uh,
you know, insanely funny. You're lucky to have that, oh
you to have that to fall back on. Yeah, I
mean she's been gone over forty years, and we still
talk about her in such recent terms, like like these
(48:13):
stories that like they just happened a few months. It's
it's really you know, and that we kind of you know,
keep her alive that way. And so yeah, that's always
a great joy for for me.
Speaker 3 (48:25):
Well, thanks for bringing me down. WHOA, I didn't want
to end this way, but whatever, Uh, that's that's beautiful. Well,
Mike Scully, thank you for being here. And this was
such a delight.
Speaker 1 (48:37):
Really, I plague. I mean, ever since I got your
first email, I was so flattered when you said I
had a last minute cancelation, right, you know, how do
you say no?
Speaker 3 (48:46):
Well, apparently you don't so that's what I was counting
on that for years. I really appreciate you being here.
I really appreciate your that that you're this wonderful, empathetic person.
Congratulations on that and maintaining it in this weird world
of show business. And uh, you know, it's rare to
get somebody who has such a deserved stellar reputation as
(49:10):
you do in the industry.
Speaker 1 (49:12):
So there's a ton of darkness.
Speaker 3 (49:14):
Well keep it to yourself because I like to keep
the the image of you just being a good guy.
And it's been great spending time with you. If you
get a chance, spend time with somebody as well. And
and don't forget to write me at dbawjk at gmail
dot com. If you've got listener questions or viewer bail
or compliments or horrible criticisms. Send them all. I would
(49:37):
appreciate it and I'll see you next time.
Speaker 2 (49:40):
Don't be alone with JJ
Strawhut Media. Hi, I'm Mike Scully and I'm on don't
be along with Jake Cogan because I had a dental
appointment next door.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
Don't be alone with jj Cogan.
Speaker 3 (00:17):
Hello, Cogan Nation, Hello, don't be al owners. It's time
for don't be along with Ja Cogan. I am Jake
Cogan and you are you, and I love hearing from you.
So please write to me at dbawjk at gmail dot
com with all your suggestions, with all your comments or
your criticisms your listener mail. I love it, I want
it all and I really appreciate it. And if you
(00:39):
have the chance, you can press subscribe to this on
YouTube or like or whatever it is on whatever you're
listening to. You can write a nice review. I love
all the positive interaction, the kindness. We're just trying to
get all the algorithms to think the show is worthwhile.
And on the human side, if you actually think a
show is worthwhile for a human being, you can just
(01:00):
send it to a friend and just say, hey, listen
to this. This might be fun for you. I do
it all the time with many other podcasts, and people
are appreciative. They like it. But only if you think
it's good, but maybe do Anyway, today we have a
really great show for you. I guess today is Mike Scully,
who used to work on the Simpsons. I also used
to work on the Simpsons, but I didn't work with
(01:21):
Mike Scully. But after I left, Mike went on the
show and eventually became the showrunner. And what's remarkable about
Mike is that people love him. People embrace him. People
see him as a wise, pleasant, sweet showrunner figure. And
(01:44):
part of me is jealous because I want to be
perceived as that, but part of me is just impressed.
How does he do it? What's his trick, what's his secret?
Why do people like him so much? Why don't they
like me that much? We'll find out more about this crazy,
kooky guy from Massachusetts and what brought him to Los
Angeles and what makes him cool and wonderful.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
Right after this don't.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Be alone with JGG.
Speaker 3 (02:15):
Let's talk about getting from Springfield to Hollywood. So you
you started out doing stand up comedy.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
When I first got out here in eighty two. Yeah,
I was just doing like open mic nights at the
Improv and Comedy Store in various Do you go to France?
Speaker 3 (02:33):
From Massachusetts to New York first, did pit stop there?
Speaker 1 (02:36):
No, suppose do. That's actually one of my big regrets.
I've worked with so many people that have great stories
about their years in New York doing like SNL or
Letterman or Yeah Solar, Yeah exactly, and I never had
that in my career. I just came straight out here.
But I feel like I missed something with the New York.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
Here ironic that you grew up in a town called
Springfield and then spent much of your life writing about
a fictional Springfield.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Right, yeah. No. A lot of people have asked me,
is it based on this? And I said, well, I
didn't join the show until season five, so that would
be but impossible.
Speaker 3 (03:08):
The Simpsons is into predictions, so maybe no, that's true.
But so what made you think there was a career
here for you?
Speaker 1 (03:16):
God, I had just kind of hit a point. I
literally went to community college for a half a day,
Holy Community College in Massachusetts and thought, this isn't for me.
I knew better right right then.
Speaker 3 (03:33):
I just started it's a place for geniuses. Yes, yeah,
I get it.
Speaker 1 (03:38):
Yeah, I really didn't know. I just thought I'm just
going to work. Because you got to remember too. This
was like, you know, I graduated high school seventy four,
so you know, it was not that a hurd of
to not go to college. It wasn't automatically expected of
everyone the way it is now. So I just started
(04:00):
taking jobs, working various you know, flipping burgers and doing
retail and hospital janitor. And I was a driving instructor.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
That was the best of the shitty jobs.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Driving instructor, Okay, I there was a blast nerves of steel.
Uh yeah. But it was also I think because of
like the Bob Newhart album and I had that in
my head all the time. And and for some reason
there was a commercial I felfilliated. There was a commercial
in the sixties where the instructor also had a steering wheel, yes,
(04:32):
which wasn't true. Well you just have a break, okay,
but you have to reach over and grab the wheel
if you need to steer around something. But uh so
that that job was just fun because I was on
my own all day. You know. Did you teach your
kids to drive? Yes?
Speaker 3 (04:47):
I did?
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Yeah, right, yeah.
Speaker 3 (04:48):
Did you use your professional skills to do it or
do were you more of a dad saying scream at
your kids? No?
Speaker 1 (04:55):
No, I actually because it actually goes back to the
first time I went out my dad. He took me
out driving, literally, you know, the very first time I've
driven a car, because he would never let us touch
his car, and within the first couple of minutes he's
screaming at me like, can't you fucking drive, like like
at the top of his lungs anchor not that it
(05:17):
took a lot to get him there. So I always
kept that in mind, you know, whether it was teaching
other people's kids to drive or teaching my kids. I'm
incredibly patient.
Speaker 3 (05:29):
Me too too, But it does require a certain uh,
you have to commit going in that there may be
a car crash. You know, something stupid might happen. It's okay,
as long as nobody gets hurt. We're just gonna ride
this out and we're gonna do our best prevented.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
But it's okay.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
Yeah, So like you have to go in with that
to calm yourself down. Yeah, But I didn't. I never,
I didn't. I didn't tend to scream at any thing.
I just got to stop stop stop stop stops. Yeah,
you know we're going to stop. You can still stop
brake pedals right there, just put your foot.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
Yeah. No, I'm very good about knowing, like well in
advance of like letting people know what we're going to
do next with the no surprises and uh. I even
when I was teaching driving, I had a student, uh
that was deaf, and but he was a great lip
reader and uh but in order for him to know
(06:31):
what we were going to do next, he had to
keep looking at me. And then I it took me
a while to get like, oh, I got to get
these I gotta really be concise with you. But he
was actually a great driver because he had been taking
his parents' car for years without them knowing since he
was like thirteen.
Speaker 3 (06:51):
Most of us did, didn't you take your car your
dad's car? Never?
Speaker 1 (06:55):
Are you kidding me? Really? Just terrified in my day,
yea was Yeah, he was a kind of a rage machine.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
Yeah all right, yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
Didn't have that. Well, that's good, and my mom was
the complete opposite.
Speaker 3 (07:09):
This could explain why you're known to be one of
the great showrunners. This is you have a reputation. I
wouldn't know because one of the people at the table
has never hired me, so I wouldn't know whether or
not you're actually a good showrunner. But I've heard reputationally
that you're a very very good showrunner. And one of
(07:30):
those things is because you may be living in reaction
to a screaming, angry dad.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
Yes, that's probably a good part of it. And yeah,
I also I, you know, love my family, want to
go home at night. I had worked on shows where
that was wasn't always the case.
Speaker 3 (07:49):
But the qualities that are part of being a good
show is I want to get out of here, that's
for sure one of them. Patients is another one. But
respecting people's time, being aware of other people's time, not
just your own, expecting a schedule, like understanding that other
people are professional and have jobs to do, and like
you you and and the quality of the shows that
(08:12):
you have made are been very, very high.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
So yeah, I would say.
Speaker 3 (08:19):
Pretty good, pretty good, even shows that may not have
been the most successful shows, Like I was a big
fan of The Pits. I was a big fan Duncanville. Thanks,
these are great shows. I mean, I think when you
made Duncanville, I think I wrote you a fan letter
saying it was fantastic. Yeah, and it really was, because
we had been in a series of terrible cartoons being
(08:41):
made and suddenly like, oh, here's a good one.
Speaker 1 (08:44):
Thank you. Yeah, thanks Sank. Yeah, we know. We had
a blast too, and just fun staff, fun cast. It
was during COVID, so we were doing it all from
like the kitchen table and learning all that hard. It
was crazy. Yeah, well we didn't know what we were
capable of doing, or how do you do this? And
then how do you record the actors and that kind
(09:05):
of stuff. We had actors in their cloud. We co
created the show with the Amy Poehler and but the
cast was Amy and Ty Burrell and just just a
great fun cast. But then you're recording them in like
in their closets at home, and depending on their closet,
you were like, we're still getting some echo on that.
Can you put another coat over your head right? Adjusting
(09:27):
sound that way? And the actors had to learn to
become kind of sound engineer just basically yeah, so but no, thanks.
It was it was one of those things we wound
up being kind of the victim of financial We wound
up with three studios owning a piece of the show
because Fox was sold to Disney during that time, so
(09:48):
suddenly we had three studios owning the show and nobody
wanting to back off and be the you know major
If everyone took a little less, maybe we could all
keep this going. It just wouldn't happen.
Speaker 3 (10:01):
And you met any when you worked on Parks and Rec.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
Yes, yeah, yeah, fantastic. Yeah, it was a blast because
I mean, she's she's everything you want her to be
and more. She's so much fun and I think just
kind of that fellow mass whole thing clicked in like
right away, like we got along well. Whether she was
in the room or on set was it was like
one of those shows where you really a lot of
(10:26):
times writers don't want to go on set.
Speaker 3 (10:28):
Right Yeah, yeah, Why do you think that is?
Speaker 1 (10:31):
They can be turbulent places or the you know, depending
on who the cast.
Speaker 3 (10:36):
Is, and seemed like that's where the fun was.
Speaker 1 (10:38):
Depending on the show, I think, you.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
Know, so, I mean, I guess, I mean even on
the most grumpy of shows, the what's going on on
set seems more fun than what's going on in the writer.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
Well, Parks and Rec was a rare thing where both
places were equally fun. Like you didn't care if you
were in the room or you're on set, You're going
to have a good time, right, And Parks and Rec
was just a unique show. And I think it was
the tone set you know, from Mike Sure, you know
in the writer's room and Amy on set, and you
(11:13):
were going to have a good time no matter where
you were. And even as the years went on on
Parks and Rec, I still remember if you gave it
an actor, like a new joke on set, you know,
like sometimes the joke just wouldn't work or something like that,
so you're give an or toss in an extra joke
at the end of the scene. They can always cut
it if they want. And I remember like Nick Offerman
(11:36):
would come over and this was like I think season four,
and he came over after I had given him an
extra joke and we tried it. It seemed to work,
he can remember, and he shook my hand and goes,
thank you very much, sir. This season four. At that point,
you know, the actors are usually barely speaking, right, but
the thing, you know, they're working on their next thing.
Speaker 3 (11:56):
That's also some Nick weirdness too, just about the formality
and all that, But.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
That's who he is. I mean that that cast was
just u It was like I've been very lucky to
work with a lot of really you know, nice people
for the most part.
Speaker 3 (12:09):
That's that I find that most of show business is nice.
Speaker 1 (12:13):
It really is.
Speaker 3 (12:13):
There's like a five percent of hellions, yes for everybody else,
but most of is really really nice.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
Yeah, yeah, that's true. Yeah, there's like a handful of monsters,
and it's usually the same people you hear all the time.
Speaker 3 (12:27):
And you wrote jokes for Amy and Tina, did you
write some Golden Globe jokes or yes?
Speaker 1 (12:34):
The years when they hosted the show so funny. Uh,
they were terrific and it was a real learning experience
for me. I had never done like an award show
or anything before, and we were all kind of crammed
into this little area backstage. I was a nervous wreck.
I was because it was largely it was kind of
like SNL kind of New York people like Robert Carlock
(12:56):
and Seth Myers was there, and you know, so I
didn't really know the people. I only knew Amy really,
and I remember and then like Amy and Tina were
getting like fitted for wardrobe and hair's being done and
Tina's got a laptop, you know, interlap while they're doing
it right, and they're honing the script, like right down
to the last minute.
Speaker 3 (13:16):
I mean, that is the nature of those people. I
did a thing with Seth Myers and he was again
he's walking with his laptop typing, like getting it done.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
Like I think it's that SNL training that that kicks
in so automatically for them that it doesn't seem crazy
to work that way. But for me, you know, and
I'm more relaxed of like, oh, give us an hour
or two, we'll get a joke, right.
Speaker 3 (13:42):
I've never worked at SNL, but I always thought it
would be great fun And then everyone I've spoken to
has said, no, it's not fun. It's really horrible. It's
very difficult and unhappy.
Speaker 1 (13:53):
But I do feel yeah, and I have that same feeling,
but I wish I had done it for at least
like a week and then got fired. Let's talk about firing.
So have you ever had I thought, I thought you
were ending the podcast, You're.
Speaker 3 (14:09):
Doing great, You're doing great so far. Have you ever
had a fire or somebody?
Speaker 1 (14:15):
Yes, yes, And to this day I've there's no good
way to do it. You kind of like wish somebody
was just being such a jerk and like where it
could be easier. But and and the first time I
did it, I was I'm terrible at it. I'm just
(14:37):
awful at it. And I remember the first one. I
actually because in your head you kind of like prepare
what you're going to say. But there's nobody sitting across
from you. And suddenly you're looking at a fellow human
being and a person you actually like personally. And and
(15:00):
it's not that they did something egregiously wrong or like
and and I started to tear up. I write to
the point of where that person was consoling me.
Speaker 3 (15:13):
That's a great strategy, by the way, you break down
a panic and they say it's okay, man, it's I'll
find another job.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
It's just an awful, awful thing because you're you're you know,
you're putting somebody out of work. You're taking income out
of their pocket. They might have a family or what.
You know. It's it's horrible. It is horrible, because if
it ever gets easier for you, I think there might
be something wrong with you.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
Don't be alone.
Speaker 3 (15:59):
And have you ever been fired?
Speaker 1 (16:01):
Oh god, no, with the cut of mind, you exactly fantastic,
by the way, Yes I have been fired. Yes I've
been fired. A few times, all right, actually, yeah, uh,
and it sucks.
Speaker 3 (16:16):
Do you understand why you were fired or in the
in those occasions or do is it just like it
doesn't matter? It doesn't.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
Usually it's kind of a I think when it's it's
been kind of a clean sweep thing, like where they're
like firing everybody. But there was one time where it
was I thought it was a sweep and then found
out it was me.
Speaker 3 (16:35):
Oh no, it was just me.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
Bad.
Speaker 3 (16:38):
Yeah, so misery calls to other people saying, isn't it
bad that we all got fired, and they say, Mike, uh,
we're in the office right now.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, that that I remember being. I was
so you know, calm, you know, and handling it so
well when I just assumed it was the group, and
then it was like an hour or two later I
found out it was just me.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
That is a bummer that I've been fired as far
as I know once, only once, and it was shocked
to me.
Speaker 1 (17:10):
Yeah, and uh and I still don't know why. Oh really,
so I wasn't there was no warning, and it wasn't explained.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
No warning, and it was not explained. It was a
decision of a star on a TV show, and uh,
and I had uh worked on the pilot, and then
the pilot went and then and then and as we're
making the pilot and into the series, during that process,
I got my here's your.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
Hat, but the pilot went to serious. Yeah, so we
have a shared experience.
Speaker 3 (17:43):
Yeah, and I got I got paid. I got paid
contracts as you get paid. So but I still don't
and the show, I mean, of course I'm biased, but
the show wasn't better for my not being there. But
I was kind of relieved to not be there part
of the time.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
So I don't know.
Speaker 3 (17:58):
It was something there's good and bad about it.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
Yeah. Yeah, I mean in the moment, it sucks, you know,
and then because you don't know what the future is,
you know, But then you move on to the next thing.
Speaker 3 (18:10):
And I have not introduced you, by the way, it
has been forever. So you're Mike Scully right here, Mike Scully.
Speaker 1 (18:17):
Yeah, yes, all right, fantastic.
Speaker 3 (18:20):
We never worked together. I only know you sort of
tangentially through The Simpsons and the world of the Simpsons
and and all that kind But you first came to
my attention when you were running working on the Simpsons,
and at some point you helped orchestrate the Simpsons going
from a non WGA show to a WGA show, Right,
(18:42):
is that was that true?
Speaker 1 (18:43):
You're one of those people.
Speaker 3 (18:44):
So like, our contracts because of Sam Simon, were always
attached to the basic Minimum Agreement, So we got paid
what Writers Guild members got paid, but our pensions didn't.
We didn't get pension and health benefits for it.
Speaker 1 (18:58):
Right, or like the script fees were not.
Speaker 3 (19:02):
Our script fees when I was worked there were exactly
what the basic minimum agreement was, really, yes.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
Because when I got there in season five they were
not because it was a non union show. Right, So
the script fee was a third of what the w
g A script fee was, which dictated that your residual
right was based on that.
Speaker 3 (19:24):
Fox when we were working there, Fox got a break.
Fox was a fourth network, started fledgling fourth nent Oh, yes,
he had a break of what that price was.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
So we were, oh, yes that that they they tried
to ride that for years. Yeah, well but.
Speaker 3 (19:39):
Here's a thing you got them. You got the was
a family guy. I mean, who are the who are
the animated shows that were around Fox that became unionized.
Speaker 1 (19:51):
We organized with King of the Hill Family Guy Family Guy,
and to Seth Macfarland's credit, uh, the show hadn't even
aired yet. They were in production on their first episode,
and Seth signed on Futurama, a show called The PJS,
The Eddie Murphy, and then I think there was one
(20:13):
other was like five or six shows, and we basically
sent a letter to the studio saying, if we're not
covered by the WGA deal and treated equally to live
action writers, within two weeks, we're shutting down all these shows.
It was kind of a wildcat strike situation.
Speaker 3 (20:34):
Right, And.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
To the studio's credit, they tried to bribe their way
out of it, right, it didn't work, and we just
kind of hung together and they made they they saw
the sense of it, and there was part of me
that in talking to them, I think there was they
were kind of partially like because this is now season
like nine or so, and where they were like, what
(20:59):
took you guys so long? Right, you know, because you
know you're never going to be on a show that
had more leverage than The Simpsons did in the nineties, right,
So yeah, So we were able to get the show
covered because I didn't know my agent didn't tell me
when I was on the show. When I got the job,
she didn't tell me it was a non union show.
(21:22):
So I found out when I got my first script fee,
and I thought there was a mistake on the check
and it was explained to me, now that's what it pays.
And then I started to realize, wait a minute, I
don't have healthcare, and just I had because I had kids.
I was the only writer on staff I think at
the time that had kids, so it was a big
concern for me. So anyway, yeah, we we got the
(21:45):
show covered and a lot of you know.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
One of the things that went away in the negotiations
for that the agreement for the show to be w
g A is that character fees for the for the
show up until the point where it was negotiated to
be a union show wouldn't count, right, Okay, so you
(22:09):
know who that.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
Affects, Yes, me, Yeah, no, it's crazy that that. You know,
so many classic and if I could go back, just
actually for one second, because it's talking to you, is
reminding me when The Simpsons first came on, Yes, like
what I had seen the shorts on Tracy Allmon and
I thought it was like okay, you know, and then
(22:31):
when I heard they were going to do a show
like a half I remember my original you know, reaction
was a half half an hour of that every week
good Luck, right, And my wife Julie had been watching
this show and I refused. I thought, I was like,
above cartoon, I've aged not a cartoon. I'm not twelve
(22:53):
years old and I'm an adult. And she said, you've
got to watch this thing. You know, it's it's super smart,
it's really funny. She's just try one, she finally begged.
So she finally got me to sit down for one.
She like made me dinner and put me in front
of the TV. And the episode happened to be bart
the Daredevil. All right. It was the funniest thing and
(23:15):
and particularly you know the gorge sequence. I'm watching it
and going, this is the funniest thing I've ever seen
on television. I'm laughing so loud and hard, and it
just changed my mind, you know, well completely, and I
at that point had no possibility of working on the show.
(23:36):
It just made me a fan of the show.
Speaker 3 (23:38):
That's my favorite episode that we worked on was was
Barta the Daredevil.
Speaker 1 (23:42):
Yeah, very favorite episode.
Speaker 3 (23:43):
I love that that show and it still still holds up.
Speaker 1 (23:46):
Yes, and it's still like to this day that clip
if it pops up in it and I have to watch
it all the way through.
Speaker 3 (23:53):
It was a big fight as you No, I don't
know that Matt Groening didn't want Homer to fall down
the cliff. He says, that's two cartoony. That was that's
not what we do here. We're trying to be a
real show. These are real people. And somebody falls down
the cloth they die, and Sam Simon was like, well,
it will make it seem real. It's not gonna be
(24:14):
like bugs Bunny where he falls down. We don't then
puff a smoke. It's going to be painful and he'll
be injured and have to go to hospital. And you know,
people fall down cliffs and live. It's okay. But there's
a big fight back and forth, and at some point,
mysteriously the animation for that sequence did not get animated.
Speaker 1 (24:32):
Oh wow and fight.
Speaker 3 (24:33):
I thought, well, maybe it was from certain camps didn't
want to and then we had to reanimate it. And
then was finally there was big fighting between people. Eventually
mattuh said, yes, he came to you know, see the
value of it, and I've spoken to him right here,
and he says he now loves it. It's one of
(24:53):
his favorite.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
Things that happens on shows.
Speaker 3 (24:57):
Yeah, Like it was a big fight because it was
the first cartoony thing, yeah, cartoony ish thing we'd ever done,
which is somebody falling down the cliff. That is very
bugs bunny. Yeah. Yeah, But going back to the millions
of dollars I lost from this negotiation, who did the
negotiating of that, of all that stuff.
Speaker 1 (25:17):
It was actually pretty straightforward in that it was just
treat us like a live action show, right, just give
us those right terms, because we were, you know, the
show at that point was you know, was printing money
for Fox, right, and you know, and you would see
these other shows come and go, you know, these live
(25:38):
action shows and new you know, well that stuff. They're
getting healthcare, they're getting pension residuals, all that stuff. But
you know, the Simpsons is kind of keeping this place afloat.
So it all worked out. I mean, to this day,
the fight continues. If you sell an animated show.
Speaker 3 (25:54):
It does not automatically go into the Writer's Guild.
Speaker 1 (25:56):
Bracket, No, because animation is not under the guild MBA
it is not. You're always on your kind of on
your own to fight it with the advice of many
like myself and many other writers who have gone through
it now and can at least.
Speaker 3 (26:12):
Are there any shows on Fox that aren't WGA.
Speaker 1 (26:14):
Now right now? Yes? Which ones? Uh? Crapopolis, Oh, Grimsburg? Wow? Yes,
there's been a since the Disney purchase of twentieth, twentieth
has been great about WGA for animation. Fox Network now
(26:37):
has their own studio called Fox Entertainment, and they have
not been great about WJA coverage, and I continue to
hope that they change back to Wow.
Speaker 3 (26:47):
Yeah, but this show Don't Be Alone with Jake Hogan
is about people coming here to solve my problems. So
you're here to solve my your problem. So my problem
is this that I think you can solve, which is
you're perceived and I've hinted at this before, that you're
perceived as a very good show runner. But also amongst
(27:09):
the crew of The Simpsons and the people, you're perceived
as a good dad. Like when your show runner like
a good dad. I think people think that you have
good advice, that you're pleasant, that you're wise, all these
things that no one thinks about me when I'm running
a show. They're just like, I don't think they think
(27:30):
any of those things. I think they're just like, if
they have a problem, they look at me and then
find someone else.
Speaker 1 (27:34):
So what is it about? What are you projecting? You're
a bad dad?
Speaker 3 (27:38):
I don't. I'm a I'm an okay dad in real life.
But I mean, I don't know. Maybe I don't. I
don't have the gravitas. Do you get the belt out
in the I don't hint anybody, but I do the
snapping things. You know, but everybody says you know, Scully
asks Scully, Scully'll know?
Speaker 1 (27:55):
So people, do you?
Speaker 3 (27:56):
What is it about your advice that's so magical?
Speaker 1 (27:59):
I still remember vividly, like getting my first job on
a show, being like the new person in the room.
Like right before I started, there was a Vanity Fair
article and maybe you were. It was like the Simpsons
Writer's Room, the Dream Team of Comedy or something like that.
So I bought it and read it, thinking, oh, that
would be great to know who the people are and
(28:20):
know a little bit, and instead it freaked me out.
I didn't know the whole Harvard thing right, give me
like you know. So I'm realizing I'm going to be
in a room with like nineteen Harvard grads and I'm
going to be the village idiot with a half a
day community college and anybody who was there will will
back me up.
Speaker 3 (28:40):
I did not.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
Speak for like three months right in the room. Every day.
I was like going home to my wife like, we
can't buy anything. You know, we can't. I'm going to
be fired. And then you start putting that pressure on yourself.
I've got to talk tomorrow, I've got to say something,
I've got to pitch something. And it was really tough.
So I'm never kind of stuck remembering who that guy is.
(29:03):
So whenever I'm running a show and you always try
to bring in some new voices and something that but yes,
you know young plus I had heard you were such
a hot exactly very difficult to work with. Yeah, So
I always kind of picture when I see the new writers,
(29:26):
and inevitably I see like the quietest writer for some reason,
takes the seat farthest from the show runner because you
just don't want to. And I'll sometimes deliberately move people
around and say sit closer to me because I don't
want to miss what you're saying, right, Because there's people
like that, they're just they pitch great stuff, but they're
(29:47):
you know, on the quiet side.
Speaker 3 (29:48):
So I'm hearing empathy. Yes, I'm hearing deep empathy. And
that's a lovely quality that most Hollywood producers are known for.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (29:58):
Oh wait, no, I mean we're not known for that.
That's fantastic.
Speaker 1 (30:02):
Yeah, like I said, I never kind of there's a
part of it. Never stopped being that guy. And also, yeah,
you got to build up people's confidence in the room.
The stronger the room comes together and starts to really work,
the easier my life becomes, you know, and makes me
you know, and we go home earlier, which always is
(30:23):
the goal.
Speaker 2 (30:34):
Is question.
Speaker 3 (30:41):
Question from Alex Ortega, who writes what was one of
the biggest challenges of becoming the show? The shows? I
guess he means the Simpsons becoming the Simpsons showrunner.
Speaker 1 (30:50):
Oh, I'm sure everybody who's run the show would say
the exact same thing, is like, don't wreck it, you know,
And that's the constant fear of or that you were
going to run out of stories, right, that's on your shift.
I don't know, we just ran And there were times
(31:10):
there's always times I think, you know where you feel like, well,
I think we're running on fumes now, you know, And
then the next week somebody has a great idea for something.
You know.
Speaker 3 (31:19):
When I watched the Simpsons that I worked on, I
only see.
Speaker 1 (31:22):
The mistakes, Yeah, I only see the god yes.
Speaker 3 (31:25):
And when I and fortunately there's been forty years of
shows I didn't work on where it's fantastic, Yeah, the
shows are great.
Speaker 1 (31:31):
Or having a solution to something twenty years later, right, yeah,
I got three eight.
Speaker 3 (31:38):
I'm very happy to put that aside, very happy and
not thinking about it anymore. Selma k Rights. What's your
favorite and least favorite guest star during the episodes?
Speaker 1 (31:48):
Oh? God, favorite guest ours. There's so many. When people
come there, there's so much fun. They're usually excited to
be there. And a lot of them are doing it.
I'm sure you remember they were a lot of them
are doing it for the kids originally, like they know
it's the first thing maybe that their kids are gonna
see them in or you know, so God, I remember
(32:10):
like in the early years down there, remember once like
we were busy in the room and Michelle Pfeiffer was there.
We heard she was on stage recording, and so we
got the word like, oh, if you want to come down,
and you see Michelle Pfiffer, you know, like you have
come down, and we were like really busy, like trying
to get something script and it was like, whoever wants
(32:35):
to go okay, go ahead, not the way you think
because a few weeks later, like Werner Klimper was there
from Logan zero and never has the room run so fast. See,
we all wanted to see Colonel that's because you're seeing
your childhood. Oh my god, and I don't. It was
(33:00):
fun watching David Murkin. At one point we had him
doing like a Homer like the way he would say
and he had forgotten how to do it how he
used to say it on the show, and Murkan had
to kind of make reteacher.
Speaker 3 (33:12):
Yes, but no, you'd go more like this, that's so funny.
Speaker 1 (33:17):
Yeah, but we've had we've had great luck with the
guest stars. Everybody's fun and a lot of you know,
I'm a sucker for you know, we've had a lot
of great bands on the show over the years and
where they were like really fun to work with. God,
you know that you haven't micked and Keith. You know
that particular episode the Rock and Roll Fantasy Camp was
(33:39):
so much fun having those guys in you know YouTube,
and yeah, it goes on and on. You guys started
with you know, like McCartney.
Speaker 3 (33:49):
We got lucky. We didn't know at the time that
it would be a cavalcade of celebrities.
Speaker 1 (33:54):
Yeah it was. Yeah. You had Harrison Reo.
Speaker 3 (33:58):
We've had a lot of We had all the these
baseball stars. We had Dustin Hoffman, we had Michael Jackson.
We had like a bunch of great people. Denise and
Karma ask and they have they have they have a
Simpson Simpson Simpson Ology show. They asked, I ask him
if what his favorite Alf compositions are, Well, you know
Alf Clawson past recently.
Speaker 1 (34:19):
Yeah, and yeah.
Speaker 3 (34:20):
This is the first mention of it on this show.
And I had a big relationship with Alf. I was
in charge of music for the first five seasons of
the show. I didn't know and uh, and I got
Alf as the composer for this. We tried a few
different people, and so it was I had I loved
Alf and I thought Alf had the right tone and
(34:41):
style for the show for the longest time.
Speaker 1 (34:43):
And then yes, at some point they didn't, but I
enjoyed working with Alf. He did a lot of I mean,
I remember I had to write the song See My
Best for mister Burns, and and the reason it wasn't
intended to be that it had to be it was
(35:05):
actually like a George pitch was we were at the
part of the story we were basically doing, you know, lady,
you know, one hundred and one dollaration, so we're basically
stealing that story. And we were getting to the point
where Burns was going to explain his plan that he
was going to kill all these dogs to you know,
make clothes. And we were like, all right, how do
(35:26):
we say this and keep it funny at the same
time and not just have it sound you know, grizzly.
And George said, what if we like sang it as
a as a song, because it might automatically feel lighter
and more fun and that way. So that was my assignment.
And at the time, my kids had loved you know,
(35:48):
Beauty and the Beast. We'd seen it many times. So
I took you know, be my guests and made it
See my Best. But I was home writing it and
then Alf had the task of how do you do
it without doing it. But I think some of the
plagiarism rules were a little looser at the time about
doing a knockoff of a song.
Speaker 3 (36:08):
Well, since we were allowed to do parody.
Speaker 1 (36:10):
Yes, he could parody lyrics and then but at one
point musicians came up with, yeah, but you're not parrotying
the tune, So if the tune isn't parodied, it's not
true parody. And then you had to start changing notes
in songs and stuff like that. But Alf did such
an amazing job with that, you know, orchestration.
Speaker 3 (36:32):
He got capture, like like when we did the Capitol
City songs, supposed to be like a Frank Sinatra song,
the orchestrations of Jeff Martin wrote that song, but yeah,
he made it sound Alf made it sound like Nelson
Riddle or Quincy Jones had arranged that.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
Yeah, he was great in a variety of genres. But
he also there was like a sweet spot where he just,
to me, he really shone, you know, like wow this
You'd go down to the stage and watch him do
his thing, and it was amazing to hear.
Speaker 3 (36:59):
The best was the emotion that he added to emotional scenes. Yes,
like that was to do that well without overreaching and
overstepping and make you still feel that it's real and great.
That's magic to me. Yes, and he could do that
in a heartbeat.
Speaker 1 (37:13):
Yeah. No, that's why it was fun when they did
that show at the Hollywood Bowl and you got to
hear so much of the music back to back. You
know that that he composed.
Speaker 3 (37:22):
Mick writes, what's the dirtiest joke he ever wrote for
a Simpsons that aired? Oh shit, I don't think we
were trying to write dirty jokes, right.
Speaker 1 (37:32):
No, there's a Salmon episode where Homer in Marge, like
the whole third act is Homer and Marge or naked
running through town trying to get home. And it was
the first time ever I got a note. We used
to get, you know, standards notes from Fox, but where
I got one where they were asking you, kind of
(37:55):
in bold face, please don't do this episode. In general,
they were very uncomfortable with it, and we had to
assure then it would be okay. There is a segment
where I think Homer is naked standing behind one of
those kind of lawn ornament things that's like two guys
(38:16):
with like lumberjacks with a saw going like in front
of his cross or something, and there was just a
tremendous amount of just nudity that Fox was very very
nervous about. Homer is dragged naked across the ceiling of
the crystal cathedral and goes, oh my, stuff like that,
(38:41):
stuff like that.
Speaker 3 (38:42):
But it seems like in a cartoon, what are they
really worried about? We you have complete control over everything
that they get. You'd have to draw a penis and
then raise it like it seems insane.
Speaker 1 (38:53):
Yeah, be worried. Yeah, well, I mean we always wrote
the show, and you know, for adults, but with an
awareness that kids were watching.
Speaker 3 (39:01):
Yeah, we didn't at first, and then eventually we came
to that. We thought, this is just for adults, and
the people are saying it's a cartoon. Kids are watching.
Speaker 1 (39:10):
So we came to that.
Speaker 3 (39:11):
We got a note, censor notes, you brought it up,
a very strange note. At one point, Homer tells uh
Selma to take this license and shove it up your ass,
and they said, you can't say shove it up your ass.
And they said, all right, well.
Speaker 1 (39:28):
Can we say, uh.
Speaker 3 (39:31):
Shove it in your ass? Much good? Fix?
Speaker 1 (39:35):
I know that was there that was there, that was there.
Speaker 3 (39:39):
They suggested, you know, what would be better if they
shove it in in their ass, and we went all right,
like like we were sacrificing something. I don't I don't
know what they thought. What that went, That one was
better or worse?
Speaker 1 (39:51):
Yeah, I know that that happened sometimes where there was
a an episode might have been a Dan Granny episode
where we needed like a a joke version of like
a viagra type medication, and we the one that was
in the script was bon Estra. That's what we had
in there, and they said, unacceptable for broadcasts, Please submit alternate.
(40:15):
So we sent over as a joke for the standards person,
jam it in and it came back. Okay. So that's
what wound up in the show.
Speaker 3 (40:27):
God bless him. Billy's and writes, can we get Apu back?
Speaker 1 (40:33):
It's up to us, you could. It's not up to us.
Speaker 3 (40:36):
I mean's not coming back. I think as a bruise,
a Simpson's bruise, and they don't want to to sort
of aggravate the wound.
Speaker 1 (40:44):
Yeah, and you know I missed the character. I really do.
I will always say and and and and Hank's areas
defense now he needs defending. But I thought Hank brought
such a great humanity to the character, which is why
we started going to him so often and doing full episodes.
And one of the few characters to really evolve during
(41:06):
the series where he got married, he had kids, and.
Speaker 3 (41:09):
And and Hank will be the first admit that he
did not understand that people, uh you know, that that
people were being hurt by this portrayal and didn't feel
that people were being offended because it wasn't being portrayed
by somebody who's uh, you know, a South Asian person.
Speaker 1 (41:29):
So yes, no, it wasn't like the show was getting
you know, complaints, and that was just wasn't happening. So
you know, the character is missed in that, you know,
he was i'mur Fox once asking me if you could
spin off one character from the Simpsons, who would it be,
And without hesitating, I set up who right, I said,
because he looks at this country completely the opposite of home,
(41:52):
where he actually is the embodiment of the American dream.
He appreciates it, he doesn't take it for granted, and
I thought it was would have been a rich world
to explore. So the character is definitely missed.
Speaker 3 (42:05):
George Wrights during your tenure. What was the which regular
character was the most difficult to write for?
Speaker 1 (42:11):
Sometimes sometimes Marge stories were tough because we didn't want
her to come across as like the you know, the
you know, the the buzzkill or Preacher Naggy like that.
But I think we also found this so many great
you know, March stories. She Julie brings such a great
(42:34):
emotion to the character. And you and I believe Jim,
you know, had the the line of like somebody had asked, like,
why would anybody love, you know, an idiot like Homer
since and Jim's thing was and maybe said it when
you guys were first there, like the audience will love
Homer because Marge loves home, right, And that never goes away.
(42:56):
So in terms of like characters are hard to write for,
it don't really recall it. It's fun when a character
becomes a great surprise, a character you think is one
episode there's a character named Gil that done by Dan Castle,
and that are kind of based on Jack Lemon and
Glengarry Glenn Ross and Dan. We never asked Dan if
(43:16):
you could do Jack Lemon, but it was so funny
at the table, and it was just kind of he
slipped into the rotation of the show and still pops
up from time. So I love like finding.
Speaker 3 (43:27):
Those pretty nice to get character payments for Gill Oh
my god.
Speaker 1 (43:30):
Yeah, but yeah, I don't know if we you know,
Selman could probably answer better now today, It's been a
long time since I've been there on a regular basis.
Speaker 3 (43:39):
Me too. Now I'm back to listener mail.
Speaker 2 (43:42):
Now it's time for listener man.
Speaker 3 (43:49):
This is a question not meant for you, but I
think you may have a good answer for this. Dear
Jay and guest. What's the one great gift you can
give your kids?
Speaker 1 (44:00):
Car? Okay, great gifts and give my kids if you
ask them. My nickname is among the kids is the lecturer, right, Okay?
Because I was famous for giving these very kind of
dad like lectures about life, and one that apparently I
would say a lot is learn to laugh at yourself.
(44:24):
Do you believe that? Absolutely?
Speaker 3 (44:26):
Okay?
Speaker 1 (44:26):
Yeah, yeah, so so because again, everything like TRACE's about,
I'm talking so much about my dad. My mom was
the greatest mom ever. She was the absolute best, and
I would not have come out here without her support,
which at that time, you know, was hard to give
because you really were saying goodbye. There's no cell phones internets.
Speaker 2 (44:48):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (44:48):
And she was sick at the time.
Speaker 3 (44:50):
To travel by train.
Speaker 1 (44:53):
The other Yeah. But my dad had a great sense
of humor up about himself. And if, boy, if you
talked him, if he took like a shot at you,
big laugh and then you topped him, there was hell
to show. And uh, my brother Brian, I don't know
(45:14):
if you ever met Brian. He was a writer on
Simpsons Family Guy, Drew Carey like that. I was working
on this show called Dad's that was a Fox multicamper
Martin Mull, Peter Rieger. They were putting together an opening
segment and they wanted like old pictures of all They
asked all the writers a pick picture with your father
(45:38):
if so. I didn't really have anything. So I called
my brother Brian, and I said, you got any like old,
like any pictures, like like a good picture of me,
me and Dad together, And he goes, you mean something
where you're not flinching?
Speaker 3 (45:56):
All right, now it's time for the moment of joy.
Speaker 1 (45:59):
Oh job, I can tell you, you know obviously. And I
just mentioned that I hadn't talked about her enough memories
of my mom always, like during tough times and or
funny times, or like I'll get on the phone like
(46:20):
with my brothers and sometimes we'll just trade you know,
mos stories, you know, because she was such a you know,
in a different time, she would have been a comedy writer,
but she was not like she wasn't like the body
broad like who would do dirty job. She was so
like smart and subtle and dead pan and funny and
(46:45):
there's but she would also find herself in the these
funny circumstances. She was very married Tyler Moore. She actually
looked a lot like Mary Tyler Moore. Sometimes I'll see
the opening of an Old Mary there's a shot of
her coming up and escalator that Like, it'll get me
teary because it reminds me so much of her. But
(47:05):
she would, you know. So it's always like anything about
my mom because we just I was. I make it
sound like she died when I was five. I was
twenty eight, but it was it was still and you know,
we were so tight, and like I said, she encouraged
the idea of me coming out here while my dad
(47:27):
was yet right about it. And she died a year
before I got my first job, like she didn't get
to see herself be right, And I didn't realize how
sick she was when I left. And you know, so
I realized the sacrifice you tell her the greatest gift
you can give a child. I mean, I can't top that.
(47:50):
Pretty great. Yeah, so she my mom was as with
Beth her and her name was Geraldine Scully and uh,
you know, insanely funny. You're lucky to have that, oh
you to have that to fall back on. Yeah, I
mean she's been gone over forty years, and we still
talk about her in such recent terms, like like these
(48:13):
stories that like they just happened a few months. It's
it's really you know, and that we kind of you know,
keep her alive that way. And so yeah, that's always
a great joy for for me.
Speaker 3 (48:25):
Well, thanks for bringing me down. WHOA, I didn't want
to end this way, but whatever, Uh, that's that's beautiful. Well,
Mike Scully, thank you for being here. And this was
such a delight.
Speaker 1 (48:37):
Really, I plague. I mean, ever since I got your
first email, I was so flattered when you said I
had a last minute cancelation, right, you know, how do
you say no?
Speaker 3 (48:46):
Well, apparently you don't so that's what I was counting
on that for years. I really appreciate you being here.
I really appreciate your that that you're this wonderful, empathetic person.
Congratulations on that and maintaining it in this weird world
of show business. And uh, you know, it's rare to
get somebody who has such a deserved stellar reputation as
(49:10):
you do in the industry.
Speaker 1 (49:12):
So there's a ton of darkness.
Speaker 3 (49:14):
Well keep it to yourself because I like to keep
the the image of you just being a good guy.
And it's been great spending time with you. If you
get a chance, spend time with somebody as well. And
and don't forget to write me at dbawjk at gmail
dot com. If you've got listener questions or viewer bail
or compliments or horrible criticisms. Send them all. I would
(49:37):
appreciate it and I'll see you next time.
Speaker 2 (49:40):
Don't be alone with JJ
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