February 8, 2023 • 42 mins
John Schmeelk and Tony Pauline review the Senior Bowl and Shrine Bowl to highlight the strongest position groups. They go into each group and pick their top 5 players who can make an impact at the next level. 00:00 - Shrine Bowl and Senior Bowl Conclusions 09:47 - Tight Ends 16:24 - Wide Receivers 20:34 - Quarterbacks 28:27 - Offensive Tackles 32:38 - Guards and Centers 36:29 - Running Backs
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
Over. This is Draft season. John Schmult, Tony Pauline back
with you right here. Go find Draft season on your
favorite podcast platform where you can find it, of course,
on the Giants app or at giants dot com slash podcast.
But this is not a Giants podcast to say, a
draft podcast. But of course if you're a Giants fan,
(00:25):
will talk all about the prospects, and if you aren't
a Giant fan, of course same deal. Man, you're into
the draft, start learning about these guys, or maybe you've
been following it tightly and you know you get Tony's opinion.
So we're get a big show today. We'll do a
really quick wrap up of Shrine and Senior Bowl. If
you want more on those two games, go back to
our episode last week. Tony I talked at the end
(00:45):
of the week, so we kind of covered everything in
terms of the prospects in those games. But we'll do
a little bit more today. Then for the next two weeks,
we're gonna do our Tony Tony's top five at every position.
The show will be offense, the show next week will
be defense, and we'll get into Tony's kind of first
round grades top thirty type thing before we head into
the combine that we get combined combined review, and then
(01:07):
we're like a month and a half away. So where
be rocking and rolling here as draft season rolls along, Tony.
It's good to see it. Man. How was your trip
back from Mobile? Quick? An event free? So that that's good?
I mean three days in Vegas for Shrine game, which
was fun, and then there was a bit bit of
a Howard horroering trip from Vegas to Mobile through Atlanta,
(01:28):
and then the three days at Senior Bowl practice primarily
sitting next to you. You know, it starts off, you're
all excited, and by the middle of the of the
practices when I'm going from Shrine to Senior like, all right,
you're counting the days down before you get home. But
you know, it was good overall, It's always good. You
always fun, no question, was a great time watching practice
(01:48):
with you. So I guess let's let's start there. Just
major takeaways. You can go Shrine or Senior Bowl first
and then we'll try to get into your top fives here. Yeah,
I think when you look at the Shrine there were
some guys really performed well. Katrell Clark, the cornerback from
Louisville was very impressive all three days. A T. Perry,
the receiver from Wake Forest, had a lot, a lot
(02:10):
of really good uh days of practice. The Mario Douglas.
You know, the big talk about the shrine was Zay
Flowers was gonna be there. And Zay Flowers was there,
although he wasn't in uniform. It wasn't a pad too much,
you know, like practice one day, which was the second
day Sunday, and then he practiced sparingly although he was
out on the field. But the liberty mutual, the deliberty mutual,
the liberty receiver Demorrow Douglas was terrific. I mean he
(02:32):
was like a miniaturized Zay Flowers with his ability to
separate to his routes. He caught everything. He showed a
burst of speed. I think he really helped himself. And
then when you move over to the senior ball, listen,
we got to talk about the two guys who were
voted practice Players of the week. You know Taj Spears.
We spoke about him during the last week's podcast from Mobile.
(02:53):
You follow me on Twitter, he read my stuff at
Pro Football Network. I talked about him every day and
the thing of up Spears was he proved that the
film is real. It wasn't that he was playing in
the American but a conference which doesn't have good defenses.
I mean, his ball carrying skills were outstanding. The vision,
the patients. He's a smaller guy, so he kind of
(03:16):
gets lost behind his line and he runs behind his pads.
The foot quickness, the burst, everything was outstanding. Again. You know,
let's go back to when we had Jim Maggie on
this program where Jim said that he feels that Taija
Spears could be a feature runner at the next level.
And I was like, but you know what, watching I'm
saying absolutely. I mean, if you're a team that's only
(03:36):
gonna run your hand the ball up to your running
back ten to twelve times a game where you rotate
your backs, tie, Chase Spears is absolutely a starter. And
you know, we talked about his running skills. I don't
know if you remember, but on the last day of
practice they were doing past catching drills and he was
up against one of the safeties and wow, he threw
a move on the safety. The safety was stock and cement,
(03:58):
I mean the safety was grasping an air. He blew
by the safety through his routes caught the ball and
it was game over. And Spears was just terrific last week. Yeah,
and look, I thought the running back class was good too. Uh.
He and Kenny McIntosh on his team, he thought. I
thought I had a pretty nice week. Could practice with
a couple of drop passes, which is odd for him,
such a good receiver. Eric Gray out of Oklahoma I
(04:19):
thought was really good. Another five not running back that
did well. We only saw Roshan Johnson for one day
until he had the hand injury, and then Chase Brown
in Illinois was solid too. Tony. Yeah, absolutely, it said
that Johnson had that hand injury. You know, you talked
about Eric Gray. Oklahoma running backs have a history of
doing well at the Senior Bowl and then they go
on the middle round picks in the draft and then
(04:40):
they're very productive pros. That has been their m O.
And I think that's gonna what's gonna happen with Gray.
And then when we talk about the defensive player of
the week, Sydney Brown, I mean, wow again. You know,
we talked about him last week on the podcast and
what I said was, you know, Sydney Brown's ball skills
his cover skills was was probably as good as any
of the quarterbacks at the Senior Ball. And I mean
(05:01):
a year ago. You may remember Jalen Petrie from Baylor
was at the Senior Bowl and there were questions about
his cover skills because he was used more in the
box as sort of a hybrid linebacker safety and he
blew everybody away ended up as a second round pick.
Similar situation with Sydney Brown this year. Granted he was
used more, you know, in center field, but is he
(05:24):
tall enough to be for what? Is he tall enough
to cover the larger receivers? Is he quick enough? He
showed it all. I mean, he showed he played well
every single day covering receivers in one on ones in scrimmage.
And again, like I said, like his ball skills were
as good as many as the cornerbacks that were that
we're in mobile for the Senior Ball. Yeah, I want
(05:45):
to give a shout out to Tony. To the offensive
line group, I thought they played particularly well. You know,
those one on one pass our shows are designed for
the defensive players to to succeed, and I thought the
offensive lineman won those drills. To be quite honest with you,
I think you have day one step and started as
their guarden center. Um Donald right at tackle, did really well.
Jalen Duncan I thought did pretty well when he was
at left tackle. Dawn Jones obviously just practiced for one day.
(06:09):
When he did, he was dominant. I think, you know,
you might not get a ton of you know, first
round offensive lineman in this draft. You know, maybe a
little less than a handful. But I think in round
two and three, you're gonna get a ton guy a
ton of guys picked and they're gonna step in and
they're gonna play right away. But Clendon Curtis of Tennessee
Chattanooga also it was really really good to remember Tennessee
chattogat a gout and then a cold Strange who was
(06:30):
in the two thousand twenty two Senior Roll was a
surprise first round pick. I don't think mcclennon Curtis has
a chance of being the first round pick, but he
could sneak in the late board to Day two. He
showed some versatility, he's got an NFL body, actually took
some nice snaps that did some nice reps at left tackle.
He's not gonna be a left tackle but he showed
that versatility and that was the one thing that we
saw and he kept You kept pointing out with Cody
(06:52):
Mock about how they moved these guys around. Guards were
playing right guard. College right guards were playing left guard
and tackle. Jalen Duncan played Who's a left tackle all
his college career in Maryland, played some right tackle. So
they moved these guys around. You've got an idea what
these guys can of can't do. I thought it was
a terrific job by that coaching stip by those coaching steps,
I should say, yeah, I want to just shout out
(07:14):
osires torn. So I thought it was fantastic. Best interior
alignment there. John Michael Schmidt's showed Yeah, maybe back into
the first round at center, probably a second round pick,
though more likely Matthew Berg round at serious. He was
another guy Tony mentioned moved around guard and tackle. Cody
make even played some center. Steve a Villa, the big
TCU guard, played some center. So those guys moved around.
(07:34):
I thought they did a really nice job. And then
I guess we should just mention to the wide receiver
cornerback by Battles. I'm not sure we're gonna have any
first round receivers or corners come out of the Senior
Bowl this year, which is not surprising. Usually, you know,
those are positions we get a lot of underclassmen coming
out early, and those are gonna be the star players
at those spots. But I thought there was some good
competition of those two spots throughout the week. I mean,
(07:57):
Tank Dale you couldn't cover. I mean he was. He
was beating people off the line, he was beating defenders
through there in the routes, and when he got in
the open field he has a burst. The problem is
he's on the hundred sixty five pounds, So where does
he go in the drift. You're gonna have to design
place for him. You're gonna have to design a position
for him. You've got to keep him off of press coverage.
And as fast as Tank Dell was on the field,
(08:18):
it was Jaden Reid of Michigan State who was topping
the GPS as far as speeds were concerned every single day.
He had had an outstanding week. And Michael Wilson of
Stanford I think, really exceeded expectations, especially with his route running.
I mean, team defenders could not stay with him in
or out of routes. Yeah, you're right, he was open
the whole day. Bigger guy to over two hundred pounds,
(08:39):
he has some strength to him. I thought he did
a really nice job. And I'm just gonna shout out
Jayden Read out of Michigan State, who you know, had
a down year this year, much like the entire Michigan
State program. But he played mostly in the slot in
Mobile and I thought he showed speed quick this, he
was able to get open, showed good hands. So just
another guy I thought did well. And then I'll mention
Luke Musgrave to Tony another guy that could be as
(09:00):
round pick coming out of that event Um out of
Oregon State. You showed he showed some rust with some
drops and stuff, but the overall physical package and athleticism
was certainly on display. And remember when Jim Nagy was
on this program. Naggie said that everyone has Michael Mayer
of Notary Dame as the numbers tight end number one,
but keep an eye on Musgrave. And you know you
said he showed some rust because he was injured, he
(09:21):
missed most of the season, and I think he told
you that, you know, he wasn't und percent people I
said I spoke, which said he looked like he was
playing injured. But he looked damn good. I mean, he
was very athletic, he showed good speed. I mean he
looked like the potential you know, tight end that plays
the position like a receiver, which is what the NFL
wants these days. All right, Tony, let's get to our
top five here, And since you were just talking about him,
(09:43):
I know it's unorthodox, but Stuart, let's talk tight ends
because I think this is a wonderful class. I went
through these guys the last few days, and you probably
have five or six guys that have gone before any
tight end in the last year's draft class. And Tramcarbride
was a good prospect, but these guys are just different.
I'll give you I'll list off Tony's top five, and
(10:04):
then Tony, you can kind of give me your thoughts
on the guys and why you order them what you did,
and then we'll talk about him a little bit. So
you're tight end. Top five. You have Michael Mayer out
of Notre Dame, the third year junior, first round grade.
You have Luke Musgrave out of Oregon State, number two,
Tucker Craft at a South Dakota state as your third guy.
Both guys with kind of first second round picks. Sam
(10:24):
Laporta at Iowa second round selection, and then Dalton Kincaid
at a Utah kind of a second third round guy.
Give me your thoughts and why you ordered them that way. Yeah,
Mayor Musgrave and Craft are very close. There's not much
that that that separates them. I gotta wait and see
what Mayor runs at the forty in at the combine,
because there's word that he may not break four eight.
(10:46):
And then we want to see what Musgrave. I'm told
you could run a low four five. And then there's
my favorite Tucker Craft. Now it depends on what you want.
I mean, Mary's your traditional three down tight end. He's
your nineteen eighties type of tight end, if you will,
in the sense that he's a terrific in line blocker.
He can block on the second level. He is a big, strong,
(11:07):
stout pass catcher. Remember I've talked about him in comparison
to Mark Bavarro of the New York Giants going way
way back. He is that type of tight end that's
not necessarily what the league wants these days. You know,
they want the guys that can get down the field
much grave does that. Tucker Craft of South Dakota State
really does that exceptionally well. And Tucker Craft is a
(11:29):
decent blocker they don't need. They don't ask him to
block all that much because he's such a good pass catcher,
but he's always looking the block when the assignment calls
for he's out on the second level blocking. Uh. Number
four is Sam Reporter of i who I just think
is ridiculously under rated. The guy has been a terrific
tight end at Iowa the past three years. He's an
outstanding pass catcher. I love this route running Tony. When
(11:51):
I watched him, I thought this route running was spectacular.
I I wrote that in my report. He runs excellent
routes for a bigger tight end. Doesn't is a solid
job walking. He's projected to run in the four sevens.
Doesn't look like a downfield threat, but he's very, very
dependable in all areas. And then there's Dalton Kincaid, who
really wasn't even the number one tight end at Utah
(12:13):
this year, even though he had all those measurables. It
was Brian Queith. Queet went down with an injury, Kincaid's
game took off. Now Kincaid has an injury, So I
think Dalton Kinkaide's one of those guys that because of
the injury, he's not gonna be drafted as early as
he should be. But if he gets back to health
and he starts to improve on what he showed he
(12:34):
can do during the season, he's gonna be a real
fine starting tight end down the road. And then there's
you know, Luke Schumacher is right behind the kid from
Michigan who's a third round pick. It kind of falls
off after that, after your first five or six guys.
All right, I want to follow up on Dalton Kincaid
because Tony I thought he runs like a wide receiver,
(12:54):
Like he's long, he's kind of slenderly. If you're looking
for this group, and I even more so than Muscar,
if you're looking for like that move tight end that's
a receiver, I think Kincaid's probably your guy. I just
love the way he moved in the second and was
able to kind of separate get open, and I bet
you he's gonna run pretty well in indeed, if he runs,
remember I mean go back to Jim Age told us,
(13:17):
you know, he may not be healthy, he may not
be able to run before the before the draft, which
is why he'll kind of be pushed down and be underdrafted.
You know, he looks thin because he's six six and
a half, I mean, and he's two under forty two pounds.
That that's why he looks thin, because he, like he said,
he's got such excellent length, natural pass catcher. I always
(13:38):
thought he was underappreciated at Utah, was never a big
player in that offense until Queen went down with the injury.
But he's got a tremendous amount of upside and if
he can, if he's able to get back to health
and improve on the ability that he showed late in
the season when he took over the starting spot at Utah,
some team's gonna hit a home run with him at
(13:59):
the tight end. One guy I want to ask you
about that that's not on your top five is Darnall Washington,
the basically offensive tackle that's playing tight end for Georgia.
Six seventy two seventy pounds, only twenty eight catches last year.
He's playing behind Bowers right, who's the number one tight end,
And you know Tony. He can block obviously at that size,
(14:19):
you know, he has build up speed. But once he
gets going, he can go against Oregon. He's like hurdling
guys on the sideline to running after the catch. But
at his side, I just don't see a great change
in directions start and stop. But boy, you know, tight
ends a traits position, and he's like, there's no one
that looks like this guy that plays that spot well. First,
and he is, you're an inch shot. He's six eight
(14:41):
and short. He was two eighty pounds coming out of
the National Championship game when he reported for combine training,
and he started training for the combine just a few
days after National Championship game. Now I smoke with his
team we're actually on my flight, uh going home, and
they said the goal is to get him down to
(15:02):
two hundred and sixty five pounds by by the time
the combine comes around. That's very aggressive. The hey at
six pounds, he moves incredibly. Well, you're right about the
change of direction. I think the fact is also is
Darnell Washington is the starting tight end on just about
(15:23):
pent of the teams around the nation except Georgia, except Iowa.
You know, except maybe Notre Dame. And what happened is
he played second field the bowers, he didn't get to save,
he didn't have the same responsibility. So I think he's
very undeveloped in that area of the route running area,
the pass catching area. So with Washington, you're probably looking
(15:46):
at a late day to pick and he's a developmental prospect.
You're gonna put him on the field on shortened third
and short uh goal line situations where you want to block,
maybe you throw on the wall. But I think it's
something where it's gonna be a process with Washington to
turn him into make him go from the awesome athlete
(16:06):
that he is at the incredible slides that he has
right now into a tight end while to upside there. Yeah,
and look he had great hands and you know there
was one pass he was going off the seamos storm
behind him. He had to flip his hips get around.
He reached out behind them, made a hands catch like
freakish things. But again, yeah, just the little role when
it comes to the route running a right let's uh,
let's jump to the other skill spot, Tony. We'll kind
(16:27):
of stick with the theme here. Let's go to wide receiver.
We've talked a ton about these guys, but we'll touch
on him here too. I imagine your first three guys
in the list are all pretty close, Jackson Smith and
Jigibus your first Quentin Johnson's number two, Jalen Highott number three,
oh at first round grades. Then you have Jordan Addison
and a Flowers with kind of one slash twos. Is
this gonna be like a chef's choice situation depending on
(16:48):
the type of player you want when you're drafting a
wide receiver. If you want to speed, downfield threat, home
run hitting guy, you're gonna go with Jalen Hyatt. If
you want the bigger athlete who can also you know,
break the deep, breaking the break it deep down the
field and has great upside, You're gonna go with Quentin Johnson.
If you want the you know NFL ready player that
(17:10):
you can stick into a lineup, uh you know, basically
from day one, you're gonna go with save Flowers or
uh or or or or Addison from USC. I have
Jackson Smith and Jig but as my number one receiver
because I remember, you know what I saw in the
two thousand twenty one film. I mean, he was outstanding.
Teams couldn't cover him, and this was really before the
(17:33):
rise of Marvin Harrison the second Smith and Jibble was
the number one guy. They knew the ball was going
to him. They really didn't even use a tight end
to him. In two thousand twenty one C J. Stroud
and they had Jeremy ruckerd there rant excellent routes, found
ways to separate. Was really injured this year, had a
third degree hamstring issue which never really resolved itself, although
(17:53):
I'm told he's had a percent now getting ready for
the Combine, So I think that, granted there was a
year off, Smith, Jib is sort of the total package
when you look at all those guys. He's got good speed,
he's a terrific rout runner, He's an outstanding pass catcher
as opposed to Quentin Johnson, who is a great athlete.
He's got the speed he's got, he's a downfield presence.
(18:15):
He can win out for the contestant passes, but he
needs to improve his route running and he needs to
be more consistent about catching the ball with the drops
away from his frame. And he got who is a
great downfield rep but you know, doesn't have an expanded
round tree. He's got to really develop those routes. But again,
if you want a guy just to run down the
field and make me a place for you, Hi, it's
(18:36):
your guy, no question about it, Tony. How how close
is is your next set of white outs after those
top five? You don't have to go through all the
names if you don't want to. But how big of
a drop off if you don't get that wide receiver
at the end of round one, which I think, by
the way, all five of these guys could go at
the end of the round one. That's possible depending on
you know where they fall and what teams want to
pick them. You know, how far is the drop off
(18:57):
to that kind of next group where if you're in
the second round you want to why receiver? You want
to get one there? Well, I mean the next guy
would be K Shawn Booty? Who you know, what are
we getting with K Shawn Booty? Are you If you're
getting the guy that we saw in two thousand twenty one,
you take K Shawn Booty in the second round, you're
potentially getting a first round receiver who played semi decent
(19:17):
football for half of the two thousand two season. After
not being around you know, the first half. If you
take him in the second round and he never really
ups his game, well then you wasted a pick. The
one thing we know about l s U receivers are
they're usually better NF players on the NFL level then
they are on the college level. So be KA Shawn Booty.
He's sort of a wild card because you know, I
(19:40):
don't want to say he could be the best of
the bunch, but he could really could be the best
of the bunch. If you go back to that two
thousand twenty one film you look at the history of
LSU receivers, K Shawn Booty could develop into, you know,
the best receiver from this class. It's just that he
really didn't play that well. And then you go down
You've got you've got Josh Downs, who's a smaller but
(20:00):
very explosive. You've got Cedric Tillman of Tennessee who's a
bigger guy but was injured last year. I think there's
a good group of receivers in that second third round
area who have a lot of potentials but also have
some questions. Yeah, I love Josh Downs, by the way,
I don't see much of for me I don't see
much of a difference between him and A. Flowers. I
(20:21):
think they're very similar, and I think if you know,
you get Downs picks after, I think you're getting a
very similar player. To be honest with you, I think
Flowers runs better routes, but I think Downs is more
of a downfield threat. Got it all right, Let's go
over to the quarterback spot in now. Tone We've talked
about these guys a bunch of obviously, and the ranking
should not surprise people. Bryce Young number one, c J.
(20:43):
Stroud number two. Then you have Hooker third, and Levis fourth.
I'm assuming the injury is why you kind of have
them in different rounds. You can explain that. And then
A O'Connell out of Purdue, and then we'll talk about
the guy that's not on the list as well. So
go through your five. Well, obviously, Brice Young number one.
I know there's gonna be people, especially after his Pro Day,
that are gonna have c J. Stroud jump over Bryce Young,
(21:06):
no doubt in my mind, because c J. Stroud's gonna
throw better deep balls. The pro day workout is made
for c J. Stroud, But when you look at the film,
there's really not much of a difference. I mean, Bryce
Young gets it. He's got an incredible field vision. There's
a clairvoyance to his game where he knows what's gonna
happen before it happens. Doesn't have a great size, doesn't
have a great deep on. It's not a bad deep on,
(21:28):
but he doesn't have that great vertical uh arm that
he's gonna drive the ball downfield. It's a little bit
slow to uh take his head off the framary receiver
from now and then, but he always makes good decisions
here to just real quick, just so people understand. When
we're an indie, people are gonna be waiting with bated
breath on his measurements, not just the height, but also
(21:49):
the way that's gonna be. And look, doesn't be a
lot of players where it's important. There's no bigger measurement
that's gonna come out of Indie than Bryce Young because
no one has really ever succeeded at quarterback in the
NFL at his stature. Tyler Murray two point out. Don't
you remember how everybody was waiting for Kyler Murray's when
he came in slightly over six ft. It went viral
(22:09):
on the internet. It's gonna be a similar situation like that.
And you're absolutely right. I mean, if you draft Brice Young,
you better make sure you put at least five good
offensive linemen in front of him to protect him because
he's not gonna be able to take the beating on Sunday.
He took on Saturday. And it's not just hey, it's
it's with its frame, it's strength. You know, yeah, he
is a he is a slender guy. He's not gonna
be able to withstand the rush. Now physically, mentally, he
(22:33):
does a lot of good things. Steps up in the pocket,
gets rid of the ball, and he protects the football,
doesn't throw adverse passes, doesn't force the ball in the coverage,
which is what you gotta love about him. C J.
Stroud is just the opposite. He's got those physical skills,
he's got the size, he's got the girth he's got
he's got the stoutness of a pocket passer, he's got
the big arm. He's very accurate. You know, again with
(22:53):
c J. Stroud, and we've bemoaned this fact on this
podcast going back to September. You know, c J. Stroudda
I thought it was over coached. At Ohio State, and
all of a sudden when they let him play against Georgia, Boom,
he puts up forty plus points against that defense. He
almost wins that game. So which c J. Stroud are
(23:13):
we getting? If we if we get the c J.
Stroud that you saw at the Georgia Georgia UH semifinal game,
and he's coached correctly and not over coach, and he's
able to there's your franchise quarterback from the two thousand
twenty two draft. There's no doubt in my mind. Uh,
it's gonna be interesting to see. And again you're gonna
see a lot of people moving towards the draft that
(23:34):
have c J. Stroud graded over Bryce Young. And I
think the best way to say it is Bryce Young.
You know what, you're getting a Bright Young. The downside
the Bryce Young is the size and the inability with
stand the rush. C J. Stroud there's a huge upside,
but there's a lot of risk in the pick Tony
real quick, real quick on Straud before you move on
to the Hooker and Levis and look, I'm always wanting
(23:55):
to tell people don't scout the helmet, but we've seen
now to Ohio State quarterbacks come out of that offensive
system in Dwayne Haskins, rest in peace and um justin
fields where the passing part of their game going from
that Ohio State system to the pros did not translate. Well,
you know you're throwing a great receivers, you have great protection,
(24:18):
and this type of route concepts they can run to
Ohio State. You can't even run the NFL because you
can't hold the ball that long. So I worry about
that too. How much of that production carries over when
you go into an NFL system? Go ahead, Sorry, it's
gonna come down to coaching With c J. Stroud. I
think a lot of people be surprised when when they
see Hendon Hooker as my number three quarterback. But I
firmly believe that if Hendon Hooker finished the season healthy
(24:41):
and went through the senior boat process, we'd be talking
about him as the number three quarterback. And I think
Hendon Hooker is in a real good position. He's not
in a good it's bad because he's gonna be underdrafted.
He's got no chance of being a first round selection.
It's probably not gonna be an early won't go into
the sect bottom half of round two, round three, depending
how the injury is. But he's in a good situation
(25:02):
is he's not gonna be able to play in two
thousand twenty three, so he's gonna have to sit on
the sidelines the first three months, which is probably a
big benefit. Hendon Hooker has continually improved his game. He
was good at a Virginia Tech, took it up a
notch in two thousand twenty one in Tennessee, really took
it up a notch this year Tennessee before before he
got injured. When you compare him to Will Levis, yeah,
(25:25):
Levis has got better size, he's stouter, he's got a
better arm, although Hendon Hooker has got a gone good arm.
But Hendon Hooker is the better quarterback. And I just
like the fact that Hendon Hooker, he may not like it.
It's gonna have to sit on the sidelines because of
the injury, which I think will beat to his benefit two, three,
four or five years down the road. Rather than sticking
(25:46):
him in the wine, I'm sticking him behind center and
basically learning on the fire. Levice is, you know, he's
sort of like c. J. Stroud times ten. He's your
boom or bus guy. I've written about it, We've talked
about it. He should have been at the Senor Ball.
He should have been the Shrine Game. As someone that
said to me, was occupational suicide that he didn't go
to the Shrine Game. Considering the Atlanta Falcons were coaching
(26:08):
one of the teams, the Atlanta Falcons need a quarterback,
and the Atlanta Falcons have the eighth pick of the draft.
Why wasn't at the Senior Bowl. Now, when we talked
to Naggy about it, he said, well, there's a toe injury,
but people thought he could have played. You usually don't
go to a game like that because he don't want
to be exposed. And that's the thing with with Levice
Struggles layering the ball, doesn't do the best job with
(26:30):
his reads. A guy who's got high upside for the
big downside. And then I've got Aidan O'Connell and a
lot of people are gonna say, well, how come Anthony
Richardson's not your your top five? And that was my
follow up, Tony, Anthony Richardson could be a great quarterback
in three years. He could also be playing receiver. I mean,
I just there's just too much unknowns about a guy
(26:52):
that has not played much football, who you know, completed
thirty three percent of his passes against Florida State, where
Aidan O'Connell was highly coming in the season. He's got
NFL size, he's a pocket passer, he's mobile, he's got
an arm. He had a solid Shrine game. He's got
a lot of upside. He's a mature guy who knows
what's going on. He's been through a lot, he's married.
(27:13):
I just think that O'Connell is a much safer pick.
Richardson could be a great quarterback in three years. He
could be playing in the CFL in three years. Who
knows what's gonna happen. Yeah, and we'll see where Richardson goes.
You know, most people think he's gonna be a first
round pick. I don't think he's getting in the top ten.
I've seen some people predict that. I think that's a
little bit too rich I think I think Levice will though.
I think you know you mentioned Strouds Pro day Tony.
(27:36):
I think with Levice, teams will see him in his
pro day. He's gonna throw like a seventy five yard
pass or something crazy. He's gonna run really well at
the combine. He's a fast kid, he's tough, they say
he knocks out of the park and interviews. He's a
real good leader. Uh you know, frame size, all that stuff.
He checks every box in terms of traits that teams
are looking for. And then you know, here's what not him.
To Tony, this year was rough, but the team's gonna
(27:57):
go back and watches the game tape against Georgia lash
year and think it'd be like, oh man, look what
he did against the best defense with all these NFL
prospects on it. And then for Hooker, I think to
your point, I think it will help him sitting a
year because that Tennessee offense is nothing like what you
can run in the NFL. The way they spread out,
they used the hashes, stuff like that. So I think
(28:17):
it will certainly help him. Certainly has a lot of
talent um and we'll see, but yeah, I think, uh,
definitely more quarterbacks going in the first round this year
than we had in last year's draft, for sure. All right,
let's go to the offensive line, Tony. Um, let's go
tackle first. Go with your Paris Johnson one. Roger Jones
at Georgia to Paris Johnson's from Ohio State. Dawan Jones,
Johnson's teammate in Ohio State, as your third guy, Anton
(28:40):
Harrison from Oklahoma, and then Warren McClendon at a Georgia
take us to your top five at offensive tackle. I
like Paris Johnson, but I don't like him as much
as other people. I think he's working progress, made the
successful transition from guard to left tackle this year. He's
got excellent length, long arms. He's a good pass blocker.
There's a lot of inc assistancy in this game. You
(29:01):
watch Paris Johnson, he's a devastating run blocker. By the
times he's getting pushed back into the pocket. We saw
that in the semifinal game against Georgia. That wasn't the
only time that happened. So I think it's a matter
of him learning to use that base to anchor and
pass protection. Shows ability blocking on the second level. I
think he's got a high upside, but I think there's
gonna be a few bumps in the road. Roderick Jones,
(29:23):
you know, a little bit shorter, a little bit smaller.
Really want to see his measurements. You talk about the
measurements UH for Bryce Young at the UH at the combine,
there's gonna be a couple of other players, especially in
the offensive line, which we'll get to where teams are
really gonna want to see the measurements of these players.
You know, how long a broaderick Roderick Jones arms are?
They long enough to stay at left tackle. He's got
(29:44):
the physical skills, he's got the athleticism, he's got the agility.
He can slide out and pass protection to protect the edge.
He can get out to the second level. That all works,
and if the measurements, you know, follow along, you're looking
at the guy that's gonna go somewhere. I believe in
the bottom half of round one, Dewan Jones. You know,
we talked about this before he knowed. Dewan Jones as
(30:05):
a massive offensive lineman six stight and a half three
d seventy pounds. He was a dominant run blocker for
two years at Ohio State. But what he showed in
that one day of senior Bill practices he could pass protect.
I mean, there were a lot of speedy edge rushers,
but the wan Jones was able to slide off the
edge of right tackle get his hands into and knock
him from their angle of its attack. You know, he
(30:26):
dispelled the myth that he was a big, stiff right tackle,
sort of in the old mold of right tackles. No,
he showed a lot of agility. He showed the abilities
to shut down the speed rushers, and then he left town.
While he didn't leave down, he just didn't play anymore
because he figured a one and done. I really helped
my draft stock. I have him as a second round pick.
Could he slide into Round one maybe the late part.
(30:48):
Anton Harrison left tackle for Oklahoma. They've had a lot
of good offensive lineman there. Anton Harrison is a mobile,
nimble left tackle. He's a natural left tackle with excellent footwork.
And then warm McClain and then the other kid who
played right tackle at Georgia came into uh Senior Bowl. Pounds.
But it was actually it was a pretty good story
(31:09):
I wrote about a Pro Football Network. Warren McClendon's roommate
was the kid who died in the car accident for Georgia.
That was his roommate. War McClinton was in that car
when it when it crashed, and the roommate and the
Stafford died. There was a lot of questions as to
whether or not he was gonna be there. He went
(31:29):
through the Senior Bowl. He wore his roommate's number. Of
the fact that he went there and competed, and he's
such a good player. I think both you know it
was gonna help war mcclenton's very impressive. I think he's
a darn good right tackle as well, Tony. I'll throw
out two other guys that we saw at the Senior
Boy I mentioned one earlier, don't know, right, I think
he could easily be a second round pick. And I
think Wanya Morris Franklin from Oklahoma had a pretty nice
(31:52):
Senior Bowl too, and I think he could be a
day to pick. Right. Yeah, I think more right tackles.
And you know you're looking at you know you want
those past protectors, you want those nimble guys. Jalen Duncan
you mentioned earlier who I think so little cemented himself
as a Day two pick, just as long as everything
checks up, off checks off on the off the field stuff.
(32:12):
And Matt berge Run, I mean I think Matt berge Run.
You mentioned him at left tackle as well as guard.
You know, those nimble, agile guys. That's what the league wants. Uh.
And I think he's also probably a third round choice.
And you see him as you think he can play
tackle in the NFL, you see more my and my
theory with with tackles is leave him at left tackle
(32:34):
until that they can't play left tackle because it is
such an important position. No, look, I think he did
a really good job at left tackle with the Senior Bowl.
All right, let's go to the interior offensive line and
the first guy into Lis Tony. I'm sure people said, wait, wait, wait, wait,
why was any on your tackle list? What's going on here?
That's Peter Skernsky at the Northwestern We talked about John
Michael Schmidt's the center out of Minnesota, number two, one
(32:55):
of your favorites. Luke Whippler, I'm sure killed you to
put him behind John Michael Schmitts on this list, But
you did Osire's tours from Florida, who we ventured earlier.
Four and then you want to make Fatton at a
Clemson number five in your top five guards center list
to want to take us through it. Well, let's talk
about why Scronsky's on my guard list and not my
tackle list. You talk about Bryce Young, and everyone's gonna be,
(33:17):
you know, anticipating the measurements. For me and a lot
of people in the scouting community, that's what it's gonna
be with Scronsky. There's rumors he's not gonna be six
ft four. There's rumors his arms aren't gonna be thirty
three inches long. If his arms are on thirty three
inches long, he's not a tackle. He's gonna be kicked
inside the guard. He is a real good football player.
He is a real good offensive lineman. He's a tough,
nasty lineman who dominates opponents. He's got great vision, he's
(33:41):
got a violence to his game. He's a good pass
protector as well. I want to see those measurements because
everything I'm hearing screams guard right now. Maybe I'm hearing
the wrong things, but let's see. You know, you're gonna
be looking for everyone's gonna be looking at Bryce Young's
height and weight. I want to see Scronsky's height and
one because that will determine whether or not he's gonna
(34:02):
be a guard or a tackle next level. He may
end up moving to my tackle a board. He will
be a top five tackle could be right there with
the Paris Johnson. I tend to like Paris Johnson a
little bit more than sponsor. You know, other people feel differently, um,
but I want to see those measurements. John Michael Schmidt's
I mean you you talked about him at the top
of the show. I mean he was terrific at the
Senior Bowl practices. You know, at in Minnesota they basically
(34:25):
used him on the line of scrimmage, but we sawt
the Senior Bowl. He can move. He got out there
the last day of practice. He was twenty yards downfield,
not the defensive back off off of office speed uh
in that two minutes drill and he showed a lot,
a lot of ability. He's got an NFL build. He's
a thick guy with a thick, glower body. I love
the way he quarterback the offensive line. During Senior Bowl practices,
(34:48):
you could see him communicating with his teammates, making the singles,
moving his head back back and forth, making sure everybody
was in position. I think that bodes well. Luke Whippler
has always been one of my favorites, more of a
zone blocking lineman compared to Schmidt, and singularly a zone
blocking lineman. But that's what the league wants, you know,
if they want those guys that are nimble, you can
get out on the second level, can move and or
(35:09):
Agilec's what whippler is. Osiris Torrance who you talked about,
big strong, sort of small area guy, three forty plus pounds.
And I like George McFadden as well. I mean, we've
seen Clemson in the past. Kids playing for Cincinnati right now,
left tackle who moves into moving into garden has had
success at the guard position. That's what I see if McFadden,
(35:30):
who I have as a third round, third round selection, Yeah,
I'm gonna throw a couple of honorable mentions here for
guys that I like. Um Tony Cody Mock out of
North Dakota State will be moving in to your point
with arm length right from left tackle into guarder center. Again,
he hasn't done a muchy it's him ups and down
at that Senior Bowl doing it. But I think, you
know athlete, he kind of just the guy's like no
front teeth, I mean, just looks like an offensive lineman.
(35:52):
I think people are buying to him. And then Steve
a Vial out of TCU. You want a phone booth
guy that's gonna move the pile and be a road greater.
He played a little center on More Deal too. That's
another guy that I think teams are probably gonna like
on the inside sometime on day two. Yes, Steven Villa
is probably the best uh power gap blocker in this
year's draft. I mean, you want a guy that's gonna
(36:12):
punch in the mouth, drive you off the line of scrimmage,
anchored to point and pass protection, but you don't want
to plumb across the line of scrimmage. You don't want
to get him, you know, more than three or four
yards off the line of scrimmage to block emotion. That's
your guy. Yeah, big guy, three nine pounds so monster.
All right, let's go real quick. You want those monster
offensive lineman tonia block for the running backs. And this
(36:35):
is a really good running back class. It starts with
Bejan Robinson, who if you're just going by grade, he's
probably maybe even a top five player in this draft,
top seven, top eight, however you want to do it,
he's number one on your list. To no one's surprised.
Jimmy or give us from Alabama is number two. Taj
Spears we talked a lot about already is also a
second round there. He is number three for you. Zach
(36:57):
Charbonne or carbon at A out of U. C. L
A Is your fourth guy, and then Seawan Tucker out
of Syracuse comes in at number five. Take us through.
I mean, Robinson's the complete package. You know, fifteen twenty
years ago, be Jean Robinson, if he's not the first
pick of the draft, is the second pick of the draft.
But you know they don't. You know, running backs, you're
(37:18):
not that highly big guarded, especially in the draft anymore. So,
Be Jean Robinson is probably gonna be a bottom half
of round one choice. But he's got all going on.
He's big, he's powerful, he's got terrific short area quickness.
He can catch the ball out of the backfield. He
creates jardist for a big guy. And I mean he's
an all around back, as is Jimir Gibbs, who is
a sensational pass catcher out of the backfield. Gibbs has
(37:40):
got excellent size, He's powerful, He's rarely brought down by
the first defender, picks up a lot of yardage off
initial contact, shows the ability to turn the corner. He's
got a burst. I mean, he is a feature back
who who you can line him up in the slot,
you can line him up in the flanks and throwing
the ball, and he's gonna catch the ball for you. Ty.
J Spears talked about him at the top of the show.
(38:01):
Really don't know if there's anything more I can end,
except you know, I came out of the Senior Bowl
thinking what Jim Naggie told us before the Senior Bowl.
J Spears can be a feature runner in certain schemes
at the next level where you're not gonna ask him
to carry the ball twenty times a game. And there
aren't too many schemes in the NFL anymore that ask
your running back to carry the ball twenty times a game.
(38:22):
Zach Scharbonnet very underrated. More of a downhill grinder, but
a guy who he's got excellent short area quickness. He's
he's never brought down by the first defender. He'll carry
the pile. He's a decent pass catcher out of the backfield.
Really a do it all, sort of a throwback type
of running back. But the guy is gonna be exceptional
on third down in short or gold mine situations. Excuse
(38:45):
me now, I and Sewan Tucker graded ahead of Kenny mackintosh.
Kenny mackintosh showed us a lot of good things at
the Senior Bowl. Kenny Macintosh had some terrific runs in
that semifinal game against Ohio State. Kenny Macintosh has not
been consistingly productive. When you look at the height, weight,
the measurables, Kenny Macintosh his light years ahead of Shan Tucker,
(39:06):
but the production was not consistent for Kenny mackintosh, which
bothers me with Sean Tucker. He was a good interior
runner at Syracuse. He showed the ability to turn the corner.
He was a good pass catcher out of the backfield.
Teams knew he was getting the ball. That couldn't stop him.
Maybe after the combine. I will flip the two, but
I when I watched them, Shan Tucker's on the field
(39:29):
and he consistently produces. Kenny McIntosh when he's on the field,
sometimes he produces that. That's a concern for me. All right, Tony,
before we wrap it up here, just give me, like,
what what do you think the deepest group here of
these offensive positions, that's that you really like If you're
a team drafting, and you feel you can feel good
about getting a player in one of these spots on
(39:50):
either you know, late day to or early day three,
and you're gonna feel pretty good about there being a
couple of good players still letting you have one, two,
three groups whatever you want to do. Obviously, I think
you gotta start with with running back, because you know,
when you look at these running backs, I'm looking at
my board right now, I've got, uh who I got
ten or eleven running backs who are top one picks.
(40:14):
And then you got guys like Eric Gray, Chris Rodriguez
and Kentucky who we saw at the senior ball, Dwayne
mcbrod of U A B. Chase Brown of Illinois who
are probably you know, early day three picks that are
gonna be very productive at the next level. So I
don't think it's it's any uh, I don't. I don't
(40:38):
think it's it's in any debate. I think it's running
back all the way. I also happened to like the
center crop. You know, we talked about Schmitz and Whippler,
But I really think in that early part of Day three,
you've got guys like Joe Tipman of Wisconsin, j Scrubs
at Penn State, Ricky Stromberg of Arkansas, Jared Patterson of
(40:59):
Notre Dame. He was by the way, he quietly had
a really good week in mobile pass and I thought
he got very good mobility. He can move pretty well.
Got better and better as the week went on, and
on Thursday he had a dominant practice both at guard
and center. And remember, I mean as a sophomore at
Notre Dame, everybody who's talking about him as being a
very early picket center moved to guard. Took a while
(41:20):
to uh to get quite get adjusted. And I didn't
even mentioned Ohlawatini of Michigan, who I I like him
as a college player. I think he's gonna to be
a solid NFL pro. I don't like him as much
as a lot of other people. I'm rooting for him
because easy got to root for. But he's not really big,
(41:41):
he's not powerful, he's not overly athletic. He just gets
the most from his ability and it gets the job done.
And while I think there's a place for somebody like
that in the NFL, I just don't know that there's
a place for a guy like that in the top
four rounds of the NFL traft Tony, good stuff. Next
week we'll have your top fives on defense. Can't wait
look forward to it. John for Tony Polly and I'm
(42:01):
John Schmoke. Thanks for joining us on draft season again.
Go subscribe on your favorite podcast platform or check us
out on The Giants Apper or Johns dot com Slash Podcast.
For Tony, I'm John. We'll see you next week with
a look at Tony's top fives on defense.
Over. This is Draft season. John Schmult, Tony Pauline back
with you right here. Go find Draft season on your
favorite podcast platform where you can find it, of course,
on the Giants app or at giants dot com slash podcast.
But this is not a Giants podcast to say, a
draft podcast. But of course if you're a Giants fan,
(00:25):
will talk all about the prospects, and if you aren't
a Giant fan, of course same deal. Man, you're into
the draft, start learning about these guys, or maybe you've
been following it tightly and you know you get Tony's opinion.
So we're get a big show today. We'll do a
really quick wrap up of Shrine and Senior Bowl. If
you want more on those two games, go back to
our episode last week. Tony I talked at the end
(00:45):
of the week, so we kind of covered everything in
terms of the prospects in those games. But we'll do
a little bit more today. Then for the next two weeks,
we're gonna do our Tony Tony's top five at every position.
The show will be offense, the show next week will
be defense, and we'll get into Tony's kind of first
round grades top thirty type thing before we head into
the combine that we get combined combined review, and then
(01:07):
we're like a month and a half away. So where
be rocking and rolling here as draft season rolls along, Tony.
It's good to see it. Man. How was your trip
back from Mobile? Quick? An event free? So that that's good?
I mean three days in Vegas for Shrine game, which
was fun, and then there was a bit bit of
a Howard horroering trip from Vegas to Mobile through Atlanta,
(01:28):
and then the three days at Senior Bowl practice primarily
sitting next to you. You know, it starts off, you're
all excited, and by the middle of the of the
practices when I'm going from Shrine to Senior like, all right,
you're counting the days down before you get home. But
you know, it was good overall, It's always good. You
always fun, no question, was a great time watching practice
(01:48):
with you. So I guess let's let's start there. Just
major takeaways. You can go Shrine or Senior Bowl first
and then we'll try to get into your top fives here. Yeah,
I think when you look at the Shrine there were
some guys really performed well. Katrell Clark, the cornerback from
Louisville was very impressive all three days. A T. Perry,
the receiver from Wake Forest, had a lot, a lot
(02:10):
of really good uh days of practice. The Mario Douglas.
You know, the big talk about the shrine was Zay
Flowers was gonna be there. And Zay Flowers was there,
although he wasn't in uniform. It wasn't a pad too much,
you know, like practice one day, which was the second
day Sunday, and then he practiced sparingly although he was
out on the field. But the liberty mutual, the deliberty mutual,
the liberty receiver Demorrow Douglas was terrific. I mean he
(02:32):
was like a miniaturized Zay Flowers with his ability to
separate to his routes. He caught everything. He showed a
burst of speed. I think he really helped himself. And
then when you move over to the senior ball, listen,
we got to talk about the two guys who were
voted practice Players of the week. You know Taj Spears.
We spoke about him during the last week's podcast from Mobile.
(02:53):
You follow me on Twitter, he read my stuff at
Pro Football Network. I talked about him every day and
the thing of up Spears was he proved that the
film is real. It wasn't that he was playing in
the American but a conference which doesn't have good defenses.
I mean, his ball carrying skills were outstanding. The vision,
the patients. He's a smaller guy, so he kind of
(03:16):
gets lost behind his line and he runs behind his pads.
The foot quickness, the burst, everything was outstanding. Again. You know,
let's go back to when we had Jim Maggie on
this program where Jim said that he feels that Taija
Spears could be a feature runner at the next level.
And I was like, but you know what, watching I'm
saying absolutely. I mean, if you're a team that's only
(03:36):
gonna run your hand the ball up to your running
back ten to twelve times a game where you rotate
your backs, tie, Chase Spears is absolutely a starter. And
you know, we talked about his running skills. I don't
know if you remember, but on the last day of
practice they were doing past catching drills and he was
up against one of the safeties and wow, he threw
a move on the safety. The safety was stock and cement,
(03:58):
I mean the safety was grasping an air. He blew
by the safety through his routes caught the ball and
it was game over. And Spears was just terrific last week. Yeah,
and look, I thought the running back class was good too. Uh.
He and Kenny McIntosh on his team, he thought. I
thought I had a pretty nice week. Could practice with
a couple of drop passes, which is odd for him,
such a good receiver. Eric Gray out of Oklahoma I
(04:19):
thought was really good. Another five not running back that
did well. We only saw Roshan Johnson for one day
until he had the hand injury, and then Chase Brown
in Illinois was solid too. Tony. Yeah, absolutely, it said
that Johnson had that hand injury. You know, you talked
about Eric Gray. Oklahoma running backs have a history of
doing well at the Senior Bowl and then they go
on the middle round picks in the draft and then
(04:40):
they're very productive pros. That has been their m O.
And I think that's gonna what's gonna happen with Gray.
And then when we talk about the defensive player of
the week, Sydney Brown, I mean, wow again. You know,
we talked about him last week on the podcast and
what I said was, you know, Sydney Brown's ball skills
his cover skills was was probably as good as any
of the quarterbacks at the Senior Ball. And I mean
(05:01):
a year ago. You may remember Jalen Petrie from Baylor
was at the Senior Bowl and there were questions about
his cover skills because he was used more in the
box as sort of a hybrid linebacker safety and he
blew everybody away ended up as a second round pick.
Similar situation with Sydney Brown this year. Granted he was
used more, you know, in center field, but is he
(05:24):
tall enough to be for what? Is he tall enough
to cover the larger receivers? Is he quick enough? He
showed it all. I mean, he showed he played well
every single day covering receivers in one on ones in scrimmage.
And again, like I said, like his ball skills were
as good as many as the cornerbacks that were that
we're in mobile for the Senior Ball. Yeah, I want
(05:45):
to give a shout out to Tony. To the offensive
line group, I thought they played particularly well. You know,
those one on one pass our shows are designed for
the defensive players to to succeed, and I thought the
offensive lineman won those drills. To be quite honest with you,
I think you have day one step and started as
their guarden center. Um Donald right at tackle, did really well.
Jalen Duncan I thought did pretty well when he was
at left tackle. Dawn Jones obviously just practiced for one day.
(06:09):
When he did, he was dominant. I think, you know,
you might not get a ton of you know, first
round offensive lineman in this draft. You know, maybe a
little less than a handful. But I think in round
two and three, you're gonna get a ton guy a
ton of guys picked and they're gonna step in and
they're gonna play right away. But Clendon Curtis of Tennessee
Chattanooga also it was really really good to remember Tennessee
chattogat a gout and then a cold Strange who was
(06:30):
in the two thousand twenty two Senior Roll was a
surprise first round pick. I don't think mcclennon Curtis has
a chance of being the first round pick, but he
could sneak in the late board to Day two. He
showed some versatility, he's got an NFL body, actually took
some nice snaps that did some nice reps at left tackle.
He's not gonna be a left tackle but he showed
that versatility and that was the one thing that we
saw and he kept You kept pointing out with Cody
(06:52):
Mock about how they moved these guys around. Guards were
playing right guard. College right guards were playing left guard
and tackle. Jalen Duncan played Who's a left tackle all
his college career in Maryland, played some right tackle. So
they moved these guys around. You've got an idea what
these guys can of can't do. I thought it was
a terrific job by that coaching stip by those coaching steps,
I should say, yeah, I want to just shout out
(07:14):
osires torn. So I thought it was fantastic. Best interior
alignment there. John Michael Schmidt's showed Yeah, maybe back into
the first round at center, probably a second round pick,
though more likely Matthew Berg round at serious. He was
another guy Tony mentioned moved around guard and tackle. Cody
make even played some center. Steve a Villa, the big
TCU guard, played some center. So those guys moved around.
(07:34):
I thought they did a really nice job. And then
I guess we should just mention to the wide receiver
cornerback by Battles. I'm not sure we're gonna have any
first round receivers or corners come out of the Senior
Bowl this year, which is not surprising. Usually, you know,
those are positions we get a lot of underclassmen coming
out early, and those are gonna be the star players
at those spots. But I thought there was some good
competition of those two spots throughout the week. I mean,
(07:57):
Tank Dale you couldn't cover. I mean he was. He
was beating people off the line, he was beating defenders
through there in the routes, and when he got in
the open field he has a burst. The problem is
he's on the hundred sixty five pounds, So where does
he go in the drift. You're gonna have to design
place for him. You're gonna have to design a position
for him. You've got to keep him off of press coverage.
And as fast as Tank Dell was on the field,
(08:18):
it was Jaden Reid of Michigan State who was topping
the GPS as far as speeds were concerned every single day.
He had had an outstanding week. And Michael Wilson of
Stanford I think, really exceeded expectations, especially with his route running.
I mean, team defenders could not stay with him in
or out of routes. Yeah, you're right, he was open
the whole day. Bigger guy to over two hundred pounds,
(08:39):
he has some strength to him. I thought he did
a really nice job. And I'm just gonna shout out
Jayden Read out of Michigan State, who you know, had
a down year this year, much like the entire Michigan
State program. But he played mostly in the slot in
Mobile and I thought he showed speed quick this, he
was able to get open, showed good hands. So just
another guy I thought did well. And then I'll mention
Luke Musgrave to Tony another guy that could be as
(09:00):
round pick coming out of that event Um out of
Oregon State. You showed he showed some rust with some
drops and stuff, but the overall physical package and athleticism
was certainly on display. And remember when Jim Nagy was
on this program. Naggie said that everyone has Michael Mayer
of Notary Dame as the numbers tight end number one,
but keep an eye on Musgrave. And you know you
said he showed some rust because he was injured, he
(09:21):
missed most of the season, and I think he told
you that, you know, he wasn't und percent people I
said I spoke, which said he looked like he was
playing injured. But he looked damn good. I mean, he
was very athletic, he showed good speed. I mean he
looked like the potential you know, tight end that plays
the position like a receiver, which is what the NFL
wants these days. All right, Tony, let's get to our
top five here, And since you were just talking about him,
(09:43):
I know it's unorthodox, but Stuart, let's talk tight ends
because I think this is a wonderful class. I went
through these guys the last few days, and you probably
have five or six guys that have gone before any
tight end in the last year's draft class. And Tramcarbride
was a good prospect, but these guys are just different.
I'll give you I'll list off Tony's top five, and
(10:04):
then Tony, you can kind of give me your thoughts
on the guys and why you order them what you did,
and then we'll talk about him a little bit. So
you're tight end. Top five. You have Michael Mayer out
of Notre Dame, the third year junior, first round grade.
You have Luke Musgrave out of Oregon State, number two,
Tucker Craft at a South Dakota state as your third guy.
Both guys with kind of first second round picks. Sam
(10:24):
Laporta at Iowa second round selection, and then Dalton Kincaid
at a Utah kind of a second third round guy.
Give me your thoughts and why you ordered them that way. Yeah,
Mayor Musgrave and Craft are very close. There's not much
that that that separates them. I gotta wait and see
what Mayor runs at the forty in at the combine,
because there's word that he may not break four eight.
(10:46):
And then we want to see what Musgrave. I'm told
you could run a low four five. And then there's
my favorite Tucker Craft. Now it depends on what you want.
I mean, Mary's your traditional three down tight end. He's
your nineteen eighties type of tight end, if you will,
in the sense that he's a terrific in line blocker.
He can block on the second level. He is a big, strong,
(11:07):
stout pass catcher. Remember I've talked about him in comparison
to Mark Bavarro of the New York Giants going way
way back. He is that type of tight end that's
not necessarily what the league wants these days. You know,
they want the guys that can get down the field
much grave does that. Tucker Craft of South Dakota State
really does that exceptionally well. And Tucker Craft is a
(11:29):
decent blocker they don't need. They don't ask him to
block all that much because he's such a good pass catcher,
but he's always looking the block when the assignment calls
for he's out on the second level blocking. Uh. Number
four is Sam Reporter of i who I just think
is ridiculously under rated. The guy has been a terrific
tight end at Iowa the past three years. He's an
outstanding pass catcher. I love this route running Tony. When
(11:51):
I watched him, I thought this route running was spectacular.
I I wrote that in my report. He runs excellent
routes for a bigger tight end. Doesn't is a solid
job walking. He's projected to run in the four sevens.
Doesn't look like a downfield threat, but he's very, very
dependable in all areas. And then there's Dalton Kincaid, who
really wasn't even the number one tight end at Utah
(12:13):
this year, even though he had all those measurables. It
was Brian Queith. Queet went down with an injury, Kincaid's
game took off. Now Kincaid has an injury, So I
think Dalton Kinkaide's one of those guys that because of
the injury, he's not gonna be drafted as early as
he should be. But if he gets back to health
and he starts to improve on what he showed he
(12:34):
can do during the season, he's gonna be a real
fine starting tight end down the road. And then there's
you know, Luke Schumacher is right behind the kid from
Michigan who's a third round pick. It kind of falls
off after that, after your first five or six guys.
All right, I want to follow up on Dalton Kincaid
because Tony I thought he runs like a wide receiver,
(12:54):
Like he's long, he's kind of slenderly. If you're looking
for this group, and I even more so than Muscar,
if you're looking for like that move tight end that's
a receiver, I think Kincaid's probably your guy. I just
love the way he moved in the second and was
able to kind of separate get open, and I bet
you he's gonna run pretty well in indeed, if he runs,
remember I mean go back to Jim Age told us,
(13:17):
you know, he may not be healthy, he may not
be able to run before the before the draft, which
is why he'll kind of be pushed down and be underdrafted.
You know, he looks thin because he's six six and
a half, I mean, and he's two under forty two pounds.
That that's why he looks thin, because he, like he said,
he's got such excellent length, natural pass catcher. I always
(13:38):
thought he was underappreciated at Utah, was never a big
player in that offense until Queen went down with the injury.
But he's got a tremendous amount of upside and if
he can, if he's able to get back to health
and improve on the ability that he showed late in
the season when he took over the starting spot at Utah,
some team's gonna hit a home run with him at
(13:59):
the tight end. One guy I want to ask you
about that that's not on your top five is Darnall Washington,
the basically offensive tackle that's playing tight end for Georgia.
Six seventy two seventy pounds, only twenty eight catches last year.
He's playing behind Bowers right, who's the number one tight end,
And you know Tony. He can block obviously at that size,
(14:19):
you know, he has build up speed. But once he
gets going, he can go against Oregon. He's like hurdling
guys on the sideline to running after the catch. But
at his side, I just don't see a great change
in directions start and stop. But boy, you know, tight
ends a traits position, and he's like, there's no one
that looks like this guy that plays that spot well. First,
and he is, you're an inch shot. He's six eight
(14:41):
and short. He was two eighty pounds coming out of
the National Championship game when he reported for combine training,
and he started training for the combine just a few
days after National Championship game. Now I smoke with his
team we're actually on my flight, uh going home, and
they said the goal is to get him down to
(15:02):
two hundred and sixty five pounds by by the time
the combine comes around. That's very aggressive. The hey at
six pounds, he moves incredibly. Well, you're right about the
change of direction. I think the fact is also is
Darnell Washington is the starting tight end on just about
(15:23):
pent of the teams around the nation except Georgia, except Iowa.
You know, except maybe Notre Dame. And what happened is
he played second field the bowers, he didn't get to save,
he didn't have the same responsibility. So I think he's
very undeveloped in that area of the route running area,
the pass catching area. So with Washington, you're probably looking
(15:46):
at a late day to pick and he's a developmental prospect.
You're gonna put him on the field on shortened third
and short uh goal line situations where you want to block,
maybe you throw on the wall. But I think it's
something where it's gonna be a process with Washington to
turn him into make him go from the awesome athlete
(16:06):
that he is at the incredible slides that he has
right now into a tight end while to upside there. Yeah,
and look he had great hands and you know there
was one pass he was going off the seamos storm
behind him. He had to flip his hips get around.
He reached out behind them, made a hands catch like
freakish things. But again, yeah, just the little role when
it comes to the route running a right let's uh,
let's jump to the other skill spot, Tony. We'll kind
(16:27):
of stick with the theme here. Let's go to wide receiver.
We've talked a ton about these guys, but we'll touch
on him here too. I imagine your first three guys
in the list are all pretty close, Jackson Smith and
Jigibus your first Quentin Johnson's number two, Jalen Highott number three,
oh at first round grades. Then you have Jordan Addison
and a Flowers with kind of one slash twos. Is
this gonna be like a chef's choice situation depending on
(16:48):
the type of player you want when you're drafting a
wide receiver. If you want to speed, downfield threat, home
run hitting guy, you're gonna go with Jalen Hyatt. If
you want the bigger athlete who can also you know,
break the deep, breaking the break it deep down the
field and has great upside, You're gonna go with Quentin Johnson.
If you want the you know NFL ready player that
(17:10):
you can stick into a lineup, uh you know, basically
from day one, you're gonna go with save Flowers or
uh or or or or Addison from USC. I have
Jackson Smith and Jig but as my number one receiver
because I remember, you know what I saw in the
two thousand twenty one film. I mean, he was outstanding.
Teams couldn't cover him, and this was really before the
(17:33):
rise of Marvin Harrison the second Smith and Jibble was
the number one guy. They knew the ball was going
to him. They really didn't even use a tight end
to him. In two thousand twenty one C J. Stroud
and they had Jeremy ruckerd there rant excellent routes, found
ways to separate. Was really injured this year, had a
third degree hamstring issue which never really resolved itself, although
(17:53):
I'm told he's had a percent now getting ready for
the Combine, So I think that, granted there was a
year off, Smith, Jib is sort of the total package
when you look at all those guys. He's got good speed,
he's a terrific rout runner, He's an outstanding pass catcher
as opposed to Quentin Johnson, who is a great athlete.
He's got the speed he's got, he's a downfield presence.
(18:15):
He can win out for the contestant passes, but he
needs to improve his route running and he needs to
be more consistent about catching the ball with the drops
away from his frame. And he got who is a
great downfield rep but you know, doesn't have an expanded
round tree. He's got to really develop those routes. But again,
if you want a guy just to run down the
field and make me a place for you, Hi, it's
(18:36):
your guy, no question about it, Tony. How how close
is is your next set of white outs after those
top five? You don't have to go through all the
names if you don't want to. But how big of
a drop off if you don't get that wide receiver
at the end of round one, which I think, by
the way, all five of these guys could go at
the end of the round one. That's possible depending on
you know where they fall and what teams want to
pick them. You know, how far is the drop off
(18:57):
to that kind of next group where if you're in
the second round you want to why receiver? You want
to get one there? Well, I mean the next guy
would be K Shawn Booty? Who you know, what are
we getting with K Shawn Booty? Are you If you're
getting the guy that we saw in two thousand twenty one,
you take K Shawn Booty in the second round, you're
potentially getting a first round receiver who played semi decent
(19:17):
football for half of the two thousand two season. After
not being around you know, the first half. If you
take him in the second round and he never really
ups his game, well then you wasted a pick. The
one thing we know about l s U receivers are
they're usually better NF players on the NFL level then
they are on the college level. So be KA Shawn Booty.
He's sort of a wild card because you know, I
(19:40):
don't want to say he could be the best of
the bunch, but he could really could be the best
of the bunch. If you go back to that two
thousand twenty one film you look at the history of
LSU receivers, K Shawn Booty could develop into, you know,
the best receiver from this class. It's just that he
really didn't play that well. And then you go down
You've got you've got Josh Downs, who's a smaller but
(20:00):
very explosive. You've got Cedric Tillman of Tennessee who's a
bigger guy but was injured last year. I think there's
a good group of receivers in that second third round
area who have a lot of potentials but also have
some questions. Yeah, I love Josh Downs, by the way,
I don't see much of for me I don't see
much of a difference between him and A. Flowers. I
(20:21):
think they're very similar, and I think if you know,
you get Downs picks after, I think you're getting a
very similar player. To be honest with you, I think
Flowers runs better routes, but I think Downs is more
of a downfield threat. Got it all right, Let's go
over to the quarterback spot in now. Tone We've talked
about these guys a bunch of obviously, and the ranking
should not surprise people. Bryce Young number one, c J.
(20:43):
Stroud number two. Then you have Hooker third, and Levis fourth.
I'm assuming the injury is why you kind of have
them in different rounds. You can explain that. And then
A O'Connell out of Purdue, and then we'll talk about
the guy that's not on the list as well. So
go through your five. Well, obviously, Brice Young number one.
I know there's gonna be people, especially after his Pro Day,
that are gonna have c J. Stroud jump over Bryce Young,
(21:06):
no doubt in my mind, because c J. Stroud's gonna
throw better deep balls. The pro day workout is made
for c J. Stroud, But when you look at the film,
there's really not much of a difference. I mean, Bryce
Young gets it. He's got an incredible field vision. There's
a clairvoyance to his game where he knows what's gonna
happen before it happens. Doesn't have a great size, doesn't
have a great deep on. It's not a bad deep on,
(21:28):
but he doesn't have that great vertical uh arm that
he's gonna drive the ball downfield. It's a little bit
slow to uh take his head off the framary receiver
from now and then, but he always makes good decisions
here to just real quick, just so people understand. When
we're an indie, people are gonna be waiting with bated
breath on his measurements, not just the height, but also
(21:49):
the way that's gonna be. And look, doesn't be a
lot of players where it's important. There's no bigger measurement
that's gonna come out of Indie than Bryce Young because
no one has really ever succeeded at quarterback in the
NFL at his stature. Tyler Murray two point out. Don't
you remember how everybody was waiting for Kyler Murray's when
he came in slightly over six ft. It went viral
(22:09):
on the internet. It's gonna be a similar situation like that.
And you're absolutely right. I mean, if you draft Brice Young,
you better make sure you put at least five good
offensive linemen in front of him to protect him because
he's not gonna be able to take the beating on Sunday.
He took on Saturday. And it's not just hey, it's
it's with its frame, it's strength. You know, yeah, he
is a he is a slender guy. He's not gonna
be able to withstand the rush. Now physically, mentally, he
(22:33):
does a lot of good things. Steps up in the pocket,
gets rid of the ball, and he protects the football,
doesn't throw adverse passes, doesn't force the ball in the coverage,
which is what you gotta love about him. C J.
Stroud is just the opposite. He's got those physical skills,
he's got the size, he's got the girth he's got
he's got the stoutness of a pocket passer, he's got
the big arm. He's very accurate. You know, again with
(22:53):
c J. Stroud, and we've bemoaned this fact on this
podcast going back to September. You know, c J. Stroudda
I thought it was over coached. At Ohio State, and
all of a sudden when they let him play against Georgia, Boom,
he puts up forty plus points against that defense. He
almost wins that game. So which c J. Stroud are
(23:13):
we getting? If we if we get the c J.
Stroud that you saw at the Georgia Georgia UH semifinal game,
and he's coached correctly and not over coach, and he's
able to there's your franchise quarterback from the two thousand
twenty two draft. There's no doubt in my mind. Uh,
it's gonna be interesting to see. And again you're gonna
see a lot of people moving towards the draft that
(23:34):
have c J. Stroud graded over Bryce Young. And I
think the best way to say it is Bryce Young.
You know what, you're getting a Bright Young. The downside
the Bryce Young is the size and the inability with
stand the rush. C J. Stroud there's a huge upside,
but there's a lot of risk in the pick Tony
real quick, real quick on Straud before you move on
to the Hooker and Levis and look, I'm always wanting
(23:55):
to tell people don't scout the helmet, but we've seen
now to Ohio State quarterbacks come out of that offensive
system in Dwayne Haskins, rest in peace and um justin
fields where the passing part of their game going from
that Ohio State system to the pros did not translate. Well,
you know you're throwing a great receivers, you have great protection,
(24:18):
and this type of route concepts they can run to
Ohio State. You can't even run the NFL because you
can't hold the ball that long. So I worry about
that too. How much of that production carries over when
you go into an NFL system? Go ahead, Sorry, it's
gonna come down to coaching With c J. Stroud. I
think a lot of people be surprised when when they
see Hendon Hooker as my number three quarterback. But I
firmly believe that if Hendon Hooker finished the season healthy
(24:41):
and went through the senior boat process, we'd be talking
about him as the number three quarterback. And I think
Hendon Hooker is in a real good position. He's not
in a good it's bad because he's gonna be underdrafted.
He's got no chance of being a first round selection.
It's probably not gonna be an early won't go into
the sect bottom half of round two, round three, depending
how the injury is. But he's in a good situation
(25:02):
is he's not gonna be able to play in two
thousand twenty three, so he's gonna have to sit on
the sidelines the first three months, which is probably a
big benefit. Hendon Hooker has continually improved his game. He
was good at a Virginia Tech, took it up a
notch in two thousand twenty one in Tennessee, really took
it up a notch this year Tennessee before before he
got injured. When you compare him to Will Levis, yeah,
(25:25):
Levis has got better size, he's stouter, he's got a
better arm, although Hendon Hooker has got a gone good arm.
But Hendon Hooker is the better quarterback. And I just
like the fact that Hendon Hooker, he may not like it.
It's gonna have to sit on the sidelines because of
the injury, which I think will beat to his benefit two, three,
four or five years down the road. Rather than sticking
(25:46):
him in the wine, I'm sticking him behind center and
basically learning on the fire. Levice is, you know, he's
sort of like c. J. Stroud times ten. He's your
boom or bus guy. I've written about it, We've talked
about it. He should have been at the Senor Ball.
He should have been the Shrine Game. As someone that
said to me, was occupational suicide that he didn't go
to the Shrine Game. Considering the Atlanta Falcons were coaching
(26:08):
one of the teams, the Atlanta Falcons need a quarterback,
and the Atlanta Falcons have the eighth pick of the draft.
Why wasn't at the Senior Bowl. Now, when we talked
to Naggy about it, he said, well, there's a toe injury,
but people thought he could have played. You usually don't
go to a game like that because he don't want
to be exposed. And that's the thing with with Levice
Struggles layering the ball, doesn't do the best job with
(26:30):
his reads. A guy who's got high upside for the
big downside. And then I've got Aidan O'Connell and a
lot of people are gonna say, well, how come Anthony
Richardson's not your your top five? And that was my
follow up, Tony, Anthony Richardson could be a great quarterback
in three years. He could also be playing receiver. I mean,
I just there's just too much unknowns about a guy
(26:52):
that has not played much football, who you know, completed
thirty three percent of his passes against Florida State, where
Aidan O'Connell was highly coming in the season. He's got
NFL size, he's a pocket passer, he's mobile, he's got
an arm. He had a solid Shrine game. He's got
a lot of upside. He's a mature guy who knows
what's going on. He's been through a lot, he's married.
(27:13):
I just think that O'Connell is a much safer pick.
Richardson could be a great quarterback in three years. He
could be playing in the CFL in three years. Who
knows what's gonna happen. Yeah, and we'll see where Richardson goes.
You know, most people think he's gonna be a first
round pick. I don't think he's getting in the top ten.
I've seen some people predict that. I think that's a
little bit too rich I think I think Levice will though.
I think you know you mentioned Strouds Pro day Tony.
(27:36):
I think with Levice, teams will see him in his
pro day. He's gonna throw like a seventy five yard
pass or something crazy. He's gonna run really well at
the combine. He's a fast kid, he's tough, they say
he knocks out of the park and interviews. He's a
real good leader. Uh you know, frame size, all that stuff.
He checks every box in terms of traits that teams
are looking for. And then you know, here's what not him.
To Tony, this year was rough, but the team's gonna
(27:57):
go back and watches the game tape against Georgia lash
year and think it'd be like, oh man, look what
he did against the best defense with all these NFL
prospects on it. And then for Hooker, I think to
your point, I think it will help him sitting a
year because that Tennessee offense is nothing like what you
can run in the NFL. The way they spread out,
they used the hashes, stuff like that. So I think
(28:17):
it will certainly help him. Certainly has a lot of
talent um and we'll see, but yeah, I think, uh,
definitely more quarterbacks going in the first round this year
than we had in last year's draft, for sure. All right,
let's go to the offensive line, Tony. Um, let's go
tackle first. Go with your Paris Johnson one. Roger Jones
at Georgia to Paris Johnson's from Ohio State. Dawan Jones,
Johnson's teammate in Ohio State, as your third guy, Anton
(28:40):
Harrison from Oklahoma, and then Warren McClendon at a Georgia
take us to your top five at offensive tackle. I
like Paris Johnson, but I don't like him as much
as other people. I think he's working progress, made the
successful transition from guard to left tackle this year. He's
got excellent length, long arms. He's a good pass blocker.
There's a lot of inc assistancy in this game. You
(29:01):
watch Paris Johnson, he's a devastating run blocker. By the
times he's getting pushed back into the pocket. We saw
that in the semifinal game against Georgia. That wasn't the
only time that happened. So I think it's a matter
of him learning to use that base to anchor and
pass protection. Shows ability blocking on the second level. I
think he's got a high upside, but I think there's
gonna be a few bumps in the road. Roderick Jones,
(29:23):
you know, a little bit shorter, a little bit smaller.
Really want to see his measurements. You talk about the
measurements UH for Bryce Young at the UH at the combine,
there's gonna be a couple of other players, especially in
the offensive line, which we'll get to where teams are
really gonna want to see the measurements of these players.
You know, how long a broaderick Roderick Jones arms are?
They long enough to stay at left tackle. He's got
(29:44):
the physical skills, he's got the athleticism, he's got the agility.
He can slide out and pass protection to protect the edge.
He can get out to the second level. That all works,
and if the measurements, you know, follow along, you're looking
at the guy that's gonna go somewhere. I believe in
the bottom half of round one, Dewan Jones. You know,
we talked about this before he knowed. Dewan Jones as
(30:05):
a massive offensive lineman six stight and a half three
d seventy pounds. He was a dominant run blocker for
two years at Ohio State. But what he showed in
that one day of senior Bill practices he could pass protect.
I mean, there were a lot of speedy edge rushers,
but the wan Jones was able to slide off the
edge of right tackle get his hands into and knock
him from their angle of its attack. You know, he
(30:26):
dispelled the myth that he was a big, stiff right tackle,
sort of in the old mold of right tackles. No,
he showed a lot of agility. He showed the abilities
to shut down the speed rushers, and then he left town.
While he didn't leave down, he just didn't play anymore
because he figured a one and done. I really helped
my draft stock. I have him as a second round pick.
Could he slide into Round one maybe the late part.
(30:48):
Anton Harrison left tackle for Oklahoma. They've had a lot
of good offensive lineman there. Anton Harrison is a mobile,
nimble left tackle. He's a natural left tackle with excellent footwork.
And then warm McClain and then the other kid who
played right tackle at Georgia came into uh Senior Bowl. Pounds.
But it was actually it was a pretty good story
(31:09):
I wrote about a Pro Football Network. Warren McClendon's roommate
was the kid who died in the car accident for Georgia.
That was his roommate. War McClinton was in that car
when it when it crashed, and the roommate and the
Stafford died. There was a lot of questions as to
whether or not he was gonna be there. He went
(31:29):
through the Senior Bowl. He wore his roommate's number. Of
the fact that he went there and competed, and he's
such a good player. I think both you know it
was gonna help war mcclenton's very impressive. I think he's
a darn good right tackle as well, Tony. I'll throw
out two other guys that we saw at the Senior
Boy I mentioned one earlier, don't know, right, I think
he could easily be a second round pick. And I
think Wanya Morris Franklin from Oklahoma had a pretty nice
(31:52):
Senior Bowl too, and I think he could be a
day to pick. Right. Yeah, I think more right tackles.
And you know you're looking at you know you want
those past protectors, you want those nimble guys. Jalen Duncan
you mentioned earlier who I think so little cemented himself
as a Day two pick, just as long as everything
checks up, off checks off on the off the field stuff.
(32:12):
And Matt berge Run, I mean I think Matt berge Run.
You mentioned him at left tackle as well as guard.
You know, those nimble, agile guys. That's what the league wants. Uh.
And I think he's also probably a third round choice.
And you see him as you think he can play
tackle in the NFL, you see more my and my
theory with with tackles is leave him at left tackle
(32:34):
until that they can't play left tackle because it is
such an important position. No, look, I think he did
a really good job at left tackle with the Senior Bowl.
All right, let's go to the interior offensive line and
the first guy into Lis Tony. I'm sure people said, wait, wait, wait, wait,
why was any on your tackle list? What's going on here?
That's Peter Skernsky at the Northwestern We talked about John
Michael Schmidt's the center out of Minnesota, number two, one
(32:55):
of your favorites. Luke Whippler, I'm sure killed you to
put him behind John Michael Schmitts on this list, But
you did Osire's tours from Florida, who we ventured earlier.
Four and then you want to make Fatton at a
Clemson number five in your top five guards center list
to want to take us through it. Well, let's talk
about why Scronsky's on my guard list and not my
tackle list. You talk about Bryce Young, and everyone's gonna be,
(33:17):
you know, anticipating the measurements. For me and a lot
of people in the scouting community, that's what it's gonna
be with Scronsky. There's rumors he's not gonna be six
ft four. There's rumors his arms aren't gonna be thirty
three inches long. If his arms are on thirty three
inches long, he's not a tackle. He's gonna be kicked
inside the guard. He is a real good football player.
He is a real good offensive lineman. He's a tough,
nasty lineman who dominates opponents. He's got great vision, he's
(33:41):
got a violence to his game. He's a good pass
protector as well. I want to see those measurements because
everything I'm hearing screams guard right now. Maybe I'm hearing
the wrong things, but let's see. You know, you're gonna
be looking for everyone's gonna be looking at Bryce Young's
height and weight. I want to see Scronsky's height and
one because that will determine whether or not he's gonna
(34:02):
be a guard or a tackle next level. He may
end up moving to my tackle a board. He will
be a top five tackle could be right there with
the Paris Johnson. I tend to like Paris Johnson a
little bit more than sponsor. You know, other people feel differently, um,
but I want to see those measurements. John Michael Schmidt's
I mean you you talked about him at the top
of the show. I mean he was terrific at the
Senior Bowl practices. You know, at in Minnesota they basically
(34:25):
used him on the line of scrimmage, but we sawt
the Senior Bowl. He can move. He got out there
the last day of practice. He was twenty yards downfield,
not the defensive back off off of office speed uh
in that two minutes drill and he showed a lot,
a lot of ability. He's got an NFL build. He's
a thick guy with a thick, glower body. I love
the way he quarterback the offensive line. During Senior Bowl practices,
(34:48):
you could see him communicating with his teammates, making the singles,
moving his head back back and forth, making sure everybody
was in position. I think that bodes well. Luke Whippler
has always been one of my favorites, more of a
zone blocking lineman compared to Schmidt, and singularly a zone
blocking lineman. But that's what the league wants, you know,
if they want those guys that are nimble, you can
get out on the second level, can move and or
(35:09):
Agilec's what whippler is. Osiris Torrance who you talked about,
big strong, sort of small area guy, three forty plus pounds.
And I like George McFadden as well. I mean, we've
seen Clemson in the past. Kids playing for Cincinnati right now,
left tackle who moves into moving into garden has had
success at the guard position. That's what I see if McFadden,
(35:30):
who I have as a third round, third round selection, Yeah,
I'm gonna throw a couple of honorable mentions here for
guys that I like. Um Tony Cody Mock out of
North Dakota State will be moving in to your point
with arm length right from left tackle into guarder center. Again,
he hasn't done a muchy it's him ups and down
at that Senior Bowl doing it. But I think, you
know athlete, he kind of just the guy's like no
front teeth, I mean, just looks like an offensive lineman.
(35:52):
I think people are buying to him. And then Steve
a Vial out of TCU. You want a phone booth
guy that's gonna move the pile and be a road greater.
He played a little center on More Deal too. That's
another guy that I think teams are probably gonna like
on the inside sometime on day two. Yes, Steven Villa
is probably the best uh power gap blocker in this
year's draft. I mean, you want a guy that's gonna
(36:12):
punch in the mouth, drive you off the line of scrimmage,
anchored to point and pass protection, but you don't want
to plumb across the line of scrimmage. You don't want
to get him, you know, more than three or four
yards off the line of scrimmage to block emotion. That's
your guy. Yeah, big guy, three nine pounds so monster.
All right, let's go real quick. You want those monster
offensive lineman tonia block for the running backs. And this
(36:35):
is a really good running back class. It starts with
Bejan Robinson, who if you're just going by grade, he's
probably maybe even a top five player in this draft,
top seven, top eight, however you want to do it,
he's number one on your list. To no one's surprised.
Jimmy or give us from Alabama is number two. Taj
Spears we talked a lot about already is also a
second round there. He is number three for you. Zach
(36:57):
Charbonne or carbon at A out of U. C. L
A Is your fourth guy, and then Seawan Tucker out
of Syracuse comes in at number five. Take us through.
I mean, Robinson's the complete package. You know, fifteen twenty
years ago, be Jean Robinson, if he's not the first
pick of the draft, is the second pick of the draft.
But you know they don't. You know, running backs, you're
(37:18):
not that highly big guarded, especially in the draft anymore. So,
Be Jean Robinson is probably gonna be a bottom half
of round one choice. But he's got all going on.
He's big, he's powerful, he's got terrific short area quickness.
He can catch the ball out of the backfield. He
creates jardist for a big guy. And I mean he's
an all around back, as is Jimir Gibbs, who is
a sensational pass catcher out of the backfield. Gibbs has
(37:40):
got excellent size, He's powerful, He's rarely brought down by
the first defender, picks up a lot of yardage off
initial contact, shows the ability to turn the corner. He's
got a burst. I mean, he is a feature back
who who you can line him up in the slot,
you can line him up in the flanks and throwing
the ball, and he's gonna catch the ball for you. Ty.
J Spears talked about him at the top of the show.
(38:01):
Really don't know if there's anything more I can end,
except you know, I came out of the Senior Bowl
thinking what Jim Naggie told us before the Senior Bowl.
J Spears can be a feature runner in certain schemes
at the next level where you're not gonna ask him
to carry the ball twenty times a game. And there
aren't too many schemes in the NFL anymore that ask
your running back to carry the ball twenty times a game.
(38:22):
Zach Scharbonnet very underrated. More of a downhill grinder, but
a guy who he's got excellent short area quickness. He's
he's never brought down by the first defender. He'll carry
the pile. He's a decent pass catcher out of the backfield.
Really a do it all, sort of a throwback type
of running back. But the guy is gonna be exceptional
on third down in short or gold mine situations. Excuse
(38:45):
me now, I and Sewan Tucker graded ahead of Kenny mackintosh.
Kenny mackintosh showed us a lot of good things at
the Senior Bowl. Kenny Macintosh had some terrific runs in
that semifinal game against Ohio State. Kenny Macintosh has not
been consistingly productive. When you look at the height, weight,
the measurables, Kenny Macintosh his light years ahead of Shan Tucker,
(39:06):
but the production was not consistent for Kenny mackintosh, which
bothers me with Sean Tucker. He was a good interior
runner at Syracuse. He showed the ability to turn the corner.
He was a good pass catcher out of the backfield.
Teams knew he was getting the ball. That couldn't stop him.
Maybe after the combine. I will flip the two, but
I when I watched them, Shan Tucker's on the field
(39:29):
and he consistently produces. Kenny McIntosh when he's on the field,
sometimes he produces that. That's a concern for me. All right, Tony,
before we wrap it up here, just give me, like,
what what do you think the deepest group here of
these offensive positions, that's that you really like If you're
a team drafting, and you feel you can feel good
about getting a player in one of these spots on
(39:50):
either you know, late day to or early day three,
and you're gonna feel pretty good about there being a
couple of good players still letting you have one, two,
three groups whatever you want to do. Obviously, I think
you gotta start with with running back, because you know,
when you look at these running backs, I'm looking at
my board right now, I've got, uh who I got
ten or eleven running backs who are top one picks.
(40:14):
And then you got guys like Eric Gray, Chris Rodriguez
and Kentucky who we saw at the senior ball, Dwayne
mcbrod of U A B. Chase Brown of Illinois who
are probably you know, early day three picks that are
gonna be very productive at the next level. So I
don't think it's it's any uh, I don't. I don't
(40:38):
think it's it's in any debate. I think it's running
back all the way. I also happened to like the
center crop. You know, we talked about Schmitz and Whippler,
But I really think in that early part of Day three,
you've got guys like Joe Tipman of Wisconsin, j Scrubs
at Penn State, Ricky Stromberg of Arkansas, Jared Patterson of
(40:59):
Notre Dame. He was by the way, he quietly had
a really good week in mobile pass and I thought
he got very good mobility. He can move pretty well.
Got better and better as the week went on, and
on Thursday he had a dominant practice both at guard
and center. And remember, I mean as a sophomore at
Notre Dame, everybody who's talking about him as being a
very early picket center moved to guard. Took a while
(41:20):
to uh to get quite get adjusted. And I didn't
even mentioned Ohlawatini of Michigan, who I I like him
as a college player. I think he's gonna to be
a solid NFL pro. I don't like him as much
as a lot of other people. I'm rooting for him
because easy got to root for. But he's not really big,
(41:41):
he's not powerful, he's not overly athletic. He just gets
the most from his ability and it gets the job done.
And while I think there's a place for somebody like
that in the NFL, I just don't know that there's
a place for a guy like that in the top
four rounds of the NFL traft Tony, good stuff. Next
week we'll have your top fives on defense. Can't wait
look forward to it. John for Tony Polly and I'm
(42:01):
John Schmoke. Thanks for joining us on draft season again.
Go subscribe on your favorite podcast platform or check us
out on The Giants Apper or Johns dot com Slash Podcast.
For Tony, I'm John. We'll see you next week with
a look at Tony's top fives on defense.
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